1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:11,160
Hello players who are always trying to fuck the BBEG and DMs who cannot figure out how

2
00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:15,600
to make your party fucking party.

3
00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:16,720
Welcome back to Table Talk.

4
00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:18,680
I'm Maddie and I'm Robert.

5
00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:20,280
What are we talking about today?

6
00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,520
Today we are going to talk about character relationships.

7
00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:26,760
This one's probably going to be a little bit more of a player heavy episode just because

8
00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:27,760
I've kind of wanted that.

9
00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:32,880
I feel like I've been yapping and yipping a lot just because I have a lot to say, a

10
00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:34,400
lot of knowledge swimming up here.

11
00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:35,400
You know what I'm saying?

12
00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:37,000
I always feel like I've got to be the last person in the room.

13
00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:38,000
Not really.

14
00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:39,000
I love hearing people's perspectives.

15
00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:40,880
Otherwise I wouldn't be on a fucking podcast with another person.

16
00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:43,080
I'd just do something by myself.

17
00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:44,080
But I'm not.

18
00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:48,200
But the whole point of today's episode is to talk about sort of the dynamics between

19
00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:52,640
players at the table, how to make relationships between PCs.

20
00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:55,520
Also how to, I think from the DM's perspective, my little bit of two cents in this is going

21
00:00:55,520 --> 00:01:01,000
to be how to craft and maintain relationships between NPCs and PCs, which I think is very

22
00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:11,120
difficult because unless you are fully into, you are every person you've ever role played

23
00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:16,120
as as a DM, you are just fully multiple personality disorder.

24
00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:21,160
But it goes beyond being an actor though, man, because it's like at a table, at any

25
00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:22,160
given table.

26
00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:26,120
One could be like six different people over the course of two hours and every one of

27
00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:27,920
those people has to be fully different from the next.

28
00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:30,040
And yes, actors can do that and do that all the time.

29
00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:34,640
But I think as a DM when you're also directing, it's like if you had your director out there

30
00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:39,160
and that director on top of directing the whole show was also playing six different

31
00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:44,080
characters in his own play, each which had its own voice, its own accent, its own, Lin

32
00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:46,080
Manuel Miranda is a great example of this.

33
00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:47,080
You're saying this.

34
00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,200
But he doesn't direct the thing while he's playing in the thing.

35
00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:50,400
That's literally, I do what I say.

36
00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:51,520
That's literally my dream.

37
00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:53,960
Like if I got to choose what I did in theater, that's what I would do.

38
00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:54,960
No, that's so valid.

39
00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:55,960
But I'm, I'm not.

40
00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:58,800
You get to write everything and direct it at the same time and then also be an actor

41
00:01:58,800 --> 00:01:59,800
and be all your favorite parts.

42
00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:00,800
Yeah.

43
00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:01,800
I get to wear all that.

44
00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:04,160
I'm also a whole another category of human being.

45
00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:06,160
I'm just an interesting person.

46
00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:07,360
That would stress me the fuck out.

47
00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:10,160
But yeah, that's, I mean, that's pretty much where my two sense ends and begins, man.

48
00:02:10,160 --> 00:02:15,240
It's just difficult to try and, especially trying to figure out how to fucking manage

49
00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:21,000
relationships between NPCs because at the end of the day, it's all the same person.

50
00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:22,000
Yeah.

51
00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,480
Like, yeah, I can write different character motivations and different this and different

52
00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:27,960
that and whatever the fuck, but like it's still me.

53
00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:28,960
Yeah.

54
00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:32,680
And I think it's just in general, I mean, not even from just a DM's perspective as it

55
00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:36,920
being difficult, I think it's difficult across the board of like a thing to manage.

56
00:02:36,920 --> 00:02:43,400
Um, cause there's just relationships in any sort of form in general.

57
00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,480
Cause there's like the whole idea and like, at least I see all of the like fucking memes

58
00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:51,120
that I see on the internet about like D and D are like all these jokes about like D and

59
00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:53,880
D is just like a thinly veiled excuse to flirt with your friends or like, if you're

60
00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,360
not flirting with your friends in D and D, are you even playing the game and blah, blah,

61
00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:58,360
blah.

62
00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:00,160
And I think that's true for a lot of tables.

63
00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:03,960
That is not the energy at our specific table.

64
00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:08,800
Just because of the nature of the group of people that we are playing with in our friend

65
00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:09,800
group.

66
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,600
That's just so far from the rate of human.

67
00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:14,520
Yeah, it is.

68
00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,720
That is also something that's also kind of like, I think.

69
00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,840
I think those are the two extremes of the D and D tables.

70
00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,160
At least that's something that like I've experienced in my own time playing D and D because when

71
00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:27,960
I was playing at another table briefly, all of us were like flirting with each other and

72
00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,520
it was like a whole thing.

73
00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:36,400
And then sometimes you have, you go to other tables and it's like, I, I, I'm sorry.

74
00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:37,840
I cannot let that go.

75
00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:38,840
Unsaid.

76
00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:42,080
Robert has been sitting here trying to eat those little like mandarin orange cups and

77
00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:43,440
like drink the juice out of them.

78
00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:47,560
And I'm telling you right now, this man is covered in mandarin orange juice.

79
00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:48,560
It is in his beard.

80
00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:50,560
My whole fucking sleep is on his shirt.

81
00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:51,560
That's a little everywhere.

82
00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:52,560
It's okay though.

83
00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:54,560
I was just trying to get through this without saying anything.

84
00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:55,560
But it was.

85
00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:58,120
I forget at some point you'd mention it some way or another.

86
00:03:58,120 --> 00:03:59,120
It was bad.

87
00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:00,120
Um, yeah.

88
00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:05,200
But I think that like sometimes at tables, it's a little bit more of like, you have to

89
00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:08,680
put a little bit more effort in you, a little bit more like try into making those kind of

90
00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:11,320
like inter-party relationships work in any way.

91
00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:15,000
Because I think it's interesting enough, I think talking about the difference between

92
00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,920
being an actor and being a D&D player is that at least as an actor that shit is written.

93
00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:19,920
Yeah.

94
00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,520
You know, and I think that's the biggest difference between like being an actor and

95
00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:26,480
like playing D&D is that when you're an actor, you, everything is given to you.

96
00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:30,800
Unwritten play where the director is giving you real time instructions about how the world

97
00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,880
is interacting with you and you got to make the script up on your own.

98
00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:35,680
It's like having improv with a director.

99
00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:36,680
It's fucking insane.

100
00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:37,680
Um, insanity.

101
00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:40,680
Which, oh my God, I'm not, I'm not gonna get into that.

102
00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:44,000
Not to chew at our own horns, but it requires an awful lot of fucking talent, man.

103
00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:45,400
Especially to do it well.

104
00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:46,800
Are you kidding me?

105
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:47,800
Sorry, I...

106
00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:52,240
No, I think, I think D&D and role-playing and the whole fucking act of it, I think

107
00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:53,680
requires a hell of a lot of talent.

108
00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,520
I will say, I'm gonna go back on like when I was in middle school.

109
00:04:57,520 --> 00:04:58,720
Back when I was in middle school.

110
00:04:58,720 --> 00:04:59,720
Not even middle school.

111
00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:01,800
I'm gonna be full honest.

112
00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:02,800
Back up until 2020.

113
00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:03,800
Back in 2020.

114
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:06,960
Maybe a little bit into 2021.

115
00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:10,560
You know, sometimes you're weird and you're on the internet and you find other people

116
00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:15,040
that are weird around the internet and you like also are on discord and you know, sometimes

117
00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:20,320
you get involved in some like communities where you are creating some cool art.

118
00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:21,320
And then...

119
00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:23,640
See, I thought it was going in the route of sometimes you get involved in some communities

120
00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:25,360
where you're role-playing.

121
00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:27,160
That's where it's going, Robert.

122
00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,120
But see, I'm thinking, I'm thinking of, yeah.

123
00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:31,120
Not like sexually.

124
00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:32,280
See, that's where I was thinking.

125
00:05:32,280 --> 00:05:33,280
No.

126
00:05:33,280 --> 00:05:36,760
You know, like you troll around on the internet, you meet some people on Amigo, you hop in

127
00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:39,280
like cats and then it's like one thing leads to another.

128
00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:40,760
It's gonna sound bad.

129
00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,080
I almost wish it was a sexual thing because I feel like it's more embarrassing if it's

130
00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:44,080
not.

131
00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:45,080
No, that's so weird.

132
00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:46,080
You know, it's like, no, I'm just like...

133
00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:47,680
We live in a world where like you can fucking...

134
00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:51,280
We're just role-playing like a healthy friendship with someone.

135
00:05:51,280 --> 00:05:52,280
Like...

136
00:05:52,280 --> 00:05:55,720
Well, role-playing a healthy relationship is wild.

137
00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:58,120
Like dead ass, that's what I was doing.

138
00:05:58,120 --> 00:05:59,600
Along with like other like really cool short points.

139
00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:01,840
It was basically D&D without the dice.

140
00:06:01,840 --> 00:06:03,800
We were just creating the story with multiple players.

141
00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:05,760
Experienced out the relationship in real life too.

142
00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:07,280
It's like, how the fuck are you supposed to...

143
00:06:07,280 --> 00:06:08,680
I wasn't even going there.

144
00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:09,680
Wow, okay.

145
00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,560
But like, if you've never experienced like that particular kind of relationship, how

146
00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,600
the fuck are you supposed to then replicate it at the table without seeming like totally

147
00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,360
off-guard and in like a way out of your depth?

148
00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:21,360
Yeah.

149
00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:26,680
Key example, we've talked about this particular player whose dad, Batman, he's so far removed

150
00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:33,480
from that kind of personality and those experiences that he just like struggles to replicate that

151
00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:34,480
personality.

152
00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:39,120
But I think the biggest thing before like talking and like delving into like the idea

153
00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:40,720
of like how to navigate these relationships.

154
00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:41,720
Sorry, we have notes.

155
00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:43,360
I can't jump too far in them.

156
00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:45,400
I like having notes.

157
00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,000
Keeps me on track.

158
00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:49,600
Just kind of like the first thing that...

159
00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:50,600
And these are just guidelines.

160
00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:51,840
You don't have to stick to that.

161
00:06:51,840 --> 00:06:56,800
You are putting so many like of these fucking Mandarin oranges in your mouth at once.

162
00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:58,280
Can you just go down the list?

163
00:06:58,280 --> 00:06:59,280
Okay.

164
00:06:59,280 --> 00:07:01,720
Instead of yelling at me for jumping too far ahead.

165
00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:02,720
So I was just gonna...

166
00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:03,720
I'm not yelling at you.

167
00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:05,600
I'm just like, we don't have to follow it exactly.

168
00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:07,960
These are points that I wanted to talk about.

169
00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:11,560
But I wanted to talk about kind of like the idea of like just checking in with people

170
00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:14,360
because I think that that's like the first step.

171
00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:18,120
And this just kind of goes in general when you're just...

172
00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:19,120
Because you're gonna...

173
00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:20,600
Interparty relationships are gonna happen.

174
00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:22,120
They have to happen.

175
00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:26,560
I mean, well, we did a campaign where they damned the year didn't happen, which was impressive

176
00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:27,560
to go that long.

177
00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:28,560
Yeah.

178
00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,280
I don't think I've ever seen a party not party that way before.

179
00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:34,200
That's why I picked my intro because I was thinking about how fucking impossible it was

180
00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:37,160
to get my first party to be a party.

181
00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:38,160
To like to interact with each other.

182
00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:39,320
They never liked each other.

183
00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:40,680
They never talked to one another.

184
00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:44,640
They very rarely, if ever, shared personal information.

185
00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:48,000
A few people would crack jokes and that was about as far as it went.

186
00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:49,000
Yeah.

187
00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:50,000
Some insults were thrown.

188
00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:56,480
I think the most mutual it ever got was if you die, I have a higher chance of dying.

189
00:07:56,480 --> 00:08:02,360
And if we're doing the math on this one, keeping you alive is the best way to keep me alive.

190
00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:06,360
That was the general feeling that everyone had towards Magnolia for like...

191
00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:07,840
It truly felt like I had dropped...

192
00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,600
I mean, I kind of did though, which is funny enough.

193
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:15,080
It was like if you dropped a bunch of people on an island and said, you're only way off

194
00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:16,080
the island.

195
00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:17,080
It's this one.

196
00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:18,080
If you work with one another.

197
00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:19,080
Yeah.

198
00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:20,960
If you work with each other.

199
00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:21,960
Yeah.

200
00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:22,960
But...

201
00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:24,480
And then none of you fucking talked to one another.

202
00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:26,280
You just got through the experience, you know?

203
00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:27,280
Yeah.

204
00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:28,280
So we're working on fixing that going.

205
00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:29,280
Awful.

206
00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:30,280
I like college roommates.

207
00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:31,280
Truly.

208
00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:32,280
Yeah.

209
00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:34,480
So this is how to make your party not feel like college roommates.

210
00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:35,480
Oh, Jesus.

211
00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:40,520
And we've talked before about how to be a good player and interact with other players.

212
00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:41,960
So we've kind of hit those points.

213
00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:43,800
But this is going to get kind of more into the nitty-gritty.

214
00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:45,920
And just check in with the people that you're playing with.

215
00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:46,920
Yeah.

216
00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:47,920
Talk about...

217
00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:48,920
And see what they...

218
00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:49,920
Talk about what's going on.

219
00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:50,920
Yeah.

220
00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:51,920
See what they want.

221
00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:58,000
Or like you're playing a bunch of characters that are very varied or something.

222
00:08:58,000 --> 00:08:59,000
Just kind of get an idea.

223
00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:04,160
Be like, hey, is it cool with like, do we want our characters to be friends?

224
00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:05,160
Mm-hmm.

225
00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:06,160
Cool.

226
00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,680
I know that as a person going into this.

227
00:09:08,680 --> 00:09:10,520
And I think there's two ways that you can kind of approach that.

228
00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:13,120
You can approach that in character and you can approach that out of character.

229
00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:16,640
I think if you're a more experienced player and you know the people that you're playing

230
00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:20,520
with very well, I think that you can do that completely in character.

231
00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:26,200
And be like, just have it kind of happen organically and naturally and find where and your relationship

232
00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,200
impulses kind of lie with different people.

233
00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,840
However, if you don't know the people that you're playing with very well and if you're

234
00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:37,560
kind of just in like newer to the game in general, I think it is going to be the most

235
00:09:37,560 --> 00:09:41,280
beneficial for you to talk to them out of character and just be like, hey.

236
00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:42,480
What are we going to do with this?

237
00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:48,920
So your character is like a warlock with like a themed patron.

238
00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:52,040
And my character is a cleric, like a light cleric.

239
00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:57,240
There's probably going to be some tension there because our like very natures contradict

240
00:09:57,240 --> 00:09:58,240
each other.

241
00:09:58,240 --> 00:09:59,240
Yeah.

242
00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:01,080
Do we want to like be antagonistic?

243
00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:02,400
Is that an okay thing to do?

244
00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:03,800
Or do we want to like do that?

245
00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:07,480
Which can feel a little bit like HRE, but genuinely I think it's going to help you in the long

246
00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:08,480
run.

247
00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:09,480
And that's something that like...

248
00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:12,320
And it drops down to another one of your fancy points here, which is how to encourage

249
00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:15,840
difference and non positive relationships without PVP.

250
00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:16,840
Yes.

251
00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:22,640
And the conflict between PCs and even PC to NPCs is so difficult because I mean kind

252
00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:25,520
of with our first point, you want your party to party.

253
00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:27,760
Like that's the whole fucking idea, man.

254
00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:31,640
I mean, and sometimes it's fun to like pit like conflict, like conflicts against one

255
00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:36,280
another and interest and like kind of like the fiend versus cleric thing or like a fucking

256
00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:39,760
rogue in a party with a paladin.

257
00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:40,760
How do you balance it?

258
00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,720
And how do you just not have it be combat and cock block every single fucking encounter?

259
00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:48,080
It's tricky and I've been on both sides of this where I have been the person who...

260
00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:52,520
Oh yeah, I've been the person to tell the rogue no.

261
00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:56,440
Like four times in one session and he got to the point where like out of character he

262
00:10:56,440 --> 00:11:00,560
was like, bro, let me do something.

263
00:11:00,560 --> 00:11:01,560
Let me play the game.

264
00:11:01,560 --> 00:11:06,240
And I'll say I've been on sides of this where I've been a character who has not known how

265
00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,320
to navigate, how did my first time playing.

266
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:09,840
I didn't know how to not do PVP.

267
00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:10,840
Notting.

268
00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:11,840
Notting.

269
00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:14,880
I've been in a lot of situations with every party member more than once.

270
00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:17,120
It was never like a thing that was supposed...

271
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:18,120
And no one...

272
00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:19,120
It was not like a cute thing.

273
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:20,120
It was like cool.

274
00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:21,120
She hits you.

275
00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:22,800
A lot of it is learning how to coexist.

276
00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:25,360
We talked about it in another episode.

277
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,040
Learning how to coexist when everyone's the main character is so impossible.

278
00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:30,440
And I think that that's like really important.

279
00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:34,320
How do you make sure your personality doesn't take up the whole fucking session, the whole

280
00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:36,720
campaign, the whole room?

281
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:41,640
And I think there's a lot of ways and we're dealing with this kind of like at our current

282
00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:45,280
table and this is something where like me as someone who knows the people that I've been

283
00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:50,320
playing up this table with pretty well, we're about to go on vacation together for the second

284
00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:51,320
time and...

285
00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:53,320
Let's just laugh.

286
00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:54,720
Jesus.

287
00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:58,240
And also like has been playing with these people for a while and I consider myself like

288
00:11:58,240 --> 00:11:59,960
a pretty decent player.

289
00:11:59,960 --> 00:12:04,080
I still like have real life conversations because there's a character.

290
00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:08,800
I'm playing a character named Nightlight with light based powers, Ray of fucking sunshine,

291
00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:14,200
Mary Bubbly and then there's a character named Shadow who is a shadow character with a sensitivity

292
00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:15,200
to light.

293
00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:16,200
Light and shadow.

294
00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:20,560
And also is like Batman and like beats the shit out of people and tortures them.

295
00:12:20,560 --> 00:12:22,720
Fucking white, good and bad.

296
00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:27,240
She doesn't think that that's okay and we had a moment at the table where we've like,

297
00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:31,880
we didn't really have time to do a lot of like inter-party like conversations with each

298
00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:34,880
other and there was a moment where I was like, I don't like what you do.

299
00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:36,560
I don't approve of the way you do it.

300
00:12:36,560 --> 00:12:38,680
He went, yeah, no me too.

301
00:12:38,680 --> 00:12:43,760
And then Robert was like, I was like, no, can we explore that conversation like a little

302
00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:44,760
bit more?

303
00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:46,000
Like there was something to be had there.

304
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,840
And we had a really cool conversation about it and we like talked about like why our

305
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,760
characters did what they did or thought the way they thought.

306
00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:55,280
And then after the session we were talking, we were like, no, that was really fun.

307
00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,800
Like I would love to explore the conflict there because these are two characters who

308
00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,440
get along very well otherwise.

309
00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:05,320
But this is kind of a big hurdle to get over of like, are you going to be okay with someone

310
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,040
who like beats the shit out of people?

311
00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:08,640
And I think that's when it really.

312
00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:14,680
It really starts to become important being like both the director and writer and not

313
00:13:14,680 --> 00:13:19,840
just like the guy telling the story and pushing the levers and pulling the buttons, you know,

314
00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:25,760
like sometimes is the DM you do have to step in and go, no, there's like, this is the script.

315
00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:27,000
This is what you should say.

316
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:28,840
This is the dialogue we're going to follow.

317
00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:33,840
This is the route we're going to pursue because part of your job and this might sound a little

318
00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:34,840
pretentious.

319
00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:37,960
You're part of your job is to know more than your players and to be like not a step above

320
00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:43,600
them, but just to be vigilant about all of the things happening and not happening.

321
00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:47,480
And if you know that for the sake of the story or for the plot or for the characters like

322
00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:50,480
Dan, they really should have had that conversation.

323
00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,520
Step in and go, hey guys, have this conversation.

324
00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:59,480
Because some players like the person that was opposite Madison are just not going to be

325
00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,880
as naturally inclined to pursue that conversation.

326
00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:03,880
And that's okay.

327
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:08,640
And that's why you have these things in place and why you have a relationship with your

328
00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:12,160
DM where they feel comfortable enough to be like, hey, like kind of dig into that a little

329
00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:13,160
bit more.

330
00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:17,640
Because I think one of the biggest differences between like your table that you play out

331
00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:23,840
in the basement versus like watching the people on dimension 20 or critical role in the way

332
00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:29,400
that that like emotional impact lands on those shows versus like at your own table.

333
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:33,400
Sometimes I think truly, truly is going to boil down to your inner party relationships

334
00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:34,400
with each other.

335
00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:39,080
Because I think if how invested you are, how much effort you put into it, have a relationship

336
00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:42,560
with the people that you're playing with and your character doesn't have a relationship

337
00:14:42,560 --> 00:14:44,920
with the other characters at the table.

338
00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:46,160
There's nothing really at stake.

339
00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:47,560
Like yeah, the world is at stake.

340
00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:50,720
That's where it gets difficult though, because some people aren't going to be able to have

341
00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:54,520
the time in real life or even the interest to get to know the other players.

342
00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:55,520
Yeah.

343
00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:58,960
And it's tricky because we're playing on a campaign where we can only play for so many

344
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,520
hours a week and we have limited time with each other.

345
00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:04,960
I mean we play more than most fucking tables get to play.

346
00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:12,080
For a while, I mean it was once every week, so that came out to four times a month.

347
00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,400
But at the same time, because of the stuff we were doing, it didn't feel like we had,

348
00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,880
our downtime was spent talking to each other.

349
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:22,920
And I think that one of the biggest downtime was spent trying to figure out what to fucking

350
00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:23,920
do next.

351
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,240
Like cool, so I'm doing this, I'm doing that, I'm doing that.

352
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:30,480
There was no downtime where it was like we sit down with a slice of pizza and talk it.

353
00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:35,400
Especially as a player, my best advice that I can give is like if you are given downtime,

354
00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:40,640
spend it doing a fucking beach episode with your party or a fucking bottle episode or

355
00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:41,800
whatever you want to call it.

356
00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,280
I just like to call them those.

357
00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:44,280
But like do something fun.

358
00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:45,280
I'm a slice of life episode.

359
00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:46,280
Have a filler episode.

360
00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:47,280
A slice of life episode.

361
00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:48,440
A slice of life of filler.

362
00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:53,120
I think that those are going to set the ground for really impactful moments later on where

363
00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:55,880
you're going to be able to encourage someone to do something.

364
00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:59,520
And it means a lot more that you're encouraging them because of this shared history that you

365
00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:03,120
have versus like the opposite.

366
00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:08,040
And I think that it's just something that's like I, having that investment is so big.

367
00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,560
And I think it's something where you just got to find other people at the table that

368
00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:14,920
are kind of like on your, and this is also coming from a perspective of like we don't

369
00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:18,480
know what your table looks like as a two-person.

370
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:20,600
I'm kind of speaking from experience at our table.

371
00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:24,000
A fucking good idea of what the majority of them look like truly.

372
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,360
It's not that varied of an experience.

373
00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:35,000
The table that we are playing at is one that is, I'm the big role play focused person.

374
00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:36,560
And like that's my favorite part of the game.

375
00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:38,840
And it is not really everyone else at the table's favorite.

376
00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:40,680
And that's, there's nothing wrong with that.

377
00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:41,680
No.

378
00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,080
We got our chess players, we got our combat, micro combat buddies, you know, we got the

379
00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:47,560
plot finders like.

380
00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:51,480
We play it, we play it in a very classic D&D table in my mind.

381
00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:52,480
It is a very like.

382
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:53,480
Yeah, it is very straight up.

383
00:16:53,480 --> 00:16:54,800
A very old school.

384
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,280
Like when you imagine a table full of people playing D&D.

385
00:16:57,280 --> 00:16:58,280
Full of men.

386
00:16:58,280 --> 00:16:59,280
And that's.

387
00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:00,280
Let's be honest, when you mentioned.

388
00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:01,280
Yeah, I didn't want to say it.

389
00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:05,760
A basement full of neckbeards sitting in their basement with slices of pizza and some beers

390
00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:06,760
like that.

391
00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:07,760
And then me.

392
00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,080
And then Madison, who's an actor.

393
00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:11,080
Yeah.

394
00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:17,240
So, you know, it's also a thing of like managing expectations, which we've talked about before,

395
00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:23,760
several times on the show of like kind of know what the, the vibe is and what the like

396
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:32,080
the, the, this is when you can help me out with a word.

397
00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,600
Like the theme, the feeling, the tone.

398
00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:36,520
I don't know, man.

399
00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:37,520
Sorry.

400
00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:40,880
No, I'm just kind of confused what like what we were going for.

401
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:41,880
I mean, I don't know.

402
00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:42,880
I have bits.

403
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:47,600
The vibe or the feeling of like the table and what other players are like wanting.

404
00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:48,880
Question for you then.

405
00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:56,560
How, as in try and give the most non-actor answer, you can try my best.

406
00:17:56,560 --> 00:18:01,840
I'm hearing a lot of like, try and manage this, try and have a relationship, try and

407
00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,720
like look for things here and look for the things here.

408
00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:05,720
How?

409
00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:07,280
Hey, this shit sucks.

410
00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:10,160
Do you have something you want to send in to make it better?

411
00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:14,040
Criticisms, topics you'd like to see discussed or an advertisement you'd like to run.

412
00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:16,080
Maybe you even want to sponsor an episode.

413
00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:25,360
If so, shoot us a message at mc460 at evansville.edu or DM us on Instagram at crescent magazine

414
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:28,800
or we'll never get better like these fucking guys.

415
00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:32,400
You have to medigame a little.

416
00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:37,640
If you find the way that I like to do it, the way that I like to approach it as me as

417
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:39,440
Maddie and this is not an actor answer.

418
00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:41,840
This is a legit Maddie answer.

419
00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:48,960
I like to see what the hooks are that I can dig my little goblin hands into and rip and

420
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:49,960
tear into.

421
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:50,960
A little dice goblin hands.

422
00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:51,960
I wasn't even going to go there.

423
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:53,960
I'm not a dice goblin and I stand by that.

424
00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:54,960
She's a goblin.

425
00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:55,960
You heard it here.

426
00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:58,200
Gremlin, sorry, I'm a gremlin.

427
00:18:58,200 --> 00:18:59,200
That fits better.

428
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:00,360
We can start saying dice gremlin if that makes you feel better.

429
00:19:00,360 --> 00:19:02,640
We don't need to say dice gremlin.

430
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:09,320
Anyway, if I know that a character, I'm going to use the fucking Warlock and cleric example

431
00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:13,480
again, if I know that a character and I know as Maddie that this character is a Warlock

432
00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:17,520
and has a fiend patron, even if my character doesn't know that, I know that that is going

433
00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:22,000
to make for a really interesting dynamic because they are like conflicting.

434
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:28,240
So I am going to have my character asking questions about the Warlock's patron and be

435
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,040
like, oh, that's Eldred's Blast.

436
00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:33,400
I didn't know you were a Warlock.

437
00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:34,400
That's cool.

438
00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:35,400
Who's your patron?

439
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:37,720
Oh, that's that's so neat.

440
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:44,240
Have you ever considered our Lord and Savior or like finding a way to kind of like explore

441
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:46,360
that there?

442
00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:50,320
So that's the way that I like to approach it is finding those hooks and finding where

443
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:55,000
your character and another character could overlap or your character and another character

444
00:19:55,000 --> 00:20:03,480
would have conflict and hitting those things and hitting them as aggressively as possible.

445
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:05,040
Because I guess it's possible.

446
00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:09,440
So sometimes I don't think there's a lot of room in D&D for subtlety when it comes

447
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:10,760
for players.

448
00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:12,760
I think a lot of the time we imagine and we want to do the same.

449
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,160
I think there's subtlety for the people that have done it a long time.

450
00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:20,080
I think there is zero room for it when you are just trying to like play the game and

451
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:23,320
you're not that experienced with it, you know?

452
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:28,280
So I think the thing of like holding a secret and being edgy is great in theory, but I think

453
00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:29,280
that's really fucking stupid.

454
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:30,280
Like awesome.

455
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:31,280
It's dumb.

456
00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:35,880
There's no reason for you to hold edgy boy secrets at a table where the whole reason

457
00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:39,360
you're there both as a person and as a PC is to work together.

458
00:20:39,360 --> 00:20:40,360
Is to work together.

459
00:20:40,360 --> 00:20:41,360
Yeah.

460
00:20:41,360 --> 00:20:45,200
Yes, you can make a character in a background who's fundamentally opposed to working in

461
00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:46,200
groups.

462
00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:51,080
That doesn't mean that you get explicit permission to dick off Batman style the whole fucking

463
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:52,080
game.

464
00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:54,720
And we've talked about that several times.

465
00:20:54,720 --> 00:21:00,160
I think to insert the DM2 since here, I think in terms of hooks to speaking directly to

466
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:06,120
the DMs, not so much to the players working those hooks in as much as you can to connect

467
00:21:06,120 --> 00:21:09,920
the players, I think is a really great way to do that too.

468
00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:14,400
Like if you see an opportunity, sorry, even if it's something that you haven't written,

469
00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:18,240
but it's something you know can give them a connection, but can take it man.

470
00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:26,520
Like it is a super easy switch to say instead of Sebastian going out and hanging with his

471
00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:31,240
best friend who has very little connection to the rest of the party Ricky, instead I'm

472
00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:37,560
going to have Sebastian go and hang out with his new best friend Parker who's out there

473
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:43,040
doing like the Lord's work and is also currently having a strange relationship with another

474
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,440
party member.

475
00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:48,560
That's going to get everybody at least those two people a lot more invested in that one

476
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:53,120
interaction and could eventually lead to some connecting and some hooking.

477
00:21:53,120 --> 00:21:56,840
But if I had just said cool Sebastian you're going to go hang out with Ricky for the day.

478
00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:02,720
I mean that player also has interest in Ricky, but Ricky's not also that player's best friend.

479
00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:06,680
So like there's no, there's no connecting of the dots there.

480
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:12,360
Like it's yes self-contained, but also aid your players with feeling connected to one

481
00:22:12,360 --> 00:22:16,320
another by giving them similar fucking anything.

482
00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:21,720
Similar friends, similar weapons, similar powers, relationships, fucking partners, plot

483
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:28,080
hooks, you know, make one character's arc necessary for another character's arc.

484
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:29,480
I love doing shit like that.

485
00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,520
And that's another thing that you can talk to player, like other players at your table

486
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:36,200
about is being like I would love for our characters to have this type of arc.

487
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:40,360
And that's like, that just in general, I didn't write this down, but that's something that

488
00:22:40,360 --> 00:22:45,120
like I'm very pro is straight up having a conversation with either your player or your

489
00:22:45,120 --> 00:22:49,040
DM and say, Hey, I want my character to have this type of arc.

490
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:50,320
I don't think that's cheating.

491
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:52,560
I think that that's actually incredibly helpful.

492
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,360
If you verbalize what you want helps me a lot.

493
00:22:55,360 --> 00:22:56,360
Sure.

494
00:22:56,360 --> 00:23:02,200
And it like also gives at least from my perspective, if I was DMing, I think it would give me kind

495
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:06,520
of an idea and a direction of like where I can go and where I can take something if I

496
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:07,520
wanted to.

497
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:11,200
And it also sets like a kind of clear of expectation.

498
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:14,480
There's another player at our table who I was like, I want our characters to be like really

499
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,480
good friends, like our characters are the two closest characters in age to each other.

500
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:21,080
We're from the same part of town.

501
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,400
Like, yeah, I am.

502
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:25,560
We're both like pretty new to the game.

503
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:30,200
And every other character is like older than us by almost 20 years.

504
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:33,920
Our characters should be good friends, like by all means.

505
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:37,280
So like next time that we've got downtime, let's hang out together.

506
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:41,600
And like, let's try and make these characters like friends, because I think that there's

507
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:46,480
sometimes like when we've done like one shots and stuff, I feel like all of our parties

508
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,520
and like characters have messed together so quickly because there's no time for like

509
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:50,520
position.

510
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,440
Because I'll make you all like a pre-made group of people.

511
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:53,440
Yeah.

512
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:54,440
You all have a bond before this.

513
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:55,440
Here's the bond.

514
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:56,440
Yeah.

515
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:57,440
Y'all know each other.

516
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:58,440
Yeah.

517
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:01,360
And I think that that's also like something, but if you're like playing in a long form,

518
00:24:01,360 --> 00:24:05,120
like a long run campaign where people have to find each other naturally and the party

519
00:24:05,120 --> 00:24:06,360
has to come together.

520
00:24:06,360 --> 00:24:08,080
I think that's when it becomes more difficult.

521
00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:11,440
But I also think that you can like kind of take initiative there and be like, I've decided

522
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:13,440
that this is our like dynamic.

523
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,160
Another easy way to do that, like give another character a nickname.

524
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,800
I think that's such an easy way to like establish like a familiarity and some sort of relationship.

525
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,920
And see, I think what keeps a lot of people from doing that kind of stuff though is that

526
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,520
it feels cringy to them.

527
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,960
And I think if it's only cringy, you make it.

528
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:34,160
To be like, Sebastian, you know, or like, or like Dee Dee, Daisy Dense or something.

529
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:35,160
Yeah.

530
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:36,160
Like, I don't know.

531
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:40,920
So much of the role playing issue when it comes to D&D is that we are not professional

532
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:41,920
actors.

533
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:42,920
Yeah.

534
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:44,520
We have not been trained to get over that cringiness.

535
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:50,000
And we are not willing to cross those social boundaries of which are like fundamentally

536
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:55,320
required for us to cross in order to create sort of the best version of the game we can.

537
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,560
And I think that that's that's always going to be the biggest hurdle for people in D&D.

538
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:01,480
And there's not going to, there's not a how to truly.

539
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,880
I mean, there are, but like, it's going to be the same how to of like how to get over

540
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:09,600
what I'm not going to say here and also act like as someone who's in college to be an

541
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:13,320
actor, I have those moments in my acting classes where I'm like this, I feel like someone's

542
00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:16,600
about to pop, maybe it's a result of like bullying in school, but I feel like someone's

543
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,840
about to pop out and be like, fucking got you, you goddamn loser.

544
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:20,840
What the fuck are you doing?

545
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:21,840
Oh my God.

546
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,040
You're really like pretending to be a squirrel right now.

547
00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:26,600
You're pretending to be 80% squirrel, 20% human.

548
00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:30,120
That's fucking stupid, which is a real exercise that we had to do in class, by the way.

549
00:25:30,120 --> 00:25:31,120
Fucking silly man.

550
00:25:31,120 --> 00:25:33,080
Yeah, it's silly, but guess what?

551
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:34,800
It was some of the most fun I've ever had.

552
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:35,960
Credit to you man.

553
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,920
And it's one of those things where like sometimes you got to figure out a way to like not be

554
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:44,600
cringy and I think my way of like kind of reaching that point is like I'm playing Dungeons

555
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:51,680
and Dragons in a basement at a table with a table full of men.

556
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,960
What else is left?

557
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:55,440
I have nowhere else to fall.

558
00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:56,800
Playing Magic the Gathering.

559
00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:01,160
I have nowhere, truly, truly the only way that I could make it weirder for myself and

560
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:05,320
sadder for myself is if I joined you all for your game of Magic the Gathering after, of

561
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:07,720
which I used to play with you all.

562
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:09,680
So I've already reached that low point.

563
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:14,720
I think truly, and this is my best way to get over it, and I mean this with love, you're

564
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,040
already playing Dungeons and Dragons.

565
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,640
You don't have to worry about being the coolest person in the room.

566
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:25,880
And it's like that step of forming those really personal connections is such a small, like

567
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:29,840
if you've already managed to get the table, you've already managed to say something in

568
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:30,840
character.

569
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:36,720
You've already managed to make a background and have a shtick and a story and a style.

570
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:40,440
What difference is it going to make for you if we're talking about feeling sort of socially

571
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:46,640
anxious to ask that person, not in an accent, not in a voice, just as you playing as that

572
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:47,640
character.

573
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,000
You want me to slice the pizza?

574
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:51,000
It's not.

575
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:52,000
Like it's not.

576
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:53,000
Like it's not.

577
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,000
I promise you that is the least weird thing that you were doing.

578
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:56,000
Truly.

579
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,840
And it's going to make everyone else feel like, wow, we're playing like in a real world because

580
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,840
there's no real world where you're going to risk your life with these people and then

581
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,440
not like also hang out with them.

582
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:09,040
Yeah, and I'll tell you what the lamest thing that you can do at the table is not.

583
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,440
That's why we're just shitting on people who just don't.

584
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,040
I mean, it definitely sounds like it.

585
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,760
Um, and maybe I am a little role play.

586
00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:18,560
Fuck you.

587
00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:19,560
You're the loser.

588
00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:20,560
Yeah.

589
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,520
I truly, I think, and like when someone's putting themselves out there, the worst thing

590
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:27,920
you can do is also not put yourself out there because you're going to look infinitely more

591
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:29,640
like a fucking loser.

592
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,120
Someone is like our table.

593
00:27:32,120 --> 00:27:34,920
I can't say that.

594
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:38,640
But like on that point of like worst thing you could do is not put yourself out there.

595
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,120
Most of the motherfuckers at our table are just like a little scared to put themselves

596
00:27:42,120 --> 00:27:43,120
out there.

597
00:27:43,120 --> 00:27:46,280
I think this is the one semester where people are like finally coming out of their shell

598
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:48,000
and really role playing.

599
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,400
But before that, they were the people that like, it was putting themselves out there.

600
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:53,400
I'm not going to lie.

601
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,000
I'm not going to sit here and pretend like it's bad man in a cave.

602
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,840
I'm not going to sit here and pretend like that is not something that I struggle with

603
00:27:58,840 --> 00:27:59,840
at our table.

604
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:02,120
But I know the people at our table and I love them.

605
00:28:02,120 --> 00:28:03,120
You're messing with the document.

606
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:04,120
I am messing with it.

607
00:28:04,120 --> 00:28:05,120
Okay.

608
00:28:05,120 --> 00:28:08,660
And don't stare at me while you do it.

609
00:28:08,660 --> 00:28:11,400
You fucking freak.

610
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,320
And I think that that's something that like I've had to deal with.

611
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,440
And that's like going back to dealing with expectations.

612
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:19,560
How long are you going to do this bit, Robert?

613
00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:22,400
Long enough for my brain to turn on.

614
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:23,400
Okay.

615
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:28,240
Well, speaking of which, I mean, this is going to get kind of like into DM territory here.

616
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,760
If we're doing an episode called character relationships, I feel like we also have to

617
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:38,160
address like the other type of relationships that kind of exist in the game, which are

618
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:44,360
very common in a lot of tables that have not happened really at ours yet.

619
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:45,360
Romantic relationship.

620
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:47,320
We finally got a couple.

621
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:50,120
We got a couple of ankleings in this one.

622
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:51,120
Yeah.

623
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:52,480
I'm excited to see how things happen.

624
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:53,480
It's so funny.

625
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:58,520
Now is like there's no reason why like Sebastian and Daisy should not be semi interested in

626
00:28:58,520 --> 00:28:59,520
one another.

627
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:00,520
Y'all are the same age.

628
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:05,880
We both know that you are attractive in the game, but because you too as players are so

629
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:07,720
absolutely not.

630
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:08,720
No.

631
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:09,720
Never going to happen.

632
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:10,720
Yeah.

633
00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:11,720
It's never going to happen.

634
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,960
There's so many times where I'm like sitting there.

635
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:16,960
It's like you put Beast Boy and Raven in a room.

636
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:20,320
How do you expect the two of them not to like hang out and talk to one another and kind

637
00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:21,320
of like flirt a little bit?

638
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:22,320
I mean.

639
00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:23,320
We got two people.

640
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:24,320
We've managed to do that.

641
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:25,320
To fit the demographic.

642
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:29,680
And they don't even acknowledge that the other person is like semi attractive or also

643
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:30,680
in the same profession.

644
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:35,800
And this is like we are where we as a table are the polar opposite of like so many other

645
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:38,400
D&D tables, which is like so many other tables.

646
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,880
It's like, yeah, you flirt with your friends and you and your friend make little characters

647
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,080
for mills and they fall in love and it's so cute.

648
00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:47,600
Our table and I mean this with love.

649
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:49,120
It is the I love everyone.

650
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:50,120
What are they?

651
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,040
I mean, there's something, there's something that's a little there that's a little weird

652
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,600
about flirting with your male friend or female.

653
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:56,600
Yeah.

654
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:57,600
If you are the opposite gender.

655
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:58,600
Yeah.

656
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,120
It's like one of the biggest hurdles at our table as we are a group.

657
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:02,120
It is a, um,

658
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:05,680
In our male, our male players will just straight up touch each other at the table.

659
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:06,680
Yeah.

660
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:07,680
Yeah.

661
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:12,320
And it's something we're like, I, this is one of the situations where like, I'm sorry,

662
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:13,720
I have a twister in my mouth.

663
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:15,440
Robert, you talk for like 10 seconds.

664
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,080
I'll talk for 10 seconds.

665
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:21,800
So I think when talking about the DM perspective, specifically when you're looking at romantic

666
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,040
relationships, I don't have a lot of expertise with it.

667
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:25,040
You want to know why?

668
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:30,000
Cause nobody at our table has dared to cross that line, but we've gotten close this semester

669
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,800
and it's only really happened with a couple of different people and it's basically just

670
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:34,800
like this.

671
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:35,800
Will they, won't they?

672
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:36,800
Yeah.

673
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:44,160
I made Aunt May or Batman and Batman rolled like 23 and then basically it was like your

674
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:48,400
lips are the color of roses and then proceeded to turn around and like basically have a panic

675
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,680
attack and vomit like on it.

676
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:54,520
And that was like, we're not sure if that was the player or the character in that moment.

677
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:55,520
100%.

678
00:30:55,520 --> 00:31:02,880
But like it's difficult because romantic relationships are like the ultimate private like connection

679
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,040
that you can have with another person for the same reason that like guys will play

680
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:10,920
grab ass, but guys also won't talk about their feelings as one another.

681
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:15,940
There's a line there that is like fundamentally not to be crossed and people are just as scared

682
00:31:15,940 --> 00:31:18,080
about crossing that line at the table too.

683
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,880
And I think at our specific table, it's, it's an interesting thing of talking about like,

684
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:26,160
you know, it is a table full of male friends that have been friends for a while and then

685
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:32,200
me and it's really difficult to separate the fact like reality from the game.

686
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:36,040
And it's one of those situations where it's like, that's a weird thing to navigate of

687
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,240
like me being at the table because I'm like,

688
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:43,640
I'm playing Sebastian and Daisy and Madison playing, sorry, Maddie and Maddie playing Daisy

689
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,000
start flirting with one another at the table.

690
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,720
It's kind of like, okay, this is gross to watch.

691
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:50,720
Yeah.

692
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,240
I don't know if it feels gross on the airport because they're basically like brother and

693
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:54,240
sister.

694
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:55,240
Yeah.

695
00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:58,240
And it's one of those things of like, I'm playing at a table full of my brothers.

696
00:31:58,240 --> 00:31:59,240
Yeah.

697
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:03,640
So you're not going to be like, Hey, brother, you're like kind of cute.

698
00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:04,640
Absolutely not.

699
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,720
And that's something where like you have a conversation with your DM and like your other

700
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:09,720
players.

701
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:11,600
So your DMs start getting you hot in PCs to flirt with.

702
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:12,600
Yeah.

703
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:16,520
And it was like the closest that we had to like a romantic relationship in our previous

704
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:21,960
campaign was still like, it was never spoken about like it was never acknowledged.

705
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:24,400
It was like there were a couple of jokes from like NPCs.

706
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:25,400
Which one?

707
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:26,400
Adeline Magnolia.

708
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:27,400
Oh, yeah.

709
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:32,680
Like there were jokes from NPCs because there was like a, they were definitely like sharing

710
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:33,680
a room.

711
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:35,960
They just like never acknowledged it at the table or anything.

712
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:37,520
No, because it would be weird.

713
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:38,560
They got married.

714
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:42,560
They straight up got married in that last fight.

715
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:44,840
Oh yeah, but not really.

716
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:49,160
Yeah, but like still for the buff, not like walk down the aisle.

717
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:52,360
It was for the like the bonus points, but like, um,

718
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:53,360
Got married.

719
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:56,320
You say like y'all like got fucking like had a whole ceremony.

720
00:32:56,320 --> 00:33:00,760
No, um, it was so we could do a really cool thing and that it didn't happen.

721
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:04,840
Um, but it was one of those things where it's everyone knew.

722
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:05,840
Yeah.

723
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:10,520
And it, but it was like any time that I as Magnolia tried to like talk about feelings

724
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:16,320
with that specific character, it got shut down so fucking fast because that player in

725
00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:20,160
real life is a little scared of those feelings at times.

726
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,440
And that's where those things were like, it's, and you got to feel at the comfort of the

727
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,520
people that you're playing with and see like what they're okay with and like where the

728
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:32,240
line is between the table and real life, which I think that some players and some tables

729
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,080
are able to do a lot easier than others.

730
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,520
We existed a table where some things are a little bit more difficult.

731
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:39,520
One woman.

732
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:40,520
Yeah.

733
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:41,880
It is, it is such a table.

734
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:43,760
It is great setup for a porno.

735
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:44,760
Jesus Christ.

736
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:45,960
Not for a D and D table.

737
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:46,960
You know why?

738
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:51,920
Cause every dick is in every pant, firmly zipped the fuck up at all times.

739
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:52,920
Where is this?

740
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:53,920
What?

741
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:59,160
I'm saying that in so many other situations, there is plenty of room for cross pollination

742
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,520
here and there is zero at a D and D table.

743
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:03,520
Correct.

744
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:05,520
And it's infuriating to watch.

745
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:06,520
Correct.

746
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:10,600
It is something where like I as a player, I'm like a little conflicted because I'm

747
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,640
someone who like at my other like tables that I played at.

748
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:14,640
Is it weird?

749
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:15,640
Are you making it weird?

750
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:16,640
And that's the thing.

751
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,760
I think it's, I think that this is one of those things where like it's only weird if

752
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:24,240
you make it weird, but also on the flip side, I've like, anytime.

753
00:34:24,240 --> 00:34:27,800
Cause every single significant other is going to go like, yeah, but you can't have like

754
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,320
really a female friend.

755
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:30,320
Yeah.

756
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:33,160
Like you're not, I'm not really going to let you guys like cuddle in bed just because

757
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:34,640
it feels nice as people.

758
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:38,720
Yeah. and I think it's one of those things where if you have like, I think that you can

759
00:34:38,720 --> 00:34:45,960
have romantic relationships like as characters at a table with like mixed, uh,

760
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:47,880
genders, mixed genders.

761
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,880
Um, just because, and I'm saying that only in the terms of like that is the table that

762
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:52,880
I play at.

763
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:59,960
Um, uh, uh, I think that that is okay, but I'm also an actor and I also like have conversations

764
00:34:59,960 --> 00:35:01,520
at the table of like, this is what we should do.

765
00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,440
Cause we had conversations earlier this year where, where you were talking about how you

766
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:06,240
wanted to introduce like romantic interests.

767
00:35:06,240 --> 00:35:07,520
Um, in this camera.

768
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:11,840
And I tried and then it ran away from me and like a fucking like just train off the track

769
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:12,840
dude.

770
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:13,840
Yeah.

771
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:18,040
Like, uh, and like we've talked a couple of times about a possible, um, like a romance

772
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:22,040
setup for Daisy in the future because that is something that I like want to happen.

773
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:25,280
Uh, everyone thing is going to be our best friend.

774
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:27,880
Everyone thinks that I think Daisy thinks that too.

775
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:32,560
I think Daisy is trying hard enough for there to be something there and Barker is just,

776
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:38,880
I think she loves Parker in a specific way, but I think if Parker was like, Hey, I like

777
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,320
you in a different kind of specific way.

778
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:42,320
I don't know.

779
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:47,160
There's a world where Daisy's like zero interest, never, never ever.

780
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:48,360
It may be.

781
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:49,360
I don't know.

782
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:54,000
That's something that'll be explored at the table, but I, I think that that would be more

783
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:55,000
fun.

784
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:59,320
I infinitely think like genuinely that is one of the opportunities.

785
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,280
I have to flirt with you at the table.

786
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:03,520
I mean, you also play Parker.

787
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:04,520
Yeah.

788
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:05,840
That's weird shit.

789
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:06,840
And that's weird shit.

790
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:07,840
And you've got to deal with that.

791
00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:11,160
And are you making it weird or is it just weird?

792
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:13,120
I think both, I think both.

793
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:14,520
I think both can exist.

794
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:15,520
100%.

795
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:19,480
And it's one of those tricky things, um, of like, I have so much respect for like the

796
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:22,400
critical roll cast and the dimension 20 cast and watching.

797
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,760
We're just flirting and fucking all over the place.

798
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:25,760
Oh my God.

799
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:26,760
It's insane.

800
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:27,760
Yeah.

801
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:31,240
They have like, and they're like character romances are like, they're like romance.

802
00:36:31,240 --> 00:36:32,240
novels.

803
00:36:32,240 --> 00:36:34,040
It's like fleshed out fully there.

804
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:35,040
Tense.

805
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:38,760
And they're like, their, their wives and husbands are at the table with them.

806
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:45,000
Like critical role or married couples, married couples at that table.

807
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,640
And let me tell you, you want to know who hypes up their relationships with other PCs

808
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:50,640
more than anyone else.

809
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:51,880
They're fucking husband.

810
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:57,160
When I tell you Travis was hyped as fuck for fucking Vex and Percy.

811
00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:58,920
That shit was adorable.

812
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,800
Like no one was more excited about that romance than he was.

813
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:09,960
Um, like I'm so much respect for like that whole like the idea of like you can like form

814
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,240
like these really cool like fleshed out relationships.

815
00:37:12,240 --> 00:37:13,240
Yeah.

816
00:37:13,240 --> 00:37:17,200
Um, but I think kind of getting back to why there's such an emphasis on those kinds of

817
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:23,600
relationships is like, if I say roll a d20 for your last saving throw and you fail and

818
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:27,760
you have no relationship to anybody in the party or you're like, damn, that sucks.

819
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:31,040
That sucks for you because like you don't get to play the rest of this combat encounter.

820
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,600
We're going to go back to what we were doing, but like, wow, that really sucks.

821
00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:39,200
Versus like your husband watches you fall from across the battlefield.

822
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:41,320
Like that's that shit's got intrigue.

823
00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:44,840
I wouldn't go into a rage like, you know, and then it's a whole thing.

824
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:52,160
I think it's also for me as like a person who's made like a million characters and even

825
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:55,120
like not in D&D fashion have done a thing where like I've created a character and worked

826
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:58,120
with other people who've created the character in that same world and we like work and like

827
00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,600
flesh out a story together and blah, blah, blah.

828
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:05,240
Um, romantic relationships are always a fun thing to do because they're just fun to play.

829
00:38:05,240 --> 00:38:11,160
Like as a, as a player, as like an actor, as a creator, those type of relationships are

830
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:13,080
so important.

831
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:16,240
And I think that there's a lot of emphasis on those in our culture.

832
00:38:16,240 --> 00:38:19,560
And I think that's why people gravitate towards them, which I think is also when everyone

833
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,560
at the table is like, no, Daisy's got to be in love with Parker.

834
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:26,000
And I'm like, is that the case or does she just have a really deep relationship with

835
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,760
him and we just have so much emphasis on romantic relationships?

836
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:32,240
So I have a question as a culture for both of us.

837
00:38:32,240 --> 00:38:35,960
How it's, it's about one of the points on here, which is how to encourage difference

838
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,240
in non positive relationships without PVP.

839
00:38:39,240 --> 00:38:45,160
How do you as a player approach a situation where in character, another character fully

840
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:49,560
like steps to you and it's like, I don't agree with the decision you just made.

841
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:51,800
I don't like you as a person.

842
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:52,800
We're in a party.

843
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:53,800
This is a very loose relationship.

844
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,360
And in this moment right here and right now, I'm calling you on your shit.

845
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:58,360
Who?

846
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,560
How do you take that in a non PVP route?

847
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:05,840
If that is not the direction that you wish to go without blowing up the fucking party.

848
00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:06,840
Okay.

849
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:08,080
I'm going to, I'm going to sound like a bitch right now.

850
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:09,440
I'm going to need more specifics.

851
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:14,080
I only because I think it is something that varies from, so let's say, let's say with

852
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:17,400
like, um, like a Magnolia situation, it never really happened.

853
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,960
I mean, it happened a couple of times, but it never really like really, really, really

854
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:21,960
happened.

855
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:26,320
So let's say a rogue goes in like Rob's a bank and Paladin like picks up on it last

856
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,520
minute because rogue drops like, I don't know, a piece, like a jewel on the way in the door

857
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:31,520
of their hideout.

858
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:36,360
And then Paladin confronts that, that rogue that evening and everyone at the table knows

859
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:41,160
including person playing character who is rogue and person playing character who is Paladin

860
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:47,160
that like their ideologies, their personalities have already been on opposite into the spectrum.

861
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:49,800
And this is like the straw that breaks the camel's back.

862
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:55,200
How do you not have it end up in a party blow up or a situation where you both is people

863
00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,960
just go, we're not going to acknowledge that.

864
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:02,720
Here is how I as a player without it turning into cool.

865
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:03,720
We're fighting each other.

866
00:40:03,720 --> 00:40:08,400
I know I'm here's how I as a player would handle that type of situation.

867
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:11,840
And this is like, I'm going to be like going like in full detail of like the actions that

868
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:12,920
I would take.

869
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:16,520
I think that a way to like explore or avoid that would be something along the lines of

870
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:17,560
I would take that character.

871
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,080
I would do a private confrontation.

872
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:20,080
Yeah.

873
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:23,320
And I would, I still think you can have a full speech and you can have a full step of

874
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:26,680
moment of I know what the fuck you're doing and it's not okay.

875
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:27,680
And I'm not going to do with it.

876
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:32,800
I think that the way that you get out of it being PVP is relying on outside circumstances.

877
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:38,080
I think going and leaning like into this person and being like, Hey, motherfucker, we have

878
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:40,000
bigger stakes at play.

879
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,440
We are on the middle of like, we are in the middle of hunting down this fucking dragon

880
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:46,280
that has burned down my grandma's village.

881
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:50,640
And I am not letting you and your dumb ass decisions get in the way of that.

882
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:54,280
So I'm going to tell you right now, I do not like you.

883
00:40:54,280 --> 00:41:00,700
We like this and as soon as our time as a party is done, I will deal with that.

884
00:41:00,700 --> 00:41:05,520
So then what do you do when the other player not clearly picking up on, because this happens

885
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:07,280
with us at the fucking time of the table.

886
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:10,200
What happens when the other person goes, you know what?

887
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:11,200
No.

888
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:12,200
No, this is a problem.

889
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:13,200
This is a standing problem.

890
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,840
It needs to be dealt with right here, right now.

891
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,360
I don't fuck with this whole let's do it later bullshit.

892
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:20,560
You're going to call me out on my stuff.

893
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,200
No, that's not the route we're going.

894
00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:28,080
Oh, well, one, I think that's a moment where you as a player, this is what I would do as

895
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:29,080
a player.

896
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:32,280
I would look at that other player and go, what the fuck are you doing?

897
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:33,280
Like real life.

898
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:34,280
Hey, this is Maddie right now.

899
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:36,560
Bro, we can't do this.

900
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:37,880
That is always an option.

901
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:42,200
And I do want to put that out there just straight up because we had a moment at the table where

902
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:44,200
I was getting a little like, huh.

903
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:45,200
Yeah.

904
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:46,200
I was like, come on guys.

905
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:50,200
With the situation and I like fully broke and was like, hey, this is Maddie talking to the

906
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:52,120
other person at the table.

907
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,000
What are we doing right now?

908
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:55,600
Is this really what we're doing?

909
00:41:55,600 --> 00:41:58,440
Because I'm not spending 20 minutes doing this in real time.

910
00:41:58,440 --> 00:41:59,440
Yeah.

911
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:00,600
So we're going to move on.

912
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:05,400
I think genuinely having your player disengage or having a player be like, you're not because

913
00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:08,040
you can go, I'm the bigger person and I'm not going to fight you.

914
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:11,880
Or you can be like, you can kind of take like the petty around be like, you're not even

915
00:42:11,880 --> 00:42:14,800
fucking worth the effort that I'm putting in.

916
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:19,560
I think the outside extenuating circumstances is almost always going to be your best default

917
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:21,400
in that situation.

918
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:25,520
To answer my own question, I think being like, hey, there are just things that are bigger

919
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:26,520
than us right now.

920
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:31,120
And for the sake of getting through this, like, yeah, we will PVP on the second to last

921
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:32,120
session.

922
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:33,120
You bet your ass.

923
00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:34,120
I'll be there.

924
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:39,000
Time and place at this like specific tree where we met me and you fucking no holds bar.

925
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:40,000
One person walks away.

926
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:41,000
One person doesn't.

927
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,120
But then being like, yeah, but we have shit to do right now.

928
00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:48,800
I think as a DM, how I would handle that situation if like two people were like dead

929
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:53,520
set or one person is very clearly like, I don't want to be VP either because they know

930
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:56,040
they're going to lose or because it's not the right thing to happen.

931
00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,680
And one person is like, no, let me hit them.

932
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:01,560
I'm asking you to roll for initiative.

933
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:02,880
Let me hit them.

934
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,320
I think truly, I think as a DM, that's the situation where you just have to go, you know

935
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:07,320
what?

936
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:08,320
Not right now.

937
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:09,320
Yeah.

938
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:10,320
Not right now.

939
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,320
Like, or that's when you're like, and suddenly somebody knocks on the door.

940
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:13,320
I was going to say that.

941
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:14,320
I was going to say that.

942
00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:19,120
Suddenly like the other two PCs who have been in the wings watching this argument go down,

943
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:23,320
walk back into the house or show up at the hideout or you hear an explosion or you're

944
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,040
you're sending stone begins to vibrate.

945
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,960
Like that's when you have to like throw a fucking wrench right in between.

946
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,160
It would be like, there's something else bigger than you all right now.

947
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:35,280
If your players aren't, I don't want to say not intelligent enough, but if your players

948
00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:39,440
aren't like perceptive enough, they're there to pick it up.

949
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:41,400
You put it down in front of them.

950
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:42,400
You go, no.

951
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:44,960
And I think that's something that you as a player can also do.

952
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:48,640
If you see this happening with two other players, you can jump in.

953
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:49,640
I just, yeah, that's you.

954
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:50,640
That's when you go to your DMU.

955
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:52,160
Can I just walk in right now?

956
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:55,320
Can I just like, I have pizza guys.

957
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:56,320
Yeah.

958
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,240
And it's something that you're going to like read differently at every table in every situation

959
00:43:59,240 --> 00:44:03,040
because maybe this is a moment where you do want PVP to happen.

960
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:07,000
And I would say always ask permission in that situation though, because there are definitely

961
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,560
times where like two players are having their thing and yes, it could be disastrous, but

962
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:12,440
they also want to play it out.

963
00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:17,960
And so to just have another PC who's like fully uninvolved in this situation go and

964
00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:19,600
suddenly I walk in.

965
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:21,440
That just feels very like, okay.

966
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:23,440
Like you didn't ask permission to do that.

967
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:25,600
Yes, we live in a world where that could happen.

968
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:27,240
No, this is not your moment.

969
00:44:27,240 --> 00:44:31,560
Fully ask your DM in this moment or even ask the players, hey guys, can I walk in in this

970
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:37,360
moment to like diffuse or just to be like comedic relief or something?

971
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:39,760
Most times you'll get told yes.

972
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:46,680
And I think just, oh my gosh, I had like a whole thought and then it just fucking slipped.

973
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:48,520
Gone to the ether.

974
00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:49,520
Truly.

975
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:50,520
That ass.

976
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:51,520
That ass.

977
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:52,520
Yeah.

978
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:53,520
Anyway, oh, this is another one.

979
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:57,200
Just fun character relationships that you can explore within your party and this is just

980
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,600
me kind of rattling off tropes that I like.

981
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:01,600
Buddy cop.

982
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:05,400
Buddy cop is, it will always be one of the funniest fucking things.

983
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:10,800
One of my personal favorite is like the Reformed villain buddy cop situation where like the

984
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:15,640
vibe at like Thor Ragnarok where like Loki and Thor like working together again.

985
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:19,360
It's like one person clearly doesn't want to be here and does not agree with the rules

986
00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:21,040
and the way that we're doing this.

987
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:25,880
But God fucking, I have to do this and now you just have like it was party full of clerics

988
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:29,960
and then they're one fucking like warlock friend who doesn't want to be there.

989
00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:30,960
That's so funny.

990
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:32,040
I don't want to be here anymore than you all want.

991
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:36,440
That is always so funny and that is always a funny like party dynamic.

992
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:37,440
Funny.

993
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:38,440
Ha ha.

994
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:43,400
I think that a parent character is always fucking funny whether that be a literal parent

995
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:48,440
or just a character that is like fully taken the role of being like, okay guys.

996
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:49,440
Like dad Batman.

997
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:50,440
Yeah.

998
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:52,480
Like the mom friend or the dad friend or dad Batman.

999
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:56,080
Like that is also infinitely going to be kind of like a funny thing and I think it

1000
00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:59,480
gives everyone just a little little side note here too.

1001
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:03,000
This is something that I've just just now in this moment decided I wanted to do but

1002
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:06,400
also something I would encourage other DMs to think about doing.

1003
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:11,160
Don't be afraid to do like a little like a little mid campaign check in with your players.

1004
00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:17,640
You know, that could be, hey, there's this plotline that I gave you and you just sort

1005
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:18,720
of fucked off with it.

1006
00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:20,040
I don't know if you remember it.

1007
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:21,640
I don't know if you're intentionally ignoring it.

1008
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:23,240
I can't force you to go after it.

1009
00:46:23,240 --> 00:46:27,680
But like, hey, maybe at the end of that rainbow, there's a pot of gold waiting for you and

1010
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:28,680
it's pretty cool.

1011
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:33,440
I just wanted you to pick that up because like maybe that person is like voicing a lot

1012
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:34,440
of disgruntle.

1013
00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:38,200
I'm not getting any, you know, any attention or any focus or any this or any that.

1014
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:42,320
And if you have, if you as a DM have like thrown it out there, breadcrumbs and they've

1015
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:44,720
just like stepped all over that shit.

1016
00:46:44,720 --> 00:46:47,680
Hey, bro, breadcrumbs, breadcrumbs, they're still there.

1017
00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:48,680
I left them there for you.

1018
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:49,680
Yeah.

1019
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:51,480
At this point, I'm giving it to you in a fucking present.

1020
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:52,480
Like just pick it up.

1021
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:56,880
I think in the same way, if there are relationships that you want your players to explore or certain

1022
00:46:56,880 --> 00:47:01,280
kinds of role play that you would like players to emphasize doing those check-ins too, I

1023
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:05,480
think would really, would really, really be helpful.

1024
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:09,360
Like in this moment, my, my thought was I kind of want to tell dad, Batman guy to be

1025
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:13,800
a little bit more dad like, because I feel like that's how he's positioned himself, but

1026
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:17,920
he's not really stepping into that role any other way than being like, here's money for

1027
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:19,760
your problems.

1028
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,640
And I personally would love to see him be anything other than here's money for your

1029
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:23,640
problems.

1030
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:24,640
You know what I'm saying?

1031
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:28,720
Uh, same thing with like a couple of the other characters, just general feedback being like

1032
00:47:28,720 --> 00:47:30,000
be more this, be less that.

1033
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,720
I like this, I like this direction that we're going.

1034
00:47:32,720 --> 00:47:33,720
What can we do with it?

1035
00:47:33,720 --> 00:47:37,480
You don't always have to just leave it up to your players to like stumble into some role

1036
00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:39,240
playing or relationship gold.

1037
00:47:39,240 --> 00:47:43,920
You can also just be like, hey, I can see it because I got a big picture.

1038
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:45,520
Maybe leave a little more on this.

1039
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:46,600
Maybe go pick up that.

1040
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,680
Maybe do a little insight check, a little perception check on that thing.

1041
00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:51,560
Ask this person out to coffee.

1042
00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:52,560
Maybe something will happen.

1043
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:53,560
You know?

1044
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:54,560
Magical.

1045
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:55,560
Just meta game.

1046
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:56,560
Just meta game.

1047
00:47:56,560 --> 00:47:57,560
You can do that.

1048
00:47:57,560 --> 00:47:58,560
That's allowed.

1049
00:47:58,560 --> 00:47:59,560
Truly.

1050
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:02,720
I think there's so many like of those fun like metagaming things and like you can also

1051
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:07,560
just like pick a fucking trope or like a concept and like straight up like just tell it to

1052
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:08,560
your party.

1053
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:11,560
Just build your character to like as a player, build your character around a trope and just

1054
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:13,240
let everyone know.

1055
00:48:13,240 --> 00:48:16,640
Like I think another one of the like really good ones are like ones that are always funny

1056
00:48:16,640 --> 00:48:22,040
or like the, the, the like unlikely pair of like two characters that seem so fucking

1057
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:24,240
different but are like besties.

1058
00:48:24,240 --> 00:48:25,240
That's always funny.

1059
00:48:25,240 --> 00:48:27,960
If you look at like Pike and Grog from Fox Machina.

1060
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:30,520
That was the first example that came to my mind.

1061
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:34,760
That is always funny if you have like this big hulking like scary character and this like

1062
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:36,840
tiny little like sunshine character.

1063
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:37,840
That's so funny.

1064
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:43,520
Or like a like a overly pessimistic fucking like asshole jaded character and like a fucking

1065
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:45,760
sunshine like a goddamn ray of sunshine.

1066
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:46,760
That's so funny.

1067
00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:47,760
Yeah.

1068
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:49,360
Like all of those things are really fun.

1069
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:50,360
Yep.

1070
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:53,040
Be afraid to mix it up.

1071
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:57,600
What are other like I immediately like normally I'm so good at like having tropes and shit

1072
00:48:57,600 --> 00:49:03,880
and I've like lost all of them instantly.

1073
00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:07,320
I think, oh Jesus, other tropes.

1074
00:49:07,320 --> 00:49:08,320
Fuck's sake.

1075
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:11,440
I mean there's so many of them.

1076
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:14,680
I think yeah the buddy Copland is just funny as fuck.

1077
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:18,680
I think having two people in like unrelated jobs like come together and then be like oh

1078
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:22,720
shit you're also in the system or like even having that like you've always been there

1079
00:49:22,720 --> 00:49:26,760
the characters had every reason to meet and never met until it's like oh my god wait you're

1080
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:28,560
from like two blocks over.

1081
00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:31,640
Yeah or having those little connections happen behind the scene.

1082
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:32,840
We're like you know so and such.

1083
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:33,840
I know so and such.

1084
00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:37,760
You know Ricky I know Ricky you're from the farm from the fringes too.

1085
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:38,760
It's shit living here.

1086
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:40,000
Yeah it's shit living here.

1087
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,160
That's like that shit.

1088
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:44,240
Just do stuff that you find funny legitimately.

1089
00:49:44,240 --> 00:49:45,560
That's what this boils down to.

1090
00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:46,560
Yeah.

1091
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:47,560
You shit that you find funny.

1092
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:51,240
100% like that's truly where you're going to have the most fun in the game.

1093
00:49:51,240 --> 00:49:52,960
That's where it's at dude.

1094
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,760
Speaking of comedy thank you all for listening to another episode of Table Talk.

1095
00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:58,760
We will see you again soon.

1096
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:00,760
Bye.

1097
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:02,240
I like to think of us as comedians.

1098
00:50:02,240 --> 00:50:04,040
I'm sorry are we not is that not what we are.

1099
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,320
No I like to think I'm a comedian.

1100
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:08,320
And see that's where the real comedy is at.

1101
00:50:08,320 --> 00:50:25,360
I will kill you.