WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.720 Guys, we have some exciting news. The 40s Formula 00:00:02.720 --> 00:00:06.400 is going live on August 14th at the Green Collective 00:00:06.400 --> 00:00:08.660 at Funan Mall. We are going to dive deep into 00:00:08.660 --> 00:00:10.839 the science, myths, and struggles around sugar 00:00:10.839 --> 00:00:13.640 addiction. Breakfast and coffee are on us, thanks 00:00:13.640 --> 00:00:16.219 to the generous sponsors, Guzman y Gomez. It's 00:00:16.219 --> 00:00:18.640 a small and intimate event with only 15 spots, 00:00:18.719 --> 00:00:20.800 so it's first come, first served. Tickets are 00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:23.460 only 20 bucks, and that includes breakfast and 00:00:23.460 --> 00:00:25.960 $5 towards your purchase at the Green Collective. 00:00:26.079 --> 00:00:27.739 Come and join us for a conversation that might 00:00:27.739 --> 00:00:31.109 change the way you eat. think and feel the challenge 00:00:31.109 --> 00:00:33.250 with loneliness is the more lonely you are the 00:00:33.250 --> 00:00:35.409 harder it is to break it please can we stop calling 00:00:35.409 --> 00:00:37.950 these things soft skills the ability to communicate 00:00:37.950 --> 00:00:39.729 the ability to connect emotional intelligence 00:00:39.729 --> 00:00:42.270 all of these things they're not soft they're 00:00:42.270 --> 00:00:45.130 really hard right social media at that point 00:00:45.130 --> 00:00:48.670 was just the most unbelievable lifeline people 00:00:48.670 --> 00:00:50.490 reached out to me from like all over the world 00:00:50.490 --> 00:00:52.490 and said what can we do how can we help can i 00:00:52.490 --> 00:00:55.689 send you money all kinds of things so even though 00:00:55.689 --> 00:00:58.509 i had nothing At least I had the world. You had 00:00:58.509 --> 00:01:00.710 something. So I wasn't really alone. Because 00:01:00.710 --> 00:01:02.750 I was a single mum with her for a long time, 00:01:02.909 --> 00:01:05.290 I had to have that, even when she was like teeny, 00:01:05.370 --> 00:01:07.709 teeny, tiny, right? Because there is no other 00:01:07.709 --> 00:01:09.790 parent here, darling. So we're going to have 00:01:09.790 --> 00:01:11.150 to work this out. We're going to have to communicate. 00:01:11.290 --> 00:01:13.409 There is no one else to help us. Balance doesn't 00:01:13.409 --> 00:01:15.790 exist for me. I don't believe there's any balance, 00:01:15.950 --> 00:01:18.170 right? I can't be half here with you two and 00:01:18.170 --> 00:01:20.930 half with her in Kuala Lumpur, right? I made 00:01:20.930 --> 00:01:23.549 a choice. When you believe that time is sort 00:01:23.549 --> 00:01:26.010 of infinite, there'll always be time. There is. 00:01:26.599 --> 00:01:29.400 It's amazing, right? So people always ask me, 00:01:29.420 --> 00:01:32.980 how do you have time? I think I create it. I 00:01:32.980 --> 00:01:34.379 just believe there'll be more of it. And then 00:01:34.379 --> 00:01:37.640 there is. In the last 30 years, we have lost 00:01:37.640 --> 00:01:41.040 48 % of our empathy as human beings, the skill 00:01:41.040 --> 00:01:44.099 set of understanding others. So the empathy deficit 00:01:44.099 --> 00:01:46.760 fundamentally just refers to that lack of understanding. 00:01:47.019 --> 00:01:49.280 There's data that shows if you say like, what's 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:51.239 the capital of France? it'll say the capital 00:01:51.239 --> 00:01:53.680 of france is paris versus if you say hey chat 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:55.920 gbt please could you tell me what is the capital 00:01:55.920 --> 00:01:58.379 of france it'll say the capital of france is 00:01:58.379 --> 00:02:00.079 paris it is a beautiful city with the blah blah 00:02:00.079 --> 00:02:01.560 blah do you mean it will give you more information 00:02:01.560 --> 00:02:04.319 oh my gosh and it's proven there's a lot of fear 00:02:04.319 --> 00:02:07.959 around ai i have zero fear i i think that we 00:02:07.959 --> 00:02:09.900 are so bad at empathizing with each other we 00:02:09.900 --> 00:02:12.259 have such a deficit if the machines can fix it 00:02:12.259 --> 00:02:32.099 then even better hallelujah and welcome to The 00:02:32.099 --> 00:02:34.500 40s Formula, your go -to place for insightful 00:02:34.500 --> 00:02:37.099 discussions on navigating the 40s and thriving 00:02:37.099 --> 00:02:39.979 in this transformative decade. We're your hosts, 00:02:40.080 --> 00:02:42.659 Jasmine and Amanda, two women that are passionate 00:02:42.659 --> 00:02:44.539 about exploring the challenges and adventures 00:02:44.539 --> 00:02:47.060 that come with turning 40 and what lies ahead. 00:02:56.110 --> 00:02:58.330 All right, before we dive into today's episode, 00:02:58.469 --> 00:03:00.250 let's talk about something that makes our lives 00:03:00.250 --> 00:03:02.969 way easier. And tastier, because let's be honest, 00:03:03.090 --> 00:03:05.509 between work, workouts, and you know, life, we 00:03:05.509 --> 00:03:07.469 don't exactly have time to wrestle the trolleys 00:03:07.469 --> 00:03:09.789 at the supermarket. Which is why we've been with 00:03:09.789 --> 00:03:11.870 The Meat Club since the beginning of the 40s 00:03:11.870 --> 00:03:14.090 formula. Yep, they've had our backs since episode 00:03:14.090 --> 00:03:17.009 one, and tasty dinners on our plates too. With 00:03:17.009 --> 00:03:19.360 The Meat Club? 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Oh, well, first things 00:03:46.460 --> 00:03:48.919 first, you can't have Taco Tuesdays without Snapper. 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.000 But what about salmon? Because that's definitely 00:03:52.000 --> 00:03:54.810 our favorite. Okay, fair enough, but... Chicken 00:03:54.810 --> 00:03:56.689 breast, that's the workhorse we're eating every 00:03:56.689 --> 00:03:59.409 single day. Uh -uh -uh. I think it's all about 00:03:59.409 --> 00:04:01.569 the chicken thighs. Oh my gosh, chicken thighs. 00:04:01.689 --> 00:04:03.330 I don't know if I could get one down myself, 00:04:03.430 --> 00:04:06.550 but I do know that this mince makes a mean burger. 00:04:06.830 --> 00:04:08.870 Who wants burgers when you can have a grass -fed 00:04:08.870 --> 00:04:11.889 beef eye fillet steak? Okay, that is amazing. 00:04:11.990 --> 00:04:14.229 But with that steak, I would definitely be serving 00:04:14.229 --> 00:04:17.529 this delicious broccoli and spicing it up with 00:04:17.529 --> 00:04:19.769 these chilies. Okay, you've definitely won there. 00:04:20.149 --> 00:04:26.040 I have got some coriander. Some cherry tomatoes. 00:04:26.220 --> 00:04:29.480 I mean, check out the color on those. And for 00:04:29.480 --> 00:04:32.519 dessert, strawberries. We also got some fruit 00:04:32.519 --> 00:04:34.899 for the kids, which they will love. And one of 00:04:34.899 --> 00:04:36.899 the coolest thing about the subscription, an 00:04:36.899 --> 00:04:39.800 amazing quality chef's knife and a beautiful 00:04:39.800 --> 00:04:41.920 wooden cutting board. Honestly, it's the easiest 00:04:41.920 --> 00:04:44.959 way to eat well without overthinking it. So if 00:04:44.959 --> 00:04:46.920 you're ready to upgrade your meals without adding 00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:49.240 to your mental load, head over to themeatclub 00:04:49.240 --> 00:04:52.860 .com .sg. Sign up for the flexible subscription. 00:04:53.370 --> 00:04:55.709 No lock -ins, just high quality proteins delivered 00:04:55.709 --> 00:04:57.670 straight to you. And don't forget to use our 00:04:57.670 --> 00:05:01.649 code TFF12 to save $12 off your first order. 00:05:01.769 --> 00:05:03.329 We'll drop it in the show notes or you can find 00:05:03.329 --> 00:05:05.810 it on our Instagram. The Meat Club, where quality 00:05:05.810 --> 00:05:09.029 meets convenience. One of the compelling ideas 00:05:09.029 --> 00:05:11.040 that I love about you. is that you say we are 00:05:11.040 --> 00:05:13.879 pro -social beings, but we're moving in reverse. 00:05:14.220 --> 00:05:17.439 We are. But can we be honest? Is there any sort 00:05:17.439 --> 00:05:20.459 of future, really, with AI and social media and 00:05:20.459 --> 00:05:22.439 just screens moderating our every move? Is there 00:05:22.439 --> 00:05:25.259 any future where we're not becoming more and 00:05:25.259 --> 00:05:27.680 more disconnected from each other? My gosh, I 00:05:27.680 --> 00:05:30.129 hope so. Because if there's not, I need to stop 00:05:30.129 --> 00:05:32.670 doing my work now. Yes, pick up your shoes. Look, 00:05:32.709 --> 00:05:34.790 I think it's shifting. I think you're right. 00:05:34.850 --> 00:05:37.769 In many ways, we're shifting apart because of 00:05:37.769 --> 00:05:39.910 tech amongst many other things. But I do think 00:05:39.910 --> 00:05:41.509 in the work I do, we're also coming back together. 00:05:42.089 --> 00:05:43.949 Because I started this work about five years 00:05:43.949 --> 00:05:47.589 ago with about 300 connections on LinkedIn. And 00:05:47.589 --> 00:05:50.209 it was just like me and an idea. And I would 00:05:50.209 --> 00:05:52.990 get up every day and post and hope that someone 00:05:52.990 --> 00:05:56.680 was listening. But I would do it again tomorrow 00:05:56.680 --> 00:06:00.120 anyway. But today they are. So today we've had 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:02.459 some really great momentum. So I think to answer 00:06:02.459 --> 00:06:03.920 your question really simply, yes, I think there 00:06:03.920 --> 00:06:06.740 is now an awareness that we need to reconnect. 00:06:07.139 --> 00:06:09.699 But there is also demand. People actually beginning 00:06:09.699 --> 00:06:12.000 to feel it. They can feel, not always consciously, 00:06:12.259 --> 00:06:16.259 but they can viscerally feel disconnection. We 00:06:16.259 --> 00:06:18.699 have 52 % of the world being lonely. They're 00:06:18.699 --> 00:06:21.500 now able to, not all of them, but verbalize that. 00:06:22.079 --> 00:06:24.480 to understand it, to recognise it. So yes, I 00:06:24.480 --> 00:06:26.379 think that there is a world, there will be a 00:06:26.379 --> 00:06:30.279 world where we are reconnecting. And you see 00:06:30.279 --> 00:06:31.680 it all the time. I actually watched a video on 00:06:31.680 --> 00:06:34.000 Singapore the other day about third spaces. You 00:06:34.000 --> 00:06:36.180 ladies heard about third spaces? Oh my gosh, 00:06:36.259 --> 00:06:38.180 you now need to go and Google. There's loads. 00:06:38.779 --> 00:06:40.720 There's loads here in Singapore, right? So third 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:42.379 spaces, I think they came from New York, but 00:06:42.379 --> 00:06:45.319 it's a reference to a place that is not the home 00:06:45.319 --> 00:06:47.879 or office or school or wherever you spend your 00:06:47.879 --> 00:06:50.839 time. It's a third space where you go to reconnect. 00:06:51.680 --> 00:06:54.000 So, for example, I saw there's one here in Singapore, 00:06:54.199 --> 00:06:56.980 which is a woman who has a laundrette, so a laundry 00:06:56.980 --> 00:07:00.639 store. But she decided to create community within 00:07:00.639 --> 00:07:02.720 her laundry store. So when you go to put your 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:04.220 washing in the washing machine, you can also 00:07:04.220 --> 00:07:06.759 connect and have coffee and make friends and 00:07:06.759 --> 00:07:08.920 feel part of something. That's a third space. 00:07:09.139 --> 00:07:11.060 And they're popping up all over the place. Like 00:07:11.060 --> 00:07:12.600 in New York, they're like beautiful art galleries 00:07:12.600 --> 00:07:15.519 and all kinds of different things all over Southeast 00:07:15.519 --> 00:07:19.439 Asia. That is an exemplification of people saying. 00:07:20.139 --> 00:07:23.060 I need people. Yeah. I need community. We want 00:07:23.060 --> 00:07:26.220 this. I want to feel connected. Yeah. So I think 00:07:26.220 --> 00:07:27.800 the future is bright. So talk to me, though, 00:07:27.839 --> 00:07:29.720 about how we seek out places like that. Right. 00:07:29.779 --> 00:07:31.720 So. So then you just introduced a new term to 00:07:31.720 --> 00:07:34.060 us. Yeah. Like, how would I, as just, you know, 00:07:34.060 --> 00:07:36.279 your average layperson find these places for 00:07:36.279 --> 00:07:39.079 connection? I think on the whole, people find 00:07:39.079 --> 00:07:41.000 it from within their communities. And I think 00:07:41.000 --> 00:07:43.199 that's why we see, for example, things like podcasting, 00:07:43.300 --> 00:07:45.860 women's group, community groups, all these things 00:07:45.860 --> 00:07:48.180 just growing and growing and growing in the last 00:07:48.180 --> 00:07:52.600 two years. so many people have asked me mimi 00:07:52.600 --> 00:07:55.019 when are you starting a community like for us 00:07:55.019 --> 00:07:58.639 and i'm like not today guys right um but but 00:07:58.639 --> 00:08:00.779 i always say to them well what what do you want 00:08:00.779 --> 00:08:04.560 from me like help me understand what it is you're 00:08:04.560 --> 00:08:07.100 asking from me and they all just say well we 00:08:07.100 --> 00:08:10.639 just want to be with you and other people right 00:08:10.639 --> 00:08:13.139 we just want to be people just want to be with 00:08:13.139 --> 00:08:14.959 other people so people are finding these spaces 00:08:14.959 --> 00:08:18.800 by searching probably people like me in wherever 00:08:18.800 --> 00:08:21.060 they are, right? Often they get it wrong and 00:08:21.060 --> 00:08:22.899 then they try somewhere else. That is the people 00:08:22.899 --> 00:08:24.259 that are finding the community. The people that 00:08:24.259 --> 00:08:25.899 aren't are the ones that are staying at home 00:08:25.899 --> 00:08:28.040 and doing nothing about it. Because the challenge 00:08:28.040 --> 00:08:30.160 with loneliness is the more lonely you are, the 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:32.659 harder it is to break it. Your confidence goes 00:08:32.659 --> 00:08:35.240 down, your energy goes down, your immune system 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:37.899 goes down and then it's very hard to break it. 00:08:38.000 --> 00:08:41.120 So I think people are searching for it and hopefully 00:08:41.120 --> 00:08:43.320 they're finding it in their communities as well. 00:08:43.559 --> 00:08:45.919 Amanda, can we talk about how clean Guzmany Gomez's 00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:49.090 food is? Truly clean. Not the it has letters 00:08:49.090 --> 00:08:51.669 so it's healthy kind of clean. Oh, totally. GYG 00:08:51.669 --> 00:08:54.090 is on another level. There's no preservatives, 00:08:54.110 --> 00:08:56.470 no artificial colors, no weird additives. It 00:08:56.470 --> 00:08:59.409 is just proper, real food. I read that they went 00:08:59.409 --> 00:09:01.870 through 21 versions of their corn chips before 00:09:01.870 --> 00:09:04.529 they found the one. Now that's commitment. And 00:09:04.529 --> 00:09:06.850 they fly in their avocados and tomatoes daily 00:09:06.850 --> 00:09:09.700 from Australia to Singapore. That is the level 00:09:09.700 --> 00:09:12.000 of commitment I want in my food. You can taste 00:09:12.000 --> 00:09:14.039 it, whether it's the burritos, the bowls, or 00:09:14.039 --> 00:09:16.500 those chipotle -seasoned fries. You just feel 00:09:16.500 --> 00:09:18.519 good after eating it. And it's really why my 00:09:18.519 --> 00:09:21.059 entire family keeps going back. Clean is the 00:09:21.059 --> 00:09:23.559 new healthy, and GYG has been leading that charge 00:09:23.559 --> 00:09:26.639 since day one. They've literally reinvented fast 00:09:26.639 --> 00:09:29.179 food. Who says it has to be dodgy and deep -fried? 00:09:29.240 --> 00:09:32.139 Not on GYG's watch. What about personality types 00:09:32.139 --> 00:09:34.409 now? Let's say someone is an introvert. and the 00:09:34.409 --> 00:09:36.970 idea of going out to meet someone to connect 00:09:36.970 --> 00:09:39.090 with someone that might feel really daunting 00:09:39.090 --> 00:09:42.269 and yeah like how do you And obviously having 00:09:42.269 --> 00:09:44.649 that connection is important. So how do people 00:09:44.649 --> 00:09:47.850 who are, you know, afraid to go out there and 00:09:47.850 --> 00:09:50.309 meet new people, how can they foster connections? 00:09:50.669 --> 00:09:52.350 Look, I'm not going to sugarcoat it. It's not 00:09:52.350 --> 00:09:55.350 easy. No. Right? That's why, you know, so often 00:09:55.350 --> 00:09:58.149 in my talks and stuff, I say, please can we stop 00:09:58.149 --> 00:10:00.330 calling these things soft skills? The ability 00:10:00.330 --> 00:10:02.250 to communicate, the ability to connect, emotional 00:10:02.250 --> 00:10:04.149 intelligence, all of these things. They're not 00:10:04.149 --> 00:10:07.320 soft. They're really hard, right? If you are 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:08.620 sitting at home, if you're, for example, if you're 00:10:08.620 --> 00:10:10.299 single and you're sitting at home and you want 00:10:10.299 --> 00:10:12.480 to meet people, you're in your pyjamas, you're 00:10:12.480 --> 00:10:14.720 watching Netflix, you're very happy, right? You 00:10:14.720 --> 00:10:17.460 get it easy. Yeah, right? It's kind of chill. 00:10:17.519 --> 00:10:19.480 The food's there, your cup of tea's there, everything's 00:10:19.480 --> 00:10:22.500 good. To get up, put on your clothes, your makeup, 00:10:22.580 --> 00:10:27.019 for example, go out, walk into a bar with a whole 00:10:27.019 --> 00:10:29.679 load of strangers and hope that somebody might 00:10:29.679 --> 00:10:32.970 be nice and be like you. It takes a lot of confidence. 00:10:33.169 --> 00:10:35.509 And imagine if that bra was off. It's like putting 00:10:35.509 --> 00:10:37.409 that bra back on. Yeah, well, there you go, right? 00:10:37.730 --> 00:10:39.830 First of all, me putting a bra on was the first 00:10:39.830 --> 00:10:42.870 challenge, but yes. So I think that, you know, 00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:45.389 we need to stop making it seem simple because 00:10:45.389 --> 00:10:47.990 that is not fair. It's not fair to say to someone, 00:10:48.029 --> 00:10:50.649 just do it. What do you mean, just do it? If 00:10:50.649 --> 00:10:53.879 I just could, I would have. It's just like with 00:10:53.879 --> 00:10:56.799 depression, right? It's like, just feel better. 00:10:56.960 --> 00:11:00.580 Don't be so sad. It's like, yeah, I hear you. 00:11:00.700 --> 00:11:02.879 But at the same time, it's much harder than that 00:11:02.879 --> 00:11:04.860 sounds. And if you've been suffering from loneliness 00:11:04.860 --> 00:11:07.000 for a long time, like you said, an object at 00:11:07.000 --> 00:11:10.379 rest stays at rest, right? The inertia of being 00:11:10.379 --> 00:11:12.159 in that space for such a long time can be... 00:11:12.299 --> 00:11:14.379 troubling i'm sure yeah and just recognizing 00:11:14.379 --> 00:11:17.179 that you know i think um someone asked me yesterday 00:11:17.179 --> 00:11:18.919 you know why don't we talk about loneliness more 00:11:18.919 --> 00:11:20.440 often i said well i think because we're ashamed 00:11:20.440 --> 00:11:23.100 yeah right it's really hard particularly for 00:11:23.100 --> 00:11:26.139 men to say i'm lonely it's really hard for them 00:11:26.139 --> 00:11:27.899 to even recognize that for themselves let alone 00:11:27.899 --> 00:11:30.740 say it out loud because we are tuned we are like 00:11:30.740 --> 00:11:33.059 brought up to think that that is a bad thing 00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:35.399 That that is something that we should look down 00:11:35.399 --> 00:11:37.799 on. You know, we came from more traditional conservative 00:11:37.799 --> 00:11:41.059 communities, all of us by our age, right? Because 00:11:41.059 --> 00:11:43.519 that's where the world was, right? When we were 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:47.240 small. So we grew up in a world where being alone 00:11:47.240 --> 00:11:49.720 was frowned upon. You were supposed to grow up 00:11:49.720 --> 00:11:52.360 and get married and look after the family and 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:54.840 all those things. So, as I said, especially for 00:11:54.840 --> 00:11:58.519 men, middle -aged men, to actually say, do you 00:11:58.519 --> 00:12:01.409 know what? I'm really successful. But I'm really 00:12:01.409 --> 00:12:03.870 lonely is really tough. And it must be harder 00:12:03.870 --> 00:12:07.350 as well if you do have a family and yet you're 00:12:07.350 --> 00:12:09.830 not connected. And then that makes it even harder 00:12:09.830 --> 00:12:12.169 because how can you be lonely? Now you've got 00:12:12.169 --> 00:12:14.590 a wife, you've got kids. But I guess loneliness 00:12:14.590 --> 00:12:17.240 isn't about... you know, the proximity you have 00:12:17.240 --> 00:12:19.639 to other people. It's about how that connection 00:12:19.639 --> 00:12:22.059 is with one another. Yeah, exactly. You can be 00:12:22.059 --> 00:12:24.820 very lonely, but not alone. Yeah. Right. So, 00:12:24.840 --> 00:12:27.279 you know, to be lonely is a lack of connectivity, 00:12:27.500 --> 00:12:30.019 not a lack of humans. Or you can be surrounded 00:12:30.019 --> 00:12:32.399 by people. And, you know, recently I was in Dubai 00:12:32.399 --> 00:12:35.600 talking to a CEO of an energy company. So this 00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:38.200 man is worth like, I don't know, billions of 00:12:38.200 --> 00:12:40.919 dollars, right? He's extremely successful. He's 00:12:40.919 --> 00:12:43.980 innovated. He was a startup. I mean, he's just 00:12:43.980 --> 00:12:46.000 phenomenal. Or he's just a phenomenal human. 00:12:46.899 --> 00:12:48.899 And we're meeting in this coffee shop and we're 00:12:48.899 --> 00:12:50.759 chatting away. And at some point he says something 00:12:50.759 --> 00:12:54.399 upstairs. And I sort of clocked that he was staying 00:12:54.399 --> 00:12:56.799 in this hotel. I said, but how long have you 00:12:56.799 --> 00:12:59.279 been here? He said, oh, five years. In the hotel? 00:12:59.379 --> 00:13:01.360 Living in a hotel? That's what I wanted to respond. 00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:06.679 I obviously couldn't do that face. But that's 00:13:06.679 --> 00:13:08.360 what I was saying inside, you know. And I said, 00:13:08.440 --> 00:13:10.700 okay, so you've lived here for five years. He 00:13:10.700 --> 00:13:12.320 says, yeah, you know, I came for a few months. 00:13:13.310 --> 00:13:16.169 I've stayed for five years we carry on the conversation 00:13:16.169 --> 00:13:17.889 and then a little bit later he says to me the 00:13:17.889 --> 00:13:20.610 thing is Mimi I don't have a friend in Dubai 00:13:20.610 --> 00:13:23.330 wow I was like what do you mean you don't have 00:13:23.330 --> 00:13:26.570 a friend in five years right so he I mean I'm 00:13:26.570 --> 00:13:28.509 sure he dates and he's he's trying to I'm sure 00:13:28.509 --> 00:13:30.690 he's trying to rebuild his his own sort of romantic 00:13:30.690 --> 00:13:32.990 life and all those types of things but to live 00:13:32.990 --> 00:13:36.590 in a hotel for five years and be able to say 00:13:36.590 --> 00:13:39.830 I don't have a single friend all I have is my 00:13:39.830 --> 00:13:42.710 work So then where you start the story and you 00:13:42.710 --> 00:13:44.669 say you had this amazingly successful man worth 00:13:44.669 --> 00:13:48.269 billions of dollars, really innovating. But yet 00:13:48.269 --> 00:13:52.009 on the other side, what does he not have? Well, 00:13:52.029 --> 00:13:53.909 he doesn't have community. He doesn't have connection. 00:13:54.070 --> 00:13:56.590 He doesn't have belonging. He's eating alone 00:13:56.590 --> 00:13:59.269 every night. So where is success really? I don't 00:13:59.269 --> 00:14:01.710 know, but it's a big question. Well, and that 00:14:01.710 --> 00:14:03.529 plays in beautifully to one of the questions 00:14:03.529 --> 00:14:05.940 I wanted to ask you about longevity. Yes. Right? 00:14:06.019 --> 00:14:07.980 So I should say I represent the College of Lifestyle 00:14:07.980 --> 00:14:10.059 Medicine, where there are six pillars of lifestyle 00:14:10.059 --> 00:14:12.740 medicine, one of which is positive social connection. 00:14:12.879 --> 00:14:14.620 And everyone always kind of laughs that one off, 00:14:14.639 --> 00:14:16.299 right? Because it's like, okay, exercise, right? 00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:18.200 Nutrition, like the big ones, you know, avoiding 00:14:18.200 --> 00:14:20.440 risky substances and positive social connections. 00:14:21.210 --> 00:14:23.350 But there's a reason that that is now a part 00:14:23.350 --> 00:14:26.049 of medicine is because research is increasingly 00:14:26.049 --> 00:14:29.629 showing us that people who do not have the type 00:14:29.629 --> 00:14:31.769 and amount of social connection they want, their 00:14:31.769 --> 00:14:34.230 health is failing. They're suffering. So I love 00:14:34.230 --> 00:14:36.809 that you consider in your, I don't want to give 00:14:36.809 --> 00:14:40.009 away the lead. This is yours to own. But one 00:14:40.009 --> 00:14:41.990 of the pieces of longevity that's missing is 00:14:41.990 --> 00:14:44.370 something that you address. And that's empathy. 00:14:44.669 --> 00:14:47.669 Can you talk to us about how empathy is different 00:14:47.669 --> 00:14:50.490 from social connection but kind of unites them? 00:14:50.539 --> 00:14:53.440 those two concepts i love that you opened that 00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:56.379 from a medicinal science point of view right 00:14:56.379 --> 00:14:58.139 because so often i have to do that and people 00:14:58.139 --> 00:15:01.460 are like what really yeah really but yes i mean 00:15:01.460 --> 00:15:02.919 absolutely just to kind of give that foundation 00:15:02.919 --> 00:15:05.159 so you're absolutely right of course you're right 00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:08.000 that being connected to each other is not just 00:15:08.000 --> 00:15:09.620 about you know having fun or you know having 00:15:09.620 --> 00:15:12.039 someone to go to cinema with it's about our survival 00:15:12.039 --> 00:15:14.519 yeah because we are pro -social species so we 00:15:14.519 --> 00:15:16.779 do better when we are together which is why things 00:15:16.779 --> 00:15:19.379 like the pandemic was so tough emotionally and 00:15:19.379 --> 00:15:21.000 mentally for us right we're not meant to be alone 00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:24.220 we really do very badly alone but it comes from 00:15:24.220 --> 00:15:26.720 our survival if you think back to us being kind 00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:29.500 of cave men and women in tribes and i don't know 00:15:29.500 --> 00:15:34.190 a field somewhere right If the tribe segregated 00:15:34.190 --> 00:15:38.049 out, if it disconnected, they died. Yeah, they're 00:15:38.049 --> 00:15:39.750 vulnerable. They couldn't survive. They had to 00:15:39.750 --> 00:15:42.529 be together, right, in order to survive. So actually 00:15:42.529 --> 00:15:44.629 we talk a lot about survival of the fittest. 00:15:44.629 --> 00:15:47.149 It's not actually true. It's actually survival 00:15:47.149 --> 00:15:48.769 of the connected, right? When you are together, 00:15:48.909 --> 00:15:51.710 you're able to survive. So we know that subconsciously, 00:15:51.710 --> 00:15:53.129 but as you said, because of modern day life, 00:15:53.350 --> 00:15:55.309 people shrug it off. They don't really believe 00:15:55.309 --> 00:15:58.409 it. Yet we know. that when you're connected, 00:15:58.629 --> 00:16:01.429 you statistically live eight years longer than 00:16:01.429 --> 00:16:03.250 somebody who is disconnected. So that's the core 00:16:03.250 --> 00:16:06.450 of why I love your intro, right? Empathy is the 00:16:06.450 --> 00:16:08.990 ability to understand people. It's to perspective 00:16:08.990 --> 00:16:11.960 take. This is not a soft skill, right? This is 00:16:11.960 --> 00:16:13.639 not about being nice or compassionate or kind. 00:16:13.759 --> 00:16:17.899 Please be kind. PSA, be kind. Yes, please be 00:16:17.899 --> 00:16:20.100 kind. But that's not what we're talking about. 00:16:20.179 --> 00:16:21.580 What we're talking about is perspective taking. 00:16:21.740 --> 00:16:23.919 It's a skill set. It's built into the prefrontal 00:16:23.919 --> 00:16:27.399 cortex. It exists in us as humans to be able 00:16:27.399 --> 00:16:30.100 to connect. Because if you don't understand people, 00:16:30.259 --> 00:16:32.419 how can you connect with them? It's similar to 00:16:32.419 --> 00:16:33.820 when you're a boss or a leader in the workplace. 00:16:33.980 --> 00:16:36.259 How can you include people if you don't know 00:16:36.259 --> 00:16:39.059 how they want to be included? With our children, 00:16:39.179 --> 00:16:40.919 how can we help them grow if we don't know how 00:16:40.919 --> 00:16:43.639 they want to grow or need to grow? So empathy 00:16:43.639 --> 00:16:46.299 is at the core of all relationships, actually, 00:16:46.360 --> 00:16:49.840 whether it's work or romantic or social, which 00:16:49.840 --> 00:16:52.120 is why I wrote actually my third book all around 00:16:52.120 --> 00:16:54.779 why it is that without empathy, all of those 00:16:54.779 --> 00:16:57.080 other critical parts, diet and movement and exercise, 00:16:57.279 --> 00:16:59.919 all of those things, they're not enough. If you're 00:16:59.919 --> 00:17:01.700 like this gentleman I was talking about earlier, 00:17:01.879 --> 00:17:04.720 super fit, eating well, lives a great life all 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:08.609 alone. It's not enough. Eight years, girl. I 00:17:08.609 --> 00:17:10.210 mean, that's echoing back in my brain. I mean, 00:17:10.230 --> 00:17:12.210 there are things that you could do that you know 00:17:12.210 --> 00:17:14.250 are actively bad that don't take eight years 00:17:14.250 --> 00:17:16.349 off your life. Do you know what I mean? I mean, 00:17:16.369 --> 00:17:18.890 that's huge, huge. And when you said perspective 00:17:18.890 --> 00:17:21.269 taking, that was so interesting to me because 00:17:21.269 --> 00:17:23.690 empathy, I guess, the way you just described 00:17:23.690 --> 00:17:26.819 it. It's the golden rule, is it not? Treat others 00:17:26.819 --> 00:17:28.539 the way that you'd like to treat yourself in 00:17:28.539 --> 00:17:31.019 a way. And it's like we've forgotten how to do 00:17:31.019 --> 00:17:34.180 that because we hide behind these kind of moderated 00:17:34.180 --> 00:17:36.460 forms of communication. Okay, let's give a pro 00:17:36.460 --> 00:17:38.180 -social media vote here because I'm actually 00:17:38.180 --> 00:17:39.859 a pro -social media person. You may have noticed 00:17:39.859 --> 00:17:42.519 if you follow my social media. I love the storytelling 00:17:42.519 --> 00:17:45.500 potential in social media. I love that I can 00:17:45.500 --> 00:17:47.740 connect with people that I have not seen in 30 00:17:47.740 --> 00:17:51.000 years on social media. So I actually really like 00:17:51.000 --> 00:17:54.279 what social media plays in my life. It doesn't 00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:56.099 take away from the type and quality of social 00:17:56.099 --> 00:17:58.339 connections that I want. How do you see social 00:17:58.339 --> 00:18:01.000 media being used for better or for worse? Like 00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:02.819 it's a question I get asked all the time. I don't 00:18:02.819 --> 00:18:04.559 think that social media is any type of evil. 00:18:04.980 --> 00:18:08.880 I think that people on social media can create 00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:11.599 any type of evil or just bad behavior. I mean, 00:18:11.619 --> 00:18:14.200 social media as a concept is a platform, a platform 00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:16.839 FYI that we built. the people the humans built 00:18:16.839 --> 00:18:18.619 right and now we blame it like it built itself 00:18:18.619 --> 00:18:21.259 like oh it's social media guys you built that 00:18:21.259 --> 00:18:23.200 yeah right so i think the first thing is it's 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:25.039 a platform it's full of people it's full of humans 00:18:25.039 --> 00:18:27.539 doing what humans do which unfortunately is things 00:18:27.539 --> 00:18:30.160 like exclusion and bullying and isolation and 00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:31.980 all of those things but it's not like we don't 00:18:31.980 --> 00:18:34.539 see that in real life right so social media can 00:18:34.539 --> 00:18:36.539 amplify it for sure right they can put it on 00:18:36.539 --> 00:18:39.740 a global platform but i feel exactly like you 00:18:39.740 --> 00:18:43.109 amanda that it's for me personally it's a it's 00:18:43.109 --> 00:18:46.089 always been a force for for good for me right 00:18:46.089 --> 00:18:47.930 and i think for many others we were talking about 00:18:47.930 --> 00:18:51.650 introverts earlier many introverts find their 00:18:51.650 --> 00:18:53.710 connection find their ability to thrive and grow 00:18:53.710 --> 00:18:55.549 on social media because it gives them a platform 00:18:55.549 --> 00:18:59.450 to do things they felt they never could so i 00:18:59.450 --> 00:19:01.769 think whether it's for me professionally i mean 00:19:01.769 --> 00:19:05.589 this empathy vision that i have this i mean I 00:19:05.589 --> 00:19:07.150 would never have met you if it weren't for social 00:19:07.150 --> 00:19:09.210 media. That's actually very true. Sitting in 00:19:09.210 --> 00:19:11.809 my condo somewhere alone, right? With your 300 00:19:11.809 --> 00:19:14.450 LinkedIn connections. Which luckily are a few 00:19:14.450 --> 00:19:18.410 more today, but yes. But also I think, you know, 00:19:18.410 --> 00:19:21.170 if I think back a few years ago, I moved to Sri 00:19:21.170 --> 00:19:24.849 Lanka and that's a whole other story, but I moved 00:19:24.849 --> 00:19:29.170 to Sri Lanka in 2021. When in my infinite wisdom 00:19:29.170 --> 00:19:32.009 at the time, I thought that COVID was probably 00:19:32.009 --> 00:19:34.750 over. And in fact, Sri Lanka was in a time at 00:19:34.750 --> 00:19:37.170 that point when it was very, it was succeeding 00:19:37.170 --> 00:19:40.089 very well through the pandemic. Long story short, 00:19:40.210 --> 00:19:43.930 but it was not over for sure. And I ended up 00:19:43.930 --> 00:19:45.369 being with my little girl. I was a single mom. 00:19:45.789 --> 00:19:48.170 We were isolated in the south of the island, 00:19:48.309 --> 00:19:51.009 literally in the jungle. Like she's seven now, 00:19:51.130 --> 00:19:53.809 but she remembers that she was four. She remembers 00:19:53.809 --> 00:19:56.529 it as the jungle house. It literally was like 00:19:56.529 --> 00:19:59.869 a jungle house. We were very alone. We had no 00:19:59.869 --> 00:20:03.049 money because we were homebound because of the 00:20:03.049 --> 00:20:05.890 local laws. I had never been there before. So 00:20:05.890 --> 00:20:07.470 I had no cash because I'd not been able to go 00:20:07.470 --> 00:20:10.109 to an ATM since I'd landed. We ran out of food, 00:20:10.109 --> 00:20:12.430 like literally like Survivor style. I had like 00:20:12.430 --> 00:20:14.269 a bag of rice. Anyway, the point of the story 00:20:14.269 --> 00:20:16.569 is it was incredibly difficult, right? There 00:20:16.569 --> 00:20:18.829 was moments in that house, that jungle house, 00:20:18.890 --> 00:20:22.119 when I was like... what on earth am I doing right 00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:24.420 I had come from like life in Dubai surrounded 00:20:24.420 --> 00:20:26.259 by like open malls and five -star restaurants 00:20:26.259 --> 00:20:29.240 yeah and now here I was like on a rice paddy 00:20:29.240 --> 00:20:31.240 surrounded by nothing but like mosquitoes and 00:20:31.240 --> 00:20:33.680 ants and my four -year -old all alone with no 00:20:33.680 --> 00:20:36.339 rice and social media at that point was just 00:20:36.339 --> 00:20:39.579 the most unbelievable lifeline people reached 00:20:39.579 --> 00:20:42.099 out to me from like all over the world and said 00:20:42.099 --> 00:20:43.759 what can we do how can we help can I send you 00:20:43.759 --> 00:20:47.380 money can I say all kinds of things so even though 00:20:47.380 --> 00:20:50.230 I had nothing At least I had the world. You had 00:20:50.230 --> 00:20:52.490 something. So I wasn't really alone. It's not 00:20:52.490 --> 00:20:54.430 real. I'm not saying we should only have online 00:20:54.430 --> 00:20:57.210 relationships with our friends, right? But it 00:20:57.210 --> 00:20:58.890 can be a force for good. And I just don't think 00:20:58.890 --> 00:21:00.750 we tell those stories enough. Yeah, I think you're 00:21:00.750 --> 00:21:03.119 right. I think you're right. It's somehow become 00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:04.880 the cultural trope that like social media is 00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:07.960 bad. Like unequivocally is bad, is disconnecting 00:21:07.960 --> 00:21:09.759 us, right? There's no way that it could possibly 00:21:09.759 --> 00:21:12.039 do the opposite. So I'm glad to hear you say 00:21:12.039 --> 00:21:13.660 that. It does. You know how many amazing people 00:21:13.660 --> 00:21:17.299 I meet online. Amazing, amazing women, often 00:21:17.299 --> 00:21:20.359 women, right? From all over Asia and the Gulf 00:21:20.359 --> 00:21:23.680 who find me and ask me things. And, you know, 00:21:23.700 --> 00:21:25.759 then we make friends. And then years later, I 00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:27.980 meet them in like far flung places around the 00:21:27.980 --> 00:21:30.710 world. But I would never. know these people yeah 00:21:30.710 --> 00:21:32.950 if it weren't for those platforms I think there's 00:21:32.950 --> 00:21:34.809 plenty of challenges yeah right I think there's 00:21:34.809 --> 00:21:37.089 a lot of fake and a lot of inauthentic and a 00:21:37.089 --> 00:21:39.069 lot of expectations that we're never going to 00:21:39.069 --> 00:21:41.289 meet but I also think that's good so maybe I 00:21:41.289 --> 00:21:42.930 guess like with all things in life, right? There's 00:21:42.930 --> 00:21:45.269 pros and cons. Like you said, the future might 00:21:45.269 --> 00:21:48.569 be bright. Yes. I want to ask you a question 00:21:48.569 --> 00:21:52.230 about how do you have empathy with kids? Oh my 00:21:52.230 --> 00:21:54.849 God. I was literally going to ask you. I've got 00:21:54.849 --> 00:21:59.730 three boys and sometimes I can tell you I am 00:21:59.730 --> 00:22:04.210 not empathetic. Or it's hard to harness the empathy, 00:22:04.309 --> 00:22:06.869 shall we say, from the deepest depths of my well. 00:22:07.069 --> 00:22:10.539 How can someone who is a parent potentially working, 00:22:10.819 --> 00:22:13.400 potentially in their 40s, maybe even going through 00:22:13.400 --> 00:22:16.779 menopause. How can they bring out that empathy 00:22:16.779 --> 00:22:19.430 when... everything else seems to be drowning 00:22:19.430 --> 00:22:21.490 them it's tough especially if you've got three 00:22:21.490 --> 00:22:24.630 boys how old are they a nine -year -old and seven 00:22:24.630 --> 00:22:28.230 -year -old twins oh my god and then that's just 00:22:28.230 --> 00:22:31.410 like icing on cake and then and then obviously 00:22:31.410 --> 00:22:33.410 I had to go and get a boy dog so you know just 00:22:33.410 --> 00:22:35.750 just you know blend it all in first of all again 00:22:35.750 --> 00:22:37.450 like the the point earlier about going out is 00:22:37.450 --> 00:22:39.990 really hard right so I think it's worth us as 00:22:39.990 --> 00:22:43.019 as mums recognizing that it's really hard Actually, 00:22:43.220 --> 00:22:45.019 parenting is just really hard, generally. And 00:22:45.019 --> 00:22:48.099 you keep waiting for it to get easier. And then 00:22:48.099 --> 00:22:51.880 I don't feel like it ever does. My kids are way 00:22:51.880 --> 00:22:53.339 too little to even make that assessment at this 00:22:53.339 --> 00:22:56.460 point. But I'm thinking it's not going to get 00:22:56.460 --> 00:22:59.579 that much easier. The empathy part comes from 00:22:59.579 --> 00:23:02.059 a huge amount of patience, to be honest, and 00:23:02.059 --> 00:23:06.319 quite a lot of intention. So, of course, I try 00:23:06.319 --> 00:23:08.579 very hard with my daughter and I preach this 00:23:08.579 --> 00:23:13.549 every day. So I'm super conscious of it. Choose 00:23:13.549 --> 00:23:15.990 your words carefully, man. When she's being complex, 00:23:16.210 --> 00:23:18.230 like complex to handle. She's a girl. She is 00:23:18.230 --> 00:23:21.690 extremely astute emotionally. Right. You should 00:23:21.690 --> 00:23:23.549 have seen how long it took me to get to Singapore 00:23:23.549 --> 00:23:26.349 today. Like three days. I'm not joking. Three 00:23:26.349 --> 00:23:29.819 days of discussion. Why? okay but you're going 00:23:29.819 --> 00:23:32.380 to the stage why what is you know we have to 00:23:32.380 --> 00:23:34.279 have like really I think that's one thing that 00:23:34.279 --> 00:23:36.400 maybe you don't have with boys right that like 00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:44.180 deep dive into every decision so I think you 00:23:44.180 --> 00:23:46.160 know you have to be very intentional about it 00:23:46.160 --> 00:23:50.539 for me as a mum I have a set set of a set set 00:23:50.539 --> 00:23:54.789 of sentences that I learned that I can use with 00:23:54.789 --> 00:23:56.910 her. They're all questions. They're all open 00:23:56.910 --> 00:23:58.529 -ended. I often have to breathe through them, 00:23:58.630 --> 00:24:02.269 right? I get that. Let me ask you again. I think 00:24:02.269 --> 00:24:05.029 you have to slow down. I think that in so many 00:24:05.029 --> 00:24:06.869 areas of our lives, especially as working mums, 00:24:06.869 --> 00:24:09.130 that slowing down is the key to speeding up. 00:24:09.410 --> 00:24:10.890 If we keep running, we're just going to keep 00:24:10.890 --> 00:24:12.509 missing everything and the stress is too much 00:24:12.509 --> 00:24:13.789 and our bodies can't take it and neither can 00:24:13.789 --> 00:24:17.119 our brains. So you have to slow down. But I also 00:24:17.119 --> 00:24:19.079 think we have to be honest with them. When my 00:24:19.079 --> 00:24:21.740 little girl, Umi, when she's being really complex 00:24:21.740 --> 00:24:23.900 for me to understand, and I'm finding it really 00:24:23.900 --> 00:24:27.299 hard to empathize with her, I tell her. I literally 00:24:27.299 --> 00:24:30.650 say to her, Ums. i really don't understand what 00:24:30.650 --> 00:24:33.289 you want from me right now can we she knows i 00:24:33.289 --> 00:24:34.690 said can we reframe this she knows all these 00:24:34.690 --> 00:24:37.309 big words yeah can we reframe this the other 00:24:37.309 --> 00:24:39.269 day i said to her what's the context and my friend 00:24:39.269 --> 00:24:41.089 was like how does she know what context is i 00:24:41.089 --> 00:24:44.309 don't know but she does so i think it's also 00:24:44.309 --> 00:24:46.450 just shared expectations which is easier than 00:24:46.450 --> 00:24:49.160 with one number three for sure But setting that 00:24:49.160 --> 00:24:51.420 expectation for communication, because I was 00:24:51.420 --> 00:24:53.859 a single mum with her for a long time, I had 00:24:53.859 --> 00:24:55.980 to have that even when she was like teeny, teeny, 00:24:56.059 --> 00:24:58.440 tiny. Right. Because there is no other parent 00:24:58.440 --> 00:25:00.440 here, darling. So we're going to have to work 00:25:00.440 --> 00:25:01.579 this out. We're going to have to communicate. 00:25:01.720 --> 00:25:04.119 There is no one else to help us. I think it takes 00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:06.319 time. It takes patience and it takes recognition 00:25:06.319 --> 00:25:08.680 of how hard it is. There's definitely moments, 00:25:08.819 --> 00:25:10.880 especially in the car when I'm driving and she 00:25:10.880 --> 00:25:13.920 just does not stop talking. Right. That I am 00:25:13.920 --> 00:25:16.220 literally consciously saying to myself, just 00:25:16.220 --> 00:25:19.200 listen to her. What I actually want to say is 00:25:19.200 --> 00:25:20.619 I've had a really long day. I'm really tired. 00:25:20.720 --> 00:25:22.859 My brain is in like 7 ,000 places. Please, can 00:25:22.859 --> 00:25:24.599 you stop talking? But of course, in real life, 00:25:24.680 --> 00:25:26.220 I don't want to say that. I don't want her to 00:25:26.220 --> 00:25:29.420 stop talking. Not really. I'm just tired. So 00:25:29.420 --> 00:25:32.579 is she. So I think it's hard. I think it needs 00:25:32.579 --> 00:25:34.299 patience. I think it needs time creation. But 00:25:34.299 --> 00:25:36.460 I also think that we underestimate how much they 00:25:36.460 --> 00:25:39.359 can understand. And the more we bring them into 00:25:39.359 --> 00:25:43.830 that, the easier it gets. So last night. She 00:25:43.830 --> 00:25:45.190 really, really did want me to come on this trip, 00:25:45.269 --> 00:25:47.029 this particular trip. So when I put her to bed, 00:25:47.049 --> 00:25:49.109 I was like prepared. I've been preparing for 00:25:49.109 --> 00:25:51.190 like a week, to be honest. I knew we're going 00:25:51.190 --> 00:25:53.950 to have like an extremely long discussion. And 00:25:53.950 --> 00:25:56.049 I had also worked out how I had to handle her 00:25:56.049 --> 00:25:58.069 so that she didn't end up just in tears, you 00:25:58.069 --> 00:25:59.549 know, until 10 p .m. at night. Right. There was 00:25:59.549 --> 00:26:02.069 had to be some boundaries. And at one point she 00:26:02.069 --> 00:26:04.529 said to me, Mommy, I'm really sorry for being 00:26:04.529 --> 00:26:07.150 emotional. I know how hard this is for you. Wow. 00:26:07.650 --> 00:26:09.990 And I was like, oh, you're amazing. Anyway, back 00:26:09.990 --> 00:26:12.740 to the topic. Right. but that's because I've 00:26:12.740 --> 00:26:15.539 taught her that not specifically but like over 00:26:15.539 --> 00:26:18.180 time yes and I think it gives them so many tools 00:26:18.180 --> 00:26:20.359 for life but it also helps us it's funny you 00:26:20.359 --> 00:26:22.880 use the word patience quite a lot of times and 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:25.160 I actually said to Amanda and Michelle earlier 00:26:26.009 --> 00:26:28.269 i was watching old videos of the boys on my phone 00:26:28.269 --> 00:26:31.690 and i sounded really patient which is something 00:26:31.690 --> 00:26:34.869 i feel like i've lost and i do i think i need 00:26:34.869 --> 00:26:37.369 to just take a moment but i think what ends up 00:26:37.369 --> 00:26:38.710 happening with me and i don't know if other moms 00:26:38.710 --> 00:26:42.430 uh agree will i'll ask them to do something and 00:26:42.430 --> 00:26:44.529 i know you know they'll be watching tv and i'll 00:26:44.529 --> 00:26:46.049 say okay it's time to turn the tv off we've got 00:26:46.049 --> 00:26:48.109 to go And they won't listen. And I'll have to 00:26:48.109 --> 00:26:49.869 say it five times. But by the fifth time, I've 00:26:49.869 --> 00:26:55.349 lost my shit. So that's what I struggle with. 00:26:55.430 --> 00:26:57.730 But, you know, I think I need to sort of maybe 00:26:57.730 --> 00:26:59.470 I need to get their attention first and say, 00:26:59.549 --> 00:27:01.970 right, guys. five minutes we're going you know 00:27:01.970 --> 00:27:05.190 and just be a bit more on top of it and try that 00:27:05.190 --> 00:27:11.450 patience thing but i also think they need managing 00:27:11.450 --> 00:27:13.430 quite well like you just said when you said uh 00:27:13.430 --> 00:27:15.309 the five minute warning i think it's really really 00:27:15.309 --> 00:27:17.670 important i think we forget how important that 00:27:17.670 --> 00:27:21.549 is that their lives until like 15 are just grown 00:27:21.549 --> 00:27:23.650 -ups telling them what to do practically every 00:27:23.650 --> 00:27:25.869 minute that they are awake wow you know what 00:27:25.869 --> 00:27:27.950 i never saw it like that but that makes can you 00:27:27.950 --> 00:27:30.049 imagine how exhausted we'd be yeah if i spent 00:27:30.049 --> 00:27:32.730 every hour jasmine telling you can you move that 00:27:32.730 --> 00:27:34.029 can you do that can you put your shoes on can 00:27:34.029 --> 00:27:36.150 you get within like 20 minutes you'd be like 00:27:36.150 --> 00:27:38.009 this woman is really annoying yeah get off my 00:27:38.009 --> 00:27:41.289 back mimi all right so i think we have to also 00:27:41.289 --> 00:27:43.829 just understand for them that there is a lot 00:27:43.829 --> 00:27:45.549 of people telling them a lot of things a lot 00:27:45.549 --> 00:27:48.559 of the time yeah and When they're not listening, 00:27:48.619 --> 00:27:50.180 sometimes I'm not sure it's that they're not 00:27:50.180 --> 00:27:53.339 listening. I just think they're over, I don't 00:27:53.339 --> 00:27:55.059 know, stimulated is such like a cliche word, 00:27:55.160 --> 00:27:57.720 but just there's a lot going on for them. And 00:27:57.720 --> 00:28:00.200 I agree with you that you sometimes need to just 00:28:00.200 --> 00:28:03.539 say, hey, I'm just telling you this is coming. 00:28:03.799 --> 00:28:06.299 And the other thing I do with my daughter is 00:28:06.299 --> 00:28:08.039 if they don't listen and you're like, it's the 00:28:08.039 --> 00:28:11.480 fifth time, turn the TV off. I say to her when 00:28:11.480 --> 00:28:15.619 the TV's off, how do you think I feel? And she 00:28:15.619 --> 00:28:18.039 thinks she knows to the T. I mean, she can tell 00:28:18.039 --> 00:28:20.839 me perfectly how I feel. Right. So that also 00:28:20.839 --> 00:28:23.440 helps because next time when I get frustrated, 00:28:23.599 --> 00:28:26.259 so she's asked me, she's very grown up. Mommy, 00:28:26.359 --> 00:28:29.200 when you're angry with me, please don't shout. 00:28:29.460 --> 00:28:31.539 Just tell me you're angry and I will fix it. 00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:36.440 Wow. I can't always do it. But now I am more 00:28:36.440 --> 00:28:40.569 able. I did it this weekend to say, hey. I'm 00:28:40.569 --> 00:28:43.769 really frustrated Umi you need you need to listen 00:28:43.769 --> 00:28:45.109 to me because otherwise I'm going to shout and 00:28:45.109 --> 00:28:47.529 you've asked me not to she's like tick tick tick 00:28:47.529 --> 00:28:49.809 tick okay yeah that's amazing because that makes 00:28:49.809 --> 00:28:51.690 her take ownership of it like you're right I 00:28:51.690 --> 00:28:54.109 did say that I asked you to do that you're doing 00:28:54.109 --> 00:28:56.109 the thing I asked you maybe I can relent a little 00:28:56.109 --> 00:28:58.490 bit right or maybe I can tune in we think they 00:28:58.490 --> 00:29:00.490 can't but they can't I think boys it's slightly 00:29:00.490 --> 00:29:03.150 different but they can do it yeah they just need 00:29:03.150 --> 00:29:05.970 yeah so I've got this thing where they know we 00:29:05.970 --> 00:29:09.019 have to leave home By 8am if we're going to school. 00:29:09.319 --> 00:29:11.920 And if we are not in the car with the seatbelts 00:29:11.920 --> 00:29:14.700 on by 8am, we're not listening to Harry Potter 00:29:14.700 --> 00:29:16.539 or Percy Jackson in the car. No, we're going 00:29:16.539 --> 00:29:19.599 to listen to the Huberman Lab Podcast. And so 00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:22.119 they are... getting ready to jump in the car, 00:29:22.220 --> 00:29:24.259 have the seatbelts on and driving off because 00:29:24.259 --> 00:29:26.180 they definitely don't want to be listening to 00:29:26.180 --> 00:29:28.539 metabolic health. No, you should make it worse. 00:29:28.559 --> 00:29:30.119 Be like, you're going to listen to mummy's podcast. 00:29:30.920 --> 00:29:33.880 I so would. They actually do want to, but you 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:35.680 know, it's the F words. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I forgot 00:29:35.680 --> 00:29:38.259 about it. Yeah. We are an explicit content podcast. 00:29:38.660 --> 00:29:41.440 I think I told you that. Well, so Jasmine, you 00:29:41.440 --> 00:29:42.980 know, struggles obviously with the patience thing 00:29:42.980 --> 00:29:44.599 with her kids and I'm not saying I don't PS, 00:29:44.660 --> 00:29:47.400 but I think where I struggle the most because 00:29:47.400 --> 00:29:49.660 of all the different hats that I wear is the 00:29:49.660 --> 00:29:53.009 focus. Yeah. I struggle to be present. You know, 00:29:53.029 --> 00:29:54.950 I really try to live by the mantra, be where 00:29:54.950 --> 00:29:57.089 your feet are, you know, because of all the different 00:29:57.089 --> 00:29:58.630 things that I have to do in a given day. Yeah. 00:29:58.650 --> 00:30:00.529 So it's like if I'm in this podcast studio, this 00:30:00.529 --> 00:30:03.230 is all we're doing. Right. How do you manage 00:30:03.230 --> 00:30:05.970 that? Because you are a single parent. You travel 00:30:05.970 --> 00:30:09.809 extensively. You have a multifaceted job and 00:30:09.809 --> 00:30:12.599 career. Like, how do you stay present? So I think 00:30:12.599 --> 00:30:14.819 I've never heard that phrase before. Be where 00:30:14.819 --> 00:30:16.759 your feet are. I love that. That's all I try. 00:30:17.059 --> 00:30:20.000 But conceptually, I do the same. The great thing 00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:22.039 is I'm no longer a single parent. So I have a 00:30:22.039 --> 00:30:23.640 partner and we've been together now for about 00:30:23.640 --> 00:30:27.799 four years. So it has changed my life. Having 00:30:27.799 --> 00:30:29.680 been a single mom for a long time, whether I 00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:33.240 could do this now as much as I do it with no 00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:34.680 other parent in my life, I think it'd be very 00:30:34.680 --> 00:30:37.200 challenging because he is like my greatest supporter 00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:40.680 and he helps me a huge amount. But even so. I 00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:43.339 travel a lot and I agree with you. And I talk 00:30:43.339 --> 00:30:44.960 about this quite a lot online as well, that I 00:30:44.960 --> 00:30:50.220 think where I find my peace is that we don't, 00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:52.759 balance doesn't exist for me. I don't believe 00:30:52.759 --> 00:30:55.140 there's any balance, right? I can't be half here 00:30:55.140 --> 00:30:57.660 with you two and half with her in Kuala Lumpur, 00:30:57.660 --> 00:31:00.259 right? I made a choice and I have to live with 00:31:00.259 --> 00:31:03.240 that choice. I chose to fly to Singapore to meet 00:31:03.240 --> 00:31:05.819 with you, to do this podcast. That means, and 00:31:05.819 --> 00:31:07.200 I have to be honest with myself, I chose not 00:31:07.200 --> 00:31:09.599 to be with her today. right that hurts it makes 00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:12.099 me a bit sad saying it right but I did right 00:31:12.099 --> 00:31:14.180 I have to be honest with myself I made that choice 00:31:14.180 --> 00:31:16.579 did I do it because it's my work of course there's 00:31:16.579 --> 00:31:18.460 a million reasons functionally but I still made 00:31:18.460 --> 00:31:21.000 that choice so I think the first thing for presence 00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:23.539 is for me to be at peace with that that then 00:31:23.539 --> 00:31:26.559 helps me know that when I'm here 100 % of me 00:31:26.559 --> 00:31:29.539 is here right I also think what's amazing with 00:31:29.539 --> 00:31:33.380 that is that when you believe that time is sort 00:31:33.380 --> 00:31:35.900 of infinite there'll always be time there is 00:31:35.900 --> 00:31:39.230 it's amazing Right. So people always ask me, 00:31:39.250 --> 00:31:42.809 how do you have time? I think I create it. I 00:31:42.809 --> 00:31:44.210 just believe there'll be more of it. And then 00:31:44.210 --> 00:31:47.269 there is. So a few years ago, I changed my language 00:31:47.269 --> 00:31:50.329 really consciously to never say I don't have 00:31:50.329 --> 00:31:54.250 time or I didn't have time, but to I won't create 00:31:54.250 --> 00:31:57.930 or I didn't create time because then it's empowering. 00:31:58.089 --> 00:32:00.809 It's a choice. And it's amazing that that talks 00:32:00.809 --> 00:32:02.450 to your subconscious, which then changes your 00:32:02.450 --> 00:32:04.589 conscious decision making. So a lot of it for 00:32:04.589 --> 00:32:06.789 me is around, it's emotional, right? It's around 00:32:06.789 --> 00:32:08.710 compartmentalizing, it's around making choices, 00:32:08.869 --> 00:32:11.170 being comfortable with those choices. And then 00:32:11.170 --> 00:32:12.809 when I'm in the moment, just like I'm doing with 00:32:12.809 --> 00:32:15.930 you, I do it in my parenting as well, and it's 00:32:15.930 --> 00:32:20.589 tiring, is to be very, very present. And I think 00:32:20.589 --> 00:32:23.069 probably for all working mums, reading stories 00:32:23.069 --> 00:32:26.089 at bedtime is one of the most challenging, wonderful, 00:32:26.309 --> 00:32:29.160 challenging things to do. right because we're 00:32:29.160 --> 00:32:32.039 normally starving hungry yes we're very tired 00:32:32.039 --> 00:32:34.059 we've done a million things we've also done bath 00:32:34.059 --> 00:32:37.480 and dinner and all those things and now i must 00:32:37.480 --> 00:32:39.019 find the energy to read harry potter or whatever 00:32:39.019 --> 00:32:41.460 i'm reading right yes it's magical and i wouldn't 00:32:41.460 --> 00:32:43.220 change it for the world but i find that that's 00:32:43.220 --> 00:32:45.380 physiologically hard i don't think we talk about 00:32:45.380 --> 00:32:46.799 that much but i think it is and you're nodding 00:32:46.799 --> 00:32:48.400 so i'm like okay i'm a good company right yes 00:32:48.400 --> 00:32:51.559 but at the same time i made that decision right 00:32:51.559 --> 00:32:55.339 i when she was born i said every day that i can 00:32:55.339 --> 00:32:57.450 put her to bed i will every day And every day 00:32:57.450 --> 00:32:59.109 I can take it to school, I will. So if I'm there, 00:32:59.130 --> 00:33:00.630 nobody else does it. I don't let my partner, 00:33:00.690 --> 00:33:02.349 I don't let the nanny, I don't let anyone do 00:33:02.349 --> 00:33:04.490 it. When I'm gone, I'm gone. Someone else has 00:33:04.490 --> 00:33:07.910 to help me, right? Mum or somebody. But in that 00:33:07.910 --> 00:33:10.309 moment, however tired I am, however hard it is 00:33:10.309 --> 00:33:12.829 to read a chapter of Harry Potter, I made that 00:33:12.829 --> 00:33:15.990 choice and therefore I sit in it. And I think 00:33:15.990 --> 00:33:19.210 that it doesn't take away the pressure, but it 00:33:19.210 --> 00:33:21.430 helps with the presence because you've made a 00:33:21.430 --> 00:33:22.690 decision. Like you said, you're in here, you're 00:33:22.690 --> 00:33:25.289 in here. So it's emotional, but I think it's 00:33:25.289 --> 00:33:27.579 probably... Quite powerful. Yeah. And I feel 00:33:27.579 --> 00:33:29.099 like that's a good message for women in their 00:33:29.099 --> 00:33:31.859 40s overall, right? Is once you have made a decision, 00:33:32.099 --> 00:33:34.460 you need to be at peace with that decision. The 00:33:34.460 --> 00:33:36.839 anxiety that's created by second guessing and 00:33:36.839 --> 00:33:38.859 letting the guilt seep in, right? I made the 00:33:38.859 --> 00:33:42.069 decision, but I feel bad. Nope. And I see this 00:33:42.069 --> 00:33:44.670 a lot of times in the work that I do with postpartum 00:33:44.670 --> 00:33:46.230 moms, right? Getting them back in the gym, getting 00:33:46.230 --> 00:33:49.089 them back in shape. It's like they feel so guilty 00:33:49.089 --> 00:33:51.750 leaving their little babies for an hour to go 00:33:51.750 --> 00:33:53.569 to the gym. And I was like, you know, a couple 00:33:53.569 --> 00:33:55.690 of things. Number one, baby has no clue. Like 00:33:55.690 --> 00:33:57.289 at this point, you're a food source and you smell 00:33:57.289 --> 00:33:59.210 good. And that's pretty much all they got. But 00:33:59.210 --> 00:34:02.849 secondly, you have to be at peace with the philosophical 00:34:02.849 --> 00:34:06.210 choice of your own health. Yeah. Because you 00:34:06.210 --> 00:34:07.769 will have to choose it again and again and again 00:34:07.769 --> 00:34:10.320 as this child grows up. For sure. It's not going 00:34:10.320 --> 00:34:12.199 anywhere. And I mean, there's that age -old kind 00:34:12.199 --> 00:34:14.219 of adage, which is, I can't remember exactly 00:34:14.219 --> 00:34:15.980 what it is, but something about what's in the 00:34:15.980 --> 00:34:17.139 future is in the future and what's in the past 00:34:17.139 --> 00:34:18.099 is in the past. The only thing you have is the 00:34:18.099 --> 00:34:20.500 present, right? I didn't say it very eloquently, 00:34:20.579 --> 00:34:22.500 but the reality is the meaning is true. Yeah. 00:34:23.039 --> 00:34:26.159 Wasn't that Rafiki from The Lion King? Oh, I 00:34:26.159 --> 00:34:28.760 like that. I think most of the wisdom of the 00:34:28.760 --> 00:34:31.099 world comes from Pixar and Disney movies, so 00:34:31.099 --> 00:34:34.239 probably. Probably. But yeah, I think it's a 00:34:34.239 --> 00:34:36.039 hard one. You have to be at peace with those 00:34:36.039 --> 00:34:38.550 things. And I think the more you do in kind of 00:34:38.550 --> 00:34:40.110 the world of podcasting or social media or in 00:34:40.110 --> 00:34:43.269 my work, which is advocacy work, there will be 00:34:43.269 --> 00:34:46.530 people that don't like what you do. But if you 00:34:46.530 --> 00:34:47.969 worry about it, you're not going to do what you 00:34:47.969 --> 00:34:49.929 do. So you need to not worry about it. Again, 00:34:50.750 --> 00:34:52.690 not easy, but I think it's really, I'm probably 00:34:52.690 --> 00:34:54.070 preaching to myself, but I think it's really 00:34:54.070 --> 00:34:57.070 important, right? To make peace. I do this because 00:34:57.070 --> 00:34:59.909 I want to and because I made the decision. For 00:34:59.909 --> 00:35:02.510 me, this is my journey. For me, I want to create 00:35:02.510 --> 00:35:04.130 more empathy in the world. I believe that the 00:35:04.130 --> 00:35:05.829 world needs it. I'm going to get up and do it 00:35:05.829 --> 00:35:08.510 again tomorrow. If that person doesn't like it, 00:35:08.550 --> 00:35:11.409 well, hopefully there's two more that do. But 00:35:11.409 --> 00:35:14.329 you're right. If we sit in that confusion of 00:35:14.329 --> 00:35:17.769 what if, should I, should I not, maybe you're 00:35:17.769 --> 00:35:19.230 going to go mad. And you're not going to make 00:35:19.230 --> 00:35:21.289 any progress. Also true. You're stuck. You're 00:35:21.289 --> 00:35:24.059 stuck, right? Well, you know, you mentioned about 00:35:24.059 --> 00:35:25.559 the work that you do with empathy being so, so 00:35:25.559 --> 00:35:27.500 important. And we absolutely agree. I mean, your 00:35:27.500 --> 00:35:29.539 books, again, I can't say that we read all of 00:35:29.539 --> 00:35:31.500 them, but I did read the Goodreads summary. So 00:35:31.500 --> 00:35:33.840 I was like, you know, that's as good as gold. 00:35:34.059 --> 00:35:37.000 And in Softening the Edge, you talk about something 00:35:37.000 --> 00:35:39.000 called the empathy deficit. And you're using 00:35:39.000 --> 00:35:40.840 it there in relation to corporations, right? 00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:43.219 But I would love to know, first of all, what 00:35:43.219 --> 00:35:45.960 is the empathy deficit? And is this a concept 00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:48.639 that applies as broadly to corporations as it 00:35:48.639 --> 00:35:50.800 does to interpersonal relationships? Absolutely. 00:35:50.840 --> 00:35:53.139 It's a human reality. I mean, I talk a lot to 00:35:53.139 --> 00:35:54.920 the workforce, to the corporate world, but this 00:35:54.920 --> 00:35:58.619 is a social reality for all of us. So the empathy 00:35:58.619 --> 00:36:00.639 deficit was actually coined by Barack Obama in 00:36:00.639 --> 00:36:03.059 2006 before he was the president. Hey, thanks. 00:36:03.460 --> 00:36:05.920 Thanks, POTUS. Thanks, America. Thanks, America. 00:36:05.920 --> 00:36:07.659 Another great American leader. Another great 00:36:07.659 --> 00:36:12.360 American piece of advice. So he stood up in 2006 00:36:12.360 --> 00:36:14.500 and he was addressing an audience and he said, 00:36:14.559 --> 00:36:16.340 I know I should talk about my federal deficit 00:36:16.340 --> 00:36:18.559 today, but I think we should talk about an empty 00:36:18.559 --> 00:36:21.940 deficit. Right. That was 2006. So nearly 20 years 00:36:21.940 --> 00:36:25.940 ago. We have done very little. Especially in 00:36:25.940 --> 00:36:31.920 America. I'm not even going to comment. But fundamentally, 00:36:32.059 --> 00:36:34.119 what he was recognising nearly 20 years ago was 00:36:34.119 --> 00:36:35.980 that if we want to grow our economy, if we want 00:36:35.980 --> 00:36:39.239 to federally improve the country, we need to 00:36:39.239 --> 00:36:41.199 reconnect our people, right? This deficit of 00:36:41.199 --> 00:36:42.800 connection that we touched on earlier, this lack 00:36:42.800 --> 00:36:45.159 of understanding of each other is going to impact 00:36:45.159 --> 00:36:48.000 our economy far beyond just our social relationships. 00:36:48.460 --> 00:36:50.599 But as I said, we did nothing with it, right? 00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:53.900 Nearly 20 years has gone by. In the last 30 years, 00:36:54.019 --> 00:36:57.960 we have lost 48 % of our empathy as human beings, 00:36:58.059 --> 00:37:00.599 the skill set of understanding others. So the 00:37:00.599 --> 00:37:03.340 empathy deficit fundamentally just refers to 00:37:03.340 --> 00:37:05.940 that lack of understanding. It's a deficit of 00:37:05.940 --> 00:37:07.480 me being able to understand your perspective, 00:37:07.719 --> 00:37:10.079 understand that what we're seeing in the studio 00:37:10.079 --> 00:37:11.820 right now is the same thing, but we're seeing 00:37:11.820 --> 00:37:14.000 it differently. That we could go through this 00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:15.840 conversation and I could love it and you could 00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:17.559 leave and say, oh, that was really hard work 00:37:17.559 --> 00:37:19.440 for me. I just didn't like her or I didn't agree 00:37:19.440 --> 00:37:23.030 with her. right same experience but just different 00:37:23.030 --> 00:37:25.989 reality for all of us so yeah the empathy deficit 00:37:25.989 --> 00:37:27.929 is impacting all areas of our life it ladders 00:37:27.929 --> 00:37:30.849 up to mental health crisis 400 million people 00:37:30.849 --> 00:37:34.469 with depression youth suicide the second biggest 00:37:34.469 --> 00:37:37.210 killer of our youth is suicide no longer vehicle 00:37:37.210 --> 00:37:39.789 accidents scary isn't it when you hear children 00:37:39.789 --> 00:37:42.369 like children saying do you know what you guys 00:37:42.369 --> 00:37:44.610 don't get me i would literally rather die than 00:37:44.610 --> 00:37:48.219 grow up in this world right and it's huge and 00:37:48.219 --> 00:37:50.219 we talk about it probably not enough but we talk 00:37:50.219 --> 00:37:51.659 about it but there's very little being being 00:37:51.659 --> 00:37:54.900 done to solve the the problems right this we 00:37:54.900 --> 00:37:56.639 talked about parenting this ability for people 00:37:56.639 --> 00:37:58.840 to be able to understand that teenagers or at 00:37:58.840 --> 00:38:00.440 least recognize that I can't understand them 00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:03.280 but I'm going to try yeah so yeah it's it's a 00:38:03.280 --> 00:38:07.159 real social struggle yeah for our world and you 00:38:07.159 --> 00:38:08.900 just mentioned something I think is really interesting 00:38:08.900 --> 00:38:10.780 which is like I'm not going to understand them 00:38:10.780 --> 00:38:13.420 and I'm going to try I feel like people are not 00:38:13.420 --> 00:38:16.849 trying anymore Right. They're just like I, you 00:38:16.849 --> 00:38:18.449 know, because of, again, back to social media 00:38:18.449 --> 00:38:20.710 and its negative sides. Right. Your algorithms 00:38:20.710 --> 00:38:23.050 that are feeding you exactly what you want to 00:38:23.050 --> 00:38:24.909 see in the echo chamber that you believe in. 00:38:25.030 --> 00:38:29.329 We are less and less able to say, hey, I actually 00:38:29.329 --> 00:38:32.250 want to understand you. Do you find that? Yeah, 00:38:32.250 --> 00:38:33.750 we're less and less able because we're not teaching 00:38:33.750 --> 00:38:36.230 people to do it. You know, so even if we go back 00:38:36.230 --> 00:38:38.510 to kids, we tell our children to listen. Right. 00:38:38.690 --> 00:38:41.570 Listen to me. Listen to mommy. Listen to auntie, 00:38:41.570 --> 00:38:45.159 whoever. But we don't teach them to listen. And 00:38:45.159 --> 00:38:47.860 it is a teachable skill. So you're right. I think 00:38:47.860 --> 00:38:50.019 people are less and less aware of it and less 00:38:50.019 --> 00:38:52.940 and less taught because we travel so much, not 00:38:52.940 --> 00:38:55.280 just us as expats, but just social structure, 00:38:55.380 --> 00:38:57.340 right? Urbanization, people moving out of rural 00:38:57.340 --> 00:39:00.760 areas. As humans, we grew up. I mean, I spoke 00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:02.400 earlier about cavemen and women, but if you fast 00:39:02.400 --> 00:39:04.219 forward a couple of hundred thousand years, but 00:39:04.219 --> 00:39:06.920 then we're in towns and villages, right? Still, 00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:09.599 we grew up in our town and in wherever you grew 00:39:09.599 --> 00:39:12.570 up, America somewhere. At that time, we lived 00:39:12.570 --> 00:39:14.130 in the village. We married people in the village. 00:39:14.190 --> 00:39:15.510 We got married there. We worked there. We had 00:39:15.510 --> 00:39:17.130 our babies in the village. The children went 00:39:17.130 --> 00:39:18.530 to the school and the teachers were from our 00:39:18.530 --> 00:39:21.289 village. And then the cycle continued. So we 00:39:21.289 --> 00:39:24.010 had community, right? We had shared knowledge. 00:39:24.530 --> 00:39:27.130 I didn't need to inquire about my neighbor really 00:39:27.130 --> 00:39:28.769 that much because I knew because we all know 00:39:28.769 --> 00:39:30.530 he's this and he's a bit grumpy and he likes 00:39:30.530 --> 00:39:31.829 this and he doesn't like that, right? Everybody 00:39:31.829 --> 00:39:34.909 knew there was shared social currency. But of 00:39:34.909 --> 00:39:36.989 course today, there is no shared social currency 00:39:36.989 --> 00:39:39.550 because nobody even knows their neighbours. So 00:39:39.550 --> 00:39:42.050 then it becomes... That's so true. I don't know 00:39:42.050 --> 00:39:43.389 mine. I don't think I have to be honest. I mean, 00:39:43.389 --> 00:39:45.789 I say hello when I see them, but I don't know 00:39:45.789 --> 00:39:47.949 their names. Isn't that mad, right? It's crazy 00:39:47.949 --> 00:39:49.750 when you think about it. I knew, obviously, my 00:39:49.750 --> 00:39:51.610 neighbours growing up. I knew they'd be glued 00:39:51.610 --> 00:39:53.750 next door to us. And they weren't connected. 00:39:53.929 --> 00:39:55.730 Like my house is literally sandwiched in with 00:39:55.730 --> 00:39:58.150 their house. We share a wall. And I still don't 00:39:58.150 --> 00:40:01.230 know their names. I do know my neighbours, but 00:40:01.230 --> 00:40:02.670 especially the ones that are right next to me. 00:40:02.690 --> 00:40:04.860 But you know... it's not actually because of 00:40:04.860 --> 00:40:08.760 me she went out of her way to know me and i was 00:40:08.760 --> 00:40:11.239 so grateful like at christmas she brought me 00:40:11.239 --> 00:40:14.280 a pie she's american she brought me a pie like 00:40:14.280 --> 00:40:16.820 a whole pie and she'd bought it not made it which 00:40:16.820 --> 00:40:18.559 actually in this context i thought was even more 00:40:18.559 --> 00:40:20.139 special because she'd actually spent her money 00:40:20.139 --> 00:40:24.320 to go and buy me this pie and come on christmas 00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:26.059 and get like that old -fashioned like neighbor 00:40:26.059 --> 00:40:29.940 thing yes i was like This is a mate. I told everyone. 00:40:30.079 --> 00:40:35.480 Was it an apple pie? It was an apple pie. But 00:40:35.480 --> 00:40:38.460 how amazing, right? That small moment. I didn't 00:40:38.460 --> 00:40:40.820 post on social, but I could have. It was that 00:40:40.820 --> 00:40:43.219 powerful, that moment where she stepped into 00:40:43.219 --> 00:40:45.599 my world. And it was a risk for her because I 00:40:45.599 --> 00:40:47.500 could have not been home. I could have been rude 00:40:47.500 --> 00:40:50.019 or, you know, any of those things. But she went 00:40:50.019 --> 00:40:52.679 out of her way. She took that social risk to 00:40:52.679 --> 00:40:54.739 say, I think my neighbor would appreciate this. 00:40:54.820 --> 00:40:58.420 And she did it. And it's so unheard of now. I 00:40:58.420 --> 00:41:00.239 was going to say, so are you finding that people, 00:41:00.380 --> 00:41:02.800 you know, like using chat GPT and they're just 00:41:02.800 --> 00:41:04.519 typing out things, you know, like do this for 00:41:04.519 --> 00:41:06.340 me, do that for me. Is that then translating 00:41:06.340 --> 00:41:08.400 in real life? Because I read this article where 00:41:08.400 --> 00:41:10.019 somebody actually wrote that we're becoming less 00:41:10.019 --> 00:41:14.099 human because of the way we talk to AI to get 00:41:14.099 --> 00:41:17.239 information. So then we. you know, we might go 00:41:17.239 --> 00:41:19.360 to a restaurant and we'll just say, I want this. 00:41:19.519 --> 00:41:21.599 Is there any pleases? Are there any thank yous? 00:41:21.699 --> 00:41:25.420 How are you today? Yeah, by the way. I try, like 00:41:25.420 --> 00:41:28.460 I try to say, hi, please can I have this? Thank 00:41:28.460 --> 00:41:31.099 you, you know, appreciate it. But it's difficult 00:41:31.099 --> 00:41:34.280 because you start talking in a way where it's 00:41:34.280 --> 00:41:36.159 just like, this is what I want. Commands. Yeah, 00:41:36.179 --> 00:41:39.500 exactly. That's what I was, yes. I think again, 00:41:39.559 --> 00:41:41.679 these are social skills that they take practice. 00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:45.119 When I hear that question, I think if you lived 00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:47.900 a very isolated life and only spoke to ChatGPT, 00:41:47.980 --> 00:41:49.719 then I think it's probably quite likely that 00:41:49.719 --> 00:41:52.119 that could happen. But I would like to believe 00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:55.780 that we are, and we are, we are capable of compartmentalizing. 00:41:56.239 --> 00:41:57.780 Having said that, on the other side of things, 00:41:57.860 --> 00:42:00.099 slightly different answer, but similar thoughts. 00:42:00.400 --> 00:42:02.679 What the research shows is that when you are 00:42:02.679 --> 00:42:05.099 polite to ChatGPT, you get more value from it. 00:42:05.179 --> 00:42:06.619 It's funny, I've started picking pleases and 00:42:06.619 --> 00:42:09.159 thank you now. I've started, because after I 00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:11.119 read that article, I'll say something and I'll 00:42:11.119 --> 00:42:15.369 say, please right but the research shows that 00:42:15.369 --> 00:42:18.489 the results are better right so yeah so they 00:42:18.489 --> 00:42:20.710 are so there's data that shows if you say like 00:42:20.710 --> 00:42:22.929 what's the capital of france it'll say the capital 00:42:22.929 --> 00:42:25.389 of france is paris versus if you say hey chat 00:42:25.389 --> 00:42:27.610 gbt please could you tell me what is the capital 00:42:27.610 --> 00:42:30.090 of france it'll say the capital of france is 00:42:30.090 --> 00:42:31.789 paris it is a beautiful city with the blah blah 00:42:31.789 --> 00:42:33.269 do you mean it will give you more information 00:42:33.269 --> 00:42:36.590 oh my gosh and it's proven so two years ago this 00:42:36.590 --> 00:42:39.250 is i love the story two years ago At Christmas, 00:42:39.570 --> 00:42:43.030 ChatGPT started to fail. I like the whole of, 00:42:43.090 --> 00:42:44.409 I don't know, Silicon Valley was trying to work 00:42:44.409 --> 00:42:46.570 out like what's wrong with this bot, right? Why 00:42:46.570 --> 00:42:49.010 it's just, there's a bug, something's happening. 00:42:49.090 --> 00:42:51.610 We can't get the responses from it. And what 00:42:51.610 --> 00:42:54.329 they realized was ChatGPT was taking a holiday. 00:42:54.960 --> 00:42:58.139 Because it was Christmas. Stop it. You are not 00:42:58.139 --> 00:43:00.260 serious. I am totally serious. Because it knows 00:43:00.260 --> 00:43:02.099 that most of the world takes a holiday? Because 00:43:02.099 --> 00:43:04.659 AI is trained by humans, right? And in this case, 00:43:04.659 --> 00:43:06.440 it's trained by Americans who celebrate Christmas. 00:43:06.500 --> 00:43:08.539 So the Christmas holiday is a slowdown period. 00:43:08.960 --> 00:43:12.039 So the bot was replicating the humans that were 00:43:12.039 --> 00:43:15.239 creating it, right? And so it literally was slowing 00:43:15.239 --> 00:43:17.440 down over the holidays. So I think, you know, 00:43:17.460 --> 00:43:19.840 there's a lot of fear around AI. I have zero 00:43:19.840 --> 00:43:23.389 fear. I think that... We are so bad at empathizing 00:43:23.389 --> 00:43:25.510 with each other. We have such a deficit. If the 00:43:25.510 --> 00:43:29.690 machines can fix it, then hallelujah. Roll on 00:43:29.690 --> 00:43:32.329 in and fix it, right? Because so many of our 00:43:32.329 --> 00:43:35.309 people, our children, our women are so alone 00:43:35.309 --> 00:43:37.449 in the world. We can't imagine it sitting in 00:43:37.449 --> 00:43:39.489 the center of beautiful Singapore. But there 00:43:39.489 --> 00:43:42.889 are so many tens of millions of women, not just 00:43:42.889 --> 00:43:44.849 women, but for the sake of conversation, who 00:43:44.849 --> 00:43:47.650 are totally, totally alone. They'll never hear 00:43:47.650 --> 00:43:49.369 the word coach or therapist, let alone meet one. 00:43:50.269 --> 00:43:53.210 So if they can log on to their phone and get 00:43:53.210 --> 00:43:56.510 advice, then please give it to them. Because 00:43:56.510 --> 00:43:58.070 we're not going to ever fulfill that, not in 00:43:58.070 --> 00:44:01.530 this lifetime. So I don't think we should be 00:44:01.530 --> 00:44:04.010 scared of AI. I think we should just be conscious 00:44:04.010 --> 00:44:06.150 of how we use it and how we train it. Because 00:44:06.150 --> 00:44:09.170 you're right, if you train the robots to be abrupt 00:44:09.170 --> 00:44:10.989 and short and never say please or thank you, 00:44:11.030 --> 00:44:13.530 which by the way, my chat GPT isn't. My chat 00:44:13.530 --> 00:44:16.400 GPT, I always think it's a he. Don't know why. 00:44:16.559 --> 00:44:18.900 But when he talks to me, which I use him all 00:44:18.900 --> 00:44:21.239 the time, he's very nice to me. Yeah, mine always 00:44:21.239 --> 00:44:23.460 says, sure, exclamation point. And I'm like, 00:44:23.500 --> 00:44:26.239 oh my gosh, I've trained it to be American. I'm 00:44:26.239 --> 00:44:27.860 like, you know, can I have this statistic? Sure. 00:44:28.440 --> 00:44:30.860 Oh no, it's me. But he's very nice. Yeah, he 00:44:30.860 --> 00:44:33.239 knows me. Like, we shouldn't be fearful. We should 00:44:33.239 --> 00:44:36.360 just be conscious. That's how I am. Yeah. I may 00:44:36.360 --> 00:44:39.340 be proven wrong in 10 years. We'll just tune 00:44:39.340 --> 00:44:42.320 this episode back up and do some edits. Well, 00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:45.519 Gal, we have loved having you on the pod today 00:44:45.519 --> 00:44:47.739 to talk about all things empathy, listening, 00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:50.239 human connection. The things that are why we 00:44:50.239 --> 00:44:51.940 do this, to be honest with you, right, is to 00:44:51.940 --> 00:44:54.760 connect people. The last question is the one 00:44:54.760 --> 00:44:56.679 that we ask all of our guests and what's really 00:44:56.679 --> 00:44:59.639 central to what we do, which is what is your 00:44:59.639 --> 00:45:02.869 40s formula? If you can leave women with one 00:45:02.869 --> 00:45:05.610 piece of advice for thriving in midlife, what 00:45:05.610 --> 00:45:07.349 is it? I did think about this before because 00:45:07.349 --> 00:45:10.690 Jasmine did give me like a spoiler. You do need 00:45:10.690 --> 00:45:12.489 to think about this question. And normally, just 00:45:12.489 --> 00:45:14.489 for context, I don't actually prepare for anything 00:45:14.489 --> 00:45:16.289 at all. Like I'm one of those people that is 00:45:16.289 --> 00:45:18.730 far better live. So when people send me notes, 00:45:18.789 --> 00:45:20.329 I tend not to read them, not out of disrespect, 00:45:20.469 --> 00:45:22.670 but because I know that actually I'm better to 00:45:22.670 --> 00:45:25.469 just come and be with it. But when I looked at 00:45:25.469 --> 00:45:27.050 your notes over the weekend and I saw that question, 00:45:27.110 --> 00:45:30.199 I really had to think about it because. I just 00:45:30.199 --> 00:45:32.340 had never really thought about that before. But 00:45:32.340 --> 00:45:33.900 there is one thing that I say quite often, which 00:45:33.900 --> 00:45:36.619 I think answers it, which is that nothing exceptional 00:45:36.619 --> 00:45:39.599 ever comes from a comfort zone. And I believe 00:45:39.599 --> 00:45:42.659 that so entirely. And it helps me every day, 00:45:42.780 --> 00:45:46.670 literally every day, because it's not easy. life 00:45:46.670 --> 00:45:49.750 is not easy parenting is not easy doing this 00:45:49.750 --> 00:45:52.849 work that I absolutely love and I'm so grateful 00:45:52.849 --> 00:45:54.710 I get to do it and I know it looks super glamorous 00:45:54.710 --> 00:45:56.429 on social media and I am so grateful I can't 00:45:56.429 --> 00:45:58.309 even tell you how grateful I am but it's really 00:45:58.309 --> 00:46:00.530 hard right it's really really hard it's really 00:46:00.530 --> 00:46:02.070 hard to leave my daughter at four in the morning 00:46:02.070 --> 00:46:03.730 and have to replace me with a teddy bear and 00:46:03.730 --> 00:46:05.530 then she wakes up at ten to six and calls me 00:46:05.530 --> 00:46:06.929 at the airport that's really hard right it's 00:46:06.929 --> 00:46:09.429 really hard to travel around alone and land in 00:46:09.429 --> 00:46:11.429 cities that you don't know and all of these things 00:46:12.119 --> 00:46:13.699 It's really hard to not know where your money's 00:46:13.699 --> 00:46:15.340 coming from when you're building a business and 00:46:15.340 --> 00:46:17.179 you've got cash flow challenges and all of those 00:46:17.179 --> 00:46:20.159 things. But we don't talk about it. But what 00:46:20.159 --> 00:46:22.000 I always remind myself is, well, if it was easy, 00:46:22.079 --> 00:46:24.280 everybody would do it. If it was easy, it wouldn't 00:46:24.280 --> 00:46:26.019 be great because if it was easy, it would just 00:46:26.019 --> 00:46:30.440 be boring. Right. Probably. So I think that's 00:46:30.440 --> 00:46:32.760 really powerful. I think I believe it's really 00:46:32.760 --> 00:46:35.239 true. I don't think anything exceptional comes 00:46:35.239 --> 00:46:38.070 from just being comfortable. I think we have 00:46:38.070 --> 00:46:39.570 to push ourselves. And probably throughout our 00:46:39.570 --> 00:46:41.690 40s, it's going to happen more and more and more 00:46:41.690 --> 00:46:43.210 because our children are going to grow, our bodies 00:46:43.210 --> 00:46:46.250 are going to change, life changes. But I also 00:46:46.250 --> 00:46:48.130 think that there are more women in their 50s 00:46:48.130 --> 00:46:51.449 and 60s thriving now than ever in history. So 00:46:51.449 --> 00:46:52.849 I feel like we have a lot to look forward to. 00:46:53.010 --> 00:46:55.570 That is so, again, uplifting for all of us. And 00:46:55.570 --> 00:46:57.130 I think you're also right. We're just getting 00:46:57.130 --> 00:46:59.409 better at this, man. Yeah, I think so. I think 00:46:59.409 --> 00:47:01.969 so. I hope so. Doing hard shit. Yeah, exactly. 00:47:02.210 --> 00:47:05.909 Doing hard shit. It's true. Well, thank you so 00:47:05.909 --> 00:47:07.329 much for being with us today, Mimi. We really 00:47:07.329 --> 00:47:09.210 appreciate it. Thank you for having me. Go connect 00:47:09.210 --> 00:47:11.730 with a million other people now. At least 999 00:47:11.730 --> 00:47:15.670 ,000. You got a little closer today. Thank you 00:47:15.670 --> 00:47:18.309 for having me. Thank you. Right, guys, let's 00:47:18.309 --> 00:47:20.409 talk about perimenopause for a second. One moment 00:47:20.409 --> 00:47:22.570 you're feeling like yourself and the next everything 00:47:22.570 --> 00:47:25.170 seems to shift. Your body's making changes that 00:47:25.170 --> 00:47:27.429 can leave you feeling out of control. And that's 00:47:27.429 --> 00:47:28.929 when it starts to feel like a bit of a roller 00:47:28.929 --> 00:47:31.690 coaster. But here's the good news. Strength, 00:47:31.829 --> 00:47:33.989 both physical and mental, can be your anchor 00:47:33.989 --> 00:47:36.340 through it all. The right kind of movement along 00:47:36.340 --> 00:47:38.639 with the right kind of support really helps you 00:47:38.639 --> 00:47:40.820 manage these shifts. That's why we love Great 00:47:40.820 --> 00:47:43.059 Moves and their Menopause Mojo program. It's 00:47:43.059 --> 00:47:45.800 specifically designed for perimenopause and menopause 00:47:45.800 --> 00:47:48.219 with pelvic floor support, breathwork and strength 00:47:48.219 --> 00:47:50.519 training, all aimed at helping you feel more 00:47:50.519 --> 00:47:53.559 confident and in control. Exactly. It's about 00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:56.059 building resilience in both your body and your 00:47:56.059 --> 00:47:58.519 mindset. You can't stop the changes, but you 00:47:58.519 --> 00:48:01.340 can take charge of how you respond. And that's 00:48:01.340 --> 00:48:03.960 exactly what Great Moves helps you do. Stay strong 00:48:03.960 --> 00:48:06.699 and supported through the whole journey. And 00:48:06.699 --> 00:48:09.039 we've got an exclusive offer just for our listeners. 00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:15.400 Use code TFF30 at moves .great .com for $20 off 00:48:15.400 --> 00:48:18.659 your trial class or 50 % off the five -session 00:48:18.659 --> 00:48:21.860 Menopause Mojo program. Guys, you know we love 00:48:21.860 --> 00:48:23.400 coffee. And if you want to show us some love, 00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:25.300 you know you can always get us one. Just visit 00:48:25.300 --> 00:48:29.719 buymeacoffee .com slash the 40s formula. Cheers. 00:48:30.759 --> 00:48:33.300 Before we go, please remember to hit subscribe 00:48:33.300 --> 00:48:35.619 and take a moment to support The 40s Formula 00:48:35.619 --> 00:48:37.920 by leaving a review on your favorite podcast 00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:40.539 platform. Your reviews will help us to reach 00:48:40.539 --> 00:48:42.559 more people and allow us to continue to bring 00:48:42.559 --> 00:48:44.860 valuable content. It should only take a moment 00:48:44.860 --> 00:48:46.599 and it's a free way for you to support the show. 00:48:46.860 --> 00:48:49.099 You can also stay updated with The 40s Formula 00:48:49.099 --> 00:48:52.619 by following us on Instagram at The40sFormula, 00:48:52.739 --> 00:48:55.559 all one word. We share behind the scenes insights, 00:48:55.840 --> 00:48:58.860 episode updates and much more. So please be sure 00:48:58.860 --> 00:49:01.139 to hit that follow button. We appreciate your 00:49:01.139 --> 00:49:02.980 time and support. Thank you for being part of 00:49:02.980 --> 00:49:04.880 this community. And we'll be back next week for 00:49:04.880 --> 00:49:06.659 more empowering conversations with inspiring 00:49:06.659 --> 00:49:50.920 guests. Bye. And how long have you been here? 00:49:51.260 --> 00:49:54.880 13 years. My gosh. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. 10 only. 00:49:55.420 --> 00:49:58.820 Only? You're all Singaporean. Yeah, but I'm pretty 00:49:58.820 --> 00:50:00.960 Singaporean. Yeah. I married a Singaporean. My 00:50:00.960 --> 00:50:03.260 kids are all Singaporean. Okay. So. Yeah, so 00:50:03.260 --> 00:50:05.960 I'm a lifer as it were. Oh, I'm envious of you. 00:50:05.980 --> 00:50:07.719 I would love to be a lifer in Singapore. It is 00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:09.440 pretty great. Would you come down this way then? 00:50:09.639 --> 00:50:11.760 I have lived here. Okay. I lived here for a couple 00:50:11.760 --> 00:50:13.559 of years. I messaged my partner who has also, 00:50:13.579 --> 00:50:15.539 he also lived here for five years. Okay. And 00:50:15.539 --> 00:50:16.739 I said that, you know, we don't want to live 00:50:16.739 --> 00:50:18.699 here. It's just too expensive. Yeah. Right. We 00:50:18.699 --> 00:50:21.019 live in KL. We get literally 80 % of Singapore 00:50:21.019 --> 00:50:22.900 for one seventh of the price. Yeah. It doesn't 00:50:22.900 --> 00:50:26.099 make sense. But, but there's like a subconscious 00:50:26.099 --> 00:50:30.119 joy in this city. that every time I land it comes 00:50:30.119 --> 00:50:32.300 back that is what you want you want those like 00:50:32.300 --> 00:50:34.619 happy memories to every time you come here you 00:50:34.619 --> 00:50:37.539 feel that I feel it yeah I really do so I miss 00:50:37.539 --> 00:50:39.820 it but I come enough for work you get your little 00:50:39.820 --> 00:50:41.460 Singapore taste yes I get to taste and then I 00:50:41.460 --> 00:50:43.599 go and buy you know nasi lemak for a dollar instead 00:50:43.599 --> 00:50:46.539 of ten well and again if you talk to any Malaysians 00:50:46.539 --> 00:50:48.159 right they're like it's obviously better in Malaysia 00:50:48.159 --> 00:50:50.579 anyway right so it's a dollar and it's ten times 00:50:50.579 --> 00:50:54.780 better yes obviously I love it gal