Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast, where academic clinicians learn the skills
to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.
As clinicians, we spend a decade or more as trainees learning to take care of patients.
When we finally start our careers, we want to build research programs, but then we find
that our years of clinical training did not adequately prepare us to lead our research
program.
Through no fault of our own, we struggle to find mentors, and when we can't, we quit.
However, clinicians hold the keys to the greatest research breakthroughs.
For this reason, the Clinician Researcher podcast exists to give academic clinicians
the tools to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.
Now introducing your host, Toyosi Onwuemene.
Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast.
I'm your host, Toyosi Onwuemene, and I'm super excited to be talking with you today, as I
am always.
And today I'm talking about making the most of your annual meeting.
I remember my first annual meeting for the American Society of Hematology.
I first attended as a fellow in either 2010 or 2011.
And I remember that the reason I wanted to go was because, wow, I was going to learn
so much Hematology.
It was going to be so awesome.
I was so excited.
And that first meeting was in Orlando, Florida.
And I will tell you that things were not exactly as I expected them to be.
So this was a meeting in Orlando in December.
So I expected I was going to go to Orlando in December, and it was going to be super
warm and amazing.
And it was incredibly cold that year.
So there was no snow, but it might as well have been snowing.
It was that cold.
I was so disappointed.
And, OK, in retrospect, maybe it wasn't that cold, but I was just so unprepared for Orlando
in December that I was so, so disappointed.
So I was disappointed by the weather.
And I was also disappointed by the meeting too, because, oh my goodness, it was huge.
It's so big.
There were so many people, and there were so many events happening simultaneously.
It was like, well, which one am I going to go to?
And I can't make all these sessions.
It was overwhelming.
And I don't know about you, but to be honest, I still find meetings kind of overwhelming.
Over time, I've been able to kind of curate my experience, but they are still big and
overwhelming.
You know, over time, I've been able to attend meetings that are much, much smaller than
our animal meeting, the American Society of Hematology.
It's a big meeting.
It's got over 20,000 people and growing that attend the meetings every year.
And so it's a big enough meeting now that there are only a couple of sites across the
country that we can have these meetings.
And so it's a predictable group of four, actually five.
The rotation is around, I think, five major convention sites.
And again, it's in December.
So we stay away from the states in which snow could be a problem for flights and things
like that.
So anyway, the American Society of Hematology meeting is huge.
It's happening in December.
I'm excited to be going and to be moderating a session or two.
And so I wanted to share some insights about how to make the most of your animal meeting
and to not be overwhelmed because it can be pretty overwhelming.
And so these are just my thoughts.
I would be excited to hear about your thoughts.
So definitely shoot me a voicemail through the podcast website or send me a DM so that
I can get your insights as well.
So the first thing I want to share is that you should plan to go.
I know that doesn't sound very innovative or original, but you really should plan to
go.
And I say that because you know what?
There are so many meetings that we go to in academia.
And absolutely, if you don't have three or four or five meetings that you're going to
or that you could potentially go to during the year, then maybe you're not at an academic
institution or maybe you are.
But there are always meetings to go to.
And so you could choose not to go.
And there are many reasons to not go to meetings.
But I think it's important to go to your annual meeting.
And sometimes people will say, well, I'm not presenting, therefore I'm not going.
And I would say that you should go even if you're not presenting.
You should find a way to present something or find something to do there.
But the most important thing at the annual meeting is not always the presentation that
you're giving.
So definitely present, but don't say that because you don't have anything to present,
you're not going.
So have a plan to go.
And sometimes the reason it's important to have something that you're presenting before
you go is because sometimes you won't find funding or people are not going to support
you to go if you're not presenting, especially when you're early career or maybe still in
training.
If you're presenting, then someone can say, OK, yeah, we're now going to release this
pot of money so that you can go present this particularly abstract.
So whatever it helps for you to do so that you can go, please do it.
But really have a plan to go.
And as you grow in your career, as you have other sources of funding, perhaps maybe your
annual faculty development fund, whatever that is, you should go anyway, even if you
don't have something to present because meetings offer so much more to you than just an opportunity
to present your research.
So definitely plan to go.
That's number one.
Number two is have a plan.
So plan to go and then have a plan for your meeting.
And by have a plan, what do I mean?
There are so many opportunities at your annual meeting, even if it's a small meeting.
And so I'm fortunate in that I am a hematologist.
And so my major meeting is the American Society of Hematology.
But I'm also an aphoresis doc.
I do research in aphoresis.
And so I attend the American Society for Aphoresis Animal Meeting.
And the American Society for Aphoresis Animal Meeting is a great meeting compared to the
American Society of Hematology.
It's so much smaller.
And there are concurrent sessions, but not too many.
And so it's a really great mix.
So definitely plan to go and then have a plan based on the kind of meeting you're going
to be at.
So perhaps you have a huge meeting like I have at the American Society of Hematology.
And it's going to be so much going on and so many opportunities to meet with different
reps or different reps of different industries, things like that.
But definitely sit down and create a plan.
Have a plan.
What do you want to get out of your meeting?
And in your plan, think about, OK, if you're going to present a poster or you're presenting
an oral abstract, well, you definitely want to make plans to be there at the right time.
Make sure you know about all information related to being a speaker, how to make sure you're
uploading your talk in due time.
So have a plan for your speaking presentation, whatever other presentation you have.
But also have a plan for who you want to connect with at this meeting, who are old friends
that you want to connect with, who are new friends that you need to meet, who are speakers
that are particularly interesting that you want to connect with, who are new collaborators
that you possibly might want to connect with.
So have a plan.
Have a plan for your meeting.
You know, honestly, when I had young children at home below the age of five, sometimes my
plan was to go to the meeting and sleep.
And so all the events people were talking about that started at 8 p.m., 9 p.m. was like,
I'm so sorry.
I'm here to catch up on sleep.
And so I'm going to do the rest of the meeting during the day, but this 9 p.m. event, I'm
not going to be part of.
And that's OK.
I'm going to have a season of my life.
And that was what I chose to do.
And so having a plan allowed me not to on the spot trying to be making decisions about whether
I attend a 9 p.m. event or not.
I was just not going to do it because part of my plan was catching up on sleep.
Yes.
So just have a plan.
And there's different seasons of your life.
And sometimes you go to meetings to do different things.
OK, so have a plan.
Number three is create a schedule.
And invariably for me, as we're coming up to our annual meeting, I'll get emails from
people requesting times to meet and they'll say, oh, can I meet with you on Saturday at
7 p.m.?
And what's interesting is that there are always going to be things happening or happening
at once.
And I just I just recall that I scheduled something that's happening that's happening
and coinciding with something else.
So anyway, what I'm saying is that there are always events every night.
Right.
So our annual meeting is a 40 meeting.
It's Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday.
And it's four night meeting.
And so there are always going to be events happening, especially during the weekend nights.
And so when people are like, oh, can you meet with me on this day or can you meet with me
on this day?
I'm like, I haven't made my plan yet.
I can't tell you yet.
I have you know, I need to sit down and prioritize.
But you definitely want to create a schedule because there will definitely be conflicts.
There'll be different things that you have to choose one over another and it will be
OK.
And there'll be some days that you'll say, you know what, I'm just not going to do anything
this evening.
I'm OK, too.
But definitely create a schedule so that you are in control of your annual meeting experience.
Now, the biggest benefit of creating a schedule is your ability to decide not to go with the
schedule.
Right.
So the planning is the key, not necessarily the actual plan.
The fact that you work and figure out all the things that are most important to you
is actually more relevant than the actual plan that you make because you have a schedule.
You want you want to have you reserve the right to change your schedule if some other
opportunity becomes more interesting that you are able to go on, they are able to take
advantage of.
So you definitely want to have a schedule, but you want to hold your schedule lightly.
You want to be free to change things on the schedule if it makes sense for you.
So definitely create a schedule knowing that you are the boss of the schedule and the schedule
is not the boss of you.
OK.
Number four is that you should meet old friends.
Oh, one of the most amazing things for me is to go to meetings and meet people that
I have not seen in years.
Even people I saw the last year, there's some people you don't talk to except at the
annual meeting.
And it is so awesome just to make those connections and to reconnect.
And one of the things it's so I mean, it's just awesome to meet your friends no matter
where where you find them.
And especially at the annual meeting.
But also it reminds you of how fast your network is.
You have got a vast network.
Can I just say it again?
You've got a vast network.
You went to medical school.
If your medical school was and mine was not even a huge medical school, I had at least
like 100 classmates.
I think it was 100 classmates.
But you know, you know, 100 people and you knew them well because you were in different
small groups with them.
You were in different big classes with them.
You know, 100 people.
And then you go to residency.
And for me, I was an internist.
I did an internal medicine residency that that was 40 people in my class.
And that's not counting the class below and the class above.
So if we had 40 each year of the three year residency, that's 120 people that I was connected
with in some way, shape or form.
Fellowship was a much smaller group, but it was still four of us per class.
And that's 12 people that you really got to know over the course of your fellowship.
And then that's not even counting the faculty you interacted with, the staff that you interacted
with.
It was a vast network.
And meeting old friends reminds you of the vastness of your network and the amazingness
of your network.
So powerful, so important, so critical that you reconnect.
And okay, you've had a couple of hundred people that you've met over the course of your training
or your career.
And it doesn't mean that you know all of them well.
But even when you recognize someone just even like as someone you haven't connected with
in a while, there's still a value in that connection, you know, especially when you
meet at an annual meeting where there's so many people you don't know.
The people you do know, you are able to connect with in a special way and it can help you
rekindle old relationships.
It can help you establish new collaborations, definitely helps you catch up to people.
And it is a really great way of just reconnecting with your network.
Another thing it does, and that's number five, is it helps you make new friends.
So you make new friends and you know there are different strategies for networking at
meetings.
My favorite strategy is just meet the friend of the friend.
And so it's easier because it's already someone you know and have a connection with and they're
with someone else that they'll point out, they'll turn around and say, well, have you
met?
And if they don't, then you'll say, oh, who's this with you?
And they can introduce you.
And that feels like a more organic and more laid back, chill and natural way to expand
your network, the friend of a friend, right?
It's the connection of a connection, which is so helpful to do and so much easier than
the cold calling that you have to do when you go introduce yourself to someone and say,
well, I am this person from this institution, right?
You still do that at poster sessions where you meet presenters and you ask questions.
But the connection is different when somebody you already know connects you to somebody
else.
There's already kind of an established, a shared bond, a shared commonality that you're
able to exploit that allows you then to, every time you meet this new person again, trace
the connection back to a common mutual friend.
And so I love the opportunity to meet old friends, especially because it also gives
me an opportunity to make new ones that are connected to these old friends.
And so meetings are an opportunity to expand your network.
And you can do it in a way that's organic, feels natural, even to the most introverted
of introverts.
So definitely make new friends.
And that's number five.
Number six.
So I'm going to say up until now, I have not said anything about the actual meeting or
learning anything.
And I will tell you that I used to think that going to a meeting was about learning things.
And it still is.
I'm not taking away the learning aspect of it.
But the connections actually may be more important than the learning of the new things.
Because to be honest, you can learn new things at any time.
But an actual in-person event, and yes, please opt for the in-person option if you can, those
are just so much more electric and amazing.
And so definitely, definitely exploit the opportunities to meet with people in person.
But then think also about what opportunities the annual meeting brings as a place of innovative,
cutting edge things that are evolving and that are changing in your field.
And so flip through the abstract book from beginning to end and find things that are
exciting and interesting and star them to go look at them.
And it may be that you are able to attend the talk or you are able to go to the poster
session and connect with the authors specifically.
But even if you're not, flipping through the abstract book allows you to just get a good
sense of everything.
And maybe it's not an abstract book anymore.
Maybe it's an online resource, whatever it is.
Make sure you go through and just get a sense of what projects are being done, what is on
the cutting edge of research in your field.
But also it helps you think about strategies that other people are using.
And you're thinking, oh, this is interesting.
They did this in this rare disease.
How can I apply it to my rare disease?
And so it's also an opportunity to really think strategically about how people are doing
their science.
Now, you're not there to copy anybody's science, or at least I hope you're not.
But it's really an opportunity to think creatively about your own work.
Because again, a lot of innovation and originality is not really totally innovative.
It's really applying something that's been applied elsewhere into a new field.
And so that's one thing that as you review and see what work other people are doing,
it helps you think about, okay, this is interesting.
They did this kind of study in this area.
How can I apply it to my area, my field of study?
So definitely look through the abstract book because it helps you figure out what lectures
you do want to attend, and it also helps you figure out, well, even if you don't attend
the lectures, how can you kind of benefit from what people are already doing or what
people have already presented?
All right.
Number seven is attend lectures strategically.
When I first started attending meetings, I was trying to get to as many lectures as I
could.
And of course, I was frustrated because I didn't make it to most of them.
And then I would be on my way to one meeting and I would run into somebody else who was
going elsewhere and I really wanted to hang with this person for at least a little bit.
So I was like, okay, I'll ditch this lecture.
So it was just, I didn't have a good plan.
But I also recognized that there were more lectures to attend than I was going to have
time to attend.
And so you want to attend lectures strategically.
You do want to make the most out of the CME, you know, the CME abundance that you're experiencing
as part of being at the meeting, but you don't have to go to lectures from morning till night.
Don't do that.
Attend lectures strategically.
Think about as you've gone through the abstract book, what are the lectures that you really,
really want to be at?
Or what are the education sessions that are really going to be most helpful to you?
Or what are the abstract sessions that you really want to go and really sit and think
or hear in detail what their methodology was, because these are some of those methodologies
that you may be, you know, applying to your own research.
So you want to be strategic.
You don't want to go to just everything.
And you don't want to skimp out on any, on any lectures at all.
I've definitely done both extremes.
I've tried to go to too many.
And then sometimes I haven't gone to enough.
I remember one meeting at the end of it, I looked and I was like, wait a minute, what,
which, which lectures can I claim CME credit for?
And I recognized that I had barely gone to a single lecture that I could claim CME credit
for.
Because what's interesting is that while there are many lectures and many opportunities to
listen to speakers present, not all of them will give you CME.
And it's okay.
I hope that the annual meeting is not your primary strategy for getting CME.
Please make CME getting part of your weekly strategy.
Go to your weekly conferences that are CME conferences and definitely just build that
over time.
If you need to catch up on CME, sure, your annual conference may be the way to do it.
But for the most part, recognize that you're going to go to some lectures or some talks
that are not CME and it's okay, because you're not there necessarily for the CME, which you
can get in different places, but you're really there to gain some insight and maybe even
speak to the speaker.
And those are things that that are helpful.
So you want to attend lectures, but you want to do it strategically.
You don't necessarily want to make the whole meeting about attending lectures.
All right.
So those are seven ways to make the most of your annual meeting.
I said number one is please have a plan to go figure out a way to make it there.
Number two, have a plan for the meeting and decide what you really want to get out of
the meeting.
Number three, create a schedule, knowing that there will be conflicts and it will be okay.
Before you want to meet old friends because it's so awesome to meet old friends and through
your old friends you want to do number five, which is make new friends.
Number six, you want to make sure you go through the abstract book so that you know what are
the big things that are being presented this year.
And you also want to attend lectures strategically.
Now I'm just reminded that as part of attending lectures strategically, one advice I've been
given in the past is to make sure to attend all the plenary talks.
I have mixed feelings about that because as a hematologist I am not a malignant hematologist.
In some years a lot of the talks are all focused on malignant hematology and sometimes I think
I don't want to really go to a malignant hematology talk.
So I haven't always felt like the plenary sessions are specifically tailored to me,
but I think it's a good idea.
You want to go to the talks that are kind of like considered the highest quality rate.
The plenary session is like the best of the best of the talks that have been presented
that year.
And so even if the subject matter may not be that helpful to you, you also want to get
a sense of what does it take to be a plenary abstract session and definitely attending
one will give you a sense of that.
All right.
So that's all I got to share with you this episode, reminding you that we do have another
webinar coming up on December 20th at noon and that is about what to do when you have
no mentor.
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All right.
It's been a pleasure talking with you today.
I want to thank you so much for tuning in.
I look forward to talking with you again the next time.
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