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Hi and welcome to Be The Flagship with our podcast host Jeff Parsons.

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This is where we tackle the day-to-day talent management challenges you face.

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And now over to our host.

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Take it away, Jeff.

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Well, hello and welcome to Be The Flagship.

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I'm your host Jeff Parsons and this is where we explore all things operations.

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So if you're an operational leader, this podcast is for you.

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We talk about operations specific topics and we also explore those areas of support to

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operations.

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We just completed a series called Finance and Operations.

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It was eight episodes where we talked about finances role and finances impact on operations.

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Today we begin a new series.

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It's called HR and Operations, Human Resources and Operations where we explore HR's impact

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on operations and how they can be a positive force in helping operations achieve organizational

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excellence and business success.

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And this first episode we're focusing on selection, hiring and development of your most important

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resource in operations, your TAL.

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And so joining us today is guest speaker Anthony Pantaleon.

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I'll let Anthony introduce himself in just a second.

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But again, thank you for joining us.

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I hope you enjoyed this series and we'll turn it over to our guest speaker.

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All right, so again with us today is Anthony Pantaleon.

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I pronounced that right, right?

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Correct?

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You did.

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Thank you, Joe.

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You sound like Anthony all the time.

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Right?

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That's true.

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Anthony is a good friend and he's also an expert in the area of assessments and talent

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actually.

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And the focus of this episode as a part of a series is HR's impact on operations and

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specifically in the area or areas of talent.

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And we'll get into those areas later.

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But first, Anthony, why don't you introduce yourself?

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Tell us, you know, what you do with TAL-X, your role and how people can get in touch

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with you.

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Should they have any questions after this?

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Oh, sure.

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Well, thank you very much for the introduction, Jeff.

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And thank you for this opportunity to be a part of your podcast.

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So you said that you consider me an expert and I appreciate that very much.

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I actually don't consider myself an expert because I feel like I need to be a student

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to constantly learn and grow.

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And I think we're all growing, right?

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And we all have to keep evolving, adapting and adapting to change.

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So I appreciate that, that you consider me an expert as I still look to, you know, strive

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to be that expert.

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So I'm in constant growth mode.

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But I've been in the assessment industry for my entire career now, which is spanning over

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30 years.

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And I actually, it was by accident that I got in the industry.

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That wasn't my original intent, but I'm really grateful that I am in the industry because

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I've been very passionate about what I do and how I help organizations add data to their

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decision-making processes throughout the talent management framework.

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And as far as contacting me, I guess the best place to find me and contact me would be on

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LinkedIn.

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I know everyone's on LinkedIn.

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So I'm just looking for Anthony Panthleon, there aren't too many people with Panthleon

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on LinkedIn.

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So I think you'll find me pretty easily.

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It sounds very Italian, Anthony.

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Yes.

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I bet your mom's a great cook.

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She is.

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And I've grown up with a preference towards pasta and carbohydrates, which I'm older,

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I don't process them as well.

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So I have to be very vigilant in my pasta choices.

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I got you.

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Oh, man.

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Well, again, thanks, Anthony.

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I really appreciate your contribution to thought leadership in the area of operations.

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And in operational success.

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So our goal is to provide thought leadership for operations leaders and listeners so that

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they can drive organizational effectiveness, achieve organizational excellence, which drives

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business success.

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Because at the end of the day, everyone within the organization, no matter what their role,

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would be in lockstep to achieve that goal, right?

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And that's through your processes, it's through your systems, it's through your equipment.

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And the heart of that organization would be your people.

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And so in previous podcasts, we focused on finances role in supporting operations and

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business success.

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And today we begin a discussion about HR, human resources.

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And their role in impacting operational excellence business success.

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And in my 30 plus years of HR and global HR and connecting with a lot of HR professionals

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all over the world, really, one of the common things I hear is that I won't accede at the

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table.

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I'm discouraged because they just think that I do payroll.

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They just think that I take care of benefits, you know, and I want a seat at the table.

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And part of the challenge in getting that seat at the table is being perceived by the

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executive team of that you're bringing true value to the organization.

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Not that payroll doesn't bring value or benefits administration doesn't bring value, but that's

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very transactional in nature, right?

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You can train just about anybody to push a button and then, you know, in ADP or one of

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those other systems and do payroll or take care of benefits and sign someone up for benefits.

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It doesn't take a high degree of HR expertise.

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And that's why it's oftentimes outsourced, right?

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Because it's very transactional in nature.

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So the real values in the gray area, you know, and as it relates to people and, you know,

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I've always and when I've mentored and coached HR people, you know, one of the first things

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I tell them is there are basically two types of HR people in the world.

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You know, very simple, just two types.

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They're business partners and they're picnic planners.

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You know, the picnic planners are more concerned about the buzzwords of the day, you know,

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and being in line with what they see in SHRM in terms of the buzzwords of what we should

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be focused on today rather than focusing on the right thing to do for the business and

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contributing value to the business and coming to grips with what my role is in working with

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leadership to achieve business success that I have a role to play.

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So too many HR people oftentimes focus on the buzzword of the day, you know, what are

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we focusing on now, you know, and when at the end of the day, it's all about town.

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It's about the talent.

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You're this within HR, that gray area where you can bring the most value is ensuring that

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you bring the right talent into that organization to help operations achieve their goals and

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to drive business success.

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So if you want to be a seat, if you want to have a seat at the table, you need to be perceived

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as that contributing to business success, not the social, you know, trends of the day.

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And again, you do this by focusing on hiring and developing the right talent.

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So you know, as opposed to great talent, you say, well, I bring in great talent.

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Well, you might watch your turnover rate, right?

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Is your great talent really aligned with your culture, your organizational goals?

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Are they helping you drive business success or are there obstacles to business success?

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Are they poisoning the well?

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Are they toxic?

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And in terms of the way they behave, no matter what their skill set is, no matter how impressive

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their resume is, no matter how great they interviewed, you know, some people interview

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really, really well and then they proceed almost immediately to poison the well, poison

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the water within the culture, right?

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And create chaos and become an obstacle as opposed to a driving force within your organization.

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You want driving forces within your organization.

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So you want to bring in right talent, not just the great talent.

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And that's why I have Anthony here today to help us understand how you can do a better

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job in determining what is the right talent.

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You know, how do you define the right talent for your organization?

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And then what is the process?

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How can you do a better job of selection?

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And we're going to start with selection and hiring.

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We'll transition from that to onboarding and then how do you develop your leaders and then

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look at talent from a more strategic model.

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Is that work for you, Anthony?

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Absolutely.

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All right.

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So let's talk about the selection and hiring process, Anthony.

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What are your thoughts on basically what I've just said, you know, in terms of the right

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talent versus great talent?

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And then what are your thoughts on how to do a better job in selection and hiring?

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Sure.

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Well, thanks for really setting the stage for us, Jeff, and providing that kind of framework.

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So when I work with HR leaders, you know, typically I like to find out a lot about how

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we can align talent with strategy.

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So organizational strategy is the guiding force that determines the kinds of employee

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behaviors that are needed.

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So we can start there and then understand how the organizational strategy then distills

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down to business strategy and then functional strategy.

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So the functional strategy then is all about the job.

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So what people need to do in their job to execute.

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So that's what really I believe helps any HR leader to build the business case for using

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assessments in an organization and creating this value because you're taking something

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that historically will is and will always be intangible.

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People were complex beings.

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And what an assessment does, a psychometric assessment will do, is it'll help you to take

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something that's intangible and make it tangible so you have a measurement.

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And we're all into data nowadays, right?

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We have wearable devices.

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I think almost everyone has some type of wearable.

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I have a ring, I have a wristband, I'm tracking my sleep, I'm tracking my steps, heart rate,

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all that stuff.

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And unless you measure something, you can't manage it.

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So now when I understand baselines, I can say, okay, so what happens if I do this to

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improve my sleep or if I do this to improve my heart rate variability?

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So it helps me to make improvements.

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Well, now we can take that same context and apply it to people.

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When we use a psychometric assessment, we now start to measure people and we have data

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points, data points to make comparisons, data points to create starting points and end points

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for trends, performance trends, turnover trends, things along those lines.

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So what we typically do through the assessment process is we look to incorporate that into

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a strategic recruitment model with the goal of improving the quality of the hire.

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So that is, first of all, first you align with strategic goals.

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So what are those goals?

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And then how does that distill down to the behaviors that are needed for any particular

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role in an organization?

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And that's how we create value because when individuals operate above their job description

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and they provide more value to their internal and external customers, then that's when you

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start to have that multiplier effect in the organization.

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So we want to align towards those strategic goals and distill those down.

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We want to be able to quantify what superior performance looks like.

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So in any particular role, when we either collaborate on that through a job description

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or assessing people who are currently in the role, we can look at those differentiated

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behaviors and then understand what they look like, quantify those and then they provide

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us with a point of reference moving forward.

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And then ultimately, in a strategic recruitment model, you want to be able to incorporate

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a way to look at job fit and organizational fit as well.

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So that type of framework requires the quantification of people, of candidates.

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So when you're able to quantify, you can align to that framework and then that would really

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yield the best end result, which is quality of hire.

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Right.

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So what you're saying is you start with the strategic staffing or recruiting model.

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This is this and you do that through collaboration.

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It's not just an HR role, but they have to collaborate with people who know what the

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expectations are for a role and know what makes a person successful or causes them to

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fail and that sort of thing.

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And so you get that involved, you get them involved, we create these profiles, I suppose,

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for position.

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Correct.

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And then when you have those, then you can use an assessment to that profile with the

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job profiles for each job within your organization.

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That becomes a baseline measurement, right?

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So that you can compare to that baseline.

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This is the baseline for this equipment operator or this nurse or this supervisor or whatever.

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This is the baseline.

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And then when you are looking for candidates, then you can compare those candidates.

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If you're assessing the right things, you can compare those candidates to that baseline

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and determine how closely they match.

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Is that right?

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That's exactly right, Jeff.

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So typically, it's easier to understand the experience of someone, the hard skills based

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on their certifications, their credentials, the degree they have.

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But I always hear it here from working with organizations that their challenge is identifying

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those attributes or soft skills.

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And I kind of hear those terms interchangeably, but being able to align the attributes with

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the job and the culture of the organization is really important because you might have

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an individual and they might have a great pool of experience that fits the role.

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But from an attribute standpoint, they may not because maybe they came from a bureaucratic

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organization which was like command and control and now your organization is maybe more collaborative,

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it's smaller, relies more on innovation.

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And so therefore, there's a different attribute or set of attributes that are needed to operate

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in this role.

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So you can take that person who has the skill fit, but they don't necessarily have the soft

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skill fit.

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And that's a really important differentiator because then that person's really being set

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up to fail because it's just a matter of time before that person has conflict and there

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are derailers and there are friction points and that eventually every organization has

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a tolerance level.

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So eventually that tolerance level gives out and that's when it's an unfortunate event.

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And I mean, typically, it's gonna take six months or more for a business to break even

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on a new hire.

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So if that tolerance level happens after six months, well, okay, so now you're in the black

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of it.

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But a lot of times it's gonna happen before six months.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I mean, there's some indicators out there that if you can retain an employee on your

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hire for at least six months, then their probability of performance and retention and all that

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increases quite significantly, right?

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The thing what I hear is what I'm hearing you say is you really oftentimes we hire for

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skills or what we perceive their skills to be when you should be hiring skills that should

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get their foot in the door, but you're hiring for behaviors.

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That's true.

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Right?

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Yes, absolutely.

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And now, behaviors are oftentimes a bit complex as well because there's a lot that goes into

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a behavior.

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Right.

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And as an example, so I always look at it as okay, so what goes into a behavior?

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Well, core traits determine behaviors.

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So if you have a certain set of core traits, there's gonna be a high likelihood that you'll

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exhibit that behavior with consistency.

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Their abilities influence behavior.

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So you could have a set of core traits and then you have certain abilities that let's

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say you gain through leadership development programs and self-discovery.

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So then you self-manage some of those core traits.

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So maybe the derailer traits or the traits that might create friction like we just talked

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about, maybe you don't see that because that person has more of an introspective, so they're

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more self-aware.

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So that can come into play.

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There's also different motivation levels.

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There's internal, external motivation levels, so that can influence how you see behaviors

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and also there are opportunities within organizations that people are privy to.

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So that can also dictate what goes into behaviors.

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But for the most part, when you're able to quantify the core traits and then put the

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other factors you know, come to the side, you'd have a really good starting point of

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understanding that if you're measuring, quantifying core traits and then aligning that with a

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profile.

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I see.

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Okay.

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How does that?

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So we're talking about selection and hiring.

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Once you get the new hire in the door, you know, you're going through the onboarding

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process, right?

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And so any suggestions, I see a lot of organizations, I've witnessed organizations where the onboarding

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process is not effective.

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And when I mean not effective, an onboarding process should be aimed at increasing employee

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retention longer term and making sure they're aligned well with their job and they feel

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a part of the team and culture and that sort of thing.

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And oftentimes, organizations just do orientation, new hire orientation.

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They bring them in, they show them where the bathrooms are, you know, they meet their new

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boss and have it met them already, they're exposed to the policy manuals and all the

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dos and the don'ts and then they're thrown in the 12-foot deep water and said, you know,

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good luck, right?

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And when that happens and it's just the orientation, I think organizations miss an opportunity.

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They miss an opportunity to engage that employee early and often.

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And again, the more engaged that employee feels, you know, six months out, you know,

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the greater the performance and retention over time.

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I'm just curious your thoughts on onboarding and how that relates to your staffing, your

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strategic staffing plan and that sort of thing.

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Jeff, you bring up a really good point and I think, you know, you set the stage earlier

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when you talked about two types of HR leaders and, you know, I think this would be very

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consistent with that when it comes to onboarding because onboarding can be very transactional,

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you know, an orientation.

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And delivering a manual and getting a signature for the manual and making sure, you know,

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the new employee has an insight as far as like, you know, all the policies and procedures

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and a tour of the facilities and all that.

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That's great.

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But I think anytime we look at people and when we look at ourselves as leaders, how

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can we make it transformational?

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How can we create value in our day-to-day interactions with people because then that

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will represent us in the marketplace ultimately.

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So to answer your question, you know, typically in the onboarding process, you know, I coach

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my clients and I work with my clients to look at it as an ongoing process where, you know,

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our hiring managers and HR are partnered with this process and then they're able to leverage

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information from an assessment, a psychometric assessment and be able to leverage that through

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the onboarding process so that the connection starts early, the relationship starts early

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and it goes beyond the surface early.

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So then you can set the stage for a really collaborative like evolving relationship down

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the road.

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So, you know, we always say, you know, we want to coach early and often and we feel

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like when we're working with our clients, we can provide them with insights so that

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they can begin to leverage the assessment information not only for selection but starting

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with the onboarding process and then being able to leverage the information for coaching

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at that stage and then beyond.

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Okay.

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Yeah, that's all good points.

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Anthony, yeah, I have an interesting, I think it's interesting at least, but story around

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onboarding.

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My stepson, when he graduated college and we were on the West Coast, his first job,

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well he corrected me every time I called it fast food.

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He said, this is not fast food, this is serious, this is, you know, this is not McDonald's

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or something like that but it was in the food industry, right, with a popular chain on the

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West Coast.

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And he came home after his first day on the job with a backpack that was full of books

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that he was required to read, you know, manuals he was required to read, you know, assessments

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he was required to take, you know, how to handle people.

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I mean, I have never seen such a thorough onboarding process, I don't believe ever and

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this is for a food chain on the West Coast.

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They were serious when they hired employee, right?

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They weren't just going to be flipping burgers or making sandwiches, they were going to make

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a bigger connection with their customers.

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And he learned a lot from that experience.

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I mean, he's not there now but he moved on to bigger and better things but he learned

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so much about working with people and, you know, about any and there was a leadership

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component to it.

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But it was just, you know, the company was investing because, you know, they franchise,

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they have a lot of employees so just imagine how much money they were investing in the

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onboarding of those employees, right?

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It was very impressive for an old HR guy like me.

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I was full boarded, I was really impressed but so onboarding is important.

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It increases what gives you the opportunity to connect with that employee and you never

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want to dismiss opportunities or connection points with your...

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Yes, and you know, one client success story comes to my mind where we actually help them

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leverage assessment data, not only for selection but also, you know, early in the onboarding

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process and they improve their average tenure by 324%.

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Oh my goodness.

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You know, huge, right?

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Huge, huge cost savings, you know, it meant a lot to the business operation and, you know,

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we did this by not only giving them reliable, accurate data to use for selection and make

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good hiring decisions but then to also help managers, the hiring managers be better coaches

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to these individuals.

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So understanding their learning style, understanding their attributes and being able to, you know,

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work with the individual in a more unique way versus a generalized way.

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So that, in my opinion, that became a real eye opener for the leadership in this company

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whether it was, you know, HR, hiring managers, you know, the entire leadership team because

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they were able to be better equipped in their role as leaders because now they had another

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tool in their toolkit, another approach to leverage and become, you know, the best leaders

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they could be.

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Yeah.

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So, Anthony, let's take a quick break and we'll come back and we will wrap up this episode.

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At Flagship Talent, we work with our clients to find and place the right talent.

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What do we mean by the right talent?

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We mean we find talent who will commit to your organizational goals and align with your

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values and behavior expectations, talent who will perform to your expectations, talent

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who will stay and grow with your organization.

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How are we different from our competitors?

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We offer the lowest fee structure in the industry.

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We offer the best talent guarantee in the industry.

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We provide selection and interviewing support to our clients at no additional fee.

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We want to save you money, deliver high quality talent, become an extension of your organization

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and be your preferred provider of talent acquisition solutions.

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To learn more, contact Jeff Parsons by email at jeff at FlagshipTalent.com or by phone

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at 1-800-530-4189, extension 101.

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Okay, we're back with Anthony Pantaleon and Anthony, we're at the end of our discussion

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today.

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It's been a great discussion, but what I'd like to do next week in our next episode is

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talk about the mindset of change that's required in order to get better, in order to be more

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effective regarding talent collection, hiring, development, all that stuff.

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Because it does require a different thought process and a different mindset, if you will.

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But I'd like to embark on that discussion next episode and I'd also like to build on

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that and what that means in terms of developing your leadership team and what that means in

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terms of how to look at talent from a much more strategic perspective.

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But thanks again today, Anthony, it's been a great contribution.

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I look forward to our discussion again next week.

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But before we go, Anthony, why don't you tell our listeners one more time how they can find

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you?

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Sure.

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Pretty easy to find me on LinkedIn, Anthony Pantaleon.

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So that's pretty easy or my email is Anthony at telexis.com and that's T-A-L-E-X-E-S.com.

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So Anthony at telexis.com.

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Okay.

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So I told you Anthony was an expert.

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Thanks again, Anthony.

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Oh, my pleasure, Jeff.

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Thanks for having me.

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Thank you for listening to this episode of Be the Flagship with Jeff Parsons.

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We hope you enjoyed it.

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If you did like it, please subscribe and share with others.

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Until next time, take the step to become the flagship in your marketplace.