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Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast, where academic clinicians learn the skills

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to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.

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As clinicians, we spend a decade or more as trainees learning to take care of patients.

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When we finally start our careers, we want to build research programs, but then we find

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that our years of clinical training did not adequately prepare us to lead our research

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program.

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Through no fault of our own, we struggle to find mentors, and when we can't, we quit.

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However, clinicians hold the keys to the greatest research breakthroughs.

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For this reason, the Clinician Researcher podcast exists to give academic clinicians

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the tools to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.

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Now introducing your host, Toyosi Onwuemene.

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Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast.

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I'm your host, Toyosi Onwuemene, and it is an absolute pleasure to be talking with you

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right now.

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Thank you so much for tuning in.

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I am excited to be bringing you today's episode about broadening your circle of influence.

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Again, broadening your circle of influence.

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And I'm so excited to bring this episode to you because it comes from a recent experience

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I had of sitting in a room.

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Actually, it was a virtual room, a virtual room full of physicians, women physicians,

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who are working to improve their financial knowledge.

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And I joined this community about a year ago today, and it never ceases to just change

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my mind because I have to tell you that as an academic physician, I don't talk about

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many very much.

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I just, in general, we talk about money, not at all.

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Sometimes we talk about a raise, maybe, you know, for the most part, it's just not part

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of our conversation.

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And I don't know about you, but as a medical student, as a resident, as a fellow, nobody

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was talking about money.

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And if they were, they were talking about it kind of on the, you know, in secret as

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if it was something to be ashamed about.

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And I know that the experience can be different for women versus men.

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So I don't know what your experience was.

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But in general, I think our society doesn't talk openly about money.

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We do gripe about it.

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We complain about it, but we don't always talk openly about strategies to improve our

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lot.

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Now, this episode is not about money, but I share my experience in this community to

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say that every time I'm around this group of women, my mind is blown because I'm like,

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oh my goodness, is that a strategy?

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What?

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And I'm always surprised.

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And what's really cool is that because, you know, it's money, so you don't have to necessarily,

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you know, have your own special specialty to be part of this group.

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It's very much a multi-specialty, multidisciplinary group.

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For that reason, I interact in this group with more people than I do, more people outside

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my specialty than I do at work.

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Because at work, I'm a hematologist, I hang out with the hematologist, and sometimes I'm

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consulting for maybe the surgeons or the internist.

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But there are people in the hospital I'll never meet because you know what?

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We just don't have any reason for us to run in the same circles at work.

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So it's been a real pleasure to be part of this group.

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And just for in the interest of full disclosure, and because I really value this group, it's

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Money Fit MD group with Dr. Latifat.

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She just does a great job.

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I mean, she's outstanding.

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You should look her up.

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Absolutely.

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She's been on the podcast before.

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So if you haven't already, look up her episode.

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But I share that to say that it is so vital, so important for us to step outside of our

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circle of influence.

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Because the only way we ever broaden our own influence is by broadening our circle.

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And in broadening our circle, we also broaden our circle of influence.

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Now I'm advocating that we think about ways in which we can up the ante in exposing ourselves,

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and I mean that in a good way, to people who are not like us.

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Like I don't talk to GI doctors, those proceduralists always scoping.

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I don't do scoping.

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I'm an E&M doc, right?

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There's no reason I would run into a GI doc unless they were consulting or something like

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that.

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But in these circles, everyone's talking about money, everyone's concerned about money.

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And so the GI docs are there.

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They have a different perspective.

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They have different strategies they think about.

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And so I realize that by being in a circle of people who think differently from me, who

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approach life differently, who solve problems differently, I get strategies that help me

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in my E&M medicine world.

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And now I'm not just talking with regard to finances or clinical work.

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I'm just talking in general that every time you're in a space, you're exposed to other

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people, something changes.

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And so that's what I'm here to talk about.

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Okay.

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The first thing I want to share is that it broadens your perspectives.

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So you're a cool person.

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I don't know who you are listening to me right now, but I just need you to know you're super

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cool.

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I know that because first you're listening to me and cool people recognize cool people.

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Haha.

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But also you went to medical school.

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You took this crazy leap of faith and you throw away your 20s.

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And you decided it was a worthy investment to serve humanity.

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And that makes you super cool.

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You've learned a lot.

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You had a lot of experiences.

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You came out on the other side of your training, totally different than how you walked in.

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You are super cool, super cool.

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And you could be cooler still because there are so many cool people you haven't even met

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yet who will broaden your perspective, who will show you that in fact, your view of the

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world is kind of small.

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As a case in point, I had a meeting with statisticians today and this was a particular statistical

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collaboration that's coming to an end.

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And I remember thinking, I remember where I was before I met you in this collaboration.

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I knew very little about statistics.

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Now I've taken all those statistical courses that you've probably taken too, statistics

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one and two, advanced statistics.

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And I still am no nearer to being a statistician than I was when I didn't take any statistical

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courses.

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Right.

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And my conversation with them on a weekly basis transformed my understanding of statistics

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because they broaden my perspective.

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And to be honest, what I realized is that I did not have respect for statisticians like

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I should have, but now I have a great deal of respect.

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What I realized is that they have knowledge gaps about clinical medicine, but I have knowledge

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gaps about that statistics.

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And so it has been a wonderful exchange of clinical for statistical knowledge.

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They have broadened my perspective.

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They're like iron sharpening my iron.

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So together we're sharpened.

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Sparks fly, sometimes there are fires, but we are both better at the end.

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And so whoever is in your circle right now, you came into the circle, right?

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You didn't used to be in medicine.

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You came into clinical medicine.

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You were up shoulders with all these amazing physicians that you work with.

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That's great.

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And now there's opportunity for more.

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You didn't used to do research in health services and then you came into health services research

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research.

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You had all these collaborators that you've been working with and there is more.

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There is more opportunity to broaden your networks and don't be afraid to lean into

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it.

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Don't be afraid to step into it.

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Don't be afraid to do the impossible, to do the unthinkable.

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And I mean that in a good way, but definitely you want to broaden your perspectives because

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it changes who you are as a scientist.

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It changes who you are as a clinician.

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And it's absolutely important.

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Number two goes without saying, networking opportunities come from interacting with people

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that you usually wouldn't interact with because honestly, people are the only people that

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open doors for other people.

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Yes, I know that is all circular, but in life, the difference maker will always be, has always

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been people.

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Like the people who, the things that really make you mad, people.

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The things that really bring you joy, people.

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The things you love so much, people.

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These people.

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And so whenever you can broaden your networks of people, that's another opportunity for

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an introduction to the next thing or the next thing or the next thing after that.

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I'll give an example.

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I got an email today from someone who was like, we think you're an expert who can speak

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to blah, blah, blah.

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And in my mind, I'm first of all like, well, yeah, I can see that I'm, well, I don't know.

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I'm not even, I didn't even feel so confident I was the expert they were looking for.

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But my first thought was where, how did you find me?

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I don't know you.

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How did you find me?

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I mean, but clearly it's a legit, legit request, but I didn't know this person.

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But I don't know how they got my information, but clearly it has to come from someone else.

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So people knowing people, knowing people, knowing people.

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People is how you grow your networks.

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People is how you have opportunities.

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People is how you have access to opportunities.

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So whatever it is that you don't have within you, and you got a lot within you, it exists

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in somebody who is already within your circle.

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Whatever you need already exists in you or in somebody that surrounds you, right?

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Or someone who's connected to someone in your circle.

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And so networking opportunities abound when you leave your safe space and go occupy space

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elsewhere.

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And now this is something I want to point out.

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You know, I don't know about you, but I've done all these career development type things

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where you go and you're together with a group for a weekend and you have such a blast.

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You're like, oh my gosh, you are so cool.

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The weekend is over and that's it.

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It's like, well, you know, the weekend's over.

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You never connect again.

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And I want to say that there is something to be said about being in community routinely,

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consistently over an extended period of time.

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And that's something that I've found to be really beneficial because sometimes the treasure

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that is in people takes time to be revealed.

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And so, you know, many times we talk about networking, about going to conferences and

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meeting people and I tell you that that's good.

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And I totally recommend and encourage that.

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What's important is to establish relationships, establish long-term opportunities for connectedness

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because more important than the one-off meetings at meetings, at conferences are the relationships

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that are sustained even if they're not deep relationships.

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The women I meet with in this group, we meet once a week.

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That's it.

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We meet once a week.

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We're not best friends, but when we do get together, we have a great time and we're able

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to think about each other because we kind of meeting routinely.

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Right.

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And so there's more opportunity for connections to occur because it's a long-term, long-term

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relationship or long-term community.

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So I just encourage finding community, real community as you're building and expanding

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your networks.

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Okay.

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So networking opportunities, number two.

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Number three is learning and growth.

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I already talked about, you know, my experience with statisticians.

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I, you know, I feel like I know a thing or two about statistics, but there's a lot I

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don't know.

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And so being in a constant, constant experience, constant community with statisticians over

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the course of a year or two years, three years, I've really learned a lot.

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I've expanded.

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I have a new appreciation for statisticians and the work they do.

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I have a new recognition of how long it really takes to give me that simple page of statistics

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I think I want.

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I'm learning.

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I'm growing.

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In fact, I can speak statistically now.

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Actually, to be honest, I can't still, but what happens though is now when they're having

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conversations, I just don't feel like I'm lost, right?

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Now I'm like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, regression, of course.

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Yeah, of course.

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Yeah, I know what that means.

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Where before it was like, what are they saying is this English?

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And so there's opportunity for learning and growth that comes from leaving your circle

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to meet new friends, to meet new colleagues.

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Number four is innovation and creativity.

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Innovation and creativity.

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So here's the thing.

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There's nothing new in this world.

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Nothing really.

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What we're doing is we're borrowing from other fields and bringing them to our field.

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And then it's like, oh, this is innovative.

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Yeah, innovation is just about borrowing what somebody else is doing, a way they've solved

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their problem to solve your problem.

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It's a new way of looking at really old problems, right?

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Innovation, creativity, it's applying your knowledge to creating new things, right?

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And so when you go elsewhere, you're like, oh, okay, they solved it this way.

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That's interesting.

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It makes you think differently about the problems you're looking at.

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And that is so wild as a scientist.

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So awesome.

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Because what are we doing in science?

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We're solving problems.

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And then somebody else has already solved a problem or at least has got further than

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we have in their sphere.

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And then we connect with them and we think, wait a minute, we could apply that to our

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sphere of research.

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And what would that break?

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And so it spurs innovation and creativity.

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And it's funny.

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It's like they've been doing it before.

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So it's not like it's new to them.

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It's new to you.

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It's new to your field.

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It changes the way you think.

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It is so awesome.

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Like when the light bulb moment you have when you want somebody else solve a problem that

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you have and you're like, wait a minute, you mean I could do X, Y, Z. It is so powerful.

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Doesn't happen in the circle of friends that you know and love and are safe and comfortable

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with.

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It happens when you expose yourself to people who think differently from you, people who

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have problems that are different from your problems.

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So taking the time to step outside of your comfort zone and going and immersing yourself,

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especially longitudinally in a community that's different from yours is so helpful because

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it transforms the way you think.

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All right.

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That is innovation and creativity.

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Number five is career advancement.

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Yes, career advancement.

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So you know the thing they tell you where you come, you put your head down, you work,

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work, work, work, work, you meet the metrics, you get promoted, all of it is a lie?

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Actually I walk that back.

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I walk that back.

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They're not lying to you.

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They just are not giving you the whole picture.

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I'm only just realizing now that doing all of that hard work is fine, and please do it,

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but that there are people who don't do that and they still advance like they're crazy.

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And it's like, wait a minute, I have more publications than you.

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How are you further ahead than me?

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And please don't do that.

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Don't compare yourself to other people because it's always a losing battle.

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Talk to us.

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What I'm saying is that you realize that when you want to compare papers to papers, grants

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to grants, many of the people who are moving ahead at a pace that's faster than you would

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expect them to move.

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If someone has published 3,000 papers, you're like, of course, I expect that you're a full

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professor with tenure and three endowed chairs because you've done this crazy stuff.

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So those people we get were like, yeah, you definitely got above and beyond.

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You totally deserve all that.

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And then there's some people who are like, oh yeah, I don't get it.

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Yeah, it doesn't make sense.

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And I realized that many times, not always, but many times the difference maker is that

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they have networks and relationships.

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You know what, if you're going to invite someone to come give a talk at your institution and

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you had a choice between famous guy, so famous, but you don't even know who he is and not

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quite so famous, but your buddy from med school, who are you going to invite?

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Yeah, okay.

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That's exactly how people think.

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People want to connect with people they already are connected with.

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Here we are talking about leaving your connections, like going outside.

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And in reality, people like to stick with people they already know.

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And so many times when we talk about this whole need for national recognition, for people

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to invite you for talks, well, you think that the more papers you publish, the more invitations

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you get.

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It's like the more people know you, the more invitations you get.

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And if they know you because you were connected in high school or you went to some one year

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longitudinal career development program together, same difference.

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You've taken 20 years to build your portfolio and now they know you.

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Or it's been 10 years or five years in your portfolio, but they still know you.

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People want to connect with people they already know.

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And so all those things about national reputation and international reputation, it all comes

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from people you know.

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I'll tell you that I was recently putting together materials for promotion and I found

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out as I was in researching metrics that were going to help explain my impact beyond the

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H index, I found out that I had published over 50% of my papers with international collaborators.

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Was it 38%?

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It was a high percentage where I was like, what?

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Who do I know who's international?

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And it turns out that I have an international collaborator I've worked with long term, but

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they weren't international technically when they started because we were working at the

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same place.

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But I was like, oh yeah, this person is international, but I hadn't really thought about it.

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But now I go to get promoted and that matters.

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All of a sudden it looks like, I mean, I do, but it looks like I have international connections

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and I do have international connections, but not in the way I'm thinking about, right?

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Because I'm thinking, yes, they know me because now my papers are circulating the world.

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Most people's papers will not circulate the world until long after their death, but your

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00:18:01,540 --> 00:18:04,820
friends will circulate.

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So many of the things that go into promotion are really based honestly on who knows you.

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00:18:12,300 --> 00:18:17,700
The more people you know, especially outside of your little sphere, the more you are able

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00:18:17,700 --> 00:18:22,500
to succeed in the things that people think we're supposed to put our head down and write,

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00:18:22,500 --> 00:18:26,140
write, write, write, write, and publish, publish, publish.

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Don't get me wrong, all those things are important and good.

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That's all you're doing.

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You are playing a losing game.

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And I say that kindly, I hope you receive it as kind because that's what I learned a

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few, actually it wasn't even that long ago.

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And they were like, Toyosi, this is one of my colleagues who may be listening.

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00:18:45,380 --> 00:18:49,940
And he was like, Toyosi, Toyosi, Toyosi, if you are putting your head down doing all this

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00:18:49,940 --> 00:18:52,300
work, it's not the way it works.

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00:18:52,300 --> 00:18:54,820
And I appreciate him.

335
00:18:54,820 --> 00:18:58,020
Usually a guy, I feel like who has the inside information.

336
00:18:58,020 --> 00:19:01,660
It's like, wait a minute, where was I when you were getting all this information?

337
00:19:01,660 --> 00:19:04,060
Anyway, but no, no, no harm, no foul.

338
00:19:04,060 --> 00:19:05,060
It's all good.

339
00:19:05,060 --> 00:19:10,100
But I do want to share with you that if you are really serious about advancing, and some

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00:19:10,100 --> 00:19:15,340
of you don't care to advance in the academic environment, that's fine.

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00:19:15,340 --> 00:19:20,500
But if you are interested in advancing, you're going to want to broaden your circle for sure.

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00:19:20,500 --> 00:19:24,300
You don't want to do it in a way that's organic and natural to you, not feeling like, oh,

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must make friends, must connect, must do mentoring and networking.

344
00:19:31,620 --> 00:19:33,060
Don't think of it that way.

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Just relax.

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You're good at making friends.

347
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You've been doing it all your life.

348
00:19:36,380 --> 00:19:37,660
This is the same thing.

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00:19:37,660 --> 00:19:41,860
Just make sure you put yourself in spaces where it becomes easy to do that, rather than

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the drive by during conferences.

351
00:19:43,260 --> 00:19:47,260
Oh, wait a minute, can I shake your hand as you're running to the next thing?

352
00:19:47,260 --> 00:19:52,100
So anyway, I feel like I've said, I've talked about that a lot.

353
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So career advancement.

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Number six is support and mentorship.

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00:19:57,260 --> 00:20:02,100
Now I don't know what it is about our own institutions, but many people are invested

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in keeping the status quo.

357
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And sometimes the status quo does not support early career faculty.

358
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And I'm not sure why that is, but it is.

359
00:20:11,100 --> 00:20:12,100
It is what it is.

360
00:20:12,100 --> 00:20:15,820
The status quo doesn't always favor early career faculty.

361
00:20:15,820 --> 00:20:22,380
And even though your mentors are lovely, and I have and have had lovely, lovely mentors,

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many times people at your own institution, whether they know it or not, unconscious bias

363
00:20:27,300 --> 00:20:29,380
is a real thing.

364
00:20:29,380 --> 00:20:31,260
They're trying to maintain the status quo.

365
00:20:31,260 --> 00:20:34,380
And so when you come with your brilliant ideas and you're like, oh, this is what I want to

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00:20:34,380 --> 00:20:40,980
do, they're like, yeah, we've never done it like this before.

367
00:20:40,980 --> 00:20:43,820
And they support you, but they're kind of lukewarm about it.

368
00:20:43,820 --> 00:20:44,820
Right?

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00:20:44,820 --> 00:20:45,820
They are.

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00:20:45,820 --> 00:20:48,340
Because you're threatening the status quo and people are people.

371
00:20:48,340 --> 00:20:52,740
They like things to stay exactly the same, even when everything is changing, they're

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00:20:52,740 --> 00:20:55,820
going to hold on to their little corner of sameness.

373
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I'm like that too.

374
00:20:56,820 --> 00:20:59,220
So this is not a judgment on people.

375
00:20:59,220 --> 00:21:00,660
It's just the way it is.

376
00:21:00,660 --> 00:21:01,660
Right?

377
00:21:01,660 --> 00:21:05,420
But it's a challenge for you because you're coming in with new ideas and innovations and

378
00:21:05,420 --> 00:21:08,440
you want to advance things and you want to transform things.

379
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:09,940
You're pushing hard.

380
00:21:09,940 --> 00:21:14,460
Now some people have great mentorship and everybody loves the new ideas that they bring,

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00:21:14,460 --> 00:21:15,460
which is great.

382
00:21:15,460 --> 00:21:17,100
Most of us don't have that.

383
00:21:17,100 --> 00:21:18,100
Right?

384
00:21:18,100 --> 00:21:23,340
So one of the things that you can do is break outside of your institution.

385
00:21:23,340 --> 00:21:28,180
And it's so important actually to cultivate a network of mentors and sponsors outside

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00:21:28,180 --> 00:21:29,620
of your institution.

387
00:21:29,620 --> 00:21:33,340
So what's the difference between a mentor at your institution versus a mentor at another

388
00:21:33,340 --> 00:21:34,340
institution?

389
00:21:34,340 --> 00:21:35,340
Location.

390
00:21:35,340 --> 00:21:36,340
Yes.

391
00:21:36,340 --> 00:21:38,740
All politics is local politics.

392
00:21:38,740 --> 00:21:39,740
Right?

393
00:21:39,740 --> 00:21:43,620
If you are trying to advance in this way, somebody else is seeing you as threatening to their

394
00:21:43,620 --> 00:21:47,540
position in your institution, the person at the other institution couldn't care less

395
00:21:47,540 --> 00:21:48,860
how well you advanced.

396
00:21:48,860 --> 00:21:49,860
Right?

397
00:21:49,860 --> 00:21:53,420
Like, well, we don't care because your management doesn't affect me.

398
00:21:53,420 --> 00:21:54,660
So they're more likely to be open.

399
00:21:54,660 --> 00:21:57,980
They're more likely to share with you things that your mentors might not share with you

400
00:21:57,980 --> 00:22:01,260
because they kind of are biased or they have conflict.

401
00:22:01,260 --> 00:22:02,260
Right?

402
00:22:02,260 --> 00:22:07,620
And so if you only have mentors at your own institution, you are doing yourself a disservice.

403
00:22:07,620 --> 00:22:11,900
And even if your mentors are great, you're doing yourself a disservice because what you

404
00:22:11,900 --> 00:22:16,300
need is a diversity of mentors and you need mentors who are outside your institution.

405
00:22:16,300 --> 00:22:21,620
So you want to cultivate your network of mentors and sponsors outside of your institution.

406
00:22:21,620 --> 00:22:25,940
As much as you have great people at your institution, please make sure that you are cultivating

407
00:22:25,940 --> 00:22:27,220
outside of our institution.

408
00:22:27,220 --> 00:22:28,220
Okay?

409
00:22:28,220 --> 00:22:29,220
All right.

410
00:22:29,220 --> 00:22:30,220
That's number six.

411
00:22:30,220 --> 00:22:32,940
Finally, number seven has to do with increased influence.

412
00:22:32,940 --> 00:22:35,580
The more people know you, the more people know you.

413
00:22:35,580 --> 00:22:39,660
And the more people know you, the more people who know you are impressed by how many people

414
00:22:39,660 --> 00:22:40,660
know you.

415
00:22:40,660 --> 00:22:45,520
And they're like, well, I don't think much about her, but all these other people from

416
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:47,780
all these other institutions are saying she's great.

417
00:22:47,780 --> 00:22:51,220
Maybe there is something to be said for that.

418
00:22:51,220 --> 00:22:54,980
People just don't think much about the people they already know.

419
00:22:54,980 --> 00:22:59,100
Nobody can be great in their own family in the way that they're like, wait a minute,

420
00:22:59,100 --> 00:23:00,100
I changed your diapers.

421
00:23:00,100 --> 00:23:04,740
What do you mean you're like top dog and I should look up to you with respect?

422
00:23:04,740 --> 00:23:05,740
People are just people.

423
00:23:05,740 --> 00:23:06,740
Right?

424
00:23:06,740 --> 00:23:07,740
And it's fine.

425
00:23:07,740 --> 00:23:08,740
It's the way it is.

426
00:23:08,740 --> 00:23:09,740
It's your institution.

427
00:23:09,740 --> 00:23:13,860
Until somebody else comes and says, this person's really, really cool.

428
00:23:13,860 --> 00:23:15,660
And they're like, huh, this person?

429
00:23:15,660 --> 00:23:20,380
And then they look at you with new eyes.

430
00:23:20,380 --> 00:23:22,500
So it increases your influence.

431
00:23:22,500 --> 00:23:23,500
All right.

432
00:23:23,500 --> 00:23:25,620
Seven things I'm going to recap.

433
00:23:25,620 --> 00:23:28,460
Number one, broadens your perspectives.

434
00:23:28,460 --> 00:23:30,620
Number two, gives you networking opportunities.

435
00:23:30,620 --> 00:23:33,180
Number three, it helps you learn and grow.

436
00:23:33,180 --> 00:23:36,060
Number four, gives you innovation and creativity.

437
00:23:36,060 --> 00:23:38,900
Number five, career advancement for sure.

438
00:23:38,900 --> 00:23:42,780
Number six, increases your support and mentorship networks.

439
00:23:42,780 --> 00:23:48,580
Number seven, increases your influence even within your own institution.

440
00:23:48,580 --> 00:23:55,740
I hope you will consider, and I'm inviting you to consider, what are some spaces that

441
00:23:55,740 --> 00:24:02,380
are open to you that are not the people you typically hang out with that you will pursue

442
00:24:02,380 --> 00:24:03,380
this week?

443
00:24:03,380 --> 00:24:05,380
Maybe it's a career development award opportunity.

444
00:24:05,380 --> 00:24:08,300
Maybe it's just a professional development opportunity.

445
00:24:08,300 --> 00:24:10,900
Maybe it's a career development opportunity.

446
00:24:10,900 --> 00:24:15,780
Whatever it is, what circles can you insert yourself into?

447
00:24:15,780 --> 00:24:20,820
Longitudinal, not talking about the drive-by networking thing.

448
00:24:20,820 --> 00:24:26,500
What longitudinal circles can you insert yourself into in the next week or apply for or put

449
00:24:26,500 --> 00:24:30,940
on your list of things to apply for that gets you connected with people who don't think

450
00:24:30,940 --> 00:24:34,180
like you, don't look like you, don't walk like you, don't talk like you?

451
00:24:34,180 --> 00:24:37,300
I invite you to think about that this week.

452
00:24:37,300 --> 00:24:40,660
And then I'd love for you to tell me about it because I'd love to hear how your expanded

453
00:24:40,660 --> 00:24:45,420
networking is transforming your career, especially as a clinician researcher.

454
00:24:45,420 --> 00:24:48,140
I want to say that it's been so fun talking with you today.

455
00:24:48,140 --> 00:24:52,940
I was so excited to talk about this topic and I'm so glad that you stayed till the end.

456
00:24:52,940 --> 00:24:58,540
I look forward to talking with you again next time on the Clinician Researcher Podcast.

457
00:24:58,540 --> 00:25:05,460
Thank you for listening.

458
00:25:05,460 --> 00:25:10,820
Thanks for listening to this episode of the Clinician Researcher Podcast where academic

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00:25:10,820 --> 00:25:16,260
clinicians learn the skills to build their own research program, whether or not they

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00:25:16,260 --> 00:25:17,620
have a mentor.

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00:25:17,620 --> 00:25:23,740
If you found the information in this episode to be helpful, don't keep it all to yourself.

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00:25:23,740 --> 00:25:25,460
Someone else needs to hear it.

463
00:25:25,460 --> 00:25:29,520
So take a minute right now and share it.

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00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:34,980
As you share this episode, you become part of our mission to help launch a new generation

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00:25:34,980 --> 00:25:40,340
of clinician researchers who make transformative discoveries that change the way we do healthcare.