Welcome to episode 5 of Behind the Shield. My
name is James Gearing. I will be your host. And
my guest this evening is Julian Penault. Now,
Julian is self -described as a movement specialist.
He's originally from France, has been an athlete
himself his whole life, started as an MMA fighter
and then moved on to strongman competition, but
then found a passion for fixing people. So became
enthralled in movement, founded his own company
called StrongFit and began fixing broken athletes.
That was kind of how I came across his work.
I had just come off a back injury, had healed
it using foundation training, but still felt
that I had got weaker even though I'd been training
more and more and more. Heard him on a podcast
called Barbell Shrugged and it just kind of blew
my mind. From when you were taught the traditional
way of thinking and someone comes in with a completely
different way, it really did strike me as amazing.
The big thing is the way he trains people is
so pertinent for firefighters, police, EMS, because
he focuses on moving weight over distance like
strong men do. So he uses a lot of sandbags,
yokes, sleds, which totally replicates the tools
that we use in our jobs, whether it's firefighters
with ladders and hoses or dragging people or
wrestling people to the ground. We don't do our
work standing still with both feet planted. We're
in awkward positions and we have to carry a pretty
substantial amount of weight and use a substantial
amount of force to do our jobs. So you need something
over and above the average level of training.
So in this interview, we first talk about how
I got him to train with me. It's quite a funny
story. We go over methods versus principles.
um why crossfitters get hurt and why they shouldn't
um common muscle imbalances found in many many
people people that are trained especially um
that lead to injury people that are in pain that
really shouldn't be in pain going to the pain
cave, finding your anaerobic threshold and pushing
through, becoming mentally tough by using exercise,
and then talking about barefoot again, about
how I mentioned before I kind of get laughed
at at the gym. But here's a 200 and God knows
how many pounds bearded monster who also walks
around his gym with no shoes, carrying ridiculous
amounts of weights. So I am extremely excited
to bring this guy to you. I think he is going
to make a lot of people think very differently
about how they train. It has not made me throw
away all the training I did before, but it's
really made me kind of reevaluate. the way i
train and certainly incorporate a lot of his
movements into my training as a firefighter i've
become a lot stronger a lot more effective as
a fighter i've become stronger as well certainly
in jujitsu where my grip strength and it's going
to overall strength and power is certainly improved
and i think when you hear him talking about where
these imbalances are I know when I looked in
the mirror and looked at my training and looked
at where my strength had actually become to diminish,
you self -examine and then you go, okay, yes,
this guy absolutely has a point. So it's not
some... this spiel trying to convince you to
do x y and z actually you'll hear in the interview
he's a he's a humanist he doesn't care about
profit he's not trying to get rich like so many
of our guests that we have they just have a message
and they want people to get out of suffering
they want people to eat well to train well to
love well um and they're not out to make a quick
buck and you know they they should be wealthier
than a lot of these these people that are very
rich in my opinion but they are more concerned
about So I am very excited to introduce this
interview to you. And without further ado, here
is Julien Panot. All right, so welcome to Behind
the Shield. This episode, we have Julien Penaud
joining us. Julien, thank you for calling in.
Oh, my pleasure. My pleasure. How have you been?
Very well, thank you. Long time no see. I think
the last time you saw me, I was crawling and
spreading tears all over the Torrance parking
lot. Oh, good. I'm glad you remember. I wasn't
sure. It was so bad, I didn't know if you blocked
it out of your head or not. No, I've still got
the picture of you. Yeah, the classic Julian
picture. Yeah, I have it too. So it's an interesting
story how I ended up there, actually. I think
I'd like to start with that before we delve into
all your knowledge. I remember hearing you on
one of the first podcasts I ever listened to,
which was Barbell Shrug, the original crew. And
I know they recently lost Chris Moore, and I
was very, very sad to hear about that. But your
initial... episode and then the two you did back
to back really really you know hit home with
me I'd been struggling with with injury um I'd
found one one method that worked very well I
think I remember telling you about it was foundation
training Eric Goodman's work um but that translated
well to a point but there was definitely other
elements that were missing um so I was dying
to to come over and And spend a lot of time with
you. And then you put out a request for a coffee
mug. Do you remember that? Yes, I do. It was
the Son Goku Super Saiyan Transformation coffee
mug. I remember. Heat activated. Exactly. So
if you put hot coffee in it, it created a fireball.
Is that right? Yeah, exactly. Something like
that. So I managed to find it in one of those
Chinese AliExpress type deals and send it over
to you. And you sent me the invitation to...
come and train with you. So first question, do
you still have the mug? I do. Of course I do.
It's Dragon Ball Z, man. I still watch the movies
and the shows and everything. I totally have
the mug. The funny thing is my cousin bought
the Vegeta one. Oh, is that the other one you
were looking for? No, because the thing was I...
put it online, right? Just as, oh, look, someone
got me this. And then everybody went crazy on
it saying they wanted one. And my cousin loved
it so much. He got the other one because I got
Son Goku. So my cousin Cedric bought the Vegeta
one. That's hilarious. So you started a trend,
man. Yeah, that was an expensive cut, though.
I paid for that in blood, sweat and tears. Yes,
you did. Yes, you did. And the other question
was, I remember using the bathroom and you had
the squatty potty. You still use that? Of course
I do. Which actually has been a problem because
we travel so much, most places don't have. So
I have to come up with creative ways to elevate
my feet. Yeah, I have to say that was another
epiphany in the world of health when I realigned
my, no other way of saying it, realigned my butthole.
It makes a way bigger difference than people
think. yeah no it really does and when you think
about again i mean probably what we're going
to be talking about anyway which is yeah evolution
101 yeah yeah squatting down when you when you
do that and how it's supposed to be principles
yeah yes exactly now uh well there you go you
just hit on the very first thing so the before
we even delve into you know all the the tools
that you use and the way that you think one of
the most poignant things that you talk about
that i think hits home for everyone and obviously
this is going to be steered towards a tactical
athlete and we'll talk about that but your emerson
quote principles versus methods yes and that's
basically what drives my life really like everything
i do so he said like there is um i mean you have
to research the quote because he says it better
than me every time i kind of mess it up a little
bit on the grammar but you see like there is
um But a million methods are there, but very
few principles. A man who follows the principles
can make up his own method, whereas a man who
follows method without understanding the principles
will always run into trouble. And that is such
a true statement. And of course, he didn't talk
about training at the time when he said that,
but you can apply to training almost more than
anything else, really. But to me, it touches
as a core. core problem that we have in today's
society. Like, for example, when was the last,
when did you hear about, you know, who was the
last great philosopher? And look how long you
have to go back. Like, so I think that's really
what philosophy is, is going after the principles
of thought and everything. And it seems we are
at a phase in society where we are focusing on
methods. more than principles which you know
is not is not uncommon like society go through
faces but we definitely right now focusing on
methods too much like you can tell like einstein
changed the world you know like about what 80
90 years ago and since then we've been really
working on applying his uh his principles and
it's a little bit the same thing uh on a society
level is right now we are too too focused on
methods and you see that You see that with training
a lot. The problem with this is methods don't
fit with everybody, obviously, always. And so
a lot of people are falling into the cracks.
And that is leading to many, many issues. Yeah,
absolutely. I think that's what I've seen in
the short time I've been on this planet. It seems
like a lot of trainers, a lot of equipment manufacturers
are all... trying to uh address an issue as if
we're all made exactly the same so you know one
one guy is going to be five feet and 200 pounds
of pure muscle someone else is going to be six
and a half feet and morbidly obese and these
training tools don't all apply to every single
person one person might be super high and slow
twitch another person may be extremely explosive
and i think that like you said that i love that
about the methods is And it's the same really
as thinking about why you're doing it is what
is it that do you want to achieve at the end?
And therefore, you know, how are you going to
traverse that path and find your own individual
way instead of trying to use, you know, a DVD
or or, you know, a weightlifting method or whatever
you've chosen to do something that is one size
fits all. Yeah. But the thing is, they are common
patterns that evolution gave us. The problem
is, as you were saying, is like everybody. is
driven mostly by trying to sell instead of sharing
knowledge which uh those programs are made to
to be sold equipment is made to be bought by
people and everything so everybody's trying to
get to a volume of sale instead of a quality
of knowledge and so they are being driven by
by finding a way that fits for most people without
caring for the few that don't fit in that mold
and So some people will get results out of it
and a lot will not. And for the ones that don't
fit in that particular mold, it sucks. And so
what I want me is I want for people to understand
the common ground on which they can base their
decision. Like I had a discussion this morning
with someone who was talking about function,
like the function of the human body, and he was
starting to quote rugby. saying like, well, yeah,
but for rugby, the function is it, the function
is that. I was like, no, dude, rugby is not a
function. It's a specialization. It's a method.
It's something you want to do. Your body doesn't
care that you do rugby. The function of the body
is to obey its biology. It's a hormesis and a
meostasis, you know, like the favorable response
to stress on one side and balancing on the other.
That's the function of the human body. That's,
you know, it regulates everything through those
two biological functions. Playing rugby is not
a function. It's just a method, just a specialization.
So if you look at training only from the side
of doing rugby, that means you're going to only
do the movements that will help you on the field.
Then you're going to lack a certain foundation
because you never truly looked at what evolution
gave you in the first place. And so it's that
mindset all the time of looking at what you want
to do as the... as the end game, instead of looking
at what evolution gave you and going from there.
So there is a certain common ground where we
can all start. The problem is that starting point
is way towards specialization instead of starting
at the basic human function. Yeah, absolutely.
I think that's what we're seeing as well in a
lot of the gyms. And I've heard you talk about
it. And I've said the same thing to my fellow
trainers in our gym. is that why again so in
my in my field obviously you know the why is
one of the reasons that people are going to be
training is to be better at our job so if you're
a fireman obviously you've got a lot of physical
tasks you're going from zero to 100 you're going
to be striking you're going to be dragging um
you know police officers are going to be chasing
from a sitting position to a full sprint um and
by doing certain movements certainly if your
your programming is towards a kind of competitive
CrossFit style genre. And I'm a CrossFit coach
and I do think that it has value, but there is
a disconnect and reprogramming why, finding your
why, I think is extremely important with your
choices of exercises. Oh yeah, the why is everything.
And by the way, I'm all for CrossFit. That's
the thing with me is I want to make CrossFit
better. I don't want to replace it. I think CrossFit
has done a wonderful thing and it has changed
the way we train women forever. There is no question
there. CrossFit has done more for women toward
training and as a sport and even for self -image
than any other activity has ever done. I think
the problem is not CrossFit itself. I think the
problem are the movements that are being used.
Because if you look at CrossFit, the idea was
high intensity functional movement done in a
not necessarily random way, but constantly varied.
It sounds like your job, really. you know like
it's either the job of a fireman or of a cop
it's a highly functional movement you know a
high intensity which means you have to sprint
like you were saying and constantly varied because
you never know what you're going to face so crossfit
like the you know like the principles of crossfit
the idea behind it was uh so so high intensity
highly functional my problem with the way it
is being done right now is like first of all
at uh high intense High intensity is gone. Everybody
is going after high volume instead of high intensity.
And doing an hour Metcon is not going to help
you chase a bad guy for 25 seconds, wrestle him
to the ground. That's just not the same. You
know, it doesn't work like that. And the second
level is that functional movement. Functional
movement to me means you are trying to mimic
nature, right? We are trying to duplicate what
works in nature. A snatch does not count as one.
The barbell does not count as one. Like in everything
that you do as a fireman, as a cop, and everything
what humankind has been doing for the last 200
,000 years, we have lifted everything that were
in between our hands. That was the rule because
you had to grab it first, right? That means the
center of gravity or whatever you're lifting
was taking you toward the internal rotation,
toward the torque, toward the inside. A barbell,
the weight is outside of the hand. So mechanically
speaking, it reverts. the torque so we go instead
of going to our internal rotation we go to our
external rotation that alone changes the way
you apply leverage therefore changes the way
we we've been doing things for so long to me
a barbell is not the best i'm not against barbells
but that's not the most functional movement i
can think of just by the mechanics of it alone
it reverses the way we've been doing things for
a very very long time so but if we look at the
root of crossfit functional and high intensity,
I'm all for that. My problem is the way it's
being done right now does not follow the principles
upon which CrossFit was created. So that's a
little bit my problem as well is I think CrossFit,
we're talking about method, like CrossFit became
a sport as well. And so instead of staying with
certain principles, they started to evolve toward
the sport. And the problem with the sport is
it does not fit 90 % of people. Not everybody
can do an overhead squat. Not everybody should
do an overhead squat. And they are being stuck
into only one plane of movement, which is a sagittal
plane up and down in order to deliver certain
things at the CrossFit game. But this cannot
be applied. to the training of regular people
or firemen or police officers or things like
that. So to me, the problem is just the evolution
of CrossFit went toward the CrossFit Games instead
of staying with that functional path, basically.
And I think that's when we went wrong. Absolutely.
Yeah. What I found, because on my personal journey,
it was very interesting. I got into it pretty
early in 2008 when it was still, you know...
From someone not being involved in the California
scene, it was pretty early on. And early on,
I followed the main site. And it was really fun.
You did your workouts and you literally competed
with everyone around the world. You also submitted
your comments. But it was like a five -minute
in a pain cave type workout one day, about 20
-minute Metcon. Yes, exactly. And then the strength
day. And then you cycled through. And when I
was doing that, I found... huge gains i wasn't
getting hurt um and then as the programming started
to seem to veer towards the competitive side
as we got to 2011 ish around then 2010 2011 i
noticed and i kind of had veered off of it myself
i noticed that a lot some of the raw strength
that i developed early on and some of the musculature
that i got had actually diminished so when i
think that's what hit me so hard when i saw yours
is um It wasn't just, oh, I think what Julian
is saying is right. I looked in the mirror and
I'm like, where are my lats? Where is my ass?
My glutes have disappeared. My lats have gone.
And then there was a very pivotal moment where
we did a fundraiser CrossFit slash fire competition.
And there was a drag using a product you'd actually
love called the fire sled made by one of my.
My brother's here. And it was a hose drag, but
there was weights on the sled and it was a piece
of hose and you dragged it. And I couldn't drag
it for love nor money. Yet I could do 30 pull
-ups and, you know, all the other movements.
So, yeah. So, I mean, the imbalances that you
talk about, I mean, they're absolutely happening.
I think not just in CrossFitters, but in a lot
of people that do the weights routine. So could
you elaborate on some of the main imbalances
and how they manifest? Yeah, so I call that balancing
the box. I was talking about homeostasis. It's
really like it's a quality of a system that seeks
to gain and maintain balance, right? You're talking
about body temperature, about pH level in the
body, things like that. Like the body wants homeostasis,
so it wants a certain amount of balance. And
if we look at the human body, and in that case
what interests us is human movement, right? So
we have to define. First of all, we have to define
human movement because it's a conversation nobody
ever has. So first of all, what is movement?
What are the components of movement? So a movement
for a human is either a load, a carry, or a hold,
right? Those are the three movements, really.
You load as in like, you know, a push, pull,
a squat, or a hinge. You can carry. or you can
hold as in balancing things and stuff like that
so it's important to understand that the body
is designed for all three because that means
you're going to need to do them in your programming
and then after that you're going to take those
movements in all planes of movement so you have
up and down toward and away from you left versus
right and then everything that is rotation based
it has to be taken through all energy systems
and all types of contraction because muscle are
capable of eccentric concentric and isometric
contractions so if you look already at those
four And you take, let's say, a training system
like CrossFit, you will see right away the imbalances
popping up. Everything in CrossFit is all loading.
We don't carry things outside of the CrossFit
games, obviously. We don't carry enough things.
We don't hold. We don't work on balance enough.
Right. So already you get one out of the three
that you work constantly and you do not work
on the other two. You neglect the other two which
is never a good idea because right away that
means you are out of balance if we look Like
your typical CrossFit programming for the planes
of movement. You will notice that everything
is up and down That is not even you know, 8 %
of movement in CrossFit is everything is up and
down mostly up actually So we don't do any more
activation toward and away from you Forget barbell
rows, bench press, all that stuff. The left versus
right is inexistent. Outside of lunges and pistols
for the lower body, I can't imagine anything
else. And for the upper body, we don't do one
-arm stuff, at least not enough. If you look
at energy systems, CrossFit used to be pretty
good at it, like you were saying. We used to
do Metcons. We used to do short. Whereas now,
really, it's basically the same workout. It's
20 -minute AMRAPs, 20 -minute EMOMs. 20 -minute
Metcon. It's basically the same energy system.
We don't have the very, very short ones. Whenever
people want to do a two -minute workout, they're
going to do a two -minute workout and then six
workouts after that. Really, what you're doing
is 20 minutes of work just with rest times. We're
still not hitting that high, high -intensity
workout where you just do that for the day and
you gear your body toward very, very short Metcons.
If you do a short Metcon, wait 10 minutes, do
another one, you're saving some in the tank for
the next one. You're not really working on that
energy system. The energy systems are getting
a bit out of whack. And the contraction, we don't
lower the weight in CrossFit because we try to
go fast. So forget eccentric. Isometric, we don't
hold anything. So forget isometric. So everything
is concentric based. So that leads to a certain
number of imbalances in the body. And then that,
over time, with the intensity, with the weights,
with the volume that is being done in CrossFit,
just starts to accumulate faulty movement patterns.
And eventually, you're going to pay the price
for that. And so something I've seen so many
times now is, for example, there's no more lat
activation in CrossFit because everything is
skipping. And so I've been telling everybody
they need to go back and do lat pulldowns because
nobody can use their latissimus dorsi anymore.
Go to your local CrossFit gym. Ask people to
do the wide lat thing that bodybuilders do all
the time, you know, that frontal pose when they
widen their lats. Ask people to do that. People
cannot find their lats anymore. If you ask them
to engage their lats, they retract their shoulder
instead of protracting them. They just can't
go do the wide lat anymore. So that means they
use their upper back all the time, their traps,
but not their lats. Problem is the second reason
for the lats is to keep your shoulders down.
So that means when you engage your traps and
upper back and not your lats, you're going to
shrug on every single thing. So you're going
to engage the traps even more. And before you
know it, your shoulders are jacked. And that's
where we see so much shoulder problems within
CrossFit. is one of the big reasons is the lack
of lat engagement. Give me one exercise in CrossFit
right now that targets the latissimus dorsi.
All the pull -ups are kept. And especially with
a butterfly is you have almost no tension now
toward engaging the lats. And so that's turning
into a real problem. That one is turning into
a real problem. And I get that. And then you
have the same thing with hammies where arm strings
are not being used that much anymore. It's mostly
quad dominant. for many reasons but we don't
have time to go into them but we have the same
problem with with the hammies so there's certain
things like that that are starting to develop
within the the programming that you know within
crowdfit right now with the programming the way
it is that i can tell you that from my side is
starting to develop certain faulty patterns that
are dangerous so i see more and more people with
messed up shoulders for the same basic reason
every time of the lats and then messed up lower
back because they can't use their hammies so
instead of hinging And learning what a hinge
is, they end up doing a flexion extension of
the spine all the time. And of course, their
erectors are blown up at every workout. They
start to thicken and their crossfit is very thick
erectors. But you don't want to do a flexion
extension of the spine with heavy weights. You're
supposed to hinge on a deadlift, not do a back
extension. So that's leading. That also is leading
to a problem with the lower back. So now we have...
A lot of back spasm, a lot of neck spasm, and
a lot of shoulder problem in CrossFit. I'm sure
I've described 99 % of people are going to listen
to you. Yeah, yeah. I mean, certainly you've
got a lot of CrossFitters out there. The other
group that we've got, I think, are everyone else.
So the people that haven't been in that kind
of gym environment yet. However, they're all
going to be at least 18 plus, unless they're
volunteering and they're young. So these are
people that have been in a chair for... Two decades,
three decades, four decades. And that's another
thing that I'm seeing a huge problem with. And
you say about the hinge. The hinge is a massive
deal. People cannot squat and cannot hinge at
the moment. Yeah. And I mean, how many movement
patterns do we have? We have four. I mean, loading
patterns. We have the push, the pull, the squat
and the hinge. That means can't squat, can't
hinge. I mean, you're incapable of using your
lower body. That means you're going to ask your
spine to do every single thing. That sounds like
a nightmare. And on top of that, you're deconditioned.
You're at the desk. That means you're around
your shoulders all day long. So that means you
have no lats, no capacity for using your lower
body. Yeah, that means you're just asking to
have a messed up back, basically. And in the
short run, forget the long run. So all this is
not working. And the problem is going to the...
CrossFit for me is the... is what we need to
go toward. Because the global gym with the machines
are not teaching you how to move properly either.
So it is a solution, but it's not the solution.
What we need is, again, those functional movements.
We need to go back to the principles and teach
people how to move correctly. And whether it's
someone sitting at a desk or a crossfitter or
a fireman or a police officer, People need to
move correctly. It took us 200 ,000 years to
get to where we are. You're not going to change
it in 40 years or 50 years just because the body
is designed for certain things. We have to follow
the guidelines. If you go against it, you apply
the wrong leverage on joints and it's going to
hurt. There's just no way around it. We need
to teach people how to hinge, for example. Otherwise,
the back spasm will never go away. People spend
so much money per year on back problems. It's
absurd. And they go see PT or doctors that can
only deal with trauma. So if you go see a PT
before you actually have a traumatic vertebrae
problem, he's going to take an MRI and see absolutely
nothing because there is no trauma yet. What
you have is basically the improper movement pattern,
which is forcing a certain muscle group to work
against his own nature. And you end up with really,
really bad back spasm. trauma yet the only thing
a PT can do is stop you from doing it make the
muscle recover and send you back on your way
and guess what since you haven't changed the
movement pattern six weeks later you're back
at the PT doing the exact same thing and this
can go on for years until eventually you actually
create real trauma on the spine and now they
talk about surgery and you still haven't changed
the movement pattern which means you still go
back to the same problem and so that's what drives
me insane in the industry right now Yeah, I had
a conversation with one of my members just the
other day who was almost in tears and she was
suffering from GERD. So it wasn't even a traumatic
thing as much. But the first thing I asked her
was, well, did your doctor talk to you about
what you're eating? And she said, no, she just
prescribed medication. And I'm like, well, that
sums it up. That's exactly the problem, whether
it's a medical condition or a traumatic injury
like a lot of us are seeing is. The information
they're getting is incorrect. I grew up going
through the quote -unquote globo gym. I went
through CrossFit in a good way. I got injured,
hurt, learned a lot of things, flew to California,
worked with you, worked with Eric, worked with
some other people, did Ido Portal's classes,
and have really reprogrammed the way I think
about movement. I think that's exactly it, the
word movement. You said that you hit the nail
on the head. We're so busy thinking about exercise,
working out. and and that's not what the purpose
is is how am i going to move better and by moving
through space and carrying loads like you said
that's how we learn to undo all the misinformation
of the last few decades yeah and it's again we
are trying we are following guidelines evolution
gave us guideline to follow we cannot go against
that and uh so yeah as you were saying like people
are so focused on i'm going to do this exercise
because i want this So, yeah, let's let's go.
Wanting something is crazy, but let's go about
what you need first. It's like, yeah, but that's
what the industry is just like that lady. They
prescribe your medication. It's like it's like,
you know, those obese people that go do a stomach
surgery. And I'm like, but you haven't dealt
with the food issues that you have yet. That
means what makes you think you're going to stop?
eating like this just because you had surgery
and they go well i don't have a choice oh no
and you know what they say that and then a year
later they're back to eating hamburgers and the
stuff they were eating before that so it's a
little bit the same thing in the training industries
like the surgery is exactly like doing that that
stomach surgery thinking oh now everything is
okay no you're exactly in the same pattern as
before you're gonna have the exact same problem
coming back and the system does not seem to care
about that it's always It's a disease care instead
of a health care system, basically. So they're
just trying to fix problems as they show up,
instead of trying to understand the root cause
of the problem and only fix it once. And so you
can either do it that way or you do what is being
done right now, which is fixing 26 times the
same problem. And so that has been the battle
for me, is to not give people exercises or methods,
to try to make them understand how to do it.
Right. It's Socrates who said, I cannot teach
anybody anything. I can only make them think.
And so that's really what I'm trying to do is
just trying to get people to understand what
are the basics of movement so they can teach
themselves how to move correctly. Or at least
coaches to teach their people how to move correctly
first before you put them into. a class system
like a crossfit or whatever it is that you want
and and go from progress after that first we
need to establish that foundation of movement
if we don't have that we're in trouble and now
that the kids are moving less and less and less
and going to our training later and later in
life it is more necessary than ever to teach
a foundation for good movement because we don't
have those chinese kids that have learned you
know gymnastics at an early age or the russian
kids that have been you know farming their whole
life we have kids And small adults and fortunately
older adults that have never truly learned to
move correctly. And so you add fitness to that
and you have a disaster. Absolutely. Yeah. And
it's inexcusable. I think it sounds very, I don't
know what the word would even be. there's a phrase
i heard a while ago and it's there's no profit
in healthy or dead people it's keeping the sick
ones alive that they're they're experts on that's
really where we're at i mean they're just medicating
people um i spoke to joel salatin who's a well
-known farmer organic farmer yes and i've read
his book yeah he's fantastic his books yep yeah
and we're pointing out the same kind of thing
is when you hear someone's on a blood pressure
medication You don't hear them in a few weeks
say, okay, that worked. I'm off now. I'm off
that medication. No, you're on it for the rest
of your life. So it's basically legalized, you
know, drug pushing, really, if you think about
it. Well, it is. Like, look at the problem that
we have with heroin in the United States right
now. It is directly linked to painkiller medication,
where at some point people take so much, it's
too expensive, they can't afford it anymore.
So they turn to heroin. This is happening in
the Midwest and the rest of the United States
right now. But that's been brewing for years
and years and years where people just were put
on pain medication instead of learning to understand
why they were in pain in the first place. We
still don't have a conversation about pain and
what pain truly is in this country or actually
in Western society. Instead, we just pump people
full of drugs and then we wonder why we turn
them into drug addicts. It's the system right
now is not. good for human beings it's good for
the capitalism aspect of it but when it comes
to human beings it is not working no absolutely
not and uh i think one of the reasons why i was
endeared to you is you always describe yourself
as a humanist and i think that's that's when
when change happens if you're not trying to make
a quick buck out of people either through drugs
or some exercise you know modality or piece of
equipment and you take a step back and you actually
care just about people and wanting to fix them
i think that's when you get a very clear viewing
like this is so so simple eat this kind of food
and move this way and and you won't be in pain
and you won't have these amazing diseases that
we've manifested the last few decades yes and
it takes people like coaches like us to as you
said take a step back do not go for the three
weeks program or the six weeks program do not
think you're going to get rich in the first two
years doing this or ever probably but It requires
us to look at people and not at the system. You
know what? It requires us to look at principles
and not methods. If we want to teach that to
our people, we have to be the first one to do
it. We need to look at principles, at who are
human beings, what are they made of, how do they
move and everything, and just go through that
process. If you do this in order to make money
and, you know, like on a monthly basis and everything,
you will not create change. Right. And you create
change by by carrying one person at a time. Like
that's that's what I always done. It is like
I want to change the world, but I'll do it one
person at a time. I'm not interested in packaging
what I do in doing big methods, basically, that
I can sell into a book. I'm interested in. Changing
the world one person at a time, trying to fix
one person at a time, making them think about
their body differently and teaching them that
way. And I think if there's enough of us doing
this, we can create something. But as long as
the fitness industry is only interested in six
weeks block, lose 30 pound bullshit, we will
have a problem. And the same thing, whether it's
food or exercise, it's all the same. Like it's,
as you said, it's actually far simpler. Once
you look at it with a different timeframe in
mind, if you look at it in a six weeks timeframe,
you're going to have problems. But if you look
at it in a two years timeframe, everything becomes
so much easier. Yeah, absolutely. And I've been
touching back on what you were saying about the
painkillers. I've been a fireman and paramedic
for 12 years now, EMT paramedic. And the few
generations before me, heroin was a big thing,
but nearly all the... the deaths that i've seen
on opiates have been the prescribed pain medication
and obviously there's only one reason why those
are prescribed pain either from poor diet or
pain from you know trauma through muscle imbalance
really so by fixing those two right there you
get into the root of the cause of a lot of drug
addiction and abuse as well well there's no question
like i mean don't get me wrong like you get hit
by a car yeah you should get painkillers but
if you need painkillers to go train Because you
have a problem that is gradually getting worse.
Now we have an issue. What's the definition of
insanity by Einstein? He's doing the same thing
over and over again, expecting a different result.
If a problem is gradually getting worse, then
obviously you're doing a movement pattern wrong,
right? There is no reason for your body to just
decay like that after every single workout. And
so I look at it and every time I'm like, but
guys, does it sound normal? your back like you
there's no mri that don't show anything you x
-ray nothing is broken but like six months now
you're worse than you were six months ago yet
you kept doing things exactly the same way and
so now your way of getting out of that you're
just taking painkillers it's circular logic you're
just killing yourself slowly and i find that
uh mind -boggling that the the system is just
jumping on on painkillers like this like we we
still are short of a true discussion even what
pain is that alone they just so that push towards
painkillers for me is to me is criminal that
it's like it's actually the dirty secret in crossfit
like everybody talks about steroids there's not
that much steroids in crossfit that's not the
problem the problem of the painkillers especially
the anti -inflammatories most crossfitter that
i know at some point or another we're training
on anti -inflammatories because the pain level
was too high and i was like then Maybe, just
maybe, you're doing something wrong. We need
to stop looking toward those quick fixes and
go toward a better approach. Absolutely. And
that kind of ties in nicely to another one of
your principles that I absolutely love. Can you
explain the Keylog to everyone? Yeah, the Keylog.
That came out of something that I saw when I
was a kid. I think it was a Discovery Channel
documentary about the logging industry in Canada.
where they were dropping the wooden logs in a
river and the river would take them down, obviously
downstream to a mill where they would cut the
wood. And once in a while, there would be a jam,
a log jam that was created by, you know, the
logs getting stuck onto each other. And so they
would call that one guy. He was actually an engineer.
He looked to me like a magician at the time,
but really he was an engineer who would come
around. and look at the entire structure, pick
one log, remove that log, and everything would
start flowing again. And that, to me, looked
like magic because if he picked the wrong log,
nothing would happen or our log would get broken
through the pressure. And so he would come and
just pick the one that created the entire jam,
remove it, and things would start flowing again.
And that, to me, even as a kid, struck me as
a fundamental... thing for life basically like
many times there's one log that is keeping the
other 265 from flowing correctly so you can try
to remove all 265 logs one at a time which will
obviously would be excessively uh you know would
take a long time and be excessively expensive
or you can try to find that key log that one
log that is blocking all the other one And if
you can remove this, everything starts flowing.
And for me as a coach, thinking about that when
I was a kid was like an epiphany for me because
I was like, that is the way the body works. There
is always that one problem that seems to trigger
all the other ones. So instead of treating all
those problems, maybe if we can come to the root
cause of that issue and treat just this and let
the body deal with the rest, then everything
will start flowing naturally. So the key for
me was this is like, try not to over coach, try
not to fix. Every single problem, like basically
methods versus principles, try to find the underlying
principle of that problem, fix that underlying
principle, and every single consequence of the
problem will just go away by themselves. And
that allows me to see complex issues in very
simple terms, because I am always looking for
the underlying principle of the problem instead
of focusing on each and every single symptom.
And so that has been the key of my coaching,
has been this. But again, I go back to principles
of our method. It is the same way of thinking
about it than everything else that I do. Fantastic.
Yeah, I know when I came over to work with you,
you had me do one of the movements that you're
famous for, which was the overhead yoke carry.
Describe that to people. holding a strongman
yoke but completely over your head in a jerk
or snatch position and then I'm traversing across
the parking lot with that swinging around. So
you're stabilizing it, you're carrying that load
and the overhead position has always been hard
for me. I'd have problems with my shoulders and
I'd also found that when I used to squat I always
used to kind of kick out to one side and when
you videoed it for me you said it's my obliques.
and so at first I didn't even know you know what
to make of that because I knew the obliques of
those muscles that you had the sidey bend moves
for and so when I looked at it I'm like oh my
god that's it and then it suddenly occurred to
me this will ring true I'm sure to a lot of the
people out there when you are one hand dominant
you normally carry most things with that hand
So when I started, A, doing the programming that
you suggested, but B, just trying to carry everything
I picked up with the opposite hand. At first,
that opposite oblique was burning. And then as
it built up and got stronger and stronger, the
balance went back through that as well as the
other movements that I put in. But having that
imbalance in your obliques as well as your pelvic
tilt affected my entire body all the way up from
my shoulders all the way down to my feet. No,
it did, yeah, because it changed your structure.
That's the problem. First, we're always dominant
on one side, so that means that side is already
stronger. And because it's also a better coordination,
we have a tendency to carry those things mostly
on that side. So now you're left with an entire
weak side that has a structure that is already
to start with far weaker. And so if you add natural
life on one side and a certain level of volume
and fitness on the other, You end up having a
structural problem. Whenever you have a structural
problem, it will reflect on everything. So in
your case, the problem was that side was so much
weaker. You could not put any real weight on
it. So you had to shift all the way to your other
side, your strong side. But that made you like
have a weird spine position in order to create
some kind of balance because you wanted to go
toward your strong side, not use your weak side.
So you had to shift your spine a certain way
to do that. And that particular position was
a nightmare for your back, your hips and everything
because nothing was aligned properly with good
leverage. And so that's that overcompensation
that wrecks you and that wrecks most people.
It's not the first mistake that kills you. It's
the second one. The first mistake is to have
a weak oblique, but that's not really what's
going to kill you at the end. What's going to
kill you at the end is trying to use your other
side too much. So that second mistake, that second
overcompensation. That one is going to get you
because now you start to have a weird positioning
and that accumulates through everything that
you do. So you start very slowly with this. So
it's barely perceptible. But if you do that over
a long period enough of time, you're going to
end up with a major problem, a major turn. So
then you have people that can't carry without
turning to one side or collapse to one side.
And now you have a real problem. Now you're creating
a situation that can be traumatic for the body.
But the problem is it's not. it's not obvious
to fix because it started so small and you build
that over time. You just didn't realize you were
doing it. That's how actually you boil a frog.
How do you boil a frog to death? You put it in
cold water and you raise the temperature very
slowly. If you do that, the frog will stay in
the water until it boils to death. If you were
putting that frog in hot water, it would jump
out. But because you put it in cold water and
raised it very slowly and you got time to get
used to the temperature going up, it will stay
until it boils to death. And unfortunately, We
are doing this ourselves a lot. As long as we
do it slowly enough, we are willing to go through
ridiculous amounts of discomfort on the body
that can lead to actual trauma. And so I see
a lot of people that just, you know, did not
realize what was happening until years and years
and years and years. And they come to me and
now there's a structural problem. So that requires
a little bit more time. What we had when you
came around, basically, was an entire side that
was collapsing under the weight. And so that
created problems in other places, like your knee,
your shoulder, whatever it was. And so if you
came to me just to fix the shoulder, if I don't
understand that there was a structural problem,
I'm going to try to fix the shoulder, but not
understanding that's not where the problem truly
starts. So that was the thing of the key log
is like, I need to see where the problem starts
at the beginning so that I don't end up trying
to fix problems that are only consequences. only
symptoms of the problem. And so many times the
oblique, it's a very, very important muscle group,
is responsible for people either squatting and
turning or collapsing on one side. But it's a
pyramid that I use, but you always have to look
at the body through the structural first. Can
your structure take the weight? Can you stabilize
it? And then we can start to play with everything
else. But so there are certain key parts. that
i look at when i look at movement but the key
is always to find that key log and in your case
i knew he was the oblique because i could tell
by the way you were collapsing under the weight
on one side and trying to compensate on the other
absolutely yeah and i sent you uh a video what
was it about two months so much better yeah it
was so much better your initial yoke i think
was 165 and that was 235 carrying it across with
better form so and and very importantly uh straight
like you were not uh, you know, you were not,
uh, talking at the spine. You were not, you,
that was actually good. Like I could tell like
both slats were firing correctly and you did
that with 50 % increase in weight. So it was,
it was, it was, I was very happy to see that
video. Yeah. I was happy to send it to you. It
was amazing. No, because I don't even remember,
but you saw the first video. Like I was worried,
I was worried about the pressure you were putting
on your spine and your shoulder. Yes. Yeah. No,
I just, it felt so. unstable and not the implement
but my my body's way of dealing with the implement
yeah your back did not look good when you did
it the first time no no i learned a lot of things
so um another one i want to touch on what was
still on the the injury side is another area
that i didn't realize was that bad till i started
using um some of your principles uh was anterior
shoulder roll now so many people have that especially
a lot of strong people so you get a lot of guys
that do that a lot of bench and those kind of
things and you see those shoulders rolled over
but they say oh i can't do this lift because
it's overhead i can't do overhead when i started
working on the z press and the landmine rows
and some of those those exercises that worked
on my rear delts and my my traps and my lats
and started pulling those shoulders back to the
position they're supposed to be in a when i looked
in the mirror My shoulders were where they were
supposed to be, like Da Vinci's original man
painting. And then B, I had the Bruce Lee lats
come back again, like you were saying, the Cobra.
But now the overhead stuff doesn't hurt. And
that is a huge one, I'm sure. I'm sure in law
enforcement being in the car all day, but certainly
with the firemen as well. And a lot of stuff
we do is overhead, passing things up there, pulling
ceiling. So just by no rehab, and you see people
doing the bands and the rotator cuff work. And
it was just purely building up those muscles,
you know, behind again. The lats. I mean, it
is such an important muscle and it's a big one
too. And go at the gym at home and start testing
people. Like as you were saying, you know, the
Bruce Lee, like the Cobra lats. Okay. Get people
to engage that way. You will be amazed, not in
a good way, on how many people cannot do this,
cannot find their lats that way. Because at every
seminar that I've done, I've chosen a muscular
female crossfitter, and they cannot do the cobra
thing. They cannot widen their lats. They can
only use their upper back. I cannot stress enough
how important it is for that muscle to work to
stabilize your shoulders. It is the structure
of your shoulders, the lats in that sense, where
they keep your shoulders down so you stop shrugging
and being always in that unstable position. The
lats are so important. And they are not being
worked properly. Go at the gym, the lat pulldowns.
I put everybody on it now. The Chinese Olympic
weightlifters do them. Find your lats. And it's
turning into a much bigger issue than even I
thought it was. But so, yeah, I think the biggest
difference you made on top of working your obliques
was working those lats. Yeah, absolutely. And
I think when... For everyone out there, if you
think about how you are now, I know I'm sitting
at a desk standing in front of this microphone.
So my hamstrings are short because I'm in the
seated position. You know, my shoulders are rolled
forward. My focus is in front of me. So I think
the same way that the body is so good at adapting
in a positive way, sadly, it's so good at adapting
in a negative way too. And if you're in this
kind of fetal position long enough. After a while,
the body decides, okay, that's what you want.
Well, let's keep it. And now you're screwed because
when you were two, you could sit in that perfect
squat with your great hip mobility. Now you're
32 and you can't even squat down without going
up on your heels or on your toes. Excuse me.
Yeah. And if I ask you to flex your lats, you
can't find them. No. Yeah. Imagine if I say flex
your quads, you'd be like, yeah, well, obviously.
Well, the glutes are the strongest muscle in
the body and the lats are the second biggest
one. And you can't find any of those two. You
know what I mean? That is not a good idea. Right.
Now, moving on to the glutes then. So we're going
to work our way around because I'm trying to
hit the main things that I'm sure the brothers
and sisters out there will be suffering from.
I think I talked about it before, I did that
sled drag. So when I started doing the sled programming,
I got myself a sled and sandbags and I started
doing it. At first, I felt very, very weak. But
again, as I started doing the drags, I realized
two things. Firstly, functionally, I was weak
in the areas that I was actually required to
do in my job. So pulling would be dragging someone
out. And then pulling as far as having the harness
on would be the same as dragging the hose. or
dragging something towards the fire, most likely.
And then the uneven carry would be people, because
I'd say to the guys I work with, people don't
have handles. They are a most awkward object
you could possibly get. They're a dead weight.
You're normally clambering over furniture and
God knows what to move people, whether it's in
a fire or... Yeah, and you can't grab them. No.
So that sled work was so important. I found a
huge benefit, especially with the rope pull as
well. The strength I got from that... i do jujitsu
as well i'm an absolute white belt terrible just
just started i got a three year excuse me a nine
-year -old has been doing it three years it keeps
reminding me he's a higher belt but when i do
roll with the guys i am known for my endurance
and now my strength and i never had the strength
part before but they're like we can't let you
get you to let go and it's it's the rope pulls
and the farmers carries and all you know the
sandbags with that raw grip strength so i'm not
in that pronated position that so many of us
are all the time when we work with barbells and
pull -ups. Yeah, what all that training does
really is build your structure. The rope pull,
the stand -by carries, the overhead your carry,
really all that system, not the system, but all
those exercises that I implement in that training
is to build your structure. Can you, you know...
Can you put weight on your structure? So that's
your carry overhead, your carry. Can you do those
basic movements that work your structure? The
rope pull is the last. So all those structural
muscles in a way that has fairly low skills so
you can push the body hard in that sense and
that is fairly low eccentric so that I don't
beat up your joints and your muscle too much.
And so you can get tremendous amounts of progress
out of those but without beating yourself up.
too much as well which is very important because
like for example as you said you're very active
you have a very demanding job and then you do
jiu -jitsu on the side and then you do crossfit
so if you do certain movements that are that
are hard on the joints then you're going to pay
for it at your job and in your case that can
be a difference between life and death so we
can't have that either so we need we that's why
i like those movements so much because the the
low skill low eccentric allows me to push the
body very far but without basically paying the
price for it So those are very, very important
movements that I think in your profession, people
would benefit of so much. And then more than
I would say like the snatch or movements like
that. And as you've seen, for jujitsu, it works.
Yeah, it certainly does. And the barbell movements,
you're absolutely right. I mean, one of the big,
just obvious, obvious epiphanies that I had.
when we started a listening to you talk and then
be doing the programming was being so static
and so many CrossFit movements, whether it's
the deadlift, the clean, the jerk, the snatch.
it's fantastic but a like you said if it's high
skill and you fail now you have to drop the bar
now that intensity is gone and then b there's
no left right transfer of that weight across
distance and there's nothing we really do and
i'm sure anyone listening in their job that's
standing still and the feet in exactly the same
place yeah and working when do you have that
much leverage and time yeah i mean like it's
it's never when do you have that much control
of the implement That implement is not awkward.
There's nothing less awkward than a barbell.
You have a perfect grip. The weight is perfectly
situated over time. You have control of the whole
thing. When was the last time you had control
about a weight you lifted during your job? As
you said, everything is awkward. Your left foot
is in front. You're twisting halfway because
you're trying to go around a table. You're trying
to whack or lift somebody who you're grabbing
on one hand. Life is awkward always. There is
no way a barbell prepares you for that kind of
weird lifting. It might make you stronger overall,
which would allow you to be stronger toward awkward
movement. But I do believe there is a better
way to do this. That if we talk about functional
training, certainly all those movements are more
functional than barbell ones. And they prepare
you mentally for like... If you ever had to lift
someone in your arms and go down a flight of
stairs, you understand what it's like to carry
a sandbag. It feels horrible. It's sitting on
your stomach. You can't breathe. Your arms are
burning because you're in that awkward position.
And yet you have to keep on plowing because otherwise
you're going to die. So at that moment, you'll
be happy you train on a sandbag. Instead of training
with a barbell, because the barbell does not
put you into that awkward thing, does not rest
against your stomach, does not impede your breathing.
You can be very pretty lifting a barbell, very,
very clean, perfect movement and everything.
Well, carrying someone out of building on fire
is not pretty and you're not breathing right.
And it's even carrying on your shoulder. One
side of your body is screaming. Your legs are
burning. It's just welcome to life, man. It's
not the barbell won't prepare you for life. Yeah.
And I think that variable grip. So for everyone
out there, pronated is how you would hold a barbell,
how you would grip a pull -up bar with your palms
facing away. And that's the majority of the movements
that we do in CrossFit. And I think a lot of
people do. But having that neutral grip, that
supinated where your palms are facing towards
you, and then not just grabbing a bar, but grabbing
all different types of objects is key in the
fire service, certainly, because all our things
are different shapes. You have to have a good
grip strength to carry someone down that flight
of stairs. You have to have a good grip strength
to ascend a 100 -foot ladder up to a building
because, God forbid, if you let go, you have
to have good grip strength to hold on to someone
that you're trying to arrest or wrestle to the
ground. Yeah, and you don't grip something with
a closed hand. In real life, everything you grab
is open hand. Nothing is small enough to grab
with a closed hand. Most things are open hand.
And that's not the same kind of grip strength
at all as a barbell. And again, like you were
saying, it's not pronated. Most things you grab
in life are in neutral. And so if you don't have,
you need to work those, you know, all nine radius
of the bones of the forearms. They cannot be
locked into the same position always. You have
to be able to train the muscle to allow them
to move as they should. So it's a lot of different
grip strength you have to work pronated. neutral
and supernated, but as well, closed fist versus
open hand grip. Those are not the same. Like
you can hook grip a barbell. You don't hook grip
anything in nature. So you have to work on a
different kind of grips, on the different grab
of hand position. All these contribute to things
in life. But if you have a tendency to train
only one thing, which is in that case pronated
and hook grip or at least closed hand, that's
what you're going to be good at. But now when
you have to grab something supinated and open
hand oh man you're gonna die and that's what
the rope pull is for is to make you work on that
open grip supinated but the first time you do
it you you'll understand how hard it is and you'll
be thankful you did that at the gym in the control
environment instead of finding that the hard
way on your job in a building on fire or catching
someone yeah absolutely And the irony as well
is that the implements we've been talking about
so far are very, very inexpensive. I know you
guys sell the sandbags at StrongFit. And they're,
you know, either side is $70. Is that right?
Yeah, exactly. And you get it shipped to you,
you fill it for the sand. And then the sleds
as well. I mean, obviously, there's different
ranges depending on what you want to do with
them. Yeah, but I mean, honestly, a sled, go
to Home Depot, grab a wooden pallet, go grab
a set of a chain, find a way to make a handle.
And then you get a sled to drag in a parking
lot for nothing, for $5. Yeah, perfect. And then
the rope, we've got 50 or 100 feet of inch and
a half, two -inch rope. Or I've actually used
a fire hose. I used an old out -of -service fire
hose for our one we have at the station. And
then you see online in Julian's videos, but you're
basically just bending over and dragging that
thing towards you. So it's low skill and your
arms and lats will be screaming by the time you're
done. Yes, they will be. And all those will allow
you to work in different ways than what you can
find in the gym. And it's just try the rope pull
alone and people will understand what I mean.
Try it once and you'll see how good of a movement
that is. Like the overhead yoke carry and the
rope pulls are by far my favorite movements.
Yeah, yeah. They're definitely some of the most
humbling movements. That too. Yeah. So let's
transition to that then as well. The different
energy systems, I know anyone that's done CrossFit
for a while, and I know we keep referring back
to CrossFit, but it is, like you said, a great
modality. I think a lot of people are familiar
with it. And overall, I think it has huge benefits.
It's just like anything, no system is perfect.
No, and there is a fact that since the games,
we have a tendency to employ it the wrong way.
I think CrossFit should be a Ferrari, and we're
using it like a landmower. like we saw the we
saw the crossfit games and we're just taking
that and making everybody do it was that was
never truly the idea behind it so yeah i i don't
want to yeah crossfit is can be done with great
results you've done correctly that's all yeah
actually just to change tack for one second um
i think you touched on this in your last live
uh thing you did with richard but CrossFit has
been amazing as well at redefining the sexes
because my gripe has always been in the fire
service. There is some mentality about, you know,
X person in the fire service, whether it's female,
whether it's whatever. And my thing has always
been you either can or you can't. There's two
types of firefighters, a good one and a crap
one. So it's been amazing to see that gender
redefined as well and see these powerful fit
women. be able to you know literally run circles
around men i mean sam briggs is a perfect example
she's a firefighter in england and is the crossfit
games champion so uh you know i mean obviously
that's one of the huge huge positive things that's
come out of that whole thing oh tremendously
i think we have trained women the wrong way honestly
up until crossfit i think we train them a weaker
uh train them like weaker men Because women seems
to respond much better to volume than it do pure
intensity So we've been loading them too much
not allow them not understanding how they working
like they work better with volume We the training
system we had for them was in was not good enough.
And so they did not trigger the results It should
have and so women were lacking behind and people
took that as I see they can't do it No, they
can they just have to be trained differently
There's a different way to train women than there
is to train men. It's just women respond better
to volume. That's just what it is. But that's
what CrossFit really does is humongous amount
of volume at a certain intensity. And women,
oh my goodness, have responded well to that.
If you look now at the weights being used at
the CrossFit Games, they probably would beat
Mikko Salo in 209 when he won. 12 women that
snatch over 200 pounds. And they do that with
a six pack, not weighing that much while being
able to do like 20 strip pull -ups. Like the
numbers that those women are capable of right
now is just, it's mind boggling. It's amazing.
And so it shows you that if you understand the
principles, you can make up any method you want,
basically. But that if you follow method without
understanding the principle, you won't go anywhere.
And that's exactly, I believe, what happened.
for training for women. It's just the principles
upon which the decisions were made were wrong.
And so the method didn't work. And here come
CrossFit who decided to do it differently. And
women have just taken off on it. I mean, so now
it's here to stay. Like, I do believe like the
strength and conditioning community is missing
a little bit. It's not jumping on the train because
they look at the men who are not very strong.
But the women, oh my God, the number they're
using. They're missing. How are they not seeing
that? There's probably like 30 women at the CrossFit
Games that squat over 315, that can deadlift
over 350, that can bench press over 185. Those
are good powerlifting numbers for women. And
you're talking about women that don't even train
for strength. in that sense, for max strength,
that do only Olympic lifting at the time, that
are very good at gymnastics, that have a six
-pack, that can run a 5K. Those are massive,
massive numbers that we have to start paying
attention to because there's something happening
there. Yeah, absolutely. And I had someone, actually
the creator of the fire sled, Rick, he said that's
where some of these agencies should be looking
to recruit. Oh, totally. I mean, that makes perfect
sense to me. Go to the... Go to the gyms in town.
Yeah, go to regionals. You can get half the field.
Like those women at regionals, like train them
for three weeks, they all pass the test. Yeah,
yeah. I mean, the tests we have now, and that's
one of my gripes too. I'm sure the law enforcement
field is the same, but there's been a lowering
of standards and they blame it for... for getting
more applicants in. But I think that's an extremely
dangerous philosophy because, you know, the,
the buildings haven't got any less dangerous.
The ladders haven't got any lighter, you know,
the, the, the felons that they're chasing on
any nicer and how, you know, so you need to keep
that standard and get people to rise up to it
and not bring that standard down. And I think
that's why, you know, the, the policeman that
you see maybe 50 years ago looked in better shape
than, than some of our brothers and sisters out
there now. And I know for the fire department
where I am, it's a constant battle just to try
and get exercise and nutrition deeply implanted
into the department because it's easier just
to say, oh, I won't, and then try and bring those
levels down. Yeah, because I know they were talking
about that for the military. How can it be? You
can tell women getting stronger by the year,
the CrossFit Games. And yet this seems to, like
in the military, they say, well, we had problems
finding women who can do five pull -ups, whatever
it was. I was like, where have you been looking?
Because I can't go to any CrossFit gym right
now. I'll find you 10 women that can do five
pull -ups. So, and if you go to regionals, you'll
find 40 that can do 15. So they are there, basically.
You guys, like, yeah. Let's introduce... proper
training done correctly. And trust me, we can
get those tests much higher than they are right
now. Yeah, yeah. And I agree completely. I think
it needs to bounce back up. I think there's so
many things that have regressed the last few
years. I mean, a few decades, excuse me, the
way people have been trained to eat, the way
people have been trained to exercise. And I think
there really is a paradigm shift in the way we're
eating. I just went to my local farmer's market
the other day. It looks completely different
than even two or three years ago. All this organic
food everywhere now. So I think people, I've
said this in one of my other podcasts, but people
are sick and tired of being sick and tired and
in pain. Yeah. So it seems we're winning slowly,
but we're winning. And me, I can tell because
from all the seminars that I do, like people
are listening now. Like five years ago, everybody
was slamming doors in my face. Now they're listening.
They actually ask questions. And I get a lot
of emails from people that want to do the same
thing, that want to fix people. Yeah, I think
like people realize that maybe just maybe being
that unhealthy and in pain all the time is not
normal. Yeah. yeah exactly just look at how how
we were when we came on this planet and look
at cultures that haven't been affected by a lot
of the the negative western influences you know
you've got people that are 80 90 still hinging
in rice paddies and and fields in these nations
growing their food you know and yet a 30 year
old can't squat down and tie a shoelace you know
so clearly it's not a human issue it's it's the
way that we are existing in 2016 Yeah, and honestly,
sometimes I think the food is even worse than
the exercise. Because exercise, if you can do
it, it's almost like an immediate feedback. With
the food, everything takes longer and everything.
And people have emotional connection to food
and are in denial when it comes to stuff like
that. The fact that some people do stomach surgery
because they can't stop eating certain things,
to me, is the most insane idea ever. yeah i mean
it is completely and then the the crazy thing
i was talking to uh joel salatin about this is
that it's so deeply ingrained that if you talk
to people about growing your own food and not
using chemicals you're you're almost viewed as
a hippie it's like this is what the entire human
race did till about 40 years ago and you guys
are talking about having something in your garden
they'll they'll look at you funny yeah And that's
the answer. Again, as simple as what we've talked
about today, the answer for wellness, the cure
for most of the diseases that we're seeing, if
they're not some sort of genetic defect, is purely
diet -based and then obviously exercise as well.
And just selling that basic, basic concept, the
principle instead of the method, would cure so
much disease in this country. Yeah, and they
would learn to do it themselves as well. They
rely on... way too much. They rely on programs
to tell them what to do, on programs to tell
them what to eat and how much of it. And then
they go to the market and then rely on them to
tell them that it was grown organically or not
or stuff like that. Just at some point, do some
of it yourself. Just go get smarter or go find
out if what they say is true. You have an organic
farmer, just one time, take a trip to the guy's
farm. See if he's doing it the way he says he's
doing it. And then maybe you learn something
on the way. Go there and then... I don't know,
learn to cook with him or something. Grow something
in you. Just start to take a little bit of control
of your own life instead of relying always on
people giving you stuff. Learn how to fish just
once in a while. Instead of asking people to
give you a fish, go learn how to fish. It will
put your mind in a better place anyway. You'll
understand how the system works and maybe you
won't take every single thing they tell you for
granted. Yeah, absolutely. I think by doing that
as well, There's a couple of things. First, you
get in touch with nature and you get your face
out of your computer or your tablet or your phone.
And then secondly, I think something that's lost
in our society at the moment is patience. So
say you do plant a little tiny garden in the
corner of your yard. That's not instant gratification.
You're actually going to have to be patient and
you're going to have to tend to it and wait for
it to grow and wait for it to mature. But then...
When you do enjoy the fruits of your labor, you're
going to feel a completely different connection
with that food than when you just went into Chick
-fil -A and bought a thing of fries, for example.
Yeah, and you'll understand it takes time. Because
that's the biggest thing is people come to me
and they're in pain. And so I establish what
needs to be done. And they're like, how long
is it going to take? And my answer is always
the same, as long as it takes. That's it. There's
no other answer than this. It will take as long
as it takes to fix you. But I mean, it took you
a certain amount of time to mess yourself up
that bad. What do you think this is? If I have
a magic pill, I'd be living on a desert island
somewhere, come here once a year, sell it for
a million dollars and go back. You know what
I mean? How long does it take? As long as it
takes. People have the wrong time frame now in
mind. when it comes to nutrition, when it comes
to exercise, they just look at it as a very,
very short time frame. And that is not the way
it works. No, absolutely not. And I think, again,
it's like we talked about before. It's knowing
your why. If you have a why, then it does take
as long as it takes because, you know, damn it,
by the end of it, you're going to get to that
point where there is... you know being able to
surf a wave that you've always want to surf or
play with your kid or you know whatever it is
but if you're just working on i want to lose
x amount of pounds or i want to have this very
short not very tangible feedback you're just
setting yourself up for failure and i think you
know getting out of pain is a great one so saying
getting out of pain is is the first part but
what do you want to do when you're out of pain
do you want to be able to do a tennis serve that
used to be able to do or And having that as your
goal, that will keep you going back to the gym.
That will make you make better choices in your
nutrition. Yeah, because getting out of pain,
actually, I can tell you from my side, is not
enough. You would think that would be enough
to get people to change certain things. Unfortunately,
it's not. Even getting out of pain, that works
for a certain amount of time, but they end up
doing the bare minimum. And I'm like, the bare
minimum does not work. Like what usually gets
people going, like the best why I've seen is
people that told me, I want to be around to play
soccer with my kids. That's been the one. Like
things like very, and usually selfless, you know,
in that sense of I want to do it for my family.
I want to do it for my kids. I want to do it
to be around for my grandkids. Those are the
kind of whys where you can tell people are. are
going to put the work in and really do real change.
People that come and say, oh, I just want to
feel a bit better because my back is spasming
or I need to lose 20 pounds, those ones never
make it. What matters is the why, is why you
do this. And vanity will never take you very
far, that's for sure. But just like who, I don't
want to be in pain anymore. Unfortunately, it's
crazy, but even that doesn't seem to be enough.
people need a stronger reason and usually a selfless
one to really get change going. That's what you
see with truly obese people that lost like 300
pounds. It's just one day they got scared. And
they had an epiphany and they go, oh my God,
I'm going to die and not see my kids. And that's
when they really do the change. But that idea
like I need to look better in the mirror, that
won't work. No, and I think that's what inspires
people when they do walk into whatever kind of...
forward thinking uh exercise space whether it's
a crossfit or whether it's something like a functional
movement like a gymnastics based uh gym is when
you walk in you see a 50 60 year old man doing
um you know clean slow strict muscle ups into
you know some sort of uh back lever or whatever
the whatever the move would be or you see someone
climbing a rope without using their feet or walking
across the floor with a handstand i think that
inspires people but you know you walk around
how many how many regular gyms you walk around
and there's young people that probably got six
packs but does that does that really inspire
you no but when you your body starts to to move
in a way that you've never been able to before
i can do things now at 42 that i couldn't do
at 18 it's so many yeah so i think that is you
know so inspiring and there's a there's a phrase
that i say to to firemen that i'm trying to i
guess inspire um there's one that says would
you want you saving you and i think a better
way of looking at it again removing yourself
from the equation is how would you feel if someone
died because you hadn't trained so then putting
other people's lives back in that balance where
it should be the whole time and reminding yourself
you know when you're getting tired or you know
you don't want to go work out or you want to
choose the crappy food someone's life might depend
on on me and that that driving you in your field
there's no question Like the responsibility is
past you. There's no question there. But this
is really the conversation because we can talk
about food and training all day and I can tell
you what to do and how to fix the back or the
shoulder and stuff like that. But at the end,
it starts there. That's just if you cannot answer
that question about your why, I can't help you.
And that's a conversation I had with most people
because they say, okay, when the conversation
starts to go, how long does it take? They have
those key words. I'm like, ooh, we need to backtrack
and we need to talk about exactly what is it
you're looking for because if you're looking
for – that's why I much rather train people that
are in pain or that are breaking more than athletes
because athletes just want to get that next competition
and everything that doesn't lead them anywhere.
The key is – You have to define your why and
there is nothing more important than that. But
not a why like I want to lose 10 pounds, like
a true why. You have to have that core reason
to go that hard and to go do that work because
it's going to take some work, that's for sure.
And so that why to me is everything. Without
the why, you'll never go anywhere. Absolutely.
I actually gave a what is your why speech at
the gym yesterday, funnily enough. um and the
reason i was doing that is i'd seen again uh
when we first had the gym uh the gym owner ted
has done really well you start off in a small
warehouse space and he's expanded and and it's
very successful gym but back when it was bare
bones you saw a lot more like we were saying
when you're done with it with the intense anabolic
um excuse me anabolic anaerobic uh threshold
type workout people lying gasping for air and
and i think that's very important to have those
kind of workouts whatever you know whatever style
you want to choose but something that puts you
to that point whether it's a sled push or or
a metcon because that's where you get that mental
toughness and that's where you go to that place
where you think you can't go anymore and i know
you're famous for this and then you get pushed
and i say to people you should leave the gym
101 % stronger than when you came in. So that
1 % that you thought you couldn't go past, if
that adds up every day, every day, every day,
now you're in a life or death situation, that's
how these people lift those cars off those kids
and that kind of thing because there's so much
capacity. But if you believe that humans are
built like China dolls, you're never going to
get that mental strength and toughness to push
through some of these things. Yeah, and I would
like to see on athlete coaches give that speech
almost every day. I think we can win that battle
with people, but it will require us to educate
people and more than just giving them knowledge.
We have to communicate that message, like make
them find the why. And I think we do that by
every single session, spending five minutes and
explaining the importance of the why. I think
that's part of our job as coaches is to go out
there and every session explain the importance
of the why. how they should do it, and just spend,
we need to spend the time educating people on
that. And every single session said, you need
your why, you need, today I'm going to need to
go push past what you think you can do. And I
think we can, that's where the change starts,
is with us coaches spending that time explaining
the why to people and why it matters that they
find it. Yeah. Yeah, because I know you shouldn't
be hitting that kind of intensity every single
session. You want to have those slower ones as
well, the ones with very strict movement, accessory
work. But we have seen a lot recently of people
finishing whatever Metcon or whatever style exercises
they've done. And before the barbells barely
hit the ground, they're already stripping their
weights and getting ready to go. So there's a
lack of that camaraderie of cheering everyone
else on and helping them get to that 101%. And
then also, if you can jump up after any sort
of exercise and start skipping to the weight
rack, something's wrong. Yeah. You didn't train.
There's no way. You've done a hard crossfit workout
and start cleaning up right away. Yeah. Yeah.
So, and I know just to kind of go back to one
of your movements, you have a prowler push that
takes people to that point. Oh, yeah. That's
my favorite right there. Like, that's when I
want to push people mentally. Because the prowler
push has no weight bearing. No eccentric, no
skill. So you absolutely have no reason for stopping.
So you stop whenever you quit mentally. That's
it. There's no skill. You can always take two
more steps. There's no eccentric, so you won't
beat up the next day. There's no weight bearing,
so your joints will be fine. So when you come
back the next day, you know you could have gone
harder. And so if I make you do this week in,
week out, within a few months, you'll be able
to create a tremendous amount of intensity in
your training. And there is no going around.
the benefits of intensity. Mentally, forget physically,
even just the mental aspect of it, you will be
so much tougher because you'll understand that
discomfort is not pain. There's a difference.
Yeah, exactly. And I think the rest of our...
Our life is so comfortable. I remember listening
to someone talking about, we have air conditioning
and we have couches and we have beds with covers
on and a roof over our head when it rains and
all these things. So you have to work extra hard,
A, on the whole muscle balance side because of
your sitting and that kind of thing. But B, if
you're in any sort of field where you need to
have that mental toughness, I mean, everyone
should have it really, but certainly tactical
athletes, you have to push yourself. hard you
know regularly because when it when it hits the
fan i mean like you said it truly is life or
death whether it's you and your partner getting
out or whether it's you getting to someone that
needs to be rescued and that extra bit um you
know that might be what it took to get to that
person so you literally might have saved a life
from that training alone and and you need to
train for it like most people think adrenaline
will take them there And that'll be fine. And
no, there are certain physical components where
you need to train to for your body to be able
to handle it. People don't understand what the
problem does when you truly go into the state
of shock because you push the body hard enough.
Like if you don't train for it, you will not
move for 20 minutes. It is far beyond what people
think. That's why, too, is people get. so comfortable
they forget what true discomfort can feel like
how soul crushing how how how strong the reaction
of the body against that can be so they they
always think like oh in the right circumstances
with the adrenaline i'll be able to go past it
no no you won't no you won't once you go anaerobic
threshold you're done there isn't you cannot
do anything you you'll die before you move And
so you need to be able to train it so you can
push that level at which your body will quit
further so that you never find that level in
your job as a tactical officer because otherwise
you're in serious, serious trouble. It can be
far rougher than people think it is because they
got soft. They don't go there anymore, so they
forget how hard it can be. Yeah, yeah. I'm paraphrasing
now, but there's some phrase. So you sweat on
the drill ground so you don't bleed on the battleground.
I think that philosophy is absolutely right.
Yeah, there is no question. All armies have known
that since the birth of time. I mean, just being
comfortable all the time is great, but mentally
it's not always a good thing. And so, as you
were saying, I think we need to push even harder
on a regular basis to compensate for that. Yeah,
I think it's even more important for the fire
department because once we make entry to a building,
the bottle on our back carries every last shred
of air that we have. So if you are panicking,
if you're not mentally tough, if you're not conditioned,
you literally have half of that air because you've
already blown off half just going in and that's
it. Once that's gone, you're done. So that, again,
dictates whether you walk out without ever making
a rescue or I interviewed the... Mitch Dreyer,
who was a fireman that got trapped in a fire
and by him checking his pack that saved his life
while his friends were digging him out. Yeah,
and also being mentally clear -minded while being
tired. That for you guys, that's paramount. Like
if you don't train and you get into that aerobic
threshold, your brain is gone. Like you can't
think straight. And there are situations in your
job where you need to think straight even though
you're excessively tired. You can train for that
by training those ridiculous workouts that I
have. Your brain will be able to go into it going
like, OK, this is bad, but I've been there before.
I can handle this. You can stay a little bit
clearer mentally. And even that little bit can
be the difference between life and death, between
making the right decision and the wrong decision.
So it is very, very important, not just for the
physical aspect, to go there on a regular basis.
You need to train for all this. It will impact
your life in many, many ways. Yeah, absolutely.
And I'm sure the clear thinking is especially
important for the law enforcement guys if they've
just had a chase and all of a sudden they're
in a situation where they might have to draw
their weapon in a split second. Plus, I know
them for fighting in MMA. When you're exhausted,
you make stupid tactical mistakes. In jiu -jitsu,
when you push far enough, when you're exhausted,
the white belt will whoop your ass just because
you can't move correctly anymore. You make stupid
mistakes because you're just exhausted as much
mentally as you are physically. You train for
it. Even exhausted, the black belt should not
be destroyed by the white belt because you should
be able at least to stall. But mentally, you
give up. Yeah, and that's exactly it. we have
the potential to tap out very easily, you know,
mentally if we're not testing ourselves all the
time. Yeah. Yeah, I saw it in Jiu -Jitsu all
the time. When you're exhausted, you want to
quit right away. It doesn't matter what the guy
does. I've seen guys quitting even without being
in a log because they just completely gave up
mentally. You know what I mean? And that was,
they were just freaking out. That's a mental
approach to it because I can't remember who said
that, but it was in ABC, I think, saying when
you're completely exhausted and you think you've
given everything, you got 60 % left. or something
like that. So I've seen it on Jiu -Jitsu many
times where guys just quit. And I was like, no
way. No way. There's no way. You didn't need
to quit. You could have just relaxed. I mean,
you quit mentally way before you quit physically.
And in your job, if you quit mentally, oh boy,
are you in trouble. Yeah, exactly. And it goes
back to the why again. I mean, if you have that
strong why. while you're training it will push
you through because you won't have that choice
in the real situation there won't be any any
walking out i mean we do evolution sometimes
and you know guys will will want to stop two
-thirds of the way in like well technically you're
in a burning building you can't take your gear
off you can't yeah yeah so exactly yeah all right
well i'm going to steer it around a little bit
um i have had so much flack by my uh refusal
to wear shoes as much as possible i have to wear
them when i'm coaching but i try and wear them
as little as possible and i know you're a fan
of not wearing shoes too so tell me tell me a
little background behind that um well honestly
a lot of it at first was like i was tired of
putting shoes in you know in and out like because
i would go upstairs in my gym and everything
at some point i said screw it so i didn't put
any shoes And then I have very flat feet and
I realized that over time, my feet, it took a
while, don't get me wrong, but my feet were getting
stronger. I was able to get the muscles of my
feet working better. Feet seems to be something
that people don't think about much, but those
muscles are not very big and it needs to be worked
a certain way. And with the shoes, the way they
are designed now is so cushy. like you you have
absolutely no control with the ground it's like
it's the same reason for me that i don't wear
gloves when i train you have prior receptors
in your hand like for example on the outside
of the hand if you press really hard you'll notice
your tricep activate that's actually a evolutionary
trait is because when you when you press hard
enough on the outside of your hand that means
you're pushing something so it triggers your
tricep to activate harder so if i wear gloves
and I lessen the amount of pressure the outside
of my palm is feeling, I'm not going to be able
to activate my triceps correctly. So that's why
I don't wear gloves when I train. It was the
same thing for my feet. There are certain pressure
points on my feet that I want to activate to
make sure my glutes, for example, or certain
parts move correctly. And so I think the softness
of the heels, for example, does not allow that
full contact. of the bone and does not trigger
the glutes as strongly as they should or things
like this so me it not wearing shoes was a matter
of moving the to me it makes sense that it would
help me move the way i'm supposed to move yeah
yeah because i've gone barefoot a lot in my life
i mean when i'm in at home i'm always barefoot
and the yard kicking around the football i'm
barefoot right now Yeah, me too. But I've never
had the issues with the fallen arches or anything
like that. And someone described it to me perfectly.
I mean, whether you believe, you know, the Darwinian
evolution theory. I do. Yeah, I do as well. But
you look at the anatomical side as well. The
bottom line is your feet are extension of your
hands. And so they're built to grip and balance
in that proprioception. is giving you feedback
all the time. And you look at the, I guess, devolution
again of shoes as the running got more and more
popular. And then before you know it, you've
got like half a foot of sponge beneath you and
you've lost complete contact. And you're higher
up, so it's easier to roll an ankle too. But
as soon as I went to the minimalist shoes or
bare feet, and I do all the yoke carries and
farmer's carries in the gym with bare feet, I
felt so much more connected with that whole movement.
it just you take a step back and well why wouldn't
you again as a species we've been barefoot until
very very recently yeah that's the thing you're
supposed to be barefoot you're not supposed to
have shoes when was the last time humanity had
shoes i mean outside the last hundred years so
that idea that oh you're not wearing shoes no
no no it's weird that you are wearing shoes i
mean like yeah and if you don't believe in darwinian
evolution i can't help you so i i had that at
the last um seminar i had the guy is a friend
actually but he raised when i i was making a
joke saying who who doesn't believe in evolution
uh jesting and he actually raised his hand i
was like oh jesus christ you don't be so uh so
let's assume that you know evolution uh is correct
for a second and um yeah we walking around barefoot
is a normal way like those bones have to touch
the ground If they don't feel contact, certain
things are not firing correctly. That's just
the way it is. Like, even when you grip, it's
the same thing. Try with your hands. Apply pressure
on certain parts of your palm, and you notice
certain muscles activating harder. Yeah, absolutely.
And I think, again, it goes back to what we said
earlier about gripping, too. You know, when you're
in one position, what happens to your hands and
your forearms? They get this huge imbalance.
Well, it's the same with the feet. If you have
shoes on all the time, and obviously there's
situations where you have to. I try and get the
lightest, most minimalist shoes for work. They
try and make out that we need to have these steel
and compass diving boots practically in case
we ever step on a nail. But the reality is we
have the EMS side where we're dealing with medical
calls in normal areas. or fire gear for if you're
going to be somewhere that may have potential
of hurting you. But that's, you know, for a short
time until that's over and then you take it off
and go back. But I think they've kind of gone
overkill in the steel -toed, steel shank, you
know, this and that. And I think the possibility
of stepping on a nail once versus 30 years of
wearing the wrong stuff on your feet is a bit
of an unbalanced concept. Yeah, and again, like
if you're going to rush into a building and everything,
of course, wear boots. But I'm guessing you don't
do that 10 hours a day. So, yeah, there are certain
occasions, of course, when you choose. But others,
like at home, for example, like we are right
now, just walk barefoot. Your feet will thank
you. And you'll be surprised how it affects balance
and glute activation and stuff like that. Yeah,
absolutely. All right. And then there's one more
concept of yours I want to touch on. And then
we'll do some short questions and let you. Get
on with your evening. But burn the questions.
I love that one too. Yeah, that was from Heidegger.
It was Heidegger, I think. They asked me during
the barbell shrug. And they were asking me what
I think when I'm about to do those parallel sprints.
So I have one set left. I mean, you're dying,
but you still have one more. Why do I think right
before I go? And I told them, I don't. I don't
think about anything. I'm at a stage where I
know why I'm doing this. I know at the end of
that parking lot is a better version of myself.
I know that once I get to the other side, I'm
going to be in a humongous amount of pain. I'm
going to cramp everywhere. But because I know
this, I am able to forge my soul a little bit
more. I'm able to be a better version of myself
on the other side. that stress will make me a
little bit better. And so I'm at a stage when
I'm ready to go. I don't think about that I need
to do it. I just I get to the point where I just
do it. And so I was using that quote when I say
burn the questions, like burn everything, burn
your doubts, burn who you think you are, burn
everything. Take that sled, go on the other side
of the parking lot. You will be a better human
being just out of doing that. but to get to that
stage you need to burn the question you need
to stop overthinking all that stuff the all those
reasons just burn the questions yeah you'll be
better yeah i think that's a great philosophy
um all right i got a couple of uh like quick
questions um first one you went on the war well
you're on the war tour really so any favorite
countries so far um i have to say for coffee
was east london oh really they have the best
coffee ever Like there was a coffee shop every
block that had just awesome coffee everywhere.
So I enjoyed my time there very much. I love
coffee. So I enjoyed my time there very much.
But a place I really like also was Holland. We
were in Utrecht, CrossFit Unscarred. And I have
to say, I love that city. Probably because I
love people from Holland. The Netherlands were
awesome. And people are... Very humble, very
polite. They all speak perfect English. I really,
really enjoyed my time over there. I love those
people. Yeah. It looked like it was an amazing
tour. And it's something that I preach to everyone.
The first year of our education here in the college
level should be a year of traveling the world
and actually seeing these countries and these
cultures for yourself and then realizing that
a lot of what you've been told is maybe not as
accurate as you thought. Yeah, it's not nearly.
Yeah, it's not what you think. That's for sure.
But I mean, I love all the countries, but just
there. You know, life is a collection of moments.
And we had some good moments. We visited a lot
of beautiful places. Overall, it was like we
were in Sintra in Portugal. That was just a gorgeous
city. We had awesome moments. Okay, now I know
you have a book club now. You recommend books
on your site. I know, it's so weird. Do you have
a favorite book though? Like one you recommend
to people listening now? Yeah, the first one
was because it was about all that. Like scientific
mindset when it comes to training of nutrition,
like principles of your method is so important.
And that's understanding the principles like
that is something that scientists do obviously
for their line of work. But the one that do it
the most, I guess, were the people for quantum
mechanics. Because a lot of the things cannot
be tested because the distances are too small.
So they have to rely on principles and advanced
mathematics. And so there was a very, very interesting
book. called A Black Hole War by Leonard Siskind.
It was a battle between him and Stephen Hawking
about information and entropy and things like
that. But it's explained in very, very simple
terms that anybody can read that book. Anybody
will understand that book even though it's about
quantum mechanics. But it will give, I believe,
a great... It shows what it takes to progress
and how to look at problems through principles
and the logical aspect that is needed to move
things forward and everything. So I found that
book to be fascinating. It's called The Black
Hole War by Leonard Susskind. Okay, brilliant.
And it shows you the universe in an aspect where
you realize you really don't know that much.
I already know that. All right, so I'll put that
link of that in the show notes. And what about
a movie or documentary? You got a favorite? A
movie or documentary? I mean, there's always
many, many movies. A documentary right now, I
watch a lot of stuff on YouTube because there's
a lot of lectures from great people that you
can find on YouTube. I don't have especially
one right now that strikes me as crazy, but I
have a tendency to watch a lot of lectures. from
there's some very um very very smart people and
it's crazy most of that stuff is for free on
the internet on youtube like this for people
to just have access to it i always wonder at
the internet man yeah yeah it's a it's a wealth
of information if you just start down that path
that's for sure and then uh when you need a laugh
when you need to decompress what do you do uh
usually i play with my daughter yeah that's uh
that seems to be a common one i do the same thing
it's amazing that the joy children bring to most
people yeah i mean not all the time but yeah
most of the time yeah all right so we're gonna
wrap it up but where where can people find you
obviously i know you've got your strongfit .com
website and you're also the movement coach is
that your technical title at uh crossfit invictus
Yeah, the movement specialist. But I'm the movement
coach. I'm on Instagram at StrongFit1. Okay,
fantastic. If people want to find me. And then
on Facebook at Julian StrongFitPino. But you'll
find me on Instagram at StrongFit1. Okay, and
then you have a lot of videos on YouTube as well,
don't you? Yeah, on the StrongFit channel as
well. Okay, so I recommend everyone look at those,
the sled movements that we're talking about,
the overhead yoke, Z -press, all those are amazing
and you could pretty much start doing them today
with stuff that you have probably very close
to you. And then is your programming on CrossFit
Invictus' site, is that correct? Yeah, that's
the template that I use. It's on the Invictus
website right now. It's called a Strongman program.
It's not a Strongman program. It's really my
template to balance, but we had to find a name.
And so it's listed under the Strongman program.
Okay. So if you subscribe to any of the Invictus
programs, Julian's, well, the performance one
is on there, I believe. But I did the Strongman
one and it was $29, I believe. Is that right?
I believe so, yeah. Yeah. And that will give
you a great start of how to program this and
get you on your way. So, all right. Well, Julian,
thank you so much. My pleasure. Your knowledge
is going to be coming from a completely different
angle, I'm pretty sure, than most people. I was
in this industry for a long time before I came
across your work and it blew me away. So, thank
you so much. Always happy to talk to you. It's
been a while. It has. And I'd love to do a part
two. I'm going to get my rear end on a plane
and come out there again. And you couldn't get
me to puke last time because I had a migraine
that day and I'd already thrown up all over my
old fire station. But I'll bring some gastric
juices for next time. Cool. And yeah, and then
I hope we'll be able to help the community, firemen,
police, all that stuff. I know like, It's a bit
closed by necessity, but I hope we can introduce
some new ideas about training and things like
that so we can help the guys. Absolutely. Well,
I'm sure that there's a huge amount of seeds
being planted after this and hopefully people
will come dive into your work and then run with
it. That would make me happy. It would make me
happy too. All right. Well, thank you so much
for taking your time. I appreciate you reaching
out to our community and wanting to help. My
pleasure. Talk to you soon, James. Thank you.
Bye.