WEBVTT 00:00:01.899 --> 00:00:05.059 Welcome to The Vegan Report, my name is Ryan 00:00:05.059 --> 00:00:09.099 and today we remember and honor the incredible 00:00:09.099 --> 00:00:13.400 life of Jane Goodall. The Jane Goodall Institute, 00:00:13.640 --> 00:00:17.420 founded by Jane herself, had those words to say 00:00:17.420 --> 00:00:21.879 about her passing. Throughout her life and remarkable 00:00:21.879 --> 00:00:26.100 career, Jane inspired generations of scientists, 00:00:26.620 --> 00:00:30.320 brought hope to countless people from all walks 00:00:30.320 --> 00:00:35.340 of life and urged us all to remember that, quote, 00:00:35.799 --> 00:00:39.420 every single one of us makes a difference every 00:00:39.420 --> 00:00:44.020 day. It is up to us as to the kind of difference 00:00:44.020 --> 00:00:49.399 we make. To discuss Jane Goodall's life and her 00:00:49.399 --> 00:00:52.780 legacy, I have with me three people who have 00:00:52.780 --> 00:00:56.060 met her and whose lives have been touched by 00:00:56.060 --> 00:01:00.899 her life work. I am joined by Dr. Mary Lee Jainspolt, 00:01:01.100 --> 00:01:04.099 the Primate Communication Scientist and Associate 00:01:04.099 --> 00:01:08.280 Director at FUNA Foundation, the only chimp sanctuary 00:01:08.280 --> 00:01:12.140 in Canada, and Friends of Washu, a non -profit 00:01:12.140 --> 00:01:15.939 organization dedicated to the welfare of chimpanzees. 00:01:16.439 --> 00:01:19.920 She is also the very first guest of The Vegan 00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:25.019 Report. Yes, from episode 1. I can say with confidence 00:01:25.019 --> 00:01:28.799 that without her voice, this podcast would not 00:01:28.799 --> 00:01:33.439 exist. I'm also joined by Dr. Alan Kornberg. 00:01:33.900 --> 00:01:37.540 a pediatrician and professor of pediatrics by 00:01:37.540 --> 00:01:40.780 profession, who served as executive director 00:01:40.780 --> 00:01:44.040 for the United States for World Animal Protection 00:01:44.040 --> 00:01:48.359 and for Farm Sanctuary. He is now the president 00:01:48.359 --> 00:01:51.540 of the Global Federation of Animal Sanctuaries 00:01:51.540 --> 00:01:55.439 and the treasurer of the Wilberforce Institute 00:01:55.439 --> 00:01:59.519 and Dharma Voices for Animals. Two amazing non 00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:03.540 -profits we have covered on this show. And lastly, 00:02:03.840 --> 00:02:07.019 Madeleine Krasnow, founder and executive director 00:02:07.019 --> 00:02:10.240 of Justify, the only organization in the world 00:02:10.240 --> 00:02:14.099 focused on the human cost of animal experimentation 00:02:14.099 --> 00:02:17.800 and the uniquely intimate, often painful bond 00:02:17.800 --> 00:02:21.000 between lab workers and the animals they try 00:02:21.000 --> 00:02:24.780 to care for. She appeared many times on the podcast, 00:02:25.379 --> 00:02:29.759 a testament to how deeply I value her voice and 00:02:29.759 --> 00:02:34.520 contributions. If you haven't already, I encourage 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:37.719 you to connect with and support the Jane Goodall 00:02:37.719 --> 00:02:41.699 Institute, FUNA Sanctuary, Friends of Washu, 00:02:42.120 --> 00:02:44.759 the Global Federation of Animal Sanctuaries, 00:02:45.240 --> 00:02:49.879 and Justify. Those are good places to ground 00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:53.840 your activism. Share this episode with the vegans 00:02:53.840 --> 00:02:58.199 you know. This episode is an inspiring invitation 00:02:58.199 --> 00:03:01.960 to action. For more meaningful conversations, 00:03:02.259 --> 00:03:06.099 follow the show. As always, thank you for listening. 00:03:08.879 --> 00:03:11.520 I guess we could start with a simple question 00:03:11.520 --> 00:03:16.000 about Jane Goodall, which is, what was your first 00:03:16.000 --> 00:03:19.219 contact with her? The first time maybe you met 00:03:19.219 --> 00:03:24.099 her, your first memory of her or with her? So 00:03:24.099 --> 00:03:28.050 who wants to answer the question first? Yeah, 00:03:28.050 --> 00:03:37.909 so my first time meeting her in person, I was 00:03:37.909 --> 00:03:43.530 a master's student at Central Washington University 00:03:43.530 --> 00:03:46.810 where Washoe and the other signing chimps lived. 00:03:47.969 --> 00:03:51.629 And at the time they lived, this was in I think 00:03:51.629 --> 00:03:54.569 about 1988, they were living on the third floor 00:03:54.569 --> 00:03:58.680 of the psychology building. And my mentor Roger 00:03:58.680 --> 00:04:02.800 Fouts had brought them there in 1980. State had 00:04:02.800 --> 00:04:05.879 promised to immediately build a building where 00:04:05.879 --> 00:04:09.180 they could be outside. And then right after they 00:04:09.180 --> 00:04:13.199 moved there, the state went into financial exigency. 00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:16.079 I think that's the word for declaring bankruptcy. 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:21.589 And so the chimps had been... you know, they 00:04:21.589 --> 00:04:24.629 were just sort of stuck in the psychology building. 00:04:24.750 --> 00:04:29.149 So he spent over a decade, he and his wife, Deborah 00:04:29.149 --> 00:04:33.470 Fouts, to build a building for the chimps on 00:04:33.470 --> 00:04:39.230 campus. And we were in the last phases of doing 00:04:39.230 --> 00:04:42.250 fundraising, we had to get the legislator because 00:04:42.250 --> 00:04:45.689 it was on a university campus, a state -owned 00:04:45.689 --> 00:04:50.579 campus. we had to get the legislators to agree 00:04:50.579 --> 00:04:54.899 for the funding. And so Jane Goodall came and 00:04:54.899 --> 00:05:00.360 addressed the legislators. Everything stopped, 00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:03.480 all business stopped. And then we also had a 00:05:03.480 --> 00:05:07.740 gala and she came to the gala. And so that was 00:05:07.740 --> 00:05:16.639 my first time meeting her. And then Yeah, so 00:05:16.639 --> 00:05:19.500 I guess I'll stop there with the first time. 00:05:19.620 --> 00:05:22.139 I mean, it was just, you know, mind blowing and 00:05:22.139 --> 00:05:28.279 overwhelming. And it already, you know, worshipped 00:05:28.279 --> 00:05:31.579 everything about her because I wanted to work 00:05:31.579 --> 00:05:36.100 with apes. And she had just a couple of years 00:05:36.100 --> 00:05:39.139 before that published the chimpanzees of Gombe, 00:05:39.259 --> 00:05:43.560 which was like the Bible of the chimp lab, because 00:05:43.560 --> 00:05:47.360 it's just It's an incredible book. It's so well 00:05:47.360 --> 00:05:51.139 written and so perfectly illustrated and explains 00:05:51.139 --> 00:05:56.100 chimps and their behaviors. So it was really, 00:05:56.100 --> 00:05:59.639 you know, just sort of rooted in chimp behavior, 00:05:59.959 --> 00:06:05.199 which, yeah, that's me. Thank you, Mary Lee. 00:06:05.560 --> 00:06:09.199 I feel the need to jump in here because things 00:06:09.199 --> 00:06:11.980 are coming back to me from college right now. 00:06:12.060 --> 00:06:16.889 And I could have sworn that I reached out to 00:06:16.889 --> 00:06:21.189 you, Mary Lee. I don't know if that is true or 00:06:21.189 --> 00:06:24.490 if it was one of my intentions, because I even 00:06:24.490 --> 00:06:28.430 took sign language when I had started to learn 00:06:28.430 --> 00:06:31.910 about the chimps at the time that were being 00:06:31.910 --> 00:06:35.850 used in, you know, like at Central Washington 00:06:35.850 --> 00:06:38.509 University. So this was one of the things that 00:06:38.509 --> 00:06:43.709 I became aware of and had read Roger Fowd's books. 00:06:44.819 --> 00:06:47.740 So this is all coming back to me, which is very 00:06:47.740 --> 00:06:52.040 wild. So I guess I can also just like chime in 00:06:52.040 --> 00:06:54.639 that, you know, Jane Goodall has been someone 00:06:54.639 --> 00:06:58.199 that I've looked up to for as long as I can remember. 00:06:58.339 --> 00:07:01.839 And when I went to college at the University 00:07:01.839 --> 00:07:07.680 of Wisconsin -Madison, I ended up studying zoology 00:07:07.680 --> 00:07:12.079 and child development. basically determined to 00:07:12.079 --> 00:07:14.920 follow in Jane Goodall's footsteps and work in 00:07:14.920 --> 00:07:21.540 primate conservation. And so this obviously guided 00:07:21.540 --> 00:07:28.139 me in a number of ways, but I had the opportunity 00:07:28.139 --> 00:07:33.579 to meet her in 2013 when she was speaking at 00:07:33.579 --> 00:07:36.740 the University of Wisconsin's Earth Day event. 00:07:37.579 --> 00:07:42.639 And that was just, Incredible because first of 00:07:42.639 --> 00:07:45.600 all I waited in line for I think probably three 00:07:45.600 --> 00:07:50.220 hours to just you know go and say hello to her 00:07:50.220 --> 00:07:56.259 and I was with my mom and When we finally got 00:07:56.259 --> 00:08:01.639 up to chat with her You know, I I'm trying to 00:08:01.639 --> 00:08:03.680 figure out what do I say? What do I say? And 00:08:03.680 --> 00:08:05.860 I guess my mom was also having the same feeling 00:08:07.899 --> 00:08:10.120 And so, you know, it's that kind of like general, 00:08:10.300 --> 00:08:12.180 like, thank you for your work. You've always 00:08:12.180 --> 00:08:15.740 inspired me. And she was like, Well, thank you. 00:08:15.879 --> 00:08:19.620 But, you know, what do you do? And I was just 00:08:19.620 --> 00:08:23.730 like, I, you know, like, what does it matter 00:08:23.730 --> 00:08:26.790 what I do, right? But at the same time, I think 00:08:26.790 --> 00:08:30.910 it's so telling because that is who she is. She 00:08:30.910 --> 00:08:34.070 cares so much about what others, who others are 00:08:34.070 --> 00:08:38.190 and what they are doing. And, you know, is just 00:08:38.190 --> 00:08:40.769 someone who isn't trying to have the attention 00:08:40.769 --> 00:08:45.389 on herself. And I just, you know, I've always 00:08:45.389 --> 00:08:47.769 looked back on that moment, which I guess now 00:08:47.769 --> 00:08:52.750 is over 10 years ago. And reflected on just, 00:08:52.750 --> 00:08:58.029 you know, her exquisite leadership in, you know, 00:08:58.990 --> 00:09:03.169 really being someone who empowers others and 00:09:03.169 --> 00:09:09.250 inspires them to, to do good. So little about 00:09:09.250 --> 00:09:14.710 me. Thank you, Maddie. Alan. Yeah, the first 00:09:14.710 --> 00:09:18.769 time I met her, it was probably seven or eight 00:09:18.769 --> 00:09:22.320 or nine years ago, I was You know, I, as you 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:25.080 know, and we worked together at Donal Voices 00:09:25.080 --> 00:09:27.220 for Animals, I work with a whole bunch of different 00:09:27.220 --> 00:09:29.659 animal protection charities. And so I've been 00:09:29.659 --> 00:09:32.039 on the board of the Global Federation of Animal 00:09:32.039 --> 00:09:36.639 Sanctuaries. And so I live outside of Boston. 00:09:37.019 --> 00:09:42.240 And so I was one of our sanctuaries, Foster Parrots, 00:09:42.559 --> 00:09:46.129 totally unrelated to. chimps or primates is in 00:09:46.129 --> 00:09:48.710 Rhode Island. So, you know, just for me, an easy, 00:09:48.710 --> 00:09:52.049 easy trip. And I was intending to just visit 00:09:52.049 --> 00:09:55.330 at some point for just a board member. And so 00:09:55.330 --> 00:09:58.990 when I was going back and forth with the executive 00:09:58.990 --> 00:10:01.289 director of Worcester Parish, she said, well, 00:10:01.529 --> 00:10:03.090 here's a few days you can come. But just so you 00:10:03.090 --> 00:10:05.470 know, Dr. Goodall is coming to visit with us 00:10:05.470 --> 00:10:07.429 on this day with that work for you. And it was 00:10:07.429 --> 00:10:10.750 like, you know, it's like. somebody the president 00:10:10.750 --> 00:10:12.129 was coming, I might have checked my calendar, 00:10:12.230 --> 00:10:13.909 but it was, you know, Dr. Goodall, and I didn't 00:10:13.909 --> 00:10:16.830 even check my calendar, right? So, I hadn't met 00:10:16.830 --> 00:10:20.070 her. And so she, you know, she's, as both Mary 00:10:20.070 --> 00:10:22.490 Lee and Maddie have described, I mean, she's 00:10:22.490 --> 00:10:27.210 lovely and self -effacing and was, and is always 00:10:27.210 --> 00:10:30.970 looking at what about the other person. And so, 00:10:31.070 --> 00:10:32.870 I was really touched. There were about 50 people 00:10:32.870 --> 00:10:35.269 at Foster Parrots that day. I should also mention 00:10:35.269 --> 00:10:39.059 this, that's kind of karma. I still get Nat Geo, 00:10:39.179 --> 00:10:42.220 National Geographic's physical magazine, and 00:10:42.220 --> 00:10:45.799 dating myself here, right? And so in my mailbox, 00:10:46.740 --> 00:10:51.500 the day before I went to Forced Apparent, Nat 00:10:51.500 --> 00:10:55.259 Geo came. And the 20 -something year old in khakis, 00:10:55.679 --> 00:10:59.620 Dr. Goodall, was on the cover. So that seemed 00:10:59.620 --> 00:11:05.990 like karma. And so she came. the first part. 00:11:06.549 --> 00:11:08.990 And she was carrying three stuffed animals. She 00:11:08.990 --> 00:11:12.309 was carrying a chimp, shockingly, and a cow, 00:11:12.529 --> 00:11:16.029 and either a mouse or a rat. And so, of course, 00:11:16.029 --> 00:11:18.610 making the point about what we do and shouldn't 00:11:18.610 --> 00:11:21.509 do to the animals that we share the planet with. 00:11:21.649 --> 00:11:26.230 And so it was all very, very touching. She spent 00:11:26.230 --> 00:11:29.870 like 50 people there. And somehow, when I... 00:11:29.740 --> 00:11:32.139 practice medicine for a while and you know in 00:11:32.139 --> 00:11:34.179 medicine like many professions you try very hard 00:11:34.179 --> 00:11:36.139 when you're in the room with a patient or you 00:11:36.139 --> 00:11:39.240 know some people a client that all that matters 00:11:39.240 --> 00:11:44.379 is that person right and so it's uh and she is 00:11:44.379 --> 00:11:46.980 the best person in the world for that and it 00:11:46.980 --> 00:11:50.320 was amazing how everyone that met with her including 00:11:50.320 --> 00:11:54.000 me and to a lot of people there felt like there 00:11:54.000 --> 00:11:57.460 was no stopwatch running at all. It was just 00:11:57.460 --> 00:12:01.559 really amazing. So she asked me if, say, maybe 00:12:01.559 --> 00:12:03.779 because I'm a doctor, there's a young vet who's 00:12:03.779 --> 00:12:06.059 starting a charity that she asked if I would 00:12:06.059 --> 00:12:08.759 support or mentor. And so I was like, yes, ma 00:12:08.759 --> 00:12:12.159 'am. And then the last part of the story for 00:12:12.159 --> 00:12:17.980 me, which was Brownie, was my wife grew up idolizing 00:12:17.980 --> 00:12:21.600 Dr. Goodall. And so I asked Jane if she would 00:12:21.600 --> 00:12:25.049 sign. the Nat Geo cover to to my better half, 00:12:25.409 --> 00:12:27.389 which she did. And so so, you know, that was 00:12:27.389 --> 00:12:30.610 like the best. It wasn't the address you put 00:12:30.610 --> 00:12:33.409 out, like the best present ever. So it was a 00:12:33.409 --> 00:12:36.509 really good get a free pass. Half kidding. But 00:12:36.509 --> 00:12:39.509 but but so but she she really I mean, she touched 00:12:39.509 --> 00:12:41.929 me in a lot of ways, but it was I mean, the two 00:12:41.929 --> 00:12:45.370 most important ways was her nonverbal messaging 00:12:45.370 --> 00:12:49.879 about all animals. And then as my colleagues 00:12:49.879 --> 00:12:53.580 here described the way that she made the other 00:12:53.580 --> 00:12:55.460 person feel like the center of the world and 00:12:55.460 --> 00:12:58.299 not her. So thank you for giving me the opportunity 00:12:58.299 --> 00:13:02.139 to share that. Yes, I want to get back to that 00:13:02.139 --> 00:13:06.299 and discuss, you know, how come she had such 00:13:06.299 --> 00:13:12.879 a deep effect on people around her. In one interview, 00:13:13.220 --> 00:13:15.659 someone asked her basically that question and 00:13:15.629 --> 00:13:20.210 she talked about the Jane effect or the Jane 00:13:20.210 --> 00:13:22.889 magic. That's what she those are the words she 00:13:22.889 --> 00:13:29.070 used. So what is what explains that magic? She 00:13:29.070 --> 00:13:34.370 was probably one of the most gifted public speakers 00:13:34.370 --> 00:13:39.470 I have ever encountered in my life. I mean, it's 00:13:39.470 --> 00:13:46.720 just It's just amazing how, you know, everybody's 00:13:46.720 --> 00:13:50.779 just so enthralled with what she was saying. 00:13:51.039 --> 00:13:55.799 So it's just a really, really gifted speaker. 00:13:56.360 --> 00:13:59.320 And I mean, that one -on -one thing is, yes, 00:13:59.360 --> 00:14:01.419 she makes you feel like you're the center of 00:14:01.419 --> 00:14:07.799 the world, but I was just so struck. I saw her 00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:10.200 speak a couple of times. One time was at Pal 00:14:10.200 --> 00:14:13.820 Books in Portland. I think she was on book tour 00:14:13.820 --> 00:14:17.340 and I had the opportunity to introduce her. And 00:14:17.340 --> 00:14:21.620 then she launched into her talk and it was, I 00:14:21.620 --> 00:14:26.500 mean, she's just such a gifted speaker. It's 00:14:26.500 --> 00:14:31.600 such a talent. And she was just able to pull 00:14:31.600 --> 00:14:37.519 people and incredibly charismatic person. I would 00:14:37.519 --> 00:14:43.720 add, last time Mr. Mysore was probably a couple 00:14:43.720 --> 00:14:45.620 of years ago, and she was giving a talk in Boston, 00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:49.779 and so my wife and I attended and spent a couple 00:14:49.779 --> 00:14:51.440 of minutes and said hello and all that, but we 00:14:51.440 --> 00:14:55.100 attended her talk, and so she was maybe a few 00:14:55.100 --> 00:15:02.049 months short of 90 then. She traveled to Boston 00:15:02.049 --> 00:15:05.049 from someplace out of country, so it was a significant 00:15:05.049 --> 00:15:09.509 trip. And she's on this stage in this maybe like 00:15:09.509 --> 00:15:12.769 2 ,000 or 3 ,000 person theater kind of building. 00:15:13.730 --> 00:15:16.929 And I was kind of shocked about how good she 00:15:16.929 --> 00:15:23.529 was. It wasn't just the presence she had. Given 00:15:23.529 --> 00:15:26.250 her other talents and attributes, she would... 00:15:26.250 --> 00:15:28.370 I mean, I just sort of... assume, which always 00:15:28.370 --> 00:15:30.950 gets you in trouble, that she would, you know, 00:15:30.970 --> 00:15:33.389 be self -spoken and, you know, she would touch 00:15:33.389 --> 00:15:36.250 the audience in her special way, but not as this 00:15:36.250 --> 00:15:38.230 charismatic public speaker. Plus, she was just 00:15:38.230 --> 00:15:40.190 short of 90 and she just got off of like a six 00:15:40.190 --> 00:15:44.350 or seven hour flight. And I was like, oh my God. 00:15:44.730 --> 00:15:50.590 So what you said is some combination of probably 00:15:50.590 --> 00:15:55.230 good genes and experience, but this quiet, lovely, 00:15:55.450 --> 00:15:59.139 touching determination. all wrapped into one 00:15:59.139 --> 00:16:08.000 special person. Yeah, I think she was an incredibly 00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:12.100 thoughtful person in her use of language and 00:16:12.100 --> 00:16:16.480 how she communicated about the chimpanzees and 00:16:16.480 --> 00:16:20.820 just the natural world itself, which I have always 00:16:21.080 --> 00:16:27.220 found really inspiring and also welcoming. She 00:16:27.220 --> 00:16:31.960 wouldn't shy away from the urgency of issues, 00:16:32.460 --> 00:16:36.980 but she also had a way of talking about it that 00:16:36.980 --> 00:16:40.159 helped still motivate people to feel like they 00:16:40.159 --> 00:16:42.840 could do something. And I think that's not an 00:16:42.840 --> 00:16:51.470 easy task. It's difficult to talk about. Heartbreaking 00:16:51.470 --> 00:16:53.710 like the suffering that's going on in the world 00:16:53.710 --> 00:16:55.649 and then at the same time be like there's something 00:16:55.649 --> 00:16:58.909 we can do there are reasons for hope right and 00:16:58.909 --> 00:17:03.970 I think she had a really. Just excellent way 00:17:03.970 --> 00:17:08.690 of of going about that I know it always inspired 00:17:08.690 --> 00:17:13.569 me despite the harm taking place I mean I think 00:17:13.569 --> 00:17:16.009 of there's a. quote that's been going around 00:17:16.009 --> 00:17:19.329 recently where she says something along the lines 00:17:19.329 --> 00:17:24.470 of, um, like the immune, the amazing human brain 00:17:24.470 --> 00:17:27.130 has already discovered all of this. And she was 00:17:27.130 --> 00:17:30.250 talking about animal research and in particular, 00:17:30.250 --> 00:17:33.390 and I just liked the way that she sort of like 00:17:33.390 --> 00:17:36.170 humans are amazing. And that's why we should 00:17:36.170 --> 00:17:40.150 be able to do human relevant research, you know, 00:17:40.170 --> 00:17:44.910 like she's. The way she talks it's just not demonizing 00:17:44.910 --> 00:17:49.950 it's inspiring it's empowering and that gentle 00:17:49.950 --> 00:17:53.190 gentle like thoughtful presence and approach 00:17:53.190 --> 00:17:57.650 was also very obvious to me in like photography 00:17:57.650 --> 00:18:01.230 and videography where i would see her with the 00:18:01.230 --> 00:18:06.769 champs so i just it really felt like. We got 00:18:06.769 --> 00:18:12.230 to know this this genuinely good person. And, 00:18:12.349 --> 00:18:15.549 yeah, I think that just resonates with a lot 00:18:15.549 --> 00:18:20.690 of people. If we talk about the legacy of Jane 00:18:20.690 --> 00:18:25.910 Cuddle, what should be, you know, how should 00:18:25.910 --> 00:18:29.849 we remember her? Is Jane Cuddle this amazing 00:18:29.849 --> 00:18:35.329 scientist who has done so much in our understanding 00:18:35.329 --> 00:18:40.829 of primates? Or is she this activist for you 00:18:40.829 --> 00:18:43.809 know, denouncing what's happening with climate 00:18:43.809 --> 00:18:48.609 change and the climate crisis, you know, she's 00:18:48.609 --> 00:18:51.890 a complex figure in that sense. And so how should 00:18:51.890 --> 00:18:55.289 we remember her? I'll go first on this one, because 00:18:55.289 --> 00:19:00.410 I mean, to me, sort of the trail of, of how she 00:19:00.410 --> 00:19:05.619 ended up, I mean, to a, I mean, Like for me in 00:19:05.619 --> 00:19:09.359 the beginning and in her beginning, it was really 00:19:09.359 --> 00:19:11.700 just about the chimps, right? She wanted to live 00:19:11.700 --> 00:19:15.420 in the jungle and she was just curious and natural 00:19:15.420 --> 00:19:20.660 ethologist. But then she ends up being this activist 00:19:20.660 --> 00:19:24.740 that has such a global impact, right? I mean, 00:19:24.900 --> 00:19:27.900 it's almost as if like the chimp part of it is 00:19:27.900 --> 00:19:31.789 so under all of these layers of things. But she 00:19:31.789 --> 00:19:35.289 realized right away, you know, that the only 00:19:35.289 --> 00:19:40.190 way to help chimps was to broaden and to start 00:19:40.190 --> 00:19:43.470 talking about the environment. And then, you 00:19:43.470 --> 00:19:46.049 know, then she built from there, I mean, just 00:19:46.049 --> 00:19:49.769 brilliant to be starting the roots and shoots 00:19:49.769 --> 00:19:53.410 in the 80s, you know, and getting children involved. 00:19:55.680 --> 00:19:59.700 And so just sort of like building from there. 00:19:59.940 --> 00:20:05.380 But I think, you know, what motivated her to 00:20:05.380 --> 00:20:08.960 be what got her got her going was was the chimps. 00:20:09.859 --> 00:20:14.500 But just amazing. Like I just I realized after 00:20:14.500 --> 00:20:17.420 she passed, you know, when I was reading all 00:20:17.420 --> 00:20:20.740 the media, it's like people aren't even talking 00:20:20.740 --> 00:20:23.599 about chimps. They're talking about all the other 00:20:23.599 --> 00:20:28.730 stuff she did. which is pretty amazing, right? 00:20:29.910 --> 00:20:33.150 It was a story that I had, I think it was in 00:20:33.150 --> 00:20:35.730 one of the many, many videos about her, and it 00:20:35.730 --> 00:20:40.630 was a roots and shoots program in the DOC Democratic 00:20:40.630 --> 00:20:46.130 Republic of the Congo. And so she, they were 00:20:46.130 --> 00:20:51.329 children that were doing some combination of 00:20:51.329 --> 00:20:55.259 conservation and animal protection work. and 00:20:55.259 --> 00:20:57.980 several of, you know, militia guys came by with 00:20:57.980 --> 00:21:02.160 their semi -automatics and all that, and that 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:04.960 she was there. And so, you know, this is almost 00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:07.660 like one of those. And then, you know, the sun 00:21:07.660 --> 00:21:09.759 came out kind of, and they put their guns down 00:21:09.759 --> 00:21:12.160 and helped the kids, you know. So, you know, 00:21:12.160 --> 00:21:16.019 so there's that, you know, that touch in some 00:21:16.019 --> 00:21:20.339 way, very special. So, Maddie, did you want to 00:21:20.339 --> 00:21:23.410 answer the question too? Yeah, I don't know that 00:21:23.410 --> 00:21:26.910 I have much to add. I feel like Mary Lee covered 00:21:26.910 --> 00:21:31.309 a lot of it. I mean, I think she just, you know, 00:21:31.450 --> 00:21:39.990 inspired people in ways that, you know, translated 00:21:39.990 --> 00:21:43.630 so much into different people's personal lives 00:21:43.630 --> 00:21:49.000 and made sort of... This this journey to becoming 00:21:49.000 --> 00:21:54.619 an activist actually More accessible for like 00:21:54.619 --> 00:22:00.599 the general public And I love that it kind of 00:22:00.599 --> 00:22:04.460 sprouted from her her experience with the chimps 00:22:04.460 --> 00:22:08.579 because You know, I also see that in myself in 00:22:08.579 --> 00:22:11.539 in what happened working in a primate lab with 00:22:11.710 --> 00:22:14.109 The monkeys even though i was you know i ended 00:22:14.109 --> 00:22:16.809 up there in the first place cuz i wanted to work 00:22:16.809 --> 00:22:20.210 in conservation like her it was that experience 00:22:20.210 --> 00:22:25.490 that made my world sort of grow. And made me 00:22:25.490 --> 00:22:28.809 you know forced me to not just look at the impacts 00:22:28.809 --> 00:22:31.569 we have on animals and labs but the impacts we 00:22:31.569 --> 00:22:34.369 have on animals in all these different industries 00:22:34.369 --> 00:22:40.140 and also the human cost in. Animal research and 00:22:40.140 --> 00:22:43.000 beyond you know human suffering all over the 00:22:43.000 --> 00:22:45.440 world and how the environment ties into all of 00:22:45.440 --> 00:22:50.240 this and so I I appreciate You know the fact 00:22:50.240 --> 00:22:54.039 that we got to kind of see that growth with her 00:22:54.039 --> 00:22:59.759 and also Seeing that reflected more broadly in 00:22:59.759 --> 00:23:02.480 in the rest of us. I think it's it's important 00:23:02.480 --> 00:23:07.019 and it shows that I think being an activist is 00:23:07.240 --> 00:23:09.480 You know, sometimes that word can I think scare 00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:12.940 people or it sounds I don't know. There's there's 00:23:12.940 --> 00:23:17.380 just this connotation with it, but When it comes 00:23:17.380 --> 00:23:21.920 to Jane and being an activist somehow it softens 00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:25.720 the term and and makes it more accessible but 00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:32.599 also inspiring to be Marilee what is exactly 00:23:32.599 --> 00:23:36.569 her contribution to? our understanding of primates 00:23:36.569 --> 00:23:41.990 and, you know, advancing science. I know that 00:23:41.990 --> 00:23:47.890 she never earned an undergraduate degree that 00:23:47.890 --> 00:23:53.569 she went right to having, you know, a PhD, starting 00:23:53.569 --> 00:23:59.470 to become PhD. So what, you know, what do we 00:23:59.470 --> 00:24:02.490 owe her in terms of, you know, advancing our 00:24:02.490 --> 00:24:06.519 knowledge? Yeah, well, I guess, you know, I mean, 00:24:06.559 --> 00:24:10.440 so the story is that she was, Louis Leakey wanted 00:24:10.440 --> 00:24:14.460 to send three basically naive people into the 00:24:14.460 --> 00:24:18.119 field to study apes. And so she was the chimp, 00:24:18.140 --> 00:24:21.259 the chimp branch. And there was Brute Galticus 00:24:21.259 --> 00:24:25.339 with orangutans and Dian Fossey with gorillas. 00:24:26.339 --> 00:24:35.460 And, you know, I mean, There hadn't been long 00:24:35.460 --> 00:24:39.740 -term field studies, so researchers would sort 00:24:39.740 --> 00:24:44.319 of pop in and take a quick snapshot and then 00:24:44.319 --> 00:24:49.700 pop out. So our understanding of the lives of 00:24:49.700 --> 00:24:53.960 chimps, she's the one that brought that to us. 00:24:55.900 --> 00:24:59.000 You know telling their stories of the individuals 00:24:59.000 --> 00:25:05.660 and the relationships and the the drama And all 00:25:05.660 --> 00:25:09.099 of the goings -on and and she was you know her 00:25:09.099 --> 00:25:13.299 field site continues today but these years and 00:25:13.299 --> 00:25:16.980 years of knowing these individuals and and how 00:25:16.980 --> 00:25:23.329 they interacted and and so that really shined 00:25:23.329 --> 00:25:26.829 a different kind of a light. She also understood 00:25:26.829 --> 00:25:30.450 them as individuals with personality. She didn't 00:25:30.450 --> 00:25:33.789 know that it was a bad thing to give them names 00:25:33.789 --> 00:25:37.049 and to talk about emotions. And, you know, really 00:25:37.049 --> 00:25:42.869 in the 60s and 70s, you did not do that. And 00:25:42.869 --> 00:25:48.309 so that was tremendous, tremendous. And, you 00:25:48.309 --> 00:25:51.859 know, what she's known for is They tell the story 00:25:51.859 --> 00:25:54.660 of that, you know, she observed them making tools 00:25:54.660 --> 00:26:00.519 and that was a first. But I really think, you 00:26:00.519 --> 00:26:04.640 know, just the understanding sort of the depth 00:26:04.640 --> 00:26:08.640 of what's going on in chimpanzee's lives and 00:26:08.640 --> 00:26:16.059 that it's so much like the drama in our own lives. 00:26:17.220 --> 00:26:21.339 The best documentary uh, People of the Forest. 00:26:21.880 --> 00:26:25.740 It's like a 90 minute documentary of, um, you 00:26:25.740 --> 00:26:30.220 know, the story of the lives of from Gombe. And 00:26:30.220 --> 00:26:32.680 I mean, that's, that's just incredible to me 00:26:32.680 --> 00:26:36.380 that that's, um, so impactful. And that's what 00:26:36.380 --> 00:26:42.720 she contributed to me. Um, besides, you know, 00:26:42.799 --> 00:26:46.069 by the fact that she was spending time I can't 00:26:46.069 --> 00:26:49.809 show you the book because my computer is propped 00:26:49.809 --> 00:26:52.470 on it. It's one of the thicker books in my library. 00:26:54.029 --> 00:26:58.109 But it's this coffee table book that goes through 00:26:58.109 --> 00:27:03.269 each one of the behavioral contexts of grooming 00:27:03.269 --> 00:27:06.109 and all the behaviors in there. And it's just 00:27:06.109 --> 00:27:09.950 so interesting because she makes it. It can be 00:27:09.950 --> 00:27:13.299 pretty dry stuff, but it's written um, in such 00:27:13.299 --> 00:27:16.420 a way that it's fascinating and, um, just so 00:27:16.420 --> 00:27:19.460 detailed and she, she was just an incredible 00:27:19.460 --> 00:27:27.299 ethologist really at heart. Thank you. Um, back 00:27:27.299 --> 00:27:33.579 in 2015, um, Jane became vegan, um, and you know, 00:27:33.660 --> 00:27:36.220 looking through articles about, you know, her 00:27:36.220 --> 00:27:39.799 legacy, her impact in, in the world, I feel like 00:27:39.799 --> 00:27:43.920 her commitment to All animals, not only primates, 00:27:44.400 --> 00:27:49.000 is often put to the side. Alan, you mentioned 00:27:49.000 --> 00:27:53.440 how she was interested in sanctuaries that are 00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:58.000 not only primate sanctuaries. What should we 00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:04.319 say about the fact that she became vegan at such 00:28:04.319 --> 00:28:12.220 an advanced age in 2015? you know, she was a 00:28:12.220 --> 00:28:15.140 lifelong vegetarian, I think. But, you know, 00:28:15.220 --> 00:28:19.640 what made her become vegan? And what does it 00:28:19.640 --> 00:28:23.759 mean, you know, in terms of her, the legacy that 00:28:23.759 --> 00:28:26.960 she leaves behind? Just one observation about 00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:28.519 that. It's interesting when she came when I mentioned 00:28:28.519 --> 00:28:30.079 when she came to force the parrot and she carried, 00:28:30.099 --> 00:28:31.880 you know, three stuffed animals, a chimp and 00:28:31.880 --> 00:28:36.490 a mouse and a cow. And so, of course, one There 00:28:36.490 --> 00:28:38.809 are several stuffed animals one could use to 00:28:38.809 --> 00:28:42.829 represent the travesties of eating animals and 00:28:42.829 --> 00:28:45.690 factory farming. Usually, cows and pigs and chickens 00:28:45.690 --> 00:28:48.210 are the first three that come to mind. I haven't 00:28:48.210 --> 00:28:49.490 really thought about that, but the fact that 00:28:49.490 --> 00:28:54.230 she carried a cow may, in fact, have been her 00:28:54.230 --> 00:28:56.890 way of messaging to herself, perhaps. Now, I'm 00:28:56.890 --> 00:28:59.430 getting a little behind my pay grade, but to 00:28:59.430 --> 00:29:03.089 others, certainly, about vegetarian is better, 00:29:03.089 --> 00:29:06.369 but it's not really there. The one other comment 00:29:06.369 --> 00:29:08.970 I would make about that, so GFAST, where I first 00:29:08.970 --> 00:29:13.650 met her, she works with equine and wildlife and 00:29:13.650 --> 00:29:15.970 farmed animal sanctuaries. And she was interested 00:29:15.970 --> 00:29:18.589 in all of that and didn't really talk to me much 00:29:18.589 --> 00:29:23.190 about GFAST supports a good number of primate 00:29:23.190 --> 00:29:24.730 and a few great ape sanctuaries. She didn't really 00:29:24.730 --> 00:29:26.349 talk about that. She talked about the other sanctuaries. 00:29:26.390 --> 00:29:30.109 And she also wondered if GFAST would be interested 00:29:30.109 --> 00:29:32.529 in a program in, she didn't use this language, 00:29:32.630 --> 00:29:35.559 but Global South Countries where with the sanctuaries 00:29:35.559 --> 00:29:38.740 that support wildlife, save wildlife, if they 00:29:38.740 --> 00:29:42.160 might find a way to also take care of some of 00:29:42.160 --> 00:29:45.380 the dogs and cats that are in a bad way in that 00:29:45.380 --> 00:29:50.720 environment. And so she seemed to me like it 00:29:50.720 --> 00:29:53.140 was a multi -day conversation. It was probably 00:29:53.140 --> 00:29:58.960 well in five minutes. And so it was all touching 00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:05.509 and impressive both. So yeah. I think the transition 00:30:05.509 --> 00:30:10.650 seems like it was probably pretty natural for 00:30:10.650 --> 00:30:14.710 her. I found that I myself kind of went along 00:30:14.710 --> 00:30:19.730 that same path. You know, when you respect and 00:30:19.730 --> 00:30:23.349 care about animals, whether it's, you know, for 00:30:23.349 --> 00:30:26.109 Jane, it started with the chimps, right? And 00:30:26.109 --> 00:30:30.910 when you You see like the connection that she 00:30:30.910 --> 00:30:35.470 established with them and and how much she sort 00:30:35.470 --> 00:30:37.930 of you know her life revolved around them and 00:30:37.930 --> 00:30:41.289 she understood them as individuals with feelings 00:30:41.289 --> 00:30:46.130 and interests. You know you it's natural to start 00:30:46.130 --> 00:30:50.009 to think about these other animals no matter 00:30:50.009 --> 00:30:53.910 what industry they are. they are kind of being 00:30:53.910 --> 00:30:58.170 used in, right? And so, you know, I think it 00:30:58.170 --> 00:31:01.089 makes sense that over time as she started to 00:31:01.089 --> 00:31:03.769 think about these bigger issues and how they 00:31:03.769 --> 00:31:07.369 intersected with the protection of chimpanzees, 00:31:07.569 --> 00:31:09.529 such as the environment, you're going to start 00:31:09.529 --> 00:31:13.170 to recognize that, you know, the way we are raising 00:31:13.170 --> 00:31:16.869 animals for food is unsustainable and contributing 00:31:16.869 --> 00:31:22.759 to, you know, A myriad of of issues such as the 00:31:22.759 --> 00:31:25.940 climate crisis and deforestation that of course 00:31:25.940 --> 00:31:31.259 is impacting. You know chance and similarly i 00:31:31.259 --> 00:31:35.220 had the same sort of growth when i was not a 00:31:35.220 --> 00:31:38.619 vegetarian or vegan when i. You know group loving 00:31:38.619 --> 00:31:42.000 animals and ended up you know working in a primary 00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:46.079 lab to pursue primary conservation but it was. 00:31:46.860 --> 00:31:49.460 my feelings starting to change about the use 00:31:49.460 --> 00:31:52.460 of animals, of course these monkeys in labs, 00:31:52.539 --> 00:31:55.119 but also starting to question, well, if I care 00:31:55.119 --> 00:31:58.079 about them, why don't I care about the cow that's 00:31:58.079 --> 00:32:01.859 on my plate? And, you know, a few years later, 00:32:02.019 --> 00:32:05.400 then starting to recognize how the dairy and 00:32:05.400 --> 00:32:09.200 the egg industries work and ultimately doing 00:32:09.200 --> 00:32:12.440 my best to eliminate the use of animals in my 00:32:12.440 --> 00:32:17.730 life. So I think it it was a pretty natural progression 00:32:17.730 --> 00:32:22.250 for her and inspiring to see her do that and 00:32:22.250 --> 00:32:26.809 continue to kind of be this figure that so many 00:32:26.809 --> 00:32:30.049 people look up to when there can be so much stigma 00:32:30.049 --> 00:32:34.829 around the term vegan or eating vegan or whatever 00:32:34.829 --> 00:32:39.240 it, however you want to talk about it. You know, 00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:41.019 there's always there's there's always learning 00:32:41.019 --> 00:32:42.720 and there's always change and positive change 00:32:42.720 --> 00:32:44.440 in all that I just observing though and of course 00:32:44.440 --> 00:32:47.940 she wasn't an average person anyway, but having 00:32:47.940 --> 00:32:50.299 done, you know a good amount of plant -based 00:32:50.299 --> 00:32:55.599 nutrition work the the number of People past 00:32:55.599 --> 00:32:58.960 the age of 80 who become vegan is at that point 00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:02.960 in one's life is is Vanishingly small. So let's 00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:10.329 just loading that as well. So Yeah And in any 00:33:10.329 --> 00:33:14.849 case, I realized since her passing, how much 00:33:14.849 --> 00:33:19.670 she meant for animal rights activists that want 00:33:19.670 --> 00:33:25.609 to create this vegan world. I think I've seen 00:33:25.609 --> 00:33:31.589 PETA even building kind of a space to commemorate 00:33:31.589 --> 00:33:36.140 Jane Goodall at their headquarters. And so she 00:33:36.140 --> 00:33:38.819 meant a lot and the fact that she became vegan, 00:33:38.819 --> 00:33:43.299 you know, that just rooted her into, you know, 00:33:43.519 --> 00:33:48.059 this figure, this icon of the animal rights movement. 00:33:48.640 --> 00:33:54.940 Um, yeah. Um, in, you know, I, in preparation 00:33:54.940 --> 00:33:58.619 for this, uh, conversation, I watched some of 00:33:58.619 --> 00:34:03.259 her last interviews and in many of them, she 00:34:03.259 --> 00:34:08.119 mentions. how this world is kind of dark and, 00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:12.460 you know, we're living in such a dark era. I 00:34:12.460 --> 00:34:17.079 would love to talk about, you know, the issues 00:34:17.079 --> 00:34:21.380 that made her stand up, you know, take the mic 00:34:21.380 --> 00:34:26.559 at, you know, 90 in her nineties, doing media 00:34:26.559 --> 00:34:30.940 tours and talking about them. And, you know, 00:34:31.000 --> 00:34:34.039 raising her voice, giving her voice for for those 00:34:34.039 --> 00:34:37.860 issues. You know, what are those? What is this? 00:34:38.300 --> 00:34:44.119 Darker than issues that she she was talking about 00:34:44.119 --> 00:34:48.219 and that alarmed her so much. I would make if 00:34:48.219 --> 00:34:50.019 I could, I would just make two apps of that, 00:34:50.019 --> 00:34:52.659 you know, at risk of being a little bit like 00:34:52.659 --> 00:34:54.260 a politician here and not quite answering the 00:34:54.260 --> 00:34:57.500 question that you asked. But but but so so I 00:34:57.500 --> 00:35:00.500 would just make a couple of observations about 00:35:00.500 --> 00:35:05.099 her. And so one is that she always, and wrote 00:35:05.099 --> 00:35:07.500 a book on this, always believed in hope. And 00:35:07.500 --> 00:35:12.559 so she always saw the good side of people. As 00:35:12.559 --> 00:35:17.940 I read what she wrote, I sometimes thought she's 00:35:17.940 --> 00:35:20.519 more understanding and more hopeful than I am 00:35:20.519 --> 00:35:24.559 on most days. But she always, I think always, 00:35:24.639 --> 00:35:26.239 but frequently would see the positive side and 00:35:26.239 --> 00:35:28.530 the opportunity that people will come to their 00:35:28.530 --> 00:35:31.550 senses and make change. And the other thing I 00:35:31.550 --> 00:35:39.210 would say about her is that she didn't seek fame. 00:35:40.210 --> 00:35:44.409 And she learned that she had become this icon 00:35:44.409 --> 00:35:47.130 that was one of the most well -known people in 00:35:47.130 --> 00:35:53.610 the world. And she saw that as a I guess a responsibility, 00:35:53.769 --> 00:35:56.929 and that sort of has a responsibility to utilize 00:35:56.929 --> 00:35:58.909 that. It wasn't what she sought when she had 00:35:58.909 --> 00:36:01.369 it, and she wouldn't waste it, that she would 00:36:01.369 --> 00:36:04.730 utilize it for the good, for the kinds of causes 00:36:04.730 --> 00:36:10.130 you're talking about. So I'm sorry if I did, 00:36:10.650 --> 00:36:13.969 but I'm reflecting on it. I'm sort of in this 00:36:13.969 --> 00:36:16.389 intellectual and emotive space about her right 00:36:16.389 --> 00:36:18.750 now, and so that's what comes to mind for me. 00:36:19.849 --> 00:36:23.429 Yeah, I heard her talk about how someone offered 00:36:23.429 --> 00:36:29.150 her a private jet and she declined. How, you 00:36:29.150 --> 00:36:32.050 know, there were big oil companies offering, 00:36:32.050 --> 00:36:36.409 you know, funding to her nonprofits and how she 00:36:36.409 --> 00:36:40.110 declined that important funding because again 00:36:40.110 --> 00:36:45.150 of her commitment, deep commitment to those ethical 00:36:45.150 --> 00:36:50.860 principles. But yeah, merrily. Well, I was just 00:36:50.860 --> 00:36:55.500 going to say, I think, I mean, I remember one 00:36:55.500 --> 00:37:00.139 of the times that she visited us in Ellensburg, 00:37:00.219 --> 00:37:02.500 I think after we got that new building, she came 00:37:02.500 --> 00:37:05.639 to see it and to see how the chimps were doing 00:37:05.639 --> 00:37:09.420 there. And so that would have been, you know, 00:37:09.460 --> 00:37:15.300 in the mid 90s. And, you know, the US government 00:37:15.300 --> 00:37:19.250 was putting an embargo on somebody or sanctions 00:37:19.250 --> 00:37:22.769 on somebody. And I remember her mentioning, just 00:37:22.769 --> 00:37:29.710 going, oh, the sanctions are just awful, what 00:37:29.710 --> 00:37:35.010 it's doing to the people. And I was a grad student. 00:37:35.429 --> 00:37:37.429 So at that point in life, all I could think about 00:37:37.429 --> 00:37:41.309 was being a graduate student and completely immersed 00:37:41.309 --> 00:37:44.809 in that world and unaware of the news. And it 00:37:44.809 --> 00:37:49.539 was Um, you know, so I, it makes me think even, 00:37:49.699 --> 00:37:52.539 even then, I mean, but she was global. She was 00:37:52.539 --> 00:37:56.800 a global person. So sort of being aware, um, 00:37:57.059 --> 00:38:01.039 and deeply empathetic for people. Um, you know, 00:38:01.039 --> 00:38:04.119 she just didn't live in this, in this bubble, 00:38:04.480 --> 00:38:11.179 like she was all over the place. Um, and I, I, 00:38:11.179 --> 00:38:14.840 I did watch that, you know, that it's sort of 00:38:14.840 --> 00:38:18.650 morbid, but it but really though the Netflix 00:38:18.650 --> 00:38:21.429 documentary that was recorded before she died 00:38:21.429 --> 00:38:26.969 right so but I think that that darkness that 00:38:26.969 --> 00:38:30.289 you're talking about was more intense because 00:38:30.289 --> 00:38:32.769 you know I had seen her when she published Reason 00:38:32.769 --> 00:38:37.019 for Hope you know and she really was Hopeful 00:38:37.019 --> 00:38:40.760 and trying to inspire hope and i felt like with 00:38:40.760 --> 00:38:43.639 that one it's that's this netflix documentary 00:38:43.639 --> 00:38:48.019 it's like the world is is imploding and we're 00:38:48.019 --> 00:38:51.280 running out of time. You know she still have 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:54.800 that message of you as an individual can do something 00:38:54.800 --> 00:39:05.630 that but. I did. do feel like getting into American 00:39:05.630 --> 00:39:08.429 politics and stuff because really it is bigger 00:39:08.429 --> 00:39:18.489 than that. But I just felt like she didn't sound 00:39:18.489 --> 00:39:22.130 as hopeful. She sounded like we're in a desperate 00:39:22.130 --> 00:39:27.849 place. And that was the take home for me. So 00:39:27.849 --> 00:39:32.190 yes, a very dark, dark place. Yeah, I felt the 00:39:32.190 --> 00:39:36.650 same way listening to her. Maddie, did you want 00:39:36.650 --> 00:39:39.750 to add something? So to be honest, I've seen 00:39:39.750 --> 00:39:43.070 a clip from it, but I have not watched it yet. 00:39:43.690 --> 00:39:47.989 And the reasoning being that I haven't, you know, 00:39:48.130 --> 00:39:51.690 emotionally prepared myself, you know, for it. 00:39:52.269 --> 00:39:58.860 I was actually at back at my alma mater at the 00:39:58.860 --> 00:40:02.059 university of wisconsin madison doing outreach 00:40:02.059 --> 00:40:05.320 on campus to students about the primate labs 00:40:05.320 --> 00:40:07.699 on campus and my experience working in the lab 00:40:07.699 --> 00:40:15.860 when i found out that she had died and um i i 00:40:15.860 --> 00:40:19.280 just immediately burst into tears like it was 00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:24.809 just this like overwhelming grief For someone 00:40:24.809 --> 00:40:27.710 that I really did not know well right like I 00:40:27.710 --> 00:40:32.550 I know that I had you know Wonderfully got to 00:40:32.550 --> 00:40:36.530 meet her for a couple of minutes but aside from 00:40:36.530 --> 00:40:39.409 that she was really someone that I just looked 00:40:39.409 --> 00:40:47.230 up to and admired and yet like The heaviness 00:40:47.230 --> 00:40:51.650 of her sort of leaving the planet and the hope 00:40:51.650 --> 00:40:54.750 that I feel like she has always kind of represented. 00:40:56.369 --> 00:41:01.309 Has been a lot to sort of take in, especially 00:41:01.309 --> 00:41:05.070 because it felt a little full circle being back 00:41:05.070 --> 00:41:08.949 on campus where I had met her and learning of 00:41:08.949 --> 00:41:12.469 this news and you know. We're all we're all gonna 00:41:12.469 --> 00:41:15.849 die one day right but it's just with jane i think 00:41:15.849 --> 00:41:19.110 i was hoping it just wouldn't happen somehow 00:41:19.110 --> 00:41:22.769 which is how i feel about like my dog for example 00:41:22.769 --> 00:41:25.329 there's just certain you know there's certain 00:41:25.329 --> 00:41:29.550 people that you just. You know feel like this 00:41:29.550 --> 00:41:37.170 even bigger loss. And i don't blame her for being. 00:41:37.610 --> 00:41:40.949 you know, for struggling to find that hope and 00:41:40.949 --> 00:41:44.610 feeling less hopeful. Because the world right 00:41:44.610 --> 00:41:50.550 now is, it's a really tough place. And, you know, 00:41:50.610 --> 00:41:58.510 so we do have a lot we need to figure out and 00:41:58.510 --> 00:42:01.690 find our place in it all, as Jane would have 00:42:01.690 --> 00:42:08.190 wanted, in terms of reducing that harm. But Yeah, 00:42:08.269 --> 00:42:13.530 it's, I think it's, it's just, it's, it's hard 00:42:13.530 --> 00:42:17.750 and it's overwhelming to kind of, I don't know, 00:42:17.929 --> 00:42:20.909 feel optimistic all the time. And, and we needed 00:42:20.909 --> 00:42:24.489 to see probably that Jane, Jane struggles with 00:42:24.489 --> 00:42:28.010 that too, struggled. I clearly struggled to put 00:42:28.010 --> 00:42:33.010 Jane in past tense. If I could build on sort 00:42:33.010 --> 00:42:37.719 of what Maddie has just brought up and The day 00:42:37.719 --> 00:42:42.219 for me that I learned about it, I had spent the 00:42:42.219 --> 00:42:49.090 morning, we actually had grief. counselors that 00:42:49.090 --> 00:42:53.710 had come to Fauna, so I had zoomed into the meeting 00:42:53.710 --> 00:42:58.250 because we experience so much loss with elderly 00:42:58.250 --> 00:43:02.230 chimps there. And one of the things that the 00:43:02.230 --> 00:43:06.389 grief counselors talked about was, yes, when 00:43:06.389 --> 00:43:11.449 someone passes you, there's a loss, but that 00:43:11.449 --> 00:43:14.380 doesn't take away all the the memories and the 00:43:14.380 --> 00:43:16.860 things that you have. So, you know, they were 00:43:16.860 --> 00:43:19.840 just trying to help people focus on that, which 00:43:19.840 --> 00:43:23.320 to me was phenomenal. And then later I was on 00:43:23.320 --> 00:43:26.820 another Zoom meeting with some sanctuary directors, 00:43:27.079 --> 00:43:30.539 other chimps sanctuaries. And, you know, we were, 00:43:31.039 --> 00:43:34.019 someone was looking for something and was like, 00:43:34.039 --> 00:43:37.159 suddenly the news popped up and they said, wow, 00:43:37.300 --> 00:43:43.460 Jane has just died. But I, I think just to sort 00:43:43.460 --> 00:43:52.420 of play on that, to me, we have so much to be 00:43:52.420 --> 00:43:56.340 grateful for that she was on this planet and 00:43:56.340 --> 00:44:01.619 that she had all of the pieces in place and, 00:44:01.619 --> 00:44:05.820 you know, what a perfect combination of someone 00:44:05.820 --> 00:44:09.320 that had everything that she had in terms of 00:44:09.320 --> 00:44:12.639 her personality, the way that she was able to 00:44:12.639 --> 00:44:16.460 get her message out to people, the situations 00:44:16.460 --> 00:44:22.059 that taught her and moved her to do what she 00:44:22.059 --> 00:44:27.820 had done and to have an incredible, incredible 00:44:27.820 --> 00:44:36.159 impact. And I'm just... so grateful that she 00:44:36.159 --> 00:44:41.760 was part of the part of the planet and that she 00:44:41.760 --> 00:44:47.719 brought all of that to the planet. And so I, 00:44:47.980 --> 00:44:51.360 I think we have just so much to be thankful for 00:44:51.360 --> 00:44:56.260 that way. And, and that she also was able to 00:44:56.260 --> 00:44:59.940 do that until she was 91. I mean, she was still 00:44:59.940 --> 00:45:06.840 giving talks. So, um, wow. Could we all be so 00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:10.679 lucky as to go how she did with our boots on? 00:45:11.619 --> 00:45:14.760 Alan, did you want to add something? Yeah. So 00:45:14.760 --> 00:45:18.179 when I learned that she passed and of course 00:45:18.179 --> 00:45:21.960 I was somber and as you said, I mean, it was... 00:45:21.610 --> 00:45:23.829 We sort of all have in our minds that, well, 00:45:23.829 --> 00:45:27.750 she's never going to leave this part of the universe. 00:45:28.349 --> 00:45:31.369 So maybe because I'm obviously a much more superficial 00:45:31.369 --> 00:45:34.210 person than my colleagues here, my thoughts and 00:45:34.210 --> 00:45:37.750 reactions were sort of a different after that 00:45:37.750 --> 00:45:40.849 initial. And I work from home, so I wasn't physically 00:45:40.849 --> 00:45:45.690 around colleagues. So I had two flashbacks, and 00:45:45.690 --> 00:45:51.690 maybe more, but two. One was video. But the fact 00:45:51.690 --> 00:45:54.530 that Dr. Goodall introduced me to the work with 00:45:54.530 --> 00:45:57.250 the gynecologist from veterinary global aid, 00:45:57.949 --> 00:46:00.210 she introduced, not as two young children, but 00:46:00.210 --> 00:46:03.550 she introduced Jane to her first baby when the 00:46:03.550 --> 00:46:05.110 baby was just two or three months old. And so 00:46:05.110 --> 00:46:08.369 I was looking at video that Anna sent to me and 00:46:08.369 --> 00:46:14.070 she was just like anybody else's loving grandmother, 00:46:14.530 --> 00:46:16.670 was the total full reaction. You would think 00:46:16.670 --> 00:46:20.150 she was the... the family grandmother. So it 00:46:20.150 --> 00:46:23.210 was just, you know, it was that. And then, so 00:46:23.210 --> 00:46:26.389 that touched me a lot. And the other one was 00:46:26.389 --> 00:46:28.230 maybe a quick humorous piece and then I'll, so, 00:46:28.769 --> 00:46:31.489 but my wife and I were just, Ramsey was sitting 00:46:31.489 --> 00:46:34.969 about and Ramsey was irritated at me about something 00:46:34.969 --> 00:46:36.650 that I'm sure she had reason to be irritated 00:46:36.650 --> 00:46:38.869 with me, you know, about and nothing monumental, 00:46:39.190 --> 00:46:42.469 but, and so my mobile goes off and I was the 00:46:42.469 --> 00:46:44.750 last person in the world to be on Shane's speed 00:46:44.750 --> 00:46:47.530 dial, but she was talking to me about Anna category 00:46:47.530 --> 00:46:50.269 is in supporting that her global aid and so she 00:46:50.269 --> 00:46:53.250 had so dr Goodall actually called me up which 00:46:53.250 --> 00:46:57.210 you know and so so I saw that on my phone which 00:46:57.210 --> 00:46:59.949 and that was probably the One of two times that 00:46:59.949 --> 00:47:02.769 ever happened. So I you know, I'm not in her 00:47:02.769 --> 00:47:06.050 it was not in her, you know a list universe so 00:47:06.050 --> 00:47:09.570 so but I picked up the phone and So you can imagine 00:47:09.570 --> 00:47:11.389 your partner is like a little irritated with 00:47:11.389 --> 00:47:13.050 you and then the phone rings and you know your 00:47:13.050 --> 00:47:15.949 partner picked the phone up, right? And so Ramsey 00:47:15.949 --> 00:47:19.130 gave me this look and I whispered to her, it's 00:47:19.130 --> 00:47:21.590 Jane. And she's like, who's Jane? And I said, 00:47:21.650 --> 00:47:24.889 Jane Goodall. And so it was like, everything 00:47:24.889 --> 00:47:26.989 changed, of course. And whatever she's meant 00:47:26.989 --> 00:47:29.090 to be about went away as well, of course. So 00:47:29.090 --> 00:47:31.070 I had those kind of flashbacks, which made it 00:47:31.070 --> 00:47:35.030 easier for me in some ways. So yeah. I'm getting 00:47:35.030 --> 00:47:36.550 tears in my eyes just telling those stories now. 00:47:36.630 --> 00:47:40.289 Isn't that something? So yeah. That's beautiful. 00:47:40.369 --> 00:47:44.889 Thank you for sharing. Quick question. Why do 00:47:44.889 --> 00:47:49.130 you think she had that multi -generational effect, 00:47:49.349 --> 00:47:55.110 you know? Younger people, middle -aged people, 00:47:55.389 --> 00:48:00.670 older people. She touched every age ranges. How 00:48:00.670 --> 00:48:04.579 do you explain that? I think it was very intentional 00:48:04.579 --> 00:48:09.480 on her part, right? I mean, she wanted to be 00:48:09.480 --> 00:48:13.559 able to reach out to younger people. And she 00:48:13.559 --> 00:48:17.099 knew, and the Jane Goodall Institute knew, you've 00:48:17.099 --> 00:48:22.300 got to reach out to younger people. They're going 00:48:22.300 --> 00:48:24.980 to be the next generation. They're the ones that 00:48:24.980 --> 00:48:32.940 are going to be making the impact. I guess it 00:48:32.940 --> 00:48:37.420 depends on which slice of time, because she's 00:48:37.420 --> 00:48:40.619 been in people's living rooms basically with 00:48:40.619 --> 00:48:43.820 all the documentaries, and she wrote so many 00:48:43.820 --> 00:48:48.920 books, and she's touching on so many different 00:48:48.920 --> 00:48:56.079 things. I think that that's why she was able 00:48:56.079 --> 00:49:03.639 to transect across the lifespan of people and 00:49:03.639 --> 00:49:08.079 catch them. And, you know, also chimps are really 00:49:08.079 --> 00:49:11.840 compelling too. So that is a pretty easy way 00:49:11.840 --> 00:49:16.420 to get people's attention. Thank you. Any more 00:49:16.420 --> 00:49:19.760 theories? I don't know if I have a theory, but 00:49:19.760 --> 00:49:22.739 I just wanted to say that it was interesting 00:49:22.739 --> 00:49:27.579 because there's obviously a generation now who 00:49:27.579 --> 00:49:30.449 still does There's there's individuals from that 00:49:30.449 --> 00:49:33.190 generation that do know but I also experienced 00:49:33.190 --> 00:49:36.690 Some individuals from you know, basically who 00:49:36.690 --> 00:49:40.409 are in college now who were like wait Can you 00:49:40.409 --> 00:49:43.929 remind me who is Jane Goodall? What did she do 00:49:43.929 --> 00:49:47.969 and I was just like jaw drop like what do you 00:49:47.969 --> 00:49:49.909 mean? What did she do? What do you mean? Who 00:49:49.909 --> 00:49:53.230 is Jane Goodall? So that was really surprising 00:49:53.230 --> 00:49:56.369 to me and I wouldn't have necessarily even realized 00:49:56.369 --> 00:50:00.199 that was a thing if I hadn't been at my campus 00:50:00.199 --> 00:50:04.659 when this happened, because I did actually have 00:50:04.659 --> 00:50:07.800 people who came up and, you know, Jane seems 00:50:07.800 --> 00:50:10.039 to always come up because people are always asking, 00:50:10.219 --> 00:50:12.320 how did you end up in the primate lab? Well, 00:50:12.539 --> 00:50:14.519 I wanted to work in primate conservation like 00:50:14.519 --> 00:50:18.460 Jane. And then I got a lot of these, oh my God, 00:50:18.599 --> 00:50:20.300 like, because everyone was starting to learn 00:50:20.300 --> 00:50:23.179 about the news. But there were a few individuals 00:50:23.179 --> 00:50:26.230 who kind of looked at me and were like, Well, 00:50:26.329 --> 00:50:29.469 can you who is she and so I was just like, oh 00:50:29.469 --> 00:50:32.750 no, you know what this means We have to we have 00:50:32.750 --> 00:50:35.710 to make sure that she lives on right and I you 00:50:35.710 --> 00:50:38.090 know She has ensured that in a number of ways 00:50:38.090 --> 00:50:41.489 but it it hurt my heart a little to think that 00:50:41.489 --> 00:50:44.809 there's individuals who who don't know who she 00:50:44.809 --> 00:50:49.289 is and sort of her journey of, again, sort of 00:50:49.289 --> 00:50:52.730 beginning honed in on the chimpanzees and how 00:50:52.730 --> 00:50:56.210 that grew to care so much about the natural world 00:50:56.210 --> 00:51:00.389 and everyone who shares it, human and non -human. 00:51:01.289 --> 00:51:05.909 She also, we've all talked about this, but she 00:51:05.909 --> 00:51:09.110 met people where they are. She was there for 00:51:09.739 --> 00:51:12.159 others. And so, I mean, that was a piece of it. 00:51:13.300 --> 00:51:17.320 There may also be a, you know, from my wife, 00:51:18.340 --> 00:51:20.119 who's, you know, so we're a generation younger 00:51:20.119 --> 00:51:23.920 than Dr. Goodall, but just one. And so she, there 00:51:23.920 --> 00:51:25.659 may also be a gender piece about having, you 00:51:25.659 --> 00:51:29.480 know, Ramsey growing up with this. So Leakey 00:51:29.480 --> 00:51:32.420 wanted and experienced three people that go out 00:51:32.420 --> 00:51:34.340 in the field. But, you know, if you're learning 00:51:34.340 --> 00:51:36.440 about her, like, oh, my God, this young woman 00:51:36.440 --> 00:51:42.039 who, like, had no creds, right? And in the 60s, 00:51:42.139 --> 00:51:45.320 where, you know, the madman era, right, was able 00:51:45.320 --> 00:51:48.940 to do this. So I think for that generation, and 00:51:48.940 --> 00:51:51.860 maybe subsequently, you know, I don't have the 00:51:51.860 --> 00:51:54.360 right chromosomes to comment on this really thoroughly. 00:51:54.420 --> 00:51:56.800 But I think for my wife, certainly, there was, 00:51:56.860 --> 00:52:00.159 it was that as well. You know, and chimps, of 00:52:00.159 --> 00:52:03.940 course, but, but, but that, how that happened 00:52:03.940 --> 00:52:08.659 with this woman. Thank you. Um, I guess to end 00:52:08.659 --> 00:52:12.280 this conversation, I want to ask you, how do 00:52:12.280 --> 00:52:16.280 we, how should we, how can we honor her legacy, 00:52:16.739 --> 00:52:20.840 her life? Um, I think, you know, the message 00:52:20.840 --> 00:52:24.380 she brought in every interview and public appearance 00:52:24.380 --> 00:52:28.960 was, you know, get off your couch, do something, 00:52:29.260 --> 00:52:33.260 you know, be part of the solution, make a difference. 00:52:33.860 --> 00:52:39.250 Um, So yeah, how do we honor her legacy? Turn 00:52:39.250 --> 00:52:49.210 off the water when you brush your teeth You know 00:52:49.210 --> 00:52:53.650 so that And and I think her point is is such 00:52:53.650 --> 00:52:58.929 a simple thing, but if everybody's doing it It 00:52:58.929 --> 00:53:04.179 will make a big impact so you know, that just 00:53:04.179 --> 00:53:08.079 remembering it, I think I'm shocked with what 00:53:08.079 --> 00:53:09.960 you said, Maddie, that people didn't know who 00:53:09.960 --> 00:53:17.300 she was. And so you already said it, I mean, 00:53:17.320 --> 00:53:23.400 we really have to have to continue. And it'll 00:53:23.400 --> 00:53:25.760 be interesting to see how the Jane Goodall Institute 00:53:25.760 --> 00:53:29.159 does that. They're certainly well positioned 00:53:29.159 --> 00:53:34.639 to do that. And yeah. Yeah, I think, you know, 00:53:35.380 --> 00:53:38.840 Jane, Jane believed in collective action and 00:53:38.840 --> 00:53:42.119 and also like localized action like do what you 00:53:42.119 --> 00:53:46.179 can in your own community. And I think these 00:53:46.179 --> 00:53:50.260 are, again, powerful because it's it's empowering 00:53:50.260 --> 00:53:54.320 and can also make some of these big overwhelming 00:53:54.320 --> 00:53:58.099 heartbreaking issues feel a little more manageable 00:53:58.099 --> 00:54:03.619 to handle. And, you know, in my kind of more 00:54:03.619 --> 00:54:06.780 like the more personal issue that I have kind 00:54:06.780 --> 00:54:09.719 of dedicated my life to that, of course, has 00:54:09.719 --> 00:54:12.739 many intersecting components, but the animal 00:54:12.739 --> 00:54:16.219 research industry, I continue to think about 00:54:16.219 --> 00:54:23.340 how she really represents wanting science to 00:54:23.340 --> 00:54:28.460 exist alongside compassion and that these things 00:54:28.460 --> 00:54:32.380 shouldn't be separate. and how much she has sort 00:54:32.380 --> 00:54:37.400 of influenced the scientific field and how much 00:54:37.400 --> 00:54:43.079 more the scientific field can do to align to 00:54:43.079 --> 00:54:46.380 the compassionate principles that Jane represented. 00:54:49.280 --> 00:54:52.920 You know stood up to two things that are still 00:54:52.920 --> 00:54:56.159 I think prevalent in in the scientific field 00:54:56.159 --> 00:54:59.340 Especially when it comes to animal research like 00:54:59.340 --> 00:55:04.000 trying to not individualize these creatures and 00:55:04.000 --> 00:55:07.280 and that's exactly what she did not stand for 00:55:07.280 --> 00:55:11.760 and so you know, I think she's helped give permission 00:55:11.760 --> 00:55:16.059 to a lot of us to think critically about what 00:55:16.059 --> 00:55:20.639 we're doing to animals and labs and animal research 00:55:20.639 --> 00:55:25.320 in general, and, you know, help us help us speak 00:55:25.320 --> 00:55:29.699 out, speak out about it. Alan, did you want to? 00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:32.159 Yeah, no, I mean, my colleagues have said it. 00:55:32.159 --> 00:55:35.420 Well, there's there's this and each of them, 00:55:35.420 --> 00:55:37.460 you know, does it in their own work. I mean, 00:55:37.500 --> 00:55:41.219 there's this, you know, there's doing what you 00:55:41.219 --> 00:55:46.019 can. But there's this determination, keeping 00:55:46.019 --> 00:55:49.460 determination and while not being Pollyannaish 00:55:49.460 --> 00:55:53.300 about her, looking for the good side of people, 00:55:53.400 --> 00:55:58.199 seeing hope. You could catch more flies with 00:55:58.199 --> 00:56:03.059 agave than with vinegar. It's true. It depends 00:56:03.059 --> 00:56:04.820 on the person what you're trying to affect change. 00:56:04.860 --> 00:56:08.340 Sometimes a little bit of that you need to, but 00:56:08.340 --> 00:56:13.920 her way of you know, being determined and getting 00:56:13.920 --> 00:56:18.639 on the right side of people is a, you know, is 00:56:18.639 --> 00:56:21.960 a lesson that, you know, I continue to try to 00:56:21.960 --> 00:56:23.719 emulate and sometimes honor in the breach, but 00:56:23.719 --> 00:56:26.780 I think it's a really, really good, good lesson 00:56:26.780 --> 00:56:32.239 from Martin. It is kind of unbelievable how successful 00:56:32.239 --> 00:56:37.920 she was at getting, you know, these true messages 00:56:37.920 --> 00:56:43.579 of justice out there. while still having so many 00:56:43.579 --> 00:56:47.119 people on her side. And that doesn't mean that 00:56:47.119 --> 00:56:49.699 it immediately changed people, right? Like she 00:56:49.699 --> 00:56:52.500 went vegan, yes, but not all of these people 00:56:52.500 --> 00:56:56.039 who look up to her have gone vegan. But she was 00:56:56.039 --> 00:57:01.019 able to bring a lot of these conversations, you 00:57:01.019 --> 00:57:03.880 know, just out there on a larger scale than I 00:57:03.880 --> 00:57:08.199 think many people have successfully been able 00:57:08.199 --> 00:57:13.230 to do. I think that that shows who she is and 00:57:13.230 --> 00:57:18.610 and how um Yeah, I don't know I mean I just I 00:57:18.610 --> 00:57:20.570 just think of that as something that is worth 00:57:20.570 --> 00:57:24.469 considering as activists and as people who care 00:57:24.469 --> 00:57:28.769 about the world humans and and non -humans and 00:57:28.769 --> 00:57:32.949 and how we can You know make things make things 00:57:32.949 --> 00:57:37.449 better and reduce suffering Yeah, what a pleasure 00:57:37.449 --> 00:57:41.409 to have welcomed the three of you who greatly 00:57:41.409 --> 00:57:45.670 valued Dr. Jane Goddall. And thank you so much 00:57:45.670 --> 00:57:50.130 for your answers, for your insights, and for 00:57:50.130 --> 00:57:54.949 sharing your dear memories of her and of what 00:57:54.949 --> 00:58:00.130 she brought in your life. Thank you. In the place 00:58:00.130 --> 00:58:05.469 where I am now, I look back over my life. I look 00:58:05.469 --> 00:58:10.130 back at the world I've left behind. What message 00:58:10.130 --> 00:58:14.429 do I want to leave? I want to make sure that 00:58:14.429 --> 00:58:18.349 you all understand that each and every one of 00:58:18.349 --> 00:58:22.570 you has a role to play. You may not know it, 00:58:22.909 --> 00:58:26.969 you may not find it, but your life matters and 00:58:26.969 --> 00:58:31.030 you are here for a reason. And I just hope that 00:58:31.030 --> 00:58:33.849 that reason will become apparent as you live 00:58:33.849 --> 00:58:38.400 through your life. I want you to know that whether 00:58:38.400 --> 00:58:41.139 or not you find that role that you're supposed 00:58:41.139 --> 00:58:45.019 to play, your life does matter, and that every 00:58:45.019 --> 00:58:48.480 single day you live, you make a difference in 00:58:48.480 --> 00:58:51.960 the world. And you get to choose the difference 00:58:51.960 --> 00:58:55.739 that you make. I want you to understand that 00:58:55.739 --> 00:58:59.639 we are part of the natural world. And even today, 00:58:59.840 --> 00:59:04.480 where the planet is dark, there still is hope. 00:59:05.820 --> 00:59:09.869 Don't lose hope. If you lose hope, you become 00:59:09.869 --> 00:59:13.409 apathetic and do nothing. And if you want to 00:59:13.409 --> 00:59:17.050 save what is still beautiful in this world, if 00:59:17.050 --> 00:59:21.829 you want to save the planet for the future generations, 00:59:22.670 --> 00:59:27.630 your grandchildren, their grandchildren, then 00:59:27.630 --> 00:59:31.610 think about the actions you take each day. Because 00:59:31.610 --> 00:59:35.590 multiplied a million, a billion times, even small 00:59:35.590 --> 00:59:42.630 actions, will make for great change. I just hope 00:59:42.630 --> 00:59:47.550 that you understand that this life on planet 00:59:47.550 --> 00:59:53.250 Earth isn't the end. I believe, and now I know, 00:59:53.809 --> 00:59:58.269 that there is life beyond death, that consciousness 00:59:58.269 --> 01:00:03.969 survives. I can't tell you from where I am secrets 01:00:03.969 --> 01:00:08.300 that are not mine to share. I can't tell you 01:00:08.300 --> 01:00:11.480 what you will find when you leave planet Earth. 01:00:12.260 --> 01:00:15.880 But I want you to know that your life on planet 01:00:15.880 --> 01:00:20.179 Earth will make some difference in the kind of 01:00:20.179 --> 01:00:24.800 life that you find after you die. Above all, 01:00:25.079 --> 01:00:28.260 I want you to think about the fact that we are 01:00:28.260 --> 01:00:32.360 part, when we're on planet Earth, we are part 01:00:32.360 --> 01:00:36.210 of Mother Nature. We depend on Mother Nature 01:00:36.210 --> 01:00:39.550 for clean air, for water, for food, for clothing, 01:00:39.949 --> 01:00:45.329 for everything. And as we destroy one ecosystem 01:00:45.329 --> 01:00:50.690 after another, as we create worse climate change, 01:00:51.329 --> 01:00:56.769 worse loss of diversity, we have to do everything 01:00:56.769 --> 01:01:00.909 in our power to make the world a better place. 01:01:01.750 --> 01:01:05.010 With the children alive today, and for those 01:01:05.010 --> 01:01:09.849 that will follow. You have it in your power to 01:01:09.849 --> 01:01:14.349 make a difference. Don't give up. There is a 01:01:14.349 --> 01:01:18.090 future for you. Do your best while you're still 01:01:18.090 --> 01:01:21.489 on this beautiful planet Earth that I look down 01:01:21.489 --> 01:01:25.869 upon from where I am now. God bless you all.