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As a strength and conditioning coach 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:58.140 myself who also trains tactical athletes, dissemination 00:01:58.140 --> 00:02:00.459 of wellness information is one of the biggest 00:02:00.459 --> 00:02:03.719 challenges. Now TeamBuildr is the premier strength 00:02:03.719 --> 00:02:06.200 and conditioning software for tactical athletes 00:02:06.200 --> 00:02:08.960 and there are several features that really impress 00:02:08.960 --> 00:02:12.530 me. Firstly, there is a full exercise library, 00:02:12.650 --> 00:02:14.969 so you, the personal trainer, does not have to 00:02:14.969 --> 00:02:18.169 create that within your own department. Secondly, 00:02:18.330 --> 00:02:21.650 you can send out programming, but also individualize, 00:02:21.689 --> 00:02:24.469 which I love. So you blanket program for everyone. 00:02:24.669 --> 00:02:27.409 Now you can tweak based on someone's injury, 00:02:27.590 --> 00:02:30.090 someone's need to maybe drop some body composition, 00:02:30.150 --> 00:02:33.050 rather than having to write a program for every 00:02:33.050 --> 00:02:35.830 single person on their own. TeamBuildr also 00:02:35.830 --> 00:02:38.289 allows you to build custom questionnaires to 00:02:38.289 --> 00:02:41.330 collate health and wellness data. It integrates 00:02:41.330 --> 00:02:43.889 with wearables. And I think one of the most important 00:02:43.889 --> 00:02:47.710 things is obviously it tracks. To me, it's imperative 00:02:47.710 --> 00:02:51.169 that we as a profession start tracking our people 00:02:51.169 --> 00:02:55.069 from day one and then over the full span of their 00:02:55.069 --> 00:02:58.289 career, therefore catching potential wellness 00:02:58.289 --> 00:03:01.810 issues and injuries before they happen. Now, 00:03:01.830 --> 00:03:04.050 if you want to try TeamBuildr, they are offering 00:03:04.050 --> 00:03:06.389 you, the audience of the Behind the Shield podcast, 00:03:06.789 --> 00:03:11.009 a free 14 -day trial to experience all of the 00:03:11.009 --> 00:03:13.550 features. And if you want to take a deeper dive 00:03:13.550 --> 00:03:18.050 into TeamBuildr, listen to episode 1032 with 00:03:18.050 --> 00:03:22.069 Melissa Mercado or go to teambuilder .com. And 00:03:22.069 --> 00:03:23.590 I'll spell that to you because it's not as you 00:03:23.590 --> 00:03:30.340 think, T -E -A -M -B -U -I -L -D -R .com. Welcome 00:03:30.340 --> 00:03:32.139 to the Behind the Shield podcast. As always, 00:03:32.159 --> 00:03:33.960 my name is James Gearing and this week it is 00:03:33.960 --> 00:03:36.860 my absolute honor to welcome on the show Marine 00:03:36.860 --> 00:03:41.139 Combat Veteran, Tactical Medic, and the man behind 00:03:41.139 --> 00:03:46.039 Warriors Choice Foundation, Anthony Longo. Now 00:03:46.039 --> 00:03:48.560 in this conversation we discuss a host of topics, 00:03:48.759 --> 00:03:51.979 from his journey into the military, fire service 00:03:51.979 --> 00:03:55.919 paramedicine, the U .S. compound attack, working 00:03:55.919 --> 00:03:59.750 dogs, catharsis through canine therapy and so 00:03:59.750 --> 00:04:02.449 much more now before we get to this incredible 00:04:02.449 --> 00:04:04.990 conversation as i say every week please just 00:04:04.990 --> 00:04:07.590 take a moment go to whichever app you listen 00:04:07.590 --> 00:04:11.110 to this on subscribe to the show leave feedback 00:04:11.110 --> 00:04:15.000 and leave a rating Every single five -star rating 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:18.139 truly does elevate this podcast, therefore making 00:04:18.139 --> 00:04:21.779 it easier for others to find. And this is a free 00:04:21.779 --> 00:04:26.399 library of well over 1 ,000 episodes now. So 00:04:26.399 --> 00:04:30.000 all I ask in return is that you help share these 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:32.980 incredible men and women's stories so I can get 00:04:32.980 --> 00:04:36.079 them to every single person on planet Earth who 00:04:36.079 --> 00:04:38.980 needs to hear them. So with that being said, 00:04:39.180 --> 00:05:03.439 I introduce to you... Anthony Longo Enjoy Well, 00:05:03.480 --> 00:05:05.480 Anthony, I want to start by saying two things. 00:05:05.660 --> 00:05:08.100 Firstly, thank you to our mutual friend, Patrick 00:05:08.100 --> 00:05:10.779 Burrows, for making the connection. And secondly, 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:12.860 to welcome you onto the Behind the Shield podcast 00:05:12.860 --> 00:05:15.259 today. Yeah, thank you, man. I appreciate being 00:05:15.259 --> 00:05:17.019 here. This is going to be fun. I've been looking 00:05:17.019 --> 00:05:18.939 forward to it. I know we've spent some time trying 00:05:18.939 --> 00:05:21.040 to connect on this, so I'm glad we were able 00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:23.360 to do it. Absolutely. I think the last time we 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:24.839 were supposed to, you got hit with jury duty 00:05:24.839 --> 00:05:27.899 right at the very last minute. Yeah, I did. Yeah. 00:05:28.040 --> 00:05:29.379 And I didn't know what time I was going to get 00:05:29.379 --> 00:05:31.620 out. So, yeah. No, I appreciate you being patient. 00:05:32.160 --> 00:05:34.139 Yeah, no, I'm going to knock on wood now because 00:05:34.139 --> 00:05:36.939 I've been a citizen now for several years and 00:05:36.939 --> 00:05:39.439 I haven't been hit yet. I know I'm on the chopping 00:05:39.439 --> 00:05:43.680 block at some point. All right. Well, very first 00:05:43.680 --> 00:05:45.540 question, where on planet Earth are we finding 00:05:45.540 --> 00:05:48.620 you today? Right now, I live in Jupiter, Florida. 00:05:49.540 --> 00:05:51.680 Beautiful part of the state. Yeah, just outside 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:56.000 of West Palm Beach, north of, yeah, pretty much 00:05:56.000 --> 00:06:00.060 North County -ish in that vicinity. So it's been 00:06:00.060 --> 00:06:01.339 beautiful. I've been here for like 20 years. 00:06:02.349 --> 00:06:03.870 Brilliant. All right. Well, speaking of that, 00:06:03.930 --> 00:06:05.550 I'd love to start at the very beginning of your 00:06:05.550 --> 00:06:07.509 journey then. So tell me where you were born 00:06:07.509 --> 00:06:09.410 and tell me a little bit about your family dynamic, 00:06:09.670 --> 00:06:12.110 what your parents did, how many siblings. Yeah. 00:06:12.149 --> 00:06:14.829 So I was born actually in Minneapolis, Minnesota. 00:06:15.490 --> 00:06:20.610 And as far as that goes, we moved back to New 00:06:20.610 --> 00:06:25.050 York where my family was from. And, you know, 00:06:25.069 --> 00:06:26.949 from there, it was just kind of growing up in 00:06:26.949 --> 00:06:30.379 a low middle. middle -of -the -road class family 00:06:30.379 --> 00:06:34.519 in upstate New York, Schenectady, New York, which 00:06:34.519 --> 00:06:38.420 used to be the home of GE back in the day. And 00:06:38.420 --> 00:06:41.339 my mother, she was starting off to be a travel 00:06:41.339 --> 00:06:42.920 agent and then ended up going to work for the 00:06:42.920 --> 00:06:45.540 Department of Social Services, where she was 00:06:45.540 --> 00:06:48.639 connecting low -income families with child support, 00:06:48.879 --> 00:06:51.939 or not child support, but child programs for 00:06:51.939 --> 00:06:55.279 funding. And then my father, he was... in with 00:06:55.279 --> 00:07:00.600 the county as a worker, shift supervisor for 00:07:00.600 --> 00:07:04.860 their maintenance crew, maintenance team. Many 00:07:04.860 --> 00:07:08.339 of the towns and cities where we saw American 00:07:08.339 --> 00:07:10.959 industry leave for whatever reason, especially 00:07:10.959 --> 00:07:14.699 if we went overseas, there was a deficit. There 00:07:14.699 --> 00:07:18.000 was a void left. And a lot of times we found 00:07:18.000 --> 00:07:20.899 poverty and addiction and gangs and those kind 00:07:20.899 --> 00:07:23.040 of things starting to emerge. Was that the case 00:07:23.040 --> 00:07:25.920 in your city? You know, you can only imagine, 00:07:26.060 --> 00:07:29.959 you know, with General Electric being a huge 00:07:29.959 --> 00:07:33.519 player in that community and watching those jobs 00:07:33.519 --> 00:07:36.819 leave, there was a huge difference in, you know, 00:07:36.819 --> 00:07:40.120 obviously traffic patterns, but, you know, what 00:07:40.120 --> 00:07:42.920 it did to the economy. So for where I went to 00:07:42.920 --> 00:07:46.160 high school, you know, I went to Scotia Glenville. 00:07:46.259 --> 00:07:51.230 I started off in Scotia and then. I moved over 00:07:51.230 --> 00:07:54.189 back to Schenectady and that's where I ended 00:07:54.189 --> 00:07:57.069 up graduating from. So long story short, Schenectady 00:07:57.069 --> 00:07:58.649 used to be Linton High School, Linton High School, 00:07:58.730 --> 00:08:02.810 home of like Pat Riley. And, you know, so in 00:08:02.810 --> 00:08:06.329 essence, you know, once all of that happened, 00:08:06.470 --> 00:08:09.189 you know, the inner city definitely moved up 00:08:09.189 --> 00:08:10.790 into our area. So there were a lot of gangs. 00:08:10.910 --> 00:08:12.509 There were, you know, at the point where I was 00:08:12.509 --> 00:08:14.870 in high school, I mean, I think we were 2 ,500 00:08:14.870 --> 00:08:19.180 students alone in that high school. So you can 00:08:19.180 --> 00:08:21.360 imagine just with anything. So I was kind of 00:08:21.360 --> 00:08:22.980 grateful. I didn't grow up in like a private 00:08:22.980 --> 00:08:25.139 school. You know, I kind of had to learn the 00:08:25.139 --> 00:08:27.600 ropes and, you know, mind P's and Q's, but also 00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:30.720 have a little bit of a street mindset to navigate 00:08:30.720 --> 00:08:34.679 those groups of who to be involved with and who 00:08:34.679 --> 00:08:37.620 to stay away from. When you think about like 00:08:37.620 --> 00:08:40.360 the pushback against, you know, not sending jobs 00:08:40.360 --> 00:08:43.889 overseas or, you know. And in the argument to 00:08:43.889 --> 00:08:45.950 send jobs overseas, oh, well, then my car will 00:08:45.950 --> 00:08:48.190 be a little cheaper or my iPod will be a little 00:08:48.190 --> 00:08:51.129 cheaper. So, yeah, but at what cost to this country? 00:08:51.230 --> 00:08:54.350 And if you look at a lot of the cities and towns 00:08:54.350 --> 00:08:57.429 that had mining, that had Detroit and some of 00:08:57.429 --> 00:08:59.049 these other places that had the motor industry, 00:08:59.309 --> 00:09:03.269 the ripple effect of saving a few dollars by 00:09:03.269 --> 00:09:06.110 exporting, I mean, is a generational issue now. 00:09:06.809 --> 00:09:09.870 Totally. Totally. And you can understand that, 00:09:09.889 --> 00:09:11.889 you know, running businesses and organizations, 00:09:12.389 --> 00:09:14.610 it's, you know, even though you're running an 00:09:14.610 --> 00:09:15.929 organization, you're still running a business 00:09:15.929 --> 00:09:17.450 because you still need money to operate. You 00:09:17.450 --> 00:09:18.809 still have operating costs. You still have all 00:09:18.809 --> 00:09:20.850 the things that associate to that. So even a 00:09:20.850 --> 00:09:22.830 small dip in the economy, especially over even 00:09:22.830 --> 00:09:25.509 the last several years, you know, post -COVID 00:09:25.509 --> 00:09:30.169 with the recession that we were facing with inflation, 00:09:30.409 --> 00:09:32.909 you know, you could feel it through donors because 00:09:32.909 --> 00:09:36.320 it's like not too many people could give. to 00:09:36.320 --> 00:09:38.720 charitable organizations because they were just, 00:09:38.740 --> 00:09:42.360 you know, they themselves were trying to salvage 00:09:42.360 --> 00:09:44.899 and make do with their money, which is perfectly 00:09:44.899 --> 00:09:48.299 normal and perfectly fine. Absolutely. Well, 00:09:48.340 --> 00:09:50.419 going back to school age, what were you playing 00:09:50.419 --> 00:09:53.379 and doing as far as exercise and sport? Yeah, 00:09:53.379 --> 00:09:56.399 so in sports, I was big into baseball, loved 00:09:56.399 --> 00:09:59.919 basketball until I... obviously went to a different 00:09:59.919 --> 00:10:02.639 school where you know you're not six foot seven 00:10:02.639 --> 00:10:05.419 being able to dunk the ball and you know have 00:10:05.419 --> 00:10:09.179 handles like not gonna not gonna matter uh so 00:10:09.179 --> 00:10:12.399 then i started playing football and i got brought 00:10:12.399 --> 00:10:15.860 up as a as a sophomore started varsity um as 00:10:15.860 --> 00:10:19.100 a sophomore was one of the uh again brought up 00:10:19.100 --> 00:10:23.000 for varsity baseball as a sophomore and um just 00:10:23.000 --> 00:10:27.909 kind of use those platforms to kind of grow into 00:10:27.909 --> 00:10:29.929 who I was, you know, essentially going to become 00:10:29.929 --> 00:10:32.210 with work ethic and, you know, the different 00:10:32.210 --> 00:10:35.210 coaches that I've had over the years, I, I contribute 00:10:35.210 --> 00:10:38.470 a lot of my drive and work ethic towards them 00:10:38.470 --> 00:10:40.929 and having those authoritarian coaches like, 00:10:40.970 --> 00:10:43.809 Hey, like get off your soapbox, like continue 00:10:43.809 --> 00:10:47.669 to push. And then, you know, actually during 00:10:47.669 --> 00:10:50.629 football, I actually tore my Leonard Labrum. 00:10:51.200 --> 00:10:52.759 which is the cartilage inside your shoulder, 00:10:52.899 --> 00:10:56.580 protects the socket. And, you know, trying to 00:10:56.580 --> 00:11:00.340 come back and becoming a pitcher and then slowly 00:11:00.340 --> 00:11:02.580 that being taken away because I couldn't get 00:11:02.580 --> 00:11:04.220 the ball over the plate and then just having 00:11:04.220 --> 00:11:06.179 to figure out and re -identify myself as a first 00:11:06.179 --> 00:11:10.379 baseman was a challenge in itself. But, you know, 00:11:10.379 --> 00:11:13.500 I kind of knew at that point. athletics for me 00:11:13.500 --> 00:11:15.379 were kind of coming to an end once you're at 00:11:15.379 --> 00:11:16.960 that point in your high school career where it's 00:11:16.960 --> 00:11:18.360 like all right well i'm not going to college 00:11:18.360 --> 00:11:20.580 for this because of this injury so let's face 00:11:20.580 --> 00:11:22.460 like what are we going to do what's our next 00:11:22.460 --> 00:11:26.580 steps and uh during that time you know we have 00:11:26.580 --> 00:11:30.320 this uh like pulley program where the military 00:11:30.320 --> 00:11:32.659 comes in and if you're interested you get opportunities 00:11:32.659 --> 00:11:35.820 to collaborate with them and go out and see what 00:11:35.820 --> 00:11:40.860 they're about and kind of just slowly get indoctrinated 00:11:40.860 --> 00:11:44.139 with the culture of of what they want and um 00:11:44.139 --> 00:11:47.279 you know from there it was like you know the 00:11:47.279 --> 00:11:50.379 marine corps stuck out to me with having you 00:11:50.379 --> 00:11:52.620 know nice uniforms always you know dudes just 00:11:52.620 --> 00:11:59.259 stoic and um very just to the point and uh yeah 00:11:59.259 --> 00:12:02.899 i went out and researched and did a little bit 00:12:02.899 --> 00:12:07.100 more uh with a focus towards the Marine Corps 00:12:07.100 --> 00:12:09.440 than I did with any of the other branches of 00:12:09.440 --> 00:12:12.539 service. Because those at that point, you know, 00:12:12.539 --> 00:12:14.960 for in my optics, they were the best of the best 00:12:14.960 --> 00:12:20.440 from a large group. And that's where I, you know, 00:12:20.460 --> 00:12:22.019 I was like, you know what, these guys are going 00:12:22.019 --> 00:12:23.500 to go off to war. They're going to do this. They're 00:12:23.500 --> 00:12:25.639 going to fight. And this is what I want for me. 00:12:25.740 --> 00:12:27.940 This is how I see myself or this is the group 00:12:27.940 --> 00:12:33.039 that I can align with. And I think it was after 00:12:33.039 --> 00:12:36.879 I graduated. I went to a prep school, a two -year 00:12:36.879 --> 00:12:41.080 school, just a community college. They have a 00:12:41.080 --> 00:12:45.059 great baseball program. And found out quickly 00:12:45.059 --> 00:12:46.460 within the first semester, I was like, you know 00:12:46.460 --> 00:12:49.539 what? This is not for me. This is not where I 00:12:49.539 --> 00:12:51.440 want to be. This is not the life that I want 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:52.879 to live. It's not the area I want to live in. 00:12:53.519 --> 00:12:57.740 I need something different. And I literally went 00:12:57.740 --> 00:12:58.960 down to the recruiting station and was like, 00:12:59.019 --> 00:13:02.000 hey, where do I need to sign? How long is it 00:13:02.000 --> 00:13:04.639 going to take me? to to get out of here what's 00:13:04.639 --> 00:13:07.820 what are the next steps and that was right in 00:13:07.820 --> 00:13:12.039 2000 2003 when i did all that so the ward already 00:13:12.039 --> 00:13:18.019 kind of kicked off we had 9 11. um so it was 00:13:18.019 --> 00:13:19.320 it was kind of funny because the one recruit 00:13:19.320 --> 00:13:22.120 was like well trying to go through his his motions 00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:25.139 of recruiting like do you want to do your your 00:13:25.139 --> 00:13:28.379 at least 12 tabs travel this and that teamwork 00:13:28.379 --> 00:13:30.519 like which ones take out i'm like buddy what 00:13:30.519 --> 00:13:34.179 don't you understand what do i sign where where 00:13:34.179 --> 00:13:37.639 do i sign like what do i have to do and um we 00:13:37.639 --> 00:13:40.559 finally got through the process and uh i ended 00:13:40.559 --> 00:13:47.100 up leaving in february of 2004 for paris island 00:13:47.100 --> 00:13:50.080 which is down in south like beaufort just outside 00:13:50.080 --> 00:13:53.799 of beaufort south carolina and uh it was it was 00:13:53.799 --> 00:13:57.230 yeah it was that was a trip We're just pulling 00:13:57.230 --> 00:13:59.129 the clock back a little bit. Talk to me about 00:13:59.129 --> 00:14:02.529 9 -11, that day through your eyes. Through my 00:14:02.529 --> 00:14:06.970 eyes, 9 -11, I, you know, freshman, freshman, 00:14:07.049 --> 00:14:12.529 sophomore year. And it was like, what the fuck 00:14:12.529 --> 00:14:14.509 just happened? Like, are you kidding me? Like 00:14:14.509 --> 00:14:19.029 how, wait, what? And there was a nuclear power 00:14:19.029 --> 00:14:21.429 plant over by us in upstate New York. So everybody 00:14:21.429 --> 00:14:23.210 was kind of worried, like, hey, what's happening 00:14:23.210 --> 00:14:26.779 here? And we were just kind of like, all right, 00:14:26.779 --> 00:14:29.100 do we go back to school? Do we not go back to 00:14:29.100 --> 00:14:32.919 school? So I ended up cutting class the last 00:14:32.919 --> 00:14:36.379 half of that day just to sit and watch and see 00:14:36.379 --> 00:14:38.480 what was happening. Because, you know, my family, 00:14:38.679 --> 00:14:41.159 my uncle was a firefighter. So I didn't know 00:14:41.159 --> 00:14:43.039 if he was going to get called in to go down there. 00:14:43.419 --> 00:14:46.980 And you can just see, you know, a city in total 00:14:46.980 --> 00:14:50.269 chaos. like what's going on what's going on and 00:14:50.269 --> 00:14:52.029 then the collapse of the towers happened and 00:14:52.029 --> 00:14:54.149 then all of a sudden you start seeing other channels 00:14:54.149 --> 00:14:56.950 between the pentagon that popping up and seeing 00:14:56.950 --> 00:15:00.409 what the the how coordinated that attack was 00:15:00.409 --> 00:15:04.850 on u .s soil um really was just like i want to 00:15:04.850 --> 00:15:09.009 i don't want to say it wasn't like infuriating 00:15:09.009 --> 00:15:12.029 it was just kind of like that that doesn't happen 00:15:12.029 --> 00:15:14.350 here like that's no one's going to come into 00:15:14.350 --> 00:15:16.590 our house and do something like that so it's 00:15:16.590 --> 00:15:21.750 like what's the next step? And, you know, for 00:15:21.750 --> 00:15:23.370 me, it was just obviously I had to wait a couple 00:15:23.370 --> 00:15:25.769 of years, but then I knew it's like, there was 00:15:25.769 --> 00:15:27.970 a bigger purpose for me to be like, all right, 00:15:27.970 --> 00:15:32.389 I, I can't do this. Like this doesn't, this didn't 00:15:32.389 --> 00:15:35.750 mean anything to me at that point. So which role 00:15:35.750 --> 00:15:38.250 did you find yourself filling within the Marines 00:15:38.250 --> 00:15:42.789 themselves? So when I enlisted, I actually enlisted 00:15:42.789 --> 00:15:47.090 as a, as a radio operator. So my, my duties were 00:15:47.090 --> 00:15:50.610 what i was looking at was hey i wanted to go 00:15:50.610 --> 00:15:53.549 into the infantry in some capacity i didn't necessarily 00:15:53.549 --> 00:15:55.529 want to be directly to infantry because i wanted 00:15:55.529 --> 00:15:57.870 to have something that was transferable post 00:15:57.870 --> 00:16:03.429 post work and um you know looking at what i could 00:16:03.429 --> 00:16:06.950 do the communication field really kind of gave 00:16:06.950 --> 00:16:09.009 a little bit more of a broad picture into where 00:16:09.009 --> 00:16:12.190 i could go and um and what industry i could get 00:16:12.190 --> 00:16:16.399 involved with So went in as an infantry communications 00:16:16.399 --> 00:16:20.039 specialist. Once I finished boot camp, went to 00:16:20.039 --> 00:16:23.480 school. I was out in 29 Palms for about three 00:16:23.480 --> 00:16:26.379 months. And, I mean, that was shocking because 00:16:26.379 --> 00:16:28.539 it's like you're rolling in at 3 a .m. and it's 00:16:28.539 --> 00:16:30.480 120 degrees out. And you're like, wait, what? 00:16:31.039 --> 00:16:34.799 Where am I going? Like, where is this? And, you 00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:36.240 know, every day that we went, because I ended 00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:39.779 up going up there to school, it was June through 00:16:39.779 --> 00:16:43.500 September. so i was just like every day was like 00:16:43.500 --> 00:16:45.019 a black flag day where you're not supposed to 00:16:45.019 --> 00:16:46.879 do training and it's just like our instructor 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:49.600 was a former recon guy so he didn't care he was 00:16:49.600 --> 00:16:52.159 just like yeah okay black flag sure it is um 00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:55.279 but it was just uh it was an experience in itself 00:16:55.279 --> 00:16:57.919 to be able to automatically kind of jump into 00:16:57.919 --> 00:17:02.240 the travel from you know leaving maps going into 00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:04.720 boot camp getting done and you know there's a 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:06.799 whole system and process that goes with that 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:12.619 uh finally finishing that feeling feeling confident 00:17:12.619 --> 00:17:15.079 and validated enough for myself of like, I just 00:17:15.079 --> 00:17:17.900 completed something that was, that was, it was 00:17:17.900 --> 00:17:22.980 difficult mentally, but not like physically challenging 00:17:22.980 --> 00:17:25.259 as some would say, it's more of like, Hey, just 00:17:25.259 --> 00:17:29.240 forget what you know, and just readapt and apply 00:17:29.240 --> 00:17:31.400 the principles that they're trying to teach you. 00:17:32.059 --> 00:17:38.539 And, um, I, I, I took hold of that. And uh you 00:17:38.539 --> 00:17:40.500 know next step was once we finished school we 00:17:40.500 --> 00:17:42.039 got to pick our duty station so where we wanted 00:17:42.039 --> 00:17:44.400 to go and it was either going to go artillery 00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:48.369 or infantry so i was just like well this is easy 00:17:48.369 --> 00:17:51.049 choice. So it was also nice because then I was 00:17:51.049 --> 00:17:54.049 on the East coast. So then on, you know, 96 is 00:17:54.049 --> 00:17:56.150 or 72 is when we get our time off, I could just 00:17:56.150 --> 00:17:57.869 get in a vehicle and just drive straight up. 00:17:58.150 --> 00:17:59.910 It was probably going to be more guys from the 00:17:59.910 --> 00:18:02.549 East coast that, that I could, you know, resonate 00:18:02.549 --> 00:18:05.809 with and create new lasting friendships with. 00:18:06.170 --> 00:18:08.490 So that's kind of, that was the path and the 00:18:08.490 --> 00:18:11.150 reasoning behind me choosing to go over to two 00:18:11.150 --> 00:18:15.130 six on the East coast out of Camp Lejeune. And 00:18:15.130 --> 00:18:19.400 I checked in. I think it was like mid -September 00:18:19.400 --> 00:18:26.559 of 2004 to my unit. And so was Fallujah where 00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:27.940 you were first deployed? Have I got that right? 00:18:28.509 --> 00:18:31.549 Yeah. So we did our initial push to Fallujah 00:18:31.549 --> 00:18:36.450 in 2000. Well, basically my 21st birthday, September 00:18:36.450 --> 00:18:41.470 19th, 2000, 2005, I was actually in transit and, 00:18:41.529 --> 00:18:43.609 you know, with the time change and everything 00:18:43.609 --> 00:18:45.609 else like that, it was like, Hey, my birthday 00:18:45.609 --> 00:18:47.930 was spent on a back of a seven ton cramped in 00:18:47.930 --> 00:18:50.589 with a bunch of dudes cruising into Fallujah. 00:18:50.730 --> 00:18:53.910 So no Vegas for me and drinking and anything 00:18:53.910 --> 00:18:55.730 else like that. I was just like, all right, here 00:18:55.730 --> 00:19:00.099 we go. Well, I always ask these two questions 00:19:00.099 --> 00:19:04.180 to people that deployed to combat. The first 00:19:04.180 --> 00:19:06.500 is a two -part question. The reason I ask this 00:19:06.500 --> 00:19:10.299 is when you are back home, you have a very polarized 00:19:10.299 --> 00:19:13.000 view of war. It's either kill them all, let God 00:19:13.000 --> 00:19:15.400 sort them out, or they're all baby killers. And 00:19:15.400 --> 00:19:18.440 in the middle are our men, women, arguably children 00:19:18.440 --> 00:19:20.480 that we send overseas with the flag on their 00:19:20.480 --> 00:19:22.859 shoulder to go fight for this country and protect 00:19:22.859 --> 00:19:27.440 people of that country. Regardless of the politics 00:19:27.440 --> 00:19:29.339 that sent you there, because I think we're becoming 00:19:29.339 --> 00:19:32.000 a lot more clear now as to some of the distortions 00:19:32.000 --> 00:19:35.519 of the 9 -11 and Iraq journey. But regardless 00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:37.480 of that, was there a point where you realized 00:19:37.480 --> 00:19:40.079 there were some horrific people that did need 00:19:40.079 --> 00:19:43.740 to be taken care of? Yeah, absolutely. You know, 00:19:43.779 --> 00:19:45.660 there are bad people out there that need to be 00:19:45.660 --> 00:19:49.900 taken down. You know, there's no way around it. 00:19:56.349 --> 00:19:59.470 involved or being with entities that are sent 00:19:59.470 --> 00:20:02.210 off to go and do that type of work so that people 00:20:02.210 --> 00:20:05.390 here in your hometown and people that you care, 00:20:05.470 --> 00:20:06.970 people that you don't know about, people who 00:20:06.970 --> 00:20:10.970 can live that life of not even being able to 00:20:10.970 --> 00:20:16.670 conceptualize what that takes to be there is 00:20:16.670 --> 00:20:21.559 the reason why I feel as though people like myself 00:20:21.559 --> 00:20:23.940 and other people who serve in communal capacities 00:20:23.940 --> 00:20:27.720 or whatever the case is um feel the need to to 00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:32.140 serve them or to to serve that purpose and some 00:20:32.140 --> 00:20:33.339 aren't when they get there they're just like 00:20:33.339 --> 00:20:36.279 oh shit no this is not for me either so you know 00:20:36.279 --> 00:20:40.440 it's um you you generally you know for me it 00:20:40.440 --> 00:20:42.759 was like i was i was glad i was able to be put 00:20:42.759 --> 00:20:47.240 into that role and to serve alongside some amazing 00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:50.579 human beings and some not so amazing but um that's 00:20:50.579 --> 00:20:55.299 anywhere you go and it was it was just you had 00:20:55.299 --> 00:20:57.519 a mutual bond and it was between one another 00:20:57.950 --> 00:20:59.569 and you didn't want to let one guy down because 00:20:59.569 --> 00:21:01.410 you were all part of this system and a part of 00:21:01.410 --> 00:21:03.910 that team and i think once you get to that level 00:21:03.910 --> 00:21:06.990 you're able to overcome things as a group more 00:21:06.990 --> 00:21:09.869 so than just individual thoughts because we you 00:21:09.869 --> 00:21:12.210 know we had guys who didn't believe in being 00:21:12.210 --> 00:21:13.829 there and what we were doing and you know you 00:21:13.829 --> 00:21:16.329 have those views but you're just that's the great 00:21:16.329 --> 00:21:18.910 thing about this country and and why i chose 00:21:18.910 --> 00:21:21.170 to serve it is like you have the ability to be 00:21:21.170 --> 00:21:24.069 objective in your thought ideology and where 00:21:24.069 --> 00:21:28.069 that places you so that when it's all said and 00:21:28.069 --> 00:21:30.250 done, you were able to still hold true to your 00:21:30.250 --> 00:21:32.390 values and complete your contract and go move 00:21:32.390 --> 00:21:35.369 on and go do what you wanted to do. Well, the 00:21:35.369 --> 00:21:37.490 other side of that question that, again, we don't 00:21:37.490 --> 00:21:40.109 really hear, you know, relayed from the combat 00:21:40.109 --> 00:21:43.190 zones around the world is moments of kindness 00:21:43.190 --> 00:21:45.329 and compassion. I've had so many examples from 00:21:45.329 --> 00:21:48.269 people of all branches, from all countries. What 00:21:48.269 --> 00:21:50.369 are some moments of kindness and compassion that 00:21:50.369 --> 00:21:54.369 you remember from that deployment? I think, you 00:21:54.369 --> 00:21:59.279 know, when it first started off, it was yeah 00:21:59.279 --> 00:22:01.279 it's like hey this is real like we're here now 00:22:01.279 --> 00:22:03.319 let's let's keep our head on a swivel do what 00:22:03.319 --> 00:22:05.640 we have to do um you know and you're you're trying 00:22:05.640 --> 00:22:11.119 to bring in these ethos to to these villages 00:22:11.119 --> 00:22:13.599 and to these people who who don't know much about 00:22:13.599 --> 00:22:17.220 anything with with what's actually happening 00:22:17.220 --> 00:22:18.759 they know their way of life and then we have 00:22:18.759 --> 00:22:20.880 ours and we're now we're we're the invaders we're 00:22:20.880 --> 00:22:22.859 the infidels that are coming in so they're trying 00:22:22.859 --> 00:22:25.440 to protect their sovereign land You know, so 00:22:25.440 --> 00:22:30.160 you try to be hospitable in that sense to to 00:22:30.160 --> 00:22:34.160 kind of integrate with what they're doing based 00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:36.759 on your mission profile. And for us, it was like, 00:22:36.859 --> 00:22:39.720 hey, look, you know, whatever. If you have a 00:22:39.720 --> 00:22:42.119 cell phone, if they're doing this, it's the ROEs 00:22:42.119 --> 00:22:44.920 kind of set the tone for what our mission was 00:22:44.920 --> 00:22:48.880 over there. And unfortunately, you know, looking 00:22:48.880 --> 00:22:51.220 at it to a point where, you know, you have a 00:22:51.220 --> 00:22:55.150 group of kids. who one of our buddies was throwing 00:22:55.150 --> 00:22:58.170 candy down next thing you know he's posted on 00:22:58.170 --> 00:23:01.150 august we're getting shot in the head so it goes 00:23:01.150 --> 00:23:05.430 from you trying to to have some empathy for these 00:23:05.430 --> 00:23:08.269 people to understand like you know you guys just 00:23:08.269 --> 00:23:10.349 got rolled through all right now we're back here 00:23:10.349 --> 00:23:12.950 we're we're trying to help out and assist in 00:23:12.950 --> 00:23:14.809 the capacity and then next you know incidents 00:23:14.809 --> 00:23:18.329 like that happen it changes your dynamic and 00:23:18.329 --> 00:23:19.910 it changes your focus to where it's like hey 00:23:19.910 --> 00:23:23.480 look now now it's on now nobody cares about anything 00:23:23.480 --> 00:23:25.099 that's happening here because you you know took 00:23:25.099 --> 00:23:28.619 one of our dudes now you're going to feel the 00:23:28.619 --> 00:23:30.579 wrath of of what we have to bring and why we're 00:23:30.579 --> 00:23:34.099 here in the first place so how long did you find 00:23:34.099 --> 00:23:36.359 yourself there and you know where where were 00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:40.279 you assigned next so we were we were in country 00:23:40.279 --> 00:23:42.359 for seven months fortunately the marines only 00:23:42.359 --> 00:23:44.359 have to do seven eight months unlike the army 00:23:44.359 --> 00:23:46.700 who's stuck in certain places for like 15 months 00:23:46.700 --> 00:23:49.380 which is just like got awful um and then you 00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:51.619 get to come home and then have to go back but 00:23:51.619 --> 00:23:55.099 um we were there for uh right up until memorial 00:23:55.099 --> 00:23:58.940 day um where we were able to come back and then 00:23:58.940 --> 00:24:02.019 after that next thing you know we're in new york 00:24:02.019 --> 00:24:06.779 city doing fleet week in 2006. so you know we 00:24:06.779 --> 00:24:11.180 had a pretty good deployment um and following 00:24:11.180 --> 00:24:14.079 that next you know we're in new york city at 00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:16.880 ground zero at 9elec like seeing it all firsthand 00:24:16.880 --> 00:24:21.579 of four years later um of of all the work that's 00:24:21.579 --> 00:24:25.059 being done to to rebuild guys getting promoted 00:24:25.059 --> 00:24:29.960 in in sacred lands um so it's like it was just 00:24:29.960 --> 00:24:34.279 all so much to kind of to take in um but you 00:24:34.279 --> 00:24:35.960 were so proud of the service and the guys that 00:24:35.960 --> 00:24:37.740 you're around because okay hey we just got back 00:24:37.740 --> 00:24:40.710 from a pretty good deployment and Now we're here, 00:24:40.829 --> 00:24:43.210 and this is kind of what drove us, or at least 00:24:43.210 --> 00:24:46.789 was a bookmark, an earmark of why we wanted to 00:24:46.789 --> 00:24:51.009 serve. So did you deploy again, or did you transition 00:24:51.009 --> 00:24:55.109 out after that? No, so we had one year, well, 00:24:55.309 --> 00:24:57.369 about nine months in between, we did another 00:24:57.369 --> 00:24:59.509 workup, and then we redeployed back to the same 00:24:59.509 --> 00:25:02.250 AO. So we were operating back in Fallujah again. 00:25:02.309 --> 00:25:04.670 This time it was pretty much from the beginning 00:25:04.670 --> 00:25:09.329 of 2007. right up until about October, October, 00:25:09.430 --> 00:25:12.990 November. And then I was interested in actually 00:25:12.990 --> 00:25:17.309 transferring over to, I was going to re -enlist 00:25:17.309 --> 00:25:18.990 out there because they were handing out signing 00:25:18.990 --> 00:25:20.549 bonuses. So I was like, all right, well, you 00:25:20.549 --> 00:25:22.609 know, I want to go and be a firefighter, first 00:25:22.609 --> 00:25:25.309 responder, whatever the case is there. Let me 00:25:25.309 --> 00:25:28.670 see what's available. And because I had picked 00:25:28.670 --> 00:25:31.569 up rank and I was ended up going to be getting 00:25:31.569 --> 00:25:34.680 out as a sergeant in E5 at that time. There was 00:25:34.680 --> 00:25:37.700 no billets available for me to transfer over 00:25:37.700 --> 00:25:42.140 into a new MOS to take on that new job. So I 00:25:42.140 --> 00:25:44.180 ended up going through the motions of, you know, 00:25:44.180 --> 00:25:46.140 listening to guys' horror stories before of like 00:25:46.140 --> 00:25:47.680 trying to get, you know, to check out of the 00:25:47.680 --> 00:25:49.839 unit and everything else like that. And I knew 00:25:49.839 --> 00:25:51.559 coming back home off leave, everybody was going 00:25:51.559 --> 00:25:53.160 to be on Libo. I was going to get extended. So 00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:55.599 I started kind of checking out while I was in 00:25:55.599 --> 00:25:57.920 Iraq and nailing down the people. It's like, 00:25:57.960 --> 00:25:59.220 well, I know you're going to be here. I'm going 00:25:59.220 --> 00:26:01.259 to go in and, you know, listen to your sales 00:26:01.259 --> 00:26:03.400 pitch. But then it's like, no, thanks. Here you 00:26:03.400 --> 00:26:06.480 go. Can you sign my checkout sheet, please? And 00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:08.839 then when I got back, it was just quickly. I 00:26:08.839 --> 00:26:13.819 think I was home for maybe a month. And then 00:26:13.819 --> 00:26:18.099 I was checked out, enrolled in school. And I 00:26:18.099 --> 00:26:21.259 was starting my EMT classes down in Palm Beach 00:26:21.259 --> 00:26:27.519 State in January of 2008. So my EAS date wasn't 00:26:27.519 --> 00:26:29.980 until February. So I still I was. collecting 00:26:29.980 --> 00:26:33.960 full pay, full benefits while I was on the beach, 00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:37.519 just hanging out, studying EMT classes. So it 00:26:37.519 --> 00:26:40.140 was nice. What was the difference between the 00:26:40.140 --> 00:26:43.380 first deployments of Fallujah and the second 00:26:43.380 --> 00:26:46.619 one in Iraq? I think the first one was a little 00:26:46.619 --> 00:26:49.059 more offensive for us. We didn't have as many 00:26:49.059 --> 00:26:51.960 restrictions as we did in the second half. The 00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:53.920 second half was more of like, you know, we're 00:26:53.920 --> 00:26:57.460 here to help. reintegrate the people that are 00:26:57.460 --> 00:26:59.359 coming back in so everybody we locked up and 00:26:59.359 --> 00:27:04.119 put away in oh five oh six oh well yeah now they're 00:27:04.119 --> 00:27:06.359 gonna get out now they're gonna come back in 00:27:06.359 --> 00:27:08.299 and now it's like you have to start giving them 00:27:08.299 --> 00:27:15.440 back more leash to assist them in redeveloping 00:27:15.440 --> 00:27:17.680 and rebuilding of their of their city of their 00:27:17.680 --> 00:27:21.349 country so there was you know for us that we 00:27:21.349 --> 00:27:23.089 looked at like we're more of a target we're not 00:27:23.089 --> 00:27:24.869 a policing force we're not supposed to be there 00:27:24.869 --> 00:27:27.750 you know marines were supposed to come in demolish 00:27:27.750 --> 00:27:30.869 it and get out you know not coming in and handing 00:27:30.869 --> 00:27:33.970 out bags of rice talking to village elders and 00:27:33.970 --> 00:27:36.230 trying to figure out what the political landscape 00:27:36.230 --> 00:27:40.390 is for the larger scale intel network that that's 00:27:40.390 --> 00:27:44.390 created from from the ground force up so that 00:27:44.390 --> 00:27:47.029 was different than you know in hindsight yeah 00:27:47.849 --> 00:27:51.210 A lot of people in the military, also in first 00:27:51.210 --> 00:27:54.269 responder professions, that transition out is 00:27:54.269 --> 00:27:56.930 very jarring. You've got that identity piece. 00:27:57.069 --> 00:27:59.109 You've got that tribal element of being part 00:27:59.109 --> 00:28:02.109 of a cohesive unit. You've got the shared purpose. 00:28:02.569 --> 00:28:04.750 And then a lot of people will say, you know, 00:28:04.769 --> 00:28:07.210 then I was at the grocery store in Buffalo, New 00:28:07.210 --> 00:28:09.450 York. And, you know, that's when a lot of them 00:28:09.450 --> 00:28:12.109 had this kind of downward spiral. What was your 00:28:12.109 --> 00:28:14.009 transition like and did the fact that you were 00:28:14.009 --> 00:28:17.400 going into another similar? profession make it 00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:22.819 easier for you i think that transition was for 00:28:22.819 --> 00:28:26.539 me looking back on it now i didn't understand 00:28:26.539 --> 00:28:28.839 i didn't know i didn't know what i didn't know 00:28:28.839 --> 00:28:30.720 about something it's just like hey look now this 00:28:30.720 --> 00:28:32.839 job's over guess what now you have here's your 00:28:32.839 --> 00:28:35.819 objectives here's your track i had a plan exiting 00:28:35.819 --> 00:28:38.240 and i just needed to execute on those objectives 00:28:38.240 --> 00:28:42.319 to get to my final destination in doing so i 00:28:42.319 --> 00:28:45.609 mean i started off with like 18 and a half credit 00:28:45.609 --> 00:28:48.089 hours. Like I was also taking additional courses 00:28:48.089 --> 00:28:50.930 to supplement what I was already taking on EMT 00:28:50.930 --> 00:28:55.009 because I felt as though I was seeing all of 00:28:55.009 --> 00:28:57.470 my friends and peers through high school, graduating 00:28:57.470 --> 00:28:59.630 college, having degrees, getting set up with 00:28:59.630 --> 00:29:01.990 jobs. I felt like, I'm like, well, I didn't do 00:29:01.990 --> 00:29:03.630 anything. Like, what am I doing? Like, I got 00:29:03.630 --> 00:29:06.930 to get my shit together and hurry up and make 00:29:06.930 --> 00:29:08.890 this happen. So I can, so I can have a life. 00:29:08.910 --> 00:29:10.589 I can have a family. I can do, I can do all these 00:29:10.589 --> 00:29:15.119 things. So I, I, you know buried myself uh in 00:29:15.119 --> 00:29:20.220 school work and you know it it became difficult 00:29:20.220 --> 00:29:24.940 because i was very um i felt like i was an outsider 00:29:24.940 --> 00:29:27.900 i felt like i had seen a lot of things that a 00:29:27.900 --> 00:29:30.359 lot of people hadn't seen and they couldn't relate 00:29:30.359 --> 00:29:33.880 to so for me to try to adjust and change my optics 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:37.460 on real life back to now what's happening here 00:29:38.400 --> 00:29:42.559 it was, I couldn't hide it. And I think my anxiety 00:29:42.559 --> 00:29:46.039 was, you know, really through the roof. And, 00:29:46.140 --> 00:29:48.519 you know, you go to the VA, you try everything, 00:29:48.700 --> 00:29:50.619 you know, I couldn't sleep. And that was like, 00:29:50.700 --> 00:29:53.220 hey, take Ambien. I'm like, all right, well, 00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:55.740 try this. And that didn't work. I was like, look, 00:29:55.839 --> 00:30:00.359 I don't like this. I'm waking up too foggy. And 00:30:00.359 --> 00:30:02.700 then it was, all right, well, try these, try 00:30:02.700 --> 00:30:05.299 this. And it's just like, all right, I'm done 00:30:05.299 --> 00:30:07.480 with this. I'm not going to do any of these meds. 00:30:08.100 --> 00:30:10.880 And I just tried to really just bury myself more 00:30:10.880 --> 00:30:13.700 into work and, and almost pretty much got burnt 00:30:13.700 --> 00:30:19.160 out by 2000, 2010, 2011. Like right when I finished 00:30:19.160 --> 00:30:22.859 paramedic school, I was just, I was cashed. So 00:30:22.859 --> 00:30:24.900 it was, it was, I would say I had a difficult 00:30:24.900 --> 00:30:26.380 transition because I didn't know what I didn't 00:30:26.380 --> 00:30:28.220 know. You know, you, you separate from the military 00:30:28.220 --> 00:30:30.779 with these classes first, you know, it's called 00:30:30.779 --> 00:30:33.900 steps and taps. And they're really, it's, it's 00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:36.019 two days of steps, three days of taps. And then 00:30:36.019 --> 00:30:38.220 they basically say, Hey, fill out everything 00:30:38.220 --> 00:30:40.720 for your VA, get all this done, write down everything. 00:30:40.839 --> 00:30:43.359 And then from here, here are the resources that 00:30:43.359 --> 00:30:44.900 are going to be available to you. Once you're 00:30:44.900 --> 00:30:47.460 out now, go find them. And then you're like, 00:30:47.539 --> 00:30:50.680 all right, well, sweet. So you're, you know, 00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:53.700 you think you're so excited to get out. And, 00:30:53.779 --> 00:30:56.140 um, you know, when you do, you're finally like, 00:30:56.140 --> 00:30:57.779 you're out in the world and like, Oh my God. 00:30:58.700 --> 00:31:01.440 Now you have to you don't account for the adjustment 00:31:01.440 --> 00:31:05.180 on the work ethic of others around you and seeing 00:31:05.180 --> 00:31:08.099 how people take their time to do things versus 00:31:08.099 --> 00:31:10.880 in the military. It's like your job is this. 00:31:11.079 --> 00:31:13.440 Go do this. This is what you have to focus on. 00:31:13.599 --> 00:31:15.500 I think that was very difficult for me because 00:31:15.500 --> 00:31:17.279 I was like, well, why is this process? Why are 00:31:17.279 --> 00:31:20.640 all these beer like all this red tape in the 00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:22.859 middle of me getting from here to here? Let me 00:31:22.859 --> 00:31:25.599 just let's just go. So that was a transition 00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:28.200 for sure. One of the things I didn't ask you 00:31:28.200 --> 00:31:31.000 about earlier, but this is such a kind of under 00:31:31.000 --> 00:31:32.940 -discussed element when it comes to military 00:31:32.940 --> 00:31:35.460 and first responder mental health, excuse me, 00:31:35.460 --> 00:31:39.920 is so many of us have certain things happen when 00:31:39.920 --> 00:31:42.819 you were younger that if left unaddressed contribute 00:31:42.819 --> 00:31:45.180 to our struggles once we're wearing the uniform. 00:31:45.559 --> 00:31:48.160 When you reflect back to your early life, were 00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:50.180 there any elements you think that fractured the 00:31:50.180 --> 00:31:54.680 foundation a little bit? Absolutely. Yeah. You 00:31:54.680 --> 00:31:56.599 know, like I said, you know, grew up in low middle 00:31:56.599 --> 00:32:00.420 class. You know, we pretty much lived, I think, 00:32:00.420 --> 00:32:02.319 when I was as a kid, when I moved back to New 00:32:02.319 --> 00:32:05.440 York, we were in Section 8 housing for the most 00:32:05.440 --> 00:32:09.059 part of what it's looked at right now. And, you 00:32:09.059 --> 00:32:13.799 know, it was, you know, separated from my father 00:32:13.799 --> 00:32:15.400 or not really separated from my father, but it 00:32:15.400 --> 00:32:17.140 was like every other week that we got to see 00:32:17.140 --> 00:32:19.920 each other for a period of time until it's like. 00:32:20.410 --> 00:32:22.049 until you're done with it. You know what I mean? 00:32:22.109 --> 00:32:25.430 It's hard to say, but once you hit a certain 00:32:25.430 --> 00:32:26.990 level of maturity, you're just kind of like, 00:32:27.029 --> 00:32:29.769 I'm done going with this volley of back and forth 00:32:29.769 --> 00:32:31.450 with different households and three different 00:32:31.450 --> 00:32:33.309 Christmases and all this other stuff where you're 00:32:33.309 --> 00:32:38.809 just like, I'm good. And then, you know, I think 00:32:38.809 --> 00:32:43.430 with just the adjustment and being alone or finding 00:32:43.430 --> 00:32:49.859 myself involved with sports. That gave me the 00:32:49.859 --> 00:32:56.380 ability to kind of align myself with friends 00:32:56.380 --> 00:33:00.680 and the people that I would care about or have 00:33:00.680 --> 00:33:05.680 that type of communal bond or tribe to overcome 00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:07.640 adversity and bounce things off of because I 00:33:07.640 --> 00:33:10.980 was around them more so than some of my family, 00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:12.680 or I would rather have been around them more 00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:14.220 so than some of my family in those instances. 00:33:15.779 --> 00:33:18.059 Absolutely. Well, speaking of tribes, walk me 00:33:18.059 --> 00:33:20.299 through your journey into the fire service. How 00:33:20.299 --> 00:33:23.660 was that transition into that profession? Well, 00:33:23.779 --> 00:33:27.079 the transition into that was it was not as not 00:33:27.079 --> 00:33:31.339 as not what I expected initially for me being 00:33:31.339 --> 00:33:33.519 just, you know, green coming out. I was like, 00:33:33.579 --> 00:33:37.599 hey, look, here I am. I'm ready to do this. There 00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:41.819 was a big hiring freeze for 2008. through 2009 00:33:41.819 --> 00:33:45.440 or 2010. And, um, that's right around the time 00:33:45.440 --> 00:33:46.839 when I was going to school. So I was like, all 00:33:46.839 --> 00:33:49.299 right, this isn't too bad. So I went to a couple 00:33:49.299 --> 00:33:51.640 of local, local departments, put in my application, 00:33:51.900 --> 00:33:54.640 got brought in and I was just straightforward. 00:33:54.819 --> 00:33:57.059 Like, Hey, this is what, this is where I've been. 00:33:57.180 --> 00:34:02.160 Here's my most trying time. Now. Um, I think 00:34:02.160 --> 00:34:04.960 at one point when I was, I actually was like, 00:34:05.019 --> 00:34:06.859 Hey, let me check out law enforcement side, maybe 00:34:06.859 --> 00:34:10.389 be a cop, do something. Almost had a panic attack 00:34:10.389 --> 00:34:12.369 inside the thing because I forgot one thing on 00:34:12.369 --> 00:34:14.170 my application that I didn't put in. And I was 00:34:14.170 --> 00:34:17.269 just like, oh, my God. Like, wow. Like, holy 00:34:17.269 --> 00:34:20.630 shit. Like, can't believe that. So bombed that 00:34:20.630 --> 00:34:25.070 interview. And then when I got brought in for 00:34:25.070 --> 00:34:27.769 another one, I was just kind of very open. Like, 00:34:27.829 --> 00:34:29.909 hey, here's everything that the VA has given 00:34:29.909 --> 00:34:32.050 me. Here's all the things. Here's my experience. 00:34:32.230 --> 00:34:35.409 Here's a. a moment in time when I had to, you 00:34:35.409 --> 00:34:37.110 know, on the battlefield, this is what happened, 00:34:37.210 --> 00:34:38.409 this, that, and the other thing. And they're 00:34:38.409 --> 00:34:40.530 just kind of looking at me like, yeah, this is 00:34:40.530 --> 00:34:42.389 never going to pass. Like it's never going to 00:34:42.389 --> 00:34:47.849 happen. So I ended up going on and volunteering 00:34:47.849 --> 00:34:50.030 with the department, working with a chief who 00:34:50.030 --> 00:34:53.389 kind of brought me in and understood like where 00:34:53.389 --> 00:34:55.369 I was at, what my headspace was, and really kind 00:34:55.369 --> 00:34:58.650 of gave me the opportunity to surround myself 00:34:58.650 --> 00:35:01.989 with that group and then be able to kind of learn 00:35:01.989 --> 00:35:04.820 the culture. And then from there on, it was a 00:35:04.820 --> 00:35:07.739 little, it was much easier. And at that point, 00:35:07.760 --> 00:35:11.599 I had an opportunity to go overseas and contract. 00:35:11.679 --> 00:35:15.440 And I was just like, well, I'm either going to 00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:18.340 work here or I'm going to go over there and make, 00:35:18.579 --> 00:35:21.039 you know, what it would be working here three 00:35:21.039 --> 00:35:26.199 years to one. So the dynamics of it were. I'm 00:35:26.199 --> 00:35:27.800 going to be back in a new place where I hadn't 00:35:27.800 --> 00:35:30.079 been, where a war is still going on. I was like, 00:35:30.079 --> 00:35:31.659 all right, well, this will give me a chance to 00:35:31.659 --> 00:35:35.739 see something different. And then that's when 00:35:35.739 --> 00:35:38.099 I was just like, all right, let me put, because 00:35:38.099 --> 00:35:41.380 I was with that department for close to three 00:35:41.380 --> 00:35:43.420 years, three and a half years, I was with them. 00:35:44.599 --> 00:35:50.480 And then left there to go overseas. And I was 00:35:50.480 --> 00:35:52.579 overseas for like the next eight years. And it 00:35:52.579 --> 00:35:55.760 was one of the best jobs. that I could ever have 00:35:55.760 --> 00:35:59.440 because I was finally getting paid at an acceptable 00:35:59.440 --> 00:36:01.420 rate. I was able to buy a house. I was able to 00:36:01.420 --> 00:36:03.579 live a life. I was able to do the things that, 00:36:03.579 --> 00:36:06.940 you know, while incurring so much debt previously, 00:36:07.219 --> 00:36:09.519 going to school and just trying to figure life 00:36:09.519 --> 00:36:13.400 out, you know, I think that was one of the hard 00:36:13.400 --> 00:36:15.639 realizations of getting out of the military because 00:36:15.639 --> 00:36:17.239 everything was covered. Everything was paid. 00:36:17.679 --> 00:36:19.860 And now you have like real expenses and real 00:36:19.860 --> 00:36:21.659 budgets and things that you have to put together. 00:36:21.699 --> 00:36:23.519 And if you don't, you could, it's a slippery 00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:28.289 slope. where you can literally wake up and you're 00:36:28.289 --> 00:36:31.190 $80 ,000, $90 ,000 in debt. And you're just like, 00:36:31.250 --> 00:36:34.670 well, how do I get out of this? So for me, it 00:36:34.670 --> 00:36:36.329 was really cool just to have the opportunity 00:36:36.329 --> 00:36:39.630 of like, all right, well, I'm a paramedic. I'm 00:36:39.630 --> 00:36:43.489 a nationally registered paramedic now. You know, 00:36:43.510 --> 00:36:47.289 they needed that skill set overseas. I had the 00:36:47.289 --> 00:36:50.050 experience in combat. You know, it wasn't. My 00:36:50.050 --> 00:36:53.369 experiences never led me to, or the PTSD that 00:36:53.369 --> 00:36:57.170 I had never led me to be cognitively impaired. 00:36:58.949 --> 00:37:04.550 It was more of, I don't want to say guilt, but 00:37:04.550 --> 00:37:07.329 it was a lot of heavy thoughts on what could 00:37:07.329 --> 00:37:09.409 have been done differently. A moral injury side. 00:37:09.829 --> 00:37:15.349 Yeah. And being over there at that time, you're 00:37:15.349 --> 00:37:18.199 around. different breeds whether they were an 00:37:18.199 --> 00:37:20.500 sf there were you know different mindsets and 00:37:20.500 --> 00:37:23.420 temperaments for the operational tempo that we 00:37:23.420 --> 00:37:26.719 were doing there as as protectees that suited 00:37:26.719 --> 00:37:30.480 me that suited us and you know it it kind of 00:37:30.480 --> 00:37:34.619 filled that void of tribe you know community 00:37:34.619 --> 00:37:40.099 and you know being well paid to to to do a job 00:37:40.099 --> 00:37:46.960 that you know you expected you've already signed 00:37:46.960 --> 00:37:49.860 the check and when it gets cashed it gets cashed 00:37:49.860 --> 00:37:53.519 but at least you're doing it in a way that you 00:37:53.519 --> 00:37:55.780 know you can see it coming versus being here 00:37:55.780 --> 00:37:58.800 in the states you're just kind of like this is 00:37:58.800 --> 00:38:01.940 fucking chaos like what is actually happening 00:38:01.940 --> 00:38:05.800 here um so that's when i found like i really 00:38:05.800 --> 00:38:09.579 had to work on who i was and really started looking 00:38:09.579 --> 00:38:11.539 into other programs looking into psychedelics 00:38:11.539 --> 00:38:16.320 looking into um different needs of of who i was 00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:20.480 as a person um because when i i'd go overseas 00:38:20.480 --> 00:38:23.840 you know my blood pressure was i think call it 00:38:23.840 --> 00:38:27.760 you know 120 over 80 i come home like 190 over 00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:32.119 over 100 and i'm just as as i am right now just 00:38:32.119 --> 00:38:34.780 whatever and just but quick to quick to ignite 00:38:34.780 --> 00:38:38.780 a fuse um and that wasn't good it you know it 00:38:38.780 --> 00:38:41.679 really hurt a bunch of relationships along the 00:38:41.679 --> 00:38:45.610 way for who I was versus now having more of an 00:38:45.610 --> 00:38:47.309 understanding and actually have done the work 00:38:47.309 --> 00:38:49.710 to get to the next level of where I wanted to 00:38:49.710 --> 00:38:52.630 be. Well, it's interesting going back to what 00:38:52.630 --> 00:38:55.590 you were talking about in the interviews. When 00:38:55.590 --> 00:38:58.469 I put my very first pre -app in, it was actually 00:38:58.469 --> 00:39:01.269 down your way. It was one of those kind of conglomerates 00:39:01.269 --> 00:39:04.369 where you do one EMT test, one fire test, and 00:39:04.369 --> 00:39:07.610 they send the results to all the agencies. And 00:39:07.610 --> 00:39:10.199 Miami Beach was there. And they had a pre -app. 00:39:10.260 --> 00:39:12.260 And again, like you, I was like, oh, well, obviously, 00:39:12.300 --> 00:39:14.260 honesty is the most important thing. So, yeah, 00:39:14.300 --> 00:39:16.239 years and years ago, I tried this and this, had 00:39:16.239 --> 00:39:19.320 a great time, never lost a job. And they literally, 00:39:19.420 --> 00:39:21.800 the guy screwed it up. And I remember him just 00:39:21.800 --> 00:39:23.639 throwing it at me. And I was like, you're disqualified. 00:39:23.800 --> 00:39:26.440 And I'm like, huh. Okay, so you have to lie to 00:39:26.440 --> 00:39:28.199 get in the American Fire Service. Got it. And 00:39:28.199 --> 00:39:30.820 then ever since then, I lied through polygraphs 00:39:30.820 --> 00:39:32.639 and all these things. And I'm not saying it to 00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:36.030 be an arrogant dickhead. I'm saying that. Basically, 00:39:36.030 --> 00:39:39.349 all the assets that contributed to me being a 00:39:39.349 --> 00:39:42.090 good firefighter and a paramedic were completely 00:39:42.090 --> 00:39:45.389 ignored from this one little box checking bullshit, 00:39:45.409 --> 00:39:47.750 which now, by the way, those compounds are used 00:39:47.750 --> 00:39:50.230 for PTSD and we'll get into psychedelics, but 00:39:50.230 --> 00:39:52.269 MDMA and psilocybin were the only ones I'd ever 00:39:52.269 --> 00:39:56.300 done. And yeah, disqualifying. And this is what 00:39:56.300 --> 00:39:58.679 is so broken. I've talked about this a lot. In 00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:01.519 our professions, you have the MMPI, which is 00:40:01.519 --> 00:40:03.920 that psych test with all the thousands of questions. 00:40:04.559 --> 00:40:06.619 And then the polygraph. The polygraph is a magic 00:40:06.619 --> 00:40:09.670 show. Done by some fucking tool bag that pretends 00:40:09.670 --> 00:40:12.369 to be the FBI's greatest profiler. And he gives 00:40:12.369 --> 00:40:14.250 this little speech. It's a beautiful monologue. 00:40:14.309 --> 00:40:15.949 It brought a tear to my eye. And then he does 00:40:15.949 --> 00:40:17.969 a smoke show. And then you go, no, I haven't 00:40:17.969 --> 00:40:19.170 done any of that stuff. And he goes, oh, wow, 00:40:19.250 --> 00:40:21.309 you beat the polygraph. Congratulations. And 00:40:21.309 --> 00:40:23.550 then you have the MMPI, which is psychology world. 00:40:23.570 --> 00:40:25.090 I said, by the way, that was never meant to be 00:40:25.090 --> 00:40:27.650 used as a standalone test, certainly to verify 00:40:27.650 --> 00:40:29.530 if someone could be a first responder or not. 00:40:29.969 --> 00:40:33.650 So both of those are bullshit. So I've been saying 00:40:33.650 --> 00:40:35.789 a lot recently, why not take the money that you're 00:40:35.789 --> 00:40:38.719 wasting on those? do a solid background check, 00:40:38.760 --> 00:40:42.159 of course, but then hire people that have had 00:40:42.159 --> 00:40:44.699 some of these things, knowing that so many of 00:40:44.699 --> 00:40:48.400 us have got shit in our past, and then give them 00:40:48.400 --> 00:40:50.960 counseling sessions. So now at the front door, 00:40:51.219 --> 00:40:53.679 Anthony Longo has the ability to start processing 00:40:53.679 --> 00:40:57.199 his early life, his time in Iraq, and then becomes 00:40:57.199 --> 00:41:00.059 an asset to, you know, aforementioned fire department. 00:41:00.559 --> 00:41:03.679 but instead we got oh no check that box oh no 00:41:03.679 --> 00:41:05.539 no no you're going to be a liability if you can't 00:41:05.539 --> 00:41:09.019 have you negating the other 99 of your lifeline 00:41:09.019 --> 00:41:10.980 that's going to be an absolute asset as a first 00:41:10.980 --> 00:41:16.300 responder yeah yeah i mean it it's it's an account 00:41:16.300 --> 00:41:18.920 it's an accountability issue that i think a lot 00:41:18.920 --> 00:41:21.099 of the higher -ups when you get to that to that 00:41:21.099 --> 00:41:24.670 level that that they face i mean even now even 00:41:24.670 --> 00:41:27.010 even looking at what suicide rates are looking 00:41:27.010 --> 00:41:29.210 at the demographics and and what the recruiting 00:41:29.210 --> 00:41:32.630 pools are for each of those services right it's 00:41:32.630 --> 00:41:34.610 they're not far off from one another there's 00:41:34.610 --> 00:41:36.750 some sort of emotional baggage that these individuals 00:41:36.750 --> 00:41:39.409 that we all carry bringing into the fire service 00:41:39.409 --> 00:41:42.230 that we either admit to or don't admit to um 00:41:42.230 --> 00:41:45.889 and it just i you know just falls on to you know 00:41:45.889 --> 00:41:49.989 how much is your chain of command willing to 00:41:49.989 --> 00:41:53.210 go out of their way to put their neck out there 00:41:53.210 --> 00:41:55.530 for you. And it's not going to happen when they 00:41:55.530 --> 00:41:58.289 have a cushy salary. Yeah, but it's the culture. 00:41:58.389 --> 00:42:00.150 This is the thing. We've got to reframe that 00:42:00.150 --> 00:42:02.590 completely and stop pretending like it's only 00:42:02.590 --> 00:42:04.949 altar boys that become police officers and firefighters. 00:42:05.550 --> 00:42:09.949 Bullshit. We are people. And again, the conversation 00:42:09.949 --> 00:42:12.949 is you can have shit in your past, but if you 00:42:12.949 --> 00:42:15.989 work through it, if you find your toolbox, now 00:42:15.989 --> 00:42:18.429 that becomes an asset as a police officer, as 00:42:18.429 --> 00:42:20.570 a firefighter. You're going to be... better you 00:42:20.570 --> 00:42:22.570 know under stress you're going to be more compassionate 00:42:22.570 --> 00:42:24.409 you're going to see yourself and some of these 00:42:24.409 --> 00:42:26.750 people are struggling in society and you will 00:42:26.750 --> 00:42:29.610 simply be there but if we've got this box check 00:42:29.610 --> 00:42:31.530 and bullshit that's how you end up with this 00:42:31.530 --> 00:42:34.210 promotional thing leaning towards all you've 00:42:34.210 --> 00:42:35.869 got to have a degree what the fuck is a degree 00:42:36.460 --> 00:42:39.019 What does that actually mean as far as being 00:42:39.019 --> 00:42:41.400 boots on the ground, good at your job? It means 00:42:41.400 --> 00:42:44.659 nothing. So that's how disconnected we are between 00:42:44.659 --> 00:42:47.480 what we need to be doing to create great first 00:42:47.480 --> 00:42:50.780 responders and this academic box -checking bullshit 00:42:50.780 --> 00:42:55.239 that we found ourselves in. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, 00:42:55.260 --> 00:42:57.800 I mean, you look at the kids that just were able 00:42:57.800 --> 00:42:59.440 to go to school. They were able to complete a 00:42:59.440 --> 00:43:02.179 task, and they did another four years. It was 00:43:02.179 --> 00:43:04.579 just like, all right, great. Yeah, I've got a 00:43:04.579 --> 00:43:07.219 degree. And the only real value to that degree 00:43:07.219 --> 00:43:08.820 is that I can tell people I've got a degree. 00:43:08.940 --> 00:43:10.760 So who the fuck is this guy? Well, he's got a 00:43:10.760 --> 00:43:13.219 degree in ex -phys. So he must know something 00:43:13.219 --> 00:43:15.059 about it. No, I learned all the stuff from coaching, 00:43:15.219 --> 00:43:18.340 from coaches, from actually coaching, from getting 00:43:18.340 --> 00:43:20.679 hurt, rehabbing injuries, not from that piece 00:43:20.679 --> 00:43:25.389 of paper that I got in a classroom. Yeah. yeah 00:43:25.389 --> 00:43:29.250 it's interesting dynamic all right we'll go into 00:43:29.250 --> 00:43:31.750 the other side so before we get to some of the 00:43:31.750 --> 00:43:33.949 things that you know you were doing in afghanistan 00:43:33.949 --> 00:43:38.130 you mentioned starting your own healing journey 00:43:38.130 --> 00:43:40.750 and exploring this toolbox. And I think people 00:43:40.750 --> 00:43:43.389 don't realize how vast this toolbox actually 00:43:43.389 --> 00:43:46.869 is from canines and, and, and, you know, horses 00:43:46.869 --> 00:43:49.510 all the way through to psilocybin and, you know, 00:43:49.510 --> 00:43:52.110 Ibogaine and everything in between. What was 00:43:52.110 --> 00:43:54.110 that journey of healing for you? Where did you 00:43:54.110 --> 00:43:56.909 find yourself finding success with some of these 00:43:56.909 --> 00:44:00.489 modalities? Yeah. So, so for me, it started off 00:44:00.489 --> 00:44:02.610 with, you know, obviously having a great schedule, 00:44:02.670 --> 00:44:05.969 great work schedule, 105 days on 35 days off. 00:44:06.829 --> 00:44:09.519 And, you know, being with a close -knit group 00:44:09.519 --> 00:44:11.639 you start hearing what their travel experiences 00:44:11.639 --> 00:44:13.900 are and where they're going you know parts of 00:44:13.900 --> 00:44:15.980 the world that they're finding themselves in 00:44:15.980 --> 00:44:18.380 because we're all trying to make money and we 00:44:18.380 --> 00:44:20.579 were all trying to preserve that money by staying 00:44:20.579 --> 00:44:24.340 out of our country for 330 days so we were not 00:44:24.340 --> 00:44:28.159 taxed and um you know finding those opportunities 00:44:28.159 --> 00:44:30.860 of listening to what they did on their leave 00:44:30.860 --> 00:44:33.480 block and seeing who they were when they came 00:44:33.480 --> 00:44:36.179 back you're just kind of like wow this is like 00:44:36.179 --> 00:44:41.659 it's deep And that attracted me to being able 00:44:41.659 --> 00:44:45.920 to have that much self -awareness of the process. 00:44:46.059 --> 00:44:49.099 And it led me to start reading more books on 00:44:49.099 --> 00:44:54.239 mindfulness and just the neurocog side of what 00:44:54.239 --> 00:44:57.559 can we do to develop these things or put systems 00:44:57.559 --> 00:45:01.760 in place that help us to be better. and to improve 00:45:01.760 --> 00:45:03.440 our relationships, to improve communication. 00:45:03.800 --> 00:45:06.039 Because I think a lot of us, that's the one I 00:45:06.039 --> 00:45:07.860 think that sticks out to me the most is communication. 00:45:08.260 --> 00:45:12.199 I think we all have this huge void in our ability 00:45:12.199 --> 00:45:15.159 to effectively communicate without feeling as 00:45:15.159 --> 00:45:19.079 though we're either having somebody tear us down 00:45:19.079 --> 00:45:22.559 or tearing somebody else down, like making it 00:45:22.559 --> 00:45:24.239 so like we're losing our own identities when 00:45:24.239 --> 00:45:25.780 that's not the case. It's just a matter of like, 00:45:25.880 --> 00:45:28.099 okay. How many times do we have to do the same 00:45:28.099 --> 00:45:29.639 thing to really understand like, hey, this is 00:45:29.639 --> 00:45:32.119 a problem. And then what can we do to change 00:45:32.119 --> 00:45:37.639 that course? So when I started slowly, gradually 00:45:37.639 --> 00:45:41.760 getting introduced to psychedelics, I first initially 00:45:41.760 --> 00:45:43.940 started off with like microdosing and psilocybin 00:45:43.940 --> 00:45:48.460 and doing mushrooms, not in any controlled way, 00:45:48.619 --> 00:45:53.239 but just like exploring. And it was the post. 00:45:54.920 --> 00:45:58.179 session that I really felt like the squelch box 00:45:58.179 --> 00:46:00.920 and the squawk box was off. Like it was the one 00:46:00.920 --> 00:46:02.900 time where my mind was not continuing to run 00:46:02.900 --> 00:46:05.519 an ultra marathon where I was just like, Oh wow. 00:46:05.659 --> 00:46:08.219 Like I'm at peace right now with this. This is 00:46:08.219 --> 00:46:11.820 amazing. I can actually enjoy being around people 00:46:11.820 --> 00:46:14.019 who would, who would. I would generally just 00:46:14.019 --> 00:46:17.159 have a lit fuse being around and it would help 00:46:17.159 --> 00:46:19.119 me kind of really understand what that relationship 00:46:19.119 --> 00:46:22.739 was for what it was and how I could be better 00:46:22.739 --> 00:46:27.320 for myself and restructure what I was doing to 00:46:27.320 --> 00:46:30.880 kind of fit that box. And I recognize that, Hey, 00:46:30.940 --> 00:46:32.960 that only goes so far, right? Like there's only 00:46:32.960 --> 00:46:34.980 so many people that you're going to travel the 00:46:34.980 --> 00:46:37.059 same path before it bifurcates or it goes in 00:46:37.059 --> 00:46:39.119 another direction where it's just like, okay. 00:46:39.530 --> 00:46:42.110 we were just meant to do this fantastic we can 00:46:42.110 --> 00:46:44.329 go this way and we're still going to be close 00:46:44.329 --> 00:46:46.829 but we don't have to be you know we're not in 00:46:46.829 --> 00:46:49.590 like a a deep relationship where we have to feel 00:46:49.590 --> 00:46:51.690 you know pissed off that well we're not friends 00:46:51.690 --> 00:46:53.550 anymore because we don't all do like the same 00:46:53.550 --> 00:46:57.869 um and and that's what it helped me kind of understand 00:46:57.869 --> 00:47:00.969 and the more that i went through and between 00:47:00.969 --> 00:47:03.349 you know psilocybin and then microdosing with 00:47:03.349 --> 00:47:06.550 lsd and the nuances between the two of those 00:47:07.320 --> 00:47:09.500 where you know mushrooms that'll take you up 00:47:09.500 --> 00:47:11.099 and take you down you got these ebbs and flows 00:47:11.099 --> 00:47:14.559 that are you know high highs low lows and waves 00:47:14.559 --> 00:47:18.260 um where lsd was very you know kind of like hitting 00:47:18.260 --> 00:47:20.360 the the seek button where it just goes from channel 00:47:20.360 --> 00:47:22.880 to channel that's that's airing so it was a cleaner 00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:29.900 more just level -headed um therapy session for 00:47:29.900 --> 00:47:32.719 me and then it was all about the post where i 00:47:32.719 --> 00:47:35.039 was like really able to like what when i was 00:47:35.039 --> 00:47:38.449 in that space what stood out what did i have 00:47:38.449 --> 00:47:40.489 to work on what did i have to earmark and say 00:47:40.489 --> 00:47:43.510 hey this is what's resonating with me this is 00:47:43.510 --> 00:47:45.909 what's really kind of the ember of my fire that 00:47:45.909 --> 00:47:49.750 what aggravates me how can i chip away at that 00:47:49.750 --> 00:47:53.489 and find new ways and be more productive with 00:47:53.489 --> 00:47:59.000 my own space and my healing and um which Fast 00:47:59.000 --> 00:48:02.280 forward a couple years later, you start hearing 00:48:02.280 --> 00:48:05.480 everybody doing ayahuasca. You start seeing aboga 00:48:05.480 --> 00:48:07.460 and everything else kind of coming out. Then 00:48:07.460 --> 00:48:10.000 you hear about DMT, and you're just kind of like, 00:48:10.059 --> 00:48:12.840 oh, shit. I don't know if I need that. You're 00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:18.440 just like, whoa. And I felt as though with... 00:48:18.650 --> 00:48:20.909 with only being able to get so far, I was just 00:48:20.909 --> 00:48:22.929 like, I got to go deeper because I'm still holding 00:48:22.929 --> 00:48:25.090 on to shit. And is it, is it me or is it the 00:48:25.090 --> 00:48:27.230 people around me? What am I doing? Because I 00:48:27.230 --> 00:48:28.809 feel like I'm still sticking square peg round 00:48:28.809 --> 00:48:31.530 hole. Like this is not, this is not what I want 00:48:31.530 --> 00:48:35.789 to have. And, um, my, my first time doing five, 00:48:35.849 --> 00:48:38.650 you know, DMT, I was just like, what the fuck 00:48:38.650 --> 00:48:43.340 was that? Like. wow like not so much the setting 00:48:43.340 --> 00:48:45.860 was my vibe because it's kind of like being you 00:48:45.860 --> 00:48:48.320 know in a in a group setting the circle everybody's 00:48:48.320 --> 00:48:51.599 around you and um i didn't know anybody there 00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:54.760 except one of my buddies who who was like hey 00:48:54.760 --> 00:48:56.099 man this is good so i was like all right i'm 00:48:56.099 --> 00:48:58.699 following your lead i'm gonna lean on you and 00:48:58.699 --> 00:49:04.059 um ended up being the my deep dive it was just 00:49:04.059 --> 00:49:08.289 like crossed over went completely went completely 00:49:08.289 --> 00:49:12.150 black really really small speck of white far 00:49:12.150 --> 00:49:14.610 off into the distance and then i kind of popped 00:49:14.610 --> 00:49:17.309 up and i was just like after about 20 minutes 00:49:17.309 --> 00:49:20.389 of that i popped out and i was just like wow 00:49:20.389 --> 00:49:23.070 and i i you know i kicked myself in the ass now 00:49:23.070 --> 00:49:24.389 because i felt like i should have just stayed 00:49:24.389 --> 00:49:27.750 in and wrote it a little bit longer to to really 00:49:27.750 --> 00:49:31.170 kind of conceptualize and and gain more insight 00:49:31.170 --> 00:49:34.050 but i was the first time where it was just like 00:49:35.150 --> 00:49:38.809 I didn't have that blast. I blasted off, but 00:49:38.809 --> 00:49:45.989 I didn't have that, like, mental cog of hold 00:49:45.989 --> 00:49:48.269 on, keep holding, keep holding. Like, it was 00:49:48.269 --> 00:49:52.210 gone. It was like, let go. And once I figured 00:49:52.210 --> 00:49:56.789 that out, I was able to really, I was like, wow, 00:49:56.929 --> 00:49:59.389 I'm happy for this. I'm happy about that. And 00:49:59.389 --> 00:50:01.530 then I was absolutely petrified following the 00:50:01.530 --> 00:50:04.159 next, like. 15 sessions that we did because it 00:50:04.159 --> 00:50:06.800 was just still like i was trying to hold on and 00:50:06.800 --> 00:50:10.119 finally i went out and i i did a session by myself 00:50:10.119 --> 00:50:13.119 outside of the group and i was really able to 00:50:13.119 --> 00:50:16.360 like you know with being in nature and and having 00:50:16.360 --> 00:50:18.300 you know just taking a deep breath in and feeling 00:50:18.300 --> 00:50:22.019 the wind wash over me in unison of me you know 00:50:22.019 --> 00:50:24.159 expelling a breath i was just kind of like i 00:50:24.159 --> 00:50:28.340 was able to felt like you know those rubber band 00:50:28.340 --> 00:50:31.570 balls in the office Back in the day, it felt 00:50:31.570 --> 00:50:33.690 like an unshackling where it's like you were, 00:50:33.829 --> 00:50:36.610 if that was all of my anxiety, it was like taking 00:50:36.610 --> 00:50:41.230 a hot razor blade and just slicing strand by 00:50:41.230 --> 00:50:44.710 strand of where my mind was and being able to 00:50:44.710 --> 00:50:46.630 navigate that and control that to then being 00:50:46.630 --> 00:50:51.849 able to come back home and falling into just 00:50:51.849 --> 00:50:57.559 new habits and making myself And learning how 00:50:57.559 --> 00:50:59.900 to love myself is really what it came down to. 00:51:00.300 --> 00:51:03.440 Not putting so much of your ego into you're a 00:51:03.440 --> 00:51:05.019 piece of shit. You didn't get this done. You 00:51:05.019 --> 00:51:06.480 need to go harder. You need to be harder than 00:51:06.480 --> 00:51:08.179 everybody else there. You need to do this. And 00:51:08.179 --> 00:51:11.739 it's like, that's good for a certain point, but 00:51:11.739 --> 00:51:13.639 you still have to be able to look inside and 00:51:13.639 --> 00:51:15.880 still love yourself and give yourself some grace 00:51:15.880 --> 00:51:19.869 for some of the accomplishments. and i can say 00:51:19.869 --> 00:51:21.489 that now but i still battle it every day where 00:51:21.489 --> 00:51:23.010 it's not like yeah dude you're not where you 00:51:23.010 --> 00:51:25.190 need to be you need to still go but it's not 00:51:25.190 --> 00:51:29.030 as not as extreme as what it was but it gave 00:51:29.030 --> 00:51:33.909 me hope that i was able to find something where 00:51:33.909 --> 00:51:36.710 it wasn't like i wanted to abuse this in any 00:51:36.710 --> 00:51:40.190 way because i was just like petrified to even 00:51:40.190 --> 00:51:42.190 do it again where i was just like nah i'm good 00:51:42.190 --> 00:51:45.329 like that was i got a lot of it it you know it 00:51:45.329 --> 00:51:48.539 lasted you know, five or six months. It really 00:51:48.539 --> 00:51:51.380 lasted up until, you know, to now for a lifetime, 00:51:51.519 --> 00:51:53.139 I would say, because it gave me a lot of true 00:51:53.139 --> 00:51:57.360 value of insight. But the ability of just like 00:51:57.360 --> 00:51:59.780 feeling things that would piss you off normally, 00:51:59.940 --> 00:52:02.699 it's just like, why, why allow it to hold that 00:52:02.699 --> 00:52:04.579 real estate in your head? Why are you going to 00:52:04.579 --> 00:52:08.360 like, for what reason? And then it translated 00:52:08.360 --> 00:52:10.280 to different relationships. And it just gave 00:52:10.280 --> 00:52:13.699 me a different sight picture set alignment of, 00:52:13.719 --> 00:52:16.340 you know, What my needs were, where I needed 00:52:16.340 --> 00:52:18.519 to be, who I needed to focus my energy on, who 00:52:18.519 --> 00:52:21.280 deserved my energy, who didn't. What relationships 00:52:21.280 --> 00:52:24.219 were just, you know, hey, that's a wash. There's 00:52:24.219 --> 00:52:28.519 no reason to hang on to this animosity towards 00:52:28.519 --> 00:52:31.860 people anymore. Where it's like, whatever, because 00:52:31.860 --> 00:52:33.539 they're not thinking about me. And if they are, 00:52:33.619 --> 00:52:38.920 so what? Big deal. So that was a huge turning 00:52:38.920 --> 00:52:42.320 point for me. You know, even with my dog, you 00:52:42.320 --> 00:52:44.659 know, who, who I've had at that point up until, 00:52:44.719 --> 00:52:46.900 I mean, he was probably, I would say five or 00:52:46.900 --> 00:52:51.099 six years old at that point. Um, you know, I 00:52:51.099 --> 00:52:54.800 saw a vision or something of him. And then when 00:52:54.800 --> 00:52:59.940 I got home, um, from that experience, which was 00:52:59.940 --> 00:53:02.239 a whole other, you know, you're coming off five, 00:53:02.300 --> 00:53:03.579 let me have DMT. Then you got to go integrate 00:53:03.579 --> 00:53:07.239 with people. You know, it's like, dude, like, 00:53:07.340 --> 00:53:10.000 oh, fuck. Here we go. Now I'm in, you know, the 00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:11.840 airport. And I'm just like, shit. I had to call 00:53:11.840 --> 00:53:13.480 up a buddy. I was like, hey, dude, I don't know, 00:53:13.500 --> 00:53:15.059 like, how I'm going to do this. Because I got 00:53:15.059 --> 00:53:17.840 five hours on this flight. And, like, I got to 00:53:17.840 --> 00:53:19.280 fly all the way back here. This is horrible. 00:53:19.360 --> 00:53:22.579 I definitely didn't plan correctly. So next thing 00:53:22.579 --> 00:53:24.900 you know, I'm in an aisle seat, like, just strapped 00:53:24.900 --> 00:53:27.420 in and had my hands all tucked in. I'm just like, 00:53:27.420 --> 00:53:29.760 oh, man, like, this is going to be bad. Like, 00:53:29.800 --> 00:53:31.420 I feel bad for the dude next to me. He's like, 00:53:31.440 --> 00:53:36.429 he's just a psychopath. But when I got home, 00:53:36.650 --> 00:53:39.369 it was like, I was, I just told my mother, I 00:53:39.369 --> 00:53:41.789 was like, Hey, look, don't ask me any questions. 00:53:42.010 --> 00:53:46.590 I'm not, I don't know anything right now. But 00:53:46.590 --> 00:53:49.969 I do know that I just need, I just need a minute. 00:53:50.030 --> 00:53:53.949 I just need time. And my dog, I was just looking 00:53:53.949 --> 00:53:56.570 at him. I was like, was that you? And for the 00:53:56.570 --> 00:53:59.769 first time, like, you know, there was an experience 00:53:59.769 --> 00:54:02.199 and connection that, you know, With back and 00:54:02.199 --> 00:54:04.099 forth to Afghanistan, coming home, there was 00:54:04.099 --> 00:54:07.639 never a like being reunited with him in a sense 00:54:07.639 --> 00:54:11.219 of from that day. Like he was literally, after 00:54:11.219 --> 00:54:13.420 I asked that question, spinning all over me in 00:54:13.420 --> 00:54:17.139 the front passenger seat, blowing his coat all 00:54:17.139 --> 00:54:20.800 over the vehicle. Was that you? That was you, 00:54:20.840 --> 00:54:23.179 wasn't it? And he's just like, he would go even 00:54:23.179 --> 00:54:26.699 more. And I was just like, this is wild. And 00:54:26.699 --> 00:54:30.550 we got back to the house and I literally. slept 00:54:30.550 --> 00:54:33.730 for probably two or three days after that of 00:54:33.730 --> 00:54:37.150 just trying to like all right let me walk outside 00:54:37.150 --> 00:54:41.289 let me let me reinstitute some of these um these 00:54:41.289 --> 00:54:44.250 tasks that i had planned for myself as far as 00:54:44.250 --> 00:54:46.650 my journey goes of here's what i want to do here's 00:54:46.650 --> 00:54:49.429 what i want to build on um to be able to take 00:54:49.429 --> 00:54:51.750 that in and i was just like you know i could 00:54:51.750 --> 00:54:53.829 really sense the difference of who i was and 00:54:53.829 --> 00:54:56.349 what i wanted to become and that gave me a lot 00:54:56.349 --> 00:54:59.659 of hope of like okay it's it's going to be fine 00:54:59.659 --> 00:55:03.260 life is not that bad anymore like this is life 00:55:03.260 --> 00:55:06.400 is actually very simple people make this very 00:55:06.400 --> 00:55:09.960 hard you know it's it's just one of those things 00:55:09.960 --> 00:55:13.219 where you get that that 50 000 foot overview 00:55:13.219 --> 00:55:15.860 of like okay we're all just plugged into this 00:55:15.860 --> 00:55:18.699 system with this matrix like what are we doing 00:55:18.699 --> 00:55:24.119 how do we stop it um and it was just it was it 00:55:24.119 --> 00:55:26.420 was a really a breath of fresh air that i was 00:55:26.420 --> 00:55:30.340 able to get from that experience As I'm hearing 00:55:30.340 --> 00:55:32.960 more and more and getting deeper into all these 00:55:32.960 --> 00:55:35.000 different healing modalities, especially when 00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:37.059 it comes to the psychedelics, the plant medicines, 00:55:37.239 --> 00:55:40.440 one thing that's now, I think, the next phase 00:55:40.440 --> 00:55:45.039 is, and I just had Kagan Gill on the show, who's 00:55:45.039 --> 00:55:46.619 a friend of mine. We went around the world together 00:55:46.619 --> 00:55:50.960 on 7X with Patrick. Yeah, great dude. And he's 00:55:50.960 --> 00:55:52.920 got this thing, I think it's called Mind Dojo. 00:55:52.960 --> 00:55:55.780 I might have that wrong. But anyway. so you do 00:55:55.780 --> 00:55:58.280 a psychedelic journey you have these eye -opening 00:55:58.280 --> 00:56:01.360 experiences but then there's a lot of people 00:56:01.360 --> 00:56:03.139 that just oh and then six months i go do it again 00:56:03.139 --> 00:56:05.059 and his whole thing is and i'm sure the people 00:56:05.059 --> 00:56:06.599 he surrounds himself with is all right you've 00:56:06.599 --> 00:56:09.340 opened the door but now you need to work through 00:56:09.340 --> 00:56:11.460 all the things that you just found and so you 00:56:11.460 --> 00:56:13.519 have meditation and breath work and you know 00:56:13.519 --> 00:56:15.820 time in nature and you know time with animals 00:56:15.820 --> 00:56:18.579 whatever the things are what has been your experience 00:56:18.579 --> 00:56:21.380 of that the the awakening that you had with the 00:56:21.380 --> 00:56:25.250 psychedelics versus what needs to come next Yeah, 00:56:25.269 --> 00:56:28.309 I think the, the awakening was, you know, again, 00:56:28.389 --> 00:56:31.070 it comes down to self -love. What is the, what 00:56:31.070 --> 00:56:33.489 is the underlying thing that, that motivates 00:56:33.489 --> 00:56:36.730 you that where you're happy in your own skin, 00:56:36.929 --> 00:56:41.369 you're you're, you're at peace and you understand, 00:56:41.469 --> 00:56:45.670 and you kind of have this, this seventh sense 00:56:45.670 --> 00:56:48.690 or enhanced sixth sense of just being able to 00:56:48.690 --> 00:56:51.590 see the right people that you want to align with. 00:56:51.630 --> 00:56:54.949 And you just. you all right i'm going this is 00:56:54.949 --> 00:56:57.889 this makes me happy i feel comfortable here or 00:56:57.889 --> 00:57:00.369 they're pushing me in a way that this is conducive 00:57:00.369 --> 00:57:04.550 to my growth um and it really just came down 00:57:04.550 --> 00:57:09.369 to what were those deficiencies how hard are 00:57:09.369 --> 00:57:10.809 you going to work on them what are the steps 00:57:10.809 --> 00:57:12.090 that you're going to put into place because like 00:57:12.090 --> 00:57:13.510 you said it's like hey yeah you can go do this 00:57:13.510 --> 00:57:14.989 six months and then six months later you're finding 00:57:14.989 --> 00:57:18.050 yourself having to go back and do it again because 00:57:18.050 --> 00:57:22.170 did you even work on Or did you just fall back 00:57:22.170 --> 00:57:24.289 into thinking like this was going to be a one 00:57:24.289 --> 00:57:26.610 -off and I'm good, I'm solid. It takes everything 00:57:26.610 --> 00:57:29.630 away. It's no, it's, it's a lot of, you know, 00:57:29.630 --> 00:57:33.409 relationships. Like what is the toxic relationships 00:57:33.409 --> 00:57:35.170 that you find yourself in that you get involved 00:57:35.170 --> 00:57:37.230 with and that you don't want to get away. And 00:57:37.230 --> 00:57:39.550 that's communication. It's just like, there's 00:57:39.550 --> 00:57:41.429 so many things that I was able to take away from 00:57:41.429 --> 00:57:42.929 that to understand, like, I didn't want to be 00:57:42.929 --> 00:57:44.489 involved with toxic relationships. I didn't want 00:57:44.489 --> 00:57:47.010 to be a contributing factor to that in any way. 00:57:48.059 --> 00:57:50.599 Um, you know, so there, there were some, I mean, 00:57:50.599 --> 00:57:55.400 bro, it's like a, it's, it's hard to explain 00:57:55.400 --> 00:58:01.119 like the, the, the number of lessons that were 00:58:01.119 --> 00:58:04.519 learned, um, because you still, you come back 00:58:04.519 --> 00:58:06.440 normal when it all settles. Like you're still 00:58:06.440 --> 00:58:09.380 a normal human being following that. You just 00:58:09.380 --> 00:58:11.539 learn ways of how to digest it and what you need 00:58:11.539 --> 00:58:16.289 to digest. And, and, you know, If you're just 00:58:16.289 --> 00:58:19.329 in a shitty situation and you're just lying to 00:58:19.329 --> 00:58:21.010 yourself and you're going to continue lying to 00:58:21.010 --> 00:58:22.849 yourself because you're trying to make something 00:58:22.849 --> 00:58:27.090 work, you're not going to find yourself healing. 00:58:27.130 --> 00:58:28.730 You're always going to find yourself compromising 00:58:28.730 --> 00:58:31.869 for another individual or for another situation 00:58:31.869 --> 00:58:35.269 versus standing up for yourself and being like, 00:58:35.329 --> 00:58:37.630 hey, as much as this is going to fucking suck 00:58:37.630 --> 00:58:41.429 to have to start over, here are the potential 00:58:41.429 --> 00:58:43.550 outcomes if I do. And here's where I'm going 00:58:43.550 --> 00:58:48.019 to be happy. So you have to weigh those out case 00:58:48.019 --> 00:58:52.340 by case. And fortunately for me, never married, 00:58:52.480 --> 00:58:57.199 no children. Most of my adult life has been spent 00:58:57.199 --> 00:59:00.760 overseas. So for me coming home, it was just 00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:02.480 always like, all right, hey, this is all fun. 00:59:02.599 --> 00:59:05.739 This is great. But then starting the organization, 00:59:06.199 --> 00:59:10.659 coming back and working with individuals who 00:59:10.659 --> 00:59:14.119 have a lot of multi... multi -system traumas 00:59:14.119 --> 00:59:17.380 and just trauma mental mental health issues um 00:59:17.380 --> 00:59:21.400 knowing that i could bear the weight of of assisting 00:59:21.400 --> 00:59:23.079 them and helping them through their path through 00:59:23.079 --> 00:59:26.599 the dogs that's really kind of where i felt my 00:59:26.599 --> 00:59:29.440 need because it was like look here's one tool 00:59:29.440 --> 00:59:31.460 the dog is a tool it's not an end -all be -all 00:59:31.460 --> 00:59:34.659 like you know it's it's it's it can be life -changing 00:59:34.659 --> 00:59:38.300 if you want it to be Um, but looking at a proprioceptive 00:59:38.300 --> 00:59:40.480 neurocog dog and what we were building out and 00:59:40.480 --> 00:59:43.380 how we wanted to see things happen for an individual 00:59:43.380 --> 00:59:45.579 with a TBI, brain injuries, mental, whatever 00:59:45.579 --> 00:59:49.639 the case is, it gives you that, that moment space 00:59:49.639 --> 00:59:53.659 and time of just nothing fucking matters except 00:59:53.659 --> 00:59:55.760 for this moment that you're with your dog right 00:59:55.760 --> 00:59:58.079 now, troubleshooting and problem solving and 00:59:58.079 --> 01:00:04.300 to having a, a, a hand in a purpose to what you're 01:00:04.300 --> 01:00:07.610 doing for yourself. Because it's my dog. It's 01:00:07.610 --> 01:00:10.929 my property. It's my thing that I'm working for 01:00:10.929 --> 01:00:13.969 myself and my overall mental health. Nobody else. 01:00:14.869 --> 01:00:16.929 And it gives you that time and place of just 01:00:16.929 --> 01:00:21.809 shutting down and focusing on what your needs 01:00:21.809 --> 01:00:25.630 are. And a lot of us don't ever admit to, what 01:00:25.630 --> 01:00:27.530 do I like to do? Like, it's hard for me to say, 01:00:27.530 --> 01:00:29.110 well, I like to do this. I like to do a bunch 01:00:29.110 --> 01:00:31.889 of shit. But what can I say? Like, I really love 01:00:31.889 --> 01:00:35.250 to do and sitting down and where it's not work. 01:00:35.719 --> 01:00:39.360 It's, it's like this, whatever, man, I'm, I'm 01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:41.099 training dogs. I'm having a great time. I'm, 01:00:41.099 --> 01:00:43.420 I'm helping people. I'm coordinating, I'm plugging 01:00:43.420 --> 01:00:46.139 holes and doing logistical stuff. Like I'm able 01:00:46.139 --> 01:00:47.900 to help people get to the next level in their 01:00:47.900 --> 01:00:50.139 life and save a couple of lives here and there 01:00:50.139 --> 01:00:55.059 where I can, or if I can in that process. And 01:00:55.059 --> 01:00:58.039 that for me was, was what I found with the dogs 01:00:58.039 --> 01:01:01.110 and, and to be able to just, you know, Think 01:01:01.110 --> 01:01:02.769 about being in a shitty relationship with your 01:01:02.769 --> 01:01:04.989 wife or just constantly fucking by just getting 01:01:04.989 --> 01:01:07.090 yelled at all the time. Now it's like, hey, I 01:01:07.090 --> 01:01:08.989 got to take the dog outside. Hey, I'm going to 01:01:08.989 --> 01:01:10.289 take him for a ride. I'm going to go. We're going 01:01:10.289 --> 01:01:12.250 to go here. We're going to go train. You know, 01:01:12.250 --> 01:01:15.010 and I think it's for for the programming that 01:01:15.010 --> 01:01:19.050 we built. It gives that person the the ability 01:01:19.050 --> 01:01:23.909 to to take a pause in the day to go focus on 01:01:23.909 --> 01:01:26.969 themselves and to find that that meditative state. 01:01:27.070 --> 01:01:28.889 Because for some of us, meditation for me is 01:01:28.889 --> 01:01:32.019 very hard. My flow state is chaos, I guess, in 01:01:32.019 --> 01:01:33.579 a sense where I have to have a bunch of things 01:01:33.579 --> 01:01:36.539 going because I can just naturally just move 01:01:36.539 --> 01:01:42.500 through and find the resources and solve for 01:01:42.500 --> 01:01:47.289 X where, you know, sit me down. say, hey, go 01:01:47.289 --> 01:01:48.550 to the beach. You're going to hang out here all 01:01:48.550 --> 01:01:51.110 day. I will be crawling out of my skin like, 01:01:51.190 --> 01:01:53.610 fuck, I'm sweating. It's so fucking hot. I'm 01:01:53.610 --> 01:01:55.110 getting all sandy. Like, I don't want to be here. 01:01:55.449 --> 01:01:57.809 This is terrible. Seeing everybody run around, 01:01:57.889 --> 01:02:01.510 dogs going crazy. I'm just like, oh, God. So 01:02:01.510 --> 01:02:04.489 that's kind of, I guess, an essence of being 01:02:04.489 --> 01:02:09.110 able to identify solutions for yourself. It comes 01:02:09.110 --> 01:02:12.989 down to self -love. What about performance? I 01:02:12.989 --> 01:02:15.929 think one of the most powerful tools when it's 01:02:15.929 --> 01:02:18.869 the naysayer, when it's the guy or woman who 01:02:18.869 --> 01:02:21.590 kind of doesn't buy into the whole mental health 01:02:21.590 --> 01:02:24.150 conversation in the fire service, for example, 01:02:24.150 --> 01:02:26.769 and say, all right, then, Rockstar, if you truly 01:02:26.769 --> 01:02:28.590 want to be the best version of yourself as a 01:02:28.590 --> 01:02:31.070 firefighter, firstly, you need to change your 01:02:31.070 --> 01:02:33.250 work week. And I know Palm Beach with Pat is, 01:02:33.309 --> 01:02:35.250 you know, they've gone to the 24 -72. So I'll 01:02:35.250 --> 01:02:37.269 just slide that in there. The department is finally 01:02:37.269 --> 01:02:41.079 getting it. But secondly, if you want to get 01:02:41.079 --> 01:02:42.820 in the flow state, you've got to have 10 ,000 01:02:42.820 --> 01:02:44.880 reps, you've got to have high stress, and then 01:02:44.880 --> 01:02:48.099 you've got to have a clear mind. So if you look 01:02:48.099 --> 01:02:50.519 at Delta and some of these tier one operators, 01:02:50.840 --> 01:02:53.260 they are working with all these organizations 01:02:53.260 --> 01:02:55.139 that ironically work really well with mental 01:02:55.139 --> 01:02:58.679 health, also for performance. So it's a win -win 01:02:58.679 --> 01:03:01.579 situation. What were you seeing as far as your 01:03:01.579 --> 01:03:04.659 ability to operate as you were on this healing 01:03:04.659 --> 01:03:17.800 journey? Good question. I was able to itemize 01:03:17.800 --> 01:03:24.719 and what I needed to compartmentalize what needed 01:03:24.719 --> 01:03:27.380 attention and what didn't need attention. And 01:03:27.380 --> 01:03:33.599 for me, that was, you know, the ability of, hey, 01:03:33.719 --> 01:03:37.760 go to the gym, go do this. go go work out um 01:03:37.760 --> 01:03:43.019 it was you know establishing new relationships 01:03:43.019 --> 01:03:47.440 it was being able to to sit and have peer support 01:03:47.440 --> 01:03:51.130 groups where you're talking to individuals who 01:03:51.130 --> 01:03:53.630 you admire, you look up to, whether it's in business, 01:03:53.750 --> 01:03:56.650 whether it's in your occupational field, whether 01:03:56.650 --> 01:04:00.949 it's in just a simple area of interest. It's 01:04:00.949 --> 01:04:05.949 diversifying that portfolio to find new tools 01:04:05.949 --> 01:04:12.150 for the toolkit that you could put into your 01:04:12.150 --> 01:04:14.929 everyday system. It's like a software update 01:04:14.929 --> 01:04:17.349 of being able to say, oh, I learned this from 01:04:17.349 --> 01:04:19.889 this guy. Let me try this. And oh, this is working 01:04:19.889 --> 01:04:22.429 well for me. Let's continue to roll with this. 01:04:22.489 --> 01:04:24.190 I think it's like those small little victories. 01:04:27.409 --> 01:04:31.289 To be able to appreciate small victories is probably 01:04:31.289 --> 01:04:32.949 the biggest thing that I think I learned. If 01:04:32.949 --> 01:04:37.010 I'm understanding the question correctly, I think 01:04:37.010 --> 01:04:40.780 that was where... we all kind of get lost in 01:04:40.780 --> 01:04:41.980 the sense of especially if you're running your 01:04:41.980 --> 01:04:43.699 own business if you're doing something and elon 01:04:43.699 --> 01:04:46.119 musk said it great it's like as a ceo or an executive 01:04:46.119 --> 01:04:48.239 in a higher level you're always eating glass 01:04:48.239 --> 01:04:51.699 you're never really celebrating the wins of what 01:04:51.699 --> 01:04:54.000 you do accomplish because you're always faced 01:04:54.000 --> 01:04:56.679 with the problems you're always faced with what 01:04:56.679 --> 01:04:58.980 didn't go right how do i fix this how do i increase 01:04:58.980 --> 01:05:00.940 these different spends and whatever i have to 01:05:00.940 --> 01:05:04.260 do to where you're never really looking at The, 01:05:04.320 --> 01:05:07.400 the, the, the momentum that everybody sees of 01:05:07.400 --> 01:05:09.199 like, oh, well you helped this. Oh my God, you 01:05:09.199 --> 01:05:11.099 put this dog here. You've done this. Like we've 01:05:11.099 --> 01:05:14.000 had some, some great individuals that we were 01:05:14.000 --> 01:05:19.489 able to work with who. who have helped me grow 01:05:19.489 --> 01:05:23.969 in so many different ways. And I was just happy 01:05:23.969 --> 01:05:26.929 to be like that one speck, a part of their life 01:05:26.929 --> 01:05:30.030 to help them change their thing. And that's created 01:05:30.030 --> 01:05:33.349 a, you know, a brotherhood in itself of always 01:05:33.349 --> 01:05:35.269 being able to have someone to reach out to and 01:05:35.269 --> 01:05:37.670 call and respect and, you know, understanding 01:05:37.670 --> 01:05:40.590 those, those different relationships and how 01:05:40.590 --> 01:05:43.750 they can, I don't want to say be transactional 01:05:43.750 --> 01:05:47.340 to a degree, but to be able to. to have a true 01:05:47.340 --> 01:05:49.980 meaningful friendship in a way that you're it's 01:05:49.980 --> 01:05:53.820 mutually beneficial absolutely well i want to 01:05:53.820 --> 01:05:56.440 get to the dogs obviously the impact on yourself 01:05:56.440 --> 01:05:59.139 and then create a non -profit but just before 01:05:59.139 --> 01:06:02.400 we do talk to me about the us compound attack 01:06:02.400 --> 01:06:09.000 so that was in 2005 uh we had just stood up a 01:06:09.000 --> 01:06:15.760 um new team up at alvarado off of um uh at the 01:06:15.760 --> 01:06:20.039 airport in kabul and we were all out there just 01:06:20.039 --> 01:06:22.320 kind of hanging out doing whatever you know i 01:06:22.320 --> 01:06:23.980 think we just got them playing freaking cornhole 01:06:23.980 --> 01:06:27.559 or something like that and uh it was right around 01:06:27.559 --> 01:06:36.159 1700 maybe even like 1800 whatever um you felt 01:06:36.159 --> 01:06:38.159 this explosion go off and this was just like 01:06:38.159 --> 01:06:40.960 oh and it's like you know you're kind of like 01:06:40.960 --> 01:06:46.199 damn whoever's on that like they got fucked up 01:06:46.199 --> 01:06:48.420 like you knew that there was like there was there 01:06:48.420 --> 01:06:49.820 was like all right hey we're just waiting to 01:06:49.820 --> 01:06:53.719 see where that was and um it just so happened 01:06:53.719 --> 01:06:58.000 to be just outside of abbey gate um where this 01:06:58.000 --> 01:07:01.900 v -bid rolled up through this alleyway and just 01:07:01.900 --> 01:07:06.360 deaded and then it was in between um two compounds 01:07:06.360 --> 01:07:09.320 one was an american compound which literally 01:07:09.320 --> 01:07:13.420 i mean you're looking at 20 foot T walls on nobody 01:07:13.420 --> 01:07:15.280 has an understanding what that is. It's think 01:07:15.280 --> 01:07:18.039 of the, the T walls on the side of the road that 01:07:18.039 --> 01:07:20.019 they put in for, for crowd control or whatever, 01:07:20.179 --> 01:07:24.980 but just add, add another, you know, 15, 15 feet 01:07:24.980 --> 01:07:30.570 onto that dusted like gone. you know, windows 01:07:30.570 --> 01:07:33.730 blown out, shipping containers that we used to 01:07:33.730 --> 01:07:35.949 live in. Those were just dumped over, peeled 01:07:35.949 --> 01:07:38.670 over. The majority of the infrastructure inside 01:07:38.670 --> 01:07:41.050 that, I mean, it was just, like, vaporized. And 01:07:41.050 --> 01:07:43.369 then you see this, you know, this monster crater 01:07:43.369 --> 01:07:48.550 where it's, like, 15, 20 feet wide, freaking 01:07:48.550 --> 01:07:51.969 almost 10 feet deep. You're just like, fuck, 01:07:52.190 --> 01:07:55.360 okay. You see the driver who skipped off one 01:07:55.360 --> 01:07:56.940 of the other T walls that was still there and 01:07:56.940 --> 01:07:59.239 his body was over here. And, you know, you just, 01:07:59.260 --> 01:08:02.059 you roll through, you know, and being that it 01:08:02.059 --> 01:08:04.340 was a mass CAS, you had guys that were stuck 01:08:04.340 --> 01:08:05.940 under equipment, you had things. So there was 01:08:05.940 --> 01:08:07.900 a lot of, a lot of logistics. Unfortunately, 01:08:08.159 --> 01:08:11.639 our QRF team, you know, we were, we were responsible 01:08:11.639 --> 01:08:13.800 for that type of incident if it were to happen. 01:08:13.840 --> 01:08:17.170 So when we rolled in. set up a perimeter move 01:08:17.170 --> 01:08:19.109 in and then from there it's just a matter of 01:08:19.109 --> 01:08:21.130 like hey jumping on bodies and like hey you'd 01:08:21.130 --> 01:08:23.569 start just mass triage this person's got to go 01:08:23.569 --> 01:08:26.310 here this has got to happen here um and at that 01:08:26.310 --> 01:08:28.170 point everybody was just getting shuffled out 01:08:28.170 --> 01:08:31.270 and going right to the uh the hospital that they 01:08:31.270 --> 01:08:35.500 had at the airport um and then from that it was 01:08:35.500 --> 01:08:38.840 just the next few days um going through debris 01:08:38.840 --> 01:08:41.420 removal trying to get things set up and you know 01:08:41.420 --> 01:08:43.880 holding perimeter holding security to make sure 01:08:43.880 --> 01:08:47.039 that that void that was just created was was 01:08:47.039 --> 01:08:50.579 protected and secured um so for the most part 01:08:50.579 --> 01:08:53.060 it was just a it was an incident that we responded 01:08:53.060 --> 01:08:58.060 to it it was um lasted all throughout the night 01:08:58.060 --> 01:09:00.949 for the next few days uh just pulling bodies 01:09:00.949 --> 01:09:03.289 and you know fortunately there were only minor 01:09:03.289 --> 01:09:05.250 injuries sustained for some of the americans 01:09:05.250 --> 01:09:07.829 there were only a few deaths on the local national 01:09:07.829 --> 01:09:12.069 side and some of the other embassies or agencies 01:09:12.069 --> 01:09:15.949 contractors that were in that in that vicinity 01:09:15.949 --> 01:09:19.189 experienced some casualties as well but um we 01:09:19.189 --> 01:09:21.130 were able to the the people that we were able 01:09:21.130 --> 01:09:24.270 to work on we were able to get out and and that 01:09:24.270 --> 01:09:26.770 was pretty much the the sum of some of that incident 01:09:27.630 --> 01:09:30.310 That's horrendous, though. Especially triage. 01:09:30.329 --> 01:09:33.590 I haven't actually had a mass cash that size, 01:09:33.689 --> 01:09:35.710 at least. I had one in LA, but I wasn't on the 01:09:35.710 --> 01:09:39.170 triage team. But just to have to walk around 01:09:39.170 --> 01:09:42.130 and tag people appropriately, and even if someone 01:09:42.130 --> 01:09:45.130 is circling the drain, putting a black tag on, 01:09:45.170 --> 01:09:47.710 basically, I can't imagine, especially if children 01:09:47.710 --> 01:09:49.569 are involved. I mean, that's one of the most 01:09:49.569 --> 01:09:51.470 brutal things that any kind of first responder 01:09:51.470 --> 01:09:53.510 or emergency personnel are going to have to do. 01:09:54.170 --> 01:09:57.520 Yeah. yeah and it's like you know you you train 01:09:57.520 --> 01:09:58.760 for it because it's like you're with a bunch 01:09:58.760 --> 01:10:03.300 of capable men and women um for us our team was 01:10:03.300 --> 01:10:07.319 was predominantly uh male infused so for us it 01:10:07.319 --> 01:10:10.039 was like you know in the event even if we did 01:10:10.039 --> 01:10:11.979 get shot it's like hey man if you can walk you 01:10:11.979 --> 01:10:15.399 can move put your shit on let's go like so systematically 01:10:15.399 --> 01:10:20.220 you get it you get it down and you're so you 01:10:20.220 --> 01:10:22.779 know from experience it's like you know you're 01:10:22.779 --> 01:10:25.399 just just structured compartmentalized like hey 01:10:25.399 --> 01:10:27.720 this you just quick look over glance like hey 01:10:27.720 --> 01:10:29.939 now this isn't this dude's got to go we got to 01:10:29.939 --> 01:10:34.619 move this guy um so yeah it was uh it was it 01:10:34.619 --> 01:10:39.119 was definitely a an interesting time i can imagine 01:10:39.119 --> 01:10:41.680 well let's get back to the dogs and i just i 01:10:41.680 --> 01:10:43.119 meant to ask that earlier so i wanted to put 01:10:43.119 --> 01:10:46.520 that in there um you have this moment where you 01:10:46.520 --> 01:10:48.760 come back now your dog's putting fur all over 01:10:48.760 --> 01:10:52.350 the car and spinning around you in circles Talk 01:10:52.350 --> 01:10:56.289 to me first about your kind of awakening when 01:10:56.289 --> 01:10:58.390 it came to that connection with your own canine. 01:10:59.590 --> 01:11:05.529 So interestingly enough, I secured my dog four 01:11:05.529 --> 01:11:09.489 years in advance to that. So for me, I picked 01:11:09.489 --> 01:11:11.350 him out at three days old. He's like this little 01:11:11.350 --> 01:11:16.470 hamster, literally just born. Didn't even have 01:11:16.470 --> 01:11:19.340 his eyes open yet. And we started doing NeuroStem, 01:11:19.399 --> 01:11:21.560 which was, you know, adopted by the military 01:11:21.560 --> 01:11:24.659 to induce stress on an animal so that this way 01:11:24.659 --> 01:11:27.840 later on in life that that dog would easily be 01:11:27.840 --> 01:11:32.939 able to handle stress more efficiently than dogs 01:11:32.939 --> 01:11:36.479 that don't have it. And, you know, from that 01:11:36.479 --> 01:11:39.800 point, you know, he and I were connected together. 01:11:40.140 --> 01:11:42.180 It took some time for our relationship to develop. 01:11:44.250 --> 01:11:47.250 Within that process of working him through those 01:11:47.250 --> 01:11:51.810 years, it gave me that purpose of being able 01:11:51.810 --> 01:11:53.890 to focus on myself. It gave me the interest. 01:11:54.029 --> 01:11:57.750 It gave me essentially another hobby of being 01:11:57.750 --> 01:12:01.989 able to look at and read and break down what 01:12:01.989 --> 01:12:06.449 the animal was telling me versus the everyday 01:12:06.449 --> 01:12:07.770 relationship. Hey, man, you want to go outside 01:12:07.770 --> 01:12:09.750 and throw the ball? It's like, of course he does. 01:12:10.720 --> 01:12:14.680 but really like what were his needs too and where 01:12:14.680 --> 01:12:18.420 I was deficient as a handler to really kind of 01:12:18.420 --> 01:12:22.399 map out and look at ways of improving our relationship 01:12:22.399 --> 01:12:25.680 by being able to clear up my communication. And, 01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:29.960 you know, with that, it was, you know, understanding 01:12:29.960 --> 01:12:33.039 the reward cycle, being able to mark and maneuver 01:12:33.039 --> 01:12:36.020 and do a whole bunch of different things. And 01:12:36.020 --> 01:12:38.189 I always try to tell, you know. individuals like 01:12:38.189 --> 01:12:40.550 guys I work with, or even some private clients, 01:12:40.710 --> 01:12:42.890 you know, what you want to focus on today is 01:12:42.890 --> 01:12:45.329 going to be looking into a kaleidoscope. It's 01:12:45.329 --> 01:12:47.250 like, oh shit, what do I got to do? Where do 01:12:47.250 --> 01:12:49.430 I start? Well, you just start small and you work 01:12:49.430 --> 01:12:51.590 your way up. You perfect one thing and then you 01:12:51.590 --> 01:12:53.229 kind of move on, but you add pressure. You're 01:12:53.229 --> 01:12:55.569 always kind of going back to that one thing. 01:12:57.770 --> 01:12:59.930 From there, it was just it laid the groundwork 01:12:59.930 --> 01:13:03.970 of being able to be present, be mindful, be understanding 01:13:03.970 --> 01:13:09.529 and coming into that space of, OK, this is something 01:13:09.529 --> 01:13:11.810 that I can that I can resonate with. It wasn't 01:13:11.810 --> 01:13:13.810 something that was just given to me. I had to 01:13:13.810 --> 01:13:19.609 earn that relationship with my animal and obviously 01:13:19.609 --> 01:13:22.310 with the with the people around me as well. But 01:13:22.310 --> 01:13:26.720 it really just kind of brought. my ability to 01:13:26.720 --> 01:13:29.979 escape and go be with my dog, do what I wanted 01:13:29.979 --> 01:13:33.159 to do in a way to connect with other people who 01:13:33.159 --> 01:13:37.220 had similar interests. And, you know, traveling 01:13:37.220 --> 01:13:39.920 with him for the first time, you know, we went 01:13:39.920 --> 01:13:42.520 to, went to Costa Rica. He was seven months old. 01:13:42.619 --> 01:13:45.439 So we, we did a flight from, where did we go? 01:13:45.500 --> 01:13:51.539 We went from Palm beach to the 2014 all -star 01:13:51.539 --> 01:13:53.920 game. where it was Derek Jeter's last all -star 01:13:53.920 --> 01:13:55.619 game. So I was like, I have to go. And I'm finally 01:13:55.619 --> 01:13:58.500 on leave. So we went up to Minneapolis. First 01:13:58.500 --> 01:14:00.779 time I've been home. First time I've ever, like, 01:14:00.859 --> 01:14:03.920 well, second time I've been ever in Minneapolis. 01:14:04.739 --> 01:14:06.380 First time I've ever been there where I actually 01:14:06.380 --> 01:14:08.000 know what the hell is happening, what's going 01:14:08.000 --> 01:14:12.779 on. And, you know, I have my dog. We went to 01:14:12.779 --> 01:14:15.340 the Home Run Derby. Then we went to the all -star 01:14:15.340 --> 01:14:19.359 game. And then following that trip, we shot down 01:14:19.359 --> 01:14:21.720 to Costa Rica and spent like 14 days in Costa 01:14:21.720 --> 01:14:24.800 Rica. Well, little did I know, like my first 01:14:24.800 --> 01:14:26.420 Malinois, I didn't know any different. You know, 01:14:26.439 --> 01:14:27.720 we're getting ready, you know, having a great 01:14:27.720 --> 01:14:29.739 time. He's running around and doing a whole bunch 01:14:29.739 --> 01:14:32.039 of, you know, bad dog shit, just having a good 01:14:32.039 --> 01:14:35.859 time. And, you know, we're getting ready to leave. 01:14:36.199 --> 01:14:38.119 Next thing you know, we have the whole house 01:14:38.119 --> 01:14:40.310 locked up downstairs. we thought everything was 01:14:40.310 --> 01:14:42.789 locked up downstairs or upstairs, went downstairs, 01:14:42.890 --> 01:14:44.329 started cleaning up, getting ready to put stuff 01:14:44.329 --> 01:14:46.470 in our rental. Next thing you know, we're outside 01:14:46.470 --> 01:14:49.170 just doing a quick, uh, quick, you know, final, 01:14:49.229 --> 01:14:51.829 final walkthrough. And next thing you know, he's, 01:14:51.829 --> 01:14:54.630 he's opens a window. We come to find out scales, 01:14:54.729 --> 01:14:58.029 a roof hops on, on a vehicle. And it's just running 01:14:58.029 --> 01:14:59.590 around like, Hey, where are you guys going? Like, 01:14:59.590 --> 01:15:01.850 don't leave me. Like I'm here. I'm just like, 01:15:01.850 --> 01:15:04.050 what the fuck? Like, dude, do you need locked 01:15:04.050 --> 01:15:06.510 up? I don't want to lose this dog. He was running 01:15:06.510 --> 01:15:09.880 off into the jungle. And, um, No, it was just 01:15:09.880 --> 01:15:11.979 like my first time there. I was just like, okay. 01:15:12.800 --> 01:15:15.640 And then at the airport, we're delayed for eight 01:15:15.640 --> 01:15:17.380 hours. Didn't get out of the airport for like 01:15:17.380 --> 01:15:18.819 eight hours. So we're just sitting there. I'm 01:15:18.819 --> 01:15:22.140 just like, oh my God. But it was just so refreshing 01:15:22.140 --> 01:15:28.439 to kind of have that escape and be able to have 01:15:28.439 --> 01:15:30.779 that animal there where nothing else mattered. 01:15:30.880 --> 01:15:35.640 The situation didn't affect me nearly as much 01:15:35.640 --> 01:15:38.039 because I had something that I could lean into 01:15:38.039 --> 01:15:40.359 and lean on. That was there for me as much as 01:15:40.359 --> 01:15:45.260 I was for him. And, you know, fast forward a 01:15:45.260 --> 01:15:48.380 couple years, I ended up getting another dog. 01:15:48.819 --> 01:15:52.640 And that ended up being our breeding bitch for 01:15:52.640 --> 01:15:57.960 our program. And right as I got out, I started 01:15:57.960 --> 01:16:01.520 the organization in 2016. didn't take it live 01:16:01.520 --> 01:16:07.479 until 2017 2018 where i did the my first litter 01:16:07.479 --> 01:16:09.319 and then that first litter was a whole learning 01:16:09.319 --> 01:16:11.500 curve of having a bunch of little malinois puppies 01:16:11.500 --> 01:16:13.899 running around and i don't know too many people 01:16:13.899 --> 01:16:16.000 who know this but they're little terrorists that 01:16:16.000 --> 01:16:18.760 straight up will ruin anything that you like 01:16:18.760 --> 01:16:21.279 they'll destroy it if you're not paying attention 01:16:21.279 --> 01:16:23.520 to them if they're quiet they're just tearing 01:16:23.520 --> 01:16:25.359 up like you have like all right where are you 01:16:25.359 --> 01:16:30.649 um but it allowed me to really reflect on hey, 01:16:31.310 --> 01:16:33.750 you know, using the hypervigilance and all of 01:16:33.750 --> 01:16:36.369 those things that kind of equated towards PTSD 01:16:36.369 --> 01:16:39.310 and what we're thinking about, it gave me the 01:16:39.310 --> 01:16:41.750 ability to focus on my dog and it gave me something 01:16:41.750 --> 01:16:47.649 to worry about or to constructively utilize that 01:16:47.649 --> 01:16:51.609 tool I was given to place that into my animal 01:16:51.609 --> 01:16:55.390 and into the work that I was performing. So with 01:16:55.390 --> 01:16:58.039 the puppies, it just came out. it was awesome 01:16:58.039 --> 01:17:00.880 it was just a unique experience where you know 01:17:00.880 --> 01:17:03.939 we were able to to link dogs up with some some 01:17:03.939 --> 01:17:05.699 really cool individuals and people that needed 01:17:05.699 --> 01:17:07.760 them and then that just kind of slowly progressed 01:17:07.760 --> 01:17:13.199 into into where we're at today um and tying guys 01:17:13.199 --> 01:17:16.539 in with coming in literally living with us for 01:17:16.539 --> 01:17:20.079 for up to five weeks in my own home you know 01:17:20.079 --> 01:17:22.060 learning how to cook dinners or do stuff and 01:17:22.060 --> 01:17:25.079 doing events recreational activities um that 01:17:25.079 --> 01:17:27.949 that were interested or they were at least at 01:17:27.949 --> 01:17:30.989 one point in their life interested in and um 01:17:30.989 --> 01:17:32.890 you know to be able to give that back to them 01:17:32.890 --> 01:17:35.949 and also on top of that give back a dog that 01:17:35.949 --> 01:17:37.590 would be able to change them in their direction 01:17:37.590 --> 01:17:39.810 trajectory of life that was like something super 01:17:39.810 --> 01:17:44.189 meaningful to me um you know because as a medic 01:17:44.189 --> 01:17:45.729 you want to help somebody you want to you know 01:17:45.729 --> 01:17:47.489 you can read a person it's like all right well 01:17:47.489 --> 01:17:49.810 sick not sick that's easy go through everything 01:17:49.810 --> 01:17:51.649 that's learned and then you just kind of map 01:17:51.649 --> 01:17:54.989 out and start tailoring dogs to you know what 01:17:54.989 --> 01:17:57.529 this person's needs are going to be where you 01:17:57.529 --> 01:18:01.229 can see deficiencies and in the dog and in the 01:18:01.229 --> 01:18:04.289 person in the handler because you have enough 01:18:04.289 --> 01:18:06.090 experience with enough dogs under your belt to 01:18:06.090 --> 01:18:07.890 know like okay this is going to drive this person 01:18:07.890 --> 01:18:11.949 or this isn't so they kind of set the tone for 01:18:11.949 --> 01:18:16.109 us absolutely i i've i've had two german shepherds 01:18:16.109 --> 01:18:17.550 now i had them growing up and then there was 01:18:17.550 --> 01:18:19.569 a period for a long time i didn't have any then 01:18:19.569 --> 01:18:22.989 we had shih tzus with my first wife Um, which 01:18:22.989 --> 01:18:24.649 didn't, I mean, there was sweethearts, but when 01:18:24.649 --> 01:18:27.090 I had my little son, the, the kind of, uh, pack 01:18:27.090 --> 01:18:29.250 mentality became dangerous. So we ended up giving 01:18:29.250 --> 01:18:32.210 them to, um, a couple that we knew and they had 01:18:32.210 --> 01:18:34.149 them right away until they passed away, which 01:18:34.149 --> 01:18:37.109 is amazing. But so yeah, I had my first shepherd 01:18:37.109 --> 01:18:40.010 and she absolutely has been, you know, my foundation. 01:18:40.170 --> 01:18:41.909 Cause as you hear a lot of people say, you know, 01:18:41.930 --> 01:18:44.390 even if you're deeply depressed, that dog still 01:18:44.390 --> 01:18:46.600 needs to be walked. It needs to be fed. It needs 01:18:46.600 --> 01:18:48.920 to be watered. And it gives you a purpose outside 01:18:48.920 --> 01:18:51.840 yourself. But I want to put a question to you. 01:18:51.939 --> 01:18:53.899 I've got a little three -year -old German Shepherd 01:18:53.899 --> 01:18:56.000 now. I lost my other one a couple of years ago. 01:18:57.239 --> 01:19:01.479 And she is a sweetheart. And I do a lot of walks 01:19:01.479 --> 01:19:04.239 with her. And then we do the balls and the games. 01:19:04.399 --> 01:19:07.819 And she's, I would argue, pretty obedient. But 01:19:07.819 --> 01:19:11.100 my God, the anxiety before a walk and the anxiety 01:19:11.100 --> 01:19:13.560 in the car, the whining and the spinning around. 01:19:14.199 --> 01:19:16.220 I know it's always us that we're doing something 01:19:16.220 --> 01:19:19.180 wrong. I've tried written stuff. I've tried the 01:19:19.180 --> 01:19:24.560 dog whisperer stuff. When you look at all these 01:19:24.560 --> 01:19:26.359 people and all the right ways of doing it, all 01:19:26.359 --> 01:19:28.220 the wrong ways of doing it, when it comes to 01:19:28.220 --> 01:19:31.420 that kind of anxiety, what is the kind of common 01:19:31.420 --> 01:19:34.720 denominator that we're missing? Because, I mean, 01:19:34.720 --> 01:19:36.840 obviously that's a barrier to that particular 01:19:36.840 --> 01:19:39.220 animal being. you know, a service dog at the 01:19:39.220 --> 01:19:41.579 moment. They can't be out in public or on a plane 01:19:41.579 --> 01:19:43.220 if they're going to be spinning around and whining 01:19:43.220 --> 01:19:45.680 for nine hours. So what are some of the issues 01:19:45.680 --> 01:19:48.579 that you see with us as far as creating some 01:19:48.579 --> 01:19:53.079 of these behaviors? I think brass tacks is anthropomorphizing 01:19:53.079 --> 01:19:55.560 with the animal. I think it's like you give animals 01:19:55.560 --> 01:20:01.079 human traits where it's like you find a sense 01:20:01.079 --> 01:20:05.720 of like trying to give them the attention you 01:20:05.720 --> 01:20:09.800 would to a human. And it's recognizing, all right, 01:20:09.819 --> 01:20:13.100 how do I break this down? How can I reward behaviors 01:20:13.100 --> 01:20:15.920 where if I did something different to change 01:20:15.920 --> 01:20:19.060 up what was causing that anxiety or finding a 01:20:19.060 --> 01:20:23.439 way to harness that drive and make it work for 01:20:23.439 --> 01:20:26.390 me? In a constructive way, especially if it's 01:20:26.390 --> 01:20:27.949 something where it's like aggravating, where 01:20:27.949 --> 01:20:29.670 you're like, fuck, just stop. Like, all right, 01:20:29.670 --> 01:20:33.470 come on, let's go. You know, I get it. You know, 01:20:33.470 --> 01:20:36.470 it's really being able to communicate with the 01:20:36.470 --> 01:20:39.170 dog of like, hey, let's take a step back. Let 01:20:39.170 --> 01:20:41.470 me maybe put you on place. Let's hold you here. 01:20:41.649 --> 01:20:43.449 I'm going to come up to you when you settle and 01:20:43.449 --> 01:20:46.329 you're quiet. I'm going to come closer. I'm going 01:20:46.329 --> 01:20:48.890 to give you what you want. And then you slowly 01:20:48.890 --> 01:20:53.949 take those wins and you gradually progress. And 01:20:53.949 --> 01:20:55.729 being able to put the brakes on the dog, because 01:20:55.729 --> 01:20:58.670 a lot of people, you know, their animals are 01:20:58.670 --> 01:21:02.609 all gas and there's no brakes. So you have to 01:21:02.609 --> 01:21:05.890 be able to manage, you know, those expectations 01:21:05.890 --> 01:21:08.510 and those realities, even, even with your dog. 01:21:08.989 --> 01:21:12.600 Even our dogs have, have, you know. I don't want 01:21:12.600 --> 01:21:15.380 to say liabilities, but they have tendencies 01:21:15.380 --> 01:21:17.760 to do X, Y, and Z. So it's like, hey, you need 01:21:17.760 --> 01:21:20.100 to be cognizant of this. And this is how we work 01:21:20.100 --> 01:21:22.619 through these problems together. But in essence, 01:21:22.720 --> 01:21:28.359 if a dog's super excited, you know, you give 01:21:28.359 --> 01:21:31.100 them the possession by working in closely once 01:21:31.100 --> 01:21:33.279 they've settled. And you have to make sure that 01:21:33.279 --> 01:21:36.340 they're clear with that. So it's like, you know, 01:21:36.359 --> 01:21:37.560 when they know that they're going for a walk, 01:21:37.600 --> 01:21:39.319 they're super excited. You have that routine 01:21:39.319 --> 01:21:43.010 down. Maybe it's switching up the routine. Maybe 01:21:43.010 --> 01:21:44.689 it's getting away from what's already previously 01:21:44.689 --> 01:21:47.649 known to maybe doing something a little bit different 01:21:47.649 --> 01:21:50.609 to where you capture the dog off beat, but they're 01:21:50.609 --> 01:21:52.510 paying attention to you. And then now you have 01:21:52.510 --> 01:21:55.409 that capture where you can begin doing what you 01:21:55.409 --> 01:21:58.890 want to do and changing or modifying those behaviors. 01:22:00.350 --> 01:22:03.630 What about as far as rewarding what would be 01:22:03.630 --> 01:22:06.210 the animal's correct behavior? Are you using 01:22:06.210 --> 01:22:09.899 food normally? yeah so we generally have food 01:22:09.899 --> 01:22:13.640 driven dogs um that that at least we we i like 01:22:13.640 --> 01:22:16.720 to use food driven dogs uh but if you have a 01:22:16.720 --> 01:22:19.260 ball or if you have something it's just it's 01:22:19.260 --> 01:22:23.899 making sure that the transaction um is very clear 01:22:23.899 --> 01:22:28.239 and what they're doing and um what i mean by 01:22:28.239 --> 01:22:29.859 that is like hey when they're down and say yes 01:22:29.859 --> 01:22:33.420 boom here's your ball or yes boom here's here's 01:22:33.420 --> 01:22:36.060 here's your food you know we use clickers i think 01:22:36.060 --> 01:22:39.170 clickers are easy because It's easy for me to 01:22:39.170 --> 01:22:43.390 transfer the dog over with a clicker so that 01:22:43.390 --> 01:22:46.729 the end user knows and can understand the reward 01:22:46.729 --> 01:22:50.270 system. But I think once you have a dialed in 01:22:50.270 --> 01:22:53.449 reward system and you understand left and right 01:22:53.449 --> 01:22:56.510 lateral limitations, then that's any relationship, 01:22:56.689 --> 01:23:00.289 right? So I think you get a better product with 01:23:00.289 --> 01:23:03.130 just defining what that reward system looks like. 01:23:04.109 --> 01:23:05.850 Brilliant. Well, I appreciate that. That was 01:23:05.850 --> 01:23:10.970 just personally for me. All right. Well, then 01:23:10.970 --> 01:23:13.630 before we talk about where, wherever you can 01:23:13.630 --> 01:23:15.329 find the nonprofit and we'll talk about some 01:23:15.329 --> 01:23:19.189 closing questions. What are some success stories 01:23:19.189 --> 01:23:21.829 that really kind of resonate with you as far 01:23:21.829 --> 01:23:29.850 as this program so far? Oof. Man. I think the 01:23:29.850 --> 01:23:32.529 successes that we've had in being able to put 01:23:32.529 --> 01:23:36.350 out close to 46 dogs at this point, a number 01:23:36.350 --> 01:23:38.430 of medical retreats and just retreats in general, 01:23:38.489 --> 01:23:42.369 the end users of who we've been able to work 01:23:42.369 --> 01:23:46.329 with, whether it's, you know, MARSOC Marines, 01:23:46.609 --> 01:23:49.289 Navy SEALs, Green Berets, you know, whoever from 01:23:49.289 --> 01:23:51.970 the special operations community, it's just finding 01:23:51.970 --> 01:24:01.180 that they're, they're bought into themselves 01:24:01.180 --> 01:24:04.619 like you've given them the ability to have some 01:24:04.619 --> 01:24:06.699 level of independence and that they're going 01:24:06.699 --> 01:24:10.180 to be okay and you know sometimes it doesn't 01:24:10.180 --> 01:24:12.439 work out i i had a really really close friend 01:24:12.439 --> 01:24:18.020 who took his life last year um and that shocked 01:24:18.020 --> 01:24:20.500 me because it's like we had normalized these 01:24:20.500 --> 01:24:23.039 conversations of suicide to the point where it's 01:24:23.039 --> 01:24:24.699 like dude just call me whatever come i don't 01:24:24.699 --> 01:24:27.640 give a fuck if you show up day of just come to 01:24:27.640 --> 01:24:29.880 the house and you'll be fine don't worry about 01:24:29.880 --> 01:24:34.100 anything whatever so that really rocked me um 01:24:34.100 --> 01:24:37.439 because we thought we had that open dialogue 01:24:37.439 --> 01:24:41.579 and it's like the successes i think is knowing 01:24:41.579 --> 01:24:45.800 that you can't you can't save everybody but as 01:24:45.800 --> 01:24:48.439 long as you're helping one person at a time um 01:24:48.439 --> 01:24:52.340 and and you see the difference of how it translates 01:24:52.340 --> 01:24:55.619 them and how it impacts their lives that's been 01:24:56.039 --> 01:24:57.939 a large success, all the personal stuff, man, 01:24:58.000 --> 01:25:00.539 like been awarded for certain that, that doesn't 01:25:00.539 --> 01:25:02.380 mean that doesn't mean shit for me. Cause it's 01:25:02.380 --> 01:25:06.079 not about, you know, the, the awards, you know, 01:25:06.079 --> 01:25:09.079 and the glory of it. Cause to me, it's like, 01:25:09.100 --> 01:25:12.260 I'd rather put myself out of business now and 01:25:12.260 --> 01:25:15.279 not have to worry about this shit so that we 01:25:15.279 --> 01:25:17.460 know that we're doing the right thing and it's 01:25:17.460 --> 01:25:19.539 being, you know, and it's effectively managed. 01:25:19.939 --> 01:25:24.720 Um, but I'm just happy that The people who we've 01:25:24.720 --> 01:25:27.300 been able to touch and the people who see our 01:25:27.300 --> 01:25:30.319 program, see what we're doing, knowing that we're 01:25:30.319 --> 01:25:31.979 not a one trick pony, knowing that it's like 01:25:31.979 --> 01:25:33.760 really it's your choice to be here because we 01:25:33.760 --> 01:25:36.000 don't owe anybody anything. Like the reason why 01:25:36.000 --> 01:25:38.399 you're coming to us is, you know, whether it's 01:25:38.399 --> 01:25:40.180 for a dog or whether it's for, you know, some 01:25:40.180 --> 01:25:41.760 of the other services that we offer, it's just 01:25:41.760 --> 01:25:43.739 a matter of you wanting to be in that headspace 01:25:43.739 --> 01:25:47.739 to heal and being open enough to receive those 01:25:47.739 --> 01:25:49.819 lessons of whatever you might be able to take 01:25:49.819 --> 01:25:51.859 away from that to implement and strategize into 01:25:51.859 --> 01:25:54.899 your life. so i think that's been that's probably 01:25:54.899 --> 01:25:58.359 that's that is the the probably the the the most 01:25:58.359 --> 01:26:03.260 gracious gift that i've been able to to value 01:26:03.260 --> 01:26:08.420 as you know proven performances like hey man 01:26:08.420 --> 01:26:13.380 i've worked with some bad dudes and they're good 01:26:13.380 --> 01:26:15.600 right now like they're they're they're in a position 01:26:15.600 --> 01:26:17.060 where it's like you don't have to worry about 01:26:17.060 --> 01:26:21.039 them or If you do, we have a tight network where 01:26:21.039 --> 01:26:23.560 it's, hey, man, I'm struggling. And it's just 01:26:23.560 --> 01:26:25.819 like, all right, well, what can we do? So I think 01:26:25.819 --> 01:26:29.119 that's probably the most glory that I can take 01:26:29.119 --> 01:26:32.260 away from any of that. Because it's a shitty 01:26:32.260 --> 01:26:33.939 thing, man. It's like you're constantly dealing 01:26:33.939 --> 01:26:39.279 with, you know. that space in your head where 01:26:39.279 --> 01:26:40.619 it's like, you're not good enough. You're not 01:26:40.619 --> 01:26:42.180 this, like, what the fuck am I doing doing this? 01:26:42.239 --> 01:26:44.479 Like, I need my own help. I like, you know what 01:26:44.479 --> 01:26:46.140 I mean? It's just like, it's, it's always a back 01:26:46.140 --> 01:26:47.920 and forth. It's always moving the goalposts, 01:26:47.920 --> 01:26:50.739 always trying to strive. Um, so I would just 01:26:50.739 --> 01:26:52.220 say that the people that we've been able to work 01:26:52.220 --> 01:26:53.800 with and the people who believe in our program 01:26:53.800 --> 01:26:56.140 and who understand it, who have reached out, 01:26:56.159 --> 01:26:58.920 would communicate, um, that's probably the base 01:26:58.920 --> 01:27:03.239 success. Beautiful. Well, where can people find 01:27:03.239 --> 01:27:05.600 it if they want to actually be part of the program 01:27:05.600 --> 01:27:08.239 or if they simply want to donate? Yeah, so if 01:27:08.239 --> 01:27:11.260 they want to find us, it's www .warriorschoice 01:27:11.260 --> 01:27:15.039 .org. You can find us on Instagram at Warriors 01:27:15.039 --> 01:27:19.699 Choice Foundation. Social media, whatever else, 01:27:19.720 --> 01:27:22.319 our app around Facebook is at Choice Warriors. 01:27:22.899 --> 01:27:27.220 We have an event coming up next weekend, which 01:27:27.220 --> 01:27:29.319 is where I think we were first supposed to link 01:27:29.319 --> 01:27:32.739 up with the CrossFit Seadog Summer Showdown, 01:27:32.880 --> 01:27:35.180 which is a fitness competition where this will 01:27:35.180 --> 01:27:39.729 be our third year. hosting the adaptive athlete 01:27:39.729 --> 01:27:42.090 division so it's one thing that we wanted to 01:27:42.090 --> 01:27:43.569 bring to this where it's like hey man we got 01:27:43.569 --> 01:27:45.210 dudes that have been blown up it's like no you 01:27:45.210 --> 01:27:47.909 can still compete you can still do this um where 01:27:47.909 --> 01:27:49.930 you know it's really about giving back to that 01:27:49.930 --> 01:27:53.770 to those individuals who you know hate to say 01:27:53.770 --> 01:27:56.590 it like they feel like they can't do that but 01:27:56.590 --> 01:27:58.949 it's like no you can let's let's go let's see 01:27:58.949 --> 01:28:04.239 you know every year same time but um Yeah, social 01:28:04.239 --> 01:28:07.100 media, Instagram, you can call us, reach out. 01:28:08.680 --> 01:28:11.060 And that's pretty much if you want to get involved 01:28:11.060 --> 01:28:14.300 with us, that's how you do it. Beautiful. Well, 01:28:14.380 --> 01:28:15.659 I want to throw some quick closing questions 01:28:15.659 --> 01:28:18.399 at you if you've got time. Absolutely. So the 01:28:18.399 --> 01:28:20.500 first one I'd love to ask, is there a book or 01:28:20.500 --> 01:28:22.779 are there books that you love to recommend? It 01:28:22.779 --> 01:28:25.119 can be related to our discussion today or completely 01:28:25.119 --> 01:28:28.560 unrelated. Yes. The Talent Code, I think it's 01:28:28.560 --> 01:28:34.920 by David Coyle. Um, tribe by Sebastian Younger. 01:28:36.539 --> 01:28:42.720 Um, I do like Jocko's book. Uh, let me see what 01:28:42.720 --> 01:28:45.819 that was. The extreme ownership, that one ownership. 01:28:46.159 --> 01:28:51.060 Yeah. Yeah. That one. Yeah. I think that, yeah, 01:28:51.100 --> 01:28:53.300 that would be, those would be my top right now. 01:28:54.199 --> 01:28:55.760 There's a lot of, there's a lot to take away 01:28:55.760 --> 01:28:58.680 from that. Absolutely. Well, what about films 01:28:58.680 --> 01:29:07.420 and documentaries? Films and documentaries. I 01:29:07.420 --> 01:29:11.100 think it's just find the voice that connects 01:29:11.100 --> 01:29:18.439 with you and listen to that. Was it Dr. Hubert? 01:29:19.020 --> 01:29:23.600 The dude that came from Cali? The Huberman? Huberman, 01:29:23.699 --> 01:29:28.079 yeah. I mean, to listen to him talk, it's great. 01:29:28.900 --> 01:29:31.380 Um, you know, find a podcast that, you know, 01:29:31.380 --> 01:29:33.979 that, that resonates, uh, around the same people 01:29:33.979 --> 01:29:36.800 in the same thought processes that you have and, 01:29:36.819 --> 01:29:39.300 and try to dive in and just, you know, continue 01:29:39.300 --> 01:29:43.859 to learn and teach yourself. Um, movies though, 01:29:43.920 --> 01:29:47.659 man, I love movies, but it's so hard to like, 01:29:47.779 --> 01:29:50.159 you know, be stunned theatrics. It's just like, 01:29:50.260 --> 01:29:55.100 um, yeah, I don't know. I'll have to get back 01:29:55.100 --> 01:29:58.649 to you on that one. I'll send them to you. Yeah, 01:29:58.689 --> 01:30:00.210 no problem at all. All right, well, the next 01:30:00.210 --> 01:30:02.090 question, is there a person that you recommend 01:30:02.090 --> 01:30:05.289 to come on this podcast as a guest to speak to 01:30:05.289 --> 01:30:07.510 the first responders, military, and associated 01:30:07.510 --> 01:30:10.390 professions of the world? Oh, 100%. I think Pat 01:30:10.390 --> 01:30:16.090 Burrows absolutely needs to get on. I think a 01:30:16.090 --> 01:30:17.909 buddy of mine, Tom Heaton. I think another buddy 01:30:17.909 --> 01:30:23.390 of mine, Andrew Arabito. I think Morgan Stahl. 01:30:24.109 --> 01:30:26.329 I'll definitely call out Morgan again in a heartbeat. 01:30:28.990 --> 01:30:33.430 And yeah, I can definitely send you out a list, 01:30:33.550 --> 01:30:36.029 man. There's, there's a, there's a bunch of good 01:30:36.029 --> 01:30:38.329 dudes that I've been able to surround myself 01:30:38.329 --> 01:30:43.449 with who can really kind of tell their story 01:30:43.449 --> 01:30:45.750 and, and, and give out some new light and hope 01:30:45.750 --> 01:30:48.229 is, you know, we're all going through some shit, 01:30:48.250 --> 01:30:49.489 man. It's just a matter of who resonates, who 01:30:49.489 --> 01:30:52.300 do you resonate with? A hundred percent. Yeah. 01:30:52.340 --> 01:30:54.300 And you hit on the word hope. That's it. That's 01:30:54.300 --> 01:30:56.300 the project I'm working. I'm turning my book 01:30:56.300 --> 01:30:58.779 into a show at the moment. And I say I'm at the 01:30:58.779 --> 01:31:00.659 moment I'm beginning the process, but it's going 01:31:00.659 --> 01:31:02.800 to happen. And that's just it. You know, I think 01:31:02.800 --> 01:31:06.359 this mental health story in some areas has become 01:31:06.359 --> 01:31:09.539 a very doom and gloom kind of portrayal. And 01:31:09.539 --> 01:31:11.760 it was stuck on the word stigma, which doesn't 01:31:11.760 --> 01:31:13.899 fucking mean anything. And I think what we need 01:31:13.899 --> 01:31:15.819 is the hope, the hope of post -traumatic growth, 01:31:16.000 --> 01:31:18.239 the hope of the version of you that's done the 01:31:18.239 --> 01:31:20.340 work and is now a beacon of light for others. 01:31:20.899 --> 01:31:23.340 Yeah. Cause you know, I think about it and it's 01:31:23.340 --> 01:31:27.100 like that, that led me to this, right? Like my, 01:31:27.199 --> 01:31:30.159 my traumatic experience of being on the battlefield, 01:31:30.260 --> 01:31:32.319 being shot at, being in a, in a really fucked 01:31:32.319 --> 01:31:36.840 up situation when it was all said and done led 01:31:36.840 --> 01:31:39.100 me to never want to be in a position where I 01:31:39.100 --> 01:31:41.720 couldn't help somebody or I couldn't perform. 01:31:42.939 --> 01:31:46.119 to give somebody the type of aid that they needed. 01:31:46.260 --> 01:31:48.939 And, you know, maybe that's my survivor's guilt 01:31:48.939 --> 01:31:53.939 of whatever. But for me, it was a reflection 01:31:53.939 --> 01:31:56.699 of I could still function. I could still do what 01:31:56.699 --> 01:31:59.460 I wanted. I was still very clear cognitively. 01:31:59.520 --> 01:32:02.659 Now, next step was, what could I do? Because 01:32:02.659 --> 01:32:05.220 I didn't have any medical training other than, 01:32:05.239 --> 01:32:06.979 hey, put a tourniquet on it, take your pill pack, 01:32:07.159 --> 01:32:10.279 and that's it. it's total different story when 01:32:10.279 --> 01:32:12.100 a dude needs a crike and this, and you're like, 01:32:12.159 --> 01:32:14.039 what the fuck do I do? I'm in the back, like, 01:32:14.060 --> 01:32:19.039 uh, keep the red shit in the body. Okay. You 01:32:19.039 --> 01:32:22.079 know? So I think it comes down to taking those, 01:32:22.140 --> 01:32:26.140 those moments that you think compartmentalize 01:32:26.140 --> 01:32:29.659 you or drowned you in finding the good in it 01:32:29.659 --> 01:32:32.000 and the lesson that was supposed to be taught 01:32:32.000 --> 01:32:35.720 and strategizing and how to build from that. 01:32:36.899 --> 01:32:39.510 Absolutely. All right. Well, the last question 01:32:39.510 --> 01:32:41.569 before we just kind of reiterate where to find 01:32:41.569 --> 01:32:45.590 you, what do you do to decompress? What do I 01:32:45.590 --> 01:32:48.470 do to decompress? I go out to the woods with 01:32:48.470 --> 01:32:51.850 my dog and do absolutely. I try to like get out 01:32:51.850 --> 01:32:54.510 of cell phone range. Like I try to like put my 01:32:54.510 --> 01:32:56.390 cell phone in the microwave and just go somewhere 01:32:56.390 --> 01:33:00.510 where like, dude, I just, whether it's fishing, 01:33:00.649 --> 01:33:03.579 whether it's, you know. Going up having breakfast 01:33:03.579 --> 01:33:05.699 with Pat and his family in the morning and just, 01:33:05.720 --> 01:33:08.140 you know, with my girlfriend and his family, 01:33:08.180 --> 01:33:12.920 it's just like one of those things that go out 01:33:12.920 --> 01:33:16.439 and explore new cuisines. And I just like to 01:33:16.439 --> 01:33:18.600 do a number of things kind of like just roll 01:33:18.600 --> 01:33:23.640 through it to find, to laugh, to cry. You know, 01:33:23.659 --> 01:33:25.340 it's one of those things that you just got to 01:33:25.340 --> 01:33:28.619 be in touch with yourself to know, hey. it's 01:33:28.619 --> 01:33:30.539 okay to break down once in a while and, and, 01:33:30.560 --> 01:33:33.020 and have that moment. And, you know, you're not 01:33:33.020 --> 01:33:34.720 a pussy for it. It's just a matter of like, dude, 01:33:34.800 --> 01:33:37.760 you know, watching a rom -com or watching some 01:33:37.760 --> 01:33:39.460 sport movie that you can resonate with. Like, 01:33:39.460 --> 01:33:41.180 Oh man, that's a tearjerker. That's fuck. All 01:33:41.180 --> 01:33:42.920 right. You know, I can see, look at the good 01:33:42.920 --> 01:33:46.600 in humanity, you know? So it's like, you know, 01:33:46.600 --> 01:33:49.600 for me, it's just a matter of trying to whatever 01:33:49.600 --> 01:33:53.659 way I can unplug and not, and just try to focus 01:33:53.659 --> 01:33:57.079 on myself, which is. a daunting task at times 01:33:57.079 --> 01:34:00.239 I think, but, um, I, uh, yeah, that's, that's 01:34:00.239 --> 01:34:02.779 pretty much it, man. Just travel and being around 01:34:02.779 --> 01:34:04.180 people that you care about and that you love, 01:34:04.260 --> 01:34:06.020 you know, surround yourself with, with quality, 01:34:06.079 --> 01:34:08.560 high quality people for high quality outcomes. 01:34:08.840 --> 01:34:13.699 Otherwise, you know, you're, you're square peg 01:34:13.699 --> 01:34:15.479 round hole. If it's not working, you're not going 01:34:15.479 --> 01:34:17.220 anywhere with it. Fuck you doing with it. Get 01:34:17.220 --> 01:34:20.760 rid of it. it's funny about the the stigma with 01:34:20.760 --> 01:34:23.159 crying like i've got go -to songs and films if 01:34:23.159 --> 01:34:25.539 i need to get some shit out that i'll put on 01:34:25.539 --> 01:34:28.939 but you think about you know obviously war But 01:34:28.939 --> 01:34:31.039 you think about sports, you know, whether they 01:34:31.039 --> 01:34:33.539 won, whether they lost, you know, the raw emotion 01:34:33.539 --> 01:34:35.939 that comes out then. But yet there's this bullshit 01:34:35.939 --> 01:34:39.159 facade like men don't cry, which I would argue 01:34:39.159 --> 01:34:41.479 came from the John Waynes and Schwarzeneggers 01:34:41.479 --> 01:34:43.680 who had never actually served in their life. 01:34:43.819 --> 01:34:45.880 You know, they're actors that, you know, and 01:34:45.880 --> 01:34:48.619 no disrespect to them, but they are not manly 01:34:48.619 --> 01:34:51.380 men at all. They are. portraying manly men in 01:34:51.380 --> 01:34:54.220 a terrible way so you know and we bought into 01:34:54.220 --> 01:34:56.380 that our generation totally bought into that 01:34:56.380 --> 01:34:59.260 kind of Hollywood facade of masculinity versus 01:34:59.260 --> 01:35:01.800 that you know you look at the real men of Easy 01:35:01.800 --> 01:35:04.180 Company talking on Band of Brothers they're in 01:35:04.180 --> 01:35:07.079 tears numerous times relaying that and that was 01:35:07.079 --> 01:35:10.359 70 plus years before so that's what a man is 01:35:10.359 --> 01:35:12.600 yeah I mean those dudes were built different 01:35:12.600 --> 01:35:15.680 too like that's a whole other fucking breed that 01:35:15.680 --> 01:35:18.140 was just like because I mean when I went to Normandy 01:35:18.140 --> 01:35:22.140 I was just like you did what like just thinking 01:35:22.140 --> 01:35:23.760 back of all like the movies that you've watched 01:35:23.760 --> 01:35:26.939 you're just like fuck that like no thank you 01:35:26.939 --> 01:35:30.819 yeah no gps no no you know overwatch none of 01:35:30.819 --> 01:35:34.720 that doors open go in and germans the fortified 01:35:34.720 --> 01:35:37.500 bunkers like to see the bunkers to like that's 01:35:37.500 --> 01:35:38.979 one of the things that one of my one of my favorite 01:35:38.979 --> 01:35:41.460 trips was being able to to go to normandy and 01:35:41.460 --> 01:35:44.960 look at some of the world like world war ii and 01:35:44.960 --> 01:35:47.199 then world war one when i went to bellwood um 01:35:48.039 --> 01:35:51.000 Or it was just like, it's unbelievable what these 01:35:51.000 --> 01:35:55.680 men had gone through to, to get us to the point 01:35:55.680 --> 01:35:59.000 of where we are today and to see the types of 01:35:59.000 --> 01:36:01.039 infrastructure, see how fast it was built, to 01:36:01.039 --> 01:36:03.760 see all the engineering that went into it. And 01:36:03.760 --> 01:36:07.100 you're just like, wait, we just, just bodies 01:36:07.100 --> 01:36:10.699 and droves just came into swarm and overwhelm. 01:36:10.970 --> 01:36:12.869 And, and to get us to this point, it's just, 01:36:12.909 --> 01:36:16.329 it's, it's remarkable to just the tenacity of, 01:36:16.369 --> 01:36:19.649 of who we are as humans to, to overcome that 01:36:19.649 --> 01:36:22.810 for a belief and just, yeah, a moral. Yeah. So 01:36:22.810 --> 01:36:25.470 it's just like, wow. It's interesting because 01:36:25.470 --> 01:36:27.810 I've had so many conversations now and either 01:36:27.810 --> 01:36:31.569 if it's an older guest, dad, but more often granddad. 01:36:31.979 --> 01:36:34.699 was in the war and we romanticize about that 01:36:34.699 --> 01:36:37.479 generation what they did was incredible but we 01:36:37.479 --> 01:36:39.420 romanticize and then they just came back and 01:36:39.420 --> 01:36:40.840 they rolled up their sleeves and they went to 01:36:40.840 --> 01:36:43.779 work and no they were a fucking mess listen to 01:36:43.779 --> 01:36:46.539 what granddad was actually like that absolutely 01:36:46.539 --> 01:36:48.659 took a toll and that environment they weren't 01:36:48.659 --> 01:36:51.500 able to talk about it like we do today so we 01:36:51.500 --> 01:36:56.279 owe it to that generation to heal ourselves because 01:36:56.279 --> 01:36:57.760 i was just having a conversation with someone 01:36:57.760 --> 01:37:01.260 right before you and i sat down what i see now 01:37:01.930 --> 01:37:03.890 in a lot of the things that are wrong with our 01:37:03.890 --> 01:37:07.949 society, is broken people at the helm of whether 01:37:07.949 --> 01:37:10.909 it's a presidential seat that they're occupying, 01:37:10.949 --> 01:37:13.569 whether it's the head of Purdue Pharma or William 01:37:13.569 --> 01:37:16.689 Morris Tobacco, where their decisions are costing, 01:37:16.970 --> 01:37:19.909 in some cases, hundreds of thousands of American 01:37:19.909 --> 01:37:23.149 lives, and they sleep like a baby at night. So 01:37:23.149 --> 01:37:26.250 left unaddressed, the trauma from World War II 01:37:26.250 --> 01:37:30.060 and beyond is still rippling today. And so if 01:37:30.060 --> 01:37:31.800 we really want to honor the men and women of 01:37:31.800 --> 01:37:35.319 the World War II generation, we bind back together 01:37:35.319 --> 01:37:37.579 and we start healing our communities. Because 01:37:37.579 --> 01:37:41.079 I see the opposite as a real kind of push. And 01:37:41.079 --> 01:37:43.859 that's such a spit in the face for the men and 01:37:43.859 --> 01:37:45.399 women that fought for the liberty in the first 01:37:45.399 --> 01:37:49.460 place. Yep. Yeah, it's wild, man. If you've not 01:37:49.460 --> 01:37:51.260 been to Normandy, I recommend it. And any of 01:37:51.260 --> 01:37:57.770 the viewers who haven't, go. It's a vibe. to 01:37:57.770 --> 01:38:00.090 witness that and to and to just see the remnants 01:38:00.090 --> 01:38:03.329 of what it was it's just like it's it puts a 01:38:03.329 --> 01:38:05.069 whole new like it's like life's not that bad 01:38:05.069 --> 01:38:08.090 right now you know with with all that's happening 01:38:08.090 --> 01:38:09.729 with all they're finding right now with you know 01:38:09.729 --> 01:38:11.210 not having to get too political but it's just 01:38:11.210 --> 01:38:13.470 it's astounding to see like it's gone that long 01:38:13.470 --> 01:38:16.250 for this country to be this much in debt and 01:38:16.250 --> 01:38:21.430 all this fucking chaos of you know what so yeah 01:38:21.430 --> 01:38:26.199 yeah I think, again, if we refine that community 01:38:26.199 --> 01:38:28.600 that they had back then, where it was truly a 01:38:28.600 --> 01:38:31.399 selfless service mentality, I think we truly 01:38:31.399 --> 01:38:33.720 could make America great again. But it's not 01:38:33.720 --> 01:38:36.260 going to be from a politician. I tell you that 01:38:36.260 --> 01:38:38.960 right now. It's going to be from us. Yeah. No, 01:38:39.000 --> 01:38:40.739 absolutely. As a community, being able to bind 01:38:40.739 --> 01:38:43.300 together and understand that there's a better 01:38:43.300 --> 01:38:48.130 alternative way to see things done. look at the 01:38:48.130 --> 01:38:51.229 numbers based on suicide deaths for first responders 01:38:51.229 --> 01:38:55.329 and how that gets reported. How many reports 01:38:55.329 --> 01:38:57.649 have you been kicked back with over the years 01:38:57.649 --> 01:39:00.430 where, oh, this is off, this is wrong, this is 01:39:00.430 --> 01:39:02.609 wrong, but okay, let's go find out how many firefighters 01:39:02.609 --> 01:39:04.590 just killed themselves. What are the reports 01:39:04.590 --> 01:39:06.630 and statistical values for us to be able to look 01:39:06.630 --> 01:39:09.750 at in real time, not wait four years later to 01:39:09.750 --> 01:39:11.210 then be like, oh, maybe we got to do something 01:39:11.210 --> 01:39:14.699 about it. It's like, okay. How about after year 01:39:14.699 --> 01:39:17.220 one, we come to the table and look at it. Okay, 01:39:17.319 --> 01:39:19.020 here's where we need to change. These are the 01:39:19.020 --> 01:39:20.680 different programs that we can explore and look 01:39:20.680 --> 01:39:23.000 at. Even just having a dog in the fire station 01:39:23.000 --> 01:39:26.340 after a significant event might be able to do 01:39:26.340 --> 01:39:28.399 something. It doesn't cost anybody anything other 01:39:28.399 --> 01:39:30.920 than the fucking dog and whoever's handler is 01:39:30.920 --> 01:39:35.140 to bring it in. So it's like even just changing 01:39:35.140 --> 01:39:37.479 up one thing, but dude, some of these guys are 01:39:37.479 --> 01:39:41.260 just stuck and they're in their own way of actually 01:39:41.260 --> 01:39:43.489 making real changes. because they don't want 01:39:43.489 --> 01:39:45.489 to piss off the mayor or they like, it's whatever. 01:39:46.250 --> 01:39:49.569 Yeah. It's a cycle. Yeah. It's going to change 01:39:49.569 --> 01:39:51.710 though. It is. I mean, I think firstly, the work 01:39:51.710 --> 01:39:53.710 week conversation is, is a revolution that's 01:39:53.710 --> 01:39:56.250 begun. Um, the thing that I'm working on this 01:39:56.250 --> 01:39:59.350 show, I hope will, you know, put our story front 01:39:59.350 --> 01:40:01.350 and center in every living room and cell phone. 01:40:01.850 --> 01:40:04.069 in the states at least if not internationally 01:40:04.069 --> 01:40:06.630 and then people are going to ask a lot of questions 01:40:06.630 --> 01:40:08.909 wait a second i thought that you know the firefighting 01:40:08.909 --> 01:40:10.670 you know it was easy and they just sat around 01:40:10.670 --> 01:40:13.869 and you know dalmatian and and people are going 01:40:13.869 --> 01:40:15.829 to realize it's not the case and then hopefully 01:40:15.829 --> 01:40:18.449 like i said that hope conversation too like if 01:40:18.449 --> 01:40:20.350 you know whoever's out there whatever level of 01:40:20.350 --> 01:40:23.210 struggle you're at that there are solutions and 01:40:23.210 --> 01:40:26.489 here they are. So, yeah. But I mean, everyone 01:40:26.489 --> 01:40:28.770 that's part of this puzzle is doing this for 01:40:28.770 --> 01:40:32.029 the right reason, not for their own career, you 01:40:32.029 --> 01:40:35.310 know, or personal gain. I think that's going 01:40:35.310 --> 01:40:37.189 to be the next renaissance, the renaissance of 01:40:37.189 --> 01:40:40.449 kindness and compassion. As I see the fractured, 01:40:40.470 --> 01:40:42.930 you know, the Jenga blocks starting to wobble 01:40:42.930 --> 01:40:46.289 in this whole self -serving monopoly, you know, 01:40:46.329 --> 01:40:50.340 I'm the most important person in the world. bullshit 01:40:50.340 --> 01:40:52.439 that to me is the opposite of what we just said 01:40:52.439 --> 01:40:54.979 that the world war ii generation so i'm looking 01:40:54.979 --> 01:40:56.819 forward to seeing kindness and compassion you 01:40:56.819 --> 01:40:59.859 finally win again yeah yeah it's gonna be nice 01:40:59.859 --> 01:41:04.479 all right well then just for everyone to reiterate 01:41:04.479 --> 01:41:07.140 where are the best places to find the non -profit 01:41:07.140 --> 01:41:09.119 and also if they want to reach out to you personally 01:41:09.119 --> 01:41:12.779 yeah best place to find us is warriorschoice 01:41:12.779 --> 01:41:16.729 .org or you can find us on social media at Warriors 01:41:16.729 --> 01:41:19.050 Choice Foundation or at Choice Warriors between 01:41:19.050 --> 01:41:22.029 X and between Facebook. And then personally, 01:41:22.050 --> 01:41:25.090 if you want to reach out to me, a .longo at warriorschoice 01:41:25.090 --> 01:41:27.010 .org is probably the best way to get in touch 01:41:27.010 --> 01:41:30.010 with me. I generally don't answer numbers that 01:41:30.010 --> 01:41:33.100 I don't know. So if anything. Shoot me an email. 01:41:33.840 --> 01:41:37.460 I'm pretty responsive at that point. Now I'm 01:41:37.460 --> 01:41:39.779 stuck on a computer most days, so I don't really 01:41:39.779 --> 01:41:41.439 get to do the fun shit anymore. Now it's more 01:41:41.439 --> 01:41:43.619 management, delegation, all that other stuff. 01:41:43.859 --> 01:41:46.380 But yeah, reach out to me anytime. Anybody who's 01:41:46.380 --> 01:41:48.479 struggling, just go to our website, put in an 01:41:48.479 --> 01:41:51.779 app, put in a request, and we'll be in touch. 01:41:51.819 --> 01:41:53.539 We have a phone number there. We're actually 01:41:53.539 --> 01:41:55.739 going to be relaunching the website. So there'll 01:41:55.739 --> 01:41:58.739 be more ways of being able to find resources 01:41:58.739 --> 01:42:00.859 and get plugged into where you got to get plugged 01:42:00.859 --> 01:42:04.039 into. Beautiful. Well, I want to say thank you, 01:42:04.039 --> 01:42:07.600 firstly, for your vulnerable, courageous storytelling 01:42:07.600 --> 01:42:10.319 and being vulnerable yourself. And then like 01:42:10.319 --> 01:42:13.560 so many people, having served and worn multiple 01:42:13.560 --> 01:42:16.520 uniforms, still wanting to continue to serve. 01:42:16.579 --> 01:42:18.399 I think even in the transition conversation, 01:42:19.180 --> 01:42:22.060 the people who ultimately do well, I think, realize 01:42:22.060 --> 01:42:24.880 that you were always a selfless servant, that 01:42:24.880 --> 01:42:27.079 you always wanted to help people. And the military 01:42:27.079 --> 01:42:30.409 costume or the fire costume was just that. It 01:42:30.409 --> 01:42:32.170 was a costume. It was clothing that you wore 01:42:32.170 --> 01:42:35.430 at that period. But now, you know, so many people 01:42:35.430 --> 01:42:37.569 that leave, you know, the first responder professions 01:42:37.569 --> 01:42:39.670 or the military and they end up doing what you're 01:42:39.670 --> 01:42:41.829 doing, that they still serve in whatever capacity. 01:42:41.949 --> 01:42:44.850 So I want to thank you so much for everything 01:42:44.850 --> 01:42:46.930 that you're doing for our community and the military 01:42:46.930 --> 01:42:49.590 community. And also for being so generous with 01:42:49.590 --> 01:42:51.229 your time and coming on the Behind the Shield 01:42:51.229 --> 01:42:53.909 podcast today. I appreciate it. Thanks for having 01:42:53.909 --> 01:42:56.050 me on. Thank you. Thanks, Pat.