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Hello players who sit in the same exact spot for every session
and when someone else sits in their seat make them move because I'll be damned if I am moving
from my fucking assigned spot.
That was a lot in DMs.
To make everybody at the table cry on a one-shot one-off event
in a story that's pre-existing to never go back to that particular universe ever again.
Welcome back to Table Talk Season 2.
Season 2.
I'm Maddie.
And I'm Robert.
And I immediately like a middle-loss.
We don't have, so this is like, okay, if you're a long-time listener,
which if you're not a long-time listener and this is your first time tuning in,
welcome. We're so glad to have you.
You should listen to our other episodes too.
But this is going to be kind of reminiscent of our session zero from last season.
Jesus fuck.
It's been...
This is the vibe of some of our sessions.
It's chaotic. It's all over the place.
We have lots of different things that we like to talk about.
This season we're hoping that we're going to start rolling in segments.
So like reoccurring portions of each episode.
We're going to try and roll that a little bit in today.
We'll see how it goes.
But session zero for season one was very much similar.
It's kind of chaotic just to catch up, tell you who we are,
the kinds of things that we do during our week.
What we've been up to.
Systems, yeah. Just sort of our nerd stuff.
Maybe we'll talk about highlights of ours from the last season.
This is just kind of a casual hangout, a casual chat of sorts.
Because it's been a while since we've actually been in the studio recording.
Because we pre-recorded a bunch of episodes while we were on break.
And the only thing that we've come in and recorded since 2023 is...
Hang on, there's just a loose wire. What is that supposed to connect to?
I'm 99% certain that it took us centuries to figure out where this wire was supposed to go.
I don't think that one connects to anything.
I think it got plugged into something.
No, I think that's the one that when someone is like bringing someone in on Zoom or something,
they use this.
Because I think that...
Okay, yeah, I don't know. They've changed things.
Anyways, our space is constantly getting touched by other people.
And I mean, to be fair, it's a shared space.
Well, it's not ours.
But listen, we reworked the whole thing.
We moved tables in. We put the computer stuff.
We built a new studio. The two of us built a new studio.
And now people are changing fucking computer settings and things aren't the same anymore.
If the camera died and I am close to tears, but...
That's the general vibe.
We're here. And that's what matters.
So what have we been up to?
Well, this past weekend has probably been both of our biggest weekends in terms of, like,
tabletop gaming and everything just because this is the first weekend that we've played.
In a while.
In like almost two months.
Yep.
And I DM'd my first session ever.
I'm still not like a DM. I'm still calling myself player first in every capacity.
You also didn't DM in like 5e.
So you're not a real DM.
Wow.
Significantly harder system. That's all I'm saying.
It's a wholly different ball game.
This isn't that argument.
I'm a G and I'm a Game Master.
I do not want to be a DM.
I'm a bloodlust.
I don't want to touch 5e with a 10 foot pole from behind the screen.
I think you'll eventually touch it.
I think it's just going to take some time.
I'm not going to have to at some point.
But that's not either here or there.
For those that are unfamiliar with the terms, DM is Dungeon Master and GM is Game Master.
They're used pretty interchangeably.
Some people use DM specifically when talking about D&D because it's Dungeons and Dragons.
It's trademarked there.
And GM is a much more broadly used term because it can work for pretty much any system,
any TTRBG.
I mean, you name it as long as you're in control of it.
You might as well give yourself the title.
Basically in this capacity, Madison would be a GM, not a DM,
because she did not play in the D&D systems.
Oh my God.
I don't give a shit.
I just think it's funny to draw the line to be like,
you actually can't call yourself that because you didn't play in the system.
Yeah. If you're taking that stance, neck beard behavior.
I do have a neck beard right now.
I need to shave it off.
So.
But yeah, so I did a...
Well, this is kind of a practice because I have some friends that go to Purdue
that eventually are going to be coming down.
With the test dummies.
Yes, they are there.
My fucking little guinea pigs.
And it was a Percy Jackson themed one shot.
Woo.
That's going to be longer than one.
On the Kids on Bikes system.
I kept all the original stats, but I did make fun little custom character sheets.
And I ended up writing, I shit you not.
As of right now, it's 35 pages and it's still growing.
She has her own source book.
Source book for myself because I really love Percy Jackson.
And it's a world that's already so pre-established that it's not something that I can bullshit on the fly.
Having your own lore all in one place is really easy.
And just kind of advised.
Honestly, having 17 different tabs open is definitely a way to do it.
But to have one general document where you can control F or command F if you're on fucking Mac, I guess.
I'm not happy about that.
And just be able to do it that way is so much easier.
We've all seen the people that run 25 different tabs up at the same time.
My computer is always screaming for help.
I'm guilty of it occasionally, but I do my best to keep them decluttered.
And having all of your data and your information and your stat blocks either on the same app or relatively between the same two or three documents.
Highly advised.
Because otherwise, if you don't know your content like the back of your hand, someone's going to ask you a question that you weren't prepared for.
And you're going to have to go, uh, give me a second.
Talks amongst yourselves.
And then you're going to listen to the world's most awkward role play as none of them know how to make casual conversation.
Correct.
And it was, this was something where I was pulling.
So the premise for the one shot was basically cool.
This group of like, um, fucking 13 to 15 year olds, um, are all, uh, arrive at Camp Half-Lud in the same week.
They're newbies.
Uh, they haven't been claimed by their godly parent.
This was basically a fun little one shot where they get claimed by their godly parent.
And the next time we play, uh, they're going to play a game of capture the flag.
It is very simple.
Um, I was not trying to do anything crazy.
And I was also working with people who had varying levels of like knowledge of the prison Jackson world.
Yeah.
This is crazy.
This is, this is a sidebar.
Robert has only seen the movies.
Yep.
I haven't read the books.
I haven't watched the TV show.
I've only seen the movies.
And when I first started watching the movies, I had no idea that the books were a thing.
Like I didn't know that they were based off something.
I did not know that these people actually existed.
Like I don't understand how much of a like advocate I am for watching movies first and reading book, reading books second.
Which is a crazy thing.
Because you will ruin your fucking, like, listen, there are some movies that have been objectively, not based on the content.
Are funny to watch and are a good ride.
No, I'm not.
And are super enjoyable.
And then you go and read the books and it's like, holy shit, that fucking movie was Dogwater.
Yeah.
So I'm just an advocate for watching first and reading second.
Because the worst thing that happens when you read the book after you watch the movies, you're like, wow.
There's a point of.
His book is so fucking cool.
Well, because-
These characters are so much more interesting.
Yeah, because the movie's never going to be able to like fully show that.
Unless you do it over like 35 movies like Doon's Planning on Doing.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, Doon, yay.
Or the MCU.
The colossal amount of comic book character stuff they have to pack in.
But so I was working with people like Robert, who had all, which is still so crazy.
Only seeing the movies and I heard about the books.
Who like, I read the books and like, I was like, I have like, it's not really a secret that I read as someone who's very much been on Tumblr for a very long time.
I thought these people were fake.
I didn't think there were people out there that actually had like only seen the movies and didn't even know they were books.
That was crazy.
There was a crazy conversation for me to have.
So I had people like that and then I also had people who had read all the books.
But it had been a couple of years.
And then-
That's a shirt for Camp Jupiter.
Yeah.
And he talks about how much certain characters mean to him and pretty much spent the whole session fanboying over individuals that he made camp.
He was so cute.
So I knew that since I was like going to be working, I wanted to do something introductory and then with that also, with it being such a pre-established world, it's not something where someone can be like, okay, get it.
Cool.
Like, what do I see around?
Because like in the Kids on Bike system and the thing that I love the most about it, and we'll probably do a whole episode this season about Kids on Bikes just because I love it so much.
It's so collaborative.
Like it is like, yeah, there's a GM, but the players also have a like huge chunk in creating the world and shaping the world and like kind of GMing the world because they get like full control over their actions and certain points and stuff.
And this was kind of difficult to balance with that system just because it's so pre-established.
So I was like working with like, I was putting together, I was like rereading some of the books and like taking like chunks of text out and then I was going from like fan wiki pages and like putting all this together.
Yep.
So I put a fuck ton together and I wanted to have it printed out because I learned very quickly.
I want my physical stuff if I'm behind this.
I mean, I'm good either way, man.
I want physical, I want paper.
I don't want to be on my computer.
I think there's just a lot to be said about choosing to place a campaign in a world that already exists and already has source material versus like making your own from scratch.
Yeah.
Or kind of doing it in between.
And I think the collaborativeness can exist in D&D as well.
I think the biggest issue is that D&D specifically, fifth edition is so rule heavy and so text based and it really takes some, and this is not to say that you can't get into it.
I mean, pretty much all of season one was dedicated how to get into 5e specifically, but it takes a certain kind of person and group of people in a DM to make a collaborative space in a world that is so bogged down by mechanics and spells and classes and subclasses and multi classes.
And kids on bikes, kids on brim just doesn't really come with a lot of that.
So you can put a significantly bigger emphasis on the role playing aspect of it and less on the mechanics of the world.
So it just, it kind of depends.
I think you can achieve the same thing in both.
I think you just have to work a lot more to get that to happen in 5e as opposed to something like kids on bikes, kids on bikes, kids on brims that kind of happens a little bit more naturally.
Yeah.
Because you don't have 76 different spells to look at at any given time and you don't have a movement speed to pay attention to and you don't have an AC to keep in mind.
It's a lot more, it's free and I like that because I'm someone with more of a background and like stage improv and like less of like, I'm very good at the like.
And Robert helped me a lot and I do have to give him a shout out with the night before we ended up switching the days that we were going to play because we were going to play mine one shot on Sunday and we were going to play our kind of like one off of our regular campaign.
Yeah, which we'll talk about after hers and you'll understand why we made that switch.
Yeah, but we decided to switch like the night before at like 10 o'clock and I'm sitting there and I like at one point look at Robert and I'm like, I need fucking help.
I don't know how mechanics work in this like I'm mechanics are not my strength.
I'm great with the like creativity aspect of it.
I'm cool with coming up with names and puns and plot hooks and story hooks and story beats and like all of the creative aspects of it.
But when it comes to like making it tangible that part is very scary for me.
So I had Robert help me a lot setting a stat block or figuring out how a specific thing works or what kind of a DC or an AC or that sort of thing to set for things is very difficult.
And I think that's why fighting in particular is so impenetrable to people that are more improv and background and want to GM or want to be a player.
But they don't necessarily know how to get into the game.
It's because there's so much to learn and there's so much to get bogged down in and there's so many mechanics to memorize that it's just impossible.
Personally, I think you should start.
I think anyone who wants to get into it should start with listening to our podcast.
Listening to our podcast.
One of our friends.
I have six episodes is basically just straight how to play the game from both the human player side.
I think this is the fastest shout out to one of our friends that now listens to the podcast and he came over one night and he asked Robert legitimately and he goes hey.
And all of our friends are like hyper aware that we have a podcast because I talk about it a lot and like we mentioned a lot only one of our friends can sit like listens to it.
Everyone else is like oh we'll get around to it.
Oh we'll get around to it and we're like OK that's fine.
I'm only a little bit better about that but it's fine.
And he came over and he asked Robert he was like do you have a good like D&D podcasts that I can listen to and Robert started giving other recommendations.
Yeah I didn't even mention our before our podcast and then he tossed it over to me because he was like oh Maddie she knows like a lot more about like different podcasts and stuff and I do.
And she'll like kind of toss it over to me and I was like I looked at Robert and I was like are you being fucking serious right now.
I was like just it feels weird plugging your own shit.
I have no problem I'm shameless.
Yeah I mean you're also a lot more experienced with the social media stuff and I mean I'm in a world where I have to ask people for a lot of different things but I'm a lot more comfortable asking somebody for hundreds of thousands of dollars than like asking them to go listen to me talk for a couple hours so we can get a couple streams.
No I'm like I my job is so opposite of the spectrum.
Begging on my hands and knees for people to support my artwork.
So this is nothing for me.
I'm just going to give you some small presentations and fucking budget package numbers and look at this look how pretty that is.
Wouldn't it be cool if you had your name on that if you just gave us a little bit of extra money like very different ways of approaching it but yeah she did great.
All I truly all I helped was mechanics and figuring out.
This person this is this item what does it do and even in other systems that aren't 5VM there's there's a lot to figure out in terms of how an item or a class feature or this or that works because ideally the things that you give your players augment their
experience as opposed to they constantly have to keep track of it or maintain it like there are some magical items out there that in mechanics that are just an absolute fucking pain in the ass to work with because there's a negative to them or you have to keep track of how many
times you've done this or how many times you've done that and it adds an option to combat or an option to role play and it's like cool I would love to just get the thing and not have to press the button every time.
Or it's like well did you forget that you had to maintain concentration on like shit like that.
And kids on bikes is good and there wasn't a really I didn't need to give everyone magical items I wanted to because fun experience Jackson world if you know a lot of the demi gods will have like gifts from their godly parent so like
Annabeth has her little hat that makes her invisible and Luke RIP had a pair of shoes that grew wings and Percy Jackson has ripped ties and so I was like OK it would also be fun for these players because of the way that they built their stats
I will also say this was another really fun discovery from playing this game so I love everyone to death and I've talked about this before on this podcast of I play at a other than me it is a all male table.
At this point this is a PSA if you know anybody that is like between the ages of like I don't know if I can 19 to 23 that is a female and that plays like a female that would love to play in another setting or the table please please send them this direction.
I love my male friends there's some of the best friends I have please.
I am constantly there's this I thought everybody at that fucking table was going to take the same goddamn highest.
So the way that the kids on bikes and I'll get into this more later is basically a dice for each for each one of your stats and you do D 20 for your highest that and then D 4 for your lowest that so basically all the characters are min maxed.
Yep which is a fun mechanic and so I'm working with everyone one on one and I'm like working them through because they've never played in the system before and I'm explaining how it works and I shit you not every single one of them with the exception of one of them chose either fight.
Or grit as they're like as their D 20 fight is your brain fight is your like your all of that ability to fight as opposed to brawn which is like brute strength and then grit is like street smarts.
So you can imagine why a group of teenage boys or at least the characters that we were playing was would all choose one of those two to be really good at it when it wasn't it was like all of their stats were basically the same and I was just like okay.
See I didn't fault myself too much because I went in with a really specific idea of what kind of character I wanted to play and then I got there and realized that I needed to be a wholly different character just to assist Madison and with ropeling purposes because I wanted to be like cool kid like cracks a few jokes like blond hair blue
white like the popular guy that everybody wants to be that doesn't slay you know and then I realized very quickly that that just wasn't gonna work with the group of people we had because they already had very similar personalities like two of the people I feel like have very similar personalities
and have that like cool guy very few lines of dialogue gonna make jokes like hit the gritty like shit like that so I did I chose to be a lot more like a pretty and high energy and nervous and it worked really well and I think that's something that I've talked before about like feeling conflicted of like when you're playing
as a character that you've built to be kind of selfish yourself centered and then you get to the table and you quickly realize okay that's not gonna work with this group is nobody else is gonna take no one else is gonna take the initiative to interact with each other and maybe that's just
because people aren't as comfortable I don't have as hard of a problem is just leaving motherfuckers like when I was like cool I'm gonna just go back and grab my shoes yeah it's like I'm just leaving y'all can go look at fucking swords I guess I don't
have interest in that but I'm gonna send as much hurt time leaving people know I do and that's why I was like like I'm one of our previous campaigns I was playing a character Magnolia who I talked about for and she's extremely selfish like the most selfish
to the core to the core just one of the most selfish people in the like literally in the multiverse like canonically that was true and there were times at the table I was like well I guess she's gonna double back and get someone because nobody else is going to
she is up now I've got to play fucking friendly even though I don't want to and there's no reason for my character to it is just me as a player looking at Robert and Robert being like you gotta do something because I can't rely on anyone else in this moment to get it like to pick up what I'm putting down and that's also part of because we
understate what the other person is trying to do a lot of the time from GMN I mean the podcast has been a thing and we also do a lot of we I think we talked the most outside of the games about decisions being made on either side of the board so just trying to be there is a player or a
DM for the other person I think is a lot easier and a little bit like it is to an extent it's like hey I need this session to go really well I need everyone to stay on point I know that I'm gonna have to wrinkle a few of you can just like heard them from the inside yeah which I would love to have a relationship with all of my
players but they come in with their own agenda things that they would like to do and that's fine that's the game we're playing but when I've spent the last four steps four sessions playing damage control and I just need to get us back on track
y'all just you gotta cooperate you gotta bend the knee you gotta take the L I would love for you to all be your main characters will get there I need you to just shut the fuck up and strap in and just watch the storytelling unfold and tell me yes or no
it's okay to have a plan to the table that's that's what I'm saying at the end of the and I would love for all of my players to be plants at the table but they they wouldn't all respond the same way that Madison does so
I love direction also that's an actor thing but it was really fun one of my highlights from the session so Robert was playing a character who was unclaimed he came in I knew from the beginning that I wanted one person at the table to be a child of Nike
because I think that that's really fun to me so I was really proud of the the magical item that he got which was a retro pair of Nike sneakers
it's clean and like oh my god what was it it was either like it was like a plus three plus all things you see anything's plus two to all failures and then all of my adversity dice or adversity tokens are worth double
yeah which is crazy I made everyone beyond broken and that's going to come back to bite me in the ass later I'm sure maybe for sure when I have players and one shot that you go like one more session to get through and then yeah
we'll probably take a significant break between the next one yeah I'm not too stressed about it but that was really really fun that was my question for viewers and also just out of my curiosity so you mentioned
the highlight what was a low light of the session like as being a DM that was one thing that you hit me or like shit I'm trying to decide how honest I want to be one thing in particular that was more you focused on this player
this is more me focused I think that I've always said before the main reason that I don't GM or DM is I've got too many control issues and I think that I think I did a pretty good job all things considered for myself
but I think there were times where I definitely felt like a lack of control and just kind of like okay I guess I guess that's what we're doing and it's not even in a way of like in something where it's like no I want to choose the decisions that you make
it was like and I'm gonna cite a specific moment because Robert and I have talked about it in length already because we have our debrief sessions after every session that we play it's basically girl gossip but it's about Dungeons and Dragons
and there was a part where I was like okay here's this giant map and I mean like I paid $5 on Etsy for someone for someone's map and it was like incredible it had a list of like I think maybe 15 to 20 locations
it was a lot to look at from the player perspective I mean I was to the point where I was like cool I'm gonna close my eyes I'm gonna put my finger on the screen and that's where we're going
I had like 25 to 30 activities for them to choose from from what they wanted to do I had 40 character names written down in case anyone wanted to talk like I was when I say I was prepped
I was prepped to a point where everyone else at the table was like when I was sitting down there like planning and they were all like sitting down playing fucking magic and some shit and they were like that's you can stop
you have like more than enough to continue this is good I think that's more than enough but there was a moment and it wasn't even that because I enjoyed the prep process and I really like that it was when
okay the first place they wanted to go was where I had anticipated them going and I tried not to anticipate that too much but I just know that this is a table full of teenage boys at this point
two of us had a 20 in fight so it was natural for us to want to go there the combat arena first because I know my players and I know the people at the table and I know that that's what they're going to choose so I had counted on that
what I didn't count on however was for these characters who after I had like spoken to the players none of them were martial like they had some high fight things but all of them were high in fight in like a very scrappy way
none of them were martial characters and they shouldn't be they're fucking 14 and this armory there's an armory there where it's got like swords and shields and I was so glad that that was the part that I dipped out of
the way that I was like okay where do you all want to go next there's a lake where you can like you can go fucking canoeing you can go swimming there's an archery field there's a climbing wall that like shoots lava at you was at this point that I said hey I got a pair of shoes waiting for me back at the
cabin and a dip in a fucking swank ass orange shirt that everybody else seems to be in and I'm all about fitting in and being the best and looking cool so I'm going to go put on those swing shoes and then orange shirt y'all have fun so he dipped and everyone else was like armory and I was like
okay armory and this was like the one place where there was not an activity like all when I mean there were activities there were like Pegasus stables where if they chose to go there they could go horseback riding like each activity had looked so best way to fucking Pegasus
like each location had activities where you could do and that's what I love it should hear some of the activities you could do at these different locations and blah blah blah blah blah and they all chose they were like armory and I was like
what the fuck do I do this isn't a place and they were like can we like see which weapons called us and like this is a fucking Harry Potter I'm sorry there's not a wand that calls to you but like this is a world in which yeah you use these weapons when there is a
legitimate fucking war and we need to arm you because that is a thing that cannon will happen you are going on a quest and we need to give you weapons or when you're training in the fucking combat arena
they aren't like weapons that you can keep this is them basically like like I so I think from the player's perspective I think this is where as a DM you have to be careful about what kind of themes and sort of tones you're setting I don't think it was anything intentional
but the the whole theme or one of the big themes of the session was like finding the thing that was yours right so being claimed by your godly parent
you know like your magical item your shoes your glasses your shirt your this your that and so I think this idea of like finding the things that call out to you immediately on day one and then like those being your thing
I think some of us again I didn't go there so I'm gonna exclude myself from this some of us got caught up in the idea of like cool so like there's gotta be a weapon that calls out to me then or this or that
and so I think just that theme of finding things and it becoming yours for the rest of time was just like enticing enough that it's like cool
I'm gonna go to the armory and see what weapon basically has my fucking name written on it in Greek you know what I'm saying and that was one of those moments is why I wouldn't there be that there like that makes fucking sense
and that was the moment where me as a GM I was being like okay this is what my players want to do and I want to to reward that and I want to like
encourage that and encourage them to do the things they want to do however this is the one fucking spot on the map that I have nothing for there's nothing to do and it is simply because there's fucking nothing to do it to shed
with weapons in it so and I was like and it's the imprevious I think this is where fire in your shoes and I had nothing prepared I think I would have said something along the lines of it's down for repair
or I would have named dropped a character and been like so and so gotten to a fight it got carried on over there it's down for repairs to the art don't go there
and then I would have directed them somewhere else or I would have had them run into somebody or something on the way to the armory that would have fully just sidetracked and been like hey let's go to this right now
like me and you right now and just completely ignore the fact that they want to go there yeah I think you don't always have to beat them over the head with a switch but sometimes you just got to be like hey man respectfully I don't have anything for you so here's the world's largest
fish hook that I'm gonna shove you on whether you want to put it in your mouth or not and then I'm just gonna yank you left and it definitely felt like I was doing that at points yeah now there were for there were for sure times and that was another thing as a GM where I was trying to figure out
and be like am I shoving something down someone's throat to a point where I'm like this is an okay thing for me to do because they're not picking it up or is this a point where I give up
but what's crazy though what's crazy is that those hooks were so beyond fucking visible and then not a single one of them except with the exception of a few a handful of times
knew that they were hooks they were just like damn that's a cool thing I guess let me do it again yeah let me do it again like I can do this one thing let me do it again
they were trying to get claimed by their godly parent and I was like huh it seems like you have a natural affinity for this or like this is going your way
they were like huh that's neat next and I'm like yeah they were like that's so cool I'm gonna go to the next thing you don't want to explore that like the whole and I think it would be different if the goal of the session was not to get everyone claimed by their godly parent
because that was a point where I'm like cool I can't make you ignore this because we only have three hours and that's it so you have to do this actually
and it was just kind of that like balancing control and like letting play and also like manufacturing and this is gonna sound kind of fucked up but making your players think they have more control than they do
100% I mean I think that's
trying to find that balance of like tricking people into thinking things are their idea
I think that's a huge skill that comes with doing it over time and why I would advise anybody that's done it for the first time and is like damn I wish I could have had them do this or I really wanted them to do that
like it's a game that you set out several hours for multiple times in a month if you're lucky to play because it takes a long time
yeah
and you'll very quickly realize that you put people in a world where they can do anything they want to with the pace they want to do it in the way that they want to do it
they are not going to do what you want them to do unless you are particularly good at it hooking people and sending them to the places and the things that you want them to do without doing it overtly and even then sometimes it doesn't work
yeah
because it's a it's a creative system people are well aware that it's a creative system and so it's not as simple as saying hey here's a really big golden key and there's a really big golden door
there are some guards over there so you should figure out how to get the guards away and then open the door
like you're three sessions deep and they're like trying to become politicians to get to the room behind the door
and it's like okay
and they've had a key for like basically 24 48 hours in real life in in-game time and it's like you really could have just been like hey guys what's that
and rolled like a DC 15 Christmas check and then opened the door
yeah
but instead we're we're choosing to like rule the town to get control of the building to then
re-hire new guards that are on our payroll to then open the door
like it's just kind of one of those things when you set people loose in a world where they can do whatever they want however they want to
that's exactly what they're going to do
yeah
and it just takes time to get better at not letting them do that
yeah
or to let them do it in the ways that you want them to
oh yeah
but yeah so that was that's kind of my soapbox and my big thing
but overall I think it went really well and who knows maybe I'll even GM a one shot this season we'll see
whoa
exciting stuff
still the player though this is still the little vacation for me
I was fine enough for those that haven't listened for a while I started as a player and then have sort of become a forever DM
I really really really enjoy doing both
I just don't always fall naturally into both
I enjoy being a player but it's almost frustrating sometimes just because I'm so used to having that not level of control but
the sort of difference in agency you have as a player versus a DM is very different
like having made the mechanics for a world and having like having set all of the boundaries and the limits for a thing and then having to be on the other side of that and go
internally I really want to look at the DM and go that doesn't make any fucking sense and you know that was an ass pool
but I can't do that because that's disrespectful to you as a player and as a DM so I'm just going to accept that I can't do this thing
it's just it's difficult especially whenever at like you're the pod that you plan everyone's a very different DM so it's some people are more lenient rule of cool
other people are like this is what I've said that's how we're going to do it
and so to be a player and somebody is a different style and you don't agree with the decision or like a world building piece
it's just like I roll and keep going so
you know down the line I'm going to be a problem for sure because I'm very loose with I very loose with my my GMing style and very like yeah that sounds cool
sure let's do it fuck it
like very very loose and very malleable as opposed to like actually paying it I'm not mechanic focused and I'm sure that that's going to be fucking infuriating for some of the people that we play with who love the mechanics
and who love the rules and don't get me wrong I do too but when I'm in control I like to ignore those because it's easier for me
and this comes to like what's your what's your more versed in right like I don't do a whole whole lot of role playing myself because it's not
it's not what I'm most vested in it's not where my sort of forte is in terms of all of the skills you have to have as being a DM
the mechanic side of things and the DC and the plot twist and the really hard mechanics and fun story points like that is what I consider myself pretty good at so
hey this shit sucks do you have something you want to send in to make it better?
criticisms, topics you'd like to see discussed or an advertisement you'd like to run maybe you even want to sponsor an episode
if so shoot us a message at mc460 at evansville.edu or dms on instagram at crescent magazine or we'll never get better like these fucking guys
usually it's a lot of players talking amongst themselves interacting with maybe two to three NPCs in a session and then figuring out plot things or you know like playing combat
and getting really involved in the mechanics or like that's just more my stuff yeah so it's nice to see sort of two different styles but speaking of my style
I think it's a good way to segue into the session that I had which is way different
so I have been a DM now for I think two years maybe going on three I've lost track
and I've been DMing for the same group of people for a while that transition once we came back from studying abroad I now DM for about five people
four of which I've known for or three of which I've known for a really long time
and then the other two I met in the last two years but we just started playing in superhero campaign not that long and in one of the previous episodes I talk about just how off the rails it got
in terms of story like it just we were on track I had I had hooks crazy turns I had I had players in the right places I had NPCs I had plot lines
and then a particular player and kind of on my behalf as well as a DM I let things get a little bit too crazy and I let a certain player make a lot of really insane decisions
and we wound up basically in Flashpoint which for those that don't know a lot about comics sort of an offshoot of the main DC timeline is called Flashpoint
it's basically where if the flash goes back and saves his mom and she dies it's a canonical event to his story and by saving his mom he never becomes the flash
and then a whole bunch of crazy fucked up things happen Batman goes dark his fucking wife is is the Joker his son like it's it just goes crazy
it's not Bruce Wayne that becomes the fucking Batman it's Thomas Wayne Bruce is the one that got shot in the alley also Batman kills motherfuckers Aquaman is a terrorist
like it just goes off the rails Superman's locked up in a fucking prison because he's an alien like it ends with fucking it's not doctor Manhattan but somebody else that's kind of on that level basically blows himself up and
eviscerates the whole world yeah so then flashed ends up having to run back in time stops himself from saving his mom and then the whole thing gets reset
but the the universe is kind of very similar in the way that I decided that I wanted to play one last session set in the what if flashpoint version where I just let that players bad decisions lead to bad consequences
it was it was one of the most fun sessions I've ever played however comma and it was like one where I was like I wish we had recorded that because we've talked about recording some of our sessions and I was like because that was like it felt like it was one of those where it felt like a perfect session
however I know that it was one of those things where it was like this me this will mean nothing to anyone else in the world but god damn it was it was brutal and it was like not as brutal as I thought it was going to be or it could have been
and it definitely could and talking to Robert he was like yeah I could have gone down that like really dark path and I mean it was pretty dark to begin with very dark
but it was an interesting experience to be on because I've done one shots before but never in like the primary universe with the primary characters that I was playing and this was just kind of a way to like reset the timeline because essentially the way that we left off was the last session we had before we went to break
I talked to the player who made the decisions and I was like hey listen I think everybody is at a position where we all really just want to get back to the way we lost the plot things have gotten really serious and really dark really quick the stakes are really high for level five
and level seven characters like we are at like basically DC fucking or yeah like like difficulty rating twenty to twenty five level stuff like we are end of times and you all have just barely cracked like teen Titan level power
like not even that they are infinitely more competent than you all are as a team because you haven't had the time to become a team yet and we now have to go basically fight Superman and the fucking government like it just got insane so
I was trying to find a way to creatively like Doctor Strange, Spider-Man No Way Home like just fucking whoop just flip it all back
and just say everybody forgot about what happened so that way we could keep some of the story points and the plot points that we liked the most while getting rid of all of the bad
there was a lot of doxing it was crazy
there was a lot of doxing but I didn't want to just do it in a one day you all wake up and forgot everything that happened
Merry Christmas we're back on the road I wanted to do it in a more creative way and so I had spoken with my fiancee who's an English major she loves writing she's read a lot of fantasy stuff and we started talking about a time jump
and then going forward from there but then there were still some issues that people have with characters because they were like I don't want to play this version of the character or I don't necessarily know if that person would want to continue being a hero
and it wasn't just one person there were several people that were thinking this like I don't know why my character would continue being a hero in this really shitty universe if we're just going to do a two year time jump
like nothing good has come of this person being in a superhero career so like why would I continue to do that
so I wanted to give people the chance to play that same character while also getting to export the natural end because I'm a huge consequences for your actions DM it's one of my favorite things to do it's like every action has a equal and opposite reaction
every like there are always consequences to your actions and I let that get away from myself in a particular character I kept setting consequences and I kept setting higher consequences in bigger consequences to be like please stop doing this
and he just like stepped on the gas and said you know what now fuck that I'm going to do it as many times as I can to see how long it takes to get to a reset
so I just a moment at the table and Robert like had message all of us he was like everyone level your characters up to 15 and we didn't really know like quite like I kind of knew what was happening but like didn't know exactly what was happening because I've talked to Robert and everything
we had very long conversations about my character in particular and I told people to expect a reset and it's like level up to 15 and then we get a text message saying level up to 15 I had just gotten in the previous session to level five
level three so we had a level jump so we were like cool this is crazy and at one point at the table while we're playing the session the character who had made some decisions looks to all of us he went hey guys I speed read his to level 15 you know
yeah and that was unhinged yeah but it was basically my approach to the session was everything at this point that could go wrong has gone wrong
and how does that play itself out in the next two to three years so I did a three year time jump and leveled everybody up from wherever they were to 15 and then basically sat down with each of them and said okay what happens between basically the end of last session to the beginning of this next one
and then I did a three year jump also gave them a setting I said okay so here's what's happened Marshal law has been instituted in this particular city the bots that are basically like fucking sentinels from X-men they essentially are made to adapt any kind of deviation and any power
they have been publicly announced on live television that they are real they exist so those have now been implemented because there's no reason to keep them behind the scenes if the public just knows they exist our number one hero basically stand in superwoman has just gone missing
has not been seen since the last big battle that she almost died in who is in theory the only person that could fix the situation and things are just bad like heroes are being executed deviants in general are being executed the equivalent of like Superman and the justice like kills the
rest of the justice league on live television yeah like it was oh yeah the the equivalent of fucking Superman in the justice league basically goes and then I guess that the appropriate thing would be more captain america's that's kind of what his character is like captain america proceeds to basically one off
the bulk in everybody else on live television and so then society just goes cool well we can't do anything about that like we have these murder bots that are able to adapt any kind of power we have rogue captain america who's basically executing anybody that the government tells him to execute
marshal laws in like is implemented heroes are allowed to be heroes villains are being prosecuted like it's just it's all bad it's all right where's your character yeah I say cool so during that they were three year period where everything is going south what is your character
doing and they all took really different directions which is really cool we had one person that basically said I'm no longer a hero I'm helping with like essentially the underground and moving people from place to place we had another person that like attempted to be a hero for a while and then some limbs get removed
by another character and now they're being a holy different hero and everyone thinks they're dead and somebody else that was like cool I'm a terrorist now I am responding in kind to what the government is now doing like they kill one of us I kill one of them they execute one of us
I'm maybe eating the bodies I'm draining their their bodies of energy on live television I'm sending a very public message that says fuck with us we fuck with you back and nobody appreciated that because all it did was escalate like the tension
and then one of our last character basically or I guess we had two more characters another character who's kind of the person started the problem decided he wanted to go on a redemption arc teams up with a villain a villain that is very well known to the team at this point who basically kicked off the sessions
kicked off our first half of the campaign and works with her hand in hand to basically create a device that's going to fix everything and then our last hero gets taken he's a he's sort of a robot one of these murder bots that has gone rogue
and got sort of hooked up with the team and just started becoming a real boy like Pinocchio style learning how to be a person whole thing and then all of a sudden they figure out how to basically bring him back and fix his code and he becomes like the flagship the number one for this bot like army
and so he's basically been the face of all of this really heinous execution rounding up deviance type stuff and it was really sad for his character because at some point in the session we made the connection that he was the one that caused the disarmament of his previous teammate
and also thought that she was dead the whole time like everybody thought she was dead and he was the reason for that I think one of my favorite decisions that I ended up making was faking my character was the one that got her arms ripped off by the way
and I think one of my favorite decisions I ended up making was faking her death I didn't realize how much of a like impact that was going to be and that was a really cool thing to see because I think one of the things we also struggled with kind of as like a table or at least in in Robert and I's eyes was cohesion we didn't feel like a team
it just didn't feel like we had a lot of investment in each other like we were around each other but we weren't like interacting that much and then to flash forward into this world where it's like cool team fucking disbanded we haven't seen each other for three years and we all joined up for the first time and even though we were split up for most of that like session because we had to be because we were like attacking different parts of the city at once
but it felt like for the first time that we were fighting as a unit and like as a like jet like it was a jazzing and figuring out where people were going and whose powers were best suited for what task yeah and it was it was a really cool like team building in a way like they're like
like we're going to play out the possible worst things that could happen to these characters and everybody cried at least once people cried I cried like I didn't expect to everyone cried and the tears came so much earlier than I expected and it came from places I didn't expect it was investment in each other's characters and finding out what happened to other people
they got people misty eyed first which was crazy to me because it's like you're just hearing about what's happening to someone else during this time jump and we all know that this is going to be reset we know that this isn't the end but like it still felt that like scary and that real
yeah the consequences like and I preface the session going into and I said hey guys I want you all to be prepared and to know this going into it because this session is going to be painful this is going to be reset I don't care how I have to do it by the end of this session none of the actions you make today are going to matter in the long run except for your performance at the table and how you would like to see your characters sort of send themselves off in this one off scenario
and I think that's kind of why I didn't really expect people to get as invested as they did because the consequences were very much like we knew that everything was going to get reset and I think it almost kind of had this like it doesn't really matter what you do feel to it but people still got very invested right away
and I think part of that was at least in my world building in my setting up of it I didn't want to treat it like it was going to be just a one off I wanted people to play like this is the world that you are leaving like this is essentially your send off like what is your character do in the final moments of this universe like are you just going to lay down and hide in the bunker somewhere and like hope things go right
or are you going to like really stand up and be a hero and sort of embody that that whole theme and messaging of the campaign and that's exactly what everybody did everybody got invested from the very beginning everyone was really into what had been going on on the other characters lives
the character Madison's character sort of really serves a catalyst for bringing everybody back together because when we were talking Madison's character previous to all of this was like this up and coming really colorful really bright really like what it means to be a hero kind of hero and then everything kind of ends very abruptly for her and then of course with like super woman basically going
MIA right around the same time it's like oh who do we look to like our number one two three and four basically all gone like Captain America's gone rogue our number two guy disappeared in the last big fight super woman basically self exiled herself so we're going to look to the only other person that's like up and coming who's this like really bright shining character who continues to operate in the dark days and then she fucking dies yeah and she dies and like in the public's eyes she dies in a really terrible fucked up way so it's like
there's no way we can recover from this is a society like it is just all bad and I think having that background and having that story really brought everybody together because everyone got super into the role play aspect of it and be like holy shit you're alive
yeah and that means so much like even to these characters that had really spent a lot of time together everyone I think felt responsible for the events that happened in the session before last and so I think that paired with just the seriousness and the sadness of it it was like
no where we like we're not responsible for her dying but in this weird way because we disbanded and we made all these decisions and we let these things happen we are
yeah and so this is an opportunity for us to come together as a team like in the end days and really try and make something count and that's a hundred percent when everyone dead
and I think that's why it was as good of a session as it was
and it was the the moment that my character basically ended up working with the superwoman and is like trying to put together one last like fight against this organization and as I'm like sending out this message and I'm like doing a little speech or something that was like really bad because it was fucking nine in the morning and I was tired
he's all very improv-y out the clock
and I was at you or someone at the table was like are you like wearing like are you in front of your mask off yeah basically being like did you take your mask off and I was like oh I didn't even think about the fact of like yeah I've been operating these past several years is like a hero is a different character
she dies goes underground basically stops putting on the the main character costume and then puts on another one which is just relevant for the moment she's she's talking about
and so I was like oh well I guess that makes sense for me to like be kind of like as a final fuck you have like actually you can't stop me bitch
you never really killed me motherfucker
and like I thought that that was just gonna be like a fun texture point and then that was like one of the points that like kicked off and um
yeah that was kind of how we like began the session was sending out that call to like the rest of the city's deviants not even just heroes it was like anybody that still wants to fight
power or I guess deviation no deviation powers no powers like it doesn't matter a hero villain everybody is welcome at the table
which is what everyone said right up until our terrorist players showed up and everyone stood up really quick and put in guns at him
and then he was like whoa guys what's going on and everyone's like you literally have been a like you've been a terrorist like you've been torturing people on live television I don't
what do you mean why am I pointing a gun at you man like you people now and he was like no I eat the bad guys which works
he rolled high enough on his check which works but yeah it was it was an incredible session as telling everybody I think I don't know how I'm ever going to be able to top it
I'm sure I will just because we'll actually have time to world build and hopefully when that final session comes on the regular timeline when things are not time jumped
it'll mean just as much when we get there and I'm hoping to have another session similar to that but yeah I was really impressed with everyone's role play just because
it was insane especially everyone really in a world where you know your your actions don't have consequences because that's what this world was
people were more invested in this one than they were in previous sessions were like consequences of actions yeah where actions had real consequences and consequences had real actions it was
interesting which is nuts it was weird for sure it was a weird feeling to see everybody invested in like this one off fuck you we're never playing it again
which was crazy and it was so cool also seeing because one of the things that I going back to kids on bikes because it is not a combat oriented system a lot of the times that you're like in a like a
conflict situation you're using other means to solve it as well so you're using your words and stuff and I think that this very easily with us being like level 15 characters for the first time and getting to be like cool
I now have a power called black hole where I can make a fucking black hole and there are black holes of people like you you would think that you would have an inclination to basically just pull out the
fucking our level nine shit and our equivalent of like level nine spells and just use those but there were people who were like dealing with with conflict and combat situations in non combative ways
yeah which surprised me and was really interesting and I thought that also really helped like the compellingness of like a lot of this like the nature of like yeah I'm going to cause problems and like try and solve these situations without like just throwing
hands immediately yeah it was really cool very contradictory to the way that like previous sessions have been played and it's interesting I don't know if it's a system I'll continue I think I still wouldn't introduce formal combat and things like that
but sort of the way that I played it was I said listen guys you know me I like combat I like doing the like combat on session and the combat off session and kind of rotating between just because I think it's a good balance to give people that are more into role play role
play role plan people that are more into hitting things hitting things but the one thing that like kids on bikes kids on brooms offers is combat that still has a pretty big focus on narrative so it's it's like you're you're rolling a post scores it's like fight
against brawn or flight against brain or shit like that and I wanted to I wanted to operate the session similar as I said listen we don't have time for combat if we did the session would probably take twice as long
there's just no way you all are dealing with 15th level stuff and we have four hours like that's it people got to go to work so I basically I didn't really institute like a formal initiative order I didn't really do combat and part of it too was the
the stakes in the levels that these people were playing at to do combat would just be unfair yeah and that's because basically the way that I done it was I rolled 2d10s and I said listen whatever this number comes out to be that's how many of these murder bots are there
are so many atlas bots are present in the city and atlas bots are if you've been listening to the episode and you haven't put this together atlas bots are basically the one thing that like can take down basically anybody are superwoman character fought one of them at the end of the session before this and almost lost
yeah which was insane I didn't even think that was gonna happen I spent hours building this character and I was like no way she's gonna even get touched in this fight and then she came away with like a quarter of her health yeah so you're basically fighting potentially hundreds of these 25 level
fucking bots I rolled there were like 45 of them in the city and so to do combat in that way would have felt like an extra layer of cruel because it's if we actually do combat and you actually have to deal with the stats and the abilities that these things have you're going to lose before you even get a turn
yeah because the level of damage that these things can put out in the level of health that they have even if I take base and don't roll for them it's just gonna be fucking unfair and there's a level of like cruelty of like cool you die before you can even get to the
that's right I mentioned ahead of time I was like some of you might not even make it to the final plan like you might get through strategy and you could die on the way there like if you fail your stealth check cold one of those bots picks up your location you are now in a situation where several of them are on their way to you and
you can run the risk of them showing up to your strategy or like strategy meeting which was already like a risky move that the characters were making them all in the same place yeah we were rushing against the clock because one of the the bots knew where we were and was actively coming so it was like
a bit the soak that someone took it from you and below it was like four people dead and it had werde on there no specific 피야거 any way different or any way from here nobody has been at all to have like five mind
If we tell this group of like 45 people that fucking murder bot number one is on their way here
No one's gonna stay. Yeah, no one's gonna be interested in talking
No one's gonna put it together because it's very much about self-preservation mode at this one
It's like how many of us are gonna walk away from this room alive and basically just remain characters
Those are the only people to lift. Yeah, everybody else died. Holy shit
Everybody in that room with the exception of the the main characters died not a single other person walked away
I mean, I guess prodigal was there and she was the crazy chick she was working with fucking lived. Yeah, she lived just barely
She had a few in Parker made it one of the NPCs
Think Parker prodigal with the only two non-player characters that walked away from that alive
Smyther died boulder died lolly died
He wasn't there. He wasn't present. Yeah
The gang and the cops died Commander Sloan died
Ricky died
Um, Godfather wasn't there, but he also died
Yeah, it was rough man. It was bad
It was it was also a return of every NPC that we'd ever met was in this meeting was kind of me
Just being like I want to touch face with the other players to figure out what we're doing
so we're not all attacking once
And it was that was another like very painful moment of like cool
You're standing in the even some people that like hadn't met to there are some people that I introduced for the first time in this session
To just kind of be like I mean realistically these few people in my source book. They're they're surviving. Yeah, I guess Rexford lift
Yeah, I guess non-Batman Bruce Wayne lived
He was such an interesting character. Yeah
Yeah, it was
But yeah, it was in one of the comments that Madison made after the fact was that it felt like a funeral home
Because it was like she was the person that was like hey guys
Here's a picture of superwoman. She's alive in the background. She can't talk right now
Also, I've been dead for three years like no, I'm not you all should come and meet up at this very specific place that everyone knows about
And that a lot of people died in and we should have a strategy meeting
Yeah, and then basically proceeded to stand at the front of the room and like wait for people to walk in
So then she had to like greet them and shake their hand
And this is her first time meeting a few of them
This is also the first time meeting several people that thought she's been dead for three years and had a really vested interest in her being like alive
it was
One of the most painful and that was one of the moments where I was like I feel bad because I feel like I'm taking up a chunk of time as a
Player but seeing everyone at the table be equally as invested. Yeah, everyone is like waiting to see the reactions to
NPCs that walked in it was crazy
And it was one of the most brutal like even just from an acting standpoint
One of the most brutal things the good there was a moment where I told Robert the night before so my character
has this best friend named Parker and
It is he's her everything. They're inseparable
blah blah blah blah blah
And I've mentioned him before on this podcast of like making a joke of like if it's Parker versus the city
She's choosing Parker and I told Robert and then she didn't and then she didn't and then I did it
And it was one of the hardest
And then she did not and there was a moment where I was like you have to let me say goodbye to this character
Yeah, and the moment that he walked through that that could buy between Parker and Daisy was one of the most painful moments
I've ever had at the table sucked just it was that was
It's like that you're so nervous and you're so choked up in the moment
It's like none of this is real but also at the same time
I have to potentially tell my best friend who by the way previous to this Parker thought along with everybody else that she
Was dead for three years like has already mourned her passing found out she was a superhero
That's a web blast
We don't even get to know how he deals with that and then finds out actually no it's my best friend and now she's dead
Yeah, it was like I found out that my best friend was a superhero in the same breath that I find out that she's dead
And I'm never gonna see her again and then three years later
I see her face on a television
He balls and then he shows up and he's like hey ready to join the fight also we have to talk before we leave like
What the fuck it was that was painful and that was a moment where I was also like really deeply affected as a person seeing
Other people be affected at the table because they were like it was misty-eyed for everyone
Everybody was really invested seeing like some of the conversations that happened in characters on a percent. It was just it was brutal
God it was brutal. It was rough, man. It was a hard session for sure, but I think
I
Think I played it as well as I could I told everybody it was gonna be dark
But the more that we started playing I was like a man. I really want to give these guys a chance
I don't want it to be one of these things where
Yes, realistically these level 15 characters are going to get fucking wiped because the level 25 character that I built based off
Superwoman almost lost a 1v1 with one of these things. There's no fucking way that these people walk away alive
Yeah, but I was like, you know what give me some roles. Tell me what power you want to use
We're not gonna do combat
Just tell me what thing on your list of fun bags or fun tricks in your bag you have and give me a role and tell me
What that dice number is and I'll tell you if you live that encounter and we just
There was one particular
Encounter where it was basically we had two different teams that ended up splitting off
We had distraction team and infiltration team. So there was what's crazy was this whole thing was basically on a gamble
There was this idea or this piece of information that was discovered really early on in the campaign that yes these robots
They have a switch. It's basically a manual override. We don't know who holds that switch
We don't even know where that switch is but we have a pretty good guess
Also, we now have a bomb that sets off all electronics, but it's also a hydrogen bomb combined
So it's not only a blitter obliterating everything within a certain radius
It's also frying all technology permanently
So the best bet at this point is to try and get that bomb as close to
Wherever the command center is for these bots and just hope that they drop when it goes off
Yeah, so we're gonna set up two different teams
We're gonna set up team one which is gonna go to the other end of town and basically set off a distraction to try and draw as many of
Those bots to them as humanly possible and then team B team 2 is gonna go to the building where we think fingers fucking crossed
This command center is
Because it's the most heavily fortified place in the city and it doesn't make sense for it to be anywhere else
And so distraction team goes basically starts kicking up a bunch of shit one person loses control of their character
It was kind of like venom doubt starts destroying buildings throwing like throwing cars almost ends up killing some of our NPCs
Like is going nuts a storm kicks off in the same place
And every single by road for it
I got a number higher than the amount of bots that we had in the city
It's all
44 remaining bots that were our 40 remaining bots that were on standby all go to that end of the city like all of them and we had
What we had two player characters there one NPC that didn't have powers. What it be for the vibes another NPC
That also didn't have powers
But I guess knew how to use a gun a guy that could teleport and a couple of gang members and a couple of cops dressed up in superhero costumes of
Superheroes that had had died. Oh, yeah
So that way they would draw more attention and then a fucking fish that could fly and generate water
And that was it and it was like cool
So it's this rag tag group of people two of which have worked together the rest of them would never be caught in the
Same room together
Basically fighting an army of robots that are specifically designed to kill people significantly stronger than all of them put together
Yeah, like I think if I had actually done combat
I think they could have taken out maybe two
Yeah, like to it max like if I had played really smart the way that I've designed these bots to be
That by that fucking combat would have been over within a turn
Oh for sure within a turn like it just wouldn't have happened that way the play
Distraction team and this is kind of fucked up to say when like looking back at the way we designed the plan
Distraction team was not the most marshally capable. We were not expecting every body city to roll out there
Distraction team is like I hope you guys live long enough for infiltration team to make their way into the fucking building
And that was the goal pretty much it was rain just hope that people live it was like cool distract not fight distract
Yeah, it was also very much like everyone that signed up was was very much cool
This is so this is the suicide team like this is we go there was we hope that you all can set the bomb off and the bomb
Works the way it's supposed to which it didn't in the new side squad
It's team a when they live the one with like fucking Pete Davidson and
Yeah, they all stormed the beach and they're like
Bail us to fuck out and Amanda Waller's like nope
This is where you're supposed to be and then they all die and then there's actually be on another beach
It's like crawling in to the country. That's exactly what that was
Yeah, it was like a deeply fucked up plan, but it was like listen
So then we're gonna send superwoman in like three other people maybe four max to go into the building and just hope that they can get to
The top yeah, so but what I was talking about how long one of these interactions on went on
So at the very end of the session
it was just distraction team left and they again had 44 bots and I'm like if I play this
Realistically you all die within minutes
And again not a single NPC with the exception of Parker because one of our one of our player characters threw them a pretty far ways away
Everyone of them died like they get pulled apart. They get beaten. They get shot like it's it's brutal
But our player characters every DC by the way every DC with the exception of a few that I said at 15
There was not a single
Difficulty that I had set for this table on this session that was not less than 20
And so I was like you know what this is how I allow people to win if people can roll 20 or above and they continue to use their
Abilities then maybe I will let them get out of this alive and they did I don't know how they fucking did it
But they did one character took out 50 bots by himself another character took out
I think 10 or 20 or I think it was 10
Our flying fish man cod father ends up killing five by himself
That was I think the one moment that I cried at the table was him going out
Not even an NPC I was deeply attached to but I was like in that moment
I said some really sad shit on his way out and everyone was like what the fuck and then he dies
Yeah, so it was it was rough
But somehow our player characters and distraction team made it and our player characters all but one
An infiltration team make it out alive as well
There was a really cool moment at the end of infiltration teams run where one of the characters is like cool
You press start on the bomb and then I TPS out and I was like hey guys
This isn't really something that's been discussed
But like you have to be one of these characters has to be present for this bomb to go off
And it can't be the one that can teleport so
You got one option and that's to basically make sure that the main guy lives long enough for bomb to go off
And then the other guy TPs out before the bomb goes off. Yeah, if that's how this works
And one of them kind of came in clutch with an ability speaking what that particular player was super rule lawyer that whole time
He was a Madison's ass several times
I was like every mechanic the only formal combat we had was between two different two different PCs
And it was the the the bot and then my character and it was like it was brutal
It was a it was a intense fight because there was one chance for this for this
For the bot to be basically brought back into the fold so crazy character prodigal
She was an antagonist for the first part of the campaign and basically what we discovered about her was that she was really
Obsessed with grooming this team of heroes to be like her arch nemesis
This is what she wanted so she will she goes out of her way to learn everything she can about these characters
So that like oh, they're gonna win no, they don't oh, they're gonna win
No, they don't because it's like I can't manufacture my own
Like wins if I don't know everything about them
So one of the things that she brought to the table was hey listen, I know you guys have a problem with the main guy
Who's been out there killing everybody?
Here's basically a key that can turn him off and then turn him back out like we're gonna hit the hard reset switch
So there was one chance for that to happen and it almost didn't several times because he had a fucking AC of 24 when he
Shielded yeah, and so it was it was brutal and he's sitting on the other end of the table and I'm like
Sweatting in like trying to he's like he's like facing hands
Wait a minute. He's turned away when he's like running away, so that's flanking right? It's like yeah flanking she gets advantage
Yep, it was crazy, man. It was a lawyer behavior in the way of like I'm like a defendant and this is my client
He was like chomping at the bit every time I was like cool
This happens and it really sucks because the thing that we were all hoping happens doesn't happen
And then he was like wait a minute wait a minute
And it's like that's a testament of how involved other players were yeah, cuz no one else's role lawyer to me that hard before it was
It was so I had respect that I was like, you know what there the mechanics work the way they do
Let it happen
Yeah, she was crazy man. It was absolutely fantastic session. We said everybody cried everybody had a moment that it was just like wow
That's insane. That's sad. That's fucked up. That's so awesome
And then we had our reset at the end and we got it
We get to go back to the main timeline because the hero that fucked everything up sacrifices himself bomb goes off
And a very flash pointing kind of way is like this is how I fix things
Here's an opportunity for you to right your wrongs and that's exactly what he did
Yeah wild session man wild session. I think now is a great point to move into our little segment that we're introducing
Where we're doing a viewer submitted questions
So these are going to come and we'll probably have a name for this later
But please feel free to submit any questions. You were submitted questions. That's what we got going right now
Yeah, well we'll workshop it but these are gonna come from Anthony
And we're very very thankful for reaching out our first viewer submitted questions. So we're super excited. Do you want to pick one first?
I figure I'll just read the whole thing and then we'll go sort of one by one
So the question says I'm an inexperienced DM that wanted to ask some questions for table talk
Do you know the best ways to play with six or more players? What fantasy books do you think you would?
You think would be the best to adapt to D&D. Do you have any other RPGs like call off Cthulhu or fallout you guys like to play?
How much do you think real-world luck affects the game?
Good luck with your podcast. Thanks for reading. Thank you Anthony for submitting a question
I'll probably hit the ones that are a little bit more DM focused. So the first one
Do you know the best way to play with six or more players?
Yeah, no, I mean to an extent to an extent it's don't to an extent it's like it's also a lot more fun
For an inexperienced DM the more people you involve the more difficult it's gonna be
But in a way, it's also a lot easier because it means that you don't have to focus on a particular
Character as much as you would with like four or five
Like finally have four people at the table
I'm gonna have to spend a lot more work writing for them and I'm coming up with plot hooks and magical items
Because they're only one of four people that are gonna be in rotation in terms of talking and role-playing and yada yada yada
But if I have six seven people at the table, it's like everyone has this understanding that they're not gonna get a whole lot of time
In each session because unless you're playing nine ten hour sessions, which is like almost half your day
What time are you gonna get like you are one out of seven and that's just kind of something that comes along with playing with that
Many people at a table. I think in terms of how to do it
Being is organized as Madison was sort of talking earlier not for every session, but for your session zero slash session one
You want as much information as you can possibly gather about your world in one place before you start that session
That does not mean that you need to know 40 NPC names that does not mean that you need to know 20 magical items
That does not mean that you
Need to know six different dungeons that they could go to that just means that you need to know enough about the world
That you're playing and that if somebody says what's that building over there?
You can think for a second or look at your source book or look at your notes and go
That's what this building is and that's what happens there
Maybe this is the name of somebody that's there if you live in that town
You need enough you need to know enough this when someone says so has there been like has there been a war in the last
I don't know 10 15 years in this area. You can go yes and no this is who it was between this is who won
If you want to know more go to the library pick up a book or go talk to that veteran in the corner
Who I haven't convenient name for here on fantasy name generator like yeah
You just need to know enough to get you through your first session and then the rest of it will start to fall in place
Because you really have to get a vibe and a feel for how your players are gonna interact with you in the world before you can start
Planning for them. Yeah at the end of the day. You're not prepping for like this
Like non-living inorganic session world-building your planning for people. Yeah, you're prepping for people
You're prepping for people's interest in the things that they're gonna want to interact with and the NPCs that they want to know more about
And it's just kind of something that unfortunately
I have to say will come naturally to you and you're really just kind of have to jump in but I think if there's any tip that I can
Give you for playing with that many people know enough about the world that you can answer some really basic questions
And if you can't answer those questions or if they dig deep or say go to a library go talk this NPC
Yeah, and that'll get you through you just got to figure out where people are interested in going and what they want to do
Yeah on a more mechanic level. I think with that many people leaning more role play focused
And I'm like taking combat encounters a little bit easy just because combat does take so long
Yeah, that's something you'll figure out very quickly combat especially with seven player economies or six or seven player economies
Which action economy is just like a it's a term that basically refers to how many different things you can do with an action or two actions and
A given turn in fifth edition or in any other TTRPG
The action economy for fifth edition for any given player, especially when you move past level three
gets insane you have free object interaction you have regular interaction you have
Oh, what is the fucking feature that allows you to take an additional action action search which it gives you a whole other action
You have actions that then turn that one action into two attacks instead of one
You have the action to ready a spell you have disengage
I mean there's the list of things you can do in fifth edition specifically when it comes to combat is as long
As it basically is as tall as long as you are like it takes a while to figure that out with that many players
I think it would be more
Beneficial to fight like one big thing as opposed to like an army or something
Yeah, those are fun when your players know how to kill them
But like if you're just trying to get combat out of the way to get like a
Something because when you've got one target you've got all these people working towards one target
It's gonna be easier to manage fight a large thing or fight one my favorite thing one large thing at the end of a room
And then maybe three or four small guys that are just there to support that gives you enough enough people enough
Targets enough bodies for people to explore and figure out combat
Well also giving you as a DM one large thing that you can then use to interact within that combat itself
Because having a way for you to actually control the battlefield as a DM is a lot harder than you think it is
Because unless you really know your stat blocks of your fucking your enemies very well
You're gonna very quickly find out that you have two things you can do
One of them makes sense to do every time when the other one only happens in a very specific circumstance
That is never going to happen in this combat correct because you have seven players and by the time what before fucking enemy a gets close enough to
Player one players fucking three through seven are gonna see a kill that they can take
Your enemies not even gonna get close. Yeah, so you can also hit random encounter generators
I cannot recommend those enough you put in how many players you have what level you're at or what level they're at and
Then it'll spit you out a bunch of enemies with stat blocks readily available
And it's just like a fun little kind of random combat thing you can do, you know
You can also simplify it like I do
If your combat's going too long and just take averages
Never tell your players how many hit points they have left in combat. Don't don't roll in front of the board
So that way you can make shit up as it goes because it's like cool. We've been in this combat for fucking two hours
We still have three enemies left all of my players are taking forever to get through their actions because they've never played the game before
Oh
You did you did 10 damage and had dirty health, but now it has nine. How do you kill it? Yeah, it's
Congratulations, it's some of those things where it's like, okay, cool
Or if it's a situation where it cool you took down the big guy all the little guys drop
We're done with that part
kind of situation but um one of the next one was what fantasy
Yeah fantasy books. Do you think would be the best to adapt and DD?
I already I was about to say Percy Jackson works really really well. We just did that
I think superheroes. I know those aren't fantasy books or comic books
Oh, I think those adapt really well
I think picking any universe that has a wiki for it already is gonna help you a lot bonus points
If you can find one that's adapted to fifth edition the more information you have about this world the easier
It's gonna be yeah, I would not recommend as an inexperienced
DM especially trying to create your own world off rip unless you've been working with it for a while because
Shit just gets difficult man. I did that myself very first time I'd ever DMed. I made it a universe
Based around one location. I found on one random wiki page
No other information about it no stop locks no mechanics and nothing and just went from there
Yeah, it's rough. It was fun
I think like I lean towards like classic fantasy books as well just because anything like a lot of reading
I think Brian Sanderson any of his stuff. I have my own thoughts on him whatever
They're easy books you can get in
There's wikis for them
Basically you want to pick the fantasy books in the fantasy universe is that when you say what did this part like what powers
Did this person have it directs you to a wiki dot page where you have a nice little convenient list?
Right in front of your eyes
I think also like classic and there's gonna be this kind of my like bogey, but like classic children's literature
I think it's also a really fun jumping off point if you've got your worlds like Wonderland Neverland Narnia
All of those kind of things I think are really fun
I mean Lord of the Rings and like the Hobbit obviously translate pretty well
But I think that yeah anything that's traditional fantasy like you're gonna go cool
I would combat encounter with fucking Nazgul
You're just gonna look up a fucking spirit stab block or you're gonna look up Nazgul fifth edition in some nerd is already gonna
Have the stab look right there for you on Google images like people have already
Adapting everything you can think of to fifth edition
Yeah, when you stick with mainstream fantasy you will be in no shortage of information that you'll want or could possibly not want
Oh, yeah
And in terms of other RPGs that we like I've been really wanting to play Call of Cthulhu
I just haven't got around to it because we mostly play in fifth edition like I said I cannot hype up kids on bikes enough
Kids on bikes is so much fun. I'm also I
Would this is what I haven't played but I really like I like vampire masquerade a lot and prime as great
It's sick as hell you have so much information and so many jumping off points or vampire the masquerade
There's I've been seeing it all over my Instagram
But somebody just recently came out with a free vampire the masquerade specific character sheet. It's all online
There are so many fucking modules for vampire the masquerade as well that like you can start pretty much anywhere
I think other systems similar to that like
Any of your like a boxed setting things like alien is a pretty popular one
There are several different versions of the alien universe that are all one-off modules where it's all pretty simple and straightforward
We haven't dabbled a whole lot outside of the fifth edition particularly with modules and things like that
Yeah, mostly just a timing thing, but if you're looking for things with in fifth edition that are a little bit different
Curse of strad is pretty good. There's also so many different versions and different people's takes on Curse of strad
There's any of the source books you can pick up at your local game store are gonna have
one shots and modules that you can run that sort of take off some of that pressure
And a lot of those source books too are a really good place to start for new new DMs because it's gonna tell you how to approach
Certain situations based on how many players you have and based on how experienced they are
So that that really helps quite a bit
three others that I personally like slash I have a lot of interest in but haven't played are
I
Love all of my like little like small systems. I just haven't got a chance to play them monster of the week is really cool
It's really fun. It's very like it's you can recreate basically Buffy the vampire slayer super natural all of those like literal monster of the week TV shows
Which is super super cool. There's also one that I haven't played yet, but I'm dying to called thirsty sword lesbians
It is a queer focused RPG game
That seems like a lot of fun
I think there's a sequel to it that also has like a fun funky little name to it
And then there's also a superhero themed one called masks a new generation and those all kind of at least
kids on bikes
Monster of the week and masks a new generation all kind of fall into the same like umbrella category for me
Yeah, I don't know what it is about them
But they have a lot of like really good like they fall into like a lot of the character creation falls into these like tropes
And so you're choosing like a character trope as you're like starting off and that really helps with role-playing purposes
Because it's like I don't necessarily know how to play this person who's from this random town and has this really complete a backstory
But I can sure as shit play like the
Smart nerd who doesn't know what so you know like yeah
You can play tropes and stereotypes for your first time as a player a lot easier and even as a DM
Then you can like a random character with fucking essays worth of backstory that you've never played
It's it's easier to play the tropes are there for a reason. Hmm. I mean characters real world luck affecting the game
That could be an entire episode in of itself for those that have listened to previous episodes
You all know that I love I love my philosophical topics
Real world luck affecting the game
I mean specifically with fifth edition and D&D it is and like it truly is
I think it depends on your DM kind of all luck. I think yeah, I think a lot of it is DM
I think as a DM you can control your DCs
And accept roles a lot easier than players can sort of interact with those systems
I think as a player it will always feel like luck to an extent
Oh, and I think what's most fun from the player perspective is that you get to take that luck into your own hands by adding mechanics by adding spells by adding
Systems that you can learn inside and out and mastering your action economy as a particular player
But I think from the DM side of it
You will very quickly find out that luck really only is present at the table if you want it to be yeah
I can set a DC for something
A specific player at our table who rolls nat ones
Oh, yeah, and you'll find people too that just fucking unnaturally roll a lot of either high rolls or low rolls and
So I mean it just depends
Because it's one of those things where you can do a really cool thing and be like yeah
Narratively this is totally gonna work and then you roll your dice and you get a nat one and you're like
Well damn
I or you do something really really cool. There was a ballsy decision. I made last session and I was like I
I had rolled a nat one on my previous attempt and I did something basically
I was about to fight this character and I decided you know what I'm gonna fucking balls to the wall instead of fighting this character
I'm gonna like drop my armor
I'm gonna drop my fighting stance and I'm gonna let them hit me and I'm just gonna really really hope that
The situation role works and I just don't get eviscerated right now and that was one of those moments where it felt like that's crazy
Like I I rolled in that one
Mm-hmm. I I'm fucked. Yeah, and I think what it's something that we've mentioned in previous episodes
I think specifically one of the ones where I focused on like how to be a good DM versus like being a shitty player and those kinds of things
Don't forget that as a DM just because this question seems to be really focused on the DM excited things that you
Can set the DC however you want to and you can accept roles even if in your mind they didn't pass the DC
Like you can be as nice and as luck-based as you want to be
It's entirely up to you if it is like all of the players actions are riding on this one really cool thing
And in your mind you were like cool DC 18 all you said at the table was give me a charisma check and they roll a 17
You are allowed. This is from Robert to DM Robert to you personally you are allowed
I give you permission to say that just barely passes or holy shit that passes. What does it look like?
What do you say? Yeah
You are all there to have fun at the end of the day in some way shape form reasons
So do not be afraid as a DM to let your players and yourself
Have fun despite the mechanics and the DCs that you've set for yourself
You can lie you can fit. Yeah bullshit. You can make things up change things last minute
Just have fun. Enjoy yourself. Let your players enjoy it when talking about luck. You can't not bring up
I'm gonna bring up Ali Beardsley from dimension 20
In one of the craziest moments in fantasy high season one spoiler alert last fight
I'm gonna talk about our own table now. I said fucking for bodega man. Oh my god. Yeah, we have our own mode
That example
We had a sort of a robot character
There were sort of two personalities with Mhen one that had been assimilated and been sort of made into this construct to work for
The government that took over the body and then the other one who's like this
Kind of like a newborn in the world trying to figure out how to have like kind of like a Frankenstein character where it's I have all
This power and I'm strong and whatever but I don't really know how to interact with people
I don't know what emotions are. I don't know what friends are
And he finally made a friend in one of our last sessions before everything went to shit
Who I just called bodega man who is basically the owner of a bodega store that was down the street?
From the base and he basically stopped in wandering the world and was like hey man
What's going on with you and he goes well I'd be a lot better if my fucking cash register would work and he was like
I can help with that. I'm a robot and then fixes it and made a friend and so we were at the table and we were trying to decide
Okay, how much does the government know about your life?
Pre like previous to being taken back into the fold like were you as chip the alt like the alternate personality within the main Atlas body
How well were you able to keep the information that you know about your superhero friends to yourself?
He rolled like a fucking three or a four which is definitely not what he wanted and everybody was like let me roll
Let me roll and I was like, you know what for bodega man
Go ahead and give me a give me going re-roll it because that's bullshit. I don't agree with that role either
And you roll a fucking natural 20 and so I was like cool. They didn't crack anything out of you
You have kept all of that information to you
Personal and private nobody knows anything that you know like yes
You're still a personality trapped within the larger robot, but like you didn't fucking tell anybody anything
You kept your goddamn mouth closed. Yep
And it's like really cool stuff or just like for the narrative, you know
20 says a lot that the dice have a story to tell and I believe that to my core
Sometimes you were just fucking doomed if you listen to our lap the season one finale
I rolled four Nat ones insanity at the beginning of the session and it was like cool
The story is that I'm I can't do shit is yeah, I'm sorry in this moment. I've cracked. I'm just too much pressure
It's me against like six of these guys and then there's other get her where you ask to do some bullshit thing
For no reason and you get a Nat 20 and you change the rules of the universe. Yep
Like cool. I give you whatever you want. Yeah, oh fun
This little side tip before we end things here because we're finally coming in the rabbit end of our episode
I think another piece of advice I would give to an inexperienced EM six players five players three players. I'm gonna shit
Let people do what they want on their own Nat 20s as long as it is within the confines and the rules of the universe
You're playing in
Also, if you let your players have that much fun on a Nat 20 and give them consequences funny stupid serious
Whatever you want to on natural ones because it makes your dice tell a significantly
Better story and more fun story and an interactive story when there are numbers on the dice that can change the entire game
At its very core and it doesn't always have to be you fucking like die. Yeah, you
You can do goofy shit. Yeah, like you fucking tear your Achilles heel on a Nat one dexterity Jack
Congratulations, you're now paralyzed from the waist down for the next two sessions like yeah, it's like no
You trip it each shit and I'm gonna roll a d6 for how much bludgeoning damage you take like it doesn't have to be stupid
Sometimes you can make Nat ones do fun things to whatever one shots
I made a Nat one send a character on a really fucking stupid quest to solve a riddle and in the end it worked
So, you know, you don't always have to make it the world's like the world's ending consequences are like well
Looks like you slip and fall on an icicle and now your brain so make a new character see it
I'm not ones are always like
When someone it's like cool
I'm doing like an inside check and then you get a Nat one and they're like hey
Guess what you know without a shit without like oh, I love
People on natural one lying to people on that one's is the it will never not be funny like that is a bit because it's
It's the one time when somebody rolls something on the dice where the player knows that whatever comes out of the DM's mouth
Next is total bullshit and I can lie to you and you just have to take that like you got a now on inside
He wants to have sex with you right now
And it creates some of the funniest moments at the table because those are moments where you as a player you're like you have to commit to the
bit committing to the I rolled in that one on it like it fucking lore check
I have to commit to the bit man
We're in like investigating somewhere in the way that Robert chose to do that
He was like you're so distracted because this guy is your celebrity crush. He's so hot
It's like such an unlikable person, but you think he's the hottest man on planet earth and he's so fucking hot
You're so in him and I'm like cool. This is this is when we commit to the bit
It
Created one of the weirdest moments this campaign has had truly. Oh, it was odd
It was there was an almost threesome happened. It was crazy
It's like funny moments like that or would you get to like also kind of take that failure into your hands
That's like the whole gorgug asking people who their who is that is in fantasy high season one if you've seen that
It's just it's I love I love the bullshit
I love it also means that when you don't know how to handle the situation when somebody fails that that bad or when somebody wins
That well you can just go what happens. Yeah, what do you do?
What does this look like because you don't have to make it up now?
It's on the player personally every nap one insight check you should just lie and be like oh
100% it's gotta be some bullshit
So funny every now one inside check is basically you looking at somebody trying to figure out what they're thinking or what they're like
What their intentions are and then making your own assumption on a horribly wrong read and going they want to have sex with me
And then you as a player are confident that because you don't know you got in that one yeah
Then like the character that you're playing has no idea that he's the he or she or they has just rolled a natural one
But what they do know is that they're awfully fucking convinced that this guy wants to have sex with them
Yeah, it's so now you get to operate as a character in a very tense situation be like so like
What are you doing later? Yeah, and like they're like an incredibly powerful politician who like actively has a significant other and you've chosen
this moment to try and like
Charisma check them up at the table in front of everybody because you think they want to fuck you it's it's so funny every time
Awesome, I think we're gonna call it a here. Thank you all for our first successful segment of
Sort of doing a little talk back and answering viewer questions also for joining us on session zero of season two
If you haven't listened to all of season one, this is a requirement
I'm setting homework as I do for my players you have to listen to all 20
Ish episodes before you come back to episode one. It's a requirement. You're not allowed to listen to the next one
That's your homework
So hopefully by then you will be the equivalent of a level 15 listener and we'll know everything there is to know
Totally and we'll see you next Thursday
Bye-bye