Welcome to the Interior Design Podcast. I'm Hayley Roy, a commercial interior designer
with a passion for creating beautiful functional spaces. Over the years, I've worked on a
variety of projects and have accumulated a wealth of knowledge which I'm excited to
share with you. I started this podcast because I believe in the power of interior design,
so much of what we need to know as designers you won't learn in a classroom. Whether
you're an aspiring designer, tackling your home project or a seasoned pro, this podcast
is for you. Season two is here and I couldn't be more thrilled to kick things off with some
fresh energy and exciting changes. This season, I'm joined by not one but two incredible
co-hosts, Hannah Denny and Scarlett Mallett. Together, we're diving deeper into the world
of design to bring you more perspectives, lively debates and all the tips and tricks
you need to thrive. We're here to offer practical advice, discuss the latest trends
and give you unfiltered real-world insights. Expect honest conversations, a bit of humour
and maybe even the occasional strong opinion and language. Remember, if it's not fun,
we're not doing it. And if you're a sound editor looking for a fun collaboration, let
us know. We'd love to have you on board. Thanks for tuning in to season two of the
Interior Design Podcast. Today's guest is Marianne Schillingford. She is the creative
director of Dulux, which she's just told me is one of the biggest paint companies in
the world. So I'm very honoured to have her on the podcast.
That's not at all. I'm thrilled to be here.
Thank you for coming. Do you want to introduce yourself and the company?
Sure. What does a creative director of a big paint company do? Well, on a daily basis,
I'll be working with designers, architects, our marketing department, the sales department,
people on the shop floor and scientists. It is an extraordinary job where you get to touch
every point at which colour becomes paint, becomes interior design. And that's the fun
part of my job. No two days are the same and I think I've probably got the best job in
the world.
Oh my God, you have.
I do. I pet you.
So tell us a little bit about Dulux for anyone who doesn't know, because there's some aspiring
designers listening.
Yeah. Dulux is a global company. It's part of Axo Nobel. It's one of the biggest companies
in the world to create paint. I work in the decorative part of the paint, but Axo Nobel
create paint and surface coatings for everything from oil rigs to aeroplanes to racing cars.
Probably the coating of your mobile phone will have an Axo Nobel coating on it. And
I work really in the colour department. We make some incredible products for protecting
the things that we've paid lots of money for. So it's protecting the surfaces of things.
My bit is to bring them to life with colour because you can create beautiful products,
but unless you've got them in the right colours, you're not going to sell them and they won't
engage. So hugely important is getting the colour right because colour is a language
that we all speak, we all understand, and it's hugely powerful in the success of everything.
Absolutely. Well said.
One of the reasons that I absolutely love Dulux as a brand is that I kind of fell upon
it by accident really because when I first started as an interior designer, I specified
a whole lot of paint for a project and I specified the colour, but I didn't specify the type
of paint. And I went into this project and the decorator was trying to cut costs and
didn't use the right kind of paint. And it was a commercial environment and it just didn't
work. And the client came back to me and said, what the hell? This is not working for me.
And I was then on a bit of a mission to try and make sure that I didn't do that again.
And I'd learned from that. So I approached Dulux and the reason I approached Dulux was
because I was talking to a decorator and he was recommending Dulux. So I approached Dulux
and said, help, like I need to learn more about paint and I need to learn more about
what kind of paints go where, which I did. But what they did was said to me, hey, don't
worry, just send me your design pack when you've done it and I'll send you a report
back that will tell you exactly what paints to use and where, and that will be something
that you can give to your client as part of your design process. And I was like, that's
amazing. So that's where my relationship with Dulux started is that I started doing that.
Now every single project that we get, we always specify Dulux wherever we can and we always
speak to Steven who's amazing. And he just literally, sometimes it's like on a Sunday
and I'm like, okay, you know, I'm urgent, urgent, urgent. I've got to get this out tomorrow.
So yeah, and they send back the report. So if you're a designer out there who is not
doing that, like seriously, that is such a valuable thing that you guys do. I respect
it.
Music to my ears. I mean, our specification teams are incredible and our color team, our
commercial color team back at Color HQ are amazing as well. And they're here to help
you. You know, our commercial color teams are here to help you with specification and
you know, color is, can be beautiful, but if it, unless it's in the right formulation,
unless it stands up to the real life and the hammering you're going to give it in whether
it's a bar or a, you know, or a domestic kitchen, it's got to be fit for purpose. So yeah. And
I think a lot of interior designers do not kind of get that. And we can mix up any color.
I mean, just recently, it's only been in the last couple of years that we've, we will mix
up any color. So as all of our competitors used to mix up our colors and we used to be
terribly sort of, we never do a thing like that. And actually we do now. So because everybody,
everybody mixes up each other's colors. So we can mix up any color in any formulation.
So if you want something like a scuff shield, that is literally, it's the most extraordinary
paint for a high traffic area. We can mix it up in any color, ours and other people's.
Amazing. I loved you Lux. Sorry. Plug. Total plug. I'm thrilled. But like, I'm just, I
just do, I just do. And we went to the Dulux launch of the color of the year a few weeks
ago. And if anyone hasn't seen it, it's on, I put it out on my reels and stuff, but it
was amazing. It was so amazing. Your talk was amazing as well. Just tell us some more
about the color of the year 2025. Color of the year 2025 is a color called true joy.
Now the process of choosing a color of the year, I know interior designers will, and
absolutely quite rightly will say, don't you dare tell us about trends or color of the
year. It's all just a marketing ploy. And I completely get it because, but what I think
interior designers, if I just explained to you how we come up with color of the year
and what that's all about. So the process of color of the year is part of a thing, a
body of work we work on called color futures. Now this is a global, a global piece of work
where we look at what's happening in the world. That's going to influence the way we're living
in the built environment in the years to come. It starts every year in June. It's all of
the countries that sell Dulux and have a color team will nominate one person from their region
or their country that's doing something extraordinary in the field of architecture or design or technology.
Could be an amazing influencer. It could be the editor of Elle Decoration in China and
India this year. Somebody who's got something to say and has a real lens on the future and
how we're going to be living in the future. What are the big things that are worrying
us? What are we spending our money on? Where are we going on holiday? What's influencing
our interiors and built environment? So every year we invite this incredible body of people
to a color futures workshop. And this is a three day workshop, believe it or not. And
we ask them to present what they think is going to be the big thing for the future.
And what we do after this three day workshop is we look at commonalities in the conversation.
So things that are actually sort of affecting the whole world. So there'll be lots of regional
things but there'll be lots of commonalities, lots of common interests, common goals, common
worries. And we take these and we turn them into stories. So rather than trends, I hate
the word trend. It's a horrible word, but trend is actually a...
Cheryl hates trends as well.
Yeah, because it's just something that sort of feels like it's imposed upon you. What
we want to do is we want to create color stories and color palettes that capture something
that's happening in the world, something that we want and something we need and something
that we see. And we give them to you, interior designers and architects, as tools. That's
simply our job is to give you colors that will bring you joy and help you to be more
commercially successful because we've got a lens on the world. We think we know this
might be a big thing in the future.
So Color of the Year came out of this moment that we are in. Isn't the world a horrible
place? I can't listen to the news anymore.
I don't either.
It makes me miserable. I know what's going to happen. And sometimes if I can't sleep
in the middle of the night, I'll turn on the BBC and I'm trying to scroll to find something
that makes me happy. And it's really hard to find something that makes us happy. Well,
this year, 2024, we chose colors and color stories that kind of helped people plug back
into the mains, help people feel comfortable, help them sort of find their feet again after
years of turmoil. Moving forward, we kind of realized that the only people that are
going to create change, positive change, are us. And we need to do it. We need to step
out of our comfort zone, take a leap into the unknown and find the good and the joy
there. Because actually, if nobody's going to do it, who is going to do it?
So this idea of the sense that this year we had in 2024, the color was sweet embrace and
the moment, the sort of mood of the moment was creating a space of your own, somewhere
you can kind of just relax in and recharge and nurture in space.
Quite nurturing, isn't it? It's like a beige-y warm...
It's a warm pink color. For 2025, we need to really, we need to kick up the bump.
I've just realized I've got a part of true joy.
This is the color. So the color is amazing. We need to describe it for our listeners.
It is the most glorious, bright, rich, vibrant yellow. It has a slight undertone of, it's
a sort of citrine. It's got a little tiny bit of green in it, teeny tiny bit of green.
So it's not, it's really, really bright, but it's got a certain coolness to it as well.
It is amazing for, if you've painted in a bathroom, I mean, there is no way you, there's
no get up and go in that bathroom. Painting it on a bedroom ceiling, if you feel you're
not really a morning person, amazing. Just little pops of this color give you a real
sense of true joy. You have to be brave. You're just out of your comfort zone because out
of your comfort zone, that's where the magic happens.
Take a leap.
Yeah.
Take a leap. When we went to the event, it was like this suspense. It was like, you went
in and we did all like smells and different colors and what they mean to us. And it was
a brilliant event. And then there was like this sort of suspense, it was like this corridor
of suspense. And then all of a sudden there was this beautiful yellow and all balloons
and oh, it was just amazing. It's really exciting.
What we wanted to do in that event was to show people the power of color because you
know, as an interior designer, all the interior designers out there know how powerful color
is to make space beautiful initially, but also to create a response. And we respond
to color in the most extraordinary ways. It uplifts us, it calms us, it could make us
feel confident, it can make us feel just relaxed. There are all sorts of emotions that we can
engender with color. And the journey through the power of color was we wanted to also help
explain how color and the senses smell, what smells, what colors do you associate with
different smells, how you associate colors with emotions. So in experience of color is
what we wanted you to have and then to experience what true joy really looked like.
Oh my goodness, they had space hoppers. They had space hoppers. And like what were the
little things that you put around your waist? Who loops? Who loops?
I could never do that.
That was amazing. But yeah, no, it was really good. And yeah, I felt very honored to be
invited to them. So thank you very much for that. So in terms of color theory and trends
and sort of the psychology of color, what's your opinion on all of that?
The color theory, we're always looking at color theory because how color relates to
each other, how it's made. And we have, I mean, in our basic stable palette, we have
33,000 colors. I think if you've got one of these big Dulux fan book, Fandex, it's about
2,400 colors in there. That's our sort of core range. And that you're constantly adding
to color. I mean, the human eye can see up to 10 million colors. We can differentiate
and we haven't named them all yet. So I'm still, you know, this is why I'm still here.
So color is an extraordinary thing. And we're constantly looking at the science of color
and how we make it, how we respond to it. And then when it sort of intersects with trends,
is this, we start to see a real relationship between feelings and colors. So let me start
with a bit of science. Okay. And then I'll explain the feelings. So each color through
the spectrum has a wavelength. So each color has a wavelength. You imagine a sound wave.
The longest wavelength color is red. Now, this red is the most impactful color. It's
like if you dropped a plate, a load of plates in a restaurant, they smashed onto the floor.
That's the kind of impact that red has visually on us. You cannot ignore red. And this long
wavelength color is right in our face. When you decorate a room in red, you immediately
draw the walls in towards you. You cannot ignore it. It's powerful and it engenders
certain feelings. In the West, it can be power. It can be being sexy, passionate. It can,
it really gets the heart racing. In the East, just generally, it can be, it's immensely
powerful but for hugely positive reasons, for joy, for purity, for luck.
Yeah, in China, red is a big color, isn't it?
So you look at the science, the science tells you it's a long wavelength color. The cultural
response to it, or so a physical response to it is, wow, it gets heart racing. And then
culturally you have this layer of culture over the top that, you know, in generally
in the West, we see red as, you know, racing cars, red dress, hot lips, sexy, you know,
powerful stop. And in the East, it can be something different. It can be weddings. It
can be joy and prosperity.
It's like prosperity, isn't it?
And prosperity. But it's still powerful. So you have this wonderful thing where you've
got the science, you've got the way we see it and respond to it culturally, and then
there's kind of emotional response to it. So each of the colors, and do you know if
we just talk, we could talk color wavelengths all day long. But then you add this, and this
is a big thing at the moment, lots of people talking about color psychology, and there
is, you know, a certain amount of psychology. Our experience, or when we look at color psychology,
or our response to it is experiential. We have been putting color palettes together
and decorating people's homes for nearly a hundred years. And so you can see a correlation
between everything from what's happening in the world, what people are watching on television,
for example. In the 80s, we were watching Dallas and Dynasty, and suddenly we got this
idea that homes should be cream and brown, like the American beautiful sense of this
gorgeous sort of natural oatmeal, natural colors, because we were watching Dallas and
Dynasty. I mean, that was what the UK homes looked like because we were watching Dallas
and Dynasty. So television and films will have a great influence on the way that we
decorate our homes. But then laterally, in the last few years, it's been a lot about
the environment and a lot about being on 24-7. Our responses to what's happening that we
can't control in the world are driving us back towards the familiar colors of nature,
the colors that make us happy, the colors that we surround ourselves with, the more
natural greens and blues. We used to sell a lot.
I was convinced that the color of the year was going to be green.
Well, it very nearly could be, and it may well be next year. But this return to greens
and blues, these colors that reconnect us with the sky and the landscape, they're huge.
I mean, one of our best selling colors at the moment is a color called Sapphire Salute.
It is the most glorious blue.
I feel like I need to like take lots of notes, but I'm recording it. So it's like, well,
I'm going to do it anyway. But Sapphire Salute, and then there's another one, Everglade Forest
and Emerald Glade. These colors are amazing. They're rich, deep blues and greens, and they're
the colors that are easy to look at. They've got shorter wavelength colors. They recede,
so you put them on the walls, so they make the walls and the space seem bigger, reconnect
us with nature on a visual level as well as a sort of a psychological level. And so we
start to see this. So when I hear color psychology, I think color psychology is more about color
experience, our experience of the world and our response to it around us, over layered
with science and the way that we see color. I think that's the more powerful indicator.
It is a layer, isn't it? There are different ways of looking at color psychology, aren't
there? There's like, like you say, culture, science.
Yeah, yeah. And people, and I know, I mean, Karen Harla, super French, the most amazing
girl, absolutely wonderful. She's a color psychologist. She's grinding her teeth in
the background. She's like, it's color psychology. She is the thing. And it is, and she is a
color psychologist. But from my point of view and from our point of view, we have an experiential
response. I think as human beings, our creatures have experience, and we adapt and flex, and
we seek what we need and what we want from our environment, don't we? And you as an interior
designer will see wonderful flexes and changes in what people are finding stylish and comfortable,
maybe moving towards a more comfortable environment, places where you can retract to more about
me rather than what's going to please the neighbor or my friends. You know, so you can
see things changing in your world and we see exactly the same things. And what we're looking
for is global trends. So we're looking for something that's kind of affecting us as humanity.
And this return to nature is huge and it's becoming more huge. And these little pops
of joy, sorry, I'm going to have to say, but within that lovely calm return to nature.
I'm so chuffed that we're all like, you're bang on trend with this. This was before I
knew about the psychology of color. This was before I knew about true joy. Yeah, or how
it might make you feel. But yeah, these joy is really important. We need to inject joy
and we need to seek it out actively in our lives. And color can give us pops of joy that
don't cost us any money. And every day you'll see this beautiful golden cushion, you'll
go and it puts a smile on your face. Why? We don't know, but it just does because it
just reminds us of sunshine, baby chicks, the flowers of spring reminds us that the
winter is over. Butter cups, biscuits looks in this one is absolutely gorgeous. Butter.
I mean, I'm thrilled already. Ginger snaps, although nice bits of custard. Oh yeah, custard.
Wonderful. So we use color to give us what we want and what we need and joy. We need
joy right now. And so bright colors, dopamine colors, these lovely bright colors that we
see in almost like sweeties, fizzy sweeties, little pops of those into an interior. Just
give us, you know, just that smile, that little cheeky smile in a room.
It was amazing. And you don't, I think if you did do yellow in a whole room, a little
bit like our toilets here, where you do pink in a whole room and you go in and you go,
whoa. But if you sat in that room with just yellow everywhere, it wouldn't work, would
it? It's all about the pops, isn't it?
Yeah, I've seen it. I stayed in an Airbnb the other day and it was the whole thing was,
it was just the shower room and toilet with yellow and the tiles, the toilet seat, the
toilet paper even was yellow. It was amazing. And I went in and I was like, where was this?
It was just, it was in Margate. It was crazy.
And that was, it was, it put a smile on my face all day, but because you just visited
that space, had an intense experience and then left, that was fine. However, and I think
in a restaurant or a commercial space where you're making a big impact, yes, but then
you're not living with it all the time. I think you just, you just, there's just, it's
like sweeties, isn't it? Or really intense spice in food. You just need enough, too much
and it overwhelms. So yeah, you've got to be clever with an intense yellow.
And this is the story of true joy or the story of yellow. That's only one yellow. I think
next year, 2025 is going to be all yellows, whether it's a buttery cream through to, all
the way through to true joy. You know, all yellows are going to have their day because
we need more joy than ever before.
Absolutely. Yeah, no, I totally agree. And when we did the event, there's a colour palette,
isn't there, around true joy, which there's three different palettes. Yes. Yeah. Do you
want me to tell you about that?
Yeah, I'd love to.
So true joy is the kind of colour, and this is where, this is where people's go, no, there's
no one colour of the year. It's a story. So true joy captures that mood of the moment.
But there were three really clear stories coming out in colour and kind of different
vibes that were coming through in design. And the first one was about being human. You
know, in the world of AI, where we have, you know, lots of problems can be solved for us
with AI, but lots more problems are created for us with AI. And there was a wonderful
advert where somebody had said, you know, I don't want AI to do my art or my poetry.
I want AI to do the dishes and the washing up and the hoovering. You know, I feel exactly
the same way.
All the admin, please.
I want to do the admin, yeah, which is a certain amount. But I don't want AI to do my art and
creativity. I want AI to do the boring bits that I don't want to do. I want to solve problems
for me. And so this sense of being human, of celebrating all the messy, mucky, dirty,
raggedy edges, bits of humanity and all the genius that is humanity. You know, a child
brings a pot or you go to a pottery class and you make your first pot. It's not perfect,
but oh my God, that's the most precious thing you'll ever have because you made it. So celebrating
humanity, how people make things. We're seeing this huge return to craft. I mean, Etsy, you
know, what do we do? We look on Etsy and there's everybody as a maker. Everybody because I'm
looking the joy of making for everybody, whether it's knitting a pair of socks.
And personalisation as well, isn't it? It's really, that personalisation is something
that we've talked about in our Trends podcast from the HRC when we did it on stage. And
that personal, like you said, that personalisation and it's all about you. It's all about how
do you feel in that space and what do you need? You know, not what's, you know, keeping
up with the Joneses is that's a bit last year, isn't it? Well, 10 years ago, maybe.
Yeah. And we're moving towards more and more of that. So that human touch, who are you?
Who am I? We're different, we're the same. And so this palette has true joy in it because
true joy is a palette of 10 colours. True joy is always one of them. But the rest of
the palette is a palette of the most beautiful, warm, neutrals, familiar oatmeal colours and
skin tones as beautiful, soft, beiges, texture to really rich, deep chocolate browns. So
a gorgeous palette of human colours, where true joy is that one colour that just gives
you that walk, pop, but it's telling a human story of what it is to be human. And then
there's another palette or the second palette is about being proud. So all around the world,
we are experiencing de-globalisation. So up until a few years ago, our sense of, I'll
just take interior design. So our sense of style was mid-century modern, a bit of Scandi,
maybe Japandi, maybe a kind of, we were homogenising design and all the way around the world, we
were seeing the same designs turning up in Design Week, in Milan Design Week. But recently
we've started to see more ethnic designs, more ethnic prints, more, so less design that's
focused on the Nordics and more design that's focused on regional areas. So beautiful wickerware
from China, the most amazing Japanese lacquerware. So things that are more, and we celebrate
them because they're different, they add a richness to design that we've not seen before.
We really have moved towards this kind of mid-century modern Scandi style of that's
what style is. And actually the world has got more to offer. So this palette is, we
call it the proud palette, it's being proud of where we've come from, whether you come
from North Wales or whether you come from Africa. It's where you've come from, your
roots, your heritage. And these colours are mainly, they're inspired by natural pigments.
So they're rich, they're raw, they're smoky. This palette's in two halves, it's got half
cool and half warm, but deep and rich and really moody. And then Truejoy is like an
equal player here, so you can pop Truejoy in anywhere. And we're starting to see amazing
ethnic prints, designs, hand painting, celebrating the handmade in big shapes and simple floral
designs or leaf patterns and that kind of thing. And this palette is perfectly designed
for that. And then the third one is called the bold colour palette. And this is the one
that captures this idea that we need to take a leap. So be bold. I love it, it's such a
dopamine hit. I love it. You see, you're hardwired to be bold on behalf of your clients. And
I think that this is a sort of, and people are starting to come around to this, yeah,
these dopamine colours, these colours that give us a bit of something that we need. And
people are being braver with colour blocks, with sort of calling out maybe a chair or
two in a bright colour or the inside of a cupboard or painting shelves or a block or
even taking colour up onto the roof. So we're starting to see that more and more and more.
And this palette is designed for that. It's called the bold colour palette and it gives
you the opportunity to leap out of your comfort zone and find where the magic is.
I feel like I've got, I keep thinking I'm going to reach for this in the middle of what
you're talking about. If anyone's listening, I apologise. But you need to go onto YouTube
and check this out. But this is the story, isn't it?
Yeah, these are the colour stories. Now what I can give you is I'll give you a link to
the PDF of the whole book, not this one, but the whole book.
Oh, the big one, yeah.
So you can share it with your listeners. And it is amazing. So that will give you all of
the trends. And I know we hate the word trends, all of the colour stories, all of the insights
behind them, why we think they're important. And a reminder from me that these are just
tools for creative people like you. This is me or our company giving you hopefully colours
that bring you joy forever or for your customers.
You touched on warm and cold just then. I've got my own theory on warm and cold in each
particular interior that I go to. And I always feel like you need to have a balance of warm
and cold. You can never sort of tip it too far the wrong way. What's your thoughts on
warm and cold colours?
Two thoughts on warm and cold colours. So if we look at how we describe warm and cold
colours, so when we talk about warm colours, we tend to talk about yellows, oranges and
reds. When we talk about cool colours, we talk about greens, blues and violets. And
that would be a sort of conversation. You would understand that. However, there is a
wonderful thing in art that says colour takes the credit, but tone does all the work. So
the darker the colour is, the closer it feels to you. So any dark colours advance. So whatever
colour you're using, whether it's a blue or a green or a red or an orange, if it's
a deep shade of that, you create this warm environment because the walls look closer
to you. So you can...
Oh, hello Harvey. Hang on. Let me just go and shut the door.
This is the interior design master himself.
Where are we? We were talking about colour.
We were talking about warm and cool.
We totally deserved the middle of that. That's annoying.
What's this? Where did we get to?
There is this famous phrase in that colour takes the credit. So colour takes the centre
stage, but it's tone that does all of the work. And if you have a dark tone of any colour,
whether it's warm or cool, so whether it's a red or a yellow or a pink, if it's dark,
it will advance. So it looks closer to you. So it creates a cosy environment. So you
can have a warm room in a deep blue. It could be described as warm and cosy in a deep green.
And these are cool colours. We would normally call these colours cool colours, but the darker
the colour is, the closer it appears to you, closer the walls appear to you and the cosier
the environment that it creates. So that's the kind of like, that's how I imagine, you
know, or that's how I think darker spaces create cosier, warmer spaces.
I think if I was to do like a dark blue room, for example, I would put something like a
pop of yellow in it or gold. So it balances it. So you've got that balance of...
Absolutely. Or lovely warm lighting. So you can balance the cool, but the dark is the
thing that creates the arm around you, the visual arm around you. The dark is the thing
that hugs you. So, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So how colour define and transform spaces? Would you like to talk about that?
Colour is one of the least expensive elements of interior design, isn't it? I mean, you
can paint a room for less than it costs for a couple of designer cushions and yet that's
the impact. So colour is everything and it is a tool for interior design, is a creative
tool.
Harvey's having a good old scratch over there. This is great. Colour is the cheapest ingredient
in interior design. I know people moan about the expense of paint, but if you think a couple
of designer cushions and you could decorate a room, it's the same amount in paint. So
colour is the biggest transformer of a space. And that's whether you're using a subtle white
or a bold colour like Truejoy. And you can use it cleverly and in pops. So when we talk
about colours, colour doesn't necessarily have to be wraparound, though that is one
thing of, you know, fully drenching a room is one beautiful way of making a statement
with colour, but also just painting the edge of a door. So you see the door that's open
behind us. If you just painted the edge of that door in a bright yellow or a pink, that
could be enough for some people to make a real statement, to give them a little smile
when they look at the edge of that door. So colour is everything. You know this because
I've been upstairs into your studio and you've got all of these wonderful books that you're
putting together and you're creating a conversation with a space using colour as one of your ingredients
and it makes all the difference. And some people can take strong colour and some people
can't. I think most people can, they just don't know it. So it is the tool that unlocks
the personality of a space more than anything else.
I think one of the things when I've got a tight budget on a project, I always get really
creative with paint. Yeah. Yeah. I always use paint a lot and in a creative way. And
I think that's the true value of being an interior designer is that you can make a statement
make something look amazing without spending stupid money. And paint is the one way. And
you can do all sorts of things. You can get some tape and make a pattern. Yeah. And painting
up onto the ceiling. A big circle on the ceiling can be the thing that stops everybody in their
tracks. You could have spent a fortune on the rug, but the circle of colour on the ceiling,
or the balls of colour on the ceiling is the thing that everybody talks about. Absolutely.
And you guys did it in your, and if anyone wants to see this, have a look at it on my
socials because there's a little, as we went into the true joy unveiling, if you like,
there was this arch of true joy and it was beautiful. And it was just paint. Like it's
just paint. You just have to just get creative. It is all about being, you know, making your
money go further. I mean, there is nothing more expensive than a new kitchen, but if
you've got a kitchen, you can paint. I mean, there's a whole other ball game going out
there. And if you're clever and you've got a good decorator, you can transform a kitchen
in less than a week. And think of the thousands and thousands of pounds that you're saving.
I think also as well, I mean, in the UK, we're having a bit of a cost of living crisis, probably
all over the world. We want to make our money work harder. If you get really good quality
paint, you can transform anything. And yeah, it doesn't have to cost you a fortune. And
again, as an interior designer, you know this, when the budget's tight, you get the paint
rush out. Absolutely. And do you know what? It's more sustainable as well. So if you can,
like if you bought a kitchen that you can paint, or if you use paint, you could, I mean,
I get really bored. Like because of what I do for a living, I want to change the walls
in my house all the time. Ditto. So yeah, painting is one of them. And actually I'm
kind of sitting here thinking, I should have bought a kitchen I could paint. Because now
I've got like a heavy gloss sort of finish and I'm going, I'm a bit bored of that now.
And I've had it for five years and I'm going, shall I get some new doors? But actually if
I'd have got painted, if I'd have got, so to get sustainable. Yeah. That's what that
was a consideration when I bought my kitchen. Can I paint it? Because I know that in a few
years time I'm going to get bored. And if I can paint it and change the color and immediately
change the whole vibe of the place, then yeah, that's a tick for me. Absolutely. Yeah. And
I love the sustainability edge as well, because we're all trying to be more regenerative,
aren't we? Yeah. I mean, on the sustainability front, you know, we talked about paint right
at the beginning of this, you know, your first experience of painting was color. It's more
than just color. You know, the actual formulation, the right formulation for the right space
will give you longevity. It will last. The customer will be happy. And if you think about
the sustainability in terms of the quality of the paint. So if you have a paint that
you can wipe, you can rub, something that's incredibly hard wearing like the diamond with
a diamond finish and it can be in a super matte, you could have a flat finish in a diamond
formulation and that lasts for years and years and years. And that's sustainability because
it means using less paint, less time. So you are extending the decorating period of time.
If you get the colors right, people will be living with it for longer. So that's that's
an element of sustainability that people don't often consider. So if you buy nice paint,
chalk paint, that's not going to last very long, you're going to be painting again and
again and again and again. If you buy, if you get the colors right and you go buy really
good paint, you're not going to be painting again and again. You save on the decorator's
fees, you save on, you save the environment, you save on time, you save money. Yeah, it
just makes sense.
I had a client recently, you're just making me think about where I'd specify Dulux paint
and I've got a funny feeling that they didn't follow the specification because it's one
of my favorite restaurants and it's the noodle bar in Colchester. And I've been in there quite
a few times and they're going, oh, we're going to wallpaper everywhere because you know,
the paint is getting really marked. And I'm like, I don't think the decorators use the
right paint. And I asked him if we could get it tested because we're going to do that.
And he's like, no, no, no, it's fine. We're just going to buy a roll of wallpaper a month
and do it themselves.
But if you get the wrong formulation, you're absolutely right. It doesn't stand up to the
job. So in a restaurant, you want a diamond finish. You want all you want in a hotel or
a really, really busy lobby. You want scuff shields. You want something that's going to
put up, you know, stand to a lot of hammer.
Yeah, definitely. And that is the crux of it is you need to just make sure you've got
the right product in the right place. Otherwise it's just, yeah.
You wouldn't use a domestic fabric, would you? On a commercial sofa. And it's the same
with paint. You wouldn't use a domestic paint in a commercial environment.
But then saying that is because I've worked in commercial first and went into residential
afterwards. I have a real thing about like the fire retardancy is higher on a commercial
fabric. Actually the durability is higher. Why wouldn't you put that in someone's house?
If you've got like, I've got a son with ADHD. He like, he trashes the sofa every time he
sits on it, as most parents will understand and relate to that. So like, why am I putting
a domestic fabric on a sofa when my child is such a Tasmanian devil, you know? So actually
when you've got dogs and children and everything, you know, I went in the doctor's surgery,
I went in the vets the other day to take Harvey to the vet because he had 27 teeth out if
I haven't. And they had a seat in the vets, which was dog proof. You could see that this
seat was really, really hard wearing. And I'm like, people should do this more at home.
And so yeah, so I kind of really bring that when I do a domestic house, I always bring
that and I always try and make it fire retardant. Because why would you not have a fire retardant
fabric when you could have got a choice to do that? Like in your home, you're not supposed
to have it fire retardant at home. So we're not as safe at home. Like, oh, is that okay?
No, I don't think that's okay. That's not okay with me. So yeah, sorry. So yeah, so
we've spoken about how Dulux predict future color trends. We've spoken about what the
top colors are for this year, next year even. How does social and environmental factors
shape color trends?
I think it's everything. If you're experiencing, so for example, we talked about a cost of
living crisis here in the UK. So that will, so it will drive people to decorate less often,
but they'll be upcycling more. So they might be decorating their homes less often, but
they'll be upcycling furniture more. So that means you're, that's a response to what's
happening to us in the world. If you think about as well, the environment, so we are
really heavily focused on nature and working in harmony with nature. So you're going to
be looking for paints that are more sustainable, VOC free. You're going to be looking for paints
where you can take the bit of leftover paint to your recycling center and somebody else
can use it. You're thinking about how you use color in the garden to attract pollinators.
So more pollinators in the garden so that they get, they meet each other, they breed
and they reproduce. So you can do that with color in the garden. We're using color more
mindfully in a situation where we find there's less that we can control in the wider world,
but more that we can control in our homes. And we're using color and paint to make ourselves
happier and to make the environment happier.
Love it. And it affects our moods and our emotions as well, doesn't it?
Absolutely. A hundred percent it does. Yeah. I mean, that's a, that's, it's, it's one of
the, it's something that I am, I'm working on the idea of a book at the moment about
the power of color to, to transform everything, but not just from a, not just from an experiential
point of view, but there was with the science as well. Why do we do things? Why do we respond
in this way? So how the science crosses over to culture, how it crosses over into emotion,
and then you put that layer on of what's happening in the world and why are we doing this kind
of thing. So it's one of the drivers of why do we use color? Why do, you know, why do
we seek color as a solution to the way that we feel often? I mean, if we're going out
to a party, we tend to either wear, well, I might, as I'm older, wear something that
makes me look slimmer. So it would generally be black, but I will wear a gorgeous pair
of earrings, some amazing shoes, some really bright tights. Oh, I'll use color. Oh, have
you seen Marianne's tights? Is it in the shot? Oh my God, they're so good. They're so treacherous.
But so I'll use color to give myself a little bit of confidence. If I'm going out with my
sister, for example, I don't care anymore. So I'm going to wear the brightest colors
that I, I, you know, the brightest colors that I can. So I use color to give myself
a little bit of something when I go out in my wardrobe. And that translates to the food
on my plate. If you've got a plate of beige food, yes, it might be comfort food, but actually
what really turns us on is a plate of really colorful food, lots of reds and oranges, and
they make your mouth water. You know, when you see, so everywhere we as human beings
touch color in our lives, it gives us something that we need. Love that. How to use color
to promote calm, focus or energy in various spaces? We have, I mean, there's an interesting
one because different people will need different things from color. So for example, in a school,
you'll have a load of children who are all very different with very different needs.
Sometimes they need to focus and sometimes they're anxious and stressed and they just
need to calm down. So you need to create spaces within that environment that gives them both
things. And there might be spaces of energy where you have to, you know, you'll get ready
for sports or the sports hall, you know, where you will use brighter, more intense colors,
or you might have a classroom where you want children to focus on the teacher or focus
on a space. So you would use it quite a bright color to draw attention. So color can be used
to engender different responses and that all promotes wellbeing. So this is the wonderful
thing about being an interior designer. One solution doesn't fit all. You have to respond
to your client, what your client needs. And often in a big commercial space, it's more
than one person. So there are much more now in an environment, you'll have multiple spaces,
a little quiet reading space, a little sort of space where you're relaxing and a little
space where you want to be energized or a space where you want to draw people together
to be entertained. So it's, yeah, it's a language you have to learn a little bit, but not in
one, one size does not fit all when it comes to color and creating.
My biggest mantra in interior design is that you have to listen. And you really have to,
and for me, this is my favorite part of being a designer is that you have to really give
that person what they don't know they want, you know, and really kind of listen to what
they're saying and translate that into how am I going to make that person feel really
good in their space because I'm going to solve that problem or this is why they've come to
me. They've got this, you know, generally people come because they're like, they haven't
got time or they, you know, they want to feel a certain way in their space and they want
to feel special and how that person feels special is going to be different for every
single client. So you can't just go like that color makes people feel special. You know,
you can't do that. You have to be really intuitive and read between the lines and kind of really
try and figure out what makes that person tick and what makes them happy. I mean, if
someone really likes being on a beach, for example, those beach colors might be a good
palette to start with on, you know. So if you've got, if you're asking your client
lots of questions, you need to get to know them, you know, and the people I've got to
know or who've allowed me to get to know them the most I've done the best job for because
I just know what makes them tick and I know what makes them feel good and things like
that. And that's the key to getting it really right as an interior designer. And then on
the flip side, that's sort of at home on the flip side of that is commercial spaces. And
like you said, you've got to make, if you've got kids who need to calm down or kids who
need to focus in a school, for example, absolutely. And you've got that in an environment in a
commercial space as well. So if you're, for example, doing it at a hotel, people are living
in your space. So you need to be able to do this exactly the same. You need to have somewhere
where people can work, somewhere where people can focus, somewhere where people can chill
out and calm down. And you've got to have all of those different things. And that's
becoming, especially in the hotel environment, much, much more prominent and much more asked
for from my perspective, from my clients is that they're wanting to give not just one
thing, they wanting to give different people. And also the whole thing with neurodiversity
as well and people being more aware of neurodiversity. I think that that is going to be huge in our
society in terms of being on the spectrum. So everyone is on the spectrum somewhere,
aren't they? And some people are much more introvert than others, you know, and that's
just character, I was going to say flaws, but character traits, you know? And there's
this thing with neurodiversity that people want to have certain things to, they need
certain environments to create something for them, to help them. And actually, when you
think about it, everybody needs that. Everybody needs that. Everyone needs that. And when
you make something, when you make a space really, really healthy for a neurodiverse
environment, it actually makes the space really, really healthy for everyone. Because it gives
you lots of different areas and different feelings and touch points and things like
that.
And I think that's going to be one of the biggest areas of development in design, interior
design is designing for neurodiversity. Because I mean, we design at the moment when all of
the legislation is designed towards people who are in wheelchairs or can't physically
or there may be some physical inability to do something physically, but actually it's
probably more what's going on in our noggins that is the biggest thing that we should address
as human beings, especially designing for spaces to make people happy and to function
better for everyone. So I think that's, I mean, it's such a fantastic area of research
and focus in Dulux. So we're constantly designing to help people. So for example, help people
with dementia to live in their homes safer for longer. We've just created a couple of
years ago, we created a dementia, not dementia, we do dementia friendly pallets, of course,
but also for people who suffer from migraine. So we worked with the National Migraine Centre
and for people who suffer with migraine, you know, colours can be triggers. And so we created
a palette of colours that works really well for people who are super sort of, you know,
have migraines and to help relieve that, to help to sort of not have those triggers in
your home anymore and create a calm environment.
There's so many people who have migraines who don't know that.
It's a huge amount of people in the world suffer from migraine. And so if you live in
a migraine friendly decorated environment and these colours are absolutely beautiful,
they're so beautiful, they're so tranquil, they're just gorgeous. This is a beautiful
palette of colours. So you can look on the Dulux website and look for the migraine friendly
palette. So you see, we're talking about colour as this magical tool, aren't we? I love it
when people say, it must be really nice working colour and it is the best job in the world.
But when you start to dive into what the day job is and how you're using this incredible
tool to transform lives for the better, that's your mission is to make life better with colour.
I mean, what a fantastic thing. And every day we'll learn something new about it and
to be able to use it to make life better.
It's so big.
Yeah, it's huge. We don't fully understand it. We understand it on certain levels, but
we don't understand the full power of colour. We really don't because it's the, we have
been genetically designed, you know, from our, colour gives us an advantage as human
beings over other human beings and as animals, if you like. So our ability to see colour
helps us to be able to see ripe fruit, to be able to make choices. So colour vision
is fundamental to the success of human beings on the planet and we don't know enough about
it. It's a bit like the deep ocean. So I've got plenty to learn.
We both have.
I do. I love learning. That's why I do the podcast. I'm learning from you now. I learn
from everybody who comes in. It's great. Every day is a school day. Do you have any real
life life examples of projects where colour has significantly impacted the design of success?
I suppose we might have loads and loads of them because our colour teams are working
on them all the time. So everything from hotels to big social housing projects, they'll, they've
got, I mean, literally we'll have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of them. I'm thinking
off the top of my head. There are so many of them. I mean, simply painting the door
of a community centre in a bright colour to remind people that it's a community centre,
taking the colour onto the edge of the doors to actually sort of show this is the door
of the community centre. Just that as an example, it's a community centre in a social housing
project. Can't remember where it was, but just that pop of colour that reminded people,
this was a space for them. This is a space where fun happened. And it was just this pop
of orange. It's just beautiful. But colour, we've got so many of them. I don't know where
to start.
Yeah. We've just done, we were talking about it on a podcast that the previous podcast
that I just did about commercial kitchens. And we worked with Gratt Brothers on Arena
Racing, which was Southwell race course or Southwell, wherever you live. If you live
in Southwell, it's called Southwell. If you don't, it's called Southwell. Really, I don't
know why. But in Southwell, what we did was we came up with a colour palette and Dulux
Colours where it complimented their brand. So with Arena Racing, they've got sites all
over the country and we work with their head office. So we've got an overall colour palette
for their whole, all of their sites. And then this one, this particular site, their brand
was a really grassy green colour. So we put more of that tone in. And we've put this orange
in that really compliment, like a terracotta orange, that really lovely colour that's on
trend. Am I allowed to say that? That's on trend at the moment. And we put that with
the green and we didn't, we just did pops. So it was pillars and surrounds and the odd
feature wall in the green and then the terracotta as well. And then everything else was really,
really neutral. And it just looked amazing. It just looked, and we didn't, we did have
a really tight budget, especially going towards the end because the insurance company decided
they weren't going to pay out as much as we thought they were going to. So we were like,
all hands on deck to value engineer everything. So it was like, right, let's use the paint
and let's use some real bold colours. And it just looked awesome. And it was really bold
and you wouldn't probably sit, you wouldn't put this green in your living room because
it would be so really oppressive. But on pops of colour as you go through, it just really
made it. And they were, when I first came up with the idea, the client was just like,
whoa, that's a lot. And I'm like, yeah. I'm like, just trust me. And he's like, okay.
And he went, they went with it. Thank you guys. Thank you guys. And yeah, I was really,
really pleased with the result. It was brilliant. Really, really cool. Even in the hotel rooms,
we did it. We did some green. Brilliant. I love a commercial project for doing that because
you can do that because people are there just for a brief amount of time and that just gives
them what they want. It's just like little nuggets of joy and fun, you know, but you
can't tend, you tend not to be able to do that so easily at home because you're going
to be there for a lot longer. You wouldn't wear the same outfit every day for the next
five years, but you kind of have to decorate a living room or a kitchen or a bedroom and
that has to be for the next five years. So you have to get it right. Absolutely. I always
like dressing things like with color, like in my house, I would always go, okay, I'm
going to change that wall. Quite a lot. This sunt is going to be white. But even with the
wallpaper, I've got a feature wall where it's a Brown McKenzie wallpaper and it's like this
greenhouse effect with these cheese plants, but like these ones. Can you see those? Yes.
And so it's got these cheese plants and all these other different plants in there. And
so it's really busy, this wallpaper, but it's got loads of like tones in it. So I'm kind
of like, at the moment, the wall is kind of like this really lovely, what's last year's
color of the year called? Sweet embrace. Sweet embrace. Really similar to that, but slightly
kind of more taupey, not so pink. And I'm going to go white next and the white wall,
so it looks quite cozy at the moment, but when I go white, it's going to look a little
bit more clean and sharp. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's really, it's really interesting.
Good. Tangent again. We're not on a tangent again. Right.
Do you have any advice for selecting colors for different spaces? For example, kitchens
and bedrooms? Coming back to color, color, choosing colors for different spaces is as
an interior designer, you'll be doing that. You'll be looking at materials. So you're
always starting with the materials, the big elements, you know, what's the carpet color?
What are the fabrics? What are the, and then you work the colors around it. So that would
always be a great starting point. So think about the most expensive thing in the room
and then work around it. So if you're stuck with a set of curtains or a carpet, you've
got to work around that. You can't ignore it. But in terms of say for kitchens, what
do you do in the kitchen? Do you want your family to come together and eat together?
Do you want to, or in a commercial environment, do you want people to be really stimulated?
Do you want it to be amazingly stimulating and memorable? And if that's the case, then
you would probably choose warm colors. You'd choose colors that bring people together that
stimulate the appetite, stimulate conversation. What colors stimulate appetite? Reds and oranges,
yellows are the same. So the colors that remind us of food, delicious, ripe food, tasty, spicy
food, and that gets us going. If you want a kitchen to be more tranquil, to sort of
be a bit more laid back, greens are fabulous in a kitchen because you can dial up the reds
and colors in vegetables and accessories and it sort of creates this more calm atmosphere.
So if you're prone to a bit of an argument at suppertime as family, busy family, there's
what's when the rows kick off, then don't choose red. And if you want to lose weight
a little bit in the kitchen, so if you're wanting to sort of not hit the fridge quite
so much, choose colors that are less appetizing. So blues and greens, violets like tinge of
violet, those are colors in nature that we don't eat, tend to eat, so it doesn't turn
us on appetite-wise. We don't start to salivate when we start to sing.
I did not think that you would be giving people advice on how to lose weight in this podcast,
but this is good. I'm loving this. I think my kitchen is going to have to go blue.
It's an association. I mean, green is great because it will promote healthy eating and
it's also one of the neutral colors that works with everything. Red will stimulate your appetite.
Red will get the juices flowing in conversation, in taste buds as well. Blues, we don't tend
to find anything in nature much other than poisons and blues, so we tend not to. That
color is definitely a less appetizing color, but it's also a calming color. So if you do
tend to find, I mean, my mom and dad used to row like cats and dogs at lunchtime, dinnertime.
They loved it. And we had an orange kitchen and I don't know whether that's just in my
mind. I'm thinking, of course, that's why they're red. So I do not have, I have a deep,
dark blue kitchen. We never row. I don't know whether that's got anything to do with it.
I mean, that's just silly. But these, you never know.
Color can affect. I mean, if you think about passion in the bedroom, if your love life
is flagging a little, get a bit of red going on in there because that's the color of passion
and excitement. If there's too much passion going on there, then pull out the green card.
There's never too much passion. But yeah, color for different areas of the house, depending
on what you want to happen. And then start looking at how the color appears on the wall.
So blues and greens and violets are receding colors. They look further away from you. They
have shorter wavelengths. So if you want spaces to be bigger, so for a living room or a hallway
and landing, if you want that to appear bigger, choose the colors that are receding, paler
versions of them. If you want to create cozy, warm environments, then you'll choose the
warmer colors. So warmer taupes and browns and creams and oranges, yellows and reds.
And those will create that lovely cozy environment. They're longer wavelength colors. And so the
walls look closer to you. It's what you want to happen in a space rather than the space
itself. I was thinking about what do you want to happen in this space? Do you want to feel
refreshed? Do you want to feel calm? Do you want to eat well? Do you want to pull people
together and then use the power of color to get that result?
I love that so much.
So what common mistakes do people make?
With color or with paint or both? So paint we talked about using the wrong paint in the
wrong environment, not doing your prep. So prep is the pig of a job that you have to
get the prep done properly. If you employing a decorator, the decorator will spend days
and days and days doing the prep and then literally when the click of his fingers or
her fingers, the job will be done. The color will be on the walls, but it's all in the
prep. So prep, prep, prep, you know, good prep has lasting results for good paint. So
good paint, good prep. And then when it comes to color, I think, you know, if you're sharing
a space with somebody, share it with them before you chuck it on the walls, try a tester,
always do a tester, use the visualizer tool on the app so you can see what the color might
look like on the walls before you commit to buying the paint. Because paint, although
it's not an expensive element of the room, probably the cheapest for the biggest impact,
is still expensive and you don't want to make a mistake. So try and visualize it before you
start. Work out how that color is going to look with all of your other elements. You
know, the most expensive thing you probably have in your room is the sofa or the rug or
the carpet, you know, the rug or the curtains. And so how does that color look with those
elements? Because paint's easy to change and all of the other elements aren't. Yeah, I
think try before you buy. I think that's probably the best bit of advice. Testers before you
go fall in. Yeah.
I love a tester. I'm going to get the interior pallets on the wall in the entrance here.
I've put True Joy up there.
Oh, lovely. Oh, lovely.
Sort of swatch on there. But I want to get like the stories. Because it just, yeah, they're
so inspiring and they're so current for me. Anyway, they are the colors that I'm using
already and it's just, yeah, it's really captured it. It's lovely.
Good.
So Dulux have lots of tools.
We do.
How, can you give us a bit of advice on how successfully to use those tools?
The best thing to do is to go onto the Dulux Trade Paint Expert website or the Dulux Trade
website and they'll have tools for professional designers. So everything from plug-in tools
for your laptop or your PC or your tablet to show you all of the pallets. They have
specifier tools. We have an amazing eye for color, which is a little digital tool that
actually gives you a color match. They're brilliant. Aren't they absolutely brilliant?
There are so many tools. We are never short of tools. And even the color cards, like the
Dulux Heritage Color Card, it is a tool. So it shows you which colors work with each other.
It puts them into color families. It gives you the perfect white for each of the color
pillars. So everything we design that we give to architects, designers and specifiers and
our customers is a tool in itself. Everything from the color cards to a digital plug-in
tool. So check out the website because it's absolutely packed with some with with tools
you can download or order. It's also one of my favorite tools and nobody really knows
about this. And it's one of my favorite ever tools. It's called the Interior Designers.
What is it called? The Dulux? It's the most boring name. It's not very sexy. So it's the
Dulux Trade Paint Expert for interior designers and it's a little tablet tool. It's a tool
that you can have on your tablet and it's the most amazing thing. So you can create
little mood boards. But what you can do is you can put a photograph of the interior that
you've got there or the carpet or the cushions. So you can start to create a mood board but
it has this magic color picking tool. And you can look into a photograph and pick from
thousands of colors. So it will identify colors from fabrics in infinitesimal detail. And
then it will give you the color palette and it will give you a coordinating contrasting
tone. It's amazing. And then you can order from the website and from that app little
swatches of painted hand-painted samples. So for your mood boards you can get real ones
for free. It's amazing. I use that app every single day. So if I'm looking at something
or I'm trying to choose a color or I'm trying to put a palette of colors together I use
that. I literally do use it every single day and you can put annotation on it. You can
put your logo on it. You can send it to clients. It's probably something you do on a slightly
different app but I got my tablet with me all the time and I'm using it all the time.
That's amazing. I'm going to put a link in the bio because that is awesome.
It is not a very sexy sounding app but it is the best. It's simply every designer that
I work with, all of our cut they all absolutely love this app. It's brilliant and it has all
of the color palettes on it.
How does Dulux incorporate sustainability into their product lines?
Sustainability is at the heart of everything we do. If we're not sustainable we don't survive.
We are not in the business of destroying the planet. So we hit all of our VOC targets of
zero VOCs. We have some amazing schemes. We've just celebrated a million liters of recycled
paint being made, paint being taken back and made into new paint.
Where would you take that paint from?
The Community Repaint Scheme is absolutely fantastic. We've been supporting this for
nearly 30 years. So basically if you or your decorator has paint, leftover paint, if they've
got Dulux, well actually any paint can go back to a Dulux decorator center. So they
will recycle it and take it away and we will recycle the paint. If you take it to a Community
Repaint Center, so you can find these online, so just put in Community Repaint Center near
you and it's basically a household refuse tip that will take the paint, we will redistribute
the paint to communities and to charitable projects. If it's really, really good we'll
sell it for peppercorn amounts to people who are running their own businesses and then
we'll recycle the stuff that we can't give away. So we want, we are committed to not
wasting a drop. I mean the biggest environmental impact is probably people washing their brushes
badly or chucking paint into the tip. So we need to encourage people and help them not
to chuck away paint that can be used and saved or made into new paint. So washing your brushes,
washing your rollers really well, using every last drop. I mean if a decorator, all decorators
know this but there's a magic tool for getting paint out of a roller where you would literally,
you can, it's about 250 mils worth of paint in a roller and paint isn't cheap and it's
also harmful to the environment if you flush it down the sink or you just chuck it away
in a tip. So save every drop. We don't want to waste a drop because that's the future
of the planet. We don't want to mess about the planet. We are a huge paint manufacturer.
There's no denying what we make is we make paint but we want to commit that we have as
much as possible a circular manufacturing process so everything gets used and not thrown
away. Then when we pass the paint into the hands of our decorators and DIYers we give
them means to be able to recycle that and take it somewhere and redistribute it, put
every drop on the walls and paint is a protective coating for the things that you love and you
spend money on and if you've got the right paint things will last longer.
Do you supply a paint, just really, really random question, do you supply a paint that
you can put on top of wallpaper?
You can put any paint on top of wallpaper. It's just how well the wallpaper's been, it's
how well it's been stuck and what kind of wallpaper it is. So if it's a vinyl paper,
if you put on a multi-purpose or a primer for difficult surfaces, a primer, so you've
got a really good stick to it so that stick it to the vinyl. But generally as soon as
you put any liquid onto a wallpaper, if it's not been stuck down really, really well it's
going to start bubbling up.
I'm thinking about, because I do a lot of commercial environments, sometimes I'll specify
a paper that's not as durable as I would like it to be. So therefore I would use a decorator's
varnish and that's what I'm being told by the wallpaper company to say. Do you know
what that is?
Decorative, well, Polyvine are a great company that do a decorator's varnish. So Polyvine
do a water-based dead flat varnish which is absolutely fantastic. You've got to be really
careful on a dark wallpaper because if you put it on too thick it can leave a milky film
but it's water-based, it's super, super tough. You can get it from Dulux decorator centers.
So if you're looking for something specific or any advice, we have a technical advice
line who are unbelievable.
They are amazing.
And if you go into a Dulux decorator center and ask them, you tell them, I had a fantastic,
somebody phoned me up there, they wanted to paint a load of leather suitcases that were
going to go, it was an art piece, so it was going to go outside on the top of a church
and it was something like 60 suitcases.
Oh you love it.
I love it.
It's only paint but this is the paint that you can use and it'll keep it going for a
little while but it won't last forever but it's paint. But there's a paint for everything.
How can designers use color to support eco-friendly and regenerative design practices?
I mean, we've just talked about, you know, never waste a drop. Make sure that your decorator
takes all of the old paint to a community repair center.
You have a conversation with the decorators, isn't it?
Absolutely. Make sure that you order the right amount. So use a paint calculator to make
sure, I mean, your decorator will do this. Because the idea is that it's precious stuff
and we don't want to waste it. So use it wisely. Make sure that you buy the right amount and
then anything that you've got left behind, you know, obviously you're going to save a
little bit for little touch-ups but then take it to a community repaint center where the
community can use it. It can be donated to good causes or made into new paint.
Is there anything else that you would like to say to our audience that you feel is really,
really important and current at the moment?
Use more color. The thing I want to say to your audience is use more color. Color is
the cheapest way and the most effective way to transform the way we feel in the spaces
that we're living in today. And color is more powerful than we can possibly imagine. And
interior designers, you talked about, we talked about color psychology. I think interior designers
are sort of psychologists anyway. We unlock the potential of marriage counselors, family
counselors and color is one of the most important and powerful tools in your toolbox.
Absolutely. Amazing. Marianne, thank you so much for coming to sit on the sofa with me.
I really, really appreciate your time and I appreciate your education for the designers
as well who are listening to this and the aspiring designers. So yeah, thank you so,
so much.
Oh, Haley, it's been my great, great pleasure. Who cannot want to spend time with you talking
about the thing I love more than anything else?
Oh, you have the best job in the world.
Thank you for joining us on the Interior Design Podcast. If you liked this episode, please
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