the Huskers nutrition podcast
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You are listening to the
Huskers nutrition podcast
presented by Midwest Dairy and
your local farm families. Here
is your host Jessica Cootie.
And we're back with Episode
three of the Huskers nutrition
podcast sponsored by Midwest
Dairy and your local farm
families. I'm Jessica Cootie
and back on the episode today.
We're gonna have Lisa
Koepke that will be joining us
today. And then we have
Jason. And joining us again is
Jake Blatter, another member
of the Huskers performance
nutrition team. You were on
episode one. You're back again
to talk to us a little bit
about. Body composition testing
and all of that. But is that
what's going on right now?
What are you guys doing with
the athletes right now to get
them ready for everything that
comes for training purposes in
the fall? Yeah, definitely. So
our track and field programs
and like our basketball
programs are starting to
start to be more of a
laboratory. So you know, that's
one thing Nebraska is really
good at is this the science and
we're able to look at that
athlete and. Break it down.
And you know what do we need to
be putting in our bodies? How
do we improve? And what do we
need to improve upon? So we'll
do Dexa. That's the body
composition testing that we
use. There's different ways of
looking at body composition.
Basically. What body comp is
looking at how much bone,
mineral density is in good
position. So that's another
thing that we use with our
athletes is, Hey, it's are we
in good health standards as
well? So why is it so
important? The body composition
testing is really important.
So we're going to be looking at
that. We're going to be looking
at the body composition. So
that's one of the things that
we're going to be looking at
is how much muscle we want to
have on that body. Do we need
to lean you out? Is your bone
mineral density in good
position? So that's another
thing that we use with our
athletes. So why is it so
important? The body
composition testing the overall
way because you guys did, I'm
sure periodically throughout
the year. Why is that so
important to the athletes
health? Yeah, it's a piece of
the puzzle. So a lot of
athletes, they try to focus on
a number on the scale and you
know, it scales. It's just a
tool at the end of the day. It
just gives you one number and
with Dexa, we're able to look
at like, well, what is that
number actually comprised of?
You know, if an athlete loses
five pounds, is that muscle
mass? Is it fat mass? Just
like, you know, it's a really
scientific and in depth look of
what that athletes made out of.
So, you know, right now we're
just kind of getting those
baseline numbers. We have some
new athletes on campus or even
some returners like, hey,
before case, they went overseas
to play in Japan. We got him on
and we're able to say like,
okay, went and played a summer.
You came back like what
happened to your body? Did we
you know, do we eat correctly?
Did we did we train correctly?
So we're able to make sure our
jobs are also, you know, our
jobs are also being taken care
of. Absolutely. Let's have
into the bone density part of
it and how you guys monitor
that. And I guess that's
something that can be addressed
if there's concerns there.
Yeah, definitely. So when an
athlete comes in, especially
like our. I want to say like
our distance crew. We want to
make sure that our bones or
our frame is able to take that
impact. So we want to make
sure that, hey, we have good
bone health. You know, like
we have a lot of stress
reactions, stress fractures.
Well, did we have good bone
health? Is there something we
could have done differently?
And there's other parts of it,
too. If we're low in bone
mineral density, do we need to
look at calcium or vitamin D?
Let's figure out or address the
problem. What's what's going
on with that athlete? So it's
it's a screening tool as long
with as a performance tool for
us. So like I said, there's
other ways of looking at body
composition. We can do skin
calipers where we pinch the
skin, like, you know, what our
bone mineral density is. So I
think Dex is pretty much our
gold standard. So say someone
needs to address some of that.
How do you go about that with
what fuel you put in your body?
What food you put in your body?
Yeah, definitely. So like
nutrition recommendation wise,
like, hey, you know, we did
your second scan and all of a
sudden your bone mineral
density went the wrong way. You
know, did we put enough
calories or enough fuel in our
body? Did we put in the right
nutrients in calcium, vitamin
D? It's one of those checks
that we do. And then we do a
lot of training, like, what do
we need to change or do we need
to change anything? Did you
progress correctly? Did we put
five pounds of muscle on from
training? So from a nutrition
standpoint, you know, most of
the time being in the Midwest,
are we getting enough vitamin D
or we do pretty good on the
dairy consumption, but a lot of
vitamin D just because we don't
see sunlight. Yeah, that's that's
one of the main sources of
vitamin D, actually. So tell us
about why that's so critical to
your testing. Yeah, definitely
like from an editing purpose,
we'll shoot you a picture of a
Dex machine, see what it looks
like. But essentially stands
for dual energy X ray absorb
atometry. So really fancy terms
for it's a bed that you lay on
and we shoot X rays at you,
essentially. So you have to go
through some licensure and some
exams and stuff like that. And
like I said, it's it's a really
scientific way of looking at the
body from multiple compartments
and then you can just look at
the body and see what's going
on there on the scale and then
just in terms of timetable and
goals for these athletes when
they come in and maybe even do
it as a freshman when they come
in and how you kind of go
through the process of a year
of testing and then how you
attack some of those things
that you're seeing that need to
be addressed. We definitely
looked at with their training
periods. We want to look at for
men's basketball specifically
when we first come to campus,
you know, two months ago for
men's basketball. We want to
look at the
training period. At the end of
summer training, coming into
fall, we'll do another scan to
see if we can get a little
better. We can do a little
bit of a risk for an ACL injury
or even, um, you know. You know
for, um, someone does have an
injury during the season like,
Oh, my gosh, we just blew an
ACL out. How much muscle mass
did you have on your right leg
before that injury? And then
after your injury, we can kind
of use that with our athletic
training staff and our sports
scientists to build a program
and a rehab program off that.
For your sport specifically,
How much do you see them kind
of helping you with that? Um,
it's great buy in. Um, I mean,
it's you're giving something
unique to that athlete, and
it's something that had a lot
of institutions, you know, have
access to decks. And I think
we have. Yeah. You know, I was
at a previous institution, and
we barely had one up in
operational, and it just worked
with the football program here.
We have two decks is and we do
all of Our athletic teams here.
So that's something definitely
unique. And like I said, from
the buy in perspective, you're
getting a lot of people that
are like, Oh, my goodness, I
would love to, you know, kind
of help them. It's definitely
nice from a nutrition
perspective because you get a
little bit better by into
there like, Oh, my goodness,
I'd like to put on a little
more muscle mass. Okay, What
do we do? Are we? You know,
you're skipping breakfast right
now. If we want to put some
lean muscle mass on, we'll
probably should be getting
some protein in or, you know,
working on breakfast, I guess.
And then just. Maybe for this
might be a dumb question on my
part, but specifically if these
are all of the above, yes, all
of the above. Trust me. There's
no dumb questions. Um yeah, I
mean, just from even a normal
health standard, you know, if
there's something that we can
do differently to improve
quality of life, you know, it
affects all aspects of life. So
you know, 20 years from now,
when you're done playing
sports, you know, I want you
to have good bone mineral
density still to I want you to
still be able to go out for a
run and enjoy. You know, maybe
some recreational stuff, too.
But I appreciate your time,
and we're going to continue
this conversation coming up
next with Lisa Copac. Late
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We're back to continue the
conversation here on the
Huskers nutrition podcast with
Lisa Copac, the director of
performance nutrition here at
Nebraska. Thanks for coming
back. Thanks for having me
back. All right, Well, tell us
about reds. What are reds?
Well reds is a syndrome that
results from under fueling and
over over exercising. So
student athletes who maybe
are under fueling, maybe
unintentionally under consuming
enough calories to support the
training that they're doing.
It's very common across all
sports across both genders, and
I'll give you a little
background. So back in the late
nineties, we had this term that
was coined called the female
athlete triad. So we had female
athletes who were under fueling
who saw menstrual disturbances
and they were seeing a
change in their ability to
exercise. So what we saw was
this three spoke wheel, hence
the triad. Those of us that
were working in performance at
that time were really
questioning. So what about our
male athletes who are under
fueling and we were seeing
other things such as decline
in libido, changes in mental
function, inability to gain
muscle mass or strength during
a workout. So we came up with
this syndrome called reds, which
stands for relative energy
deficiency in sport. So
essentially it's under fueling
or over training, but
essentially we're not meeting
the needs of the body. There's
not enough left over after
training to support basic
physiological function. I
imagine that probably happens
quite often, right? I mean, I
mean, I know it's probably an
education part, but it is an
important part of the
process. So we put some extra
pieces into place to help
screen all of our student
athletes for reds, because
unfortunately some of the
symptoms that might show up
could be psychological. So
somebody may be struggling
with depression or an
inability to sleep. Somebody
else may have chronic soft
tissue injuries or not recover
well from one day to the next.
Somebody else might have an
illness that they can't
recover. So we always align.
There isn't one definitive
diagnostic criteria that says
reds. It's an accumulation of
a bunch of things together.
That's why we call it a
syndrome, and it takes all of
the support staff coming
together and actually
communicating and figuring out
what's going on with this
particular student athlete.
Who what kind of athlete could
be affected by this? All
athletes are going to be
affected by this. We have
been talking about the need of
low energy availability. We
have been fasting all night.
We haven't eaten anything, and
that's why we should start our
morning with breakfast. Our
athletes should absolutely
consume something before
they're doing their morning
training sessions. The problem
is when under fueling has been
going on because student
athletes are busy, maybe they
have class conflicts and they
don't have time to eat, they
don't have time to eat. They
don't have time to eat. So that
all leads to an unintentional
under fueling and over time
that affects the appetite. So
pretty soon, student athletes
are like, Well, I'm just not
hungry, so I didn't think I
needed to eat. And then maybe
what's the difference? I guess
between reds and then an
eating disorder or disordered
eating. Okay, so there is a
spectrum. So we have
disordered eating in the middle
and then we have normalized
eating on the other side. I
often ask student athletes, has
anybody ever eaten because they
were bored, hungry, tired,
frustrated or sad, and they all
raise their hand? Well, that's
disordered eating here in the
middle of the spectrum. On the
other side, when we have eating
disorders like anorexia
nervosa, bulimia nervosa, binge
eating disorder, those are
all different diagnoses. So
there's a specific criteria in
the DSM five. It is a
psychological condition that
requires the help of a dietitian
to help manage or treat that
condition. But that is a very
specific diagnosis. Reds could
be anywhere along that spectrum.
It just depends on each
individual athlete. So treating
reds can be very challenging
because you don't treat
them the way you would treat
them. So it's a very specific
issue. So, Amy, whatever the
issue might be, at what point
does somebody know when to seek
help? If somebody is struggling
with sleep, depression,
injuries, frequent illness for
our female athletes, any changes
in their menstrual cycles, so if
they're having fewer than nine
menstrual cycles in a year,
that's reason to seek help. And
that's really important because
of their bone health. So what
happens is when you're under
fueling, the body doesn't have
enough calories for that basic
physiological function and
managing our hormones. So that
lends us to missing periods,
and that leads to bone issues.
And we have done a feature in
the past talking about an
athlete that had an eating
disorder, and you kind of dove
into that. And I think that's
the mental health part of it
here at Nebraska to that you
and Brett Haskell and that team
can work together when there is
an issue that that might come
up from something like that.
Yeah Anytime we're dealing with
student athletes with injuries,
sleep issues, psychological
issues, nutrition issues. It is
not just one discipline that's
involved. It affects every
aspect of their life. So Reds
really is a multi disciplinary
discipline. And we're not going
to be looking for any risk
factors that may pop up. So if
it's just under fueling right?
If an athlete is under fueled,
what are some of the foods or
that you go to immediately to
grab? If an athlete is
struggling with under fueling
and I was to approach them and
say, Ooh, actually, you need
another 500 or 1000 calories
today. That's not going to be
really effective. That scares
them. So what are the
components of those meals? What
is the amount of calories that
an athlete is if they're
currently eating three meals
during the day and a snack?
What are the components of
those meals? Are we missing a
group of macronutrients at
lunchtime? For example, maybe
they have a salad with a piece
of salmon, but they don't have
any carbohydrates to fuel the
activity they're going to be
doing in the afternoon, so we
might add some carbohydrates at
lunch. Maybe their afternoon
meal is a salad with a piece of
salmon, but they're not doing
anything at bedtime because
they've heard through our diet
culture that we shouldn't eat
after seven PM. Most athletes
should have a bedtime snack,
so we're going to encourage
encourage another snack that's
high in protein and
carbohydrates. A yogurt parfait
with fresh berries and granola,
potentially a bowl of oatmeal
made with milk, peanut butter
and a banana sliced in there.
Maybe a deli meat sandwich with
a slice of avocado in there.
Maybe we can add some of the
opportunities in their current
fueling pattern where we can
add something else in whether
it's a piece of cheese on the
burger they're already eating.
Maybe a slice of avocado in
their stir fry bowl or
enhancing their snack. And we
we've already covered a lot of
information in three episodes,
but and I know this something
you guys go to school for, but
how do you continue to stay up
with all the knowledge and not
just the
information that you have?
Because it I got to imagine it
changes from time to time to
right. Well it does, because
when I was here over 20 years
ago, we only had the female
athlete triad and now 20 years
later, we have reds, which
incorporates our male and our
female athletes who are under
fueling and it's continuously
changing. So we do attend a
lot of conferences. I just
came back with our team
physician, Dr Janet selling. We
were out in Boston for a week
and we were just trying to get
our kids back to school and
continuously getting educated
and trying to bring some of
those new things we learn back
to this environment. One of
the things just for people that
when we were talking about
eating disorders, what happens
when someone wants to dig in
their feet and not. Listen not
eat and whether it be
disordered, eating eating
disorders or that reds that
you're talking about when they
are not really wanting to hear
what you're trying to tell them
that their body needs, right?
So that's one of the things
that we do when we talk about
eating disorder. Oftentimes we
have to pull them out of sport
initially to get them the help
that they need. There are risk
to themselves if they are
trying to train and compete
under fueled. So that means
I'm usually going to our team
physician athletic trainer
talking to them about what I'm
seeing. And they're going to
ultimately be the ones that
pull that student athlete out
of sport. Um student athletes
and I'm going to be the one
that completes a way for
outpatient treatment, maybe
partial residential or
intensive outpatient something
more than what we can provide
for them here. Someone might
be listening and might need
help or know somebody that
needs help. Do you have a
resource that they could go to
to seek out help? Um I would
ask them to follow up with
their physician and or ask for
a referral to a dietitian that
works in the sports related
field. So that's that's that's
it for this week. We're back
with the Oscar performance
nutrition, the director of
performance nutrition here.
We're back with another
episode of the Oscars
performance podcast next week.
So keep it right here on the
Oscars Radio Network podcast.
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this podcast. Thank you.