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This is the Things We Do podcast, a podcast about film, life, television, culture, mental

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health and all of that fun jazzy stuff.

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Today I've got my special guest and friend Madison Heinze.

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Hello.

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Oh, hi.

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How are you going?

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Good.

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How are you?

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Very well.

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That was very smooth transition.

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I had to think, it was a whole thought process.

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Yeah.

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I was like, I'm going to get the Z right at the end because I could have just stopped

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at Heinz.

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I know.

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It's so true.

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You think of the baked beans and you're like, yeah, that's what it is, but no, it's got

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an E on the end.

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It's got an E on the end.

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Is it German or is it-

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It is German, yes.

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Yes.

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You've got the German last name.

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Yes, correct.

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Yes.

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So yeah, I originated from the Barossa Valley in South Australia.

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So that's German territory traditionally.

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So yeah, it's-

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What did the Germans colonize that section of Australia?

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They were just like settled there.

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I was like, why is it German territory there?

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Well, I don't think it's like, it's not necessarily like German territory in terms of strictly

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Germans only, but it's more that primarily a lot of the families there are German families.

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Yeah, a lot of them.

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So a lot of the last names are very, very, you know, common German last names.

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Yeah.

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So it's very kind of like centralized.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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Interesting.

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Yeah.

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Cause I know my last name is German.

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Seewald is actually a very German name.

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And yeah, but our family originated from Scotland and England.

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So I don't know how we ended up with a German last name, but I guess it came from somewhere.

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I guess.

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Cause yeah, we did enough research into the history of my dad, courtesy of him.

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Yeah.

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Found out that the name was originated from German and it was called originally, if you

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pronounce it in German, I think it's Tybald.

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Oh, right.

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Cause you don't do the TH like the, it's just to, and yeah, it's, it's very bizarre.

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Whereas like everything else is very Anglo-Saxon, like English in my name, which is Mun and

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then Grokoly.

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Yeah.

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And I don't know, it's very like, um, I don't, it sounds so regal as well, especially when

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there's current climate with names and we just lost the Queen.

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Yes.

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I know.

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Um, I was on the phone to my parents the other day.

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It was like one of those conversations.

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And I think, cause we're not a Royalist family.

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Yeah.

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Neither am I.

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Um, but I remember mum and dad were just like, it is kind of sad for us because our relation

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to like Prince Philip and the Queen has been our entire lives, they're in their sixties

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now and it's like, that's an understanding because they've known nothing else like, except

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for, you know, post-war, like fifties, sixties, kind of seventies and eighties, like era where

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you still were kind of feeling the ramifications of World War II and World War I.

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And then suddenly to now.

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So yeah.

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And then suddenly we lose Queen and Prince Philip, who was, you know, both weren't perfect

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people.

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They were quite racist and problematic.

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And also if anyone wants to do research and how much taxpayer dollars go into the Royals,

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it's a lot.

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Um, it's so much money.

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There's like, I think this funeral is costing England alone, like so much money.

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It's like millions to like, it's so enormous because it's like, you've got poverty issues.

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Yeah.

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Of course.

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But then you've got people who sit in a castle and, and have a, and we treat them like gods.

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We like the, you know, the problem is the Brits treat them like gods.

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So you've got this downside of it where it's like, it is patriotism.

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It is like, and the same with America, but we don't have that in Australia.

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Like we don't have that level of, well, at least I don't feel like we do have that level

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of patriotism.

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Um, because you know, we, we've very much a remote Island.

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We're very much like New Zealand.

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We don't, our closest connection is New Zealand.

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Like realistically, we've got Australia and then we've got New Zealand.

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So we kind of feel more affiliation to them than we probably do to our, you know, original

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country.

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Correct.

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Yeah.

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And, um, and it was a way kind of like had this debate all the time, which is like, um,

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something which is we are on technically stolen land.

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We were as colony, we were a colony Island and we stole it from the people who lived

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here.

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Yeah.

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And if you think about it, it's why like my biggest pet peeve is, you know, I don't know

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if you remember in school, like the curriculum level, like, oh, we only have 200 to 300 years

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of actual history.

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It was like, we have so much more.

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We have like thousands.

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Um, but they don't really talk about that in a modern setting, like even to this day.

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And I feel like the problem now with as unfortunate as the Queen and stuff, don't, I think it

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is the perfect time to become our own country and, and, and not, you know, if you don't

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think of a Republic as a great idea, that's fair enough.

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But I do think we've got so many Australian figures like, you know, indigenous people

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and indigenous leaders who should have statues over the Queen.

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Absolutely.

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I do think it's interesting that Anthony Albanese, as much as I like him as a PM, I think it's

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a very odd and it's probably a generational thing.

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It's patronism where he's like, I'm going to put up this way for people to commemorate

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the Queen in Australia in Hyde Park.

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I'm like, why?

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It's the most bizarre thing because the modern generation coming in care less than your generation

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was.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Which is, I guess, and I mean, like for someone who's had a life like him, um, who's very

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open about that, it does kind of a little, I think it is probably the only thing is that

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he just feels like it was part of his generation.

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So he's like, I want to put something from my friends and family rather than the new

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people, but I'm like, that's still art.

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It's not necessarily our culture.

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You know, it's, you know, with, you know, with the indigenous in Australia, like they're,

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they've got such a rich history as well.

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And storytelling is such a massive thing and it's so important and the land as well.

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So I think, you know, rather than concentrating on, you know, the Queen and everything and

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you know, yes, she was important and she, you know, achieved a lot and everything, but

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you know, our indigenous society is just, it's so important as well.

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And unfortunately, I think it gets neglected.

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Well, I mean, it wasn't only recently a few years back that they stopped people going

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on Uluru, like physically walking Uluru.

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And I was like, thank goodness this has taken however many years for people to actually

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realize that this is probably not the smartest move.

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And I mean, like, um, you know what, I, there was an interesting doco.

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I've talked about it many times, but I really recommend people watching it, which is there

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is two indigenous cops who worked in, uh, WA.

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Um, and they talk about their experiences being in a remote town and just how little

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there are actually in terms of indigenous police officers.

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And that is a huge neglect on Australia as a society that not enough indigenous people

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are given positions of power and say, yes.

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And especially in our Western culture where we are, we fought, and I will say this not

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lightly, we do force our culture onto, you know, we are in this societal stand where

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our day-to-day experience, whether you mean it or not, you are forcing the Western way

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of thinking onto others.

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And these people have learned English because the English gave them no choice.

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It wasn't going to be the other way around.

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So I do think that making, um, you know, giving everyone a fair say is more important, especially

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with like, you know, flipping around to back to film eventually.

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I think that's what our, you know, particularly our industry that we work in is particularly

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like important because then we give people, whether it's to doco or drama or, you know,

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or fiction, um, anything like that.

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We give people an opportunity to have a say that isn't necessarily our own voice, but

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it's someone else's and therefore everyone kind of, you know, has this bigger opportunity

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to kind of spread awareness.

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But then the downside is showing films aren't well received internationally always because

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of our accent.

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But I do want to swing us around to you Madison.

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Yes.

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You want to ask the obvious question that I know, but I want you to get excited to everyone

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on the internet on our ears, who you are and what you do.

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So they have some context.

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Yeah, for sure.

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So like I'm a camera assistant.

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I've been a camera assistant for probably four, four or five years now.

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And um, you know, I love it.

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It's, it's been quite a journey so far already.

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So um, like I studied photography beforehand before going into film and then, um, yeah,

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decided in my second year of studying photography and went, Oh, okay.

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You know, I'm kind of, I'm noticing that I'm noticing a shift with my work that I'm enjoying

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the moving image a lot more as well.

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So you know, that was one of our subjects was like video art as well.

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So it's kind of, you know, it's very highly conceptual and that kind of, um, that kind

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of vibe, but I really enjoyed working with the moving image.

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So I just, you know, in myself, I thought, okay, well, I can see a bit of a shift going

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on.

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Um, so yeah, I decided to move to Sydney and study at afters.

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So the Australian film and TV radio school and, um, yeah, so I studied like a six month,

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uh, diploma of camera course there as well.

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And the main reason I chose that is so that I actually had flexibility to be able to work

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in the industry as well.

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Yeah.

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Because, you know, um, like bachelor degrees and everything, they're very important and

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so on, but I found, you know, me being quite a practical person as well and you know, the

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destination was like, I want, I would like to be in camera department.

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So for me, it's like, yes, I really, really want to, you know, actually physically hold

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a camera and actually understand how to use it as well.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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Yes.

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So I, um, yeah.

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So I studied that and, you know, just was very, very, very fortunate that I got offered,

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uh, to do an attachment on a Fox tail job.

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So basically just sort of from there, just, you know, working, working up into the industry

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as a, as a camera assistant.

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Wow.

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Yeah.

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And that's, and that's been four years.

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Yeah.

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Yes.

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Do you feel overwhelmed ever?

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Oh, I don't really, I wouldn't really say like overwhelmed, but definitely like, you

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know, it's taken, it's taken a lot of hard work and it's taken a lot of persistence as

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well.

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So when I was at afters, I also volunteered on a lot of the master short films as well,

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just to, just to actually get experience with, okay, what's a set like, how does it work

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and everything.

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And um, and actually, you know, touching, um, uh, like actually industry based cameras

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as well, which is just such an important thing to be able to establish and go, okay, well

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like I can actually use these cameras.

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I can understand them because you know, they're, they're so different to your, you know, your

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little DSLR and everything as well.

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So, you know, trying to make sure that you actually have the understanding behind them

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and say, okay, I got, I got this now.

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I always remember like back in the day, um, and I make it sound like, you know, like a

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hundred years ago, but it's all like 25 years ago, but I do remember everyone walking around

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with like those giant cameras, which clearly had like your little, um, your little tapes

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in them and you know, and disks that they had to go through like hundreds of, you know,

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them a day.

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Cause like, you know, you'd record onto four by three crappy videos and then format them

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and digitize them.

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Um, and I remember actually when my parents gave me like a handy cam for, I was like nine

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or 10 and it had like little cassette tapes in it.

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I remember having to work out how to digitize that and play it in real time to the computer

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and that's like my earliest memory of like before digital became like this, just SD card

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and you put it in and you kind of upload.

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And I do love the old school where it like, it takes a while to do and everything's kind

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of, you got to like really understand what a camera does prior to doing anything with

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it.

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Um, and I miss that because nowadays like the cameras that come out are so user friendly.

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Yes.

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Very, very.

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And I love manual.

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I just love knowing how, you know, color temps work, how like everything works and how you

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just go, okay, cool.

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00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:45,800
This shot, how I'm going to try and match it as close to this other shot that I did

240
00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:49,840
earlier so that color grading isn't going to be a nightmare.

241
00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:50,840
Yes.

242
00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:56,960
Cause like that's always like the funnest thing, um, that I learned, but I mean like

243
00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:02,120
as a camera assist, you're basically building the camera for the DOP and the camera operator.

244
00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:03,120
Yes.

245
00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,120
Correct.

246
00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:09,840
So it's like a, you know, the ins and outs of how to set it up, like what lenses it uses,

247
00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:11,400
what lenses you need.

248
00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:12,400
Yes.

249
00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,400
Um, what's the kind of like, do you ever have a fear of breaking some?

250
00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:25,440
Um, you know, sometimes, yes, sometimes, but, um, like I was also a rental prep technician

251
00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:26,440
as well.

252
00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:32,320
So a couple of years back, I used to work at LEMAC and, um, so I was, you know, often

253
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:37,240
seeing cameras come in and working with different types of cameras as well.

254
00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:44,600
So, um, you know, being able to have that exposure to, you know, understanding the,

255
00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:51,160
the ins and outs of, you know, certain lenses, certain cameras, um, and actually having time

256
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,480
to go through their menus and all of that as well.

257
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:57,600
And then obviously maintenance of the gear itself.

258
00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:03,240
So it's really, it's definitely really helped me to understand that side of things as well.

259
00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:07,440
Like, because as a camera assistant, like that's part of your job as well as maintaining

260
00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:11,560
the gear and making sure that, you know, if something does break, you report it straight

261
00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:14,480
away and you know, that kind of thing.

262
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:18,320
Whereas, you know, like, um, I've got to the point now where I'm like, I don't want to

263
00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:19,320
break things.

264
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:22,000
I want to make sure that, you know, everything's perfect.

265
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:23,000
Everything's right.

266
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:24,000
Yeah.

267
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,920
So let's avoid breaking things.

268
00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:31,560
I mean, like, yeah, cause like lenses and, or bits of gear can cost like thousands of

269
00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:36,960
dollars and it's, I remember like the first time I ever got lenses cleaned, they're like

270
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:42,640
$300 to clean a lens professionally, um, where they take it apart.

271
00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:46,680
They take out the glass, they literally dismantle the whole thing, clean it and then put it

272
00:15:46,680 --> 00:15:47,680
all back together.

273
00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:48,680
Yes, exactly.

274
00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,920
And, and look, I recommend if you're a photographer or anything, go and get your lenses cleaned

275
00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:54,640
because there is a lot of dust.

276
00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:55,640
A lot.

277
00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:58,840
And it builds up underneath the elements as well.

278
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,580
So sometimes like, especially coming from a rental house as well.

279
00:16:02,580 --> 00:16:08,060
So I was able to actually see like that same process as well of them being actually physically

280
00:16:08,060 --> 00:16:13,960
taken apart and then actually seeing the ins and outs of like what, what the lens is like

281
00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:15,960
when it's not in its casing.

282
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:16,960
Yeah.

283
00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:21,040
And it's, it's quite fascinating, but it's also like, you know, scary as well.

284
00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:25,520
Yeah, cause it's like this bit of chunk of glass that you're like, Oh no, this could

285
00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:26,520
break.

286
00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:28,640
It's kind of like a magnifying glass in a way.

287
00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:29,640
Yeah, it is.

288
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:33,440
It's, it's very much that principle of you're looking through a magnifying glass, but with

289
00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:40,280
a mirror and other elements to kind of bounce light through to, cause the way I always think

290
00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:43,920
of lenses is like, like eyes, you think of them as like an eye.

291
00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:48,480
So a singular, like if anyone wants to do that sort of theory, we cover one eye and

292
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:54,780
that's all you see is like that lens and then the way the light enters is the sensor and

293
00:16:54,780 --> 00:16:56,040
everything and so forth.

294
00:16:56,040 --> 00:16:59,480
You basically imagine it like that, but it's a much more complicated eye.

295
00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:04,840
Like you have complete, you, you actually have all the manual control of this eye.

296
00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:10,240
So you're, you know, resetting everything from colors to, you know, but I do find with

297
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:14,400
different cameras, like I was just thinking while you were talking, my favorite camera

298
00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:18,840
in terms of LUTs or like log format would be the Sony.

299
00:17:18,840 --> 00:17:19,840
I love Sony.

300
00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:20,840
It's great.

301
00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:21,840
It's easy.

302
00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:27,960
It's super like they come out in this very flat format when you record in log and then

303
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:33,800
you have so much to play with to kind of pull out and get color temps and everything.

304
00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:39,880
But then with terms of like actual cameras though, that's the only thing I love about

305
00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:40,880
Sony.

306
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:43,680
Cause Sony are very like, I love them.

307
00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:49,800
I feel like they're the most limited kind of camera to use in unless you're, you know,

308
00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:53,880
you're an indie artist and you particularly want to shoot something on a Sony.

309
00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:58,640
But as like most cameras, I love, I love black magics.

310
00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:00,040
They're great.

311
00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:05,600
And I also love like Ari Alexas because they're just stunning and beautiful.

312
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:10,720
And, and I've also, I particularly, if I would go to lenses, anything anamorphic, I love

313
00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:11,720
anamorphic lenses.

314
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:12,720
The flares.

315
00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:18,600
But also what I didn't realize and I was researching, this is how much of a nerd I am sitting on

316
00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:24,040
YouTube watching videos about like cameras and lighting and sound.

317
00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:25,040
All my day, every day.

318
00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:32,160
And one of the things that I learned was about anamorphic lenses is the image because of

319
00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:37,040
the way the lens is and it tilts in a certain way and it shifts whenever you sort of change

320
00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:41,240
the position and focal lengths, it does create a blurred outline.

321
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:45,880
So you know, most people don't know that, that a lot of your image will be a bit blurred

322
00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:47,680
on the outer region.

323
00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:53,200
And you need to understand what an anamorphic lens does before you use it because I've seen

324
00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:59,360
it used very wrong over the course of a few years of watching TV or film or anything where

325
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:01,800
people have just been given anamorphic lenses.

326
00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:07,960
So they don't actually know the limitations of these lenses as well as the pros because

327
00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:12,320
most normal lenses don't have that issue where they're just like the outer ring, you know,

328
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,560
like it just captures whatever is within the range.

329
00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:16,560
But anamorphic doesn't.

330
00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:19,320
It's a very specific and it squishes the image.

331
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,880
So you need to pull the image.

332
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:27,200
It's like, do you find that like fascinating when you look at camera stuff?

333
00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:28,200
Absolutely.

334
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:33,880
Like, you know, that's, that's one of the major things that I love about anamorphic as

335
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:39,680
well and like again, with, with when you're actually using the camera itself, like, you

336
00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:44,840
know, you've got that setting of that anamorphic D squeeze as well, because, you know, you

337
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,800
can see, you can see that squeeze happening.

338
00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,880
Like the moment you put the lens on and you watch the image, you're like, oh, okay.

339
00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,200
So I can actually see that I can physically see it.

340
00:19:55,200 --> 00:20:00,120
And then you put the apply the D squeeze and you're like, okay, now it actually looks a

341
00:20:00,120 --> 00:20:01,120
little bit more normal.

342
00:20:01,120 --> 00:20:04,760
I don't have like this squished image.

343
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:05,760
Yeah.

344
00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:06,760
Yeah.

345
00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:08,680
It's, it's like a so bizarre as well.

346
00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:14,200
I mean, like it's because if I were to ask you what your favorite camera and, and like

347
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,160
particularly, what is your favorite camera?

348
00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:23,520
I'd be very biased, unfortunately with, with the, um, Alexis, I love the Alexis.

349
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,640
I think that the color science is just beautiful.

350
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:32,320
Um, and they're also, you know, just so user friendly, which is just so key as a camera

351
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:37,880
assistant as well is just, you know, I, you know, when I'm formatting cards or so on,

352
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:40,760
you know, I want it to be quite quick and easy to do.

353
00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:46,160
So, you know, that's sort of my only, you know, issue that I kind of have with the Sony's

354
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:50,240
as well as that, you know, there's often a menu, but then there's a deep menu as well

355
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,240
that you've got to, you know, navigate through.

356
00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:58,200
So you know, as long as you've got the time on set to be able to do that, that's great.

357
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:03,640
But you know, if you're in a real quick hurry, you're like, I can't always keep going right

358
00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:05,720
through to the deep menu all the time.

359
00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:10,160
You know, it's generally, you know, for, if you're doing something a little bit more technical

360
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:16,400
with the camera, but yeah, it's, you know, I really like the Alexis and their format

361
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,800
in terms of just, it's very, it's very simple to use.

362
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:20,800
Yeah.

363
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:23,960
And that's what we need on set is, you know, quick and easy.

364
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:24,960
Yeah.

365
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,880
Quick and easy, get to the point straight away.

366
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:27,880
Yeah.

367
00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:32,440
Cause I mean like you look at major productions and, and time, you know, that little saying

368
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:33,440
time is money.

369
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:34,440
Yes.

370
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:39,960
I get, get back to say it's, it's not a, I remember in like school, I used to think that

371
00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:43,200
was a really bad saying, but it actually makes a lot of sense because the faster you get

372
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,360
stuff done, the quicker everyone can go home.

373
00:21:46,360 --> 00:21:47,360
Exactly.

374
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:48,360
Like it's so true.

375
00:21:48,360 --> 00:21:49,360
It's so true.

376
00:21:49,360 --> 00:21:55,680
And there's, I think, um, do you ever feel like you've been on set where you're just

377
00:21:55,680 --> 00:22:03,120
like, this day has taken longer than actually necessary and well without of your control?

378
00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:04,560
Yeah, definitely.

379
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:07,760
You know, there are, there are days where like, you know, we've, we've got nine and

380
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:12,040
a half to 10 minutes, you know, of scheduled time, like scheduled screen time that we've

381
00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:13,040
got to get in the bag.

382
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:19,120
And you know, that's a very, it's, you know, it's not impossible, but it's very ambitious.

383
00:22:19,120 --> 00:22:23,680
Like it's especially, you know, if you're working with kids or something like that as

384
00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,280
well, you've got to take all of these things into account.

385
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:33,760
Um, and I find that like, unfortunately there's a lot of Australian TV shows and everything

386
00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:38,840
that the, the scheduling is getting tighter and tighter and the budgets are getting tighter

387
00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:40,500
and tighter as well.

388
00:22:40,500 --> 00:22:45,920
So it's starting to, you know, put stress on, you know, all of us as a crew and everything.

389
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:52,420
So our days do typically sometimes get a little bit longer than what they should be as well.

390
00:22:52,420 --> 00:22:56,040
And it's just because we've just got so much to do in a day.

391
00:22:56,040 --> 00:23:00,840
And then, you know, gets to, you know, near when we should be wrapping the like, okay,

392
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,960
you know, we're going to ask for an hours over time and is everybody okay with that?

393
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:08,160
And a lot of the time we're like, yeah, okay.

394
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:13,240
You know, it's cause most of the time we're like, well, if, if we don't do that scene

395
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,880
now it's going to get pushed to another day and then they could just ask for overtime

396
00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:18,520
on that day as well.

397
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:19,520
Yeah.

398
00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:20,520
So, yeah.

399
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:26,600
So it's, you know, there's definitely days where it will come across as being like, you

400
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:31,880
know, quite a long, long day, but you know, I've, I've been very surprised.

401
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:35,360
Like the latest show that I've been on was actually a kids TV show.

402
00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:41,000
And we were like the first block who were doing nine and a half to 10 minutes a day

403
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,360
and we were actually getting it in the bag with very minimal overtime.

404
00:23:44,360 --> 00:23:50,320
Like, you know, we'd be getting it with, you know, maybe only 15 minutes extra, like

405
00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:51,840
minutes over time.

406
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,560
So it's, it was very, very surprising to actually see that.

407
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:57,440
And that's really good schedule.

408
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:58,440
That's what it is.

409
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:04,200
I mean, it's down to good producing, good scheduling and good first ideas, which you

410
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:10,920
know, and, um, you know, kudos to many first ideas who know how to schedule stuff to us.

411
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:11,920
Yeah.

412
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:18,360
To a T. Um, I've been, I definitely like, I think with sets as well, it's one of those

413
00:24:18,360 --> 00:24:23,920
environments that you know, like I always say when you run over or you, you know, like

414
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:30,280
everything is over and I know I have it in my contract because I work full time and I

415
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:32,880
know I have my contract because I do shift work.

416
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:39,360
They do say if anything happens and we need you to stay back at last minute, you know,

417
00:24:39,360 --> 00:24:44,920
we have the ability to, you know, what I can obviously will pay you, but it's, it's kind

418
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,760
of like, you can't, you know, we'll ask, but it's not kind of like you can refuse.

419
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:50,600
No, that's exactly right.

420
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:51,600
Yes.

421
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:52,600
It's the same principle.

422
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:53,600
Yes.

423
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:54,600
Yes.

424
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:55,600
That's true.

425
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:59,680
Like, you know, I've only really had it on, you know, a few circumstances where, you

426
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:04,440
know, it's a Saturday and you know, it was also working with kids as well.

427
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:09,520
Again, you know, it's first of all, not great that, you know, these kids have got to work

428
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:14,720
on a Saturday and they should have a life too.

429
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,400
But yeah, it's, you know, that was, that was a day where like, you know, on the Friday,

430
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:23,480
like we'd heard that they were going to ask for overtime on the Saturday and everyone

431
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:26,520
was like, no, like we've all got lives.

432
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:32,120
You know, there are, there are, you know, gaffers and first ACs and so on that, you

433
00:25:32,120 --> 00:25:37,720
know, older than me have kids and so on and want to go home to them, of course.

434
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:42,120
So, you know, that's, that's when we would, you know, arc up and say, Hey, you know, no,

435
00:25:42,120 --> 00:25:47,400
we're not going to do overtime on Saturday because, you know, we've got lives too.

436
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:48,400
Absolutely.

437
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:52,640
I mean, like, and that's kind of my mentality as well.

438
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:55,960
It's like, you know, you do have a life outside of work.

439
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:56,960
Yes.

440
00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:01,800
And whether it's your hobby or your interest, like you've got to also respect other people's

441
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:02,800
time.

442
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:03,800
Yes.

443
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,600
I mean, like it's interesting as well, cause I think about unions and I always think about

444
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,040
like how unions are meant to protect us.

445
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:16,240
And I'm very much like, are meant to because not all unions do.

446
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:20,160
But like if you do enough research, there was a lot of unions out there.

447
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:25,200
There was a lot of like, I was crew, you know, the MEAA.

448
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:26,200
Yes.

449
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:27,200
MEAA.

450
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,200
I always used to say MEAA.

451
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:33,720
I don't know why, cause it's the way it's written and it just like blows my mind.

452
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:34,720
Yeah.

453
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:40,440
And you know, I think protecting people, they do a good job, but I mean, as a country, we

454
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,120
don't have a strong union unions.

455
00:26:43,120 --> 00:26:48,360
Like we don't have it like Europe does where, you know, back in the day, if it was 5pm,

456
00:26:48,360 --> 00:26:52,040
they'd switch off the lights, regardless of how much time, like overtime.

457
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:53,360
They don't do that here.

458
00:26:53,360 --> 00:26:56,520
Like we don't have that ability to be like, all right, that's it.

459
00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:57,520
We're all gone home today.

460
00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:59,600
But we've got like three hours to go.

461
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:01,840
No, no union says we're done.

462
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:02,840
Yeah.

463
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,320
Like that's in our contract as part of the union done.

464
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:06,320
Like we don't have that.

465
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:07,320
No, no.

466
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,560
We're very different in how we approach work.

467
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:13,800
And I think that's when we kind of feel like we're overworked.

468
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:14,800
Yes.

469
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:15,800
Yes.

470
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:22,520
Which happens, I guess more from the less, you know, like if you're at the top tier,

471
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,000
it kind of happens to all the people there.

472
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:25,000
Yes, it does.

473
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:26,280
It's a, it's a domino effect.

474
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,840
It just kind of keeps passing down the chain.

475
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:34,160
And then unfortunately, you know, the crew kind of gets a bit stitched up with that kind

476
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:35,640
of thing as well.

477
00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:38,880
And you know, like turnarounds is such a big thing too.

478
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:45,080
Like, you know, I always, you know, feel awful for the unit department because they, you

479
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,320
know, they're the first ones there and they're always the last ones to leave.

480
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,800
And they're the most at risk for breaking their turnarounds as well.

481
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:58,240
And unfortunately, like I've seen it happen too often and then that's when fatigue comes

482
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,080
into things as well.

483
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:07,000
So it's, you know, it's not only just the, you know, like key departments like sound

484
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:13,800
and so on, but it's just like, you know, unit, they're essentially the people who, you know,

485
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:18,800
keep us alive on set, you know, with making sure that we've got, you know, obviously amenities,

486
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,640
we've got coffee, we've got all of those kinds of things.

487
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:27,960
Like they are really the backbone to keeping us all sane.

488
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,920
I do like that you use the word sane.

489
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:31,920
It's so true.

490
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:36,680
I mean, and it is kind of appalling that we still kind of work in an industry where that

491
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:40,480
is the ability to overwork is.

492
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:46,800
And I remember I was told this when I was 21, like pretty early on actually in my life,

493
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:52,640
I had a family friend who was an editor and she just went, if you want to have a family,

494
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:54,640
don't work in this industry.

495
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:59,480
Basically was 101 and she was in her late 40s, early 50s at the time.

496
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:04,200
I thought about that long and hard and I do want to have a family that is like a definite,

497
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:11,320
but I do think that there is part of me that goes, God damn, this industry does not benefit,

498
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:17,440
especially, you know, still to this day, women who want to have kids like maternity leave

499
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:19,200
is better.

500
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:25,520
But in terms of like long term, you know, I know a few friends who've like come back

501
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:27,280
for casual work and that's fine.

502
00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:32,640
But others who have been completely dropped by the industry for various reasons, like

503
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,800
is that something that you kind of go, oh God about this industry and worrying about

504
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:37,800
it?

505
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:38,800
Yeah, a little bit.

506
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:44,280
I feel like, I think it was one of the first jobs that I actually did and we just wrapped

507
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:50,080
the job and the director came up to me and like she was a female director as well and

508
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,560
she said, oh, you know, I can see that you're, you know, very driven and you do want to

509
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:55,560
go far in this industry.

510
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,160
And I said, yes, that's correct.

511
00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:00,080
And she said, well, do you want to have the family as well?

512
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,400
And I said, yes, I, you know, ideally I would love to have a family.

513
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:09,840
She said, just be very careful and very aware that as you're going along in the industry,

514
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:15,200
you know, you're, you're going to have times where like you don't often have time to, you

515
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:18,880
know, to prioritize that side of things as well.

516
00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:23,840
And you know, so she went on to like say, you know, the difficulties that she's had

517
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:29,280
just as a, you know, as a director as well, that, you know, trying to keep track of, you

518
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:36,040
know, where your kids are at during the day while you're at work and that kind of thing.

519
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:42,360
So, you know, it's, it's definitely, um, a bit of big thing for me to, to consider.

520
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:43,360
Definitely.

521
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:44,360
Yes.

522
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:51,080
I like it's, it's one of those things that I think, um, you, you kind of want that separation,

523
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:58,040
especially for your kids, um, do have like, and also not wonder where you, you know, your

524
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,440
parents are 24 seven, like going home.

525
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:01,440
Yeah.

526
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:03,120
Oh, they're working overtime again.

527
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:04,600
I guess I'm with the babysitter.

528
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:10,280
Like there is a lot of that where it's like the industry is a little bit more like, okay,

529
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:11,280
we do have families.

530
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:12,280
We do have small kids.

531
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:13,840
We need to go home to those kids.

532
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:20,320
Like we're paying the babysitter by like the hour or my mom's got a concert tonight and

533
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:21,320
she's looking after the kids.

534
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:23,040
So I've got to be home by this hour.

535
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:25,240
Oh, we call them to overtime.

536
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:26,240
Cool.

537
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,120
I guess they're not going to do anything.

538
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:34,360
And it's like, you know, all these things that weigh up and I, you know, I think of

539
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,520
it, uh, we're not saving lives.

540
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:37,520
There's this running.

541
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:38,520
Exactly.

542
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:42,200
That is like the most common saying, you know, what I also love, and this is when I know

543
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:47,600
it's, it's a good production is when they, these situations happens where they go, okay,

544
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:48,720
we're not going to do overtime.

545
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,400
We're just going to rewrite a same for later.

546
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:57,720
And they use material and then rewrite it so it fits into another episode or another

547
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,760
scene later down the track at a completely different location.

548
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:02,760
So they're like, cool.

549
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:03,760
All right.

550
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:04,760
That might be useful.

551
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:09,600
That's happened so many times in productions where rewrites happen during filming and because

552
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:14,800
of logistical errors or just they've run out of time at a scene or the quotient is gone.

553
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:16,040
We can't film there anymore.

554
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,640
So you're going to have to film it somewhere else.

555
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,120
And, um, that does happen.

556
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:23,120
It saves time.

557
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:24,120
Yeah, it does.

558
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:26,800
It's, it means people don't get overworked sometimes.

559
00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:33,480
Um, especially if you're on location and particularly if you're booked for a week on this remote

560
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:38,160
location and suddenly everyone goes, oh, we missed a scene crap.

561
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,480
Um, can't, we don't have time to film it.

562
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:42,040
Can't get an extra day here.

563
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:43,240
Let's go and film it somewhere else.

564
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:47,080
That is completely like it's long as it still has the same feeling and the same meaning

565
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:48,720
and it doesn't look jarring in the film.

566
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:49,720
Yes.

567
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,360
Or in the show may as well do it there.

568
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:53,360
Yeah.

569
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:54,360
Yeah.

570
00:32:54,360 --> 00:33:00,160
You'd be surprised with how many sort of cheats you can do here and there, especially like,

571
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:05,360
you know, I've had it, you know, probably not so much as, you know, like whole scenes

572
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:11,360
before, but in terms of, um, like, you know, being able to, like, if it's an insert on

573
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:18,480
a laptop or something like that, most of the time you can work around that and have a different,

574
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:23,440
um, a completely different location that you're at, but work it around and have the lighting

575
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,440
exactly the way you need it.

576
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:30,160
Um, so that you can, you can actually do that shot elsewhere as well.

577
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,160
So it's, you know, you're getting the key parts of the scene where you actually have

578
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:34,200
to be.

579
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:38,960
And then as soon as it comes to actually picking up the little, the little bits and pieces

580
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:43,520
here and there, it's, it's a lot simpler doing it that way as well.

581
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,640
So yeah, it just, again, it saves time.

582
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:54,400
It's, it's also like editing is your friend and as speaking as someone who's edited quite

583
00:33:54,400 --> 00:34:00,960
a bit now, it's, it does get you out of jail so quickly when you work around an edit.

584
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,200
And it's why I love people who think outside the box and people, you know, like DOPs or

585
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:10,480
camera operators or anything like that, who think outside the box and they know what they

586
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,280
can cheat and what we can get around.

587
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:20,040
Because it makes everyone 10 times better to be like, cool, you know, cause there's

588
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:27,120
nothing worse than someone who just doesn't care and doesn't want, and is very rigid in

589
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:29,000
their instructions of what they want to do.

590
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:30,000
Yeah.

591
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:37,360
Well, I think it's also so key with, um, really good first ADs as well that often they're

592
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:42,120
always thinking of ways, you know, how to get things done quite efficiently.

593
00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:48,640
So if we're, if they're, you know, if it's raining or, you know, whatever we can't, um,

594
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:53,760
control happens, you know, and it happens a lot, especially with La Nina this year as

595
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:54,760
well.

596
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:59,200
We've had so many, um, so many setbacks with rain and everything as well.

597
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:04,120
So the director will always be, you know, trying to go, okay, well, what can I do next?

598
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:08,800
And the AD is always thinking going, okay, well, we can actually prioritize this and

599
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,040
we can bring this forward and we can do, you know, there's, there's.

600
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:17,800
There's such a, you know, I have such an appreciation for the ADs department because that's, you

601
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:22,520
know, there, there was often a lot of rescheduling that goes on that we don't see.

602
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:23,520
Yeah.

603
00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:28,640
As the crew, like, you know, we know that it happens, but in terms of actually seeing,

604
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,200
you know, how we reschedule and everything, it's, it's pretty amazing.

605
00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:33,200
Yeah.

606
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:37,840
I mean, like, does that, did that blow, when you, when you first went to set and your first

607
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:42,280
ever set, like, you know, paid experience with that, like the experience, like what

608
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:46,240
was that a very stressful kind of first day?

609
00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:52,300
It definitely was because, you know, coming from film school and going onto a professional

610
00:35:52,300 --> 00:35:55,040
set is just, it's such a different world.

611
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:56,480
It is so different.

612
00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:01,880
There are so many unwritten rules that, you know, I didn't know, you know, coming, coming

613
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:03,600
into a professional set.

614
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:09,800
So, you know, a student film is just so much more relaxed and, you know, there's not, you

615
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:13,200
know, not a huge crazy time constraints.

616
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:17,840
I guess they're definitely, you know, they'll obviously try to get everything done that

617
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:21,120
they need to get done, but it's not as, it's not as critical.

618
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:22,120
Yeah.

619
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:27,520
So, you know, coming onto a, you know, a professional set, I'm, I'm like, oh my goodness, like,

620
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,080
there is so much to think about, so much to do.

621
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:36,120
You're always prioritizing, like, you know, especially once you, once you get into camera

622
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:40,320
department and you're doing like the video split role, which is generally, you know,

623
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:45,920
your starting role in the camera department, like you're always prioritizing about where

624
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:51,680
the split's going to go and making sure that the director always has picture and, you know,

625
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:55,800
and then it's all the other behind the scenes stuff as well, you know, keeping the camera

626
00:36:55,800 --> 00:37:00,720
department functioning with water and coffee and all of these, you know, there, there's

627
00:37:00,720 --> 00:37:03,640
just so many more things that are involved with it.

628
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:08,960
So definitely it was a big, you know, not really a shock, but just more like a, well,

629
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,320
okay, you know, this is a lot more involved.

630
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:13,320
Yeah.

631
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:16,000
Then you initially, yes, yes.

632
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:19,320
Coming from a student set to that totally different.

633
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:20,680
Yeah, it really is.

634
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:24,960
And, and expectation like very different.

635
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:31,160
And I think like that's really interesting as well.

636
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:35,600
And I like that, you know, if for anyone who doesn't know what split is, I think we use

637
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:40,000
terminology here that, you know, not everyone would understand what that is, but it generally

638
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:44,440
split is like a monitor or at least vision for the directors.

639
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:45,440
Yes.

640
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:46,440
So they can see.

641
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:47,440
And it's very important.

642
00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:50,960
It's very important that the director sees what they're filming.

643
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:52,600
So they can critique it.

644
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:57,960
But I do remember, I think my first ever set experience and it was like, I just, I was

645
00:37:57,960 --> 00:37:58,960
such a novice.

646
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,920
I remember, I did, and it was a student set.

647
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:10,000
Like it was like, you know, 18 years old I was, and I went to this, afters thing and

648
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:14,240
they had this, you know, they wanted someone be doing a volunteer role for behind the scenes.

649
00:38:14,240 --> 00:38:19,680
They hadn't really told the director, which I think was the producers had not really done

650
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:24,280
their job by informing everyone on the set that there would be someone doing behind the

651
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:28,120
scenes or really kind of, I think if they thought it was a nice idea, I think it was

652
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:31,080
a very last minute thought and they were like, this would be fun.

653
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,080
And I think the school kind of said, this would be a nice idea as well.

654
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:38,080
So it was kind of like tacked on and I rocked up and I remember like they were doing all

655
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:40,180
these rehearsals and I was like, perfect.

656
00:38:40,180 --> 00:38:41,180
You know what the opportunity is?

657
00:38:41,180 --> 00:38:42,180
I'll grab my camera.

658
00:38:42,180 --> 00:38:46,440
I'll go and film the camera coming down the hallway and seeing what it's like from the

659
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:47,440
other side.

660
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,800
And I was told to get out of shot.

661
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:51,320
I was like, oh no.

662
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:53,160
And it was, they were just doing a rehearsal.

663
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:54,160
It was fine.

664
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:58,960
But the director just didn't want me in shot as any kind of distraction.

665
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:01,760
And at the time I thought, oh God, she hates me.

666
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:09,240
But now 10 years later, 10, 20, 10, 12 years later, I think about it and I just go, nah,

667
00:39:09,240 --> 00:39:12,780
she was just like really hyper-focused in what was going on.

668
00:39:12,780 --> 00:39:17,720
And the last thing you want is someone who's new to a set, kind of distracting you and

669
00:39:17,720 --> 00:39:23,040
you have to constantly keep an eye on so that they don't get in trouble or danger.

670
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:28,640
And but yeah, I mean like the, I remember the data wrangler was one of the nicest people

671
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,320
and he took me in and showed me how to data wrangle like old film.

672
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:33,480
And I was like, this is so cool.

673
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:38,440
So I did learn a lot about that experience, what to do on a set and what not to do.

674
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:40,440
Also not what to do.

675
00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:42,240
Don't look like you're not doing anything.

676
00:39:42,240 --> 00:39:43,240
Yes, exactly.

677
00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:46,920
Regardless of you're not, don't look like you're doing nothing.

678
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:48,520
Always stand to attention.

679
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:49,520
Yes.

680
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:54,920
Well, you know, one, one of the camera assistants that I've sort of worked alongside of at one

681
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:59,280
point she had a saying of like, you know, if you've got time to lean, you've got time

682
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:00,280
to clean.

683
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:04,600
So, you know, for me that's, you know, as a camera assistant as well, I'm like, okay,

684
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:06,640
well, what can I clean with the camera?

685
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,040
Is there any dust on any of the fans?

686
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,160
Is there, you know, so I'm always trying to like think of ways.

687
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,520
To, to maximize that time.

688
00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:20,280
If I have any downtime, which you know, is depending on what camera is playing, like

689
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:25,000
if there's a steady cam shot and if I'm not the camera assistant for the steady cam, then

690
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:29,360
I'll obviously try and make sure and go, okay, well, you know, I could clear some rushes

691
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:30,360
in the meantime.

692
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:32,520
I could, you know, clean the camera.

693
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:33,760
I can clean the monitors.

694
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:38,160
There's, there's so many different things that I can keep myself occupied with and obviously

695
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:42,880
cleaning the lenses as well and making sure that there's no dust visible on the top of

696
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:48,120
them or no, you know, fingerprints or marks or, you know, those kinds of things.

697
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:53,280
So there's, you know, I'm often trying to maximize that time as much as possible.

698
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:58,760
So especially if there's also, you know, additional gear that's got to come in as well.

699
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:03,920
So I'm always talking and organizing with, you know, runners and production and so on.

700
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:09,600
And, you know, just a lot of things goes, you know, goes on sort of while I'm not sliding

701
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:13,000
a camera and while I'm not changing lenses and so on.

702
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:14,960
So I'm often, I'm always busy.

703
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:15,960
Yeah.

704
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:22,800
You can't really sit, sit still and it's kind of a luxury that you have on student sets

705
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:29,400
or short films or anything low budget because there's more like, but it's also my pet peeve.

706
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:31,360
It is literally a pet peeve.

707
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:35,920
I don't care if you're on a short film or on a low budget set, never just sit there

708
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:36,920
in your phone.

709
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:37,920
Yes.

710
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:40,520
It pisses me off to the nth degree.

711
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:45,680
It's one of the first things that I actually teach, like, you know, juniors coming into

712
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:49,480
the camera department as well as like, you know, don't be on your phone.

713
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:51,160
Like it's such an important thing.

714
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:57,120
Like, you know, we've got, we've usually got viewer that we use to, you know, stream the

715
00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:02,680
actual, you know, the video as well of what we're actually, what the cameras are seeing

716
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:03,680
as well.

717
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:08,000
So I'm like, yes, you can be checking that, making sure it's working, but if you're not

718
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:10,200
doing that, don't be on your phone.

719
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:11,200
Yeah.

720
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:15,920
So, and I also like explain to them as well, like when I'm an A camera assistant, generally

721
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:20,840
like I'm also trying to like, you know, message production in the meantime and organize things

722
00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:21,840
for later.

723
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:26,720
So I said, look, you know, I may be on my phone, but I'm actually doing work on my phone

724
00:42:26,720 --> 00:42:31,680
and unfortunately like it's, it's the part of the job that I probably don't like as much.

725
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:36,000
I don't like being on my phone, like, because it kind of detracts from me actually being

726
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:38,120
on set as well.

727
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:43,480
So often, you know, if I do have a shot off or something like that, because you know,

728
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:48,560
steady cams playing or so on, or if it's only a single camera, then yes, that's sort of

729
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:53,440
my time that I take to, to do messaging and to do those things.

730
00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:58,520
So that, you know, I'm not trying to do it in between when I'm actually busy on set.

731
00:42:58,520 --> 00:42:59,520
So yeah.

732
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:00,520
Yeah.

733
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:05,840
Which is, you know, cause I mean, I, I just think that, you know, especially when you've

734
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:10,960
got people, you know, high profile people coming in and producers who sometimes are

735
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:12,920
the ones who are the ones paying you.

736
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:13,920
Yes, that's right.

737
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:18,600
You know, sometimes the producers will hover on, on set and you know, again, that's when

738
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:22,840
I sort of brief the juniors and go, okay, we've got producers on set.

739
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:24,920
Let's just, you know, keep it really professional.

740
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:25,920
Yeah.

741
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:28,480
You know, be as on top of things as possible.

742
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:31,600
Let's make sure that the splits always got power.

743
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:32,600
It's always got an image.

744
00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:37,440
You know, we're not waiting for, you know, for picture or something like that.

745
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:38,440
Yeah.

746
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:43,600
And I mean, like because one of the, you know, we talk about professionalism in sort of a

747
00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:50,480
blanket term, but it is also just like, you know, it's not standing into attention, but

748
00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:56,520
it's just being a hyper aware of everything that's going around you and being like, if

749
00:43:56,520 --> 00:44:00,040
someone, if you don't need to talk, don't talk kind of thing.

750
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:01,520
Just, just be quiet.

751
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:02,520
Yeah.

752
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:06,600
Um, and that's, that's also another thing that I teach, like the younger ones coming

753
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:11,640
into camera department as well is, you know, like, and this will generally only come over

754
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:18,700
time, but it's also, um, it's also watching the set and, you know, viewing it as a big

755
00:44:18,700 --> 00:44:19,700
piece of information.

756
00:44:19,700 --> 00:44:20,700
Yeah.

757
00:44:20,700 --> 00:44:22,080
There's, there's a lot going on.

758
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:27,440
There's a lot happening and you can learn and understand a lot from what is happening

759
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:28,440
as well.

760
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:33,280
So that's why I, you know, once we're a couple of weeks into the actual shoot and I've got

761
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:39,720
them to, you know, understand the split itself and how to, you know, how to operate it and

762
00:44:39,720 --> 00:44:40,720
so on.

763
00:44:40,720 --> 00:44:45,360
Then that's when I start going, okay, be aware of your surroundings and start looking at

764
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:48,640
the blocking, you know, the, it's such a important time.

765
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:49,640
Yeah.

766
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:55,720
And then I start doing line reading, everything that happens and then going, okay, well, you

767
00:44:55,720 --> 00:45:00,120
can, you can actually see that and you can actually understand where the cameras are

768
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,840
going to go after that as well.

769
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:06,600
So in terms of, you know, rather than coming up to me and being like, Oh, where, where

770
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:08,240
can I put the split?

771
00:45:08,240 --> 00:45:12,080
You know, you can watch the block and you can understand, okay, one camera is going

772
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:13,080
to look that way.

773
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,080
One camera is going to look the other way.

774
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:16,760
Safe is over this way.

775
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:17,760
Yeah.

776
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:23,000
So it's, you know, it's stuff that starts informing, you know, informing that person's

777
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:24,000
knowledge.

778
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:25,000
Yeah.

779
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:30,000
Which you need to like, I think it's always good practice as well.

780
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:36,160
And, and to just have like that, that is to knowledge as well to what, what things do

781
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:40,720
and how to be the best on the best you can be on set.

782
00:45:40,720 --> 00:45:41,720
Yeah.

783
00:45:41,720 --> 00:45:45,880
Um, because yeah, like I think even if you're in a volunteer capacity, it's just, it's good

784
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:55,080
practice, um, to, but I mean, I think also just, you know, I think a lot of the time

785
00:45:55,080 --> 00:46:00,800
also the biggest stress of being on, you know, when you're new to the industry and you know,

786
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:06,400
people are telling you, and I often find it very interesting because, um, I've, I've taught

787
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,960
people particularly my own age about, you know, who have never worked in the industry

788
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:17,120
about industry standard things and you know, just, I think you, you get to a point where

789
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:18,480
you don't want to sound like a dick.

790
00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:19,480
Yes.

791
00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:23,160
You don't want to keep repeating yourself as well, though.

792
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:27,880
You're kind of like, please learn this because if you haven't, then you're going to actually

793
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:32,600
start getting people annoyed at you because they will, everyone has this point.

794
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:38,200
And I remember a great teacher taught me once he said, um, and he, like everyone used to

795
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:42,320
think this guy was an asshole, but he was so good at his job and he was very, and he,

796
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:43,920
and he said to me, don't lie to me.

797
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:47,560
If you don't understand something, just tell me, but don't try and fake it.

798
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:48,560
Otherwise I will not teach you.

799
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:49,560
Exactly.

800
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:50,560
I was like, learn from the get-go.

801
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:51,760
And I'm the same principle.

802
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:53,960
If you lie to me, I will not have time for it.

803
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:56,280
I'm just like, no, you're on your own then.

804
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:59,680
And, or if you don't try, I don't also have time.

805
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:01,680
Like give it a shot.

806
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:07,380
Um, cause there's so many ways to work around situations and problems.

807
00:47:07,380 --> 00:47:13,680
And I think also because predominantly I work in such a triage heavy job, um, that it's,

808
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:21,680
it's quick thinking, fast reacting time that if you don't have that ability and you get

809
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:26,760
stressed easily, like you probably shouldn't be in the job because you can't get stressed

810
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:32,160
in and you can't take things personally because nine times out of 10, someone's going to yell

811
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:34,880
and because they've had a bad day.

812
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:39,760
And while that behavior is not acceptable, it's still not a personal attack.

813
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:44,200
No, they just got pressures from somewhere else that they don't know how to deal with

814
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:45,200
and vent with.

815
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:47,480
So it just, it filters down.

816
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:48,480
Yeah.

817
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:53,360
And I think that that then comes to the other side of the coin where a lot of new people

818
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:58,280
come in and they get hypersensitive about things or they get super worried or they go,

819
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:02,240
or they start going, Oh, everyone's, you know, like I know the, the feeling of when it's

820
00:48:02,240 --> 00:48:07,320
downtime at work, we do have the ability to be on our phones and it's less stress because

821
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:12,080
we are in an office where we are doing day in, day out 24 seven shifts.

822
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:16,520
So we do have downtime and, but we are also working.

823
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:20,560
So it's not exactly, but when we're training people and people see that and they're like,

824
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:22,160
Oh, these people are on their phones.

825
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:27,040
So I can be on it's like, no, as a trainee, you're not allowed to touch your phone.

826
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:28,400
That is the last thing you touch.

827
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:30,840
The last thing is you talk to your friends while you're in work hours.

828
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:32,600
You put that phone in your bag.

829
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:34,220
That is your job at this point.

830
00:48:34,220 --> 00:48:39,840
And then you are attentive to whatever's happening around you because you are learning.

831
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:45,640
And that is the, the people who are experts at this, like know how to react quickly to

832
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:50,560
situations and not think, Oh, I'm just messaging, you know, my wife, I will get back to this

833
00:48:50,560 --> 00:48:51,560
emergency.

834
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:53,400
It's like, no, this comes second.

835
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:56,880
That comes first because that's the triage brain.

836
00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:00,080
But I've worked with so many people over the years that you kind of, you get to a point

837
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:04,640
where you're like, I need to kind of beat it out of you.

838
00:49:04,640 --> 00:49:09,440
And it's awful, but it's like when you come from student films and you don't understand

839
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:16,800
that, um, being like on your phone is like a bad thing when you come to the professional

840
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:23,880
industry, it's like, it is, it is just such a bad look when you're not attentive.

841
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:31,040
And even like, because our, um, our camera sheets these days are more electronic as well.

842
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:36,400
So, um, so again, like I made sure that I went out and bought an iPad because again,

843
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:40,240
I'm like, look, we can do the camera sheets on our phones, but I don't like being on my

844
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:42,440
phone when I'm on set.

845
00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:47,280
So I'd rather not have that look, even though I'm, I'm doing the camera sheet, but I'd rather

846
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:51,680
just, you know, actually have the iPad in front of me as well.

847
00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:52,680
Yeah, absolutely.

848
00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:58,240
And I think then, you know, like when you're scheduling, when you're looking at, you know,

849
00:49:58,240 --> 00:50:02,880
a thousand emails, you know, and cyphering, it is better to have something a bit more

850
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:08,320
robust than your tiny phone going, can I read that right now in a dark room and no,

851
00:50:08,320 --> 00:50:13,280
actually like this bright light sort of suddenly detracts from everything around you.

852
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,920
And you're like, I'd rather have a tablet that I can turn down the brightness, look

853
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:17,680
at what's in front of me and look at it.

854
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:21,960
And then also, you know, like you say, have a split of the camera feed that I can look

855
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:27,240
at to refer to and then go back and write down notes.

856
00:50:27,240 --> 00:50:30,880
And I love, like, I remember the days when everything was paper.

857
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:32,600
I miss the days when everything was...

858
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:34,520
I mean, it was, it was wonderful.

859
00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:40,600
And I did like the paper days, but I can understand how COVID's obviously changed that as well,

860
00:50:40,600 --> 00:50:45,600
because that was the main reason why we went to electronic is because, you know, us camera

861
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:48,800
assistants would be, you know, touching the camera sheets and so on, and then it would

862
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:53,040
go to post and then they would have to touch the sheets and all of that kind of thing.

863
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:59,440
So it's, you know, it, I made like it under, sorry.

864
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:04,040
It makes sense that we've gone to electronic sheets and you know, now that I've used them

865
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:08,440
for so many jobs as well, it makes sense.

866
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:13,040
And I really enjoy using the electronic sheets because I can just, you know, upload them

867
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:15,000
like that to production.

868
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:17,160
And it's just, it's done as soon as we wrap.

869
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:23,480
So, you know, yes, paper sheets were very similar as well, but then, you know, you couldn't

870
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,840
really pre-anticipate too much with it.

871
00:51:26,840 --> 00:51:33,440
So you know, there was no such thing as auto-fill and all of those kind of things.

872
00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:37,640
And then, you know, if you started to like, you know, when I was doing paper sheets, like

873
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:44,760
I would try not to write down any camera settings until we were actually rolling because again,

874
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:50,400
during, during takes or like, you know, during, you know, you might do one take and then something

875
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:56,400
changes on the camera, whether it's the exposure, like the DOP adjusts the exposure or they

876
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:59,560
go up in ASA and that kind of thing.

877
00:51:59,560 --> 00:52:00,560
So those things were changed.

878
00:52:00,560 --> 00:52:03,640
And then on paper sheets, you have to like cross that out.

879
00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:05,720
It starts to make the sheets look really messy.

880
00:52:05,720 --> 00:52:10,640
Whereas, you know, now on electronic sheets, you've just got the ability to just backspace

881
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:11,640
it.

882
00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:12,640
Yeah.

883
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:17,560
So you can sort of pre-auto fill things, but then you've got quick ability to be able to

884
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:23,040
just change it and it's not messy or, you know, it doesn't make you look bad in front

885
00:52:23,040 --> 00:52:24,040
of poster.

886
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:25,040
I know.

887
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:30,560
And I, I, I, a good camera shape and the less is a life saver, especially when you're dealing

888
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:32,720
with multi-camera set up.

889
00:52:32,720 --> 00:52:35,120
It's really nice to know what each camera is doing.

890
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:36,120
Yes.

891
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:37,720
And it keeps everything consistent.

892
00:52:37,720 --> 00:52:38,720
Yes.

893
00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:43,920
And I'm also like, I try to describe the shot as best as possible as well.

894
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:49,280
It's just so that if, if by any reason there is an error somewhere along the lines, the

895
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:52,080
editor has got that ability to be able to go into the sheet.

896
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:54,920
They know exactly what camera settings it was.

897
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:58,080
They know exactly what shot it was as well.

898
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:01,520
You know, whether it was handheld or, you know, all of those kinds of things.

899
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:08,600
I try to describe it as best as possible so that posts have that opportunity to know exactly

900
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:09,600
what the shot is.

901
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:13,160
There's no, you know, nothing's misconstrued along, along the way.

902
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:18,360
No, and it's the worst feeling in the world looking through an edit and not knowing where

903
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:22,640
you're looking at and knowing which shots what and which scene it's for and going through

904
00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:28,160
the entirety of the thing and scratching your head and going, what am I doing with all this

905
00:53:28,160 --> 00:53:29,160
footage?

906
00:53:29,160 --> 00:53:32,880
Like what's the mission other than the script that I've got?

907
00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:33,880
Yes.

908
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:34,880
Yeah.

909
00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:38,320
Like, cause that's the thing I feel like people don't understand the importance of informing

910
00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:43,840
the editor of all the information as well, because they generally don't see the production.

911
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:46,600
They have never been on set.

912
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:50,080
So they're looking at everything from a separate point of view.

913
00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:51,080
Yeah.

914
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:52,080
From a screen.

915
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:53,080
Yeah.

916
00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:54,080
And then they're going, Oh, is this shot meant to be here?

917
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:55,800
Is this shot meant to be here?

918
00:53:55,800 --> 00:54:01,000
Like, and then the camera notes are literally just, and the continuity notes and everything

919
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:05,960
will go to the post and then the editor can flick through all these notes and go, cool.

920
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:06,960
Okay.

921
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:07,960
That's for that.

922
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:08,960
Yeah.

923
00:54:08,960 --> 00:54:12,640
I can, I can start and they often, I think also people that understand as an editor has

924
00:54:12,640 --> 00:54:16,160
a generally has an assistant unless it's on a low budget, in which case they are their

925
00:54:16,160 --> 00:54:17,160
own assistant.

926
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:18,160
Yes.

927
00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:22,960
And the assistant generally goes and labels everything from the original card label, as

928
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:27,200
well as the camera assistance sometimes in the data wranglers do.

929
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:31,240
Generally, I think it's like second AC can data wrangle as well.

930
00:54:31,240 --> 00:54:32,240
Yes.

931
00:54:32,240 --> 00:54:36,080
And they'll label everything so that by the time it goes to the editor, a lot of that

932
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:41,520
is saved and they know what the data is, what it's telling them, you know, what file formats

933
00:54:41,520 --> 00:54:43,880
it is all in.

934
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:50,360
And a lot of the time, like I found this out recently, because I predominantly edit Premiere

935
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:51,360
Pro.

936
00:54:51,360 --> 00:54:52,360
Yes.

937
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:53,360
Great software.

938
00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:55,560
It's become more of an industry standard now than it used to be.

939
00:54:55,560 --> 00:55:01,520
It used to be considered a very independent indie film, but I think because of the sellability

940
00:55:01,520 --> 00:55:06,200
of it now and its upgradability, it's so useful and user friendly.

941
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:07,200
Yes.

942
00:55:07,200 --> 00:55:08,200
That's a lifesaver.

943
00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:14,840
But I found out my laptop now that it's 2015 has maxed out at 2019 version of Premiere Pro

944
00:55:14,840 --> 00:55:19,480
and cannot see some codecs that I'm very sad about.

945
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:26,400
So I won't register Apple ProRes like certain files and it makes me hurt inside.

946
00:55:26,400 --> 00:55:31,800
So I have to upgrade my laptop, unfortunately, to kind of get a lot of the new files, but

947
00:55:31,800 --> 00:55:35,280
that's how quickly, you know, that's only a space of what, seven years?

948
00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:36,280
Yeah.

949
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:39,200
And codecs and file formats are changing so rapidly.

950
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:40,200
Yeah.

951
00:55:40,200 --> 00:55:45,880
And the scope of things that I think, you know, like Apple ProRes files, I actually

952
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:46,880
like a lot.

953
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,880
They're very useful and user friendly, but also I love the ability that Premiere has

954
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:55,880
where you can flick through, you know, like the camera LUT settings and what like actually

955
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:56,880
it's doing.

956
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,120
So it has a little mini tab inside it.

957
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:02,960
And if you go to the actual footage, you can flick through what setting it is.

958
00:56:02,960 --> 00:56:04,440
So then you can grade it.

959
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:09,000
Cause generally what people, if you don't see it, you'll just see it in it.

960
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:12,480
It's sort of like, I remember once I used to think, oh, this shot's really overexposed.

961
00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:15,840
No, you're just looking through a non-LUT setting.

962
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:16,840
Yes.

963
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:20,400
And generally the camera will just do what it normally thinks and then go, this is too

964
00:56:20,400 --> 00:56:21,400
bright, this too dark.

965
00:56:21,400 --> 00:56:22,400
Cool.

966
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:24,120
That's what I'm going to show you as.

967
00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:28,360
And then the LUT has such a high dynamic range that you can pull all that information out

968
00:56:28,360 --> 00:56:31,600
and do whatever you want with it and fix it.

969
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:34,760
And it's funny because when you don't understand those principles, you think, God, the footage

970
00:56:34,760 --> 00:56:35,760
is ruined.

971
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:36,760
Yes.

972
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:37,760
Oh goodness.

973
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:39,400
And it's the biggest stress.

974
00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:43,920
And I think I remember when I was very young looking at footage and going crap, everything

975
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:46,680
sucks and it all looks terrible.

976
00:56:46,680 --> 00:56:52,640
Now as an adult and understanding how cameras work, your high dynamic range and the same

977
00:56:52,640 --> 00:56:55,240
principle now happens and applies to audio.

978
00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:59,640
Audio has a massive range now than it used to where you'd only be able to record things

979
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:08,420
in 16 bit, very shallow and then peak distortion in the analog days would happen very easily.

980
00:57:08,420 --> 00:57:11,880
And now we've got the wonderful world of digital distortion, which is a whole other kettle

981
00:57:11,880 --> 00:57:14,080
of fish.

982
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:17,000
But then the same thing of having, if you didn't have your camera settings to the correct

983
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:20,440
settings, it would be very noticeable.

984
00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:21,440
Yes.

985
00:57:21,440 --> 00:57:27,120
And I think nowadays like high dynamic range does have the ability to, you know, fix a

986
00:57:27,120 --> 00:57:29,080
lot of your learning abilities.

987
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:30,700
It does teach you very quickly.

988
00:57:30,700 --> 00:57:35,440
You can fix white balance very easily in post a lot more than you used to be able to, where

989
00:57:35,440 --> 00:57:38,680
it was like stuck to a certain way.

990
00:57:38,680 --> 00:57:43,760
But I have still been on some student sets where they don't understand what log is, or

991
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:50,440
they think that fixing your camera to the camera settings is better than going to the

992
00:57:50,440 --> 00:57:51,440
log settings.

993
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:57,880
I'm like, no, always go to raw log format because it, it gives you all of that information.

994
00:57:57,880 --> 00:57:58,880
Yeah.

995
00:57:58,880 --> 00:57:59,880
It gives you all of it.

996
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:03,520
And then you've got the option to actually play with it as well.

997
00:58:03,520 --> 00:58:08,280
So, cause I remember when I first got my camera, I didn't realise it wasn't just set to JPEG.

998
00:58:08,280 --> 00:58:12,760
So I got all these JPEG images back and I was like, well, I can't do anything with these.

999
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:15,480
Like I've got bugger all I can do.

1000
00:58:15,480 --> 00:58:19,240
And then suddenly you discover in the sub menu and it was a Canon camera.

1001
00:58:19,240 --> 00:58:25,320
I was like still learning it's a, um, uh, Mark four, five day great camera.

1002
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:29,240
I still use it to this day, but I did have to go like when I first started using it into

1003
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:33,720
the backend and go, Oh, there's a setting to get raw as well.

1004
00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:39,360
And it has a few settings and you can get more exclusively and I choose to get raw and

1005
00:58:39,360 --> 00:58:40,360
JPEG.

1006
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:46,480
So I have a lower format and I can send, generally send that to people so they can look at the

1007
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:48,520
files while I'm editing them.

1008
00:58:48,520 --> 00:58:52,960
And go, okay, well I've got the Canon raw file so I can just play around with these.

1009
00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:58,240
But at least the people have got the unedited versions and I can just scan through whatever

1010
00:58:58,240 --> 00:58:59,240
they like.

1011
00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:02,900
Um, but yeah, like a lot of people just don't look at your sub settings.

1012
00:59:02,900 --> 00:59:07,720
Like we say, where it's like, you've got all these like, um, you know, but I mean, also

1013
00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:11,240
when you're in a, you know, like what's it, what's a horror experience that you had on

1014
00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:16,480
a short film when you were doing that, you were just like, this is not how you deal with

1015
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:23,720
a camera like settings or you just like had this overwhelming like all anxiety about it.

1016
00:59:23,720 --> 00:59:30,200
It wouldn't, it wouldn't probably be too much about the actual camera settings per se, but

1017
00:59:30,200 --> 00:59:38,480
it was, it was again, back towards the scheduling side of things that yes, it was, um, I had

1018
00:59:38,480 --> 00:59:44,560
a horror story from one that was in, um, Newcastle.

1019
00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:50,480
So we'd all traveled up to Newcastle and yeah, there was a, you know, a young director on

1020
00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:58,100
that and, um, yeah, we just had to, while we were actually filming the short film itself,

1021
00:59:58,100 --> 01:00:01,120
it was just, it was taking way too long.

1022
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:09,520
Um, there was, uh, a lot of shots that kind of came spontaneity, like on spontaneity and

1023
01:00:09,520 --> 01:00:11,600
it wasn't like, it wasn't planned stuff.

1024
01:00:11,600 --> 01:00:14,760
So, and it was a night shoot as well.

1025
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:18,360
So, you know, we've only just started in, you know, late afternoon and we're going to

1026
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:26,560
be working into the long hours of the night and it, um, just the real lack of planning

1027
01:00:26,560 --> 01:00:28,340
of shot listing and everything.

1028
01:00:28,340 --> 01:00:32,860
Like you just, you underestimate how important that is.

1029
01:00:32,860 --> 01:00:38,620
And yeah, so it, it basically, it blew over into, you know, we only finished at four o'clock

1030
01:00:38,620 --> 01:00:43,000
or five o'clock in the morning and you know, we were all exhausted.

1031
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:44,000
Everyone's tired.

1032
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,520
The camera department, which, you know, like I was in as well.

1033
01:00:47,520 --> 01:00:53,160
So we had like a DOP and then one of my good friends that was a camera assistant as well.

1034
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:58,040
And we were all just like, we basically spent the next day, like, you know, went back to

1035
01:00:58,040 --> 01:01:04,400
bed, you know, crashed out for ages and then spent the next day, like re-shot listing,

1036
01:01:04,400 --> 01:01:10,880
like this entire short film because it was just taking so long to try and get the coverage

1037
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:16,160
and to get everything that we actually needed as opposed to just things that were, you know,

1038
01:01:16,160 --> 01:01:20,240
on the spontaneous moments like, oh, we could get this shot, we could get that.

1039
01:01:20,240 --> 01:01:25,160
And you know, it starts to throw things right out the window, especially when you're doing

1040
01:01:25,160 --> 01:01:32,000
a night shoot and everybody's tired and we were sort of in a remote-ish location as well.

1041
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:37,280
So in terms of actually getting food for everybody, that was about like 25 minutes away.

1042
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:42,840
So, you know, we'd have to wait, you know, quite a decent time to actually get some form

1043
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:45,280
of sustenance for the crew.

1044
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:52,960
So, you know, it was just a very interesting experience that, you know, you underestimate

1045
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:55,800
how important that kind of thing is.

1046
01:01:55,800 --> 01:01:56,800
Yeah.

1047
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:02,840
And yeah, like, you know, like at least we had someone who was quite professional behind

1048
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:04,520
the camera as well.

1049
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:09,320
So he also had a lot of good ideas with how we could speed things up.

1050
01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:14,200
And then as a camera team, we sort of worked together to re-shot list this entire film

1051
01:02:14,200 --> 01:02:16,880
and it was just, yeah, it was very interesting.

1052
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:17,880
Oh my God.

1053
01:02:17,880 --> 01:02:19,880
I do not envy you.

1054
01:02:19,880 --> 01:02:21,880
No, no.

1055
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:28,760
But that reminds me of like many horror stories when I was younger of trying to do shorts

1056
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:31,920
and just like learning as you go.

1057
01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:36,520
I don't think anyone teaches you that when you're making stuff young as well, like when

1058
01:02:36,520 --> 01:02:41,000
you're doing like short films or you're doing like stuff like that.

1059
01:02:41,000 --> 01:02:47,320
And I've worked with some great DOPs and some not great DOPs, it really depends, it fluctuates.

1060
01:02:47,320 --> 01:02:52,880
But I do remember being on one set and I'm still good friends with all the actors and

1061
01:02:52,880 --> 01:03:00,800
crew and like minus the DOP, which was the only person who I was like, yeah.

1062
01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:08,840
But I remember particularly, yeah, a lot of the shots were decided by them on the day

1063
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:12,760
and they didn't agree initially with what the shots I wanted.

1064
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:19,200
And I think that was where a lot of the production woes happened and a lot of it just ended up,

1065
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:23,080
we originally were going to do both days of the weekend and then it was only one day and

1066
01:03:23,080 --> 01:03:25,040
then we were like, okay, well, let's reschedule.

1067
01:03:25,040 --> 01:03:28,600
And then all the actors were like, well, we can't because we've got like other things

1068
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,720
going on and it's like, well, that's a nightmare.

1069
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:34,300
And it became, I remember I got to the end of the day and I was like, I've shot nothing

1070
01:03:34,300 --> 01:03:35,560
that I actually wanted to shot.

1071
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:40,920
What I've shot, what we've ended up shooting was like five different things that were unrelated

1072
01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:41,920
and terrible.

1073
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:47,240
And I remember we went even into overtime, like we were going and I remember I had to

1074
01:03:47,240 --> 01:03:50,680
call like quit for the day because I was like, I'm tired.

1075
01:03:50,680 --> 01:03:51,880
All the actors are tired.

1076
01:03:51,880 --> 01:03:53,880
No one cares anymore.

1077
01:03:53,880 --> 01:03:59,640
And what has actually happened is you've just not listened, unfortunately, to anything that

1078
01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:05,040
anyone actually wanted and have gone on a whim hoping that it might fall together.

1079
01:04:05,040 --> 01:04:07,760
And I was like, not happy with the results.

1080
01:04:07,760 --> 01:04:12,880
So I definitely think that, and I've definitely watched a lot of short films as well where

1081
01:04:12,880 --> 01:04:18,680
it's like, sometimes it is logistically down to the camera side of the department or the

1082
01:04:18,680 --> 01:04:22,000
sound side of the department or anything that, or there's just like producer or director

1083
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:23,000
or whatever.

1084
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:29,880
But it's one of those things that when it all comes together, it all works really well.

1085
01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:36,720
And I've worked with some amazing DOPs who have thought very much outside their box and

1086
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:42,080
like collaborating, but then I've worked with others who would like very much not enjoy

1087
01:04:42,080 --> 01:04:43,080
any of that process.

1088
01:04:43,080 --> 01:04:44,080
No, not at all.

1089
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:46,320
And I'm like, oh, okay.

1090
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:47,760
Tell me what you want out of it.

1091
01:04:47,760 --> 01:04:51,360
Because you've got to meet in the middle when you're a director or a camera operator or

1092
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:54,840
something and you've got to find this mid ground, whether it's a big production or an

1093
01:04:54,840 --> 01:04:58,440
independent film, you've got to find like something.

1094
01:04:58,440 --> 01:05:02,720
But I do agree with you with short films in particular.

1095
01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:03,720
And it's not all the case.

1096
01:05:03,720 --> 01:05:11,240
It's not, you know, whether it depends on the film, but I think some of them are less,

1097
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:15,360
I want to say less well thought out than others.

1098
01:05:15,360 --> 01:05:20,280
And the ones that are like phenomenally thought out, you know, and it can't be, it's not always

1099
01:05:20,280 --> 01:05:21,280
down to the script.

1100
01:05:21,280 --> 01:05:24,680
Sometimes the script is great and what you see on screen is terrible.

1101
01:05:24,680 --> 01:05:25,680
Yes, sometimes.

1102
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:33,120
Like, and that's through just translation of, but I mean, it's kind of like that blanket

1103
01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:38,840
slate of you can't blame just every, you know, you can't be like, it's the entire cruise

1104
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:44,000
fault because it's just so many components to what actually there's a lot that goes into

1105
01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:45,000
it.

1106
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:46,000
Yeah.

1107
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:49,840
And like, yeah, just the horror stories that I think about, like, and it's always every

1108
01:05:49,840 --> 01:05:50,960
day is a learning day.

1109
01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:51,960
That's what I say.

1110
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:52,960
Every day you're learning something new.

1111
01:05:52,960 --> 01:05:59,440
Like, I remember like, you know, 2018 me is not the same as now.

1112
01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:02,000
And that's four years different.

1113
01:06:02,000 --> 01:06:06,560
And you know what works and what doesn't and kind of go, okay, well, what can I challenge

1114
01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:11,480
myself on to make this product worthwhile?

1115
01:06:11,480 --> 01:06:16,280
But I've definitely also, I think, and I don't know if you agree with this, but I definitely

1116
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:20,800
think there are some people like we're both very driven people, but I think in some people

1117
01:06:20,800 --> 01:06:25,920
in this industry think that drive and being, you know, you know, efficient and good at

1118
01:06:25,920 --> 01:06:32,320
your job or enjoying it is very different to what, you know, like is to have being the

1119
01:06:32,320 --> 01:06:35,640
big glory, you know, big leagues and stuff like that.

1120
01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:38,900
And I think, yeah, obviously everyone's a big break and stuff, but I think that's the

1121
01:06:38,900 --> 01:06:46,440
underside of what actually being driven is because being driven and engaged in your work

1122
01:06:46,440 --> 01:06:51,160
means you're enjoying in the ability and you wanting to continually learn.

1123
01:06:51,160 --> 01:06:57,160
Whereas I think if you're trying to get to a point where you're top tier big leagues,

1124
01:06:57,160 --> 01:06:59,800
that's not really our direction.

1125
01:06:59,800 --> 01:07:04,840
It's a lot about challenging yourself and it's a lot about the actual journey itself.

1126
01:07:04,840 --> 01:07:11,480
Like it's very, you know, like I'm just incredibly thankful for those around me as well for giving

1127
01:07:11,480 --> 01:07:13,920
me the opportunities that we have to.

1128
01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:18,600
So, you know, that one, that's certainly something that I don't try to lose track of all the

1129
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:19,600
time.

1130
01:07:19,600 --> 01:07:26,440
I'm always trying to up the ante with what I'm doing as well, like physically on set,

1131
01:07:26,440 --> 01:07:29,960
making sure that I'm really, really on top of things.

1132
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:34,400
And obviously keeping an eye on my team as well, making sure that they're okay too, because

1133
01:07:34,400 --> 01:07:37,400
it's just, it's so important to look out for your team.

1134
01:07:37,400 --> 01:07:43,780
Like if someone's tired or just, you know, if they've got, you know, personal things

1135
01:07:43,780 --> 01:07:47,920
going on or something, you know, just always looking out for them and going, okay, like

1136
01:07:47,920 --> 01:07:50,520
are you actually okay?

1137
01:07:50,520 --> 01:07:51,520
And so on.

1138
01:07:51,520 --> 01:07:57,640
And yeah, like obviously just what I was saying about like challenging yourself as well, like,

1139
01:07:57,640 --> 01:08:03,600
you know, you don't want to, you don't want to stay in a particular, you know, zone in

1140
01:08:03,600 --> 01:08:09,800
terms of, you know, like your career for too long because, you know, otherwise then it

1141
01:08:09,800 --> 01:08:12,920
will just sort of, it will become a bit too repeat.

1142
01:08:12,920 --> 01:08:13,920
Yeah.

1143
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:18,880
So for me, I try to always like challenge myself and be like, okay, for this next job,

1144
01:08:18,880 --> 01:08:19,880
what can I do better?

1145
01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:21,920
What can I try to improve on?

1146
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:25,400
And, you know, I talk to colleagues as well and just say, look, you know, how can we make

1147
01:08:25,400 --> 01:08:27,760
this more efficient and so on?

1148
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:32,400
Like, especially because it's just so important these days with the time constraints that

1149
01:08:32,400 --> 01:08:37,280
we've got and all of that kind of thing to just be very efficient.

1150
01:08:37,280 --> 01:08:43,920
So I'm always trying to work on, you know, how we can be, you know, as, you know, efficient

1151
01:08:43,920 --> 01:08:45,640
as possible as a camera tech.

1152
01:08:45,640 --> 01:08:46,640
Yeah.

1153
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:47,640
Yeah.

1154
01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:48,640
Cause is your main career goal?

1155
01:08:48,640 --> 01:08:52,440
Like, cause I'm, I imagine this has asked quite a fair bit of what a career goal for

1156
01:08:52,440 --> 01:08:56,320
camera assist is, but is your main career goal then to become a DOP?

1157
01:08:56,320 --> 01:09:03,600
I definitely would like to definitely would love to operate at some point as well.

1158
01:09:03,600 --> 01:09:08,200
And then, you know, eventually DOP, but it's, it's, it's not something that I mean, a rush

1159
01:09:08,200 --> 01:09:09,200
to get towards.

1160
01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:13,920
Like I'm quite content with being a camera assistant for, you know, for quite some time

1161
01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:18,980
and you know, quite happy to, you know, work alongside of, you know, like I've been very

1162
01:09:18,980 --> 01:09:23,920
fortunate to have worked alongside of so many amazing DOPs.

1163
01:09:23,920 --> 01:09:28,080
So just, you know, now that I'm getting more and more used to camera assisting, I'm starting

1164
01:09:28,080 --> 01:09:34,080
to find a little bit more time on set to just observe what the DOP is actually doing and

1165
01:09:34,080 --> 01:09:38,280
the choices that they're making with how they light things as well.

1166
01:09:38,280 --> 01:09:42,120
So I'm trying to always be a little bit more aware of that side of thing.

1167
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:47,240
And then trying to also ask questions every now and then not necessarily on set, but I

1168
01:09:47,240 --> 01:09:52,520
might try and think of a question, type it out in an email and then just send it a bit

1169
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:57,480
later because you know, on set everything's, you know, the DOP is always just, you know,

1170
01:09:57,480 --> 01:10:02,520
on all the time thinking about, you know, the next setup, the next lighting, you know,

1171
01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:04,760
the next way that they're going to light and so on.

1172
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:08,560
So there's so much that they're thinking about in time.

1173
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:13,080
So you know, again, it's, you know, I want to learn things as well, but you know, not

1174
01:10:13,080 --> 01:10:16,800
right in that moment where they're, you know, they're busy.

1175
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:21,560
Yeah, no, and that's entirely, entirely fair.

1176
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:26,280
I mean, and also like this industry is becoming very much like there's a huge female camera

1177
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:27,280
team now.

1178
01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:30,600
Yeah, massively even compared to probably when we were at uni.

1179
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:33,840
Yeah, it's so true.

1180
01:10:33,840 --> 01:10:39,200
Does that inspire you as well to be sort of like, you know, as a woman going into this

1181
01:10:39,200 --> 01:10:40,200
industry?

1182
01:10:40,200 --> 01:10:41,200
Yeah, absolutely.

1183
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:42,480
It certainly does inspire me.

1184
01:10:42,480 --> 01:10:49,480
And it also, you know, especially now that I'm up to like being an a camera assistant,

1185
01:10:49,480 --> 01:10:57,800
like I've got a little bit more opportunity to, to recruit people, you know, recruit different

1186
01:10:57,800 --> 01:11:04,040
people as well in terms of, you know, when we get an attachment on board, you know, often

1187
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:08,120
it's not often my choice, but I can obviously be like, Hey, you know, I've heard of this

1188
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:11,080
person through afters or that kind of thing.

1189
01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:16,120
There's, you know, so many different ways that we can, you know, bring, you know, not

1190
01:11:16,120 --> 01:11:24,240
just females, but also non-binaries and everybody into it as well and give, give people opportunities.

1191
01:11:24,240 --> 01:11:29,880
So because, you know, it was, you know, traditionally back in the day, it was very, very, you know,

1192
01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:31,800
boys club kind of industry.

1193
01:11:31,800 --> 01:11:36,720
So I'm really happy to see that there is this transition happening.

1194
01:11:36,720 --> 01:11:45,960
And it's also like with the ACS, the recent ACS study that they did as well, the lens,

1195
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:50,360
I think it was lens wide open thing, something like that, a wider lens.

1196
01:11:50,360 --> 01:11:52,240
I think that's what it was.

1197
01:11:52,240 --> 01:11:59,160
So the study had a lot of, um, surprising statistics, but also sometimes not surprising

1198
01:11:59,160 --> 01:12:05,680
as well, because, you know, in terms of there not being any indigenous DOPs, like not many

1199
01:12:05,680 --> 01:12:09,160
indigenous women DOPs out there as well.

1200
01:12:09,160 --> 01:12:13,120
Like, you know, so, you know, when I looked at the stats actually presented in front of

1201
01:12:13,120 --> 01:12:16,920
me, I'm like, okay, well like, you know, this is shocking, but it's also not surprising

1202
01:12:16,920 --> 01:12:22,160
because I literally, I haven't seen an indigenous female DOP on set.

1203
01:12:22,160 --> 01:12:28,360
So, you know, there, there are things that certainly did rock me and we're sort of like,

1204
01:12:28,360 --> 01:12:33,920
wow, this is really horrible to see that, you know, especially with major feature films

1205
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:34,920
as well.

1206
01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:37,680
You know, there's not many female DOPs out there.

1207
01:12:37,680 --> 01:12:43,400
You know, there's Mandy Walker, um, and she's done such an amazing job as well.

1208
01:12:43,400 --> 01:12:50,480
Um, but it's just in terms of female DOPs getting that offer to work on huge major feature

1209
01:12:50,480 --> 01:12:51,480
films.

1210
01:12:51,480 --> 01:12:53,920
It's very rare and it's, and it's sad.

1211
01:12:53,920 --> 01:12:56,240
It is as well.

1212
01:12:56,240 --> 01:13:04,280
And I like, you know, I think that we are going into a very forward era more so now

1213
01:13:04,280 --> 01:13:07,640
when, you know, like, um, you know, going forward.

1214
01:13:07,640 --> 01:13:12,240
And I think it's also like a strong belief of mine where it's like given, give, you know,

1215
01:13:12,240 --> 01:13:18,880
people, um, you know, of, um, you know, non-binary gender fluid, like, you know, and, and women

1216
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:26,960
an opportunity to work in tech roles that are much more, you know, like, and branch

1217
01:13:26,960 --> 01:13:32,520
out that opportunity for these people to have opportunities that might not have happened

1218
01:13:32,520 --> 01:13:37,040
in a white cis male kind of environment, which was very much the industry like 15 years ago

1219
01:13:37,040 --> 01:13:43,480
or 10 years ago, because it's like, I definitely think that we, we, we walk this fine line

1220
01:13:43,480 --> 01:13:48,760
especially and you know, like I've worked under management that if you know, said, oh,

1221
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:52,960
if women get pregnant, it's a big burden when they take maternity leave and all that stuff.

1222
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:59,800
And it's just, or, you know, like they specifically avoid people of, you know, the LGBTQIA plus

1223
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:05,040
community and, you know, be like, no, I don't want to deal with something that's uncomfortable

1224
01:14:05,040 --> 01:14:09,400
to me. And it's like, but that's progression. Like, yeah, that's just, that's right. That's

1225
01:14:09,400 --> 01:14:13,320
all part of it. Yeah. You've got to allow these people opportunities and a lot, you

1226
01:14:13,320 --> 01:14:18,200
know, and it's the same with like, you know, hiring just white people. Like, yeah, it's

1227
01:14:18,200 --> 01:14:23,760
just constantly, um, a big, a big thing, but I, I, I've always like, and I've always thought

1228
01:14:23,760 --> 01:14:29,000
about this every majority of the sets I've worked in on, um, you know, whether it's,

1229
01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:36,160
uh, my inset or quite a few others, um, have either been very LGBT, um, friendly or, um,

1230
01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:43,520
also just very women centric. Like there's a lot of women on set, which is honestly the

1231
01:14:43,520 --> 01:14:46,840
nicest thing because I think it's such a, for me, it's such a high school thing where

1232
01:14:46,840 --> 01:14:52,080
I like, I like, you know, I like having women on set and I like having people on set who

1233
01:14:52,080 --> 01:14:56,840
are just very forward thinking. Um, and I just find it very easy to work with women

1234
01:14:56,840 --> 01:15:04,040
as well, but I think on other sets, um, it's yeah. You know, when I just see a very straight

1235
01:15:04,040 --> 01:15:07,240
white man, I'm like, I don't know what to do with half of you. Like, because you're

1236
01:15:07,240 --> 01:15:11,640
all like weird and uncomfortable with anything different. And that's not to say that all

1237
01:15:11,640 --> 01:15:16,560
straight men are like that, but there is a lot. I've worked with a lot of like very,

1238
01:15:16,560 --> 01:15:22,400
uh, straight men who just don't know what to do with like power thrown elsewhere. Yes.

1239
01:15:22,400 --> 01:15:28,080
Um, yeah, well, I definitely, you know, when I first, um, became a member of the ACS and

1240
01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:33,880
went to one of the, um, the meetings as well, like it was like, um, and it was brought up

1241
01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:38,720
in the wider lens report as well that one of the cinematographers that they interviewed,

1242
01:15:38,720 --> 01:15:43,880
like a female one, she said, look, it was very intimidating because, you know, a lot

1243
01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:49,360
of the room was middle-aged white men. Yeah. So, and I experienced exactly the same thing

1244
01:15:49,360 --> 01:15:53,600
as well. I went in the room and went, wow, okay, there's, there's really not many women

1245
01:15:53,600 --> 01:16:00,720
here, like not in a DOP perspective, not in a camera perspective, like at all. So, you

1246
01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:06,240
know, certainly over the last few years, it's definitely changed a lot. And I've seen like

1247
01:16:06,240 --> 01:16:13,200
a lot of progression, which is just awesome. And, and that's why when, when I go onto set

1248
01:16:13,200 --> 01:16:21,680
and I've got, you know, either, um, you know, LGBTQ, um, or a, um, like a female camera

1249
01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:25,600
assistant as well, like a, like, you know, a young junior in our team, like I'm always

1250
01:16:25,600 --> 01:16:30,800
trying to bring them up as best as I can and try and like, spend the time with them and

1251
01:16:30,800 --> 01:16:35,600
actually go, okay, you know, this is how we do things in the camera department and so

1252
01:16:35,600 --> 01:16:40,160
on, because it's all, it's all part of this progression. And I think like some people

1253
01:16:40,160 --> 01:16:45,600
get like a bit, um, lost in the aspect of like, oh, but they're, you know, competitors

1254
01:16:45,600 --> 01:16:49,760
because you know, they're coming up in the camera department and that kind of thing.

1255
01:16:49,760 --> 01:16:55,440
So there's, I kind of try to ignore that attitude and go, but this is part of the progression,

1256
01:16:55,440 --> 01:17:00,080
you know, we need to actually give people opportunities to be able to come up in the

1257
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:06,160
camera department as well. So, and that's, you know, that's why when I was, um, because

1258
01:17:06,160 --> 01:17:11,600
I volunteered on the behind the scenes of this wider lens, um, report that the ACS did.

1259
01:17:11,600 --> 01:17:17,040
So, um, you know, it's when I was chatting to some of the cinematographers that were,

1260
01:17:17,040 --> 01:17:22,880
that were part of it. Um, I said, look, you know, that's just everything's, you know,

1261
01:17:22,880 --> 01:17:28,240
in terms of bringing up attachments through, through, uh, through films or TV shows or

1262
01:17:28,240 --> 01:17:32,840
something like, it's all part of that progression of, you know, allowing more opportunity to

1263
01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:33,840
more people.

1264
01:17:33,840 --> 01:17:39,440
Yeah. I mean, it's also like there's a lot of trial and tribulation as well in, you know,

1265
01:17:39,440 --> 01:17:45,280
particularly that kind of side of the industry as well, when you're, you know, a person,

1266
01:17:45,280 --> 01:17:50,040
um, you know, in the, um, queer community as well as like a woman, you know, going into

1267
01:17:50,040 --> 01:17:55,120
this tech field because there's a lot of like, there's still controversy over it.

1268
01:17:55,120 --> 01:17:56,120
Yes.

1269
01:17:56,120 --> 01:18:00,320
Um, which is bizarre to me, like we live in 2022 and it's like, it should just be done.

1270
01:18:00,320 --> 01:18:06,040
Um, but I do think that, you know, going, going forward as well, it's like, you know,

1271
01:18:06,040 --> 01:18:10,600
and I do know that like some of my friends, you know, specifically who work in tech fields

1272
01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:18,840
try to avoid, you know, like having personal relations with anyone inside, particularly

1273
01:18:18,840 --> 01:18:25,480
men in the industry. And also, um, particularly like it's very common, um, just for people

1274
01:18:25,480 --> 01:18:30,680
to date in the industry and avoid it. Um, so I think that's something that I always

1275
01:18:30,680 --> 01:18:35,000
try and like, just sort of tell people it's like, it's good to have a life outside.

1276
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:36,000
Yes.

1277
01:18:36,000 --> 01:18:43,280
Um, or date someone who isn't always in your role. Like it works for some, but like my

1278
01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:49,160
partner is in the industry, but we work in very different roles and that makes life easier

1279
01:18:49,160 --> 01:18:53,760
because then we don't sort of think about it and we have other interests that kind of

1280
01:18:53,760 --> 01:18:59,440
fuel it. But, um, I think that, yeah, some people have met and, and if it works for you,

1281
01:18:59,440 --> 01:19:04,400
it works for you, but sometimes, you know, it can create weird scenarios on set because

1282
01:19:04,400 --> 01:19:09,080
it's like, and I often used to think this said it like sometimes being on a set when

1283
01:19:09,080 --> 01:19:15,600
close proximity to everyone can become a very incestuous, dangerous time. And you know,

1284
01:19:15,600 --> 01:19:22,440
particularly it's mostly with the actors because that tends to be what actors like end up doing.

1285
01:19:22,440 --> 01:19:27,400
Um, but it's not always the case, but yeah, like there's a lot of, um, I think with crew

1286
01:19:27,400 --> 01:19:32,320
and stuff, you know, you just kind of, um, like most of them are married or, you know,

1287
01:19:32,320 --> 01:19:36,380
have families, but then a lot of the younger people sort of see it as opportunities to

1288
01:19:36,380 --> 01:19:40,760
meet people and mingle and then, you know, and then experience like maybe dating and

1289
01:19:40,760 --> 01:19:44,960
stuff like that. And I think that's always like an industry side that I remember, like

1290
01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:50,080
people talked about when I started in the industry, but I think is fading. Like, and

1291
01:19:50,080 --> 01:19:54,660
people have more of a, like a modern and common lens to go, okay, cool. I'm going to sort

1292
01:19:54,660 --> 01:20:00,000
of keep my distance. Yes. Like we do talk about it before, like, you know, how we spend

1293
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:03,160
a lot of time with each other and overtime. And that's what, where you fall into that

1294
01:20:03,160 --> 01:20:08,680
pattern of going, well, I see this person every day. So why not? Yeah. Yeah, that's

1295
01:20:08,680 --> 01:20:13,360
right. And I like, so I definitely agree with it and it definitely works for some people

1296
01:20:13,360 --> 01:20:19,800
here and there, but I definitely enjoy having, you know, like seeing other people that are,

1297
01:20:19,800 --> 01:20:24,640
that are not in the industry and going, okay, well, like this kind of gives me a break from

1298
01:20:24,640 --> 01:20:29,120
it, you know, cause like, especially when you're working with people a lot on set, it

1299
01:20:29,120 --> 01:20:34,600
kind of, it becomes a very family nature as well. Like, you know, especially, you know,

1300
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:39,400
not really the big feature jobs because there are just so many people in those jobs that,

1301
01:20:39,400 --> 01:20:44,840
you know, sometimes you might email, but you'll never see them in real life. Yeah. Whereas

1302
01:20:44,840 --> 01:20:53,320
TV shows and so on, like, you know, it becomes a very sort of family kind of, you know, a

1303
01:20:53,320 --> 01:20:58,120
very family orientated kind of thing, because, you know, yes, you're, yes, you're, you know,

1304
01:20:58,120 --> 01:21:03,480
seeing them every single day. You know, they're your colleagues as well, but you, you know,

1305
01:21:03,480 --> 01:21:08,240
you might not agree on particular things here and there. So again, it, you know, it creates

1306
01:21:08,240 --> 01:21:14,800
that family kind of aspect. You want to work as a team, but you also, you also have your

1307
01:21:14,800 --> 01:21:20,400
differing opinions and, and that kind of thing as well. So it's, you know, it's, it's such

1308
01:21:20,400 --> 01:21:26,000
a, I think it's such a wonderful thing sometimes like on set as well, when, you know, you can

1309
01:21:26,000 --> 01:21:31,520
have such a close knit team and you can really enjoy each other's company, but just, you

1310
01:21:31,520 --> 01:21:39,200
know, as really good colleagues as well. Yeah. And like, do you find, do you find that like,

1311
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:44,400
you know, with, with like, because I remember when I was in the dating like field that explaining

1312
01:21:44,400 --> 01:21:49,360
to people when you did, you dated people outside of the industry was a very difficult conversation.

1313
01:21:49,360 --> 01:21:54,960
It definitely is like it still is. And I think like, unfortunately COVID kind of brought

1314
01:21:54,960 --> 01:21:59,920
up like a very, you know, because of the singles bubble that they brought in and everything

1315
01:21:59,920 --> 01:22:05,960
as well. I think unfortunately the modern dating game is quite toxic nowadays that, you

1316
01:22:05,960 --> 01:22:10,960
know, there's a lot of this hookup culture going on and it's just, it's, it's quite sad.

1317
01:22:10,960 --> 01:22:17,560
And me trying to express to like another guy and just say, look, you know, this is my industry.

1318
01:22:17,560 --> 01:22:22,880
This is sort of how we work. You know, the hours aren't always the best. And you know,

1319
01:22:22,880 --> 01:22:28,000
sometimes I'm tired on weekends. There's, you know, so sometimes I think it intimidates

1320
01:22:28,000 --> 01:22:32,560
them a little bit because it's like, they're like, oh, you know, you don't, you don't always

1321
01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:36,680
have time. And I'm like, yes, I don't always have time, but it doesn't mean that I want

1322
01:22:36,680 --> 01:22:43,400
to like, you know, just, you know, do work and that's it. You know, it's such a, it's

1323
01:22:43,400 --> 01:22:49,120
such a, you know, a balance. That's why I cherish my weekends and, and so on, because

1324
01:22:49,120 --> 01:22:55,600
you know, there it's just such an important, an important aspect to have such a balance

1325
01:22:55,600 --> 01:23:01,400
when you are working on set, especially long forms. It can, it can get quite tiring and

1326
01:23:01,400 --> 01:23:06,160
it can, you know, you can be doing, you know, consecutive night shoots as well. So it can

1327
01:23:06,160 --> 01:23:11,840
really mess with your body clock, let alone everything else that's going on in your life.

1328
01:23:11,840 --> 01:23:18,320
So you know, that, that's certainly one thing that I've had, you know, sort of, you know,

1329
01:23:18,320 --> 01:23:24,360
a lot of, you know, issues trying to be like, okay, you know, this is, this is how the industry

1330
01:23:24,360 --> 01:23:28,880
rolls and unfortunately it's not a nine to five job, you know, as much as, as much as

1331
01:23:28,880 --> 01:23:35,160
I loved having a nine to five job, you know, a few years ago when I used to work at LEMAC,

1332
01:23:35,160 --> 01:23:40,060
I guess it was, you know, kind of in the industry, but it wasn't, it wasn't necessarily what

1333
01:23:40,060 --> 01:23:47,980
I wanted to do exactly. So, yeah, so moving forward, it was just a very, it's still a

1334
01:23:47,980 --> 01:23:52,780
tough conversation trying to be like, look, you know, this is unfortunately just the way

1335
01:23:52,780 --> 01:23:58,560
the industry is and I can't always control the hours, but I'll obviously do my best to

1336
01:23:58,560 --> 01:24:04,320
sort of work around it. And yeah, so that, that's definitely been a tricky side.

1337
01:24:04,320 --> 01:24:11,080
Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean, like, I think my relationship before I started the industry and because

1338
01:24:11,080 --> 01:24:17,000
of the industry, I was like very, like it's a make or break relationship as well. And,

1339
01:24:17,000 --> 01:24:22,600
um, you know, I was constantly tired. I was constantly fatigued and I, and I remember

1340
01:24:22,600 --> 01:24:27,400
like when I, it's particularly when I was like doing, you know, my single years and

1341
01:24:27,400 --> 01:24:31,000
I was going on, you know, the dating apps and trying to meet people. I remember I met

1342
01:24:31,000 --> 01:24:36,040
a lot of people who did not get it. And they were like, Oh, so why do you want your alone

1343
01:24:36,040 --> 01:24:41,840
time? It's cause I'm tired. And I really just don't want to see people. And that's an entirely

1344
01:24:41,840 --> 01:24:46,240
valid reason, but there is a side of, you know, when people don't work in the trade,

1345
01:24:46,240 --> 01:24:51,340
they think you're ignoring them. And a lot of their own self anxieties can come out.

1346
01:24:51,340 --> 01:24:56,340
And it's not like that at all. Like it's, you know, and when you sort of like, and my

1347
01:24:56,340 --> 01:25:02,560
parents to this day still do not get it. Like my mom, you know, has no idea what, like how

1348
01:25:02,560 --> 01:25:06,960
I do my hours and she still goes and you know, it's like, Oh, you, you know, are you okay?

1349
01:25:06,960 --> 01:25:12,960
And it's like, I'm tired. Oh, you're always tired. It's like, well, yes. Cause I do weird

1350
01:25:12,960 --> 01:25:13,960
shifts.

1351
01:25:13,960 --> 01:25:20,080
Yeah. Yeah. And I think I've also like sort of, you know, lost, um, prospective relationships

1352
01:25:20,080 --> 01:25:25,320
as well, because they've just been intimidated by the hours. Like, especially since, you

1353
01:25:25,320 --> 01:25:29,680
know, like I'm now getting to the age where like, you know, people are starting to settle

1354
01:25:29,680 --> 01:25:34,200
down and that kind of thing as well. So, you know, I think some guys kind of view it and

1355
01:25:34,200 --> 01:25:38,600
be like, Oh, you know, so are you actually going to be home to look after the kids and

1356
01:25:38,600 --> 01:25:42,480
all of that kind of thing? And they kind of, I think they overthink it a little bit too

1357
01:25:42,480 --> 01:25:47,800
much because it's like, well, you know, when it, when it actually comes to family time,

1358
01:25:47,800 --> 01:25:52,080
then, you know, tools down, you know, make, make some time for it, you know, that kind

1359
01:25:52,080 --> 01:25:57,040
of thing. Cause you know, like there's amazing cinematographers like Reed Marano that, you

1360
01:25:57,040 --> 01:26:01,640
know, she was like, what, seven or eight months pregnant. She was still filming on set. Like,

1361
01:26:01,640 --> 01:26:06,200
yeah, she's just, she's doing it. She's just in there. She's in the moment. And then as

1362
01:26:06,200 --> 01:26:12,320
soon as, you know, it actually came time to have the family as well. Like she made time

1363
01:26:12,320 --> 01:26:16,400
for that. And, and, you know, I'd be very much the same as well that I'd actually be

1364
01:26:16,400 --> 01:26:21,440
like, okay, well, you know, I want to actually make time for that as well, because it's,

1365
01:26:21,440 --> 01:26:24,720
it's an important aspect to me. So, yeah,

1366
01:26:24,720 --> 01:26:29,160
I absolutely agree. And when like one of my coworkers has just gone on to paternity leave

1367
01:26:29,160 --> 01:26:33,920
and, um, to help his wife out and like, he's just so excited because he's like, Oh, it's

1368
01:26:33,920 --> 01:26:41,480
been time with my son and you know, actually be a dad. And I remember like, you know, that

1369
01:26:41,480 --> 01:26:45,680
most of the people I work with who are great, great people. And yeah, when they go, you

1370
01:26:45,680 --> 01:26:49,520
know, and the ones who don't have families absolutely love, you know, they've, they've

1371
01:26:49,520 --> 01:26:52,560
had their entire career, not having kids. And they're like, yeah, I'm great. Like I

1372
01:26:52,560 --> 01:26:57,240
don't want kids and that's perfectly fine. But yeah, as someone, you know, like I'm like

1373
01:26:57,240 --> 01:27:01,840
doing all the projects that I want to do while I'm young and I don't have kids. And the moment

1374
01:27:01,840 --> 01:27:06,420
I have kids, the priority changes. And I just suddenly go, okay, well, my entire focus is

1375
01:27:06,420 --> 01:27:11,760
on my family and everything unfortunately goes into the second category, which is, you

1376
01:27:11,760 --> 01:27:21,880
know, fine, but it does, it does make you reprioritize your entire life. Um, and I think

1377
01:27:21,880 --> 01:27:25,960
that, you know, it doesn't work for everyone, but I think particularly for me, like I am

1378
01:27:25,960 --> 01:27:32,560
such a family oriented person. I'm always very close with my family. Um, and I think

1379
01:27:32,560 --> 01:27:36,000
that's what I've always tried to bring to like any project that I've ever done is family

1380
01:27:36,000 --> 01:27:41,160
because I love reworking with people. Um, whether it's in a professional or nonprofessional

1381
01:27:41,160 --> 01:27:45,480
capacity, I love spending time with certain people and, um, getting to know them. And

1382
01:27:45,480 --> 01:27:50,160
I think that's what's made particularly with, you know, whether my kids end up having an

1383
01:27:50,160 --> 01:27:55,440
interest in this industry, go them if they do, but I think whatever they choose and whatever

1384
01:27:55,440 --> 01:28:01,080
direction, um, they have, I'm just going to be like being beaming regardless, because

1385
01:28:01,080 --> 01:28:07,280
I do think that as parents, uh, particularly from my parents' generation, like, you know,

1386
01:28:07,280 --> 01:28:10,880
my dad was a photographer and had been for many years. And I think he was the one who

1387
01:28:10,880 --> 01:28:15,960
kind of knew my interests more than my mom did. And my mom was just like, that's nice.

1388
01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:19,600
Like you do create, she's an academic and she was like, you do creative things. And

1389
01:28:19,600 --> 01:28:24,440
my dad was like, this is exciting. I get to see my son do all these things and have a

1390
01:28:24,440 --> 01:28:30,160
life and have like these creative outlets. And, um, I was really influenced by that.

1391
01:28:30,160 --> 01:28:35,000
And I think, you know, like I remember going to long road trips with my dad, like, you

1392
01:28:35,000 --> 01:28:38,800
know, we'd be away for like a month or six weeks or something like that. So, you know,

1393
01:28:38,800 --> 01:28:44,240
he did a lot of traveling. And I remember like as a kid, I didn't think any different.

1394
01:28:44,240 --> 01:28:49,080
And when people talk about nine to five jobs or like gender roles or anything like that,

1395
01:28:49,080 --> 01:28:52,280
and I'm like, I had a stay at home dad and I had a mom who went to work. That was my

1396
01:28:52,280 --> 01:28:59,080
life. That was my brother in my life. So to have anything different and, and, and it's

1397
01:28:59,080 --> 01:29:03,040
why when people go, that's a man's job, or this is like a woman's job, I'm like, no,

1398
01:29:03,040 --> 01:29:08,400
it's anyone's job. Like literally whoever's got a spare hand should go and do that. If

1399
01:29:08,400 --> 01:29:15,560
they've got the time. Like, and I think that, um, you know, for me, I think this, the downside

1400
01:29:15,560 --> 01:29:19,400
of this industry is that perspective where it's like, you know, oh, it's the woman's

1401
01:29:19,400 --> 01:29:24,840
job to care for the child. And it's like, well, no, it's like, sorry. It's, it is both.

1402
01:29:24,840 --> 01:29:28,920
And it's like, whoever's home is going to take care of that child and make sure they're

1403
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:34,280
fed because legally by also requirements and by the law of Australia, that is mass, that

1404
01:29:34,280 --> 01:29:40,240
is murder. If you don't look after your child and it dies, it's child neglect. And I think,

1405
01:29:40,240 --> 01:29:44,840
um, you know, it's just, you do so much for kids and I think that, you know, to give them

1406
01:29:44,840 --> 01:29:52,220
a fair chance and, um, yeah, I, I sort of think that, you know, that's the, the great

1407
01:29:52,220 --> 01:29:55,820
side about the industry, but I also think as, you know, people who, you know, us as

1408
01:29:55,820 --> 01:30:00,520
our age and as young as we are, when we are in 20 years time, when we do have families,

1409
01:30:00,520 --> 01:30:06,840
um, you know, and I think that is much of the perspective is hopefully we can give them

1410
01:30:06,840 --> 01:30:12,320
opportunities that we didn't have. Um, you know, and like we do for new people coming

1411
01:30:12,320 --> 01:30:17,080
into the industry and giving them more and more so that, you know, the next generation

1412
01:30:17,080 --> 01:30:22,240
have a better experience necessarily. We even did, which, you know, might've been hit and

1413
01:30:22,240 --> 01:30:25,920
miss because, you know, we talk about the Australian government, not funding the arts

1414
01:30:25,920 --> 01:30:32,280
and stuff, but you know, like hopefully in, in, you know, I would like to think in 15

1415
01:30:32,280 --> 01:30:36,000
years time that the Australian has quite a booming industry of international capability

1416
01:30:36,000 --> 01:30:42,840
where we are our own house and we aren't just a reliance source of American and English

1417
01:30:42,840 --> 01:30:48,640
production and Chinese markets. Like we are our own big production house because most

1418
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:52,680
of the time you just see the production logos and that's about the extent of the excitement

1419
01:30:52,680 --> 01:30:59,000
that's yeah. Yes. Yeah. Um, and that's what I love so much about. Like there are so many

1420
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:05,160
amazing Australian TV shows out there. Like mystery road is one of them. And I absolutely

1421
01:31:05,160 --> 01:31:10,920
love it. Not only because like it showcases our Australian land, but it also showcases

1422
01:31:10,920 --> 01:31:17,440
how amazing our indigenous actors are here as well. Like Aaron Pederson, what an amazing

1423
01:31:17,440 --> 01:31:23,480
actor. So, you know, I just fell in love with that show because it was, it was not only,

1424
01:31:23,480 --> 01:31:29,600
you know, how, how well they had developed his character, um, throughout the few seasons,

1425
01:31:29,600 --> 01:31:33,980
but also just the way that they were showcasing the land as well, because the land is obviously

1426
01:31:33,980 --> 01:31:40,880
incredibly important to our indigenous ancestors. So, um, you know, just the beautiful drone

1427
01:31:40,880 --> 01:31:45,280
shots of the land and everything. Oh, you know, it was, I just fell in love with that

1428
01:31:45,280 --> 01:31:50,880
show and I had to binge watch it. I think that's on Stan, isn't it? Yes, it is. Yeah.

1429
01:31:50,880 --> 01:31:57,720
Stan has some good shows. Yes, it does. And, and same with like, um, wolf like me as well.

1430
01:31:57,720 --> 01:32:01,960
I did a couple of, I did a couple of weeks on that as well. And like, technically I think

1431
01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:07,600
that one does have some international funding towards it as well, but it was technically,

1432
01:32:07,600 --> 01:32:13,480
it was set in Adelaide. So here in part in Sydney. Yeah. But it was filmed pretty much

1433
01:32:13,480 --> 01:32:18,240
here in Sydney. So I think they did an amazing job at, you know, making it look like it's,

1434
01:32:18,240 --> 01:32:23,920
you know, little, little Adelaide there, but you know. I think my favourite scene is when

1435
01:32:23,920 --> 01:32:29,760
Josh Gad is at Tram Sheds literally down the road and I was watching this and my partner

1436
01:32:29,760 --> 01:32:34,600
Emily and I were just like, holy crap, that's like literally down the road. And, and like

1437
01:32:34,600 --> 01:32:38,000
the same with Jubilee Park, if they were sitting there and like I love Fisher, but the thing

1438
01:32:38,000 --> 01:32:42,400
that always baffled me about that show is Isla Fisher is Australian. Yes. Yet she's

1439
01:32:42,400 --> 01:32:46,800
an American character. I'm like, just make her an Australian. It made no sense. Cause

1440
01:32:46,800 --> 01:32:52,160
Josh, but I also love that show because Josh Gad is a huge fan of Australia as well. He

1441
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:57,240
is a massive fan of Australia. And I think what really makes, and they're doing a second

1442
01:32:57,240 --> 01:33:04,840
season now. I can't wait to see it cause I'm a huge fan of that show. Um, but I do think

1443
01:33:04,840 --> 01:33:10,080
that also it's, it's Australian drama that works. And it's like, you know, with, with

1444
01:33:10,080 --> 01:33:15,200
Wolf Like Me. Um, and you know, and I think also like, you know, you had shows that probably

1445
01:33:15,200 --> 01:33:19,520
didn't land as well, but I do remember a great show, which was called the Glitch. Um, which

1446
01:33:19,520 --> 01:33:25,040
did three seasons. It was a fun show. It was, um, set in a rural town and all these dead

1447
01:33:25,040 --> 01:33:30,620
people came back to life. It was very weird, but it was very unique. Um, and then I also

1448
01:33:30,620 --> 01:33:35,840
remember years ago when I was a kid, there was a BBC, a CBBC show called Jeopardy. Oh

1449
01:33:35,840 --> 01:33:40,880
yes. I do remember. Yes. And it was set in Australia for two seasons and it was about

1450
01:33:40,880 --> 01:33:47,400
kids discovering UFOs and alien invasion. And it was really fun. I had, that was one

1451
01:33:47,400 --> 01:33:52,560
of my favorite shows as a kid as well. I just, I loved it. Yeah. And I think back to those

1452
01:33:52,560 --> 01:33:57,280
shows and it's like, those are the content that I love watching where you show the rural

1453
01:33:57,280 --> 01:34:02,080
side of Australia, but also so the city side and you have this great balance because I

1454
01:34:02,080 --> 01:34:07,560
think the shows that I love are a crime and our sci-fi and our drama based shows, because

1455
01:34:07,560 --> 01:34:11,800
when it comes to, you know, the, you know, as well as I think like Home and Away and

1456
01:34:11,800 --> 01:34:16,000
Neighbors were great training grounds and still is like with Home and Away, um, they

1457
01:34:16,000 --> 01:34:20,960
are the shows that are very rinse and repeat. They have a quick turnaround in terms of actually

1458
01:34:20,960 --> 01:34:27,080
what they do. And while like Neighbors has just wrapped up and finished forever, it's,

1459
01:34:27,080 --> 01:34:30,720
it's one of those shows that I think in 10 years time might get revitalized because it's

1460
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:35,840
such a training ground for people. Yes. Um, or something will come out of its place, like

1461
01:34:35,840 --> 01:34:40,520
some other soap drama that will last another 50, 60 years because you know, like you've

1462
01:34:40,520 --> 01:34:44,960
got, it is great training grounds for young people. It's, you know, whether you're an

1463
01:34:44,960 --> 01:34:48,280
actor, whether you're a camera operator, whether you're, you know, like, you know, any tech

1464
01:34:48,280 --> 01:34:53,640
assistant or a runner, go and do those shows because like, like with any show, like with

1465
01:34:53,640 --> 01:34:59,240
the stand shows and stuff, they're great training grounds. Yes. You learn fast, you learn hard

1466
01:34:59,240 --> 01:35:03,720
because they've got either, you know, big actors, Australian actors or big names attached

1467
01:35:03,720 --> 01:35:09,160
to them in terms of starring roles. Uh, but you also just learn very fast about what to

1468
01:35:09,160 --> 01:35:16,600
do and how fast a show won't be made and the, the process of it because logistically they're,

1469
01:35:16,600 --> 01:35:20,800
you know, they're either, you know, but also you'll see the sides which, you know, aren't

1470
01:35:20,800 --> 01:35:25,880
advertised, which is when things go wrong on these kinds of shows. And that is the funnest

1471
01:35:25,880 --> 01:35:30,120
thing because we talk about like, you know, uh, nothing, you know, scheduling issues and

1472
01:35:30,120 --> 01:35:34,320
you know, it's big productions have that all the time. They have so many days where it

1473
01:35:34,320 --> 01:35:39,720
goes over under. Um, but yeah, like going, I said to anyone new, just go and watch a

1474
01:35:39,720 --> 01:35:43,560
bunch of things and, and then watch the behind the scenes, go and watch behind the scenes

1475
01:35:43,560 --> 01:35:47,920
docos cause they are the things where you see all the things go wrong and you see what

1476
01:35:47,920 --> 01:35:54,000
doesn't work and you know, and like, yeah, it's just, and you see the problem solving

1477
01:35:54,000 --> 01:35:59,880
that goes into things as well. Cause problem solving is just such a huge thing in the industry

1478
01:35:59,880 --> 01:36:04,840
as well. You know, whether it is a weather problem or whether it is, you know, now a

1479
01:36:04,840 --> 01:36:09,520
new scheduling issue that's popped up or, you know, there's, there's so much problem

1480
01:36:09,520 --> 01:36:15,960
solving that goes into it. And I think, you know, our first ADs always, you know, the

1481
01:36:15,960 --> 01:36:20,160
first people to try and fix that.

1482
01:36:20,160 --> 01:36:25,560
Make it work. Yes. Oh my God. It's so true. Um, I'm going to use this perfect point to

1483
01:36:25,560 --> 01:36:33,480
wrap us up because, but I have absolutely loved. Yes. I've had a wonderful time. So

1484
01:36:33,480 --> 01:36:38,840
Madison, where can people find you? Where can they stalk you onto the internet? I'm,

1485
01:36:38,840 --> 01:36:44,920
um, I'm on Instagram. It's Maddie movement, but it's a, it's a private account. So you

1486
01:36:44,920 --> 01:36:52,400
have to, you have to request. Um, and, um, I do have a website as well, but that's sort

1487
01:36:52,400 --> 01:36:58,600
of under development at this stage. It's still, you know, I've uploaded quite a few things,

1488
01:36:58,600 --> 01:37:03,520
but I just, I need to get more content happening onto it. So, you know, that's, that's sort

1489
01:37:03,520 --> 01:37:08,640
of where I'm at at the moment where you can find me, where you can stalk me. Yeah. Just

1490
01:37:08,640 --> 01:37:14,040
go on, go on stalk Maddie. It's like, well worth it. It's so much fun. No, it was an

1491
01:37:14,040 --> 01:37:18,520
absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for having me anytime. And if you want to go and check

1492
01:37:18,520 --> 01:37:22,120
out more episodes of the things we do, you can check them out on Apple and Spotify. I'll

1493
01:37:22,120 --> 01:37:44,840
be speaking with another guest next week and I'll speak to you all later. Goodbye.