1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:12,120 Welcome to Swing Theory Golf, the ultimate podcast for the golf enthusiast. 2 00:00:12,120 --> 00:00:17,860 I'm your host, Tim McElvanagh, PGA professional, and I'm thrilled to be joined by my co-host 3 00:00:17,860 --> 00:00:23,280 Sean Clautz, a seasoned PGA professional, as well as over 20 years experience in the 4 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:24,960 golf industry. 5 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:30,480 Join us as we delve into the world of golf, covering everything from swing tips to top 6 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:31,760 notch golf destinations. 7 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:36,960 We will discuss the greatest golfers of all time and explore the latest golf trends in 8 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:38,720 the game of golf. 9 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:44,640 Get ready to tee off with Swing Theory Golf, your source for all things golf. 10 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:45,640 Let's dive in. 11 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:50,720 All right, welcome everybody. 12 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:52,520 Welcome back to Swing Theory Golf. 13 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,360 We're here with Sean Clautz and Mark Clautz as well is on the line with us. 14 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:00,640 Today's episode, we're going to talk about the seasonality about golf, you know, from 15 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:05,040 people going from northern courses to southern courses, what they kind of see different, 16 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:07,760 terrain, structure and stuff like that. 17 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,520 So Sean, you're a guy from New England. 18 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:13,720 What are some of the big differences you kind of see as well? 19 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:14,720 It's funny. 20 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:17,440 First of all, Mark, you know, definitely thank you for joining us. 21 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:18,840 We're happy. 22 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:19,840 Thank you. 23 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:20,840 Yeah. 24 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:23,280 And for the listeners, that's that's not an accent, by the way. 25 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:24,680 That's his real speaking voice. 26 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:26,680 Yeah, it is. 27 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:30,240 Just he always says that he doesn't have an accent. 28 00:01:30,240 --> 00:01:32,440 Everybody else has an accent down here. 29 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:34,440 Yeah, that's right. 30 00:01:34,440 --> 00:01:40,600 But anyways, so yeah, so I've actually literally been in Florida longer than I've been in Massachusetts. 31 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:46,160 But you know, we both grew up in just north of Boston, about 15 miles north of Boston, 32 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:48,440 little town called Peabody Mass. 33 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,200 So we played high school golf up there. 34 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:55,960 And it's the conditions of high school golf when you're coming out of the spring or basically 35 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:56,960 it's a spring season. 36 00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:57,960 Yeah. 37 00:01:57,960 --> 00:01:58,960 So that kind of goes into it. 38 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,680 There's such a seasonality to the game in New England versus Florida. 39 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:09,560 Mark, you know, I mean, as a as a general manager, head professional for, you know, 40 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:11,400 what is it, 25 years now? 41 00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:12,400 Maybe longer. 42 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:13,400 Me? 43 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:14,400 Yeah. 44 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:15,400 Yeah. 45 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:16,400 30. 46 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:17,400 Okay. 47 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:18,400 There you go. 48 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:22,320 So you've in your career has basically been in Massachusetts or Connecticut a little bit 49 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:23,800 too for the last 30 years. 50 00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:25,560 What do you guys see? 51 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:29,200 What's the challenges maybe kind of like coming out of the spring? 52 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,320 You know, like we're talking about with high school golf when it's so cold and rainy and 53 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:33,580 nasty. 54 00:02:33,580 --> 00:02:37,280 And then now what we're leading into is to the when your season kind of winds down, what 55 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:42,960 do you see from like the green, you know, growing the grass and just some of the challenges? 56 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:43,960 Yeah. 57 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:49,280 So we have, you know, the thing about high school golf up here is that they've changed 58 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:50,280 seasons. 59 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:55,160 So the boys play in the boys play in the fall and the girls play in the spring. 60 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:56,160 Okay. 61 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:58,000 Because there's so many more boys that play golf. 62 00:02:58,000 --> 00:02:59,280 Oh, yeah, makes sense. 63 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,000 We have a lot more, you know, availability in the fall, if you will. 64 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:08,080 But fall golf is fall golf can be great in New England, especially in September, October, 65 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:11,920 it could be really wet and cold real quick, too, of course. 66 00:03:11,920 --> 00:03:16,600 They like today is 55 and not too good out right now. 67 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,440 But these are the high school golf match. 68 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:22,640 So tough, tough scoring conditions right there. 69 00:03:22,640 --> 00:03:23,640 Right. 70 00:03:23,640 --> 00:03:27,000 I thought scoring conditions, you know, and, you know, everybody's all these all the kids 71 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:28,760 from the south are so much better. 72 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:30,400 We have a lot of kids up here that are really good. 73 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:34,280 They just have, you know, they have to deal with those kind of conditions all the time. 74 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:37,360 I think Mark, I think the thing is like we just we just played in it. 75 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:38,360 You don't know any different. 76 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:39,360 Yeah, right. 77 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:40,360 Right. 78 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:41,360 That's the thing. 79 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:45,120 You just get up and you just go and you're hitting balls when it's 40 degrees out. 80 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:53,000 And I think one of my best memories, honestly, is me and you and our buddy Paul hitting balls 81 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:55,080 into the snow like we hit. 82 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,320 We had a makeshift tee box. 83 00:03:57,320 --> 00:03:58,880 There's no way there's no chance for me. 84 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:02,720 No, we had this makeshift tee box in the back of his neighborhood, back of his house, because 85 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:04,520 it was a new neighborhood going in. 86 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:08,480 And we would just hit balls into the snow and go get them and then bring them back and 87 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:09,480 hit them again. 88 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:10,480 That was like our driving range. 89 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:11,480 It was a practice area. 90 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:12,480 Right. 91 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:13,480 Yeah. 92 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:14,480 Oh, absolutely. 93 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,320 It was it was absolutely that, you know, it could be any kind of weather we'd be doing 94 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:18,320 it. 95 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:19,920 It's funny thinking about that. 96 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,600 Yeah, we hit a lot of balls in that back area. 97 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:23,600 Yeah. 98 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,040 But yeah, it was always just kind of work on your game. 99 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:31,200 So I remember being at Sagamore down the street from me and not from us. 100 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,600 Excuse me, Sean, down the street. 101 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:38,680 I walk in the winter time and I go down and sneak on the golf course there at Sagamore 102 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:41,600 and I hit in between the snow banks, leaving on a temp. 103 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:42,600 Oh, wow. 104 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:46,080 So that definitely straightens out those drives, doesn't it? 105 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,600 And I have I have the owner would come out in his car. 106 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:50,120 He's like, Mark, what are you doing out here? 107 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:51,120 I'm like, I'm practicing. 108 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,680 He's like, OK, just, you know, don't make too many divots. 109 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:54,920 And he was really nice about it. 110 00:04:54,920 --> 00:05:00,000 But I just think about that memory there of, you know, it was all kind of conditions. 111 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:03,160 And now I think about all the crazy people up here in the north. 112 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:04,720 They try to play golf all through the winter. 113 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:05,720 They're down the Cape. 114 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:06,720 They're down Rhode Island. 115 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:08,720 They're down the Potsdam, Connecticut. 116 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:13,320 They can they they they can get a lot of season in. 117 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:15,960 I mean, they'll they'll play when it's 20 degrees, though. 118 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:16,960 I don't advocate that. 119 00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:17,960 I don't think it's golf. 120 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:18,960 I don't think it's that. 121 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:21,120 I don't think it's golf, of course. 122 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:22,920 But yeah, and they do it. 123 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:28,840 You know, so the course conditions, you know, springtime, we're always just trying to get 124 00:05:28,840 --> 00:05:30,840 going because you're dealing with frost delays still. 125 00:05:30,840 --> 00:05:33,840 You don't have any frost delays in Florida. 126 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:35,480 I'm pretty sure we do. 127 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:36,480 Very, very few. 128 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,320 But we do get a couple, not many. 129 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:42,300 You know, and we're dealing with, you know, aeration. 130 00:05:42,300 --> 00:05:44,960 We do a lot of aeration up here because of the seasons. 131 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:47,760 I don't think you guys are there as much as we do, maybe. 132 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,480 But we do have a lot of area going on. 133 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,160 You know, right now they're doing right now as we speak, they're doing the fairways here 134 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:57,960 at Cohassie and they did the greens a couple of weeks ago. 135 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:00,040 And, you know, that just gets everybody for next year. 136 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:04,240 But unfortunately, when you're a rate, you know, you take away the product and, you know, 137 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,560 it's just not as good as it usually is and you feel bad for a customer. 138 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:12,040 But it's just part of the, you know, the evil of getting the golf course in such great shape 139 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:13,040 when it isn't great. 140 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:14,040 Yeah. 141 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:15,040 Keeping it in good shape. 142 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:16,920 So just to that topic, even just airifying. 143 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:20,200 So for some of the listeners and maybe newer golfers, what we're really talking about is 144 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,760 basically you're making holes in the greens specifically. 145 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:27,320 If you're doing fairways, that's usually like an added benefit to a golf course. 146 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:28,320 Yeah. 147 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:32,160 There's a lot of golf courses that don't have the revenue or the money to be able to do 148 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:36,120 fairway airification, but the courses that do it, you can definitely tell how the ball 149 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:38,440 props up on the fairways. 150 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:40,000 Much easier to kind of swing through it. 151 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:41,000 Yes. 152 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,000 Makes a big difference on the fairways for sure. 153 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:44,000 Exactly. 154 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,760 And then, but the airification during the summertime here, which is again, depending 155 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:54,480 on the type of golf course, the, I'll say the, you know, more higher price ones we'll 156 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:58,240 call it, they probably airify more because they want their green speed to be faster. 157 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:01,440 You worked actually with Jovita, didn't you, Tim? 158 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:05,360 Worked at Jovita as a maintenance crew, also worked over at Temple Terrace, watched those 159 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:06,640 guys get it pretty quick. 160 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:11,160 So they'll do the big punches, they do a lot of the small punches as well to kind of keep 161 00:07:11,160 --> 00:07:15,040 those things aerated and keep any greens nice and quick. 162 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:16,040 Right. 163 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:18,800 And like Mark says, it does, you know, you get that phone call during the summertime 164 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:19,800 a lot. 165 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:20,800 We do in Florida. 166 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:21,800 Oh. 167 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:22,800 Right. 168 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:23,800 Did you guys airify yet? 169 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:24,800 Yeah. 170 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:25,800 When are you airifying? 171 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:27,200 You know, how long until airification and all that? 172 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:28,200 Yeah. 173 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:33,920 Do you guys do that like two times a summer, Mark, typically at Cojase or the airfying? 174 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:41,880 Yeah, Cojase, we actually have a new system the last three years, air injection and sand 175 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,160 injection, water injection. 176 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:50,320 So it's a machine, it's called A2, it's called an A2 machine and it puts air in the machine, 177 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:53,360 so when we're aerating, you don't see anything. 178 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:55,480 All you see is very small holes. 179 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:59,600 The air goes in, the water goes in and the sand goes in. 180 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:06,480 So we're not taking out the huge tines anymore and as of 2024, we've been approved to just 181 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:09,440 do that kind of system and not do any more coring. 182 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,960 That's got to cut down on labor costs significantly, doesn't it? 183 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:16,520 Cuts down on labor costs, it cuts down on, the biggest thing, I mean, yes, definitely 184 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:18,040 labor costs and it's a great system. 185 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:19,040 It works wonderful. 186 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:22,560 I'm very, I came here three years ago, I'm like, what the heck is that machine? 187 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:27,080 And it was very, very cool when I saw how it worked and the functionality of it. 188 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:29,480 We do that once a month. 189 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,160 So we do that once a month. 190 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:33,600 You really don't have to do anything else. 191 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:37,120 So it's going to save our labor costs, but also it works. 192 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:38,840 It works really well. 193 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:45,760 And now you don't take, because we air fight with cores recently. 194 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:51,280 It was the last one, this would be the last time we core, this was three weeks ago. 195 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:54,440 And the core is still healing up now as we speak. 196 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:55,440 Yeah. 197 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:56,440 It always happens. 198 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:57,440 Yep. 199 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:00,880 So just for the listener again, because I'm learning too, as I'm talking to you, and I've 200 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:04,680 only known you for 53 years or 52 years, I guess. 201 00:09:04,680 --> 00:09:08,480 So we definitely do airfications on greens here. 202 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,800 And like you're talking about, that's kind of the more 10 to 14 day healing process. 203 00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:18,360 That's what you see in TMAC when you, again, Jovita, Silverado, Lake Laredet. 204 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:26,920 It's just, the whole purpose is to kind of get down inside the roots to get the bad stuff 205 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:28,440 out, for lack of a better term. 206 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:32,600 Well, just to make sure that the root ball doesn't start overtaking itself and it starts 207 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,600 to grow properly instead of getting infected and stuff like that. 208 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:40,960 So when you're talking about that, Mark, and I've seen that AT machine at, actually at 209 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:44,600 the PGA show, they were doing a demo on it out at a golf course called Providence. 210 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:48,280 And I was really interested, back when I was at Silverado, we talked about that. 211 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:56,640 But is it, so I'm going to use the word tines, like smaller, thin, kind of almost like verticutting. 212 00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:00,600 Does it even leave that impression on the greens or is it just almost imperceptible? 213 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:01,600 You wouldn't notice it. 214 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:02,600 Wow. 215 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:03,600 You wouldn't. 216 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:08,600 When I say you wouldn't notice it, I mean, they do it and then they just, they go over 217 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:12,280 and they do a cut and you wouldn't even notice it happen that day. 218 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:13,280 Wow. 219 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:14,280 That's cool. 220 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:16,440 So we don't lose any type of play. 221 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:17,440 That's my whole point. 222 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:18,440 Yeah. 223 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,080 You know, and when we aerated, you lost people for 10 days. 224 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:24,760 And all you aerated, we're not going to come up with the greens out that quick. 225 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:30,520 I'm the one who also said, you know, still good to practice, still good to play, if they 226 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:31,520 are aerated. 227 00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:36,480 But now with this 282 machine, we're going to have no disturbance at all for our whole 228 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:37,480 golf schedule. 229 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:38,760 Imagine how good that's going to feel. 230 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:39,760 That's nice. 231 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:40,760 So wish we could have that. 232 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,760 Well, I was going to say, as we're, as three golf pros are sitting here talking on a podcast, 233 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:48,600 I wonder if we had three superintendents and they would all agree with us, especially Florida 234 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:49,600 superintendents. 235 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:57,200 Cause they, you know, what I've heard down here since I've been down here is essentially 236 00:10:57,200 --> 00:10:59,840 they prefer to do it three times a year. 237 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:00,840 And that's the big times. 238 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:01,840 Yeah. 239 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:03,840 The big cores like you're talking about. 240 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:08,360 And I guess that's got to be the difference of, and this is a good kind of segue, Bermuda 241 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:10,320 grass versus bent grass. 242 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:11,320 Yeah. 243 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:12,320 Absolutely. 244 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:13,320 Right. 245 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:18,760 I mean, the bent grass, when I go up there in July or August and play up there and have 246 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:20,280 you played much up north at all? 247 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,320 I played a couple of bent greens and I'll tell you what, the ball really spins. 248 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:26,760 I mean, you've got, you've got to, I love it. 249 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:29,360 It's a much different type of golf up there for sure. 250 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:30,360 Yeah. 251 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:31,360 Yeah. 252 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:35,920 It's, and that's the thing, Mark is it just the grass is so much different putting on. 253 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:40,600 So when we, when we get our greens fast down here, it's during the winter time when essentially 254 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:46,120 the Bermuda has gone dormant and either they either over seed it with a rye or they just 255 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:47,800 don't put anything down there at all. 256 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:49,800 Then it just becomes barren brown. 257 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:50,800 Yeah. 258 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:51,800 Brown, but fast. 259 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:52,800 Right. 260 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:57,520 But during the summertime, it's a, it's such a challenge to keep speedy greens and I don't 261 00:11:57,520 --> 00:11:58,520 very grainy. 262 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,240 You know, you get a lot of grain with Bermuda going different ways. 263 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:03,840 You've got to, you know, definitely take that into account when you're looking at those 264 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:06,360 greens, which I don't think you have to do with Ben. 265 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:08,520 I was going to say, do you even look at that? 266 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:12,520 Yeah, very, very, very few things where I think it's grainy out here. 267 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:13,520 Yeah. 268 00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:18,040 You know, or in New England in general, I really don't, you know, I really don't see 269 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:19,040 it too often. 270 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:23,160 We're just more about, you know, we have a lot of undulation on our greens compared to 271 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,920 Florida as far as I can see for the most part. 272 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:31,920 You know, we have a lot of, you come to Cohassie and we got double tiered greens and slopes 273 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:32,920 and everything like that. 274 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:38,280 I go to a lot of Florida golf courses and it's pretty flat, you know, not the same. 275 00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:42,840 Do you find that usually the green complexes up there in the North are a little bit bigger, 276 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:47,760 a little bit smaller than what you find here in the South or do you find the complex reversed 277 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:48,760 on that? 278 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:53,280 Yeah, I, you know, I mean, you know, course to course differences, of course, but we have 279 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:56,080 just so many beautiful old golf courses. 280 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:57,080 Yeah. 281 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:01,000 You know, you guys have some old golf courses, but you have a lot of modern projects that 282 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:03,000 just didn't happen up here. 283 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,280 We have a lot more, you know, 19, my course is 1918. 284 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:13,080 You know, a lot of 1918s and 20s and 1925s and all those golf courses, they have very 285 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,240 small, very small greens from those parts. 286 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:19,520 And they utilize a lot of what they had for the natural terrain up there. 287 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,400 They didn't have all that equipment, correct? 288 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:22,400 Oh, that's right. 289 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,920 You know, there was no, there was, there was just manmade. 290 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:28,840 That's all it was, you know, was they weren't using tractors or anything like that. 291 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:32,480 They just kind of worked with the contour of the greens and the contour of the, of the 292 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:33,480 land. 293 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:38,760 And you still see it today, you know, my course here, and there's humps and bumps when Donald 294 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:42,600 Ross was here that I'm sure he just left there, you know, it's okay. 295 00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:46,240 You know, today's world, you know, especially in a modern golf course, you see a lot more 296 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:47,240 flatness. 297 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:48,960 Yeah, that's an interesting point right there. 298 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:53,880 It is a Donald Ross design that you got that you're at right, a nine hole private facility. 299 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:54,880 Yes, sir. 300 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,240 Yeah, that's really cool. 301 00:13:57,240 --> 00:13:59,240 He did a bunch of golf courses up in Massachusetts. 302 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:03,400 He did a, did a decent amount down here in Florida, but a bunch in the New England area 303 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:05,000 in New York too, right? 304 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:06,000 I think. 305 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:10,520 Yeah, he has all of New England, New York, a little bit of course, you know, pioneers, 306 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:12,600 of course, in North Carolina. 307 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:14,640 And then he's got some stuff down your way. 308 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:22,440 But up here, I think he's got a, his history is he's still got 157 golf courses in the 309 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:25,760 New England area that are his design, that are still functioning. 310 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:30,560 So I played a course down in Sarasota called Sarah Bay. 311 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:35,280 And that's that that just, and you know, and Mark, we've talked about this before we play, 312 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:40,160 you know, when you walk on a Donald Ross property, you can tell immediately, like they have that 313 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:45,840 signature, the turtle shell back on all the greens and everything like that. 314 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:48,000 Don't be behind the green turtle backs. 315 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,000 You got false fronts. 316 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:55,220 I mean, he did, he, he was very, very, very, I mean, it's just amazing that his courses, 317 00:14:55,220 --> 00:14:58,280 you know, you look at the course today, here we are 100 years later, it's still hard. 318 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:00,680 You know, nothing's really changed. 319 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:02,240 It's still hard, especially my course. 320 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,360 I mean, not much has been done to change his golf course. 321 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,880 I think it's cool seeing some of the pictures in your clubhouse, you know, and they're black 322 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:13,800 and whites, Tim, you know, and they're just the guys are dressed in that 1930s. 323 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:14,800 Love that look. 324 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:15,800 Yeah, love that look. 325 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:17,680 Almost a suit that they're wearing out there. 326 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:19,760 And it's 105 years old. 327 00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:23,280 And does not, like you said, not a lot in Florida that get even close to that. 328 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:27,200 No, no, no, I think we played, we played Dunedin. 329 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:28,840 Yeah, your area. 330 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:30,400 Yeah, that's a Ross. 331 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,800 And that has a lot of the Ross feel to it. 332 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:38,280 Unfortunately, too, I mean, I say it, I love architecture golf courses. 333 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,640 I love what Ross did. 334 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:44,040 Some of the others, of course, I still love Jeffrey Cornish for some of his artwork. 335 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:46,600 And you see what Ross did. 336 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:51,280 Unfortunately, like a lot of golf courses, oh, we can fix this, we can change this. 337 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:54,400 They take bunkers out and they take things out that Ross left there. 338 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,280 And you see a lot of the golf courses. 339 00:15:56,280 --> 00:15:58,800 Now they're trying to go back to what he originally did. 340 00:15:58,800 --> 00:15:59,800 Yeah. 341 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:02,920 Like watch Houston, watch uses from Donald Ross. 342 00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:09,840 I played there last week and that is a, they actually put a bunker 75 yards off the seventh 343 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:10,840 hole. 344 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:11,840 And somebody says, why? 345 00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:12,840 I said, because now you can see where the green is. 346 00:16:12,840 --> 00:16:16,840 It has nothing to do with the tee shot, but that's why Ross put it there. 347 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,720 So it's kind of neat to see that stuff. 348 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:23,200 Yeah, just as a visual to intimidate you. 349 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:24,200 That's pretty good right there. 350 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:30,160 Now, do you think with the emergence of like Gil Hans bringing in things like Banyan dunes, 351 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:34,520 it's really brought this Donald Ross kind of feel of bringing back the natural architect 352 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:38,080 of golf and all that, that feel. 353 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:43,200 Because back in the nineties, they had Greg Norman and those guys just building target 354 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:44,200 golf. 355 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,840 And now it seems to be much more of a link style. 356 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,200 Everybody seems to be going to that natural golf thing now. 357 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:51,200 Absolutely. 358 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:56,280 I love that I went down to Pinehurst a few times and the last time I was at Pinehurst, 359 00:16:56,280 --> 00:17:01,720 they have a nice video about Ben Crenshaw going and trying to recreate the old Pinehurst. 360 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:06,840 And to make it have more naturalized and not so much, because they changed a lot. 361 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:10,240 They changed the rough, they changed everything back in the seventies there. 362 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:14,640 And to bring it back to the real way, I think it's pretty cool for the real way it looks 363 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:15,640 or should look. 364 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:18,160 They're doing the same thing at, what's the country club right now? 365 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:19,160 They have my house. 366 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:20,160 That's a Donald Ross. 367 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:22,440 And they're redoing three holes every year. 368 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:26,880 And they're trying to bring it all back to the old Ross. 369 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:27,880 That's great. 370 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:28,880 Yeah. 371 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:34,040 So, so Mark, one of the things that I see when I go up north, back and forth a little 372 00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:37,840 bit, Florida golf versus Massachusetts golf or New England golf in general is first of 373 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:40,400 all, like chipping conditions are totally different, really. 374 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:46,840 Like you just have to have different almost imagination to how you execute the shot. 375 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:47,840 Does that make sense? 376 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:50,640 You come down here in January versus what you're doing throughout the summer? 377 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:51,640 Oh yeah. 378 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:55,600 I tipped differently there. 379 00:17:55,600 --> 00:18:00,440 I feel like I hit a lot more bump and runs down your place and a little more higher shots 380 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:01,440 here. 381 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,680 But I don't know if that's right or not, but that's how I play it. 382 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:08,200 It's definitely different just the way the club goes through the grass down there. 383 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:10,800 It can grab my club down here, can grab my club. 384 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:11,800 It's different. 385 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:12,800 It's definitely different. 386 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:13,960 I think you see that on tour, right? 387 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:18,480 That's why they have like the California swing where they've got the Poana grass. 388 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:22,680 And then there's certain almost kind of horses for courses type of thing. 389 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:26,480 There's players that play well in Florida versus players that play well in California 390 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:28,320 because they're kind of used to the conditions. 391 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:29,320 Look at Ty. 392 00:18:29,320 --> 00:18:34,040 Johnny Miller, number one at tournament east of the Mississippi. 393 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:35,040 There you go. 394 00:18:35,040 --> 00:18:36,040 Oh, yeah. 395 00:18:36,040 --> 00:18:37,040 Fine example. 396 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:38,040 Just for an example. 397 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:39,040 Yeah. 398 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:40,040 Absolutely. 399 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:41,040 So that's one thing. 400 00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:45,960 You definitely see as you move kind of from the north to the south is the amount of blind 401 00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:49,080 golf shots that you have to hit up there versus down here. 402 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:53,480 Like you said, it's kind of a flatter terrain, sea level pretty much. 403 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:59,640 That's why when we get a golf course like Diamond or Black Diamond, it seems so weird 404 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,880 because it's a canyon. 405 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:07,120 But up there, it's almost there's a lot of golf courses that you hit blind shots into 406 00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:11,120 tee boxes, fairways, into greens, whatever. 407 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:13,800 A lot more dog legs up there, I bet, as well. 408 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:14,800 Right? 409 00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:16,800 A lot of dog legs up here. 410 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:17,800 Yeah. 411 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:20,800 A lot of dog legs up here. 412 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:22,840 And the blind shots are. 413 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:23,840 Yeah. 414 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:26,640 And the blind shots are like my fifth hole. 415 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:28,640 I mean, it's almost two blind shots. 416 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:29,640 Like it's just crazy. 417 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,920 You know, you go to Florida and it's like right in front of you. 418 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:39,440 How many dog legs do it was that I've played with? 419 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:42,120 So then that that really affects your yardage. 420 00:19:42,120 --> 00:19:46,160 And that's kind of where I was going to with the question was that the 150 yard golf shot 421 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:50,840 in Florida is not necessarily 150 yard golf shot in Massachusetts, because if you're going 422 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:54,120 downhill or uphill, you got to change the club based on the condition of what you're 423 00:19:54,120 --> 00:19:55,120 trying to hit. 424 00:19:55,120 --> 00:19:56,120 Yes. 425 00:19:56,120 --> 00:19:57,120 Yeah. 426 00:19:57,120 --> 00:19:58,480 And that confuses people a lot. 427 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,680 I know you're 150 yards. 428 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:04,400 You know, you got 30 feet downhill and how come you hit a wedge? 429 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:06,800 I mean, because it's not it's not 150 yards. 430 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:08,280 And some people don't get that still. 431 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:09,280 I mean, I think it's funny. 432 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:10,280 But yeah. 433 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:11,280 Yeah. 434 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:14,920 And it again works the other way in the opposite where they they got the uphill shot and they're 435 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:16,960 like, oh, can't believe it came up short. 436 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,000 Well, I see that all the time. 437 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:22,400 They just grab, you know, the eight iron for the 150 yard shot when they really need a 438 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:24,680 seven or a six or something for the elevation. 439 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:26,200 They never even think about the elevation. 440 00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:28,040 We see that on the flat conditions here, Tim. 441 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:29,040 Oh, yeah. 442 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,800 They're only five feet up and they're still grabbing the same old club and coming up, 443 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:33,800 you know, 10 yards short. 444 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:34,800 Yeah. 445 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,800 And then, you know, again, even like a wind condition. 446 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:40,840 Obviously, we have wind in Florida, you know, the same thing. 447 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:47,480 But it just seems like there's more not more factors, but there's just you got to be aware. 448 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:48,480 It's different. 449 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:50,320 I guess it's not really, you know, not more. 450 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:51,320 It's just different in Florida. 451 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:56,540 You've got to be more aware of water hazards and kind of terrain to the right and left 452 00:20:56,540 --> 00:21:01,360 of you because you could miss hit it and be in the woods real quick or in a conservation 453 00:21:01,360 --> 00:21:04,280 area, whereas up north swamp. 454 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:05,280 Swap. 455 00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:06,280 There you go. 456 00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:07,280 Yeah. 457 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:11,760 And again, you know, golf courses are different up there to you get championship style, whatever. 458 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:15,600 But but yeah, up there, it's you got to carry bunkers. 459 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:17,520 You got to head to the right number. 460 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:22,320 Like T Mac was talking about earlier, the green complexes become more challenging because 461 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,320 the golf courses get harder. 462 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:25,320 They're tighter. 463 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:26,960 The greens are a little harder. 464 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:28,160 So you got to be the number. 465 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:29,720 You can't roll it up there. 466 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:33,240 It seemed like you'd have to be much more of a tactician up there, you know, planning 467 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:36,640 out your second shot where more the Florida courses. 468 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:37,640 It's going to be straight on. 469 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:41,800 If you miss it, you know, you've got kind of a fade or a little draw to get back into 470 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:42,800 it. 471 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:45,640 But probably up there, it's going to take a you know, a little bit more imagination 472 00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,040 to get out and get to where you need to be. 473 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:49,040 Yeah. 474 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,360 And I don't mean this like I think Florida golf course was very hard. 475 00:21:52,360 --> 00:21:53,520 Don't get me wrong. 476 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,240 I think that's one of the hardest things you have to have different imagination up here. 477 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:02,080 You have to, you know, certain places you just you got to think, you know, I got to 478 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:05,000 hit it 30 feet left to the pin, even though it's a straight shot. 479 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:06,280 No, it's not a straight shot. 480 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,840 You know, happens so much up here. 481 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,920 And when I go to Florida, it seems like it's pretty much hit it at the pin or a little 482 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:13,920 bit. 483 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:14,920 I'm not not so much. 484 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:15,920 It's flat. 485 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:23,360 Yeah, your first hole actually, for our listeners down here in the Tampa area, basically, and 486 00:22:23,360 --> 00:22:25,480 Lake Jovita might be a good example. 487 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:29,040 The number one in the south course at Lake Jovita, you've played that golf hole markets 488 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:30,040 par four. 489 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:31,040 Oh, yeah. 490 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,240 But I mean, it's not a hole where you can hit it right down the middle of the fairway 491 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,760 because it's going to roll out and go into the rough to the right. 492 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:37,760 Absolutely. 493 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:38,760 Right. 494 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:39,760 So you got it. 495 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:43,680 You got to aim left and let it kind of feed its way down the hole down the down the hill, 496 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:48,200 whereas the first hole at Cohassie coming up now, there's another it's an elevated 497 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:49,200 second shot, Tim. 498 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:50,200 Okay. 499 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:51,200 You know, you're hitting Valley. 500 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:55,720 If you hit a good drive, you're hitting maybe 130 to 160 in. 501 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,320 But you got to play it one extra club. 502 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:02,000 And then you got to aim it right of the of the green, not right of the flag, right of 503 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:04,000 the green, because it's a huge hill to the right. 504 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:05,540 It's going to hit that hill. 505 00:23:05,540 --> 00:23:06,540 That takes commitment right there. 506 00:23:06,540 --> 00:23:07,540 Yeah, yeah. 507 00:23:07,540 --> 00:23:08,540 You know, yeah. 508 00:23:08,540 --> 00:23:09,540 Oh, you got to bounce. 509 00:23:09,540 --> 00:23:10,540 You got to bounce it off. 510 00:23:10,540 --> 00:23:11,920 You got to bounce it off the hill to bounce it on the green. 511 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:12,920 Right. 512 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,720 If you hit it at the green, it's going to go over the green or hit it the green. 513 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,160 It's going to use in the bunker or it's going to be over the green. 514 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:21,000 Yeah, it's like we said, it's just it's different. 515 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:26,480 But always I always feel like I'm I always feel like I'm getting the Massachusetts golf 516 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:28,360 like on my last day of being there. 517 00:23:28,360 --> 00:23:32,840 You know, and you probably feel that coming down here like, oh, I got this Florida thing 518 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:33,840 figured out. 519 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:34,840 Yeah, yeah. 520 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:40,040 So how about the let's talk a little business now. 521 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,280 What's the like what do you do during the wintertime? 522 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,200 I guess would be the best way to start the question. 523 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,800 Like what's your because you're coming to the end of your season essentially. 524 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:49,920 So what's it? 525 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:53,320 It's also changed for you, hasn't it, too, for the last over the last 20 years, like 526 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:57,000 how you conducted your business over the last 20 years during the winter? 527 00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:58,000 Yeah. 528 00:23:58,000 --> 00:23:59,000 Yeah. 529 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:02,280 So at Cohassie, they put a simulator in a couple of years ago. 530 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:05,640 So I do golf lessons inside here. 531 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:07,960 But really, well, that's obvious. 532 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:14,240 I've been working in Boston, a place called City Golf Boston teaching indoors there with 533 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:15,240 simulators. 534 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,800 And, you know, I used to like be like, oh, teaching and simulators. 535 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,040 I don't know. 536 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:22,440 And then really, it's like 95 percent of the business now. 537 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:23,440 Everybody's teaching and simulators. 538 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:30,040 So yeah, that's a good plug for one stop golf club in Wesley Chapel, which is a private 539 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,520 hitting facility and has a track man. 540 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,160 Anyway, sorry, your private oasis. 541 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,200 It's a quick commercial. 542 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:37,200 Sorry. 543 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,440 Now, let me ask you this. 544 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,680 Now that you're doing more or doing, you know, some indoor lessons, what do you kind of prefer? 545 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:50,880 Do you prefer doing more lessons out on the range versus indoors or do you not have a 546 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:54,920 preference or what do you kind of see usually now that you're making that transition indoors 547 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:55,920 a little bit sometimes? 548 00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:56,920 Oh, it's funny. 549 00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:02,120 It's two different lessons to me, you know, the outdoor, you know, you definitely get 550 00:25:02,120 --> 00:25:08,720 to see the ball flight, you know, and, you know, you're hitting off of real grass and 551 00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:15,040 the simulator hitting off of, you know, just whatever you want to call it, just, you know, 552 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,080 a perfect after turf. 553 00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:20,000 But the perfect lie, there's no let go. 554 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:21,000 There's no let go. 555 00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:22,000 There's no give it. 556 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:23,000 So it's a definite lesson. 557 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:29,040 I love the indoor thing because you get to work a lot with club angle. 558 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,080 How the club's attacking the ball. 559 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:35,720 Very important to be able to tell the student or your club, you know, four or five degrees 560 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:39,040 open, that's why you're cutting the ball. 561 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,280 So you know, and the outdoor situation, you might not see that, but obviously to the ball 562 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:46,560 going the right way, you can explain that too, but different. 563 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:47,560 Gotcha. 564 00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:48,560 Gotcha. 565 00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:50,920 So just a side note here. 566 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:55,080 I went to a Dave Pelts for our younger listeners. 567 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:59,320 Dave Pelts is a great short game instructor. 568 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:00,320 The short game Bible. 569 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:01,320 Yeah, the putting Bible. 570 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:02,320 Yeah. 571 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,360 You know, work with Mickelson, work with a lot of guys on tour. 572 00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:11,840 But I went to a Dave Pelts seminar and it was basically like a short game one day seminar. 573 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,120 Now shockingly, Dave Pelts wasn't there, but he was still making a lot of money from the 574 00:26:15,120 --> 00:26:16,120 seminar. 575 00:26:16,120 --> 00:26:17,120 Good for him. 576 00:26:17,120 --> 00:26:18,120 Which is where we're all going, right? 577 00:26:18,120 --> 00:26:19,300 That's where we're all heading towards. 578 00:26:19,300 --> 00:26:21,500 But the point was it was broken up in two segments. 579 00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:28,920 The morning time was chipping and the afternoon time was was putting and we did two and a half 580 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:33,480 hours indoors putting, which is a lot of time to be indoors putting. 581 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,400 Tell me if you can get a student to do that. 582 00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:37,400 Right. 583 00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:38,400 Right. 584 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:42,200 But it kind of shows you the commitment that the guys on tour have and how concerned they 585 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:47,600 are with their form as opposed to seeing the ball go into a hole. 586 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:52,680 You know, like it was just all about the length of the putter, the lying of the putter, how 587 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:57,080 your arms hang, you know, what's your stroke tempo look like. 588 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:01,680 There was so much in that two and a half hours that we talked about that was nothing about 589 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,320 you know, getting the ball in the cup. 590 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:07,600 It was just more about getting the right stance, posture set up. 591 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:12,000 And I think that's kind of me and Tim have talked about this throughout our time so far, 592 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:17,060 Mark, is just what the guys on tour do, what the ladies on tour do is their their basics 593 00:27:17,060 --> 00:27:19,360 and their fundamentals are pretty much rock solid. 594 00:27:19,360 --> 00:27:20,360 Yeah. 595 00:27:20,360 --> 00:27:23,120 Whereas some of the people we teach aren't. 596 00:27:23,120 --> 00:27:25,080 They overlook those things completely. 597 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:26,080 Yeah. 598 00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:27,080 Yeah. 599 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:28,920 And, and they're and they're pretty impatient, too. 600 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:33,360 And I'm not trying to like indict our audience, but it's just you got to be you got to work 601 00:27:33,360 --> 00:27:37,480 the steps and make it, you know, make sure your stance is correct and make sure your 602 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:42,040 arms are hanging down correctly from your from your shoulders to have a good setup for 603 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:47,120 your putter before you can even think about should I go buy the new four hundred dollar 604 00:27:47,120 --> 00:27:48,120 or whatever. 605 00:27:48,120 --> 00:27:49,120 Oh, yeah. 606 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:50,880 The new toy that you got to have. 607 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:56,000 I mean, I think Ben Hogan said that 90 percent of the shot is either missed or won by your 608 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:57,000 setup. 609 00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,720 If you don't get that right, you're already set up for failure. 610 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:04,400 So take your time, do your setup and and work on that for sure. 611 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:08,320 I'm always amazed that people don't have a routine. 612 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,040 You know, you watch the tour player. 613 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:11,920 I remember Mike Weir a bunch of years ago. 614 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,200 He was about to hit me. 615 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,240 Somebody screwed him up behind him. 616 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:17,240 He went back. 617 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:20,760 You have to put the club back in the bag, put the head cover back on the bag and then 618 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:23,080 took the head cover off and redid his whole routine. 619 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:26,480 He went and hit a great shot, of course, you know. 620 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,160 It's like it was interesting to see. 621 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:33,720 But you know, I think you've got your student who'll get up and lose it rainfall to rainfall 622 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:34,720 as fast as possible. 623 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:38,640 You're not working on any kind of setup. 624 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,640 I really preach that to my people as long as I can. 625 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:43,640 They look, hey, take your time. 626 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:44,640 Take it out. 627 00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:45,640 It's all bucket balls. 628 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,640 It shouldn't take you five minutes. 629 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:54,640 You know, and there's good practice and there's bad practice, you know, and there's good, 630 00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:58,640 set up and bad set up, and if you don't if you don't have a good routine, I don't know 631 00:28:58,640 --> 00:28:59,640 why you're hitting the ball. 632 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:00,640 All right. 633 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:01,640 Yeah. 634 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:02,640 Yeah. 635 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:07,920 It it goes back to my analogy is always Steph Curry, who's arguably the best free throw 636 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:08,920 shooter ever. 637 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:14,240 But if you made Steph Curry bounce the ball twice before he shoots his free throw, he 638 00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:18,400 would miss because he's so ingrained into one bounce. 639 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:23,540 Basically spins the ball in his hands and then throws it up. 640 00:29:23,540 --> 00:29:30,520 So if you see people that are on TV doing it, I don't care girls, boys, whatever, there's 641 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:35,320 a reason why they're on TV or they're successful in their craft. 642 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,240 Baseball players are really good to watch, too. 643 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:42,020 Remember, I want Mark to say this name because he's going to say it in the perfect Massachusetts 644 00:29:42,020 --> 00:29:43,020 accent. 645 00:29:43,020 --> 00:29:44,020 I love it. 646 00:29:44,020 --> 00:29:45,020 The short. 647 00:29:45,020 --> 00:29:46,020 No, my got the power. 648 00:29:46,020 --> 00:29:47,020 There he is. 649 00:29:47,020 --> 00:29:48,020 No, my. 650 00:29:48,020 --> 00:29:49,020 Yeah. 651 00:29:49,020 --> 00:29:50,020 No, my. 652 00:29:50,020 --> 00:29:51,020 That's broken. 653 00:29:51,020 --> 00:29:52,020 Felt backwards. 654 00:29:52,020 --> 00:29:53,020 No, my. 655 00:29:53,020 --> 00:29:54,020 That's broken. 656 00:29:54,020 --> 00:29:55,020 No, my. 657 00:29:55,020 --> 00:29:58,200 That's why that's always a crowd favorite in Boston because everybody could say his name 658 00:29:58,200 --> 00:29:59,200 correctly. 659 00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:00,560 Oh, he would do the wrist thing. 660 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,760 I mean, what was the count on the wrist things? 661 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,600 How many times would he do that? 662 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,600 Oh, every, every, every pitch, every pitch, every pitch. 663 00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:11,840 You take the gloves off, put them back on, flip the switch. 664 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,320 And then he got he got a three thirty five. 665 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:15,320 That's it. 666 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:16,320 Yeah. 667 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:17,320 Yeah. 668 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:18,320 Very, very. 669 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:19,320 Yeah. 670 00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:22,120 So consistency would be and that was literally one of our first podcasts was kind of compression 671 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:24,520 and being consistent with your strike. 672 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,480 And we're going to you're going to hear that a lot throughout these times when we talk 673 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:32,800 because consistency defining consistency, but also being, you know, hey, having a pre-shot 674 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:34,400 routine like you're talking about. 675 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:39,240 The thing I think, too, Mark, is when I work with my students, I'm kind of amazed they 676 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:45,240 might have some type of pre-shot routine for their driver or their irons. 677 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:49,640 But then when they get to a wedge or a putter, it's almost abandoned or they do something 678 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:50,640 different. 679 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:51,640 Correct. 680 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:52,640 You know, yeah. 681 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:57,520 And it's the most important part, you know, the stroke constant. 682 00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:59,360 Yeah, they go to the quickest on the putt. 683 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:01,080 It just seems like they just get over it. 684 00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:02,120 They don't line it up. 685 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:03,440 They don't look at the hole. 686 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:08,360 They just actually they just look at the hole and pop it and don't read it. 687 00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:11,640 Don't kind of, you know, go behind the hole or anything, you know. 688 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:17,040 But they will sit on the driver and, you know, look behind it, line it up and, you know, 689 00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:20,840 put their club up in the air and, you know, act like they're, you know, getting that thing 690 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:21,840 down the line. 691 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:24,320 But then they just get up there to the putter and wave along. 692 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:25,320 Yeah. 693 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:26,320 Three wiggle. 694 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,520 And on the putting thing too, like they don't, again, watch TV. 695 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:34,560 You know, there's certain guys that even get a little bit criticized for kind of how long 696 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,160 they take before they actually make their putt. 697 00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:42,560 But those guys are kind of the one you're watching on Sunday afternoons because they're 698 00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:44,520 committed to what they're doing. 699 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,000 And they've got that routine. 700 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:50,440 And Tiger, Tiger wasn't the fastest putter, but he was super like he always looked at 701 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:51,440 it from different angles. 702 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:52,440 He did. 703 00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:54,080 But his routine, you could time his routine. 704 00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:57,800 Like when he got set over that ball to when he hit that stroke, I mean, you could put 705 00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:01,280 a stopwatch on it and it was pretty much dead on every time. 706 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:06,000 Now you get over some of your students and maybe it's 30 seconds, five seconds, two minutes, 707 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:11,800 who knows how, you know what it is, but there's no routine, you know, get in, do it. 708 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:12,800 Agreed. 709 00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:13,800 Yeah. 710 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,800 And I've seen, you know, Mark is one of the best putters I've ever been around, whether 711 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:17,800 he knows that or not. 712 00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:22,560 But he's got a super solid routine from the time he was 17 to the time that he's, you 713 00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:23,560 know, 56 or whatever. 714 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:25,360 Always been the same. 715 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:26,440 He changes putters a lot. 716 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:30,080 I'll give him that now lately. 717 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:36,560 But the routine has been consistent and always, you know, just a good follow through, good, 718 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:37,560 you know, good fundamentals. 719 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,080 Like the stance hasn't changed in 30 years. 720 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:42,880 The length of the stroke hasn't changed. 721 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,100 The shoulders move the same way. 722 00:32:45,100 --> 00:32:46,600 And there's a reason why he's a good putter. 723 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,160 And he's got confidence too. 724 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:52,720 I'm sure being up north, you guys had some winter time to really work on those putting 725 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:53,720 routines. 726 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,960 Because I always find those kids from the north can really putt very well. 727 00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:04,600 Me and Sean in the living room, dining room, upstairs, always putting, always putting. 728 00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:06,200 We had a little cup there. 729 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,200 We always putt with the cup. 730 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:09,200 Ten putters. 731 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,280 Chipping up and down the stairways. 732 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:13,080 We did a lot of inside golf. 733 00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:15,080 My mother put up with a lot. 734 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:16,080 I know that. 735 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,400 Or we would, you know, we did that. 736 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:23,880 We went to the, whenever the range was open up on route one, you'd have the heaters, which 737 00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,080 is again kind of the floor, you know, New England thing. 738 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,080 Or, you know, you'd have the heaters on you and they weren't making you too warm. 739 00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:30,840 But again, what are you going to do? 740 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,160 You're going to go try to hit it around and stuff. 741 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:35,640 So what's the year? 742 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:37,560 How many years apart are you two? 743 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:38,560 Five. 744 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:39,560 Five years. 745 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:40,560 Yeah. 746 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:41,560 Yeah. 747 00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:42,600 So we've played a lot of golf together. 748 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:43,600 Not enough. 749 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:44,600 But not enough. 750 00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:45,600 Not enough. 751 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:47,560 But it's always, always fun getting together with them. 752 00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:51,720 Hey, before we get going, one last thing I wanted to ask you in this particular podcast, 753 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:55,600 Mark, because I know we're going to do some more in the future. 754 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,320 What's your feedback on the PGA show and sort of how it's changed over the last kind of 755 00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:00,960 five years, 10 years? 756 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:02,480 COVID's affected it. 757 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:05,920 Does it change your buying habits up north versus what you've done in the past, that 758 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:06,920 type of thing? 759 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:12,920 So it's funny because, you know, the PGA show has evolved in different ways. 760 00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:18,720 You know, we also had, I remember that we had the collapse, financial collapse in 2007, 761 00:34:18,720 --> 00:34:19,720 2008. 762 00:34:19,720 --> 00:34:20,720 Right, yeah. 763 00:34:20,720 --> 00:34:21,720 And that was big. 764 00:34:21,720 --> 00:34:23,480 So that changed the golf show too. 765 00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:30,280 But you know, the golf show back in 2000, we had the Blues Brothers, you know, Jim Belushi, 766 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:31,280 not John. 767 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:34,680 And we were at the House of Blues, John, or something like that. 768 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:36,880 Yeah, I still got the hat. 769 00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:38,360 And that was super cool. 770 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,720 And they spent money like it was crazy. 771 00:34:40,720 --> 00:34:46,160 And then all of a sudden, you know, that 2008, 2009 time hit, companies couldn't afford to 772 00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:47,160 send their people. 773 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,720 So the show became super small. 774 00:34:49,720 --> 00:34:54,080 And, you know, and then, of course, COVID hit and became another thing. 775 00:34:54,080 --> 00:35:00,200 But I saw a big resurgence this year, I thought, John, you know, this year, 2023, I thought 776 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:01,200 it was a big resurgence. 777 00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:05,720 I thought, you know, even to see the pickleball, it was funny at the golf show. 778 00:35:05,720 --> 00:35:06,720 Yeah. 779 00:35:06,720 --> 00:35:12,000 You know, my buying habits have always been, you know, I like to see when I go to the golf 780 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:14,680 show, I like to see some of the newer stuff. 781 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:18,200 You know, unfortunately, I'm going to have to buy titles, golf balls, no matter what. 782 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,000 But I want to see what the new golf ball is. 783 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,000 I want to see, you know, I don't care what it is. 784 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:23,000 I want to see what's new, you know. 785 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,600 So I think that show gives you a lot of the newness. 786 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,960 But I have good relationships with my reps up here. 787 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:30,920 So I'll buy up here anyways. 788 00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:35,560 I also enjoy, of course, getting to see so many old friends in the business. 789 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:36,840 I'm 57 years old. 790 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,320 I still think I'm 35 years old. 791 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:43,320 I really feel like, you know, when I go down there, it's like, oh, it's old home week. 792 00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:44,720 You do get to see a lot of good guys. 793 00:35:44,720 --> 00:35:47,760 You see, you know, Scott Johnson from Oakley Country Club. 794 00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:48,760 I see Jeff Leonard. 795 00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:49,760 I see some other guys. 796 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:55,040 You know, my past, I'm like, oh, this is so much fun just for that, too. 797 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:57,080 I'm excited to see guys are still going. 798 00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:00,160 You know, COVID, of course, killed the show for a couple of years. 799 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,800 But like I said, I think it's resurged very well. 800 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,120 And I think they did a great job last year. 801 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:06,120 Yeah. 802 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:11,120 I think T-Mac, to our point now, you know, he's been in the area for 15 years being a 803 00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:17,560 PGA guy around here type of stuff and working in the program and myself as well. 804 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:19,840 There's a reason that the PGA show is in January. 805 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:20,840 It's geared towards you. 806 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:21,840 Yes. 807 00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:22,840 Yes. 808 00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,200 It's geared towards New England or to the north is what they always tell us. 809 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:29,840 That's why the new clubs come out in January and February because they're, you know, that 810 00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:37,400 buying segment is whatever you want to call it, bigger, but it's more economically feasible 811 00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:40,040 up north. 812 00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:43,120 The season's shorter, so they want to get the clubs out quicker. 813 00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:47,600 It's really, I'm going to say it word, hassle because it's a blessing to be able to go to 814 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:50,240 it because it's such a fun event. 815 00:36:50,240 --> 00:36:56,680 But it's very difficult for us as Florida golf pros to get away in January for four 816 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:57,680 days. 817 00:36:57,680 --> 00:36:58,680 Yeah. 818 00:36:58,680 --> 00:36:59,680 That's a very busy season for us right there. 819 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:00,680 Absolutely. 820 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:01,680 Absolutely. 821 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:02,680 Yeah. 822 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:03,680 Yeah. 823 00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:04,680 Yeah. 824 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:06,080 But it's just always been interesting. 825 00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:11,280 But yeah, some of those days when, like you said, the Bridgestones or whoever it was that 826 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:17,880 was sponsoring the House of Blues, they would take you out to lunch or dinner at the Peabody 827 00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,480 Hotel or we'd have a Burns Steakhouse or a Chocos. 828 00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:22,480 Texas State, Brazil. 829 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:23,480 Yeah. 830 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:24,480 Yeah. 831 00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:27,840 And now it's kind of, you know, we're pretty impartial on this. 832 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:32,160 I think that's part of our goal is to be impartial, to kind of just let the listener know what 833 00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,400 actually happens in the golf world. 834 00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,240 Yeah. 835 00:37:36,240 --> 00:37:38,040 The companies don't care now. 836 00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:39,040 They're making money anyways. 837 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:40,040 Absolutely. 838 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:42,080 So they don't really have to send. 839 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,520 And some of those displays and some of those, you know, sending the people there was, they 840 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,600 would tell you it cost a million dollars to send their people there. 841 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:50,960 But they don't really care now. 842 00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:55,240 I think they've kind of, all kind of, since COVID really forced their platform online 843 00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:58,120 now, especially to the younger crowd. 844 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:01,560 When I see that, I see a lot of the younger people coming, you know, after COVID, they 845 00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:02,720 really got hooked on golf. 846 00:38:02,720 --> 00:38:09,480 So a lot of the product is online for them, geared towards them where, you know, I am 847 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:13,160 seeing in the pro shops, especially down here, less product, less shirts. 848 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:15,400 It's more like if you want that, we can order it for you. 849 00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:19,800 You can do this, you know, other than before it was. 850 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:20,800 Yeah. 851 00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:24,600 And the, and also even like TMAC just talked about, you know, you'll see some kind of like, 852 00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:30,080 if a, if a company wants to get a club out quickly, they'll just do a Instagram post 853 00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:34,760 on it or they'll just do a, you know, they'll kind of put it out there. 854 00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,880 Like they don't have to make a specific, okay, we're going to come out in January with it. 855 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:43,880 No, they just do a, you know, a, you know, advertisement blast and that's it. 856 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,360 And they don't really, there's no impersonal with it anymore. 857 00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:48,840 It's no like, Hey, let's go see the pro or anything like that. 858 00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:49,840 They just do a blast now. 859 00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,680 And then when you get the people calling you saying, Hey, I want to get this new club and 860 00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:54,720 you know nothing about it. 861 00:38:54,720 --> 00:38:58,400 And most of the time the rep can't get it to you until, you know, much later. 862 00:38:58,400 --> 00:38:59,400 Until January. 863 00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:00,400 Right. 864 00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:01,400 Yeah. 865 00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:02,400 Yep. 866 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:03,400 All right, Mark. 867 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:04,400 Well, Hey, great talking to you as always. 868 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:05,400 Yes. 869 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:06,400 Thank you, Mark. 870 00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:07,400 Certainly appreciate it. 871 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:08,400 I appreciate you guys. 872 00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,720 And I look forward to the next one and we'll do, we'll even have a better one next time. 873 00:39:11,720 --> 00:39:12,720 I appreciate it. 874 00:39:12,720 --> 00:39:13,720 Thanks for everything guys. 875 00:39:13,720 --> 00:39:14,720 Sounds good, man. 876 00:39:14,720 --> 00:39:15,720 Thank you. 877 00:39:15,720 --> 00:39:16,720 Thank you. 878 00:39:16,720 --> 00:39:18,880 All right, everybody want to say thank you want to give a special shout out to Mark Klotz. 879 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,480 Thank you so much for joining us on this podcast. 880 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:24,720 And my cohost Sean Klotz, thank you from Swing Theory Golf. 881 00:39:24,720 --> 00:39:25,720 Thank you. 882 00:39:25,720 --> 00:39:26,720 And keep teeing them up. 883 00:39:26,720 --> 00:39:27,720 Talk to you guys later. 884 00:39:27,720 --> 00:39:28,720 Take care. 885 00:39:28,720 --> 00:39:36,640 Thank you for tuning in and teeing off with Swing Theory Golf. 886 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:41,080 Keep swinging, keep improving and stay tuned for more exciting episodes. 887 00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:51,280 This is Tim McElveen signing off.