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Welcome to the God's Goodness podcast where our mission is to encourage and highlight God's

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goodness in modern-day miracles. We are your hosts, Josh and Shelley Hankins. Today we have

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with us a special guest. We met through TikTok and her name is Lisa Pugh and let me tell

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you Lisa loves Jesus and Jesus loves Lisa and Lisa prayed and asked the Holy Spirit

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on what she should share about today and we know that God speaks to everybody in every

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episode. So we pray that you're blessed by this episode. We're going to have Lisa open

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us up with an opening prayer and then we'll get into it.

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Thank you so much. Let's pray. Dear Lord, I just thank you so much for the opportunity

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to talk to my friend Shelley today, God. I thank you for the many ways that you bless

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us and thank you that we are able to read and comprehend and hide your words in our

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heart. God, I ask you today to just speak through us and touch the lives of those around us.

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I thank you so much for the way that you will use this podcast to reach people and change

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lives and change hearts. And I ask all these things in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Thank you

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for that. Thank you. So where would you like to start, Lisa?

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So after praying about it for a while and I actually had the opportunity to serve in

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a newer women's ministry, which is crazy because I live kind of out in the country and there's

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not a whole lot of things close to me, but this women's ministry actually opened up in

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its 15 minutes from my house. Yes. And so it is a women's addiction recovery home. And

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so it's a 12 month program and it's a smaller home out in the country and there's just some

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good Jesus living people that opened it up. And I have had the opportunity to go there

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once every week. They have me on their calendar and we sometimes we do some stretching and

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light exercise things. And sometimes we just sit in a circle on the floor and talk about

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what's going on and how God has blessed us. So I actually was able to share my thoughts

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about what I was going to talk about today with them yesterday. Oh, great. And yes, it

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was such a great conversation, but it's all about learning to surrender the control of

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our minds and our emotions to the Holy Spirit. That's yes. You want to renew that month every

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day. Yes. And you know, I think it's a whole lifelong process of learning to lay down different

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parts of ourselves to fully surrender. And sometimes, you know, that's it's a lot of

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times it's not just a one time thing, especially in my case, I've had I'm a planner and you

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know, I think moms we do this. We like to have everything lined up just so and unfortunately

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life doesn't usually line up with our plans. Yeah, sometimes we forgot we forget to tell

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our husbands our plans. Yes. Yes. Wonder why he's not following the thing in my head.

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The plan. I know. I know. And so, you know, I think I've had to learn that is, you know,

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I just have to give all control. And one thing I've learned through this particular season

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in life is that I may not be able to control what's going on around me or with people around

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me, but I can control how I react to that. And that's only by allowing the Holy Spirit

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to do that for me because it's not by my own strength because like if you know, if Lisa's

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in charge of it usually doesn't go that well. So I need Jesus to come in and be like, Yeah,

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let me handle that. For sure. Yes. And it's not like a daily thing. I was thinking it's

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like it throughout the day to have the renewing of your mind because there's so many things

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external factors that can get you off track and get you in a funk. Yes. And I've noticed

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that too. And I've also noticed the Bible has some really good life principles. And

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it's funny to me because like we study and we memorize scripture and like we know scripture.

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And then when we actually apply it, we're like, Oh yeah. Wow. Look at that. You know,

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yeah, it's kind of like a dull moment. You know, yeah, wisdom is knowledge applied. Yes.

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And so I've learned that now. One thing I was thinking about is, you know, we are supposed

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to emulate Jesus and we are supposed to surrender like he did. And he, you know, I think it's

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in John might be in chapter 10 where he's saying like, you know, nobody took my life

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from me. I laid it down. You know, he surrendered his life for our lives as a ransom for many.

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So we in that same way have to model Jesus by surrendering all of us. And that, you know,

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our thought life. I mean, a lot of times that's where the enemy comes in and tries to attack

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is in our thought life. Plants of seeds. Yes. Exactly. Or, you know, tries to put like a

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root of bitterness in, amplify an offense or, I mean, and those things like that's serious.

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And then, you know, we as women, a lot of times are so much more emotional. True. And

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you know, if you want to practice, you know, being a strong woman, you can kind of take

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that on almost like a, like an anti biblical stance. Like I'm a woman. I don't need a man.

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I mean, like that kind of thing. Like I, you know, and that's not a biblical way to approach

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things because, you know, men are needed and women are needed. And even though we have

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equal value, we do have different important roles. But, you know, I think a lot of that

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can get misconstrued. A lot of like feminism can come in and say, I'm a woman, but I won't

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show you my emotions or I won't, you know, do all these things. And that's really the

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not, not the right way to look at it either. Right. Like in what way does that mean you're

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you're a woman by stifling it? How does that define womanhood? Right. I know. And it's so

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unhealthy, you know, I was thinking about this. So I watch a lot of sermons and things

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on YouTube. And even when I'm just doing things around the house or, you know, I like to just

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have something always playing in the background. And so, you know, I'll stop and write a note

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if, if I hear something particularly that, you know, applies to me, but I saw something

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that came up on my YouTube feed and I had not looked up this word and I had not searched

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it or anything like it. And it came up and it said, Stoicism, how to be stoic. Okay.

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So now, you know, there's lots of things that we can look at and listen to and read that

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are do not glorify God. And sometimes I found myself in the pursuit of trying to understand

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other points of view, you know, trying to listen to some of those things. And, and that's

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okay, but also can be dangerous. Like you have to hold everything in light of scripture.

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You know, so, but I said, huh, I'm going to click on this and see, you know, what they're

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saying here. So there were all these like mantras or whatever that you were supposed

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to tell yourself, not, not Christlike affirmations, but like worldly mantras, you know. And so

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they would have things like, I will tell myself, I am in control of my thoughts and emotions.

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I will tell myself, I am not scared of anyone. So, but I got to thinking about this and I

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said, you know what? And you know how a lot of times the things in the world will have

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some ounce of truth in them. But without the truth that is the real truth, which is the

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word of God. And so I thought, well, you know what? We can be stoic in Christ by saying,

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I'm not in control of my thoughts and emotions, but the Holy spirit that lives inside of me

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is in control of my thoughts and emotions. And, you know, the Bible tells us we have

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the mind of Christ in first Corinthians. And then where it says, I'm not scared of anyone.

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So, okay, I'm not scared of anyone because God has not given me a spirit of fear. So,

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it's not enough to claim these things because that's in our own strength. And there's no

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power behind our own strength.

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Right. When you add those words from the Bible and the Holy word of God, then it has that

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power with that truth in it.

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Yes, because I mean, the word of God is living and active. And that's where all those things

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can become truth.

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I was really glad that I looked at that because I was like, you know, that's what the world

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will tell people to do, you know, is to almost, you know, I don't need anyone and I don't

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need and I can do it all myself.

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It makes them sound powerful, but without the word of God and that power behind the

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word.

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And see, that's not what I'm looking at when I hear that from my point of view. I hear

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it lonely.

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Yes, I can do it myself. Why would you want to?

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Right?

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Why don't you know better?

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Exactly. And I think that comes from a place of hurt a lot of times, you know, and like

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you said, lonely, because what it's done is it's probably, you know, people that have

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said, well, you know, before people have tried to intimidate me or scare me and I will never

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allow that to happen again.

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So instead of guarding my heart, now I've closed my heart off. And that that creates

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a whole other issue because, you know, there's always, you have to be able to love, you know,

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and take that risk of not being loved back.

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Right. Is that not biblical?

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I mean, really, right?

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If you had the Holy Spirit in space, but did not love, you would be bankrupt.

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That is so true. You know, I thought about that before and I feel like that's the whole

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when we can learn unconditional love of others, then we can truly see how God loves because,

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you know, God loves so many people that don't love him, that curse his name, that worship

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other gods, that never, that go about their everyday life, never considering him. And

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yet he loves.

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And so if we are able to ever know that kind of love, I mean, I think that's a gift. So

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we're able to know that kind of love, but it does not come without hurt, you know.

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But I would risk it. I mean, I have been able to see the love of God so much more clearly

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since I've been able to love people that did not return love to me.

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But you know what? It hurt and I didn't like it. But I would not trade it because God used

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that to show me his love and to show and I know how much more he loves me because of

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those things.

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So even through the bad, you know, we see the goodness of God, which is what we're talking

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about.

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But just like you said, you know, things, I thought about this, things do come around

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every day, all day long. They can come at us and through different forms and it's you

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have to be on guard, right?

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Because the devil does prowl like a roaring lion, you know. And so I think so many people,

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I think take that as they should be scared of what might happen. And that's not the case.

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Being aware is not being scared. It's just knowing that I have weapons that God has given

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me to handle those things when they come up. And we know we're supposed to take our thoughts

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captive.

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But you know, I think sometimes it can stop there with people say, oh, you got to take

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your thoughts captive, take your thoughts captive. But the next part of that is to make them

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obedient to Christ.

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Amen. One thing that I was thinking of is sometimes the devil won't come at you with

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something that you'll know isn't good for you. He'll come in with something that's good,

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that is not yet like great that God has for you. So Eve, she was tempted with something

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that was good.

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Right. Right. Right. She saw that it was good.

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Yes. That's so true.

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So you need to be very careful.

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And that's why we need to be in the Word and why we need to talk to God because I use an

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analogy that if I baked you a pie that was 99% pie, pumpkin pie, and 1% arsenic or 1%

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whatever you would never put in your mouth. Right.

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And I didn't tell you it at first and you get I gave you this pie. It's like a sermon

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that you would hear. Right.

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Right.

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And after you're examining this pie, you deem it is not fit to eat even though it looks

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good.

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Mm hmm.

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It's that discernment that we need. And if we don't have the scripture, we won't know

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how to discern one thing from another because something will sound good. Like what you were

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saying before, this that that affirmation that you were saying that was wrong.

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That sounds good.

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Right.

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It sounds empowering. It sounds like it's helpful. But in fact, it's just isolating.

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Yes. That's so true. And that's like, you know, that phrase that says the devil has

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no new tricks because that's what he does is he takes something that that God intended

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to be one way and he twists it. And there's enough truth in it. And so if people don't

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really study their Bible, don't really know scripture, but only, you know, have heard

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maybe bits and pieces of it and somebody else comes to them using that scripture. Well,

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they don't know any different. So they're taking their word for it.

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And you know, the Bible says that the devil is like a lion prowling around seeking to

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whom he can consume. Right.

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Yes.

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And what does a lion do? It separates the weak from the herd, isolates them and then takes

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them down.

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Yes.

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We're stronger together.

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Yes. And you know what? Somebody, I heard somebody once say the devil is like a lion,

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but he is not the lion, which is the line of Judah, you know, so it's always been a miserable

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copy.

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Yes, always. And it's a counterfeit of what, you know, you think about all those things

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like like success and lust of the eyes, lust of flesh, pride of life, all those things

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that the devil throws at people to convince them that that will be their happiness, that

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that will be their identity is found in those things.

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And it's just a fake. It's just a, you know, a weak fake of what the actual truth is. Like

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I didn't realize and I know Shelling knows part of my testimony and I've been, I met

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Jesus about eight years ago.

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And before that, though, I was a career woman, I guess you would say, and I had always worked

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and much of my identity was found in my work.

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Well, fast forward and after legal problems came up from a job company that I worked for

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and having to, I was criminally penalized for that.

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So ever since then I have, I'm not able to even work in that field anymore. So it's like,

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if Jesus had not met me and showed me what my true was, it would have been all wrapped

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up in that. And I would be, you know, it'd be done.

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So I think that that is, I mean, there's so many ways that that God is so good to have

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met me before I even walked through any of that because he, you know, really showed me

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what the truth was before I had to let the world tell me what the truth was, you know?

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So I feel like that's so important. But the thing about the everyday stuff, and I know

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you guys have heard this, the garbage in garbage out theory. Yeah. And so, you know, what we're

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supposed to feed our minds with are the things that are true and honorable and respectable

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and all those things that he talks about in Philippians. And so when I, if I catch my

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mind deviating to something that is not one of those things, that's those thoughts that

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I have to take captive and make obedient to Christ. Because if it doesn't fit in that

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list of items, you know, it's, it's, that's where anxiety comes from. That's where worry

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comes from. That's where, you know, you can dwell on an offense, but not if you're focused

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on these things, which, which are, you know, instead of like, which are things that are

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true and honorable. And we know that whatever our heart is full of is going to flow out.

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And that's the garbage in garbage out thing. So it is a lot about what goes in. And not

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only, I mean, you know, that's what we listen to what we, what we look at. And like you

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said, Shelley, it doesn't have to be something overtly bad. But it can be something that

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we, or just something that takes the place of God or takes the place of putting him first.

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Even our children, even a Bible study, even, you know, something like that, we can go get

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so caught up in activities, even though those are good activities. But are we having that

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closeness that God desires?

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This reminds me of our first guest of season two. He was also on a track of doing things

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in a certain field, but with eight arrests in a single year, he was not able to get a

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job in that position that he was going to college for. And God showed up in a way that

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no one would have seen coming. And now he's an evangelist that travels the world. And

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so I'm just, you know, like, I think of that when I think of your story, because like you

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can't go in that field. So it's kind of like a redirection to something even better.

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Yeah, probably.

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And I feel like I always felt like God was saying to me, you know, like you did that

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and you got some valuable, you know, experience and things that I developed in you during

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that time. But now that time is done. And you're going to take that and use it for whatever's

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next.

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And I did.

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This is stepping stone building blocks.

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Yes. Yes. And I'm appreciative for that because, you know, I did, I was in sales. And so I

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was able to, you know, develop relationships with people. And now I do believe since the

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very first moment that I was saved that I was going to be in ministry in some form. And

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so that has happened on small scales, you know, so far in just everyday life things.

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But I believe that everything that I have walked through in the different seasons is

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preparing me for that. And, you know, I did, I was listening to another one of the pastors

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and he said that the closer, the more sanctified you become because, you know, that's a whole

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process in a cell.

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Yeah.

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And not a one time event.

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Very similar.

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Yes. The more sanctified that you become, the stronger your mind becomes and the stronger

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your thought life becomes. Because if you think about it, if God doesn't want to call

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you into ministry or even in your everyday career or wherever you're going to be in,

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to get you to be the person that he wants you to be. And in order to effectively lead

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other people to Jesus, you are going to, you know, you have to be able to let the Holy

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Spirit be the one that guides all those interactions.

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For sure.

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You know, I can't, I can't say, and you have to, this is also what I've learned is that

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the people that can be the same person that they are in church, at home, at the ballpark,

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at the grocery store, those are the people that have allowed the Holy Spirit to do work

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in them.

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Because I don't have to turn on a different voice when I go to this place and I don't

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have to act a different way when I go to this place. But I've embraced who God wants me

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to be. And so, and that's what I always have told my kids too about telling my story, because

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they have never, my kids have all heard my whole story. And they've always been proud

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of me for the way that I've told it, because I don't carry any shame with it. And that

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is only because of the Holy Spirit's working in my life, because of course, it's full of

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things that I could be shameful for. I could carry shame for. But they have always been

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so proud of me because they're like, Mom, you just, you know, tell everybody what actually

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happened and you don't, you know, sugarcoat anything and you don't. And I told them, the

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more you allow the light in to your life, to your story, then the enemy doesn't have

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a chance to expose anything like you've already exposed it. It's already in the light.

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Right.

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And so nobody can hold that against you because you know, the enemy will try to hold your

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past against you, you know, but God, God, he canceled that out.

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Yes. Yes. And so that's really where I've been in this whole new season, a different

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season of my life. I've actually was able to study for an Alabama real estate exam and

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I passed my exam.

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Congratulations.

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I thank you. And so I've already have a broker that has said that, you know, I should work

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with her and, and now I don't know if that is something that will be a career, a lifelong

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career. I don't know if that is to, you know, move me to the next place where there will

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be a ministry opportunity. I don't know. And, and you know what? I don't have to know, but

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you'll be meeting a lot of people doing it.

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That's right. And because I trust God and you know what? He has opened a door. He's

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like cracked the door open a little bit more and a little bit more and a little bit more.

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And I've just stepped out in faith every time he's revealed a step to me and he's blessed

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it. And so that's what I have to hold on to right now. But I am grateful even though like

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this is the whole, probably the past year has been, it has been a difficult time for

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me to learn how to surrender my mind and motion. So I know that God has used this time to make

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that stronger. So I'm grateful for that. But like I said, it's like with any other thing

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that we walk through and, and you know how it says in James about trials, you know, and

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trials produce perseverance and perseverance character. And so I know that these things

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are for my good. And now I'm seeing that they are working for my good. But it sometimes

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takes coming out on the other side before you can see how you can trust that it will

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be good. Yeah. But a lot of times you can't see just how. Yeah. But hard to see the other

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side of the forest when you're standing in the fire. Exactly. Exactly. And Shelly, I

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know like some of them, you've probably seen some of the videos that I had done before.

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And I'm real passionate about having right relationships with people. So about having

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good family relationships, a good marriage, marital relationship, a good, you know, and

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managing all the different people that we come into contact with and managing as best

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we can because it's really not a possible thing. But that is difficult. A lot of the

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times, because people are different and not everyone has the same level of, you know,

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people are different, different in their walks. And not everybody is going to be at the same

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place in every area that you're in. And so I think it's about being able to recognize

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where people are and not taking any of that personally. And, you know, especially like

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we just had Thanksgiving, right? So I know probably I know several people, friends of

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mine that I talked to that were actually dreading being around a lot of their family just because

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there's always so much chaos. And there's always, you know, and I feel like that, you

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know, usually there's some kind of family something going on. Drama. Yeah. And so but

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that can, you know, if you sit around and think about that, like that can make you anxious,

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that can make you not spend the day giving the Lord thanks for all the things that he's

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done, but just holding on to that anxiety, like, you know, and how am I going to respond

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to that? And I think that's where a lot of mine was is I want to respond like Jesus would

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respond. But I also don't want to be a doormat. And I also don't want to internalize these

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things. I want to these things, this character and this development that God has done during

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these different seasons. I don't want to allow the enemy to try to demolish any of that,

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you know, like, I appreciate all the habits and stuff. Right. Exactly. And you know, that's

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what he does. Like the devil tries to get us out of character. And it's like God's

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developing this character, like he's forging it in the fire. And then the devil's over

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here trying to be like, let me just bring you right back in there. And I think for me,

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I finally was like, no, like that's it. I'm tired of, you know, you trying to do this,

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like I'm the person God wants me to be. And if I I'm not going to return evil for evil.

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I'm going to going to overcome evil with good. And you know, when it comes to that point,

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we can either overcome or we can be overcome. And God wants us to be overcomers. So yeah,

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vectors instead of victims. Yes. And so that's it. Now it is not easy to

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know. I mean, I will tell you that like I've had to but but that's where Josh, like you

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were saying, like people have to know their Bible because what's happened like in those

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circumstances now is I will actually have those some of these verses playing in my mind

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as I'm having these interactions. And so I'm like, Oh, I have the mind of Christ. I'm

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not going to repay evil for evil. I'm, you know, I'm going to bless those that curse

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me. I mean, you know, so it's like these things. And when when the Holy Spirit is louder than

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our own thoughts, then that is a great thing. Praise God. Yeah, praise God. So I'm like,

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yes, just let me take hold of that because we have to be we're called to be peacemakers,

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but we're not called to be peacekeepers. So I had to really think about that. Like, you

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know, a lot of times we can and me I'm I hate conflict. Okay, so I like everybody to get

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along. I like everything to be smooth. You know, if somebody has a problem, I want to

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go patch it up real quick. And so conflict is not my my fun place. But I realized that

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a lot of times if someone sins against us, and you don't like conflict, then you kind

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of try to like put a bandaid on it. And really what that does is it it keeps God from doing

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something in that situation. Like it's almost like, you know, how you can enable bad behavior

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in children. Yes, by stepping in and not letting them experience any consequences. Look at

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society right now. Right. We have almost an entire generation and a half that have not

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experienced consequences. Right. And what does that mean? It's just so destructive.

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Yes. And so I feel like so, you know, you think about that and you think it, like to

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me, I was thinking, well, that's extreme. That's only in extreme circumstances, like

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if someone's an addict or something. But it's really not it's an it can be an everyday

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things because, you know, God says, like, it's his to avenge is not, you know, we're

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not the one that's supposed to make things right. Now, we are just supposed to love

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like Jesus, stay in our Christ like character, not let these things pollute our hearts and

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minds. And God will deal with the rest of it. But only if we can say, this is not my battle,

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you know, so we can get out of God's way because he's really good at being God. Yes. We're

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not. Yes. He's a lot better at it than I could ever imagine to be. Exactly. Exactly. So I

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had to remind myself of that because I think I was, you know how you can justify things

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by think saying that that they're good. So I would be like, well, I'm just trying to

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make sure everybody's happy and I'm just trying to, you know, keep the peace and I don't, you

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know, I want everybody to be comfortable and I want every and so it was out of a I felt

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like it was out of a good place that I was doing it, but it still wasn't my place to

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do it. Yeah, sometimes our relationships could actually be stronger if we base the conflict

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head on and say, hey, this made me feel some type of way. Yeah. And then work through it

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instead of just, you know, putting that bandaid over it. Yes. And I think that's what God

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wants us to do. And I think for sure that was one of my lessons because I don't like

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conflict so much. And, you know, I felt like God was saying like, I get it, but I need

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you to be able to be okay with it, you know? Yeah. You know, and I still don't like it,

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but now I'm more okay with it because I think it conflict it God's way is not the world's

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conflict either. You know, so I don't have to, you know, come at you, but I can speak

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the truth in love, which is counter cultural if you think about it, because people don't

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don't address people like that if they have an issue. They don't say, hey, do you think

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we should we could sit down and talk about this because I really, you know, I care about

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you and I want to know where you're coming from. I mean, like people don't handle things

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like that. They'll end up ghosting each other and you're like, what happened? Right? Or

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like the whole cancel culture that we've been in, you know, I mean, people can love somebody

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one day and hate them the next. I mean, depending on the mood of your peers, right? Exactly.

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And people are so easily influenced, you know? Yeah. Well, I mean, we all eat lies when our

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hearts are hungry. Oh, you're so you're so right. And a lot of hearts are starving. So,

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you know, absolutely, absolutely. You know, God created us as spiritual beings. And if

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we're not seeking him, we're seeking something else spiritually. Exactly. And I mean, so

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it's one or the other. Right. I tried to tell somebody that the other day, I mean, it might

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have been my middle child, I have three children, but I was telling her, you know, there's only

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two sides, like, you know, there's not like, maybe I'm a little bit with God and maybe

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I mean, you know, it's it's pretty black and white if you look at it, you know. But a lot

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of people don't look at it like that. But I know we're close on time. I wanted to tell

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you this though, one of the things that so I don't know if you guys have heard of the

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freedom curriculum. Yeah, I have not. Okay. Well, so it's a small group curriculum that

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my church does. And I've actually been into the small groups and I co led one of the

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groups in the spring. But it's basically about how you can get freedom, you know, the things

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maybe that have been like strongholds in your life and and all these different things. And

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then at the end, we have this amazing conference. And, you know, it might be people that have

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dealt with like trauma in their lives or like different areas. But one of the things that

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is a whole we have a whole book and it teaches us through 12 or 13 weeks. And one of the

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things the main themes, which reminded me of it whenever I was thinking about talking

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to you guys today, one of the things that we said was choices lead and feelings follow.

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Because we you can't lead with your feelings. I mean, you know, and our feelings are more

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of an alert system, but they're not always the truth. So feelings are here for us to

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enhance our lives in positive and negative ways, just to help like a flavor like salt

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in our own life. But they're not they're not supposed to be our radar for navigating life.

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No, just another sense to feel life and experience life so that God has given us his happiness.

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That's not a bad one. She always clearly given by God. Right. And so these are these are

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gifts of God to help us cope as being humans. Yes. But you know, it's when people make decisions

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based on feelings or you know, yeah, that's what we're in dangerous territory. Yes, we

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are. And feelings will betray us. Oh, they will so much. I mean, the heart, you know,

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the hearts to see full above all things. That's one of those. It all kind of ties into this

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thing. Because it's our hearts, our minds, our emotions that all have to be submitted.

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Absolutely. Yep. But that's I have learned this lesson. I've walked through it. It's

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amazing how I don't believe in coincidence and nothing is the accident. But it's amazing

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how many of these different things that we talked about, I talked about with you guys

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today have shown up various forms that have all been related. So so I know that was something

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a lesson that I needed. And it's really helped me. It really has. God is very good at weaving

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the tapestry of all our lives together and closely and those of us that follow closer

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to him, I think are more aware of some of the pattern because we see some of the people

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repeating patterns and we're like, Hey, we're in the same area of the tapestry at this moment

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in our lives and it may not be that way 10 years from now, but right now it is. Yes,

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I totally agree with that. And I mean, I have been so especially for the last month, I have

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been and I would watch like documentaries and stuff. I'm not saying I watched any bad

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shows or anything, but but I've noticed more of I didn't really say, Hey, I'm not going

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to watch that anymore. But all of a sudden I just didn't and I would just be listening

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to worship music or I would but I've been like God has been so good to put me I've been

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in such like this. I've been in the presence of God like nonstop for a month. And I'm like,

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why do I not live my whole life like this? Because it's so good.

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The flesh is weak, even though the spirit is willing. It doesn't take much for your

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flesh to say, Oh, Penny, Oh, squirrel, candy.

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And sometimes your flesh is more malicious than that. It's not so innocently. You stumble

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sometimes your flesh desires or crave something so horrible because the enemy is whispering

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into you and we can't crack your spirit because that's where the Holy Spirit lives. Right.

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But he can crack your flesh and cause these polls and these urges that are hard to resist

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or that you might be in the middle of when you're tired and didn't realize you're in

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the middle of it and go, Oh man, I was supposed to not do that.

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Yes. Yes. You're so right. But then I'm like, you know, what I like how we can acknowledge

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when we're in like a close relationship or having like a special time. But you know what

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I don't want to do is I don't want to move out into the next season and leave this behind

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or or or minimize it because it's so good. Like I want to stay here.

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But yeah, it's been so good. I've learned a lot about this and I know that it is it's

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a journey. It's not like, okay, I've learned it. Now I'm good. I'm going to check that

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off. Yeah, he'll evolve it into something else. Yes, he will. And I'll, you know, keep

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learning and growing in. But I think that's whole. I think God can do so much with our

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surrender. So we have to find those areas that we are still holding on to. And it's

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not sometimes it's not really easy to pick out, you know, but the more we can be in his

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presence and the more we can study his word and in pray, you know, prayer is so special

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and so powerful. And the more we can do those things, then I think that we will be able,

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it's like it's easier to lay it down. So I'm grateful for it.

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I'm grateful you got to share this with everybody because I'm sure somebody when we release

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this, somebody will be going through this and they'll be like, this is exactly what

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I needed to hear. Yes, I hope so. And you know, I know that God allows us to walk through

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things and teaches us lessons so that we like the Bible says we're ready to, you know, walk

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with somebody else through that. They have to comfort them. Yes. And so I'm glad that

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he chooses to use us for that. Well, he can't unless we're open to be used by him. You're

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right. He means that obedient heart. Yes. And so if you feel called by God, know that you

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are you have that obedient heart. Yes, amen. I'm thankful for it. Well, thank you for being

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with us, Lisa and sharing this little testimony that you've been working on. And I look forward

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to the next things that God does. Yes, me too. And I can't wait to tell you guys all

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about it. That'll be great. And then we'll have you back on to share some more stuff.

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Yes, that'll be awesome. Thank you. Awesome. Well, if this episode has been a blessing

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to you, we ask that you share it with a friend. And don't forget, if you rate the podcast

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and Apple podcast or Spotify, it'll help the algorithm know that people are liking it.

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And then it can go out to more people and more people could be encouraged. And also in our

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about section, we have some links if you want to donate to the ministry that'll help us

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keep this going. And that would be greatly appreciated as well as prayers. And with that,

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we'll talk to you next time.