Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Cryptic Cocktail Party, a show where we
have a few drinks, share a few laughs, take a dive into the unknown, I'm your host Dave,
joined as one, joined as always by my wonderful co-host Sarge, how's it going Sarge?
What's going on?
What's up?
I'm California Sarge now, because I was in California for a week.
Alright, well yeah, we'll get to that later.
We're also joined by a host of Chasing Legends on Paraflix, Nash Hoover, what's going on
man?
How's it going guys, thanks for having me on.
Oh, not a problem.
Thanks for coming on.
Yeah.
Nash, I just want to say thank you so much for coming on.
What's new with you?
How's life?
How are things going in your world?
Life's good, I mean, living someone's dream, I mean.
That's the best answer to give after such a heavy sigh.
Well, I'm glad you're doing good man, again, I really appreciate you coming on.
I mean, I don't know how busy your schedule is, but you know, I'm going to make it seem
like you're super busy all the time, productions, all these things.
So thank you.
Sarge, what about California?
What are you going on about?
So we recorded last Sunday, and then I got in a plane and went to California, and I stayed
in the Four Seasons Hotel.
My company paid for it, so let's not pretend that I have that money.
I don't have Four Seasons money.
And how was it?
And for a brief period, I thought that I might be in a haunted room.
Oh, okay.
What happened?
Because my ice box, my ice bucket kept like filling up.
Like I would come home from work, I would drop my stuff, I'd go get dinner, I'd come
back and my ice bucket would be full.
Okay, so you're talking about housekeeping.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, exactly.
The thing is, they got a little sign on the door, man.
So housekeeping comes in twice, and that's what confused me.
Okay.
But also you're saying at the Four Seasons, I feel like that's like a ritzy thing.
Yeah, but I'm a poor, I don't know that.
And so it's true, I am, I'm broke.
I'm broke as a joke.
But I recall discovering that housekeeping was coming into my room because at one point,
it was a cell phone charger that was all wrapped up and it had a little Four Seasons cell phone
charger wrap around it.
Okay.
So what you're saying is that Four Seasons is the pinnacle of like...
Yes, and I also recognize that my economic status made me not see this as great service,
but instead paranoia.
Why were they in my room?
What were they looking for?
Buddy's just tweaking.
Terrified.
Sorry, sorry, I'm going to have to revert you back to our episode on gang stalking so
that you can try and quell these fears, all right?
But no, it was great.
I actually, I really did try to get to Fresno while I was there, but I was in LA and apparently
Fresno is like three hours away.
Yeah, you don't realize how big California is until you're in it.
Exactly.
Because I remember when we went to San Francisco, I was like, oh, I'm going to go to all these
different places.
And I was like, nope, fuck all that.
We have a rented car that's like 800 miles away.
I'm all, I'm good.
Thank you.
Yeah.
I wanted to go see the Fresno night crawler like stuff that they have in Fresno.
And it just wanted to roam around that dude's front yard.
Yeah.
I want to go stand next to that tree that looks really big, but is actually tiny.
It's a very tiny tree.
All right.
Anyway, before we dive into today's topic, Nash, for those of those listening who don't
know who you are, what your show is, why don't you just give us a brief little rundown?
I have a couple of questions, but we wait till the end to do those so we can get through
this episode.
But yeah, take the other floor, sell yourself.
I am a, I am a Nash Hoover.
I am a cryptid enthusiast, a host of Jason Legends currently on Paraflex, producer, filmmaker,
husband dad who want to know my credit score and number two over at it.
What's your mother's maiden name?
Just your social will be fun.
But you've been, you've been at this for, what'd you say?
You said since 2013, something like that, something.
Yeah.
2013 is when we, when we created the show and then I've been researching cryptids since
like oh two, oh three.
Oh Jesus Christ.
So what got you, what got you into that?
Like you were just like saw like something about like Nessie and you're like, oh shit,
that's my fucking jam right there.
I mean, yeah.
I was in elementary school at the time, came across a book about Bigfoot and was kind of
intrigued because I was kind of big into wildlife at the time, watching a lot of Corwin and
Irwin and, and it just kind of was intrigued because I was like, oh, there's this, you
know, primate species that's being seen in North America that, you know, in a place we
don't have native primate species and it's kind of weird.
So then, yeah, so I kind of intrigued me and then yeah, I started, you know, I've got into
Loch Ness and UFOs and then as, you know, around that time, or, you know, not long after
that is kind of when paranormal TV kind of started to get big.
And then, you know, shows like Monster Quest and Designation Truth and stuff like that
came out.
So I was able to kind of broaden the kind of global horizon and realize that this is
a much bigger phenomenon than it's, you know, I would, I was kind of, you know, under the
impression.
I want to ask you, do you, would you personally classify aliens in like the same vein as cryptids?
No.
Okay.
See, that's always a question I had also, but because I wouldn't at all.
I feel like it's two wildly different things.
Yeah.
Like we talk about those things, but we don't, we don't put them together.
Yeah, I see.
Yeah.
It's, it seems to be a lot more recently where there's a lot of people that are roping like
clear like extraterrestrial things in with the cryptid stuff and it just doesn't make
any sense.
Yeah, to me at least.
So to bounce off that real quick.
So it's a long standing tradition on this show that we, we just don't straight up don't
believe in Bigfoot.
See, but here's the thing I used to, I did, but I did when back when Bigfoot was just
a hairy primate living in the woods of North America.
Yeah.
Now it's a, you know, interdimensional alien and all this stuff.
And I feel like the reason why is because no one, they can't prove it exists.
So that now they have to find reasons why they can't prove it exists.
So they're like, well, clearly it phases in and out of existence or you know, the UFO
is beam it up.
That's the biggest headache.
You look so mad at us.
The biggest headache of mine is these like communities that kind of specify, you know,
specify on one cryptid overall.
Yeah.
These communities that just seem like they all they want to do is shoot themselves in
the foot and seem like the craziest people you possibly can.
Right.
Yeah.
The Bigfoot community is really kind of gone the route of the paranormal community where
they just.
It's too much.
They need to come out with the craziest theories to justify why there's no evidence or anything.
Exactly.
Yeah.
And there's and I agree with that because I growing up was like very big into paranormal
stuff and then I, you know, I got really excited when those ghost documentary shows would come
out and we're not documentary.
You know what I mean?
Like the reality TV, travel channel kind of thing.
And then you'd clearly see like dust going across the screen and just catching like a
little bit of light.
And you're like, oh, that's clearly a dust particle.
And then it's like, come on, stop it.
So I get what you're saying because like they'll find they'll find a tree with a little bit
of bark off it.
And they're like, this is clearly Bigfoot.
And it's like, or the or it's a tree is dying or the tree is going to fall down soon.
Don't say there's a dude.
There's a dude.
I won't say his name.
I doubt he listens.
But I always see him post stuff on cryptic groups on Facebook where it's I think he's
in I think he's in British Columbia, but he finds like pieces of, you know, waterlogged
bark on the beach and it's kind of rigid.
And he is like, oh, these are clear chew or claw marks from the creatures I've been tracking.
But then he doesn't elaborate on what he thinks they are.
And it's like every and then he I'll see them on every page.
Everyone's like, dude, what are you talking about?
But then he doesn't he doesn't like comment or he doesn't like feed into it.
Yeah.
And like, I want to know how they know what the mating call of Bigfoot sounds like.
How do you know that?
Because Bobo from finding Bigfoot or whatever.
I think it's what it is.
Something like that.
Anyways, before we get too deep in the weeds, I'm glad we're on the same page, Nash.
I'm glad we're on the same page.
We're getting sued now.
I'm just rubbing feathers.
All right.
We're already nine minutes in, but I did have one more question.
So you've done a lot of searching and expeditions trying to find different cryptids or at least
evidence or proof or something along those lines in your travels.
Was there ever anything that you ever have an idea for, like an episode or a series where
you go to find something and you're like, I know this is a folkloric story.
I know this technically probably doesn't exist, but you had to go do it anyways because
people wanted to see it.
Or maybe you just, you or yourself were curious.
Yeah, most of the time.
Okay.
Most of the time.
All right.
Good.
Oh, all right.
That makes me feel sorry.
So basically, so are you, would you say you're more skeptical, skeptic than believer or like,
is it one of those?
Yeah, I've always classified myself as an open-minded skeptic, but just because like
you have to be.
Like I, yeah.
I mean, that's what we are when it comes down to it.
Like, yeah.
Like I want these things to be real, but I'm also not willing to embarrass myself by pretending
that waterlogged bark is evidence of Bigfoot.
I want enough evidence to disprove like a true skeptic.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
Well, we, I mean, that's kind of what we, our approach is that we kind of, we kind of
cover both sides.
We, you know, we explore with biological stuff and then the cultural aspects of whatever.
So like the folklore stuff, and then we kind of find, you know, in our like, you know,
mental pie chart and figure out where they kind of meet.
And then that's kind of where we, you know, kind of focus our efforts on.
And then, you know, it's, you know, we, we've always in it kind of makes sense in our own
way, but it's, you know, we don't look at it.
We don't kind of go after these things to prove whether they exist or don't exist.
We prove, do I go at it to see if it's possible, you know, and kind of like, just sift through
the nonsense to see if we can figure out, you know, and some of these it's, you know,
are more likely than not, you know, misidentifications or just, you know, people jumping on the
Icington 2 bandwagon.
But yeah, it's like the, like the Montauk monster that turned out to be like a dead
raccoon.
Yeah.
Some of these, some of these gained a lot more traction than they need to.
That's fair.
All right.
Well, that kind of, that's kind of a perfect segue into what we're going to be talking
about today, because it is kind of a mixture of like true belief and folklore, I guess.
Today, gentlemen, we're going to be discussing one of the most requested topics by our listeners.
And by that, I mean like three people messaged me saying we should like do this.
But three out of our literal tens of listeners.
Wow.
It's a good chunk.
But to do that, we are going to be heading to a region of the world that we have yet
to cover on this show.
And that good sirs is Africa.
So we're going to, we're going to set the stage for this, for this topic a bit.
So we were going to play Toto's Africa during this, but could not get the rights.
I fucking wish.
But I heard you say deep in the Congo.
So there's only so many, so many routes you can go.
So let's go.
So deep in the Congo river basin in the swampy mosquito infested wilderness where hippos
and crocodiles are beneath the surface.
The local people have passed down stories for generations about a massive mysterious
and violently territorial creature.
Well Kelly, I assume you guys are familiar with it.
Oh God.
Yeah.
Very man.
I've got, I've got some theories on this one, boys.
I this was, so this was the cryptid that got me into cryptids.
This was the one.
Cause I was, I love dinosaurs as a little kid.
I had a whole, I did a whole presentation back in September and this was in, this was
one of the big talking points.
Great.
So I have an expert on something that I bullshitted for me, dude.
Oh, I regret every decision I've made.
And I can take this down the creationist route if you want.
Cause they really want this to be real.
We'll get there.
Okay.
Now, Mokelium Bembe, which translates to the one who stops the flow of rivers, awesome
name is described as being roughly elephant sized with a long slender neck with grayish
brown skin.
It's basically like a small, like a smaller brontosaurus.
It's a dinosaur.
It's a straight up fucking dinosaur.
Whatever dude.
All right.
Technicalities.
Never stop fact checking.
I fully read.
I'm going to watch Dave melt down in real time.
No, well it is vegetarian.
So it doesn't like eat people.
It is very much like Shrek from the 2001 hit motion picture Shrek, where it's very territorial
of its swampy domain.
So it will straight up murder you if you decide to enter it.
It's been known to capsize boats, trample fishermen, or just kill you at a spite because
it can.
It's pretty much kind of like that.
So it's a hippopotamus.
Hold on.
Now the people that live in these areas near the Mokeli and Bembe stomping grounds, pun
intended, to them, this legend is very real.
Many of whom claim to have either encountered it themselves or heard its bellows from the
jungle or seen its massive prints on the swampy shores.
So how Mokeli and Bembe went from localized legend in small tribes in the Congo to become
easily one of the more well known folkloric cryptid creatures in the world?
Well, we're going to have to go back a little bit.
So the first written mention of something resembling Mokeli and Bembe dates all the
way back to 1776.
God bless America.
Now while George Washington was busy crossing the Delaware to give those dirty red coats,
what for?
A French missionary named, I don't know how to pronounce this, Abbe Proillard.
I'm going to go with that.
I don't speak French, so that's as good as it's going to get.
He was in Africa writing about mysterious clawed footprints found in the Congo that were
roughly the size of dinner plates.
Now I wrote, insert a joke about Sarge's nipples here, but I think the listeners could probably
already do that themselves.
Store bought pepperoni.
Now these tracks were definitely not from any animals local to the region.
These prints had deep impressions and widely spaced claw marks suggesting a massive, heavy
creature.
Now fast forward to 1909 and we got big game hunter Carl Hagenbeck claiming that he's heard
stories of a quote unquote half elephant, half dragon living in the swamps of the Congo.
Now Nash, you're an explorer of sorts.
I assume if you were alive in 1909 and someone's like, yo, there's dragons in there.
Are you going?
Are you doing it?
Are you going to go?
Yeah.
Fuck yeah.
Who wouldn't go?
No, dude.
I'm not fucking with a dragon in 1909.
We're so far removed from dragons.
And at that point, I'd be like, no, I'm good, man.
It's all good.
No, I'm going.
I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm not, I don't want to get burned.
So like I'll bring a jacket or something, but I'm going to go check it out.
Just embrace the malaria boys.
Let's go.
Yeah.
No, but even though Hagenbeck never saw the creature himself, he took these stories of
proof that dinosaurs were still alive, roaming around in the Congos.
Then there's the 1913 account of Captain Ludwig Freier von Stein zu Lauschnitz, which first
of all, I fucking hate this name.
I'm never going to say it like that again.
This guy was a German officer sent to serve a camera room when he heard from locals, the
stories of Mokali and Bembe.
He described it as huge, long necked, elephant sized and aggressive.
So you guys remember like the locals, they're not describing this as like a ghost or like
a, uh, like a water demon or some sort of spirit, but this is like an actual like flesh
and blood animal that lived alongside them.
So it's kind of like how, like when we cover like, like the Wendigo or the Kalupalik, like
those they know are like evil spirits.
This to them is like a full on flesh and blood creature.
Now the captain documented that some tribes outright refused to fish in certain areas
of the rivers, believing that the creature would attack their boats on site.
While he never like personally saw it, Ludwig found the consistency of the accounts compelling.
His reports ended up being buried in like colonial archives for decades, but when they
surface, cryptozoologists lashed onto them as one of the strongest, like early quote
unquote scientific sources of the beast.
Of course they did.
So it's like an Indiana Jones situation.
They turned in those reports and they were like, it's being looked at by top men.
Okay.
Nash, so far, how am I doing?
I'm going to, I'm going to refer to you as the expert on this.
So,
Nash, you just want to take over the episode.
Like let us know what we're going wrong here.
I'm actually kind of surprised because I genuinely thought that this was kind of like a folklore
creature, like, like something to be like revered and worship, not just like there's
this elephant like animal.
Just you wait until I'm given the floor, bud.
Okay.
I'm ready.
I just gave you the floor and you just said, good job.
So I mean, that's not me, buddy.
All right.
So you, you, you're okay.
You've got it.
He misses Mark.
He has to be quiet for the rest of the episode though.
Now in 1932, cryptozoologist Ivan T Sanderson reported seeing a dark, massive shape in a
river in Cameroon.
He swore it was some unknown animal, but it disappeared before he could get a good look.
So it could have also been a large poop.
Let's be real.
What?
What do you got?
Just say you interrupt at any time.
Come on, jump in, man.
Obviously.
All right.
So he's stretching for it.
I hate this.
So in the Congo, and this was part of the presentation I did in the Congo, there was
a, there was a now extinct subspecies of rhino, a black rhinoceros that used to be in the
Congo river basin.
Hold on.
Wait, and this is more than likely what people have been seeing.
So I get into that.
Just wait.
Now, before we get too into the weeds talking about evidence and sightings and the expeditions,
which we'll cover, let's bring some science into the mix guys.
You fucking ready to hear what these nerd ass scientists got to say about this shit?
Yeah.
Stupid.
The reality is, and I hate to say it, there's zero physical evidence that Mokele and Bembe
is real.
There's no bones.
There's no giant poops.
The footprint evidence is flimsy at best.
Biologists say that an animal like Mokele and Bembe, which is essentially a dinosaur,
would need to have a breeding population of hundreds to avoid extinction, let alone to
last as long as these people are saying that it's been around.
And yet there's nothing.
Some scientists think locals might be seeing swimming elephants, which to be fair, if you've
never seen an elephant swimming, it's kind of a nightmare.
There's surprisingly strong swimmers and when they cross rivers, only their trunk sticks
out of the water, like a fleshy snorkel.
Band name.
But like, dude, all right.
So imagine you're just like, it's like dusk.
There's a thick jungle mist and you just see this fucking thing like wading through like
a river or a lake.
Like you're going to think it's a fucking di- something.
It's not an elephant.
Like the monster in the trash compactor in Star Wars.
A hundred percent.
Kind of like that.
But that's what you would think.
Like no question.
Other scientists suggest hippos or crocodiles, which may- that doesn't make any sense to
me.
Neither of them have a long neck, but whatever.
They don't really fit the bill the same way like an elephant swimming does.
Others think the legend is just a distorted memory of animals that used to live in the
region like the now extinct black rhino.
One time there was this one time where researchers showed locals a lineup of animal drawings.
I wasn't going to get to this.
And the locals pointed to the rhino and like, yo, that is Mokeli and Bembe.
And the scientist was like, oh, son of a bitch.
That sucks for you guys.
I don't know.
Nash, do you want to expand on this at all?
I'm sure you got-
That's it.
That's why.
Yeah.
That's basically the hardest evidence you need.
And I mean, there is still belief too that these, this, you know, given that the Congo
is like impossible to like fully survey that they believe that these could still, the subspecies
could still very well be alive in some numbers in the Congo, which would explain some of
the more modern sightings.
Yeah.
I mean, and to, and to be fair, to be fair, the, like the fucking, like the gorilla, like
for the longest time was considered a cryptid.
And because where it lives is so dense that like, we just couldn't get to it for a long
time until we did.
And now we have one that we always had, but now we have gorillas.
Yeah.
Just because science isn't convinced doesn't mean people have stopped looking.
In the last 100 years, over 50 expeditions have tried to track this thing down.
Can you guys guess what they found?
Nothing.
Malaria.
I say it is mostly malaria.
Lots of people got sick.
One of the most famous expeditions was the 1980 Roy Mackle expedition.
Mackle was a biologist who was 100% convinced that McCully and Bembe was real.
He and his team interviewed dozens of locals, all of whom described the creature the same
way.
Long neck, big body, lives in swamp.
They attempted to use sonar equipment in the murky waters of Lake Talay.
I don't know if that's how you pronounce it, but I'm going to assume that I'm a hundred
percent on point.
Hoping to detect large underwater movements.
And while they did pick up some unidentified disturbances beneath the surface, the results
were inconclusive.
Yeah.
And even though...
Yeah, because it's not there.
It's a hippopotamus.
And even though Mackle and his team didn't actually see or even really find anything,
Mackle, he walked away more than convinced than ever.
This thing exists because of course, if you're going to put that much money into something,
you have to just firmly believe that it's still there.
Honestly, this is why I love believers.
They'll go somewhere, get no evidence and be like, I believe it now more than ever.
It's fantastic.
Okay.
Yeah.
To be fair, you can't cover every inch of any area.
And I've been more than happy to kind of say this at the end of some of my episodes.
Like we're in like, the area we're searching is a drop in the primarily bucket of this
wilderness.
Yeah.
If this thing's out here, it was more like somewhere else.
But at the same time, like Dave said, the population you would need to breed this creature.
Oh yeah.
For it to be a suropod, 100%.
You would have to see at least one of them at some point or some real evidence that couldn't
be explained by elephants, hippos, rhinos.
And that's not the only thing that makes it biologically impossible.
Right.
But also you're not considering the fact that this thing could also be interdimensional,
aliens.
All right.
I don't think anyone's considered that point.
That explains why all the photographs are blurry.
Exactly.
It's a, it's a ray shield, like a force field.
You took a picture of this in the seventies?
Why isn't it clearer?
But continuing on with the expeditions, we got Herman Ragusters, a former NASA engineer
who spent a month at Lake Telly.
I don't know how to pronounce this fucking Dave.
Dash, how do you pronounce this lake, Dave?
Close enough.
Well, he was there.
He was there for a month in 1981.
He claimed that his team actually saw Mokele and Bembe several times during their time
there.
By Herman's estimations, the creature was about 30 feet long with a thick, powerful
tail and a long, flexible neck.
Now they took photos, made plaster casts of footprints and recorded mysterious roars.
Now that sounds awesome, right?
That's a lot of evidence.
The problem is it was all made up.
Those photos were crazy blurry and didn't show anything.
The footprints were never confirmed and the sounds, well, do you want to hear the sounds?
I have the sounds.
Were they gorillas?
I have the sounds.
Oh, I need to hear this.
Okay.
So the original audio is kind of garbage, but I was able to find a cleaned up version
courtesy of the YouTube channel Crash Course Cryptozoology.
Karik!
And it sounds a little bit like this.
Can we hear that again?
Okay, so it does sound like a whale.
I'm not crazy.
No, it's yeah.
It sounds like the Bloop.
Yeah, yeah.
You remember the Bloop?
Yep.
But I mean, it's pretty spooky, right?
Yeah.
Now, some scientists say that this is just hippos or maybe elephants, but in that Crash
Course video, he compares the pitch and frequencies of Herman's recordings against recordings
of elephants and hippos, and they don't really line up, but...
It's because Karik's a madman and he deep dives everything.
Yeah.
But one animal sound that it did line up with, and the one that I think is responsible for
the sounds, is giraffes.
In the Congo?
Now specifically, this is nocturnal giraffe humming.
Now, nocturnal, so I didn't know this, but apparently giraffes, when they, at night,
they hum kind of like to each other as like a night...
I don't know if...
I really don't understand why they do it, but at night they'll hum to each other.
And it sounds like this, and it's a nightmare.
And if I didn't know what was making this sound, I would throw myself to lions to escape
whatever it was that I thought was coming from it.
Now, he compared these two sound frequencies and they match up almost perfectly, but this
is what it sounds like.
It's awful and I hate it.
Sounds like dirt bikes.
I don't want to be crude here, but that sounds like somebody farting into a tuba.
I hate this so much.
It reminds me of my wife had never heard of what the Tasmanian Devil sound like.
And I'm like, oh boy, here you go.
It's like people finding out what a fisher cat sounds like.
Yeah.
It's just a series of screams in the night.
Dude, I used to live in this area in New Hampshire.
It was by Shaffer County Prison and there was fisher cats all out back.
And if you didn't know what it was, you would think like a woman was getting murdered in
the woods behind your house.
Fisher cats are terrifying.
Tasmanian Devils also terrifying, but also they're super cute and I would try and pet
one because I'm a nightmare.
It would kill me, but I do it.
Yeah.
Oh, almost forgot.
So this last one, this last expedition, there was a 2001 BBC expedition where they literally
just went to the, to the region and asked some pygmies like, Hey, is McCullough and
Ben Bay real and this one guy said, Oh yeah, totally fucking no question.
And BBC was like, that's all we needed to hear.
And then they just bounce.
It's just like, that's it.
So where does this leave us?
Is Mokellian, Ben Bay real, possibly surviving dinosaur, an aggressive hippo, maybe a misidentified
elephant?
Honestly, I don't know.
What I do know is that, what I do know is that the legend isn't going anywhere, whether
it's a real undiscovered, undiscovered creature or just an amazing folklore tale or a misidentified,
you know, whatever people want to believe in the unknown.
And really that's like half the fun of these types of stories.
Now, do I have my own theories?
Sure.
I personally don't think Mokellian, Ben Bay is a real flesh and blood creature.
Even if it is a misidentified rhino, the idea behind it is kind of like the Kalapalik, the
Wendigo or the Kappa.
It's like an allegory or a cautionary tale.
Like in this case, the Mokellian, Ben Bay is used to pretty much like warn people about
the dangers associated with swamps, rivers, lakes in the region, things that there's so
many things in there that could fuck you up.
Like, why wouldn't you use something like this to try and dissuade people from going
into regions where you know it's dangerous, whether it's going to be like a fucking hippo
that'll flip your bow, crocodile, something to keep you away from where you shouldn't
be, I guess.
But that's just me.
A lot of those in cryptozoology.
Yeah.
So.
But I think it's also coupled with misidentified creatures that they are seeing.
Oh yeah.
For sure.
That's 95% of the time.
Yeah.
It's like when I'm out with my kids and they're like, dad, what's that?
And I'm like, it's a dragon, probably.
You know, like they didn't know.
They were just trying to give them or give them an answer that would be that would satisfy
and offer no further questions.
Yeah.
But but they have a guy that that is a very boilerplate version of the story of Mokali
and Bembe.
Nash, anything you want to add to this or your feelings, thoughts, concerns?
Yeah.
I mean, you covered all the points I would have brought up.
I mean, it's I personally I think it's I buy into the black rhinoceros.
Yeah.
As it being especially when, you know, the the side by or the kind of lineup of animals
in the Congo was kind of like the nail in the coffin for me or it's like, yeah, that's
what we're seeing.
All right.
Problem solved.
I just want I just want to know how how do you confuse a rhino with a.
I'm just, you know, just just throwing that out there.
It seems a little weird, but I mean, I guess like there's many tales of people seeing it's
like the case of the Kraken and whale penises.
Do you know what I'm talking about?
Like the giant squid, but really they're seeing fucking whale dicks flopping around on the
ocean like maybe something like that.
Like you see you see one aspect of the like maybe they just saw like the back of it or
like the body of it moving through brush.
And at the same time, something up in the tree like moved.
So they assumed it was like one big creature and not two separate instances of things happening
simultaneously.
Yeah.
And then like, who knows if it's like, you know, they were, you know, these pygmies were
out in the jungle and they get charged by this thing.
And yeah, you said they just see part of it and they just, you know, their mind fills
in the rest.
Yeah, they can also like everything is too different.
Like things happening.
What was that?
What?
Like everything is big to a pygmy, you know, like they're smaller people.
I don't, it's also what I also find intriguing about all this is that, you know, these are,
you know, at least back, you know, late 1800s, early 1900s, these were a group of people
that wouldn't have necessarily known what dinosaurs were.
That's true.
Right.
For them to describe a dinosaur is weird in itself.
But yeah, when you take into account all these other factors, you know, it's like, yeah,
that's.
It makes sense too, because just the misinterpretation, you know, for them, it might've been, you
know, a creature with a long neck, but it wasn't like super long.
It was just like longer than the other animals they're familiar with.
Yeah.
Longer than what they're used to in terms of the wildlife that they're familiar with,
you know, encountering on the daily.
Yeah.
But then over the, over the course of years or even like word of mouth, like we see it
all the time.
Yeah.
It's like telephone.
Yeah.
You know, it started, it started out with like, you know, it was just like a foot or
two and then over the course of a few years, it's a 10 foot long neck and a massive body.
Like, yeah, you see it all the time when it comes to like these folkloric stories.
It's crazy.
And, and it's actually, so if you, if you'll indulge me for just a moment, I just have
to talk about this because it's so funny to.
Oh yeah.
So, so Sarge, so Sarge wanted to talk about the, the creationist theory of Macaulay.
So I'm not a religious person and I'm not trying to attack anyone else's religious beliefs,
but there is a guy out there who is a complete moron named Ken Hovind.
And I will say his name because he's an idiot.
He's such an idiot that even the like luminaries in the creationist space have completely disavowed
him because he's so dumb.
That's crazy.
One to go to Congo to see, to like try and find this creature because it would, it would
prove his moron theory that humans were walking around with dinosaurs.
It's not like the crazy.
It's a theory, but when it comes, but when you hear it come from a creationist, it sounds
even crazier.
Well, he also like, he also believes that the Grand Canyon was formed in like a week.
Oh, and then it's a copper mine or something like I've seen.
Yeah.
Well, no, he thinks it was, it was formed by Noah's flood.
Okay.
I mean, and that the earth is only 6,000 years old.
We don't know that it's not.
There's theories that can go, I don't, I haven't heard anything like this with the Grand Canyon,
but there's definitely theories about certain, you know, large gorge features in other parts
of the world.
Yeah.
You know, does definitely looks like they were formed pretty instantaneously by large
flow of water, which we're not, we won't get into that.
Right.
That's not the whole thing is Kent doesn't use any evidence for this.
He's just a moron.
Like there's creationists that have compelling arguments.
And I, I don't know enough about the topic to accurately try and attempt to debate this,
but Kent definitely doesn't know enough about the topic to debate this because I've watched
a number of debates where he just gets demolished in his only responses.
Well, I'm not related to a strawberry and that's it.
What does that mean?
All life forms are essentially believed to have come from single cell organisms, right?
Yeah.
So that's why we're all part that we're all classified on the higher levels as you carry
out.
And then we, you know, supposedly evolved further down according to evolutionary science.
His whole argument against evolution is not like against his religion or anything else.
He's like, I'm not related to a pine tree.
And you're like, well, that's, but that's not the same thing.
It's not the same thing, buddy.
I hate it here.
Yeah.
And he wants to go find this dinosaur in the Congo, but he's also like wildly racist.
Oh, I mean, as most as they usually are.
So I'm like, please don't go to the Congo.
I don't want them to think all Americans are like you.
You know what's in the Congo, bud?
To be fair, it took me a long time to figure out whether it's saying Pygmies or not was
racist.
And I'm glad I it's not.
I was afraid to type that into the script.
But to me, too, I would also be fair.
I would also be scared to use that.
But I did happen to just find out recently that that's OK to say.
Yeah.
To that guy's credit, though, there is there are those those fossilized footprints.
I don't remember where they are, but they it's the dinosaur human footprints next to
one another.
Yeah.
In the same layer.
Yeah.
I mean, I'm not I'm not knocking it.
But I'm all I am.
All right.
So but that's all we got for today's episode.
I think it went pretty well.
I don't know.
Nash, you got any pointers, any tips or anything?
No notes.
Hell yeah, dude.
All right.
You looked when you when we first started, I saw you rubbing your head and I was like,
oh, no, he's very worried about what's going to happen.
I was worried about what's going to happen.
He did a presentation on it.
I'm an asshole half drunk right now talking about a dinosaur in the Congo.
This man is on TV and I do this.
So you know, I was worried.
All right, Nash.
Is normally I'd open up the floor to Sarge and I will after this.
But is there anything you want to plug?
Anything you got going on?
Obviously, you got your show.
But you know, plug away.
Take as long as you want.
I genuinely don't care.
I mean, yeah, I mean, we're chasing legends on Paraflex and four episodes on there.
And then there's another two, three, three on YouTube.
Older ones.
Nice.
Yeah.
Chasing legends crew.com.
Cool.
Hit me up.
And if they if they want to follow you on your social media, where can they find you?
At Nash Hoover.
All one word.
All right.
And then you also got at chasing legends, I believe on chasing legends official.
She's a fish.
Oh, shit, dude.
All right.
Yeah.
If you ever come up here to look up the Bridgewater Triangle, try and track down some puck watchies.
Well, you know, so you did.
I don't want to do it again.
Wow.
Bridgewater left that bad an impression on you.
Last time I was in Massachusetts, Brockton almost killed me.
So I'm good.
Oh, that was your mistake.
You went to be fair.
Don't go to Brock.
Never go to that is that was your wish.
I would have been told that before I booked the Motel 6 in Brockton.
Oh, God.
Oh, my God, man.
Yeah, bro.
The one star on Google.
Give it away, bro.
We were you not almost stabbed.
I don't know.
My my whole mindset behind it was, oh, we just need somewhere to stay.
I've never had a bad Motel 6 experience.
I'm sure it's fine.
And then we got there and it was just like from the minute we from the basically from
the word go, it was just terrible.
But then we all started and we all sat around on our phones, looked at reviews and we're
like, what have we done?
So expensive filming equipment.
Yeah, I had never checked out of a hotel room in the middle of the night before.
So on a scale of one to 10, how bad was the scabies when you left that Motel 6?
I can only imagine.
Luckily, we came out of there unscabied.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, I was sorry.
Yeah, it was it was it was a fun time.
Luckily, there was a was it a residence in it was like half an hour away.
Then they were like, we basically told them what we were dealing with.
And they're like, we have one room.
It's a it's a single king bed.
There's a pullout couch.
And we're like, I'm like, there's five of us will do.
Like, oh, now, I am so sorry.
You need a local guide next time.
Try and find somebody hire someone to tell you not to go to Brockton.
Well, now I know.
So when we were when I was messaging Nash on Instagram about the show and like all this
stuff, we talked about your puck wedges episode and how I said you should do a redo of it
like a like a like a follow up, because there's one part of the legend that you left out.
And that was that the the God we left out, man.
Yeah.
Like there's the once the the the the native God picked up the puck, wudgy, shook them
like a can of beer, then threw them across all of New England.
That needs to be included.
But also amazing little hand grenades.
But I didn't know you didn't mention the Brockton thing.
And now it's like, oh, fuck, dude, don't ever go back to Massachusetts.
Well, we we filmed it all.
Everybody.
I think the couple of the guys filmed it on their like filmed like everything as it was
happening on their phones.
And we were going to use the footage and we were just like, this is too insane.
Like, let's just like omit it so we forget it forever.
But yeah, it was a that was a long.
Wow.
I haven't looked to see if that is still open or not, because I had I filed basically like
a because they wouldn't give me the they wouldn't give me my money back.
Like they fought me on it.
Really?
And I called and eventually got through to somebody and the guy and they're like, yeah,
well, you know, we'll we'll send this over to whomever.
And I got a call from a guy and he's like, look, he's like, listen, he's like, if I'm
calling you about this matter, it means we're taking incredibly serious.
What happened?
And I explained I basically broke down everything to them and he's just like, oh, my God.
OK, we'll take care of this.
Like you get money back.
No questions.
Unbelievable.
Yeah, I'm so sorry.
Like like we're we joke a little bit, but like Brockton is like that place where Simba
asked Mufasa like, what about the shadow area?
That's Brockton, Simba.
You must never go there.
There's a there's a band from Brockton called Call of Arabia and their singer is insane
and he would wrap chains around his fist and punch people in the face when playing shows
in Brockton.
It is not a great area.
Go there.
But with to be but at least you went to the Bridgewater Triangle and you didn't get sued
by by Lauren Coleman.
So that's oh, my God, Lauren Coleman.
So he's everywhere.
He's a nightmare.
He coined the term Bridgewater Triangle.
Did you know that?
He's going to sue us now for saying it.
Sarge, is there anything you want to plug before we sign off?
Yes.
The coloring book is still live.
You can get it.
We've talked about it a million times.
But Sarge is supernormal.com.
Get the coloring book.
It's like a little activity book, too.
There's a lot of pages, though.
So it's it's good.
It's worth the nine ninety nine, I promise.
And then, Dave, we got to talk about the new logo.
We got a new logo.
We got a new podcast.
Art is pretty good.
It's pretty metal as fuck.
Probably going to put on a T-shirt soon.
Who knows?
But we also got new intro music coming soon from this band called Killed by Yeti.
It's kind of like a new chapter in this show.
So, you know, me and Sarge have been doing the show together for almost a year.
But everything that we have, the artwork, the music, it's all dated.
It's all pre-Sarge.
So we're starting new, starting fresh.
I appreciate that.
It's also drink their against beer.
They're our sponsor and we should be calling them out from time to time.
Yeah, that's fine.
You got to pay the bills.
Yeah, they pay us in years supplies worth of beer.
That's enough.
If if you guys want to follow us, it's at Crypto Cocktail on Instagram, Crypto Cocktail
Party on Tick Tock.
We have a Patreon.
We got one tier, two dollars a month.
That's just to support the show.
Seven dollars a month.
We've got a ton of unedited video episodes of the show.
And then, you know, once we get some stickers and pins made, stuff like that, you know,
we'll be sending it out to patrons as well.
I think that's all.
Leave us a five star rating and review on, you know, Spotify, Apple Podcast, wherever
you can just do it.
It'd be amazing.
You know, you know, or leave us a five star review and just a scathing review.
I think that's a really funny way to do it.
Be as mean as you want.
I think that's pretty funny.
Just give us five stars, be as mean as you want, but five stars, please.
Exactly.
Nash, normally I would tell Sartre to say goodbye and I love you to the audience.
But do you want to do the honor of saying goodbye and I love you to the audience?
Goodbye.
I love you.