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This episode is sponsored by 511, a company I've used personally for well over a decade

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This episode is brought to you by GovX and as you know, I only have companies on here

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every single time you purchase.

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Welcome to episode 379 of Behind the Shield podcast.

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As always, my name is James Gearing and it is my absolute honor to welcome this week,

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NIMS Die.

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Now, we recorded this a few weeks ago, but NIMS has a brand new book coming out, which

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will be released today when I put this out, which is called Beyond Possible.

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A background on NIMS, he was a Nepalese Gurkha serving with the British army, then transitioned

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to the SBS, Special Boat Service, one of the most elite fighting organizations on the planet,

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and then transitioned to becoming an incredibly elite mountain climber, not only climbing

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14 of the highest peaks in record breaking time, but also facilitating multiple rescues

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as well.

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So I can't stress how much depth there is to NIMS' story, how much you need to buy his

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book as well, but I'm so, so honored that I was one of the first people to get the interview

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prior to the book coming out.

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Now before we get to that interview, as I say every week, please just take a moment,

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go to whichever app you listen to this on, subscribe to the show, leave feedback and

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leave a rating.

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Each five star rating truly elevates this podcast, making it easier for people to find.

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And this is a free library for you, Planet Earth.

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So all I ask in return is that you help share these incredible men and women's stories so

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I can get them to everyone else who hasn't heard them yet.

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So with that being said, I introduce to you NIMS Die.

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Enjoy.

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All right.

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So NIMS, I'm going to start by saying thank you so much for taking the time to come on

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the podcast.

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I have been following you now for a couple of years, I think, since Eric Donohoe introduced

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us, but I think now is the perfect time with the book being ready to be released.

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Hey, buddy.

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Yeah, so good to obviously, you know, glad to be having this conversation and obviously

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glad to see you a bit earlier on this in the Skype as well.

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James, yeah, it's been quite a while that, you know, obviously Eric has been obviously

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in Nepal with us and all that.

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But yeah, great to be connected, Paul.

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Absolutely.

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Well, first question, where on planet Earth are we finding you today?

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Well, right now I'm at my home in Hemsire and I've just been back here basically for

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the book launch.

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So, yeah.

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And that's actually in Nepal?

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No, it's in Hemsire in England, buddy.

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It's near the doorstep.

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I wish I was in Nepal, you know?

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Okay.

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But I got to be here for obviously, you know, various interviews and stuff for obviously

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the book, Beyond Possible and To Be Fair, mate, and I'm really excited and all that.

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So yeah, it's all good thing, I suppose.

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Beautiful.

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Well, yeah, the publisher was kind enough to send me a copy and we're definitely going

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to talk about that.

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But it was a great read just so that you know ahead of time.

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So I want to start chronologically.

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So where were you born?

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And then tell me about your family dynamic, what your parents did and how many siblings.

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Okay.

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So I was born in western part of Nepal in a very remote area.

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You know, we had a really humble upbringing in my family.

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Obviously we got mom and dad.

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Mom sadly passed away a couple of months ago, but then we have five siblings, four son and

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one daughter, which is my sister, Anita.

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And yeah, three of us are in the Gurkhas.

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One of my brother is, you know, he just got retired as a teacher in Nepal.

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So yeah, that's us.

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Well, I'm sorry to hear about your mother for a start.

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Hey, thank you.

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It's okay.

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So and then from what I understand, so there's an age gap between you and your older brothers,

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is that right?

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Yeah, massively.

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So you know, as I just said earlier, we're very poor at the start.

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You know, my mom and dad, you know, they eloped to get married, which was at that point in

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Nepal was quite a big crime.

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So they had nothing, you know, obviously they used to work in other's farm and eventually,

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obviously my brothers were born.

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And once they got into the Gurkhas, so obviously they sent me and my sister Anita to better

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school.

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We moved to Chitwan, which is the most flat and warm part of the country.

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But yeah, there is gap between me and my, you know, elder brother is 18 and a half year

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old.

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So that's why, you know, they could, you know, send us to, you know, goodie school and all

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that once they joined the Gurkhas, if that, you know, makes sense.

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No, absolutely.

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So for people listening, obviously being British, I'm a little bit more of you know, a little

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more aware of the Gurkhas.

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But tell me about the history of the Gurkhas, how they came about with their interaction

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with the British armies.

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I think it's a pretty fascinating story.

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Yeah.

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So somewhere around like, you know, 205 years ago when the British Empire was in India trying

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to take over the world, they, you know, of course Nepal being a neighboring country,

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they tried to take over Nepal.

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But what happened was, you know, neither the British could, you know, win or neither the

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Nepalese, you know, would give up.

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So you know, the British were really, really impressed by the bravery of the Nepalese people.

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And what they said at that point was, OK, we're not going to attack you anymore because

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one of the generals was killed as well in this battle.

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So we're not going to attack you more guys, but can we have, you know, you know, your

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guys fighting for us?

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And the king of Nepal at that point was, of course, he had too much problem with, you

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know, fighting against obviously this massive power.

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So he said, of course, we can, you know, we can partner.

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But since then, the Gherkas have been serving with the British for 205 years now.

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We have been, you know, with them throughout this whole journey, you know, Second World

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War and all the Iraq, Afghanistan, you know, Libya and all that kind of stuff.

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So yeah, and just to give you an idea what the selection of a Gherkas is like in Nepal

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is, you know, in a year when I went for the selection, there were like 32,000 young men,

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you know, trying for it and only 320 makes it.

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So it's a very, very tough selection in Nepal.

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That's amazing.

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So one in one in a thousand chance of basically getting a spot.

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Yeah, pretty much like that.

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So staying with the Gherkas just for a second, because as a Brit, you know, one thing that

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we always hear is the courage, you know, and there are, you know, numerous stories of,

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you know, Gherka heroism.

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So with that long history, what do you attribute that courage to as far as, you know, the culture

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and the beliefs of the Nepalese people?

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I think for me, you know, when people ask me, you know, what's, you know, who are you,

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I always say, you know, I'm Nimistai.

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I was born in Nepal, but I was raised in the Gherkas and United Kingdom Special Forces.

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And of course, you know, I was made in the mountains.

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But coming that, you know, I spent 16 years in the British military.

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And what does Gherka means to me is it's in my bone, I think.

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And what does Gherkas stand for across the world?

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As you said, James, it's for bravery and also loyalty.

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And you know, we live with the motto, you know, it's better to die than to be a coward

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and all that.

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So, yeah, it's very proud to be part of that family.

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But you know, that respect is earned.

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Absolutely.

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Well, I always ask about, you know, athletics and being a sportswoman when you're younger.

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As you mentioned, the Chitwan area was flat.

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So am I right in understanding that you weren't really climbing when you were young?

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I only started climbing when I was 29 years old, nearly 30.

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But yeah, so yeah, and it was only in December 2012.

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And as you said, Christian, I had no idea to climbing.

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I didn't even trek at all before.

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So yeah, it was completely, you know, different kind of dynamics to who I am now to how my

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childhood was.

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Yeah.

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Beautiful.

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So then tell me about your journey in martial arts because I know that was a pretty powerful

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element.

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Yeah, of course, you know, when I was in the kid, you know, I was put into this boring

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school and, you know, Nepal being a third world country, you know, there are like, of

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course, nasty things happens, you know, and there's loads of, you know, like school bullies

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and all that.

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And I was pretty young and all that.

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But I remember in the in year seven, I started learning, you know, kickboxing and pretty

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soon, you know, I started, you know, fighting for the regional championship and all that.

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So obviously all those bullies and all that didn't happen after that.

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But yeah, all good.

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You know, I was I have always been a sportive, you know, when I was like not studying in

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Nepal, you get only one day as a weekend, you get only Saturday off.

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So in Saturday, I used to like explore the jungle of Chitwan.

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It's a massive jungle.

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I used to go into the to the river, like really small river.

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Obviously, it's not massively well, you know, to those who are listening, because I was

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a little kid.

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But I used to go and look for the crabs and, you know, I was that much motivated that I

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would turn every rocks in that river and, you know, in a search for, you know, those

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crabs and come back home.

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And I used to cook this crab with mom and of course, you know, we used to obviously

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eat and all that.

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So it's a very humble upbringing, if I'm honest.

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Yeah, well, one thing that really struck me and this struck me as well, the reason why

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you transition out of the SBS, but you mentioned early in the book about, you know, a lot of

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people would give their money to the temples, but you actually would like to give it directly

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to the people that you saw that needed it.

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So where where did that kindness and compassion come?

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Is that a national thing or is that more from your parents specifically?

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I think I don't know, mate, to be honest, somehow early, even early, early in my life,

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nobody taught me.

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Nobody said anything, but I wasn't a religious person since I was kid, you know, because

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I kind of, you know, even in very young age, I kind of, you know, started believing in

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what I see.

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And and, you know, for me, like a lot of, you know, you know, Nepalese people, they

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go to the temple and they, you know, donate money to the mountain god, which is the statue,

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you know, so not the mount, the Hindu gods, you know, which is the statues.

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But then I feel that's a bit pointless, you know, rather than giving that money to the

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statues and all that and somebody like taking that, you don't know where that money goes.

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And I think it would make an absolute sense if you donate that money to the needy people,

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like if there's an orphan, you know, and if there's someone, you know, disabled people,

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if there is someone who is really poor and I still remember, I didn't have much in my

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wallet, to be honest, because we're still like that.

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But then I was I saw this guy who was really, really, he was poorer than us.

227
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,600
And I asked him, you know, does he has kids?

228
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:34,600
And he said, yes.

229
00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:38,400
And I just emptied my wallet and I just said, yeah, go and, you know, in Nepal, you know,

230
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:42,440
you don't really, you know, have enough money to buy good food.

231
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:45,960
So I said, you know, like, here's your money, don't spend that on alcohol, make sure, you

232
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:50,040
know, you know, that's that's been, you know, this out to the family.

233
00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:52,200
So I haven't always been like that somehow.

234
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:53,200
Yeah.

235
00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:54,200
Beautiful.

236
00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:58,520
I mean, obviously, that that comes out again later in the story.

237
00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:03,560
So just to kind of recap, so your older brothers went in the Gurkhas that allowed you to have

238
00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:04,840
the education that you had.

239
00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:08,240
So tell me about your journey then into the Gurkhas.

240
00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:16,760
Yeah, so I was in obviously in this, you know, boarding school in hostel, really strict regime

241
00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:20,760
and yeah, you are not allowed to get out of the compound and all that.

242
00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:26,200
But what I used to do is I used to wake up about like two o'clock in the in the morning

243
00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:29,720
and I used to go for a run, you know, sometimes in a 20k, 30k.

244
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:35,040
And I used to be back, you know, just before like, you know, six in the morning when everybody's

245
00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:37,360
awake, I used to pretend I'm still sleeping.

246
00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:41,880
No one would know that I have been up out, you know, running with them, putting some,

247
00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:46,800
you know, like metal rods in my in my in my socks as well, trying to make, you know, training

248
00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:49,520
because, you know, we didn't have any weights or anything.

249
00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:55,720
So I just, you know, shoe metal rock and metal rods bar into my socks.

250
00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,840
And I was doing that kind of training.

251
00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:04,320
But I felt my first selection to the Gurkhas just because, you know, the Gala Wala who,

252
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:13,200
you know, what Gala Wala is, you know, he is a very old retired in all school, you know,

253
00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:14,200
expensing a Gurkha guy.

254
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:16,320
And, you know, if he doesn't like it, he doesn't like it.

255
00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:21,040
So I felt for the first time and I only made it on the second attempt.

256
00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,280
But for me, since I was kid, I didn't want it to be anything else.

257
00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:28,000
I didn't want, I was really good in school, really good as in like, you know, I used to

258
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:34,440
be in top three in terms of whole, you know, marking system.

259
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:41,480
But, you know, my dream was only to be a Gurkha so I was secretly training for that and eventually

260
00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:42,480
I made it buddy.

261
00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:50,000
So, what do you think it was though that gave you that intrinsic determination to get, to

262
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:54,520
be the only child in that school that woke up at two in the morning, sewed steel rods

263
00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:58,160
to their socks and went for a 20 or 30k run?

264
00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:03,760
I think what I had in me is if I really want something and if I really, you know, like

265
00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:09,040
dream of being something, you know, I've always put my heart, soul and, you know, dedication

266
00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:10,240
to that.

267
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:14,680
And I think that's who I am, you know, and then that's not only from, you know, joining

268
00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:18,360
the Gurkhas but that's also like, you know, there are a few stories which I have mentioned

269
00:17:18,360 --> 00:17:20,360
on the book Beyond Possible.

270
00:17:20,360 --> 00:17:24,920
So, yeah, I think it's kind of in the blood as well.

271
00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:30,840
But why I wanted so much to be a Gurkha, it was purely because my dad was in the Gurkhas

272
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:38,320
and my two brothers were in the Gurkhas and whenever they come home, I kind of like their

273
00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:44,480
like military style, you know, really smart and everybody was well, you know, like respecting

274
00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:50,040
them and in a Gurkha was quite a big thing in our village.

275
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,160
So yeah, I just wanted to be part of that.

276
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:53,480
Yeah, well, that's understandable.

277
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:54,480
Absolutely.

278
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:56,280
You had some role models coming home.

279
00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:58,000
So what was your journey like then?

280
00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:01,800
There you are in Nepal, you know, you finally get a place in the Gurkhas and now you fly

281
00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:04,880
off to the UK, a very different country than Nepal.

282
00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:10,600
Yeah, you know, like when you are in Nepal, when people talk about, you know, United Kingdom,

283
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:16,600
England, you know, you think of in a big band in London Eye, Buckingham Palace.

284
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:17,840
So I was expecting that.

285
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:23,120
But what happened was when we land, it was raining sideways in London Heathrow, then

286
00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:26,280
we're like soaked into this bus.

287
00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:31,320
And after driving like almost 10 hours, we got into this place called Cattrick, which

288
00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:34,680
is really up north of the England.

289
00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:38,320
And we came out and look around.

290
00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:40,640
The weather was absolutely miserable.

291
00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:46,480
Haven't seen anywhere where the rain come like, you know, from from like sideways.

292
00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:50,920
And yeah, and I was like, there's only a couple of houses you can see and there were more

293
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:52,200
sheep.

294
00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:57,920
So I was like, well, actually, this is, you know, almost as you know, as worse as Nepal.

295
00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:02,200
I was like, yeah, but you know, of course, that was it.

296
00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:06,400
And eventually, you know, we were really, you know, went into a strict regime of the

297
00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:10,320
training with the Gherkas, nine months in training.

298
00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:16,640
Yeah, so it was a bit of cultural shock, to be honest, but you know, you got to adapt.

299
00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:17,640
So it was hey hey.

300
00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:18,640
Yeah, well, that's the thing.

301
00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:24,560
I mean, if you're in a mountainous region of Nepal, like, you know, so far up the mountain,

302
00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:25,900
I can see how it would be warm.

303
00:19:25,900 --> 00:19:30,520
But if you're from a more tropical jungle like part of Nepal, then it was probably pretty

304
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:31,520
miserable.

305
00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:33,480
Oh, it was like, yeah.

306
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:34,480
All right.

307
00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:39,200
Well, the the the Gherkas are known obviously for the kukuri knife, the the kind of L or

308
00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:41,600
the boomerang shaped knife almost.

309
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:45,200
Is that something that you ceremoniously get when you graduate the Gherkas?

310
00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:46,600
Or you know, when when do you get that?

311
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:48,240
Or do you still even get that anymore?

312
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:49,520
Yes, buddy.

313
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:56,520
Whenever you pass the selection for the bigot of Gherkas, you are given that on your graduate.

314
00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:57,520
All right.

315
00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,520
So then your first deployment was Afghanistan.

316
00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:00,520
Is that right?

317
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:01,520
Correct.

318
00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:02,520
In 2007.

319
00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:05,520
OK, so what was that like again?

320
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,240
I mean, you're now you go into a completely different landscape.

321
00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:12,360
You're going from, you know, a peaceful country where you grew up and then where you trained

322
00:20:12,360 --> 00:20:14,760
as well to to now a war zone.

323
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:17,960
So what was that like for a young Gherka?

324
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:22,840
For me, you know, like everything like for me was, you know, for the reputations.

325
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:28,200
And you know, and I will just tell you one story that I have briefly covered in the book,

326
00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:29,200
for example.

327
00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:35,760
You know, we were working with with the Marines, Royal Marines, you know, 40 commandos in Herik

328
00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:36,760
7.

329
00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:44,040
And one of my job as a as an engineer commander was to clear this compound so that, you know,

330
00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:48,880
when we say clear this compound, we mean, you know, the compound is free from IED bombs

331
00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:52,520
or any detonating device.

332
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,040
So I was doing that.

333
00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:59,440
And obviously, my one of my, you know, corporal was like in southern with names hurry up.

334
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,760
And I was like, look, I cannot hurry up, you know.

335
00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:05,440
And they were like, names, can you hurry up?

336
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,240
And I was like, I just got so angry.

337
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:12,560
I was like, you know, there is a valen valenism, you know, a metal detector that detects, you

338
00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:15,960
know, IDs or any bombs, any metal on the ground.

339
00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:17,720
So I just like threw that away.

340
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:22,080
And I was like, listen, if you think that I'm scared of like doing this and if you think

341
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,920
I'm doing it so slowly and methodologically because you think I'm scared, then there you

342
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:27,920
go.

343
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:30,200
I can just walk around without this valen and all that.

344
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:36,880
But the reason why I'm doing this job, you know, you know, 100 percent or methodologically

345
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:43,640
is because if I miss something here and those like, you know, the Marine Infantry Unit comes

346
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:49,800
in and if something detonates or if IED goes off, then, you know, we, you know, because

347
00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:55,600
of my carelessness or our team carelessness, the whole reputation of the Guards is going

348
00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:56,600
to get jeopardized.

349
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:57,600
So listen.

350
00:21:57,600 --> 00:21:59,640
And of course, after that, they all listen.

351
00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,080
But it was really humbling experience.

352
00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:08,080
I worked with the commandos and before that, I wanted to join SAS after this tour.

353
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:13,080
But after working with the Royal Marines, I kind of preferred their ethos and I decided

354
00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:16,080
to go to SBS.

355
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:22,480
And for those who are listening, just to give an example between SAS and SBS in terms of

356
00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:34,680
military is in SAS, we got most of the guys who passed into SAS are from the Army background,

357
00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:43,040
whereas the SBS, most of the guys who passed to the selection are from the Marine background.

358
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:44,360
So that's kind of a bit of sort.

359
00:22:44,360 --> 00:22:47,760
I think we're going to probably cover a bit more into that later on.

360
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:51,440
But yeah, they both are tier one UKSF.

361
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:52,440
Yeah, absolutely.

362
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:53,440
Yeah.

363
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,920
And I definitely want to explore that because obviously SBS is more of a Marine background

364
00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:59,640
and Nepal is not known for its oceans.

365
00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:02,460
So we'll explore that in a moment.

366
00:23:02,460 --> 00:23:06,360
One thing I always ask every member of the military, I ask, you know, Jay and SAS and

367
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:11,480
everyone else has come on with most of us being civilians, most of us, even if you're

368
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:18,160
in the military, if you weren't deployed specifically into a combat zone, there's these polarizing

369
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:22,280
kind of views that we get fed through television, whatever it is, either the very pro war or

370
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:23,800
the very anti war.

371
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:29,040
And to me, the more members of military that come on, the more I realize that there are

372
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:33,200
two things that you actually see as a soldier, as a sailor, whatever, you know, whoever the

373
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,320
person is.

374
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:40,720
One is that it seems to be this common denominator that wherever the war zone is amongst all

375
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:45,080
that fighting are men, you know, fathers and mothers and children that are just trying

376
00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,520
to get on with their life.

377
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:53,160
But the other thing is usually they witness some sort of atrocity that then reinforces

378
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:55,800
the fact that they are doing some good when they're over there.

379
00:23:55,800 --> 00:24:00,440
So did you have any kind of moments when you first deployed where you saw some of the horrific

380
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:04,360
stuff that was going on by some of the extremists over there?

381
00:24:04,360 --> 00:24:07,680
Oh, yeah, massively, James.

382
00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:12,000
And of course, you know, we went on this war for, you know, reasons.

383
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:15,960
And yes, a lot of people could have a different opinion on that.

384
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:22,960
But I have been on the ground and I have seen some horrible stuff that we try to obviously,

385
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:28,800
you know, stop prevent from, you know, you know, in or stopping that act, which is against

386
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:29,800
the humanity.

387
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:35,180
And so, you know, and specifically once you get into the garrick and his special forces,

388
00:24:35,180 --> 00:24:42,680
we always make sure that who we go into our identity, our target, everything is identified

389
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:47,280
and there is a solid, legitimate, you know, bomb proof evidence.

390
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:48,360
And that's when we go.

391
00:24:48,360 --> 00:24:52,640
So there's no doubt about what I have done and all.

392
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:56,920
And yeah, it's for the better world, which I believe in.

393
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,640
So but we are people and everybody has got different opinions and all that.

394
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:06,800
But, you know, unless you are in that in that shoes and unless you have been there, I don't

395
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,040
think, you know, you can really comment.

396
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:10,800
But hey, yeah, no, exactly.

397
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:16,220
I think that's an important point to underline is, you know, when I hear these stories, yes,

398
00:25:16,220 --> 00:25:21,360
you are representing the UK or the US or Australia or wherever the person is from.

399
00:25:21,360 --> 00:25:25,420
But ultimately, when you are on the ground, you're protecting the Afghani people or the

400
00:25:25,420 --> 00:25:26,420
Iraqi people.

401
00:25:26,420 --> 00:25:28,760
And I think that's that's a message that a lot of people lose.

402
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:30,960
Yeah, massively, mate.

403
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:36,120
And then, you know, like there are situations where, you know, like, you know, like young

404
00:25:36,120 --> 00:25:41,720
kids being brought into to to to be to be trained to be a terrorist.

405
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:47,720
And that's like completely wrong, you know, where, you know, like a certain, you know,

406
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:53,520
terrorists, you know, those people in training, you know, like, you know, young kids, you

407
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,200
know, putting bombs on them and all that.

408
00:25:56,200 --> 00:26:00,640
And I think, yeah, I think I don't really want to go in details about that, you know,

409
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:05,080
but if that's OK, I really wanted to talk about, you know, you know, what, you know,

410
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:09,560
what my past is, you know, what, you know, you know, what I have done last year, because

411
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:14,880
I'm I cannot talk so much about the Special Forces stuff because, you know, you know,

412
00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:15,880
I have.

413
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:16,880
Yeah, no, no, absolutely.

414
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:17,880
Absolutely.

415
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:20,920
No, I've just it's just an interesting perspective, I think, from the people that were on the

416
00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,960
ground, you know, but that's that's just one little thing I just want to touch on and move

417
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:24,960
on now.

418
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,880
So so your journey into SBS, then.

419
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:33,320
So there you are again from Nepal, like I said, not really exposed to a lot of aquatic

420
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:34,320
activities.

421
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,080
So tell me about the journey in through there.

422
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:42,320
No other guy I had obviously made through the ranks of SBS.

423
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:46,800
So that was really, you know, tough challenge to start with, because I would go there as

424
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:53,720
an alien and everything what I have to do over there, I have to work twice harder to

425
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:58,400
to prove myself, because, you know, you came from completely different background.

426
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:03,360
And for me as well, you know, it's not only about me, you know, it's about the reputations

427
00:27:03,360 --> 00:27:09,240
of, you know, those hundreds and thousands of guys, you know, who who who has, you know,

428
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:13,500
build their name and reputations of bravery and loyalty.

429
00:27:13,500 --> 00:27:18,920
So of course, I had to operate in extreme under pressure throughout my whole career.

430
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:24,000
And it's something, you know, that taught me massively also in terms of, you know, which

431
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,520
we'll talk about, you know, Bremen Project possible in a bit.

432
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:31,120
But yeah, it was it wasn't easy, buddy.

433
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:36,540
But I thoroughly enjoyed it because, you know, the work cycle, the job cycle is like a washing

434
00:27:36,540 --> 00:27:37,540
machine cycle.

435
00:27:37,540 --> 00:27:41,560
You know, you've been basically thrown around everywhere across the world.

436
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,440
And one thing that you cannot do is you cannot fuck up.

437
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:49,080
So yeah, that's the level of you know.

438
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:53,600
Well, and then something you touched on before with, you know, with the sweeping for ID story

439
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,280
and is something that seems to pan over and over again is the attention to detail and

440
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:02,880
whether it's my profession, the fire service or law enforcement or whatever it is, that

441
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:08,840
seems to be a very, very important part of, you know, of of earning the title professional.

442
00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:14,600
So again, you know, how much was that reinforced when you when you leveled up to the SPS?

443
00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:15,600
100 percent.

444
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:20,320
You know, you've got to apply all that and maybe beyond that.

445
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:25,960
So yeah, you know, that's why we are the best in elite service in England or maybe even

446
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:26,960
in the world.

447
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:27,960
Absolutely.

448
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:35,680
Well, so you have an interesting story from within the SPS to actually getting to Everest.

449
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:40,360
So I'd love to hear about how climbing started factoring into your service in special operations.

450
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:47,680
Yeah, so basically, I was 29 year old when I decided to go to Nepal to see the Everest.

451
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:49,600
It's a trekking, by the way.

452
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:53,560
But then once I started trekking, you know, you come through this beautiful village called

453
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,200
Namche Bazar.

454
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,640
And as you come through, then you see a massive mountain called Amadablam.

455
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:01,160
It's so beautiful.

456
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:03,840
It dominates the whole of the Khumbu Valley.

457
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,440
Honestly, it's such eye catching, such a beautiful.

458
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:08,440
It's amazing.

459
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:13,400
And after that, I was like, wow, I just wanted to experience how it feels to be standing

460
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:18,040
on the summit of that mountain and see the world.

461
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:21,960
So I asked my obviously instructor at that point was my guide to hike and recline.

462
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:22,960
And he laughed.

463
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:25,280
He said that mountain is super technical.

464
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,040
People who climb Everest can't even climb that.

465
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:34,480
So anyway, long story short, I managed to convince him to climb another mountain, 6200

466
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,240
meter peak.

467
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:43,200
The way we did was we had no kit and equipment, so we hired a kit in this village and we were

468
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:48,160
taught how to wear crampons and use crampons in the grass at this village.

469
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,760
So we were putting crampons and walking, obviously.

470
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:52,760
Yeah.

471
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:56,480
And after that, I know eventually submitted to the lobbyist.

472
00:29:56,480 --> 00:30:02,280
And at that point, when I was on this mountain, what I realized was when you come from a geocache

473
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:06,280
background, when you become like, you know, come from the special forces, when you have

474
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:11,800
done things and been there, all that stuff, you think you are invincible.

475
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:18,000
And when I went into the mountain, at that point, I just realized we are no one.

476
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:27,920
It made me feel how small I am, but also equally, I just love that, you know, the whole atmospheric

477
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:33,160
challenging, the environmental challenge, like where you are struggling to breathe,

478
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:34,160
you know.

479
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:35,160
Yeah, it was awesome.

480
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:39,440
But also the view once you get to the summit and all that.

481
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:43,520
So that's what it got me into in extreme high altitude mountain.

482
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:47,560
And from that point, you know, whenever I had like a bit of leave, you know, coming

483
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:51,560
from special forces background, it's always hard.

484
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:56,280
So yeah, I managed to do a bit of climbing here and there after that.

485
00:30:56,280 --> 00:31:03,640
Now, you know, with the Nepalese background, did you notice that your physiology was different

486
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:08,920
than some other people that you climb with and that you were able to tolerate the altitude?

487
00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:12,840
At that point, not really, because at that point, I just thought I'm UK special forces.

488
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:17,240
I must be faster and stronger than anybody else here.

489
00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:20,200
That was kind of my attitude, which was massively wrong.

490
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:29,120
But I discovered like I had kind of a natural strength in terms of high altitude mountaineering

491
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:36,600
in 2014 when I climbed Dalagri, which is the world's seventh highest mountain.

492
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:43,120
And I submitted that mountain in just 14 days Kathmandu to Kathmandu without any prior acclimatization,

493
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:48,080
leading more than 70 percent of the route when I was obviously in a trailblazing and

494
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:49,080
all that.

495
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:50,840
So I kind of realized.

496
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,880
But just to give you an idea, at that point, I had no idea still.

497
00:31:53,880 --> 00:32:01,280
I was just planning to climb Everest one day and other 8,000 meter peak eventually.

498
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:06,000
But I was kind of improving my skills towards climbing without oxygen.

499
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:10,280
But I was kind of collecting my experience at that stage.

500
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:11,280
Yeah.

501
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:15,340
So I know you ended up teaching climbing within special forces too.

502
00:32:15,340 --> 00:32:16,980
So when did that come in?

503
00:32:16,980 --> 00:32:23,280
So what happened was after Lobuche East, which I just mentioned you about, I got back into

504
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:24,280
SPS.

505
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,520
I was in MPVS troop.

506
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:32,400
That means you would take lead on parasitting and anything MPVS, watery stuff.

507
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,800
And I changed from that troop to mountain troop.

508
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,800
And eventually I started working my way and all that.

509
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:48,240
And yeah, when I left SPS, I was one of the lead badge role as in badge operator.

510
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:55,800
I was head of that, kind of like in teaching the special forces guys about extreme cold

511
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:57,080
weather warfare and all that.

512
00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:58,080
So yeah.

513
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:06,760
And did you find that your climbing then made you even better when it came to your SPS activities?

514
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:10,920
Well, you know, like it's a completely different stuff.

515
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:14,320
You know, what we do in SPS is not extreme high altitude.

516
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:18,160
What we do there is in extreme cold weather warfare.

517
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:20,560
So it's a completely different skills.

518
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:24,080
But at some point that does, you know, collapse.

519
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,080
As in like there will be a few overlaps and all that.

520
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:33,720
But yeah, but obviously I was doing this in a high altitude mountain as my love and passion.

521
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:37,820
But I was trying to bring that into SPS.

522
00:33:37,820 --> 00:33:43,760
Because with that incident in Nanga Perbath in 2011 when, you know, 11 climbers were killed

523
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:49,600
by the terrorists, you know, nobody could go and save their lives.

524
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:54,180
So I was kind of looking into this, you know, if something like this happened, I was kind

525
00:33:54,180 --> 00:33:57,480
of working towards developing the capabilities and all that.

526
00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,560
But eventually, obviously, I left.

527
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:01,560
But yeah.

528
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:05,320
That's very interesting, that was in the mountains of Afghanistan, is that right?

529
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:06,320
In Pakistan.

530
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:07,320
Oh, Pakistan.

531
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:08,320
Okay.

532
00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:09,320
Yeah.

533
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:10,320
Incident in Nanga Perbath, it happened in 2011.

534
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:13,080
It was a huge terrorist incident.

535
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:17,160
So the other thing that kind of springs to mind to me is, again, you were born in the

536
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:21,840
tropical area, then you go to the UK, you have to see you're deploying to the Middle

537
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:24,040
East.

538
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,880
Where do you relate your ability to tolerate the cold?

539
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:31,120
Because up to that point, you hadn't really been exposed to a lot of very, very cold areas.

540
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:38,440
Well, when I went to the mountain trip, obviously, I went to Norway and did loads of an extreme

541
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:43,080
cold weather warfare training within the SBS.

542
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:51,280
But yeah, I think if you love doing something, things would come naturally, I guess.

543
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,320
And then so the speed element too.

544
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:59,560
So I know we're going to talk about obviously the project possible and the ridiculous speed

545
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:01,960
that you did the peaks.

546
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:08,560
When did you start noticing that you were just faster in general than a lot of climbers?

547
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:15,000
In 2017, I was one of the instructors for the gearkas to the Everest.

548
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:20,200
And the mission was to put a first serving gearka on the summit of Everest.

549
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:21,200
Okay.

550
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,880
Technically, I had done that in 2016, but in the wider military didn't know because

551
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:26,360
I was in the special forces.

552
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,240
Nobody knew about this anyway.

553
00:35:28,240 --> 00:35:30,640
So yeah, 2017, here we are.

554
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:34,000
And I was one of the instructor going over there.

555
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:40,600
And what happened that season was, you know, in Everest, there is an officer team normally

556
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:44,920
who said the fixed lines to the summit and a lot of people, you know, use that trail

557
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:50,200
blades, use that logistic, that, you know, that fixed lines to summit to the Everest,

558
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:51,200
to the top.

559
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:54,240
So that season that didn't happen.

560
00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:59,920
And what it meant for me as an instructor and as a gearka and as a UK Special Forces

561
00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:06,840
operator was one, as a gearka, whenever, you know, like in another chance, this will be

562
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:11,320
our like, if we fail on that one, it will be another third attempt that we will get

563
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,680
another chance to go and climb Everest, you know.

564
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:15,680
So that was no.

565
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:19,520
And also, you know, like coming from the gearka background, everybody think, you know, Everest

566
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:20,520
is in your back garden.

567
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:24,880
You know, but it's not, but there was a huge reputation on the ricks as well.

568
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:29,520
The second one was, you know, again, you know, this was the second time that we used, you

569
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,480
know, British taxpayers money to go and do this.

570
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,640
And I don't think there will be ever third attempt.

571
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:41,160
So I stepped up and I formed my own team to go and set these fixed lines, a combination

572
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:44,840
of, you know, mostly serpas and a couple of gearka instructors.

573
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:50,840
Yeah, went and obviously set the fixed lines, not opening the route for only our team, but

574
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,240
the rest of the season's mountaineer.

575
00:36:53,240 --> 00:36:57,800
And immediately after that, obviously, I came with the team to Kathmandu.

576
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:04,520
Then I went back again to climb Everest, Lhotse and Makalu, which I did in five days.

577
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:07,800
And that's including stopping for two nights, parting in between.

578
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:11,400
Otherwise, I could have done that in three days.

579
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,640
And at that point, I realized I had so much to give into this mountaineering world.

580
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:19,040
So that's where, you know, the bigger vision is to start coming into me.

581
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,760
That's when I realized, you know, I was something different.

582
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:22,760
I had something different.

583
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:23,760
All right.

584
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:29,000
And so the 2017 summit was basically two years later for the G200.

585
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:30,000
Is that right?

586
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:36,880
Yeah, 2017 summit was only two years later after I did my project possible.

587
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:37,880
Right.

588
00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:38,880
Yeah.

589
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:39,880
Okay.

590
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:42,840
So was that 2015, was that when they had the earthquake on Everest?

591
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:43,840
2015 was.

592
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,680
So the first time we attempted was 2015.

593
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:48,000
The big earthquake came.

594
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:53,520
Nobody's, you know, obviously made it to the top as the expeditions were all canceled.

595
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:57,920
2017 was the second time that, you know, we were back again.

596
00:37:57,920 --> 00:37:58,920
Right.

597
00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:03,600
So going back to just the SBS, one thing I kind of missed, I think it's very important,

598
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:09,120
was, you know, you detailed this in the book, that you actually were shot in the face.

599
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:17,520
So how were you able to kind of overcome that injury and push forward?

600
00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:22,960
I think we should leave that for the readers to find in the book beyond possible.

601
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:23,960
Shall we?

602
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:24,960
Beautiful.

603
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:25,960
Yes, let's do that.

604
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:28,020
I haven't got this chronologically down.

605
00:38:28,020 --> 00:38:32,280
So when was the first time you made a rescue on the mountain?

606
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:41,920
It was in 2016 when I went to this, you know, super secret trip to, you know, Everest.

607
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:49,440
And this was the trip that I made a really last minute decision between the tour, operational

608
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:52,200
tour between, you know, the threat of the threat.

609
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:56,960
So no one knew, not even my family, other than, you know, my wife.

610
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:01,120
I went to Nepal, decided to climb Everest solo.

611
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:06,320
And on the way down, I rescued this female climber who was, you know, left behind to

612
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,600
die by, you know, of course, in her team and guide.

613
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:11,360
So I brought her down.

614
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:13,840
And at that point I was climbing.

615
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:20,160
I take oxygen from camphor, but I was I was developing my skills towards to climb without

616
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:21,160
it.

617
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:28,080
But what happened from that point was I managed to rescue her from balcony with a thousand

618
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:30,160
four hundred fifty meters.

619
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:35,920
I did five hundred meter worth of rescue at the desert in just 90 minutes.

620
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:36,920
That's super quick.

621
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:42,640
Just to give you an example, it took two days for a team of five rescue members to get her

622
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:44,360
down to come to.

623
00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:48,920
So from that point, obviously, I decided to climb, you know, big mountains with oxygen

624
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,040
after camphor or high camp.

625
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,560
But yeah, it was only in 2016.

626
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:59,800
And I rescued her, got back into, you know, Kathmandu, then to England.

627
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:06,320
And within like literally a week of submitting Everest secretly, I was in Afghanistan kicking

628
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:07,320
door.

629
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:08,320
Nobody knew about it.

630
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:09,320
So, yeah.

631
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:11,280
Well, how does that look like?

632
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:16,240
What does that look like when when it's normally so slow and, you know, that her team had basically

633
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:17,240
left her?

634
00:40:17,240 --> 00:40:22,640
You know, what were you doing differently that allowed you to make that rescue so rapidly?

635
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:23,640
I'm Nimzatai.

636
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:33,840
What I have is like being brutally honest, you know, I have this massive physical stamina.

637
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:40,600
My mindset is, you know, you know, different, you know, I operate differently at the death

638
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:41,600
zone.

639
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:42,600
That's like my playground.

640
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:47,360
And, you know, coming back from in a girl cousin, special forces background, I have

641
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:51,400
never left anyone behind in the operations or in the battle.

642
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:55,480
I'm not going to leave someone in over there when they see my, you know, in my joint.

643
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:57,360
So I had to rescue.

644
00:40:57,360 --> 00:40:58,360
So yeah.

645
00:40:58,360 --> 00:40:59,360
Beautiful.

646
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:00,360
All right.

647
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:06,520
Well, then I know that you decided to make a transition out of SBS for a very kind of

648
00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:08,160
altruistic reason.

649
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:14,040
So tell me about your journey to making the decision to transition out of the military.

650
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:15,320
OK.

651
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:23,520
So 2018, I was appointed as, you know, head of an extreme cold weather warfare within

652
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:25,120
the SBS.

653
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:30,760
And one of my job is to obviously go out, do loads of, you know, find out about the

654
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:36,320
climbing, mountaineering, finding out what these professionals are doing, find out new

655
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:41,280
kit and equipment, all that and pass that knowledge to our fellow operators.

656
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:46,440
In process of that, what I approached to SBS at that point was, can I go and climb top

657
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:52,160
five highest mountain in just 80 days?

658
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,600
Because you know, I had loads of in the leave, old and all that.

659
00:41:55,600 --> 00:42:02,280
And but then the decision was no purely because of the risk factors, you know, in K2, one

660
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,800
in four dies, Kansanjunga nearly that.

661
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:09,240
And you know, of course, I wasn't just climbing one mountain, but I was doing a pretty much

662
00:42:09,240 --> 00:42:10,320
mountain marathon.

663
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,900
So it makes sense from, you know, of course, the defense.

664
00:42:13,900 --> 00:42:15,020
So they said no.

665
00:42:15,020 --> 00:42:16,020
And I was like, OK.

666
00:42:16,020 --> 00:42:23,040
But at that point, when I say when I put my in a cheating, I got invitation from an SES

667
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:26,600
to like, you know, join their regimen.

668
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:32,200
And certainly they had a better job opportunity for me and all that.

669
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:36,520
But yeah, you know, for me, it wasn't, you know, you know, that, you know, my loyalty

670
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,720
lies in the blood.

671
00:42:39,720 --> 00:42:44,800
Coming from the background, you know, whatever I do, you know, it will have an impact on

672
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:46,960
my future generations.

673
00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:54,840
So I took my loyalty and over, you know, my job security, pensions and everything.

674
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:56,480
And yeah.

675
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:58,200
And after that, I resigned.

676
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:02,120
And I was like, since I'm resigning anyway, I got like time to myself.

677
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:05,120
I don't have to get permission to do things and all that.

678
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:06,280
I'm my own boss.

679
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,200
So why only climb five mountain?

680
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:11,480
I'm going to climb all the 14.

681
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:17,720
So I googled in the internet, I found out the fastest time was nearly eight years.

682
00:43:17,720 --> 00:43:19,760
Then I planned all that out.

683
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:22,400
And I thought, you know, I could do under seven months.

684
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,240
So that's the journey.

685
00:43:24,240 --> 00:43:25,240
Yeah.

686
00:43:25,240 --> 00:43:27,720
Well, when you told that story, you gave up your pension.

687
00:43:27,720 --> 00:43:32,960
And I can totally relate because I retired out the fire service and basically took the

688
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:37,120
money that I had and put it back into doing this for exactly the same reason.

689
00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:38,120
I mean, don't get me wrong.

690
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:44,120
I wasn't climbing 14 mountains, but it was I realized I could do more good leaving the

691
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:48,400
environment that I was in and being a voice for the people rather than staying in that

692
00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:49,400
profession.

693
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:52,000
Yeah, true, buddy.

694
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:56,600
And you know, like for me, I never joined, you know, in SBS to be a general or to make

695
00:43:56,600 --> 00:43:57,600
millions.

696
00:43:57,600 --> 00:44:04,400
You know, it was pure for love for the job and pure like passion for the job.

697
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:09,680
You know, because, you know, I wanted to be part of that group so much.

698
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:13,400
And at that point, I even said, you know, if I just pass the selection, if I'm good

699
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:15,800
enough, I'm happy to work for free.

700
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:19,160
So that much, you know, like I wanted to be part of that group.

701
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:20,160
So yeah.

702
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:26,080
And then for me, I have I felt like I have done enough for the for the crown in a country.

703
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:32,640
I have served 16 years all my time during the military where, you know, in that period

704
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:35,960
where the war was kicking up all across the globe.

705
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:41,600
So I had a really, really hardcore, you know, military, you know, duty as well.

706
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:46,440
So but after that, it was, you know, for different reason.

707
00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:52,160
It was for something else that, you know, I can I can reach out to to the wider community

708
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:53,440
and all that.

709
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:54,440
So yeah.

710
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:55,440
Beautiful.

711
00:44:55,440 --> 00:45:01,300
Well, the the project that you that you started planning was Project Possible.

712
00:45:01,300 --> 00:45:03,000
So tell me tell me about the recipients.

713
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:08,040
Who are you trying to raise money and or awareness for with that project?

714
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:15,400
So everything what I do in life, I need to find a purpose or a goal or something that

715
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:18,800
really means most to me.

716
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:24,100
So when I come with this idea, you know, of course, I need a purpose why I'm doing this.

717
00:45:24,100 --> 00:45:26,300
And it was very simple for me.

718
00:45:26,300 --> 00:45:32,960
I wanted to show the world that what is humanly possible, you know, because at that point,

719
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:38,720
no one could even imagine and I couldn't even imagine that before that until 2018.

720
00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:41,680
It was it was beyond my imagination as well.

721
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:46,520
So I somehow it came into my imagination that I could do it.

722
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:51,480
So I wanted to obviously show the world that, you know, if you can imagine something and

723
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:55,160
if you really put your heart, mind and soul into that, you can do it.

724
00:45:55,160 --> 00:46:00,880
Secondly, I wanted to raise the the name of the Nepalese climbers who have been frontier

725
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:07,600
of all the Himalayan peaks, you know, but they never got the right credit.

726
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:12,440
And thirdly, I wanted to raise the awareness about climate change and global warming, which

727
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:14,400
is very close to my heart.

728
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,760
And I really believe in those three purposes.

729
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,600
And that's what it gives me strength, fire and everything.

730
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:25,880
Yeah, well, I know that your mentor, your climbing mentor that you actually lost in

731
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,200
2015 was extremely passionate about climate change.

732
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:35,600
So while you have a captive audience here, tell me what you know, from the Nepalese perch,

733
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:39,880
what you guys are seeing regarding to climate change?

734
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:41,920
There has been a massive change.

735
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:49,940
For example, I was in Amadablam, which is the most beautiful iconic peak of Himalayas.

736
00:46:49,940 --> 00:46:55,240
My first climb when I went there, it came on, we could just, you know, grab the snow,

737
00:46:55,240 --> 00:46:59,000
melt it, drink water, cook food and all that.

738
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:03,120
When I went there again in 2018, there was no snow.

739
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:09,160
So we had to carry like gallons of water because the water is heavy, right?

740
00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:10,720
You know, one liter is one kg.

741
00:47:10,720 --> 00:47:16,160
So when we had to carry like gallons of water, you know, into this extreme like route altitude,

742
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:21,680
I was like, oh my God, that was so painful, but equally so sad.

743
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:26,400
And that's when I had the true realization of, wow, this is real.

744
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:32,280
Again, you know, like I was in Dalagri, my first 8000 meter peak in 2014.

745
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:38,600
I went back there in 2019 for, you know, for this project and the whole of the glacier

746
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:39,600
was melting.

747
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:48,440
And I didn't believe that in just in a matter of few years, you could see such a huge change.

748
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:52,600
And you know, if you look, if you now forget those what I have seen and just like if you

749
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:58,640
look into the scientific figures and all that, if you look, you know, the Khumbu Valley,

750
00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:02,720
if we lose the glacier of, you know, like Khumbu Icefall and all that, it's going to

751
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:06,520
have an effect on millions of lives.

752
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:11,240
And this is something that's really worrying.

753
00:48:11,240 --> 00:48:17,000
So I really wanted to obviously raise, you know, the awareness about it through my channels.

754
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:19,240
So yeah, and that's what I've been doing.

755
00:48:19,240 --> 00:48:20,240
That's beautiful.

756
00:48:20,240 --> 00:48:22,000
That's something that I've talked about a few times on here.

757
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:27,880
I lived in Los Angeles for a little while and I always found it insanity that you would

758
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:33,520
have all these kind of anti-climate change views.

759
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:37,880
And my thing was, well, we're in a city where you can't even see 200 meters ahead of you.

760
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:41,400
So rather than even worry about, you know, the climate change element, why don't we just

761
00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:44,680
work on what we can see, which is the product of emissions.

762
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:50,120
You see the smokestacks all over the country that are spewing out toxic gases.

763
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:53,680
Let's work on what we can see and I guarantee you will probably have a knock on effect on

764
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:55,160
climate change as well.

765
00:48:55,160 --> 00:48:57,480
Yeah, that's so true, buddy.

766
00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:03,080
And I just was that, you know, a documentary by Sir David Ettenborough.

767
00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:08,000
And you know, and the message he sends was so powerful, like, you know, whatever we do

768
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:15,580
all as a human, if we put, you know, nature to our heart and make decisions around that,

769
00:49:15,580 --> 00:49:16,580
we can make changes.

770
00:49:16,580 --> 00:49:22,960
We don't, you know, and then it's only like when there is a bigger goal and when there's

771
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:25,640
a bigger project, it's not the big thing that makes a difference.

772
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:27,240
It's the smaller things.

773
00:49:27,240 --> 00:49:32,380
And if everyone is doing those little smaller things, that's what it makes the huge change.

774
00:49:32,380 --> 00:49:33,380
So yeah.

775
00:49:33,380 --> 00:49:34,380
Absolutely.

776
00:49:34,380 --> 00:49:35,380
All right.

777
00:49:35,380 --> 00:49:40,680
Well, then you mentioned 14 peaks, but you didn't mention how, you know, what the record

778
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:46,040
was up to that point and then the time period that you were hoping to scale all 14.

779
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:50,080
So what was the current record and then what was your hope?

780
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:58,200
So the record was, you know, I think it's seven years, 11 months and 14 days.

781
00:49:58,200 --> 00:50:04,920
And that record was hold by, you know, Jersey Cuscooza and a Korean climber, Kim Jang-ho,

782
00:50:04,920 --> 00:50:10,280
tried to break his record and he break that record by only, you know, less than 10 days

783
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,280
or something like that.

784
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:14,280
Yeah.

785
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:19,280
So when I plan into like seven months, it was crazy because, you know, if you look into

786
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:23,080
this idea for those who doesn't know this big mountains and all, you know, people take

787
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:28,520
two months to climb one big mountains, one 8,000 meter peak and all that.

788
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:30,560
So no one could really imagine.

789
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:36,520
But being able to change that perspective into this, you know, new era of, you know,

790
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:41,080
extreme high altitude mountaineering, I think it's quite humbling, buddy.

791
00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:43,240
And that's kind of what I wanted to do.

792
00:50:43,240 --> 00:50:44,240
Yeah.

793
00:50:44,240 --> 00:50:48,480
Well, you had self-belief and obviously, you know, you'd seen what you were capable of

794
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:54,000
at that point, but I know that proposing it to sponsors was a challenge for you.

795
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,120
So what was the fundraising element like for you?

796
00:50:57,120 --> 00:51:05,840
The fundraising was one of the toughest thing I have ever done after writing this book.

797
00:51:05,840 --> 00:51:16,440
So yeah, at that point, I still had one year planning to do before I get into this project.

798
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:18,840
The whole project had two planning.

799
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:23,560
One was operational, which was my bag, my perk, my expertise.

800
00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:26,280
And there was another one which was fundraising.

801
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:30,100
The fundraising part was led by one of my friend.

802
00:51:30,100 --> 00:51:36,240
And just like three months prior to the project, you know, I was told that there is zero pound

803
00:51:36,240 --> 00:51:38,600
on the project fund.

804
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:42,320
So after that, I decided to take the lead by myself.

805
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,280
And yeah, nobody would believe it.

806
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:51,400
They were like, OK, Nims, if you think like, you know, you are that bad ass climber, mountainer,

807
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:52,920
why haven't we heard about you before?

808
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:57,640
I was like, I just told you I was in special forces, you know, I didn't even have a Facebook.

809
00:51:57,640 --> 00:51:59,480
I didn't have any Instagram.

810
00:51:59,480 --> 00:52:01,960
So how are you going to hear about me?

811
00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:09,040
And then some would say, oh, the previous two records are nearly 80 years and you were

812
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,040
just trying to say you're going to do that in seven months.

813
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:14,000
So people were making the joke out of it and all that.

814
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:15,600
Yeah, mate.

815
00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:20,760
And just to give you an idea, before I set off from London Heathrow to Kathmandu, Nepal

816
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:25,800
for this project, I only had five percent of the total fund.

817
00:52:25,800 --> 00:52:26,800
It was that hard.

818
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:29,920
And I still remember when people were so negative and all that.

819
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:32,840
I was driving in this motorway in M3.

820
00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:42,680
And given the fact I have operated in a very, very hostile, you know, stressful, multilayered

821
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:44,560
very stressful environment.

822
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:48,400
And that doesn't like overwhelm me.

823
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:53,200
But on this one fundraising, I was driving on this motorway and I just had tears coming

824
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:54,200
from my eyes.

825
00:52:54,200 --> 00:52:59,800
I had to pull off and obviously had had to have a word for myself, get a grip, you know.

826
00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:01,280
And then I drove off.

827
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:07,960
And then and the reason why it gives me strength was the purpose why I was doing this mission.

828
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:14,360
But yeah, it was it was tough, buddy, and the funding started coming later on from the

829
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:16,000
from the project through sponsorship.

830
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:21,280
A lot of people supported through GoFundMe page as well.

831
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:26,280
Once I started climbing in the way that I said I would climb and the rescues, you know,

832
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:27,280
all that.

833
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:28,280
Beautiful.

834
00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:30,280
Well, this is a tangent with that.

835
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:34,840
So many members of the military had on, you know, myself, my profession, you know, all

836
00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:37,760
the tactical professions.

837
00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:38,760
There's a toll.

838
00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:43,440
There's a mental toll to what we see is a mental toll to what some of us have to do.

839
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:47,760
And then, you know, a lot of times that manifests when you transition out of the profession

840
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:53,080
because that group that you were in, that tight knit tribe that you belong to, now you're

841
00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:54,080
on the outside.

842
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:58,760
Well, with your journey, not only on the outside, but now you have the added frustration of

843
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:03,640
having served your country and yet not now, you know, having so many problems trying to

844
00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:08,040
have raised money for this this climb that you know is going to do so much good.

845
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:12,920
So did you have either then or later on in your, you know, the last few years, have any

846
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:19,680
elements where, you know, you saw the ripple effect mentally of, you know, the service

847
00:54:19,680 --> 00:54:21,880
that you've given?

848
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:23,760
Nobody.

849
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:28,480
Because for me, you know, I think it was different.

850
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:33,680
And of course, you know, I see a lot of friends, you know, having a ripple effect.

851
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:38,400
But at the moment, no, because in everything what I did was was by the book.

852
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:42,360
You know, it was something that I really loved doing it.

853
00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:45,760
And there was a there was a purpose and all that.

854
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:47,880
So yeah, I'm okay, thankfully.

855
00:54:47,880 --> 00:54:48,880
Well, good.

856
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:50,640
And I think that I expected that answer.

857
00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:52,800
And the reason being is because, as you said, you had a purpose.

858
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:58,280
And that seems to be the key for people transitioning out, you know, healthily is that they go

859
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,160
from one purpose to the next.

860
00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:03,600
And obviously, you know, the client seemed to be that good transition.

861
00:55:03,600 --> 00:55:04,600
100%.

862
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:05,600
Beautiful.

863
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:06,600
All right.

864
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,680
Well, then, so you know, you were still working on the fundraising.

865
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:14,160
So lead me through to Braemont because I want to give them some some airtime too, because

866
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:20,200
they seem to be, you know, well-engrossed in, you know, your climb, obviously, with

867
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:21,200
Through Dark.

868
00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:26,720
So let's talk about how they came in and, you know, got behind your project.

869
00:55:26,720 --> 00:55:33,240
So you know, when I finished the first project and all that, you know, a lot of people started

870
00:55:33,240 --> 00:55:37,680
believing that I could really do it, you know, because, you know, at first people didn't

871
00:55:37,680 --> 00:55:38,880
believe in all that.

872
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:44,640
But on the second phase, when I was like, struggling for the for the fund, Braemont

873
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:48,960
advanced me, you know, roughly in a 200k.

874
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:53,040
And that allowed me to do the second phase in a peaceful manner.

875
00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:56,920
Yeah, and then through that, guys, and of course, they have been, you know, like, you

876
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:01,960
know, friends, they have been supporting me with the clothing and all that.

877
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:05,920
And I'm quite proud to represent them and all that.

878
00:56:05,920 --> 00:56:10,480
But yeah, they were like great sponsors, like in and Middleton, you know, who supported

879
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:15,520
this project, you know, give me, you know, sponsorship.

880
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:20,280
And yeah, he didn't even ask for anything, not even like one social media post and all

881
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:21,280
that.

882
00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:27,440
But there were some really great supporters out there like Select So, Osprey Europe, I

883
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:34,680
had like tons of, you know, like the sponsors because nobody could, you know, fund the whole

884
00:56:34,680 --> 00:56:35,680
project.

885
00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:42,440
So and I must not forget my, you know, half of the project fund came from the crowdfunding.

886
00:56:42,440 --> 00:56:47,160
Actually people giving, you know, five pounds, ten pounds, and a lot of people were giving

887
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:48,520
that as well.

888
00:56:48,520 --> 00:56:51,920
So that's why I keep saying it was a people's project.

889
00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:52,920
Beautiful.

890
00:56:52,920 --> 00:56:54,480
Well, then back to the climbs then.

891
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:59,280
So kind of walk me through that and then where you not only did it in a certain time, but

892
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:02,520
also that was including other rescues that you made.

893
00:57:02,520 --> 00:57:06,480
Yeah, you know, for me, of course, that was the mission.

894
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:07,800
The mission was there.

895
00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:13,400
But you know, before mission, you know, of course, there is a humanity and there is a

896
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:20,640
culture and there is a true spirit of who really I am.

897
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:27,560
And for me, I couldn't really walk away with not risking people or walking past the needy

898
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:29,120
people.

899
00:57:29,120 --> 00:57:35,000
So I did, you know, first rescue was on Annapurna, you know, where I was about to go to climb

900
00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:38,000
Daulagri, my second mountain to tick off.

901
00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:44,440
But then I abandoned that Daulagri to go and rescue Dr. Chin.

902
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:47,760
The side effect was massive because, you know, my team in Daulagri, because they have been

903
00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:50,840
waiting for a while, they said I was never going to come.

904
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:54,480
So they almost like, you know, close the camp and left.

905
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:56,960
But yeah, and the story goes on.

906
00:57:56,960 --> 00:58:00,720
Like in, for example, Kanchenjunga, I hadn't slept for like six days.

907
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:06,120
Normally people, you know, go to the summit from, you know, sleeping at camp one, camp

908
00:58:06,120 --> 00:58:07,480
two, camp three and all that.

909
00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:08,480
I didn't have that luxury.

910
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:13,160
So I was just racing from base camp to the summit of this massive mountain, world third

911
00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:15,360
highest mountain, Kanchenjunga.

912
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:20,720
And that as well, I had to give, you know, me and my team, Miqmaq, David, myself and

913
00:58:20,720 --> 00:58:28,080
Guest Man, we rescued four climbers and we had to give oxygen at 1450 meters.

914
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:30,720
And a lot of people say, oh yeah, you climb with oxygen and all that.

915
00:58:30,720 --> 00:58:33,120
But this is the main reason why I do it.

916
00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:37,280
You know, I get my oxygen to save the life of these people.

917
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:44,320
And if you look into the science, physics beyond that, coming off oxygen at 1450 meters

918
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:50,560
and doing a rescue, which is like equally dragging a car at the sea level is is hardcore

919
00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:53,720
than any mountains you climb without oxygen and all that.

920
00:58:53,720 --> 00:59:01,800
So yeah, but the whole thing about this rescue is about, you know, not letting your core

921
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:08,040
value and principle go in a very tough, challenging conditions.

922
00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:09,920
But also you've got to know your abilities as well.

923
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:13,400
You know, you don't want to be, you know, one of the stupid in a person who doesn't

924
00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:18,640
know your ability, try to rescue somebody else and then you become other casualty.

925
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:21,600
And then you kind of, you know, like met that problem even more.

926
00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:28,240
So it's all about a dynamic, calculated risk assessment given the whole circumstances and

927
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:29,240
environment.

928
00:59:29,240 --> 00:59:32,760
Yeah, and obviously you detail the climbs and the rescues in the book.

929
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:35,480
And again, I can't mention that enough.

930
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:41,640
But it also highlights again, that altruistic element that you have where you're not carrying

931
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:47,400
oxygen so that you can be the best, you can be the fastest, but you're lugging that tank

932
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:50,000
up on the off chance that you have to make a rescue.

933
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:53,840
So you either have the strength or you're able to give oxygen to the victim.

934
00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:55,840
So I think that speaks volumes.

935
00:59:55,840 --> 01:00:01,920
Yeah, maybe, you know, because at the end of the day, you you got to learn from your

936
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:02,920
experience.

937
01:00:02,920 --> 01:00:08,040
OK, whenever we go in the target, whenever we go in the mission, there's always debrief.

938
01:00:08,040 --> 01:00:10,700
We don't only talk about what went well and high five.

939
01:00:10,700 --> 01:00:11,700
We just talk.

940
01:00:11,700 --> 01:00:15,080
We also talk about what went wrong as well and what are the lesson learned.

941
01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:21,560
And for me, the lesson learned from my first Everest expedition in 2016 was climbing a

942
01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:24,240
thousand meter peak is not about ego.

943
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:30,000
You know, if you can climb all this mountain with the value and principle, then that's

944
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:32,940
the one for me anyway.

945
01:00:32,940 --> 01:00:39,380
So I learned something from that expedition and I carried that with me to this point and

946
01:00:39,380 --> 01:00:40,380
all that.

947
01:00:40,380 --> 01:00:47,320
It's all about learning from the experience and making what it fits with you as a human,

948
01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:49,560
as an individual as well.

949
01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:51,840
And I'm not there to please the world and all that.

950
01:00:51,840 --> 01:00:54,400
Nobody can do that, you know, because we all are human.

951
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:55,400
We all are different.

952
01:00:55,400 --> 01:01:00,360
But, you know, as long as you have purpose, you learn from your mistakes, you learn from

953
01:01:00,360 --> 01:01:05,360
your experience, you always will be successful in what you do because you are always learning

954
01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:06,360
and adapting.

955
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:07,360
Beautiful.

956
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:12,600
Just to point out, one of my favorite parts of the book was the very end, the lessons

957
01:01:12,600 --> 01:01:13,800
learned at the back.

958
01:01:13,800 --> 01:01:15,720
And it ties in all the stories.

959
01:01:15,720 --> 01:01:21,160
But you know, you've got these key points that really make you think about, you know,

960
01:01:21,160 --> 01:01:23,880
leadership and ownership and all these other areas.

961
01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:25,840
Yeah, 100%.

962
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:31,760
You know, like the whole thing with the book, as I said, is like, even covering the leadership

963
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:36,520
in my team members, I normally when people go to the big mountains and all, they will

964
01:01:36,520 --> 01:01:40,280
have somebody else who has submitted that mountain because, you know, he can show you

965
01:01:40,280 --> 01:01:41,280
the route.

966
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:44,700
There's like, you know, there's danger, you know, because once you submitted, you kind

967
01:01:44,700 --> 01:01:45,700
of know the route.

968
01:01:45,700 --> 01:01:46,700
But I didn't do that.

969
01:01:46,700 --> 01:01:52,400
Because I put my guys because they were rotating, you know, between summit to the summit.

970
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:56,700
So I put these guys into the mountain that they haven't climbed before.

971
01:01:56,700 --> 01:01:59,040
So they also have the objective as well.

972
01:01:59,040 --> 01:02:02,760
So when you put, you know, the interests of your team members, you know, into your heart

973
01:02:02,760 --> 01:02:06,120
as well, and that gives such a powerful gesture.

974
01:02:06,120 --> 01:02:11,880
Yeah, the whole leadership style is completely different and all that.

975
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:15,320
And I think that's also one of the reasons why, you know, the whole, you know, project

976
01:02:15,320 --> 01:02:16,320
was successful.

977
01:02:16,320 --> 01:02:17,320
Yeah.

978
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:22,600
Well, speaking of the Nepalese people, so here we are now recording this in, you know,

979
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:23,840
2020.

980
01:02:23,840 --> 01:02:31,580
What has been the impact of COVID on the climbing environment and therefore the economic side

981
01:02:31,580 --> 01:02:32,580
for the Nepalese?

982
01:02:32,580 --> 01:02:37,000
You know, good question.

983
01:02:37,000 --> 01:02:42,880
You know, a lot of people in Nepal, the climbing community, they massively rely, you know,

984
01:02:42,880 --> 01:02:45,580
rely on Everest Expedition.

985
01:02:45,580 --> 01:02:46,840
That's the biggest expedition.

986
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:50,120
That's where they make money, you know, all the guides.

987
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:55,040
And of course, you know, the whole family depend on that, you know, expeditions and

988
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:56,040
all that.

989
01:02:56,040 --> 01:03:01,080
But with COVID, all the Himalayan expeditions were cancelled this year.

990
01:03:01,080 --> 01:03:04,800
So it was really tough time, you know, and I did what I could do to help them.

991
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:10,360
You know, I kind of had that GoFundMe page and we're like just buying food for the people.

992
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:12,440
A lot of people have donated on that one.

993
01:03:12,440 --> 01:03:15,760
And thank you so much to those who have donated and all that.

994
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:18,600
Yeah, it's a really tough time, you know.

995
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:20,640
It's a tough time for everybody else.

996
01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:23,680
I know we all have our own problems and all that.

997
01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:30,880
But just in relation to the climbing community, thank you so much to everyone who had supported.

998
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:31,880
Yeah.

999
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:32,880
Brilliant.

1000
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:33,880
All right.

1001
01:03:33,880 --> 01:03:38,600
Well, then lead me through then what made you decide to write a book and then what that

1002
01:03:38,600 --> 01:03:39,600
process was like.

1003
01:03:39,600 --> 01:03:42,520
I just finished a book myself so I can relate.

1004
01:03:42,520 --> 01:03:44,480
But what was your experience?

1005
01:03:44,480 --> 01:03:48,440
Why I wanted to write the book.

1006
01:03:48,440 --> 01:03:55,320
This was one of the strengths that I had when I was almost dying on the 1000m peak, when

1007
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:57,200
I was running out of my energy and all.

1008
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,640
I wanted to tell the story by myself.

1009
01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:04,040
I wanted to do the justice to the story.

1010
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:09,160
I didn't want, you know, somebody else writing my story on the guest, you know, on like Azimson

1011
01:04:09,160 --> 01:04:12,000
or in the imagination.

1012
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:15,340
Because what I have written in this book is a statement.

1013
01:04:15,340 --> 01:04:16,880
No one can argue with this.

1014
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:21,160
Everything what I have written is backed up by either video evidence or anything.

1015
01:04:21,160 --> 01:04:26,180
And everything hasn't been even like, you know, when people do something, people make

1016
01:04:26,180 --> 01:04:28,020
it bigger.

1017
01:04:28,020 --> 01:04:31,800
And honestly, believe me, I've tried to play down as much as I can.

1018
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:33,880
And everything is like, like there.

1019
01:04:33,880 --> 01:04:42,240
But to be able to tell this story from my own perspective, you know, it was really,

1020
01:04:42,240 --> 01:04:43,680
really humbling experience.

1021
01:04:43,680 --> 01:04:48,800
But to be honest, buddy, the writing book is hardcore.

1022
01:04:48,800 --> 01:04:51,760
It is so hard.

1023
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:55,720
I have read this book now nine times.

1024
01:04:55,720 --> 01:05:00,240
And I must say, I'm very excited now because I have put so much work.

1025
01:05:00,240 --> 01:05:03,960
And as you know, I give 100% in everything that I do in my life.

1026
01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:06,520
And that's what I have done with the book.

1027
01:05:06,520 --> 01:05:09,360
And this book is not about, you know, mountain.

1028
01:05:09,360 --> 01:05:15,200
It's about letting, you know, yourself about climbing your own mountains and how you could

1029
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:22,120
achieve, you know, your own new possible in relation to how I cope with the problem, how

1030
01:05:22,120 --> 01:05:26,120
I mitigate with them, what my thought process are and all that.

1031
01:05:26,120 --> 01:05:29,400
So I hope it will be, you know, people's book as well.

1032
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:32,080
No, well, like I said, I thought it was fantastic.

1033
01:05:32,080 --> 01:05:38,040
And there's many times now in conversations on here, I've spoken to people who have redefined

1034
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:39,640
something in life, you know.

1035
01:05:39,640 --> 01:05:44,640
And then once they do, then behind them is a bunch of people that then start to kind

1036
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:45,920
of match the same thing.

1037
01:05:45,920 --> 01:05:50,280
But it's that first pioneer, that first person that shows other people that something is

1038
01:05:50,280 --> 01:05:51,280
possible.

1039
01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:54,520
And I think that's what I got from this is, you know, again, like you said, definitely

1040
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:59,600
the kindness, compassion element, which I think is beautiful, but also that belief,

1041
01:05:59,600 --> 01:06:00,600
that self belief.

1042
01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:05,000
Like, I don't care what anyone says, I fucking know that I can do this.

1043
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:06,960
So I'm just going to show you.

1044
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:07,960
Yeah.

1045
01:06:07,960 --> 01:06:08,960
Thank you, buddy.

1046
01:06:08,960 --> 01:06:11,240
And that's what exactly it is.

1047
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:15,480
And that's what exactly, you know, the being possible is about, you know, finding your

1048
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:16,480
own mission.

1049
01:06:16,480 --> 01:06:23,840
If you believe in that, give your heart, mind and soul into it and just go for it and you'll

1050
01:06:23,840 --> 01:06:24,840
be successful.

1051
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:27,680
You will make the impossible possible.

1052
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:30,080
Now what was it like for you once you'd written it?

1053
01:06:30,080 --> 01:06:33,600
Were you able to kind of breathe a sigh of relief now you were able to kind of offload

1054
01:06:33,600 --> 01:06:37,040
that story?

1055
01:06:37,040 --> 01:06:42,160
I have, but obviously, you know, I'm not that kind of a person who can just go on a busy

1056
01:06:42,160 --> 01:06:43,160
holiday and relax.

1057
01:06:43,160 --> 01:06:44,920
You know, I can't do that.

1058
01:06:44,920 --> 01:06:48,720
So I have been on a mission and I have been learning how to speed fly.

1059
01:06:48,720 --> 01:06:51,520
I have been like, you know, full on buddy.

1060
01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:55,880
I'm planning on, you know, like the next future project and all that.

1061
01:06:55,880 --> 01:07:00,880
So it's full on mission because, you know, I'm quite new to this mountaineering world,

1062
01:07:00,880 --> 01:07:01,880
to be honest.

1063
01:07:01,880 --> 01:07:05,960
I just became a professional climber only a year ago.

1064
01:07:05,960 --> 01:07:09,960
Before that, you know, my profession was in a tier one UK in a special forces.

1065
01:07:09,960 --> 01:07:12,240
So I got a lot to do, I think.

1066
01:07:12,240 --> 01:07:13,240
Yeah, absolutely.

1067
01:07:13,240 --> 01:07:15,280
Well, so are there any big plans?

1068
01:07:15,280 --> 01:07:20,080
Is there a next adventure that you're hoping to share?

1069
01:07:20,080 --> 01:07:27,520
I cannot really say that now, but it is something massive, you know, equally big.

1070
01:07:27,520 --> 01:07:28,520
And yeah, stay tuned.

1071
01:07:28,520 --> 01:07:30,360
I don't doubt it for a moment.

1072
01:07:30,360 --> 01:07:31,360
All right.

1073
01:07:31,360 --> 01:07:33,240
Well, again, like I said, the book is incredible.

1074
01:07:33,240 --> 01:07:37,240
And I think what's so good is you are the quiet professionals, you know, and again,

1075
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:42,160
I'm not trying to draw anything out from any of your service that shouldn't be out there.

1076
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:47,200
But when, you know, when men and women who have these powerful stories are able to put

1077
01:07:47,200 --> 01:07:52,360
it in writing, whatever they're allowed to tell about, it really, really resonates with

1078
01:07:52,360 --> 01:07:55,960
people because there's so much shallow fiction out there.

1079
01:07:55,960 --> 01:08:00,440
And yet these real life stories that many of whom have had on the show are so much more

1080
01:08:00,440 --> 01:08:03,440
powerful than most storytellers can make up anyway.

1081
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:08,800
So I can't advocate highly enough for your book.

1082
01:08:08,800 --> 01:08:09,800
Thank you, buddy.

1083
01:08:09,800 --> 01:08:11,440
That's really kind of you.

1084
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,880
And thank you for your honest feedback as well.

1085
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:14,880
No problem.

1086
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:18,280
Let me transition some closing questions so I can let you go.

1087
01:08:18,280 --> 01:08:20,400
We'll talk about where people can find the book in just a moment.

1088
01:08:20,400 --> 01:08:24,200
But is there a book that someone else has written that you love to talk about or recommend?

1089
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:29,360
It can be related to what we've discussed today or something completely different?

1090
01:08:29,360 --> 01:08:36,520
Nothing really, buddy, because I'm going to be brutally honest, I haven't read any book.

1091
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:37,520
Sorry.

1092
01:08:37,520 --> 01:08:38,960
No, no problem at all.

1093
01:08:38,960 --> 01:08:39,960
What about it?

1094
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:47,080
My writing book was really crazy and all that because the whole life in Escriptural Forces,

1095
01:08:47,080 --> 01:08:49,600
you're busy running around and all that.

1096
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:55,360
And straight after that, I was into this project and obviously, full on.

1097
01:08:55,360 --> 01:09:02,120
But I can definitely tell you who have been my inspiration from what I have been seeing

1098
01:09:02,120 --> 01:09:06,480
and all that is definitely Muhammad Ali and Usain Bolt.

1099
01:09:06,480 --> 01:09:10,760
These two guys have been a massive inspiration for me.

1100
01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:11,760
Beautiful.

1101
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:15,560
Yeah, I think that's the problem with your profession, even my profession, is there's

1102
01:09:15,560 --> 01:09:21,760
so many facts and skills to master that I found in most of my Fire Service career.

1103
01:09:21,760 --> 01:09:25,600
I was reading textbooks and reading medical books and all those things.

1104
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:28,600
So there wasn't a lot of time for other books, really.

1105
01:09:28,600 --> 01:09:29,600
Yeah.

1106
01:09:29,600 --> 01:09:30,600
Brilliant.

1107
01:09:30,600 --> 01:09:31,600
All right.

1108
01:09:31,600 --> 01:09:32,600
So then what about a film?

1109
01:09:32,600 --> 01:09:36,400
Any films or documentaries that you've loved?

1110
01:09:36,400 --> 01:09:38,000
I cannot talk about.

1111
01:09:38,000 --> 01:09:39,600
Oh, you mean like that I love?

1112
01:09:39,600 --> 01:09:40,600
Yeah, that you love.

1113
01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:41,600
Nothing secret.

1114
01:09:41,600 --> 01:09:46,000
I watched the last dance by obviously Michael Jordan.

1115
01:09:46,000 --> 01:09:47,840
It was awesome.

1116
01:09:47,840 --> 01:09:48,840
Yeah.

1117
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:52,400
And then you mentioned David Attenborough's documentary as well?

1118
01:09:52,400 --> 01:09:55,040
Yeah, it was that as well in a couple of days ago.

1119
01:09:55,040 --> 01:09:56,040
That's amazing.

1120
01:09:56,040 --> 01:09:57,040
Yeah.

1121
01:09:57,040 --> 01:09:58,040
Beautiful.

1122
01:09:58,040 --> 01:09:59,960
My sister works for the BBC and she edits.

1123
01:09:59,960 --> 01:10:02,160
So I'm hoping this is the absolute pipe dream.

1124
01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:03,360
I'd love to get him on one day.

1125
01:10:03,360 --> 01:10:04,360
That would be incredible.

1126
01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:05,360
Wow.

1127
01:10:05,360 --> 01:10:06,360
We should see.

1128
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:07,360
That would be awesome.

1129
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:08,360
All right.

1130
01:10:08,360 --> 01:10:12,560
So the next question, is there a person that you recommend to come on this podcast as a

1131
01:10:12,560 --> 01:10:17,960
guest to speak to the first responders, military and associated professions of the world?

1132
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:22,880
Is it like, you know, who I recommend to come on the next podcast?

1133
01:10:22,880 --> 01:10:23,880
Is that your question?

1134
01:10:23,880 --> 01:10:24,880
Yeah, just as an answer.

1135
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:26,040
Then it can be again, anyone.

1136
01:10:26,040 --> 01:10:28,720
Doesn't have to be specifically what we've discussed today.

1137
01:10:28,720 --> 01:10:32,640
Anyone on planet Earth that you think would be a good person for us to listen to.

1138
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:34,640
Did you speak with Jay?

1139
01:10:34,640 --> 01:10:35,640
Jay Moulton?

1140
01:10:35,640 --> 01:10:36,640
Yes.

1141
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:38,920
So Staz and Jay were both on a little while ago.

1142
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:43,240
You took their clothing through dark up the mountain, didn't you?

1143
01:10:43,240 --> 01:10:44,240
Okay.

1144
01:10:44,240 --> 01:10:45,240
Yeah.

1145
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:46,920
And basically, you know, like if you can, you know, bring Anne Middleton.

1146
01:10:46,920 --> 01:10:50,200
You know, he has such a positive mindset and all that.

1147
01:10:50,200 --> 01:10:51,880
So yeah, get him.

1148
01:10:51,880 --> 01:10:52,880
Brilliant.

1149
01:10:52,880 --> 01:10:53,880
I shall.

1150
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:54,880
Thank you so much.

1151
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:55,880
All right.

1152
01:10:55,880 --> 01:10:57,680
So then the last question before we make sure everyone knows where to find the book and where

1153
01:10:57,680 --> 01:10:58,680
to find you.

1154
01:10:58,680 --> 01:11:04,040
What do you do to decompress?

1155
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:11,080
I go and do an extreme sports where I'm literally living my life in the moment.

1156
01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:14,800
You know, if I mess up, if I fuck up, I die.

1157
01:11:14,800 --> 01:11:18,440
And that's what I do to decompress.

1158
01:11:18,440 --> 01:11:21,120
Which sport specifically?

1159
01:11:21,120 --> 01:11:22,120
Anything mate.

1160
01:11:22,120 --> 01:11:26,280
There's so many things, you know, climbing peak mountains or climbing an extreme in a

1161
01:11:26,280 --> 01:11:30,280
great mountains, isn't like grading or even speed flying.

1162
01:11:30,280 --> 01:11:31,280
Yeah.

1163
01:11:31,280 --> 01:11:32,280
All that kind of stuff.

1164
01:11:32,280 --> 01:11:33,280
Beautiful.

1165
01:11:33,280 --> 01:11:34,280
Yeah.

1166
01:11:34,280 --> 01:11:35,840
It's hard not to be in the moment when you almost die.

1167
01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:37,560
All right.

1168
01:11:37,560 --> 01:11:39,440
So then the very last question then.

1169
01:11:39,440 --> 01:11:42,640
So where can people find the book first?

1170
01:11:42,640 --> 01:11:46,840
So basically, if you are following on my Instagram at Nimsta, there's a link.

1171
01:11:46,840 --> 01:11:50,800
You can just find it from there or, you know, you can find that from in a water with stones

1172
01:11:50,800 --> 01:11:52,400
in a imagine.

1173
01:11:52,400 --> 01:11:53,640
Yeah.

1174
01:11:53,640 --> 01:11:57,640
But the easiest thing for now, you know, if you're listening is, you know, just, you know,

1175
01:11:57,640 --> 01:12:00,520
type Nimsta on Instagram or Facebook.

1176
01:12:00,520 --> 01:12:06,240
There's a link on the bio and yeah, I hope you will enjoy reading it.

1177
01:12:06,240 --> 01:12:07,240
Absolutely.

1178
01:12:07,240 --> 01:12:08,640
Well, Nims, I want to say thank you so much.

1179
01:12:08,640 --> 01:12:09,960
It's been a great conversation.

1180
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:10,960
I really enjoyed it.

1181
01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:14,080
And I really appreciate you taking the time to come on the podcast today.

1182
01:12:14,080 --> 01:12:33,000
May thank you so much to you as well for having me.