Welcome to Technically Short. I'm Shawn and I'm Thomas and today's episode is going to
be sort of like a review of other episodes. So it's really good. So stay tuned and we're
about to start right now.
Alright. Yeah. So like Shawn said, this is a recap where we're still in the perfectly
imperfect series on excellence and we decided it would be a good idea to look back at the
past episodes that we've had with Brandon, Mike, Josh, Michaela so far and just kind
of pick out. We picked out like some of the best lessons that we built that like stuck
with us personally and separately and we dive and we'll dive in a little deeper into each
one of those things. So Shawn, why don't you bring up your what's your first lesson that
you got up?
Okay. So I'm going to take my first lesson which is Michaela's and it was don't strive
but seek. Right? So like we should be seeking for what God has for us, not striving to be
a certain person and that's what brings excellence. So like if we seek what God has for us or
for a person who doesn't believe in God, a person if you seek what is the best for you,
then you will be able to be excellent.
Well, I have the same thing written down that you just write that always because that's
what we bring up in like every episode. We always talk about striving versus seeking
aspect of excellence now that Michaela brought it up and I never in here the negative, it's
a negative connotations that some people could start to believe if they are always striving.
They want to get to that next big thing so badly that everything else falls to the wayside,
your friends, family, other responsibilities, etc. And then they burn out. Like it's the
striving that it's a constant. It's like if you're striving for like if you think financial,
if all you're striving for is to have more money, then you'll never be satisfied. And
all you want is that next promotion that we talked about that with Mike. You just want
that next promotion. You want that next step up. You want that title change. But that never
ends. There's no satisfaction to that. And so like really striving versus seeking is
more like it's seeking, like Shawn said, it's seeking who you're being called to be, but
not just seeking who you're called to be, but also kind of like bleeding into what Josh
I think Josh was talking about a little bit is like it says it says seeking for that end
goal. Focus on what you're doing in the current moment and focus on the journey versus the
destination, right? Like you're striving, you know, striving. If you're striving in
the wrong way, then you're going to burn out. You're going to your life's going to go down
instead of up. But if you're in your striving, you are actually seeking, then what you're
seeking for like Michaela brought up is like you're seeking God out. You're seeking who
he is and how you can be more like him and be a more successful person, be a more successful
person, be a more successful person of faith. And what that means is for those who aren't
of faith, that means like you're doing what essentially doing what you believe God is
telling you to do without and I get that that might seem kind of weird to people that don't
believe in God and that's okay. And I think for people that maybe don't believe in God,
that seeking part would be more like I'm seeking, I'm seeking improvement. I'm seeking to grow.
I'm not just seeking for the end result. I'm not just straight here or striving for that
end result. I'm seeking. I'm seeking out what how how I can be better and how I can
better be a better servant to other people. Yeah, that's good too. Oh, my second point
was, I love when Josh said this, he said, don't fall in love with the fruit fall in
love with the root. So I bring this back to what you were saying, Thomas, that was like
nail on a on its head. Oh, we can't fall in love with the product. We got to fall in love
with the product maker. We got to fall in love. Yeah, that's good. We I just honestly
think that like, oftentimes, we always are worried about the end goal. But if we've like
you said, fall in love with the destination, but even more than that, it's like your focus
is on the root for us Christians, the root is God, which is Jesus, which is the Holy
Spirit, which is the Father. And when you fall in love with that, you become the person
you were always meant to become, because you're not worried about, okay, the person I'm supposed
to become without having a foundation. Yeah, I was reading Dave Ramsey yesterday, really
good stuff. And it's like, when life tests you, and it will, it'll test all of us, believers,
non believers, all that, but the foundation that you build on determines everything. And
this is why it's so important to fall in love with the root over the product. Because if
you just have the product, and you don't have a strong enough root, when the storms of life
happen, and they will, you just fall. It's like the three little pigs, the one little
arm pig, he built his house on hay, the other little pig built his house on sticks. The
third one was had a strong foundation, he builds his house on bricks. So when the storms
of life happen, the other two pigs had to move in with the little the biggest brother,
the wise one, because he had a good foundation. So fall in love with the root.
No, that's really good, Shawn. Like, I again, have the same thing written down for John.
But like, one thing that I want to say, like, having the having the good foundation, and
like we like we say, we say as Christians that our foundation is in Jesus Christ. And
it's what we believe like what we call the rock, we call the rock, like whether I rather
have their foundation built on a rock, then built on sand. And sand is like, it's always
shifting. It's like you can never really get a good a good foot, get a good fit and footing.
If you've been to the beach, you know what I'm talking about. But what if you're on
a rock, if you're on you're standing on a rock, it's a lot easier to get a grip. It's
a lot easier to like hold your ground and diving a little bit deeper into what we're
talking about the process. Like when you're focusing on it, when you're focusing on the
journey, like you want to focus on the journey, because that's where the growth actually happens.
Like the destination is just it is just the end result of your of the growth that you've
experienced. Like you're going to grow either way, whether you're like but you're going to
grow a lot more effectively if you're actually focusing on the growth itself. And it's depending
on what you're going to actually going to grow in. And like I think Shawn already kind of
mentioned this, but as you grow as you grow as a person, you're risk getting deeper into who you
are and who Jesus is calling you to be. Because going back to Michaela, if you're seeking out who
you're being called to be versus like just some rudimentary thing that rudimentary goal of like
having more money or like you can't say something like or like I want to say like lose weight, but
you can definitely lose enough. There's an end to that. But like I think you guys get what I'm
saying. Like you want to focus on you want to focus whenever you have that foundation,
especially while you're on that journey. When that journey isn't even it's not going to be easy
because if you're growing, that means you're getting into uncomfortable situations.
And it's not going to be easy, which means you have to have a solid foundation under your foot
in order to not just in order to like so you don't fall down, it's easier to get back up.
But also because you will fall down like it happens that's life. Yeah, but like absolutely
you'll fail and then the failure though is it just a learning process. There's a book I want to get
by John Maxwell because it's called sometimes you win and sometimes you learn. And I'm like,
I want to get that book. I want to get all of his books. But yeah, I think going forward,
if you're like wanting to grow in a certain aspect of your life, look at what your foundation is in.
And then if your foundation is your friend, maybe your foundation is your friends,
maybe they're constantly shifting. Maybe your foundation maybe like and you might not know
what your foundation is and that's okay. But maybe you're like think about like what is the core of
my life right now? What do I set things on top of? Like where do I how do I learn? Where am I
learning these new things? Like it could your foundation could easily be to some somebody on
social media, some influencer. And that's terrible. I'm going to be honest right now.
Uh, like there are great people and great people at church at our church, great people
at great people around the globe that are like they're focusing on teaching growth. Yeah. So
today I guys I don't love the root but be in love with but don't love the fruit be in love with root.
I messed it up. No worries. Um, you care if I start this one off? Yeah, no, you can start that. So,
um, so for Mike, for my guys, he had two things and it caught both Shawn and I off guard.
One thing is if the people this one didn't if you're leading people,
if you're we talked about leadership and like leaders excellence in that leadership. And if the
people you are leading are being successful there and you're doing something right and doing it
right. But he then he said this, he said if you're doing more than the people you're leading, you're
doing something wrong. And we were like, what are you talking about? So true. Yeah, I, um,
I have right here, like I take this to mean that you as a leader set your followers up for success.
You give them the tools, the vision and direction. However, you don't do things for them. You let
them fail, learn, fail and learn. And you, you be their guide and their servant, but not their
detriment. Well, that's good. You not, or I should say you can, you be their guide and their servant,
but not to their detriment. So like, you don't like, I, you know, like a leader knows,
knows more than before. Yeah. That leader should know a good leader knows more than before the
people that he's leading. And then when he, he, and then he or she can hand that off, can be like,
this is the plan. This is, this is the vision. This is what we're working towards. And the leader,
though, doesn't necessarily execute every little tiny thing. Cause if they did, they wouldn't be
able to work on, they want to be able to work on people development. They want to be able to do,
they want to be able to take the time to do the, for growth that they need to take
so that they can pass that growth on to their followers that who are actually, who are taking
that time, who are taking their time to pursue the vision. So like there's work to, there's work to
be done. So like there's work to be done and the leader can't do it all. That is so good. And like,
I had to think about it for a little bit after, especially even after the recording was done. I
was like, what the heck did that mean? Yeah. Oh yeah. So like when I, when I take this means,
I actually had thought at the same point, which is so crazy in my head, cause my whole life,
I was taught like a leader works harder than everybody else. A leader does this and the leader
does that. And Mike brought such a good point of like the leader shouldn't be working harder than
everybody else. Why? Because if you're leading well, the people are already bought in. And if
people are bought in, they're going to work just as hard as you so they can achieve whatever goal
that is set, right? Achieve whatever standard of excellence is put out there if they're brought in.
But see, that's the thing. A lot of times when people are leading, they're leading to people
who don't actually want to follow. So if a person who's followed, not want to follow, then you have
to put in extra effort and then you have to try to get this person, persuade this person to get
their mindset on the goal to be achieved. But when people are bought in, they naturally want
to achieve the same goal. And if they're naturally wanting to achieve the same goal,
then the hard work should be shared among everybody, the leaders and everybody. So it makes
a lot of sense when I thought about it that way. First is the first way when I was taught as a kid
is like, okay, all leaders work harder than everybody else. And everybody else just follows
the leader. And then it's like, but now my mindset is completely different. And it was shout outs to
Mike, shout outs to Thomas because it's like, yeah, that question itself was so deep than the
understanding. It's just, wow. And like, don't take this to mean that like the leaders don't work
hard. Yeah. Because they do and like leaders need to work hard. And it's because of their hard work
that the followers know what to work hard on. Right. And because they might not be working on
the same things that their followers are working on, but it's all working towards the same vision.
Like in the beginning, before a leader is a leader and they don't have any followers,
they're putting in all of this time and putting all this time and all of this effort into all this
time and all of this effort into like into building this vision out. And like they have
the vision and they're like, I'm working towards growth. I'm growing myself. And then like,
I'm growing myself. I'm growing myself that I'm maintaining and I'm maintaining, but also
watching as my vision changes as I grow. And when it gets to the point where some people come
alongside of you, because they're not below, they're beside. Yeah. And people come alongside
of you that you're leading, then you can be like, okay, this is like, this is what I've learned.
This is all the work that was the front end work I put in that nobody else has seen.
And that this is what the vision now is. And if the, and like, like Shawn was saying, if those people
are coming alongside to follow you or they weren't just hired. Sometimes if they are hired,
obviously, like there's business leaders, things like that, and people will buy into their vision,
want to work for the company. And then they work in whatever area that their gifts are most pertinent
for, for that vision to be successful. And it's like within the church, we say we are one body,
we are all different parts. So good. And so like if the leader is the head and the leader is like,
okay, it has the brain. So we're going this way. This is what we're going to do. This is how we're
going to do it. Like then the, like the people that want to do like, let's take the business
real quick. Like marketing. Yeah. Some people are going to do the marketing. Some people are going
to do outreach. Some people are going to be speaking. Some people are going to be, some people
are going to be some of your salesmen. Like there's going to be, there's so many different
aspects to any of the, any vision that a leader not only, like a leader can't do it by themselves
in order to enact a big vision. So like that's what I like in my in-depth, in-depth kind of
breakdown of what that one sentence means of like, if you're doing more than the people you're
leading, you're doing it wrong. It means like, it kind of goes all the way back down to, or
or over to like what Michaela was saying and Josh and Brandon too. Like you can get to the,
if you're trying to do everything, you're going to burn out and you're going to fail. Yeah.
See any other people alongside you that are going to work just as hard, if not harder than you.
Yep. Agreed. 100% agreed. My next point would be, I'm taking this quote from my mentor,
Pastor Brandon. He said, we are a by-product of our friends, our community. So it's like, wow.
I'm thinking about that. You really keep your eyes open. In his episode, he was talking about like
how he had to eliminate certain friend groups or move away from that area just because of the
by-product, because people have to see and be bought in. So your friend group is very important.
Your circle is very important. You can't let everybody speak into you. You can still be friends
with that person. It's not saying that you can't, but what I'm saying is that your circle should be
wise counselors, advisors, mentors, people who can give you experience and knowledge that you
didn't have to help you in situations. People who could speak life into your situation. People who
can help you in areas where you're at. That's what you really want as your circle. You can have
other friend groups as well, but as your circle, it should be like you should have your as your
main circle, I would say, is people who are advising you. And then you can have a circle
underneath that where you're helping other people. And then you can have a circle like, you know,
like in the way I see it is like you have your mentors, you have your peers, and then you should
have people you're discipling. So I think that was wise when he told me, told us about that in his
episode. So yeah, I think like, trying to get off of that, like, they're like, you like you, if you're
inner circle, like we're talking about, we start to inner and outer circle, but if your inner circle
are people that aren't lifting you up and aren't growing you, then you need a new circle. Yeah.
And that's kind of what Brandon was alluding to, like you like moving away from different friends,
moving away from different friends, friend groups, and different and certain people in order to
be able to surround yourself with others, because you can only spend so much time with people.
Right. And so now it's like, like, who are the people that are pouring into your life?
Who are the people that you can pour into, like, who are the people that you can pour into them,
they can pour into you, and so you can grow each other. And then your outer circle is like the
people that you kind of, that you can still talk to, and they're still really good people,
and they can still grow you, but they're not the people that you maybe tell all the most pertinent
details of your life to, but they're still really good people that you want to surround yourself
with. And I do like the point though, that you've made it a few times throughout the episodes of the
three, the three layers of influence, and where it's not just, it's not just top down. Yeah, it's
it's not like, like you don't just look below you and be like, I can mentor these people down here
and bring them up, but you also look up and be like, who can mentor me? Yeah. Because you're not,
like nobody's perfect in everything. So there's always going to be something you can be mentored
in. So I think that was a really good point to bring up. My thing I got from Brandon, this was
the first different one we had, is if you see the gold in someone, you speak the gold. Oh, and it
kind of goes along the same lines because it goes down to your discipling point. And if you see the
gold in someone, speak the gold. Like he, like I mentioned, like he said, like Josh mentioned this
in his episode about Brandon, like he saw something in him, and I've had this experience as well,
and I'll talk about that in a second. Like the, Josh was like, he said he was just somebody who
was quiet, he was shy, but Brandon saw something in him that where he was like, he's got, he's got
like, he saw something in him and he didn't even know what it was yet. He was like, there's something
to this guy. And then he started discipling him and started speaking it out. And that's what I think
a lot of us should be able to do a lot more of is exalting each other and pointing out to pointing
out the, like we see something good and we tell you and we tell you about it. And we're like, oh,
and like for me, it's like, it's like, you, like, you notice something, you notice that thing.
That's just something I do all the time. It's nothing special to me. And, but someone else
notices it and they're like, wow, that's really cool that like, like Shawn, like it's really cool
that you're like, like you're so good at like talking to people about the Lord. Like you're so
good at like, you're so good at like looking, having those conversations with people that maybe
otherwise wouldn't have had that, but maybe by and large I had that opportunity that day.
And like, that's something that you're really good at. And like, and obviously I believe you know
that you're good at that and you lean into that. I don't think, and I, so like that's something that
you guys with your friends can start doing. And I feel like you don't just wait for somebody to do
it to you. You also, you just go forward and do it to others. And when people notice that like that
kind of stuff is contagious. So you just, you keep speaking, you see the gold, you speak the gold.
But the other one was whenever he actually Brandon defined the excellence, cause they all had their
different ways to define excellence. But Brandon's first started off with what's saying, what's
saying like, what excellent isn't, excellence isn't, is in words. He said, it's not perfection.
It's like, it's don't live a life, a performance based life or in like, pursuing everything. And
what it is, is pursuing everything Jesus has called you to pursue. And this is stuff that kind of has
been said already, but like it's not perfection. So good. It's like, that's how you burn out.
It's how you, like whenever you're striving for like that, trying for that one goal of having so
much money that you let all those things fall to the wayside and you're trying to be perfect.
And you're saying it'd be so good that I mean, if I can make $10,000, if I can make $10,000,
like then like, like that would be great. So how do I get, how do I make those $10,000? What do I
have to do to just like, and that becomes the main focus and then everything else falls off.
And that, and I mean every, everything, like the good and the bad or actually the good will fall
off. The bad might end up getting amplified. That actually I want to go back, sorry, I know
I'm talking about this is really good. I'm enjoying it, but I want to go back to, like I said,
I was going to talk about how somebody saw the golden me. Yeah. And I forgot and then I remembered
again, but this happened, this happened a few years ago, whenever Pastor Kels, he's now in
down in Georgia, right? Yeah. In Athens, I believe. Yeah. And like he, whenever I started leading
production team is because he came up to me after like, I was serving with him to get his message
out during COVID and I was helping set up his tech equipment. And it was like the second time we were
back in person for a service on a Wednesday or Tuesday, whatever day we were having when we came
back. And he just comes up to me right afterwards, Hey Thomas, can you build me a production team?
I'm like, okay. So I was like, I never did this before, but I'll try. I went and grabbed two
friends and like, here you go. Here's our team. It was like five minutes. He was like, oh, that was
fast. I was like, yeah, I can build a team with both teams. And like, but it was that moment that
like, like I was years ago and now like 20, whatever time of what year was that? 2021, whenever
we were allowed to come back and be human again. Yeah, it was weird because the first coming back,
we had to still have a mask on, remember? Yeah. It was annoying. Yeah. But the, I'm still doing
production today. I'm still leading a team in Aspire Collective. And I was like, for a time,
I was even, I was part time at the church called the production team for our East Campus. And
like, and like guys, like whenever you speak something, he didn't even have to speak it. He
just, he just like, he just put me in a position because he saw something. He said, he just like
gave me a role because he saw something in me that I didn't see in myself. I always knew I kind of
like thrived in leadership positions, but like, yeah, I always liked them growing up. And we talked
about that in past episodes, but like, but I never, I never like volunteer wise, I'd never put myself
in that position. And it took, and then, and then like, so Kelv was like the first person to do that.
And he was like, and it was like, hey, are you going to do this? And then like Pastor Ed started
doing that as well. It's like, he was like, he was the first person that talked to me about
possibly joining the production team that didn't get paid for that. And like, and then I got to go
to Philly, there was a production there. And I, like, it just opened up, it opened up so many
experiences to me that I wouldn't have had otherwise. And that's like, that's why you need
to speak to go out and people. Because if you, like, cause like, like, if you don't, nothing's
going to happen. And like, so nothing bad will happen, but nothing good will happen either. But
so like, whenever you do, like only good can come out of that and only good for that person.
And it will be, it's not, and it's not just for that person. It's also for you. Because whenever you,
you can see, like you, like you see that out in somebody, when you speak to somebody,
tell them, you exalt them in the things that you see, that that goal that they see, that you see
in them, like that changes, that shifts your heart even more every time you do it. Absolutely.
It causes your heart, it makes it easier the next time. Oh, so, so good. So you can keep doing it,
keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep pouring into people and also making sure you're
important into it as well, obviously. But like, guys, that's like, like for me, that's like one
of the pinnacle points of our series so far. Yeah, absolutely. It's like excellence and like,
we like excellence isn't just striving for the things. Excellence isn't just striving,
or striving or even seeking the things out for ourselves. It's not about us. It's about the
people that are like our visions and our goals will affect and for the, for the better. So,
whenever, for excellence, isn't just being like trying to reach a goal and doing that excellently.
It's, like we said before, it's exceeding expectations. Most people do not expect to be,
be exalted for something that they've done that they may, might think is normal to them. Like,
that, that is an excellent thing to do. Yeah, if I could speak on that for a second. Yeah,
I've been talking a lot. No, I think that, I think that's good. I was just going to say, Thomas,
you do that so well. That's actually what I was about to speak on. It's like, God has given you
the power to not like just be a leader and just like certain people, when they just become a
leader, they're like, oh, okay, great. I'm in charge. I'm better than everybody else. But like,
Thomas, your heart's never been that way. Like when God puts you in leadership positions,
your goal is always like, okay, how can I help serve this other person? How could I do that?
And I think it comes down to what God calls us all to be leaders, right? But a lot of people don't
realize that they're the called to be leaders, so they don't know how to. But I love how the fact
that you are able to just like speak into people and then you're raising up people and you're
serving people because it comes down to what God calls all humanity to do, which is to love God
with all your heart, mind, soul, spirit, everything, and then love people. When you truly love people,
you're able to say, okay, I see the greatness in you. How can I, how can I help you get to
your greatness? You know what I mean? When you don't love people and it's all about you and it's
about pride, then you're just worried about, okay, me, me, me, me, me, how can I be better than
everybody else? But when you truly are a great leader, which all the people who have been on
our episodes are, that is Mike, Michaela, Josh, Brandon, Thomas, me, David, Nathan, so many great
leaders of who have been on our show, but all of them are. And that's because they realize it's not
about them. Yeah. So that's good. And, uh, you know, I think that's a good way to wrap it up.
That was like, I feel like this, this was, I think this was a great recap, but we also got a dive in
a little, got down a little bit. And so guys, like, I really hope you enjoyed this episode. This was
kind of something we decided like last night to do. And it's the next morning and we, uh, we prep in
different ways. Like he is all in his head and I have my stuff written out and like that works and
that works for us. And like, um, honestly it works, it works better than I initially would think it
would work. Uh, so guys, I hope, I hope you guys honestly really enjoyed this episode. If you liked
it, like it, if you would give us five star review when I ever platform you're on Apple podcast,
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episode. We'll see you next time. Love you guys.