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Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast, where academic clinicians learn the skills

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to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.

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As clinicians, we spend a decade or more as trainees learning to take care of patients.

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When we finally start our careers, we want to build research programs, but then we find

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that our years of clinical training did not adequately prepare us to lead our research

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program.

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Through no fault of our own, we struggle to find mentors, and when we can't, we quit.

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However, clinicians hold the keys to the greatest research breakthroughs.

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For this reason, the Clinician Researcher podcast exists to give academic clinicians

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the tools to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.

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Now introducing your host, Toyosi Onwuemene.

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Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast.

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I'm your host, Toyosi Onwuemene, and it is a pleasure to be talking with you today.

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Thank you so much for tuning in.

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Today I'm talking about how to find the right leader for your career.

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And I have a feeling that this one's going to be short.

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Yes, the moment you say it's going to be short, then it's awfully long, but I do have seven

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things, but I think it'll be really short.

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So how do you find the right leader for your career, and why does it even really matter?

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And I think back to earlier on in my career where I had no clue what I was supposed to

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do as an academic faculty, and you could say, well, that's on you.

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You should have gone to figure it out.

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I guess I was figuring it out.

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And in the meantime, I thought my mentors were going to tell me they were going to be

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the ones to help me.

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And I really counted on them for so much.

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And I was disappointed.

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And I think I was disappointed because I just put so much on people.

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And at the end of the day, nobody cares about your career like you do.

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Nobody's thinking about your life like you are thinking about your life.

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And so there I was thinking, oh, I'm not getting the mentoring I need.

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Oh, people are not really caring about me.

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Oh, my goodness, they're not helping me move forward.

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And I think what I didn't recognize is that any gift you get from anybody is a gift, and

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you just take it as that.

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And people are just people.

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And there are some people that they connect with more.

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Some people they feel like they can see themselves in more than others.

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You know, your mentor looks at you and they think, wow, that's exactly how I was 10 years

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ago.

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Or they look at you and they're like, I can't even imagine what you were like 10 years ago.

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Right.

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And so it's just a different experience for different mentors.

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And mentors are not superhuman.

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They're only human.

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And if we have challenges in general, right, as far as like how people move forward in

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their careers, you know, it just it just also applies to our academic institutions as well.

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So anyway, just saying that mentoring doesn't always get you where you think it should take

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you because you have expectations that sometimes don't match what is reality for you as far

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as the mentors you have available to you.

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So anyway, so I wanted to share with you a couple of things as to how to find the right

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leader for your career.

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And the first thing I want to say is that this leader that you find for your career

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has to really care about you.

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Like they've got to care.

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They've got to say, wow, you know, they're going to be thinking about you.

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They've got to be wondering, OK, how do I make things better for this person?

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They've got to really, really care about you.

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And why is that relevant?

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Because, you know, mentoring or leading someone's career is a big deal, right?

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You're considering what are the challenges that they are running into?

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What are the things that they really need?

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You know, you're thinking about them to some extent.

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It kind of is like having a child.

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I guess we could call it you're a scientific parent as a leader, as a mentor, helping someone

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navigate their own career.

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And it works best when you actually care about the person whose career you're helping to

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navigate.

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And so as you're thinking about who's the right leader for my career, you've got to

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recognize that it's going to be someone who actually cares about you.

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And I think that there are many people in academia who, you know, they're neutral about

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you.

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I mean, you're someone who needs help and they're available to help.

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They're happy to help.

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But it doesn't mean like they're invested in you or that they really, really are like,

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I want you to succeed by all means.

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There are not too many people in life who actually I mean, not that they don't want

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that for you, but they're not too many people who care that much.

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You know, it's like, hey, I've got a lot to think about.

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I've got a lot on my plate.

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And I'm not really thinking about you beyond just our interaction here.

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And so you just got to recognize that not everybody deeply cares about you like that.

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And but but if you're really going to have someone help you lead your career, you do

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need to find people who actually do care about you.

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And so you may have mentors or you may have people who help you lead your career who don't

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care about you like that.

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You know, there are different things that you're getting from them and that's OK.

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But when you're looking for the one person that you're really going to put your career,

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you know, you're going to put your career in their hands, you want to make sure that

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they actually really care about you.

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OK.

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The next thing is that this leader actually needs to see your potential where you can't

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see it.

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And so the challenge is that we have so many blind spots.

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When we start out in our academic careers, we don't even know what we what we can and

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cannot do.

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Right.

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We don't know our potential.

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We don't really recognize how powerful we are.

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We have no idea who we are.

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It's like, you know, Superman, who is like, yeah, I'm like, I have all these powers and

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it's kind of weird, but I just don't think much of myself.

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I think I'm just ordinary like everybody else or maybe better still.

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It's like the chicken or the eagle that grows up among chickens.

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I've heard that story before where you don't even know how far how much you can fly or

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soar because you've been surrounded by chickens who don't fly, who don't soar.

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And so it takes another person who's like thinking about you and thinking, wow, you

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have potential.

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You're an eagle.

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You can do this.

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Right.

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And they've got to see potential where you can't see it.

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OK.

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The next thing is that this leader actually needs to have a bird's eye view of your entire

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career.

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Now, I'm not just talking about your career as in, you know, your your academic advancement

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or your patient care.

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They really got to just look at your whole life.

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Like, where are you in life?

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Are you in a place where you have small children at home and you're not really able to make

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the kinds of investments that people who don't are?

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Or are you in your career and a place in your career where maybe you have parents who are

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aging and really need your support at this time?

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Do you are you in a place in your career where you have someone who's a loved one that you're

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primarily responsible for who's going through a major illness?

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Right.

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So this person has really got to be able to take into consideration your stage in life,

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everything that you're going through.

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And they've got to really be able to support you through that.

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Again, you know, it's like what this is so idealistic.

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But this is important because I think in academia, so many times we're so focused on the products

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of the academy, on papers, on manuscripts, on publications, on grants and presentations

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and showing up internationally or nationally, you know, all the stuff that helps us move

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forward and those things are good.

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It's good that we're focused on them.

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Where else would we be focused on them?

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But they've also got to take into account your big life, your big picture.

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And so if we are focused on these things to the exclusion of the big picture of your life

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and the challenges that are going on in your life, it puts stress on you because even while

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nobody else is acknowledging what's going on with you, you know, you're acutely aware

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you're having to manage it.

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And so this leader has really got to have a bird's eye view, not just of your academic

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career, but just who you are and where you are in life and what you need at this particular

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time of your experience.

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Okay.

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This leader needs to ride with you through the highs and the lows.

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So I'd love to say, and you know, that we are not always high, right?

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You love to say that, oh, my goodness, everything is always so awesome and life is always so

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good.

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But there are times when that's not true and things are challenging.

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You know, there's the unexpected funeral that, you know, you have to deal with.

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There's an unexpected illness that you weren't preparing for.

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There's an unexpected accident where now you need to fix your car or there's an unexpected

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pull out of an au pair and now you're kind of left looking for support for your children.

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And this person has got to be able to go with you through those highs and those lows.

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Number five is that this leader needs to support you even when doing so is a sacrifice to their

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own personal lives.

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So it's like, okay, you need support right now.

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I'm going to do it even though it costs me.

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And that's a big deal.

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It's a big deal to ask people to do things that could potentially cost them.

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Maybe promoting you may mean that they have to forego like their leadership position.

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They're like, you know what?

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I think you should go, you should move into this leadership position.

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I'm stepping back so that you can step forward.

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That's a big deal, right?

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That's a huge deal.

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But really, it's someone putting you forward.

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It's someone giving you a platform.

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And for you to really have someone who's the right leader for your career, they've got

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to really support you even when it's at a personal cost to them.

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Okay.

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So I say all of those so I can let you know that I really have just created the picture

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of an idealistic leader who does not exist in human form.

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And so you may have a little bit of this in so many different people, but it's a little

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bit of each thing in so many different people.

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But what you probably don't have is all of it in one person.

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So if you think about the person who really cares about you, maybe it's really a parent.

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And they certainly are not in your academic environment.

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Maybe you work with a family member or maybe your parents are in academia.

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Good for you.

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But most of the time, it's not the way it is.

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And so yes, you have different people who embody these different things, but you don't

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necessarily have one person who embodies all of it.

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And so if you are not going to be able to find one person who embodies all of this,

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then you do have to go to the next best thing.

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You have to go to option number two.

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So there's no ideal person.

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And there might be some people are able to find mentors who they gel with, they connect

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with, and the mentor is like, I'm like a parent to you.

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I'm going to do everything to promote you.

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Some people do find that.

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But I want you to know it's very few.

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It's less than 20% of people.

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And so for the rest of us, the next best thing, which is number seven, is to recognize that

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the next best leader is you.

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And as I say that, I see people saying, oh, wait a minute, me, haha, don't even really

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care about myself like that.

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I totally see no potential in my life.

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I have a struggle with birds eye view of my entire career because I have no idea where

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I am right now.

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And I can't even ride with myself through the highs, much less the lows, right?

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You look at yourself and you're like, me, definitely not.

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Can we find someone else who will lead my career?

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And I am sorry to have to break it to you, but it's you.

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You cannot find the ideal leader who's going to be all things to you.

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And so the next best thing is that you step up and you take ownership.

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You take ownership for your experience.

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You take ownership of your, you take leadership.

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You take up the leadership mantle for your own career.

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But what does that mean, though?

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It means you've got to do things a little bit differently.

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It means you first of all, got to actually start to really care about yourself.

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So the whole thing, maybe this is not you, but for somebody hypothetically who doesn't

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care enough about themselves, right?

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Who is not sleeping enough, not eating right, not exercising, right?

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Not really caring for themselves as they should.

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Then what do they do?

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Well, you got to get there.

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You've got to do the work to be able to really see yourself as someone you really need to

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care for.

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And sometimes it's hard because I think in medicine, our training leads us to kind of

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put ourselves last and to some extent sacrifice our personal experience on the altar of other

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people's moving forward, especially patient care.

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And so sometimes it's hard for us to actually really care for ourselves.

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And it takes time.

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And it takes work.

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And for some of us, it takes going to therapy and so that we can do that work and do that

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work in therapy.

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Or for some of us, then that's work that we have to do in coaching.

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And whatever the venue where you do the work, where you learn to care for yourself and take

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care first of your own oxygen, right?

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You take care of putting on your mask first before you go on to try to save the universe,

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right?

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You really got to do that work so that you can do that well.

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And the other thing you need to do as you want to become this best leader for yourself

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is you got to just go get the training needed, right?

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You want to read books, you want to attend professional development, you want to attend

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career development events.

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You want to do things that help you grow as a person because when you grow as a person,

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then you're really able to lead your career as you're supposed to.

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And so you really, really, really have an opportunity where there's a gap.

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There's no one to lead.

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You may have a great mentor, but most people do not.

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There's an opportunity to lead.

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There's an opportunity to really lead the people who are helping you lead your experience,

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right?

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So you do have mentors.

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Okay, maybe there's not one of them that's like a superstar mentor leader, as I've just

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described, but you do have those who are around you and are there to help you.

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And so you get the training you need so that you can help them give you the kind of advice

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that helps you get where you're going, right?

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It means disclosing things as needed to say, hey, I know that this next two weeks is crunch

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time for this abstract, but I'm going to sit this abstract submission out because x, y,

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z, right?

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It's you being able to be bold and confident to say, I'm going to take the leadership mantle

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for my own career because I actually really understand what I'm going through and what

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needs to be done.

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But it will take time for you to get the training that's needed to become the leader that you

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need to be to lead your own career.

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So the question I want to ask you to consider as you go on to this week is what do you need

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to do to develop the leader within you?

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How do you move this leader forward?

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How do you help this leader succeed?

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How do you help yourself succeed so that you can lead yourself in the way you want to?

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And it's important because as you learn to lead yourself, then you're really open to

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leading a lot more other people.

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And to be honest, we need leaders like you.

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We need leaders who care for themselves well enough where we know that, well, if you treat

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yourself well, it's a sign that you're going to treat other people well.

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But if you treat yourself poorly, then we're suspicious that you're going to treat other

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people under your leadership poorly too.

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And so what do you need to do to begin to develop a leader within you so that you can

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really lead yourself in your experience and then turn around and lead others as well?

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OK, so just to summarize, this leader's got to really care about you.

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They've got to see potential where you can't see it.

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They need to have a bird's eye view of your entire career.

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They need to ride with you through the highs and the lows.

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They need to support you even when doing so would be a sacrifice to themselves personally.

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And I list all these things and let you know that this leader probably doesn't exist in

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human form.

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And so the next best thing is you is to develop yourself to be the leader that you need to

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be.

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All right.

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I think that is short.

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I am coming to the end of it.

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And I just want to thank you for taking the time to listen to today's episode.

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And I look forward to talking with you again the next time.

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Have a great day.

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And please share this podcast episode with someone.

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All right.

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Bye.

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Thanks for listening to this episode of the Clinician Researcher Podcast, where academic

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clinicians learn the skills to build their own research program, whether or not they

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have a mentor.

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If you found the information in this episode to be helpful, don't keep it all to yourself.

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Someone else needs to hear it.

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So take a minute right now and share it.

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As you share this episode, you become part of our mission to help launch a new generation

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of clinician researchers who make transformative discoveries that change the way we do health

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care.

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Right now, suit yourself.

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There.