WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.620 This episode is sponsored by Transcend, a veteran 00:00:02.620 --> 00:00:04.980 -owned and operated performance optimization 00:00:04.980 --> 00:00:08.039 company that I introduced recently as a sponsor 00:00:08.039 --> 00:00:10.820 on this show. Well, since then I have actually 00:00:10.820 --> 00:00:13.080 been using my products and I have had incredible 00:00:13.080 --> 00:00:15.939 success. There was initial blood work that was 00:00:15.939 --> 00:00:19.039 extremely detailed and based on that they offered 00:00:19.039 --> 00:00:23.559 supplementation. So I began taking DHEA. bpc 00:00:23.559 --> 00:00:26.539 157 for inflammation based on the fact that i've 00:00:26.539 --> 00:00:28.859 been a stuntman a martial artist and a firefighter 00:00:28.859 --> 00:00:31.980 my whole life lots of aches and pains dihexa 00:00:31.980 --> 00:00:34.759 to help cognition after multiple punches to the 00:00:34.759 --> 00:00:37.820 head and shift work and peptides four months 00:00:37.820 --> 00:00:40.119 later they did a detailed blood work again and 00:00:40.119 --> 00:00:43.140 i was actually able to taper off two of the peptides 00:00:43.140 --> 00:00:45.640 because my body had responded so well to just 00:00:45.640 --> 00:00:48.079 one of them that it was optimized at that point 00:00:48.570 --> 00:00:51.890 So I cannot speak highly enough of the immense 00:00:51.890 --> 00:00:54.390 range of supplementation that they offer, whether 00:00:54.390 --> 00:00:57.409 it's male health, female health, peptides to 00:00:57.409 --> 00:00:59.429 boost your own testosterone, which I would argue 00:00:59.429 --> 00:01:02.429 is needed by a lot of the fire service, or whether 00:01:02.429 --> 00:01:04.569 it's exogenous testosterone needed, especially 00:01:04.569 --> 00:01:08.019 after TBIs or advanced age. Now, as I mentioned 00:01:08.019 --> 00:01:10.400 before, the other side of this company is an 00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:12.900 altruistic arm called the Transcend Foundation, 00:01:13.420 --> 00:01:15.980 which is putting veterans and first responders 00:01:15.980 --> 00:01:19.099 through some of their protocols free of charge. 00:01:19.340 --> 00:01:22.079 Now, Transcend are also offering you, the audience, 00:01:22.260 --> 00:01:25.319 10 % off their protocols. And you can find that 00:01:25.319 --> 00:01:28.040 on jamesgearing .com under the Products tab. 00:01:28.359 --> 00:01:30.840 And if you want to hear more about Transcend 00:01:30.840 --> 00:01:34.560 and their story, listen to episode 808 with the 00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:38.950 founder, Ernie Colling. or go to transcendcompany 00:01:38.950 --> 00:01:42.890 .com. Welcome to the Behind the Shield podcast. 00:01:43.090 --> 00:01:44.909 As always, my name is James Geering, and this 00:01:44.909 --> 00:01:46.930 week it is my absolute honor to welcome on the 00:01:46.930 --> 00:01:52.370 show veteran skydiver and stuntwoman Katie Hansen. 00:01:52.989 --> 00:01:55.530 Now, in this conversation, we discuss a host 00:01:55.530 --> 00:01:58.670 of topics, from her journey into the world of 00:01:58.670 --> 00:02:02.290 skydiving and wingsuits, the importance of fitness, 00:02:02.590 --> 00:02:07.239 diligence in training, her near -fatal skydiving 00:02:07.239 --> 00:02:10.759 near -miss, the psychological journey refinding 00:02:10.759 --> 00:02:14.840 her confidence in the sky, working on Thunderbolts, 00:02:14.939 --> 00:02:18.699 the Jimmy Chin project in the Sphere in Vegas, 00:02:18.919 --> 00:02:21.939 and so much more. Now, before we get to this 00:02:21.939 --> 00:02:24.300 incredible conversation, as I say every week, 00:02:24.400 --> 00:02:27.520 please just take a moment. Go to whichever app 00:02:27.520 --> 00:02:30.139 you listen to this on, subscribe to the show, 00:02:30.379 --> 00:02:34.639 leave feedback, and leave a rating. Every single 00:02:34.639 --> 00:02:37.939 five -star rating truly does elevate this podcast, 00:02:38.259 --> 00:02:40.800 therefore making it easier for others to find. 00:02:40.979 --> 00:02:45.840 And this is a free library of well over 1100 00:02:45.840 --> 00:02:49.719 episodes now. So all I ask in return is that 00:02:49.719 --> 00:02:52.539 you help share these incredible men and women's 00:02:52.539 --> 00:02:56.219 stories so I can get them to every single person 00:02:56.219 --> 00:02:59.900 on planet Earth who needs to hear them. So with 00:02:59.900 --> 00:03:03.740 that being said, I introduce to you... Katie 00:03:03.740 --> 00:03:26.169 Hanson. Enjoy. Well, Katie, I want to start by 00:03:26.169 --> 00:03:28.490 saying two things. Firstly, thank you to our 00:03:28.490 --> 00:03:30.889 mutual friend, Eric Salas, for making this connection. 00:03:31.129 --> 00:03:33.550 And secondly, I want to welcome you onto the 00:03:33.550 --> 00:03:36.069 Behind the Shield podcast today. Thanks for having 00:03:36.069 --> 00:03:39.830 me. So where on planet Earth are we finding you 00:03:39.830 --> 00:03:42.530 this afternoon? I am in Leadville, Colorado. 00:03:43.650 --> 00:03:47.810 And I arrived here about an hour ago. And what's 00:03:47.810 --> 00:03:52.219 taking you there? Um, I live in Moab, Utah and 00:03:52.219 --> 00:03:55.159 it's super hot during the summer. And so my husband, 00:03:55.280 --> 00:03:58.080 Matt and I have been staying away this summer 00:03:58.080 --> 00:03:59.919 and we spend a month in Washington state. And 00:03:59.919 --> 00:04:02.740 now for August, we're going to be kind of home 00:04:02.740 --> 00:04:05.180 -based out of here and then head back in September 00:04:05.180 --> 00:04:08.520 when it's a little bit nicer there. Yeah. If 00:04:08.520 --> 00:04:09.840 you're escaping the heat and glad you didn't 00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:11.960 come to Florida, it's been brutal here. Like 00:04:11.960 --> 00:04:13.780 in a hundred and, you know, a hundred and six, 00:04:13.800 --> 00:04:16.600 108 with the humidity. So yeah. No, thank you. 00:04:17.220 --> 00:04:20.850 No, thank you. All right. Well, I would love 00:04:20.850 --> 00:04:23.209 to start at the very beginning of your journey. 00:04:23.310 --> 00:04:25.689 So tell me where you were born and tell me a 00:04:25.689 --> 00:04:27.290 little bit about your family dynamic, what your 00:04:27.290 --> 00:04:30.149 parents did, how many siblings. Sure. So I was 00:04:30.149 --> 00:04:32.870 born in Portland, Oregon, but moved to Washington 00:04:32.870 --> 00:04:35.470 State when I was maybe three or four years old 00:04:35.470 --> 00:04:38.509 and consider Washington State home. So I grew 00:04:38.509 --> 00:04:42.110 up in a few different places there. But, you 00:04:42.110 --> 00:04:44.790 know, my high school years and things like that, 00:04:44.810 --> 00:04:48.230 I lived in Big Harbor, Washington. And my family 00:04:48.230 --> 00:04:51.370 still has roots out there today. We've got a 00:04:51.370 --> 00:04:53.910 beach house we spend time at every summer on 00:04:53.910 --> 00:04:56.389 the Puget Sound. And the Pacific Northwest definitely 00:04:56.389 --> 00:05:00.009 feels like home to me, even though I moved away 00:05:00.009 --> 00:05:03.990 in 2006 to California and started a whole other 00:05:03.990 --> 00:05:08.389 journey then. But I am extremely fortunate with 00:05:08.389 --> 00:05:11.529 my family. I grew up thinking it was normal and 00:05:11.529 --> 00:05:14.209 realize now it's probably more of an exception 00:05:14.209 --> 00:05:17.379 that I'm. really close with my whole family. 00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:20.819 My parents are celebrating their 50th wedding 00:05:20.819 --> 00:05:24.720 anniversary this year and are great examples 00:05:24.720 --> 00:05:27.680 of a loving relationship, good communication, 00:05:27.939 --> 00:05:31.560 and caring about their kids. And that doesn't 00:05:31.560 --> 00:05:33.759 mean that we haven't all had our rifts or made 00:05:33.759 --> 00:05:36.100 mistakes, but I know that they'll always be there 00:05:36.100 --> 00:05:38.180 for me. And they, throughout my life, have been 00:05:38.180 --> 00:05:40.100 people that I could rely on and turn to when 00:05:40.100 --> 00:05:43.819 I needed advice or when I was screwing up. that 00:05:43.819 --> 00:05:47.220 they would get me back in line. I have a brother 00:05:47.220 --> 00:05:51.519 and a sister. Both are amazing people. I'm the 00:05:51.519 --> 00:05:54.600 youngest and grew up being tortured by them, 00:05:54.639 --> 00:05:59.040 of course. And, you know, we became, I would 00:05:59.040 --> 00:06:04.000 say, good friends as we became older. And that's 00:06:04.000 --> 00:06:06.819 more or less, you know, my family dynamics in 00:06:06.819 --> 00:06:11.120 a nutshell. I guess I can add my dad was an actuary 00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:16.269 growing up. like a branch of mathematician, basically 00:06:16.269 --> 00:06:21.589 super smart. My mom has a degree in microbiology, 00:06:21.670 --> 00:06:25.149 but her job growing up was to take care of us. 00:06:25.230 --> 00:06:29.230 And I think it's a blessing when a parent can 00:06:29.230 --> 00:06:31.430 stay home and raise their kids themselves. And 00:06:31.430 --> 00:06:34.269 we were fortunate enough to have that be our 00:06:34.269 --> 00:06:36.670 circumstance. And, you know, they were really 00:06:36.670 --> 00:06:39.990 involved with. sports and you know timing at 00:06:39.990 --> 00:06:42.769 track meets and driving me to soccer practice 00:06:42.769 --> 00:06:46.370 and all that kind of stuff so very lucky very 00:06:46.370 --> 00:06:49.970 lucky with my family it's it's so good to hear 00:06:49.970 --> 00:06:52.769 because you're right especially in a lot of professions 00:06:52.769 --> 00:06:55.290 in uniform, you know, there is actually a lot 00:06:55.290 --> 00:06:57.089 of struggles in our early life, which I think 00:06:57.089 --> 00:06:58.949 partly sends us to this, but even, you know, 00:06:58.970 --> 00:07:00.970 your sport, there's a lot of people that I feel, 00:07:01.029 --> 00:07:03.269 you know, there was some voids early on and some 00:07:03.269 --> 00:07:04.949 of the skydivers, for example, that come on the 00:07:04.949 --> 00:07:07.050 show that were filled by that adrenaline, that 00:07:07.050 --> 00:07:12.170 excitement. When you look back now, what were 00:07:12.170 --> 00:07:14.910 the elements of your parents' upbringing that 00:07:14.910 --> 00:07:17.810 you think forged this loving relationship when 00:07:17.810 --> 00:07:25.089 they met each other? Um, my parents both are, 00:07:25.110 --> 00:07:28.689 they're incredible people. They love, um, they 00:07:28.689 --> 00:07:30.689 have it together. You know, they met in college 00:07:30.689 --> 00:07:35.250 and they, as far as I know, basically fell in 00:07:35.250 --> 00:07:37.589 love on a ski trip and enjoying the outdoors 00:07:37.589 --> 00:07:40.310 and pursuing life, you know, and they, I think 00:07:40.310 --> 00:07:44.230 walk a pretty nice balance between real jobs 00:07:44.230 --> 00:07:46.790 and having it together and providing and, you 00:07:46.790 --> 00:07:50.490 know, being responsible with a love for. Fun 00:07:50.490 --> 00:07:53.310 in the outdoors and, you know, being adventurous 00:07:53.310 --> 00:07:58.370 people. So what about sports? Obviously, we're 00:07:58.370 --> 00:07:59.910 going to get to the extreme sports you do now. 00:07:59.970 --> 00:08:01.430 What were you playing and doing when you were 00:08:01.430 --> 00:08:05.870 in the school ages? I started doing club track 00:08:05.870 --> 00:08:08.949 when I was nine and did that through high school. 00:08:09.209 --> 00:08:13.709 And soccer was always a huge, you know, I played 00:08:13.709 --> 00:08:17.250 really competitive soccer from probably kindergarten 00:08:17.250 --> 00:08:22.680 up through high school. I always ask people this 00:08:22.680 --> 00:08:24.819 when they've done individual sports and they've 00:08:24.819 --> 00:08:28.360 done team sports, what did you glean from each 00:08:28.360 --> 00:08:30.500 of those that then served you later in life? 00:08:31.100 --> 00:08:33.720 Ah, that's an interesting question. I love both 00:08:33.720 --> 00:08:37.240 team sports and individual sports. I think individual 00:08:37.240 --> 00:08:41.139 sports, there's like, it's very good for your 00:08:41.139 --> 00:08:43.740 confidence to know that, that you're the one 00:08:43.740 --> 00:08:46.460 who performs, you know, like if you did well, 00:08:46.559 --> 00:08:49.799 it was all on you. And I think, especially growing 00:08:49.799 --> 00:08:52.899 up, self -confidence was kind of a central theme 00:08:52.899 --> 00:08:55.340 for me looking back you know it's been kind of 00:08:55.340 --> 00:08:57.639 an important thing and I don't know if not really 00:08:57.639 --> 00:09:00.399 sure why but that was one of the things that 00:09:00.399 --> 00:09:02.820 boosted my self -confidence like when you place 00:09:02.820 --> 00:09:06.679 in state or you excel or you win a meet that 00:09:06.679 --> 00:09:08.879 was you you know when it came down to it in the 00:09:08.879 --> 00:09:13.240 moment and um with team sports there's so many 00:09:13.240 --> 00:09:16.220 so many good lessons that come from team sports 00:09:16.220 --> 00:09:22.259 um from leadership, you know, when there's been 00:09:22.259 --> 00:09:24.940 teams where I've fallen into a captain role and 00:09:24.940 --> 00:09:29.100 it really is about the team, not yourself, you 00:09:29.100 --> 00:09:32.019 know, or setting up someone else to succeed because 00:09:32.019 --> 00:09:34.840 that makes the team succeed or really having 00:09:34.840 --> 00:09:39.000 each other's backs through the difficult times 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:41.759 and celebrating together. It just like, it bonds 00:09:41.759 --> 00:09:44.320 you and you feel what it's like to be part of 00:09:44.320 --> 00:09:47.379 a community. And I think that's a really. special 00:09:47.379 --> 00:09:51.799 thing as well speaking of women's soccer uh the 00:09:51.799 --> 00:09:54.879 british lions or the england lions or british 00:09:54.879 --> 00:09:57.620 lions i forget now but the our our female football 00:09:57.620 --> 00:10:00.360 team i think it was england lions um they just 00:10:00.360 --> 00:10:02.519 won again they've won i think several times now 00:10:02.519 --> 00:10:05.299 but uh around this time with you know obviously 00:10:05.299 --> 00:10:08.179 my social media was looking at women's football 00:10:08.179 --> 00:10:12.419 soccer there came up a story as well where i 00:10:12.419 --> 00:10:16.639 think it was spain they had used um This video 00:10:16.639 --> 00:10:19.059 is a promo for women's soccer. And it was the 00:10:19.059 --> 00:10:21.379 highlight of all these great goals and tackles 00:10:21.379 --> 00:10:24.480 and headers and all the things. And then as the 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:27.500 commercial goes on, they show how they did it. 00:10:27.539 --> 00:10:29.779 And what they actually did was used AI to replace 00:10:29.779 --> 00:10:32.919 the women's faces with men's faces. So actually 00:10:32.919 --> 00:10:35.879 what you were seeing the whole time was was women's 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:39.120 soccer. And so using today's technology, it was 00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:42.840 kind of. uh you know debunking the myth that 00:10:42.840 --> 00:10:44.980 you know female sports weren't as good to watch 00:10:44.980 --> 00:10:46.919 for example because you were all in when you 00:10:46.919 --> 00:10:48.799 thought it was men but it was the whole time 00:10:48.799 --> 00:10:51.000 it was women that you're watching yeah oh that's 00:10:51.000 --> 00:10:53.659 fascinating what a cool little social experiment 00:10:53.659 --> 00:10:57.700 yeah absolutely well what about career aspirations 00:10:57.700 --> 00:10:59.480 again as you're progressing through the school 00:10:59.480 --> 00:11:01.320 age what were you dreaming of becoming back then 00:11:01.320 --> 00:11:06.000 oh man I had to kind of come to terms with it 00:11:06.000 --> 00:11:07.960 was interesting because I grew up in a family 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:10.360 where, you know, the expectation, not because 00:11:10.360 --> 00:11:12.200 it was pushed on you, but that's just the example 00:11:12.200 --> 00:11:16.500 set before you was going to college, you know, 00:11:16.500 --> 00:11:19.840 getting a degree and getting a job and playing 00:11:19.840 --> 00:11:24.259 on the weekends and and setting yourself up for 00:11:24.259 --> 00:11:26.960 retirement later in life and having a family. 00:11:26.980 --> 00:11:30.000 And, you know, there's nothing wrong with any 00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:33.419 of those things at all. But I found that they 00:11:33.419 --> 00:11:36.620 weren't necessarily a good fit for me. And having 00:11:36.620 --> 00:11:40.759 to kind of come to terms with that and realizing 00:11:40.759 --> 00:11:43.639 that there's more than one correct path to take 00:11:43.639 --> 00:11:46.539 through life. And even though what I thought 00:11:46.539 --> 00:11:50.580 was going to be, you know, my future as I grew 00:11:50.580 --> 00:11:54.039 up turned out to not be what I wanted. And having 00:11:54.039 --> 00:11:56.019 to realize that that didn't mean that I was failing. 00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:59.360 It was me just kind of growing as a person and 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:06.110 discovering who I was. I started skydiving when 00:12:06.110 --> 00:12:08.809 I was 18, the day before I walked for high school 00:12:08.809 --> 00:12:11.750 graduation, fell in love with it. And we can 00:12:11.750 --> 00:12:17.429 get into that, you know, later, but I knew that 00:12:17.429 --> 00:12:20.330 I did want a fallback career, no matter what 00:12:20.330 --> 00:12:23.529 I wanted to be responsible. And I found that 00:12:23.529 --> 00:12:27.090 kind of a balance between something that You 00:12:27.090 --> 00:12:29.590 know, I'm a very nurturing person, despite some 00:12:29.590 --> 00:12:33.149 of my rough exterior. Sometimes I am. I deeply 00:12:33.149 --> 00:12:38.029 care about people. And nursing was a career that 00:12:38.029 --> 00:12:42.210 needed people and also had a very flexible work 00:12:42.210 --> 00:12:45.289 schedule. And there was always going to be a 00:12:45.289 --> 00:12:47.429 need. It was a growing field, you know, and I 00:12:47.429 --> 00:12:50.490 didn't want to be so naive that I just, you know, 00:12:50.490 --> 00:12:53.940 got a degree. Something that wasn't going to 00:12:53.940 --> 00:12:56.340 set me up for a job later if I was going to go 00:12:56.340 --> 00:12:58.580 to school. I wanted it to be something that actually 00:12:58.580 --> 00:13:01.740 I could use the degree for. So I decided to go 00:13:01.740 --> 00:13:06.899 to nursing school and did. I went to nursing 00:13:06.899 --> 00:13:11.220 school and graduated as an RN in 2000, the very 00:13:11.220 --> 00:13:14.320 end of 2009. So I've been a nurse since 2010 00:13:14.320 --> 00:13:21.570 and have spent basically since then. kind of 00:13:21.570 --> 00:13:25.970 flip -flopping or meshing between full -time 00:13:25.970 --> 00:13:29.850 skydiving and working as a nurse you know and 00:13:29.850 --> 00:13:32.590 eventually got into travel nursing but kind of 00:13:32.590 --> 00:13:35.110 find a balance found a balance between the two 00:13:35.110 --> 00:13:39.950 ish I I feel like I'm a pendulum and I go from 00:13:39.950 --> 00:13:42.730 like working too hard nursing and feeling like 00:13:42.730 --> 00:13:45.110 I need to be responsible and then being miserable 00:13:45.110 --> 00:13:49.019 and then quitting that job or You know, that 00:13:49.019 --> 00:13:51.279 contract would end and then I would just like 00:13:51.279 --> 00:13:57.159 pendulum the other way into, you know, eat, sleep, 00:13:57.299 --> 00:13:59.700 breathing, skydiving, working on the drop zone. 00:14:00.539 --> 00:14:03.759 And, you know, I've kind of done a lot of different 00:14:03.759 --> 00:14:07.100 jobs within skydiving in terms of, you know, 00:14:07.139 --> 00:14:08.860 I was a packer for a season and packed other 00:14:08.860 --> 00:14:11.559 people's parachutes and quickly realized I wanted 00:14:11.559 --> 00:14:13.980 to be in the air all the time and started, you 00:14:13.980 --> 00:14:16.970 know, shooting video for tandems. Didn't get 00:14:16.970 --> 00:14:22.009 my tandem rating until I think I had 7 ,500 skydives 00:14:22.009 --> 00:14:25.230 because I didn't want to have to do tandems because 00:14:25.230 --> 00:14:28.110 I didn't want my own personal progression to 00:14:28.110 --> 00:14:30.710 suffer. And once people get a tandem rating and 00:14:30.710 --> 00:14:33.990 start doing tandems, they have a tendency. not 00:14:33.990 --> 00:14:36.769 to work on their own personal flying but my solution 00:14:36.769 --> 00:14:39.470 to that was you can't make me do tandems if i 00:14:39.470 --> 00:14:42.350 don't have a rating so i just didn't get one 00:14:42.350 --> 00:14:44.710 until i felt like i had kind of safely avoided 00:14:44.710 --> 00:14:49.210 that trap and then uh yeah so anyway kind of 00:14:49.210 --> 00:14:52.149 to answer i kind of flip -flopped between nursing 00:14:52.149 --> 00:14:56.570 and nursing and skydiving i want to take a dive 00:14:56.570 --> 00:14:58.570 into the nursing but just before we do you'll 00:14:58.570 --> 00:15:00.990 be an interesting person to to get a perspective 00:15:00.990 --> 00:15:04.509 on on this When I came over to the States from 00:15:04.509 --> 00:15:09.549 the UK, one of the big kind of realizations was 00:15:09.549 --> 00:15:11.789 I kept making, you know, what I would determine 00:15:11.789 --> 00:15:15.090 as Uncle Rico's. So all these guys that were 00:15:15.090 --> 00:15:17.950 kind of late 20s, early 30s deconditioned by 00:15:17.950 --> 00:15:20.529 this point. And they would always have I would 00:15:20.529 --> 00:15:22.029 have, could have, should have been story, you 00:15:22.029 --> 00:15:23.490 know, with the football, with baseball, whatever 00:15:23.490 --> 00:15:26.570 it was. And as time went on, especially now with 00:15:26.570 --> 00:15:28.830 the podcast, I start speaking to high level athletes 00:15:28.830 --> 00:15:32.850 and coaches. people from different walks of life, 00:15:33.029 --> 00:15:39.809 I realized that there is a danger of when you 00:15:39.809 --> 00:15:42.289 forge performance with a child, with a youth 00:15:42.289 --> 00:15:45.320 athlete, a high school, a college. that it can 00:15:45.320 --> 00:15:48.480 be done at the detriment of wellness, of longevity. 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:51.500 And you do see a lot of broken athletes when 00:15:51.500 --> 00:15:54.299 they're literally 18, 19, 20 years old. And I 00:15:54.299 --> 00:15:57.720 think that then is a huge dissuader for continuing 00:15:57.720 --> 00:16:00.320 to just simply enjoy sports, to simply move, 00:16:00.460 --> 00:16:03.519 to simply play. What was your experience as you 00:16:03.519 --> 00:16:04.980 walked through when you were playing football 00:16:04.980 --> 00:16:07.710 at a high level? that's a good question and do 00:16:07.710 --> 00:16:10.190 you mean like the physical ramifications of it 00:16:10.190 --> 00:16:11.570 because you're injuring your joints or do you 00:16:11.570 --> 00:16:13.110 mean like the emotional part where they're so 00:16:13.110 --> 00:16:14.970 burnt out they hate the sport and don't want 00:16:14.970 --> 00:16:22.009 to do it anymore yes and yes um i actually i 00:16:22.009 --> 00:16:25.669 loved i loved sports and i still do and i think 00:16:25.669 --> 00:16:30.950 that for me personally um it was so beneficial 00:16:30.950 --> 00:16:34.659 i still think of and it's funny how Some of the 00:16:34.659 --> 00:16:38.019 drills that I've spent decades, you know, like 00:16:38.019 --> 00:16:41.639 so long doing in track, like warm up drills and 00:16:41.639 --> 00:16:46.799 stuff, I find have helped my flying, my free 00:16:46.799 --> 00:16:53.879 flying, which is so funny. And one of the most 00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:56.200 influential people I think in my childhood was 00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:58.659 one of my track and cross country coaches in 00:16:58.659 --> 00:17:03.259 high school. And her name was Patti Lay. And 00:17:03.259 --> 00:17:06.759 she was like an Olympic caliber distance runner. 00:17:06.900 --> 00:17:12.660 And she instilled into us so much passion. And 00:17:12.660 --> 00:17:18.940 the thing that I think was so important and influential 00:17:18.940 --> 00:17:22.980 was about mindset and how your mindset can change 00:17:22.980 --> 00:17:27.940 your physical performance. You know, there's 00:17:27.940 --> 00:17:29.839 been a few key points in my life where I've really 00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:31.619 gone back and tried to analyze why they were 00:17:31.619 --> 00:17:33.460 key points. And I think that all of them kind 00:17:33.460 --> 00:17:36.339 of come down to a mindset shift. And there was 00:17:36.339 --> 00:17:40.539 one particular, it was just a practice that is 00:17:40.539 --> 00:17:43.400 like a core memory that stuck with me was my 00:17:43.400 --> 00:17:45.339 track team was really good. My cross country 00:17:45.339 --> 00:17:47.240 team was really good and our workouts were hard. 00:17:47.480 --> 00:17:51.240 And I was on the varsity team and we were doing 00:17:51.240 --> 00:17:53.460 a really challenging workout that, I mean, you 00:17:53.460 --> 00:17:54.960 just want to die. You felt like you're going 00:17:54.960 --> 00:17:57.549 to puke if you hadn't already. You know, it's 00:17:57.549 --> 00:18:00.190 mentally exhausting. It's, you know, sprints 00:18:00.190 --> 00:18:04.309 that are, you know, distance, distance length 00:18:04.309 --> 00:18:06.069 that you feel like you're sprinting with not 00:18:06.069 --> 00:18:08.450 enough rest and just you're worn out. And there 00:18:08.450 --> 00:18:10.990 was one left and everyone was just like, couldn't 00:18:10.990 --> 00:18:15.190 wait for it to be over. And she told her, she 00:18:15.190 --> 00:18:18.910 said to us, she said. you don't just survive 00:18:18.910 --> 00:18:21.089 this one which is what all of us were telling 00:18:21.089 --> 00:18:22.890 ourselves she's like you don't survive this one 00:18:22.890 --> 00:18:25.609 you grab it by the throat and you murder this 00:18:25.609 --> 00:18:28.890 one and it was she meant it like with such force 00:18:28.890 --> 00:18:31.710 and it was god is so fired up it's like i don't 00:18:31.710 --> 00:18:35.269 think i've ever run so hard when i was already 00:18:35.269 --> 00:18:37.970 so tired and went just that mindset shift i'm 00:18:37.970 --> 00:18:39.890 like oh i gotta get through this just survival 00:18:39.890 --> 00:18:44.910 mode to taking the opportunity to forge the most 00:18:46.109 --> 00:18:48.430 strengthened mindset so that when you come up 00:18:48.430 --> 00:18:52.390 running against other people you break them and 00:18:52.390 --> 00:18:55.130 you watch their mind you watch them you watch 00:18:55.130 --> 00:18:57.150 them think oh I'm not going to get left behind 00:18:57.150 --> 00:18:59.329 you watch them realize that you're not going 00:18:59.329 --> 00:19:00.910 to give up and you're going to punish them and 00:19:00.910 --> 00:19:03.029 you watch them quit and fall behind and I think 00:19:03.029 --> 00:19:07.789 that those lessons that I learned in sports from 00:19:07.789 --> 00:19:09.369 her it's not to say I wouldn't have learned them 00:19:09.369 --> 00:19:11.269 somewhere else but sports is where I learned 00:19:11.269 --> 00:19:15.789 them and I'm endlessly grateful for it and i 00:19:15.789 --> 00:19:18.109 feel like my life is better off for having her 00:19:18.109 --> 00:19:21.930 be my coach and for doing sports when i was young 00:19:21.930 --> 00:19:26.509 so when you reflect back what was it about the 00:19:26.509 --> 00:19:28.849 coaching and the environment that you were you 00:19:28.849 --> 00:19:32.470 know wrapped in that prevented the mental burnout 00:19:32.470 --> 00:19:34.549 the physical injuries that we see with a lot 00:19:34.549 --> 00:19:40.460 of other people um I did have some physical issues 00:19:40.460 --> 00:19:43.019 and I think that honestly it came from, I don't 00:19:43.019 --> 00:19:45.140 really know what they were. Even I think back 00:19:45.140 --> 00:19:48.720 in like pushing myself so hard mentally that 00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:54.200 my body really did collapse. Like passing out 00:19:54.200 --> 00:19:55.740 while you're running basically. I don't know 00:19:55.740 --> 00:19:59.539 if it was like glycogen stores running dry, like 00:19:59.539 --> 00:20:02.390 your body physically. Like generally when we're 00:20:02.390 --> 00:20:04.809 mentally fatigued, our body has so much more 00:20:04.809 --> 00:20:06.569 to give. And I feel like if you push past that 00:20:06.569 --> 00:20:09.089 point where your body actually gives out, that 00:20:09.089 --> 00:20:11.390 can cause psychological damage too. And there 00:20:11.390 --> 00:20:15.150 was definitely a period where I, my competitive 00:20:15.150 --> 00:20:17.549 drive was definitely reeled back. I felt like 00:20:17.549 --> 00:20:21.690 I had been damaged from it. And somewhere along 00:20:21.690 --> 00:20:25.549 the line, got better and found my competitive 00:20:25.549 --> 00:20:28.119 drive again. And pushed through it. So it's not 00:20:28.119 --> 00:20:30.059 to say there weren't setbacks, but I think in 00:20:30.059 --> 00:20:32.980 the grander scheme of things, it was important 00:20:32.980 --> 00:20:37.660 for me to have those lessons. And yeah, I'm not 00:20:37.660 --> 00:20:41.599 sure. I don't know what they did to necessarily 00:20:41.599 --> 00:20:43.680 prevent that from happening because it kind of 00:20:43.680 --> 00:20:47.960 did happen. But yeah, just set good examples 00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:52.869 of caring and working hard and that. When you 00:20:52.869 --> 00:20:54.490 were struggling, you could come to them with 00:20:54.490 --> 00:20:56.309 anything, whether it was in your personal life 00:20:56.309 --> 00:20:59.210 or your schoolwork or your running and knowing 00:20:59.210 --> 00:21:01.750 that they cared about me as a person and would 00:21:01.750 --> 00:21:04.230 be there for me to help me through, you know, 00:21:04.250 --> 00:21:06.150 those difficult times too and didn't discard 00:21:06.150 --> 00:21:09.170 you because you were having issues or got replaced 00:21:09.170 --> 00:21:11.390 in your performance by someone that was behind 00:21:11.390 --> 00:21:13.549 you. You know, they cared and wanted to bring 00:21:13.549 --> 00:21:16.410 you back up. Yeah, that's probably a big part 00:21:16.410 --> 00:21:19.210 of it too then because I know that loss of identity, 00:21:19.549 --> 00:21:22.410 that perceived failure. We're talking about children, 00:21:22.529 --> 00:21:28.170 so it's going to be crushing. Yeah. Walk to me 00:21:28.170 --> 00:21:30.430 through the nursing side then. So you go through 00:21:30.430 --> 00:21:33.549 the educational element. You enter the American 00:21:33.549 --> 00:21:36.809 medical system. What were some of the aha moments 00:21:36.809 --> 00:21:42.960 for you, the highs and the lows? Oh, man. So 00:21:42.960 --> 00:21:46.920 when I started nursing school, I had already 00:21:46.920 --> 00:21:49.140 started skydiving. I started skydiving in 2003, 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:53.799 moved to California in 2006, got into a really 00:21:53.799 --> 00:21:56.400 competitive nursing program. I basically scored 00:21:56.400 --> 00:22:00.079 in the top 1 % on the entrance exam and got accepted 00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:07.819 to CSU Sacramento, to Sac State. And somewhere... 00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:11.259 Between when I applied for nursing school and 00:22:11.259 --> 00:22:14.839 got in and when I got out, things went from multiple 00:22:14.839 --> 00:22:19.480 job opportunities and signing bonuses to there 00:22:19.480 --> 00:22:25.000 not being any jobs for new grads. And that is 00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:31.099 demoralizing. And school was hard. And I was 00:22:31.099 --> 00:22:36.400 loving. loving skydiving by then I was working 00:22:36.400 --> 00:22:39.559 on the drop zone on the weekends you know doing 00:22:39.559 --> 00:22:43.980 school work in between loads studying in between 00:22:43.980 --> 00:22:49.420 jumps and um it was really hard by the time I 00:22:49.420 --> 00:22:52.519 graduated I crawled across the finish line I 00:22:52.519 --> 00:22:54.519 did not want to be nursing all I wanted to do 00:22:54.519 --> 00:23:01.130 was skydive and so basically my um You know, 00:23:01.170 --> 00:23:05.990 my choices when I graduated were as a new grad, 00:23:06.069 --> 00:23:09.769 move away to somewhere else besides Northern 00:23:09.769 --> 00:23:14.130 California and get a job in a hospital or take 00:23:14.130 --> 00:23:16.529 a terrible job at like a skilled nursing facility. 00:23:17.329 --> 00:23:20.750 And I was killing it in my skydiving career. 00:23:20.869 --> 00:23:23.230 I was up and coming. I was, you know, jumping 00:23:23.230 --> 00:23:25.750 all the time and I didn't want to leave NorCal. 00:23:25.789 --> 00:23:32.259 I was thriving there. And so I opted. to pursue 00:23:32.259 --> 00:23:35.539 skydiving and put that first and had like a part 00:23:35.539 --> 00:23:38.119 -time job in a skilled nursing facility which 00:23:38.119 --> 00:23:41.700 man i appreciate the hard workers there so much 00:23:41.700 --> 00:23:48.519 it's it's a sad place to see what um you know 00:23:48.519 --> 00:23:52.250 the laws instead of protecting you know the nursing 00:23:52.250 --> 00:23:54.349 ratios and stuff those nurses are overworked 00:23:54.349 --> 00:23:56.250 and the patients are under care for not for a 00:23:56.250 --> 00:23:58.710 lack of compassion by the staff there but by 00:23:58.710 --> 00:24:02.930 the people who run them and you know the tools 00:24:02.930 --> 00:24:07.569 are given to work with is so sad and um and so 00:24:07.569 --> 00:24:11.309 the job sucked I hated it it was hard and um 00:24:11.309 --> 00:24:13.630 you leave every day feeling like you should have 00:24:13.630 --> 00:24:15.269 done a better job because you're not given the 00:24:15.269 --> 00:24:17.930 tools you need to take care of the people the 00:24:17.930 --> 00:24:20.900 way you want to take care of them and So when 00:24:20.900 --> 00:24:23.960 it was between that and full time skydiving, 00:24:24.019 --> 00:24:28.140 it was a pretty easy choice for me. And all I 00:24:28.140 --> 00:24:31.160 did was make my resume for nursing worse and 00:24:31.160 --> 00:24:33.819 worse in a really competitive field to get jobs 00:24:33.819 --> 00:24:36.279 in hospitals because, you know, there's hundreds 00:24:36.279 --> 00:24:39.759 of applicants for positions. So I spent the first 00:24:39.759 --> 00:24:43.319 six years of my nursing career skydiving and 00:24:43.319 --> 00:24:48.539 nursing very little. And it was through. um the 00:24:48.539 --> 00:24:50.400 skydiving network that someone was like oh yeah 00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:52.019 you want a job as a nurse we're always hiring 00:24:52.019 --> 00:24:55.599 on my unit got an interview got a job um which 00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:58.380 was intimidating after being out of the hospital 00:24:58.380 --> 00:25:01.259 and out of nursing school for six years before 00:25:01.259 --> 00:25:08.400 I got my first hospital job um and when I I had 00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:10.380 that job for a year and three months. And I know 00:25:10.380 --> 00:25:12.440 that because it's the longest I've ever had a 00:25:12.440 --> 00:25:15.940 real job where you have to ask for time off. 00:25:16.039 --> 00:25:18.039 And I've only done it twice in my whole life. 00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:21.680 I don't do very well with being told I can't 00:25:21.680 --> 00:25:27.640 go play for extended periods of time. But, you 00:25:27.640 --> 00:25:29.940 know, it was California too. And I love California, 00:25:29.960 --> 00:25:33.980 but there's some quirky things about Californians 00:25:33.980 --> 00:25:37.640 and the way things run there. I remember just 00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:39.940 getting pulled into the office. By that time, 00:25:39.940 --> 00:25:41.619 it was like every other day, I was always in 00:25:41.619 --> 00:25:45.559 trouble. And it was for stuff that was so dumb. 00:25:46.019 --> 00:25:50.599 And basically, you know, not to get into like 00:25:50.599 --> 00:25:53.859 the drama of working in the hospital, it was 00:25:53.859 --> 00:25:57.519 totally unwarranted. And the boss, she was the 00:25:57.519 --> 00:25:59.359 manager, because I think she couldn't cut it 00:25:59.359 --> 00:26:00.940 working on the floor. She'd only been a nurse 00:26:00.940 --> 00:26:03.819 for like six months to come to the pressure of 00:26:04.410 --> 00:26:06.369 you know, other people and whatever, for some 00:26:06.369 --> 00:26:09.730 reason, she kind of had it out for me. And I 00:26:09.730 --> 00:26:11.750 was in trouble once again for something like 00:26:11.750 --> 00:26:14.329 so dumb that was just pulling me off the floor, 00:26:14.430 --> 00:26:18.130 using our resource nurse to cover my patients 00:26:18.130 --> 00:26:20.029 instead of helping people that needed it. And 00:26:20.029 --> 00:26:22.809 I was miserable, you know, was just losing my 00:26:22.809 --> 00:26:25.769 hair from stress from this job that I was just 00:26:25.769 --> 00:26:30.430 miserable. And I just said, thank you for the 00:26:30.430 --> 00:26:33.670 opportunity. for having worked here this is my 00:26:33.670 --> 00:26:37.750 two weeks notice i'm out of here and i quit and 00:26:37.750 --> 00:26:41.250 became a travel nurse um which was a much better 00:26:41.250 --> 00:26:45.910 fit because i could skydive full time for six 00:26:45.910 --> 00:26:48.170 months or five months at a time and then take 00:26:48.170 --> 00:26:50.829 a nursing contract for three months you're not 00:26:50.829 --> 00:26:54.250 involved in any of the politics because you're 00:26:54.250 --> 00:26:57.599 only there for three months and you you know 00:26:57.599 --> 00:26:59.119 just pick the one thing like all right what's 00:26:59.119 --> 00:27:01.500 your unit care about this one thing I'll do a 00:27:01.500 --> 00:27:03.160 great job doing that one thing and then you're 00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:06.279 out of there after three months and it was it 00:27:06.279 --> 00:27:08.859 was a better fit for me and everyone says like 00:27:08.859 --> 00:27:11.660 oh nurses travel nurses make better money and 00:27:11.660 --> 00:27:13.700 for me all that meant was cool I only have to 00:27:13.700 --> 00:27:16.319 work half as much I can go skydive the other 00:27:16.319 --> 00:27:19.259 half so I probably didn't do the best job in 00:27:19.259 --> 00:27:21.640 terms of getting ahead financially but in terms 00:27:21.640 --> 00:27:24.750 of life life experience and you know, pursuing 00:27:24.750 --> 00:27:28.269 my passion, which has been skydiving since the 00:27:28.269 --> 00:27:31.829 first time I did it. Um, it was a great opportunity 00:27:31.829 --> 00:27:36.210 for me. Why was it so competitive? Was that post 00:27:36.210 --> 00:27:41.970 the 08 crash? Yeah, I'd left Anaheim, California 00:27:41.970 --> 00:27:45.029 right before that. And I was suddenly, you know, 00:27:45.049 --> 00:27:46.710 went through a divorce, was thinking about going 00:27:46.710 --> 00:27:48.289 back to California and they were like, Nope, 00:27:48.390 --> 00:27:53.779 there's no jobs here anymore. Yeah. Yeah. So 00:27:53.779 --> 00:27:56.359 it's interesting, though, because in my profession 00:27:56.359 --> 00:27:58.400 and your profession, if you look back then how 00:27:58.400 --> 00:28:01.740 competitive it was, and now you look at today, 00:28:02.079 --> 00:28:04.460 fire departments are offering signing bonuses. 00:28:04.500 --> 00:28:06.700 That's never, ever happened in the history of 00:28:06.700 --> 00:28:08.480 the fire service. And the same with nursing. 00:28:08.599 --> 00:28:11.799 And it's a reflection of not taking care of your 00:28:11.799 --> 00:28:14.359 people. That's really what it is. So there's 00:28:14.359 --> 00:28:18.680 so much. Yeah, I mean, there's just so many lessons 00:28:18.680 --> 00:28:20.180 that need to be learned. And I think, you know, 00:28:20.180 --> 00:28:23.049 in my profession. And there's this kind of beginning 00:28:23.049 --> 00:28:26.730 of a revolution where they're realizing we can't 00:28:26.730 --> 00:28:28.670 work our people into the ground. They're literally 00:28:28.670 --> 00:28:30.730 dying. So we have to change something. So the 00:28:30.730 --> 00:28:32.690 work week is starting to change here in Florida. 00:28:32.789 --> 00:28:34.710 And it's going to go across the country. There's 00:28:34.710 --> 00:28:36.930 no question. But, you know, nursing needs the 00:28:36.930 --> 00:28:38.670 same thing. I mean, I hear it all the time, the 00:28:38.670 --> 00:28:41.430 danger of the ratios. And, you know, not only 00:28:41.430 --> 00:28:44.569 is it incredibly unfair to the nurses and behind 00:28:44.569 --> 00:28:47.069 everything from burnout, excuse me, burnout to 00:28:47.069 --> 00:28:50.130 alcoholism to all the other things. The fact 00:28:50.130 --> 00:28:52.170 that patients are dying, patients are given the 00:28:52.170 --> 00:28:54.509 wrong doses, patients aren't given enough doses 00:28:54.509 --> 00:28:57.089 because you've got a nurse trying to run around 00:28:57.089 --> 00:29:00.029 that's also chronically overworked, sleep deprived, 00:29:00.089 --> 00:29:03.230 and just can't even think straight. Yeah, I think 00:29:03.230 --> 00:29:05.410 you hit the nail on the head. Couldn't agree 00:29:05.410 --> 00:29:09.170 more. We're expendable. They run you into the 00:29:09.170 --> 00:29:11.569 ground until you burn out and quit, and then 00:29:11.569 --> 00:29:15.029 they replace you. And it's just sad to see them 00:29:15.029 --> 00:29:17.410 spend that budget on new hires instead of paying. 00:29:18.109 --> 00:29:21.549 their staff, you know, what they're worth. And 00:29:21.549 --> 00:29:23.910 the more frustrating thing too, is, you know, 00:29:23.910 --> 00:29:25.549 they're looking at numbers on paper and their 00:29:25.549 --> 00:29:28.970 quarterlies and what you can't put a monetary 00:29:28.970 --> 00:29:32.670 value on. It's like the culture of the unit. 00:29:32.690 --> 00:29:34.890 And especially now, you know, they put so much 00:29:34.890 --> 00:29:39.049 emphasis on patient satisfaction scores and it's 00:29:39.049 --> 00:29:42.750 like, dude, yeah, it's, it's frustrating to even 00:29:42.750 --> 00:29:45.609 talk about. It's like, just take care of your 00:29:45.609 --> 00:29:49.930 staff, you know, and. Everyone feels it. And 00:29:49.930 --> 00:29:54.750 yeah, it's such a valuable job, you know, and 00:29:54.750 --> 00:29:58.029 it could be such a great career, but it's just 00:29:58.029 --> 00:30:01.450 ruined by the people that are in charge of the 00:30:01.450 --> 00:30:06.390 hospitals. Did you watch the show The Pit? I 00:30:06.390 --> 00:30:12.470 loved it. It was amazing. Yeah, I think, you 00:30:12.470 --> 00:30:14.529 know, there's obviously it's a TV, so it's not 00:30:14.529 --> 00:30:17.170 perfect, but I thought it did a pretty good job 00:30:17.170 --> 00:30:20.130 of what it feels like to work in the ER. And 00:30:20.130 --> 00:30:23.819 I, yeah, I enjoyed it. Yeah. I mean, you know, 00:30:23.880 --> 00:30:26.039 obviously we are getting the perspective of the 00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:28.019 medics in that show that walk through. We offload 00:30:28.019 --> 00:30:29.539 the patient, you know, we might hang out for 00:30:29.539 --> 00:30:31.819 a bit, find out why they're dying and then leave. 00:30:32.480 --> 00:30:35.500 But, you know, in COVID, you know, people were 00:30:35.500 --> 00:30:37.420 like, oh, there's this patients in the hallway. 00:30:37.640 --> 00:30:39.380 The reporters was like, there's always fucking 00:30:39.380 --> 00:30:41.059 patients in the hallway. Have you not been paying 00:30:41.059 --> 00:30:43.200 attention the rest of the time? and it's the 00:30:43.200 --> 00:30:46.960 same with the exactly and so then you know when 00:30:46.960 --> 00:30:48.960 you look at the patient satisfaction scores you 00:30:48.960 --> 00:30:50.839 know his his character the lead is like well 00:30:50.839 --> 00:30:52.680 of course they're not satisfied they're waiting 00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:55.259 eight fucking hours for a bed so how the hell 00:30:55.259 --> 00:30:57.539 are you supposed to get good good you know scores 00:30:57.539 --> 00:31:00.299 when you're again understaffed and overworked 00:31:00.299 --> 00:31:03.789 it's impossible Yeah, no, I loved that show. 00:31:04.049 --> 00:31:06.009 And other than, I thought it was funny that the 00:31:06.009 --> 00:31:08.109 doctors did so much of the work that really the 00:31:08.109 --> 00:31:11.210 nurses do. But other than that, it was pretty 00:31:11.210 --> 00:31:14.349 accurate. It was, it was great. All right, well 00:31:14.349 --> 00:31:16.250 then let's kind of roll the clock back for a 00:31:16.250 --> 00:31:19.329 second to 18 years old. What was it that made 00:31:19.329 --> 00:31:21.650 you even want to try skydiving in the first place? 00:31:22.569 --> 00:31:26.329 That's a good question. I get asked that a lot 00:31:26.329 --> 00:31:30.569 and I'm not really sure what it was that sparked 00:31:30.569 --> 00:31:33.539 it. But I think I was about 14 years old and 00:31:33.539 --> 00:31:37.740 I thought skydiving was so cool. And I think 00:31:37.740 --> 00:31:39.619 the big draw was I thought it was how cool, how 00:31:39.619 --> 00:31:41.960 much trust in themselves skydivers had. And I 00:31:41.960 --> 00:31:43.640 was like, that's insane. They can literally jump 00:31:43.640 --> 00:31:47.980 out of a plane and know with 100 % certainty 00:31:47.980 --> 00:31:50.079 that they're going to do what they need to do 00:31:50.079 --> 00:31:53.200 under the pressure of being in free fall and 00:31:53.200 --> 00:31:55.980 deploy their parachute and land safely. And I 00:31:55.980 --> 00:31:59.839 thought that was so cool. I knew that my dad 00:31:59.839 --> 00:32:01.880 had wanted to do a skydive when he was in college 00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:05.420 and never did it. And, and so we made a deal 00:32:05.420 --> 00:32:08.920 that we would go for, I, my dad and I just talked 00:32:08.920 --> 00:32:10.380 about this. I thought it was for my birthday. 00:32:10.460 --> 00:32:13.700 He said it was for graduation, but my birthday's 00:32:13.700 --> 00:32:17.200 in January. So in Washington state, that's pretty 00:32:17.200 --> 00:32:19.539 cold. But when I turned 18, I was like, right, 00:32:19.619 --> 00:32:22.380 dad, you remember our deal from a few years ago? 00:32:22.500 --> 00:32:25.480 And he was like, Oh man, no, I didn't. But okay, 00:32:25.579 --> 00:32:29.210 let's do it. And we. We jumped the day before 00:32:29.210 --> 00:32:32.049 I walked for high school graduation. And I don't 00:32:32.049 --> 00:32:34.450 even think I had jumped yet. And I was like, 00:32:34.529 --> 00:32:38.910 oh, yeah, this is for me. Like, I immediately 00:32:38.910 --> 00:32:43.130 felt like there wasn't anything wrong with me 00:32:43.130 --> 00:32:45.609 and I didn't need to keep trying to fit in anywhere. 00:32:45.750 --> 00:32:47.650 I was like, oh, there's nothing wrong with me. 00:32:47.670 --> 00:32:51.690 I just found my people like I'm good and loved 00:32:51.690 --> 00:32:56.430 it from before I even made my first jump. i've 00:32:56.430 --> 00:33:00.089 done two skydives in my life one in new zealand 00:33:00.089 --> 00:33:03.130 and then one did you ever jump with sean schumer 00:33:03.130 --> 00:33:07.450 yeah uh you know what's funny is i sean schumer 00:33:07.450 --> 00:33:09.650 is a good friend of mine and he's one of my husband's 00:33:09.650 --> 00:33:12.869 best friends and um i know i've been base jumping 00:33:12.869 --> 00:33:14.250 with him but i actually don't think i've ever 00:33:14.250 --> 00:33:17.650 been skydiving with him but we've flown wingsuits 00:33:17.650 --> 00:33:20.589 together in europe and done jumps off the bridge 00:33:20.589 --> 00:33:23.349 at the parine and yeah sean's wonderful and i 00:33:23.349 --> 00:33:25.470 actually listened to his podcast he did with 00:33:25.470 --> 00:33:30.710 you um oh brilliant yeah yeah um but did you 00:33:30.710 --> 00:33:33.329 jump with him did you skydive with him no so 00:33:33.329 --> 00:33:36.569 but i my second skydive was when we did 7x so 00:33:36.569 --> 00:33:38.329 we went around the world with the navy seals 00:33:38.329 --> 00:33:41.049 and all the guys so i've done one in new zealand 00:33:41.049 --> 00:33:43.440 which was absolutely stunning and then one over 00:33:43.440 --> 00:33:45.839 the pyramids from a Russian helicopter. So for 00:33:45.839 --> 00:33:48.900 a guy that's done two jumps, I'm so spoiled. 00:33:48.980 --> 00:33:51.359 But the reason I say that is the first one, full 00:33:51.359 --> 00:33:54.519 transparency, I was shitting myself, metaphorically 00:33:54.519 --> 00:33:56.819 and literally, like in the McDonald's bathroom 00:33:56.819 --> 00:34:00.880 right before. But when I landed, I was like, 00:34:00.980 --> 00:34:03.680 this was amazing. Now, I never was in an environment 00:34:03.680 --> 00:34:05.519 to pursue it. I was traveling around the world 00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:08.300 at the time, so I didn't find myself near a skydiving 00:34:08.300 --> 00:34:11.280 school. But I have to say, I went from sheer 00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:14.610 terror before. to again landing going i want 00:34:14.610 --> 00:34:16.590 to be an instructor didn't didn't you know full 00:34:16.590 --> 00:34:19.289 transplant did not take those steps but i i see 00:34:19.289 --> 00:34:22.190 you know the the the absolute thrill from that 00:34:22.190 --> 00:34:23.769 and then the second time was really interesting 00:34:23.769 --> 00:34:26.550 because i think post -fire service the adrenal 00:34:26.550 --> 00:34:29.730 fatigue i was doing almost like an experimentation 00:34:29.730 --> 00:34:31.530 i'm like well this is from a helicopter this 00:34:31.530 --> 00:34:34.190 time this is just a sheer drop no you know no 00:34:34.190 --> 00:34:37.340 forward motion from an airplane and nothing Had 00:34:37.340 --> 00:34:40.019 a blast, but didn't feel any adrenaline whatsoever. 00:34:40.260 --> 00:34:42.480 So I'm like, okay, I think I am a little broken 00:34:42.480 --> 00:34:44.820 from the fire service. But anyway, point being, 00:34:44.960 --> 00:34:48.159 I can resonate with that first time. That being 00:34:48.159 --> 00:34:51.000 said, though, you found your people. How did 00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:54.280 that develop into such a love of skydiving that 00:34:54.280 --> 00:34:56.059 you ended up making it an entire profession? 00:34:57.699 --> 00:35:01.139 I think it just developed organically. It's just, 00:35:01.199 --> 00:35:04.969 why do we love the things that we love? the people 00:35:04.969 --> 00:35:07.349 had a lot to do with it the personal challenge 00:35:07.349 --> 00:35:10.269 for sure like it is terrifying when you first 00:35:10.269 --> 00:35:12.730 start and i think that it's really gratifying 00:35:12.730 --> 00:35:17.489 to do things that are terrifying because it shows 00:35:17.489 --> 00:35:19.989 you the strength of overcoming those things and 00:35:19.989 --> 00:35:23.530 you know after enough jumps go by it's not terrifying 00:35:23.530 --> 00:35:26.369 anymore and you realize because you're given 00:35:26.369 --> 00:35:29.469 these tasks to do on each jump and those are 00:35:29.469 --> 00:35:32.159 challenging And then you get better at them and 00:35:32.159 --> 00:35:35.099 you complete those and start being given more 00:35:35.099 --> 00:35:39.039 challenging tasks. And it's like, it's not just 00:35:39.039 --> 00:35:42.360 the skydiving and the, you know, the adrenaline 00:35:42.360 --> 00:35:45.480 or anything like that. I just, I love the people. 00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:48.440 I thought it was fun and I thought it was challenging 00:35:48.440 --> 00:35:52.599 and it feels good to pursue challenge. And skydiving 00:35:52.599 --> 00:35:56.019 is really cool in the way that you don't have 00:35:56.019 --> 00:35:59.010 to be good at it. for it to be fun. It's like 00:35:59.010 --> 00:36:00.710 a great example of enjoying the progression. 00:36:01.269 --> 00:36:03.610 The entire progression is really fun. And there's 00:36:03.610 --> 00:36:06.909 never going to be a moment, I think, where I 00:36:06.909 --> 00:36:09.570 feel like, all right, I'm good. You know, like 00:36:09.570 --> 00:36:11.289 I'm on top. I don't have anything else to learn. 00:36:11.550 --> 00:36:15.610 So it's just continuously stimulating, whether 00:36:15.610 --> 00:36:19.250 that's, okay, now I'm good at doing this discipline. 00:36:19.349 --> 00:36:21.630 I can want to go work on my wingsuiting or I 00:36:21.630 --> 00:36:24.130 want to work on high performance canopy piloting. 00:36:24.130 --> 00:36:26.090 There's always more avenues and more challenges. 00:36:27.210 --> 00:36:29.809 And it is super fun. Like it is really gratifying. 00:36:29.829 --> 00:36:32.550 You just dangle one thing in front of me like, 00:36:32.630 --> 00:36:34.130 oh, my God, that was the best thing ever. I can't 00:36:34.130 --> 00:36:36.030 wait to do more of that. And there's just like 00:36:36.030 --> 00:36:41.590 a never ending supply of that feeling. So how 00:36:41.590 --> 00:36:44.250 did you transition into the wingsuit and base 00:36:44.250 --> 00:36:46.650 side? And then again, how many jumps did you 00:36:46.650 --> 00:36:49.030 have regularly before you made that transition? 00:36:50.309 --> 00:36:52.889 I would like to preface this with things were 00:36:52.889 --> 00:36:57.530 a little bit different back then. There was no, 00:36:57.610 --> 00:36:59.829 like nowadays there's like first flight courses. 00:36:59.869 --> 00:37:01.409 Like you want to learn how to fly a wingsuit. 00:37:01.429 --> 00:37:05.650 You get 200 skydives. You sign up for a first 00:37:05.650 --> 00:37:08.510 flight course and you go with an instructor and 00:37:08.510 --> 00:37:12.010 they teach you. And none of that existed. And 00:37:12.010 --> 00:37:20.090 I think I had somewhere around 85 skydives when 00:37:20.090 --> 00:37:22.610 I put my first wingsuit on. And I was like an 00:37:22.610 --> 00:37:25.289 18 year old girl. And some dude gave me a wingsuit. 00:37:26.619 --> 00:37:28.920 The wingsuits were really small back then, but 00:37:28.920 --> 00:37:31.659 still, I probably had no business flying it. 00:37:33.039 --> 00:37:37.159 And then I don't think I flew it again for, I 00:37:37.159 --> 00:37:39.599 don't know, a year or two, basically until I 00:37:39.599 --> 00:37:41.719 moved to California. So maybe a year or two later. 00:37:41.840 --> 00:37:47.079 And I just walked into the drop zone with complete 00:37:47.079 --> 00:37:50.139 confidence. Nobody knew who I was. No one knew 00:37:50.139 --> 00:37:53.179 that I had no idea how to fly it. And I just 00:37:53.179 --> 00:37:57.019 showed up. and manifested for a load and taught 00:37:57.019 --> 00:38:01.179 myself how to fly and um let's definitely you 00:38:01.179 --> 00:38:02.860 know there's more efficient ways to learn how 00:38:02.860 --> 00:38:05.000 to be good at something and it's definitely not 00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:08.099 the route I would recommend but that is what 00:38:08.099 --> 00:38:12.320 I did that's that's my story um and then for 00:38:12.320 --> 00:38:17.519 um and actually I guess an interesting part of 00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:21.940 that too I should back it up I went to I went 00:38:21.940 --> 00:38:24.619 to Baffin Island, which is in the Canadian Arctic, 00:38:24.699 --> 00:38:31.119 for my first expedition in 2007. And I went back 00:38:31.119 --> 00:38:35.619 in 2008. And at that point, I had more base jumps 00:38:35.619 --> 00:38:41.340 than skydives. And I was so inspired by the people 00:38:41.340 --> 00:38:45.460 wingsuit base jumping up there that I decided 00:38:45.460 --> 00:38:48.260 I need to get back into skydiving and I'm going 00:38:48.260 --> 00:38:50.659 to learn how to fly a wingsuit. And it was that 00:38:50.659 --> 00:38:56.059 motivation that drove me to go back to the drop 00:38:56.059 --> 00:38:59.679 zone and put on a wingsuit and really commit 00:38:59.679 --> 00:39:05.559 to learning how to fly and fly well. And I think 00:39:05.559 --> 00:39:08.280 I have my years messed up here. That was 2008 00:39:08.280 --> 00:39:11.000 that I was driven to go back to the drop zone 00:39:11.000 --> 00:39:12.699 and get good at flying because I went back in 00:39:12.699 --> 00:39:15.920 2010 for my third expedition up there and did 00:39:15.920 --> 00:39:19.039 my first wingsuit -based jump. after I had been 00:39:19.039 --> 00:39:21.099 training for two years really hard and put in 00:39:21.099 --> 00:39:26.900 a lot of work. And so, yeah, that's what sparks 00:39:26.900 --> 00:39:28.780 me learning how to fly wingsuits and kind of 00:39:28.780 --> 00:39:31.280 just going and doing it. And then I decided I 00:39:31.280 --> 00:39:33.739 needed to get good at flying my body in general 00:39:33.739 --> 00:39:37.019 and like learn the more fundamental skills. So 00:39:37.019 --> 00:39:39.219 I didn't necessarily do anything in the order 00:39:39.219 --> 00:39:42.559 that made sense in general. And took off my wingsuit 00:39:42.559 --> 00:39:44.860 and really learned how to fly my body well without 00:39:44.860 --> 00:39:48.019 it, which in the long run made me a much more 00:39:48.019 --> 00:39:52.139 proficient wingsuit pilot also. Because you can 00:39:52.139 --> 00:39:54.199 basically think of a wingsuit as like an amplifier, 00:39:54.480 --> 00:39:56.960 where if you're good at flying your body, because 00:39:56.960 --> 00:39:58.699 it gives you more surface area. So if you're 00:39:58.699 --> 00:40:01.059 doing things well, you have more power. And if 00:40:01.059 --> 00:40:05.139 you're not doing things well, it amplifies that 00:40:05.139 --> 00:40:10.449 also. So yeah, and so. That's kind of the path 00:40:10.449 --> 00:40:13.150 that I took through learning how to fly wingsuits. 00:40:13.289 --> 00:40:16.630 And in terms of how I learned how to base jump, 00:40:16.809 --> 00:40:21.650 I, oh man, this is another story of don't do 00:40:21.650 --> 00:40:23.510 things like I did them, but things were a little 00:40:23.510 --> 00:40:27.650 bit different back then. And I had 46 skydives 00:40:27.650 --> 00:40:30.590 when I started base jumping, which is not enough. 00:40:30.869 --> 00:40:35.869 And I was 18 and had gotten an academic scholarship 00:40:35.869 --> 00:40:42.199 to go to Montana State University. And, um, by 00:40:42.199 --> 00:40:43.860 the time when I signed up to go there, I was 00:40:43.860 --> 00:40:46.860 so excited. And by the time it was time to go, 00:40:47.039 --> 00:40:50.019 I was so sad. I didn't want to go to Montana. 00:40:50.199 --> 00:40:52.820 I started skydiving in that interim, just wanted 00:40:52.820 --> 00:40:55.519 to be in Washington with my friends and had met 00:40:55.519 --> 00:40:59.280 somebody there who was a base jumper who I ultimately 00:40:59.280 --> 00:41:02.099 ended up dating for like five and a half years. 00:41:02.500 --> 00:41:06.619 And, um, he was going to go base jumping in Twin 00:41:06.619 --> 00:41:10.280 Falls, Idaho. And I had convinced somebody because 00:41:10.280 --> 00:41:13.199 I didn't have a car that it would be fun to take 00:41:13.199 --> 00:41:16.340 a road trip to Twin Falls, Idaho and watch base 00:41:16.340 --> 00:41:20.840 jumping. And when I showed up, it was like 10 00:41:20.840 --> 00:41:24.400 o 'clock p .m. All the base jumpers I was going 00:41:24.400 --> 00:41:28.820 to meet were at, you know, Texas Roadhouse having 00:41:28.820 --> 00:41:31.900 tons of drinks. They were all hammered and they 00:41:31.900 --> 00:41:34.679 had already decided that they were going to throw 00:41:34.679 --> 00:41:37.440 me off the bridge the next day. And the person 00:41:37.440 --> 00:41:39.199 that I went there to meet had told them that 00:41:39.199 --> 00:41:42.900 I had 200 skydives. And I just kind of went along 00:41:42.900 --> 00:41:46.480 with it and fell in love with base jumping. And 00:41:46.480 --> 00:41:51.260 definitely realized that I didn't have a lot 00:41:51.260 --> 00:41:54.199 of experience. And instead of jumping full throttle 00:41:54.199 --> 00:41:58.920 into it, continued to skydive, continued to only 00:41:58.920 --> 00:42:02.119 jump really beginner -friendly objects that, 00:42:02.119 --> 00:42:04.000 you know, because I knew I was new at canopy 00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:07.000 piloting and all that. I liked to think that 00:42:07.000 --> 00:42:11.579 I did a not super responsible thing as safely 00:42:11.579 --> 00:42:16.300 as could have been done. Well, speaking of that, 00:42:16.380 --> 00:42:19.460 one of the skydivers I had on was Alistair McCartney. 00:42:19.500 --> 00:42:21.300 I don't know if you've come across him before, 00:42:21.360 --> 00:42:24.400 but in the interview, I remember him saying, 00:42:24.639 --> 00:42:26.719 you know, people will say, well, you know, it's 00:42:26.719 --> 00:42:29.659 99 % safe or whatever the term that will be used. 00:42:29.820 --> 00:42:31.280 And he's like, but you can't do that in base 00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:34.199 jumping. He's like, you know, that 1 % means 00:42:34.199 --> 00:42:36.940 you died. So we were talking about the diligence 00:42:36.940 --> 00:42:39.440 of training. The perception that people have 00:42:39.440 --> 00:42:41.280 is, you know, a lot of the extreme sports people 00:42:41.280 --> 00:42:44.059 are, you know, foolish and they're taking unnecessary 00:42:44.059 --> 00:42:48.300 risks, but you listen to the diligence of the 00:42:48.300 --> 00:42:50.849 training. It makes you realize, same with Alex 00:42:50.849 --> 00:42:52.489 Honnold. I mean, we're talking about Jimmy Chin 00:42:52.489 --> 00:42:54.650 earlier, you know, the free solo. I mean, the 00:42:54.650 --> 00:42:57.309 number of times that he prepared for that route, 00:42:57.590 --> 00:43:00.170 he basically got to the point where he couldn't 00:43:00.170 --> 00:43:02.829 fail. So just elaborate on that a little bit, 00:43:02.909 --> 00:43:04.550 you know, because my profession, again, you know, 00:43:04.550 --> 00:43:06.909 if we don't prepare properly, we could die as 00:43:06.909 --> 00:43:10.030 well. So what is the kind of behind the scenes 00:43:10.030 --> 00:43:12.590 as far as a preparation for, you know, bass, 00:43:12.730 --> 00:43:14.510 wingsuit, some of the extreme stuff that you're 00:43:14.510 --> 00:43:17.349 doing? Yeah, that's a great question that you 00:43:17.349 --> 00:43:19.190 asked. And it's funny you bring up, you know, 00:43:19.210 --> 00:43:21.690 Alex Honnold and Jimmy Chin, because we're actually 00:43:21.690 --> 00:43:26.849 shooting a Jimmy Chin documentary right now for 00:43:26.849 --> 00:43:30.349 The Sphere that is also featuring Alex Honnold. 00:43:30.989 --> 00:43:34.170 And the premise behind it, the documentary is 00:43:34.170 --> 00:43:37.690 called From the Edge. And that is the premise. 00:43:37.750 --> 00:43:42.340 It's about why do we do what we do? And what's 00:43:42.340 --> 00:43:44.739 the behind the scenes, what's the planning and 00:43:44.739 --> 00:43:46.719 the thought process that goes into something 00:43:46.719 --> 00:43:49.940 that you just watch a one minute clip on Instagram 00:43:49.940 --> 00:43:51.559 or on YouTube and you're like, oh, that guy's 00:43:51.559 --> 00:43:54.780 crazy. But what you don't see is, you know, the 00:43:54.780 --> 00:43:59.139 years of preparation and the, you know, maybe 00:43:59.139 --> 00:44:03.400 just there's so much thought that goes into it 00:44:03.400 --> 00:44:06.360 that you don't see from that one minute clip 00:44:06.360 --> 00:44:08.340 that you watch. And like in the base jumping 00:44:08.340 --> 00:44:11.239 side. You know, it depends on what your goals 00:44:11.239 --> 00:44:14.860 are. Like say your goal is to wingsuit base jump. 00:44:14.880 --> 00:44:17.940 I'll use an example. There's a jump that I wanted 00:44:17.940 --> 00:44:22.059 to do called Pise de Lac and it's in the Dolomites. 00:44:22.059 --> 00:44:24.840 And it's this amazing wingsuit base jump that 00:44:24.840 --> 00:44:26.500 I watched a video. I was like, oh my God, I want 00:44:26.500 --> 00:44:30.019 to do that. But basically you jump off the exit, 00:44:30.059 --> 00:44:33.380 you fly right. And then you can either just kind 00:44:33.380 --> 00:44:35.579 of fly down and land safely. And it's a fairly, 00:44:35.699 --> 00:44:38.750 you know. I hate to use the word boring, but 00:44:38.750 --> 00:44:40.730 like, you know, there's not a lot going on in 00:44:40.730 --> 00:44:44.230 the flight or you can fly to the right of this 00:44:44.230 --> 00:44:46.849 ridgeline. And basically you're like entrenched 00:44:46.849 --> 00:44:49.989 in this crack between the cliff you just jumped 00:44:49.989 --> 00:44:52.349 off on your hard right. And this whole nother 00:44:52.349 --> 00:44:55.170 cliff band that's now on your left, you know, 00:44:55.170 --> 00:45:01.630 and it's something that you watch and there's. 00:45:03.569 --> 00:45:05.949 It looks cool, but you don't realize, you know, 00:45:05.949 --> 00:45:07.989 it's easy to get judged for like, oh man, that 00:45:07.989 --> 00:45:10.110 guy is stupid. He has a death wish. But what 00:45:10.110 --> 00:45:12.969 you don't see is like, all right, I'm going to 00:45:12.969 --> 00:45:16.969 go get all this GPS data on what my exits look 00:45:16.969 --> 00:45:19.570 like. I'm going to make sure that I know my data 00:45:19.570 --> 00:45:22.650 points overlay this jump I can do. I'm going 00:45:22.650 --> 00:45:24.969 to make sure I learn about reading the weather. 00:45:25.030 --> 00:45:28.989 I'm going to make sure that my. The first few 00:45:28.989 --> 00:45:31.510 jumps I do off it, I'm flying around it, just 00:45:31.510 --> 00:45:33.710 doing reconnaissance to make sure that I'm hitting 00:45:33.710 --> 00:45:35.710 the checkpoints I could have. I wanted to go 00:45:35.710 --> 00:45:38.489 into that entry gate, making sure that I'm taking 00:45:38.489 --> 00:45:43.730 into consideration that conditions change from 00:45:43.730 --> 00:45:45.429 jump to jump. And just because the last time 00:45:45.429 --> 00:45:48.070 I was here, I could have made it to that entry 00:45:48.070 --> 00:45:50.429 gate, realizing in the moment not to get caught 00:45:50.429 --> 00:45:53.670 up into that and making sure you're assessing 00:45:53.670 --> 00:45:56.409 on. The jump that you're going to go for, that 00:45:56.409 --> 00:45:59.650 your plan is still to, or at least for me, to 00:45:59.650 --> 00:46:02.489 bail and fly around it, unless it's just begging 00:46:02.489 --> 00:46:04.170 to be jumped and you're still hitting all your 00:46:04.170 --> 00:46:06.949 checkpoints that maybe you have sinkier conditions 00:46:06.949 --> 00:46:09.389 and you're not going to. There's so much that 00:46:09.389 --> 00:46:11.570 goes into it. And then the first time that I, 00:46:11.670 --> 00:46:15.889 not the first time I did that jump, but it's 00:46:15.889 --> 00:46:19.530 like the first time I flew that line. I was grinning 00:46:19.530 --> 00:46:22.250 from ear to ear and I was thinking, I'm doing 00:46:22.250 --> 00:46:25.130 it. I was so excited. And I was so proud of the 00:46:25.130 --> 00:46:28.070 fact that I had flown it. But the most, the thing 00:46:28.070 --> 00:46:31.849 that I was most proud about was my approach to 00:46:31.849 --> 00:46:33.690 it. And that I didn't just go fly this line that 00:46:33.690 --> 00:46:36.909 I thought looked really cool was that I had a 00:46:36.909 --> 00:46:40.489 really measured approach to how I did it. And, 00:46:40.530 --> 00:46:41.690 you know, and those are the kinds of things that 00:46:41.690 --> 00:46:44.449 you don't necessarily see from just watching 00:46:44.449 --> 00:46:46.710 somebody's video and thinking that they're crazy. 00:46:47.929 --> 00:46:50.010 That if somebody is raining it back, you know, 00:46:50.289 --> 00:46:55.070 say if you fly at 100 % and you're flying to 00:46:55.070 --> 00:46:58.369 the edge of your performance envelope all the 00:46:58.369 --> 00:47:02.010 time, you know, things do go, things eventually 00:47:02.010 --> 00:47:06.449 go wrong. And if you're not padding kind of your 00:47:06.449 --> 00:47:10.409 margin for error so that you can accommodate 00:47:10.409 --> 00:47:12.630 for those things to go wrong, eventually when 00:47:12.630 --> 00:47:14.590 they go wrong, you're going to get really hurt 00:47:14.590 --> 00:47:20.050 or die. you know, everyone's 80 % looks different. 00:47:20.670 --> 00:47:24.730 So it's hard to judge someone based just off 00:47:24.730 --> 00:47:26.329 what they're doing without knowing the person 00:47:26.329 --> 00:47:28.329 and knowing that the work that they've put in, 00:47:28.389 --> 00:47:30.550 because some people are flying at a hundred percent 00:47:30.550 --> 00:47:32.130 and they are idiots and they are probably going 00:47:32.130 --> 00:47:34.670 to die, but someone else might be flying. They're 00:47:34.670 --> 00:47:37.110 just really good. And they've put in a ton of 00:47:37.110 --> 00:47:39.730 work and it might look crazy to me watching it. 00:47:39.809 --> 00:47:41.789 And then you realize that that person is just 00:47:41.789 --> 00:47:44.710 that good and they really are padding it and 00:47:44.710 --> 00:47:47.150 they're flying at their 80%. And I think that's 00:47:47.150 --> 00:47:49.750 just something interesting and a good lesson 00:47:49.750 --> 00:47:52.449 to keep in mind. But the most important part 00:47:52.449 --> 00:47:55.730 of that is to realize that you can't fly at your 00:47:55.730 --> 00:47:58.929 max and pushing it all the time because something 00:47:58.929 --> 00:48:01.750 will go wrong eventually. And then you won't 00:48:01.750 --> 00:48:04.550 get to have this wonderful experience of life 00:48:04.550 --> 00:48:08.510 anymore. I've never even thought of it that way. 00:48:09.699 --> 00:48:12.219 If I think of it in like the gym, totally different 00:48:12.219 --> 00:48:14.880 example. But, you know, when I was younger and 00:48:14.880 --> 00:48:17.400 CrossFit was younger, you know, there'd be that 00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:19.340 one rep max that everyone was trying to get. 00:48:19.500 --> 00:48:21.460 And more often than not, you'd be sore as hell 00:48:21.460 --> 00:48:23.420 for a few days if you didn't, you know, F you 00:48:23.420 --> 00:48:26.280 back up. But now as we've matured, you know, 00:48:26.300 --> 00:48:29.019 my gym, we do a five rep max or a three rep maybe. 00:48:29.639 --> 00:48:32.239 And, you know. for me now if you look to me not 00:48:32.239 --> 00:48:34.099 that i'm going to be lifting that heavy at all 00:48:34.099 --> 00:48:36.800 i'm never going to that 100 anymore because i'm 00:48:36.800 --> 00:48:39.760 51 and i want to i want to as you said have that 00:48:39.760 --> 00:48:42.119 envelope i'm happy working in that envelope because 00:48:42.119 --> 00:48:44.880 there is a margin for error if i lose you know 00:48:44.880 --> 00:48:47.539 the the kind of brace in my back slightly i'm 00:48:47.539 --> 00:48:49.760 not going to be so heavy that it's going to tear 00:48:49.760 --> 00:48:52.739 everything apart again and from the outside looking 00:48:52.739 --> 00:48:55.829 in someone who's performing at a high level It's 00:48:55.829 --> 00:48:58.090 a great, great point. We would think, oh, that's 00:48:58.090 --> 00:49:00.210 their 100%, but it's not. You've still got that 00:49:00.210 --> 00:49:02.670 margin of error. And this seems to line up with 00:49:02.670 --> 00:49:04.489 what a few of your peers have said on the show. 00:49:04.730 --> 00:49:06.889 I think Dukes and some other people talked about 00:49:06.889 --> 00:49:10.110 this. You've got this kind of copycat element 00:49:10.110 --> 00:49:13.070 that are seeing people like yourselves and then 00:49:13.070 --> 00:49:15.829 taking shortcuts in the base community or wingsuit 00:49:15.829 --> 00:49:18.699 community. And now they are, as you alluded to, 00:49:18.780 --> 00:49:21.480 at that 100%. And the moment there is a change 00:49:21.480 --> 00:49:24.940 in weather or whatever it is, you see these catastrophic 00:49:24.940 --> 00:49:31.940 accidents. You do. And it's interesting you bring 00:49:31.940 --> 00:49:33.719 that up, too, because, I mean, we talked about 00:49:33.719 --> 00:49:36.059 that I just had an accident a few years ago. 00:49:36.119 --> 00:49:39.239 The things that I've just been talking about 00:49:39.239 --> 00:49:43.380 are things that I've learned and held close to. 00:49:45.550 --> 00:49:48.949 to myself throughout my career. And it doesn't 00:49:48.949 --> 00:49:51.110 mean that I'm infallible and don't mess up either. 00:49:51.210 --> 00:49:53.170 And I feel like that's part of the reason that 00:49:53.170 --> 00:49:55.889 got me into my accident. And I thought I was 00:49:55.889 --> 00:49:59.610 safely past this point, not in my twenties anymore, 00:49:59.849 --> 00:50:04.829 you know, and I still got caught up with, with 00:50:04.829 --> 00:50:08.110 forcing it. There was a line that I really wanted 00:50:08.110 --> 00:50:10.849 to jump. I'd watched a video of a friend fly 00:50:10.849 --> 00:50:15.989 it. um I wanted it and it's funny how when you 00:50:15.989 --> 00:50:18.630 want something really badly and are essentially 00:50:18.630 --> 00:50:23.170 forcing it that you can justify things that if 00:50:23.170 --> 00:50:25.329 you took a step back and were looking more objectively 00:50:25.329 --> 00:50:29.389 like no that's probably not a good idea but you 00:50:29.389 --> 00:50:32.969 know when you're in the middle of it I think 00:50:32.969 --> 00:50:35.409 that me personally I lost sight of some of those 00:50:35.409 --> 00:50:38.960 lessons that I had learned and went out to go 00:50:38.960 --> 00:50:42.559 do this jump that I wanted really badly and it 00:50:42.559 --> 00:50:45.860 was at high altitude you know so the air is less 00:50:45.860 --> 00:50:49.119 dense it was a warmer day than you know it was 00:50:49.119 --> 00:50:53.360 a warm day and so the air is less dense and um 00:50:53.360 --> 00:50:57.900 intuition we haven't talked about that yet but 00:50:57.900 --> 00:51:00.219 I think that intuition man is something this 00:51:00.219 --> 00:51:02.159 deeper sense trying to tell you something and 00:51:02.159 --> 00:51:05.639 I think that it's really worth listening to and 00:51:05.639 --> 00:51:08.989 my intuition was telling me something was off 00:51:08.989 --> 00:51:11.210 that day and I didn't really want to do the jump 00:51:11.210 --> 00:51:15.150 but I I wanted it that's why I was there and 00:51:15.150 --> 00:51:19.789 I felt like this was my opportunity and no one 00:51:19.789 --> 00:51:21.730 had ever jumped to the exit that we were jumping 00:51:21.730 --> 00:51:28.469 it was farther back in a gully and lower than 00:51:28.469 --> 00:51:30.909 the exit we had watched someone jump on that 00:51:30.909 --> 00:51:34.449 video and Even though what we call like the rock 00:51:34.449 --> 00:51:36.909 drop was higher. So like the actual distance 00:51:36.909 --> 00:51:40.190 to get your vertical distance to get flying was 00:51:40.190 --> 00:51:43.630 higher. The exit overall was lower and it was 00:51:43.630 --> 00:51:46.309 a fairly flat jump, like where you have to have 00:51:46.309 --> 00:51:50.170 a pretty good glide to get out. And conditions 00:51:50.170 --> 00:51:53.090 were not lifty like they were when I watched 00:51:53.090 --> 00:51:58.269 that friend fly. And there was three of us out 00:51:58.269 --> 00:52:02.719 there that day. And the first person went. And 00:52:02.719 --> 00:52:05.099 he called back up and he basically said, oh, 00:52:05.199 --> 00:52:09.059 it's kind of sinky, you know, but you should 00:52:09.059 --> 00:52:13.739 be good. And it's like, it wasn't good. It was 00:52:13.739 --> 00:52:16.380 sinky. My intuition was telling me not to go 00:52:16.380 --> 00:52:20.400 there or not to jump. It was forced. Like I just 00:52:20.400 --> 00:52:22.280 wasn't in the right headspace. The whole thing 00:52:22.280 --> 00:52:26.420 had so many red flags and I just figured it would 00:52:26.420 --> 00:52:33.519 be okay. And from the moment I exited. it didn't 00:52:33.519 --> 00:52:36.480 feel good I'm the exact thought in my head was 00:52:36.480 --> 00:52:38.840 what the fuck like I didn't think I would be 00:52:38.840 --> 00:52:42.300 this low in this gully and you know it's the 00:52:42.300 --> 00:52:45.539 beginning of the jump I was optimistic that I 00:52:45.539 --> 00:52:48.019 was still going to have enough clearance to get 00:52:48.019 --> 00:52:50.159 over this ridge line to the right which was plan 00:52:50.159 --> 00:52:54.239 a plan b was to just fly get ridge lift and fly 00:52:54.239 --> 00:52:56.440 kind of high up on the ridge use the lift and 00:52:56.440 --> 00:52:58.739 just fly down to the bottom and deploy my parachute 00:52:58.739 --> 00:53:02.659 and I just kept looking for my opportunities 00:53:02.659 --> 00:53:04.840 to cross that ridgeline, and I was just never 00:53:04.840 --> 00:53:07.940 really high enough over the ground that I was 00:53:07.940 --> 00:53:10.619 in a comfortable place. I never felt really high 00:53:10.619 --> 00:53:12.900 enough to pull, nor were there any good landing 00:53:12.900 --> 00:53:18.280 areas up there. I was trying different things 00:53:18.280 --> 00:53:21.559 to get more altitude. I was trying to fly glidier, 00:53:21.739 --> 00:53:24.679 which would give you separation from the ground 00:53:24.679 --> 00:53:28.079 because you would gain altitude, but flying with 00:53:28.079 --> 00:53:32.489 max glide. gives you a really slow speed which 00:53:32.489 --> 00:53:34.909 is dangerous because speed equals lift and if 00:53:34.909 --> 00:53:37.969 you don't have enough power from flying fast 00:53:37.969 --> 00:53:40.809 you can't pull away from terrain when you need 00:53:40.809 --> 00:53:43.769 to it was just it was not good it's like so I 00:53:43.769 --> 00:53:45.809 was flying max glide and thinking this is stupid 00:53:45.809 --> 00:53:48.110 I shouldn't be flying max glide and it's not 00:53:48.110 --> 00:53:51.409 working so I tried to pitch a little bit steeper 00:53:51.409 --> 00:53:53.849 and pick up speed so that I could kind of like 00:53:53.849 --> 00:53:56.170 flare away from the terrain and couldn't do that 00:53:56.170 --> 00:54:02.380 and just watching my opportunities disappear 00:54:02.380 --> 00:54:04.679 you know and finally I was like I'm pretty sure 00:54:04.679 --> 00:54:06.920 that was the last opportunity to cross it I wasn't 00:54:06.920 --> 00:54:10.460 high enough and before you know it I was just 00:54:10.460 --> 00:54:13.880 so low in this canyon not really at an altitude 00:54:13.880 --> 00:54:18.260 high enough to pull and the and the gully just 00:54:18.260 --> 00:54:20.320 like flattens out into there's no like cliff 00:54:20.320 --> 00:54:22.599 band at the bottom where you gain altitude again 00:54:22.599 --> 00:54:26.760 it just kind of melts into the horizon and I 00:54:26.760 --> 00:54:33.000 had a solid like 15 seconds to realize that that 00:54:33.000 --> 00:54:35.699 was probably the last 15 seconds of my life. 00:54:35.860 --> 00:54:42.000 And I think when you're having an intense moment, 00:54:42.079 --> 00:54:44.500 I experienced this thing called like time dilation. 00:54:44.579 --> 00:54:49.079 And so 15 seconds is like an eternity to think 00:54:49.079 --> 00:54:54.239 about how I had just effed up. I was so mad at 00:54:54.239 --> 00:54:58.199 myself. And there was no like moment of like, 00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:01.159 well, I had a good life. I was so pissed and 00:55:01.159 --> 00:55:03.420 in denial. I was like, are you serious? Are you 00:55:03.420 --> 00:55:05.659 kidding me right now? And, you know, I thought 00:55:05.659 --> 00:55:08.280 about my family. I thought about like, man, I've 00:55:08.280 --> 00:55:11.659 always wondered what people's last thoughts are 00:55:11.659 --> 00:55:14.519 before they go in. And I was like, man, I guess 00:55:14.519 --> 00:55:16.659 I'm having those thoughts right now. That's weird. 00:55:17.099 --> 00:55:22.960 Like, and I was like, well, this sucks, but it's. 00:55:23.500 --> 00:55:27.519 about to just all be black and I was like I'm 00:55:27.519 --> 00:55:31.980 not gonna I'm not gonna go in without not at 00:55:31.980 --> 00:55:34.059 least going through the motions of trying and 00:55:34.059 --> 00:55:37.039 I threw my pilot chute which for those of you 00:55:37.039 --> 00:55:38.719 who aren't familiar with skydiving the base jumping 00:55:38.719 --> 00:55:41.179 the pilot chutes that little parachute that pulls 00:55:41.179 --> 00:55:43.960 out the big parachute I threw my pilot chute 00:55:43.960 --> 00:55:48.579 basically as I hit the one tree that was around 00:55:48.579 --> 00:55:54.889 in this rocky gully and basically hit a decomposing 00:55:54.889 --> 00:55:57.130 log. I went through the tree, head first through 00:55:57.130 --> 00:56:00.610 the tree, smashed into a decomposing log and 00:56:00.610 --> 00:56:03.250 like did a backwards somersault and stood up. 00:56:04.929 --> 00:56:08.969 And I was like, why am I not dead? Like, how 00:56:08.969 --> 00:56:13.489 am I conscious right now? And how am I standing? 00:56:13.750 --> 00:56:15.710 I was like, there's no way I'm okay. Like my 00:56:15.710 --> 00:56:18.170 legs must be broken. I'm standing on adrenaline. 00:56:20.400 --> 00:56:22.800 And I knew, I was like, all right, do I know 00:56:22.800 --> 00:56:26.820 who I am, where I am, like when I am, what happened? 00:56:26.900 --> 00:56:28.320 I was like, well, that's probably a good sign 00:56:28.320 --> 00:56:30.679 that I know to even check those things. And then 00:56:30.679 --> 00:56:34.619 I looked at my parachute in the tree and that's 00:56:34.619 --> 00:56:39.039 when I really, I was like, oh my God, my parachute 00:56:39.039 --> 00:56:42.739 was still completely packed together. And the 00:56:42.739 --> 00:56:46.780 slider that slows the deployment down so you 00:56:46.780 --> 00:56:48.460 don't break your neck because it opens too hard 00:56:48.460 --> 00:56:50.670 was still all the way up in the parachute. Meaning 00:56:50.670 --> 00:56:53.789 my parachute hadn't really started to deploy. 00:56:54.289 --> 00:56:58.150 And I don't know if just like the, you know, 00:56:58.150 --> 00:57:00.630 if it snagged in the tree and helped decelerate 00:57:00.630 --> 00:57:06.170 me. I'm not totally sure. I don't know. None 00:57:06.170 --> 00:57:08.349 of it makes any sense to me, which is something 00:57:08.349 --> 00:57:13.449 I had to come to grips with. The why of why I'm 00:57:13.449 --> 00:57:18.929 still alive. But I called. I called the person 00:57:18.929 --> 00:57:22.610 who hadn't jumped yet because basically I disappeared 00:57:22.610 --> 00:57:25.750 from view from the person on the top. And I never 00:57:25.750 --> 00:57:27.949 appeared from view to the person on the ground. 00:57:28.030 --> 00:57:31.329 So nobody saw what happened. And I was wearing 00:57:31.329 --> 00:57:34.170 a camera, which we saw later the footage from, 00:57:34.230 --> 00:57:36.369 which is pretty insane. But I called the guy 00:57:36.369 --> 00:57:39.289 on the top to tell him it's not good to jump. 00:57:39.510 --> 00:57:42.030 And he was also, as it turns out, we talked about 00:57:42.030 --> 00:57:47.980 later, a little unsettled up there. Similar to 00:57:47.980 --> 00:57:50.099 how I was feeling. And he turned his phone on 00:57:50.099 --> 00:57:52.960 to airplane mode so that no one would disturb 00:57:52.960 --> 00:57:58.579 him. And so he jumped. I got a hold of the guy 00:57:58.579 --> 00:58:04.400 that was on the ground and said, I landed in 00:58:04.400 --> 00:58:08.420 a tree. I think I'm okay, but I need help, which 00:58:08.420 --> 00:58:10.440 is like the understatement of the century. Like 00:58:10.440 --> 00:58:13.019 I watched the footage recently. I was like, it's 00:58:13.019 --> 00:58:15.039 so not clear what happened from what I said. 00:58:16.429 --> 00:58:18.590 He probably, I'm sure he thought I just opened, 00:58:18.690 --> 00:58:22.329 landed in a tree and was being a wuss, you know? 00:58:22.469 --> 00:58:25.590 And I basically, I started to walk down the gully 00:58:25.590 --> 00:58:27.889 and there was a bunch of bees. You can't make 00:58:27.889 --> 00:58:29.530 this up, right? There was a bunch of bees and 00:58:29.530 --> 00:58:31.530 I think I'm allergic to bees. I was like, are 00:58:31.530 --> 00:58:33.869 you serious right now? So I turned around, this 00:58:33.869 --> 00:58:37.989 is after I stashed all my gear and started to 00:58:37.989 --> 00:58:42.329 walk up the gully to find a path to get found. 00:58:42.489 --> 00:58:45.469 And as I was stashing my gear, it started to 00:58:45.469 --> 00:58:51.219 become, uh difficult to breathe and you know 00:58:51.219 --> 00:58:57.820 a moment set in of like definitely uh realizing 00:58:57.820 --> 00:59:01.500 because of the mechanism of injury and what I 00:59:01.500 --> 00:59:04.659 was experiencing that this could be really bad 00:59:04.659 --> 00:59:08.519 and I was pretty far from help and really having 00:59:08.519 --> 00:59:12.639 to just coach myself through staying calm I was 00:59:12.639 --> 00:59:17.920 in a pretty bad situation and freaking out wasn't 00:59:17.920 --> 00:59:20.280 going to help anything and if I'm far from help 00:59:20.280 --> 00:59:23.340 the only way to get closer even if it seems really 00:59:23.340 --> 00:59:26.039 far away is to just start moving towards it and 00:59:26.039 --> 00:59:31.820 so um walked up the gully found a path found 00:59:31.820 --> 00:59:35.260 my friends gave them my gear and one person went 00:59:35.260 --> 00:59:39.239 to go get the car and I found the closest level 00:59:39.239 --> 00:59:41.239 on trauma center and called report on myself 00:59:41.239 --> 00:59:45.889 and um Someone saw my friend running to get the 00:59:45.889 --> 00:59:47.690 car and just said, do you need help? And he said, 00:59:47.750 --> 00:59:49.409 yeah, because the car was pretty far away, like 00:59:49.409 --> 00:59:52.090 over a mile. And my friend jumped on the back 00:59:52.090 --> 00:59:54.230 of this guy's dirt bike, went and got the car, 00:59:54.269 --> 00:59:56.469 came and picked up me and the friend that was 00:59:56.469 --> 01:00:00.869 with me and took me to the hospital. And yeah, 01:00:01.010 --> 01:00:03.849 that's kind of the beginning of that journey. 01:00:05.690 --> 01:00:08.050 What was the difficulty breathing specifically? 01:00:08.190 --> 01:00:12.050 Was that attention pneumo or hemothorax? I was 01:00:12.050 --> 01:00:15.969 worried about that. I was worried about pericardial 01:00:15.969 --> 01:00:18.610 effusions. I was worried about all kinds of stuff 01:00:18.610 --> 01:00:22.030 going on in my chest. And it turns out it was 01:00:22.030 --> 01:00:25.110 a pulmonary contusion. So I had a bruised lung 01:00:25.110 --> 01:00:30.730 and mild concussion while I was in the hospital. 01:00:30.769 --> 01:00:33.289 Part of my vision started getting pretty weird. 01:00:34.909 --> 01:00:37.929 And they ultrasounded in my eyeball. They did 01:00:37.929 --> 01:00:41.050 so many scans. They put me back. in the CT machine 01:00:41.050 --> 01:00:44.409 for a CTA, like they, they checked everything 01:00:44.409 --> 01:00:50.670 and I had basically bruised, bruised bones. It 01:00:50.670 --> 01:00:53.130 was pretty bruised up, but I didn't break anything 01:00:53.130 --> 01:00:59.130 and had a mild concussion, which is unreal. Absolutely 01:00:59.130 --> 01:01:03.829 unreal. I had a bone bruise in my, my fist. in 01:01:03.829 --> 01:01:06.590 a kickboxing you know match not really a match 01:01:06.590 --> 01:01:09.590 but in training um but it went full contact it 01:01:09.590 --> 01:01:13.090 was like fight club and uh took forever to heal 01:01:13.090 --> 01:01:15.809 and then one of the the physicians i saw said 01:01:15.809 --> 01:01:17.530 that you'd be much better off just breaking your 01:01:17.530 --> 01:01:20.489 bone my bone bruises are a nightmare so did it 01:01:20.489 --> 01:01:22.289 did it take a long time for those contusions 01:01:22.289 --> 01:01:25.409 it took a couple months i think for for the one 01:01:25.409 --> 01:01:29.150 of my lower leg uh like my tibial plateau area 01:01:29.150 --> 01:01:34.019 was hurt for a couple months to walk on and I 01:01:34.019 --> 01:01:36.780 think I have pretty dense bones. I did a DEXA 01:01:36.780 --> 01:01:39.480 scan one time for like body composition. And 01:01:39.480 --> 01:01:41.519 honestly, I think it's because I'm allergic to 01:01:41.519 --> 01:01:44.880 milk. And so my mom always made sure I got tons 01:01:44.880 --> 01:01:47.739 of calcium growing up, like very mindfully. And 01:01:47.739 --> 01:01:51.219 that and a lifetime of weightlifting and weight 01:01:51.219 --> 01:01:54.480 -bearing exercise, I think has definitely saved 01:01:54.480 --> 01:01:58.090 me from a lot of injury. Yeah, I'm the same. 01:01:58.170 --> 01:01:59.530 I've never broken a bone. I'm going to knock 01:01:59.530 --> 01:02:00.829 on wood now. I'm probably going to fall over 01:02:00.829 --> 01:02:03.590 after this interview and break my face. Not quite 01:02:03.590 --> 01:02:10.010 the same. I've broken a few. Yeah, but even when 01:02:10.010 --> 01:02:12.829 I was a lifeguard, they hated me having to tow 01:02:12.829 --> 01:02:14.590 me when we were doing partner drills because 01:02:14.590 --> 01:02:16.809 my legs just sink straight down. If I exhale, 01:02:16.949 --> 01:02:20.510 I end up on the bottom of the pool. It's a good 01:02:20.510 --> 01:02:23.909 thing, definitely. So then talk to me about the 01:02:23.909 --> 01:02:25.710 rehabilitation journey. We kind of touched on 01:02:25.710 --> 01:02:27.449 this before we hit record. You mentioned that 01:02:27.449 --> 01:02:29.829 you'd been in a motorcycle accident prior to 01:02:29.829 --> 01:02:33.050 this. So what was the difference about this journey 01:02:33.050 --> 01:02:36.329 and then what was the mental impact of such a 01:02:36.329 --> 01:02:39.869 terrifying near miss? Yeah, good questions. The 01:02:39.869 --> 01:02:46.730 motorcycle accident was in 2012. And I was basically 01:02:46.730 --> 01:02:49.989 not seen by a car. And someone swerved in front 01:02:49.989 --> 01:02:53.190 of me and I got thrown off my bike. I was on 01:02:53.190 --> 01:02:56.929 a Gixxer 750, but not doing anything wild. I 01:02:56.929 --> 01:02:59.570 was on just like a two lane country road with 01:02:59.570 --> 01:03:02.269 no cross streets. And a guy swerved into a driveway 01:03:02.269 --> 01:03:05.710 who was missing. And I clipped the back of the 01:03:05.710 --> 01:03:07.989 car and got thrown off my bike and went through 01:03:07.989 --> 01:03:12.170 a mailbox and smashed like back first into a 01:03:12.170 --> 01:03:18.570 metal fence and broke C7, T1, T2. T3, T5, T8, 01:03:18.630 --> 01:03:23.670 T9, L3, separated my AC joint in my left shoulder, 01:03:23.869 --> 01:03:27.449 shattered my scapula, broke most of my ribs on 01:03:27.449 --> 01:03:31.889 the left side, collapsed my lung and tore my 01:03:31.889 --> 01:03:35.409 knee open through the joint. If you just drank 01:03:35.409 --> 01:03:39.650 milk, you would have been fine. That's hilarious. 01:03:40.349 --> 01:03:44.469 So, you know, and again, it was really hard to 01:03:44.469 --> 01:03:48.840 breathe like immediately. I also thought that 01:03:48.840 --> 01:03:50.840 I was going to get left there. The guy that caused 01:03:50.840 --> 01:03:54.059 the accident after what felt like an eternity 01:03:54.059 --> 01:03:56.880 finally came over just inside my field of vision, 01:03:57.039 --> 01:04:00.179 put his hands on his head and looked around up 01:04:00.179 --> 01:04:02.780 and down the street and turned around to walk 01:04:02.780 --> 01:04:04.659 away. And somebody came running out of their 01:04:04.659 --> 01:04:07.420 house in the middle of nowhere and had called 01:04:07.420 --> 01:04:11.360 911 and stuck by me until I went to the hospital. 01:04:11.679 --> 01:04:16.389 But for that, the... The rehabilitation was, 01:04:16.469 --> 01:04:19.190 it's so all encompassing, right? My body was 01:04:19.190 --> 01:04:23.889 so damaged. It consumed my life. My life was 01:04:23.889 --> 01:04:27.469 rehabilitating my body, which in some ways is 01:04:27.469 --> 01:04:29.530 easier than just breaking your arm, which I've 01:04:29.530 --> 01:04:31.510 done before too, where you're like, God, I want 01:04:31.510 --> 01:04:33.449 to do everything. I feel fine, but I can't because 01:04:33.449 --> 01:04:36.409 my arm hurts. This is like, okay, it trumps everything 01:04:36.409 --> 01:04:40.369 going on in my life. celebrating those small 01:04:40.369 --> 01:04:42.269 wins like I remember the first time I could lift 01:04:42.269 --> 01:04:44.829 my elbow off the bed to reach for something I 01:04:44.829 --> 01:04:47.010 was still in the hospital I was like oh my gosh 01:04:47.010 --> 01:04:49.610 things are starting to work again you know and 01:04:49.610 --> 01:04:56.449 I found out um you know that I had this really 01:04:56.449 --> 01:05:01.849 innate just intrinsic motivation to get better 01:05:01.849 --> 01:05:07.110 and I feel really thankful for that um because 01:05:07.110 --> 01:05:11.329 that That amount of injury could have been, you 01:05:11.329 --> 01:05:13.289 know, I had every excuse to take painkillers 01:05:13.289 --> 01:05:16.710 and complain about my back hurting. But the only 01:05:16.710 --> 01:05:19.329 person who would have lost in that would be me. 01:05:19.389 --> 01:05:24.369 I didn't want to be on pain medicine. And I just 01:05:24.369 --> 01:05:26.309 wanted my life back. I didn't want excuses. I 01:05:26.309 --> 01:05:29.250 wanted to go skydiving. So, you know, I worked 01:05:29.250 --> 01:05:34.130 really, really hard. And, you know, when I got 01:05:34.130 --> 01:05:40.679 in that accident was. During the world record, 01:05:40.800 --> 01:05:44.320 the 164 way head down world record or the 138 01:05:44.320 --> 01:05:46.460 way head down world record. And I was fairly 01:05:46.460 --> 01:05:48.980 good enough to be on it. Maybe I would have got 01:05:48.980 --> 01:05:51.519 cut very likely, but I at least would have gotten 01:05:51.519 --> 01:05:56.659 a shot. And it meant a lot to me three years 01:05:56.659 --> 01:05:59.980 later to be on the next world record. I was on 01:05:59.980 --> 01:06:05.530 the 164 way and. and back on track to to live 01:06:05.530 --> 01:06:06.969 my life you know it's not to say I don't have 01:06:06.969 --> 01:06:08.949 a little bit of residual stuff but in my day 01:06:08.949 --> 01:06:12.070 -to -day life I don't feel held back by that 01:06:12.070 --> 01:06:15.570 at all so you know the the big thing in that 01:06:15.570 --> 01:06:18.690 accident was physical while in the accident that 01:06:18.690 --> 01:06:22.929 I had more recently it was much more emotional 01:06:22.929 --> 01:06:26.889 you know ultimately my body was okay and I um 01:06:26.889 --> 01:06:30.110 I was having a hard time for sure my life felt 01:06:30.110 --> 01:06:34.380 um completely meaningless I thought you know 01:06:34.380 --> 01:06:37.440 what's the point if I work so hard to to eat 01:06:37.440 --> 01:06:41.360 well and take care of my body and you know sacrifice 01:06:41.360 --> 01:06:46.219 you know fun things for the betterment of my 01:06:46.219 --> 01:06:48.800 health and future and then you snap your fingers 01:06:48.800 --> 01:06:51.679 and it's all over like what's it all for I didn't 01:06:51.679 --> 01:06:55.659 get the point and You know, my life felt meaningless, 01:06:55.699 --> 01:06:57.639 but at the same time, I felt completely risk 01:06:57.639 --> 01:06:59.920 averse. You know, I started having panic attacks 01:06:59.920 --> 01:07:02.900 for the first time in my life, which is quite 01:07:02.900 --> 01:07:05.739 humbling for someone who feels like they have 01:07:05.739 --> 01:07:10.360 their mental game together. And, you know, dealing 01:07:10.360 --> 01:07:16.119 with anxiety and it was difficult. It was difficult 01:07:16.119 --> 01:07:18.159 to deal with, you know, didn't nobody really 01:07:18.159 --> 01:07:23.349 wanted to wingsuit base jump anymore. I went 01:07:23.349 --> 01:07:26.170 on a wingsuit base jumping trip. I already had 01:07:26.170 --> 01:07:30.050 one planned like the next month. And also the 01:07:30.050 --> 01:07:33.789 200 way have a tendency to get hurt in July. 01:07:34.650 --> 01:07:39.050 The next world record attempts, which we ultimately 01:07:39.050 --> 01:07:41.210 didn't break the world record, were right after 01:07:41.210 --> 01:07:44.250 that. And I was just trying not to freak out 01:07:44.250 --> 01:07:48.559 in the airplane while we were like. Going slow 01:07:48.559 --> 01:07:50.880 after takeoff flying over a cord because I looked 01:07:50.880 --> 01:07:52.579 out the window and just felt close to the ground 01:07:52.579 --> 01:08:00.659 going slow, you know, and. Basically, I was not 01:08:00.659 --> 01:08:03.179 in a good headspace. Wingsuit base jumping was 01:08:03.179 --> 01:08:07.539 terrifying. Like I wasn't doing well. And I had 01:08:07.539 --> 01:08:09.559 to step back and reanalyze, like, how am I trying 01:08:09.559 --> 01:08:11.619 to rehabilitate myself? I have a lot of work 01:08:11.619 --> 01:08:13.280 to do. I can't just keep pushing through thinking 01:08:13.280 --> 01:08:15.960 things are going to feel better without changing 01:08:15.960 --> 01:08:19.479 how I'm. trying to heal from this. And wasn't 01:08:19.479 --> 01:08:21.199 sure if I wanted to wingsuit base jump anymore, 01:08:21.319 --> 01:08:26.260 but did decide that if I chose not to, it was 01:08:26.260 --> 01:08:31.439 going to be from a healed mindset where I just 01:08:31.439 --> 01:08:34.359 decided that wasn't what I want and not from 01:08:34.359 --> 01:08:38.939 a place of fear. And so I put in a lot of work. 01:08:38.939 --> 01:08:43.239 I did a lot of journaling. I sat with the discomfort 01:08:43.239 --> 01:08:46.989 of trying to analyze what happened. um radical 01:08:46.989 --> 01:08:50.630 ownership of my mistakes leading up to it which 01:08:50.630 --> 01:08:55.569 man it sucks to screw up it sucks making huge 01:08:55.569 --> 01:08:58.829 mistakes and it's not fun to think about them 01:08:58.829 --> 01:09:04.210 um but the only way to truly learn from it to 01:09:04.210 --> 01:09:06.229 make sure that I never made those mistakes again 01:09:06.229 --> 01:09:10.710 and to change my approach to wingsuit base jumping 01:09:10.710 --> 01:09:14.649 was to ultimately sit with immense discomfort 01:09:16.079 --> 01:09:23.000 and do a lot of internal analyzing and after 01:09:23.000 --> 01:09:25.699 analyzing what happened and what was my part 01:09:25.699 --> 01:09:27.859 in it figuring out how it would never happen 01:09:27.859 --> 01:09:30.500 again and what my goals were with wingsuit base 01:09:30.500 --> 01:09:33.840 jumping and what my tolerances were also and 01:09:33.840 --> 01:09:36.060 ultimately you know there's a lot of lessons 01:09:36.060 --> 01:09:38.260 learned from it but one is even though I have 01:09:38.260 --> 01:09:42.539 the This skill set to jump something, it doesn't 01:09:42.539 --> 01:09:45.039 mean that it's necessarily within my risk tolerance 01:09:45.039 --> 01:09:48.500 anymore either. And I don't have anything to 01:09:48.500 --> 01:09:56.800 prove and even to myself. And yeah, modernized 01:09:56.800 --> 01:09:59.300 some way, you know, some things I was doing got 01:09:59.300 --> 01:10:03.689 better with analyzing data and. Even though I 01:10:03.689 --> 01:10:05.609 don't like it, I like flying. I don't like computers, 01:10:05.850 --> 01:10:08.810 you know, but realizing that there's so much 01:10:08.810 --> 01:10:11.149 that can be learned from the modern way of doing 01:10:11.149 --> 01:10:14.529 things and really finding kind of a new mentor 01:10:14.529 --> 01:10:16.770 to teach me those things that I was felt safe 01:10:16.770 --> 01:10:19.109 with, too. I'm an experienced jumper, but someone 01:10:19.109 --> 01:10:23.590 who would nurture that environment for asking 01:10:23.590 --> 01:10:27.029 basic questions and be stoked for me instead 01:10:27.029 --> 01:10:29.949 of making me feel dumb about it was important 01:10:29.949 --> 01:10:34.319 to me, too. So surrounding myself with a team 01:10:34.319 --> 01:10:37.800 of amazing people and putting in a lot of work 01:10:37.800 --> 01:10:40.739 and that piece de la jump that I talked about 01:10:40.739 --> 01:10:43.899 earlier had compounded significance to me because 01:10:43.899 --> 01:10:46.699 it wasn't just my approach to that one jump in 01:10:46.699 --> 01:10:50.739 particular. That was also kind of a pivotal moment 01:10:50.739 --> 01:10:54.220 of me in that longer rehabilitation from being 01:10:54.220 --> 01:10:58.439 in that accident to feeling like I was accomplished. 01:11:01.070 --> 01:11:04.130 in a better headspace and better with my wingsuit 01:11:04.130 --> 01:11:06.630 base jumping than it was before my accident so 01:11:06.630 --> 01:11:10.430 that was a pretty special jump for me um and 01:11:10.430 --> 01:11:12.850 eric was there on that jump too i know he's a 01:11:12.850 --> 01:11:15.850 mutual friend of ours eric and pat walker um 01:11:15.850 --> 01:11:21.729 so um there's a i don't want to say a quote because 01:11:21.729 --> 01:11:23.609 i'm probably going to screw it up but basically 01:11:23.609 --> 01:11:26.689 i was watching instagram and i don't even remember 01:11:26.689 --> 01:11:31.119 who said this but basically he said That healing 01:11:31.119 --> 01:11:35.119 isn't a peaceful process and that you have to 01:11:35.119 --> 01:11:41.000 sit with what broke you or what you broke until 01:11:41.000 --> 01:11:45.659 you understand it. And so I am very proud of 01:11:45.659 --> 01:11:48.039 that uncomfortable journey that I've gone through. 01:11:48.220 --> 01:11:51.100 And, you know, it was never a secret, my accident, 01:11:51.260 --> 01:11:53.220 but I also didn't broadcast it because I had 01:11:53.220 --> 01:11:54.920 a lot of work to do and I didn't really need 01:11:54.920 --> 01:11:59.529 external people either validating or. whatever 01:11:59.529 --> 01:12:01.329 i didn't need their input i needed to figure 01:12:01.329 --> 01:12:03.550 out what i was going through myself and now i'm 01:12:03.550 --> 01:12:05.010 in a place where i feel like i can talk about 01:12:05.010 --> 01:12:08.630 it and um hopefully other people can learn from 01:12:08.630 --> 01:12:13.489 it and yeah more comfortable sharing that story 01:12:13.489 --> 01:12:17.789 now well i'm glad you did thank you i mean it's 01:12:17.789 --> 01:12:22.239 so powerful before the accident Where were you 01:12:22.239 --> 01:12:26.119 at spiritually wise? Were you a believer in a 01:12:26.119 --> 01:12:27.840 certain religion? Did you have a relationship 01:12:27.840 --> 01:12:31.079 with God? And then what was that journey after? 01:12:32.960 --> 01:12:37.159 You know, that's a good question. And I didn't 01:12:37.159 --> 01:12:40.159 grow up in a very religious household. I would 01:12:40.159 --> 01:12:43.199 call my mom agnostic and my dad is an atheist. 01:12:43.300 --> 01:12:45.600 But they were always very supportive of my own 01:12:45.600 --> 01:12:52.159 spiritual curiosity and journey. Early adulthood, 01:12:52.319 --> 01:12:56.819 I have started to kind of find my own way. And 01:12:56.819 --> 01:12:59.220 it's not an organized religion, but I very much 01:12:59.220 --> 01:13:02.560 am a spiritual person and do believe that there's 01:13:02.560 --> 01:13:06.439 something else out there and kind of a thread 01:13:06.439 --> 01:13:09.619 that connects us all. And that intuition, I think, 01:13:09.640 --> 01:13:13.220 is a thing that we tap into with that. And, you 01:13:13.220 --> 01:13:15.600 know, I've had to kind of surrender for lack 01:13:15.600 --> 01:13:19.569 of a better term that I won't understand. why 01:13:19.569 --> 01:13:22.289 I'm still alive and I'm okay with that now but 01:13:22.289 --> 01:13:27.430 I do feel like I'm not done here I feel like 01:13:27.430 --> 01:13:32.789 I have some I feel like I'm here to be a leader 01:13:32.789 --> 01:13:36.670 and a teacher and someone who inspires and inspires 01:13:36.670 --> 01:13:39.829 through following my own passion and I think 01:13:39.829 --> 01:13:44.569 if if nothing else you know I'm still that person 01:13:44.569 --> 01:13:47.819 and it's just even more solidified and It's hard 01:13:47.819 --> 01:13:51.560 to explain aspects of spirituality other than 01:13:51.560 --> 01:13:54.739 I very much feel like I'm where I'm meant to 01:13:54.739 --> 01:13:57.899 be right now. And I feel like I'm on my path. 01:13:58.119 --> 01:14:04.039 And when in my life, I've had the courage to 01:14:04.039 --> 01:14:06.939 kind of yank the safety net out from under me 01:14:06.939 --> 01:14:10.180 and like really go for it and follow my heart 01:14:10.180 --> 01:14:13.340 and what calls me. There has been so much opportunity 01:14:13.340 --> 01:14:15.380 that presents itself, but it presents itself 01:14:15.380 --> 01:14:19.369 after. It's like being rewarded for having the 01:14:19.369 --> 01:14:22.270 courage to follow my heart. And I feel like I'm 01:14:22.270 --> 01:14:26.029 very much in the middle of one of those periods 01:14:26.029 --> 01:14:28.449 of my life right now. Hopefully that will never 01:14:28.449 --> 01:14:30.869 end. That's just the state I want to live in. 01:14:32.149 --> 01:14:35.750 But yeah, I would say I feel very connected to 01:14:35.750 --> 01:14:39.729 spirituality and source or whatever you want 01:14:39.729 --> 01:14:43.550 to call it. And especially since my accident. 01:14:45.240 --> 01:14:47.859 That's really interesting. I'm similar. I grew 01:14:47.859 --> 01:14:50.640 up, you know, not really even in a Christian 01:14:50.640 --> 01:14:52.939 household because neither of my parents were 01:14:52.939 --> 01:14:55.800 actively practicing that, but I was exposed to 01:14:55.800 --> 01:14:58.560 the Church of England. Ironically, I went to 01:14:58.560 --> 01:15:01.539 a Christian secondary school. And let's just 01:15:01.539 --> 01:15:03.000 say, I don't think a lot of the people that went 01:15:03.000 --> 01:15:06.140 to the school were participating in it. There's 01:15:06.140 --> 01:15:08.699 a guy would come, I forget how often now, but 01:15:08.699 --> 01:15:12.430 we'd get the local vicar. would give us a talk 01:15:12.430 --> 01:15:14.750 and he'd hand out a magazine called Jesus and 01:15:14.750 --> 01:15:16.850 Me. And then we'd all roll it up and then have 01:15:16.850 --> 01:15:20.250 fights with it in the next playtime. So I'm not 01:15:20.250 --> 01:15:22.630 sure how religious my schoolmates actually were. 01:15:22.729 --> 01:15:25.550 But I found myself with that common denominator, 01:15:25.670 --> 01:15:27.449 as I've said, you know, don't be a dick is pretty 01:15:27.449 --> 01:15:30.949 much universal. But I don't believe that God 01:15:30.949 --> 01:15:33.270 has a plan as far as James is still alive and 01:15:33.270 --> 01:15:35.270 didn't die in a fire or a car wreck or anything. 01:15:35.390 --> 01:15:38.050 But this eight month old is dying of leukemia. 01:15:38.090 --> 01:15:40.090 I don't think that he's moving chess pieces around. 01:15:41.609 --> 01:15:44.850 But we are still here. And so for me, I mean, 01:15:44.869 --> 01:15:47.670 I see God in nature already. I think this experience 01:15:47.670 --> 01:15:50.289 that we're having is absolutely incredible. But 01:15:50.289 --> 01:15:52.390 if you are still here, then to me, it's gratitude. 01:15:52.949 --> 01:15:55.770 You're still here. So what can you do? How can 01:15:55.770 --> 01:15:57.090 you make the world better? Because that's all 01:15:57.090 --> 01:15:58.890 we know. I don't know anything else. I don't 01:15:58.890 --> 01:16:00.569 know of a heaven or any of that stuff. But I 01:16:00.569 --> 01:16:04.300 know that if I try and do good things. that it 01:16:04.300 --> 01:16:06.479 will benefit other people. And it's not about 01:16:06.479 --> 01:16:09.180 me, it's about us. So it feels like there's a 01:16:09.180 --> 01:16:13.819 similar connection there. Definitely. And it's 01:16:13.819 --> 01:16:15.760 just interesting you bring up gratitude too. 01:16:15.800 --> 01:16:20.579 I've started, you know, a practice where I spend 01:16:20.579 --> 01:16:23.119 time each morning, you know, either doing something 01:16:23.119 --> 01:16:27.060 for myself, whether that's journaling, which 01:16:27.060 --> 01:16:31.579 when I journal. It's not super structured, so 01:16:31.579 --> 01:16:33.159 I don't make it sound that way. It's like whatever's 01:16:33.159 --> 01:16:35.359 on my mind. If I just need to hemorrhage what's 01:16:35.359 --> 01:16:38.159 on my mind, I do that. If I'm not sure what I 01:16:38.159 --> 01:16:41.079 want to journal about, which is often, I start 01:16:41.079 --> 01:16:44.619 with five things that I'm grateful for. And it 01:16:44.619 --> 01:16:48.479 really does put you into a positive mindset for 01:16:48.479 --> 01:16:53.180 your day. Something a good friend of mine, his 01:16:53.180 --> 01:16:56.100 name is Mort, and I love this so much. He calls 01:16:56.100 --> 01:16:58.500 it MRI and it stands for the most reasonable 01:16:58.500 --> 01:17:00.680 interpretation. And it's like when you're faced 01:17:00.680 --> 01:17:03.319 with things that come up in your life that it's 01:17:03.319 --> 01:17:06.300 so easy to, you know, make up these things in 01:17:06.300 --> 01:17:07.899 your head that you start to get anxious over 01:17:07.899 --> 01:17:09.859 or pissed off at that are just stories that you're 01:17:09.859 --> 01:17:11.819 telling yourself. It's like, wait a minute, what's 01:17:11.819 --> 01:17:13.800 the most reasonable way that I can interpret 01:17:13.800 --> 01:17:15.960 this? What's like the best case scenario I can 01:17:15.960 --> 01:17:17.720 think of? You know, it's not to say you don't 01:17:17.720 --> 01:17:19.579 prepare for worst case, but it's like, all right, 01:17:19.600 --> 01:17:22.250 if this person did this. what's the best case 01:17:22.250 --> 01:17:24.409 that I can think of that they might be doing 01:17:24.409 --> 01:17:27.770 that for, you know? And it's just a different 01:17:27.770 --> 01:17:31.050 mindset to be in, to think the best of people 01:17:31.050 --> 01:17:35.630 and to be positive and, you know, try and bring 01:17:35.630 --> 01:17:38.949 the team up and do what's good for other people, 01:17:38.970 --> 01:17:41.029 just be a good person. And I think that, you 01:17:41.029 --> 01:17:42.989 know, those are the lessons that people are supposed 01:17:42.989 --> 01:17:47.329 to feel. theoretically right with religion also 01:17:47.329 --> 01:17:50.390 you feel spiritual you feel close to god or whatever 01:17:50.390 --> 01:17:53.550 you want to call it and i think that a lot of 01:17:53.550 --> 01:17:56.689 people that go to church aren't very spiritual 01:17:56.689 --> 01:17:58.149 probably they're going because they feel like 01:17:58.149 --> 01:18:00.789 they suppose they are supposed to be going or 01:18:00.789 --> 01:18:02.890 that's what they were taught to do and i think 01:18:02.890 --> 01:18:04.609 it's such a blessing when you can actually feel 01:18:04.609 --> 01:18:07.569 that in your own life through your own experiences 01:18:07.569 --> 01:18:10.170 that you just feel like this you know the majesty 01:18:10.170 --> 01:18:13.649 of nature or the beauty of you know sharing a 01:18:13.649 --> 01:18:15.729 connection with people and i think that i think 01:18:15.729 --> 01:18:18.329 that that is what the message was supposed to 01:18:18.329 --> 01:18:22.810 be and you know and i feel that and i hope that 01:18:22.810 --> 01:18:24.649 other people can too whether they do that through 01:18:24.649 --> 01:18:27.449 organized religion or on their own but that's 01:18:27.449 --> 01:18:31.050 just kind of my my own personal view yeah no 01:18:31.050 --> 01:18:34.369 absolutely i agree 100 well kind of switching 01:18:34.369 --> 01:18:37.619 tact a little bit now I was in the stunt world 01:18:37.619 --> 01:18:41.979 for 22 ish years, mainly in the live stunt show 01:18:41.979 --> 01:18:44.380 side. I never got into film and television. I 01:18:44.380 --> 01:18:46.560 was in film and television, but basically as 01:18:46.560 --> 01:18:49.060 a glorified actor, excuse me, glorified extra, 01:18:49.220 --> 01:18:52.859 excuse me. So love the stunt world when it came 01:18:52.859 --> 01:18:56.220 to the live show. How did you transition from, 01:18:56.260 --> 01:18:58.659 you know, skydiving just for the pure passion 01:18:58.659 --> 01:19:01.779 of the sport to using that as far as the entertainment 01:19:01.779 --> 01:19:07.170 side? The entertainment side being. Stunts? Stunts, 01:19:07.210 --> 01:19:09.970 yeah. Well, the movie, television, etc. Oh, man, 01:19:10.069 --> 01:19:12.850 that's the dream. Everyone wants to be in stunts. 01:19:12.850 --> 01:19:15.130 They're badass when they're on the, at least, 01:19:15.189 --> 01:19:17.329 you know, the aerial side. Stunts in general, 01:19:17.470 --> 01:19:19.810 you know, if I were in my 20s and had known about 01:19:19.810 --> 01:19:21.310 it, I think that probably would have been a pretty 01:19:21.310 --> 01:19:23.630 good career path. But now that I'm not in my 01:19:23.630 --> 01:19:25.789 20s, that just looks like a lot of getting beat 01:19:25.789 --> 01:19:30.229 up and uncomfortable and falling down. But like 01:19:30.229 --> 01:19:34.619 the, you know, the... the creme de la creme of 01:19:34.619 --> 01:19:37.979 stunts, at least from someone who's a skydiver 01:19:37.979 --> 01:19:40.439 is I want to do those cool aerial jobs. Like 01:19:40.439 --> 01:19:43.539 they're rad. And it's definitely Eric. I have 01:19:43.539 --> 01:19:46.979 to thank for that for bringing me in on one that 01:19:46.979 --> 01:19:49.220 actually came to fruition, which was so special. 01:19:49.260 --> 01:19:52.560 It's one of the coolest experiences that I've 01:19:52.560 --> 01:19:56.699 had in skydiving or base jumping. And that was 01:19:56.699 --> 01:19:59.039 for the Marvel movie Thunderbolts that just came 01:19:59.039 --> 01:20:03.000 out in May. That was a great, great film. It 01:20:03.000 --> 01:20:06.119 was a great film. I loved it so much. Stunts 01:20:06.119 --> 01:20:12.319 aside, I just loved the movie. But yeah, the 01:20:12.319 --> 01:20:14.500 opportunity came up almost, I think, two years 01:20:14.500 --> 01:20:16.699 ago at this point. And we talked about it for 01:20:16.699 --> 01:20:19.920 a year. And it was going to happen and then not 01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:21.560 going to happen and then going to happen again. 01:20:21.619 --> 01:20:25.359 And ultimately, after that roller coaster, it 01:20:25.359 --> 01:20:30.039 did happen. And we went to Malaysia and got to 01:20:30.039 --> 01:20:32.560 jump off the second heist. building in the world, 01:20:32.600 --> 01:20:36.119 which was incredibly rad. Like obviously the 01:20:36.119 --> 01:20:39.220 stunt was cool, but I think that what really 01:20:39.220 --> 01:20:43.420 stuck out to me was that I got a glimpse into 01:20:43.420 --> 01:20:46.159 the world of stunts, right? Because I know the 01:20:46.159 --> 01:20:49.760 aerial world, but it was so cool to see what 01:20:49.760 --> 01:20:53.060 a family and a community and a tribe that was. 01:20:53.560 --> 01:20:56.260 And I'm not sure like the ins and outs of what 01:20:56.260 --> 01:20:58.619 exactly the strikes were going on in Hollywood 01:20:58.619 --> 01:21:01.680 leading up to that. But I think that the end 01:21:01.680 --> 01:21:07.159 result was people who normally all run their 01:21:07.159 --> 01:21:09.380 own teams, they're all very accomplished within 01:21:09.380 --> 01:21:12.859 the stunt world. Instead of all running their 01:21:12.859 --> 01:21:14.659 own teams on different projects, we're all working 01:21:14.659 --> 01:21:19.359 on that project. And there was just so much experience 01:21:19.359 --> 01:21:23.239 and so much camaraderie between them. I felt 01:21:23.239 --> 01:21:27.159 like so honored and privileged. to be a part 01:21:27.159 --> 01:21:29.359 of their world for that. And it was just a really 01:21:29.359 --> 01:21:32.000 special thing to, to get to experience. And then 01:21:32.000 --> 01:21:37.380 obviously the jump was cool. And yeah, I just 01:21:37.380 --> 01:21:41.460 had a wonderful team of people over there. What 01:21:41.460 --> 01:21:44.060 was different when you're now jumping within 01:21:44.060 --> 01:21:47.380 a set, what was different compared to if you 01:21:47.380 --> 01:21:51.100 just jumped, you know, recreationally? Jumping 01:21:51.100 --> 01:21:54.420 within a set is different because there's like 01:21:54.420 --> 01:21:58.659 100 people there watching and you're jumping 01:21:58.659 --> 01:22:04.420 on someone else's cue, which honestly, it's like 01:22:04.420 --> 01:22:08.319 they warned me and I love the people who are 01:22:08.319 --> 01:22:13.439 mentors in it. John DeVore and Tim Rigby are 01:22:13.439 --> 01:22:16.659 super experienced in that stunt world also and 01:22:16.659 --> 01:22:22.600 Eric. what I remember specifically Tim was sharing 01:22:22.600 --> 01:22:25.619 knowledge which I love Tim is incredible and 01:22:25.619 --> 01:22:27.119 just saying like you know at the end of the day 01:22:27.119 --> 01:22:29.319 Katie make sure that you're not jumping if you're 01:22:29.319 --> 01:22:31.640 not comfortable and that kind of thing and I 01:22:31.640 --> 01:22:36.060 appreciated so much his talking to me about that 01:22:36.060 --> 01:22:41.319 and but to be quite honest I feel like you know 01:22:41.319 --> 01:22:43.539 I'm comfortable enough with who I am and where 01:22:43.539 --> 01:22:46.979 I am in my base jumping I don't really mind the 01:22:47.880 --> 01:22:51.100 like quote pressure you can have 5 000 people 01:22:51.100 --> 01:22:52.939 watching me i don't really care because it's 01:22:52.939 --> 01:22:58.300 really i can just kind of shut them out and when 01:22:58.300 --> 01:23:00.539 it came down to it you know pat who's my camera 01:23:00.539 --> 01:23:03.920 guy and a really good friend um he and i were 01:23:03.920 --> 01:23:06.680 the jumpers and we're standing up there and you 01:23:06.680 --> 01:23:08.520 know when they're giving the 30 second call or 01:23:08.520 --> 01:23:10.819 whatever it really just feels like me and pat 01:23:10.819 --> 01:23:13.180 just like giggling because we are so stoked we 01:23:13.180 --> 01:23:15.579 get to jump off this thing and you know it was 01:23:15.579 --> 01:23:19.300 easy to make the rest melt away and just focus 01:23:19.300 --> 01:23:22.600 on him and doing the job. And, you know, that's 01:23:22.600 --> 01:23:25.020 in that one circumstance, it's not to say that, 01:23:25.020 --> 01:23:27.880 you know, potentially in another job or someone 01:23:27.880 --> 01:23:29.979 else having different circumstances, it can be 01:23:29.979 --> 01:23:32.800 harder to tune that out. But on that job in that 01:23:32.800 --> 01:23:36.020 moment with that team, it was really no problem. 01:23:36.119 --> 01:23:40.560 And it was just very gratifying to be able to 01:23:40.560 --> 01:23:43.300 do that. I was proud of myself for the job that 01:23:43.300 --> 01:23:46.220 I performed. I feel like working well within 01:23:46.220 --> 01:23:50.760 the team and, and yeah, just having fun with 01:23:50.760 --> 01:23:53.439 my friend, Pat, which is what it really felt 01:23:53.439 --> 01:23:57.500 like in the moment. So it was pretty cool. You 01:23:57.500 --> 01:24:00.119 just reminded me of another important thing I've 01:24:00.119 --> 01:24:01.399 heard from a lot of people, especially Chris 01:24:01.399 --> 01:24:04.899 McDougall, Dukes talked about this. And just 01:24:04.899 --> 01:24:06.640 to preface this, there was a story the other 01:24:06.640 --> 01:24:10.039 day online of an airline pilot. They'd done some 01:24:10.039 --> 01:24:11.739 sort of maintenance thing. I think it was supposed 01:24:11.739 --> 01:24:15.220 to go to Hawaii. And he said, I just don't feel 01:24:15.220 --> 01:24:17.899 right about this. And he ended up saying, we're 01:24:17.899 --> 01:24:19.640 not flying. You know, if there's another plane 01:24:19.640 --> 01:24:21.319 available, then we'll deplane and get on to the 01:24:21.319 --> 01:24:23.079 next one, or we might have to postpone until 01:24:23.079 --> 01:24:26.119 another one does come. And he was trusting his 01:24:26.119 --> 01:24:28.640 gut instinct. And I remember Dukes talking about, 01:24:28.739 --> 01:24:31.539 you know, some of the jumps that you guys do. 01:24:31.699 --> 01:24:35.060 There's a two -hour hike that, you know, is before 01:24:35.060 --> 01:24:38.119 it. And despite all of that work, he would say, 01:24:38.159 --> 01:24:41.100 when it doesn't feel right, I'd be like, no. 01:24:41.449 --> 01:24:43.430 And we'd turn around and we'd walk two hours 01:24:43.430 --> 01:24:46.170 back down again. So talk to me about that. You 01:24:46.170 --> 01:24:48.970 were told, hey, don't jump if it doesn't feel 01:24:48.970 --> 01:24:51.810 right. Talk to me about the responsibility to 01:24:51.810 --> 01:24:54.350 yourself of trusting that intuition, even if 01:24:54.350 --> 01:24:57.189 you've done hours of preparation prior to that 01:24:57.189 --> 01:25:00.369 jump. Well, that's interesting. I feel like that's 01:25:00.369 --> 01:25:04.109 kind of touching on two things. One is not jumping 01:25:04.109 --> 01:25:07.130 if it's not good, right? Sometimes you get up 01:25:07.130 --> 01:25:11.119 there and you're like, oh, conditions suck. That's 01:25:11.119 --> 01:25:14.199 an easy one to walk away from. When conditions 01:25:14.199 --> 01:25:17.699 are marginal is the hardest, right? When you're 01:25:17.699 --> 01:25:19.659 like, ah, it's not really clear one way or the 01:25:19.659 --> 01:25:25.500 other. And I feel like intuition plays the biggest 01:25:25.500 --> 01:25:27.680 part when everything looks fine and you can't 01:25:27.680 --> 01:25:30.460 really put your finger on why, but something 01:25:30.460 --> 01:25:33.720 doesn't feel right. And, you know, that's an 01:25:33.720 --> 01:25:36.119 important thing to be able to pay attention to 01:25:36.119 --> 01:25:41.039 also. And just trusting that, you know. your 01:25:41.039 --> 01:25:43.399 subconscious knows something that you you don't 01:25:43.399 --> 01:25:46.760 it's trying to tell you and you'll never you 01:25:46.760 --> 01:25:48.380 know you're not going to die from the jump that 01:25:48.380 --> 01:25:53.180 you didn't do probably so you know unless there's 01:25:53.180 --> 01:25:55.359 I mean I laugh because there's exceptions to 01:25:55.359 --> 01:25:58.380 that sometimes the approach or you know the retreat 01:25:58.380 --> 01:26:04.140 is dangerous you know and you know there's been 01:26:04.140 --> 01:26:05.899 times where I felt more comfortable jumping off 01:26:05.899 --> 01:26:08.279 something than going back the way we came so 01:26:08.840 --> 01:26:10.880 It's not like it's a one size fits all, like, 01:26:10.880 --> 01:26:13.199 oh, if it's not good, turn around. But in general, 01:26:13.260 --> 01:26:17.020 for sure, Dukes is totally right. You know, it's 01:26:17.020 --> 01:26:19.920 worth being uncomfortable or tired or hungry 01:26:19.920 --> 01:26:23.680 to turn around and leave and have a story to 01:26:23.680 --> 01:26:27.020 tell and live another day than jump when it's 01:26:27.020 --> 01:26:29.460 not good. And there's been a lot of jumps that 01:26:29.460 --> 01:26:31.739 I've turned around, walked off at, walked off 01:26:31.739 --> 01:26:33.960 of over the years, you know, sitting up there 01:26:33.960 --> 01:26:37.500 thinking like, it's just not worth it. Or like, 01:26:37.500 --> 01:26:40.100 what? If my mom was sitting here talking to me 01:26:40.100 --> 01:26:42.100 about it, it's like, ah, I got to make a good 01:26:42.100 --> 01:26:45.880 decision, you know? And yeah, Dukes is totally 01:26:45.880 --> 01:26:48.939 right. I think most jumpers would agree with 01:26:48.939 --> 01:26:53.100 him on that. It's interesting because that carries 01:26:53.100 --> 01:26:55.760 over to my profession. And, you know, we've got 01:26:55.760 --> 01:26:57.920 a very young fire service at the moment. You 01:26:57.920 --> 01:26:59.819 know, I think a lot of departments, about half 01:26:59.819 --> 01:27:01.720 their department have got five years or less 01:27:01.720 --> 01:27:05.699 on. And, you know, there's of course the overly 01:27:05.699 --> 01:27:07.680 cautious side of the fire service where they 01:27:07.680 --> 01:27:09.140 don't want anyone going in and we'll just get 01:27:09.140 --> 01:27:11.079 it from the outside. And there's times where 01:27:11.079 --> 01:27:13.119 that's wrong. You know, there's a rescue that 01:27:13.119 --> 01:27:14.960 you could facilitate. And so you do have to make 01:27:14.960 --> 01:27:17.619 entry. But then there's also, and I feel like 01:27:17.619 --> 01:27:20.619 this kind of mirrors the copycatting that we're 01:27:20.619 --> 01:27:22.840 talking about that gets a lot of skydivers hurt 01:27:22.840 --> 01:27:26.800 or killed, where it's a very chess beating machismo. 01:27:26.840 --> 01:27:30.100 We go in on every fire, you know, and there's 01:27:30.100 --> 01:27:33.069 many times where you just can't. conditions dictate 01:27:33.069 --> 01:27:35.829 that there is no one viable in there and it's 01:27:35.829 --> 01:27:39.270 only risking more firefighters lives by blindly 01:27:39.270 --> 01:27:41.949 going into a fire you got no business going into 01:27:41.949 --> 01:27:44.789 so i think you know for us that intuition which 01:27:44.789 --> 01:27:47.390 i think comes with experience too and that's 01:27:47.390 --> 01:27:49.630 the dangerous part of having such a recruitment 01:27:49.630 --> 01:27:52.409 crisis and therefore a young fire department 01:27:52.409 --> 01:27:55.729 is you got all these people on scene arguably 01:27:55.729 --> 01:27:58.130 who may not have seen enough to really develop 01:27:58.130 --> 01:28:01.000 that intuition in the first place blindly go 01:28:01.000 --> 01:28:03.659 into a fire and then you know lose their lives 01:28:03.659 --> 01:28:06.960 too yeah i think that you're spot on there's 01:28:06.960 --> 01:28:08.779 a lot of similarities between the two things 01:28:08.779 --> 01:28:11.140 and you know the more experience you can get 01:28:11.140 --> 01:28:13.960 the more you know broad of a knowledge base you 01:28:13.960 --> 01:28:18.060 have to make better decisions in the future absolutely 01:28:18.060 --> 01:28:20.880 well before we go to the sphere are there any 01:28:20.880 --> 01:28:22.239 other hollywood productions that you've been 01:28:22.239 --> 01:28:28.920 working on i wish i'm ready ready and available 01:28:30.620 --> 01:28:32.859 Well, let's talk about that then. So Jimmy Chin, 01:28:33.119 --> 01:28:37.600 renowned filmmaker, documentarian, obviously 01:28:37.600 --> 01:28:40.680 Alex Honnold, legend in himself. How did you 01:28:40.680 --> 01:28:43.119 come across this project? And then tell us what 01:28:43.119 --> 01:28:48.140 we can expect and when. That is a great question. 01:28:48.239 --> 01:28:53.939 I got cold called, to be honest. And this guy, 01:28:53.979 --> 01:28:57.260 Davey, who has become a friend of mine. Basically, 01:28:57.279 --> 01:28:59.260 it was his brainchild for this whole project. 01:28:59.319 --> 01:29:02.340 And he had reached out to me through he said 01:29:02.340 --> 01:29:04.500 he tried to find an agent and reach out to me 01:29:04.500 --> 01:29:06.180 through a few different platforms. And basically, 01:29:06.199 --> 01:29:08.899 it was an Instagram message caught in the filter 01:29:08.899 --> 01:29:11.439 because we didn't we weren't connected, you know, 01:29:11.460 --> 01:29:14.399 that said, hey, are you interested in doing this 01:29:14.399 --> 01:29:17.079 documentary? Blah, blah, blah. And the answer 01:29:17.079 --> 01:29:19.880 is always yes until it's no. Right. I wanted 01:29:19.880 --> 01:29:21.680 more information. So I was like, oh, it sounds 01:29:21.680 --> 01:29:25.359 interesting. Signed an NDA, which. I'm not going 01:29:25.359 --> 01:29:27.100 to divulge anything in the NDA that hasn't already 01:29:27.100 --> 01:29:30.159 been public publicly put out, but basically I 01:29:30.159 --> 01:29:32.380 signed the NDA. And then he said it was for the 01:29:32.380 --> 01:29:35.359 sphere in Las Vegas. I saw Jimmy Chin's name 01:29:35.359 --> 01:29:37.880 on it. I was like, what is happening? It's like, 01:29:37.899 --> 01:29:42.319 I'm in. And he sent me the pitch that had, you 01:29:42.319 --> 01:29:45.340 know, it was like 30, like 30 slides of like 01:29:45.340 --> 01:29:47.500 info is so in depth. I couldn't believe that 01:29:47.500 --> 01:29:52.979 so much information on me. And. And it looked 01:29:52.979 --> 01:29:54.880 incredible. And basically, like we touched on 01:29:54.880 --> 01:29:59.359 earlier, the premise is about why do we do what 01:29:59.359 --> 01:30:03.300 we do? You know, so I'll back up and say it's 01:30:03.300 --> 01:30:05.979 an hour, you know, it's a documentary featuring 01:30:05.979 --> 01:30:08.399 five different extreme sports athletes, each 01:30:08.399 --> 01:30:15.399 from a different extreme sport. With Alex Honnold 01:30:15.399 --> 01:30:20.239 is the climber. Kai Lenny is surfing. Marcus 01:30:20.239 --> 01:30:24.720 Eder is a skier and Alenka Artnik is a free diver. 01:30:24.899 --> 01:30:27.619 And I just feel so honored to have my name amongst 01:30:27.619 --> 01:30:30.500 theirs. It's, you know, it's a dream come true 01:30:30.500 --> 01:30:36.159 for sure. And it's about why we do what we do. 01:30:36.199 --> 01:30:37.899 You know, what's the common thread? Maybe we 01:30:37.899 --> 01:30:40.880 all do different extreme sports, but what makes 01:30:40.880 --> 01:30:43.600 us tick? What draws us to these things? And, 01:30:43.600 --> 01:30:47.949 you know, what is the... the experience and the 01:30:47.949 --> 01:30:51.569 analysis and the forethought and the training, 01:30:51.970 --> 01:30:53.649 you know, that goes into all this that people 01:30:53.649 --> 01:30:56.449 don't necessarily see. And I think, you know, 01:30:56.449 --> 01:30:59.270 Jimmy, and I just want to mention too, Chai is 01:30:59.270 --> 01:31:03.489 also directing it. But Jimmy is an athlete, you 01:31:03.489 --> 01:31:07.050 know, and he wants to bring these things to light 01:31:07.050 --> 01:31:10.569 from experience. And it really shows in the way 01:31:10.569 --> 01:31:13.640 that he directs and the questions he asks. you 01:31:13.640 --> 01:31:15.439 know, the way that I felt we already did some 01:31:15.439 --> 01:31:19.720 of the filming for it. And he also made it very 01:31:19.720 --> 01:31:25.380 clear, you know, that in the moment, enjoy myself 01:31:25.380 --> 01:31:30.640 and, and that we can reset everything and don't 01:31:30.640 --> 01:31:32.640 go if it doesn't feel right, you know, and just 01:31:32.640 --> 01:31:34.659 felt very supported from the athlete side, but 01:31:34.659 --> 01:31:39.239 he very much is inspired to capture, you know, 01:31:39.260 --> 01:31:41.239 the beauty of all of the mindset that goes behind 01:31:41.239 --> 01:31:46.479 it. It should be an incredible documentary. It 01:31:46.479 --> 01:31:48.600 sounds amazing. When are they hoping it's going 01:31:48.600 --> 01:31:52.659 to be at the Sphere? The last thing that I saw 01:31:52.659 --> 01:31:57.399 released said estimated fall or winter of 2026. 01:31:57.720 --> 01:32:09.000 So about a year and a half. Is there a person 01:32:09.000 --> 01:32:10.939 that you'd recommend to come on this podcast 01:32:10.939 --> 01:32:13.619 as a guest to speak to the first responders, 01:32:13.779 --> 01:32:16.100 military and associated professions of the world? 01:32:17.699 --> 01:32:26.060 Hmm. I think I would actually recommend my husband, 01:32:26.279 --> 01:32:29.079 Matt Lajeunesse. He has an incredible story, 01:32:29.199 --> 01:32:32.619 was briefly a firefighter for about six months. 01:32:33.239 --> 01:32:36.399 And then, yeah, I'll let him tell his story about. 01:32:36.989 --> 01:32:40.390 why that didn't keep going um and is also one 01:32:40.390 --> 01:32:43.909 of yeah sean schumo's best friends and i think 01:32:43.909 --> 01:32:48.149 uh i think that everyone would love it let's 01:32:48.149 --> 01:32:50.029 make it happen then i'd love to have him on thank 01:32:50.029 --> 01:32:53.430 you awesome all right well then the last question 01:32:53.430 --> 01:32:55.390 before we make sure everyone knows where to find 01:32:55.390 --> 01:33:01.649 you what do you do to decompress oh i read books 01:33:01.649 --> 01:33:05.260 a lot to decompress um If it's in the evening 01:33:05.260 --> 01:33:11.060 and to stay kind of even keeled, I practice mindfulness 01:33:11.060 --> 01:33:14.359 in the morning. And even if it's for five or 01:33:14.359 --> 01:33:16.899 15 minutes, really try to just get up a few minutes 01:33:16.899 --> 01:33:21.680 early when it's still quiet and basically just 01:33:21.680 --> 01:33:24.760 center myself. And I've been pretty committed 01:33:24.760 --> 01:33:27.920 to a meditation practice that has really helped 01:33:27.920 --> 01:33:32.539 keep me calm and grounded. It's interesting. 01:33:32.619 --> 01:33:36.960 I used to kind of waffle between go, go, go and 01:33:36.960 --> 01:33:40.880 at home decompressing from trips. And I've really 01:33:40.880 --> 01:33:43.479 in the last year tried to integrate the two together 01:33:43.479 --> 01:33:48.060 and bring some of that peacefulness into those 01:33:48.060 --> 01:33:52.399 trips where I'm just charging. And so even when 01:33:52.399 --> 01:33:54.359 it's easy to get wrapped up and stuff, still 01:33:54.359 --> 01:33:56.279 trying to spend those few moments each morning 01:33:56.279 --> 01:34:03.250 detaching from. what I'm actually doing in terms 01:34:03.250 --> 01:34:08.270 of, you know, I don't identify myself by what 01:34:08.270 --> 01:34:11.590 I do, but who I am. And because we're all just 01:34:11.590 --> 01:34:15.470 one, one choice away from never being able to 01:34:15.470 --> 01:34:17.510 do these things we love anymore. You know, I 01:34:17.510 --> 01:34:19.369 could get in an accident and never skydive again. 01:34:19.529 --> 01:34:22.449 And I think that it wouldn't change who I am. 01:34:22.810 --> 01:34:25.810 And I make sure that I spend time each moment 01:34:25.810 --> 01:34:28.470 identifying as Katie Hanson and the things I 01:34:28.470 --> 01:34:30.229 love and the people I love and the things I care 01:34:30.229 --> 01:34:34.689 about. And it keeps me a little bit more grounded. 01:34:36.550 --> 01:34:39.010 That's exactly what we struggle with in my profession. 01:34:39.149 --> 01:34:41.689 The identity becomes the firefighter, the Marine, 01:34:41.930 --> 01:34:44.869 whatever it is. And God forbid you get hurt, 01:34:45.069 --> 01:34:48.090 you get fired, or you just simply retire. If 01:34:48.090 --> 01:34:50.989 that's all you've seen yourself as, one day you're 01:34:50.989 --> 01:34:53.670 not anymore, whether you like it or not. But 01:34:53.670 --> 01:34:56.649 if you see yourself as James Gearing, who wants 01:34:56.649 --> 01:34:59.289 to... help people, and that was in the role of 01:34:59.289 --> 01:35:01.310 a lifeguard, and then the role of a firefighter, 01:35:01.310 --> 01:35:03.670 and you're this continuing through line, then 01:35:03.670 --> 01:35:05.869 the things that you did don't necessarily define 01:35:05.869 --> 01:35:11.090 you anymore. Exactly. With the mindfulness, it's 01:35:11.090 --> 01:35:12.609 be interesting, because I mean, you know, the 01:35:12.609 --> 01:35:16.010 the acuity that you need, free falling from the 01:35:16.010 --> 01:35:19.529 sky is, you know, quite unique. One of the things 01:35:19.529 --> 01:35:23.159 that I've realized is a lot of the the elements 01:35:23.159 --> 01:35:25.239 that will help with mental health, that will 01:35:25.239 --> 01:35:27.659 help with, you know, with weight loss, with all 01:35:27.659 --> 01:35:30.460 these kinds of things. You can also kind of, 01:35:30.460 --> 01:35:33.060 as I say, putting, you know, putting honey on 01:35:33.060 --> 01:35:35.340 the medicine, as it were, you can also change 01:35:35.340 --> 01:35:38.039 the lens to performance. So if I've got a, you 01:35:38.039 --> 01:35:40.479 know, air quotes alpha that doesn't believe that 01:35:40.479 --> 01:35:43.079 the mental health is a thing, well, I can talk 01:35:43.079 --> 01:35:45.039 about mindfulness and performance. If you really 01:35:45.039 --> 01:35:47.380 want to be at a, you know, make entry in a SWAT 01:35:47.380 --> 01:35:49.640 call or make entry to a burning building and 01:35:49.640 --> 01:35:52.350 get in that flow state. and really see that room 01:35:52.350 --> 01:35:54.850 in your mind and find that child you need to 01:35:54.850 --> 01:35:58.149 have a calm mind what have you seen as far as 01:35:58.149 --> 01:36:00.850 meditation and your performance when you're skydiving 01:36:00.850 --> 01:36:08.829 now that is a good question and honestly my skydiving 01:36:08.829 --> 01:36:12.050 i'm performing well but i i feel like i'm just 01:36:12.050 --> 01:36:16.750 more even keeled at the end of the day and very 01:36:16.750 --> 01:36:21.949 comfortable with who i am and um since i started 01:36:21.949 --> 01:36:25.069 that practice i've done less competition skydiving 01:36:25.069 --> 01:36:30.310 and things like that and more um bigger projects 01:36:30.310 --> 01:36:34.710 i would say and my ability to stay focused and 01:36:34.710 --> 01:36:38.029 stay calm through like high pressure filming 01:36:38.029 --> 01:36:45.229 stuff is as is the best it's ever been i use 01:36:45.229 --> 01:36:48.439 headspace you know diligently now it was on and 01:36:48.439 --> 01:36:50.140 off for a long time but i'm on a i'm on a good 01:36:50.140 --> 01:36:52.159 run at the moment what kind of practice do you 01:36:52.159 --> 01:36:55.960 use um right now i'm actually not used i was 01:36:55.960 --> 01:36:58.279 on mind valley for a while and i've actually 01:36:58.279 --> 01:37:00.920 just kind of ventured into now i'm exploring 01:37:00.920 --> 01:37:04.140 just my own it's not guided and just kind of 01:37:04.140 --> 01:37:07.420 have my own routine things i go through in the 01:37:07.420 --> 01:37:09.840 morning and it's not to say i won't do guided 01:37:09.840 --> 01:37:12.399 stuff again but i'm really liking where i'm at 01:37:12.399 --> 01:37:15.539 and you know it's always evolving You can change 01:37:15.539 --> 01:37:18.079 it. I have masterclass too. I was watching some 01:37:18.079 --> 01:37:21.520 of that just about, about meditation, but not 01:37:21.520 --> 01:37:24.859 necessarily taking you through a guided one. 01:37:25.720 --> 01:37:30.819 And I will say too, I will, I have noticed like 01:37:30.819 --> 01:37:34.600 the ability to drop into that headspace is easier 01:37:34.600 --> 01:37:37.119 the more you practice it. So like if I am on 01:37:37.119 --> 01:37:40.279 top of, you know, a wingsuit base jump and I 01:37:40.279 --> 01:37:42.060 haven't jumped in a while, it's always scarier 01:37:42.060 --> 01:37:44.020 the first one, you know, when you're not current. 01:37:44.380 --> 01:37:48.659 And the ability to, it's funny, it's like basically 01:37:48.659 --> 01:37:51.439 when I put my helmet on, it's almost like a physical 01:37:51.439 --> 01:37:56.500 conduit into like dropping into that headspace. 01:37:57.060 --> 01:38:00.199 And, you know, one of the guys that was filming 01:38:00.199 --> 01:38:04.739 us in Switzerland was saying that he could like 01:38:04.739 --> 01:38:09.720 feel the energy shift when, because we were goofing 01:38:09.720 --> 01:38:10.920 around on the ground a lot, but when we were 01:38:10.920 --> 01:38:13.899 up on the exit. he's like whoa because we took 01:38:13.899 --> 01:38:15.979 him up there with us he's like that was interesting 01:38:15.979 --> 01:38:18.600 to watch you know and being able to shift into 01:38:18.600 --> 01:38:22.859 that headspace of uh it's still fun but it's 01:38:22.859 --> 01:38:28.560 it's focused and I think that practicing mindfulness 01:38:28.560 --> 01:38:32.159 yeah helps to draw me into that headspace more 01:38:32.159 --> 01:38:35.699 more easily which ultimately leads to higher 01:38:35.699 --> 01:38:40.939 performance and um yeah it's good for good for 01:38:40.939 --> 01:38:44.359 safety and for and for performance absolutely 01:38:44.359 --> 01:38:47.180 well for people listening if they want to learn 01:38:47.180 --> 01:38:49.000 more about you follow you where are the best 01:38:49.000 --> 01:38:53.140 places online or social media um best place online 01:38:53.140 --> 01:38:56.479 and social media would be through my instagram 01:38:56.479 --> 01:38:58.899 right now which is fly with katie and i spell 01:38:58.899 --> 01:39:03.460 katie k -a -t -i -e brilliant Well, I want to 01:39:03.460 --> 01:39:05.239 thank you so much. It's been such an amazing 01:39:05.239 --> 01:39:07.340 conversation. I mean, all the different facets 01:39:07.340 --> 01:39:10.300 from the diligence and training and progression 01:39:10.300 --> 01:39:12.920 when it comes to skydiving and safety. And then, 01:39:12.960 --> 01:39:15.920 you know, your emotional journey from the accident 01:39:15.920 --> 01:39:18.159 has been so much to kind of glean from this. 01:39:18.260 --> 01:39:20.800 So I want to thank you so much for being so generous 01:39:20.800 --> 01:39:23.100 with your time and coming on the Behind the Shield 01:39:23.100 --> 01:39:25.760 podcast today. Thanks for having me, James.