What's going on, Pursuers? Welcome to The Pursuit
of Calling, the podcast that provides you with
the strategies and tools needed to successfully
discover and pursue your calling. Whether it's
through inspiring stories, thought -provoking
interviews, or quick, insightful episodes on
personal growth and development, we've got you
covered. I'm your host, Thomas Carney. Enjoy
the episode. Alright, welcome to the episode.
So, I'm here with Raksha Gopal, and just a quick
intro from my perspective. We met at the International
Maxwell Conference, which I've talked about a
couple times on this podcast already. I believe
the last episode or two episodes ago was a recap
on the first day of the conference. recorded
at the conference when i was in my hotel room
and i um as reached out and asked a few people
uh that i specifically had a um had a good conversations
with at the conference if they wanted to be on
podcast rock just said yes and like i feel like
it's uh it was kind of great because i'm going
to mention we're going to talk about this later
but we initially met in the elevator walking
down uh to breakfast And then later we were talking
about this pre -recording and then later, uh,
in the same day, I got to see her be coached
on stage by Valerie Burton, um, for 30 minutes.
And we got in like, uh, and I was sitting there,
I'm like, man, I know her. I was sitting there
and I was like, I just talked to her a couple
hours ago. And I was like, it was kind of crazy.
Seeing her on stage in front of thousands of
people and being as vulnerable as she was being
was fantastic. But now, let me stop talking like
she isn't here. And say, hey, Raksha, how's it
going? Good, Thomas. How are you? It's good to
see you again. Yeah, it's great to see you, too.
It's great to see you. Yeah, I'm really happy
for you, Beyond. Thank you for your yes. Thank
you for asking me to be on this podcast. For
sure, for sure. I wanted to ask you, for those
who don't know you, most people that listen to
this podcast won't know you. So who is Raksha
Gopal? Well... I do wear a lot of hats. So I
am the biggest pride, of course, is a proud mother
of a 23 -year -old who just graduated from UCLA
and she got into medical school. So very proud
about that. And also a wife of 35 years, a caretaker
of a 92 -year -old mother -in -law and an eight
-year -old mom, and a friend that loves to party
and dance. I'm also an immigrant from India that
came to US to complete her master's in computer
engineering and since then had a successful career
for 32 years. And I've been a leader 28 years
of those. I am a mentor that loves to teach and
currently a vice president of corporate project
management at a software company. And of course,
a Maxwell certified team member. Let's go. You
say you have a career of 35 years. What's that
career? Not career of 35 years. I was your mayor
for 35 years. What was your current career? Actually,
my career has been for 32 years. 32? Yeah. And
what was that in? What is that career? Yeah,
in software. So I graduated with a computer engineering
degree. And my first job was in software development.
And I've continued in that tech industry. But
I eventually went into project management because
I love planning. And I would say pretty much
like after about four or five years, I went into
project management. And that's been my passion
ever since. So yeah, so I still continue to work
for a software company now. Oh, that's fantastic.
That's actually kind of cool. I'm a web and mobile
app developer from a full -time career. So it's
cut from the same cloth. That's kind of cool.
I remember we connected over that at breakfast
at IMC. So thank you for that introduction. Thank
you for... telling us telling about all those
things i think uh it's really cool that i don't
know i i love that we get one like yeah you like
you said we made that connection and that we
even though like um yeah sure we have we have
that connection around software engineering software
development and then um but then that's not how
we connected we we connected through the max
through the max one network because we both have
this desire to grow and to grow others yes um
So I think that's, I don't know. I think that's
really, really, I think, I don't know. I just
find that really inspiring. That's like, that's
how, that's how we met. Yeah, I agree. But with
this, now speaking of that, of how we met and
with, and with this podcast being called the
pursuit of calling, I want to specifically talk
about yours. And this is something I talk with
all the guests about. From your perspective,
what is your purpose? What is your calling? Yeah.
You know, I think after having worked for so
many years, one of the things that I feel that
I've been really lucky is that I've had the right
mentors in my life. And just dating back even
before that, before I started working, is just
the... thanks to my parents, it's the values
that they had instilled in me that still continues
in me. So a lot of my leadership is based on
the values. And that's why I think I got attracted
to Maxwell Leadership because of that. But having
accumulated so much experience right now, 32
years of it, I really feel the need now to start
helping others. I feel like I was lucky enough
to accumulate all this good information. that
has served its purpose. And now I've become like
the reservoir of, you know, experience. I want
to be able to help others either by paying it
forward with, you know, with upcoming professionals
who are, who possibly are struggling the same
things I struggled with, but I figured out and
I know what the path forward is. So that's one
of them. And then second is just with leadership.
It's like leadership journey is not easy. It's
not easy at all. And being able to, to be able
to impart that knowledge and that experience
to somebody who's up and coming in that role.
I feel like that's, that's my calling right now.
I feel like that's where I need to leave my legacy
and saying, Hey, I've done this now. Let me help
you. Yeah. And what is the, like, particular
way that you're that you're doing that so mentoring
is one of them right for sure because i do ucla
has like a mentorship program for students i
enroll in that so that way i can mentor some
of the college students who are you know about
to graduate and trying to figure out okay what's
next and a few feel about that Then even people
at my company, there's some people that are mentor.
Now, this is besides, of course, leading them.
So and then with the Maxwell leadership, that
was the whole reason why I got into it is being
able to focus my coaching on companies towards
the leadership growth. So leadership development
and leadership growth, because I think leadership
is one of the things that. it's a word that people
use very casually oh that person's a leader but
really not knowing not knowing exactly what does
leadership mean it's like it's not just management
right so i feel that that need is there in many
companies right now especially software companies
yeah and since you brought before you brought
up um the values that you've gotten from your
parents, and then you also just talked about
leadership isn't just management. Yeah. I'm curious
what these values are. Like, what are these values
that cause you to see that leadership isn't just
management? Yeah. I'll tell you, the two key
things that come to mind is integrity, for sure.
Because standing the ground based on... integrity,
like irrespective of how difficult a decision
is, that is core. That is core to leadership.
Whereas in management, a lot of times, you know,
things are done more with a singular focus on,
like, it's usually about how the company is performing.
And it's not much about the integrity or valuing
people even. That's the other thing that I strongly
believe in is. Everything happens because people
bring in the value. They are the most important
assets. And when that's the case, and as a leader,
you're thinking about, okay, what is the value
I can bring to the person because they are bringing
value to me? That's number one. The integrity
part is no matter what happens, you know, stay
true to those principles, to your own principles.
Because when you have those two things, I feel
like, you know, any decision you make will always
be the right decision. I think this is something
I've heard multiple times. I've heard it from
Craig Rochelle, but I've also heard it in the
same sense from John Maxwell that everything
rises and falls on leadership. Yes. Yes. Like
you were saying, Leadership focuses on the people
because they're the biggest asset to the company,
biggest asset to a team, obviously, because if
there's no people, there's no team, and there's
no one to lead. Also, I think I'm remembering
John Maxwell saying, if you're leading and nobody's
following you, then you're just taking a walk.
Yeah, exactly. Or are they being threatened to
follow? That's the thing, right? If are they
following willingly because they want to, or
are they falling because they're afraid and because
of fear? Yeah. Hmm. Hmm. I'm trying to decide
which direction to go. I, um, Hmm. How do you
make sure people, uh, how do you make sure people
do want to follow? How do you, how do you incentivize?
Is it incentive? Is it just through integrity
of the leader? It's it is the integrity of the
leader. I think when, when people, it's a couple
of things. So one is that when people know that,
that you care about them, right? Like, so let
me take it from an organization standpoint, right?
When, When people know, like my team, if they
know I care about them, and if there is a particular
vision in mind and we are trying to strive for
that, they will follow the reason being that
they know the person, the leader, cares about
them and would not do anything to jeopardize
them or to jeopardize anything that will hurt
them. When that trust is there, they will be
willing to go out of their way. to be able to
work with that leader and do what is needed.
Now, on the other hand, if there is any hint
of hidden agendas, then that constant doubt is
going to creep up going, why am I going to follow
you? Why am I going to do what you're telling
me to do? What's in it for me? The moment that
question comes up, what's in it for me? Then
you know that the leader is not. successfully
communicated or expressed or shown that they
actually care for the people like um before this
recording i was telling you like i i keep the
questions kind of like they're open because a
lot of the time because i already asked you like
five questions i would didn't have i didn't send
you and it's like because like i want this uh
i that's why i love um, just interviewing. That's
why I, I even love coaching. That's why I love
coaching. Cause I get to get to have a conversation.
That's right. Um, and, uh, I, I, I thrive in
the, in the one -on -one, uh, one -on -one conversations.
Um, and speaking of those one -on -one conversations,
like where I want to, I want to go back to, um,
you, uh, whenever you were on stage, you getting
coached by Valerie Burton. And I'm wondering
if you could give us like a quick, I'll say like,
give us like a quick, I guess a quick synopsis
or like what, give us a bit of an understanding
from your perspective about that experience.
Yeah, that was, first of all, it was like, I
think an experience that I'm going to cherish
for my life. It's just a number one being coached
by Valerie Burton. And then just, watching her
brilliance come through as a coach that that
was amazing that was yeah transforming for sure
the um i know um and i'm sorry i'm gonna have
you please repeat the question because the moment
you said i kind of it transferred me back to
that day no worries no um first i'll say uh for
those who don't know who valerie burton is uh
you can look her up but also I'll say that she
is the, I would say, the lead coach, I guess
you could say. She is a person that, through
Maxwell Leadership, she's the trainer who does
all of the teachings and coaching training for
the Maxwell Leadership team. And then she's had
her own coaching practice. She has had her own
coaching practice, multiple books. And she's
honestly brilliant when it comes to helping people
grow and realize their potential. So if you want
to look her up, find her books, I highly recommend
you do that. But the question to Raksha was,
what can you tell us about that experience? Oh,
sure. Yeah. So I think, you know, one of the
things obviously being. on stage in front of
about 2 ,000, 2 ,500 people. Initially, when
it went on, I think I was in there to really
try to get past that mental block I've had. Because
since I'm working full time, I kind of have been
in the same career for so long, right? So stepping
into this coaching thing and trying to go out
and have the confidence to. talk to people about
coaching. I was having this constant mental block
about, am I good enough? You know, what are they
thinking? Why will they want to go with me? So
all those questions that I know, it just keeps,
you know, stopping us, right? And it's really
intense. When I found out that I would get coached
by her, I was like, I really wish something comes
out of this because I was getting very frustrated
with myself. So once we got on stage and she
said, it's just you and me here. You're not going
to worry about anybody else. And I really took
that word for it. I'm like, okay, it's you and
me here. I'm going to focus on you, Valerie.
But when she started talking, somehow she did
build that little, like, you know, the thing
around us that I was. Except when people laughed
or clapped or something that came up, I was really
oblivious to the crowd. I don't know how she
did it, but she did it. So that was one. And
then the second is she showed the power of presence
as a coach. And since I'm training to be a coach
now, so that was the second biggest takeaway,
the way she held my attention. The way she held
the moment, like with her presence and with her
eye contact and just the questioning, right?
It was just so intense and it was just so, like
I was in there just like going through my brain,
finding answers myself. And I did not really
expect that being on stage. Yeah, so it just,
I was just, yeah, I was just in awe at what she
was able to have me realize with her questions.
Yeah. What kind of things were that? What kind
of things did you realize? I think the biggest
thing was, you know, it's okay for me to take
risks. I've taken risks all my life. And this
one time, I don't know why I was hesitating.
It's like, what if they say no? And the biggest
takeaway I had is, which I still have in front
of my computer here is, I'm willing to hear a
no till I hear a yes. That was the biggest thing
I came away with. And it's still like, it's on
my post -it right in front of me. And every morning
it reminds me like, you know, I have a purpose.
And the second thing I wrote down. which is after
actually I read this in a book, was get over
yourself so you can give yourself to others.
The whole concept of, okay, what is my why right
now is to bring my value. And there's people
that can benefit, somebody. And if there is a
match, there will be a yes. And if there is no
match, it'll be a no, and it's okay, which means
they don't. They don't need my, what I have to
offer. Right. Yeah. So I think it kind of helped
me detach myself from it in that equation. Yeah.
As a person and instead kind of look at it as,
okay, Raksha, your why right now is you've accumulated
all this knowledge that you want to start giving
to people. And when that person finds me, when
I find that person, that match is going to happen
automatically. Don't force it. So the whole thing,
the pressure is putting like, oh, I need this
business. Like they need to say, yes, I'm forcing
it. I'm forcing it with my own, introducing my
personality in there rather than saying it's
all about value. Yeah. So I think that's what
it was. I think that's what kind of clicked in
me during that conversation. And it's just stuck
by me. I'm pretty bold right now. sending out
what i'm doing it's not with a bated breath saying
what if what if nothing no i'm just like i send
it out if i hear back i will that the goal now
is just add value where i can yeah yeah wow so
it's actually kind of funny because earlier today
i was talking with um my coach earlier today
about working on getting more no's so i get the
yes and i um for those who are listening i most
people that are listening aren't coaches aren't
looking for um most people i would say aren't
coaches aren't looking for the uh um like maybe
aren't looking for those one -on -one coaching
clients or maybe aren't even looking for clients
they're they're working a full -time job like
i'm wondering if we can have a conversation about
I'm thinking about it right now because I want
to practically apply that to other people's lives.
I'm curious, how would you apply that to somebody's
life that isn't necessarily looking for that
one -on -one coaching client? Somebody that is
like... Well, I have some thoughts, but what
would you think about that? Yeah. And you're
talking about what I learned as part of this
coaching session with Valerie? Yes. Yeah. I think,
you know, it applies in every field, Thomas,
because, you know, even at my work, right? It's
just as an example. Yeah. At my work, because
I lead a team of people. I'm part of the senior
leadership team. And previously I used to hesitate.
Like, I'm like. What will they think? Because
I wanted to introduce some of the concepts and
ideas we are learning through Maxwell, right?
And it's great content, right? All about leadership.
And my hesitation, and I'll tell you, like I
started Maxwell program in October, 2024. So
in December, I was like, okay, I have this presentation
I want to bring to the team. Never did it. Never
did it. It took me till after coming back from
IMC. with that same realization that the reason
I was not doing it is because I was constantly
afraid of getting judged, being judged. Now,
why is that coming into my mind? Again, I'm introducing
myself in there as a person to be evaluated rather
than saying, I have something that I want to
share with the team that I know will be valuable
because I found it very valuable. And now that
I have that mindset, I'm like, I had one session
with our team two weeks back. We meet every other
week. So now I plan to bring in law of connection
to the team to talk about that. And it's just
that now I'm thinking it's just the value I'm
bringing. I have something I'm going to share
with you. And so I can see even for your listeners,
right? This is nothing to do with coaching per
se. It's really about the mindset. If you're
doing anything that you're thinking about, I
want to add value to people, then it does not
matter whether they like me or not, because that's
irrelevant at that point. It's really about,
can they do something with that material that
I have, that I can provide to you? And whether
they can use it or not, it's really up to them.
It depends. Some of them might want and use it.
Some of them might have no use for it. and some
of them might have a need for it but might decide
not to use it so it can be it can go any other
way but it's up to that person who's receiving
it at that point yeah like like um yeah like
wondering like how can i add value to more people
like how can i add value how can how can i add
value and not worry about like you were saying
not worrying about if they disregard it completely
yeah yeah exactly like i um I think I have, I've
talked with people before, whether it's coaching
clients or not, that they want to be more of
a light in the world. Like that's one of their
big goals is to add value to more people. And
it's, so I like that you made that connection.
It's like the worry that whenever we, the worry
that we have about how like whether we can actually
add value to people or not it a lot of and what
holds us back a lot is is imposing some sort
of imposing that person's judgment on yourself
before it even happens yep and yeah so it's like
it's really just being able to go and say like
you said like i have some i being confident in
yourself and being willing to say like i have
something that will be that is valuable to others
because it because it was value is valuable to
me first and that it's valuable to me and now
i'm making it available to others so if there's
value for them they're gonna take it and run
with it yeah yeah because i cannot say some concept
that helped me might help another person all
i can do is present and say here's how it helped
me now the other person might go Oh, I have no
use for it, right? Yeah. I don't control that,
though. I don't control that. I like the purpose
question. One of the purpose questions that Valerie
gave us during the coaching training. My favorite
one is, how do people's lives improve having
crossed your path? Yeah. And I think... that
like that that's like the one that i think i've
asked that to all my clients and that always
opens up their eyes to be like wow i never really
thought about my life that way yeah i'm actually
adding i can add people value to people's lives
just through the value through the values i already
hold yeah like you were saying before yeah and
it's like i say i've said that I've used that
question a lot on previous episodes of this podcast,
and I don't think I'm going to stop because it's
one of the most valuable questions I've gotten
out of that training. It's like, how do you want,
like, I know, like, I have my own personal, my
own personal, like, I don't know what you call
it, the vision statement, the mission statement,
and like, to provide people with the tools they
need to successfully discover and pursue their
calling. I, and I like what Valerie has said
in previous, in like training that I just listened
to recently. It's like, then like what comes
before that even? Like what comes before you
provide, what comes before I provide the tool
is I actually have to find the tool. And then
I have to apply it. And then I use it. And then
I find the value in it. And then I provide it
to other people. completely resonate with what
you're saying yeah you know that that point you
just made is a great point it's like in order
to offer that value first you have to be able
to collect that information and apply it to see
how it's adding value to you right and then only
you can then offer it and say here's what i think
it is so going through like even this coaching
program right that that's part of training myself
and making sure that like doing the peer coaching,
being on stage with Valerie, it's like me to
see how coaching and the powerful questions can
be of value. And then in turn, being able to
offer that to somebody else. Yeah, I think that
applying it to self is so critical first. Now
you're doing that right now by taking what you
gained in that coaching session, and now you're
able to share it with more people here. Yes.
You probably shared it the next day. Whenever
you got back from IMC, you were able to share
it with other members at the company, other family
members. It's something that happens that's so
profound. It's hard not to share it with other
people. Yeah, I think the biggest thing that
I brought back that I've been using is that the
presence. So being able to, with my coaching
clients that I have and also with peer coaching
is like being present the way Valerie was present
for me. Yeah, that's one of the things for sure
I've carried forward with my clients. Yeah. I
think that's huge, because it takes a lot, even
in everyday conversations, to be present. I think
this is a good place to end it off, and we'll
go through the final questions, and we'll go
from there. So, based off of our conversation
today, and when it comes to personal growth,
development, pursuing your calling, what kind
of resources do you typically recommend to people?
So I, I read a lot of books. Obviously right
now it's like with John Maxwell's books quite
a bit. And then podcasts, you know, there's so
many podcasts out there, particularly I, again,
I think. Based on my day, sometimes I'm just
like, I've got my headphones on and listening
to Maxwell Leadership Executive Podcast. I'm
also as part of the John Maxwell program. I like
their speaking lane. And so I listen to a lot
of Roddy's also, his podcast. And then Mel Robbins
is the other one that I enjoy listening to. But
certainly podcasts because there's so much knowledge
out there. That's so easy to listen to and try
to benefit from it. Let's see. The others are
the TEDx and TED Talks. I love listening to TED
Talks. And once again, it's like, be it about
leadership or encouragement, about resilience,
so many different topics. I enjoy listening to
that. Or self -help, self -improvement. Yes,
I usually... I tend to, so usually it'll be like,
you know, TEDx talks or podcasts. If I have time
to sit down with a book, I'm not like an audiobook
person. I have to have the paper in my hand.
So usually reading books means I'm really taking
time to sit down and read. So I can't do it on
the go. And well, thank you for those. And like
for the final question. You know, John always
asks the question, who do you know that I should
know? Or in other words, I like to ask, who would
you recommend I connect with or who would be
great to have as a guest on the podcast? I think,
you know, I feel like any of our Maxwell team
members, they are so passionate about adding
value to people. And I feel like they'd be great.
Because all of them have, again, in consistent
to your theme, right, about pursuit of calling.
I feel any of the team members would be such
awesome guests for you on your show. The other
person that came to mind is my first company
that I worked for. He was the founder and CEO,
Frank Peters. He's moved since to Santa Barbara.
And living a retired life there, but a very active
retired life. So he's trying to work and he's
trying to get more bicyclists and less vehicles
in Santa Barbara. And he has this podcast, I
think it's called Santa Barbara Cyclist. But
yeah, he would be a great one because talk about
just having that calling in life. be that single
person who's trying to make that change i can't
even imagine like having something like that
in mind and going after it but he is and he's
making like you know small difference and in
his own way making changes yeah which i think
is very powerful oh that's awesome well i'm definitely
gonna i'll look him up and i don't know if you
have any content information but i'll uh but
either way i'll look him up and reach out um
well thank you thank you um But yeah, thank you
for being a guest on the podcast. Really appreciate
it. Thank you, Thomas. I really appreciate you
asking me that night at breakfast. And I'm really
glad our paths crossed because I enjoyed the
conversation with you that day when we were at
breakfast and since then. So looking forward
to seeing your progress too. Thank you. Yeah,
no, I agree. meeting at breakfast that day. I
don't know, meeting at breakfast, meeting at
elevator that morning. It was great. But to all
the listeners, thank you for listening to this
episode of the Pursuit of Calling podcast. You
know, to go out on all the platforms and give
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And guys, thank you for listening again. I'll
see you next time. Keep pursuing your calling.