Like five rounds in three days. Oh, gosh. Yeah.
Do you feel, like, not as strong as other climbers?
For sure. Yeah. I feel pretty weak all the time.
We can't do one arm. Okay. I, like, brag about
how weak I am. Yeah, I take a lot of pride in
that. There was a comment on it that said that
Japan brought the Avengers. Yeah. And then the
U .S. brought the Benchwarmers Benchwarmers.
Relationship advice. Yeah, let's get your guys'
relationship advice. Welcome to another episode
of the That's Not Real Climbing podcast. I'm
your host, Jinni, and I'm excited to introduce
my guests for today, Declan Osgood and Zoe Yi.
Declan and Zoe just competed at the Fukuoka Exhibition
Team Event for Team USA, where they climbed in
all five boulder and lead rounds. In this episode,
we'll learn about their unorthodox climbing training
program here in San Diego, how team selection
and strategy worked at Fukuoka, and whether there
was added pressure climbing with a team and coach
present. This is my first time doing an in -person
recording with two guests, so sorry for the strange
audio mixing in certain parts, but I hope you
can enjoy this interview with Declan and Zoe.
Please pardon this brief intermission, but I'm
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for helping to sponsor the podcast. Now, back
to the show. Okay, how are you guys doing? How
did you brave the rain? Good. I almost died driving
here. Yeah. Me too. It was pretty scary. Sorry
for scheduling it on this day. It's okay. But
it might be a good thing because there's like
nothing else to do anyway. Yeah. Yeah. There
were, like, a lot of people who didn't have their
lights on while driving, and I hated that. I
was just following one car the entire time because
I couldn't see the, like... Yeah, in front. Yeah.
Please tell me you guys have your lights on while
driving. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Good. Okay,
cool. Well, then, let's get right into it. So,
how did you guys both get into climbing and competing,
first of all? You can go first. I went to a summer
camp. When I was eight at the wall climbing gym,
and then they told me to join the team. So I
joined the team and started competing after that.
They, like, knew right off the bat that you were
something special or what? I don't know. Okay.
Prodigy. Yeah. I was pretty similar, but it was
a birthday party. It was actually my brother's
birthday party. And then after that, my dad got
into climbing. Oh. And then I just kind of went
with him to the climbing gym. I joined, like,
the local team. But there was only, like, one
practice a week. So we didn't train very much.
And then I didn't start competing until I moved
to San Diego. Okay. That makes sense. Where I
joined, like, Mesa. Oh. Oh, I didn't know that
you were. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I joined Mesa, like,
the competitive team. And then started competing.
And does your dad still climb? Yeah. Is he good?
He's gotten better throughout the years. Okay.
Yeah. So that's a no then? There was a time where
he was better than me, but that didn't last very
long. Okay. How hard would you say he, like,
climbs? At Mission Valley, the grades are pretty
hard, so maybe V5. Okay. That's pretty good.
Yeah. Mission Valley V5s are pretty hard. Yeah.
Oh, for real. I get that. Yeah. Does anyone in
your family climb? Uh, no, my dad climbs like
once a year, but yeah, I was, I was on the wall
climbing team for a couple of years and then
I joined Mesa rim. So we were on the same team
for a bit and then we both joined class five.
Yeah. It all comes back to the wall. Uh, 2021.
Yeah. It all comes back to the wall. Okay. Yeah.
So do you both still like train with class five
at all? Or cause you guys aren't like on the
youth team anymore. It's not really a youth team.
Oh. It's more like an adult. It's not really
a team. It's a community, really. Yeah. Okay.
Tell me more about class five. Because, like,
I always thought it was just a youth team. But
it's just a team. Yeah. Of people. But it used
to be a youth team. Okay. But now that we're
non -youth, it's no longer a youth team. Like,
a lot of people aged out of youth and, like,
moved away for college and stuff. Yeah, now it's
Al, our coach, and then the two of us, and then
two more, Phoebe and Alina, who are kind of on
the team. Oh, okay. You guys never recruited,
like, newer people? No, but do you know SDCA?
SDCA, no. It's like a new youth team that kind
of came out of Class 5. Oh, I haven't heard of
it. It's not Class 5, but it's similar ideas.
Yeah. It's David and Marco. Okay. But they're
kind of the youth team at the wall. Okay. And
then we're kind of, like, the adult team, kind
of. Interesting. Like, we train at the same time.
Yeah. We're not really together. Okay. So they're
not in it for, like, I guess technically youth
teams are, like, a business, really. So it's
more just about the game. Class 5 is a business.
Okay. Well, I also know, like, who is it? I always
see, like, Ross and... Oh, my God, what's her
name? Kylie, wearing, like, Class 5 shirts. Yeah,
they're also Class 5. Okay, but they, like, graduated
and have gone away. Yeah, they don't really practice
with us. Interesting. Well, that's a bit unconventional,
and you guys also mentioned that your training
is a bit unconventional. So, like, first of all,
what is, like, a typical training routine? Because
I think a lot of people aren't involved in, like,
youth teams or, like, structured climbing programs.
And then, yeah, how is your training different
from it? Well, I'd say we don't really have as
much structure, I think, as other youth teams.
Like, our coach doesn't really come up with plans
for the day. It's more just, like, what we want
to work on and how he can help us with that.
Like, during those couple hours at practices.
Yeah, I mean, we just climb. Yeah, we don't really
hangboard or work out that much. I haven't worked
out in like two months. Dang. We're not climbing
for strength gain. It's more like technique and
body awareness and stuff like that. Yeah, but
I guess even when it comes to technique and body
awareness, there's not structured programs for
it. You just do whatever. Well, I think the philosophy
is to create an environment where you're kind
of forced to learn to climb. The right way? Mm
-hmm. So, like, our spray wall, we spend a lot
of time spray walling. Mm -hmm. So it's kind
of set in a way where you can't just, like, pull
up on the holds and be strong. You have to, like,
use your feet and connect your entire body to
really be able to do any moves. Mm -hmm. And
how do you feel like that compares to a typical
training program, like what you guys were doing
at, like, Mesa or the wall? Mesa was a lot of
strength training, like workouts and stuff. Mm
-hmm. I think it was really beneficial when we
were youth climbers, but maybe now so it's not
as important. Really? I feel like technique is
more important now. Yeah. I think like the philosophy
that Al has is like if you're not as strong,
you have to compensate by using technique. Yeah.
So if you're stronger, it's like easy to kind
of cut corners. And so it kind of forces us to
learn good movement and we can always get strong
later. Do you feel like not as strong as other
climbers? For sure. Yeah. I feel pretty weak
all the time. We can't do one arm. True. And,
like, how do you feel about that? You feel, like,
fine about it? I feel great about it. Okay. I,
like, brag about how weak I am. Yeah, I take
a lot of pride in that. Oh, okay. Yeah, it's
kind of funny, you know. But, like, do you think
one day you guys will do more strength training?
Because, like, I guess when I talked to Ross,
it was, like, you need to, like, get to a certain,
like, you get to a certain strength and then
your, like, technique. catches up to the strength
and then you like can't really progress further
until you get stronger and then you like do strength
training and then you technique i think through
our like technique training we'll just get stronger
naturally and so i think it's more like the technique
will rise and then our strength will just catch
up i think it's kind of the opposite i feel like
it's also like i think climbing is the best way
to get stronger at climbing like um it's like
you can do a bunch of traditional like, weightlifting,
but how well that actually transfers to climbing
is a bit, like, I'm not too sure. No, I get that.
That's good to hear that you don't need to, like,
do a bunch of strength training in order to be
good at climbing. That sounds kind of like what
they do in Japan or, like, what I've heard, at
least. Do you know if that's, like, actually
what they do there or just what they say they
do, but actually behind the scenes? I mean, I
don't actually know what they do. Okay. I mean,
you guys were just there, so. When I was there,
I was just doing the same thing that we do here.
I was just climbing on boulders. Yeah. But the
boulders there are set in a way where, as Zoe
was saying, you have to climb it very well. It's,
like, times 100. Yeah. So it's better for technique,
climbing there, for sure. Okay. Yeah, it's definitely
similar. Yeah. And how did you guys like Japan?
It was so cool. First time. Yeah. I mostly miss
the convenience stores, honestly. Oh, right,
the 7 -Elevens. Yeah, they have lots of good
food options, and you can't really get anything
to eat at gas stations here. Yeah. The triangles
are really nice. The what? The triangles. The
rice triangles? Oh, yeah. With, like, fish inside.
Yeah, there's a name for them, I think. I call
them triangles. We all call them triangles. Yeah,
gotcha. Yeah, I've never been to Japan, but it
seems nice. What about the climbing gyms? Like,
did you guys go to the big ones? Yeah. E -Pump,
Ogikubo. Right, yeah. Next Gen. Oh, yeah. I went
to the Underground. I don't think you went to
it. It was probably my favorite gym. It was,
like, this really small box. Like, underneath
is a Parma complex, and it was, like, Some of
the best setting I've climbed on. It was really
fun. What makes, like, good setting for you?
Just, like, the way I thought about it was when
I'm in, like, a position, naturally there's kind
of a way that you want to leave that position.
And I felt like the climbs really rewarded that
just, like, intuition. I could just climb, and
it didn't matter. How I climbed it, I just climbed
it naturally, and it felt, like, really fun.
Okay, so then getting into, I guess, how Japan
went in terms of the actual event that you guys
were a part of. Is it pronounced Fukuoka? I think
so. Okay. So, yeah, the team event, I think most
people are probably wondering how the USA team
was selected. Because, like, Japan and Korea
brought, like... their biggest climbers, the
ones who win, like, all the medals at the World
Cups. So, yeah, how did you guys get selected?
It was kind of just open. We have, like, a national
ranking. That's how they select the people who
go to World Cups. But I think, I mean, he's on
the national team, but I'm only on the development
team, so I'm, like, lower down. Tired from the
entire season and wanted to take a break, so
they turned it down. So it came down to us. It's
really weird, though, because even though I'm
on the national team for lead, they're selecting
based off of Boulder as well. Okay, so, like,
it was your combined scores? Well, because I'm
not on the Boulder development team at all. Oh,
okay. So it was your combined score and any,
like, points that you got in World Cups. So if
you had made, like, a semifinal at a World Cup,
you had more points over someone who was, like,
on the team, I think. Okay. I don't really know.
But, yeah, there was some sort of point system
that they had in place. Yeah. And so everyone
else just kind of passed up. Yeah. There were
a couple points. Xander Waller was right in front
of me, and he declined, and then it passed down
to me. I think Colin and Jesse declined as well.
Yeah. I was, like, fourth down or something.
Okay. Yeah. Were you guys excited to get the
opportunity, or was it like, eh, I'm not sure?
No, I was really psyched. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's
a cool opportunity. I mean, I guess it is far,
though, for us. Yeah. But, like, it's Japan.
Like, how can you not go? Yeah, I mean, yeah.
I would have gone, too. Did you have any, like,
expectations for the event going into this, especially
hearing that you guys were, like, going to compete
against Serato? We were going, like, two weeks
before. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. I was in Japan after
World Champs. And then I flew back to the US
and then like the day after I flew back, I got
the email that I was going to Fukuoka. That sucks.
Yeah. But we had no clue what to expect. We like
found out the format the day before the comp.
Oh, wow. Yeah. The logistics of what was happening.
It was like, yeah, we had no clue what was going
on. There was no way to prepare. Yeah. Okay.
So then how did you feel the difficulty of the
boulders compared to maybe like World Cup climbs
or the other like biggest? Well, neither of us
have actually climbed on a World Cup. I've never
been on a Boulder World Cup. Biggest comps that
you guys have been a part of. What's the biggest
comp you've been a part of? Yeah, Youth Worlds,
bouldering. I think you've been to Youth Worlds,
too. I've never been to Youth Worlds for bouldering.
I've never bouldered internationally. I think
it was similar styles, but maybe turned down
quite a bit. I thought they were quite generous.
I was able to get several tops. That doesn't
say that it was easy. I think it was just turned
down a little bit. Okay. Especially in the qualies.
Up for the bend, I think a climb got, every man
topped one climb in the elimination round. And
then the other climb, it was like only a few
people didn't top it. So you wouldn't really
see that in a World Cup. Okay, that's true. Well,
we, so as viewers, we didn't get to see like
qualies. I guess the earliest we saw was the
Boulder elimination round. So I guess, like,
how did the Boulder elimination round compare
to, like, what you guys have done before? Easier,
for sure. Easier. Yeah. Well, that's what I was
talking about, the elimination round. Oh, okay,
gotcha. Yeah, that's the one that had a lot of
tops. Actually, I think Boulder Qualies was quite
a bit harder. Oh. Because it was all the teams.
It was, like, all six of them. Yeah. Versus the
elimination round was only four. True, yeah.
So like we didn't top a single, at least for
the guys, we didn't top a single one in the all
-over fire round. Yeah. That round was actually
pretty hard. Okay. Pretty destroyed in that one.
And then what about finals for both? I thought
the setting was quite generous throughout the
entire round, the entire comp. Like, I mean,
I got a flash in boulder finals. Just like, I
wasn't expecting to get anywhere on the boulders,
honestly. And I got pretty high on the lead route
too. I think it was more like they were just
trying to, like they didn't really care if setting
was a little easy because it's more about like
showcasing the team format and all that. For
the lead routes, you could tell that there was
a change, especially for the guys. The World
Cup routes are so powerful that you can like
easily fall in like the first crux. But these
routes, it was like really chill. Up until the
headwall where it, like, turned on a bunch. Oh,
okay. So I think that's where they wanted to
get a little bit of change in the results. Everyone
was kind of at the same spot, and then it would
just get, like, really, really hard. Okay. Yeah.
So, like, separation between, like, Serrano and
Doyon, probably. Yeah, yeah. That was the difference
between where I fell and then where, like, Doyon
got to. I see. It was in that, like, really hard
headwall section. Yeah. And then how was it,
like, how helpful was it to actually see other
people's beta? I thought it was really helpful.
Helpful for me. I went basically last in qualies
and finals. I feel like I tend to do better during
flash format because I think once I know the
beta, I'm pretty good at just executing. I feel
like I don't actually like to watch people climb.
Maybe if I just see one person, just to get in
my head that it's possible, then I can just climb
based off of what I already was thinking in my
head and intuition. because if you watch so many
people you just get really nervous because you're
like oh you're watching every single like foot
placement and like worrying about not slipping
yeah which if you haven't watched anyone then
you just climb based off of your own ability
and it like feels more fun that way i think no
i get that i won't well so like i personally
haven't competed in that like a what's it called
on -site or yeah flat flash format yeah so I've
never done on -site and I guess I always thought
like oh I would prefer to go with my own beta
yeah um and then when I think back to any competitions
that I have done I've only ever sent harder things
by copying exactly what other people are doing
so um yeah I don't know if I'm actually good
at on -site format um what about having a coach
there like how helpful was that I mean, the coach
that you sent was Al, our coach. He's been coaching
me since I started climbing. Oh, wow. Like 10
years. Yeah, since I was 8. So that was really
cool to go with him. Because, I mean, coaches
don't usually get to, like, influence anything
in a competition, really. So it was cool to have
him out on the floor and, like, ask for beta
if needed. I didn't really notice it too much.
I think for bouldering. I'm pretty much in my
own zone. Oh, okay. I think it was helpful if
you're on, like, a wrong track, he can kind of
tell you where to go. Yeah. If you're doing something,
like, really dumb. Yeah. But besides that, like,
he's mostly giving, like, little tips. Yeah.
Just to lead you in the right direction. But
I think it's good to let the climber really do
it on its own, just because you can get really
distracted, especially if it's, like, five minutes.
True. I don't want to stay locked in. Yeah. And
not be worrying about, like, certain beta or
anything. Okay. Yeah. I think it's, I think we're
both pretty independent climbers, but it's just
helpful, like, if, like, I had a coordination
move for one of my boulders that I was struggling
to stick. It was, like, the first move, so it
was helpful to get an outside perspective of
what I looked like and just, like, little pointers
like that. So there wasn't that much, like, communication
back and forth during the run? Not too much,
especially because he's balancing two different.
teams yeah it's like on like opposite ends so
it's kind of hard for them to be in two places
at once yeah you didn't get to like watch back
what you were doing in the moment right no i
think a few teams did i saw the korean team yeah
video and then when they come down they would
like watch the video yeah i think that's definitely
a strat because that's what we do like in training
we'll have a video of our spray wall so we can
watch it back but in in the moment It's hard
for one coach to do that because then he has
to be in two places at once and filming two things
at once. I think it wasn't possible with what
we had, but I think it's definitely a strategy
we could have used. Did they have two coaches
there? The Korean, probably. Probably more than
two. I think so. A lot of the teams have a few
coaches. I guess it's a lot closer for them.
Did you feel more pressure with your coach being
right there, able to talk to you at the same
time? I didn't know. Maybe that's a me thing.
I just feel so stressed if there's like someone
who kind of cares about my climbing watching
me. That's fair. I mean, we've climbed in front
of him for years. He's seen us fail pretty miserably
and do really well. I guess along those lines,
when I think about climbing as a sport, it's
like a very individual sport. How do you feel
climbing in, like, a team format where there's,
like, also the pressure of your other teammates
counting on you? I thought it was cool because,
like, if I mess up, you know, hopefully there
will be people that have my back and maybe can
pull the team score up a little bit. But I just
feel like it kind of forced us to, like, actually
talk and be friends and, like, collaborate because,
like, I didn't really know Vale and Paloma at
all. Like, I hadn't really talked to them before.
They were our other two teammates. And I feel
like normally at World Cups, I've only been to
a couple, but I think since the U .S. is just
so big geographically, it's hard to really feel
like a team because you just don't know a lot
of your teammates. And I also don't think we
did a very good job of watching every round.
I think a lot of people just kind of go off and
do their own thing. Oh, sure. I think it was
pretty similar to just how I would, like, train
normally, where you're just, like, climbing another
person, you're just trading off. Like, you're
talking about it, and you're climbing. So it
felt normal for me. Yeah. Like, if I'm climbing
with my friends, we'll do the same thing. We'll
just, like, try it, try the same climb, and then
talk about it, and then keep trying it. Yeah.
It didn't feel that different. But with, like,
the point system, you never felt like, oh, like,
I let my team down. Like, I didn't get these
points. Or, like, your teammate didn't get it.
Maybe a little bit. You should have tried harder.
Definitely a little bit. Yeah. But you can also
make up points in so many different ways. Like,
if you, like, on a sport climb, if you miss,
like, one hold or something, then, like, the
teammate is going to get, like, three other points
per one hold. Or, like, because it's exponential,
the points, if you miss one hold. That's like
three points. But if they get one hold and it's
higher, that's like even more many points. It's
a weird scoring. Oh. Yeah. Wait, was it dependent
on how far you got? Yeah. Well, no, it's how
high you get up, the more points you get. Oh,
okay, yeah. Kind of like how it was in the Olympics.
In the Olympics. Okay, gotcha. Yeah. So if you
like mess up early. There's there's room to make
that up. Sure. Yeah. Yeah, so it I didn't feel
as much pressure. Okay Did you feel like there
was anything to change in terms of like your
mindset or strategy when it came to competing
in a team format? I think for lead it was the
same because when you're climbing you're still
by yourself. Yeah for Boulder It was completely
different. I think the qualifier round we like
did not do a very good job as Like climbing as
a team and then as the rounds progressed we like
I think we had a pretty good format for Maybe
the elimination round was really good. And then
the final round was just really hard. But I think
we had a good kind of team system going. Yeah,
I think it just took a little bit of time to
warm up to our teammates, like if we've never
climbed with them before, just getting used to
their style. Yeah, was there any, like, strategy
involved in terms of, like, oh, this person should
go first? Or, like, what were the negotiations
that happened during the comp? It wasn't very
dramatic. It was sort of just like, hey, I'll
brush the feet and you brush the hands and you
can go first. It was kind of just decided in
the moment. With Vale, we were actually thinking
pretty strategically, I think. Because he's been
training bouldering a lot more and I'm training
more lead. There were different styles. So for
like the slab, I'm better at slab. I would say
I'm better at slab than Vale. And so I would
try it first just so I had more time to kind
of think about the climate and I would have a
better shot at doing it. And then for the more
like powerful boulders, he had a really good
idea of how he wanted to do it. And I was kind
of like, well, I don't know what I'm going to
do. Okay, you can go first so I can watch you.
You know exactly what you're going to do. You're
going to flash it. And then I have kind of more
information to go off of and decide what I'm
going to do. Yeah, which I think was great. We
like complemented each other really well. Yeah.
He's, like, a really tall boulder. I'm, like,
a shorter kind of slab climber. So I think it
worked out really well. Yeah. And then Paloma's
also, like, pretty tall, right? Yeah, Paloma's
pretty tall. I think we had a good team going.
I think it was great that we had, like, two taller
and two shorter climbers. Oh, true. Yeah, like,
allows you to fit in different boxes. Yeah. Yeah.
What about, like, the lead? Was there any, like,
strategy with, like, who goes out first? I think
less who goes out first, but more, like, who
goes on which route. Oh, yeah. Remind us how
that went. There were two routes, and each route
needed a female and a male climber. So we would,
like, get to the venue, look at the routes, kind
of see, like, it was sort of about, like, which
style suited you more, but also, like, the point
scale, right? So it's kind of like, oh, if there's
a stop or move, like, someone might fall here,
but, like... I think there's usually a more bouldery
route and a more resistance -based route, so
I feel like the intuition would be to put us
on the resistance route and the boulders on the
bouldery route. But then you could say, well,
maybe if we do the jump in the middle, we have
potential to go a lot higher since our endurance
is a little better. And so, yeah, what was the
strategy you guys went with there? I mean, I
just let Vale pick. Okay. because he's more of
a boulderer, and most of the times he was on
the bouldery route, the ones with, like, the
jumps or the canvases or whatever, and then I
was put on the endurance route. How did the lead
routes feel? Was it, like, what you expected?
Yeah. I mean, the beginning half was pretty chill.
Right. And then it would just get harder as you
went up, which I think was pretty fun. It was
a lot less pressure, because you can kind of
ease into the route, and you're not, like, fully
thrown into this, like, really cruxy boulder
problem at the start. Which was a lot more fun
than just, like, a World Cup where as soon as
you're on the wall, you're, like, fighting for
your life. Okay. It honestly reminded me a lot
more of American setting than, like, IFSC style.
Some of the routes I got on. I feel like most
of the positions were pretty secure. Like, you
could rest in a lot of places. Whereas in, like,
World Cups and stuff, they kind of force you
to keep going. Like, you can't stay in one place
too long. And then you guys had to do a lot more
climbing than most other teams. So how did the
climbing and boulder elimination plus finals?
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to the show. Which one was the same day or the
day before? They were kind of all the same day.
Oh, okay. The first day was lead and boulder.
Yeah. Qualifications. Yeah, qualifications. The
second day was boulder and lead. And then the
third day was just boulder finals. So there's
a lot of rounds. Like five rounds in three days.
Oh, gosh. Yeah. How did it affect you guys? I
mean, it wasn't actually that bad because each
round you're only doing like one route for the
lead and two routes, max three routes for the
boulder. Yeah. But it's just a lot of preparation
because you have to warm up. You have to cool
down and then fully warm up again. So, I mean,
you're still getting tired, but it's not as much
as like a full lead comp where you're doing two
qualities and then one semi or like five boulders
in a round. Yeah, I think it ended up being okay.
I think maybe a little low on skin, but... Yeah.
I felt fine, like, energy -wise. What about the
others? Yeah, because, I mean, half... It's kind
of like you're climbing half the amount compared
to, like, a regular... Yeah. Okay. I guess that's
true. Yeah, so you guys were fine. So no one
should feel bad. Compared to the other teams,
they had much more people. Yeah. So... They'd,
like, swap people out every round. Yeah. So we
didn't climb that much, but compared to the rest
of them, we climbed a lot. True, yeah. Yeah,
I guess, why wasn't there any, like, swaps? Or,
like, is there, like, literally no one else who
wanted to, like, come and do, like, swap outs?
Or is it, like, a financial issue? That and,
oh, just, like, financially, I think, like, if
we sent more people, we'd all get less funding,
so. Yeah. Yeah. I think people just didn't want
to go. But it works out because then we get to
do more climbing. It was really cool to do every
round. And did you guys get funded to go? Your
flights and hotels were paid for? We got a lump
sum from IFSC. That's nice. It doesn't quite
cover everything, but it covers a good chunk
of it, I think. But then if more people came,
it would have taken longer. Okay, that makes
sense. And then for both of you, I think this
is like your first time, well, you said it's
your first time competing on the world stage?
I've done a couple World Cups, and I did World
Champs in Seoul. And then what about you? You've
also done some. I did some World Cups this season
and last season. Okay, yeah. Yeah, just a handful.
Yeah, so how did this event kind of compare to
that in terms of like... viewership or like crowd
or how it felt in general? Well, a whole other
world because I've been to, I haven't made a
semi. So I've never been like on the live streams.
So it was, it was cool that like my family could
watch. Oh yeah. Um, and we did so many rounds
so we could watch every single one. I think like
the production quality was quite good. Like just
regular, like World Cup. I mean, yeah, and I
think especially, like, all the volunteers and
the audience, they were super psyched. Like,
it was really cool. Like, they kept it up the
entire round, even when everybody got to the
top of everything sometimes. But, yeah, it felt
like there really weren't that many of us. There
were, like, four teams in finals. I've obviously
never been in a World Cup final, but it felt
like a World Cup final. Yeah. But, like, zero
pressure. Oh, really? Yeah. No pressure. Yeah.
Just because you didn't have any expectations
going into it? Yeah, I was just excited to be
there. It felt like a charity event, kind of.
Have you done other charity events? No, well,
just like there wasn't any pressure to do well.
There was nothing that we were qualifying for.
It was just a standalone event. Right. Especially
if you're in the final, that was kind of the
goal, was to qualify for finals. So when you're
there, you're just like, okay, nothing can go
wrong now. Especially because we qualified in
fourth, so we literally could not do any worse.
We could only do better. And it's like, you only
have to beat one team to podium. Yeah, true.
Was there, I forget, was there like a prize pool,
or was it just for bragging rights? I think so.
For the podium, yeah. Well, it's kind of a shame
you guys didn't get a podium then, but... But
it was a cool experience. How does it compare
to, like, youth competitions? I feel like youth
competitions, like IFSC, there's a lot of pressure.
Oh, really? I find that the youth world competitions
have, like, so much more pressure than the World
Cups. Oh. Just because there's, like, kind of
a time limit for how long you can compete because
you can graduate and you, like, really want to
do well because if you do well there, it kind
of leads into, like, doing well in the World
Cups. For kind of USA Climbing youth and like
USA Climbing elite, I don't think there's as
much pressure, I think, just because there's
not as much competition and it's kind of like
you're with your friends. So it's just kind of
like a fun comp, which was more similar to this.
Yeah, I feel like I felt the most pressure at
Youth Worlds because that's... It's kind of like
what I was training for the entire year, like
mainly youth nationals, like to be able to make
youth awards. And World Cups are just like a
nice, like, you know, like I get these opportunities
and it's really cool to go and experience it,
but not really like expecting anything from it.
Yeah, I guess I have heard, well, I've heard
some people say that like the youth scene is
a lot more like stressful than... The elite or,
like, adult scene, I guess? For sure. You experienced
that, too? Yeah. Is it, I guess, like, the pressure
or expectation that you'll actually, like, win
or podium at it? I feel like the youth comps,
the youth nationals that I've been to have always
been, like, the hardest comps to win or, like,
to do well at. Because there's so much pressure,
and there's, like, only one comp that you've
been training for, like, this entire year. There's
so many comps that you've been to, and... Everyone's
so close because they're the same age. They've
been climbing for the same amount of years. So
everyone's kind of around the same level. It's
just luck of the draw or just pure determination
who comes out on top, I think. And especially
there's only three spots for Worlds. Anything
can happen. Your foot slips and then that's it.
What has World Cups and that whole circuit kind
of highlighted in terms of your strengths and
weaknesses? I feel like especially bouldering
in the team event in Japan, because it was, like,
my first international boulder comp, like, I
finally really understood why we train the way
we do or, like, why we get on the boulders that
we do. Because it felt so familiar and intuitive
compared to comps in the States. And it would
lead to, like, once I got to the World Cup stage,
I was, like, I feel like I got... much better
results there than in domestic comps, even though
I didn't make semis. But, yeah, I just felt a
lot more comfortable with the style. Oh, what
was, like, the style difference? Just, um, I
think in the U .S. there's a big emphasis on
being strong and having a lot of fitness. I think
World Cups really, um, they really reward, like,
being able to climb well. like getting through
sections fast. I think for the most part, when
I go to these World Cups, it's like the technique
is there for me. I feel like all the moves are
possible. It's more just like a kind of a strength
thing, like a comfort thing. I guess a lot of
the climbs are really uncomfortable, and they
take a lot of like almost brain patience where
you're like in these really uncomfortable positions
for like a really long amount of time. where
maybe your body isn't super tired, but your brain
just gets really fatigued. And so I've been trying
to work on that, where you're in really uncomfortable
positions. I think that's probably the biggest
style difference, is just everything's really
uncomfortable. Interesting. Yeah. I'm trying
to think if there's a way to relate to that,
because I have no idea what that means. Like
brain patients or uncomfortableness? I guess
brain patients. I'm trying to imagine what a
boulder would look like. When I think about it,
it's like you're in this position, and if you
move too quickly, you're going to fall out. So
you just have to like... slow it down, and just,
like, keep moving. Even though your brain's like,
I don't want to do this, I want to, like, hop
off the wall. You just have to, like, keep going,
keep going, and keep going, like, inch by inch.
Just shoot, like, the next move. Okay. Was there,
like, a move or, like, boulder during this competition
that you remember, like, mostly feeling like
that? On the slab in the finals, it was, like,
you do this kind of, like, foot cross, and...
The foot felt horrible when I put it on, but
you just have to really slow it down and then
step over it. I think this is something that
I need to get better at, is being really patient,
because the next move, I got the foot out, and
as soon as I felt good, I just went immediately.
But I really should have just slowed it down
and tried to do it as smooth as possible. I got
really excited, and I dropped the top. So if
I had waited a little bit longer and... kind
of sat in that position, I think I would have
done it, or at least have a better shot at doing
it. But it's, like, really hard to sit in those
uncomfortable positions because you're, like,
on that line. I feel like I'm going to fall out
right now. Yeah. But you just have to, like,
stay there, which is really hard. I get that.
It's a weird kind of patience, for sure. Yeah,
in our finals as well, there was the first boulder.
It was, like, a mantle off of kind of slopey
volume. It was green. Wow, it's been a while
now. That was, like, a month ago. But you're
kind of, like, you have to flip all the way,
and you're reaching up, and there's this, like,
crimp on the underside of another volume. Oh,
I remember that. And you just feel stuck, like,
so stuck. But then you just have to keep going
and, like, slowly get your foot up. And I felt
really, like, I just wanted to hop off the wall
so bad because it felt so uncomfortable. I remember
for that women's finals one, like, the Korean
and Japanese climbers did it, and it looked quite
different from everyone else doing it. For the
slab, did anyone end up setting it? One guy did,
Oren. Oh, yeah. But I was actually pretty proud
of that because it was actually a really hard
slab. Yeah. And everyone was falling on the last
move, so the fact that I got there, I had a shot
at it, it was pretty cool. Yeah. It was a really
fun climb. Those are the slide climbs that I
really like, and I think I'm pretty good at them.
Yeah, that was cool to see. So yeah, in general
for both of you, it seems like lead climbing
is what you guys are doing right now. Is that
your preference, or are you trying to expand
into boulder? I do prefer lead. I am trying to
expand. Yeah, I think I just enjoy lead more
because I think in most of the U .S. comps, a
lot of bouldering is just like, can you jump
really far? Or can you, like, hold these terrible
holds? And it's just not, like, really as enjoyable
for me as a lead. But, I mean, obviously you
have to get better at bouldering to get a better
lead because the moves are going to get harder.
Yeah, true. I actually don't have a preference.
I like them equally. I think I'm just better
at lead, like, naturally. But I've been getting
more into bouldering because it's just... There's,
like, something cool about, like, how hard...
can you do and like like what's the max amount
of power you can generate in like such a short
amount of time yeah like it's it's pushing the
limits of like just pure strength versus lead
is like it's a little bit more of just a lot
of climbing like the moves are easier so it's
not as like i feel like the bottom half of lead
routes aren't as cool as like the cruxes of boulder
routes I got that, yeah. Like, it's kind of cool
to just try really hard. Yeah. I feel like in
lead you don't get that as often because it's
more like you're trying hard on, like, one really
hard move, and it's just like you're just tired.
Try really hard when you're pumped. Yeah, but
it's only for, like, one move, and then you're
falling down. For boulder, it's like you get
to try hard, and then you rest, and you get to
keep trying hard. Maybe you should be trying
harder on the end of lead routes. Yeah, I should
be trying harder on lead routes, yeah. I guess,
like, what's your long -term thinking, like,
strategically in terms of choosing boulder or
lead or boulder and lead? Is there any, like,
thinking or is it just what you feel like? I
mean, I think if you're a good climber, you're
going to be good at both. So I think that's more
the goal is just being a really good climber
and being good at, like, everything. Because
then it doesn't matter if you're training lead
or training boulder, like, you're going to be
really good regardless. I think definitely, like...
I noticed this gap a couple years ago just comparing
against, like, other people my age who are, like,
really good in lead, but they're also really
good in boulder. And I was, like, not even making
semis at youth nats or, like, not making finals,
and I was, like, I feel like this is a bit of
a problem. So I've definitely been, I think I'm
definitely closing the gap now. Like, I've been
bouldering a lot more this year, especially,
like, getting to travel and climb on different
styles, I think, has helped a lot. Yeah. I've
done a lot of the cash comps recently. It's been
cool. Oh, yeah, you did... Wait, which one was
it? Oh, Battle of the Bay. I think I did a comp
every weekend of October. Oh, gosh. It was like...
I was gone for 18 days, which is the longest
I've been away from home. So I first... I took
a train to New Mexico because there were no good
flights, so they were like $400. I took a 20
-hour train. Oh, my. No, it was chill. So that
was for Yankinyard. Oh. It's, like, the one with
the highballs and, like, the airbags. They, like,
set a boulder on their lead wall and put an airbag
under it. I did not see this. No. Yeah. That
was really cool. Was it streamed anywhere? It
was on YouTube. Oh, really? Okay. I just wanted
to go because it seemed really cool. Yeah. I've
never been before. And then it was Japan, and
then flew back to San Francisco for Battle of
the Bay. Right. And then I did, um... Battle
for the Fort last weekend in Colorado, but I
didn't make finals. And then you did Boulder
Fest right before that, right? I did Arizona
Boulder Fest, like, beginning of October. How
do you guys like doing cash comps? I have a lot
of fun just, like, being able to see my friends
and go different places and hopefully win some
money. Yeah. I think it's a lot more fun because
there's no pressure. Yeah. But they're really
far away. We don't have very many in San Diego.
So then what are your, like, future plans for
climbing in terms of, like, because you guys
are both on the younger side. I mean, I'd like
to be able to make a semifinal at one point.
Yeah. I think that'd be pretty cool. Semifinal.
I think if you make a semifinal, you have the
ability to make a final. Yeah. It's just, like,
you just have to be really good and, like, perform
really well. Or, like, making the boulder team.
Yeah. That'd be cool. I think. I think if I can
make the Boulder team, then I'll have the skills
and the strength required to make a lead World
Cup semi. Yeah, I have similar goals, honestly.
Just keep climbing, hopefully. I don't really
have a very solid plan for the future with college
and everything. I am committed to Carnegie Mellon,
which is in Pittsburgh. Honestly, don't know
if I will survive the winters there. Yeah. So
I might change plans. Oh, like college plans?
I might, like, reapply this year to somewhere
else. Whoa. Yeah. Dang. Wow. But it's all up
in the air right now. Yeah, I'm currently taking
a gap year. What went into that decision? Was
it about climbing? It was about climbing. And
I'm, like, really happy with my decision. Like,
I think everyone should take a gap year, honestly.
Like, my friends are all jealous now that I'm
not in school. Yeah, true. But, yeah, just, like,
to compete as much as I can, like, train a little
bit more because I was pretty busy in high school.
I went to, like, a regular high school. So, yeah,
getting to train and compete and travel. Yeah,
I think I've been, like, I can afford to be really
spontaneous with my travel now. So I think it's
really nice. Where are you thinking of applying
instead of carnivore? I have no clue. Like personally,
I mean, you're doing like computer science, right?
I'm doing my intended major was information systems,
which is like computer science with a side of
business, really. Yeah. I honestly don't know
where I would apply. It's summer with better
weather. Probably, like, west coast. You can't
get better than right here. Yeah, that's kind
of hard. Well, yeah, I just, yeah. I don't know
if I could stay, like. I say as it's currently
raining right now. Well, I mean, we talked about,
like, driving in the rain for, like, 30 minutes,
which, like, no one else ever would do ever.
Did you grow up here? I moved here when I was,
like, five. Okay. I'm from Seattle, though. There
was a lot of rain there. Yeah. I like the rain.
Okay. Yeah. Occasionally. Well, I think I was
in a similar, well, I wasn't in a similar position
to you, but I know Carnegie's a good school.
Yeah. So that part is good. Yeah. I think. I
don't like Pittsburgh, though. I grew up in Pennsylvania.
Oh, really? Yeah. I didn't. I toured Carnegie
and like University of Pittsburgh and I did not
like the vibes. Did you tour? I went for admitted
students day. Oh, okay. Like, two days. I think
it was nice. I think, like, the academics are
definitely very good. Mm -hmm. And the name,
too. Yeah. Like, I think would help. Yeah. But
the weather in the winter is questionable. And
the climbing isn't great. Mm -hmm. I don't have
any friends there. So, sort of, like... Yeah.
It's okay to not have your friends there, but
I did not like the weather. I thought Pittsburgh
looked depressing. And you can apply to, like,
Berkeley. Yeah, I don't, I think, I mean, I really
like the weather in San Francisco, but I just
don't think I could do a big school like that.
I think I'd just get lost. It's, like, too big
of a school? Yeah. Interesting. Like, what are
you looking for? This is turning into, like,
a personal question. I don't know what I'm doing
with my life. I'm just so curious. I mean, one
of... I don't know. Like, probably somewhere
near the West Coast. But I think, like, the biggest
thing I like about climbing, like, more than
the actual... Climbing itself is just the community.
Yeah. I feel like it'd be important to be close
to, like, some climbing friends. Okay. I don't
know. Okay. Declan, what about you? Like, what
are your future plans in terms of, like, are
you going to go to school or are you going to
continue training? I'm currently in a gap semester.
Yeah. I mean, I'm not committed anywhere. I don't
have any, like, super rigid plans. I definitely
want to stay in San Diego. Okay, yeah. I can't
imagine really living anywhere else. It's like
when you're in paradise, you don't want to leave
paradise. I agree with that. I agree with that.
So, yeah, I think that's probably the most important
thing is like location. And I know so many people
here that also want to stay here. Yeah. I had
thoughts of maybe going to Salt Lake City because
so many people move out there to train. But I
just don't like Salt Lake City very much. Oh,
yeah. I just prefer being next to, like, the
ocean and not having, like, insanely hot summers
and then cold winters. But the training's really
good there. But I think building up, like, San
Diego would be really nice because we have, like,
kind of this thing going. I think if you, like,
keep building it up, then we'll have kind of
a training spot that's on par with Salt Lake
City, I think. Oh, you think so? I think so.
I mean, because we have... What about the National
Training Center? Well... Yeah, I mean that national
training center is really nice, but they have
like only one coach there, Josh, versus here
we have like a lot of people that are kind of
joined on like the same ideas and are kind of
like building each other up with kind of like
the same goal in mind. So I think... If we just
get the facilities right, I think we'll have
a really good climbing place down here. I feel
like we train at the wall climbing gym. I feel
like the facility is pretty crazy for what the
gym is. We have two spray walls, a whole back
area where we can set anything. They have really
good boulders in the main gym. Honestly, that's
all you need. Especially seeing the gyms in Japan,
they're really small, but they utilize their
space really well. So we have a similar idea
where we have a lot of space and we just have
different things that kind of do different jobs
for our climbing. And that's really all you need
is different stations. And then in terms of Salt
Lake's weather, I do agree that it's kind of
crazy there. I was there last year, not the 2025
season, but the 2024 season World Cup in Salt
Lake. And it was 80 degrees one day, and then
the next day it was, like, snowing. Yeah. And
I was so pissed off. Yeah. I hated that so much.
And it was really windy. Well, the day was 80.
It sucked. And then in terms of staying in San
Diego, you mentioned really wanting to stay here.
Is there anything else here that you really like
to do? Like, are you a surfer? I do surf a lot,
yeah. I mean, I just like the weather. Yeah.
I feel like we have a good community here. Like,
in North Park, there's a lot of stuff to do.
Those are, like, really good restaurants. When
I travel to other places, I, like, realize how
good we have it here. So that makes me want to
stay even more. I got that. What about you? Is
there anything else you'd like to do outside
of London? I mean, not really anything, like,
related to San Diego. Sure, it doesn't have to
be. Yeah. I don't surf or anything. I don't like
the beach. Oh, you don't like the beach. No.
Yeah. But I recently started working part -time
as a stagehand. So, like, setting up concerts
mostly and taking them down. I did, like, theater
tech all throughout high school. It's kind of
been an interest. I was like, I think this year
is just a good time to join the industry. and,
like, see what it's like. Hmm. Of, like, theater?
Like, the live event industry. Oh, really? So,
I think it'd be cool to try to work my way up,
like, maybe into rigging, like, hanging stuff
up and, yeah. Have you worked with any of these
rappers? Yeah, you should have helped me, like,
set up this thing. I worked on Night Hearts Festival
a couple weeks ago. I think, do you know Skrillex?
Oh, yeah. You don't know Skrillex? I don't. You've
never heard of Skrillex? I've never heard of
Skrillex until that. What? That was... It's a
generational thing. Oh, my God. Don't say it
like that. I'm not that much older. No, I mean,
I don't, like, know them. Like, I'm not a huge
fan, but, like, I've heard of Skrillex. I'm working
a WWE Survivor Series at Echo Park next week.
Interesting. Have you heard of WWE? A generational
thing? Yeah. Yeah. Huh. Okay, cool. Yeah, you
should have helped me set up this. Oh, I don't
know anything about audio. Oh, okay. So it's
just like we're getting a lighting tech. Okay,
well, these lights are very fancy. They're set
up for me, I guess. Okay, cool. Good to know.
Okay, I guess now we can get into some of the
audience submitted questions that came in. So
the first one, this was from Discord. With your
experience from the team event, how would you
have wanted a team climbing event to be shaped
differently, if anything? I think it went pretty
well, especially for the first version of this
format. I think it went really well. I don't
know if you, because it wasn't live streamed,
but after the comp there was a speed traverse.
Oh, no, I didn't see that. Yeah, it was crazy.
They took down all the climbing walls. routes
on the boulder wall and they put up like this
really big traverse that we just like ran through
and they're like really big jumps and it was
like it showcased like just the experience of
climbing I think the entire comp was just like
this is what climbing is so I think it did a
great job and the audience was like really psyched
for a couple of the rounds they brought in like
school kids Yeah, they brought, like, a bunch
of schools, and they were just, like, super psyched
to watch. And you would just, like, be, like,
really showboating on these routes, and, like,
as soon as you did anything cool, it would go
crazy. So it was really cool. I honestly can't
think of anything that I would change. Yeah,
I think it was very well executed, especially
for the first one. Would you want to do more
of these, or do you think... I don't know if
the goal of this event was to, like... test it
out and see if like world cups are always going
to be like that but how would you feel if like
the format changed more towards something like
this i actually don't i would not prefer world
cups in this format because it's hard to be really
competitive because the routes are easier and
it's like for the like mixed boulder a lot of
the guys would like do it in a few attempts and
the kind of discrepancy and results would be
like if the women got it So it's a lot harder
to be competitive in. But it is just, like, really
fun. So I would do it occasionally. But it's
hard to do, like, championship events like this.
Yeah. I think it would be cool to hold, like,
one of these kinds of events at the end of the
season just as, like, a fun way to cap it off.
Yeah, I'd really enjoy seeing it, like, more
consistently, like, maybe every year. Yeah, I
forgot to ask earlier about, I guess, like, how
the, like, gender -combined boulders felt. How
did that feel for, like, both of you? I think
it's really hard to set, like, mixed boulders
that, like, balance well between the two genders.
I think they did a pretty good job. But I think
for boulders, like, it always has to be slab.
And that just makes it a little boring. But I
think it was good to test out. Did it feel, like,
reachy? No, it felt pretty good. Yeah, it felt
fine. It's always going to be really technical
slabs because you can't just have, like, a really
powerful climb. Yeah. And so, yeah, it's not
as fun to watch. I think Slab isn't as fun to
watch because you're just, like, standing on
the wall for, like, a minute straight. Yeah.
But our first, it wasn't live streamed, but our
first qualities route for the mixed boulder was
actually pretty technical. There were, like,
some small crimps, and there were a few girls
that did it and then, like, a few guys that didn't
do it. So I think that one was actually really
well set. Like, some good tiebreakers for that
one. Yeah. Which was cool. Yeah, I think for
finals I saw some discussion on maybe like Reddit
where people were saying that the finals mixed
route was like a bit reachy looking for the women.
Maybe like the last move. Yeah. Yeah. I wasn't
sure if it was just if it was actually reachy
or if it just looked like that because we saw
it look so much easier for like the taller guys
to do it. I mean, Mao did it. Yeah. And she's
like. really short yeah so i don't think there
was a hype problem at all yeah yeah maybe if
you have like i'm more in there there'll be like
a question yeah yeah oh but then there would
just be the whole argument about yeah yeah okay
cool um next question from the audience um any
memories from youth training or advice that stuck
with you there's like a famous like idea from
al it's like uh kind of the like instructions
of climbing i guess you could say where it's
like you uh throw catch settle throw it's like
how you do like a move or something or like even
a climb it's just like what you're doing the
entire time is you're like throwing to a hold
you catch it and there's like the time that you're
settling to prepare for the next hold or the
next move and that idea was like kind of what
started how we trained at class five, I think.
And then like all of our ideas kind of flowed
from that. It was like, oh, this is how you should
throw. This is how you should catch. And then
this is like why it matters. It's like a weird
way to think about it. I think maybe for a lot
of people, it's like really weird to understand.
Yeah, like what are you supposed to do? Like,
that's just it. Okay. It's like a language thing.
I guess you just have to, like, feel it and,
like, understand it. You understand it when you,
like, start to feel it out. It's hard to describe
in, like, words, I guess. Is there, like, a tip
you can maybe give to, like, people who want
to get better at climbing in order to, like,
do this? Or, like, something that made it click
for you? I feel like just... the intention behind
like figuring out what part of the move feels
hard because the throw, catch, settle, throw
is just like the move in its entirety and there's
different parts of that kind of section that
can feel harder. If it's like, oh, this move,
what's really hard for me is the throw is like
really weird. Like the catch, the end position
is like fine. It's like a good hold, but it's
just like a really weird throw. Then you have
to like... really kind of hone in on why does
this throw feel weird you know and then you like
figure if it's like oh it's just like a really
weird squeeze or the foot's bad and that's where
you go even deeper and you're like okay how do
i make this foot better or how do i you know
connect these two holes okay yeah that makes
sense yeah you're just really specific and like
um just your intention is like what makes you
better i think an idea i was introduced to pretty
early on was like practice versus performance
um when you're thinking about a comp yeah i always
thought like like i was like okay like maybe
maybe these locals are all practice right they're
like sort of low stakes but like nationals youth
nationals has to be performance right because
like if it isn't then what is but i feel like
i slowly realized over time that like nothing
really is performance like it's all practice
for the next thing and that mindset kind of helps
you relax and see the comp as a learning experience
and also just like you know a place to have fun
um instead of like putting a lot of pressure
on yourself to succeed did you see on uh did
you watch the live streams on youtube for the
football yeah there was a comment on it that
said i didn't read the comments um that japan
brought the avengers yeah and then the u .s brought
The Benchwarmers, Benchwarmers. Yeah, how do
you feel about that? I think it's fine. I mean,
we definitely weren't, like, the strongest on
the U .S., but I think we did actually really
well regardless. Yeah, I think for being, like,
the, I don't know, B -team, Benchwarmers, Benchwarmers,
we were pretty good. Yeah, I think we did good.
Not bad at all. I mean, still made finals. Yeah,
still made both finals, which was cool. But I
saw some people defending us. They're like, well,
they made both finals, so pretty good. Yeah,
it's pretty good to make both finals. Yeah, I
guess I didn't ask during the episode, but what
are your guys' outdoor goals, if you have any?
I've been trying buttermilker in Bishop for quite
a while now. And every year I get a little bit
closer, because I only try it one day a year.
Yeah, fair enough. So it's like one year, it's
this really big move, and I wasn't strong enough
or tall enough. And then last year, I was able
to do the stand from it, which is a 12. And then
hopefully this year, if I go back, I'll maybe
send that one. Yeah, every year, I just try to
take off another climb. So last year, I did a
mystery, which you probably don't know it because
you're not thinking about outdoor climbing. Is
it in San Diego? No, no, it's in Bishop. Oh,
okay. Yeah. Well, like SoCal area, I mean. The
Buttermilker's also in Bishop. Oh. Yeah, we only
go to Bishop. I mean, there is outdoor climbing
in San Diego, which I think would be cool to
go to. But I just have not experienced it in
that way. Okay. Yeah, I just go wherever everybody
else goes, honestly. So long for the ride. I've
been trying Maze of Death, which is also in Bishop,
like the past two years, and some of my teammates
are not really psyched on it, so I think I want
to try to do it this year. Okay. Is Bishop not
considered SoCal? It's pretty central. Oh, okay.
I've been there once. Yeah? Yeah. So I have been
there. Five, six -hour drive up north? Yeah,
that feels like it's in California. I wouldn't
consider it. Okay. Maybe some people would. I
stayed in a really cool, like, goat farm Airbnb
there. Really? But then it burned down. While
you were in it? No, I was not in it, but it burned
down. So now, unfortunately, people can't stay
there anymore. But I would recommend it if it
was still existing. But maybe one day they'll,
like, build it up again. Yeah. Okay, I only had
one last question. And it was also, it was like
an audience question just for Declan. And it
was also not really an audience question. It
was Jaden's question. So, yeah, I guess you beat
Elden Ring, Night, Rain. Do you want to discuss
that? Well, I beat Cruz. Do you know Cruz Padilla?
I mean, I've seen all these people. He's like,
I've... grown up with him like competing in youth
so he's one of my biggest competitors but also
like one of my best friends because we we have
like pretty different styles yeah when it comes
to climbing um and so you know we'll just play
games on the weekends or something and jayden
also joins but i i beat we beat the the final
boss without jayden but it was his fault anyway
wait is it a multiplayer game yeah oh yeah It's
like multiplayer, but you're fighting computer
bosses. Oh, okay. Yeah. Oh, I didn't know it
was multiplayer. I thought people were just out
there playing that by themselves. Well, I'm staring
at the wheel. Should we spin the wheel? Since
we're filming in this interesting studio, we
get to spin the wheel. Okay. I might cut this
out. Okay. Are you giving him two free concert
tickets? Crap. What's spinning in? Okay. Oh my
god. What concert are you taking me to? I guess
it is fate. Do you guys want concert tickets
to something? Skrillex? Yeah, next time Skrillex.
If it's two free concert tickets. Relationship
advice. Yeah, let's get your guys' relationship
advice. Do you want relationship advice, or are
you giving it to us? I think you guys should
give your general relationship advice as 18 -year
-olds. Go climbing. Okay. I think that was actually
pretty good advice. Legitimately? Yeah, I think
it is good. You see how they think. Yeah, it's
problem -solving. Okay. Yeah, if they just, like,
get really mad at a boulder. True. Maybe that's
a red flag. Yeah, when they, like, come down
and then they, like, punch the boulder. Yeah.
That's a red flag. We don't want that. Yeah.
Okay. Do you have any relationship advice? Well,
I'm curious if you guys would prefer to, like,
date climbers or non -climbers. That's interesting.
A lot of my friends... say they'd rather not.
Because it's really weird if you go to a competition
and you're like, I have to focus on this thing
that I've been training for for a really long
time. Oh, actually, I also have to think about
this other person that they're also focused on.
I think if you do it right, it's fine. But for
the most part, it's at a level of stress that's
just not needed. But I feel like normal people
might I find it hard to, like, understand why
you're just in the gym. Yeah. Yeah, but that's
the same with, like, a lot of sports are like
that. That's true. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I don't
know if other sports. I guess if you could date
someone else who's, like, doing another sport
at a similar level. Yeah, that's true. But, yeah.
Yeah, but then you're not competing against,
like, you're not competing together. Oh, so you're
just talking about, like, people in the competition
scene. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That's a very small
scene. I guess maybe I interpreted the question
differently, but I think if they're doing a different
sport, I think it's fine. So date climbers and
go climb. Go climb. Okay, I'm going to leave
it at that. I'm not giving any advice. Okay,
cool. Well, I think that's all the questions
I had then. Thanks for joining me today. Any
last -minute words of wisdom you guys want to
get out there? I have no wisdom. I'm not a wise
person. I'm not very deep. Okay. All right, then
anything you want to shout out or let people
know where they can find you? Shout out Class
5. Oh, yeah. Yeah, shout out Class 5. With their
weird training methodology. Yeah. Okay, cool.
Well, then, thank you guys for joining me today,
and it was good to talk to you guys. Thank you.
Thanks so much for having us, yeah. Thanks for
joining in the rain. Thank you so much for making
it to the end of the podcast. Don't forget to
like and subscribe if you enjoyed. Otherwise,
you are a super fake climber. If you're listening
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in the description. Thanks again for listening.