Welcome back everybody to another episode of Cryptic Cocktail Party, a show where we
have a few drinks, share a few laughs, take a dive into the unknown.
I'm your host Dave, joined as always by my wonderful co-host Sarge.
How's it going Sarge?
Yo!
And we also have a very special guest today.
Joining us all the way from Chicago, Illinois is Jordan Holmes of Knowledge Fight.
What's going on man?
Yes, hello!
This is the sound of my voice.
I am from the podcast Knowledge Fight, where I make similar noises for a large audience.
Yeah, definitely larger than ours.
I don't know if I would admit to making similar noises until you hear the noises we make,
because sometimes, especially Dave.
I mean, I'm a bit of a minor bird when it comes to mimicking the sounds of thinking
apes.
I'm more of an animal of instinct and survival, but you know, who knows.
We'll see how this goes.
Okay.
I like the minor bird reference.
So what's going on man?
How are things going?
How's life?
How are things?
I mean, still bad at small talk.
Sorry.
That's my new, that's my, how's it going?
It's all right.
It's not good.
It's great.
It's bad.
They're all the same to me.
Stuff is still bad at small talk.
Things are definitely happening in life.
All right.
So, absolutely.
They have yet to stop.
All right.
Well, how about this?
This is an easy question.
Are you like a cryptids folklore kind of guy?
Like is that kind of your realm or?
No, absolutely not.
I find it all, it's so very strange because I've lived in a very specific world for such
a long time that it's sometimes difficult to remember my identity outside of this magical
land of Alex Jones that I've found myself trapped in, but I actually don't care.
Okay.
That's so valid.
Like, you know, like sometimes when I remember, when I go deep inside of my own head, I remind
I reminded that like, oh, I don't give a shit about conspiracies at all.
I don't care about Bigfoot at all.
Don't care.
Don't give a shit whatsoever.
So that's probably what my greatest skill is.
A general apathy towards all interesting things.
Okay.
That's that'll actually help you for most cryptids.
Yeah.
We actually covered your favorite cryptid last week.
The Squatch.
We covered a little Alex Jones.
Oh, okay.
I got you.
Yeah.
This is going to look real weird because I did not expect you to say yes immediately
after us doing an Alex Jones episode.
Like, oh, they're going to think we're in cahoots or some shit like that.
Never.
I hate to end.
In fact, actually, I mean to insult your show.
Never listen.
Sorry.
That's okay.
I would not have missed that.
You know what?
To your face, I have to say it.
I've never listened to your show and I'm probably not going to listen to this one.
That's fine.
That's all right.
All right.
So you guys ready to dive into this?
Yeah.
All right.
So this episode is going to be coming out like the Monday before Thanksgiving and Sarge,
you requested that I find a cryptid or some sort of like folkloric beast that was essentially
like a big bird or something.
I'm assuming.
Nothing says America like eating a giant bird.
Well, there's like there are a ton of creatures in folklore and like cryptids that are basically
just giant birds are close to it.
But the real gnarly ones that would have been even like remotely interesting to talk about,
they all come from Native American culture.
And while we have covered Native American folklore in the past, things like Pukwudgies,
the Wendigo and so on, I thought it'd be kind of distasteful for three white dudes in their
late thirties, early forties to crack jokes about Native American legends.
Yeah.
Like wicked distasteful.
This time of year, really a poor choice.
I bet one of you has read a Neil Gaiman novel, so you're totally fine talking about the religion
of native cultures as a as a British decision.
Wow.
You you really caught me on that one, actually.
I spent a week here.
I think I can do it.
Yeah.
I really did just start watching Sandman.
So that's that hits close to home.
Oh, that's the white in you.
Right.
But I mean, that's all that I have is white.
So well, I think I think I found a good compromise that we can all feel good about.
Sarge gets his big bird kind of thing in our white consciousness can rest easy because
this week recovering some Slavic folklore that most people might be familiar with, but
may not know the full scape of.
So Baba Yaga.
She's I don't think she's a Baba Yaga.
No, the Baba Yaga, though, has a house with stilts or with feet of a giant chicken.
It's possible.
It's not chicken.
It's it's something like that.
But the Baba Yaga's house is a is a ambulatory beast of its own.
I'm very excited about this because I have not I've heard of the Baba Yaga, but I was
not aware of the chicken house.
So I don't know why I know this.
We haven't even confirmed that it is Baba Yaga yet.
All right.
So is it Baba Yaga?
And he's like, OK, so anyway, the Baba Yaga.
Well, I went really hard on the on the like I wrote the reveal of this.
So just let me get through that.
And then
Great.
We bring on we bring on the guy from the big show.
He runs in five seconds.
Awesome.
Really excited about that.
I like I like how that belies my whole previous answer where I'm like, oh, yeah, by the way,
I could just rattle off all this shit.
Top of my head.
Oh, is the Baba Yaga is that what we're talking about?
I don't give what other regions about cryptids, by the way.
Oh, is this a Lebanese folk tale?
Yeah, I recall that when I was when I was traveling in the past.
All right.
Well, I'm really I'm really proud of how I wrote this build up.
So yes, it is about.
Yeah.
Let me get this.
I apologize.
It's fine.
Perfusely.
In the deepest part of the forest, where the trees twist like withered hands and the air
grows unnaturally still, there lives a legend.
Travelers through these forests speak of strange sounds, a scraping, shuffling noise like claws
raking the ground and glimpses of something unnatural moving between the shadows.
They say her dwelling is alive.
Fuck yeah.
A graveyard of secrets ringed with bones lit by skulls and filled with the thick black
scent of death.
By the way, something ancient, something both cruel and wise, a being who could just as
easily offer salvation as destruction.
She tests those foolish enough to seek her out and her rewards.
If you survive or as extraordinary as her punishments are final, but be warned, she
does not suffer timid or lazy.
And her hunger is as legendary as her power.
They call her the witch of the woods, the devourer of the weak, the keeper of impossible
wisdom.
This week, gentlemen, you guessed it.
We are covering Baba Yaga.
Yes, Baba Yaga.
It was a good buildup, even with even already knowing what it was.
It was a good buildup.
I like I went so hard on that for no reason.
Yeah.
Well, what I like is you couldn't have found a more obscure thing.
And he's like, I don't know anything about crypt.
Oh, yeah.
No, I totally know this story entirely.
Well, I guess the big the big bird kind of probably gave it away and Slavic.
It kind of.
Yeah.
Big Bird and Slavic.
There's really there's really only one option because I.
It just really is only one.
So they don't.
It's not like they have ostriches to base their other regular myths off of.
That's they're they're trapped with no giant birds.
So how familiar are either of you guys with like the full story of Baba Yaga?
You obviously know the house with the chicken leg.
Sarge, you kind of have an idea.
But like how like.
I know nothing about Baba Yaga to be honest with you.
I keep getting confused with whatever they call Keanu Reeves in the John Wick movies.
It is Baba Yaga in John Wick.
It makes no sense because they say it's a yes, because he's not a witch.
But it's it means like old lady witch.
Not much.
Yeah.
For me, my understanding of the Baba Yaga is less specific and more kind of general.
Her her existence is similar to that of of like the the wise monkey kind of character
where in a claimant will show up and will be like, I knew I want to do this thing.
And Baba Yaga will be like, oh, yeah, I'll totally make that thing happen.
And then you find out later on that you're an idiot and Baba Yaga eats you.
Oh, that's essentially the the general gist of it.
I really thought you were going in the direction of like the monkey's paw or like you make
a wish and you get it.
But it's like the worst version of that wish.
It's a little bit like that.
It's got that level of like ironic.
Oh, be careful what you wish for.
You'll you're you're going to get yourself hurt in the process.
Baba Yaga's take on it, though, is always a little nice where it's like if you're courageous
and true and honest, then the Baba Yaga's tricks can't work on you and you'll get what
you want and survive.
Got you.
It's only the it's only the cowardly.
It's only the people who are trying to trick.
It's only the people who are trying to pull one over on the Baba Yaga.
So Baba Yaga punishes, but mainly the people who deserve a good punishing.
Yeah, for the most part.
So Baba Yaga is, for lack of a better term, just like an absolute fucking nightmare as
far as like her whole general vibe.
For starters, she's old.
Not like that's like a bad thing or anything, but she's like impossibly.
She's like Jimmy Carter old.
Like it's very upsetting.
She's grotesquely thin.
One source described it as, quote, skeletal as though the forest itself consumed her flesh
and left only the bare essentials to sustain her life.
So like Keith Richards, Willem Dafoe, kind of skinny.
Yeah.
Her face is deeply wrinkled, which I mean is to be expected when you're about as old
as the tree that they used to make Christ Cross.
Her eyes are sunken and glowing with a faint otherworldly light.
Her long nose is sharp and hooked.
It's so large, it's said that it touches the ceiling when she sleeps.
And some tales claim that she has iron teeth that glint like polished blades, which she
uses to gnash through the bones of those who displease her.
And it's not just like the fact that she looks like the old lady from the bathtub scene in
The Shining, but that like unnerves people.
It's just like her overall presence is super unsettling.
Baba Yaga radiates power, like the kind that can't be bargained with.
She's said to move with a sort of unnatural energy flying through the air and what I can
only describe as one of the worst modes of transportation.
It's a mortar and pestle.
So basically what she does, she sits in the mortar like a boat and she uses the pestle
as her rudder and then has like a silver birch broom behind it that sleeps her tracks away
as she passes.
It's very like it reminded me of you ever seen The Secret World of Ari Yeti?
It's kind of like they rise like something like that, only like large and not small,
like an actual.
Yeah.
Was that Miyazaki?
Yeah.
Or Ghibli.
I don't know if that was specifically Haya.
It was one of the Studio Gili movies.
I don't know.
Yeah.
When I was in high school, when I was in high school, we had a speech teacher and they were
they were called she was called a speech teacher and I don't know why they she didn't teach
anything and didn't speak very well.
But she had this kind of like angular presence that led us to call her Birdwoman.
And I don't know.
I don't know specifically why.
But once it landed there, it was going to be that for the rest of our lives.
And to this day, hopefully she's dead, so she never hears the show discovers that I
still do this.
But it is it is always fun for me whenever we get the folklore and the myths where you
can very clearly see that it's an exaggerated version of something of like some some dude
just yeah, some dude just didn't like.
Yeah.
Like he's the old lady that was down the street from him.
Exactly.
He's got his knuckles with a ruler and he's like, oh, that now that's demons, which is
goddamn which is going to have to smear women for the rest of our time.
This lady sucks.
I'm writing a fairy tale.
You should never trust any woman ever because this old lady is a jerk.
I mean, that's I feel like it's how all folklore and usually ends up starting is just one dude
did something bad to another dude or a woman or something like that.
Like, ah, that's it.
For the rest of for the centuries, you'll be known as this one terrible thing.
Oh, sure.
All right.
Well, now, well, this is a terrible choice and ride the mortar and pestle mode of transportation
isn't just like a fun little thing thrown in for some flavor in Slavic folklore.
The mortar and pestle are tools of transformation used to grind herbs, mix potions or prepare
meals.
Baba Yaga's use of them symbolizes her ability to break down and reshape reality itself,
blurring the lines between the mundane and the magical.
They say that when she's near, who said that?
This is what people say.
Who said that?
Who says that?
That's what it symbolizes the Slavs.
I, I strongly doubt that.
Hey, man, I'm just going off what the folklore was.
Don't just be.
I know I get that.
I get that they they get to say shit like that, but that that immediately raises red
flags for me.
The idea, the idea that we should all just take is read that it's OK that it's symbolized
that a border and pestle just the thing that she might use.
Maybe they were uncreative that day.
Oh, no, actually.
Maybe they just ran out of ideas.
Oh, no.
It actually symbolizes her ability.
Bullshit.
I call bullshit.
It doesn't symbolize shit.
Here's the thing.
You're thinking about it.
I'm going to need you to not think about it, because here's the thing about this.
None of this is real.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
I understand.
I understand that it's not holding his feet to the fire.
No, no, no.
She's not real.
More than what she's supposed to symbolize.
According to those assholes is real.
That's fair.
And they're the assholes.
They say that when she's near.
This reminds me of like an art history class where they like show you a painting and they're
telling you all this shit about it.
And you're like, are you sure?
Because that just looks like a vase and an apple.
I do have a strong hatred of higher education.
I could have something to do.
I've been to five different universities, though, so I know for a fact they suck.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I have a master's.
I get it.
Yeah, there's a lot of nonsense in there.
So they say that when she's near, the air around you changes, grows cold and heavy with
the scent of damp earth and decaying leaves.
But anyway, so yes, that's her general vibe.
She's a grotesque old lady.
She's not very nice and she lives in a not lives but drives around a moral of pestle.
Like so far, I've already gotten basically your general ideas.
But how you feeling about Baba Yaga so far?
I feel like whoever wrote this was extremely high on something.
Ergot poisoning, just fucking dripping balls.
Like how do you it's got to be something like that because like house with chicken legs,
rolling around in essentially a rock bowl doesn't make a lot of like all of this sounds
like something that I would read.
And like it sounds like something Jim Morrison would sing about.
You know what I mean?
I guess I fucking hate the door.
So I don't know.
It's a little silly.
Like it's cool.
Don't get me wrong.
I can totally see this being like one of those new horror movies like they just made the
Winnie the Pooh horror movie.
They could totally make this horror movie.
But at the same time, a house with chicken legs.
I don't keep going back to that.
We haven't even covered that yet.
You just hold your horses, bud.
All right.
OK, we haven't even once mentioned the house.
That was all Jordan.
But also the mortar and pestle is so confusing to me.
Yeah, I don't know.
What a terrible mode of transportation.
When you said mortar and pestle, I'm thinking one of those little things you get in a store
that calls itself an apothecary, but it really just sells incense.
But you're talking about like a big it's like it's got to it's got to be huge to fit a person.
It's about person size.
Well, it's got to the the the mortar part.
It's got to be or the pestle.
I don't know what stick is called, but the big part is going to be fucking heavy, right?
Well, she's supernatural, and it's also, again, not real.
Look, I just want realism in my Slavic folklore.
OK, that's all I'm asking.
I like I like it.
I've always been a big fan of the Baba Yaga because it's another good example of editing
that just happens over time.
Yeah.
Like, you know, we watch the the the traditional hocus pocus witch style movies now, you know,
and you can see all the stuff where it's like, oh, that is from the Baba Yaga.
But then you also see the stuff where they're like, oh, we can just cut that out.
We don't need.
We don't need the oh, that's no.
Maybe she can just wear a black hat.
That's better than having to be.
Oh, she's as thin as the ghosts of eating her skin like now we can just have to be a
lady wearing a nice hat.
It'll be fine.
Let's just make it bet Midler.
And yeah, it's just good editing.
It's just editing.
We need all this bullshit to be attached to.
All right.
So now that Sarge is all set about the house, I think it's time that we talk about her house.
So Sarge, this is this is where your giant bird kind of comes into play.
Her home is pretty much as infamous as she is.
If anything, people more so know the imagery of her house and Baba Yaga itself.
Like people know more about this house on chicken legs than they do about this old lady
going around in a mortar and pestle.
Her home.
It's it's pretty much just like a gnarly looking hut standing atop massive gnarled chicken
legs with scaly cracked skin that's as tough as bark and is constantly scratching at the
ground with its talon like claws.
Essentially her house is alive.
It's restless and it's never still like this thing is always on the move.
Sometimes sometimes the hut spins in place just like a fucking blur of wooden chicken
legs.
But it's disorienting whirlwind and unpredictability is almost like an anti burglary system kind
of thing.
Like it's hard to break into what boils down like essentially to like a fucking Elden Ring
boss like it's kind of what it is.
Now only those who know the proper incantation can stop it from spinning.
And the incantation is simply turn your back to the forest, your front to me, which as
far as incantations go, it's a little disappointing.
I was hoping for more of something more like doesn't even fucking rhyme.
What are we doing?
Maybe it rhymes in the language in the original language.
Maybe it rhymes.
OK, you're not understand.
No, you're not understanding.
This is a practical.
The Slavs very practical people at this time, which you need to understand.
These forests are very, very big and this house is not that big.
So you're going to have to wind up walking around and saying this thing over and over
and over and over again until you actually find the way you want to keep it short and
snappy.
You can't be you can't be having long incantations that you have to say every every 25 feet.
You go down the way and you're like, oh shit, we got to start all over again.
Draw a circle on the ground.
Put a little star over here.
Jesus Christ.
They also still said Jesus Christ back then.
So they got to know these witches, shits, motherfuckers.
These.
I actually prefer that, though.
But anyways, but once those words are spoken correctly, as if they're super hard to remember,
the house numbers to a halt, its legs full beneath it.
And once it settles, the door will open to reveal what lies within.
And I got to say, the inside of a home is pretty much everything like I'm already aspiring
my home to be.
Maybe not all of it, but so once inside, the walls appear to close in ever so slightly,
creating a claustrophobic atmosphere that's heavy with the scent of herbs, smoke and just
the faint metallic scent of blood.
Shelves line the interior, stacked with jars filled with powders, roots, glowing liquids
and preserved creatures.
Animal skulls hang from the ceiling.
The centerpiece of the hut is a massive stove, which is pretty traditional for any witch.
And they say that the mouth of it is glowing with what some have described as an unholy
fire.
Now, I don't know who described it as that, Jordan, so don't come at me for that.
That one I have no problem with.
So here, Baba Yaga prepares her meals, her potions and sometimes her victim.
This also sounds where this sounds like where Billy Bob Thornton is.
Yeah, you guys seen him lately?
It's a lot going on.
There's a lot going on.
Moving on.
Elsa.
I don't I have I genuinely don't know like where what angle to take on that.
I'm not sure if Billy Bob Thornton is relevant or if I'm irrelevant.
I don't know which is which.
It's so weird to be wondering about the current stress of Billy Bob Thornton, a 70 year old
man at least outside of her hut, because of course, her landscaping is just as gnarly
as her interior decorating.
The hut is surrounded by fences made of bones.
Human skulls top the post.
Their hollow eyes lit up to be used as lanterns in the night.
Some say the skulls are those that belong to her victims, serving as a warning to intruders.
Others suggest that the fence is a test itself, daring the faint of heart to turn back before
they even knock on the door.
That's my favorite.
That's my favorite trope with it.
It's always my favorite thing.
It's like a some suggest and others suggest blank and then you just move on as opposed
to like stopping and then picturing a conversation between these two people just sitting there
suddenly getting furious about no, the fence is a test.
God damn it.
The fence is a test.
See what's great about that is that a picture I just picture two folklorists in my mind
and they're not like the most aggressive of people, but to them just screaming at each
other.
Absolutely.
No, this is a test.
And it's Slavic folklore.
So they're bringing out axes.
Absolutely.
What I love is that you were like the legs are the burglar alarm.
No, no, the spinning is a burglar alarm.
The skulls on the fence.
No, that's fine.
You put like who's going to go into that house?
I would.
I think if it's just sitting there, if there's skulls on the fence, I'm like, you know what?
Maybe I don't need to go there today.
I have skulls in my house and I go in my house every day.
I don't want to go in there.
Every every group of between three and eight children has to have a witch house nearby
to dare one of them to go touch.
That child will then be abducted by the witch who then teaches him, you know, like poetry
or something.
Yes.
Yeah.
Or chess.
So one of Baba Yaga's darkest and probably most infamous traits is her is her appetite
for children.
She loves to eat kids and many of Baba Yaga's tales.
She lures kids, usually those lost or wandering through the woods into her hut with the promise
of food, water and safety only to fatten them up and toss them in the oven, presumably to
eat later.
It's very hot, like Hansel and Gretel kind of shit.
But Baba Yaga, lucky for her, I don't know why I wrote that.
She doesn't really like have to like hunt down children herself.
Like her nightmare Tim Burton house pretty much does all the work for her and acts kind
of like a lure like the spinning, the chicken legs, the eerie glow.
All this seems almost designed to draw the curious and lost to her doorstep.
But once you're inside, that sucks to suck.
Like I don't know what else to tell you.
Like you're not you're pretty much not leaving.
I feel like this house is only drawn in.
I feel like this house is only drawn in the hot topic kids though.
You know what I mean?
Like the ones with the Jack Skellington hoodie.
Those are the ones getting sucked in.
Well, it was it was often like one of the best ways to keep children from going too
far into the forest is not to explain like object permanence, but to be like, if you
go too far, you're going to die.
There's going to be a murder out there.
Not like, hey, man, there's only enough food for so many of us and maybe we'll see you
next spring.
I don't know.
Man, everyone in the old days was a terrible pair.
It's tough in the past.
It was tough for the past.
Now for all of her less than stellar qualities, Baba Yaga is an entirely malevolent.
She's also considered a figure of judgment, testing those who come to her in search of
aid or knowledge.
The lazy, disrespectful or cowardly people quickly meet a grim fate.
And Baba Yaga doesn't fuck around.
So if you fit into any one of those categories, like her punishments are swift and fucking
brutal.
You can fail any task that she gives you.
So basically what's going to happen is if you go to her and you're just a straight up
dickhead or you're a coward, she's going to like Ned Stark, cut your head off and put
it on the fence or she'll eat you either.
But anyways, but those who show courage, humility and wit can win her favor.
In some stories, Baba Yaga offers guidance, magical tools, or even as something as simple
as just like safe passage through the woods to those who prove themselves to be worthy.
And it's this duality that is central to her character.
Like most people in the black metal community, she is as much of a gatekeeper as she is a
predator.
Standing at the crossroads of life and death, offering both peril and possibility.
Take for instance, the story of Vasilisa the beautiful.
So Vasilisa was sent to this is kind of sounds like very like Cinderella was sent by her
wicked stepmother to fetch fire from Baba Yaga's hut.
Like you understand why it sounds kind of Cinderella.
I do fully understand.
You understand it doesn't.
It goes the other direction.
Like you understand it sounds because this story sounds like Hansel and Gretel because
Hansel and Gretel is from this story.
It doesn't go the other direction.
I'm just having fun with it, man.
All right.
Sounds a little Cinderella.
No, it is because the guy read this story and then wrote Cinderella.
I know.
It's not like this.
Oh, my like Ariana Grande reminds me of.
No, she's from the present and reminds you of something from the past, not the other
way around.
Disgusting.
Now I know why your mic is so quiet, Jordan.
I told you.
I don't know.
I just I just told you.
So Vasilisa was sent by her wicked stepmother to fetch fire from Baba Yaga's hut.
Vasilisa courageously approaches the hut and Baba Yaga sets before her like a series of
impossible tasks in order to gain what she's there asking for, separating grains of rice
from poppy seeds, cleaning her house and preparing her meals.
But Vasilisa has an ace up her sleeve.
Her late mother had gifted her a magical doll before she passed, hence late mother.
And this doll helped Vasilisa to complete each chore.
Now impressed, Baba Yaga spares her life and gives Vasilisa a fiery skull that she then
brings back home.
And then it kills her whole family.
Oh, good.
Oh, great.
But see, well, it kills her evil stepmother.
And I forgot to mention that she also had evil stepsisters.
So it killed those people.
Left her like, like, Vasilisa's fine.
Now she's just like there to fend for herself with a flaming skull.
So win, win, I guess.
So here's the problem with this story that you got to see now.
There's only one psychological lens.
All right.
Yeah, absolutely.
Just the one problem.
Gotcha.
Because the story shouldn't have happened.
Right.
When your mom when your mom gifts you shit after death.
Yeah.
Right.
There's no way you're going to like your step mom.
You can't because you've got this ghost of your regular mom hanging around.
So there's no way you can develop a lasting and comfortable bond with your new mom.
You're still trapped in the past in the form of this.
What was it again?
A doll.
See, that's creepy as shit to begin with.
Right.
Even if it had no magical abilities, that's creepy as shit.
I don't trust anybody who collects like porcelain dolls.
Absolutely.
As you should not.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And as a recent convert to voodoo, you don't know what I can do with a doll.
I can do anything with that kind of shit.
Now on the other end of the spectrum, you have the stories of the lazy and disrespectful
traveler, someone who comes to Baba Yaga seeking an easy answer to their problems.
They would scoff at her chores and tasks and demand help without earning it.
Now if you come with Baba Yaga all hot like that, she will not hesitate and just like
straight up toss you in her pot.
Baba Yaga's tests, they're not they're never arbitrary.
Like they reveal the true character of those who come to her.
Like in every encounter with Baba Yaga, there's a choice.
You either face your fears and prove yourself or turn away and remain unchanged.
Now those brave enough to enter her home might find exactly what they need or they might
never be seen again.
Like it's really just like a roll the dice type scenario.
But okay, I don't know.
For me, like that's what makes her such like a fascinating character of folklore.
Like she's much more than just like a witch or a villain.
She's a symbol of transformation, but also a cautionary tale of the untamed forces of
nature.
Like kind of like what you were joking about earlier, Jordan, like, you know, you wander
into the woods like you're going to be taken by Baba Yaga.
But really, it's more of a cautionary tale of like, you don't know what the fuck is in
these woods like you're.
Oh yeah, no.
Some, some scholars say that she's a symbol of the ocean and because she's very deep.
Oh, I hate it here.
I like it.
You did so much research on this and we're just like, bullshit.
I mean, obviously, we know it's not real folklore, like, but still.
Yeah, I know.
Anyways, her.
No, no, no, I agree.
I'm just I'm just enjoying having a fun time.
I mean, I'm actually like I think it's kind of a fascinating folks.
I didn't know anything about Baba Yaga other than it was Keanu Reeves in a movie.
And so now I'm like, I didn't know about the chicken house.
I didn't know about any of this stuff.
So I'm fascinated by it, but at the same time, like I do kind of agree with Jordan when they're
like, this is what this represents and what that represents.
And I'm like, I think you are making them far more sophisticated.
They were just trying to scare the shit out of their children to not go in the woods.
I mean, there's there's definitely that, but there's also like what what these do is they
get transformed throughout time, you know, so the Baba Yaga story back when it was told
is not the Baba Yaga story that we are talking about now.
The Baba Yaga story back when it's told was a thing.
And then it gets filtered through, you know, Shakespeare's, you know, representation of
the mother maiden and crone kind of story and the way that our collective consciousness
adds that through there and then strains the Baba Yaga into that.
And so when we talk about, you know, like what scholars think of the Baba Yaga story,
what we're talking about is both like regional and four dimensional at a at any given point
in time, they may have thought something completely different because there is a different melange
of things inside of it.
Jordan nailed it because we're going to cover that like a little little at the end, not
maybe not as in detail as that, but he's he's he's no Jordan's right, though, is that like
over time, like any good folkloric story, most of them start out as like an oral tradition,
then they get written down, then they get translated, retranslated, and then the her
tale isn't just one single story that has changed over time.
It's Baba Yaga appears in many different stories, and she's always either the villain or the
hero or like a weird amalgamation of both.
So when scholars say like it could represent this or it does represent this, like it depends
on what version and or what era they might be talking about Baba Yaga in.
So while yeah, Jordan's right, like it's all kind of fucking silly, but it's just because
like it depends on when you're talking like right now, like we're talking about it like
in the sense of what Baba Yaga is known as now, not what it was when some dude in the
woods saw a weird old lady one time.
Right.
And sure.
And plenty of these plenty of these stories in their specifics are in this case about
Baba Yaga.
But the story itself in general, the idea of this character with these traits goes to
this character with these traits.
Morality ensues, you know, problem solved.
That's also like a cut and paste.
So one culture will have originally had it with the sun god Ra.
And then it'll be the exact same story, but it'll now be the Baba Yaga.
So when you say, oh, the Baba Yaga represents this, are you talking about the Baba Yaga
in this story or the Baba Yaga?
It's actually a callback to the sun god Ra from several thousand years back.
So in general, I just hate skulls.
That's really what I'm talking about.
Just in general, just a general leg.
I like to I like to know things just so I can hate on people who know.
It's a real dick thing to do is no shit.
So she's a symbol of transformation, but but also a cautionary tale of the untamed forces
of nature.
Now her chicken legged house, which shards seems to just really hate the constantly spinning
like a Beyblade in the forest, it reflects her connection to the in-between, the threshold
between the human world and the supernatural to to approach her hut is to step into a realm
where normal rules like just no longer apply in the house.
Like the house's legs, as fucked up in Eldritch as they are, they do hold a deeper meaning
in Slavic folklore.
Chickens are liminal creatures, so they're tied to both the earth and the sky.
So by standing on chicken legs, Baba Yaga's hut becomes a gateway between worlds, like
a place of like profound transition.
So it's like a TARDIS.
It is a little bit like a yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, that's that's a really good kind of like an analogy for this specific.
So the spinning motion of the house mirrors the chaos of life's challenges, and only those
who can still their fear and speak the right words can eventually find the stability they
so desperately seek.
Jordan, your face just seems like you want to yell.
No, I'm just I know I just like the idea of like a mother telling her two children this
story.
And then at the end of it, just go and be like, hey, shut up.
The spinning house represents fucking the liminal space between when it spins and then
when you're not alive.
You know, it's the chaos of life.
I was like, Jordan, this is a lot.
It's the no, it's the no.
What?
Shut up.
Quit crying.
It's about the chaos of life is what this story is about.
I regret having both of you on.
I should have done this by myself.
Even Baba Yaga's duality, her roles as both destroyer and helper.
I hate that I'm going to say this next thing represents the complexities of life.
She's a reminder.
Yeah, that she's a reminder.
Ring the bell.
She's a reminder that the unknown can be both terrifying and transformative.
The danger and wisdom often walk hand in hand.
Now the tales of Baba Yaga have endured for centuries and while her legend is consistently
evolving, it never loses its edge.
Like she's popped up in countless folktales, each one adding a new layer to her character.
In modern times, she's found her way into literature, films and games from Neil Gaiman's
Stardust to the Hellboy comics to the Witcher series, even in trading card games like Cryptid
Camp.
Yet no matter the adaptation, like her essence remains the same.
It's wild, untamed, unforgettable.
And Baba Yaga is much more than just like a folkloric story or a cautionary tale.
She's a challenge.
She's a test of courage and character.
Her spinning hut, her gnashing teeth, her relentless appetite.
They're all symbols of the trials we face in life.
Whether she offers help, harm or something in between.
It all depends on how you approach her.
So gentlemen, in closing, if you ever find yourself wandering through a dark forest,
see a hut with chicken legs scratching at the earth, take a deep breath, speak the right
words, step through the boneline fence and prepare to face whatever test she has in store.
So there you have it guys.
That is not the whole tale, but most of the tale of Baba Yaga.
Thank you very much.
I feel like in a world where we have warnings on plastic bags, something like Baba Yaga
is even more terrifying to me.
You know, cause like actual consequences.
Yeah, I don't want that in the form of failure leading to sacrifice.
Yeah, I don't want that.
That doesn't sound fun.
Yeah.
You know what?
You're not wrong.
Yeah, I like it.
What websites are like, are you sure you want to press this button?
I'm going to give you as many off ramps as I can.
There are no off ramps.
Whatever you're walking on a chicken leg.
That's just, you're just going off the chicken leg house.
Honestly, like the visual of it is so awesome.
It's compelling.
It's a really great visual.
It's a truly tremendous like the house on chicken legs is just great.
That's the story of Baba Yaga.
I want to get your guys's honest, true opinions.
Jordan, how you feeling about Baba Yaga?
The story as told this way, not by the ancients, obviously.
I've always been a big fan of Baba Yaga as the folkloric figure, just because Baba Yaga
is often associated with both the power of women and the power of travelers, if you will.
So it is very much the lessons are work hard and you'll be rewarded.
It's not complicated.
Yeah.
The lessons are like, if somebody is coming by to your house and needs something, give
it to them.
Don't be an asshole.
What are you doing?
What's wrong with you?
Like the lessons of Baba Yaga are so very much like, hey, don't be an asshole.
It's really not as hard as you might think.
And then the way that people behave in the stories is so clearly like, man, this guy
fucking Derek came through town six weeks ago, dude, ate all of my stuff, all of it,
all of it.
And then just left, didn't leave a fucking Pence behind.
And you're like, well, he's going in the story.
He's going to go.
People in 2024 are going to be like, yeah, Derek was a real piece of shit.
It's true.
And Baba Yaga is going to get him.
So don't worry about it.
Exactly.
He screwed you over.
But Baba Yaga will get him.
You got it.
I was one of the things like, cause like when you try and find like folkloric stories about
Baba Yaga, it's always the, like the disrespectful traveler never has a name, I feel like.
It is because they did that purposely so you could put in the name of some shit bag who
fucked you over.
And you're like, yeah, well, so I use Derek.
Exactly.
I find it funnier in specific, but also it's a general, it's a synecdoche.
It's okay.
Don't worry about it.
But there's also like, there's Norse mythology that's like that with travelers who were disrespectful
as well.
I remember one where they were eating, I think it was like one of Thor's goats.
And they said, you know, don't break the bones, eat the marrow out because you know, the goats
can't come back when the goat came back and it was lame.
Thor just killed him.
He was like, well, fuck you guys.
You did exactly what I told you.
It was one rule.
You can follow the one fucking rule.
Yeah.
All right.
But that's our episode.
Thank you guys so much for listening.
Jordan, thank you so much for coming on.
Had a great time.
Did you honestly?
Yeah, no, I had a great time.
Am I coming back?
That's a different question to whether or not I had a great time.
That's a time and effort based question.
You know, all of those things are very changeable and frankly, capricious.
This is normally where we would, we would plug our stuff, but I'm going to open the
floor to you, Jordan, to plug whatever it is you want to plug.
I know you got things going on.
I guess we do a show knowledge fight.com, but I wrote a book.
It's the quiet part loud.
You can get it for free at the quiet part loud.com.
All right.
So if so, yeah.
So go, go to the knowledge fight.
If you're listening to this, you know how to find other podcasts.
So just knowledge fight, whatever.
If you want to follow us on Instagram at that crypto cocktail, you can find all the links
in our Instagram.
Get my coloring book, you savages.
It's now got legs because moron got elected for four more years.
So you can take all your frustrations out on the coloring book or just, you know, burn
it and make hot dogs out there.
All right.
So just super normal.com.
So that way, Jordan, would you like to say goodbye?
And I love you to the audience.
Goodbye.
I love you to the audience.