1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,560 I'm extremely excited to announce a brand new sponsor for the Behind the Shield podcast, 2 00:00:04,560 --> 00:00:07,480 and that is Rescue 1 CBD. 3 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:10,880 For any of you who have listened to this podcast for the last eight years, you will have heard 4 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:17,320 my own personal journey from using prescription pills after a knee surgery to finding CBD 5 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,200 and having incredible success with that. 6 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:26,160 I then saw my son's wheezing diminish, my wife's anxiety, and so many more kind of success 7 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:27,260 stories. 8 00:00:27,260 --> 00:00:32,400 The problem is though, I've also seen the stigma and misunderstanding about this incredibly 9 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:34,580 powerful plant medicine. 10 00:00:34,580 --> 00:00:39,460 When it comes to workplace drug testing, it's THC that they are looking for. 11 00:00:39,460 --> 00:00:45,080 The 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00:02:02,760 That one's called out of service. 32 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:07,260 And then topical CBD, obviously for aches and pains on the outside. 33 00:02:07,260 --> 00:02:11,320 Now on top of all that, Rescue One is offering you, the listener of the Behind the Shield 34 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:18,160 podcast, 15% off your order if you use the code BTS, as in behind the shield. 35 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:20,040 And you can find all of their products. 36 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:25,480 You can find all of the testing and understand why this truly is a product that you can trust 37 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:29,480 by going to rescue1cbd.com. 38 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:34,120 And you can listen to my conversation with John on episode 1011 of the Behind the Shield 39 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:36,320 podcast. 40 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:40,720 This episode is sponsored by TeamBuildr, yet another company that's doing great things 41 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:43,400 for the first responder community. 42 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:48,660 As a strength and conditioning coach myself, who also trains tactical athletes, dissemination 43 00:02:48,660 --> 00:02:52,440 of wellness information is one of the biggest challenges. 44 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:57,360 Now TeamBuildr is the premier strength and conditioning software for tactical athletes. 45 00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:00,360 And there are several features that really impress me. 46 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:05,240 Firstly, there is a full exercise library, so you, the personal trainer, does not have 47 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:08,000 to create that within your own department. 48 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:13,320 Secondly, you can send out programming, but also individualize, which I love. 49 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:15,640 So you blanket program for everyone. 50 00:03:15,640 --> 00:03:21,160 Now you can tweak based on someone's injury, someone's need to maybe drop some body composition 51 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:25,840 rather than having to write a program for every single person on their own. 52 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:30,360 TeamBuildr also allows you to build custom questionnaires to collate health and wellness 53 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:31,360 data. 54 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:33,240 It integrates with wearables. 55 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,960 And I think one of the most important things is obviously it tracks. 56 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:43,360 To me, it's imperative that we as a profession start tracking our people from day one and 57 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,760 then over the full span of their career. 58 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:52,200 Therefore catching potential wellness issues and injuries before they happen. 59 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:56,080 Now if you want to try Team Builder, they are offering you, the audience of the Behind 60 00:03:56,080 --> 00:04:02,720 the Shield podcast, a free 14 day trial to experience all of the features. 61 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:08,480 And if you want to take a deeper dive into Team Builder, listen to episode 1032 with 62 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:12,520 Melissa Mercado or go to teambuilder.com. 63 00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:15,560 And I'll spell that to you because it's not as you think. 64 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:20,920 T-E-A-M-B-U-I-L-D-R.com. 65 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:22,360 Welcome to the Behind the Shield podcast. 66 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:26,000 As always, my name is James Gearing and this week it is my absolute honor to welcome back 67 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:32,520 onto the show Smokejumper and innovator, Jason Ramos. 68 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:37,640 Now Jason first came on the show on episode 219 and I highly recommend that you listen 69 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:43,320 to his story, the creation of his book and so much more on that episode. 70 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:49,240 This time we sat down on the wake of the California fires and not only were deadly but devastated 71 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:52,280 neighborhoods and people lost everything. 72 00:04:52,280 --> 00:04:57,400 So I wanted to get a respected voice from the wildland community to discuss the fires 73 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:02,440 and talk about preventative elements that we can apply and hopefully avoid the next 74 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:03,800 tragedy. 75 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:09,280 So we discuss a host of topics from some of the incredible technological innovation that's 76 00:05:09,280 --> 00:05:14,800 available, some of the ancient methods that they're finding working very well, the issue 77 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:21,840 with the water supply, sheltering in place, climate change and so much more. 78 00:05:21,840 --> 00:05:27,140 Now before we get to this incredible conversation as I say every week, please just take a moment. 79 00:05:27,140 --> 00:05:32,160 Go to whichever app you listen to this on, subscribe to the show, leave feedback and 80 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:34,280 leave a rating. 81 00:05:34,280 --> 00:05:39,520 Every single five star rating truly does elevate this podcast therefore making it easier for 82 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:46,680 others to find and this is a free library of over 1000 episodes now. 83 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:52,320 So all I ask in return is that you help share these incredible men and women stories so 84 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:57,720 I can get them to every single person on planet earth who needs to hear them. 85 00:05:57,720 --> 00:06:02,120 And as one side note I was sick as a dog when I did this interview so you will hear a massive 86 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:06,520 difference in my voice and I apologize for any sniffing or coughing that I wasn't able 87 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:08,120 to delete. 88 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:13,640 So with that being said, I welcome back onto the show Jason Ramos. 89 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:34,080 Enjoy. 90 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:37,680 Well Jason, I want to start by saying welcome back to the show. 91 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:43,280 You are my guest on episode 219 and since we're up past a thousand now that would suggest 92 00:06:43,280 --> 00:06:45,480 that was probably about six years ago. 93 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:49,680 So it's been a long time coming that we had the second conversation so welcome back. 94 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:51,040 Yeah, it's an honor. 95 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:54,440 It's always good to hear you, see you. 96 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:55,760 It's awesome. 97 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:59,240 So we're going to jump into several topics. 98 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:03,640 Obviously the world of wildland firefighting has become front and center since the tragedies 99 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:05,760 in California. 100 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:09,880 Before we do though, can you lead me through, you know, we left off where you were about 101 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:10,880 six years ago. 102 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:15,960 What have the last five or six years been like for you as far as career and just kind 103 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:17,640 of personal journey? 104 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:21,040 Well, that's crazy, right? 105 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:22,880 I'm still in a roller coaster. 106 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:27,980 Since the book came out 2015, it's been a ride. 107 00:07:27,980 --> 00:07:30,080 It still is. 108 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,400 And what's cool, I'm still able to do something, right? 109 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:38,160 I'm not the old firefighter, put him in the barn and shoot him, at least not yet. 110 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,800 So I'm in the, I do search and rescue stuff. 111 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:43,600 I'm still consulting on bigger levels. 112 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:49,160 I was honored to consult for the president's PCAST team, an outgoing president. 113 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:55,480 The list just goes on, just keeps stacking, which is a huge honor, right, as my dad taught 114 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:56,480 me. 115 00:07:56,480 --> 00:08:02,260 And if you knock on the door and you kick on the door, someone will answer, right? 116 00:08:02,260 --> 00:08:07,120 So I stick to that recipe and it's been crazy. 117 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:08,440 I do a lot of drone stuff now. 118 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:14,360 So I'm on the FAA safety team. 119 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:17,120 Everything to do with flying unmanned aircraft, which I did as a hobby. 120 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:21,560 Now I'm doing it, I'm getting paid for it, which is quite hard work. 121 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:22,560 And some of it's volunteer. 122 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:25,960 So I still do a lot of stuff as a volunteer as firefighters, right? 123 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,840 We do a lot of stuff that you don't get paid for. 124 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:30,840 That's how it goes. 125 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:34,440 So if you don't like it, hey, go somewhere else. 126 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:40,160 So a lot of interesting things and every day is something different. 127 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:41,160 It keeps me moving. 128 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:46,720 Well, we are straddling presidencies as we have this conversation. 129 00:08:46,720 --> 00:08:52,920 What were the good things that you were able to help put in place under the last administration? 130 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:58,800 And then what are you hoping that we can transition to with this one? 131 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:04,640 It's the trillion dollar question and answer there. 132 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:11,800 The outgoing, it was a huge honor to be part of the, it's a wild land report for the president 133 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:13,160 right at that time. 134 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:15,080 It's by the PCAST team for the president. 135 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:20,120 It's all their PhDs and folks very smarter than me, a lot smarter than me. 136 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:26,520 And to see the report was cool, but still not listening to some of the pieces. 137 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,040 And what's hard about that, when they do in a report like that, they got to understand 138 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:34,560 that a lot of people they need to speak to, they can't talk to you because the government 139 00:09:34,560 --> 00:09:36,800 won't let them talk. 140 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:38,080 That's the sad part. 141 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:39,080 In what way? 142 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:42,280 What's preventing the conversation? 143 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:46,920 So you have the ethics right under the, whether it's the Fed firefighters, I'll say at the 144 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:48,400 Forest Service, I don't work for him anymore. 145 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:53,680 It was an order to work for him, but the Forest Service had a lot of red tape. 146 00:09:53,680 --> 00:09:58,040 We're not talking red tape, we're talking red barricades of things you can say, what 147 00:09:58,040 --> 00:09:59,800 you can't say. 148 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:03,200 And I got very proficient at what I could say. 149 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,320 They tried to determine my position for writing a book. 150 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,680 I was able to win that and not get terminated for writing a book because I didn't do anything 151 00:10:09,680 --> 00:10:10,680 wrong. 152 00:10:10,680 --> 00:10:15,960 So there's firefighters out that just act like if you were an employee, you were out 153 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:21,120 there speaking and you hit national news, you might not have a job tomorrow if you went 154 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:29,200 viral because that chief, that chain of command, the chief as it goes up, it gets to DC. 155 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:32,120 You're probably, if you don't have the permission, you're not going to be able to talk. 156 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:36,100 And what's interesting about the, when I was with the Forest Service, they always would 157 00:10:36,100 --> 00:10:40,120 put a PIO, public information officer, attached to you. 158 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:43,560 And there was times I was very lucky, I was trusted to say the right things, which is 159 00:10:43,560 --> 00:10:44,560 a huge honor. 160 00:10:44,560 --> 00:10:45,560 They trusted me. 161 00:10:45,560 --> 00:10:49,440 But I've watched other employees, they're like, no, we're going to attach a PIO to 162 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:53,160 you and then that person can't speak freely. 163 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:55,240 The PIO is speaking for you. 164 00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:57,520 It's like, well, that's not right. 165 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:03,080 So that's, when that report came out, it was, there was a lot of tech in there, which 166 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:08,920 is great, but as true boots on the ground firefighters, that kind of tech doesn't put 167 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:10,320 out fires. 168 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:13,540 Fires as a chemical reaction is fuel, heat, and oxygen. 169 00:11:13,540 --> 00:11:15,800 That is it. 170 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:24,200 Still little green men visit us from another planet and change our physics and our rules. 171 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:27,040 That's something different, but right now it's fuel, heat, and oxygen. 172 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:34,160 If you give me satellites and all this, I call it fluff, that doesn't put the fire out. 173 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:40,280 I need to suffocate it, take the fuel away, or cool it down. 174 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,680 Just like a human being or chemical reaction. 175 00:11:42,680 --> 00:11:48,720 If I take food away from you, I make you cold, I suffocate you, you die. 176 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:49,960 Period. 177 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:52,720 So that's what I was trying to get to that PCAST team. 178 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:53,720 And the meeting was over 90 minutes. 179 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:54,720 I was doing something right. 180 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:55,720 It wasn't 90 seconds. 181 00:11:55,720 --> 00:12:01,200 Usually when you get a meeting with a mayor or a governor or something, it's like, 90 182 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:02,200 seconds, go. 183 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:03,200 Right? 184 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:09,560 I can't even go to the bathroom in 90 seconds nowadays. 185 00:12:09,560 --> 00:12:13,800 So long story short, I was proud to be in the report, but it's like, no, that's not 186 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:14,800 what I want. 187 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:15,800 And it's not just me. 188 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,600 But it's like, why are they not listening? 189 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:24,520 And that's been my biggest challenge since I was in the agency, the Forest Service, until 190 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,880 now I'm out of it and I can speak more freely. 191 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:30,020 How do you get the right folks to listen? 192 00:12:30,020 --> 00:12:33,760 Because you have a lot of fire chiefs, a lot of high brass. 193 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:35,200 Those are the folks that get consulted. 194 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,480 And I've come up with some simple terms. 195 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:41,760 I say, look at their resume, those folks making the decisions. 196 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:47,600 If they're making wildland fire decisions and they've never been on a hand crew, heli-tech 197 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:58,040 crew, wildland engine type six crew or type one, smoke jumper, hot shot, how are they 198 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:02,320 going to lead their folks for those kind of decisions? 199 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:03,320 And that's what we've seen. 200 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:04,320 I've done my own research. 201 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:08,720 I'm a research company and you pick and you look under here, you look under there. 202 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:12,560 It's like, well, that's the wrong person for that dual, for that job. 203 00:13:12,560 --> 00:13:15,880 So that is the biggest thing I've seen in the last few years. 204 00:13:15,880 --> 00:13:23,720 We have folks in the wrong position making the wrong decisions and not getting the support. 205 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:27,360 That reminds me when I worked for Anaheim and we were kind of a wildland interface, 206 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,840 the actual city, and then we had crews that went off and deployed. 207 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:37,880 But I was a tiller man on a truck, so I was ultimately staying in the city. 208 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:42,040 Just spending that time that I did in the trainings that we had, the progressive hose 209 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:46,440 lines, cutting line, which was a very, very short portion of it because we're not probably 210 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:48,660 going to be cutting line. 211 00:13:48,660 --> 00:13:53,500 You just see how it's a completely different skill set, understanding the weather and topography. 212 00:13:53,500 --> 00:13:55,880 That's a whole other job description. 213 00:13:55,880 --> 00:14:01,080 So I can't imagine being from the municipal side and being in charge of the wildland side, 214 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:06,300 just as a basal firefighter, you can see immediately the room for errors if you haven't actually 215 00:14:06,300 --> 00:14:08,680 been in those positions yourself. 216 00:14:08,680 --> 00:14:09,680 Correct. 217 00:14:09,680 --> 00:14:12,960 And it's one of the reasons I wanted to become a smokejumper. 218 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:16,640 I started at the bottom as a volunteer, which was amazing. 219 00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:20,440 I still consider myself a rookie and a volunteer. 220 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:25,800 Got to ride tailboard for basically a little over a year, almost two years, and move your 221 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:26,800 way up. 222 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:28,680 Now you can get to be the cab man. 223 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:32,880 Had to get the engineer not lost or the captain not lost to the fire. 224 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:35,320 And then I moved on to rescue squad operator. 225 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:41,240 And then I went to the feds and you see those ranks and it's like, whoa, those guys know 226 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:42,240 how to fight fire. 227 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:45,960 It's not just a shovel digging dirt. 228 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:48,960 There's a science to that. 229 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:50,600 You don't get that till years and years later. 230 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:55,240 I'm still learning, but I've spent a lot of time from ground zero, from piling sticks 231 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:58,360 for fire prevention to control burns. 232 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:03,520 So I've been stationed at all those little pieces. 233 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:09,080 And again, you have high brass out there that we know they don't know what that means. 234 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:10,460 They've never done it. 235 00:15:10,460 --> 00:15:15,840 So how do you give that to your battalion chiefs and your division chiefs and your captains, 236 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:17,800 your engineers, your lieutenants? 237 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:20,480 It's not going to work. 238 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:21,960 And that's what's exactly happened. 239 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:23,040 That's what's supposed to happen. 240 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:24,040 It's not working. 241 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:25,040 Yeah. 242 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:26,400 And I'm trying to change that. 243 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:29,920 And I remember one of the comments, I won't say who was, but they said, Mr. Ramos, we 244 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:32,240 can't fire people. 245 00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:34,000 And I laughed a little bit. 246 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,080 I said, I didn't say fire people. 247 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:41,720 I said, re-educate them or remove them from their position and put them somewhere else. 248 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:43,440 Put them where they're good at. 249 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:47,320 It's like taking, again, Willy Wonka and say, Willy Wonka, we're going to come over. 250 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:48,320 You're making pizza. 251 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:51,560 He doesn't make pizza. 252 00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:53,000 Makes candy. 253 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:59,080 So it's very interesting to still see this today, even the past of Santa Ana event that 254 00:15:59,080 --> 00:16:01,080 we had. 255 00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:04,520 I just, I pull my hair. 256 00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:06,680 I pull my, that's why I got short-cut hair, right? 257 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:08,400 I'm not losing my hair. 258 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:09,880 I just pull it out. 259 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:15,440 And it's such a bummer that being honored to be a smokejumper for those many years in 260 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:22,640 Hell Attack and able to jump out of aircrafts on very extreme fires and be able to put them 261 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,600 out with our recipe, it works. 262 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:30,920 And to do prescribed fires in areas with fire goats, that was probably one of my funnest 263 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:33,120 times that was in my off season. 264 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:37,560 I got to work multiple months working with fire goats. 265 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:39,580 Fire goats, exactly how it sounds. 266 00:16:39,580 --> 00:16:44,800 You put them in an area for a couple of weeks and they will eat everything in sight. 267 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:45,960 They'll eat everything in sight. 268 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:50,760 If you stand there long enough, you're going to be in your underwear. 269 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:58,120 They're amazing and I got to do hard work with, there were some days we had 200 head, 270 00:16:58,120 --> 00:16:59,640 400 head. 271 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:03,240 It's insane of what part of the tool. 272 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:04,980 It's not the answer to everything. 273 00:17:04,980 --> 00:17:09,520 But if you stick fire goats in a Santa Ana corridor, which I call it right, an area that 274 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:15,480 you know the Santa Ana's are going to be back and you got Chaparral, all these different 275 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:21,360 types of one hour, 10 hour fuels, you start breaking those little pieces. 276 00:17:21,360 --> 00:17:23,040 No fuel, no fire. 277 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:27,760 I'm not saying erase everything, but less fuel, less fire. 278 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:31,000 It's a simple, Mother Nature has given us the tools. 279 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:32,840 We're not using them. 280 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:38,600 It's amazing how when we have these modern day technological problems, more often than 281 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:41,440 not the answer is already there in history. 282 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:46,400 For example, look at us now, we're realizing, oh, if you put chemicals and hormones and 283 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,760 antibiotics in your food, it causes cancer. 284 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:56,000 But if you don't do that and you grow it holistically and you move and you get sunshine and you ground, 285 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,200 then you're a healthier person. 286 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:00,200 I remember seeing fire goats for the first time. 287 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:02,440 I think it was Portugal was using them. 288 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:07,920 So do you know the kind of origin story from the US of when that idea was brought here? 289 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:12,640 Because to me, it just seems like a full circle to probably what they've done for millennia 290 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,960 in human history. 291 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:23,400 I first experienced fire goats and grazing sheep, that kind of stuff. 292 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:24,960 I was a teenager still because I know it. 293 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:32,400 I can actually tell you where I was standing, Harvest Way in Riverside County, looking at 294 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:33,960 them running the fields. 295 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:42,400 That came to fire in 1989, so we're talking 86, 87. 296 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:45,360 And his little trailer caught on fire. 297 00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:46,360 And right, caught on fire. 298 00:18:46,360 --> 00:18:47,360 And guess what? 299 00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:52,400 It didn't go anywhere because the sheep and the goats ate everything around it. 300 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:58,400 And years later in my book, you see that fire that was the same area the goats and the sheep 301 00:18:58,400 --> 00:19:00,600 didn't get to. 302 00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:04,840 It's just a small piece of the solution. 303 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:16,000 But if everyone tends to their backyard and does what they need to do, you will have some 304 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:18,080 fire prone areas. 305 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:19,080 It's so simple. 306 00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:20,840 And I told that to the presence team. 307 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:26,160 I said, we could start right now, two minutes from now. 308 00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:28,160 Is it going to be the full solution? 309 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:29,320 No. 310 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:32,800 Do you have to come up with more money and do this? 311 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:33,800 Not really. 312 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:35,140 It's already in place. 313 00:19:35,140 --> 00:19:36,400 We have fire prevention officers. 314 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:37,400 We have all these things. 315 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:44,960 So that was my first experience being a teenager on a skateboard going, whoa, what are they 316 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:45,960 doing? 317 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:55,880 And then years later, almost 15, whatever, years later, or 10 years later, came home 318 00:19:55,880 --> 00:20:03,080 and see the area that we lived in, they hired this shepherd, this person that shepherded 319 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:05,600 these goats to eat all the fuels. 320 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:06,600 And I was a firefighter. 321 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:07,600 I'm like, whoa. 322 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,560 So I went and talked to him, met the owner, found out it was a smoke chumper. 323 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:12,120 He says, hey, you want to work? 324 00:20:12,120 --> 00:20:13,120 I said, yeah. 325 00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:14,120 It was free. 326 00:20:14,120 --> 00:20:16,920 I said, you feed me, I'll work for you. 327 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:18,640 And he fed me well. 328 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:30,120 So I spent weeks tending to some preemies a little bit, sick goats, giving them the 329 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:31,120 shots. 330 00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:32,120 I mean, hard work. 331 00:20:32,120 --> 00:20:36,080 Some of the hardest work I've ever done. 332 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:37,080 There is no breaks. 333 00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:38,080 There's no vacation. 334 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:39,280 There's no I'm sick. 335 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:40,280 There's no. 336 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:41,280 Right? 337 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:45,480 He said, Jason, I'd like to give you a couple head of goats you can run on yourself. 338 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,020 You got your van already? 339 00:20:47,020 --> 00:20:48,020 You're like plug and play. 340 00:20:48,020 --> 00:20:54,920 You're like, oh, you know, back at that time, I was chasing waves, spearfishing. 341 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:57,200 And that was my thing. 342 00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:01,480 It's like, I don't think I want to say can I take the goats to Mexico with me? 343 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:04,680 He's like, no, got to stay here. 344 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,880 So that was my first experience. 345 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:13,720 But that is part of a solution in some areas that are low impact. 346 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,280 And the reward and the outcome in a couple of weeks. 347 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:18,680 There's nothing left. 348 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:21,060 There's nothing left. 349 00:21:21,060 --> 00:21:23,480 It's so clever and it's so simple. 350 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:24,680 Let's you touched on the fire. 351 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:28,120 So like I said, I worked Anaheim for a few years. 352 00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:33,440 The east side there was really our kind of interface and certainly a very dangerous place. 353 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:38,320 You know, if you look at the potential and I mean, the whole place was just brown, you 354 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:41,680 know, months and months and months and months. 355 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:47,400 Let's kind of unpack what you've seen as far as the events leading up to these fires. 356 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:51,520 And then we can talk about the end the way they were fought and then the takeaways. 357 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:57,900 But what have you analyzed so far as the contributing factors to it being such a deadly and destructive 358 00:21:57,900 --> 00:22:00,120 fire this time? 359 00:22:00,120 --> 00:22:01,120 Should I break it down? 360 00:22:01,120 --> 00:22:05,260 This is there's only one gentleman recently I've heard in the years he just did an interview 361 00:22:05,260 --> 00:22:08,220 on what is it called California insider. 362 00:22:08,220 --> 00:22:12,940 He's the past, I think, LA County sheriff. 363 00:22:12,940 --> 00:22:15,220 He knew his stuff. 364 00:22:15,220 --> 00:22:16,520 He stays in his lane. 365 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,700 He's right. 366 00:22:18,700 --> 00:22:23,120 So what I'm what I'll get into is I like to bring down the analogies because most people 367 00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:24,120 just don't get it. 368 00:22:24,120 --> 00:22:28,240 So if you don't cut your lawn forever, it gets big. 369 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:29,240 You don't weed your backyard. 370 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:30,280 It gets big. 371 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:33,600 If you don't weed your garden, it gets overgrown. 372 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:39,400 If you plant your tree when you're in elementary right now you're in college, it's gigantic. 373 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:40,400 Right? 374 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:41,400 Right. 375 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,960 You're hanging from it. 376 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:45,580 It's the same thing with our fuel. 377 00:22:45,580 --> 00:22:50,120 So meaning our brush, our homes fuel can also mean homes. 378 00:22:50,120 --> 00:22:55,400 If we pile up a bunch of homes close to each other, that is a fuel issue. 379 00:22:55,400 --> 00:23:03,960 So if we don't mitigate and trim our lawns, cut our lawns, weed our gardens, trim your 380 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,740 beard, get your hair cut, you're going to look like Bigfoot, right? 381 00:23:08,740 --> 00:23:10,840 Don't cut your hair for 20 years. 382 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:15,900 You're going to be stepping on your hair. 383 00:23:15,900 --> 00:23:18,240 It's the same thing with our brush. 384 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:21,400 We have these, I call them Santa Ana corridors. 385 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,080 I was telling you not too long ago, I can pull up a map. 386 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,120 It's a program that we use for search and rescue and emergency responders use across 387 00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:28,120 the nation. 388 00:23:28,120 --> 00:23:30,000 It's called Cal Topo. 389 00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:37,600 I can go pick an area, let's just say the Malibu area, and go back to the early 1900s. 390 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:43,120 It'll give me all the archival fires from the 1900s in colors. 391 00:23:43,120 --> 00:23:50,520 And I can show this to a kid in a science class in a STEM program and he'll probably 392 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:55,200 say, Jason, looks like this area is a problem area. 393 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:57,560 We need to fix that area. 394 00:23:57,560 --> 00:23:59,000 This is going to happen again. 395 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:06,280 Just imagine if you knew there was going to be a tsunami at some point at this same location, 396 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:07,280 but you had warnings. 397 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:11,040 You had three or five days warnings from the weather forecast, high pressure in the Great 398 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:16,720 Basin, low pressure setting up, and we're probably going to possibly have 60 to 80 mile 399 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:21,120 an hour winds days ahead of the time, but this could happen every three, five, 10 years 400 00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:22,760 or every year, right? 401 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:24,280 And we still do nothing. 402 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:25,280 We do very little. 403 00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:26,400 I'm not saying nothing. 404 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:30,560 Some departments do, but at the scale that we know, right? 405 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:35,720 I've been, I started fighting fire in 1989 in Southern California. 406 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:39,320 I watch fires get bigger and bigger in Santa Ana corridors. 407 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:43,400 And as the brush grows, right, it gets bigger, trees get bigger, and we're still not maintaining 408 00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:44,400 it. 409 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:49,560 So I just think in another five years or 10 years, some of these areas that have not had 410 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:55,160 fire in a while, you're going to have another extreme incident. 411 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,560 And the thing is we know in the fire service, depends on where you're at, right? 412 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,520 In the government, we did, every day we did a briefing. 413 00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:09,160 You had your daily weather, your outlook three days, five days, seven days, you kind of pick, 414 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:10,160 right? 415 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:12,400 And then you had a meteorologist telling you what's going on. 416 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,440 This is every day in the fire service. 417 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:20,000 I could go to a different county, sit in as a guest, and it's clockwork. 418 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:23,140 It's the same thing. 419 00:25:23,140 --> 00:25:28,440 And if you go back on January 6th and look in Google, just go Google January 6th, you'll 420 00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:33,660 see some of the headings in Google, catastrophic winds, hurricane winds, and then you click 421 00:25:33,660 --> 00:25:37,080 on it, and some of them have disappeared, right? 422 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:38,600 Maybe due to lawsuits or whatnot. 423 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:41,960 But like we're getting warned. 424 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,520 Why are we not acting? 425 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,320 So that's the most interesting part that we can fix now. 426 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,520 But it's sad to know that, you know, a lot of people say, well, we didn't know what was 427 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:52,520 going to happen. 428 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:53,680 I say, yes, you did. 429 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:56,320 You probably knew about five days. 430 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,300 Even the homeowners, this is not just the firefighters, right? 431 00:25:59,300 --> 00:26:03,320 We got to put accountability on if you live in a Santa Ana quarter, which you want to 432 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:08,480 live near the beach or live in this beautiful area, you need to trim your grass or trim 433 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:09,560 your beard as well. 434 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,600 You need to help the firefighters. 435 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:13,760 And we got, right? 436 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:17,100 I say we, still think I'm a firefighter, but I'm still a first responder. 437 00:26:17,100 --> 00:26:22,920 But if you have hundreds of homes burning, sorry, immediately we don't have hundreds 438 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:23,920 of fire engines. 439 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:28,060 It's going to take a few days to get those resources, those type one resources. 440 00:26:28,060 --> 00:26:32,080 Type one, always think type one, the biggest and baddest type one helicopter, type one 441 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:34,420 hand crew, that's the biggest and baddest. 442 00:26:34,420 --> 00:26:40,120 So it's something we can fix. 443 00:26:40,120 --> 00:26:44,520 And I always hate to say this, by Easter, we'll be off to the next big thing until Santa 444 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:46,920 Ana's roll around next year. 445 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,680 Nothing might not happen next year and then the next year. 446 00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:54,880 And then maybe in five years from now, you'll get, maybe it'll be San Diego. 447 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:57,240 It might be parts of Orange County. 448 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:04,360 It might be parts of north of LA, right? 449 00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:09,700 And we're still, it's like, what are we doing? 450 00:27:09,700 --> 00:27:14,760 So hope that answer your question, but it drives me nuts. 451 00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:16,720 It reminds me of COVID. 452 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:24,600 We have this virus come through and the middle of the road truth is that in almost all the 453 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:31,240 cases, anomalies aside, it was really taking out people who already had preexisting medical 454 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,360 conditions. 455 00:27:32,360 --> 00:27:36,840 So the takeaway should have been, let's make Americans healthier. 456 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,960 Let's bolster local farms to grow organic food. 457 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:41,800 Let's put real food in schools. 458 00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:44,920 Let's put PE programs back where they should have been. 459 00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,200 Let's do all these things to make our nation healthier. 460 00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:52,600 So when, as you said, when it's a fire or a virus, when the next one happens, the amount 461 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:58,020 of people affected is greatly reduced, but nothing happened after COVID. 462 00:27:58,020 --> 00:28:02,280 They just swept it under the rug and they were like, all right, well, let's move on. 463 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:05,760 And I think it's such a disservice because there are lessons in this. 464 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:10,460 If you analyze what happened in California, and like you said, there's all these levels. 465 00:28:10,460 --> 00:28:12,740 What do we miss at the forestry level? 466 00:28:12,740 --> 00:28:19,960 What do we miss at the enforcing that homeowners are abating brush and trees on their perimeter? 467 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,240 Are there any areas to address in the fire service response? 468 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,380 What about the water supply? 469 00:28:25,380 --> 00:28:31,160 But if we, it just seems to be from the outside that, like you said, it's insanity doing the 470 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:33,560 same thing again, expecting different results. 471 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,160 Yes, and you nailed it, right? 472 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:37,720 It's like, this is going to happen again. 473 00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:42,680 And it's interesting, people that are close to me that can go back in time, I have a business 474 00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:43,680 now, right? 475 00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:44,680 We keep notes. 476 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:46,840 They can say, Jason, you called that one two years ago in that area. 477 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:50,240 I said, yeah, I know, because it's a corridor. 478 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:52,640 It will happen. 479 00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:58,560 I can't tell you when exactly, but when you have the winds, the low relative humidities, 480 00:28:58,560 --> 00:28:59,560 it's going to happen. 481 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:06,760 And again, it's interesting to watch all these folks, some great, I would say, I would say 482 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:08,120 leaders, right? 483 00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:09,120 They're doing something. 484 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:10,280 They're in the arena, right? 485 00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:11,280 They're getting punched. 486 00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:12,720 They're out there trying to make a difference. 487 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:18,160 One of my biggest pet peeves when I want to contact some of these guys, gentlemen and 488 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,240 ladies, they make it so hard. 489 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:22,240 You can't contact them. 490 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,440 They make it double 07. 491 00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:29,440 And it drives me absolutely nuts that I can't get a hold of someone. 492 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,120 I got to get a hold of an agent. 493 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:32,640 The agent doesn't answer his phone. 494 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:34,180 You do an email. 495 00:29:34,180 --> 00:29:35,940 We don't live long enough. 496 00:29:35,940 --> 00:29:42,340 If we lived 200 years, I'd be like, okay, I'll get him 50 years from now. 497 00:29:42,340 --> 00:29:46,040 So it's interesting when I, and that's how my book came out. 498 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:50,040 People ask, Jason, how do you get a hold of these CEOs and become friends with them? 499 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,040 And you design this and you design a better helmet and all these. 500 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:56,680 I said, I blow up the phone and I find them. 501 00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:01,920 I hunt them down at an expo and I stare at them. 502 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,520 And I crush their hand, give them a good firm handshake. 503 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,600 And that's how I get stuff done. 504 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:13,080 And when I can't contact someone, it drives me crazy because they're on the same page. 505 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,240 And if you have a team of folks, you can do more damage. 506 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,360 Damage meaning good, right? 507 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:18,720 Good damage. 508 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:23,080 So that's what really bugged me in the president's report and all this stuff. 509 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,960 It's like, give me the tools. 510 00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:27,320 And I said, prove me wrong. 511 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,960 I said, you give me this power right now, I will go out. 512 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:32,120 We'll pick a section. 513 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:33,600 We have multiple sections in Washington state. 514 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:35,600 We did these clearings. 515 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:36,600 They're called Firewise. 516 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:41,040 You drop timber, you bring in some goats, you do a little bit of hard work. 517 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:44,520 You have chippers come in. 518 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,120 They have volunteers that come in or they get paid. 519 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,080 There's a solution to it all. 520 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:54,880 But again, if you're not a connoisseur of that, you don't know the resources and it 521 00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:55,880 doesn't happen. 522 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:57,360 So it's a bummer. 523 00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:02,360 It's a true, true bummer that we have this learning experience. 524 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,440 And I still haven't seen anything come out. 525 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:11,680 The best thing I've seen come out for your, again, your listeners is go to the California 526 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:15,440 Insider and look at one of the recent interviews there with the past sheriff. 527 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:16,440 It was amazing. 528 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:18,080 It's about unified command. 529 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,000 Not many people know what unified command is. 530 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:24,200 And that's when I know someone knows what they're talking about. 531 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,320 That means I'll go to Mission to Walmart with you. 532 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:29,440 If you don't know what unified command is, I'm not going to Mission to Walmart or any 533 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:34,360 else with you because you just, I don't want to be stuck with you somewhere because then 534 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:37,280 I'm not about to be saving your butt. 535 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,100 And unified command is exactly how it sounds, unified. 536 00:31:41,100 --> 00:31:47,080 So everything from the dog catchers, the water districts, the utilities, the fire, the police, 537 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:51,960 Willy Wonka, Walmart, I don't care whoever's in that area, unified command. 538 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:53,280 Well, you need pizza. 539 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,280 That's why Willy's there. 540 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:56,280 Yes. 541 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:57,280 Right. 542 00:31:57,280 --> 00:31:58,560 So, and that's when it works. 543 00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:01,400 I mean, I watched an old video at Riverside County. 544 00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:03,720 They were doing a demo on unified command. 545 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:09,600 People, listeners can Google this just, and you can see how well it works when you know 546 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:14,240 Fred and Diana from the water district and you're like, hey, what's that reservoir look 547 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:15,240 like? 548 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:16,240 What do we got? 549 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:17,240 And they're like, you're good. 550 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:18,240 You're awesome. 551 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:19,240 I know Diana. 552 00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:20,240 I've known her for years. 553 00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:21,240 Right. 554 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:25,800 And then you, a certain amount of helicopters and you see Fred over there from Cal Fire 555 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:26,800 or the Forest Service. 556 00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:28,680 And he's like, I got you covered, man. 557 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:30,720 We got three type ones. 558 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:33,000 We got a type one team if you need. 559 00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:34,000 Awesome. 560 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:35,000 Okay. 561 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,360 We've got a bunch of animals running the streets. 562 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,560 Where's Tanya? 563 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:41,560 I'm on it. 564 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,880 We got animal control. 565 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,560 But the other way, everyone's scrambling. 566 00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:46,560 Oh, we got animals. 567 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:48,120 Oh, we got people looting. 568 00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:49,120 We got... 569 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,520 It's like, guys, it's all there already. 570 00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:56,280 It's like, didn't you take your leadership courses, your L courses and your task force 571 00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,240 courses and your division courses? 572 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:04,200 It's like, how did you get that brass on your collars that you're aligning every day to 573 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:05,200 go to work? 574 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,320 How did you get that? 575 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,060 Because you're supposed to know that. 576 00:33:09,060 --> 00:33:14,200 So that's where I get a little bit, I can still be your friend and give you hugs, but 577 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:17,840 I have no... 578 00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:22,360 My mercy gets thin when you're wearing collar brass and you're not doing your job. 579 00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:26,000 I've literally been calling that out even just from the health of the fire service in 580 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:27,480 the moment and the recruitment crisis. 581 00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:31,280 I mean, if you're not stepping up and advocating for the health of your people, but you're 582 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:35,600 collecting a chief salary, there's something wrong with that. 583 00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:36,600 Correct. 584 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:41,520 And that was one thing I loved at being a hell attack and being a jumper and even sorry 585 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:42,520 is you got to PT. 586 00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:43,520 You got to... 587 00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:47,400 I don't care if you got to bust out 20 pushups in the bathroom, some chair pushups, do some 588 00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:48,640 squats on the toilet seat. 589 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:50,440 I don't care. 590 00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:52,680 Do something. 591 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,760 Do some paces, do a couple lunges. 592 00:33:55,760 --> 00:34:01,520 It's like, you got to be in shape when we're all going to get old at some point. 593 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:03,680 There's guys still in their 80s that can do some pushups. 594 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:04,680 I've seen it. 595 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:08,120 I've had that experience, it's like, wow, that guy is in better shape than me right 596 00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:09,120 now. 597 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,880 So, right, it's that trillion dollar, million dollar question. 598 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:18,960 It's like, how do we motivate people when things bad go happen and we have the answers 599 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,560 to fix it? 600 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:23,920 But most people don't want to fix it. 601 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:26,320 But it affects the people that want to. 602 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:27,320 Yeah. 603 00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:30,160 I hate it when people say we don't have the answers. 604 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:31,600 I heard that recently. 605 00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:37,480 And it's like, but I know the answers and I'm by far not an SME. 606 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:40,240 I've never rose above the rank of firefighter. 607 00:34:40,240 --> 00:34:41,440 So I've always flipped it around. 608 00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:46,320 Well, if I can find the answers as a dumb ass firefighter, why the fuck haven't you 609 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:47,320 already? 610 00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:50,860 Whether it's a union or chiefs or whatever. 611 00:34:50,860 --> 00:34:55,840 When we've talked in the past and then Ben Strahan and Rex and some of these other Wildland 612 00:34:55,840 --> 00:35:01,760 brothers that I've had on the show, there seems to be a reoccurring theme. 613 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:07,640 The resistance to prescribe burns from communities also seems to hamper the suppression of some 614 00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:08,640 of these fires. 615 00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:10,960 Is this still an issue now? 616 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:11,960 It is. 617 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:15,280 So, right, it's all about the education. 618 00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,800 This is the first time we had a good talk on that PCAST meeting. 619 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:24,440 You got folks, right, whether they're, they got some lung issues or smoke, right, irritants. 620 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:25,640 I get it. 621 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:27,840 I get it. 622 00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:29,560 But we have companies like now called burn bot. 623 00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:31,840 They got a burn chamber for one hour fuels. 624 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:36,280 They can come in and burn all year round in places that have one hour fuels. 625 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:41,680 One hour fuels is a quarter inch and under, right, light fuels, twigs, grass, the latter 626 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:46,400 fuels that start the big fires, right, get into the bigger 10 hour fuels, which are brush 627 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:47,400 and so on. 628 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,400 And then timber, hundred hour fuels and so on. 629 00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:54,120 The burn bot comes in, they have mastication tools, they got robotics. 630 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,820 They can come in a small crew. 631 00:35:56,820 --> 00:35:57,820 They don't need hot shot crews. 632 00:35:57,820 --> 00:35:59,760 They don't need hand crews. 633 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:05,720 They come in themselves and they can do a lot of, how would you say, fuel mitigation 634 00:36:05,720 --> 00:36:07,360 in a very short amount of time. 635 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:09,960 I've been following them for years. 636 00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:11,440 I have briefed everyone on. 637 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:14,120 They work like they're operational. 638 00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:15,120 People can Google them. 639 00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:19,040 Listeners go look at burn bot, watch the, one of the PhDs. 640 00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,040 I believe his name is Phil. 641 00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:22,040 I should know his by heart. 642 00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:23,040 I'm embarrassed. 643 00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:24,520 I should know his first name. 644 00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:26,520 But he talks about the burn chamber. 645 00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,960 Phil, I'm sorry if your name's not Phil, sorry. 646 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,600 It is now. 647 00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:36,960 So it's amazing to see them grow from their prototype. 648 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:41,160 We had a fire summit here in San Bernardino a couple years ago and in less than a year 649 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:44,000 they were operational. 650 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:50,320 And I remember I picked, I hand selected some of the best fire folks in the Southern California 651 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:51,320 area. 652 00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:53,520 Actually one guy that trained me when I was 17. 653 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:57,640 He didn't recognize me, but I told him it's your fault. 654 00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,040 Why are you here? 655 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:04,400 And a lot of my buddies were coming over and asking me, Jason, is this real? 656 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:11,400 This looks like a red wider wagon with a fan and is this another concept crazy idea? 657 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,180 I said, nope. 658 00:37:13,180 --> 00:37:18,000 And then less than a year they did a video on YouTube with, they had a contract with 659 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:22,120 the Forest Service for multiple large acres. 660 00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:24,200 And they're like, they're operational. 661 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:26,640 I said, yeah, of course they are. 662 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:32,280 You think I'm going to bite someone that's just complete concept? 663 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:33,320 So there's that tool. 664 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,520 That's just part of the solution. 665 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,400 So you have a place that's very sensitive on smoke. 666 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,640 The burn bot would come in if it meets the parameters of that light fuels. 667 00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:43,640 Let's say it doesn't. 668 00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:47,360 Let's say, hey, we can't, the fuels are too big for the burn bot. 669 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:49,600 Okay, we'll bring in some of the masticators. 670 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:55,320 The masticators will come in and chew up all that 10 hour fuels, whatnot, and leave it 671 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:56,320 looks like a dozer. 672 00:37:56,320 --> 00:38:01,520 I remember I had a picture, my buddy was out doing some of the work and I said, did you 673 00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:02,520 have a doe? 674 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:03,520 You had a cat. 675 00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:04,520 He's like, no, no. 676 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:06,680 It was the little masticator down to dirt. 677 00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:11,720 So there is solutions right now and what they're trying to do, I know in the past they were 678 00:38:11,720 --> 00:38:16,520 trying to treat a million acres a year, which is a huge number. 679 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:21,960 I know the owners, the PhDs, the folks there, they do not say something. 680 00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:27,120 They have not done the homework and I've watched them succeed and execute. 681 00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:28,120 And that's what's good about them. 682 00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:32,800 They execute, they're doing it, they're kicking butt, but they're just one small piece. 683 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:39,040 If I had my Willy Wonka machine and made, let's just say I made a thousand of them, 684 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:43,080 you wouldn't have Santa Ana issues anymore because all those corridors would be treated 685 00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,120 for the brush side. 686 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:50,280 We couldn't fix the home side until we get sprinkler kits and mitigate the homes. 687 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:55,920 But the fuel side of the brush would be mitigated with that type of work, mastication, fire 688 00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:59,520 goats, hand power. 689 00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:06,080 Well, what seems to be weird as well as if you think about it, a little discomfort. 690 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,760 And again, I lived in California for a few years. 691 00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:14,520 Burbank was burning several times when I lived there and that wasn't a prescribed burn. 692 00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:20,120 But a few days of inconvenience is nothing compared to your entire neighborhood being 693 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:24,720 raised to the ground after just before the insurance companies have pulled the plug on 694 00:39:24,720 --> 00:39:26,400 any coverage for you. 695 00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:29,320 So even, I mean, like you're talking about the goats and the masticators and the burn 696 00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:36,160 bots sound amazing, but even just putting your foot down as a, whether it's the forest 697 00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:41,540 service, whichever just jurisdiction that is and saying, look, a little discomfort versus 698 00:39:41,540 --> 00:39:44,640 losing your home, that there's no conversation here. 699 00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:46,320 Like we have to do this. 700 00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:47,640 Otherwise it will be so dangerous. 701 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:50,520 We might lose the city of paradise, for example. 702 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:56,280 So that's where I feel like, you know, again, you're talking about earning your, your position. 703 00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:59,000 You just have to be courageous and say, look, I get it. 704 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:04,160 Ideally, you'd have clear air every single day, but this is the price of doing business. 705 00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:06,600 You chose to live in this part of the state. 706 00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:10,480 We have to mitigate this fuel or you may lose your home. 707 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:11,760 Correct. 708 00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:16,120 And as my old command officer, he should say a little bit of smoke now or a lot later. 709 00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:21,000 There might be some French in there, a little bit of F in smoke now or a lot later. 710 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:22,200 And it's absolutely right. 711 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:25,240 So let's just take, let's say take LA County, right? 712 00:40:25,240 --> 00:40:29,720 That's a Santa Ana corridor, orange counties, Santa Ana corridor. 713 00:40:29,720 --> 00:40:32,560 Some of that's not fed land, but you can collaborate, right? 714 00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:35,600 Bring the professionals in, but now you don't even need to do that. 715 00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:37,360 You can contact folks like burn bot. 716 00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:39,700 You can contact some of these fire coach. 717 00:40:39,700 --> 00:40:46,460 You can contact some of the CCC that come in and ship and fire wise. 718 00:40:46,460 --> 00:40:49,200 You don't even need to contact the fire service. 719 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,120 That's the most interesting part, which no one's tapping into. 720 00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,240 Like the chief of LA, right? 721 00:40:55,240 --> 00:40:56,240 I'll say it. 722 00:40:56,240 --> 00:40:57,480 The chief of LA County. 723 00:40:57,480 --> 00:40:59,040 I don't know her. 724 00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:07,320 I'd love to see her background. 725 00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:08,720 She should be more prepared. 726 00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:13,680 You live in that area. 727 00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:19,500 I don't care if you're right, LA City, whether you want to be a structure firefighter, right? 728 00:41:19,500 --> 00:41:21,200 You better have some wildland boots. 729 00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:26,440 You better have be trained in cutting line for hours. 730 00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:30,360 Not that you're going to do it because you're assigned to maybe a truck, but if you live 731 00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:36,000 in that area, those citizens are relying on you to protect them out those high standards 732 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,400 and not saying those firefighters don't. 733 00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:39,400 I have friends there. 734 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:40,400 I've trained some. 735 00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:45,880 They work in that department, but the bummer part at the high brass, why are they not doing 736 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:46,880 more? 737 00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:47,880 That is the question. 738 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:54,040 There's stuff I can't see, but if I was, let's just say me and you, right? 739 00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:55,040 You're the chief. 740 00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:56,040 I'm your division. 741 00:41:56,040 --> 00:41:57,040 I'm your assistant chief. 742 00:41:57,040 --> 00:42:00,480 I'm going to say, James, here's our corridor. 743 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:10,200 We have acres of high threat one hour fuels into 10 hour fuels in 100 hour fuels. 744 00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:12,180 We've already mapped it out for you. 745 00:42:12,180 --> 00:42:16,240 We can start treating some of these near the road because most of these fires start from 746 00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:20,120 human beings by accident or by purpose, right? 747 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:21,840 You have cigarettes. 748 00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:28,360 You have barbecues, weed eaters, someone trying to use a warming fire, arsonists. 749 00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:29,920 Treat that first, right? 750 00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,120 It's doable. 751 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,640 I could do that and then I'd give you my plan and you'd say, go for it. 752 00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:36,640 Don't go for it. 753 00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:37,640 Do you know who I am? 754 00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:38,640 I'm the chief. 755 00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:39,640 How dare you talk to me like that? 756 00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:40,640 Right? 757 00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:41,640 Exactly. 758 00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:43,480 That's what could also happen in a fragile ego environment. 759 00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:47,960 Not saying that's LA County, but I know personally, there are people that if you're not their 760 00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:51,120 rank or above, they don't want to hear what you have to say. 761 00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:52,120 Correct. 762 00:42:52,120 --> 00:42:54,200 It has to, let me back up a little bit. 763 00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:55,640 You'd have to be a pro chief. 764 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,540 You'd be saying, you'd say to me, Ramos, I want you to go out and do this for me and 765 00:42:58,540 --> 00:43:00,760 come back with me and we're going to make this happen. 766 00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:06,160 If I went out and did it my own and briefed you, I'm probably going to get some reprimand 767 00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:07,680 some way somehow, right? 768 00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:10,040 Because you're not going to like it. 769 00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,240 And we've learned that in the fire service, right? 770 00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:14,040 Chain of command, all these things. 771 00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:16,760 And it's like, wait a second. 772 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:22,000 We took an oath, life and property, period. 773 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,280 There's nothing else. 774 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:29,400 But we only kind of do that? 775 00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:31,160 It doesn't make sense to me. 776 00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:33,920 And again, no one can take that away from me. 777 00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:35,160 I got over 33 years. 778 00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:38,880 I did 20 years active jumping out of helicopters and planes. 779 00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:39,960 Can't take that away from me. 780 00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:42,320 You can't take my quals away from me. 781 00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:44,040 You don't have to like me. 782 00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:45,640 You can't take that away from me. 783 00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,520 And I've designed, I've done some pretty cool things. 784 00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:51,400 Can't take it away from me. 785 00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:53,120 So I have something to say about that, right? 786 00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:56,040 So when I'm on a mission, it's like, hey, let's do this. 787 00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,320 And I've been lucky to be chaperoned 788 00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:00,820 and put under the wing of some of the best out there, 789 00:44:00,820 --> 00:44:04,560 even in the jump program, to learn how to, 790 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,440 when I jump a lightning fire, that that fire's 791 00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:07,720 out when I leave it. 792 00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:09,240 It's 110% out. 793 00:44:09,240 --> 00:44:11,680 And if it isn't, I'm going to lose, probably lose my job. 794 00:44:11,680 --> 00:44:12,920 Because I failed. 795 00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:15,200 And now I just started the huge forest fire 796 00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,480 that burned homes, could possibly kill someone. 797 00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:19,440 I take that very important. 798 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,080 Imagine now if I was a chief. 799 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:26,040 I wish I can give that shot of, how do you say, 800 00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:30,240 of responsibility to fire chiefs around the nation. 801 00:44:30,240 --> 00:44:33,240 Because some are great and some are lacking. 802 00:44:33,240 --> 00:44:36,880 And the good part is you can fix yourself. 803 00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:39,280 Go in the bathroom, throw some water in your face, 804 00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:40,880 run in the door a couple of times, 805 00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:42,360 kick yourself in the nuts. 806 00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:44,040 I don't care what you do. 807 00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:45,360 Like, you can change it. 808 00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:47,920 That's the good part about it. 809 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:50,480 Like, you could go out there and say, you know, 810 00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:53,800 I'm the chief, things are going to change. 811 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:55,720 And yes, some people can get pissed off. 812 00:44:55,720 --> 00:44:56,280 I don't care. 813 00:44:56,280 --> 00:44:58,400 I got these things on my brass here. 814 00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:00,360 Come try to take them off of me. 815 00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:02,440 You want to duke it out a little bit? 816 00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:02,960 That's OK. 817 00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:04,360 Let's get some Nerf bats. 818 00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:06,040 Let's beat each other. 819 00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:07,080 We'll take the Nerf bats. 820 00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:10,080 We'll go in the back room and beat yourself together. 821 00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:11,640 Or we'll play the old boxing game. 822 00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:13,840 We'll do the thumbs or whatnot. 823 00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,480 So yes, it's very interesting. 824 00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:21,120 And I've had my run-ins with chiefs and captains. 825 00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:22,920 And I respect them. 826 00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:24,560 I apologize when I have to. 827 00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:26,720 I will be saying, I'm sorry, sir, for being in line. 828 00:45:26,720 --> 00:45:29,800 But this is life and property. 829 00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:31,560 And this is why I did that. 830 00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:35,280 This is why I disobeyed a direct order when 831 00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:39,840 you told me to cancel your response and drive back. 832 00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:41,960 But when I'm driving by my firefighter 833 00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:45,920 and he's screaming for help, why I got on the radio 834 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:50,000 and told dispatch, squad 68, available on scene, 835 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,240 get out, help my firefighter, because he's 836 00:45:52,240 --> 00:45:55,120 screaming for help, and then go back to the station 837 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:58,480 and the captain wants to write me up. 838 00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:00,480 Write me up all day long, sir, I'm sorry, 839 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,000 for helping my firefighter that was screaming for help. 840 00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:04,680 I am sorry. 841 00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:06,920 How many push-ups do I have to do? 842 00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:08,040 I will clean the bathrooms. 843 00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:09,160 I am sorry. 844 00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:10,640 I didn't get written up. 845 00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:12,840 So those are the kind of things. 846 00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:15,720 And it's such a fixable thing. 847 00:46:15,720 --> 00:46:16,720 Absolutely. 848 00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:17,880 Sorry for the rant. 849 00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:18,680 No, no, no. 850 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:22,040 You're in a similar company. 851 00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:23,440 Well, you touched on reservoirs. 852 00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:25,440 So let's hit that. 853 00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:27,760 Obviously, there's one side of the conversation 854 00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:30,360 that's glaring, which if enough houses are burning 855 00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:32,840 and enough engines on scene, a water supply 856 00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:34,320 is going to be extremely challenged. 857 00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:37,160 That can happen in a city setting as well. 858 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,440 I remember going on one massive fire that was like, 859 00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:42,440 I think it was an entire block, if I remember rightly, 860 00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:44,320 in Fullerton years ago. 861 00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:46,600 And I know the supply was a challenge 862 00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:48,240 for that particular fire. 863 00:46:48,240 --> 00:46:51,920 What have you heard as far as, again, Monday morning 864 00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:52,960 quarterbacking? 865 00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:56,200 What needs to change so that we can increase 866 00:46:56,200 --> 00:46:58,280 the likelihood of the firefighters having 867 00:46:58,280 --> 00:46:59,360 water when they need it? 868 00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:03,280 So I've heard a lot, right? 869 00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:05,160 And I own a research company. 870 00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:06,760 Again, you'll hear me. 871 00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:10,040 You won't hear me say I think a lot. 872 00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:12,720 I use the word I think when I'm with you. 873 00:47:12,720 --> 00:47:17,320 I say, hey, man, James, I think I have room for more pizza. 874 00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:19,240 I can eat that last piece of cake. 875 00:47:19,240 --> 00:47:20,600 I think I can do that. 876 00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:22,640 Because you've got to remember, when I say think, 877 00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:24,320 everyone's at 50%. 878 00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:26,200 I think that'll work. 879 00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:28,160 I think we'll be OK. 880 00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:29,320 So I've heard a lot of thinks. 881 00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:34,240 If you're, again, I'm going to go back to this. 882 00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:38,840 If you are a chief or the commander in charge, commander 883 00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:43,400 in chief of a department in a Santa Ana corridor, 884 00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:46,920 all your pre-plans, you better have water. 885 00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:50,320 I want every battalion, every station. 886 00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:51,680 I remember checking fire stations 887 00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:54,520 when I was 17 years old because they would stick toys in them. 888 00:47:54,520 --> 00:47:56,120 That's one of the jobs we did is, hey, 889 00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,320 we had to go check this fire hydrant to see 890 00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:01,680 if they stuck toys in there. 891 00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:02,920 In your pre-plans, you're supposed 892 00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:05,240 to be doing all these things. 893 00:48:05,240 --> 00:48:09,680 If I was a chief in an area that I, in a Santa Ana corridor, 894 00:48:09,680 --> 00:48:14,600 and had a dry reservoir, something's wrong. 895 00:48:14,600 --> 00:48:21,480 And if you want to fix it, don't fix it during Santa Ana months. 896 00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:26,440 Let's fix it when the Santanas are gone, maybe from May, April, 897 00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,720 April to May, June. 898 00:48:28,720 --> 00:48:31,280 That's a time to work on that thing. 899 00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:33,680 Not during a Santa Ana. 900 00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:36,480 Santanas come, as a kid, riding a skateboard 901 00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:38,240 and flying power kites. 902 00:48:38,240 --> 00:48:44,240 We knew every year, September, January, somewhere in there, 903 00:48:44,240 --> 00:48:46,400 sometimes a little bit in February, 904 00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:51,760 was the best kite flying to see Wizard of Oz stuff, 905 00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:55,560 trees falling over, and storms and sand storms. 906 00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:57,720 As a kid, you were like, yeah, storm, right? 907 00:48:57,720 --> 00:49:00,840 Not fires, but sand storms and stuff. 908 00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:04,720 So why were those? 909 00:49:04,720 --> 00:49:05,840 That's my question, right? 910 00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:09,440 If I was on a president's team, I would say, that can't happen. 911 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:11,480 And why did that happen? 912 00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:13,960 Tell me why. 913 00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:18,760 If you go back in time, and they had a type 1 team that 914 00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:22,560 came in there to support them for this possible win event, 915 00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:25,960 somewhere in that team operations, most likely, 916 00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:27,680 they're going to be looking at the area. 917 00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:30,480 One of those ops guys are going to say, or she, 918 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,360 how many reservoirs you got, and what's your water supply? 919 00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:35,720 Days out before. 920 00:49:35,720 --> 00:49:38,840 This is not rocket science. 921 00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:41,400 This is standard ops. 922 00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:44,320 So that puzzles me, right? 923 00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:47,280 We have some people on YouTube flying days before. 924 00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:50,200 They backlogged some stuff and showed the reservoir is dry. 925 00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:52,560 I said, well, that's definitely not good. 926 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:54,120 If it was full, would they have been 927 00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:55,360 able to stop the whole thing? 928 00:49:55,360 --> 00:49:59,600 No, but they would have been able to probably do more. 929 00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:03,400 If you don't have water, what are you going to use? 930 00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:06,200 So there are some serious problems there. 931 00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:08,400 Not only that, in these corridors, 932 00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:09,760 you can have dip sites. 933 00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:13,040 Dip sites are what I did as a helotack. 934 00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:20,520 You could have areas with 2,500 gallon dip tanks, or even more, 935 00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:24,480 pre-positioned out in areas. 936 00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:26,560 We call it typical terrain, right? 937 00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:29,040 I would say forest, but some of it might be county land. 938 00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:30,760 They're sitting out there ready. 939 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:33,500 So helicopters can come and grab. 940 00:50:33,500 --> 00:50:35,320 Engines can come and take. 941 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,440 They're all sensory located. 942 00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:39,720 That is a huge problem. 943 00:50:39,720 --> 00:50:42,960 Another big problem is there are egress and ingress, right? 944 00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:43,840 Pre-plans. 945 00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:45,920 When I was 17, being in a fire department, 946 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:51,480 that our battalion knew all the citizens that we protected, 947 00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:54,120 when it had a storm, you couldn't go down that road. 948 00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:55,360 You'd get stuck. 949 00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:56,560 We made sure they knew. 950 00:50:56,560 --> 00:50:58,200 That was part of the fire department 951 00:50:58,200 --> 00:51:01,920 to tell people, hey, if there's a fire here, floods, 952 00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:03,640 this is how you get out. 953 00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:05,280 People would come to the fire station. 954 00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:06,200 The bays would be open. 955 00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:07,320 They would ask us questions. 956 00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:08,440 We'd educate them. 957 00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:12,680 So back to the water there, that just blows my mind. 958 00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:18,040 I can't even, I'm not going to sit there and quarterback, 959 00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:20,700 sit here from a seat and say, you know this, this, and this. 960 00:51:20,700 --> 00:51:26,020 But if you live in a corridor, you should be ready. 961 00:51:26,020 --> 00:51:27,760 So all those people listening right now, 962 00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:31,720 if you're in a corridor, Orange County, San Diego, 963 00:51:31,720 --> 00:51:37,400 Malibu area, Laguna, remember, fuel, heat, and auction 964 00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:40,280 is the fire triangle. 965 00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:43,320 If you don't have something to break that triangle, 966 00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:44,720 that's what's supposed to happen. 967 00:51:44,720 --> 00:51:48,520 It's going to burn until it can't burn anymore. 968 00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:50,840 Were there sprinkler systems? 969 00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:52,960 Because obviously, there was quite a lot of money 970 00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:55,600 in some of these neighborhoods that were raised. 971 00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:58,000 Were there sprinkler systems set up there 972 00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,520 that didn't have the capacity to turn on again because 973 00:52:00,520 --> 00:52:02,680 of the water shortage? 974 00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:06,240 So I know for a fact, there was some, 975 00:52:06,240 --> 00:52:08,560 there were companies I know had some of the clients, 976 00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:09,520 their homes. 977 00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:11,120 Again, this is hard to say, right? 978 00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:12,400 Oh, my home was saved. 979 00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:13,900 And then I see pictures like, no, it 980 00:52:13,900 --> 00:52:17,280 could have been saved without the sprinklers on. 981 00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:18,720 So it depends. 982 00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:22,040 If again, imagine the amount of fires. 983 00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:23,400 You hear this on the news, right? 984 00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:26,320 If we all turn on our hose at one time, 985 00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:28,880 you're going to have drops coming out of it. 986 00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:33,680 So these areas, like right now, the counties 987 00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:35,840 that didn't get burned that live in Santa Ana quarters, 988 00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:40,440 they should be going out doing mock scenarios. 989 00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:45,400 I want every battalion to turn on a hydrant at this time 990 00:52:45,400 --> 00:52:47,040 for so many minutes. 991 00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:49,800 Like right now, they can be doing something. 992 00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:52,100 I want all the homeowners to turn on their sprinklers 993 00:52:52,100 --> 00:52:53,680 at this time, right? 994 00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:55,240 I'm sure there's going to be some environmental. 995 00:52:55,240 --> 00:52:56,680 Oh, no, we can't do that. 996 00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:58,760 We can't. 997 00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:00,840 How are you going to fix the problem if you can't see what 998 00:53:00,840 --> 00:53:02,000 the issues is? 999 00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:05,280 So there was some homes. 1000 00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:06,720 We did have, there was an interview 1001 00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:11,720 of an older gentleman that did save his home estate. 1002 00:53:11,720 --> 00:53:14,800 And around his homes were burned and his were saved. 1003 00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:18,280 You've got to remember, some of these homes, 1004 00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:22,240 depending on the direct flame impingement and the wind 1005 00:53:22,240 --> 00:53:24,960 and the relative humidities of that area, 1006 00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:27,920 some can be really saved and some cannot. 1007 00:53:27,920 --> 00:53:31,920 If we have Forty-Maur winds and the flames are horizontal, 1008 00:53:31,920 --> 00:53:34,560 blowing against a home, at some point, 1009 00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:36,080 that's going to catch fire. 1010 00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:39,160 But the gentleman was interesting with his old hose. 1011 00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:43,400 He dragged it around and was putting out little spot fires. 1012 00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:47,320 And there was a reporter that kind of went viral. 1013 00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:48,520 It's the one where all the embers, 1014 00:53:48,520 --> 00:53:50,020 he's out there in the battle and he's 1015 00:53:50,020 --> 00:53:51,020 getting all these praise. 1016 00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:55,920 If I knew him, he would definitely 1017 00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:57,640 would not get a Christmas present from me 1018 00:53:57,640 --> 00:53:59,560 because he's filming one little fire. 1019 00:53:59,560 --> 00:54:00,360 It's a spot fire. 1020 00:54:00,360 --> 00:54:01,560 He says, I can't do anything. 1021 00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:03,400 I can't do anything. 1022 00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:04,560 And he runs somewhere else. 1023 00:54:04,560 --> 00:54:07,440 I can put that out with my foot. 1024 00:54:07,440 --> 00:54:11,800 And that area was going to start that house possibly on fire. 1025 00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:13,920 It's like you can pee on that. 1026 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,560 So it's this education. 1027 00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:19,920 But if every homeowner in those areas 1028 00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:23,760 were educated on basic sprinkler kits or wedding agents 1029 00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:27,200 that they can apply with a spray paint gun, 1030 00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:29,360 whether they rent one or own one already, 1031 00:54:29,360 --> 00:54:32,960 or an ace sprayer that stays on the home, 1032 00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:38,360 it's non-caustic, non-hazardous, that works too. 1033 00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:39,240 It works. 1034 00:54:39,240 --> 00:54:40,520 There's been testing. 1035 00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:42,400 It's proven solution. 1036 00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:43,440 CAL FIRE has tested that. 1037 00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:46,640 You can watch on YouTube of homes treated 1038 00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:49,760 with fire resistant or wedding agents and ones without. 1039 00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:55,160 What about shelter in place? 1040 00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:58,600 I think it was Rex Strickland that talked about this. 1041 00:54:58,600 --> 00:55:01,400 If you look at what happened in Paradise Fire, 1042 00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:03,960 I had Beth Bowersox, who was a dispatcher from that fire. 1043 00:55:03,960 --> 00:55:08,000 So really heartbreaking, unique perspective that she had. 1044 00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:09,920 And her home was destroyed in that whole thing. 1045 00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:11,560 But she was a Paradise resident. 1046 00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:14,680 So all her neighbors were dying on the end of the phone. 1047 00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:16,960 And it was actually a building that 1048 00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:19,880 was on a concrete pad that saved a lot of people 1049 00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:22,240 that were being led by one of the police officers. 1050 00:55:22,240 --> 00:55:23,200 And they all survived. 1051 00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:25,280 There was a school bus full of kids and teachers 1052 00:55:25,280 --> 00:55:27,120 that were in there. 1053 00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:30,040 And so Rex's concept was actually 1054 00:55:30,040 --> 00:55:33,600 communities having a specific shelter in place. 1055 00:55:33,600 --> 00:55:35,640 Like in Florida here with hurricanes, 1056 00:55:35,640 --> 00:55:38,920 a lot of the high schools become the shelter for people. 1057 00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:40,600 What's your perspective on that? 1058 00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:42,640 We know how narrow these lanes are. 1059 00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:46,600 And we saw how they got jammed up immediately. 1060 00:55:46,600 --> 00:55:48,520 In high rise fires, for example, we 1061 00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:52,480 use that as long as it's obviously not a 9-11 or Grenfell 1062 00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:53,960 situation. 1063 00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:56,160 So talk to me about that concept. 1064 00:55:56,160 --> 00:55:56,640 Correct. 1065 00:55:56,640 --> 00:55:57,200 And I love it. 1066 00:55:57,200 --> 00:56:00,280 And I'm always an advocate for these small communities that 1067 00:56:00,280 --> 00:56:02,840 have their own fire departments, their own police departments, 1068 00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:04,760 their own, right? 1069 00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:11,200 If you have able of fighting age, I call it, 1070 00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:14,680 you could have a block that could be your task force. 1071 00:56:14,680 --> 00:56:18,520 Those folks can shelter in place and take care of everything. 1072 00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:21,280 They've got the right fire hose, garden hose 1073 00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:23,120 that's professionally used. 1074 00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:24,400 They can have wetting agents. 1075 00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:27,960 If there's no water, they can still treat without water. 1076 00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:33,200 They can take care of the elderly, the ones that can't. 1077 00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:33,960 It can be done. 1078 00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:36,680 It's been done. 1079 00:56:36,680 --> 00:56:39,280 Have the egress to know when to leave. 1080 00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:41,360 Say, hey, folks, here's our pre-plans. 1081 00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:42,920 Like, I have it up where I live. 1082 00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:44,640 If we can't go here, we go there. 1083 00:56:47,720 --> 00:56:50,720 Communities can do that because the fire departments 1084 00:56:50,720 --> 00:56:54,360 and the police departments, when they're that task saturated 1085 00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:56,920 on that large of an event, there's 1086 00:56:56,920 --> 00:56:59,160 only so much they can do. 1087 00:56:59,160 --> 00:57:03,320 So that shelter in place and holding your own ground, 1088 00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:06,520 if you're trained and have the tools, you can do it. 1089 00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:08,960 And then you have that fallback. 1090 00:57:08,960 --> 00:57:11,120 It's OK, guys. 1091 00:57:11,120 --> 00:57:11,960 We did what we did. 1092 00:57:11,960 --> 00:57:13,000 Now we have to leave. 1093 00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:15,920 But we know which way to go. 1094 00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:20,160 We have some simple stuff, apps on your phone, cameras, 1095 00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:20,960 wetting agents. 1096 00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:22,360 And it's not that difficult. I've 1097 00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:27,040 done this multiple times with friends, their communities, 1098 00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:30,640 their neighborhoods, their quarter sacks, their areas. 1099 00:57:30,640 --> 00:57:32,000 They do it. 1100 00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:34,600 And then when fires happen or emergencies, 1101 00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:37,000 they're rocking and rolling. 1102 00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:39,040 Like, it works. 1103 00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:40,880 The hard part is who to teach them, right? 1104 00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:42,640 You go on some of these government sites. 1105 00:57:42,640 --> 00:57:43,640 It's not there. 1106 00:57:43,640 --> 00:57:51,920 So I concur with that, how do you say, that mode of tactics. 1107 00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:55,200 I know many communities that know me, 1108 00:57:55,200 --> 00:57:57,000 become friends with me. 1109 00:57:57,000 --> 00:57:57,760 They do that. 1110 00:57:57,760 --> 00:57:59,320 They know where their ins and outs. 1111 00:57:59,320 --> 00:58:02,240 They have mitigated the fuel. 1112 00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:04,800 They know their neighbors' medications. 1113 00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:06,480 They know what vehicles they have. 1114 00:58:06,480 --> 00:58:08,480 They're like, hey, I got a spinner fan. 1115 00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:09,520 I could fit eight people. 1116 00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:11,720 And they're like, hey, yeah, I got my swimming pool. 1117 00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,760 And I also have two 55-gallon drums of water 1118 00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:17,720 in the back for earthquake. 1119 00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:20,360 So everyone's like, oh, yeah, and I got a bunch of cans 1120 00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:24,960 of peaches and asparagus in cans. 1121 00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:27,520 I mean, it can be done. 1122 00:58:27,520 --> 00:58:29,400 It is being done in some communities. 1123 00:58:29,400 --> 00:58:32,040 Some of Colorado, I did some stuff. 1124 00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:32,720 My book came out. 1125 00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:37,960 They were some of the most progressive fire prep emergency 1126 00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:39,840 because they were near dams. 1127 00:58:39,840 --> 00:58:41,680 They had wildfire issues. 1128 00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:43,160 And the whole community, everyone 1129 00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:46,400 was like their own fire department, police department. 1130 00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:48,840 Now, again, not going and grabbing robbers. 1131 00:58:48,840 --> 00:58:51,000 But if they seen something bad, they helped out. 1132 00:58:54,160 --> 00:58:56,440 I hope that answered that question. 1133 00:58:56,440 --> 00:58:59,120 Yeah, no, and I think it really alludes to something 1134 00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:02,080 that we need to refine in this country, which is community. 1135 00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:03,320 I think it's all within us. 1136 00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:04,120 Don't get me wrong. 1137 00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:06,960 But with the division that we've seen, 1138 00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:09,520 certainly over the last four plus years, 1139 00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:12,680 with COVID and beyond, that's an enemy 1140 00:59:12,680 --> 00:59:14,760 to responding to these disasters, 1141 00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:16,840 whether it's the poor people in North Carolina, 1142 00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:22,400 whether it's the fire-affected towns and areas in California. 1143 00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:24,560 If you've pre-planned and you're communicating 1144 00:59:24,560 --> 00:59:27,400 with your community, you're watching over each other. 1145 00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:28,880 And now with this technology today, 1146 00:59:28,880 --> 00:59:32,240 you've got apps that you said to see, OK, Mrs. Jones has just 1147 00:59:32,240 --> 00:59:34,400 hit the emergency button on the app. 1148 00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:36,560 Let's go get her. 1149 00:59:36,560 --> 00:59:38,560 Now you've just amplified the response. 1150 00:59:38,560 --> 00:59:39,760 It's like the Green Berets. 1151 00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:42,600 The Green Berets don't go and kick indoors, even when they 1152 00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:43,560 can. 1153 00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:45,400 They go train a militia. 1154 00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:46,960 And then the militia go kick indoors, 1155 00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:49,440 maybe with one of the Green Berets can oversee in it. 1156 00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:50,800 And it's the same thing with this. 1157 00:59:50,800 --> 00:59:53,840 I think whatever our target hazards are, 1158 00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:58,600 whether you're in the tornado corridors or the hurricanes 1159 00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:01,880 here, having that communication with the community 1160 01:00:01,880 --> 01:00:06,520 and having that preparedness so that when it happens, 1161 01:00:06,520 --> 01:00:07,960 you're not all just running around 1162 01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:09,960 like with your heads cut off. 1163 01:00:09,960 --> 01:00:12,880 And now you're screaming for first responders 1164 01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:14,720 after maybe you voted against them getting pay 1165 01:00:14,720 --> 01:00:17,640 raises and more staffing. 1166 01:00:17,640 --> 01:00:19,080 And it's too late then. 1167 01:00:19,080 --> 01:00:21,280 Whereas if you do it before, maybe then 1168 01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:23,600 that would help integrate in the first responder community 1169 01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:25,680 and people would learn a lot more about what we do, 1170 01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:30,120 how prepared we are, and what we need to be even more prepared. 1171 01:00:30,120 --> 01:00:34,560 So I think it's a great idea to really kind of spearhead 1172 01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:38,520 that community response element so that now if it happens, 1173 01:00:38,520 --> 01:00:40,000 they've already got a plan as well. 1174 01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:43,000 They're working alongside us. 1175 01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:43,480 Correct. 1176 01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:46,880 And here's the most interesting part of that too. 1177 01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,920 So every fire station has a prevention, right? 1178 01:00:49,920 --> 01:00:53,720 Whether it's a small department back somewhere 1179 01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:55,720 that he's the chief, the captain, the engineer, 1180 01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:57,960 the prevention, the mayor, right? 1181 01:00:57,960 --> 01:00:59,640 Or you have a department that has that. 1182 01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:02,240 So all the listeners, they can go to their fire station 1183 01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:05,320 right now and say, can you come to our neighborhood 1184 01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:08,760 and show us, teach us, right? 1185 01:01:08,760 --> 01:01:11,960 And if that prevention's not doing it, give me a call. 1186 01:01:11,960 --> 01:01:13,880 Give me a call. 1187 01:01:13,880 --> 01:01:16,280 I'll make a call, and we'll make it happen. 1188 01:01:16,280 --> 01:01:21,800 So we have communities that we love our country, 1189 01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:23,880 or we love our neighborhoods, we love our brothers, 1190 01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:24,720 we love our sisters. 1191 01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:30,760 It's like, OK, take that to the next level, right? 1192 01:01:30,760 --> 01:01:32,640 I mean, arm yourself. 1193 01:01:32,640 --> 01:01:34,240 Not arm yourself physically, right, 1194 01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:36,240 with the education, the power. 1195 01:01:36,240 --> 01:01:40,800 If you have fires in your areas, be on the lookout. 1196 01:01:40,800 --> 01:01:43,480 Warn your next door neighbor to say, hey, today's 1197 01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:46,800 probably not the best day to cook those hamburgers, 1198 01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:50,560 because the RH is at 2, and if you fart, 1199 01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,600 you might make a fire, Tom, right? 1200 01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:55,840 It's like, why are we not doing that? 1201 01:01:55,840 --> 01:01:58,280 You can come up with cool shirts. 1202 01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:01,280 You could be your own little fire brigade. 1203 01:02:01,280 --> 01:02:03,320 It's totally doable. 1204 01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:05,400 Like, there's no losses you cannot do. 1205 01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:08,760 I'm not telling people to go out and do all this crazy stuff. 1206 01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:10,360 We're saying basic, right? 1207 01:02:10,360 --> 01:02:11,920 We watch our kids come home. 1208 01:02:11,920 --> 01:02:12,600 We protect them. 1209 01:02:12,600 --> 01:02:16,880 We watch our dogs do the same thing with your home. 1210 01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:19,280 Protect your home. 1211 01:02:19,280 --> 01:02:20,360 You can't do that. 1212 01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:22,160 Like, a lot of people say, I'll just let it burn. 1213 01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:23,480 The insurance will take care of it. 1214 01:02:23,480 --> 01:02:25,360 It's like. 1215 01:02:25,360 --> 01:02:26,720 Not anymore, it won't. 1216 01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:28,160 They'll pull in the plug. 1217 01:02:28,160 --> 01:02:29,400 Yeah, that's not the answer. 1218 01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:30,800 Take care of your property. 1219 01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:31,800 You do everything else. 1220 01:02:31,800 --> 01:02:34,000 You're out there trimming your roses, 1221 01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:38,840 and your lawn's perfect, and your backyard's perfect. 1222 01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:41,160 Or let's say it's not perfect. 1223 01:02:41,160 --> 01:02:43,240 It can be perfect, right? 1224 01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:45,080 You can go up there and learn these things. 1225 01:02:45,080 --> 01:02:48,720 So there's no excuse to not know how 1226 01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:51,480 to do that in your neighborhood. 1227 01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:52,360 There's no excuse. 1228 01:02:52,360 --> 01:02:55,040 And I wish the Santa Ana corridors, 1229 01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,160 I wish it was almost, you can't make it mandatory, 1230 01:02:57,160 --> 01:03:00,160 but I wish it was where, if you wanted to live 1231 01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:04,320 in these areas, you had your task force neighborhood 1232 01:03:04,320 --> 01:03:05,720 number five, right? 1233 01:03:05,720 --> 01:03:07,920 You could have your whole little captain chief there, 1234 01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:10,120 and you can have little fire engines, little sirens, 1235 01:03:10,120 --> 01:03:10,960 or whatever. 1236 01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:11,640 Take care. 1237 01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:16,800 But be ready when the fire comes, and you can help out. 1238 01:03:16,800 --> 01:03:19,480 We have media guys going there, getting their likes. 1239 01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:21,080 They're in there, and they're battling, 1240 01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:22,400 they're filming, which is great. 1241 01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:27,360 It's like, how about you guys maybe help out a little bit? 1242 01:03:27,360 --> 01:03:28,920 Still get the footage. 1243 01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:29,680 It can be awesome. 1244 01:03:29,680 --> 01:03:31,640 It could be better footage. 1245 01:03:31,640 --> 01:03:35,240 If you put that fire out, you'd have more likes. 1246 01:03:35,240 --> 01:03:37,760 But instead, you said, I can't do anything. 1247 01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:41,920 So it's, yeah, don't get me started on that. 1248 01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:46,040 But anyways, it can be done. 1249 01:03:46,040 --> 01:03:48,520 And I've been trying to do that since my book came out. 1250 01:03:48,520 --> 01:03:51,600 And we've had some committees doing it. 1251 01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:55,360 They got some people buy their own, an old fire engine, 1252 01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:57,840 an old slip-on, called a slip-on. 1253 01:03:57,840 --> 01:03:58,880 They put it on their trucks. 1254 01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:01,400 Got 100 gallons, 150 gallons. 1255 01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:02,480 They have wedding agents. 1256 01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:05,440 They have pumps that they put in the creek 1257 01:04:05,440 --> 01:04:08,480 that all the neighbors can come and use the fire kit 1258 01:04:08,480 --> 01:04:09,960 if they need to. 1259 01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:11,200 How cool is that? 1260 01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:12,800 And then when the foresters comes in, 1261 01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:16,960 it's like, oh, man, that whole section up there, they're good. 1262 01:04:16,960 --> 01:04:18,880 They can move on to the next section 1263 01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:22,000 because they're taking care of their own land. 1264 01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:24,040 What you said about the journalists reminds me, 1265 01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:25,400 and it was funny, I was in Anaheim 1266 01:04:25,400 --> 01:04:29,680 when I saw this in station six in the kitchen. 1267 01:04:29,680 --> 01:04:34,040 Geraldo, I'll never forget this, middle of Katrina, 1268 01:04:34,040 --> 01:04:37,280 he's there under this overpass. 1269 01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:40,240 And he's like, man, I was here three days ago 1270 01:04:40,240 --> 01:04:42,000 and the same families are here. 1271 01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:44,360 And I just remember looking at him going, 1272 01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:47,440 well, then why the fuck didn't you take him with you? 1273 01:04:47,440 --> 01:04:48,280 Right? 1274 01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:49,120 You know what I mean? 1275 01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:50,320 This is exactly what you were just saying. 1276 01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,160 You went there, filmed these people, 1277 01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:53,480 and then you fucking left. 1278 01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:55,840 And then you have the audacity to come back 1279 01:04:55,840 --> 01:04:58,200 and say, why haven't these people been rescued? 1280 01:04:58,200 --> 01:05:00,720 That is the fucking problem right there. 1281 01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:02,040 Yeah, it is. 1282 01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:04,000 You know, my dad's gone now, 1283 01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:07,360 but he would have some comment to like, 1284 01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:09,800 he would say, son, pull your head out of your ass. 1285 01:05:09,800 --> 01:05:10,640 Right? 1286 01:05:10,640 --> 01:05:13,440 It's like, I just couldn't believe it 1287 01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:14,760 when I see stuff like that. 1288 01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:17,600 And you're like, make a difference. 1289 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:20,880 Like, I don't care if you're a journalist. 1290 01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:22,680 I don't care if you're this. 1291 01:05:22,680 --> 01:05:23,520 Do something. 1292 01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:27,160 You see an elderly person on the floor hurt? 1293 01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:31,520 When do you wanna pass up an opportunity 1294 01:05:31,520 --> 01:05:35,200 to be Superman or Batman or Spider-Man? 1295 01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:38,040 Again, some people are not able to, but you can help. 1296 01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:40,560 You can help. 1297 01:05:40,560 --> 01:05:42,160 Not everyone's tuned that way, 1298 01:05:42,160 --> 01:05:45,640 but everyone growing up in the kid, right? 1299 01:05:45,640 --> 01:05:47,160 Think back when everyone was your kid, right? 1300 01:05:47,160 --> 01:05:49,400 Everyone's a superhero, right? 1301 01:05:50,240 --> 01:05:51,520 I don't remember that many kids saying, 1302 01:05:51,520 --> 01:05:52,960 I don't wanna be a superhero. 1303 01:05:54,400 --> 01:05:57,480 So all of us, at least all people around my circle, 1304 01:05:57,480 --> 01:06:00,920 it's like, oh yeah, man, like this guy, it was this guy. 1305 01:06:00,920 --> 01:06:02,240 We all started that within us. 1306 01:06:02,240 --> 01:06:04,120 Why are we not doing it? 1307 01:06:04,120 --> 01:06:05,840 It doesn't matter how old you get. 1308 01:06:07,680 --> 01:06:08,600 Make a difference. 1309 01:06:08,600 --> 01:06:12,680 So it's sad to see the fire, to see the mayor speak, 1310 01:06:12,680 --> 01:06:16,320 to see the chief across the table, right? 1311 01:06:16,320 --> 01:06:18,720 When you have your core people, you're the mayor, 1312 01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:21,200 you have your high brass next to you 1313 01:06:21,200 --> 01:06:22,760 within touching distance. 1314 01:06:23,600 --> 01:06:25,760 You help me with the question, I help you. 1315 01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:27,400 I have my team with me. 1316 01:06:27,400 --> 01:06:31,600 My team is not sitting over there across the table, 1317 01:06:31,600 --> 01:06:34,600 looking down at their knees or looking at the ground. 1318 01:06:36,360 --> 01:06:38,080 I can tell right now you guys are screwed up. 1319 01:06:38,080 --> 01:06:39,880 I don't wanna go to a mission with you. 1320 01:06:40,840 --> 01:06:43,880 But the good thing again, you can fix it. 1321 01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:46,480 Course it's gonna cause some waves. 1322 01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:48,200 Course you're gonna be hit. 1323 01:06:48,200 --> 01:06:50,840 When you wear those collar brass, 1324 01:06:50,840 --> 01:06:53,280 I'm sorry, you're getting paid to get hit. 1325 01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:55,240 You're getting paid to get kicked. 1326 01:06:55,240 --> 01:06:56,840 You're getting paid to all these things. 1327 01:06:56,840 --> 01:07:00,440 And if you don't like it, as my old supervisor says, 1328 01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:02,400 McDonald's would love to have you. 1329 01:07:03,320 --> 01:07:05,640 McDonald's is always looking for some, 1330 01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:08,800 the best of the best, right? 1331 01:07:08,800 --> 01:07:11,160 I've met some great McDonald's folks that worked there 1332 01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:13,000 and now they're doing great things. 1333 01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:16,360 They took pride in to give you the best fries, right? 1334 01:07:16,360 --> 01:07:17,520 Not the healthiest, right? 1335 01:07:17,520 --> 01:07:20,480 Or to make your milkshake or your McNuggets, 1336 01:07:20,480 --> 01:07:22,400 whatever it may be, right? 1337 01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:26,120 It's just, it's this, we've lost this peace. 1338 01:07:26,120 --> 01:07:28,320 And again, the answer that it can be fixed, 1339 01:07:28,320 --> 01:07:30,080 but we've lost some mentors, right? 1340 01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:33,880 I mean, it's like bring back Superman, bring back Spider-Man, 1341 01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:37,120 bring back the Fonz, right? 1342 01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:41,020 Things that were mentors that had good values 1343 01:07:41,020 --> 01:07:42,080 and they did something. 1344 01:07:42,080 --> 01:07:44,840 And we're getting some of those, the Sean Ryan Show, 1345 01:07:44,840 --> 01:07:47,080 the work that you do, right? 1346 01:07:47,080 --> 01:07:48,020 It's amazing. 1347 01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:51,040 It's like, where are these folks? 1348 01:07:51,040 --> 01:07:52,560 Stand up, right? 1349 01:07:52,560 --> 01:07:54,040 Shine that sword. 1350 01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:56,560 Shine your tennis shoes. 1351 01:07:56,560 --> 01:08:00,600 I mean, be any superhero that you want, right? 1352 01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:02,040 Seattle used to have a superhero, 1353 01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:03,680 I can't remember his name, it'll come to me. 1354 01:08:03,680 --> 01:08:08,680 He used to walk the streets of Seattle and look for crime. 1355 01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:12,000 I talked to him, right? 1356 01:08:12,000 --> 01:08:13,320 More than once. 1357 01:08:13,320 --> 01:08:15,840 And the guy was a little bit right, 1358 01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:19,360 but he was out there protecting people. 1359 01:08:20,960 --> 01:08:22,440 And he wore a mask. 1360 01:08:22,440 --> 01:08:25,200 It's like, awesome, man. 1361 01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:26,040 So. 1362 01:08:27,160 --> 01:08:29,000 Yeah, we can go on for hours about that. 1363 01:08:30,280 --> 01:08:32,840 Well, I wanna hit one more area, then we'll wrap up. 1364 01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:33,880 Sure. 1365 01:08:33,880 --> 01:08:37,200 When, I think it was literally this morning or last night, 1366 01:08:37,200 --> 01:08:38,280 it's funny, because we were just about 1367 01:08:38,280 --> 01:08:39,960 to have this conversation. 1368 01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:42,200 I saw an article and then I Googled it 1369 01:08:42,200 --> 01:08:44,080 and this was actually a real thing, 1370 01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,840 that from the Trump administration, 1371 01:08:46,840 --> 01:08:50,480 there was a directive that any mention of climate change 1372 01:08:50,480 --> 01:08:52,680 had to be removed from, I think it was the USDA 1373 01:08:52,680 --> 01:08:54,120 and the Forest Service. 1374 01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:58,200 Every single person, and correct me if I'm wrong, 1375 01:08:58,200 --> 01:09:01,120 you included, that I know there's actually boots 1376 01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:04,560 on the ground, wildland firefighters said, 1377 01:09:04,560 --> 01:09:06,200 climate change has made a difference. 1378 01:09:06,200 --> 01:09:08,840 These fires are getting bigger and bigger and bigger. 1379 01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:10,560 Now, my perspective on this, 1380 01:09:10,560 --> 01:09:13,360 having lived in California, for example, 1381 01:09:13,360 --> 01:09:17,400 is we can see how polluted our airs, our oceans are anyway. 1382 01:09:17,400 --> 01:09:19,240 So it's not even a question. 1383 01:09:19,240 --> 01:09:22,680 We are damaging the planet with the way that we do business 1384 01:09:22,680 --> 01:09:24,800 with the pollution and all that stuff. 1385 01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:27,080 Perfect example, when COVID happened, 1386 01:09:27,080 --> 01:09:29,640 look at the change. 1387 01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:33,680 So there's a clear difference between business as usual 1388 01:09:33,680 --> 01:09:36,960 and when we actually take our emissions seriously. 1389 01:09:36,960 --> 01:09:40,480 So with that all being said, obviously that's my perspective, 1390 01:09:40,480 --> 01:09:43,160 but this directive was handed down. 1391 01:09:43,160 --> 01:09:46,840 What is your perception of climate change and these fires? 1392 01:09:46,840 --> 01:09:49,960 Because if the wildland community seems to think 1393 01:09:49,960 --> 01:09:52,640 this is an issue, that's another reason 1394 01:09:52,640 --> 01:09:56,200 why we should be looking for alternative ways 1395 01:09:56,200 --> 01:09:59,280 of reducing all the contributing factors 1396 01:09:59,280 --> 01:10:04,280 so that we can mitigate all these kind of symptoms 1397 01:10:04,520 --> 01:10:07,360 that we're seeing, including obviously making it far more 1398 01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:08,800 dangerous for our firefighters. 1399 01:10:09,680 --> 01:10:10,600 Correct. 1400 01:10:10,600 --> 01:10:13,920 So in my book, a good chapter, let's see here, 1401 01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:17,120 I should know this by heart, chapter 17, 18, 1402 01:10:17,120 --> 01:10:19,080 possibly 16 or even before, 1403 01:10:20,320 --> 01:10:21,520 we talk about a lot of things, right? 1404 01:10:21,520 --> 01:10:23,800 The planet Earth is a dynamic thing, right? 1405 01:10:23,800 --> 01:10:27,120 We've had ice ages, we've had this, we've had that. 1406 01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:30,600 Have we added some horrible things to it? 1407 01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:31,440 Yes. 1408 01:10:31,440 --> 01:10:32,260 Does that change? 1409 01:10:32,260 --> 01:10:33,100 Yes. 1410 01:10:33,100 --> 01:10:34,520 You can't argue that part. 1411 01:10:34,520 --> 01:10:38,360 And I've learned as I've done briefings at state capitals 1412 01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:42,240 and all these things and governors and president's team, 1413 01:10:42,240 --> 01:10:44,640 everyone has their own definition of something. 1414 01:10:44,640 --> 01:10:48,800 I like to be calibrated to mean red is red, it's not blue. 1415 01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:52,220 Black is black, white is white, pink is pink. 1416 01:10:52,220 --> 01:10:55,020 Where some folks will say red is, no, it's kind of yellow. 1417 01:10:56,080 --> 01:10:56,920 No, it's red. 1418 01:10:58,520 --> 01:11:00,920 And I understand what some of these folks say, 1419 01:11:00,920 --> 01:11:03,480 hey, we're freaking people out about climate change 1420 01:11:03,480 --> 01:11:06,320 and that course is changing. 1421 01:11:06,320 --> 01:11:10,120 Have we added horrible smog and all these things, right? 1422 01:11:10,120 --> 01:11:11,840 From our plastics and all these, 1423 01:11:11,840 --> 01:11:13,520 yeah, we've made a difference. 1424 01:11:13,520 --> 01:11:15,080 Some of it's not good. 1425 01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:15,920 We know that. 1426 01:11:17,120 --> 01:11:19,840 Two plus two is four, right? 1427 01:11:19,840 --> 01:11:23,120 I had a PhD say, well, Jason, 1428 01:11:23,120 --> 01:11:25,040 not if we're talking quantum physics. 1429 01:11:25,040 --> 01:11:27,960 And I said, okay, you're beyond me now. 1430 01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:29,400 You're missing the point. 1431 01:11:29,400 --> 01:11:31,520 Let's just stick on Spock. 1432 01:11:31,520 --> 01:11:35,000 Two plus two is four, no matter what galaxy you're at. 1433 01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:40,000 So yes, there's an issue there. 1434 01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:43,960 The issue on the fire stuff, and I had this with my book. 1435 01:11:43,960 --> 01:11:48,480 I was teeth to teeth fighting with my author 1436 01:11:48,480 --> 01:11:50,880 and all my team. 1437 01:11:50,880 --> 01:11:53,780 And it's like, the problem still is our fuel. 1438 01:11:55,640 --> 01:12:00,640 The climate change could make my one hour fuels 1439 01:12:00,640 --> 01:12:04,040 with the rain and the seeds that came in grow faster. 1440 01:12:04,040 --> 01:12:05,000 I grow too. 1441 01:12:05,000 --> 01:12:06,400 I'm a farmer, I can grow. 1442 01:12:06,400 --> 01:12:10,560 People say you can't transplant carrots. 1443 01:12:10,560 --> 01:12:13,640 I can transplant carrots and I've done it. 1444 01:12:13,640 --> 01:12:14,480 I do microgreens. 1445 01:12:14,480 --> 01:12:15,880 So I know how things grow. 1446 01:12:15,880 --> 01:12:19,120 I know the effects of RHs, water. 1447 01:12:19,120 --> 01:12:21,280 When you starve something, how it reacts, 1448 01:12:21,280 --> 01:12:24,220 how it becomes more flammable and fuel moistures. 1449 01:12:24,220 --> 01:12:26,040 I have all the gear I've designed with Kestrel. 1450 01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:27,280 I have a weather meter, right? 1451 01:12:27,280 --> 01:12:29,120 All these things, it's like, no, 1452 01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:30,660 there is a difference there. 1453 01:12:30,660 --> 01:12:33,700 So climate change depends on who you're talking to, 1454 01:12:33,700 --> 01:12:35,880 but yes, there's something happening. 1455 01:12:35,880 --> 01:12:38,800 It's always happening, but is it happening worse? 1456 01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:41,380 We're adding some things that are not good 1457 01:12:41,380 --> 01:12:46,380 and we won't know, but why keep adding some bad stuff 1458 01:12:46,600 --> 01:12:48,300 that's gonna make it worse, right? 1459 01:12:50,660 --> 01:12:52,640 And the sad part is when there's, 1460 01:12:54,040 --> 01:12:55,080 you do some of the research, 1461 01:12:55,080 --> 01:12:57,960 folks that live near certain parts of the country, 1462 01:12:57,960 --> 01:12:59,240 the waters, right? 1463 01:12:59,240 --> 01:13:03,840 And the melt off and all these things, it's happening. 1464 01:13:03,840 --> 01:13:06,000 Do we know if it's exactly this or that? 1465 01:13:06,000 --> 01:13:08,000 Some of them might come out and say, hey, no, 1466 01:13:08,000 --> 01:13:09,900 it was actually the Willy Wonka movie 1467 01:13:09,900 --> 01:13:14,120 because everyone made gobstoppers or jawbreakers 1468 01:13:14,120 --> 01:13:16,280 and that sugar actually caused this 1469 01:13:16,280 --> 01:13:18,280 and that's why you had all the fires. 1470 01:13:18,280 --> 01:13:20,280 I mean, I'm choking, but right? 1471 01:13:21,160 --> 01:13:23,720 You have all these PhDs and you listen to all these 1472 01:13:23,720 --> 01:13:27,240 very smart people and you can't argue. 1473 01:13:27,240 --> 01:13:28,780 So I'm out of the forest service now, 1474 01:13:28,780 --> 01:13:30,920 so I would kind of argue some of that 1475 01:13:30,920 --> 01:13:33,840 because things are changing, right? 1476 01:13:35,760 --> 01:13:37,240 I lived in Southern California 1477 01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:40,280 and the amount of smog back then to some of the stuff now, 1478 01:13:41,280 --> 01:13:43,440 that's from us, right? 1479 01:13:43,440 --> 01:13:46,120 That's not bears farting and coyotes farting 1480 01:13:46,120 --> 01:13:48,080 and deer farting. 1481 01:13:48,080 --> 01:13:49,760 We're putting that air, you're trying to tell me 1482 01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:51,240 that doesn't do something? 1483 01:13:52,640 --> 01:13:55,560 It does something to my lungs 1484 01:13:55,560 --> 01:14:00,560 because my lung capacity is not the same anymore, right? 1485 01:14:00,560 --> 01:14:03,360 And I was a kid, I had problems, I had to take, you know. 1486 01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:08,200 So I hope that didn't confuse the listeners 1487 01:14:08,200 --> 01:14:12,600 or answer the question, but to say something's not changing, 1488 01:14:12,600 --> 01:14:14,400 if you wanna call it a different word, 1489 01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:17,920 let's call it a different word, but something's happening. 1490 01:14:17,920 --> 01:14:20,600 Yeah, I think this is the thing is you wanna identify 1491 01:14:20,600 --> 01:14:22,360 all of the contributing factors 1492 01:14:22,360 --> 01:14:25,860 and if you just kind of brush one under the carpet, 1493 01:14:25,860 --> 01:14:29,200 like I said, the obesity epidemic brushed under the carpet 1494 01:14:29,200 --> 01:14:31,600 during COVID, still a massive problem. 1495 01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:33,560 Is it the only reason with COVID? 1496 01:14:33,560 --> 01:14:36,240 No, but is it a massive thing that needs to be addressed? 1497 01:14:36,240 --> 01:14:39,520 Yeah, sleep deprivation and firefighters, massive, 1498 01:14:39,520 --> 01:14:41,080 no one wants to talk about it. 1499 01:14:41,080 --> 01:14:43,000 Everyone's, oh, we can't do that, 1500 01:14:43,000 --> 01:14:44,560 we don't have the money, all this shit 1501 01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:45,720 and our firefighters are dying 1502 01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:47,560 and we have a national recruitment crisis. 1503 01:14:47,560 --> 01:14:51,880 So by suppressing one of these elements, 1504 01:14:51,880 --> 01:14:53,320 you're basically saying, 1505 01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:55,560 I actually don't wanna fix the problem. 1506 01:14:55,560 --> 01:14:56,920 Now, like you said, is that everything? 1507 01:14:56,920 --> 01:14:59,320 No, but if we can figure out, 1508 01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:00,800 like, I mean, just public transport, 1509 01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:03,520 some of these other things that it's not about, 1510 01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:05,360 every car being electric. 1511 01:15:05,360 --> 01:15:08,800 It's like why, I saw a great video a while ago 1512 01:15:08,800 --> 01:15:13,480 and they had dramatized what a street would look like 1513 01:15:13,480 --> 01:15:14,680 without the car. 1514 01:15:14,680 --> 01:15:17,160 So you had people and they were walking 1515 01:15:17,160 --> 01:15:18,520 and stopping in front of red lights 1516 01:15:18,520 --> 01:15:20,560 and then walking to the, you know what I mean? 1517 01:15:20,560 --> 01:15:23,280 And you realize how much space a single car takes. 1518 01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:25,000 You know, you look at the fricking vehicles 1519 01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:28,320 people drive these days for them and their one child 1520 01:15:28,320 --> 01:15:31,120 or whatever it is, and it looks like a fucking school bus. 1521 01:15:31,120 --> 01:15:34,800 So there are ways of still having the same quality of life, 1522 01:15:34,800 --> 01:15:39,200 but much better public transport or the hybrid vehicles, 1523 01:15:39,200 --> 01:15:43,720 whatever it is, we can make a better impact on this. 1524 01:15:43,720 --> 01:15:45,440 And I get it as well, India, China, 1525 01:15:45,440 --> 01:15:48,560 there are other countries that have to buy into this too. 1526 01:15:48,560 --> 01:15:51,120 But by suppressing the conversation, we fix nothing. 1527 01:15:51,120 --> 01:15:52,280 So- 1528 01:15:52,280 --> 01:15:55,160 Correct, and yeah, it sucks, man. 1529 01:15:55,160 --> 01:15:56,960 And like I said, if you wanna change a name, 1530 01:15:56,960 --> 01:15:58,920 but there is, I watch so many documentaries, 1531 01:15:58,920 --> 01:16:00,600 I love education every night before I go to bed, 1532 01:16:00,600 --> 01:16:03,480 I watch an educational piece. 1533 01:16:03,480 --> 01:16:04,800 I watch some funny stuff. 1534 01:16:04,800 --> 01:16:07,400 Every single night I fall asleep to something, 1535 01:16:07,400 --> 01:16:12,120 whether it's a PhD, a professor at a university, 1536 01:16:12,120 --> 01:16:14,320 some I fall asleep and don't wanna listen to again, 1537 01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:19,320 some I'm like, wow, this person is, I mean, 1538 01:16:19,800 --> 01:16:21,480 some of the folks Sean Ryan's been interviewing 1539 01:16:21,480 --> 01:16:24,400 are crazy, I mean, crazy good. 1540 01:16:24,400 --> 01:16:27,760 And the stuff you're interviewing is like, wow, right? 1541 01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:30,680 How cool to have a phone book of all those people 1542 01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:32,840 I can call or you could call. 1543 01:16:32,840 --> 01:16:34,760 Instead of I gotta go to an agent 1544 01:16:34,760 --> 01:16:37,520 or I gotta get ahold of this CAA guy 1545 01:16:37,520 --> 01:16:40,520 to talk to Fred, to Diana, to give him a call, 1546 01:16:40,520 --> 01:16:42,800 to text him so I can call him or her. 1547 01:16:44,760 --> 01:16:48,080 It's like, come on, share your mojo, share it all. 1548 01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:48,920 Share it all. 1549 01:16:48,920 --> 01:16:51,720 I gotta agree with you on the climate change. 1550 01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:56,560 It's a crazy, again, it's always changing, 1551 01:16:56,560 --> 01:16:57,920 but again, we're not adding, 1552 01:16:57,920 --> 01:16:59,600 we're not making the problem better. 1553 01:16:59,600 --> 01:17:01,000 Put it that way. 1554 01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:02,040 We're not making it better. 1555 01:17:02,040 --> 01:17:03,120 If people wanna argue about that, 1556 01:17:03,120 --> 01:17:05,040 it's like, hey, forget climate change, all that. 1557 01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:06,880 We're not making it better. 1558 01:17:06,880 --> 01:17:09,160 See all that brown stuff over there 1559 01:17:09,160 --> 01:17:11,560 that's supposed to look, supposed to be clear 1560 01:17:12,400 --> 01:17:16,640 and it looks nasty, that's from us, right? 1561 01:17:16,640 --> 01:17:17,640 Let's fix it. 1562 01:17:17,640 --> 01:17:20,520 So yeah, that's a crazy topic. 1563 01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:23,200 And I've been, especially working for the Forest Service 1564 01:17:23,200 --> 01:17:24,280 and hearing all these things 1565 01:17:24,280 --> 01:17:26,480 and seeing on it and being an employee. 1566 01:17:27,760 --> 01:17:28,600 Right? 1567 01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:31,840 It's like, huh, no, something's happening. 1568 01:17:33,120 --> 01:17:33,960 It's not funny. 1569 01:17:33,960 --> 01:17:36,520 I'm laughing as a, not laughing at it, 1570 01:17:36,520 --> 01:17:39,200 laughing that it's real. 1571 01:17:39,200 --> 01:17:40,440 Absolutely. 1572 01:17:40,440 --> 01:17:42,320 All right, well then you mentioned the book. 1573 01:17:42,320 --> 01:17:44,280 Your book is Smokejumper. 1574 01:17:44,280 --> 01:17:46,120 Where can people find that? 1575 01:17:46,120 --> 01:17:48,320 And then also, where can they reach out to you 1576 01:17:48,320 --> 01:17:50,760 or learn more about some of the innovative projects 1577 01:17:50,760 --> 01:17:52,600 that you're a part of? 1578 01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:54,120 So Amazon's a good place. 1579 01:17:54,120 --> 01:17:55,160 Audible's great. 1580 01:17:56,280 --> 01:18:00,000 The voice who played me, it's date, how old I am, 1581 01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:00,880 was Ned Vaughn. 1582 01:18:00,880 --> 01:18:03,880 He was in the movie for The Red October. 1583 01:18:03,880 --> 01:18:05,080 So he was one of the sound techs 1584 01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:08,240 listening for Sean Connery's submarine. 1585 01:18:08,240 --> 01:18:09,680 So it was pretty cool to have him. 1586 01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:10,560 I got to pick him. 1587 01:18:10,560 --> 01:18:14,160 I liked his voice and he was an ex-wind surfer kind of thing. 1588 01:18:14,160 --> 01:18:16,760 So Amazon or smokejumperbook.com, 1589 01:18:16,760 --> 01:18:19,040 you can just Google it and you'll find it. 1590 01:18:19,040 --> 01:18:20,880 I am easy to get a hold of, right? 1591 01:18:20,880 --> 01:18:23,240 You get on there, you'll find my number. 1592 01:18:23,240 --> 01:18:25,480 If you crank call me, I'll crank call you back. 1593 01:18:27,600 --> 01:18:29,800 I love it when people call me and say, 1594 01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:32,160 Mr. Ramos, your taxes, you're gonna get arrested. 1595 01:18:32,160 --> 01:18:33,400 You gotta pay us money now. 1596 01:18:33,400 --> 01:18:34,320 I said, really? 1597 01:18:36,080 --> 01:18:37,060 Tell you what, come on over. 1598 01:18:37,060 --> 01:18:38,720 I'll give you a check right now. 1599 01:18:39,680 --> 01:18:41,280 So again, that's my comedy. 1600 01:18:41,280 --> 01:18:45,380 Some days I pick up these calls and the spam calls. 1601 01:18:45,380 --> 01:18:47,000 It's bummer now because there are more robots now. 1602 01:18:47,000 --> 01:18:49,720 I liked it when they were real people, the spam calls. 1603 01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:52,120 So again, my number's out there. 1604 01:18:52,120 --> 01:18:53,400 You can read my book. 1605 01:18:54,860 --> 01:18:57,400 I work with a lot of companies out there. 1606 01:18:57,400 --> 01:18:59,200 I'm still, I've designed some better 1607 01:18:59,200 --> 01:19:00,280 fire gear for firefighters. 1608 01:19:00,280 --> 01:19:01,680 That's a passion of mine. 1609 01:19:01,680 --> 01:19:04,320 No, I don't get a lot of money for this stuff, right? 1610 01:19:04,320 --> 01:19:05,140 I'm not a millionaire. 1611 01:19:05,140 --> 01:19:07,740 I still work, I'm retired, but I'm not retired from work. 1612 01:19:07,740 --> 01:19:09,080 I still work my butt off. 1613 01:19:09,080 --> 01:19:11,640 Some of the stuff I get pennies for. 1614 01:19:11,640 --> 01:19:13,800 Some of the stuff I don't get money for. 1615 01:19:13,800 --> 01:19:17,500 Some of the stuff I've designed, I never had a contract. 1616 01:19:17,500 --> 01:19:18,680 I never had anything. 1617 01:19:19,560 --> 01:19:22,320 And they're still on the shelf and I say, ugh. 1618 01:19:22,320 --> 01:19:23,680 And my advisors or lawyers say, 1619 01:19:23,680 --> 01:19:25,760 Jason, you can't do that anymore. 1620 01:19:25,760 --> 01:19:26,600 I say, well, I'm the owner. 1621 01:19:26,600 --> 01:19:27,420 I can do what I want. 1622 01:19:27,420 --> 01:19:28,760 They're like, well, yeah, but. 1623 01:19:29,920 --> 01:19:32,120 So yeah, smokejumpbook.com, Amazon. 1624 01:19:32,120 --> 01:19:35,400 And I tell folks, just hear me out. 1625 01:19:35,400 --> 01:19:36,880 You don't have to believe everything I say, 1626 01:19:36,880 --> 01:19:39,040 but I hope you enjoy the book. 1627 01:19:39,040 --> 01:19:40,920 It's for all first responders. 1628 01:19:40,920 --> 01:19:43,580 It's not just about smoke jumping. 1629 01:19:43,580 --> 01:19:45,240 I started off as a volunteer. 1630 01:19:45,240 --> 01:19:47,440 My heart is still as a volunteer firefighter. 1631 01:19:48,680 --> 01:19:51,160 So it's for everyone, for the wives. 1632 01:19:51,160 --> 01:19:53,040 And it's pretty cool in the years past 1633 01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:55,080 to have husbands and wives come over and say, 1634 01:19:55,080 --> 01:19:55,920 thank you, Jason. 1635 01:19:55,920 --> 01:19:57,960 Now I know what my husband does 1636 01:19:57,960 --> 01:20:01,600 because he doesn't talk about it, right? 1637 01:20:01,600 --> 01:20:03,000 And some do talk about it. 1638 01:20:03,000 --> 01:20:04,520 So that was pretty cool. 1639 01:20:04,520 --> 01:20:06,520 The guys whispered in my ear, Jason, good book, 1640 01:20:06,520 --> 01:20:08,360 because they don't want to hear someone else, right, 1641 01:20:08,360 --> 01:20:11,400 hearing that he's giving me a thumbs up. 1642 01:20:11,400 --> 01:20:13,520 And you find out who your friends are 1643 01:20:13,520 --> 01:20:15,280 when I wrote the book. 1644 01:20:15,280 --> 01:20:17,720 My commanding officer stood by my side. 1645 01:20:19,520 --> 01:20:20,820 And just a few more. 1646 01:20:20,820 --> 01:20:25,340 Everyone else, they're not my bros, right? 1647 01:20:25,340 --> 01:20:27,400 That's one thing I don't, I hate, you know, 1648 01:20:27,400 --> 01:20:28,440 oh, you're my bro. 1649 01:20:28,440 --> 01:20:29,360 I was like, yeah. 1650 01:20:31,840 --> 01:20:33,800 I don't do high fives, I do low fives. 1651 01:20:35,540 --> 01:20:37,400 So yeah, and I hope people read the book 1652 01:20:37,400 --> 01:20:38,400 and please share it. 1653 01:20:38,400 --> 01:20:42,720 And you can make a difference. 1654 01:20:42,720 --> 01:20:45,080 You can design something if you have an idea. 1655 01:20:45,080 --> 01:20:46,120 I've designed multiple things 1656 01:20:46,120 --> 01:20:48,560 with some of the biggest companies on planet Earth. 1657 01:20:48,560 --> 01:20:49,700 I've helped do it. 1658 01:20:50,540 --> 01:20:53,920 You don't need a degree in engineering or a PhD. 1659 01:20:53,920 --> 01:20:57,220 I got three degrees, but they're just in passion. 1660 01:20:57,220 --> 01:20:59,880 So it's a little riddle if anyone could figure that out. 1661 01:20:59,880 --> 01:21:00,960 But I got three degrees. 1662 01:21:00,960 --> 01:21:04,120 So I got to do a TEDx talk, right, live in New York, 1663 01:21:04,120 --> 01:21:08,120 which I've quite a bit off on that one, 1664 01:21:09,120 --> 01:21:13,080 but hard to do verbatim with no teleprompter 1665 01:21:13,080 --> 01:21:14,880 in front of a live audience. 1666 01:21:14,880 --> 01:21:18,560 And if you screw up, you don't get to be on YouTube. 1667 01:21:18,560 --> 01:21:22,080 So it's like a little bit of pressure, right? 1668 01:21:22,080 --> 01:21:22,920 A little bit. 1669 01:21:23,920 --> 01:21:25,320 Well, I wanna thank you so much. 1670 01:21:25,320 --> 01:21:26,560 If people were listening, 1671 01:21:26,560 --> 01:21:28,920 if you haven't listened to episode 219, 1672 01:21:28,920 --> 01:21:31,000 you know, we lead you through your career. 1673 01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:33,440 So another great, great conversation. 1674 01:21:33,440 --> 01:21:34,920 But this was just so pertinent. 1675 01:21:34,920 --> 01:21:36,960 I'm gonna push this out almost straight away 1676 01:21:36,960 --> 01:21:40,040 because I think now as these fires are dying down, 1677 01:21:40,040 --> 01:21:41,480 as the media is packing up 1678 01:21:41,480 --> 01:21:44,440 and getting ready to cover some other disaster, 1679 01:21:44,440 --> 01:21:46,640 you know, this is the perfect time 1680 01:21:46,640 --> 01:21:47,840 to address some of these issues 1681 01:21:47,840 --> 01:21:49,600 and to address the first responder health. 1682 01:21:49,600 --> 01:21:51,720 These firefighters that were hailed as heroes, 1683 01:21:51,720 --> 01:21:54,560 let's actually get them a working environment that's healthy. 1684 01:21:54,560 --> 01:21:56,240 So I wanna thank you so much 1685 01:21:56,240 --> 01:21:58,360 for being so generous with your time again 1686 01:21:58,360 --> 01:22:01,000 and coming back onto the Behind the Shield podcast. 1687 01:22:01,960 --> 01:22:02,800 Thank you so much, James. 1688 01:22:02,800 --> 01:22:05,240 It's been great to have you, you know, in my circle. 1689 01:22:05,240 --> 01:22:06,880 You're a friend, you've always answered the phone with me. 1690 01:22:06,880 --> 01:22:08,280 You're great to talk to you. 1691 01:22:08,280 --> 01:22:09,720 You have compassion, you listen. 1692 01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:13,080 And it's just, right, if I can just clone folks like you, 1693 01:22:13,080 --> 01:22:15,440 all the people who would be, 1694 01:22:15,440 --> 01:22:17,320 not even clone that, we can make folks, right? 1695 01:22:17,320 --> 01:22:18,400 Get mentors. 1696 01:22:19,280 --> 01:22:21,120 All the listeners out there, that's how I started. 1697 01:22:21,120 --> 01:22:23,080 You'll hear it in the first episode. 1698 01:22:23,080 --> 01:22:25,400 I call people, I meet people and become my mentors. 1699 01:22:25,400 --> 01:22:27,000 They're friends of mine to today. 1700 01:22:27,000 --> 01:22:29,400 Some of the biggest CEOs now are my mentors. 1701 01:22:30,360 --> 01:22:31,280 And they're friends. 1702 01:22:31,280 --> 01:22:32,760 It's like, how cool is that? 1703 01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:34,160 So thank you, it's an honor. 1704 01:22:34,160 --> 01:23:02,840 Thank you, you're the best.