1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,400 Welcome to Global Outpouring. 2 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:11,900 I'm Philip Bus. 3 00:00:11,900 --> 00:00:14,220 And I'm Sharon Bus. 4 00:00:14,220 --> 00:00:19,820 We have very special guests with us today, and we're going to talk about something that 5 00:00:19,820 --> 00:00:25,740 is so important for this nation especially, and really for all the world. 6 00:00:25,740 --> 00:00:40,800 It has to do with who we are and how we live and whether we have freedom or not. 7 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:45,100 I would like to welcome David and Sigi Oblander to be with us today. 8 00:00:45,100 --> 00:00:47,960 This is really a special treat for us. 9 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:53,260 We're really grateful that you've joined us today, and I just want to give people an opportunity 10 00:00:53,260 --> 00:00:56,160 to learn more about your ministry. 11 00:00:56,160 --> 00:01:01,520 David, can you give us some specifics, your website and that sort of thing, and maybe 12 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:04,400 a little bit about the books that Sigi's written? 13 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:06,320 Yes, sure. 14 00:01:06,320 --> 00:01:08,560 We have several books. 15 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:12,880 Sigi has a devotional book which is full of teaching. 16 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:18,140 It was published in South Africa, and it's really a daily format, but sermons that she's 17 00:01:18,140 --> 00:01:19,320 preached over the years. 18 00:01:19,320 --> 00:01:23,240 It's really been a book to uplift people and encourage a deeper walk. 19 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:28,520 It's full of a lot of concentrated stuff, something you have to just read a little and 20 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:29,520 think about. 21 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:34,320 Then she has her life story, how she lived in East Berlin as a young teenager before 22 00:01:34,320 --> 00:01:38,480 they escaped, really a story of how their family was preserved during this time and 23 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:43,720 how they lived under the oppression of communism and how God finally delivered them and gave 24 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,680 them the ability to get out. 25 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:53,400 There are Bible studies, several of those, others, and we have a book by Sigi's brother 26 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:59,280 whom she got saved through which talks about the ability to go from poverty to our destiny 27 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:04,480 and how God makes a way and gives us the ability to use gifts through our faith in Him and 28 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:09,920 through our personalities to really be successful and to use that, what He gives us, to help 29 00:02:09,920 --> 00:02:11,000 the kingdom of God. 30 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:16,800 So it's a really uplifting story in how God brought a man from poverty really into a place 31 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:20,080 of success and how He poured it back into the kingdom. 32 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:22,240 It's a really great book and we love him. 33 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:25,440 He's a dear man of God, Sigi's oldest brother. 34 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:26,920 And those are several things. 35 00:02:26,920 --> 00:02:36,960 Our webpage is called just SigiOblander.com, S-I-G-I-O-B-L-A-N-D-E-R.com. 36 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:38,400 That's our webpage. 37 00:02:38,400 --> 00:02:41,080 If you type in that, you'll get it one way or the other. 38 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:42,680 We're situated in Atlanta. 39 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:44,640 We travel 10 months out of the year. 40 00:02:44,640 --> 00:02:45,640 Under normal circumstances. 41 00:02:45,640 --> 00:02:48,240 Under normal circumstances, yeah. 42 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:53,280 So we're thankful for what God has done over the years and we do a lot of work overseas 43 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:55,220 as well as the United States. 44 00:02:55,220 --> 00:02:57,440 And so how could people reach you? 45 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:01,000 Is there a place to write to on that website? 46 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,160 Yes, there is. 47 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:07,380 On our website, you can make comments or you can make donations, whatever you want. 48 00:03:07,380 --> 00:03:09,760 You can order books and CDs. 49 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:11,300 It's all available there. 50 00:03:11,300 --> 00:03:12,600 And they can email you there? 51 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:13,600 Yes. 52 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:14,600 Okay. 53 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:15,600 Very good. 54 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:16,600 Thank you. 55 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:23,520 Sigi has been, well, she was one of the founders of this ministry and she has been a dear friend 56 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:25,300 for many, many years. 57 00:03:25,300 --> 00:03:29,280 She was one of the first people that I met from this ministry. 58 00:03:29,280 --> 00:03:35,480 One of the first people I heard and the anointing that was in her life so captivated me that 59 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:38,280 I, all I could do was cry. 60 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,340 And Sigi is from Germany. 61 00:03:41,340 --> 00:03:43,940 She was born in Berlin. 62 00:03:43,940 --> 00:03:46,560 It was during World War II, right? 63 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:47,560 Yep. 64 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:48,560 Okay. 65 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:53,120 And after World War II, there were some political, what do they call it? 66 00:03:53,120 --> 00:03:54,560 Geopolitical changes. 67 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:55,560 What happened? 68 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:01,360 David, can you give us a clue what happened politically and how Germany was kind of divided? 69 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:06,960 Yes, well, after the war, when the Allies won the war, Germany was divided, East and 70 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:07,960 West Germany. 71 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:12,800 But in the middle of the country was Berlin and that was also divided, East and West Berlin. 72 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:17,920 And Sigi happened to live in East Berlin, which was occupied by the Russians. 73 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:20,080 The Allies occupied West Berlin. 74 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:26,520 So it was to get to Berlin, you'd have to drive through the country, East Berlin, Germany 75 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:28,120 to get to Berlin. 76 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:32,720 So it was like an island in the middle of everything, in the middle of Germany. 77 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:36,240 And that's the life and that's the situation politically. 78 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,520 So it was really a country divided. 79 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:39,520 Wow. 80 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:41,160 And not only a country divided, but a city divided. 81 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:42,160 Yes. 82 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:45,840 But it was a city that was an island in the middle of a communist country. 83 00:04:45,840 --> 00:04:46,840 That's right. 84 00:04:46,840 --> 00:04:47,840 Wow. 85 00:04:47,840 --> 00:04:52,720 And without America, we would never have survived because the first thing the Russians did, 86 00:04:52,720 --> 00:05:00,400 they wanted to cut it off and the American took their planes and they sent food in and 87 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:05,160 struck parcels from the airplanes so we could survive. 88 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:08,840 So they couldn't really block West Berlin off. 89 00:05:08,840 --> 00:05:12,720 And that was our salvation because we would be smugglers. 90 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:16,280 We go from the East to the West to survive. 91 00:05:16,280 --> 00:05:18,360 And we had influence before. 92 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:23,800 That's why the wall of Berlin was built because every day thousands of people escaped from 93 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:25,040 the East to the West. 94 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:26,920 Well, why would they want to escape? 95 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,200 Isn't communism a good place, good kind of a place to live? 96 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:31,200 That's what you think. 97 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:38,960 It's in theory, it's a good place, what people think, but not in practical ways because communism 98 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:42,760 is something which takes your freedom into your liberty. 99 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:49,680 Now I went 10 years to a communistic school and in these schools we had Russian teachers. 100 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:55,920 We were the first generation who actually got brainwashed because we were not trained 101 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,480 in socialism or communism. 102 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:05,560 So the greatest thing was for the socialists to change a whole youth, a whole generation 103 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:09,200 to think like they wanted us to think. 104 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:13,520 So what they would do, we would go to brainwashing sessions. 105 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:21,760 And these brainwashing sessions would be intense times of indoctrination where we would take 106 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:29,800 Marxism and Leninism and all these things to transform our thinking. 107 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:36,560 Because you can see today too, it's not they don't want you to think, they just want you 108 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,840 to think in a certain way. 109 00:06:38,840 --> 00:06:42,120 They don't want you to think yourself. 110 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:46,360 They want that you think the way they teach. 111 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:52,400 And they would say to us, since we were little, my mother and father were Christians so we 112 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:59,600 were not in a party, and they would say to us that we will never go to high school, we 113 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:05,320 will never go to university because they will not raise an enemy of the state. 114 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:11,520 And we were actually blackmailed and they would say we're enemies of the state. 115 00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:17,520 So because we were enemy of the state, that's why we had spies follow us. 116 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:24,600 And everybody in Germany, East Germany was one of the greatest nation or country where 117 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,160 every second or third neighbor was a spy. 118 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:33,680 And what they did, they broke down the trust because we didn't trust any neighbor. 119 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:39,920 We didn't trust any, not even sometimes our relatives, because the indoctrination was 120 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:48,720 so strong that it actually broke down natural feelings and natural bondings in people's 121 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:49,720 lives. 122 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:50,720 Wow. 123 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:55,200 So what happened is eventually the teachers would come to our house. 124 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:56,200 Right to your house? 125 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:57,200 Yeah. 126 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:01,680 And they would talk to our parents so that we would become communists. 127 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:07,320 So eventually my mom and dad came, gave in because we could not do sports. 128 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:10,280 We were cut out from doing sports. 129 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,000 We were not allowed to do anything. 130 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:16,100 We were like the outcast of the school. 131 00:08:16,100 --> 00:08:22,000 And the pressure became so hard that we, my sister and I, we became young pioneers. 132 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,500 And that's a youth communist party. 133 00:08:25,500 --> 00:08:33,520 And as we became young pioneers, we became like clay supposedly in their hand so that 134 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:34,760 they could form us. 135 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:41,200 Now, one of the things they would teach us for many, many indoctrination sessions is 136 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:42,960 how to conquer America. 137 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:43,960 Really? 138 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:44,960 Yes. 139 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:53,160 How to conquer America and how to destroy Israel because it just, it even just got formed 140 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,440 in order to destroy. 141 00:08:55,440 --> 00:09:00,600 And they said to us in many of these sessions, they said America is too strong. 142 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:03,080 We never conquer it from without. 143 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:06,120 We will conquer America from within. 144 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:12,520 Even if it takes years and years and years, we are going to get a people from within who 145 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:18,640 will conquer what America is or under foundation of America. 146 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:20,160 We didn't know the foundation. 147 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,240 I didn't know the constitution. 148 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:24,200 I did not understand liberty. 149 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:33,480 We just knew that America was a nation which, and the flag was a flag which would be a sign 150 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,200 of freedom and liberty to us. 151 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:39,280 So we would risk our lives sometimes. 152 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:47,400 We had a radio up in the attic and we would go in the attic and they had in a German language 153 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:49,720 a voice of America. 154 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:51,920 And the neighbors are not allowed to hear it. 155 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:58,880 So we would go up there and we would risk our freedom to actually listen because we're 156 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:02,240 so hungry for freedom and for liberty. 157 00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:10,200 And I, you know, when I came here as a young woman, I would go to many schools and I would 158 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:18,080 preach in many universities and I would see that the young people are trying to awaken 159 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:19,600 them what freedom is. 160 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:24,240 And I remember one time I was in one of the universities, I think it was somewhere in 161 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:25,500 Nebraska. 162 00:10:25,500 --> 00:10:30,680 And when I came out, that was in the 70s, when I came out of the university, all my 163 00:10:30,680 --> 00:10:32,160 tires were slashed. 164 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:38,520 And you can see that they start working the indoctrination in this nation. 165 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:40,360 And that's what happened. 166 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:41,600 You can see it now. 167 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:47,880 If you actually have a people raised up in this nation who don't is not a part of America 168 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:48,880 anymore. 169 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:50,080 Yeah, it's true. 170 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:54,640 And I understand that there are those that have this mindset now. 171 00:10:54,640 --> 00:11:00,000 They've been raised in this here in this country, but they don't seem to have awakened to the 172 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:06,440 fact that communism and socialism have actually failed in so many nations where it started 173 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:07,440 out. 174 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:08,440 Yeah. 175 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,640 But you see, this communism now is a little different than over there as much more as 176 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,920 we've had was brutal communism. 177 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:22,600 If they like China now or like Cuba, they would just take you in prisons and you get 178 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:23,600 indoctrination. 179 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:29,920 I mean, before we escaped, then we had somebody come and tell us that we're an enemy of the 180 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:34,320 state and we're on a blacklist and that eventually we escaped. 181 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:40,740 Now here in America, this communism and socialism is more sophisticated. 182 00:11:40,740 --> 00:11:44,000 It comes in a way that people don't even know. 183 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:45,920 It's like a frog. 184 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:53,720 It's in water, in cold water, and you put the boiling on and then that frog doesn't 185 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:54,720 jump out. 186 00:11:54,720 --> 00:12:00,040 We had boiling water put on us and we tried to jump out. 187 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:05,320 Here it's cold water and they get so used to that they don't even know that they are 188 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:06,320 boiled. 189 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:15,640 But don't you think like what we've seen up in Seattle where they took over this portion 190 00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:24,080 of the city, don't you think that what we saw there is kind of like what we would expect 191 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:26,120 if that whole thing was able to take over? 192 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:32,240 Yes, that will be because then it comes that when they're in power, then they will come 193 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:38,440 after the people who are the implorables or the ones who don't fit and then we will have 194 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:50,000 the same as China or re-education where people are going to be re-educated or you suffer 195 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:56,520 or maybe you get the IRS after you or some systems and things and they're going to put 196 00:12:56,520 --> 00:13:00,120 pressure on you and they're going to put pressure on the church. 197 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:06,360 The pressure will be that you say things who don't fit into society and you're going to 198 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:08,360 suffer for it. 199 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,040 Wow. 200 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:16,960 So where we are right now, what do you see is what needs to happen in order for that 201 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:17,960 to not happen? 202 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:22,800 Well, I can see in churches it's not just that people are safe. 203 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:28,360 Many people are safe but their thinking does not change and to understand or to get your 204 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:34,680 thinking changed you almost have to have certain experiences in your life because it says that 205 00:13:34,680 --> 00:13:38,880 experience brings hope and hope doesn't make a shame. 206 00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:45,800 So some of us we have to actually experience things in our life to have new hope and that 207 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:53,920 hope has to come into our perception of our mind the way we see things in our life. 208 00:13:53,920 --> 00:14:00,720 So I realized when I came back we were evacuated from South Africa and as I came back I was 209 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:01,720 really... 210 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:02,720 When was that? 211 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:03,720 In April this year. 212 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:05,720 Yeah, because of the lockdown. 213 00:14:05,720 --> 00:14:13,920 Because of COVID and we got locked up and so the government evacuated us and we came 214 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:20,880 here and as I came here and the riots are starting, I tell you something, it shook me 215 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:28,200 to the bottom of my soul because I did not think that I would see that so drastically 216 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:29,200 in my lifetime. 217 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:35,700 I know it would happen because of the way people perceive things and think and that 218 00:14:35,700 --> 00:14:37,940 freedom doesn't mean much. 219 00:14:37,940 --> 00:14:44,440 In these days people don't want to be free, people want to be secure and I realized that 220 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:48,400 people don't understand freedom because you can... 221 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:55,720 Look at the birds, we have some friends who have parrots, big huge parrots and when you 222 00:14:55,720 --> 00:15:02,960 have a parrot for 30 years, they live 70 years, something like that, you have a parrot or 223 00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:07,640 whatever you call these birds in a cage for 30 years. 224 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:11,160 Now how are you going to teach that parrot to be free? 225 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:12,160 He's tame. 226 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:16,320 Now you see the gospel has not made us free, it has made us tame. 227 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:17,320 We're tame. 228 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:18,800 We don't know how to fly. 229 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:25,000 We're just happy to be in the cage because our message was that God's blessing us, it's 230 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:33,160 our prosperity, it's our security, it's our lifestyle is more important than life. 231 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:37,160 So we don't understand life just because we have a lifestyle. 232 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:43,480 We can eat and drink and do the things around here and there and the church has promoted 233 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:48,480 that so that many of us are tame in the gospel. 234 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:50,400 We don't know how to fly. 235 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:56,880 We don't know how to dare things and we lose our priority and I have to check my own life. 236 00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:03,400 I mean in a certain age of your life when you become secure and the Lord speaks about 237 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:05,600 that you must lose your life to gain it. 238 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:12,280 Now that process of losing has an effect in your life and you have to become free because 239 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:18,080 you can't lose without being free because you will hang on and you're attached to things 240 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:21,920 and you will wrestle for things and fight for things. 241 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:28,640 So I realized when you see and use that example of that bird and you open the cage and you 242 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:31,240 say fly, they don't fly. 243 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:34,720 They don't even want, actually that one bird would take all time. 244 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:39,920 You open the cage door, it shuts the door because it doesn't know what's freedom. 245 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:40,920 It never flown. 246 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:41,920 It's a bird. 247 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:46,760 It's never flown but it's been in the cage all its life and some of us are like that 248 00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:47,760 as Christians. 249 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:50,080 We don't know how to fly. 250 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:51,880 We have a lifestyle. 251 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:55,360 You know and I always use the beaver too. 252 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:56,640 You know what the beaver does? 253 00:16:56,640 --> 00:17:00,160 He takes a flow and makes a lake and that's what we do. 254 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:05,280 We take a flow when the revival comes and the move of God comes and we take the flow 255 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:11,080 and we create a lake where we can live the lifestyle, protect the lifestyle, love the 256 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:15,040 lifestyle and do what we need to do. 257 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:21,040 But now what the Lord does now, I think in America, in that generation right now, that 258 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:28,080 has to be an awakening and that awakening is not just to see miracles and signs. 259 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:35,160 That awakening has to wake us up from our nightmares and dreams and ideas so that we 260 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:41,360 can see as He sees and knows as He knows so that we can become a free people otherwise 261 00:17:41,360 --> 00:17:46,640 we're going to lose it just like the children of Israel. 262 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:56,480 They have 430 years crying for liberty and become what a generation who was an evil generation 263 00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:00,920 who didn't know how to walk in the freedom and liberty of God's Spirit. 264 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:06,960 Yeah, they didn't know, it's like they came out of Egypt but Egypt hadn't gotten out 265 00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:07,960 of them. 266 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:14,720 They had food given to them, they had a cloud by day to protect them from the elements, 267 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:18,160 they had fire by night to protect them from the cold. 268 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:24,080 They were protected and taken care of and they were secure but they were complaining 269 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:25,080 and moaning. 270 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,520 And they could not conquer the giants. 271 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:28,520 That was the problem. 272 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:29,520 Yes. 273 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:30,520 It was their mindset. 274 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:33,960 And that's what happens right now in America. 275 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:39,920 See, people, I think the awakening has to be, has to be converted. 276 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:45,240 Like the Lord said to Peter, when thou art converted, strengthen your brethren. 277 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:51,240 And I think that awakening has to bring a conversion that we see life from just a different 278 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:54,840 aspect as He sees, as He feels. 279 00:18:54,840 --> 00:19:01,760 And I think the key is that we love as He loves and that we know as He knows and feels 280 00:19:01,760 --> 00:19:04,840 as He feels and hates as He hates. 281 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:05,840 That's significant. 282 00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:12,600 Very significant because we love, we think about Him, we love things about Him but we 283 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,360 don't love like He loves and does as He does. 284 00:19:16,360 --> 00:19:19,360 We just don't know how to do that. 285 00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:25,480 And we're pretty flippant with the Almighty God who created us. 286 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:33,000 We don't really have much of a reverence for Him and for His presence because we don't 287 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:34,000 know Him. 288 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,880 But you know, when Gwen and I, the first thing is when we, the first time we took the Bible 289 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:45,280 into Russia, I mean, we take great risks. 290 00:19:45,280 --> 00:19:50,760 This is how, do you tell them how God, David, how the Lord changed their life just on that 291 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:51,760 one trip? 292 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:54,840 Yes, that was a life-changing trip. 293 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:59,640 In 1976 you had a tour, Gwen Shaw and Sigi were the leaders. 294 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:01,040 Yeah, I wanted to go on that one. 295 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:02,040 Were you in that? 296 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:03,040 You didn't come. 297 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,800 I wanted to so badly. 298 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:12,400 So you know, here I am raised in Montana and never been on an airplane, very, you know, 299 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:16,340 lived a very simple, easy life. 300 00:20:16,340 --> 00:20:21,360 But when I had a burden to go on this trip, God put it in my heart to go because I'd heard 301 00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:23,380 that there were things happening there. 302 00:20:23,380 --> 00:20:25,160 And so He made the way possible. 303 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:30,320 I got there and I'd never really felt such fear in my life. 304 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:39,140 As I felt people watching us, as I felt people being manipulated, there was just the atmosphere 305 00:20:39,140 --> 00:20:40,780 that I wasn't prepared for. 306 00:20:40,780 --> 00:20:43,860 It shook me to the core. 307 00:20:43,860 --> 00:20:48,200 And as Sigi and others went out every night in the middle of the winter to bring Bibles 308 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:52,400 to people, I knew that they were taking a risk. 309 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:58,240 And the whole time we were doing things that was legally against their law. 310 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:03,880 As we entered the border, I remember going into Russia, we were, first of all, already 311 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:05,720 found out in England. 312 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,320 And as we were in England, they said, oh, you shouldn't go there. 313 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:14,600 But they said, well, we feel like God wants us to bring the life, the word of life, the 314 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:15,840 Bible into the people of Russia. 315 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:19,420 I said, OK, well, we can't guarantee your safety. 316 00:21:19,420 --> 00:21:22,680 So they let us back on the plane in London. 317 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:27,120 And we flew four hours in Russia and I could see everybody was very ashen white in their 318 00:21:27,120 --> 00:21:29,360 face and praying up a storm. 319 00:21:29,360 --> 00:21:33,700 We got into the airport and everybody was going through so nicely. 320 00:21:33,700 --> 00:21:39,360 We were told not to have any Bible, any material in our pockets, only head vests underneath. 321 00:21:39,360 --> 00:21:44,120 It was the middle of winter and we looked 20, 30 pounds heavier than our normal weight, 322 00:21:44,120 --> 00:21:45,720 but they didn't know that. 323 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:51,320 And so everybody was going through great and then finally one guy in the tour of about 324 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:56,760 40 people, he didn't take, he had a song book, a Christian song book in his pocket. 325 00:21:56,760 --> 00:22:04,760 And they saw that and the immigration officers, they said, hey, this is this anti-Soviet literature. 326 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:06,560 Search the Americans, search the Americans. 327 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:11,200 So everybody that was left in the group after that was was searched. 328 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,040 And if they had Bibles on them, they would have been found. 329 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:16,200 Unfortunately, no other ones had it. 330 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,820 Only person left to go through was Sigi. 331 00:22:18,820 --> 00:22:22,560 But in God's wisdom, she still had a West German passport. 332 00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:24,520 They didn't connect her with the group. 333 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:26,960 So she was loaded with Bibles. 334 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:33,800 She was 40 pounds heavier looking and she went through scot-free and I said, my God, 335 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:35,400 You're even bigger than the KGB. 336 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:38,880 I remember saying that You're even bigger than the KGB. 337 00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:44,320 My faith was just illuminated and it was really a faith and a whole week was a week of fear 338 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,400 and anxiety. 339 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:51,720 And I remember going to the state run church there and we went there and we sat in a service 340 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:55,120 that was pretty much controlled by the state. 341 00:22:55,120 --> 00:22:57,520 And there were two women there sitting. 342 00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,560 You know, people came. 343 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:04,560 There's a hunger for the word of God, whether it was a state manipulated thing or not. 344 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,680 People there, their word of God was read. 345 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:08,720 And these two ladies were not far from me. 346 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:15,560 And I looked in their eyes and in their eyes, I saw I can't describe it like a joy, a depth 347 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:19,200 of a well of joy that I know I didn't have. 348 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,320 And I said, God, I want that. 349 00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:22,320 Wow. 350 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:24,200 I want that. 351 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:31,920 So from that point on, it wakened something new in me and something I'd never seen. 352 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:35,040 And when I came back to America, of course, the first thing I did was go on the ground 353 00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:38,520 and kiss the ground and said, thank you for freedom, Lord. 354 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:39,920 Thank you for freedom. 355 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:45,320 But those are the kind of things that change us when we allow ourselves to be in situations 356 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:50,320 where we're out of our comfort zone and God really worked in my life. 357 00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:55,160 That was a life changing moment and really what brought me into full time ministry eventually. 358 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:56,280 Wow. 359 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:57,280 That's a tremendous testimony. 360 00:23:57,280 --> 00:23:58,280 I hadn't heard that part. 361 00:23:58,280 --> 00:23:59,280 Oh, no. 362 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:00,280 No, I never heard that. 363 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:01,280 Wow. 364 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:05,320 You were right there when it all happened. 365 00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:09,000 I was actually just finishing high school at that point. 366 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:10,120 Oh, you did? 367 00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:15,220 And then at the next world convention, let's see, that was 76. 368 00:24:15,220 --> 00:24:17,280 That was the first world convention. 369 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:23,880 So by that time, Sister Gwen had written the booklet Destination Moscow and told some of 370 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:26,320 the stories about that going on. 371 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:27,320 Oh, she did. 372 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:28,320 I read that one. 373 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:31,760 I'm sure you read it back then. 374 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:33,640 I think it's gone out of print long ago. 375 00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:41,720 But these are things that were formative for me because when I first met you, you were 376 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,220 a Bible smuggler. 377 00:24:43,220 --> 00:24:50,160 And that was the hook that caught me because I wanted to hear about these ladies that smuggled 378 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:51,960 Bibles behind the Aaron curtain. 379 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,680 I don't think you and David weren't married yet. 380 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:56,880 No, we married afterwards. 381 00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:57,880 Yeah. 382 00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:58,880 Afterwards. 383 00:24:58,880 --> 00:24:59,880 Yeah. 384 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:03,840 So, but my sister had invited me to come and hear these ladies that smuggled Bibles behind 385 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:04,840 the Aaron curtain. 386 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,040 I thought, wow, that sounds like adventure. 387 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:08,900 I'd like to hear them. 388 00:25:08,900 --> 00:25:10,520 I want to know what's going on. 389 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:11,520 This sounds good. 390 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:15,120 And when you preach, you didn't preach anything about smuggling Bibles. 391 00:25:15,120 --> 00:25:23,200 But there was something in your anointing that was calling to my spiritual DNA that 392 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:29,480 was saying, there's something about these women that has something to do with me. 393 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:30,480 And all I could do was cry. 394 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:31,480 It was amazing. 395 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:32,480 It was amazing. 396 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:34,480 How things come together. 397 00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:35,480 Yeah. 398 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:36,480 Yeah. 399 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:37,480 Amazing. 400 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:38,480 It really was amazing. 401 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:42,160 And here we are, something like 45 years later. 402 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:44,560 And these are formative things. 403 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:51,040 But we had an understanding in those days of the potential of socialism coming to this 404 00:25:51,040 --> 00:26:00,240 nation and communism taking over that slow frog warming way. 405 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:01,240 And now we're seeing it. 406 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:06,400 Now you mentioned something about how it affected you when you saw the rioting. 407 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:07,400 Oh, yeah. 408 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:10,280 It affected me because I thought, where am I going now? 409 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:14,800 Suddenly, I know here it was always my dream to be in America. 410 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,280 And I never thought it would come in my lifetime. 411 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:24,200 I knew eventually maybe my kids and grandkids would deal with it, but not me. 412 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:25,200 Because where we go now? 413 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:26,200 I've been everywhere. 414 00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:27,200 I've lived there. 415 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:29,560 I've done this and done that. 416 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:32,640 And it actually affected me physically. 417 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:37,040 One day my blood pressure was up to 200 something. 418 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:39,720 And David had to take me to emergency. 419 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:46,240 So I realized that something was stirred up within me that America was such a, what would 420 00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:53,800 you say, price to me, which I dreamt about, wanted to be and be a part of it. 421 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,600 And I realized that I had to release it. 422 00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:58,240 And it was a process again. 423 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:04,040 It is not just something which come because that was my heart's desire since I've been 424 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:11,920 in a trial to be in this nation because to us this nation was exceptional, was different, 425 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,080 was something God has done. 426 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:20,160 And you can't even explain it today to people because people don't see America the same 427 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:22,240 way as we have seen it. 428 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:25,000 No, they don't. 429 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,760 It's a viewpoint from within the pot, where the frog is in the cold water. 430 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:35,480 But see, when you think of it, now we lived under Russian occupation. 431 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:38,480 Now the teachers tell us the Russians are your friend. 432 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:44,280 Now they raped us, they robbed us, they dominate us. 433 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:46,640 And they say now America's your enemy. 434 00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:48,480 And we come over to the West. 435 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,080 Now that was our privilege that we could do that. 436 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,760 Before the wall of Berlin was built, we just went back and forth as kids. 437 00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,920 Ten years old, six years old, we went on our own. 438 00:27:59,920 --> 00:28:07,040 And we would come in streets and see, that's why I seen the first black American and black 439 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:08,040 soldiers. 440 00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:14,800 And they would come and put their hands in their pockets and give us chocolate and give 441 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:16,480 us candies. 442 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:24,680 And there was a love born because of these guys who just gave to us that something happened 443 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:29,960 within, doesn't matter what they said, we knew that America wasn't our enemy. 444 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,360 And Russia wasn't our friend. 445 00:28:32,360 --> 00:28:35,400 Because the experience gave hope. 446 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:36,520 There you go. 447 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:37,760 There you go. 448 00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:39,320 You were being told lies. 449 00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:40,320 Yes. 450 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,360 But your experience was giving you truth. 451 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:44,520 Truth, right. 452 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:49,960 And that led you on this longing journey that brought you here to America. 453 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:50,960 Absolutely. 454 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:51,960 Yes. 455 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:57,520 And it was the pursuit of freedom that really brought you here. 456 00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:58,520 Yes. 457 00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,600 That was my greatest cry, to know what freedom is. 458 00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:04,080 I wanted to always be free. 459 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:09,360 Free from, and then when I became a Christian, I thought, now I'm not free either because 460 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:16,040 German religion was so strong that I started another journey to find freedom. 461 00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:20,440 Well why don't we talk about that next week on the next podcast? 462 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:21,440 All right. 463 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:22,440 Sure, I'd love to. 464 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:23,440 All right. 465 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:24,440 All right. 466 00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:28,480 But freedom in Christ is really... 467 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:29,480 Only free. 468 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:30,480 It's the only freedom. 469 00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:31,480 It's only freedom. 470 00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:37,920 Because David, you saw that those people in Russia had a freedom that was inside that 471 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:39,080 you didn't have. 472 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:40,080 Right. 473 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:41,080 Right, exactly. 474 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:42,800 But you have to fight for that freedom all the time. 475 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:44,160 It's born from within. 476 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,280 But you have to defend it all the time. 477 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:48,280 It's true. 478 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:49,280 All the time. 479 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:52,040 Only I can take it away from you. 480 00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:53,200 That's the truth. 481 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:58,040 So we're going to take this up again next week. 482 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:04,120 And in the meantime, press in for the reality of freedom. 483 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:06,120 What is freedom really all about? 484 00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:14,040 And if you know somebody who is pressing towards this socialism thing and this communism thing, 485 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:18,960 believing that it's the best way to go, share this podcast with them. 486 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:24,040 Because they need to know the truth and the truth will make them free. 487 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:25,040 Yeah. 488 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:26,040 Amen. 489 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:33,880 If you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, rate, and review this podcast on iTunes or 490 00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:35,880 wherever you listen to podcasts. 491 00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:41,120 Your review helps the show reach more people and spread the good news of God's global outpouring. 492 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,660 Check out our website at globaloutpouring.org. 493 00:30:43,660 --> 00:30:47,820 To find out more information, connect with us, get a link to our Facebook page and our 494 00:30:47,820 --> 00:30:48,820 YouTube channel. 495 00:30:48,820 --> 00:30:52,880 You can browse our online bookstore for amazing anointed material. 496 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:55,580 Until next time, this is Sharon Bus. 497 00:30:55,580 --> 00:30:56,840 And I'm Philip Bus. 498 00:30:56,840 --> 00:31:19,840 God bless you with this overwhelming loving presence.