1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:15,960 In the very first episode of this podcast, I have a Italian biologist called Ignazio 2 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:20,320 Avella who did his bachelor's degree at the University of Naples. 3 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:26,840 He then went on for a master's at the University of Rome working on snakes, which I believe 4 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:33,520 is his first love, and now, well, since 2018, he's been working at the CBO Research Center 5 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:37,320 in Portugal on vipers. 6 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:44,800 And he is a PhD student, but he has already published more than 11 scientific papers, 7 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,440 I think, am I right there? 8 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:54,560 And he has worked in, well, all over Europe, but also in Morocco, Namibia, Mexico, Peru, 9 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:58,160 and he's all over the place chasing snakes. 10 00:00:58,160 --> 00:00:59,160 Welcome, Ignacio. 11 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:00,160 Good to see you. 12 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:01,160 Thank you. 13 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:02,160 Thanks for having me here. 14 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:08,160 Yes, it's 11, but not all of them are peer reviewed, so you know, that you got them. 15 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:10,920 Yeah, different things, different things. 16 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:12,720 But all on snakes, I think, right? 17 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:14,720 Most on snakes, yes, sir. 18 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:15,720 Most on snakes. 19 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:17,760 Every now and then some amphibians on the way. 20 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:18,840 All right, right. 21 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:21,400 And you're doing a PhD now on snake venom. 22 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:28,000 And I mean, a PhD is, you know, it's not fun always. 23 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:31,600 It's a long, hard work. 24 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:32,960 Why venom, man? 25 00:01:32,960 --> 00:01:35,440 What's so important about snake venom? 26 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:36,440 Why venom? 27 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:41,120 Well, let's start with saying that, as you say, snakes are my first law, but also my 28 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:42,120 biggest law. 29 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:45,840 I also like amphibians, I like other things. 30 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:49,520 But I felt like I really wanted to work on snakes for something, as you were saying, 31 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:55,600 because if I need to dedicate myself to a PhD, it better be on snakes. 32 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:57,760 I was wondering, okay, like, what's cool about snakes? 33 00:01:57,760 --> 00:01:59,680 Why am I so driven for them? 34 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:03,920 You know, why are you like, first of all, they're cool in general, but they're beautiful, 35 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:04,920 beautiful colorations. 36 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:08,760 I don't know, you know, there is this kind of passion that many people have for these 37 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,400 so you dream things without legs. 38 00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:14,760 And then, yeah, I was like, yeah, you know what, I think that's what really catches the 39 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:19,000 attention about snakes is their potential, like the harmful potential and so on. 40 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,160 So venom, super cool stuff. 41 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,360 So you think that's because there is a lot of guys like you who are just mad about snakes 42 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,640 and that have trouble saying why? 43 00:02:27,640 --> 00:02:30,640 I mean, I see it, but I... 44 00:02:30,640 --> 00:02:36,000 Yeah, I would say it is probably one of the main reasons, you know, it's like the thrilling 45 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:41,160 of handling something that, you know, well, Doris Keisairo can also kill you, but it's 46 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:46,600 probably one of the main things that can lead, I would say, this passion, this interest towards 47 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:47,600 these animals. 48 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:49,680 Love, they're loved, you know what they say. 49 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:51,960 But it also makes the field work a little bit risky, right? 50 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:56,880 If you're going out into middle of bloody nowhere and you get bitten by a snake, you're 51 00:02:56,880 --> 00:02:57,880 in real trouble. 52 00:02:57,880 --> 00:02:58,880 Yes, sir. 53 00:02:58,880 --> 00:02:59,880 Yes, sir. 54 00:02:59,880 --> 00:03:00,880 Indeed, indeed. 55 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:04,880 Also, they have the tendency to be in very remote places usually, whether it be in the 56 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:09,560 jungle or in the desert, you know, where you are pretty bloody far away from hospitals or 57 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:10,560 antivenoms. 58 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:14,080 So I keep an eye on those 100%. 59 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:16,760 And this year you went to Guiana? 60 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:17,760 Yes, yes. 61 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:18,760 Last summer, right? 62 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:19,760 It was last summer, I think. 63 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:20,760 Yeah, that's exactly, exactly. 64 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:21,760 It was from June to August. 65 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:22,760 It was a fantastic experience. 66 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:31,680 I had the chance to go there for a social science project. 67 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:32,680 You just go there. 68 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:37,600 I was there as a volunteer, volunteering to be fair, and my aim, what I had to do there 69 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,320 was basically bring students into the jungle. 70 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:45,440 It was with Operation Wallacea, a very nice organization that does this kind of science. 71 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:48,760 You just bring students into the jungle, you show them the animals, you tell them a couple 72 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:51,120 of things about whatever is here around. 73 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:54,000 Of course, Guiana is a fantastic place for wildlife. 74 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:55,440 Yeah, what is it like? 75 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:56,440 What is it like? 76 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:58,640 Is it all jungle, like people imagine? 77 00:03:58,640 --> 00:03:59,640 Or what was it like? 78 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:00,640 Pretty much, yes, yes. 79 00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:05,560 I was shocked when I saw it, you know, when you're landing from the plane and you just 80 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:11,160 see insane amount of green everywhere, canovicoa, gigantic, gigantic canovicoa everywhere. 81 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,080 And actually they told me, yeah, you know what, 80% of the surface of the country is 82 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:15,680 made of primary forest. 83 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:20,000 I don't know if this is totally right, but yeah, I can definitely see 80% of the country 84 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:21,000 being green. 85 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:26,640 And you stay there right in the jungle or were you more like in a town or a city? 86 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:33,800 We were staying actually in a very small village in the north of Guiana, and that is literally 87 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,480 buried in the deep primary and secondary forest. 88 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:37,480 It was fantastic. 89 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:41,480 So amazing chances to see insane amount of wildlife definitely has been the best jungle 90 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:42,480 I've seen so far. 91 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:46,720 I'd say they've been around for a while, but it has really been impressive. 92 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:53,360 And you were there with a big group of students then staying in a hotel or in a bunk bed? 93 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:54,360 No, no, no, no. 94 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:55,360 It was a jungle. 95 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:56,360 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 96 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:57,360 No, no, it was not a hotel. 97 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,880 It was a pure experience, pure jungle experience, yes. 98 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:05,120 As I said, we were in this village, so we were living with the local community, you 99 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:07,320 know, with the local people was absolutely great. 100 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,720 You know, they live on, for example, they still hunt with bows and arrows. 101 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:11,720 It's fantastic. 102 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:12,720 Oh, wow. 103 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:13,720 Yeah. 104 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:14,720 So we're cool. 105 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:17,240 We were there, pens and mugs. 106 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,480 That's how we were living on the basis. 107 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:25,800 I mean, also the issues of getting another drinkable water, forgetting your stuff. 108 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:29,680 Yeah, if you wash your clothes, you want to get it dry, but it's the rainforest, you 109 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:30,680 know. 110 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:31,680 It's not like that. 111 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:33,720 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 112 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:34,880 Beautiful. 113 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:37,760 And so you went into the gorgeous jungle there. 114 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:38,760 What happened? 115 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:42,040 I could tell you many stories. 116 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:47,840 Like if we speak to snakes, I have to say it has been absolutely amazing, the fear that 117 00:05:47,840 --> 00:05:52,480 I was going out every single night, you know, for everything, because of course, yeah, you 118 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:53,640 want to show as much as you can. 119 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:57,560 And of course, at night, the jungle is absolutely alive and even a bit overwhelming at some 120 00:05:57,560 --> 00:05:58,560 point. 121 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:02,520 So you were there at the head of like a column of 20 students or something? 122 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:03,520 That's it. 123 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:04,520 Yes, exactly. 124 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:05,520 Exactly. 125 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:07,720 I was taking a bunch of students with me every night, like we were divided into groups, because 126 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:12,320 of course, we're at best, like I would say 60 people, but you cannot take 60 people with 127 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,480 you in the jungle all at the same time, you know. 128 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:19,160 So yeah, we were making smaller groups, let's say eight, nine people every time, and we 129 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:25,120 were going on these transects, you know, these trails that were defined pretty much in the 130 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:29,160 jungle going around a bit, yeah, stopping at everything that was moving. 131 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:34,320 And at night in the jungle, it's amazing because every little thing is moving between emirtebrates, 132 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:40,320 mammals, birds, reptiles, of course, amphibians, you can really see everything. 133 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:44,120 It was amazing that every single night that we went out, of course, I was focusing on 134 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:48,160 the pedophile, but we could find a different species of snake. 135 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:50,920 It was amazing, you know, you never find the same thing. 136 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:53,400 So, you know, you keep the enthusiasm always high. 137 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:57,040 It's not like, oh no, you go around and you always find the same toad on the same trail, 138 00:06:57,040 --> 00:06:59,840 you know, and it's always near. 139 00:06:59,840 --> 00:07:00,840 It was always near. 140 00:07:00,840 --> 00:07:03,240 What was the most amazing thing you saw there? 141 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:09,840 The most amazing thing without any doubts that really made it the best archaeological 142 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,400 night of my life so far has been a bushmaster. 143 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:17,680 But it has been absolutely amazing also the way we found it. 144 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:19,680 Because, you know, I knew it was there. 145 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:21,720 Of course, Guyana is in the range of the species. 146 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,480 It is one of my favorite species, biggest viper in the world. 147 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:27,960 Up to four meters, you know, something like that. 148 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:31,360 And I really, really wanted to see one, but I knew that it is extremely rare. 149 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:34,320 There are people that have looked for it for years and they never had the chance to find 150 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:35,320 it. 151 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:36,320 Right? 152 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:37,320 Right. 153 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:38,320 I knew it was there. 154 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:41,320 I was getting very stressed because I could not find it, you know, walking all those trails, 155 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:43,720 but still I couldn't find it. 156 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:45,920 Do you know where to look for it or something like that? 157 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:51,520 You can look for it, but it's basically, you know, a big, big snake that would be coiled 158 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:52,520 up. 159 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:55,920 It can be in the middle of your trail, exactly, in the middle of your transect. 160 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:59,960 Instead of four days looking for prey to pass, you know, in ambush, it can be under a log, 161 00:07:59,960 --> 00:08:04,880 they eat really like, you know, rotten logs and trees and they just stay there waiting. 162 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,280 And they are very, very nicely camouflaged. 163 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:11,340 So something can be difficult to see even a snake that is running around a house. 164 00:08:11,340 --> 00:08:13,000 And this is a dangerous snake, right? 165 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:14,000 Super dangerous. 166 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:18,920 It's super dangerous because of the size of it, it can inject insane amount of pain. 167 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:20,520 And that's exactly the point of it. 168 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:24,200 And then again, it really occurs in these very remote primary forests. 169 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:28,080 So if you get bitten there before you reach an hospital, you're going to have a hard time. 170 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:30,160 It's going to be very complicated. 171 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:35,000 So isn't that a bit scary going with students who don't know anything? 172 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:36,000 It is. 173 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:37,000 It is of course very scary. 174 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,160 The first thing that I always tell them, guys, don't touch anything. 175 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:41,960 If you see anything, just call me. 176 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:45,800 You know, we try to assess the situation because of course many snakes are not dangerous for 177 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:48,920 you, but you don't know. 178 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:50,120 You guys just don't know. 179 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:51,400 Now let me deal with this. 180 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:55,000 I will just check if it's possible maybe to handle it a bit, you know, to get closer or 181 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:58,440 not, if the situation is safe or not. 182 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:02,080 With the Bushmaster we're just fantastic because it was absolutely unexpected. 183 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:03,080 I was really stressed. 184 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:04,400 I really wanted to see this animal. 185 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:05,400 I knew it was there. 186 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:09,560 You know, the night that it happens, you just don't know. 187 00:09:09,560 --> 00:09:10,560 It just happens. 188 00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:14,360 Had you already given up on seeing it? 189 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:18,640 I was not giving up on seeing it, but I was just thinking, you know what, if it happens, 190 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:19,640 fantastic. 191 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:21,480 If it doesn't, I'm not going to get stressed. 192 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:26,560 I'm not going to ruin my experience just with this kind of anxiety, with this kind of nervousness 193 00:09:26,560 --> 00:09:28,440 that I really need to see this animal. 194 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:30,800 This was super high on your list. 195 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:33,720 This is my top species in my bucket list. 196 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:39,200 After that, you get what I think is called emotional hangover. 197 00:09:39,200 --> 00:09:43,960 You just get this gigantic rush of adrenaline when you finally see it. 198 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:47,760 Your favorite species are unicorns or many other pathologists in the world. 199 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,440 Yeah, I just need to check it. 200 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:52,440 So what happened? 201 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:53,880 You were walking in the jungle and then? 202 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:59,480 I was walking in the jungle, especially the night with a very, very tiny group of students. 203 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:03,960 We were literally four people just going around because it was after a very, very long rainy 204 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:04,960 day. 205 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:05,960 I really wanted to go out. 206 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:09,440 We were a bit tired already, you know, halfway into the expedition. 207 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:10,440 You know what? 208 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:12,840 I feel like this is a nice night to go out. 209 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:17,640 And I go out and I pass in front of this gigantic boulder that is always on the front of course. 210 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:20,400 Nobody's going to move that, right? 211 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:25,400 And I've seen the boulder already for several days, several nights. 212 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:26,400 Same thing here. 213 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:31,080 I always thought that this could be a nice place for a big snake. 214 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:32,720 Always you can find like footprints around. 215 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:37,240 You can find tracks of jaguars because of course there are also jaguars there. 216 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:40,320 Rabbits, opossums, mammals, you know, crawling around. 217 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:45,000 And as always, as I always did, I just look at there, look a bit at the tracks. 218 00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:48,480 Maybe there was a jaguar here, but of course you don't see it. 219 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:52,480 Like every other night I look at it and in the back of my head, literally maybe one wither 220 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,920 away, I was listening to this rattling, right? 221 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:58,720 This little vibration that kind of reminds of a cicada. 222 00:10:58,720 --> 00:10:59,720 All right? 223 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,040 I was saying, yeah, this must be a cicada. 224 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:05,040 There's plenty of them in my vertebrae. 225 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:06,560 Then I stand up, literally. 226 00:11:06,560 --> 00:11:09,880 I turned my head on the other side of the transmit. 227 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:11,560 So the boulder was on the right. 228 00:11:11,560 --> 00:11:18,440 I look on the left after I look at the boulder and my high torch just points on this massive 229 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:19,440 snake. 230 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:21,760 It was Bushmaster indeed. 231 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:23,640 One meter away from me in my back. 232 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:25,120 Yes, on my back. 233 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:26,480 One meter away. 234 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:27,480 Yes. 235 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,280 I had absolutely not seen that. 236 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:30,280 Yeah. 237 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:32,320 Just because I was looking on the other side of the frame. 238 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:36,400 And the guy was just there rattling his tail on the ground, making this vibration, very 239 00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:37,600 high frequency vibration. 240 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:38,840 Very cool. 241 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:42,280 I screamed like a crazy, crazy guy. 242 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:44,560 Like this kind of stuff. 243 00:11:44,560 --> 00:11:46,560 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 244 00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:47,560 Jackpot. 245 00:11:47,560 --> 00:11:48,560 Absolutely. 246 00:11:48,560 --> 00:11:50,680 I mean, and one meter away. 247 00:11:50,680 --> 00:11:51,680 This is a big snake. 248 00:11:51,680 --> 00:11:53,480 It could almost strike you at that distance, right? 249 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:54,480 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 250 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:58,760 I tell you what, like it was one meter away, but the snake itself was one meter and 80, 251 00:11:58,760 --> 00:11:59,760 right? 252 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:00,760 So even taller than me. 253 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:05,240 It's a little bit bigger than the biggest one because they're each four meters. 254 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:07,840 But definitely it was in, you know, long distance. 255 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:10,000 It could have gone for me. 256 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,400 Thank God it's a gentle giant, they call it. 257 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:17,480 Because just how massive it is, you know, is not going to be that aggressive. 258 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:18,960 Absolutely amazing night. 259 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,120 First night on my life so far. 260 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:22,120 Yeah. 261 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:24,360 Hitting the number one on your bucket list, man. 262 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:25,360 How was that? 263 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:27,360 You were frozen for the rest of the night or? 264 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:28,360 Yeah, yeah. 265 00:12:28,360 --> 00:12:30,600 The rest of the week I would say yes. 266 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:34,320 I had one week when I was absolutely high on enthusiasm for this. 267 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:37,160 So what happened when you first saw it? 268 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:38,160 Then what? 269 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:40,160 What did you do? 270 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:44,320 I remember as I told you, like we were four people in total, right? 271 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:49,200 We just standing there in awe and the snake was just, you know, with the head up looking 272 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:50,200 at us. 273 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:51,200 Yeah. 274 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:54,920 And we were just staring at each other for I would say roughly five minutes. 275 00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:56,400 I didn't know what to do after screaming. 276 00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:59,000 I was like, all right, all right. 277 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:04,440 I'm going to spend the next four hours independently from the mosquitoes, from the rain, for everything. 278 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:05,440 It really doesn't matter. 279 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:07,760 I'm going to take pictures of this fantastic animal. 280 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:08,760 Yeah. 281 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:09,760 And that's what I did. 282 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:14,240 I literally spent three hours in the mud in the dead lift litter, scoured the mosquitoes 283 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,360 and just taking pictures of the animals, of this animal. 284 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:18,360 Guess what? 285 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:20,600 I'm not so surprised with even one of those pictures. 286 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:24,960 Not one of those pictures makes really just this beautiful animal. 287 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:25,960 No. 288 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:26,960 Fantastic. 289 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:27,960 Beautiful. 290 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:29,120 But the experience stays, man. 291 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:30,120 The experience. 292 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:31,120 Yes. 293 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:32,120 That's exactly it. 294 00:13:32,120 --> 00:13:33,600 You can take as many pictures as you want. 295 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:35,180 Experience is totally other thing. 296 00:13:35,180 --> 00:13:36,180 So grateful for it. 297 00:13:36,180 --> 00:13:39,920 It was just hitting the jackpot in the most unexpected way. 298 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,920 And your students, how did they respond to this? 299 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:47,560 So you have to know that these students actually didn't know much about snakes. 300 00:13:47,560 --> 00:13:48,560 All right. 301 00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:49,560 Of course they're cool. 302 00:13:49,560 --> 00:13:50,560 So they liked them. 303 00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:54,800 But I really think that the enthusiasm that I was having at the time, they absolutely 304 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:55,800 freaked out with me. 305 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:56,800 It was like, oh, fantastic. 306 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:57,800 We found it. 307 00:13:57,800 --> 00:13:58,800 What's the name of this thing again? 308 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,800 And I'm like, yeah. 309 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:02,800 Yeah. 310 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:06,520 So that pretty much concluded the Giana for you, right? 311 00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:08,160 I mean, that's your number one species. 312 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:09,960 No reason to go back or? 313 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:10,960 100%. 314 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:13,480 No, 100% that was my number one species. 315 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:15,600 But of course there's so much more to be seen. 316 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:17,920 Of course I want to see bigger bushbusters also. 317 00:14:17,920 --> 00:14:19,720 And then I saw Arpy Eagles. 318 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:25,360 I think I saw a Jaguar at some point, just two big green eyes in the night that calls 319 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:26,660 for a big mammal, right? 320 00:14:26,660 --> 00:14:27,660 And some spots. 321 00:14:27,660 --> 00:14:28,660 Could it be in another big cat? 322 00:14:28,660 --> 00:14:29,660 I really don't know. 323 00:14:29,660 --> 00:14:30,660 I'm no mammal specialist. 324 00:14:30,660 --> 00:14:31,660 But yeah. 325 00:14:31,660 --> 00:14:36,000 I've had that experience in the desert in Morocco with some big green eyes, slightly 326 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,920 too high above the path for you to be comfortable with staring. 327 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:40,920 All right. 328 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:44,080 I mean, how was that seeing a Jaguar in the wild? 329 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,440 I mean, that's one of the strongest cats, right? 330 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:48,440 This was pretty crazy. 331 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:49,440 It was pretty crazy. 332 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:53,240 We knew of course there were Jaguars around because there were some little farms and apparently 333 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:59,880 every now and then there is a farm animal disappearing because a big Jaguar maybe goes 334 00:14:59,880 --> 00:15:01,760 there and gets lunch. 335 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:02,760 Yeah. 336 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:06,040 And we were basically sailing on a tiny boat on the river. 337 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:08,400 We were very close to the river there. 338 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:12,520 And at some point we were with the headlamps looking at the canopy goer because every now 339 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:17,560 and then you can find like hanging snakes, boas, three boas and so, or even opossums 340 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:19,960 and night monkeys and such. 341 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:24,880 At some point our lives literally shine on these green eyes. 342 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:29,360 And you could see from the distance of the eyes, it was pretty much this, was a big head, 343 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:30,360 right? 344 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:34,320 And there might have been a big, big head. 345 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:36,480 And there are not really many big animals around there. 346 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:40,400 Like you can have a table here, but it doesn't have spots because we also saw some spots. 347 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:41,400 All right. 348 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:43,280 We saw it for maybe three seconds or four seconds. 349 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:44,280 There it is. 350 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:46,000 And it disappeared in the night. 351 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:51,520 And when it went away, what we could see was like four spots, you know, like yellowish 352 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:52,520 dark spots. 353 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:53,520 Okay. 354 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:54,720 So you really know what it was one. 355 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:56,480 It really, it really was. 356 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:58,960 Everyone said, everyone said the maples signed this. 357 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:01,200 The guys there said this was a Jaguar. 358 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:02,200 This was a Jaguar. 359 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:03,600 And we all shut down. 360 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:07,880 We couldn't speak because of course we want that second to last as long as possible. 361 00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:08,880 They're too smart. 362 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:09,880 They're not like snakes. 363 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:10,880 They don't stay there. 364 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:13,880 You know, they just leave after a while. 365 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:14,880 Awesome. 366 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:18,200 Jill, Jill, now you're back when you see something like that, right? 367 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:19,200 Absolutely. 368 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:20,200 Absolutely. 369 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,200 Not as the Bushmaster though. 370 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:22,200 If you ask me, not as the Bushmaster. 371 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:23,200 Yeah. 372 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:26,960 Well, you're a snake guy and you've been all over the place. 373 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:28,480 So this was, this was recent. 374 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:33,480 So you've already been in a lot of places and, and I mean, jungle is amazing. 375 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:38,160 There's just so many animals, but there was also an incident I think in Namibia. 376 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:42,880 And that was last year, right? 377 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:43,880 It was last year. 378 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:44,880 Yes. 379 00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:45,880 It was last year. 380 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:46,880 Completely different environment, right? 381 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:47,880 Completely different environment. 382 00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:48,880 Yes. 383 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:51,920 You go from the primary forests of South America to Les Artinal. 384 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:52,920 Yeah. 385 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:53,920 How is Namibia? 386 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:54,920 I've never been. 387 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:55,920 How is it to be there? 388 00:16:55,920 --> 00:17:00,400 It's absolutely amazing because you just don't get the three dimensionality of the space 389 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,600 because it just, everything's so flat and so intense. 390 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:07,160 You know, that it's just like you're, you're running into a page, right? 391 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:10,040 Into a picture or something like that. 392 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:11,040 It's crazy. 393 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:12,040 It's crazy. 394 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:13,040 It's absolutely amazing. 395 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:16,520 Also there, like doing field work there, it can be very, very difficult and very tiring 396 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:17,520 because it just- 397 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:18,520 How so? 398 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:19,520 How so? 399 00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:24,040 How, how is, I mean, I presume you are in a four wheel drive driving around and pitching 400 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:25,240 at them every now and then. 401 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:26,240 How does that work? 402 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:27,240 Yeah. 403 00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:28,240 And that's the easy part. 404 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:32,280 You're in the four wheel drive and actually the roads are quite, are quite nice, very 405 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:33,460 well organized and everything. 406 00:17:33,460 --> 00:17:37,480 You can literally cross the savanna without any issues, you know, like flat, flat land 407 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:38,480 and so. 408 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:39,480 Okay. 409 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:43,240 We still got like four broken wheels in two weeks, but it's all right. 410 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:44,240 Yeah. 411 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:48,080 And then we got this very nice, I think it's called book tent or something like that. 412 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:52,320 Well, a tent that was just set on the top of the four wheel drive, right? 413 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,080 Because at night you don't want to be on the floor because of course there will be arenas 414 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:57,080 going around, even layovers. 415 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:58,080 Layover, layover, layover. 416 00:17:58,080 --> 00:17:59,680 Yeah, you got a roof tent. 417 00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:00,680 Nice. 418 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:01,680 Yes. 419 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:02,680 Yes, a roof tent. 420 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:03,680 Exactly. 421 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:04,680 We were on the roof tent. 422 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:05,680 So at night we were just living up there. 423 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:07,280 Super nice experience. 424 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:10,720 But in the day it gets warm so easy and so soon. 425 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:14,680 We were waking up every morning at five because it was just unbearable already. 426 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:15,680 All right. 427 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:16,680 So you went in the whole season. 428 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:17,680 And you were just assembling. 429 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:18,680 Yes. 430 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:19,680 Yes. 431 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:20,680 Yes. 432 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:21,680 It was, it was indeed. 433 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:25,880 So you crawl out of your roof tent and then you go looking for snakes. 434 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:30,920 You go to your roof tent, you close the tent, pack everything in again, then you go. 435 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:32,920 You go for the, for the sampling sites. 436 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:37,000 Of course we knew some people that were telling us, yeah, if you're looking for vipers, you 437 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:38,000 should go there. 438 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,280 If you're looking for other snakes, you should go there. 439 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:43,760 So you were specifically there for vipers. 440 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:45,560 What did you need for these vipers? 441 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:48,520 Just photograph them or what was the goal here? 442 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:55,120 I was specifically there for vipers because of a site project that I'm being part of, 443 00:18:55,120 --> 00:18:58,920 that is being developed by my current supervisor, PhD supervisor. 444 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:03,880 We're going there to sample Amoebian vipers to analyze their venom. 445 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:05,320 Then genetics, follow geography. 446 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:07,240 Basically they are very, very understudied. 447 00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:09,000 There's not really much about them. 448 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:13,000 So it's really important of course to do some amazing fieldwork, see some fantastic animals 449 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,160 and publish some very nice research. 450 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:16,160 Yes. 451 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:20,800 And yeah, we were looking specifically for this very nice, I'm sure you know it, it's 452 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:23,480 the site Winder, I think it's called there. 453 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:25,720 There is a side winding vibrea. 454 00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:30,920 Well, the side winding is usually is a rattlesnake in North America, but there is a true side 455 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:31,920 winding. 456 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:34,080 In Namibia with the same name, they call this very tiny viper. 457 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,520 Yes, not particularly big, but it's just amazing how it goes on the dunes. 458 00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:42,280 And there's no other way to look for it than going there in the morning on the dunes and 459 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:45,240 looking for its tracks, the sand winding tracks. 460 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:51,440 Otherwise it just so perfectly miniatized, so perfectly camouflaged with sand. 461 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:52,440 You're never going to find it. 462 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,160 It just goes under the sand. 463 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,080 So you just have to track it. 464 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:57,080 Super cool. 465 00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:58,080 Very good experience. 466 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:02,160 And yeah, that was a fantastic experience indeed. 467 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:05,200 And I also remember another nice story about it. 468 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:07,480 There are also cobras. 469 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:10,720 Working with cobras, it's a totally different thing. 470 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,200 They're smarter and faster than vibras if you ask me. 471 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:15,200 All right. 472 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:16,200 Yes. 473 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:19,840 Basically we were just cruising in this car, in this whole weird car. 474 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:22,920 We were just three people looking for a place to stay. 475 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:23,920 So the sun was setting. 476 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:24,920 Nice. 477 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:26,600 The temperature was getting cooler. 478 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:27,600 It was nice. 479 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,760 At some point we just saw this black snake crossing. 480 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:36,080 And there are not that many long black snakes that cross your path in Namibia. 481 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:37,440 We're from cobras. 482 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:39,240 So we're like, yeah, that's got to be a cobra. 483 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:43,640 We just pulled out of the car, carried by our equipment, which are these big snake tongs 484 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:44,640 and snake hooks. 485 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:50,560 And when I'm pinning it down, of course it's like a protective eyewear, you know, glasses 486 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:51,560 and stuff. 487 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:54,400 Because there are also spitting cobras that can go straight to your eyes and you're going 488 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:55,400 to lose them. 489 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:58,680 If you don't, you can get blind. 490 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:00,000 You can get blind with it. 491 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,840 And in fact, it was a spitting cobra. 492 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:06,400 What happens is that this guy just falls into a bush. 493 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:07,400 All right. 494 00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:12,800 And so you got three guys with three sticks hitting this bush, trying to look for the 495 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:13,800 snake. 496 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:14,800 The snake just disappeared. 497 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:15,800 We didn't know where it was. 498 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:16,800 We were so frustrated. 499 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:17,800 That's scary. 500 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:18,800 Very scary indeed. 501 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:25,120 But I was just very frustrated because I really wanted to catch a cobra. 502 00:21:25,120 --> 00:21:29,800 Then I just walk away, you know, and I do my hips and like, I don't know why I could 503 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:30,800 we lose it. 504 00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:31,800 How could we lose it? 505 00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:32,800 It was there. 506 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:37,160 All of a sudden, as I said, like the sun was setting, I feel water on my head. 507 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:38,160 Like yeah, great. 508 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:39,160 It's going to start raining now. 509 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,160 It's even going to start raining. 510 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,960 Once, twice, you know, I just brush it off. 511 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:45,120 Then I think, wait a second. 512 00:21:45,120 --> 00:21:46,120 I'm in Namibia. 513 00:21:46,120 --> 00:21:47,120 It's raining. 514 00:21:47,120 --> 00:21:54,080 Girl, I look up, perfectly clear sky, no clouds at all. 515 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:56,440 And then it occurs to me that it was a spitting cobra. 516 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,680 Spitting cobra spit venom, venomous liquid. 517 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:04,240 I turn my head and this snake just went from a bush and no one saw it. 518 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,000 Climbed up the tree that was maybe an acacia. 519 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:09,000 You know, it wasn't even that tall. 520 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:10,600 Maybe two meters above. 521 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:14,800 It was just hanging from a branch, spitting at the back of my head. 522 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,120 And over there, all over. 523 00:22:17,120 --> 00:22:20,040 I just went at a chance that I was not looking at it. 524 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:23,680 Otherwise I would have had a complicated time, you know, if some of that venom would have 525 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:24,680 gotten in my eyes. 526 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:28,880 Yeah, because even if you wear glasses, you can still get a little bit. 527 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:30,560 It really depends on the glasses. 528 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,520 They can be extremely precise when they aim for your eyes. 529 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:38,600 So if they sprayed, you know, a little drop can still get in your eye. 530 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:39,600 That's going to hurt. 531 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:40,600 Wow. 532 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:42,520 And that was so what did you do with the cobra? 533 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:47,240 I mean, you were you were obviously trying to catch it for I presume to look at the venom 534 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:48,240 or something. 535 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:49,240 Yes. 536 00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:50,240 Yeah, exactly. 537 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:51,240 We got the venom. 538 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:52,240 First of all, of course, we got the cobra. 539 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:57,320 We got all the protective gear needed to, you know, handle safely this animal like color 540 00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,600 gloves and the tongs and stuff. 541 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:04,920 We just go on the branch and safely put the cobra in a bag, reinforced bags and stuff. 542 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:10,560 And the morning after, like we actually measured the cobra, we got some morphological measurements 543 00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:11,560 of it. 544 00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:13,780 We got the venom, insane amount of pictures. 545 00:23:13,780 --> 00:23:17,960 And for some reason, this cobra was specifically annoyed at me out of the three people. 546 00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:23,560 So for the full photo for the photo shoot, it was just fitting at me specifically. 547 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:24,560 Really? 548 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,480 Which is great, which is great, because at least, you know, it had always the hood open 549 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,080 and the father was really pissing him off. 550 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:30,400 I mean, anything else work. 551 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:33,280 Well, yeah, just we just let it go where we planted. 552 00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:34,280 All right. 553 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,080 And so what and what happens to the venom? 554 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,080 So you take that with you? 555 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:40,800 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 556 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,240 Basically we just we collected the venom. 557 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:47,000 We transferred it with a bait into an ephendorf. 558 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:48,640 From the back of your head, I presume? 559 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:49,640 Yes, exactly. 560 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:50,640 Yes, yes. 561 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:54,680 And the fact is that it also dries very, very easily. 562 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:59,840 Like, you know, if you leave it outside, it just gets first thing, it dries out and becomes 563 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:00,840 a little first thing. 564 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,480 It can bring with them some impurities. 565 00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:09,560 So what we got is we got the venom in a little jar, I would say, a little jar covered with 566 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,240 parafilm, you know, for the snake to bite it, release the venom. 567 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:17,560 And from that, we transferred it into ephendorfs, which are, of course, easier to transfer, 568 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:19,120 you know, and dig around. 569 00:24:19,120 --> 00:24:20,520 And we try to keep it as cool as possible. 570 00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:24,960 In fact, we had also a little fridge with us, if you want to keep it cool, it doesn't 571 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,060 dry out. 572 00:24:27,060 --> 00:24:30,760 And then eventually it was taken back to Europe with all the permits, of course, all of the 573 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,680 case, we localised it and it's waiting to be analysed. 574 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:35,680 Awesome. 575 00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:37,560 So that's still work to be done. 576 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:38,560 Yeah. 577 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:39,560 Yes, yes. 578 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:41,120 I'm still focusing on vipers. 579 00:24:41,120 --> 00:24:42,120 Next step is cobras. 580 00:24:42,120 --> 00:24:43,120 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 581 00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:46,400 You're all over Europe at the moment, right? 582 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:47,400 Chasing vipers. 583 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:51,640 Yeah, but yeah, mostly in the Burmese peninsula, to be honest. 584 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,760 Mostly in the Burmese peninsula, I've been focusing on species from the Burmese peninsula, 585 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:56,480 which are heavily understudied. 586 00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:02,880 So yeah, I've been developing many, many, many days of field work here. 587 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:03,880 Yeah. 588 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:08,640 I mean, I've seen them, they're quite small little snakes, but they still pack a lot of... 589 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:09,640 Yeah, they are. 590 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:15,040 You got some of them that have these very big phrandor heads, you know, very typical 591 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:16,040 from vipers. 592 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:20,720 Of course, the bigger the head, usually the higher the amount of venom that they can inject. 593 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:25,000 Of course, what really makes it complicated when you get beaten by a snake is the amount 594 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,280 of venom that you can inject. 595 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:28,280 But that never happened, right? 596 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:29,280 I mean, you're safe. 597 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:34,560 They were being beaten, they were being beaten so far, and I hope to give it that way. 598 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:35,560 All right? 599 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,640 There will be some snakes I've tried, 100%, some snakes I've tried. 600 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,400 I know, so far I've been safe enough. 601 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:42,400 Good. 602 00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:47,480 I mean, and then, yeah, you get beaten maybe on the gloves that you use and you feel, you 603 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:52,000 kind of think, oh God, I felt the fang, itching the skin. 604 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,720 Overspin, oh, let's see, let's see, you wait a bit, no, just your fear. 605 00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:01,080 Okay, well, that's not just any glove, right? 606 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:02,400 That's a highly specialized... 607 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:03,400 Yes, yes. 608 00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:04,400 Covered gloves. 609 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:05,400 ...catching glove. 610 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:06,400 Yeah. 611 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:07,400 Yeah, exactly. 612 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:08,400 Armored gloves. 613 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:11,400 The gloves of power, some people call them. 614 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:12,400 Awesome. 615 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:13,400 Awesome. 616 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:19,360 So, you said, you know, the Bushmaster was your number one bucket list. 617 00:26:19,360 --> 00:26:24,200 I know you've been to a lot of places, what's next? 618 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:28,280 Where would you like to go and what animal is still there to see that you would, you 619 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:32,600 know, that would be now your new number one bucket list animal? 620 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:38,160 This is a question I've been asking myself for a while since I got back from Vienna. 621 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,320 After you eat the top, what do you want to see next? 622 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:41,320 All right? 623 00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:42,320 Come on, I need that, eat something more. 624 00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:46,000 I don't know, a Gaboon Viper or something? 625 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:48,040 A Gaboon Viper, yes, that would be great. 626 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:49,040 But you know what I thought about? 627 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:54,880 I was like, right, I've been in South Africa, in Southern Africa, I mean, I've been in South 628 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,440 America, I've been around, so I've seen these tropical places. 629 00:26:58,440 --> 00:26:59,440 What am I missing? 630 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:00,440 Asia, 100%. 631 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:01,440 Okay. 632 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:02,440 What do we have there? 633 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:03,440 King Cobras, there we go. 634 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:04,440 That's your answer. 635 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,960 All right, that's the next one on the list then. 636 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:12,680 If you're going for big pan of mistakes, you want to go for a big King Cobra, 100%. 637 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,640 So yeah, that's my trip. 638 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:17,240 And is that planned already? 639 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,760 Are you planning any trips to Asia or not? 640 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:27,840 I'm planning a trip for the beginning of the fall of 2024 when there will be the World 641 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,840 Congress of Herpetology, and it will be in Southeast Asia. 642 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:36,880 General Sire Sammoni joining the Congress and then maybe disappearing for one month 643 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,600 in the jungle there just for Cobras. 644 00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:45,040 I think you won't be the only one at the Herpetological Congress that will be looking for a King Cobra. 645 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,120 Sure, I'm sure everyone is going for that. 646 00:27:48,120 --> 00:27:49,120 Yes, sir. 647 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:54,760 So yeah, starting the ceremony right now because it's appearing for one month. 648 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:56,920 Chasing the next snake to study their venom. 649 00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:58,840 That's really cool. 650 00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:04,700 So if people want to follow your scientific work, where do we go? 651 00:28:04,700 --> 00:28:07,680 Do we go follow you on Twitter, Instagram? 652 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,440 Where can we find you on the social webs? 653 00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:12,760 Oh, yes, yes, 100%. 654 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:15,600 I can give you my contacts, Twitter and Instagram. 655 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:16,600 Exactly. 656 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:17,600 I'm using them. 657 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,240 Exactly the same contact. 658 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:20,240 What's your Twitter name? 659 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:21,960 What's your Instagram name? 660 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:23,800 Is natural underscore her. 661 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:25,960 Very, very original, I know. 662 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:27,520 And natural underscore her. 663 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:28,520 All right. 664 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:29,520 All right. 665 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:30,520 All right. 666 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:31,520 Yes. 667 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:32,520 Follow me. 668 00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:33,520 Follow me. 669 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:34,520 I'll put those on the screen somehow. 670 00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:35,520 Thank you very much. 671 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:36,520 Thank you very much. 672 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:37,520 Awesome. 673 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:38,520 Well, thanks for being here, man. 674 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:39,520 Thanks for the awesome stories. 675 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:40,520 Thank you, Ari. 676 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:41,520 Thank you for seeing me. 677 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:42,520 Thanks. 678 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:46,680 And I'll have to ask you back in a few years' time when you've seen that ginkgo bro. 679 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:48,320 Looking forward to it, man. 680 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:49,320 Yes, sir. 681 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,840 Or if you follow me on Instagram, hopefully I will be able to post a picture of it if I 682 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:54,600 see it. 683 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:55,600 Even better. 684 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:56,600 Thanks a lot. 685 00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:57,600 Talk to you soon. 686 00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:58,600 Thank you, man. 687 00:28:58,600 --> 00:28:59,600 Thank you very much. 688 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:12,400 Sure.