WEBVTT 00:00:04.410 --> 00:00:07.129 Hello everyone and welcome to this week's episode 00:00:07.129 --> 00:00:10.890 of Trinity Talks. My name is Kyla and this week 00:00:10.890 --> 00:00:13.410 I am sitting down with a couple of other young 00:00:13.410 --> 00:00:15.669 adults here at Trinity and we're just going to 00:00:15.669 --> 00:00:18.710 talk a little bit about their faith journey and 00:00:18.710 --> 00:00:21.589 specifically how that intersects with their families 00:00:21.589 --> 00:00:23.949 and their cultural background being, you know, 00:00:24.149 --> 00:00:26.670 kids of Chinese immigrants. So I think that'll 00:00:26.670 --> 00:00:29.710 be a really... interesting, really helpful conversation. 00:00:30.149 --> 00:00:32.189 So maybe, can we start over here? Can you just 00:00:32.189 --> 00:00:34.170 introduce yourself a little bit? Yeah. My name 00:00:34.170 --> 00:00:36.789 is Jesse. I've been here at Trinity for about 00:00:36.789 --> 00:00:39.570 like 15 years or so. I run one of the life groups 00:00:39.570 --> 00:00:42.369 for young adults and thanks for having me. Yeah. 00:00:42.490 --> 00:00:46.149 Okay. And what about for you? I'm Melissa. I've 00:00:46.240 --> 00:00:48.939 I only started going to Trinity, I think, just 00:00:48.939 --> 00:00:51.939 like two or three months. But I am also part 00:00:51.939 --> 00:00:55.759 of Jessie's Life Group, and it's just been wonderful 00:00:55.759 --> 00:00:59.140 here. I love it here so much. Good, yeah. So 00:00:59.140 --> 00:01:01.539 maybe we can just start and you can tell us a 00:01:01.539 --> 00:01:05.260 little bit about your family's sort of backgrounds. 00:01:05.659 --> 00:01:08.319 So as I said, you both come from parents who 00:01:08.319 --> 00:01:11.560 are immigrants to Canada from a Chinese background. 00:01:12.200 --> 00:01:14.359 So maybe, yeah, tell us a little bit about that 00:01:14.359 --> 00:01:16.519 story. You want to start Jesse? Yeah, so for 00:01:16.519 --> 00:01:18.579 my parents, they came from Hong Kong. So I'm 00:01:18.579 --> 00:01:20.439 from Hong Kong descent. I was born here in Canada, 00:01:20.459 --> 00:01:22.579 though, in terms of like, I think my parents 00:01:22.579 --> 00:01:25.939 came here in Canada roughly around 19, late 1970s 00:01:25.939 --> 00:01:29.079 or early 1980s. It was like one of the first 00:01:29.079 --> 00:01:32.000 waves I think of Hong Kong expats up before Hong 00:01:32.000 --> 00:01:35.140 Kong was passed over from British rule to communists. 00:01:35.180 --> 00:01:36.299 And so that's probably the reason why they came 00:01:36.299 --> 00:01:39.060 over here. And it's interesting as they actually 00:01:39.060 --> 00:01:41.620 met through church as well. I think it was in 00:01:41.620 --> 00:01:44.340 a church in Peterborough. And yeah, so that's 00:01:44.340 --> 00:01:46.040 kind of like the background for me when it comes 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:48.459 to where my parents from or anything and kind 00:01:48.459 --> 00:01:50.959 of tied to their faith as well. They started 00:01:50.959 --> 00:01:53.980 our family. So they immigrated here sort of separately 00:01:53.980 --> 00:01:56.299 and then met once they were in Canada. Okay, 00:01:56.299 --> 00:01:58.590 cool. And what about for your family, Melissa? 00:01:59.390 --> 00:02:03.390 So my family and I, we immigrated to Canada from 00:02:03.390 --> 00:02:08.490 China when I was two years old, so in 2001. And 00:02:08.490 --> 00:02:12.409 they met in China. We were married in China. 00:02:12.550 --> 00:02:18.469 I was born there. When we came here, my parents 00:02:18.469 --> 00:02:21.949 are not Christian, but they did bring me to a 00:02:21.949 --> 00:02:25.990 Chinese Christian church just to be part of community, 00:02:26.069 --> 00:02:29.050 which is something a lot of people from immigrant 00:02:29.050 --> 00:02:33.729 backgrounds do, because churches are welcoming, 00:02:34.409 --> 00:02:38.370 they don't turn people away, and so that's where 00:02:38.370 --> 00:02:46.219 I was introduced to God. Melissa, you said, you 00:02:46.219 --> 00:02:48.400 know, your parents didn't come from a Christian 00:02:48.400 --> 00:02:50.659 background, but you were introduced through this 00:02:50.659 --> 00:02:52.759 church. So like, what has faith sort of looked 00:02:52.759 --> 00:02:56.960 like in your life? Yeah, it's interesting because 00:02:56.960 --> 00:02:59.699 thankfully I'm very blessed that my parents, 00:02:59.919 --> 00:03:02.599 even though they personally have not given their 00:03:02.599 --> 00:03:06.379 life to Jesus, they are very encouraging and 00:03:06.379 --> 00:03:09.039 accepting of my faith, and I know that's not... 00:03:08.969 --> 00:03:14.909 a story that everyone has. So even though I, 00:03:14.909 --> 00:03:18.090 you know, like I love going to church, I wanted 00:03:18.090 --> 00:03:20.569 to get involved, even when I was baptized, my 00:03:20.569 --> 00:03:23.689 mom and dad were both there. So sometimes it's 00:03:23.689 --> 00:03:25.889 just like, me having to take this step, but I 00:03:25.889 --> 00:03:28.250 have been fortunate in having supportive parents, 00:03:28.270 --> 00:03:31.370 and I fully believe that God will reveal himself 00:03:31.370 --> 00:03:33.669 to them one day, and I'm praying for that. Yeah, 00:03:33.830 --> 00:03:35.949 yeah, for sure. And what about for you, Jesse, 00:03:35.969 --> 00:03:37.729 what has your sort of faith journey with your 00:03:37.729 --> 00:03:40.069 family looked like? It's kind of the, quite the 00:03:40.069 --> 00:03:42.189 opposite, where I'm lucky enough to be born and 00:03:42.189 --> 00:03:44.889 raised in a Christian family, so I guess that 00:03:44.889 --> 00:03:46.349 for both my parents, since they met in church 00:03:46.349 --> 00:03:48.530 and everything, when they did have me and my 00:03:48.530 --> 00:03:51.110 sisters, we were basically raised in the faith, 00:03:51.590 --> 00:03:53.990 especially in regards to, like, kind of the exposure 00:03:53.990 --> 00:03:55.830 in general. So we went to like church every Sunday, 00:03:55.949 --> 00:03:57.710 a lot of stuff when we were exposed to the kids, 00:03:57.889 --> 00:03:59.969 like, you know, Veggie Tales, I think was, most 00:03:59.969 --> 00:04:02.849 kids back in the 90s, how they had Christian 00:04:02.849 --> 00:04:05.729 content kind of provided for them. And then we 00:04:05.729 --> 00:04:07.069 also have like, you know, devotions and other 00:04:07.069 --> 00:04:09.789 stuff. So it's always kind of been a big part 00:04:09.789 --> 00:04:11.909 of the backdrop for me, though, I would say, 00:04:12.090 --> 00:04:13.729 I think with like many people who are born of 00:04:13.729 --> 00:04:15.610 the faith, you do have to actually take your 00:04:15.610 --> 00:04:17.209 time to actually commit yourself to Christ. And 00:04:17.209 --> 00:04:19.290 for me, I don't think I really took my faith 00:04:19.290 --> 00:04:22.990 seriously in terms of having ownership of, you 00:04:22.990 --> 00:04:24.839 know, Moving forward my own faith journey until 00:04:24.839 --> 00:04:26.620 roughly around grade four and five for myself 00:04:26.620 --> 00:04:29.699 So there was some time before I really got to 00:04:29.699 --> 00:04:32.860 that point. Sure. Yeah. Yeah It's it's interesting 00:04:32.860 --> 00:04:34.240 because you're both, you know, you're coming 00:04:34.240 --> 00:04:36.740 from different places But the sort of commonality 00:04:36.740 --> 00:04:38.660 is like that the church provided you with a sense 00:04:38.660 --> 00:04:41.360 of community, right? And especially like you 00:04:41.360 --> 00:04:44.079 said your parents met at at a church, right Jesse? 00:04:44.220 --> 00:04:48.620 So there's that sense of like yeah, like As you 00:04:48.620 --> 00:04:50.839 sort of said really, really nicely Melissa, like 00:04:50.839 --> 00:04:52.660 when immigrants are coming in and looking for 00:04:52.660 --> 00:04:54.879 community, like church is a place that really 00:04:54.879 --> 00:04:59.980 provides that. So yeah, that's really cool. Are 00:04:59.980 --> 00:05:04.480 there ways that you think that your sort of cultural 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:07.779 background has influenced the way that you express 00:05:07.779 --> 00:05:11.600 your faith or the beliefs that you have? Yeah. 00:05:12.240 --> 00:05:16.600 I would say that I I mean I can only speak for 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:19.660 people who are coming from um kind of like a 00:05:19.660 --> 00:05:22.399 Chinese or East Asian background but I believe 00:05:22.399 --> 00:05:25.079 that this sentiment carries across for like all 00:05:25.079 --> 00:05:27.720 Asian Christians which is that when you think 00:05:27.720 --> 00:05:30.439 of someone who's Christian you don't visualize 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:34.500 someone who is a basically someone who's Chinese 00:05:34.500 --> 00:05:36.959 because I think Christianity has been seen as 00:05:36.959 --> 00:05:39.899 more of like a western religion right and I think 00:05:39.899 --> 00:05:42.480 just having kind of like that um idea because 00:05:42.480 --> 00:05:44.720 Christianity it's not a western religion it's 00:05:45.439 --> 00:05:50.279 it's literally not that you know when you say 00:05:50.279 --> 00:05:52.500 I'm Christian and they're like oh but you're 00:05:52.500 --> 00:05:54.600 also Chinese right and it's just like well why 00:05:54.600 --> 00:05:56.319 can't those be the same things and I think it 00:05:56.319 --> 00:05:58.959 is because like people don't associate Chinese 00:05:58.959 --> 00:06:01.100 people with being Christian or people from East 00:06:01.100 --> 00:06:03.120 Asian backgrounds as being Christian and I think 00:06:03.120 --> 00:06:06.019 that sometimes has impacted me where sometimes 00:06:06.019 --> 00:06:09.420 I'm like oh like very young I'm like this is 00:06:09.420 --> 00:06:12.319 something that doesn't go together. Like I think 00:06:12.319 --> 00:06:14.240 it doesn't go together because I'm not seeing 00:06:14.240 --> 00:06:17.360 that on the media or around me, right? But then 00:06:17.360 --> 00:06:20.610 really God was just like... As I grew closer 00:06:20.610 --> 00:06:23.689 to him just realizing that like there's no nationality 00:06:23.689 --> 00:06:25.930 or ethnicity or background associated with Christianity 00:06:25.930 --> 00:06:28.750 Christianity is for every single person Jesus 00:06:28.750 --> 00:06:30.970 died for every single person and I think it's 00:06:30.970 --> 00:06:33.889 important to break down those like Stereotypes 00:06:33.889 --> 00:06:36.430 associated with Christianity because it can be 00:06:36.430 --> 00:06:38.410 a disservice to people who are coming from a 00:06:38.410 --> 00:06:41.449 Chinese background And they might start questioning 00:06:41.449 --> 00:06:44.110 if they can be Christian. It's like you can be 00:06:44.110 --> 00:06:48.009 so I think in that aspect sometimes being Chinese 00:06:48.009 --> 00:06:50.959 might caused a bit of tension when I was younger, 00:06:51.639 --> 00:06:54.160 but God really led me through that. Yeah, yeah, 00:06:54.180 --> 00:06:57.399 for sure. And you said when you sort of first 00:06:57.399 --> 00:07:00.160 came, you were attending a Chinese church, right? 00:07:00.959 --> 00:07:03.279 And so are there ways that like that experience 00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:05.199 is different than being, you know, Trinity is 00:07:05.199 --> 00:07:07.620 not a Chinese church. There are some folks of 00:07:07.620 --> 00:07:10.420 different Asian backgrounds, but it's predominantly 00:07:10.420 --> 00:07:13.319 white, right? Yeah. So how has that been different 00:07:13.319 --> 00:07:17.529 for you? Again, I can only speak for myself. 00:07:18.029 --> 00:07:19.750 It hasn't been too different because I did grow 00:07:19.750 --> 00:07:21.790 up in Mississauga, which is incredibly diverse. 00:07:21.870 --> 00:07:25.250 So I think it's always been something that doesn't 00:07:25.250 --> 00:07:28.829 like if I'm in a space where there's not many 00:07:28.829 --> 00:07:31.050 Chinese people or there are many Chinese people 00:07:31.050 --> 00:07:35.410 I'm like, it's I'm cool with it either way. I 00:07:35.410 --> 00:07:37.870 think it's just I fell in love with Trinity just 00:07:37.870 --> 00:07:40.790 because everyone's so warm and you give back 00:07:40.790 --> 00:07:43.850 to the community. Sure. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. What 00:07:43.850 --> 00:07:45.569 about for you, Jesse? Are there ways that you 00:07:45.569 --> 00:07:47.709 feel like your cultural background, your family 00:07:47.709 --> 00:07:49.629 background has shaped your faith? Yeah, it's 00:07:49.629 --> 00:07:52.329 interesting because for my, compared to Melissa's 00:07:52.329 --> 00:07:54.589 experience, I felt maybe because I, starting 00:07:54.589 --> 00:07:57.430 off even for my first school, it was a Christian 00:07:57.430 --> 00:07:59.350 private school and it was very diverse in that 00:07:59.350 --> 00:08:01.509 one too. So I didn't quite have the same experience 00:08:01.509 --> 00:08:03.930 in terms of like coming to grips with it, seeing 00:08:03.930 --> 00:08:06.170 as like a Western religion. I felt like it was 00:08:06.170 --> 00:08:09.079 quite broad when it came to. ethnicity because 00:08:09.079 --> 00:08:11.699 there's so many people in my school that... they're 00:08:11.699 --> 00:08:13.220 black, they're Chinese, they're white, it doesn't 00:08:13.220 --> 00:08:16.100 matter. But I feel like in terms of my actual 00:08:16.100 --> 00:08:18.860 Chinese background, the funny part is that for 00:08:18.860 --> 00:08:21.399 most first generation Chinese immigrants, I'd 00:08:21.399 --> 00:08:24.500 be considered a banana. So yellow on the outside, 00:08:24.620 --> 00:08:26.680 white on the inside. I definitely have some aspects 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:28.500 of that. But I think one of the things I did 00:08:28.500 --> 00:08:31.660 inherit culturally speaking was kind of the, 00:08:32.059 --> 00:08:33.899 and this kind of ties into a lot of East Asian 00:08:33.899 --> 00:08:35.460 cultures as well, that deference to authority, 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:37.279 especially regarding your elders and family. 00:08:37.620 --> 00:08:39.779 And so that's one thing that me and my younger 00:08:39.779 --> 00:08:42.340 sister, always found weird when it came to when 00:08:42.340 --> 00:08:43.919 we heard people's struggles like, oh, you know, 00:08:43.919 --> 00:08:45.639 sometimes I feel like I want to like blame God 00:08:45.639 --> 00:08:47.000 for stuff, especially like, let's say things 00:08:47.000 --> 00:08:49.080 bad happen or things don't pan out the way you 00:08:49.080 --> 00:08:51.679 want it. And from our perspective, it's like 00:08:51.679 --> 00:08:54.159 you never blame the person who's like on top 00:08:54.159 --> 00:08:55.720 almost. You always say like, oh, it must be something 00:08:55.720 --> 00:08:57.919 wrong with me. Right. So me and my sister always 00:08:57.919 --> 00:08:59.659 feel like, oh, like we never blame God if something 00:08:59.659 --> 00:09:01.100 went wrong or we were unhappy with something 00:09:01.100 --> 00:09:02.639 that happened or he didn't necessarily answer 00:09:02.639 --> 00:09:03.879 our prayers. We're like, oh, maybe something 00:09:03.879 --> 00:09:06.120 about maybe I'm not worthy enough or maybe God's 00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:08.879 punishing me because I'm sinful, which is like 00:09:08.879 --> 00:09:10.460 a double It's good in the sense that you never 00:09:10.460 --> 00:09:12.779 really, so any case where, you know, something 00:09:12.779 --> 00:09:14.720 go my way and undermine my faith in God, but 00:09:14.720 --> 00:09:16.600 it was also not a healthy mindset in the sense 00:09:16.600 --> 00:09:19.080 that it could lead to like potential self -pity 00:09:19.080 --> 00:09:21.340 or loathing. And that was something I had to 00:09:21.340 --> 00:09:23.980 kind of like navigate myself through early on 00:09:23.980 --> 00:09:25.519 in my faith journey before I came to realize 00:09:25.519 --> 00:09:27.179 that's not really the way to think about it. 00:09:27.200 --> 00:09:29.159 But that was kind of the default based on kind 00:09:29.159 --> 00:09:30.960 of the Chinese cultural backgrounds raised with 00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:34.259 my parents. Yeah, yeah. That's really interesting 00:09:34.259 --> 00:09:38.360 to think about. Yeah, how those those power dynamics 00:09:38.360 --> 00:09:41.480 play a role right in in our faith and I think 00:09:41.480 --> 00:09:47.139 Yeah, just so interesting even I think that like 00:09:47.139 --> 00:09:51.960 for folks like myself who sort of grew up because 00:09:51.960 --> 00:09:54.700 I grew up in rural Nova Scotia We're like, yeah 00:09:54.700 --> 00:09:56.940 everybody not everybody but most people looked 00:09:56.940 --> 00:10:00.159 like me and we all sort of had the it was rather 00:10:00.159 --> 00:10:02.379 homogenous in a lot of senses, right? So we always 00:10:02.379 --> 00:10:05.200 sort of I never really had to stop and reflect 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:07.639 on like, how does my culture influence my faith 00:10:07.639 --> 00:10:09.779 because they just like, everybody was doing the 00:10:09.779 --> 00:10:12.879 same thing, right? Yeah, so then to think about, 00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:17.100 oh, like this is how, yeah, our cultural perspectives 00:10:17.100 --> 00:10:20.440 really do make a difference in like, how we understand 00:10:20.440 --> 00:10:25.320 God and how we experience faith. Yeah. Are there 00:10:25.320 --> 00:10:29.519 other beliefs or other sort of practices that 00:10:29.519 --> 00:10:31.600 sort of stand out to you in terms of, you know, 00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:35.470 how you think about your faith? Honestly, like 00:10:35.470 --> 00:10:38.230 I feel like some aspects of it's like for example 00:10:38.230 --> 00:10:40.809 like the holidays okay so like it's interesting 00:10:40.809 --> 00:10:42.049 because like for times New Year usually it's 00:10:42.049 --> 00:10:44.350 more you know within those like the zodiac stuff 00:10:44.350 --> 00:10:46.409 and everything sure but if anything it's funny 00:10:46.409 --> 00:10:48.980 because for our family we kind of use it as another 00:10:48.980 --> 00:10:51.379 excuse to thank God for stuff. So it's almost 00:10:51.379 --> 00:10:53.879 like another Thanksgiving, but Chinese -oriented. 00:10:54.039 --> 00:10:57.440 So we shift a little bit away from maybe the 00:10:57.440 --> 00:11:00.659 more Chinese -focused myths towards just using 00:11:00.659 --> 00:11:02.720 that more of a reason to praise God instead. 00:11:02.940 --> 00:11:06.360 So there's cases like that where we almost Christianize 00:11:06.360 --> 00:11:10.320 parts of the Chinese cultural offense that we 00:11:10.320 --> 00:11:13.080 have. Not to say we ignore it entirely, but obviously 00:11:13.080 --> 00:11:15.440 that's more of a focus rather than necessarily 00:11:15.440 --> 00:11:17.100 some of the more traditional aspects that we 00:11:17.100 --> 00:11:19.940 still It's mainly the food for us and the reason 00:11:19.940 --> 00:11:23.019 to come together as family and then celebrate 00:11:23.019 --> 00:11:25.039 God for what He's given us as well. So I think 00:11:25.039 --> 00:11:26.840 that's one example, I think, off the top of my 00:11:26.840 --> 00:11:29.940 head. Yeah, yeah. I would say, so, you know, 00:11:29.940 --> 00:11:32.759 my family, we do celebrate Chinese New Year as 00:11:32.759 --> 00:11:36.320 well. We celebrate the Mid -Autumn Festival and 00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:39.519 that's just food. We just kind of eat it. In 00:11:39.519 --> 00:11:42.100 terms of kind of like the more traditional aspects 00:11:42.100 --> 00:11:44.059 and like, you know, the reasons, like you said, 00:11:44.179 --> 00:11:48.220 the zodiac or like the moon. Myself and my parents 00:11:48.220 --> 00:11:50.820 and I we don't really know too much about that 00:11:50.820 --> 00:11:53.100 It's not something that they really taught me 00:11:53.100 --> 00:11:55.600 when we came to Canada So it is like I have a 00:11:55.600 --> 00:11:57.539 lot more knowledge about like Canadian holidays 00:11:57.539 --> 00:12:00.259 than I do about Chinese holidays But I think 00:12:00.259 --> 00:12:02.679 it's important that you know, whether you're 00:12:02.679 --> 00:12:05.279 coming from a Chinese background or from any 00:12:05.279 --> 00:12:08.320 background That's not Eurocentric and you're 00:12:08.320 --> 00:12:12.049 celebrating holidays that are not Canadian holidays, 00:12:12.309 --> 00:12:14.529 you can still include God in that. You know, 00:12:14.610 --> 00:12:17.289 it's like if we're celebrating a new year according 00:12:17.289 --> 00:12:19.450 to this other calendar, like you said, like still 00:12:19.450 --> 00:12:21.990 give thanks to God for a new year. Thank God 00:12:21.990 --> 00:12:24.230 for the food, for the community, for the people. 00:12:25.029 --> 00:12:29.289 I think just really just keeping God at the center 00:12:29.289 --> 00:12:31.570 of everything you're doing and just also being 00:12:31.570 --> 00:12:33.730 mindful too that maybe there's some things you're 00:12:33.730 --> 00:12:35.710 not fully comfortable with and that's okay. You 00:12:35.710 --> 00:12:37.970 can just say no to that. Yeah, yeah, for sure, 00:12:38.049 --> 00:12:42.049 for sure. And I know, so you mentioned your parents 00:12:42.049 --> 00:12:45.889 came from Hong Kong. And is your family from 00:12:45.889 --> 00:12:48.929 mainland China? Yeah, okay. So Jesse, you were 00:12:48.929 --> 00:12:50.789 mentioning to me before, like in your family, 00:12:51.090 --> 00:12:54.090 you speak Mandarin? Cantonese. Oh, Cantonese. 00:12:54.389 --> 00:12:56.409 And your family speaks Mandarin. Yeah. Okay. 00:12:56.730 --> 00:13:00.769 So are there ways that you think that your language 00:13:00.769 --> 00:13:03.169 background has sort of influenced your faith? 00:13:03.610 --> 00:13:06.559 I mean, I know If you've been attending, you 00:13:06.559 --> 00:13:08.559 know, English -speaking churches, that might 00:13:08.559 --> 00:13:10.399 not be as much of a thing, but I know sometimes 00:13:10.399 --> 00:13:12.919 when I go and visit people in other countries, 00:13:13.620 --> 00:13:16.840 like, the way that they think about God is different 00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:19.200 because of the language that they use to think 00:13:19.200 --> 00:13:21.799 about God. So are there ways that that is also 00:13:21.799 --> 00:13:26.120 true for you guys? I would say personally for 00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:30.149 me, because I have... I grew up more English 00:13:30.149 --> 00:13:33.230 speaking than I am Mandarin. That is the language 00:13:33.230 --> 00:13:36.090 I feel more comfortable listening to sermons 00:13:36.090 --> 00:13:41.509 in that I don't really know if it might be different 00:13:41.509 --> 00:13:44.149 if someone were saying a sermon in Mandarin or 00:13:44.149 --> 00:13:45.850 Cantonese. Maybe that's something my parents 00:13:45.850 --> 00:13:47.889 can speak on since they're more fluent in that 00:13:47.889 --> 00:13:52.139 language. I would say that Something that's interesting 00:13:52.139 --> 00:13:54.399 is you know even the Bible itself. It wasn't 00:13:54.399 --> 00:13:57.659 originally written in English, right? Yeah, and 00:13:57.659 --> 00:14:00.100 but by being translated to English some of the 00:14:00.100 --> 00:14:05.240 words did lose the nuances and complexities that 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:08.980 the words had and maybe Hebrew or Greek or Aramaic 00:14:08.980 --> 00:14:11.740 and so I sometimes wonder you know because there 00:14:11.740 --> 00:14:15.179 are some words in Mandarin that You just don't 00:14:15.179 --> 00:14:17.320 have words for an English right that I wonder 00:14:17.320 --> 00:14:20.789 if it may be a translate it could translate closer 00:14:20.789 --> 00:14:24.429 to the original text of the Bible if it is a 00:14:24.429 --> 00:14:26.970 Mandarin or maybe it's a little bit different 00:14:26.970 --> 00:14:28.610 and you have to look at it through more of a 00:14:28.610 --> 00:14:31.990 Chinese context. So I think that's something 00:14:31.990 --> 00:14:35.129 that I think I would love to experience if I 00:14:35.129 --> 00:14:39.370 were to grow my Mandarin speaking skills. I think 00:14:39.370 --> 00:14:41.629 I'm going to send a spot to Melissa because there's 00:14:41.629 --> 00:14:43.789 a reason why I set up Medana. So that functionally 00:14:43.789 --> 00:14:45.389 also means that I'm almost like a literate when 00:14:45.389 --> 00:14:47.269 it comes to Cantonese sometimes. So a lot of 00:14:47.269 --> 00:14:49.370 my information comes from my dad who's actually 00:14:49.370 --> 00:14:51.529 fluent in everything. And so it's interesting 00:14:51.529 --> 00:14:53.190 because sometimes he tells me like the literal 00:14:53.190 --> 00:14:55.350 translations, for example, when we call God in 00:14:55.350 --> 00:14:57.629 Cantonese, it's tin foo, which is basically like 00:14:57.629 --> 00:15:00.769 sky God. But then it's interesting because then 00:15:00.769 --> 00:15:04.340 they also when they say, like, for Jesus, it's, 00:15:04.340 --> 00:15:06.080 uh, yeah, so, which is like, I think, sort of, 00:15:06.080 --> 00:15:08.399 sort of, like, be similar to, like, Yeshua, like, 00:15:08.460 --> 00:15:10.299 just, like, closer to the original, uh, I think, 00:15:10.299 --> 00:15:12.620 like, Jewish Aramaic that they would use to, 00:15:12.620 --> 00:15:15.139 like, say Jesus' name. So, it's interesting seeing 00:15:15.139 --> 00:15:16.539 different parts where, like, it's literal, just 00:15:16.539 --> 00:15:18.320 like, okay, we're just gonna use, like, Chinese 00:15:18.320 --> 00:15:19.639 words for this, and then other ones where, like, 00:15:19.659 --> 00:15:22.419 they try to, kind of, like, um, anglicize it 00:15:22.419 --> 00:15:25.200 in the way they actually say the name. So, again, 00:15:25.259 --> 00:15:26.679 I don't know about, like, the content, so I'd 00:15:26.679 --> 00:15:29.230 definitely ask more on that, but... The only 00:15:29.230 --> 00:15:31.029 thing I can kind of bring up with, and this is 00:15:31.029 --> 00:15:33.169 the weird tidbit, that's funny because I think 00:15:33.169 --> 00:15:35.190 this is less to do with the language itself and 00:15:35.190 --> 00:15:39.610 probably the context of when I guess Christian 00:15:39.610 --> 00:15:41.169 is viewed through a different lens. This is a 00:15:41.169 --> 00:15:42.590 little bit different because this is obviously 00:15:42.590 --> 00:15:45.480 tinged by. the communist version on the mainland. 00:15:46.360 --> 00:15:48.919 But like I know that they rewrite parts of the 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:50.580 Bible that didn't actually happen through there. 00:15:50.659 --> 00:15:52.240 Right. But those are like the state -sponsored 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:53.539 ones, not the underground churches I would I 00:15:53.539 --> 00:15:54.679 think are legitimate. So just to give you an 00:15:54.679 --> 00:15:56.460 example, this is a really bad one. This is one 00:15:56.460 --> 00:15:58.000 that came up because I took an East Asian course 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:00.679 and they talked about the Bible there. There's 00:16:00.679 --> 00:16:03.980 you know the part where you know they were going 00:16:03.980 --> 00:16:06.419 to stone the woman for I think being like a prostitute 00:16:06.419 --> 00:16:08.799 or whatever. Oh yeah for adultery. So let he 00:16:08.799 --> 00:16:10.820 who casts, let he without sin cast for stone. 00:16:11.019 --> 00:16:15.159 Right. And so It's funny for that one because 00:16:15.159 --> 00:16:18.519 I think they changed it to say like They actually 00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:20.700 ended up stoning her instead and just like oh 00:16:20.700 --> 00:16:22.460 and they tried flaming her in the context of 00:16:22.460 --> 00:16:24.179 like Oh, no one's perfect. So you can do it. 00:16:24.179 --> 00:16:26.500 You can you can just do it. Anyways, I was like, 00:16:26.500 --> 00:16:28.299 oh that's wrong. That's that's very That's very 00:16:28.299 --> 00:16:31.179 bad. I know I know it was just interesting like 00:16:31.179 --> 00:16:34.779 wow, okay, they taste a lot. Yeah. Yeah interesting 00:16:34.779 --> 00:16:42.639 Yes Well, okay. Yeah so you're obviously, folks 00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:44.519 coming from Chinese backgrounds, but you're also 00:16:44.519 --> 00:16:46.779 young adults hanging out here in our church. 00:16:47.740 --> 00:16:51.960 And so I think sometimes that also creates differences 00:16:51.960 --> 00:16:54.799 in the way that we experience our faith versus, 00:16:54.799 --> 00:16:57.899 you know, kids, obviously, or versus, you know, 00:16:58.139 --> 00:17:00.460 older adults. So what do you think, like, how 00:17:00.460 --> 00:17:04.119 has your experience at this age being in this 00:17:04.119 --> 00:17:06.519 sort of community, how has that shaped your faith? 00:17:06.740 --> 00:17:08.460 Because when I was younger and I was reading 00:17:08.460 --> 00:17:11.480 the Bible, I'll be honest, like, I was in high 00:17:11.480 --> 00:17:14.019 school, like middle school, reading KJV and I 00:17:14.019 --> 00:17:15.880 was like, I don't know what's happening, but 00:17:15.880 --> 00:17:19.240 I'm just gonna keep reading. I'm like, I don't 00:17:19.240 --> 00:17:23.099 know what's happening. But I think now that, 00:17:23.319 --> 00:17:25.099 and so when I was younger, a lot of times, like 00:17:25.099 --> 00:17:27.599 following God, it did feel a little bit like, 00:17:27.599 --> 00:17:29.960 like Jesse said, like I had to or I was gonna 00:17:29.960 --> 00:17:33.039 be punished. And I think I was looking at through 00:17:33.039 --> 00:17:36.259 a lens where I didn't have a lot of, you know, 00:17:36.500 --> 00:17:40.140 adults that were kind of guiding me. So I was 00:17:40.140 --> 00:17:41.720 just trying to understand it myself, but now 00:17:41.720 --> 00:17:43.900 being an adult and I know that there's versions 00:17:43.900 --> 00:17:46.900 other than the KJV and I can read and I can learn. 00:17:47.559 --> 00:17:49.980 It's like, I feel really, really grateful to 00:17:49.980 --> 00:17:52.240 be in this place where I know more about who 00:17:52.240 --> 00:17:55.980 God is and I see his love all around me. And 00:17:55.980 --> 00:17:57.960 I think that's something that, you know, how 00:17:57.960 --> 00:18:00.220 you understand God in the Bible when you're younger 00:18:00.220 --> 00:18:01.960 is different than how you understand God in the 00:18:01.960 --> 00:18:04.339 Bible when you're older. I think I've understood 00:18:04.339 --> 00:18:08.859 more about God's love now that I'm older. understand 00:18:08.859 --> 00:18:13.240 that I also can be a light for other people, 00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:17.099 that Jesus can work through me for other people. 00:18:17.339 --> 00:18:19.160 When I was younger, I didn't really see that. 00:18:19.259 --> 00:18:22.900 I think I didn't feel like as a kid I could. 00:18:23.180 --> 00:18:25.940 Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. What about for you, Jesse? 00:18:26.180 --> 00:18:28.599 Yeah, no, I think a big part of the kind of being 00:18:28.599 --> 00:18:31.440 in a... in your faith journey as a young adult 00:18:31.440 --> 00:18:33.319 compared to maybe when you're younger. I feel 00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:35.640 like it's a lot more communal now because everyone's 00:18:35.640 --> 00:18:37.819 kind of roughly at that life step where you can 00:18:37.819 --> 00:18:40.259 you have all had these experiences and everyone 00:18:40.259 --> 00:18:41.759 has different parts of their faith journey but 00:18:41.759 --> 00:18:43.539 everyone's really open to kind of sharing and 00:18:43.539 --> 00:18:44.980 supporting one another. I feel like obviously 00:18:44.980 --> 00:18:46.980 when you're like going through Sunday school 00:18:46.980 --> 00:18:49.000 or you know other stuff you're kind of just going 00:18:49.000 --> 00:18:50.660 in there for like the Sunday and you just don't 00:18:50.660 --> 00:18:52.079 really see each other outside of that. I know 00:18:52.079 --> 00:18:54.039 youth group also exists but I feel like it's 00:18:54.039 --> 00:18:55.619 quite different once you're actually you know, 00:18:55.859 --> 00:18:58.359 actually you're intentionally meeting every week 00:18:58.359 --> 00:19:00.680 when you have a work life and you have all this 00:19:00.680 --> 00:19:02.420 other stuff happening and you're actually setting 00:19:02.420 --> 00:19:05.259 aside and everyone kind of knows, you know, how 00:19:05.259 --> 00:19:08.180 life is. And I think we're also a lot more open 00:19:08.180 --> 00:19:10.059 to saying like, hey, we need help with this or 00:19:10.059 --> 00:19:12.339 we can actually have deeper discussions. That's 00:19:12.339 --> 00:19:15.099 kind of facilitated by us more so than the church 00:19:15.099 --> 00:19:16.720 itself. Like obviously we're still meeting within 00:19:16.720 --> 00:19:18.880 the church and we're part of the community. But 00:19:18.880 --> 00:19:21.339 I think that makes a big difference to really 00:19:21.559 --> 00:19:23.359 you know, grow in your faith alongside other 00:19:23.359 --> 00:19:26.099 people. Mm hmm. Yeah. And it's that aspect of 00:19:26.099 --> 00:19:29.240 like chosen community versus like youth group 00:19:29.240 --> 00:19:31.099 is like great. And you like get all of these 00:19:31.099 --> 00:19:33.400 different people together. But when you're still 00:19:33.400 --> 00:19:36.920 living under your parents, like. rules and house. 00:19:37.279 --> 00:19:38.680 Like it's like, okay, I'm going to go because 00:19:38.680 --> 00:19:40.279 like somebody's forcing me to go. Yeah. It's 00:19:40.279 --> 00:19:42.180 like, it's kind of like facilitated for you, 00:19:42.240 --> 00:19:43.759 right? But this was like, again, like I think 00:19:43.759 --> 00:19:46.519 that found aspect of that group and choosing 00:19:46.519 --> 00:19:48.259 to be part of that community and building it 00:19:48.259 --> 00:19:50.160 with your own. It's, it's a lot more, I think 00:19:50.160 --> 00:19:52.339 intimate because of that. Cause you can see the 00:19:52.339 --> 00:19:54.299 different parts of the group that you've contributed. 00:19:55.039 --> 00:19:57.940 Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And I mean like for you 00:19:57.940 --> 00:20:00.720 too, Melissa, like, you know, you, you don't 00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:02.940 have a family that's like pressuring you into 00:20:02.940 --> 00:20:05.779 church, right? And so you are, yeah. You're choosing 00:20:05.779 --> 00:20:09.980 that community. Yeah, if anything, it's if you 00:20:09.980 --> 00:20:11.799 guys meet my mom, it's more so me being like, 00:20:11.799 --> 00:20:13.559 mom, let's go to church. Let's go to church. 00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:17.539 Right. And I think that's something that, you 00:20:17.539 --> 00:20:20.279 know, not even just for people who are coming 00:20:20.279 --> 00:20:22.480 from a non -Christian family, even just anyone 00:20:22.480 --> 00:20:25.759 coming from any Christian family that even, you 00:20:25.759 --> 00:20:28.500 know, when you're younger, the understanding 00:20:28.500 --> 00:20:30.599 that you have about God and actually having that 00:20:30.599 --> 00:20:33.759 relationship with Jesus is something that I think 00:20:34.079 --> 00:20:36.859 you can make that decision multiple times in 00:20:36.859 --> 00:20:40.839 your life and ultimately like dedicate yourself 00:20:40.839 --> 00:20:43.460 to Jesus whether you're a kid or adult but I 00:20:43.460 --> 00:20:45.819 definitely think that you know when you are in 00:20:45.819 --> 00:20:49.079 a community of like -minded people it just it 00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:51.599 kind of like for me it kind of reaffirmed that 00:20:51.599 --> 00:20:54.019 like yeah like I don't have to go through this 00:20:54.019 --> 00:20:57.119 alone I can be around other people and not only 00:20:57.119 --> 00:20:59.339 that I can also be alive for other people that 00:20:59.339 --> 00:21:04.839 they could maybe They're like, oh, okay now I 00:21:04.839 --> 00:21:07.220 want to come to church and they learn about Jesus. 00:21:07.660 --> 00:21:12.519 Yeah Yeah, and to get to do that in a community 00:21:12.519 --> 00:21:15.819 of people like we So I'm also in this life group 00:21:15.819 --> 00:21:19.680 that the two of you are in. Yeah. So to get to 00:21:19.680 --> 00:21:23.279 do that in a community of people who have some 00:21:23.279 --> 00:21:26.440 similarities. We're all in similar life stages 00:21:26.440 --> 00:21:29.220 and have some similar experiences, but also are 00:21:29.220 --> 00:21:34.259 so diverse. People diverse ethnically, diverse 00:21:34.259 --> 00:21:37.160 in terms of work and schooling background and 00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:40.000 all of these things. Yeah, I think it really 00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:43.819 enriches our faith. Right? It gives us this space 00:21:43.819 --> 00:21:47.380 where we get to figure it out together and we 00:21:47.380 --> 00:21:49.960 get to like learn from each other. Right? And 00:21:49.960 --> 00:21:51.779 see like, oh, like I never would have thought 00:21:51.779 --> 00:21:54.700 about it that way. Or like, you know, this this 00:21:54.700 --> 00:21:56.680 experience that you're bringing in like helps 00:21:56.680 --> 00:22:00.599 to illuminate the scripture in a new way. Yeah, 00:22:01.319 --> 00:22:05.079 I agree. And I think, you know, Again, I can 00:22:05.079 --> 00:22:07.420 only speak for myself, but when I was younger, 00:22:08.220 --> 00:22:12.480 I saw Christianity kind of like in a one -size 00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:14.819 -fits -all kind of thing. But now that I've grown 00:22:14.819 --> 00:22:17.099 and even just being in Life Group and being in 00:22:17.099 --> 00:22:20.339 Trinity, just understanding that you can come 00:22:20.339 --> 00:22:22.339 from so many different backgrounds, but what 00:22:22.339 --> 00:22:24.799 connects us all is just Jesus. It's Jesus, right? 00:22:25.339 --> 00:22:28.759 And it's like you don't have to be like another 00:22:28.759 --> 00:22:34.059 person to call yourself a Christian. Yeah, I'm 00:22:34.059 --> 00:22:38.279 grateful to learn that. Yeah, super cool. I think 00:22:38.279 --> 00:22:41.180 this has been a really sort of helpful way for 00:22:41.180 --> 00:22:43.400 us to start to understand. what it looks like 00:22:43.400 --> 00:22:47.319 to bring our whole selves into our faith, right? 00:22:48.039 --> 00:22:50.400 You know, you reflected Melissa on this point 00:22:50.400 --> 00:22:53.339 that like, you know, at one point maybe you thought 00:22:53.339 --> 00:22:56.279 like, oh, Christianity isn't for someone like 00:22:56.279 --> 00:22:58.539 me, someone who looks like me or has my background. 00:22:59.319 --> 00:23:02.039 But you found a home in it, right? And that's 00:23:02.039 --> 00:23:06.440 really beautiful. And something I just like love. 00:23:06.619 --> 00:23:08.839 like learning about, I just love learning about 00:23:08.839 --> 00:23:11.700 history and just learning about how the church 00:23:11.700 --> 00:23:15.180 spread and the missionaries and, you know, not 00:23:15.180 --> 00:23:17.420 even just like for China, even just like for 00:23:17.420 --> 00:23:20.940 like other countries as well. This, I think someone 00:23:20.940 --> 00:23:23.460 might need a fact check me, but I believe it 00:23:23.460 --> 00:23:26.480 was Saint Thomas, doubting Thomas, who actually 00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:29.000 brought the gospel to India, you know, and that 00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:31.420 was something I didn't know because I just automatically 00:23:31.420 --> 00:23:34.920 assumed like, oh, it just went to North America, 00:23:34.960 --> 00:23:37.940 but no there's such a rich deep history of Christianity 00:23:37.940 --> 00:23:41.319 all over the world and there's Christians literally 00:23:41.319 --> 00:23:45.880 in every single country. There's you know Christians 00:23:45.880 --> 00:23:47.960 who are being persecuted for their faith, who 00:23:47.960 --> 00:23:51.180 are dying for their faith, who have to like are 00:23:51.180 --> 00:23:52.819 imprisoned for their faith or have to kind of 00:23:52.819 --> 00:23:56.519 like hide it so that they aren't you know imprisoned 00:23:56.519 --> 00:24:01.160 or killed and I think it's just like if anyone 00:24:01.160 --> 00:24:03.960 who Maybe it's from a Chinese background from 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:06.880 a background that's different than what they've 00:24:06.880 --> 00:24:08.759 seen in the media when it comes to Christianity 00:24:08.759 --> 00:24:11.160 I just want to say like explore that because 00:24:11.160 --> 00:24:13.700 like Christianity is for you, you know Jesus 00:24:13.700 --> 00:24:18.640 is for you And ultimately it's God's will that 00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:21.819 not oh my gosh I don't want to say the scripture 00:24:21.819 --> 00:24:25.420 the verse wrong, but it's like God he Doesn't 00:24:25.420 --> 00:24:27.940 intend for any of his children to be to be lost. 00:24:28.019 --> 00:24:31.539 Yeah. Yeah, so I think it's just Christianity 00:24:31.539 --> 00:24:33.079 is for you. It doesn't matter where you're coming 00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:36.380 from. Yeah, and as you were talking about, you 00:24:36.380 --> 00:24:38.700 know, Thomas or whoever it was that brought the 00:24:38.700 --> 00:24:42.900 gospel like to India, I was thinking like Christianity 00:24:42.900 --> 00:24:45.579 never started in North America. Christianity 00:24:45.579 --> 00:24:47.700 didn't even start in like Great Britain or something. 00:24:47.700 --> 00:24:51.400 It started in the Middle East, right? I mean 00:24:51.400 --> 00:24:53.720 like Christianity was in Africa before it went 00:24:53.720 --> 00:24:56.859 anywhere else, right? And the Ethiopian Bible 00:24:56.859 --> 00:25:00.079 is older than the KJV Bible, you know, so I think 00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:04.140 that when we perpetuate, you know, I think people 00:25:04.140 --> 00:25:06.720 maintain the stereotype that Christianity, again, 00:25:06.779 --> 00:25:10.519 is a Western religion. But I think it's important 00:25:10.519 --> 00:25:12.220 to break that down because if we don't break 00:25:12.220 --> 00:25:14.559 that down, it can make a lot of people feel like 00:25:14.559 --> 00:25:16.759 Christianity isn't for them and then the meaning 00:25:16.759 --> 00:25:18.880 of the gospel gets lost, right? Because Jesus 00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:21.319 died for all of us. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. 00:25:21.559 --> 00:25:25.579 100%. Yeah. Yeah, oh, that's so good. Yeah, no, 00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:30.160 it's so great to just recognize that Jesus was 00:25:30.460 --> 00:25:34.720 for everybody, right? Jesus was not just a one 00:25:34.720 --> 00:25:37.599 dude looking for everybody to be exactly like 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:41.079 Jesus. I mean, yes, like Jesus, but not like 00:25:41.079 --> 00:25:44.200 Jesus in ethnicity or language or any of those 00:25:44.200 --> 00:25:46.759 like superficial labels. Yeah, there's not a 00:25:46.759 --> 00:25:48.240 cookie cutter approach when it comes to it. And 00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:51.700 so you can come as you are to Jesus where you're 00:25:51.700 --> 00:25:53.440 at. And I think that's the biggest part is that 00:25:53.440 --> 00:25:55.299 it doesn't matter what stage of life you're in. 00:25:55.920 --> 00:25:58.019 God is always open there for you, right? Yeah, 00:25:58.579 --> 00:26:01.000 yeah. So good. Yeah, well, thank you both very 00:26:01.000 --> 00:26:03.180 much. This has been a really good conversation. 00:26:04.140 --> 00:26:06.460 And thank you for tuning in to this week's episode 00:26:06.460 --> 00:26:09.059 of Trinity Talks. I hope that you have also been 00:26:09.059 --> 00:26:11.460 able to find some hope and some encouragement 00:26:11.460 --> 00:26:14.539 to figure out what Jesus looks like for you and 00:26:14.539 --> 00:26:18.359 how you are also called to be part of this beautiful, 00:26:18.519 --> 00:26:20.839 diverse family. And we'll see you next week.