WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.100 Yeah, well then let's roll without video and 00:00:03.100 --> 00:00:08.300 fuck the torrid overlords. You are now listening 00:00:08.300 --> 00:00:49.490 to Cryptid Cocktail Party. Welcome back, everyone, 00:00:49.549 --> 00:00:51.250 to another episode of Cryptid Cocktail Party, 00:00:51.289 --> 00:00:52.789 a show where we have a few drinks, share a few 00:00:52.789 --> 00:00:54.850 laughs, take a dive into the unknown. I'm your 00:00:54.850 --> 00:00:57.170 host, Dave. Normally, I'm joined, as always, 00:00:57.310 --> 00:01:01.329 by Sarge, but he is, unfortunately, doing something. 00:01:01.409 --> 00:01:03.009 I honestly don't know what he's doing, but I 00:01:03.009 --> 00:01:04.849 got a special guest today, special co -host. 00:01:04.950 --> 00:01:07.269 I got Chris Collari from Scared All the Time. 00:01:07.329 --> 00:01:09.590 What's going on, man? Hey, how you doing, man? 00:01:09.709 --> 00:01:12.010 Thanks for having me on. I brought, I brought, 00:01:12.150 --> 00:01:14.650 I was just telling you before we started, but... 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:18.319 in honor of the cocktail it's 11 a .m here uh 00:01:18.319 --> 00:01:20.500 in los angeles where i'm recording and i have 00:01:20.500 --> 00:01:24.480 some uh some brunch margs lined up so that's 00:01:24.480 --> 00:01:27.200 my that's my cocktail that i'm bringing to this 00:01:27.200 --> 00:01:30.159 cryptid party well i mean los angeles is you 00:01:30.159 --> 00:01:33.340 know the land of excess so i mean i guess having 00:01:33.340 --> 00:01:36.079 two double fisting margs at 11 a .m is i would 00:01:36.079 --> 00:01:39.000 assume par for the course there well uh it is 00:01:39.000 --> 00:01:43.180 for some people i i i normally i would have one 00:01:43.180 --> 00:01:45.780 but i made these for my wife and i and she wasn't 00:01:45.780 --> 00:01:49.620 digging the uh the the mango was maybe a little 00:01:49.620 --> 00:01:53.519 not properly ripe so i think it works as a mark 00:01:53.519 --> 00:01:57.159 base but i ended up with two so i figured what 00:01:57.159 --> 00:02:00.299 the hell we're gonna be talking ghouls and goblins 00:02:00.299 --> 00:02:03.620 or whatever so i mean i guess i guess it's good 00:02:03.620 --> 00:02:05.359 to get lubed up early because this what this 00:02:05.359 --> 00:02:07.030 story is kind of weird it's not like It's not 00:02:07.030 --> 00:02:09.270 the craziest story, but it's definitely one of 00:02:09.270 --> 00:02:12.069 the more interesting, I feel like. I tried to 00:02:12.069 --> 00:02:14.490 find something fun for you. That's the best way 00:02:14.490 --> 00:02:17.150 I'll put it. Okay. But yeah, I'm glad you're 00:02:17.150 --> 00:02:21.969 here. I'm glad we could get this together. All 00:02:21.969 --> 00:02:25.530 right, Chris. you're a smart man a well -traveled 00:02:25.530 --> 00:02:28.229 man i assume uh have you ever been you ever been 00:02:28.229 --> 00:02:30.710 overseas across the pond to europe or anything 00:02:30.710 --> 00:02:33.729 like that i have been across the pond to europe 00:02:33.729 --> 00:02:37.389 i went in in middle school my aunt and uncle 00:02:37.389 --> 00:02:41.389 were living in belgium for my uncle's job so 00:02:41.389 --> 00:02:45.719 i was over there um and there's photos of me 00:02:45.719 --> 00:02:47.919 seeing the Eiffel Tower and stuff I don't really 00:02:47.919 --> 00:02:51.000 remember a lot of that trip but then I also went 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:55.500 to my dad's hometown in Italy when I was in the 00:02:55.500 --> 00:02:57.900 summer between my freshman and sophomore year 00:02:57.900 --> 00:03:02.020 of college and that was awesome that trip was 00:03:02.020 --> 00:03:04.719 great I remember that trip very well so yeah 00:03:04.719 --> 00:03:07.759 i've i've been overseas what what crazy what 00:03:07.759 --> 00:03:09.979 crazy thing is happening overseas that i need 00:03:09.979 --> 00:03:12.080 to know about was well while you were there i 00:03:12.080 --> 00:03:13.300 don't know if did you ever get did you get a 00:03:13.300 --> 00:03:15.340 chance to visit uh the country of torrid while 00:03:15.340 --> 00:03:19.199 you were there the country of torrid no no are 00:03:19.199 --> 00:03:20.840 you familiar with the country of torrid at all 00:03:21.120 --> 00:03:22.960 I'm not familiar with the country of Torrid, 00:03:22.960 --> 00:03:25.039 and I'm not great at geography, so this might 00:03:25.039 --> 00:03:28.060 be a very normal country that I've just never 00:03:28.060 --> 00:03:30.180 heard of. No, it's fine. But something tells 00:03:30.180 --> 00:03:34.199 me it's not. You're not the only one who hasn't, 00:03:34.199 --> 00:03:36.580 because neither had the customs and immigration 00:03:36.580 --> 00:03:39.860 agents working at Haneda Airport in Tokyo, which 00:03:39.860 --> 00:03:41.479 is why they were kind of caught off guard when 00:03:41.479 --> 00:03:43.860 a sharp -dressed man presented them with a passport 00:03:43.860 --> 00:03:46.560 for a country that, at least in this universe, 00:03:46.879 --> 00:03:49.620 doesn't exist. today chris we're going to be 00:03:49.620 --> 00:03:52.020 talking about the man from torrid are you familiar 00:03:52.020 --> 00:03:55.360 with this story at all uh now that you mentioned 00:03:55.360 --> 00:03:58.580 this and the japanese piece of it it's vaguely 00:03:58.580 --> 00:04:01.520 familiar but i don't know i don't know really 00:04:01.520 --> 00:04:04.879 any of the details so uh yeah let's get into 00:04:04.879 --> 00:04:07.439 it tell me more about this man from torrid all 00:04:07.439 --> 00:04:10.840 right so it's the morning of july 1954 at tokyo's 00:04:10.840 --> 00:04:13.849 haneda airport International flights had been 00:04:13.849 --> 00:04:16.069 arriving throughout the morning, passengers shuffling 00:04:16.069 --> 00:04:17.769 through customs. You know how airports work. 00:04:17.910 --> 00:04:20.850 Among those arriving was a well -dressed Caucasian 00:04:20.850 --> 00:04:23.209 man who appeared to be in his mid -40s, carrying 00:04:23.209 --> 00:04:25.370 himself like a man who's done this a million 00:04:25.370 --> 00:04:28.300 times. He was dressed in a nice tailored business 00:04:28.300 --> 00:04:31.259 suit, crisp white shirt, polished shoes, neatly 00:04:31.259 --> 00:04:33.220 knotted tie. He was dressed like what the Japanese 00:04:33.220 --> 00:04:35.060 would call like a salary man. You know what I'm 00:04:35.060 --> 00:04:37.379 talking about? Now, at first glance, nothing 00:04:37.379 --> 00:04:40.000 about him seems special. He's just a business 00:04:40.000 --> 00:04:42.660 dude at a Tokyo airport. I'm sure he's one in 00:04:42.660 --> 00:04:45.360 a million. But that all changed when he presented 00:04:45.360 --> 00:04:48.569 his passport. the document seemed genuine enough 00:04:48.569 --> 00:04:50.569 it was bound in the style you would have found 00:04:50.569 --> 00:04:53.089 on all european passports at the time complete 00:04:53.089 --> 00:04:55.790 with official looking stamps seals entry and 00:04:55.790 --> 00:04:57.870 exit markings from multiple countries including 00:04:57.870 --> 00:05:00.870 japan the trouble though was that the issuing 00:05:00.870 --> 00:05:04.290 nation was the nation of torrid now this through 00:05:04.290 --> 00:05:07.269 customs officers through a bit of a loop no one 00:05:07.269 --> 00:05:09.529 on duty had ever heard of the country of torrid 00:05:09.529 --> 00:05:12.300 so They had like a little aside, did some quick 00:05:12.300 --> 00:05:14.459 reference checks and confirmed that no, this 00:05:14.459 --> 00:05:17.379 was not a real place at all. It was not listed 00:05:17.379 --> 00:05:19.620 anywhere among recognized nations. I don't know 00:05:19.620 --> 00:05:22.740 how they did that. I don't know if they have 00:05:22.740 --> 00:05:24.660 like a cheat sheet somewhere. I assume they probably 00:05:24.660 --> 00:05:28.879 just looked at a map. Yeah. And how is this country? 00:05:29.019 --> 00:05:31.980 How is this name of this country spelled? T -A 00:05:31.980 --> 00:05:35.720 -U -R -E -D. Okay. All right. So there's a little 00:05:35.720 --> 00:05:39.420 bit of maybe the root Latin for bull in there. 00:05:40.339 --> 00:05:42.680 It also sounds like maybe an ingredient in Red 00:05:42.680 --> 00:05:49.670 Bull. It's horrid. But yeah, but even as the 00:05:49.670 --> 00:05:52.269 customs agents were questioning this man's literal 00:05:52.269 --> 00:05:55.149 existence, he stayed calm. I don't know if I 00:05:55.149 --> 00:05:57.410 would in that matter, but he stated very matter 00:05:57.410 --> 00:06:00.089 -of -factly that Tord was in fact a real and 00:06:00.089 --> 00:06:03.050 sovereign nation located between France and Spain 00:06:03.050 --> 00:06:05.689 and had been there for more than a thousand years. 00:06:06.009 --> 00:06:09.209 Definitely not. I can fact check that right now. 00:06:09.410 --> 00:06:12.029 That's incorrect, sir. I don't know where he 00:06:12.029 --> 00:06:14.850 thinks he's been, but... Well, to call his bluff, 00:06:14.970 --> 00:06:17.439 or out of just genuine curiosity, The customs 00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:19.579 agents were like, all right, prove it. Pointed 00:06:19.579 --> 00:06:22.319 out on this map, and he did so without hesitation. 00:06:22.540 --> 00:06:24.660 He pointed to the region in the Pyrenees Mountains, 00:06:24.720 --> 00:06:27.720 and there is a country there. The only problem 00:06:27.720 --> 00:06:31.000 is that that country is Andorra, not Torrid. 00:06:31.100 --> 00:06:33.600 Now, upon learning this information, the man's 00:06:33.600 --> 00:06:35.740 demeanor shifted from just like polite assurance 00:06:35.740 --> 00:06:38.959 to just full -on genuine confusion. Like even 00:06:38.959 --> 00:06:40.600 he was like, what the fuck is happening here? 00:06:41.199 --> 00:06:43.680 The man insisted that he had never heard of such 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:45.939 a country and that this is where the nation of 00:06:45.939 --> 00:06:48.360 Torrid is located. So not everyone is confused. 00:06:48.980 --> 00:06:51.439 Officials are confused because the man has what 00:06:51.439 --> 00:06:53.600 seems to be a legitimate passport and documentation 00:06:53.600 --> 00:06:56.639 from a country that does not exist. And this 00:06:56.639 --> 00:06:58.899 man's having an existential crisis because his 00:06:58.899 --> 00:07:01.199 whole reality at this point is shifting. And 00:07:01.199 --> 00:07:03.199 you can see his demeanor change because of it. 00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:06.100 That's crazy. I mean, I'm one of those people 00:07:06.100 --> 00:07:11.100 who if... I think it's called the spotlight effect, 00:07:11.240 --> 00:07:13.560 where if somebody questions you, you immediately 00:07:13.560 --> 00:07:16.339 start to think, oh no, I must be wrong. I must 00:07:16.339 --> 00:07:21.420 have done something stupid. If this official 00:07:21.420 --> 00:07:23.620 person is saying, well, hang on a second, that's 00:07:23.620 --> 00:07:26.579 not right, I start to panic. So I can only imagine 00:07:26.579 --> 00:07:30.540 how scary it is when you've ended up in a reality 00:07:30.540 --> 00:07:34.019 where you are completely wrong and no one's going 00:07:34.019 --> 00:07:37.319 to believe you. This guy was having... A very 00:07:37.319 --> 00:07:40.699 bad day. Especially in a foreign country. It's 00:07:40.699 --> 00:07:41.899 not like you're being questioned by authorities 00:07:41.899 --> 00:07:45.360 in your own place. You're somewhere completely 00:07:45.360 --> 00:07:47.740 different. Well, yeah, that's a good question. 00:07:47.819 --> 00:07:51.180 I wonder if he was speaking Japanese or if the 00:07:51.180 --> 00:07:53.500 Japanese were speaking English or they were both 00:07:53.500 --> 00:07:57.600 speaking a third language. That would be interesting. 00:07:57.860 --> 00:08:00.819 He was fluent in Japanese, so he was able to 00:08:00.819 --> 00:08:03.389 speak with them. No problem. He was fluent in 00:08:03.389 --> 00:08:05.910 French, Japanese, and I believe another language 00:08:05.910 --> 00:08:08.189 as well. And I'm sure whatever they speak in 00:08:08.189 --> 00:08:12.550 Torrid. They never said what it was. But where 00:08:12.550 --> 00:08:15.110 it's located, it could be either French or Spanish. 00:08:15.209 --> 00:08:24.250 I have no idea. Or Taurine. It could be. So now 00:08:24.250 --> 00:08:26.670 it's time to call in some more senior officials. 00:08:26.790 --> 00:08:28.970 And he was interrogated and questioned almost 00:08:28.970 --> 00:08:31.620 immediately. At first, officials assumed that 00:08:31.620 --> 00:08:33.559 this was just like a simple misunderstanding, 00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:36.200 either like a translation error, or maybe it 00:08:36.200 --> 00:08:38.360 was just like an unfamiliar regional name for 00:08:38.360 --> 00:08:39.899 like a real country or something, which does 00:08:39.899 --> 00:08:41.960 happen. Countries call themselves other things 00:08:41.960 --> 00:08:44.519 regionally on their own. It's like Germany and 00:08:44.519 --> 00:08:47.120 Deutschland kind of thing. But he insisted that 00:08:47.120 --> 00:08:49.759 no, this was not the case. The man claimed, and 00:08:49.759 --> 00:08:52.629 as evidenced by his passport, that this was not 00:08:52.629 --> 00:08:54.509 his first time in Japan and that he had been 00:08:54.509 --> 00:08:57.090 regularly coming and going from Japan for business 00:08:57.090 --> 00:08:59.970 regularly over the past five years without incident. 00:09:00.190 --> 00:09:01.950 When asked about his current business in Japan, 00:09:02.190 --> 00:09:04.389 he said that he was scheduled to meet with representatives 00:09:04.389 --> 00:09:07.070 from a company based in Tokyo and named the firm 00:09:07.070 --> 00:09:10.250 and his contacts without hesitation. But when 00:09:10.250 --> 00:09:13.190 customs officials called to confirm, they were 00:09:13.190 --> 00:09:15.409 told that there was no such meeting and that 00:09:15.409 --> 00:09:17.429 no one at this company had ever heard of this 00:09:17.429 --> 00:09:20.309 guy. They then asked him about his lodging, where 00:09:20.309 --> 00:09:22.750 he was going to be staying in Tokyo, and he said 00:09:22.750 --> 00:09:24.809 he had a room booked at a hotel in central Tokyo, 00:09:24.889 --> 00:09:27.149 but when they contacted the hotel, they had no 00:09:27.149 --> 00:09:29.389 reservation for anyone under his name for the 00:09:29.389 --> 00:09:31.389 dates that he was supposedly supposed to be staying 00:09:31.389 --> 00:09:35.929 there. Wait, so the business that he said that 00:09:35.929 --> 00:09:38.610 he had business with was a real business that 00:09:38.610 --> 00:09:40.929 they contacted? Yeah, the business was real, 00:09:41.049 --> 00:09:44.909 the hotel was real, but when they... called to 00:09:44.909 --> 00:09:46.769 like confirm whether he was actually meeting 00:09:46.769 --> 00:09:49.149 someone or staying at the hotel there was no 00:09:49.149 --> 00:09:51.830 record of him no one knew who he was nothing 00:09:51.830 --> 00:09:56.909 like that okay crazy all right so well then they 00:09:56.909 --> 00:09:58.210 were like all right well maybe if we check his 00:09:58.210 --> 00:10:00.870 passport that'll give us some clues as to like 00:10:00.870 --> 00:10:02.529 what we're missing here and figure out who this 00:10:02.529 --> 00:10:04.190 dude is or what he's actually like where he's 00:10:04.190 --> 00:10:07.009 from but that just made everyone more confused 00:10:07.009 --> 00:10:09.509 uh the booklet was printed in a language that 00:10:09.509 --> 00:10:11.710 no one could immediately identify it said it 00:10:11.710 --> 00:10:14.039 was kind of like a mix it wasn't like quite French, 00:10:14.039 --> 00:10:17.659 it wasn't quite Spanish. It was like a weird 00:10:17.659 --> 00:10:21.379 amalgamation of the two, kind of. The stamps 00:10:21.379 --> 00:10:23.779 inside were legit, though, like from real countries, 00:10:23.779 --> 00:10:25.919 complete with proper dates and official port 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:28.340 of entry seals. So that wasn't really any help. 00:10:29.179 --> 00:10:31.820 So they figured, well, maybe what's in his wallet? 00:10:31.940 --> 00:10:33.980 They found banknotes from multiple countries, 00:10:34.100 --> 00:10:37.259 French, Japanese, German, all of which were consistent 00:10:37.259 --> 00:10:40.120 with his claimed travel history. So that didn't 00:10:40.120 --> 00:10:42.919 really help anything. He did carry a checkbook 00:10:42.919 --> 00:10:45.960 that was tied to a bank and tore it. So all they 00:10:45.960 --> 00:10:48.000 had to do was contact the bank and get this all 00:10:48.000 --> 00:10:51.539 settled. The problem is the bank, when checked 00:10:51.539 --> 00:10:54.179 against international registries, the bank also 00:10:54.179 --> 00:10:57.320 did not exist. So this dude is sitting here listening 00:10:57.320 --> 00:11:02.940 to all of this with growing frustration, and 00:11:02.940 --> 00:11:07.360 he's insisting with his whole chest that this... 00:11:07.769 --> 00:11:10.029 all had to be a mistake. He had visited Japan 00:11:10.029 --> 00:11:12.809 a bunch of times, always without incident. Toru 00:11:12.809 --> 00:11:15.129 was a real and sovereign nation, older than many 00:11:15.129 --> 00:11:17.389 other countries, he stated, and the fact that 00:11:17.389 --> 00:11:19.710 no one here recognized it was just absolutely 00:11:19.710 --> 00:11:23.570 absurd. I can't imagine what this dude's going 00:11:23.570 --> 00:11:26.210 through. No, I mean, he must be completely spiraling 00:11:26.210 --> 00:11:29.639 out at this point, and I think he... I mean, 00:11:29.659 --> 00:11:32.580 the language thing is interesting because he 00:11:32.580 --> 00:11:35.799 said that the country was between France and 00:11:35.799 --> 00:11:38.820 Spain, right? So the idea that the language was 00:11:38.820 --> 00:11:41.740 a mix of both is kind of interesting. But I feel 00:11:41.740 --> 00:11:44.899 like if you... What's interesting is that it 00:11:44.899 --> 00:11:47.659 seems like if we go with the idea that this guy 00:11:47.659 --> 00:11:53.590 shifted realities somehow, it's not just... his 00:11:53.590 --> 00:11:56.730 physical being that shifted reality it seems 00:11:56.730 --> 00:12:00.549 like he was able to shift realities with a couple 00:12:00.549 --> 00:12:04.309 of artifacts from the old reality which raises 00:12:04.309 --> 00:12:08.309 a lot of questions about how exactly that reality 00:12:08.309 --> 00:12:11.070 shifting would happen and why only those artifacts 00:12:11.070 --> 00:12:15.570 came through and not no other residual torrid 00:12:16.500 --> 00:12:19.440 material made it you know was it only things 00:12:19.440 --> 00:12:21.919 that were on his person were able to make it 00:12:21.919 --> 00:12:24.259 or that's what that's what i'm thinking is that 00:12:24.259 --> 00:12:26.220 is probably like just what just happened to be 00:12:26.220 --> 00:12:28.480 in his pockets or like bag at the you know i 00:12:28.480 --> 00:12:31.659 mean like anything that was on him because it 00:12:31.659 --> 00:12:33.580 doesn't seem like anyone else on that flight 00:12:33.580 --> 00:12:38.019 into tokyo had this problem or if there was well 00:12:38.019 --> 00:12:40.080 right and where did it get caught where did he 00:12:40.080 --> 00:12:43.000 where did he get on the flight again from uh 00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:45.320 i don't know where he got on the flight from 00:12:45.320 --> 00:12:48.299 he said he was doing business all around europe 00:12:48.299 --> 00:12:51.720 but i i i'm pretty sure he came from torrid to 00:12:51.720 --> 00:12:54.480 tokyo well they better call the airline then 00:12:54.480 --> 00:12:57.440 like that's uh because then everybody else on 00:12:57.440 --> 00:12:59.879 that plane everybody else on that plane would 00:12:59.879 --> 00:13:05.039 have been on torrid air along with him so yeah 00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:06.860 i don't know he wouldn't have been the only one 00:13:06.860 --> 00:13:08.860 yeah you would you would think that there i mean 00:13:08.860 --> 00:13:11.019 but i mean if unless it was just i don't even 00:13:11.019 --> 00:13:13.539 know how to like Yeah, I wouldn't even, I don't 00:13:13.539 --> 00:13:15.860 know. I think we're thinking about it. I think 00:13:15.860 --> 00:13:18.600 that's the problem. If we put more than two seconds 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:21.340 of thought into this. Yeah, it's one of those 00:13:21.340 --> 00:13:25.259 mysteries that doesn't really bend to logic. 00:13:25.419 --> 00:13:29.679 It's sort of just one of those universal things 00:13:29.679 --> 00:13:32.860 where if this wasn't, well, I don't know. Are 00:13:32.860 --> 00:13:35.299 you going to get to theories or should I? Yeah, 00:13:35.340 --> 00:13:37.019 we'll get into some theories, but we can talk 00:13:37.019 --> 00:13:38.659 about some of them now. Why not? Okay, okay. 00:13:38.820 --> 00:13:42.659 I was just going to say, I mean, either. this 00:13:42.659 --> 00:13:46.519 guy somehow you know did shift realities which 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:50.539 there's stories in the past of of you know throughout 00:13:50.539 --> 00:13:55.059 different newspapers and and yeah you know collections 00:13:55.059 --> 00:13:58.000 of folklore of people who have stepped through 00:13:58.000 --> 00:14:00.059 whether it's like through like a fairy circle 00:14:00.059 --> 00:14:01.860 or something that they've stepped through into 00:14:01.860 --> 00:14:04.480 another reality or another dimension or there 00:14:04.480 --> 00:14:06.179 are people who have claimed these things before 00:14:06.179 --> 00:14:10.620 nobody had or i would say this is one of the 00:14:10.620 --> 00:14:14.600 more very slight differences in reality you know 00:14:14.600 --> 00:14:16.539 it wasn't like a lot of fairy circle stories 00:14:16.539 --> 00:14:18.860 are like i stepped through and it was a whole 00:14:18.860 --> 00:14:21.659 other world and there were sparkling gems and 00:14:21.659 --> 00:14:24.580 or i felt like i was underwater or whatever this 00:14:24.580 --> 00:14:27.179 guy just was like in another boring ass airport 00:14:27.179 --> 00:14:31.240 that's the worst kind of interdimensional travel 00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:32.720 it's like you step through into like a whole 00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:35.240 new universe or whatever and you're like It's 00:14:35.240 --> 00:14:38.259 just as mundane. Like that's such a boring alternate 00:14:38.259 --> 00:14:40.259 dimension to go into. You're just like, fuck, 00:14:40.279 --> 00:14:42.620 I have to go do business now. The only other 00:14:42.620 --> 00:14:45.340 worst place to realize that you slipped timelines 00:14:45.340 --> 00:14:48.519 or something would be at the DMV where you're 00:14:48.519 --> 00:14:53.279 just like, oh, God damn it. In the other reality, 00:14:53.679 --> 00:14:56.820 I was at the front of the line, okay? I don't 00:14:56.820 --> 00:15:00.059 need to go to the back. I was at the front. Yeah. 00:15:01.059 --> 00:15:05.320 So by this point, The situation is like it's 00:15:05.320 --> 00:15:09.080 escalated far beyond like a routine customs check. 00:15:09.120 --> 00:15:11.299 So the authorities decided the best option was 00:15:11.299 --> 00:15:13.419 to get him out of the hotel or out of the airport 00:15:13.419 --> 00:15:15.620 and put him somewhere more secure until they 00:15:15.620 --> 00:15:18.220 figured out like who or what they were dealing 00:15:18.220 --> 00:15:21.059 with. So they made arrangements for him to be 00:15:21.059 --> 00:15:23.940 put up in a nearby airport, like hotel, like, 00:15:23.980 --> 00:15:26.179 you know, like the shitty hotels by the airport. 00:15:26.220 --> 00:15:29.159 So like airline crews and like. layover people 00:15:29.159 --> 00:15:31.820 stay at it wasn't anything special um he was 00:15:31.820 --> 00:15:34.720 escorted to the hotel under guard um but they 00:15:34.720 --> 00:15:36.159 made sure to let him know that he wasn't under 00:15:36.159 --> 00:15:39.279 arrest but he was not free to leave either so 00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:41.779 once at his room which wasn't anything special 00:15:41.779 --> 00:15:44.279 it's just like a bed a desk bathroom like there's 00:15:44.279 --> 00:15:47.879 no adjoining doors or balcony only one way in 00:15:47.879 --> 00:15:50.120 or out and that was through the front door where 00:15:50.120 --> 00:15:52.440 they had stationed two immigration officers who 00:15:52.440 --> 00:15:54.960 were ordered to keep him in his room until further 00:15:54.960 --> 00:15:58.100 notice now reportedly the dude remained pretty 00:15:58.100 --> 00:16:00.220 cooperative like he hung out in his room kept 00:16:00.220 --> 00:16:03.000 to himself got some room service for dinner and 00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:05.139 he didn't show any signs like agitation or anything 00:16:05.139 --> 00:16:07.179 like by all accounts he gave off the impression 00:16:07.179 --> 00:16:10.419 that he expected all this to be cleared up by 00:16:10.419 --> 00:16:12.019 the morning and then he'd be on his way to go 00:16:12.019 --> 00:16:16.419 do business with whatever he does but by morning 00:16:16.419 --> 00:16:20.480 he was gone like when the guards unlocked the 00:16:20.480 --> 00:16:22.700 door to bring him back for questioning the room 00:16:22.700 --> 00:16:25.769 was completely empty his clothes briefcase passport 00:16:25.769 --> 00:16:28.470 personal effects all gone with him there's no 00:16:28.470 --> 00:16:31.450 sign of a struggle no open windows in no way 00:16:31.450 --> 00:16:33.669 he could have just like slipped by the guards 00:16:33.669 --> 00:16:35.970 without being seen the dude just vanished into 00:16:35.970 --> 00:16:40.490 thin air how we feel about that shit uh i mean 00:16:40.490 --> 00:16:47.840 i i feel like tarids technology that that because 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:49.179 here's the thing well we don't know if it was 00:16:49.179 --> 00:16:50.299 like a tech we don't know if it's a technology 00:16:50.299 --> 00:16:52.299 thing like it could have just been like a like 00:16:52.299 --> 00:16:55.039 a like a wormhole or whatever that tv show was 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:57.000 where like the plane went like 15 years into 00:16:57.000 --> 00:16:59.360 the slider or whatever or sliders yeah it could 00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:02.259 be a sliders thing like but i don't it could 00:17:02.259 --> 00:17:06.059 be a natural occurring you slip timelines how 00:17:06.859 --> 00:17:09.759 How are you slipping back less than 24 hours 00:17:09.759 --> 00:17:12.000 later? I guess maybe the universe just writes 00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:13.940 itself or something. Yeah, it could just be like 00:17:13.940 --> 00:17:16.119 a blip. Yeah, you go to sleep and you wake up 00:17:16.119 --> 00:17:18.420 back in your bed and tar it and think, wow, what 00:17:18.420 --> 00:17:21.440 a crazy dream that was. And meanwhile, back in 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:23.359 our reality, we're still talking about this, 00:17:23.420 --> 00:17:31.140 what, 60, 70 years later? I mean, I'm also very 00:17:31.140 --> 00:17:34.220 curious. This guy, it seems like... business 00:17:34.220 --> 00:17:37.299 it seems like doing business was a an actual 00:17:37.299 --> 00:17:40.079 job in torrent with the amount of insistence 00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:43.440 he had that he was just here to do business without 00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:45.859 it seems like a ton of details as to what that 00:17:45.859 --> 00:17:48.940 business was i think like like those details 00:17:48.940 --> 00:17:51.640 like what he actually did for work and stuff 00:17:51.640 --> 00:17:53.440 like that like that was never mentioned anywhere 00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:56.119 which is probably for convenience for the story 00:17:56.119 --> 00:17:59.019 i assume right right right they should have checked 00:17:59.019 --> 00:18:01.960 his my co -host i'm scared all the time and vicola 00:18:02.730 --> 00:18:05.869 has a theory about you can tell if someone's 00:18:05.869 --> 00:18:08.569 from another dimension if you check the the tags 00:18:08.569 --> 00:18:11.329 on their clothes because they won't be clothes 00:18:11.329 --> 00:18:13.589 clothing labels that you've ever heard of before 00:18:13.589 --> 00:18:16.829 so they should have done that they should have 00:18:16.829 --> 00:18:19.009 strip searched this man and checked his underwear 00:18:19.009 --> 00:18:22.769 to see what what brand underwear he was wearing 00:18:22.769 --> 00:18:27.150 or pants or shirt or anything it reminds me a 00:18:27.150 --> 00:18:29.269 little bit of there's a lot of there's a lot 00:18:29.269 --> 00:18:33.529 of reddits or subreddits about slipping dimensions 00:18:33.529 --> 00:18:37.430 or mandela effect type stuff where one or two 00:18:37.430 --> 00:18:41.089 details in the world have changed and people 00:18:41.089 --> 00:18:43.970 insist that that means that they have been able 00:18:43.970 --> 00:18:47.490 to shift dimensions or that they've accidentally 00:18:47.490 --> 00:18:49.829 fallen into a new dimension but in those cases 00:18:49.829 --> 00:18:53.309 it's always something relatively insignificant 00:18:53.309 --> 00:18:57.910 yeah like the spelling of bernstein bears or 00:18:57.910 --> 00:19:01.869 the cornucopia on the yeah like the cornucopia 00:19:01.869 --> 00:19:04.869 on fruit of the loom or if the movie shazam exists 00:19:04.869 --> 00:19:08.089 which i have to admit i don't know if any listeners 00:19:08.089 --> 00:19:10.609 have have followed much about mandela effects 00:19:10.609 --> 00:19:13.670 and that sort of thing but the the shazam one 00:19:13.670 --> 00:19:16.529 got me because one of the first times i ever 00:19:16.529 --> 00:19:20.589 heard about mandela effect was an article i was 00:19:20.589 --> 00:19:22.589 reading it and they were talking about the sinbad 00:19:22.589 --> 00:19:25.369 movie shazam and how it had come out around the 00:19:25.369 --> 00:19:27.769 same time as kazam sort of like armageddon and 00:19:27.769 --> 00:19:30.609 deep impact yeah And I was like, you know, in 00:19:30.609 --> 00:19:32.130 my head, I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:19:32.190 --> 00:19:33.289 I remember the movie, blah, blah, blah, blah. 00:19:33.390 --> 00:19:35.049 And then it hits the twist in the article where 00:19:35.049 --> 00:19:37.529 they're like, except Shazam never existed. And 00:19:37.529 --> 00:19:41.349 I was like, hang on, full fucking stop. What 00:19:41.349 --> 00:19:44.869 do you mean Shazam never existed? Like, I really 00:19:44.869 --> 00:19:47.910 I thought that movie was real. But then the thing 00:19:47.910 --> 00:19:50.529 that the thing that has convinced me that all 00:19:50.529 --> 00:19:53.029 these Mandela effects are really just some sort 00:19:53.029 --> 00:19:58.130 of like pre meme. meme that existed like in our 00:19:58.130 --> 00:20:02.150 subconscious is that nobody has a clear recollection 00:20:02.150 --> 00:20:06.650 of what the movie Shazam was about myself included 00:20:06.650 --> 00:20:09.289 yeah and that's what makes me feel like there's 00:20:09.289 --> 00:20:12.390 no way that there because if if it was some sort 00:20:12.390 --> 00:20:14.730 of interdimensional sliding thing like somebody 00:20:14.730 --> 00:20:17.880 would have some clear memory and probably more 00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:20.420 than one person would have some clear memory 00:20:20.420 --> 00:20:24.180 of oh yeah the movie started even roughly you 00:20:24.180 --> 00:20:26.480 know like this happened in the first couple minutes 00:20:26.480 --> 00:20:28.420 and then and then this happened and then at the 00:20:28.420 --> 00:20:31.519 end this happens and nobody has ever been able 00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:33.680 to come forward and say that they know what happened 00:20:33.680 --> 00:20:37.140 in that movie so i do think it probably is just 00:20:37.140 --> 00:20:39.839 some weird hiccup in our brains but it that kind 00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:42.319 of stuff is interesting and not exactly what's 00:20:42.319 --> 00:20:45.539 happening here this is less of a collective experience 00:20:45.539 --> 00:20:49.299 and more of one guy's crazy experience but this 00:20:49.299 --> 00:20:51.579 is this is one singular dude's mandela effect 00:20:51.579 --> 00:20:55.380 yes yes i'm also trying to think like you know 00:20:55.380 --> 00:20:59.420 this is this is uh how many years is this after 00:20:59.420 --> 00:21:03.759 the bomb got dropped oh this is 1954 so what 00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:08.220 like 10 years on from from japan getting the 00:21:08.220 --> 00:21:11.359 bomb dropped so i i just i wonder if there could 00:21:11.359 --> 00:21:15.890 have been any weird you know, spy craft or something 00:21:15.890 --> 00:21:18.329 going on? Like, could this have been somebody 00:21:18.329 --> 00:21:23.170 trying to test for like security lapses somehow 00:21:23.170 --> 00:21:27.930 in their in their immigration system by, you 00:21:27.930 --> 00:21:30.910 know, having all these forged documents and trying 00:21:30.910 --> 00:21:35.769 to see, you know, which which things work, like 00:21:35.769 --> 00:21:37.990 what seemed realistic to them and what didn't? 00:21:37.990 --> 00:21:40.250 Or, you know, could this have been some sort 00:21:40.250 --> 00:21:43.759 of an information gathering exercise? by somebody 00:21:43.759 --> 00:21:49.579 you're me maybe well don't worry we're gonna 00:21:49.579 --> 00:21:51.519 get to it don't worry about it oh oh oh okay 00:21:51.519 --> 00:21:53.220 okay i'll let you keep going then keep going 00:21:53.220 --> 00:21:55.779 all right so all right so where were we oh so 00:21:55.779 --> 00:21:58.059 the so the dude's gone he just vanished out of 00:21:58.059 --> 00:22:01.319 nowhere um the uh the guards and the authorities 00:22:01.319 --> 00:22:03.259 they did an immediate search of the hotel and 00:22:03.259 --> 00:22:04.940 surrounding areas but they didn't turn up anything 00:22:04.940 --> 00:22:07.920 uh immigration records showed no one boarded 00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:10.410 a plane under his name or description There was 00:22:10.410 --> 00:22:12.910 no trains, buses or taxis reported picking up 00:22:12.910 --> 00:22:15.049 a passenger matching his description. And as 00:22:15.049 --> 00:22:17.430 far as the official record was concerned, like 00:22:17.430 --> 00:22:20.289 the mandatory just ceased to exist. And with 00:22:20.289 --> 00:22:22.450 no real way to do any further investigating, 00:22:22.650 --> 00:22:25.369 at least by like 1954 standards, the case went 00:22:25.369 --> 00:22:28.329 cold. It's hard to investigate a man that just 00:22:28.329 --> 00:22:30.809 stopped existing from a country that doesn't 00:22:30.809 --> 00:22:34.630 exist. So now, Chris, as you're probably wondering. 00:22:35.630 --> 00:22:37.630 Where does this story come from? And is there 00:22:37.630 --> 00:22:40.549 any real proof that this actually happens? We've 00:22:40.549 --> 00:22:43.009 already been kind of talking about it. And the 00:22:43.009 --> 00:22:47.450 answer is no, not really. Well, that solves a 00:22:47.450 --> 00:22:51.250 lot of my problems then. That answers a lot of 00:22:51.250 --> 00:22:54.049 questions. I was approaching this as if there 00:22:54.049 --> 00:22:56.509 was a record or something. But if there is no 00:22:56.509 --> 00:23:01.250 real proof, then I suspect I might know where 00:23:01.250 --> 00:23:04.109 this man was from. And the answer is fiction. 00:23:05.369 --> 00:23:09.190 Yes and no. So when researchers looked for any 00:23:09.190 --> 00:23:11.769 sort of paper trail, like police reports, immigration 00:23:11.769 --> 00:23:15.910 logs, newspaper coverage from 1954, nothing turns 00:23:15.910 --> 00:23:18.650 up. And for something as wild as businessman 00:23:18.650 --> 00:23:21.069 from unknown country disappears under mysterious 00:23:21.069 --> 00:23:23.990 circumstances is you would think that there would 00:23:23.990 --> 00:23:27.230 be something, which leaves us with two possibilities. 00:23:27.309 --> 00:23:30.809 One, the government and the powers that be deliberately 00:23:30.809 --> 00:23:36.210 buried this story for reasons. Or two, it wasn't 00:23:36.210 --> 00:23:39.730 in the public records in 1954 because it hadn't 00:23:39.730 --> 00:23:42.950 happened yet. So don't get excited. This isn't 00:23:42.950 --> 00:23:44.569 like time travel or anything like that. It's 00:23:44.569 --> 00:23:48.390 just that when researchers went digging for evidence 00:23:48.390 --> 00:23:52.150 from 1954, like I said, for police reports, logs, 00:23:52.430 --> 00:23:54.390 articles, nothing came up. There's no mention 00:23:54.390 --> 00:23:57.130 of a mysterious man from an unknown country disappearing 00:23:57.130 --> 00:24:00.309 from a Haneda Airport hotel, which is weird. 00:24:00.430 --> 00:24:03.460 You would think... something would come up if 00:24:03.460 --> 00:24:06.799 this actually happened. So that's why some people 00:24:06.799 --> 00:24:10.000 suspect that the 1954 date may be like a later 00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:12.099 invention, because when you look up anything 00:24:12.099 --> 00:24:15.500 resembling the Torrid story, the closest match 00:24:15.500 --> 00:24:18.000 turns up several years later in a case that is 00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:21.599 very real, very documented, but far less paranormal. 00:24:21.720 --> 00:24:27.099 So in 1959... The Japanese authorities arrested 00:24:27.099 --> 00:24:30.259 a man by the name of John Allen Kutcher Zegras. 00:24:30.359 --> 00:24:31.859 I think that's how you pronounce it. I didn't 00:24:31.859 --> 00:24:33.200 bother looking it up because I don't care enough. 00:24:33.720 --> 00:24:38.400 He was an international con artist and forger 00:24:38.400 --> 00:24:41.119 who had been living in Japan with his wife. He 00:24:41.119 --> 00:24:43.279 was arrested for presenting a passport from a 00:24:43.279 --> 00:24:47.119 country no one had ever heard of named Torrid. 00:24:47.480 --> 00:24:51.079 Torrid. Nice. The passport, just like the one 00:24:51.079 --> 00:24:54.160 in the story, was super elaborate. It was printed 00:24:54.160 --> 00:24:56.579 in an unknown language with entry and exit stamps 00:24:56.579 --> 00:24:59.339 from multiple countries. And just like the man 00:24:59.339 --> 00:25:02.000 from Torrid, Zagoras carried various currencies, 00:25:02.099 --> 00:25:04.599 spoke multiple languages, and told very convincing 00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:07.660 stories about his travel. But unlike the man 00:25:07.660 --> 00:25:10.079 from Torrid, Zagoras didn't vanish from a locked 00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:12.940 hotel room. He was caught, arrested, tried in 00:25:12.940 --> 00:25:15.400 a Tokyo court, convicted of fraud, sentenced 00:25:15.400 --> 00:25:17.920 to prison, and then eventually deported to Hong 00:25:17.920 --> 00:25:23.210 Kong. Okay. It did not disappear from his prison 00:25:23.210 --> 00:25:26.849 cell. No, he was... I mean, he did, but because 00:25:26.849 --> 00:25:29.750 they forced him out of the country. Yeah, yeah, 00:25:29.769 --> 00:25:32.410 yeah, yeah. So the similarities between the two 00:25:32.410 --> 00:25:35.490 stories are kind of hard to ignore, but so are 00:25:35.490 --> 00:25:38.029 the differences. Like, over time, it seems that 00:25:38.029 --> 00:25:41.049 the real story lost its messy legal ending in 00:25:41.049 --> 00:25:45.079 favor of a more mysterious one. And that happened 00:25:45.079 --> 00:25:47.799 because French writer Jacques Berger published 00:25:47.799 --> 00:25:51.599 a modified version of the story in 1964, shifting 00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:55.579 the date to 1954, dropping Zegras' name and adding 00:25:55.579 --> 00:25:58.940 some Cold War overtones to the story. And then 00:25:58.940 --> 00:26:02.160 by 1981, authors Colin Wilson and John Grant 00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:04.720 condensed that into a brief entry in their book 00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:07.880 titled The Directory of Possibilities, and they 00:26:07.880 --> 00:26:10.240 presented it more as an unsolved mystery rather 00:26:10.240 --> 00:26:13.700 than a closed case with an actual ending. And 00:26:13.700 --> 00:26:16.420 then from there, the internet just pretty much 00:26:16.420 --> 00:26:18.380 finished the transformation. Like the story was 00:26:18.380 --> 00:26:20.920 retold on early paranormal and urban legend websites 00:26:20.920 --> 00:26:24.839 in the late 1990s and early 2000s with each iteration 00:26:24.839 --> 00:26:29.299 kind of reshaping what was once a documented 00:26:29.299 --> 00:26:32.680 forgery case into like this neat interdimensional 00:26:32.680 --> 00:26:35.619 cinematic tale that we know today. I don't know 00:26:35.619 --> 00:26:37.700 if that answers any of your questions. Oh yeah, 00:26:37.799 --> 00:26:41.519 it answers all of them. The only thing it doesn't 00:26:41.519 --> 00:26:47.500 answer is, I bet this guy, I forget his entire 00:26:47.500 --> 00:26:50.660 name that you laid out there. It's so long. But 00:26:50.660 --> 00:26:55.700 he probably had an interesting life even before 00:26:55.700 --> 00:26:59.000 he became the subject of the Man from Tared myth. 00:26:59.240 --> 00:27:03.880 If he was a guy who was traveling internationally, 00:27:04.940 --> 00:27:08.480 and a forger on the level of being able to forge 00:27:08.480 --> 00:27:12.619 a passport stamps and the guy was probably up 00:27:12.619 --> 00:27:15.759 to to some adventures before he got caught so 00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:18.180 i i would love to just read a biography about 00:27:18.180 --> 00:27:21.200 him he he was very like he reminded me of like 00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:24.420 uh the dude from leonardo dicaprio from catch 00:27:24.420 --> 00:27:27.720 me if you can it was like yes from what i know 00:27:27.720 --> 00:27:31.759 about him he like he for he did uh check fraud 00:27:32.269 --> 00:27:35.849 Bank fraud, identity fraud, like he did it all. 00:27:35.930 --> 00:27:38.029 And this just happened to be the one thing that 00:27:38.029 --> 00:27:39.710 brought him down. I think it was the boldness 00:27:39.710 --> 00:27:43.009 of creating a whole country and language. You 00:27:43.009 --> 00:27:45.630 know, if he just stuck with normal shit, he would 00:27:45.630 --> 00:27:47.950 have been fine. What it makes you wonder if he'd 00:27:47.950 --> 00:27:50.529 ever, if that had ever worked somewhere in like 00:27:50.529 --> 00:27:55.130 maybe a smaller country or, because it's a pretty, 00:27:55.289 --> 00:27:59.210 if things had been going all right for this guy, 00:27:59.369 --> 00:28:04.750 it does seem insane. to go to a level of making 00:28:04.750 --> 00:28:08.230 up a country and then try to use that cover story 00:28:08.230 --> 00:28:13.410 to get into a fairly, even though Japan in the 00:28:13.410 --> 00:28:17.470 1950s and 60s isn't what it is today, it still 00:28:17.470 --> 00:28:20.529 is a fairly large country on the world stage. 00:28:20.609 --> 00:28:22.670 You weren't exactly slipping through the shadows 00:28:22.670 --> 00:28:28.059 on your fake passport somewhere in... you know, 00:28:28.099 --> 00:28:30.960 some, some small Island country or something 00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:33.880 where I feel like maybe you could, maybe you 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:38.019 could get away with it pre computer, uh, you 00:28:38.019 --> 00:28:40.839 know, pre internet or something, but I would, 00:28:40.859 --> 00:28:44.460 I would love to know what moved him to, to leap, 00:28:44.539 --> 00:28:47.740 to take the, take the con to that, to that level. 00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:51.500 Uh, and, and then, because that it's also, I 00:28:51.500 --> 00:28:54.140 mean, maybe it was just some sort of. you know 00:28:54.140 --> 00:28:56.160 a lot of criminals get to the point where they 00:28:56.160 --> 00:28:59.059 like want to be known for the extent of their 00:28:59.059 --> 00:29:02.480 yeah crimes like a hubris type thing yeah maybe 00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:05.220 that was him you know turning himself in in a 00:29:05.220 --> 00:29:07.779 way and thinking maybe you know i mean i guess 00:29:07.779 --> 00:29:11.119 if it was it went down in history in a way that 00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:13.400 he probably never could have imagined but it 00:29:13.400 --> 00:29:16.980 certainly did go down in history as a as a wild 00:29:16.980 --> 00:29:21.140 tale i respect the hustle but uh but even with 00:29:21.140 --> 00:29:24.079 like the the zegras case like this is likely 00:29:24.079 --> 00:29:26.920 the foundation for the man from torrid legend 00:29:26.920 --> 00:29:30.140 but some people don't buy it and there are theories 00:29:30.140 --> 00:29:33.420 that are still being thrown around today um and 00:29:33.420 --> 00:29:36.000 they usually fall into like three different categories 00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:39.200 of who the man from torrid is um the most popular 00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:41.440 explanation in paranormal circles is that the 00:29:41.440 --> 00:29:45.039 man was a traveler from a parallel earth um one 00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:47.839 similar enough to ours that most geography matched 00:29:47.839 --> 00:29:51.200 but different enough that his home nation of 00:29:51.200 --> 00:29:53.259 torrid existed instead of andorra like that's 00:29:53.519 --> 00:29:55.559 The only difference. I like to think that in 00:29:55.559 --> 00:29:58.079 that world, I like to think that in that world, 00:29:58.160 --> 00:30:03.720 he went on to direct the film Shazam. Maybe, 00:30:03.799 --> 00:30:09.119 maybe. Let's hope. The second one is time travel. 00:30:09.500 --> 00:30:12.220 Some interpretations suggest the man was a time 00:30:12.220 --> 00:30:14.539 traveler from either the past or the future. 00:30:15.240 --> 00:30:17.460 Caught in an era where his country did not exist. 00:30:17.660 --> 00:30:21.599 This is often tied to like... speculative physics 00:30:21.599 --> 00:30:23.799 about branching timelines like kind of think 00:30:23.799 --> 00:30:28.099 of like uh like loki and that kind of it's basically 00:30:28.099 --> 00:30:29.720 what they're it's kind of the same thing as that 00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:32.539 there's no evidence to support any of this um 00:30:32.539 --> 00:30:35.559 and then the final theory is the one that we 00:30:35.559 --> 00:30:38.599 pretty much already know is that it's misremembering 00:30:38.599 --> 00:30:41.380 myth building like the legend is a product of 00:30:41.380 --> 00:30:44.240 decades of retellings translation errors and 00:30:44.240 --> 00:30:46.160 embellishments likely starting with the real 00:30:46.160 --> 00:30:49.299 zagra's case And then the names, dates, and events 00:30:49.299 --> 00:30:51.960 were shifted to make the story cleaner, stranger, 00:30:52.259 --> 00:30:55.319 and more shareable on the internet. Like the 00:30:55.319 --> 00:30:58.200 locked room disappearance thing in particular 00:30:58.200 --> 00:31:00.380 is wildly considered a later invention to the 00:31:00.380 --> 00:31:04.140 story. But whether you treat this as the story 00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:06.240 of an interdimensional traveler or a passport 00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:08.460 forgery that snowballed into an urban legend, 00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:11.460 the man from Tor remains one of the most enduring 00:31:11.460 --> 00:31:15.309 quote -unquote mystery travel stories. ever recorded 00:31:15.309 --> 00:31:17.690 i guess you'd want to say uh especially on the 00:31:17.690 --> 00:31:19.690 internet but there you go chris there you have 00:31:19.690 --> 00:31:22.490 it that is the story of the man from torrid i 00:31:22.490 --> 00:31:24.390 hope you enjoyed it you got any thoughts questions 00:31:24.390 --> 00:31:28.569 concerns i love it i mean i i'm concerned for 00:31:28.569 --> 00:31:32.569 whoever thinks that it is anything but obviously 00:31:32.569 --> 00:31:37.710 a mishmash of retellings of the story about a 00:31:37.710 --> 00:31:40.559 guy who literally showed up at an airport with 00:31:40.559 --> 00:31:43.460 a passport from TARED like I think that's kind 00:31:43.460 --> 00:31:46.259 of what you know really seals the deal there 00:31:46.259 --> 00:31:49.119 that as much as you might want to stretch and 00:31:49.119 --> 00:31:53.500 reach and hope that like I'd be more I'd be more 00:31:53.500 --> 00:31:57.019 willing to believe that John Titor or Titor from 00:31:57.019 --> 00:31:59.880 the internet was actually a time traveler than 00:31:59.880 --> 00:32:05.640 the man from TARED was not just a sort of folkloric 00:32:05.640 --> 00:32:08.859 retelling of this event that actually happened 00:32:08.859 --> 00:32:12.380 but no that's it's a crazy story I feel like 00:32:12.380 --> 00:32:17.880 you know that I think it there is something there's 00:32:17.880 --> 00:32:22.380 something so hooky about probably the reason 00:32:22.380 --> 00:32:25.039 it's stuck around is there's there's something 00:32:25.039 --> 00:32:29.380 very sticky or hooky about the idea of a guy 00:32:29.380 --> 00:32:32.259 showing up at an airport with a passport from 00:32:32.259 --> 00:32:34.259 a country that doesn't exist it's very perfectly 00:32:34.259 --> 00:32:38.500 twilight zone it's very uh you know the pieces 00:32:38.500 --> 00:32:41.759 just fit in a way that you go oh yeah like you 00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:45.019 want to believe it you know it's like jj abrams 00:32:45.019 --> 00:32:48.980 could never you know he he he would that would 00:32:48.980 --> 00:32:52.519 be a great opening scene to a jj abrams pilot 00:32:52.519 --> 00:32:55.720 you know it also gives me a chance to shout out 00:32:55.720 --> 00:32:59.220 it's not exactly the same um but it's a great 00:32:59.220 --> 00:33:03.480 parallel earth show called uh God, now I'm going 00:33:03.480 --> 00:33:06.420 to forget the name. Is it Counterpart? You might 00:33:06.420 --> 00:33:09.099 have to delete. No, yeah. Okay, yeah, Counterpart. 00:33:09.380 --> 00:33:13.539 Counterpart with J .K. Simmons is a great Cold 00:33:13.539 --> 00:33:17.819 War thriller. It was on, I think, Starz for like 00:33:17.819 --> 00:33:23.299 a season or two. And it's basically, I don't 00:33:23.299 --> 00:33:24.839 know how much I really want to give away, but 00:33:24.839 --> 00:33:26.799 I don't think anybody watched this show, so it's 00:33:26.799 --> 00:33:28.799 very hard to talk about it without giving anything 00:33:28.799 --> 00:33:34.819 away. But it's essentially a story of East and 00:33:34.819 --> 00:33:39.160 West Berlin if the wall was dividing two different 00:33:39.160 --> 00:33:41.759 dimensions instead of two different cities. That's 00:33:41.759 --> 00:33:46.400 fucking rad. And J .K. Simmons plays a version 00:33:46.400 --> 00:33:49.900 of the same character living on both sides of 00:33:49.900 --> 00:33:53.779 the wall. It's a really, really underrated show. 00:33:54.440 --> 00:33:58.660 Because it's that perfect kind of genre fiction 00:33:58.660 --> 00:34:02.519 where, like, It's our world, but just a little 00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:05.660 bit different. And it really is just a spy story 00:34:05.660 --> 00:34:10.579 with this slightly science fiction twist to it. 00:34:10.659 --> 00:34:13.440 And J .K. Simmons giving two incredible performances. 00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:15.460 Well, I'd expect nothing less from him. Kind 00:34:15.460 --> 00:34:18.659 of reminds me of the man from Tor Ed. Yeah. So 00:34:18.659 --> 00:34:21.440 I would check that out if you haven't. But yeah, 00:34:21.519 --> 00:34:23.820 other than that, man, this was fun. Thanks for 00:34:23.820 --> 00:34:27.340 having me on. I'm glad I'd never heard of the 00:34:27.340 --> 00:34:32.360 European country of Tor Ed before. next time 00:34:32.360 --> 00:34:35.739 i go to europe i'll visit yeah just let me yeah 00:34:35.739 --> 00:34:37.579 send me a postcard you know let me know how it 00:34:37.579 --> 00:34:40.940 is uh all right man well thank you so much for 00:34:40.940 --> 00:34:43.360 coming on i'm stoked you enjoyed it um before 00:34:43.360 --> 00:34:45.820 we end the episode is there anything you want 00:34:45.820 --> 00:34:48.760 to plug anything you want to shout out mention 00:34:48.760 --> 00:34:51.780 oh yeah yeah listen to scared all the time anywhere 00:34:51.780 --> 00:34:53.619 you get your podcast wherever you're listening 00:34:53.619 --> 00:34:56.239 to this podcast you probably can listen to scared 00:34:56.239 --> 00:35:00.860 all the time it is a Show that my co -hosts and 00:35:00.860 --> 00:35:04.260 I, each week we explore a new fear. Sometimes 00:35:04.260 --> 00:35:06.639 they're universal fears. Sometimes they're very 00:35:06.639 --> 00:35:11.199 specific. And we come out every other week. And 00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:14.059 if you sign up for our Patreon at patreon .com 00:35:14.059 --> 00:35:17.440 backslash scaredallthetime at our lowest Patreon 00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:21.139 level, you can sign up to get our other show, 00:35:21.260 --> 00:35:24.099 New Fear Unlocked, that fills in the gaps between 00:35:24.099 --> 00:35:26.400 those weeks so you can get scared all the time 00:35:26.400 --> 00:35:29.989 every week. if you if you dig what you hear so 00:35:29.989 --> 00:35:33.010 uh support and support cryptic cocktail these 00:35:33.010 --> 00:35:34.710 guys rock i mean if you're listening already 00:35:34.710 --> 00:35:37.449 you know that but uh they're uh i think they're 00:35:37.449 --> 00:35:41.090 they're a key part of the the new wave of of 00:35:41.090 --> 00:35:45.550 paranormal podcasting so yeah man this was fun 00:35:45.550 --> 00:35:48.690 and uh hopefully we can do it again soon yeah 00:35:48.690 --> 00:35:51.210 man um all right uh and if they want to find 00:35:51.210 --> 00:35:53.250 you on the internet where can they find you really 00:35:53.250 --> 00:35:56.130 scared all the time on the internet uh yeah they 00:35:56.130 --> 00:35:59.630 we scared all the time is on instagram um and 00:35:59.630 --> 00:36:02.670 uh if you want to find me i'm at chris collari 00:36:02.670 --> 00:36:05.030 i'm pretty much it's pretty much just instagram 00:36:05.030 --> 00:36:08.190 for us these days we do have a facebook uh a 00:36:08.190 --> 00:36:10.730 facebook group for scared all the time if you're 00:36:10.730 --> 00:36:15.130 a big facebook head uh but we we stop we stopped 00:36:15.130 --> 00:36:17.750 with twitter because unless you pay for twitter 00:36:17.750 --> 00:36:22.230 now no one sees your shit yeah um so uh we're 00:36:22.230 --> 00:36:25.730 pretty much just facebook and instagram um and 00:36:25.730 --> 00:36:27.750 wherever you listen to podcasts hell yeah man 00:36:27.750 --> 00:36:29.889 um all right well with that out of the way uh 00:36:29.889 --> 00:36:32.050 normally sarge says like uh goodbye and i love 00:36:32.050 --> 00:36:33.530 you to the audience but would you want to take 00:36:33.530 --> 00:36:35.329 the reins and say goodbye i love you to the audience 00:36:35.329 --> 00:36:41.929 audience adieu ciao i love you we love you and 00:36:41.929 --> 00:36:42.869 we'll catch you next time