WEBVTT

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We're talking about the one skincare ingredient

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that gets more hype, more confusion, and more

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TikTok drama than any other. Retinoids. Some

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say they're the fountain of youth in a bottle,

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others swear they ruin their skin. And we're

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gonna get into it, how they work, and how you

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as a professional can use them to treat acne,

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pigmentation, aging, and everything in between.

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If you're new here, welcome to Beauty Babble,

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where we talk shop about the real stuff behind

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running a beauty business. I'm Doreen, a brand

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and content strategist and former esthetician.

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And I'm Suzanne, Sadesco certified esthetician

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with over 30 years in the industry, spa owner,

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and now an educator mentor for beauty pros. And

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today we're getting into retinoids. See, I've

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already messed it up because there's retinol,

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retinoid right now. Why don't you give us a definition?

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Retinoids are compound chemically related to

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retinoic acid, the active form of vitamin A that

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binds the retinoid receptors in the skin affecting

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how cells behave, particularly how they grow,

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shed and repair. There's so many, you're right,

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there's so many ways of saying it and how they're

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using it in its understanding and really it comes

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down to whether they're prescription or over

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-the -counter meaning what we can use too, right?

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So that's kind of the difference. What can beauty

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pros use that isn't prescription? Well, in your

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own product line, it'd be good to know which

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one you're using and there's some mild to moderate

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ones. Retinol is a moderate one. whereas retinal

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is so there's r -e -t -i -n -o -l and then there's

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r -e -t -i -n -a -l so retinal retinol that's

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i think where we get confused sometimes with

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it the retinal al at the end is moderate over

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the counter and it can it's usually less irritating

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and that's why you're probably going to find

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it not as much in products, but the most common

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one in skincare products that we will see is

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actually the retinol, the OL at the end. And

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that's mild to moderate, over -the -counter.

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So even your Sephora products, your other department

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stores, kind of pieces, different skincare. But

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that one's the one, the most common in skincare.

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But there's also retinol with a YL, palminate.

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And that's over the counter. That's very, very

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mild, which is quite nice to use too, because

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it's often that beginner type of retinoid that

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you can start to use or sensitive skins. And

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there's still, I mean, sensitive skins want to

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do anti -aging or sensitive skin might have acne

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or pigmentation. So it's kind of that less potent

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level, you know, whereas you're getting into

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the other ones. Tretanone is a retinonic acid

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and that's a prescription level. So you're not

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going to see that unless you're working in a

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medispa or under a doctor or potentially maybe

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a nurse practitioner. Medical aesthetics, that

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end of things. Fast acting and actually fun fact,

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it's the most researched ingredient. Of course,

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because it falls under the medical side of things.

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Oh, interesting. And there's the other one that

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is phazerotin. Am I saying that right? I can't

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even say it. Sorry, I'm terrible at those things.

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That is a high strength one as well and often

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used for that high acne, you know, stage three,

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stage four level and even psoriasis. It's a prescription

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level as well. I'm going to share actually this

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table that you have made because some of these

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names are very hard. So the tretinoin, this is

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the Highest one is what you were saying. This

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is the prescription. It's medical. We're not

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touching that This is the other one Prosperity

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is a routine i'm butchering that that's also

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a prescription one. That's right. All right,

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and then This one is the next one. Did you talk

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about this one? No, I was getting to that one.

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That is a mix between over -the -counter and

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prescription, which is interesting. I don't personally

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know enough about that one, but I would just

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be researching it if I wanted to know more. And

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I'm just going to say the name for our listeners

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who aren't watching this on YouTube. Adapalene.

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Yeah, and those are the other. And then you talked

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about these ones. This is retinol, retinol, retinol

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and retinol. So I was saying the end of the word

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is an A -L or an O -L or the Y -L. And then all

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if you if you're saying it quickly, you don't

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know which one it is. So when your clients say,

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yes, I use a retinal, ask them which one find

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a product so you understand what they're actually

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using. I think that's where we think it's all

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the same. And they'll they'll show different

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names for it. Yeah. Well, and how would we use

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this? I think that's a big thing, too, is that

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well, one is age. Oh, during you have to share

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your story. Oh, yes. We all know, we've seen,

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you know, these articles of kids using retinol,

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but my daughter had a birthday party, 10th birthday

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party, we had a sleepover, and the kids were

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getting ready for bed. I say bed because they

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didn't actually end up sleeping. And so I go

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down to the basement and to check on them, and

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one of her friends had pulled out her... Sephora

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product and it said on it retinol and she's passing

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it around and these are like 10 year olds with

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Their skin, like they've got baby skin, like

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their skin is absolutely flawless. They do not

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need retinol. So I just made sure that I'm like,

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ah, maybe don't share that because some people

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might react or whatever. But I think I had been

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a little too late. I know my daughter didn't

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put any on, but I know some of the other kids

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did. And you can have a reaction to that. Their

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skin is way too young. Yeah, typically you might

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see it in the I'll say tweens to teens. If they

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have started to get bright, then you'll some

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doctors will actually subscribe it to them but

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that's for a condition not because you're saying

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you're using it and I think this is a great opportunity

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for beauty pros out there is to maybe have the

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ingredient or topic that's out there when you're

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following social media what's the trend what's

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going on out there who are these kids watching

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and doing and put up there a little bit of blurb

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about it so talk to me about this especially

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if your kids are using it or want to know more

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so you can educate your clients and you're tapping

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into helping them with their kids. Like if you

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were my client and you saw that in my room, you

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would have been, oh my God, that just happened.

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What is this stuff? And then I become that professional,

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explain to my client more about it, right? I

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think these are little opportunities that we

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kind of miss on as professionals in the room,

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but this isn't going away. This has been an ingredient

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around forever. Again, the trends come and go,

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but this one sticks around, I think is a big

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one. because everybody's in the anti -age or

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the pro -aging world our 10 year olds are look

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at that yeah and i think and you you had said

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this before but it it is for more than just anti

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-aging and also for clearing up breakouts and

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stuff what else can it be used for um the one

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thing that if we look at us deep in the layers

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of the skin what's happening when it's an acne

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skin or a breakout even it's just common don't

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break out like Stage one to two kind of thing.

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It's not full on pustule level but it's you know,

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the the pores getting clogged because of the

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comedone because of the blackhead or the that

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type of idea so when you look at the buildup

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of dead skin on this on the surface and keeps

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building up building up and if we are naturally

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Releasing that buildup it allows as we like to

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say the skin breathe Normalize, I guess you could

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say on that way. But if you look at it that way.

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Well, what is the purpose behind? are anti -aging,

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the same process, right? So it's always about

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trying to keep the skin from building up too

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much dead skin cells, right? And even when it

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comes to the melanin or hyperpigmentation of

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the skin, it actually is going a little to the

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same idea that is going to help the layers of

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that pigmentation as it builds up. that's hyperfigmentations

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in the upper part. We're not talking melasma.

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That's a lot deeper, right? But you're allowing

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that to slough off, which begins to lighten it.

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But the biggest thing out of everything is they

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have to be using an SPF. They have to be putting

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it on again throughout their day if they're exposed

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to the sun more than, you know, that hour or

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two, depending on what Fitzpatrick they are,

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right? But, you know, can you use retinoids in

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the summer? Yes, you can. depending on what you're

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using. What is in mild form? Are you, how are

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you helping coach your clients through it through

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the summer? Hats, SPFs, they want to take care

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of their skin. And usually that's where we fall

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aside, I guess you could say is that our clients

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are not taking the series that they should. And

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I think that's a big part of it. Like you said,

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like you don't, I don't know, does the parent

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know that this happened? That their kid is using

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that product? It's hard to say. It's confusing

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because there's so many different kinds. It's

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confusing for the professionals sometimes. It's

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easy for it to be confusing to, you know, the

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non -professionals who are just like, oh, here

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it is. And if you think if you get that retinoids

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all together, they're a game changer. They really

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are when used properly. And more is not always

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better. You hear me. I'm a broken record when

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I say it. It's just a little bit at a time. It

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is an acid base. I guess we should look at it

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that way. different degrees of it, right? I remember

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when it first came out, as I mentioned, how long

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I've been in the industry, that a client came

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in one time and she was literally shedding like

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a snake her face. And she had just had a vitamin

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A treatment, a retinol treatment from the dermatologist.

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And I was like, oh my God, I forgot what percentage

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it was. It was like a 50, it was crazy. And she

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didn't go outside, she had to stay indoors. go

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through the did her skin look great later on

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sure but not everybody wants to have that downtime

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right not everyone can afford the downtime and

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how you're going to stay at home all the time

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but yeah that's a long time ago folks can i say

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this it's been a long ways but i think it's the

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other thing is they don't realize like for acne

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and breakouts is actually an anti -inflammatory

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too so that helps to take that inflammation out

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of the skin it's not just about you know that

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anti -age or the acne side of it it helps to

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bring down fight the bacteria as well and a big

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thing is that it it turns over like it speeds

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up the turnover of the cells which is the healing

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side which we want from the acne or breakouts

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i should say no wonder it's so popular yeah is

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it preventative sure but how often do you need

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it so that comes into the skin thickness the

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age of your client what else are they using i

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mean I think that's what we forget that, you

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know, I remember having a brief conversation

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with someone, they were asking someone knew me

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and said, Oh, you should ask her, she knows about

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skincare. And I was like, Oh, sure. I got a couple

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minutes, right? I don't know what you're using.

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And it's okay. Well, you're using retinols. And

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she used to shouldn't know she's using two different

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types. Remember the OL and the AL? YL? She's

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using two different ones. One of them was twice

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a week. The other one's twice a week. Plus she

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was exfoliating with a scrub. She's doing mini

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enzyme masks and she was 23 years old. And so

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I begin by teaching People have more questions.

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Like what how was her skin? She was dry. She

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complained of dryness. She's sensitive ago. Yeah

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Yeah, I can see why your rosy cheeks and you're

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feeling dry And then I showed her like once I

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figured out the product and then I saw how often

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you using it I said I just cut back. You're only

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23 years old how often your skin turns over.

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Yes, we want that, but more does not prevent

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aging. Biologically, you're set at that age.

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Yes, there could be external factors that age

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you quicker, sun tanning, sun tan beds. It's

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the sun mainly, right? Lifestyle, I guess, sure.

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Genetics, yes, but it's mainly that. So once

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I said that to her, like when I ran into her

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a week later, and she saw a difference right

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away, she said, stop using all of that and don't

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exfoliate your skin for the next five days. I

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said, just give it some time, use your hyaluronic,

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use this, she had a mask that was like a soothing

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one for the redness, like go use that for the

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next few days and just see how that goes. And

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she was, oh my God. So then I just said to her,

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I don't know the brand very well. I'm being honest,

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I don't sell that brand, so I don't know it,

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but just knowing the ingredient. Why don't you

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try doing this and then think seasons as well

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like so then she's like, okay, and then it was

00:13:29.460 --> 00:13:32.480
probably I Don't know months months later asked

00:13:32.480 --> 00:13:34.000
her how you doing. She was oh my god That was

00:13:34.000 --> 00:13:35.919
a game changer. Everything was so different about

00:13:35.919 --> 00:13:38.340
it. And again, it's just understanding what the

00:13:38.340 --> 00:13:41.740
ingredient is So I know that we're taught especially

00:13:41.740 --> 00:13:45.179
nowadays. We're taught a brand and how to use

00:13:45.179 --> 00:13:47.779
the brand in our trainings Yes, we need to know

00:13:47.779 --> 00:13:50.000
that but you still need to know ingredients.

00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:52.669
You need to help your clients outside of you

00:13:52.669 --> 00:13:54.450
know the treatment room as well right if this

00:13:54.450 --> 00:13:58.169
thing comes up yeah the other one pigmentation

00:13:58.169 --> 00:14:02.409
this is interesting because what some might not

00:14:02.409 --> 00:14:04.590
know and because we were talking about this ingredient

00:14:04.590 --> 00:14:06.629
it made me deep dive again because it's been

00:14:06.629 --> 00:14:09.149
a little while since i deep dove into this one

00:14:09.149 --> 00:14:12.070
but i did forget that it actually disrupts the

00:14:12.070 --> 00:14:15.769
melanin transfer in from the melanocytes into

00:14:15.769 --> 00:14:18.470
the dead skin cells which was interesting oh

00:14:18.470 --> 00:14:20.470
yeah that's right i'm a little geeky when it

00:14:20.470 --> 00:14:22.789
comes to that stuff right but That's how come

00:14:22.789 --> 00:14:25.350
it helps hyperpigmentation, not just the sloughing

00:14:25.350 --> 00:14:28.870
off of the skin cells, but it's also what's happening

00:14:28.870 --> 00:14:31.830
when the melanins transfer into those spot areas,

00:14:31.870 --> 00:14:34.629
I guess you could say. So it helps to diminish

00:14:34.629 --> 00:14:37.970
that transfer into there, if that makes sense.

00:14:39.350 --> 00:14:42.590
Yeah. Yeah. And the other thing is, how do you

00:14:42.590 --> 00:14:45.250
partner with the retinoids that you're using?

00:14:45.909 --> 00:14:49.039
So thinking about what could work with it. So

00:14:49.039 --> 00:14:51.059
you want to think of brightening agents, vitamin

00:14:51.059 --> 00:14:55.279
C, you want to think niacinamide is great. Now,

00:14:55.539 --> 00:14:58.139
in respect to that, just remember that niacinamide

00:14:58.139 --> 00:15:01.600
is a very active and you want to increase circulation,

00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:04.419
same with vitamin C, but just knowing what you're

00:15:04.419 --> 00:15:06.480
going to use, how you're going to use it. So

00:15:06.480 --> 00:15:08.539
understanding, it's a little bit of a puzzle

00:15:08.539 --> 00:15:10.080
thing for each person, right? You got to put

00:15:10.080 --> 00:15:12.299
the puzzle together for each person to figure

00:15:12.299 --> 00:15:14.960
that out. But they work really well together

00:15:14.960 --> 00:15:18.340
and Azalic acid actually is another ingredient

00:15:18.340 --> 00:15:20.679
that works really well with the retinoid as well,

00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:24.519
so it helps to effectively use the retinoid better

00:15:24.519 --> 00:15:28.059
for the skin reaction of less melanin in those

00:15:28.059 --> 00:15:30.960
areas. You're not whitening the skin, you're

00:15:30.960 --> 00:15:34.220
not bleaching the skin, you're just changing

00:15:34.220 --> 00:15:37.059
almost like the chemistry of the skin and how

00:15:37.059 --> 00:15:40.700
it's releasing the melanin into those areas.

00:15:42.759 --> 00:15:44.480
One other thing that I should mention too is

00:15:44.480 --> 00:15:47.120
people are really scared for retinoids for the

00:15:47.120 --> 00:15:50.080
Fitzpatricks, the higher Fitzpatricks. So if

00:15:50.080 --> 00:15:53.279
we think back, what did we learn about acids

00:15:53.279 --> 00:15:56.419
and peels and Fitzpatricks? So no different.

00:15:57.100 --> 00:15:59.639
If they're that higher Fitzpatricks, four, five,

00:15:59.639 --> 00:16:04.019
six, you want to do, you know, very slow, very

00:16:04.019 --> 00:16:07.860
mild, not too fast. You don't want that, you

00:16:07.860 --> 00:16:10.740
know, that rebound pigmentation effect that happens.

00:16:11.230 --> 00:16:13.830
but you could, you know, something to buffer

00:16:13.830 --> 00:16:18.289
with it, the milder form, are you using it, maybe

00:16:18.289 --> 00:16:20.669
alternating nights or only a couple of times

00:16:20.669 --> 00:16:22.769
a night to see like what's happening with them

00:16:22.769 --> 00:16:26.190
and just really slowly introduce it. And again,

00:16:26.190 --> 00:16:29.549
it's based on what brand are you using and then

00:16:29.549 --> 00:16:31.710
talk to that brand representative, the educator

00:16:31.710 --> 00:16:34.350
to help guide you through those things too. I

00:16:34.350 --> 00:16:37.549
think that's really important on that side. But

00:16:37.549 --> 00:16:40.309
in the end, if you want it to work properly,

00:16:40.350 --> 00:16:43.090
you need to you know what one use it properly

00:16:43.090 --> 00:16:45.470
but SPF is really essential but it can be used

00:16:45.470 --> 00:16:49.009
as well right it depends which one you're using

00:16:49.009 --> 00:16:52.629
yeah you know yeah and i and i tell clients like

00:16:52.629 --> 00:16:55.649
it's not negotiable you have to use the SPF always

00:16:55.649 --> 00:16:59.610
all year round tell them why yeah yeah even you

00:16:59.610 --> 00:17:01.309
saying like can you use retinoids in the summer

00:17:01.309 --> 00:17:04.420
or whatever like We need to be using our SPF

00:17:04.420 --> 00:17:08.039
all year round. So if you are going to use retinoids

00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:10.000
in the summer, then it's just you just have to

00:17:10.000 --> 00:17:13.200
be a bit more vigilant. The other side of I didn't

00:17:13.200 --> 00:17:15.039
mention to you is that because it's doing what

00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:19.319
it's doing, it also helps with other treatments

00:17:19.319 --> 00:17:21.160
that you're going to be introducing. Maybe it's

00:17:21.160 --> 00:17:23.400
the prep, right? Maybe it's for their home care.

00:17:23.400 --> 00:17:26.000
It's prepping them for their hyaluronic because

00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:27.680
you're, you know, lifting off the dead skin.

00:17:27.720 --> 00:17:29.680
You're adding more moisture with this other mask

00:17:29.680 --> 00:17:31.730
and hyaluronic is going to... work better because

00:17:31.730 --> 00:17:33.809
you're preparing the skin so there's a lot of

00:17:33.809 --> 00:17:36.890
fun ways to do it as you get more comfortable

00:17:36.890 --> 00:17:41.049
I think doing it but in the end just generally

00:17:41.049 --> 00:17:43.789
and keeping on top and keep reminding like I

00:17:43.789 --> 00:17:46.289
said I went back when oh yeah I'm gonna deep

00:17:46.289 --> 00:17:48.289
dive a little more about that and like I you

00:17:48.289 --> 00:17:51.509
can't remember everything so be okay with to

00:17:51.509 --> 00:17:54.009
continually learn and grow with it and they're

00:17:54.009 --> 00:17:56.829
also finding new things all the time so I think

00:17:56.829 --> 00:17:59.779
that's a fun part of it too right But yeah, like

00:17:59.779 --> 00:18:01.660
a lot of people forget or maybe weren't even

00:18:01.660 --> 00:18:03.799
taught that it actually helps to disrupt that

00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:06.440
melanin transfer for the hyperpigmentation is

00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:08.920
why you get that nice bright, bright lightening

00:18:08.920 --> 00:18:13.119
of the skin. Yeah, I think it the you know, it's

00:18:13.119 --> 00:18:16.740
been overshadowed by the anti aging and the acne

00:18:16.740 --> 00:18:19.200
treatment because I had it prescribed when I

00:18:19.200 --> 00:18:21.880
was younger, when I had like more acne skin.

00:18:22.420 --> 00:18:24.660
And I did have like I couldn't go to work one

00:18:24.660 --> 00:18:26.660
day I was working at the time I was working at

00:18:26.660 --> 00:18:29.190
the front desk at a spot and like my face is

00:18:29.190 --> 00:18:32.130
completely peeled. And then after that was a

00:18:32.130 --> 00:18:34.089
lesson learned, I went after that, I'm like,

00:18:34.490 --> 00:18:37.029
I'm going to take it, you know, I got into skincare

00:18:37.029 --> 00:18:42.529
and learned it and went the slow and steady route.

00:18:43.170 --> 00:18:45.650
Yeah, so I think if you look at almost, I'll

00:18:45.650 --> 00:18:48.029
say almost any age based on the condition, what

00:18:48.029 --> 00:18:50.589
are we doing? Why are we using it? And I think

00:18:50.589 --> 00:18:53.509
if that's what you look at first, and then choosing

00:18:53.509 --> 00:18:56.609
which one you're going to use, like that beginner

00:18:56.609 --> 00:19:01.700
level, and slowly introduce it. We're talking

00:19:01.700 --> 00:19:03.900
esthetician, we're not talking medical grade.

00:19:04.599 --> 00:19:06.700
And maybe you're trying it, have the client using

00:19:06.700 --> 00:19:10.140
it overnight. It's only a couple, one time a

00:19:10.140 --> 00:19:12.240
week, then the following week, two times if they're

00:19:12.240 --> 00:19:15.960
sensitive and giving gaps in between. So that

00:19:15.960 --> 00:19:19.140
layering idea of introducing it into it, start

00:19:19.140 --> 00:19:21.599
out slow, like I said, one, maybe two times a

00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:25.259
week. Then depending on the skin, like what's

00:19:25.259 --> 00:19:27.480
the goal? Acneic. hyperpigmentation, whatever

00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:30.640
it may be, if there's that condition behind it.

00:19:30.940 --> 00:19:33.759
Or let's add the anti -aging, someone's older

00:19:33.759 --> 00:19:36.299
just getting into using products like this, and

00:19:36.299 --> 00:19:38.859
they could really use, they have a lot of fine

00:19:38.859 --> 00:19:41.859
lines, elasticity of the skin, the dead skin

00:19:41.859 --> 00:19:44.279
buildup. Sure, you can act on that as well, the

00:19:44.279 --> 00:19:47.200
same idea, where maybe the skin will gradually

00:19:47.200 --> 00:19:49.779
tolerate to three times a week to four times

00:19:49.779 --> 00:19:53.069
a week, but again, it all is age. skin condition

00:19:53.069 --> 00:19:55.329
thickness of skin what else are they doing with

00:19:55.329 --> 00:19:58.069
it right and then eventually you can do that

00:19:58.069 --> 00:20:01.049
sandwich where you're you know you're doing your

00:20:01.049 --> 00:20:04.450
moisturizer your retinol and another moisturizer

00:20:04.450 --> 00:20:07.930
like you can you can play with that idea as well

00:20:07.930 --> 00:20:10.309
just it's almost like you're doing that thing

00:20:10.309 --> 00:20:12.990
of like a vitamin where it's a slow release you

00:20:12.990 --> 00:20:15.410
know it's that scene concept you could do it

00:20:15.410 --> 00:20:17.470
that way as well and always always pair it with

00:20:17.470 --> 00:20:20.430
the spf and non -negotiable and it got to be

00:20:20.430 --> 00:20:25.690
30 to 50. on the SPF every morning. Yeah. Yeah,

00:20:25.690 --> 00:20:28.349
I'm gonna go. I need to go put my retinol cream

00:20:28.349 --> 00:20:31.329
on. I know. I know. I was looking going, God,

00:20:31.410 --> 00:20:33.890
I don't know. Last time I had, I got to use up

00:20:33.890 --> 00:20:35.869
what I got. I have to do that. I got to stop

00:20:35.869 --> 00:20:38.130
doing this and jump into the ingredients that

00:20:38.130 --> 00:20:40.609
make me want to dive into more. Yeah. I'm like,

00:20:40.609 --> 00:20:43.069
I want to use them all. I love it. This was a

00:20:43.069 --> 00:20:45.690
good one though. And I hope it gave us all some

00:20:45.690 --> 00:20:48.849
clarity. And I think the important thing as professionals

00:20:48.849 --> 00:20:52.369
to remember that we have the responsibility to

00:20:52.369 --> 00:20:55.410
guide and like clear up some myths for our clients

00:20:55.410 --> 00:20:57.250
too because there is so much information out

00:20:57.250 --> 00:20:59.930
there and so much stuff on social media that

00:20:59.930 --> 00:21:06.089
is not always yeah not always accurate yeah yeah

00:21:06.089 --> 00:21:09.230
awesome okay great i love it hopefully you all

00:21:09.230 --> 00:21:11.450
enjoyed listening to this episode and make sure

00:21:11.450 --> 00:21:15.730
you subscribe for the next one thanks for listening

00:21:15.730 --> 00:21:16.710
to beauty babble