Hello, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode
of Trinity Talks. My name is Kyla, and I am really
excited to be sitting down with a couple of folks
who are members here at Trinity and have a really
interesting, really fun story to tell about the
history of this church. So thank you for joining
me. Thanks, Kyla. Yeah. Maybe we'll start with
an introduction. Do you want to introduce yourself?
Oh, I'm Diane Toyson, and my husband and Dave
and I have been coming to Trinity for 38 years.
Okay. Wow. That's a long time. Yeah. Well, yeah.
And go ahead. So I'm Wally Vogel. My wife, Jane,
and I have been coming for 36 years. Okay. When
we came, we were basically newlywed 20 -somethings,
and we're grandparents now. Okay. So that gives
you some idea of the arc of our timeline. Yeah.
A long time. Yeah. So we're going to zoom in
on a little bit of Trinity's history here. As
Rob said in our service, the church is 120 or
more years old. We're going to zoom in on the
past 30 or so years. So in 1998, there was a
fire here at Trinity that burned the whole building
to the ground. But before that, there was actually
some other changes that were taking place. So
can you take us back to 1998, 1997? What was
happening in the life of the church then? Well,
Harold Percy was our rector at the time, and
things were really going strong. Lots of people
coming. We had two services at the time, 9, 15,
and 11, and they were getting really packed.
Not much room, and so we wanted to make room
for more new people to join us. So we got space
at the Hazel McCallion School at Gymnasium and
started having a 10 o 'clock service there. Okay.
And there were maybe 40 people that were over
there, and our music director, John McDonald,
would shuttle back and forth between the services.
cover the music. Okay. And it was really an exciting
time. Sure. We ended up calling it St. Hazel's.
Okay. Very cool. And so what was happening here
at the building during that time? So we were
looking for ways to expand because while the
school was a good satellite congregation, you
know, really people were tending to come in through
the front doors here, spotting us on Queen Street.
So we were really looking for a way to expand.
The very first plan was to build, you know, a
lovely church right here. house everybody. But
the obstacles were we didn't have the budget.
We didn't have the parking. And we would have
trouble getting some of the city permits. So
with all those obstacles in our way, that project
wasn't able to move forward. So we were really
looking for alternatives. And we looked at everything.
We were looking at leasing some industrial space
up the street and what have you. So we were looking
at all kinds of alternatives. And then I'll tell
a little bit of a story. I'll try and tell it
quickly. I remember I was at one of the last
board meetings, probably 1997. And I was like
a junior assistant warden, whatever. I was one
of the new kids on the board. And we were talking
about the building and saying, oh, we can't do
anything for five years. We don't have the money.
We don't have the parking and so on and so forth.
And in my youthful exuberance, I was a little
frustrated. I said, we must be able to do something.
And then Harold called me up the next morning.
Went, yeah, well, you don't know what you're
talking about. And then the next morning, Harold
called me up and he said, listen, what you said
last night, let's get together and talk. And
he actually had a bit of a dream that told him
that, you know, you kind of have to step out
before things will happen. met at the time that
keg was up the street we met there and had lunch
and we're writing down well what if we raised
this much from the diocese what if we did this
did this yeah and uh and uh diane was there at
lunch too and she came by at our table and said
what are you guys talking about and harold picked
up the napkin he said we just built a church
Okay. So that was the beginning of the construction
project. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Okay. So we
also have a few photos to share to sort of help
us tell this story a little bit. So the first
picture we have is the original church building
back in 1893. So obviously none of us were around
to see this. But yeah, just this really... A
very basic sort of building that, you know, has
the big brick steeple, very similar to our steeple
today, but just a long sort of worship space.
And then we have a picture of the building in
1962. And so you can see that there was an expansion
built on the side of the building. So what was
in that expansion space? Well, that was called
the Education Center, sort of. There was a middle
hall. Yeah. It was sort of a meeting area, and
then there was a parish hall on the upper level
over on the extension. And then underneath, we
had Sunday school space, office space. We had
a nursery school that was running. Ida Dundas
was the director of that. So that was quite a
going concern. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you had lots
of space for all this other stuff, but it was
the worship space that was sort of, that was
a bit of the constraint. And so then we have
a picture of construction that had started in
1997. Yeah, so you can see, obviously, the sanctuary
is no longer there. Just a big empty space there
as the church is expanding and getting ready
to grow. and so what was the sort of hope or
vision there like was it it was a growing church
at that point absolutely we were growing quickly
we had lots of young families i remember when
we were raising the the money to do the uh construction
yeah We rolled a cement mixer, so we were meeting
in the schools at St. Hazel's, and we rolled
a cement mixer up the middle, and people were
to put their commitments for the building fund
in an envelope, throwing it in the cement mixer.
And the kids were dancing behind, there was music,
and the kids were dancing, and it was marched
up. We raised the commitments for everything
that we needed, which was just amazing. I mean,
God was so good to us because we needed parking.
For example, we were trying to figure that one
out. That was one of the toughest problems. And
then just before our annual vestry, the lot across
the street came up for sale. And we were able
to very quickly put together an offer. And I
think it was, I want to say it was within 30
days we had acquired that parking from when it
went. So that same parking lot that we use now.
Yeah. parking lot that we have across the street
at the time there was a salon in the front of
course because this is streetsville yeah yep
very cool that became a police station became
a police station for a while okay interesting
lots lots of different things happening there
and we still had our offices underneath the old
parish hall area okay still meeting there yeah
yeah okay So then, April 26th, 1998 hits, and
we have this very dramatic photograph of the
church fire. And we have these history books
of the church, and this image of the steeple
on fire. roof. You can't even see it there anymore.
And I've been told that the kids will walk by
and see these little books and are all very intrigued
by this particular photograph because they want
to know the story of what happened. And so I'm
wondering if you folks can take us back to that
day, April 26, 1998. Where were you? How did
you hear about this? What was your sort of reaction
to that? Do you want to start, Wally? Sure. I
remember it distinctly. It was a Saturday night.
Jane and I were going out for dinner. And I said,
before dinner, can we swing by the church and
check on the construction? Because it was something
that we just kind of did every day. And we came
by here and checked on it to see how it was.
And everything was in pretty good shape. And
then we went out to dinner. And we got home and
went to sleep. And around, I'm going to say it
was close to midnight, the phone rang. And it
was Diane that called me. And she said, Wally,
there's a fire at the church. I didn't ask any
question. I just said, I'll be there in five
minutes. I hung up and got dressed very quickly.
And as I'm getting dressed, I'm praying, caught
small fire, small fire. I get out in my driveway.
I live south of Eglinton here. I got in my driveway.
I could already smell the smoke. By the time
I turned on to Mississauga Road, I could see
the flames. Wow. You told me you'd gone in the
building. Yeah, we had gone in the building on
the Saturday. The day before. A few hours before.
Yeah, they had just completed the roof, and I
saw the rolls of tar paper. I stepped over them,
actually, to come in. And it was those rolls
of tar paper that the young man set aflame later
that night. Wow. And the stained glass window.
that we have now in there used to be over the
altar and it had been taken out and stored. And
because we were getting close to finishing the
construction, the, the crate, whatever, holding
the stained glass window had been brought back
in and it was laying on the floor of the, of
the church. And well, there's a story in that.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So we can see the picture there.
You can see the, So it was in a wooden or cardboard
crate of some kind. Yeah, so all of the wood
around the windows is completely charred. The
window itself is quite black. It's hard to see
through. But this is the same window that now
sits in our sanctuary. That's right. And it was
restored with funds from the Bread and Honey
Festival in memory of Sam McCallion, who was
the chairman or convener of that event. So now
it's in our new building, which is lovely. I
think it was restored. There was a company down
the street here. Yeah, it was called Red Hill
Art Glass. It's where there's a coffee shop now.
And they restored it. That's right. And it's
hard to really describe how miraculous it is
that that stained glass survived. I mean, there
were steel beams that were... twisted and warped
and fallen from the heat there like yeah it was
an incredible fire as you saw from the picture
and right in the middle of it was this stained
glass window yeah and yet it was at least it
wasn't undamaged but it was restorable yeah yeah
very cool i heard about the fire harold called
me what dave and i had been out to a play or
some some kind of event and had gotten home and
had received the call and so we Quickly drove
over here, parked at Tim Hortons, and I remember
running down the street to get down here to the
parking lot. And we stood out in the parking
lot watching the firemen work on the building.
Yeah. Something. Yeah. It's amazing. I was working
on the staff at the church. Okay. I was director
of programming and parish life. And I did that
for 24 years. And so I was pretty much involved
in things right here. Had my office downstairs
and everything was going. Yeah. Yeah. So then
what was it like being part of this congregation
in the weeks and the months after that fire?
I'm sure there's a lot of sense of grief and
loss. Yeah. Yeah. Well, one of the. Nice things
was that parishioners Ross and Davis Mitchell
invited our staff to come over to their house
and set up our offices in their basement. So
we were there for several weeks, I think, until
we looked and found a warehouse on Century Avenue
up by Argentina, and we were able to rent that.
big open warehouse, and I worked on a floor plan
of designing the different spaces that we could
set up in there for offices and some meeting
rooms. There was a little kitchenette and washroom
and stuff, so we could have our 8 o 'clock traditional
worship service there. In the warehouse. Yeah,
in meeting rooms there. And we had our offices
there, and we could have meetings and midweek
kind of things. And then we still worshipped
at St. Hazel's. Yes. And everybody moved there.
Yeah. And then we had at least one service at
Meadowvale Theater. Okay. I think an Easter service.
Sure. Do you remember anything else? I just think
it's worth mentioning, you mentioned Ross and
Davis Mitchell. Ross Mitchell, who unfortunately
is no longer with us. He passed away a few years
ago. But Ross was just such an integral part
of all this. Harold and I designed the church
on a napkin. It wouldn't have gotten much further
than that if we hadn't asked Ross to be the head
of the building committee. Ross was absolutely
a force to be reckoned with, and he made sure
through the first building project, through the
fire, through the second building project. I
remember Ross saying to me one time, he and I
were both entrepreneurs and had our own business.
He said, it's a good thing we have our own business
because if we worked for anybody else, we would
have been fired for all the time we're spending
in the church. Sure, sure. Yeah. There's one
more photo I want to share of the church itself.
So obviously there was a lot of damage done to
the church, but then not there. The bell tower,
I think, was not entirely damaged. Is that right?
Oh, yeah, it was. It was destroyed. OK, OK. The
fire was set underneath. Right. OK. It was like
a chimney. After the fire, what was left here.
So, you know, I had the unfortunate distinction
of maybe being the only warden to sign two demolition
orders for the church. The first demolition order
was partial demolition. Sure. To prepare for
the renovations. Yeah. The second one was complete
demolition. Right. This place we're sitting in
was literally just a hole in the ground for about
a year. Yeah. While we tried to settle up the
insurance claim. So you can see in the image
there that they're clearing away all of the bricks.
There's really not much left there. There was
literally nothing. We preserved some of the brick,
which has been used downstairs and behind the
altar. Yeah. But no, there's nothing. I can see
there's nothing left of the original structure.
Yeah. It was literally just dug out and we started
from scratch. Yeah. And then another picture
from the newspaper that I want to share with
you folks, because you are actually featured
in this picture. So at the top there, we have
Wally and Diane, along with Harold Percy, who
was the minister at the time, and Hazel McCallion,
who is, of course, famous mayor of Mississauga,
but also a member of this church. Yeah, all just...
And Ross Mitchell. Okay, and Ross Mitchell as
well. Okay, yeah, that we were just talking about.
And I can remember standing outside when they
removed the old bell from the tower. That's what's
happening there. Yes. The bottom picture. And
that bell is out in the lobby right now. Yes,
yeah. And then you see the sign out in front.
Right. It talked about we had rising from the
ashes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, very cool. And so the
sub headline of this was that it was a team who
started this fire. But then there's actually
quite an amazing story that comes along with
that. So do you want to share a little bit about
how this team became sort of a little bit of
part of Trinity's life for a little while anyway?
Yeah. So, yeah, there were three young men that
came into the church, and one of them started
the fire. One of the other ones, I guess, you
know, was apprehended and gave his name. So it
was fairly quickly that... You know, the young
man that started the fire was apprehended. My
recollection is he was 17. Yeah. Yes. And so
actually, Harold and Diane and I were invited
to the courthouse when he was being tried. And
the judge asked Harold to recommend, you know,
sentencing. He said, you know, by default, this
young man would go to prison. Right. And, you
know, what would you like? And I think, Harold,
you said sought some advice, I think, from somebody
for that. Lou Smedes was a famous professor at
Fuller Seminary. And he wrote some books. And
Dave connected Harold with Lou Smedes. And he
made some recommendations of how to. make it
a more healing process for everyone. And so he
was, the sentence was that he was to do, set
up and take down chairs at 200 community hours,
and that was part of taking up and setting up
chairs at the school. He used to do some lawn
work here at the church. He was to give 10 %
of his part -time job money, and he was to make
an apology, a public apology to the congregation.
And that was an amazing experience. We were over
at the school and packed an auditorium there,
and he and his mother came, and he got up and
made an apology. it's written out in one of the
books we've got out on display. And it was really
an emotional experience for everyone, but it
was a very healing experience for the congregation
too. Yeah. It was known as a service of forgiveness
and, and it was really important for us to go
through that. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. It's
really neat to sort of think about that from
the lens of, what it means to be a church, what
it means to be a follower of Jesus, right? Because,
so like you said, the sort of default sentence
would have been prison, which is a space of isolation,
right? It's a space where we take people to get
them out of our community. But instead, what
the church was able to offer was... community
and integration, right? And yes, sort of community
service hours, there was some hard work that
was involved in that. But community service in
the context of community, in the context of being
part of this church family, yeah, I think that
must have felt, I'm sure there's a lot of emotions
wrapped up in that. Yeah, a lot of tears. Yeah,
for sure. For sure. But I think it was, it was,
and, you know, I'll credit Harold for this. It
was sort of a model of how to deal, if you've
been wronged, how do you deal with it? And I
think forgiving is more important maybe for the
victim than the perpetrator, right? Because you
have to learn to let go of it. The other thing
was, I mean, I think that was maybe the most
covered church service in Mississauga. We had
news. News vans out for that apology service.
And it showed the community what was going on.
And the community rallied around the church in
an incredible way. Hazel did a fundraiser up
at the Delta Hotel and raised money from the
community. People were just showing up with donations.
Other churches that had experienced fires were
sending donations. It was incredibly affirming
just to feel the support of the community. Sure.
That's a big part of how I think we built some
connections into the community at the time while
we didn't have a building. Yeah, yeah. And another
interesting thing is that we had a connection
with St. Andrew's Presbyterian Church down the
street from us. Okay, yes. Where Doug McQuay
was the pastor there. And we were... permitted
to have some services there. They could use it
for weddings or funerals, and we had our annual
lamb dinner there one year. And now we have Doug,
and when Doug retired, he and his wife Liz started
coming to Trinity. And his son, Scott McQuade,
is a drummer and looks after the sound and lighting.
And his wife is Libby McGrath, who is our music
leader and worship leader. So it's amazing to
still have that connection. Lots of family connections,
community connections, all these things. Yeah,
very cool. Yeah. So now we're moving along in
the story towards rebuilding. And we have one
last photo to share of the rebuilding the bell
tower at the church. And you can sort of see
at the bottom there, reopening spring of 2000.
So there's this real new momentum, new process
underway. So what was that rebuilding process
like? How did that get started? What was involved
in that? And there were some limitations before.
So were there still limitations? Well, that was
a really interesting time because we did actually
see an opportunity coming out of the fire in
that before. As you saw, there was the old church
building, the middle hall built in 1930, the
parish hall built in 1962, and a big empty courtyard
in the middle. Right. So we couldn't, because
of some restrictions, we couldn't just, we had
to work within that kind of footprint of the
building. But after the fire and we had a hole
in the ground, well, now we said, okay, now we
can recapture that space because it would be
more economical to just build a big envelope,
which is what we have now, just basically a big
rectangle over the whole space. So we actually
ended up picking up a lot of usable space in
the new configuration. The problem with that
was, and I remember distinctly because we had
a meeting down at St. Andrews and Doug McQuaid
was kind enough to allow us to meet there. And
we were going to present the new plans. And I
talked to the insurance company and, you know,
they said, don't worry, we're going to cover
you for replacement costs. And so we went down
there to unveil the new plans and get everyone
excited about the building. And like literally
hours before the meeting, I got a call from the
insurance company and they said, yeah, so here's
the number you're going to get. I'm going to
say it was something like 500 ,000. I'm like,
no, we need 1 .5 million. And I remember going
into that meeting, just I've never. prayed so
hard in my life as going in front of the congregation
to say, yeah, we can't rebuild right now. And
we sat with that hole in the ground for a full
year while we tried to work out the insurance.
Eventually we did. I'm pleased to report that
we got, my recollection is 1 .8 million by the
time we were done, because when we had to go
through, we actually found other items that were,
you know, should have been covered by insurance.
Sure. So ultimately that all got settled and
that's when we were able to start rebuilding
again. Okay. But it was, it was quite a time.
I'll tell just one other story really quick.
And while this was all happening, Hurricane Mitch
hit in the Honduras. Okay. And it was devastation.
And Dave was head of World Vision at the time
and brought it to the attention of the board
and said, you know, could Trinity do something?
And I know we're doing great things now in Nueva
Frontera, but our first, you know, forage into
Honduras was then. And I remember being in a
board meeting and it came up and we said, okay,
you know, what can the church do to help? help
the victims of the hurricane. And somebody said,
oh, you know what? It's not the time. We're trying
to rebuild the church. We don't have the insurance.
And somebody else on the board said, well, you
know what? These people were hit with a storm
and they're homeless. And we're homeless. We
should understand what they're going through.
And this is the time for us to step up. And we
did. And I was really encouraged at how the church
supported that and reached out. And that became
a big project. We built a computer training center
that hundreds of people were able to get jobs
as a result of that. So there was a lot. And
we built. I think a school, right? A small school
room. We went down and visited in Honduras. Yeah,
there were several trips that went down. So it
was, again, something good. You know, this is
the amazing thing. I mean, you know, God, we
go through terrible things in our life sometimes,
right? It's a tough world. But God can redeem
things in wonderful and unexpected ways. Yeah,
totally. It was great. Diane, when you think
about that rebuilding time, how did you see God
at work? It was certainly a sense of community
working together, supporting one another and
being behind that. And just seeing it all come
together was just amazing. And still new people
were coming to the church, even though we were
meeting over at St. Hazel's. It was still growing.
And so the grand opening that weekend, we had...
big event for the community and tours of the
building and out in the parking lot. And we all
set up with refreshments and stuff and just a
lot of excitement about coming together and how
we were able to reach out to a lot of people.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think like one
of the things that sort of stands out to me in
this whole bringing all the pieces together is
just the way that Trinity was able to be a witness,
a presence in this community of what it means
to go through really hard things, to lose everything
as a church, but to remain faithful. Yeah. We
had the bread and hunting parade. Yeah. Always
a big deal at Trinity. This week's congregation
would sit out. front of the church sure and watch
them watch the parade go by and hazel was always
trooping along in front in front of it and we
had a big banner that we had in the parade that
one year that said rising from the ashes and
a big uh float that we had with a band and people
on it and everything and so it was it was really
a a wonderful witness to the community yeah yeah
Yeah. And yeah, I mean, I also just go back to
that story of bringing this youth into the community
of, yeah, doing the hard work of love in the
midst of the hard stuff of life. So when you
reflect on the past 25 years now that this building
has been open, yeah, what stands out to you?
How have you seen Trinity grow? How have you
seen God at work in the last? 25 or so years.
Do you want to start us off, Wally? Sure. So
I think we've been through our ups and downs.
Time won't permit to describe all of them, but
let's just say there was a bit of a roller coaster.
Certainly moving into the new building was a
high, but there were lows that came along the
way. But I think what I've seen, particularly
in the last few years, is just how God has blessed
the church with... people coming from different
backgrounds, different ages, a lot more young
families and kids that we see. And just the energy
in the community. Trinity has always been, like
throughout the highs and lows, Trinity has always
had this very strong sense of community and just
support for one another. And that's been great.
But I think the energy can kind of wax and wane
over the decades. And I just love the energy
that's in the church now. It's amazing. Yeah,
for sure. I think one of the... most noticeable
things is the the broad ethnic group that we
have represent and people from all over the world
yeah i mean the trinity yeah and that's really
lovely yeah like when i think about our current
congregation there are some folks like yourselves
who have been here for 30 or more years but there
are lots of folks who are very new to this congregation.
Like even myself, I was just saying, you know,
I've been here three or four years, maybe. And
so don't know this long history of God's faithfulness,
this history of Trinity showing up as a space
of love and light, even in the midst of devastation.
Right. And so I think to hear all of this, to
think about, you know, this is who we are. This
is our DNA. Even if we don't, know that that's
our dna that's right like this there's something
about this story that forms us as a community
together um yeah and so i'm really grateful to
both of you for sharing your perspectives on
this to get us thinking about this in a little
bit of a different way yeah So thank you both
so much. Thank you, Kyle. Yeah. And thank you
for tuning in to this week's episode of Trinity
Talks. I'm so grateful for whatever role you
play in our church community, even if it's just
listening to this podcast or if it's coming on
Sunday mornings. Thank you for being part of
this legacy, this story of rebuilding together
and trusting that God will continue to sustain
us into the future. And we will see you again
next week.