What's going on everybody? Welcome to this episode of the Pursuit of Calling with me,
your host, Thomas Carney. I got to sit down with Lee Hanyo, a project manager at a golf
software company. Pretty cool. We talk a bit about what it means to endure for what you
want to accomplish. We dive pretty deep into that because he is a man of endurance. And
then we go into how he pushes other people to be more than they believe that they can
be. And then after we were done recording, so you guys won't get to hear this part, but
he also pushed me to do something that I can't really talk about yet. But he pushed me to
do something that could be really cool. So guys, make sure you're actually taking notes
this episode. It's great. But before we dive in, I want to ask you to send me a message.
If you have any questions or you want me to talk on a particular topic, or you just want
to say some encouraging words, you can do so on Instagram or via the email that is listed
in the show notes of this episode. Thank you. And let's dive in.
All right, guys. Hey, how's it going? So I'm here with Lee, it's Hanyo.
Hanyo. Yeah. Mike Wallace butchers it all the time. And he thinks he's right. He looks
at me and I get like this. I go, no, that's not right.
You say Hanyo? He says Hanyo. He said Hanoi before, like Vietnam or whatever, right? Capital
or something like that. No, it's Hanyo. Hanyo. Okay. Okay. Hanyo. It makes me think.
Okay. It's like Han. I don't know. But anyway, so we were just catching up for a little bit
before the episode, before the recording. But for those who don't know Lee, who is Lee
Hanyo? Lee Hanyo. Lee Hanyo. Yeah. So I always like to
start this off with I'm a child of God. I think that's first and foremost. I am a husband.
I have a beautiful wife, Megan. And just in general, I'm like an adventurer. I like to
explore. I like to learn new things. I like to see new places. Very important part of
my life, I think, is just travel and experience. And I love fly fishing. I love cycling. I
love running, backpacking, pretty much any kind of outdoor sport or activity you could
think of. I've dabbled in it, I'm sure. But those are kind of like my core passions.
Have you ever gone spelunking? Spelunking? No. So that kind of freaks me out a little
bit, actually. We have a cabin up north. My wife's family has a cabin up there and there's
some cave systems up there. I've been in a little bit and that's, I don't know, I feel
like I have probably have a little bit of like a claustrophobia. So that kind of freaks
me out a little bit as well as like underwater stuff. I love swimming. I'm a great swimmer,
but I don't think I could be like a scuba diver or like go in like cave systems. I just,
I don't know, it freaks me out. Yeah. My uncle, he would take us, he would take us like caving
and bike. He would take us bike riding, but the only thing we would do that like with
my favorite thing was like caving. Okay. And there was this cave called Bear Cave and we
would, there's no bears in it, but the, it was, I tell people about it and they, like,
there's this one point where you have to like army crawl for like, I saw like a hundred
feet and like, and I'm a whole time I'm crawling through. I'm like, I get like you get the
thought of like, man, this could just collapse right now. Yes, exactly. That's terrifying.
But then I don't think about it until I'm there. Okay. I get in there, I move around
like you step on, like you get, like, I can't explain it. Like there's like, I can't explain
it, but like without video, the show people, but like what I mean, but like the, I don't
know. It was just, it was like so much, it was so much fun. There barely, there's barely
any water. They're like small little streams at certain points, but and then he also scuba
dive. He had like a certified scuba guy and he would just go, like he loves like underwater
caves and stuff. Like, no, cool guy. You know, this podcast is called the pursuit of calling
recently changed. And I asked you, and I asked you one of the questions I sent, like, like
what is your calling? And I let you interpret that however you want to interpret that. The
kind of, we were talking about how, what about your work as a project manager and like what
you did before that and then what you do with the church. So like, how would you define your
calling?
Yeah, I think that's, that's a great question. I think I probably haven't realized it until
lately, maybe the past handful of years, but I think it's definitely helping people, whether
that's realizing potential or helping them through a tough situation. I feel like a lot
of my life, my adult life, at least I've spent figuring myself out where now I think I have
a pretty good understanding of like who I am and, and, and what I'm good at where now
I can sort of pass a little bit of that knowledge and wisdom onto other people. I've lived a
really long life for only being 33 years old. I've just had a lot of really interesting
and odd and great and terrible experiences. So I feel like I have a lot of experience
with different situations and different things and I'm very much a self starter. So helping
other people get started with something or helping them realize a passion or unlocking
their potential seems like a lot of fun to me. And I feel like as of recently, things
are just more about people instead of myself. So connecting with people, serving, helping,
helping build things is definitely, I think my calling or at least where I'm being drawn
to at this current moment.
And like you mentioned about just now and, and, and when your texts that we're talking
on that you like that you say like you love believing in people and helping them get started
on a journey. So like, how do you do that practically? Like, what do you, like, what
do you mean by that?
Yeah. I think a lot of people see the stuff that I do when it's like a cycling thing or,
or backpacking or running or maybe photography or something like that. And they're always
like, wow, that's so cool. Like, I wish I could do something like that. I hear that
so much. I wish, I wish I could do that. Not just the things that I do, but just things
in general, right? We're just chatting and conversation. Oh, that'd be so cool. And do
that. I'm like, let's do it. Yeah. Like, why can't you do it? Why can't we do that? Brandon's
a really good example. This Brandon major. He, we talked about this on his podcast. We're
going to talk about a little bit more next time I get with him, but a handful of years
ago he was like, I want to be more outdoorsy. I'm like, cool, let's go do it. And he's like,
well, what are we going to do? I'm like, I'm going to throw you into the fire. Like, let's
just go backpacking. Let's like, let's do that. Let's go on backpacking trip. Let's strap
all a bunch of gear to kayaks and go down the river for a couple of days and do that.
And he was like, dude, my dreams to go to the Grand Canyon and see it. I'm like, okay,
we're going to go five years from now. We're going to do a big five year plan, but instead
of seeing it, we're going to like experience it. So let's, let's go rim to rim. Let's start
on one side and go through it. Okay. See, see the canyon by being inside of it and then
summit on the other side. So we're actually going to do that this September, but that's
something that's like, that's something practical. Like if I, if I know something about what
you're interested in or what you want to do, then I have a really good frame of reference
to pull from and to help you out with that. And if it's something that I don't know anything
about, I love to learn. So I'll learn about it with you and I'll take that journey with
you. You know, like a lot of my friends are like, I want to get into this or that. I'm
like, I don't know anything about it, but let's do it. It'll be, it'll be fun for me
too. You know, it's like as like another arrow to the quiver of things that you're knowledgeable
about or you're good at. And then you could pass that information on to other people and
help them out. Yeah. That's awesome. I think that's really cool. Like that, I think that,
I mean, that's a special quality to have to be, to not just want to learn how to not to
love the learning. I love learning and I love helping people, but the way you're doing it
is definitely, it's in a more physical sense, I guess. Like with like the hiking and stuff
like that, like in that, in that sense, I'm sure there's other ways that you can do it
too. The, how did you, how did you find out that like you, that was a passion of yours
like helping people with it? Just something you started doing, it just like popped up
in your head and that you're like, why can't you do that? Or like, what, is there any backstory
to that?
I wouldn't say there's like one specific moment, like one of those aha moments where it was
like, oh, this is what I want to do. I think it's more or less that I just grew up doing
a lot of, just a lot of things. And as I made more friends or even just thinking about my
two brother-in-laws, like they were into fishing and backpacking and stuff like that. But then
we, we started going on these adventures and starting, started to do like bigger things
and kind of just helping them out with some stuff. And they helped me out with, with understanding
different things. I think just, just over time, it just struck me as this would be really
cool to help people with, with experiences or help people just kind of unlock things
in them that they might, you know, they might not think that they can do or they don't believe
in themselves. I think, I think everybody has a little bit, a little bit more inside
of them than they think. So yeah, yeah, definitely not like one specific experience or something
like that, but, but it's, it's really cool doing stuff with people. I have a friend right
now, he wants to ride, go on like a, if you're into cycling, it's called a century ride,
100 miles a century. So that's like a big thing like for, for cycling. Like that's like
a, that's definitely like a good accomplishment if you're into riding bikes. So he was like,
dude, I want to, I want to do that. I'm like, all right, let's do it. Like I'll tell you
exactly how to train. We're going to go ride that. So he's been working on that this year
and hopefully we're going to knock out a hundred mile ride. I can do that with him and see
him to the finish line. So it gives me, it gives me a lot of satisfaction, you know, not,
not selfishly, but just you're, you're completing something or a goal of yours and I can walk
alongside you with that. So it's, it's fun to help people. And it's also, you know, it
gives you satisfaction to help someone complete that goal. Right. It's like a two for one
special. Yeah. Yeah. The reason I was asking about like the backstory piece is because
I like, I like to think, I like to, pardon me, likes to dissect stories and like to see
like the story behind the person, the story behind it and like, and you answered it and
you answered that question. Well, I, as well, I'm wondering, like maybe for others that
are listening, we can do two parts for others that are listening that maybe are in that
spot where they're like, maybe there isn't something they want to do something. They
don't think they may have the imposter syndrome and anything or they it's maybe there's something
else holding them back. And maybe there was an answer that things that you've heard before.
Um, what we've kind of talked about some advice, but if like without, like, if they don't know
you directly, like what are some practical things a person can do for themselves? Yeah.
I think, um, everybody's, everybody has a little bit of fear in them and it's, it's
hard to start some things, right? Um, I thought about this a lot too, is like the fear of
failure where a lot of times people don't start something because they're just scared
that like, they're not going to be able to finish it or complete it. Right. But what
I always say is that failure for me is not starting something that's, that's, that is
a failure because you're, you're doing a big disservice to yourself on something that you
could be great at, but you might not be good at it. And if you're not, if you're not good
at it or if you don't get any kind of personal satisfaction or gain from it, um, you know,
dropping that isn't like failing. It's just like, Hey, this wasn't for me, but at least
you started it, at least you tried and challenge yourself. So that's kind of, that's, that's
everybody's barrier to entry, I think, is it starts with fear. So my practical advice
for that is like, as, as easy as it is to say, like be brave and just step out and just
do it. Like I'm not, or I wasn't, I've changed a lot, but I wasn't really like a big people
person growing up and I don't do well with big crowds, um, or like putting myself out
there to talk to people or meet people. But something I've been doing more the past couple
of years is like just saying hi to people, talking to people more. And it's, you know,
that's, that's something that was hard for me, but I had to just start doing it. And
after a while it just becomes second nature. Yeah. So I think, yeah, being brave and just
getting started is the best thing you can do. So just don't think too much about it.
I mean, if you're getting into something very specific or technical, like it's probably
a good thing to know kind of what you're getting yourself into, right? Like you don't want
to just be like, I want to go base jumping and then just start jumping off a building.
Like you probably don't want to take a few more easier steps between now and then. Right.
But, but other things like running or, um, like you, you code, right? I mean, just things
like that. Like if you want to get into it, like just do a little bit of research, but
don't let that paralyze you. Just try to learn a little bit of it and then just get started.
You'll learn along the way and whatever happens, happens after that. But at least you, at least
you can say you tried. Yeah. That's really good advice to say that failure is not starting.
It's the failure to start. I remember whenever you were like, when I was talking about Brandon
and like, like you were talking about breaking into steps, the, I think when you start, when
I think people don't start a lot of time because they, they see the end vision. They see where
they want to, they say where they want to be. And they're like, man, I can never make it
there. Sure. And then the reason they don't start is cause they never think they don't
really necessarily think about the easy steps that they, the easy thing that they can do
to, to get to that point. Like maybe the barrier to entry isn't really that big. Yeah. And
it's just the entry or even just barrier to start. Like the coding barrier to start is
very low because all you have to do is like go to YouTube and look up how to code and
like you're good to go. Access to some kind of device, right? To code on. But yeah, there's
nothing too crazy. You got to get into, you have to buy 20 grand worth of equipment, right?
Right. You want to get into running, you got two legs, right? Get running, you know, you
don't have to, yeah, it's nice to have a good pair of running shoes and, and to have, you
know, nice running gear and equipment or whatever. But it's like, you can go out and do it like
cycling. Same thing. You don't need a $10,000 carbon fiber bike to do it. You got a bike
start running your bike. You can upgrade it later, but just get started.
Think the one thing you mentioned in your, another one thing you mentioned in one of
your texts that you say you love to endure. Yeah. I Googled the word indoor just to see
what it would say. And the Cambridge dictionary, the first thing that comes up is to suffer
for something difficult, unpleasant or painful. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. Love it. So like,
what do you mean? Like you love to endure, like go into that. Yeah. It's interesting.
I mean, I can break this down into kind of two different things. Yeah. I guess to start,
I like to really physically challenge myself. And whenever I say that, I mean, like it's
fun to have like a good workout and a hard workout or do something like that whenever
you're gas. But I like to be on like the brink of like collapse. I don't know why. I mean,
there's definitely like probably like masochistic to a point, but it's, it's something that
weirdly gives me joy. I like, I love seeing how far I can push myself, like really how
far you can go. I think I mentioned this to you whenever we were texting back and forth,
that I feel like people have so much potential and they have so much like inner strength
or like inner like inner brains and like, and you know, they're smart, but people don't
push themselves enough to kind of unlock that. It's really cool to see what you can do whenever
you really, when you really push yourself onto like that brink of like, am I going to
make it out of here? You know, I'm not saying like death, but it's really interesting whenever
you, you kind of get past the point you didn't think you could go and that unlocks a whole
new thinking in your mind is like, man, I can really accomplish a lot more than I ever
thought or imagined I could. So I try to do stuff regularly that makes me get to that
point. And I feel like that it's really good for just like building character, building
inner strength, building confidence and belief in yourself. And then that's stuff that you
can pass on to other people or you can be like a model for other people to look at.
And you know, I mean, it's not, I don't do it for people to be like, Oh, like, look,
he's so like strong or whatever, but I, I do a lot of the stuff where part of me is
really just wanting to inspire people to, to do it themselves or to like take a challenge,
like take a risk on something. Yeah. I also think like, I know a little bit ago for those
who don't know, Lee and Rob mentioned it, but he was like, he recorded, he, he was like,
it was like the day before that you guys were leaving for the bike ride. Yeah. And that
was like 390 some miles. 392. Yeah. Yeah. Man. I almost got that. Yeah. You were close
actually. That's really good. Like that was like, I was, I was looking at that and I was
like, man, I was like, it made like, like, it made me, I think maybe want to figure out
how to get back on my bike. Yeah. Cause like, I love that. I have my, like, I've been talking,
you know, Chaz, Chaz Du Bois and he, I love his last name. He's a great name. But he,
but like, I'm talking, I try, I talk to him every now and then on Sundays and stuff. I
thought like, what can we do to like get me on a bike? Cause like, I can't grip for too
long, but like, what can I do? And then when I get my leg figured out, then I was like,
what can I do? You get, what do I have to do to get out back on the bike? I use, I,
I was, whenever I was furloughed for three months, like I went back when I saw that,
I went back to when I was furloughed for three months, like during COVID and I, like I went
for a bike ride like every day. I went to the same trail, but like, I would go like,
I would go like every single day and like popping the podcast or music and it was great.
And like, I like that, that is a big part of my life that I miss. I'm like, man, it's
like, man, I can't wait. I'm going to figure it out. Yeah. Like, cause I'll help you. Yeah.
We'll figure something out. Dude, I appreciate that. Like I, like, I want to get back on
my bike. Like that's like, that's a goal of mine. Let's do it. The, man, I really like,
I like the, whenever I looked up the like, like endurance has to suffer. Like the first
thing I read, I was like, man, I was like, I was like, that's like the harshest like
thing that I, I was like, I didn't think that was going to come up to like when I came to
indoor, but it makes sense. Cause like, like you're, like you're really stripping a lot
of stuff away. Like you're, you're, I have to endure the pain of like, a lot of it is
like you have to push through the mental barrier and that's painful. And then you have like,
if it's a physical thing, it's pushing your body to like, you know, for your muscles to
like tear apart and then for that, that to build for your muscles to build up. And it's
like, I like it, it says to suffer some difficult, difficult, unpleasant or painful. And like,
I like that we're in, but like we're taking it in the context of like for a greater purpose.
And it's not like, like cause enduring can be enduring something truly awful, but like
the endurance that we're talking about, that you talk about, you know, people talk about
their endurance of like, how long can they run and stuff like that. And I never really
thought about it like that. I never thought about like, Oh, how long can they suffer for?
Yeah, that's what it is. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've been, I've been on, I did 150 mile ride
one time I rode from Cumberland, Maryland back to Pittsburgh on the gap trail. That's
a great Allegheny passage. It shortened up the gap, but that was, that was kind of like
my first like real test of myself that I passed. I feel I actually failed a lot and like, I
shouldn't even say that because I just told you failure wasn't starting. But I mean, okay,
let's put it this way. I had some not so great experiences before that with cycling. And
that, that ride, that 150 mile ride was kind of like my last hurrah of can I, can I really
do this, you know, and do it well. And I had, I had a great day on the bike. It hurt. I
went through like three hours of like lightning and rain and mud. And it was miserable. And
I loved every second of it. And that, that really showed me a lot. That was back in 2020
about how I can push myself and circling back to the bike trip that you had mentioned. I
like to do one of those every year. So it's, I was trying to figure out a way that I could
tie something into something I'm good at. So I was, I'm pretty good at cycling. I'm
not, there's a lot of guys out there that are way better than me that are probably riding
on these streets where you live at every day, but I'm decent. I'm probably in like a top
percentile of people that actually get out and ride. But I wanted to marry that with
something and I felt the need to serve or to give. So every year I pick a different
charity or cause I ride doing these long rides and I raised money for that. So that's kind
of how we got into that. And that's how I partnered up with the Amplify and we did the
fundraiser for the survival center with Rob. Yeah. Yeah. So that's kind of tying that all
back in together. And let me tell you that, that, that cycling trip that we took, I don't
know if you saw the videos or whatever. I had, I had a rough time. I suffered on that
trip, you know? And I was battling a lot of, a lot of disappointment and pride on that
because it's been a long time since I've not like finished something whenever it comes
to doing something like this. Right. And I had two days where I had to pull the plug
short and I learned on this trip that it was smart for me to do what I did. And it also
isn't embarrassing because it wasn't a failure. Rob, Rob, who he was amazing on this trip.
So proud of him. He was able to keep finishing off those days. I couldn't say he kept us
going. Yeah. That kept it legit for the days were for finished to completion. But yeah,
I just, Meg Croyle, she sent me a message and she was like, Hey, maybe this is like
God telling you that you can still attempt to like, to do something like things that
you enjoy while also taking care of yourself and showing other people that you can take
care of yourself while like still suffering through something. Actually, do you mind if
I pull up the message she sent me? I just want to, I want to read it because I'm not,
I'm not worrying that correctly. And I really want to make sure I do it justice because
she sent me such a really nice message. And it meant a lot. So let me, let me pull this
up here real quick. And whenever I read that, it made a lot of sense to me. And it made
me think about the bad time I was having and put it in a different perspective. Yeah. So
she said, she said, God's reminding you that you have no idea the power he is displaying
through you when you feel weak. Maybe there is someone watching who desperately needs
to know that you can stumble and keep going, that you can pursue serving others and take
care of your health at the same time. So even though I was having a really, really hard
time, you know, I was stumbling through something. It was, Hey, I'm still out here. I'm still
doing it. And I'm doing it smart, taking care of myself. And we made it through. And we
completed the mission. So I think a lot of times, you know, having endurance is not only
suffering through something, but it's also just taking the steps necessary, maybe taking
steps back, doing what you need to do to finish something. I don't know if that makes sense
or not, but that's an interesting way to look at it too, I think. Yeah. Like when you say
taking steps back, you mean like, like for, like for me in that specific instance was
like pulling out one of the days, prioritizing my health so that for the rest of the trip,
I could complete the rest of it. You know, I didn't want to, I didn't want to die on
the first day. It was, it was really rough out there. It was like 106, 107 degrees out
there on the street. And I, I was probably very close to heat stroke. I was getting dizzy
on the bike and Rob had to hold me up at points and it was, I was in bad shape. So taking
a step back and being like, I shouldn't be doing this right now, even though that's all
I want to do. You know, I looked at it that time. I was like, this is embarrassing. I'm
the guy. I'm the guy that does this. And all of a sudden I'm out here on the first day
and I'm like, I'm weak, you know? So it was, it was hard for me to come to terms with that.
But, but you know, what kind of, what Meg said, and then just thinking more and even
just praying about it and trying to, trying to hear God, it was just like, Hey, you can,
you can still do this. Let's just do a little bit differently. You know, and it might, it
might look different. It might take longer, but that's what endurance is. You know, it's,
it's just sticking with something and it's like outlasting something for me. It was outlasting
the pain that I was having. It was outlasting my current condition and just bouncing back
and tackling it and finishing the job off. So I think that gives into a lot of endurance
too.
Yeah. And like this isn't just for the listener here. Like it's not just for like, we're not
just talking physical endurance. These are just examples that I have recently. Right.
Yeah. And like it's cause like whenever we talk about like your calling, it's like you're,
if you want to pursue something that you're passionate about, it's not going to be an
easy thing to pursue. And there's going to be times when you need to endure and like
there's going to be times of suffering to be able to like, like to learn new, to learn
new things. There are going to be points of, I guess you air quote failure and like times
whenever you're going to learn new things and then have to deal with like learn new
mental strategies to deal with, deal with like whatever, whatever, whatever you have
to learn, whenever you have to, whenever you have to grow through in order to accomplish
what do you want to accomplish? The mental like, like mental endurance is like extremely
hard to like, you can't perfect it, but you can like get really like, like you can get
really, you have to be, I think just like working out, you have to practice, you have
to practice, you have to keep doing it. And if you stop doing it, it's going to, it's
going to be hard to, you have to get back into it again. And I'm rambling a little bit,
but the, like what I'm saying, making sense. Yeah, for sure. I, yeah. I mean, I definitely
like what you said there, especially with like the mental endurance. It's, it's just
like you said, working out. I mean, your, your brain and your mindset is a muscle that
you have to work. The more that, the more that you can kind of push yourself places
or maybe outlast like a bad situation that makes you mentally tougher, that gives you
mental endurance. It sharpens you. And then whenever things pop up in your life down the
road, you're like, you have a frame of reference. You're like, oh yeah. I mean, like this is
terrible, but like I've been through this before. Like we'll get through this. Yeah.
It makes, it makes some of the more mundane day-to-day agitations, maybe not feel so big
anymore. Right. It's just like, okay, like this is something that doesn't even matter
anymore. It kind of rolls off you because you have a little bit more, more mental strength,
you know, to get through some, some situations. Yeah, definitely. And I think I've talked
about this before too, but you know, endurance in your faith. Yeah. That's something we can,
you know, that's something we can definitely talk about. It's like, you know, you, you
can go to church and you can raise your hand for salvation. And then you can just be like,
cool. You know, wipe my hands clean. Like, you know, I'm saved. But it's like, you know,
where's, are you building a relationship with God? You know, are you, are you understanding
the way that, you know, things were designed to be? It's like, that's a lifelong process.
Yeah. And you're never gonna, you're never gonna fully get a hundred percent filled up
in that. Yeah. It's you're always, you're always learning, you're always praying. You
should always, always be talking to God. You should always be listening and serving and
doing things in the community. And that's, that's endurance. You know, I mean, it's like
you, everybody, everybody wants to thank God for the good times, but it's like, what happens
whenever someone passes away or you go through a really, really terrible situation. It's
like, do you have the endurance to stick through that to, while you're going through that hard
time to keep praising, keep thanking God for everything that's good in your life, even
though you have something bad going on. So there's, there's endurance in so many things
in life that you can practically apply like some of the stuff to. Yeah. Yeah. I think
also like some, something to like, I like the concept, like stuff like this, it translates.
It translates into different situations. Like you go into endurance in one area of your
life, it's going to translate to another area. So like, kind of like what you were saying,
like you mentioned already, like you, like, I'll use my own personal example of like me
going through my trials pain and like through my issues with muscular, muscular dystonia
and things like that. Like it's, I've realized that like there's the mental endurance has
excessively, like kind of exponentially grown within the last couple of years as my pain's
gotten worse. And it's like, I mentioned to you before, like, like Meg, like she mentioned
to me, like I guess the other day, like how, like when she looks at me, she doesn't see
a person and she didn't even think about how much pain I'm in. She thinks about all the
things I'm doing with the podcast and with the, and with my job or how I lead, how I
do with production and like, A, that's encouragement. And, but, and like B is like, it's me reminding
myself like, cause I'm dealing with this pain everywhere I go. And that it's the, like I
use that as like, like I know I've gone through, I go through, like, I get this podcast set
up and reach out to people to try and like get guests on the podcast. And before that
would seem very daunting to reach out to somebody in text and be like, and I feel like, I think
it's thinking like, man, I've done so much harder already. Like every day, like five
minutes ago, like I've done so much harder. Like I can do this. And like, it's not even
a thought and I don't even think about it anymore. Like it's like stuff like that would
affect me so much. It doesn't affect me anymore. And like, there's still things I'm like, like
I can be socially awkward, like a lot of people and like things like that. And like I'm learning
to, learning to like, grow my confidence and things like that. And building in like, like
comments like that, like Meg gave me, like, I don't see like a person in pain. I see like
this man that God has created and building, God has built. I'm like, that's like, I couldn't,
like, I couldn't have asked for a better compliment. Any, I have a couple closing questions, but
like, like based off of the conversation, do you have any like last things to say to
like the listeners to like people that are listening, maybe they're struggling, maybe
they want to, what if they, maybe there's somebody that would like to help a friend
out and help them indoor.
Yeah, for sure. I think, I think I touched on this a little bit earlier, but we'll summarize
it again, is that I think everybody out there wants to get started with something or wants
to step out of their comfort zone and whether they even know that or not. I think there's
something that stirs inside everybody to take a chance or take a risk or go on an adventure.
So my advice is to either, if you know what you want to do, get started. Don't, don't
let fear hold you back. If you, if you don't know what you want to do, just keep, keep
exploring dabble in new things, try, try new things out. I think life happens outside your
comfort zone. That's a very popular saying, but it's such a very true statement. You know,
if you're, if you're very much stuck in a routine or in a rut, like just get out of
that. If you're inside a lot, just go take a walk in the park. Something's going to come
to you, you know, pray, pray a little bit. Something might come to you. But once, once
that comes to you, like that's, that's, that's a little spark. Let's, you know, let it catch,
let's let it create some members. Let's let it catch the logs and start a big fire. I
think that's how you need to kind of tackle things in life. So that's, that's, that's
my advice and definitely to surround yourself with people that are encouraging and that,
that believe in you. If you have a friend group where you guys, you know, it's a lot
of like subliminal dissing and kind of tearing each other down, haha, joking, but at the
same time it's like that, that can kind of, that can break down over time, right? Like
you need to be surrounded with people that, that believe in you, that encourage you. And
even if they have no idea how to help you get started or do something, at least they're
there for you to say like, Hey, if you're, if you're in, like, I'm going to support you
on a, on a how I can, but like, I will just let me know. So yeah, surround yourself with
the right people too. It's definitely a big key in life. I think.
Now that's, that's extremely true. We talked about that a lot. We've over like the lat.
This is episode 49, I believe. Really 49. Yeah. You've been hard at it. Yeah. Yeah.
It's been a ride. It's fun. Cool. There. Whenever, uh, with Sean and I, like we've talked, we
talked a lot, like with other people and like throughout the time, like we talked a lot
about community with a bunch of other people and always comes up a lot about surrounding
yourself with surrounding yourself with the right people. And, um, like, and also, I think
it's also like from the other side, like try to be that person that is the right person
that other people want to surround themselves with advice. Like it's like, I don't know,
think about like, like, would you want to be around you? Like, yeah, that's a great
question to ask yourself. It's a, it, I don't know. I, I like that you brought that up.
I think it's a, some good, some good, like, uh, final advice to give just like, think,
yeah, think about that. Would you, would you want to be around you? Would you be, are you
encouraging? Are you loving? Are you caring? Do you, um, do you pray, do you pray for others?
Do you like, do you like, um, do you, do you do those things? And if, or if you don't like,
you can't think of me shrugged, but sorry about that. But, uh, if you don't like, think
about how you can start, like think about a friend that you could reach out to. And
like we talked about before in a while ago, uh, Brandon mentioned about speaking the gold
out in people and like speaking about like what you see in them, just giving them encouragement.
And like, we've already mentioned Meg a couple of times out, like how much like she does that
for us. So like, yeah, just think about, think on that and, uh, we're gonna do some final
questions. So when it comes to personal growth, development, um, the things that like really grow
you, what kind of resources would you recommend or do you typically recommend to people?
Yeah. Um, the Bible. Yep. I mean, we laugh, but like for real, you get into the word. I mean,
that gives you a lot of tools to figure out who you are as a person and it kind of lays out the
structure of like how life should be. I think that's a great place to start. I've definitely
noticed my life's been a lot better since I've been consistently reading. Um, that's, that's,
that's a good start for anybody. Um, non-religious based, uh, super polarizing figure, David Goggins.
Are you familiar? I've heard of him. Okay. Yeah. So, I mean, if you can, if you can deal with a
little bit of a little bit of graphic language, great motivator. He, his first book is called
can't hurt me. Okay. Uh, I read that whenever it came out in 2020, that book was like almost
like life-changing for me. Uh, really just taking like personal, personal accountability, um, kind
of like getting out of the, the pity party of maybe something that like you're going through
and just really focusing on like, okay, like I'm here now, like how can I make this better? How
can I better myself? Uh, super motivating book. So if you, if you can get, if you can get through
a little rough around the edges, uh, you know, language and things like that, he's, he's a great
motivator. Uh, we were talking earlier about Huberman, Andrew Huberman. He has a, he's a great
podcast called Huberman Lab. Um, really cool. Just, uh, talking about health and, and science
based stuff like that. I listened to a lot of Huberman. Um, and there's just a lot of like
off the wall stuff I listened to, or I recommended people, but Cam Haynes, uh, he's, he's a bow hunter
up in Oregon, but he does a lot of endurance sport and stuff like that. So he kind of meshes
those two things together and then gets a little bit in the faith and things like that. But he
has a lot of good guests on his podcast from a lot of different backgrounds and they, they talk
about life journeys and successes and failures. So I like listening to his keep hammering podcast.
Yep. Um, you know, that one. Yeah, it's a good one. Yeah. Yeah. I, I like a lot of endurance stuff.
So those are all my recommendations, but, but really, just like we talked about earlier,
wrap this all up again, tie it together. It's like, you might not be interested in cycling or
running or some of the stuff I'm talking about, but the endurance aspect of it translates to so
many other parts of your life. So you may listen to something that I'm recommending and be like,
oh, well yeah, I can apply that to this part of my life. Like, oh, I can see myself through this
difficult time going through by having this sort of endurance. Um, so I think, I think it all
connects and I think people might, might be more interested in things than they think they would
be. Right. So that's why I'm always like talking to people about like, oh, you should get into
running. You should get into cycling. You like riding your bike. Like let's, let's get you into
cycling a little bit more. Um, cause there's a lot that you can take from, from sport, I think,
especially endurance sport that you can apply to the rest of your life. So that's why, that's why
I like to talk about that stuff a lot. No, that's fair. No, that's great. Um, so then don't know how
much you have listened to the podcast before. I've listened a bit. Okay. Um, like, so knowing the
guests that we've had on and like now that we've been on, who do you think would be a, uh, good
guest to be on the podcast? Have you had Ian on here? I haven't had Ian. Okay. That'd be a great
start. I would love, I would love to hear from Ian. I would love to hear, I mean, what a, what a smart
guy. Um, and just how much he knows about production and music, like musicality too. You know, he drums,
um, does production at church and runs the production team. Um, I would like to hear
just his story. I would like to hear maybe some, some stuff faith wise from Ian and just how he
kind of applies like, like what he does just in his day to day life to, to something greater than
just, you know, doing the sound or drumming. I think he would have a good, a good story to tell
and Cole Zimmerman too. Okay. Yeah. He's a, that guy is an absolute wizard with the camera. Um,
and just an overall amazing person. I got to know Cole really well over the bike trip that Rob and
I took because he came out and then did, you know, video and some, some stuff for the church. Uh,
but we became really, really good friends and what, what just a solid individual, really,
really funny guy. I mean, the, the level of care he had for us, uh, both mentally and physically
and helping us out through that trip, it really opened up my eyes to just a different side of him
that I didn't know about, you know, he's amazing with the camera, but he's also a really good
person. So I would say Ian and Cole would be two, two good guys to chat with and just get their
perspective on things. All right. Great. Well, Ian, you heard it here. For those who don't know,
he edits the audio. So Ian, you can leave that in. Shout out Ian, get on the podcast as soon as you
can. Let's go. Um, all right guys, thank you for listening to this episode of the pursuit of calling,
almost at the wrong name. Um, and, uh, if you haven't already, go ahead and share it out on
all your social medias. Give us a five star review on Apple podcasts or Spotify and leave a comment
or review. All right. See you next time.