Coming up on The 40s Formula. My dad passed away
when I was five, so things changed and their
focus was, oh, you need to study properly, you
need to become an engineer. i was like oh you
know that's not me this is not like a road this
is a roller coaster like upside down and like
i loop the loop okay every day is a challenge
every day is like something unexpected tell them
how we need to use the sari to make a chemo like
are you crazy like who's gonna wear that in india
there are about 650 million women And even if
half the population, about 330 million women,
has only one sari, that's about 1 ,650 ,000 ,000
meters of fabric where you can go around the
equator 41 times. It's an ecosystem where sustainability,
music, fashion, and experiences are all aligned
in one place. Everybody has their opinion. Opinion
is... It doesn't matter because your vision is
different. You have to love yourself really hard.
You have no spare parts. You have no substitution.
It's only you, your mind, your body, and your
soul. Just follow your heart because your heart
is never wrong. Beatrice Nannini, originally
from Italy, is a Singapore -based fashion entrepreneur
and luxury retail leader. Her partner, Naveen
Murugan. hails from India and is a sound designer
and music producer. Together, they co -founded
the eco -conscious fashion label Rajarani. Rajarani
is an ecosystem that blends sustainable fashion,
music, and community. The brand is known for
its signature old sari kimonos and vibrant apparel
that celebrates color and creativity. Rooted
in the fusion of music, fashion, and mindful
craftsmanship, Rajarani embodies a contemporary
and conscious lifestyle the 40s formula the 40s
formula the 40s formula hosted by Jasmine Dillon
integrated health strategist specializing in
gut health hormones and midlife well -being and
Amanda Lim director of Lift Clinic and a leading
expert in female strength and metabolism named
one of CNA's top podcasts and winner of the 2025
Asia Podcast Awards in the Best Health and Wellness
Podcast category. The 40s Formula is your no
fluff, science meets real life guide to thriving
in your 40s. This episode is about finding your
rhythm again, in creativity, in purpose, and
in the way you show up for yourself and others.
It's about turning passion into impact and proving
that sustainability isn't just about the materials.
It's about mindset. If you've ever felt the pull
between art and ambition, between growth and
groundedness, this one's for you. Because sometimes
the most powerful thing you can create is something
that actually lasts. If you enjoyed this episode,
don't forget to like and subscribe to The 40s
Formula and share it with a fashionable friend.
So welcome, Beatrice. Welcome, Naveen. We are
so excited to have you guys today. Thank you.
Can we first talk about the outfits? For our
listeners, no one has ever seen us this dressed
up. So much for this. This is our first ever
styled episode. So we're really happy that you
guys are here. The masterminds behind Rajarani
bringing this beautiful fashion to light. We
love having you. What people might not realize
about Rajarani is that there's a story behind
the name. So can you share that with us? Of course.
So first of all, thank you so much for having
us. And we are very proud to be the first one
to style you up. And you look amazing, by the
way. Again, thanks. So Rajarani, first of all,
means king and queen in Tamil. I did not know
that. And also, yeah, because it's the same in
Hindi and it's the same in Punjabi as well. So
I did know that. Oh, there we go. Really? Yeah.
I guess it must be rooted back to, I don't know,
either Arabic or Sanskrit or something. But basically
it's the same in all these languages. So yes,
I did know that. Right. So first of all, it represents
the two of us mainly. And then there is a duality
in our business, which is music and fashion.
So we wanted a name that was representing this
kind of duality. And then another thing is the
empowerment that we want to bring to the people
that are wearing our clothes or they are listening
to our music. The people need to feel empowered
and some kind of in a royalty way. I think it
works really well. And honestly, like you're
talking about, you know, how it represents, you
know, your brand. And I have to say, I feel like
a queen in this outfit. I feel like elevated
the moment I put this on. It's like in terms
of like the fabric and just the way it feels,
it feels incredible. So, wow. what we are trying
to achieve. Yeah, it works. And I saw on your
website that you have menswear. So like, I need
to get my kin up in this. My husband look amazing
in this. Mainly, most of our things are unisex.
So, I mean, you can see it in the website whereby
a male model, but it can be like... easily wear
by, I mean, we are, we are sharing basically
our, our, of course, not the dress. Honestly,
Tyler and I look great in this. But there are
things that are of course preferred by men and
like. Pinky. I tend to go for the ladies. And
what you guys are not seeing on air, but I will
definitely share on my socials, is that there's
a little tiny matching kimono for my daughter.
Yes. That's called the Mamma Mia. Oh, I love
the Mamma Mia. I mean, I couldn't, I literally,
well, you saw it. My email was like an idiot.
I was like, this is my look. No question. Tell
us a bit about how an Italian creative and an
Indian music producer came together and were
like, hey, let's do this thing that's actually
fashion. I want to hear all about the origin
story. Tinder. She went straight to the hook.
Okay, let me share a bit of background about
myself. I come from a very conservative middle
class family from India. And my family is...
Background is in tailoring. My grandfather, my
father, my aunt, everybody was in the same business.
When I was 10, 12 years old, they would ask me
to go down. Because we used to live in a house
where our factory is at the ground floor. Original
shop house situation. And I hated it because
you see this every single day. So 20 years of
my life, I see tailors, fabrics. Every single
day of my life. I mean, I knew that I could do
this job. It's very easy. It's in me. But I was
interested in music. I wanted to learn music.
And, you know, like my dad passed away when I
was five. So things changed. And their focus
was like, oh, you need to study properly. I mean,
every Indian household is like, you need to study
properly. You need to become an engineer. I don't
know that they come up with this idea of becoming
an engineer. But they were like, yeah. And I
was like, oh, you know, that's not me. The entire
family was like, they were looking for my well
-being. My father, my grandfather, they were
not educated to become a designer. They all self
-taught, like my grandfather passed his knowledge
to his kids. And so I never really got attention
towards this. I kind of proved that I was not
good at anything. You know, you're not actually
not doing anything. I was very bad. And then
I said, like, I want to pursue audio engineering.
Like there was a school in Singapore back then
called the School of Audio Engineering called
SAE. And I said, like, OK, can I go to the school
and study audio engineering? And it was a diploma.
They were like, no. Diploma? No, you need to
get a degree. But you're like, it has the word
engineering. And I was like, yeah, there is engineering.
Can I do that? And they were like, no, you finish
some degree and then you go do whatever you want.
And so I found a visual communication course
because it was boring as hell because I wanted
to study audio. And that was like a tiny part.
And I couldn't. And I think at one semester,
my attendance was like 8%. Like I was not even
going there. It was horrible. I mean, after two
years, they saw everything. My mom went to the
college and then she was like, yeah, you know,
your son doesn't turn up here. So we need to
do something. We don't know that now. Did you
get the... The cane or the slipper? That was
very early. I was taller than my papa. You know,
there is no hope. And she said, okay. Then after
I finished my two years of my college and I said
like, you know, I can't do this anymore. I'm
going mad because I don't like what I'm doing.
I can't focus on what I like. So all this long
story short. And then after two years of my college
is like, I want to study engineering. I found
a course in London, in Westminster. I want to
go study there, a master degree. They were like,
okay, this guy is a joke. It's a master's, so
we're getting close now. No, and it's also a
joke because I need to clear my papers to even
apply for the master's. So I had six months to
clear all my papers, which I flunked in two years.
I cleared it in six months. And I was like, okay,
boom. Now I want to go. Because you had a reason,
you had a purpose. And I moved to London. That's
when I really started learning something, which
I really liked. And I really started my life
there. And I finished my course and I moved back
to India. I worked on Indian films as an audio
engineer. And then I got an offer here in Singapore
to work for the National Broadcaster. So I was
working with them for about seven years. And
COVID happened. Boom. Everything. There was no
filming. There was no production happening. And
she happened. As I say Tinder. Yeah. We are going
back to the hook. And then I will let her continue
after this. All right. So Tinder, actually, we
matched during Secret Breaker. So we couldn't
meet. And I was OK. I was very strict. I don't
want to see you until. Yeah, I tried. Less strict.
and then what really bring us together was music
so we started talking about music we bonded over
like the music we like the festival we were going
we realized so I also came about at the same
time in 2016 so it's now 10 years for the both
of us And we realized that we were going to the
same clubs. We were going to the same parties.
We were having like many common friends, but
we never met. Interesting. So we never met since
COVID. And then we said, okay. Then I wanted
to learn how to DJ. Yeah. I was like, oh, but
now it's... Everything is closed. Also the school
and you cannot do like video call to do, to practice
this. So I said, no, don't go to the school.
I will teach you. And this is how it started.
Like after Circuit Breaker, we started meeting
on Sunday afternoon for music class and I was
cooking pasta. Nice. Very Italian of you. I like
it. And it was... That was my pay. Yeah. Probably
worth it. Yeah, sure. And he was teaching me.
And then after a few months, I mean, really,
as I said, bonded over music, we became best
friends and best friends leads to a relationship.
So now we are like a proper couple. For a long
time. Yeah, it's five years. And then, like,
I think after, what, a few months? One year,
maybe. I don't know. A few months to one year,
we said, you know what? It would be nice to have
a business together. Okay, let's put it in a
pipeline for the next five years. And then after
one year, we started already because we had like
this idea that came to us. And we were like,
you know what? Let's just do it. Because anyway,
we had nothing else to do. And you had been in
fashion or you had not? Oh, I come from Florence.
Okay. I grew up with the fashion. I have a master's
degree in fashion marketing. And I mean, the
environment I grew up with, it's in fashion and
I've been working my entire career in fashion.
This is weird, isn't it? Because it's almost
like you were meant to be like with your, you
know, your personal background in clothes and
fashion and tailoring. And then yours and then
the same sort of love for the same things. But
what's really weird is how did you decide that
your business was going to be a combination of
your two passions and experiences? Because I
don't think people naturally put clothes and
music together. So if you think about it, there
is a big connection with the fashion and music,
but it's the opposite. So you do like a fashion
event and you put the music as a background.
So for us, music started first. let's say I was
still learning how to DJ and then we tried one
day to play together. Yeah, that was also an
accident. Yeah, that was an accident. So now
this is what we are doing. We are playing always
together, back to back, three tracks, three tracks.
And we used to like do this fun game that we
never talked, I mean, we never say to each other
which tracks we're going to play, no? So we're
like... uh surprising each other with the music
that we wanted to play and it's like back and
forth to like one one yeah two three three three
that's what we do in the clubs too so we i mean
we tried it at home in the living room because
like oh okay we will play you play three i play
three but we never tell what's what we're gonna
play next would you like choose the same song
no no okay crazy because our music spectrum is
it works together as a set but when we are choosing
she completely Finds new music, which I never
come across. The same. Yeah. So this is how we
started, like with the music. And then it was
again, COVID time. So clubs were closed. We couldn't
go to the festival. We were like dreaming about
dancing on like with lots of people all together.
Impossible. And then so he was telling me about
his background, the tailoring background. And
then at some point I was like. Why don't we do,
because we are always wearing kimonos when we
are going to festival and to concert, whatever.
During COVID it was in the living room. Because
they're like flowing, they're meant to be like,
you can dance with it. So that's the combination.
So why don't we do something Indian with an Indian
flavor that allows people. to dance that was
the first like the first sparkle of the idea
and then i told him i was like okay so let's
try i mean um we really did try without any thinking
of the outcome we tried and we tried like to
wear this sample uh with our friends in like
of course in our small environments in the uh
was the boat party and people were like oh this
is really nice where did you get it and then
we were like on etsy we were like let's don't
talk it out loud first and then yeah we started
like with a very very very small capsule of like
20 pieces that his family helped us produce and
then we invite our friends over in our house
and we show them we're like oh we're working
in this like small business and they were like
oh my god it's gorgeous right of course at the
beginning the support of our friends was fundamental
i mean the fundamental of our business was the
support which we had from friends and we are
forever grateful for the encouragement and the
support they gave us because if they were not
there because i think People around us influence
your life. They change your life, like in good
or bad. And those guys really, I mean, people
who are watching, they will know they have really
helped us to where we are now. Because without
that confidence, we are not going anywhere. And
I think that's part of the story of sustainability,
right? How do you sustain a passion? And I think
you have to find a community that shares your
passion because then it amplifies. Community
is super important. Yeah. And I think, you know,
thinking about how your family was involved in
the production back in India. Can you share a
little bit about that? Because I know that upcycling
saris is part of kind of your brand story. How
much of that production is done kind of at the
grassroots level in India? OK, so so the initial
samples which we made and the first one year,
one and a half years. I still had my cousin who
was helping me. Amazing. I mean, it's not easy
to work with family. Oh, yeah. And, you know,
when I told them, oh, we need to use the sari
to make a kimono, like, are you crazy? Who's
going to wear that? You're stupid. Are you wasting
the sari? Or just, yeah, just breaking the paradigm
so shortly, right? Like, sari can only be a sari.
How can it be a kimono? And I mean, it was not
easy to convey the idea we had because we are
also playing with it. We have no idea where this
is going to go. And we had no intention to bring
it anywhere. In the beginning, we wanted to start
a business, but we didn't have the capacity or
the guidance or the knowledge to scale it because
we come from nothing. So we were like, oh, do
you want to try this? They were like, it was
very hard. So for one year, I was like, I can't
scream at my cousins. I need to be nice. Otherwise,
I'm not getting a shipment. I was like, holy,
okay. Can we try this? Like, no. I'm like, guys,
like, give me a break. And then the first initial
batches, they helped me. We got things out. And
the one main reason why I also didn't want to
get into this is because, like, as I told you,
when I was growing up, We used to have this as
big as this table, but 1 .5 meters deep. So we
have this outside at the corner of the factory
where they dump wastage from production day to
day. So they fill up. It's this tall. They fill
up every day. Scraps, just scraps. Just scrap.
And then it goes for destruction. Like it goes.
And when I was like growing up, me and my cousins,
we used to play hide and seek. We go inside the
box. And we can still cover ourselves up. And
that's the amount of wastage per day. And then
you can imagine what everybody else is doing.
And I was like, okay, you know what? This is
crap. I don't want to, we don't want to do this.
And that was very clear for me. And then I also
shared with her, it's like, and she knows she's
been in this business and she knows how much
wastage goes on sizing. Like, let's say if you
have size S or XL, 50 % of the stock is dead.
What everybody produces. That's why Rajarani,
we don't do sizes. It's size free. If you fit,
well and good. If you don't fit, I'm sorry, we
will try to alter it in a way that it works for
you, but we can't do size small, medium, large.
I never thought about that. Sizing necessarily
is going to produce waste. But the concept of
sizing is going to have a wasteful effect because
obviously, yeah, you're producing four times
as many, six times as many. I mean, of course,
it's your strategy, right? As a company, what
do you want to do? You want to serve like a wider
spectrum of body shapes. But for the kimono,
there is no way. I mean, there is no problem
in that sense. Yeah. So for us, that's another
kind of philosophy besides sustainability, meaning
not overproducing, but also, honoring that body
shape and size don't need to dictate your consumption.
And I think that is something that a lot of women
are searching for in the brands that they choose.
And women that are choosing more sustainable
brands, I think also have that undercurrent.
You know, like I know as someone who's struggled
with my weight for a long time, you know, I would
see something and I'd be like, oh, that's a small,
but it doesn't fit. I'm not going to buy the
medium or, you know, like, oh no. But at least,
you know, when it's a free size, you're not thinking
about, it's just like, how does this feel? How
does this look? And how does it make me feel?
And I think that's such a better mindset when
it comes to what you're wearing than, you know,
oh no, it's a small or a medium or XL or whatever
it is. And also like thinking about what you
said earlier about community, like, We can share
our clothes. Oh, yes. How many clothes can we
share? You know, I'm not saying it's just dollars.
It sounds not right. My arm is like the length
of her leg. So it's like there's not a lot we
could share, but we could share this. And I think,
again, encouraging that spirit of community,
of sharing, of, you know, thinking about wearing
these at a dance festival, which, by the way,
I haven't even considered because I'm so far
out of that part of my life right now. That could
be a wellness festival. Yes, exactly. I could
throw this on over my yoga. You know, somebody's
like, oh, I'm feeling chilly here. Borrow mine.
Like there's there's an inherent community in
that that does not exist in sized clothes. And
I have never thought about that before. So thank
you for bringing that perspective. And one more
thing is like it also carries a story. This is
one by a woman in India who we don't know what's
her name, which caste, which religion. about
how you perceive things. It's not that you need
to have this branded logo on your shirt or t
-shirt to feel happy. And the dress she's wearing,
that fits small, medium, large. Because it all
goes with the belt we have had, which just works
for all sizes. And that's what we want to also
convey and continue to do. Not that we have to
please every variety of people. But we do in
a different way. So just sort of coming back,
you said that, you know, that these have been
worn by women from India. Now, is it stuff that
they've sort of just donated because they're
done with it? Like, how do you then source your
material? So that's another fun part. So in India,
let's say my mom, if she has a stain or a hole
on this part of the sari or you can see, you
know, there is a specific way to wear a sari
and there is a hole, there is a stain. They would
want to throw away. Or there are guys who goes
around and collects these saris in return for
like a pot or like a spoon. So they take this
and it all goes to a big hub. And these guys
resell the saris to us. Oh, wow. So you're participating
in like another little ecosystem, economic ecosystem.
And it's strong in India. And I'm really proud
that it's... still going on and I want it to
continue I just hope a lot of youngsters wear
more saris because that's slowing down so okay
so for example they will give your mum a pot
or a bowl or a spoon your mum will give the sari
yeah and then you will then pay for that is amazing
like that is such a great everyone is getting
what they need in there yeah oh wow I'm So fascinated
by this amazing concept. But then that does bring
up the challenge. And you kind of hinted at this
before of scaling. How do you scale a business
that is truly sustainable? I feel like this is
a this is something that like no one really wants
to ask. Right. It's like, OK, this is a beautiful
story of sourcing materials. How are you going
to source a thousand of those? You know, like
so. So then, you know, it's almost like your
growth is inhibited by your devotion to this
process. Is that okay? Talk to us about scalability
in your side of the business. So yeah, you're
perfectly right. One thing is how many can you
get? Because so we are also very picky in what
we are choosing. So these people are like giving
us like bundle of saris and we have to go through
like thousands if we want the same feel and touch
that we want. Exactly. Or if you want like specific
colors. So it's a long, long process. So now
we have two girls in India that are helping us
in that process. But still, like from the, I
don't know, the 20 pieces that we made the first
time, now we are like kind of reaching the ceiling
of what we can really like procure in that sense.
And that's also, if you think about the website,
we cannot put like the upcycle. pieces on the
website and it's just one off. It's impossible.
Yeah, it's impossible. So, I mean, for us, it's,
I mean, the sustainability will always be like
a fundamental part of our business, but we need
to adapt a little bit. So, for example, this
is not upcycle. This kimono is not upcycle. But
what we are doing is to follow a zero waste policy.
So from this sari, this is a sari, we will do.
It's crunchy. We will do a headband. We were
going to do like the bag that you put inside
the kimono. So we are trying to use every single
inch of that site. So that's, that's, I mean,
you need to think about different options about
the sustainability part, but it's impossible
to scale up only with the upcycled material.
Impossible. So then how does that redefine what
you think of as a success in your business? Right.
Because so many people narrowly define. Right.
I sold more. I made more or I made more. I sold
more. Yeah. What does success look like for you?
So success is exactly what you guys just said
before. I really feel good. I'm really happy.
Like sometimes people are sending picture of
being on a holiday or like wearing this with
their daughter or like. So this is for us, every
single person that is happy with what they buy
and they're like thanking us for making this.
This is for me is already a success. And the
same things happen. Let's say, for example, when
we play music and at the end of the set, people
come to us and they're like, oh, I really love
the set, really love the music, the vibe, et
cetera. That's how I define success now. So it's,
of course. I mean, it's a business. You need
to have the revenue. You need to have the profitability
of it. But it's not just that. And you have been
able to grow, right? I mean, you guys have been
in Singapore, in Malaysia, Bali, UAE. Where do
you want to go next? That's a good question.
Earlier, we were really focused on going into
different markets, learning about different cultures
because you need to tailor your products according
to different markets. And then we realized we
are being quite aggressive on scaling in different
locations. But we thought, what is the core of
this idea? Building community. And you can't
keep the community tight if you are everywhere.
And we said like, okay, let's take a step back.
We focus on what we have, the four regions you
mentioned. And we build our community. We spend
time with our clients. We talk to them. We understand
what they need. And the next one or two years
is going to be only to strengthen our community.
And then it will naturally grow by itself. Like,
let's say going back to scalability of using,
procuring saris, right? Our girls, we are really
fortunate that they get the saris. So now it
used to be a monthly procurement process. Now
it's weekly and it's become bi -weekly. And because
if you go to a godown, you go through 3 ,000
saris, you will get only 200 saris a day. So
you need to do two rounds to get 400, 500 saris
a week. and okay we thought like okay how it's
not gonna cut it like i need to hire more people
because the team needs to spread different parts
of india to collect these saris then we launched
a new project out of demand because every customer
who comes to us they are like asking i have saris
at home what do i do with this so in may we launched
a project called replay you said like you bring
your clothes i mean you bring your saris if you
have a scarf if you have a table cloth Anything,
any textiles, any textile, bring it to us and
we will turn it into a shirt or a kimono or a
pant or whatever you like. So this is like, you
know, I'm not looking for sarees anymore. You're
bringing it to me. And I mean, too. And people
often ask us why sarees, why you are doing upcycling
with sarees on and why don't you do it with the
scarf? You know, I I grew up with sarees and.
There is a small research which we did. In India,
there are about 650 million women just in India.
And even if half the population, about 330 million
women, has only one sari. Like, let's say, my
mom has 100. And every household, like every
Indian household, even if you're poor, middle
class, you would have few dozens to wear because
my mom doesn't wear anything other than a sari.
So let's say if half of the population has only
one sari and that's 330 million women, right?
Do you know how many meters of fabric is there
in a sari? It's a lot, isn't it? It's another
one for you. Three? No, is it more? Six? Almost
there. So five to six meters of... Five to six.
This is pure silk sari, which I took from my
mother. I came back last night from India. I
was like, I'm going to this podcast. I need to
borrow one. She's like, will you give it back
to me? Yes. So that's five to six meters of fabric.
330 million women, one sari. That's about 1 ,650
,000 ,000 meters of fabric. Where you can go
around the equator 41 times. And that's with
just one side. Assuming one per woman. Per half.
And half of the population and only in India.
Then you can calculate the Indians. Outside of
India. I mean, even I've got one sari here. She's
feeding your one sari quota. Actually, even I
have one sari. See, for Indian weddings. And
funny enough, it's actually very similar to this
color palette. I'll show you guys after the show.
So you actually brought up something and you
said that the younger generation are now not
really dressing in traditional wear. I know you
kind of just mentioned that, you know, there
are still a lot of women, but do you see that
impacting this business and how it's going in,
in the future? If people don't really wear the
traditional wear. Yeah. Then they're not buying
it. Then you don't have it. So the, the problem
space is where they are not wearing it on day
to day basis because denims t -shirts are easier
to wear. I can't complain. I would, I mean, if
I was born in this age, that's exactly what I
would do. So the sarees are limited to festivities.
They are going for some special occasion for
weddings. So this is going to bring down the
amount of saree consumption. But this is also
bring down the level of production by the saree
makers. So that's why we say, OK, doesn't have
to be a saree, right? Do you have a piece of...
So we had one lady, one Italian lady. Someone
gave her a piece of fabric for her wedding. I
don't know what exactly the purpose was. She
was supposed to use it as a shawl. And she had
it for 20 years? How many years? No. I think
it was 10, yeah. 10 years plus. And then it's
also kind of getting damaged. And she brought
it to us. I don't know what to do with this fabric.
And it's, of course, it has a meaning because
it's for a wedding. And then, okay, let's turn
it into a kimono. And one girl had a piece of
tablecloth. Tablecloth. Wow, that's interesting.
She turned it into pants. Wow. I was going to
say that could not be a kimono, right? But yeah,
no. That would actually be quite cool once. Was
it like a linen -y type material? Yeah, it was
cotton. It was like super easy. And it turned
out beautiful. So I don't think we are limited
to saris. I mean, the core of this is saris because
it's beautiful. And it has a specific... pattern
of how things work in a sari and the traditional
like connection with yeah i mean what we are
doing is only what we grew up and also the the
pattern no the the fact that and this backside
there is a difference yeah so in the part of
the sari like let me show you quickly this we
call you can buy any piece of fabric in the world
it doesn't come with specific color segments
in the saree itself like if you see this red
part is where you have the fall where the saree
they put behind which we call a pallu and only
in sarees you have this in same piece of fabric
you have this one meter which has a different
color and a different pattern and we use this
in the same the dress we are using at the back
which is only in a saree i even if i buy new
fabrics they're not gonna make a specific part
of that like the fabric into into a special design
they will say no it doesn't exist and that's
why it's unique to use a saree and we use it
and cut it in a way that it's special And we
will continue to do it as long as saris exist.
I feel like the sari crisis is a few years out.
Long way to go. Long, long, long way. In terms
of, you mentioned kind of that there's a color
story here, right? I mean, your clothes are not
black and white and gray, right? They are boisterous.
They are beautiful. I mean, again, even this.
Even the black and white. It's still very, very
colorful. How do you see color? as a part of
the union of music and fashion. Does color communicate
something for you guys in terms of your ecosystem?
For sure. I mean, we are not minimal person.
We love colors. I mean, wearing a bright color
gives you more energy, more positivity. So this
is what we want to communicate. It's not going
to be like a gray or a full black. Yeah. It's
impossible. And I think for women in their 40s,
we do tend toward the black, you know, gray,
neutrals a lot. You feel safer, more comfortable.
But the beauty of it is that you can wear a black
dress underneath and just put it on. Yeah. And
it changed the look completely. Yeah. And I would
argue changes the feel. Yeah. You know, I'm wearing
my black dress. OK, fine for the millionth time.
But I put this on top and now I'm new and I'm
energetic. You know, there's something different
in my spirit. Absolutely. So I think that's amazing.
All right, guys. So we have a little segment
that we do on the show. So we want to do it with
you. Yes. It's called Hot or Hype. So the idea,
and I love that we have two people for this.
And I love that we have a man and a woman for
this. Okay. So Hot or Hype is basically I give
you a hot topic in sustainable fashion. And you
tell me if you do think that's hot or you think
it's hype. Overblown. Not a thing. And you can
both give different answers. You can absolutely.
You can definitely give different answers. And
also, you know, you can feel free to kind of
give each other a side eye if you don't agree
with what the other one said. Okay. Hot or Hype.
sustainable fashion can't be fashion forward.
No, no way. Hype. Hype, for sure. Can I motivate
you? Yes. Yeah, it's not a one word answer. So
yeah, hype is the base. So as we said, like you
need to really think of like you're lacking in
resources when you want to be sustainable or
you want to find alternative to the like. classic
material that so it's like for sure you need
to be more creative so in a way it's like more
couture is what you're saying like this is this
is more made to order this is for sure for sure
yeah love it and i want to add on to that uh
for sure it's hype and people even if we are
making new kimonos or shirts from new fabrics
People always ask us for the upcycle one because
there is no way if it's an upcycle piece, I can
find the same sari. Yeah. How do I do that? So
they're like, if I have this, it's only me. It's
very personal. Yeah. To me, that is style. It's
like uniqueness. Yes. So there is always demand.
So that's why. Our business is like, oh, I need
to procure more because people keep asking for
that kimono. Even if they have a kimono, they
will buy two more because it's two different
things and I can't make it again. So and and
also the mentality of the younger generation
is changing from what we see. They want value
in what's happening behind that piece of fabric.
the brand nobody cares about i need to wear this
they are like they are confident enough to wear
a five dollar ten dollar t -shirt and they are
confident to pull that it's not that they need
to wear a big brand to feel confident so when
they they are very conscious about purchase so
when they want to buy a piece they are specific
to understand what's happening behind and what
are your values And am I wearing and carrying
your values forward? Otherwise, no, it's a waste
of money. So that's why we have to stick to our
core. I mean, our commitment to our heritage
and our connection to sustainability. And at
the same time, we don't compromise on our storytelling
through music experiences. So we want to keep
these three things intact in our business, wherever
we go, however big we scale. the core values
these are very simple core values which you can
keep you just when things are conflicting just
say no if it's not going anywhere screw it just
wait it will you will find different ways to
use it like how we if you can't find more saris
buy a piece of cloth or use zero waste policy
there are so many things to tackle this issue
then just okay what is the shortcut let me send
these pieces by 100 meters of fabric use throw
And I think that's cool that you guys, though
you are creatives, okay, and this is like a world
so outside of my world. I always say I'm like
the least creative person on earth. But, you
know, though you are creatives, you have boundaries.
You have a mission and you have values. I think
that's important for people to understand about
creative work and what it takes to thrive in
the business sense. Because, you know, you mentioned
the zero waste policy, right? You mentioned the
commitment to upcycling materials wherever they're
sourced. Like these are boundaries that then
shape. the creativity that you express, you know,
it's not an either or, right. It's like, you
can be successful and also have a little bit
of structure around what you're doing, you know,
and like you said, kind of be unrelenting in,
in your acceptance or refusal of certain elements
of the business. Yeah. All right, guys, hot or
hype using AI in creative work. It's a difficult
one. Tell us why again, not being creative. Tell
me why. I mean, I will give you an example. Yeah.
So earlier, like two years ago, just two years
ago, when we used to do samples, I mean, if we
are proposing a new product to a client or someone,
we have to physically buy the piece of fabric.
We have to physically make the product. We have
to put it on a mannequin and do a photo shoot.
Imagine the cost, time, manpower. Now, okay,
I designed the... fabric or we choose the fabric
from the vendor we put it on on ai okay i want
to make this specific piece of thing like a shirt
or a kimono and i want to present it to my client
tomorrow i can do it in one hour and it's definitely
a strength people some people say oh you can't
use this this is like not authentic dude it shares
the vision in one hour if you want To take that
vision forward. OK, take the next step, but don't
get stuck for a week or 10 days trying to figure
this out. Yeah. So use it to your advantage.
For sure. Use it to your advantage. And again,
it doesn't sound in that example like it in any
way is in your creative process. It's actually
in your marketing, in kind of your, you know,
your business side of the process. Right. Which
is, I think, the smart way to do it. All right.
I have a different opinion. OK. I have a different
opinion. Not. I mean, not for our case, but what
I see in the market. So if you pay attention
and if you're going to any shop now, you're going
out, you will see the same colors. You will see
the same or very similar cut more or less everywhere.
And this is why... business are relying on ai
not for the creativity process but for what they're
gonna sell so colors and shape you're gonna see
the statistics and you're gonna say okay the
next pantone color for the season will be the
berry like burgundy whatever it's everywhere
now so this is i think it's gonna be like more
and more homogenized. Yeah. But not for us. I
mean, we don't care. The great thing about operating
kind of outside. I mean, if you're going to give
your creative process to AI, you might as well
turn yourself off and plug yourself. But it's
definitely a super tool. It's super tool for
like administrative stuff. Yeah. Yeah. That's
what we find as well. Like administrative wise.
amazing but it doesn't allow it like you know
a lot of folks just like generate their podcast
scripts right right off of ai and it's like you
can't do that because then it's the same question
because where's ai drawing from the other podcast
so it's like you can't just do that you have
to actually create the questions you want to
answer yes but i hear you but you know there's
definitely a double -edged sword there So obviously,
Jasmine and I can relate to the idea of starting
something as a passion project and then kind
of having two minds in the game, right? Can you
share some of the inevitable, hopefully resolved,
conflicts or bumps in the road in either the
beginning of Rajarani or along the way? Bumps
in the road. So this is not like a road. This
is a roller coaster. This is a road, people.
It's not a road. There are, like, not just bumps
in the road. There are, like, upside down. Like,
loop -de -loop. Like, okay. So, yeah, of course.
Of course, it's, like, every day is a challenge.
Every day is, like, something unexpected. We
are working with Indian suppliers. It's always
a surprise. Something unexpected. So I think
the biggest lesson that we are learning is how
to react to it. Because like challenge will always
be there at any point of time, any day. So now
what we are, I think, getting quite good at it
is like, OK, what's the lesson here? So what
are we going to do next to avoid this? And this
is really helping. I mean, this mindset that
we need to really put into the business. And
in terms of conflicts, I would say we don't have
really conflicts. They are really, really unsolvable
because otherwise we wouldn't be continuing this
business together. Of course, there are disagreements
or misalignments or something that we are not
really aligned. But we just talk about it and
we're trying to figure it out. What's the halfway?
Yeah. Yeah. And what's that quote? Again, I butcher
every quote that I try to bring on the show.
So here's another example. It's like, I don't
fear the storms because I have learned to sail
my ship. There you go. Yes, exactly. I think
you said that very nicely. Thank you. Whoever
that is credited, thank you for your work. Yes.
But it's true when you can kind of know that
you anticipate there will be bumps, right? Or
loop to loops or falls off a cliff. But then
you also have the tools to get through it. Because
there is no blueprint for us. There is nobody
who's going to tell you that this is going to
work because everybody's vision and business
or whatever. they are doing in their lives. It's
only respective to their thought process, their
vision, because their ideas are not going to
work for you. Your ideas are not going to work
for you. So, I mean, it's not going to make any
sense for you to put yourself in a box and know
I need to follow these rules and so on. So just
fall, get up, run again. Yeah. If any potential
investors were listening to this show, and again,
we hope y 'all are out there. Okay. So please
listen. What is something that you would want
them to know about Rajarani that would be unique
as an investment opportunity for your brand?
Okay. Let's say if you see us in an investment
perspective, Rajarani is not about you are investing
in a music duo or a clothing brand. It's an ecosystem
where sustainability, music, fashion, and experiences
are all aligned in one place so there is no other
project like this because when we started this
project people are saying oh you should keep
the music separate you should have the fashion
no we were always like to the point we're going
to keep this together where it goes we will find
out because that's what it was born and those
are our values So they are not, if an investor
is investing, they will say, okay, you're a clothing
brand, but you don't have any value in terms
of how you drive clients to your business. Well,
we have music everywhere we go. When we are wearing
this and playing a set, people always ask, where
did you get this? Come to my shop. So it's circular.
And when we are selling these kimonos and boutiques
fair or like different locations and people are
like, oh, so this is really nice. Oh, but we
also play music. We are also DJs. They come to
our gigs. So and all these experiences we create,
like when we did a replay event that day. These
are the kind of experiences where we create,
like, let's say we have a wellness event where
we have yoga for the day. And slowly it goes
into a workshop where we teach people how to
upcycle or cut the patterns for a kimono. And
then we play music. And what we are doing through
this, we are building a community. So what investors
are investing in is a big community which we
are forming, which you can't buy with ads, which
you need to develop on the ground. And that's
what we are doing. So if people are there to
help us with funds, of course, the community
is going to go stronger because our rules and
our core values are strong that we are not going
to deviate. And we'll be only focused on enriching
this community in a global scale. I mean, scalability
wise, we have proven already. When we reached
out to Dubai, Abu Dhabi or Kuala Lumpur, Singapore,
Bali. People are welcoming. It's doing well.
We can push even further, but we are coming back
to strengthen this community because that's the
core. And if we are looking at scalability, I
want to sell this product in every e -commerce
platform that's achievable, but the community
is dead. There is nobody. And it doesn't bring
any value. to our lifestyle movement, which we
are trying to portray. And it's sort of getting
further away from your core values as a company
and what you guys all believe in. Yeah. So you
mentioned that you're now doing replay. So you're
doing kind of commission piece upcycling. You're
also going to be participating in the boutiques
fair here in Singapore this November. Yes. Can
you tell us any more about recent and upcoming
projects? So we also have a very, very beautiful
project that is with the Fashion Phone concert.
So we're going to dress up 12 models. Maybe 30.
So we are still not sure about the number. And
so all of them are cancer survivors. So, I mean,
everybody has like their sensibility or again,
is the free size is really helping to dress them
up, to feel them like empowered. They don't need
to care about the size or how they're going to
fit in it because it's going to be very easy
for them to dress up. And it's going to happen
at Marquis? Yeah. Oh, wow. At Marina Bay Sands.
Amazing. And so what date is that? 20th? Wow.
Thursday? So there's going to be a white collar
boxing. So before the boxing match, they're going
to have this fashion show, Fashion for Cancer.
So please follow them. Fashion and sports is
something very close to my heart. So that's for
you guys as well. So I hate to bring this conversation
to a close. It's been, first of all, we're not
bringing these outfits to a close. But we do
have to bring the combo to a close. And though,
you know, I don't want to assume anyone here
is in their 40s besides us. but perhaps we are
here on the 40s formula. Is there anything that
you can offer to our listeners about your 40s
formula from the perspective of this beautiful
ecosystem that you represent? What is the formula
for women to thrive in their 40s? Okay. So I
want to start with something that my nonna, my
grandma used to tell me all the time. You have
to love yourself really hard. You have no spare
parts. You have no like substitution. It's only
you. So you need to really love yourself and
the full package, like your mind, your body and
your soul. That's the first thing. Then second
point for me, it's be selective with the people
and your energy where you spend your time and
energy with and how. Because your time and energy
are very limited. So you better be selective
of what you're doing and with who. Love yourself
and spend your resources wisely. Absolutely.
Time and energy. Yeah. And Naveen? I'm not sure
if I would give maybe an advice that could, I
mean, people in the 40s or... 20s or 30s you
could all relate is that I mean this comes from
my own learning I could be totally wrong don't
listen to anybody just follow your heart and
do what you feel is right for you because what
you often hear from outside are opinions because
let's say be fashion or music it's all very subjective
everybody has their opinion opinion is doesn't
matter because your vision is different and Don't
listen to opinions, which is equal to noise to
me. And just follow your heart because your heart
is never wrong. So it always leads you to the
right direction. Even if you make a mistake,
you fall down, you come back and listen back
to your heart. And it's like, oh, you learned
something there. That was a lesson. That was
not a mistake. And then you move forward. So
I think that's the only. uh thing which i follow
for myself i mean this i also learned in the
past few years after meeting her and and all
these things came together yeah imagine had you
not followed your heart and not followed the
music but to be honest i wouldn't do it without
him yeah i wouldn't do it by myself yeah and
i do think people come into each other's lives
at the exact correct right time yes you know
and following your heart Thank you both for being
on the show today. We really, really appreciate
it. Thanks again for these gorgeous gloves. Everyone,
please check out the show notes for more information
on where you can find Raja Rani. Thank you so
much. Thank you. Thanks for having us here. It's
our pleasure. sneeze, say something completely
bizarre, you know, and it goes. You never see
that again. Don't you worry.