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I'm here today with James Harris and for anybody who's worked with reptiles or

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amphibians in Europe that's a very familiar name because James has been

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all around Mediterranean mostly I guess right and mostly mostly collecting

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reptiles amphibians lizards snakes and now they're parasites as well and

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writing a lot of papers about them I've tried to find how many papers you've

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written but you know one source is like over a hundred the other is like 316 any

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idea how many yeah see it's probably over 300 by now if you can't hear okay

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there's a lot of small notes in I am really small bits and pieces and get

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together but yeah it's it's I mean if you think I've been doing it well I think

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the first time I went to Morocco was in 94 uh-huh maybe maybe 95 that sort of

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time so it's quite a long time now it's a bit scary even big I was being yeah

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and that's so mostly more yeah the I went the first herping trip I did was

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tomorrow I went my PhD supervisor as fresh PhD student I didn't actually

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really enjoy it that much is a surprising thing and what it was I lost my luggage

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okay and at least my luggage never turned out so that was a bit bit tough because I

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had to do the whole trip wearing the same clothes and this was came from me

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yes yes that even in those days there weren't even direct flights to southern

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Morocco so I had we flew to Gibraltar and change planes in Gibraltar with

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that wagged ear and yeah my luggage never turned up and that had not

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something equipment in it which was annoying I didn't have it so we had to

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run around trying to get in particular alcohol was the complicated one is of

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course we take genetic samples mostly what I work on and we didn't have any

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alcohol and it's quite difficult especially in those days particularly

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difficult you wander around pharmacists in Morocco saying just me large

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quantities of alcohol and and people look at you very nervously but anyway I

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think it was more just a stress I hadn't been anywhere like that before people

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constantly you know trying to talk to you every time you stopped you

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immediately got people trying to sell you things I found it more stressful

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than I expected so I went on the backups quite happy to to get out of it I mean I

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enjoyed yeah it wasn't it was it was stressful and so yeah it's quite funny

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that I've been 20 or 30 times since then yeah I was about to say how many times

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have you been but pretty much every year the bus in every ends up for code so

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from part from 2000 I started going back in 2000 so I went first as a PHD student

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in 2000 I already have my my PhD so I actually wait with the PhD student and

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between and yeah since 2000 until now the only years we go with the two years

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of COVID and every now and so I mean we're working in Portugal so it's very

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convenient destination take students because you can drive there in one day

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early in the morning just drive down get the ferry be in Morocco by evening and

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it's the right sort of level of difficulty for students to get an idea

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whether they enjoy football you know it's it's not easy I mean it's Morocco

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it's it's certainly not just crossing the border into Spain but it's not so

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you can you can do things relatively and we can drive down to everything in the

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back of the car take our tents and our cooking equipment and things you need so

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it's really been very very handy as a place to train students and now I've got

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contacts there I mean they started off as just people at university talked to

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but I've been working some of them now for quite a few years so it's really

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worked very well yeah no I've had the pleasure of going to the field with you

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so yeah it's great I love Morocco also not just because it's convenient but it

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was also one of the more beautiful countries you can visit in North Africa

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yeah it's there's not many places that in such a short time for Mediterranean

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type landscapes through really high mountains and then down the other side

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proper first dummy desert yeah hard-core desert so to see all of that period

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yes yeah it is and in 2005 you said you went there yeah so I mean most of the

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work we've done is yes it's essentially collecting samples for genetic

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analysis usually we've got like a target group so we might be working on a

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particular lizard that we think is is more than one species mm-hmm and that's

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our main focus but of course you collect other things as you go along so I mean

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as an example like snakes you don't go somewhere and just catch 30 snakes it's

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never fair but if you go to Morocco 30 times then obviously each time you catch

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one or two and particularly tend to find dead ones unfortunately she catch road

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kills and then suddenly after what he looked back and said what did be

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collection and now we can we never would have thought to look at initially so so

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yeah there's always the target species that we're particularly looking for and

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then there's just places where you just stop and do this yeah and it's a lot of

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driving around right I mean it's you sit in the car you drive around and have

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people get tired so you say oh let's just stop here this nice we might see

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something interesting it's just and and so that that does happen and on that

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particular trip because this is quite an early trip for me so then he'd be let's

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say five or six times I still wasn't that experienced and I was with some

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other herpetologist from here so gal can't it there those Spanish

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herpetologist who traveled a lot with me and also and a grader yeah I should get

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yes yes he kept saying I'm not sure if you like this and they call us has who

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did his PhD with snakes and in particular with with Portuguese Vipers

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so he's very interested in in Vipers but the Portuguese one in particular is

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interesting this is a very small snake it's it's maybe 30 centimeters so it's

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it's a pretty small fairly innocuous one and so in Morocco with a great team of

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herpetologists so so what's it like and we just you know get an idea you're

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driving around it's hot I imagine yeah of course I mean in particular me I should

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get further south obviously gets hot and this particular day we just I mean we

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were driving through more Eastern Morocco so out towards Algerian side and

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we thought we'd just stop and stretch our legs and never walk around see what we saw

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and it was a very steep piece of habitat and sort of rocky dead so mostly

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mostly open so we were just sort of walking just seeing seeing what we might

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find and basically I stopped take a pee behind very large rock and I saw

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secluded spot to go has that and and you know you look down see where you're

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pointing and there was a very large snake in a crevice down there and and now

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this point I mean I my PC was on lizards not snakes so I've had less experience

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in handling large snakes back there so my immediate reaction so I better call

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over some some assistance for this so Miguel was closer so I shout to me I

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said me I'll get I'll come and have a look at this and and then explained him

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no he was the snake on the and Miguel Miguel saw this very large in chill

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that's that's what in those days was called mad review so it's a very large

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poison snake yes and he's very yes and see a live live one like that was was a

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real pleasure so we saw on a we need we need to call

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Zechariah so for this because he's got the experience handling vipers and he's

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it's it's a thing so so we called Zechariah sober and I'm gonna say like

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that's well to maybe me to 20 see big and and poisonous snake so they call us

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of course but John is is not I mean they're basically biking gloves stick

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thinking on the gloves so if you get bitten and protected and but by the

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song obviously people moving around the state to realize that there's there's

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people about so it slides off into a into a crevice but second second gets a

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good look he's like oh yeah I really I really want to catch this so let's let's

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go away for a few hours this will be its you know it's its home territory let's

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let's go off look around in other areas but let's come back here in a couple of hours

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mmm and see so so we went off and a couple hours later we come back and

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we're all sort of you know spread out over the bitter hillside looking to see

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if if we can find it and then suddenly Miguel's sort of shout how I've seen it

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here it's here and it's a really era said was really steep incline and the

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girls standing up above us and and there and myself and Miguel tries to and the

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other thing I suppose I should mention is when we catch lizards most of the

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time we carry fishing rods me sound like strange thing to do in the desert but

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you put a small noose on the end of the fishing rod and it's an ideal way just

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over the head of the lizard and it's very hard technique for catching this so

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Miguel's got a fishing rod so he sees the snake and snake of course is scared

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and starts heading back towards its its crevice so Miguel tries to get the

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fishing rod under the snake stop and getting and pretty much at exactly the

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same moment falls if this steep and you did so it gets the fishing rod under the

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snake and basically flicks the snake up into the air and then it proceeds to

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fall down the mountainside in a classic sort of comedic so boom ah ah he's fully

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done down the mountain so Carlos is at the other distance really wants to catch

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his snake so he's just running towards and shouting catch the snake catch the

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snake and at this point I look at Anna and she's gone like why and she hadn't

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really mentioned before because she also works with this that she really really

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is nervous about snakes and having a sort of meter and a half long venom snake

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flying towards you and obviously at this stage in an extremely angry state is

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enough to to make anyone go wide so she's just standing there petrified

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basically and look on her face I mean she was just a ghost and and I'm not

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much better because I just don't have experience in catching flying snake

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lion so so both of us are just standing there and see Carlos just comes pounding

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across the mountainside which it's like a mountain goat that just and he finally

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just throws himself on it and I mean really that that what was amazing is

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that look on his face because he's used to handling the little 30 centimeter

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yeah and he was just so these holding this huge viper super rare vibrate

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the other course is lying at the bottom of the hill so he's ripped his trousers he's totally down

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yeah it's all rocks yeah it's all rocks it's like and he really fell he really

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just fell down and so if he really took a beating and then the funniest thing

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what said of course biologists are then going to take photographs we can take

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samples and we took photos and and so of course most things photos of say Carlos

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and Miguel holding a snake and then people like come on you've got to have a photo

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taken with the snake because after all you know and it's still like you know

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hearts obviously beating like crazy I don't really want to even touch it but

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so they've got a picture with with Anna holding the snake although in fact

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so cause is probably still holding and correct other people are there and they

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were asked to send some photographs for publication in some sort of natural

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history type journals and magazines Portuguese and it was the photo Anna

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holding the snake so this is published photograph of Anna extremely nervous

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but it was very like saying and but yeah those are the sort of experiences that

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that everyone enjoys I mean after after after poor Miguel he was really beaten up

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as well so it was like one of those days you know we were close to ending up taking

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the hospital or something really you really just fell with it and it was a

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good day it's a good thing no I know if you find one of those your trip is good

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right I mean that's a super rare snake and I find a big one yeah and a snake

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like that could be like 20 years old it's amazing so you think all of that

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time it's been out there on that hillside yeah yeah beautiful to find

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very pretty you really yes of course of course we take us two drops of blood

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analysis tip the tail and those tips those next go yeah that's one of the

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great things about genetic sampling mostly is that we don't need to kill an

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awesome that's nice you can spend your time out in the field you can get

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excited about finding things actually that macro every on red just they just

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they just had to catch you don't turn up in collections because you know Jim see

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a lot man I've seen far more dead ones really yeah yeah yeah only big yes

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certainly not not Colin that's the first big dangerous see you see also them

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now just a classic I don't know what people would normally consider them as

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sort of Indian cobras yeah the ones that that rear up and and open up now that's

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a serious cover as only one species of cobra and you're a cobra that's and

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that's that one you see but only in the far south so in the rest of Morocco in

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the north in terms of big venom snakes the only one you're gonna bump into is

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abysmal a bit and yeah it's a feature fun snake and I would eat the seal

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fantastic yeah it's a bad for his a girl's he did his picture book she has

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nice make he probably got his own pictures and in other places but yes

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that particular one it was fun to see other because she has she gets nervous

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handling any in Morocco there's also another snake which again used to be a

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cool type lot it looks more like an earth yeah really really tight and that's

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about the only snakes she doesn't really like had me then so water snakes on

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that tricks of jury yeah totally harmless innocuous small snake even

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those she's a little bit and then this is a big one but also it makes me think

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you know looking back at some of these old stories makes me realize how we've

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progressed to herpetologist going to Morocco being many times with her and

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so you get that gal be blinds they post and she were we were much more amateurish

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there you know cuz it's close to 20 years ago and but now far more people

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experience myself included yeah but in AI I still remember that it was the first

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big venomous snake going to be in Morocco and it was quite an experience

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right and Morocco has changed quite a lot as well I imagine yeah the the

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particularly the roads is something you notice there used to be almost no

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highways just a little bit down the coast and so driving down to a cash or

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something took days and and you saw everything you know you saw people

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hanging outside of buses dozens of people on tractors cars driving lights

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which was quite quite no and whereas now he basically European style I weigh

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the way down to a good deal so if you stick to the main roads yeah

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Morocco driving yeah it's a breeze super easy if you go out to the mountains you

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can still wonder down some dirt tracks yeah because you spend most of your

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time also in high up in mountains right yeah certainly that the high mountains

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places that there's a lot of unknowns there because people don't go so often

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so there's a lot of alpine species which are known only from one or two places

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that are easy to get you know there's a classic place who kind of dead which is

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both a ski resort and they have some international telescopes there there's

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of course I mountains clear skies not much light pollution and so they've

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there for example there's a nice road right up high into the mountains and

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everyone goes there so the mountain lizard species generally then them from

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this kind of place almost nowhere else so if you're interested in if it's

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actually more than one species or just how much variation there is then you

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need to go there of course and again I went there on my very first trip to

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Morocco and during my PhD but also you need to go to the other mountains where

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there aren't ski resorts and therefore there are no place and you end up just

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hiking a lot yeah and the thing is once you've done a few trips you start to

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think that driving up mountainous tracks and crossing quite difficult terrain

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is quite easy so on a on a late trip we went and as it happened there's a

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conference scene in Marrakesh as well so we thought this is really will will not

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only go to Morocco do something and take a bunch of students to get some

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experience but we'll go to the conference as well the agent they can

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get experience on that so we took more students than we normally okay and we

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were gonna go up a particular mountain that we were looking for to catch these

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high mountain lizards called Andrianski's the very pretty little lizard I've been

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working on a lot but after after a few days already going down I'm sure the

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students will be able to cope with a really high mountain trip was it the

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students or was the situation or no I think it's just they it's just it's just

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hard I mean a lot of students haven't and this is probably a sad thing even a

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university students or biology students they haven't been out in the field much

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so they don't know what it's like so you know when I say camping you stop

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somewhere and you say we'll put our tent here and sleep and and people come to

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you and say well where's the bathroom yeah and you say well you see that bush

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over there that's a nice looking bush I'd use that one if I was you and and of

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course there's always a few things you can amuse yourself with as you all know

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working a lot with scorpions and scorpions are quite fun to see out in

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these places because you'd be go out at night with the blue light they shine in a

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really unexpected way the first time I saw it I was I was definitely impressed

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it's not what you think a scorpion will do in fact I still wouldn't know why they

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do it it's a very unusual feature but it's quite striking so it's quite fun

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for the students you count you camp out you say alright let's set up our tents

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let's you know we're sitting around getting our food ready and then you say

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oh come and have a look at this is it gets dark and you take your your your

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dark light and shine it around there are lots of scorpions in these places so

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sooner or later you're gonna see a very very bright scorpion and then of course

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all the students start to panic because they think somehow scorpions are gonna

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wander into their tents at night so so on this particular trip I had an

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experienced post-op with me Daniel Salvi, Daniel had a lot of work with me in Morocco and we

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said alright let's let's split up because we've actually got this trip we

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had so many people we had two cars and he said alright I will take the other

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experienced people and some of the PhD students I'll go up mountain looking

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particularly and you take students who have no experience or very little and

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we'll just do a really small what I thought was a really really small hike

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and on a I wouldn't like to call it some of the hills right and there were some

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species that we were interested in finding if we could so I thought this would be nice

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see we'll just we'll just do it literally camp get up the next day hike

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for two three hours get to the place nice see if we find anything in a few

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hours hike this should be really nice but as I said I was taking only the

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inexperienced few people so you know we camped I showed them scorpions with all

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kind of fun and then the next morning I said all right make sure you've all got

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plenty of water so you know carry everyone's got to carry a couple of

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liters of water with you it's hard for the open territory and we we start

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hiking up there and and again I pick this as an easy but again perhaps well

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then I've got nothing I'd misjudged how much experience I have in because for a

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lot of people when you say you're hiking again it's not trails it's yeah it's

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climbing through bushes and when there's a big rock to go round it or over it

255
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however you're going to do it it's you get going track sometimes in places but

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it's it's not what many people think of it even as hike because they're used to

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hiking on very easy trails which are marked yeah not just across Stanford

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yeah and so after after a couple of hours I checked them and so and I looked

259
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and a lot of people had no water left already oh all right and I was like you

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do realize that you know got the water that we all brought we all brought a

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couple of liters if you can't call your water now there is no more water that's

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just how it goes and and they were like oh yeah we were hiked on a little bit

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and we got to the place by the time I got there I was just couldn't really look for lizards

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yeah and and Danny and one is it one of the girls said I can't I can't walk any

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further and I was like well what do you want me to do you know I'm I'm not gonna

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carry you and I assure you if I leave you here see if we're not going to go

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well so so I mean it's astonishing to me sometimes that people I mean a can't

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walk what's really a more than two or three hours and be then then just have

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no idea that you know you ration your water don't just sit down and say I

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can't walk and we really what they thought I'm gonna do I had no idea

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fortunately I said my waters I've still got some of my water you can get some of

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my hold and I was oh god I'm glad I'd take these guys up high enough to do is

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they would have just done and we saw stagger back to the fact well at least

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is going down right I mean this should be able to manage that so but by then of

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course you know they're all absolutely dying back in the play and we get there

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and and there's a like a roadside little place with the kids sell stuff and say

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it's they haven't got but they they've got a few things to drink and one of

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the things that happens Coca-Cola it's Morocco you can't can't get a cold beer

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and so people get in the car they're first and so they start drinking and

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young lad in front seat car just takes a large bottle of Coca-Cola and starts

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drugging just like blood blood blood blood blood I thought Alex it's just

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kind of weird behavior but he just blood blood blood and then I looked at it and

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he just literally vomited into the wind we're fitting in the car just like

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that's the windscreen of the car and then glass back over pretty so we're all

285
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just like so cool a lot I mean I had to be stomach for very long but so well

286
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even so we're we're we're all a bit sort of like it's like okay get him out of

287
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the car you know it so we try we sitting down by the side of the road

288
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nothing well I say these kids are really struggling I mean you know I I thought

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it's just um yeah he's moaning yeah but so the the guy sitting by the side of

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course the local Moroccan kids in selling their stuff from their little

291
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store but some the road will come over to have a look because they're all quite

292
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excited about it's not often you see someone bomb it into the window over the

293
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car from the inside and and one of them one of the small boys comes up and he

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takes him some herbs or something from inside the road and he's clearly

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indicating that this is something you should sniff or mean it do something we

296
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of course the guy on the side there speak anything that we can but it's very clear

297
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that it's an indication that someone who's you know fainted or something

298
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should write this and you sniff it in so yeah exactly that concept so one of the

299
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students obviously also understands this and he and he takes the smelling stuff

300
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smelly plant whenever he wants and and holds it up towards the nose student who

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just vomited everywhere and the students vomited actually using it so he acts like

302
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he's gonna bite the other person's such like snapping at the hand really it was

303
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just bizarre wow he was really out of it he was really out and then Joanne Meyer

304
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the students with her and you know yes he says he looks at I mean you know I'm

305
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now thinking oh my god this guy's really really lost it completely and Joanne

306
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looked at me and said do you think I should give him a massage

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I don't know what happened to this kid but he's completely lost it so we're

308
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like okay I mean I said no it was like dehydration or something worse or what

309
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happened so we we said after a while he's just sitting there calmly I said

310
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well I seen windows we'll have to just let's get out of here let's get to a

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place a tower there's a hotel or something yeah load up with water maybe

312
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go to a pharmacist and get some salts and stuff in case it's some sort of

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dehydration yeah and started off just sitting in the car and the straight away

314
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his phone were yeah so he picks up the phone and and he starts talking and it's

315
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absolutely British it's just it's not it's not doesn't make any sense really I

316
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mean it's complete she was like that half random sentences that didn't make

317
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any sense and then there'd be a pause say something else for a little fight and

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the strangest thing was exactly his parents who called for the house because

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we didn't know we didn't know who was calling us but they must have been

320
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thinking because has absolutely no and then he's slow and put the phone away

321
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we were like that was weird but yeah I mean there I mean I suppose the bright

322
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side of the story was that we went to a you know a small motel next time and we

323
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gave him some salt water and he laid out 24 hours 24 okay okay it took a long

324
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time to get better but then it was fine and he totally recovered yeah I mean I

325
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guess he actually did manage to dehydrate and we unexpected yeah it just

326
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goes on servers yeah yeah so and the reaction was in and then the worst thing

327
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of course we clean the car as you do yeah at least in the way why do baby

328
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wipes because we always have but what we forgot is that we just sort of cleaned

329
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up and look fine and then two days later somebody opened the glove compartment

330
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and it was one of these sort of plastic ones sort of cup shape at the bottom so

331
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basically what had rolled down the windscreen and actually just boat in there

332
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was still there so we had these five or six day old sticky bottom to the

333
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:58,320
club compartment like a bottle of coke or coke vomit yeah it's amazing how it

334
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:02,120
looked back you know it's amazing how much you know a liter or two of coke

335
00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:06,320
hitting windscreen and bouncing back into the car are you can soak while

336
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:12,320
I'll be touching the cloth. Also yeah I mean we're kids so that was and that was I

337
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:16,040
know I wasn't really sure to think about so well I'm glad I didn't take on the

338
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:23,320
difficult hike yeah or maybe my difficult hikes now are really difficult even a

339
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:30,440
media hike is is is too much so yeah that was that was an unusual day we

340
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:36,640
haven't had anyone have to be hospitalized. I smacked a couple of

341
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:41,920
fingers I've still got some scars somebody dropped a rock on my hair and took a few

342
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:46,240
close shapes but I think that was probably the closest I've been to thinking right

343
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:52,440
just like doesn't get better. Especially the talking gibberish. Yeah it was just

344
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:56,680
most peculiar and he had no idea afterwards and said like do you remember

345
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:04,200
usually don't know what happened. It just lost. Wow okay and so now with the

346
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:08,480
students you have yeah now now we yes that would be the same three

347
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:12,760
started at least to the first couple of days because they as I said or I think

348
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:16,800
this is also part of the important things never never take a whole bunch of

349
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:21,160
students and be the only experienced person because it's neat if you it's

350
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:25,160
really handy if you've got someone else there to just debate things with because

351
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:30,880
I was like do I need to take him to a hospital if so what if this gets worse

352
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:34,520
what's my dear it's really hard if you're the only person there because

353
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,160
there was no point asking the other students because they were all basically

354
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:46,040
in shock except giving mass. So yeah I was thinking now on I think that's

355
00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:50,240
a balance with fieldwork when we take if you take a card I always try and take

356
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:57,240
one total student who's never been anywhere and then other students got a

357
00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:00,560
little bit of experience and then at least one other sort of well experienced

358
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:04,880
person and then you know you've got people to discuss things with yeah and

359
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:08,800
it means it's just easier if you have some people in the middle as well like

360
00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:13,440
PhD students then then you don't get a sort of divide between the people with

361
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:20,880
no experience and older people like myself. Right. So yeah learn things from

362
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:25,920
tricks even when it's not and myself it's having there. It's fun but it's

363
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:29,880
really I mean you're really out there in the out of this mountain so it could take a day

364
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:34,840
to drive out. Yeah yeah and I mean that's the thing I mean for the high high

365
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:40,200
mountain so that all naturally while we were doing the easy hike and the other

366
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:45,720
people tried to get up the mountain and basically failed because the problem

367
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:49,360
with this particular mountain we were trying to find we just couldn't find a

368
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:58,120
good road even halfway up so you end up parking the car at still let's say a

369
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:02,120
thousand eight and if you want to get up to three and a half thousand meters

370
00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:08,680
that's a really high part and most of the time once you get higher there's no

371
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:12,440
water that's the same coming you can carry sleeping bag you carry food carry

372
00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:18,120
all the stuff you need it's the water that kills you because you need liters of

373
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:26,000
stuff right it's heavy so yeah so I think I don't know if you're the following year

374
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:30,680
after that tree we said we've got it we've got to get up just got to do it so

375
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:34,400
we're just gonna take some more experienced people and and we're gonna

376
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:39,000
each up there and even there it was it was it was quite difficult to just get

377
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,760
up the small dirt tracks to get into the base of the cliff and we kept looking

378
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:48,240
for new dirt tracks get a little bit higher and and we'd really struggled a

379
00:34:48,240 --> 00:34:52,680
bit it's hard to find the tracks we've got a puncture three quarters and so we

380
00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:59,560
had to stop so by the time we we got the car as far as we could go and so right

381
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:03,720
any further we're just gonna have to start hiking from here we were already a

382
00:35:03,720 --> 00:35:08,880
bit stressed because it'd taken longer than oh it's too punctured slowed us down

383
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:14,480
the Jack we have with the car's rubbish you know the usual things so so we get

384
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:20,040
out it's just we can do this and we had a plan early in the mornings just let

385
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:25,680
them by the car and we saw it we can just basically hike up for a day sleep

386
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:30,680
another day up there probably just a morning because it's coming down much

387
00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:36,160
faster so it's not gonna be that we've got to take everything so you got the

388
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:41,600
things to we thought the species might be any species so take calipers to

389
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:47,920
measure it with cheetahs alcohol for the samples and all its bugs you need the

390
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:52,400
cameras and things like that okay okay how we're gonna walk six you're gonna

391
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,360
carry the tanks yes that's okay right you and you are we're carrying water

392
00:35:55,360 --> 00:36:00,520
tons of water oh no problems water yet fine got all the equipment we need yeah

393
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:05,080
ready but we really wanted to get started so we you know we were everyone's

394
00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:09,680
this file and we'd like okay we can all sleep at one time for that short period

395
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:15,320
of time it's gonna be a total squeeze but we can do it and we start and and

396
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:22,960
the the hikes are too bad knows it's a proper trade man probably after we've

397
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:27,920
been hiking four or five hours there was still like a little heart with some

398
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:32,720
shepherd and they were there that people are incredibly nice in those sort of rural places

399
00:36:32,720 --> 00:36:38,720
they are see people coming so they were so far we again not speaking but showing

400
00:36:38,720 --> 00:36:42,080
with their gestures you know do you want to say it needs a bread with us or

401
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:46,240
whatever we're good which we're gonna get up these mountains we're still going

402
00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:53,480
so we yeah very nice rest a little bit as you do and I can we keep hiking keep

403
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:58,480
and you may actually sourced it I mean that that day I keep up mountains is

404
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:02,440
always the killer but you know we've taken experience people this time we

405
00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:08,920
know what we get there and we get pretty high we're not right where we want to be

406
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:13,000
but we could probably be there a couple more hours tomorrow so done the vast

407
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:16,360
majority of the height destroyed ourselves climbing up this mountain

408
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:23,080
we'll sleep and we'll go on so let's let's get all get the tent out I think

409
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:28,300
and then my father who PhD she was working on particular species and she

410
00:37:28,300 --> 00:37:32,080
said all right yeah and we got to say okay where's all the stuff cooking stuff

411
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:37,200
and she said James okay where's the food I don't maybe that maybe that then we're

412
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,360
looking around and then she said no James where's the food and I was like

413
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:47,120
I've got I've got some bad news we brought everything except we forgot to

414
00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:52,600
bring any food and of course my father just doesn't she's just take James it's

415
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:59,000
not funny it's not funny anymore where's the food and I'm like all right so um

416
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:05,440
no we forgot the food so so we with this is the experience people we know it so

417
00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:08,920
I was like well I've got like a packet of sweets in my pocket which you can

418
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:16,160
carry on the way up anyone else got anything and they Daniele says well

419
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:21,400
actually because I'm sure this is gonna be news and and so I as well as all

420
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:25,920
stuff I supposed to carry they also snuck into my bag a bottle of wine and

421
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:31,760
an Italian sausage because I wanted this to be when we get the new species we're

422
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:36,800
gonna have Italian sausage and bottle of wine so I'm like right so basically over

423
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:43,280
the next six what we've got what we've got is like an Italian sausage and like

424
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:54,280
half a packet and and my final cook and I'm vegetarian so so we like well

425
00:38:54,280 --> 00:39:01,680
what can we do thin slice of sausage everybody that's your dinner breakfast thin

426
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:09,080
slice of sausage everybody that's my bread it was quite hard but then so we

427
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:14,600
we we hiked up the next little bit of mountain the next morning and the good

428
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:18,640
news was lo and behold the little lizards were there and then this is

429
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:24,240
about our third trip trying to get up this mountain so we're super happy and

430
00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:28,520
and it was looking for probably is in these feces we still haven't described

431
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:35,880
it but probably is and so Daniele said let's get get the bottle of wine open let's

432
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:39,280
drink that because we found the thing it looks a bit different and we sure it

433
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:43,320
will be something different so so let's celebrate as an act of me when you it

434
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:47,040
you know two and a half thousand meters and you haven't eaten anything a day and a half

435
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:52,200
it's amazing what happened you can really feel I don't think I've ever felt

436
00:39:52,200 --> 00:40:00,680
so drunk quarter of a bottle of wine empty stomach yes so we drank about the

437
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:05,880
wine it's got some slits just we don't need to stay a whole second day hike back

438
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:11,160
down so we managed to we spent that afternoon so in the end it was only two

439
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:17,560
days people eating it wasn't that bad still but yeah experience

440
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:26,200
sabotages take everything with them forget for that yeah so I'd like to say

441
00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:31,280
I've actually improved from the first trip where I flying snake I know what to do

442
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:39,000
to full ability by the egg but no I still kind of important one of those

443
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:47,080
things but yeah so certainly we we've had some fun in rock when was that that

444
00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:51,920
would have been I mean my father was here she she stopped around 2015 so I

445
00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:55,720
think it'll be back 2012 so these probably about ten years between the

446
00:40:55,720 --> 00:41:01,280
first trip at the last but he has I said we carried on and there certainly be

447
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:06,080
well I see you're you're prepared on the call and I'm not so sure I'm supposed to

448
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:09,800
tell stories of you in that was a nice that was a good repair so at one point

449
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:15,080
we were we often don't have quality vehicles here at CBO so we trying to go

450
00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:19,600
off mountains with with a Renault Kangoo basically which which is a big little

451
00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:25,680
car surprise but you can rip the bottom out of it bouncing over big rocks on

452
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:30,240
dirt tracks that nobody sensible would take anything except a four-wheel drive

453
00:41:30,240 --> 00:41:36,360
come on time we were driving and suddenly people away I'm smelling a lot

454
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:41,920
of petrol and we stopped the car and we're on a dirt track obviously not

455
00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:48,120
another cars gonna come by oh I remember we are spin out and and there's petrol

456
00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:53,400
pouring out pouring out of the fuel light and you you got it there with the

457
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,520
pliers and got them and I think we just had to like sell it a board and we'll

458
00:41:56,520 --> 00:42:02,440
sell it yeah oh you had some tape some good tape yeah and we taped it up and we

459
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,680
thought that gets to the next village and in fact he calls all the way back to

460
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:10,880
Portugal it worked very well so I don't think we even told the people here that

461
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:19,400
no I think just thought that's good little repair so are you going here this

462
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:25,160
year yeah let's see I'm not sure I mean I've got a lot of few work this normally

463
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:30,320
let's break it's it's still my preferred time of year and but I have been later in

464
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:35,960
the side it's very hot and we don't need to go in it that hot so I prefer not to

465
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:39,360
and in the autumn sometimes it can be good a lot of people like going in the

466
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:44,600
water and this spring I've got a lot of food work to do here but I have got some

467
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:48,680
new master's students that need their initiation yeah so I think I'm up I

468
00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:54,000
might try and go in in September just even if it's just a short trip just so

469
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:59,320
that they get get their experience it's a more stores let them practice a bit

470
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:04,080
walking up hills before that make sure they make sure they take sensible boots

471
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,560
because I mean you tell people ten times over take sensible boots and they think

472
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:13,640
I bought my tennis shoes I thought that was good shoes like not not exactly no

473
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:18,360
no not the ideal foot you gotta be walking on sharper rocks for two weeks

474
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:24,880
in a row yeah pretty right James thanks a lot that was pleasure

475
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:30,920
I hadn't heard those stories yet so and we I know there's a lot more where that

476
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:33,320
came from there are a few now we look forward to

477
00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:36,840
here to be able to you know recording at the same time yeah yeah I'll let you

478
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:54,960
rest yeah bye you