1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,000 Hi, Nick here from Pods with Nick and James. Just a quick one before we get into this podcast. 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:12,000 I want to say a massive thank you for the support that we've received since starting these podcasts. 3 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:16,000 We thoroughly enjoy it and we look forward to creating more. 4 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:23,000 If you want to have your say on any topics that we've discussed or suggest future topics, 5 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:30,000 you can do so at www.reddit.com.com.au. 6 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:35,000 And if you want to support us, you can do so from as little as £1 a month. 7 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:40,000 You can do that at www.patreon.com.au. 8 00:00:40,000 --> 00:01:09,000 Anyway, back to the podcast. 9 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:20,000 Hi, welcome to Pods with Nick and James, a podcast where two friends just discuss different intellectual topics 10 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:31,000 as we just have a little bit of a, you know, dip our toes into the ocean of knowledge that we all have at our fingertips nowadays. 11 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:43,000 Today's topic is going to be one that's kind of always interested me on a number of levels, 12 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:51,000 partly in its ambiguity and partly just in the way that it's collected together and put into the group. 13 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:56,000 The topic this week is the Renaissance or Renaissance if you're American. 14 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:02,000 It depends. Yeah, depends how you want to pronounce it, if I'm honest with you. 15 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:12,000 My main sources for this topic was some of the videos on Crash Court by John Green, 16 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:21,000 as well as the Stephen Fry documentary on Johann Gottensberg's creation of the European printing press, 17 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:32,000 as well as the Renaissance, a very short introduction by the Oxford University Press by Jerry Broughton. 18 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:39,000 Nick, I know you've had a number of different sources. I should have said hello earlier. How are you doing today? 19 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:42,000 I'm good. Thank you very much. Yeah. 20 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:52,000 The intention on this podcast was that we would both look into the same source. So we were both going to look at a brief history 21 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:56,000 or whatever it was called of the Renaissance by Jerry Broughton, was it? 22 00:02:56,000 --> 00:03:00,000 Yeah, that's how it's pronounced. I think that's how it's pronounced. 23 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:13,000 No worries. But unfortunately, my copy of the audiobook failed halfway through and as such, I decided to dip into other sources, 24 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:27,000 namely the Britannica, Quora, other places such as that, Geeks for Geeks, online encyclopedias and forums, 25 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:31,000 which is where I normally get my resources from. 26 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:37,000 It should give a nice couple of different angles to the discussion. 27 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:42,000 No, that's fair enough. That's fair enough. Well, I guess we'll start with the basic thing, Nick. 28 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:48,000 What do you believe? Like, because there's lots of different... 29 00:03:48,000 --> 00:04:04,000 Once again, because the Renaissance was a cultural phenomenon, what are your views on what constitutes as the Renaissance? 30 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:29,000 The Renaissance in historical terms was the transition from the Middle Ages to the modern thinking of man. I suppose the best way to really describe the Renaissance is actually to define humanity in the Middle Ages. 31 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:35,000 Okay. All right. No, that's a fair point. So to kind of put it in context. 32 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:50,000 Yeah. So a human being, a human person, if they were previous to the Renaissance, they belonged to a church, they were heavily religious, 33 00:04:50,000 --> 00:05:09,000 and they thought of themselves as that member of that church. And if they were a worker, they would normally belong to a branch of work or a guild, for example, the Blacksmiths Guild or the Woodcutters Guild. 34 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:10,000 The Bankers Guild. Yeah. 35 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:36,000 Yeah, exactly. So it was about ownership, I suppose. Each individual was not an individual. They were a part of an ownership in the Middle Ages, not to mention the fact that it was very secular, war-driven, oppressed, violent times. 36 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:56,000 Yeah. Also, one thing that you touched upon briefly there is it was about ownership, but it was also nationalism was massive. So you're absolutely right. The individual, as we understand it, it seems to suggest almost didn't exist. 37 00:05:56,000 --> 00:06:12,000 Like you were, well, I'm a Catholic. Well, okay, that's fine. What are you? I'm an Englishman. All right. Fine. What are you? I'm a woodcutter. Exactly. And that's what the Middle Ages was. 38 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:37,000 Sorry, I'm a bit of a dry throat. And that's not what we always were, which is kind of what the Renaissance was looking at, because previous to the Middle Ages, there was more of this individuality in Greece and in Rome, particularly with people like Plato and Aristotle. 39 00:06:37,000 --> 00:07:04,000 Their kind of teachings, it was almost like that was lost in the Middle Ages with all the war that was going on. All of that independent thinking, that philosophy was lost. And the Renaissance was the renewing of it. It wasn't like a rebirth. Well, I suppose it was a rebirth. It wasn't the birth of the modern man. It was more like the renewal or the rebirth of an individual. 40 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:14,000 You are absolutely correct. I'm pretty sure that's what the word means. I should have pulled up the Oxford. Yeah, actually, I didn't mean to make that segue. I didn't mean to make that segue. 41 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:22,000 No, no, no, no, that's a very, very good point. Because 42 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:31,000 we should have prepared this beforehand. 43 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:37,000 Okay, so yeah, it's seen as a revival or a renewed interest in something. 44 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:46,000 It also comes under resurrection or reawakening. I find that they go a little bit 45 00:07:46,000 --> 00:08:01,000 far in my mind in that it is the refinding of the self is something that was heavily pointed to in Jeremy Broughton's book. For me, 46 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:07,000 although it is that kind of discovery of humanism, which we'll go into in a moment, 47 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:15,000 for me, it's a movement of 48 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:22,000 okay, so for me, it is financial, technological, 49 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:30,000 cultural, and then ideological in that order for me. 50 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:35,000 But maybe I'm being a bit too 51 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:42,000 compartmentalizing it too much. But for me, that's kind of like how it seems to have gone. 52 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:47,000 So in my mind, you had the Crusades. 53 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:53,000 And then rather than killing the Ottoman and Turks, 54 00:08:53,000 --> 00:09:04,000 the Venetian cities started trading with them. And things over the next couple of hundred years seems to have gotten a lot better. 55 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:15,000 And that for me is a broad, a very broad, but also a very reductive kind of history of the Renaissance, not going into the individual 56 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:23,000 amazing accomplishments of people of that time, which I'm hoping we'll step into. 57 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:26,000 I guess. 58 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:30,000 All right, you know what, just some really basic things. 59 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:44,000 What do you feel was the most important element or the most okay, you know what, we'll do element, person, and then favorite person, if that's okay with you. 60 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:51,000 What was your favorite element of the Renaissance? 61 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:58,000 I think my favorite element of the Renaissance was the change in the art. 62 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:05,000 It went from quite broad. 63 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:14,000 It became the main focal point of most art in the Renaissance was on the human form. 64 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:23,000 And it became a lot more realistic, should we say, in the way that they were drawing and very emotive. 65 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:36,000 And there was, I mean, some of the art was so deep in the layers of meaning in the art was, it was so clever. 66 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:42,000 And previous to that, you didn't really have that level of depth. 67 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:43,000 You have the symbology. 68 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:44,000 Yeah. 69 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:56,000 So like you had, it was, I almost hate to say it because I like Byzantine art in and of itself. 70 00:10:56,000 --> 00:11:02,000 So that you know what, no, okay, no, the art is a good thing and that was. 71 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:06,000 Yeah, that is one of my favorite elements as well. 72 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:31,000 The movement from traditional, almost ritualistic symbolism to the representation of the real form as it appears in the human eye is one of the, I think, one of the best things that happened during the Renaissance. 73 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:47,000 And conversely is one of the worst things that happened to art after the Renaissance with the Baroque movement, which then started to exaggerate things as a way of trying to overcome that. 74 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:58,000 Do you, since you've said art, what is your favorite example of Renaissance art? 75 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:09,000 I mean, I'm, the joys of being me is that I don't really have, it's only looking into the subject that's really got me into art. 76 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:11,000 Actually, I, that's a lie. 77 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:14,000 I went through the Vatican City. 78 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:15,000 Oh, wow. 79 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:19,000 Yeah, I visited the Vatican City whilst I was in Rome. 80 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:27,000 And I think, if I'm honest, the Sistine Chapel, the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, the story behind it as well. 81 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:28,000 You've seen it. 82 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,000 Yeah, the story behind it as well. 83 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:37,000 Did you know that when Michelangelo painted the Sistine Chapel, he couldn't paint. 84 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,000 He'd never painted before in his life. 85 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:41,000 He was a mathematician. 86 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,000 This is the thing that really annoys me. 87 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:52,000 Like, so, okay, so you know how, like, you look back in time to ancient Greece and everyone's a natural philosopher. 88 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:57,000 It seems to be there's another term in the Renaissance, they just call everyone a polymath. 89 00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:58,000 Yeah. 90 00:12:58,000 --> 00:12:59,000 Yeah, and that's the thing. 91 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:01,000 Which means they did maths and other stuff. 92 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:05,000 Yeah, and to be fair, Michelangelo did everything. 93 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:11,000 But his, I suppose his greatest art was that of the Sistine Chapel. 94 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:17,000 There's no higher praise when you're not even an artist than being asked by the Pope to paint your ceiling. 95 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,000 And as I said, like, he couldn't paint. 96 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:27,000 So in order to get around the fact that he couldn't paint, do you know how he managed it? 97 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:28,000 Did he copy? 98 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:42,000 No, he started his painting the furthest point away from where the Pope stood as he could in hopes that by the time he reached the point where the Pope stood, it'd be all right. 99 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:46,000 And the Pope would never notice. 100 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,000 That's amazing. 101 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:51,000 And to be fair, very, very human. 102 00:13:51,000 --> 00:14:03,000 How a man doesn't know how to paint and yet paints the human form so perfectly in the way that he did in that amazing tapestry on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel. 103 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:06,000 I have no idea. 104 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:10,000 And he's upside down. 105 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:18,000 Yeah, yeah, I heard he did literally lay on scaffolding whilst he painted it. 106 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:23,000 Yeah. 107 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:29,000 I mean, there's so much of his Raphaels, there's a lot of Raphaels art in the Vatican as well. 108 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:32,000 A lot of sculptures from around that time. 109 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:37,000 And of course, the dome of the Basilica to San Pietro. 110 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,000 The Church of St. Peter. 111 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:49,000 I really like, so out of Michelangelo's, I have to say his statue of David is my favourite. 112 00:14:49,000 --> 00:15:04,000 And my reason for that is the fact that he took, so with his statue of David, he's made the head and shoulders bigger than they actually are on a human person. 113 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:13,000 And the reason why he's done that is to make the form appear perfect from the average standing position. 114 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:23,000 So he's taken the form and then he's done an additional perspective trick with the form to make it look even better. 115 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,000 You could argue that it's actually the first example of Baroque. 116 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:38,000 And even though I've said that I dislike that movement, this is kind of like the exception almost that proves the rule that I do like the fact that he was able to do that. 117 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:54,000 The simplest examples of you get of this sort of thing nowadays when you get those adverts on football pitches, where they've been sprayed to kind of like work with the perspective so that the people in the opposite stand can see things perfectly. 118 00:15:54,000 --> 00:16:00,000 Yeah. It's actually from the perspective of the cameras for the TV. 119 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:01,000 Oh, right, yeah. 120 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:07,000 They're always painted so that the cameras on the TV look like they're standing billboards. 121 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,000 But they're not. 122 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:13,000 Yeah. 123 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:27,000 Yeah. Interestingly, did you know, like, I don't know if you've noticed this about Renaissance sculptures, but they always sculpted the male package extremely small. 124 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,000 Do you know why that was? 125 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:33,000 I imagine it was to make us all feel better about ourselves. 126 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:34,000 We had nothing to do with it. 127 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:36,000 It was seen as a sign of intellect. 128 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,000 If you had a small penis, it was because you were smarter. 129 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:43,000 You didn't need you didn't need a big penis if you were smart. 130 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:44,000 Apparently. 131 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:47,000 All right. I'll try to try using that one on the ladies. 132 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:51,000 See if that works. 133 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:54,000 Right. Okay. Well, I did. Okay. 134 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:55,000 Did not didn't. 135 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:59,000 Although I guess that does kind of fit with a lot of. 136 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,000 Kind of Greek thinking. 137 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:12,000 For example, the ancient Greeks thought that the prime of your life wasn't when you were like 30 or under the prime of your life was when you were 60. 138 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:19,000 Because you still had enough strength to do most things and the experience to do them well. 139 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:22,000 You weren't governed by your base desires at that stage. 140 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:28,000 You had evolved and were about as smart as you were going to get. 141 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:31,000 There's still hope for me. 142 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,000 Well, I am. 143 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:46,000 Okay. Well, yeah, that was one of the art of the Renaissance is incredibly fantastic, which is why all of the characters and the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles are named after those Renaissance masters. 144 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:52,000 Weird enough Splinter before anyone says it turns out was an architect. 145 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:53,000 I didn't know. 146 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:57,000 He also did lots of other stuff like a lot of people in the Renaissance. 147 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:05,000 I do find it interesting that nowadays we've got these very defined specialisms, whereas it seems people in history. 148 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:13,000 They invented the specialisms by doing everything absolutely and then doing one thing amazingly well. 149 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:17,000 So it kind of really to me just undermines that. 150 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:21,000 Yeah, because I was a lot of conversation with the tour guide in the Vatican. 151 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:31,000 I was like that Michelangelo painted, but you say he was a mathematician, but then he also did architects architecture as well. 152 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:35,000 Like, what was he? And she was like, well, he was Michelangelo. 153 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:39,000 And I was I was like, okay, fair enough. 154 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:47,000 You know, but he wasn't the only person that was like that. 155 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:59,000 He he he was one of the greatest like that, but he certainly wasn't one of the he wasn't the only person that that would paint and sculpt and do all this other stuff. 156 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:06,000 And nowadays, I suppose we are just into boxes in order to conform in our little place in reality. 157 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:22,000 And that that restricts our ability to try other things and endeavour to grow in many different ways and and become a great person, not necessarily a good person, 158 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:28,000 but a great person, given the depth of skill that you might end up with. 159 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:40,000 Well, that does seem to be a lot of people. I realize, you know, what people became famous and they'd always become famous for a reason. 160 00:19:40,000 --> 00:20:04,000 So one of the favorite things, one of my favorite things about the Renaissance is is that at the time there wasn't the modern understanding of the divide between East and West or like there was there was still 161 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:11,000 both rivalry and conflict between Islam and Christianity. 162 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:24,000 But at the times when there were trade, like there wasn't a there wasn't a need to view one history as one history and one history as another. 163 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:36,000 And like, so when you talk about the Renaissance, people think that it's something that just happened only in Europe and that it didn't kind of sweep anywhere else. 164 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:48,000 And although a lot of the movements, like a lot of the intellectual movements were in part 165 00:20:48,000 --> 00:21:05,000 between Europe and Western Europe, like one of the biggest things that kind of started the Renaissance was in fact the victory of the Ottoman Turks against Constantinople, 166 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:18,000 therefore dividing the dividing church and state, which I don't know, it's one of my favorite. 167 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:39,000 It's one of my favorite dates in history, it's one of my favorite kind of events in history as I don't as although I am very religious myself, I also don't believe it should be a dead hierarchical structure. 168 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:57,000 You know, yeah, because if you if you put too much structures on anything, then you kill it. And that I guess that's one of the things reasons why I see the fall of Constantinople in many ways as as a good thing. 169 00:21:57,000 --> 00:22:10,000 My favorite thing. I guess my favorite thing about the Renaissance is the movement of ideas. The fact that you had so many new ideas. 170 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:21,000 Well, you had the you had the people rediscovering the texts of Plato and Aristotle after forgetting about them for several hundred years. 171 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:31,000 Yeah, thank you libraries in Baghdad and the Ottoman Empire in the whole on the whole for looking after those texts and then selling them back to us. 172 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:36,000 That's genuinely an amazing thing. 173 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:47,000 Again, also the the dyes used in the paintings and in the tapestries and stuff during the Renaissance period were all bought. 174 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:58,000 I'm an empire through the Ottoman Empire and it's just it's weird that that wasn't ever something I was taught in school. 175 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:14,000 I also find it interesting because going on to when we were talking about the Communist Manifesto, the Renaissance for me seems to be the start of modern day capitalism and seems to also be the rise of the bourgeoisie class as a whole. 176 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:22,000 Yeah, but that's a darker age to it. Yeah, so sorry. My favorite thing is the change of ideas. 177 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,000 Did you who do you think? I don't know. 178 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:32,000 Okay, who do you think was the most important? 179 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:41,000 You know, I realized I've made a mistake in this podcast. I should have given more of an overview earlier, but that's fine. The whole point of this is the conversation. 180 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:48,000 Who do you think contributed the most to the Renaissance? 181 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,000 Like, who do you think? 182 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:56,000 Yeah, who do you think defines that age the most? 183 00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:04,000 I think reading about him, I would probably say Martin Luther. 184 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:05,000 Interesting. 185 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:23,000 Just because of the work that he did. I mean, he dabbled in a bit of everything. He learned a bit of law and then he learned a bit of what became a friar, didn't he? And then he kind of went, I think the church needs to look at things a bit differently. 186 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:26,000 And he wrote the 95 Thesis. 187 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:27,000 Yeah. 188 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:46,000 And I think originally he wrote it as a kind of if I was in power, I would do this. But eventually he hypothetically nailed it to the front of a church or an abbey. I can't remember particularly. And it is hypothetical. I don't know that there was actually. 189 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:50,000 That is how religious debates and stuff happened in those days. 190 00:24:50,000 --> 00:25:03,000 Yeah, yeah. So you just kind of like forced it into the faces of the church and when this is what you need to be looking at. And then became by proxy a Protestant. 191 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:26,000 And the first Protestant, I suppose you could say. And that in turn gave an angle for Henry VIII when eventually he moved to protestation away from the Roman Catholic Church in order for him to divorce Anne. 192 00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:28,000 Catherine of Aragon. 193 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:51,000 Catherine of Aragon so that he could marry Anne Boleyn. That was the one. I knew it was one of those two ways. Interestingly, something else that I picked up on, the beginning of that audio book, the brief introduction to Renaissance, it goes on about, it talks about Hans Holbein's, I can't remember what the painting is called. 194 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:52,000 The Ambassadors. 195 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,000 The Ambassadors. 196 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,000 I had to listen to it again to get that bit down. 197 00:25:56,000 --> 00:26:01,000 Yeah, so Hans Holbein's The Ambassadors, which is in the British. 198 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:02,000 National Gallery. 199 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:03,000 National Gallery. 200 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:04,000 I'm going to go find it. 201 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:13,000 Yeah, yeah. So Hans Holbein, he actually painted the human form throughout the Renaissance. 202 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:25,000 And he painted the picture of Anne of Cleve that Henry VIII saw that made him want to marry her. 203 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:28,000 Interesting. Isn't Anne of Cleves the one that outlived him? 204 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:36,000 Anne of Cleves is the one that he married and then immediately divorced because she wasn't as pretty as he thought he was. He thought she would be. 205 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:43,000 But she did become one of his, like she was still important in court. 206 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:44,000 Absolutely, yeah. 207 00:26:44,000 --> 00:27:09,000 Anne Boleyn got killed and got called loads of things. Catherine of Aragorn had to kind of disappear in shame. Anne of Cleves is interesting because she had so much political clout that the king, rather than shame her, he just literally renamed her my beloved sister. 208 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:20,000 Yeah, she became the king's sister. And she was given a castle in Richmond and a load of land and a load of gold. 209 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:29,000 She did actually do very well. She did really well. She was married to him from January to July, I believe, of the same year. 210 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:30,000 Oh my God. 211 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:45,000 And then it was annulled as unconsumated. And yeah, but interestingly, as I said, there's a really famous picture of Henry VIII that mostly comes up when you search for Henry VIII. That was painted by Hans Holbein. 212 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:46,000 Really? 213 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:47,000 Yeah. 214 00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:50,000 The one of him where he's a little bit chunky and he's got the hat? 215 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:56,000 Yeah. That was painted by Hans Holbein. 216 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:57,000 All right, interesting. 217 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:05,000 Yeah, when I heard Hans Holbein in that beginning, I was like, wait a minute, that's that guy. And he did this and then there's that guy and he did this. 218 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:22,000 And I was like, wait a minute, it's all coming together now. So basically, Henry VIII was our first Renaissance king, I suppose you would say. He brought the Renaissance to England. 219 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:31,000 That's true. He did bring a lot of things. Although humanism had been around for quite a while, it's just it took a little while longer to reach England. 220 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:35,000 Yeah, we quite like being subservient. 221 00:28:35,000 --> 00:29:00,000 Also, just really quickly to throw out there, a bit of information, although I was incredibly ignorant of this, Aragon was a large kingdom in which about half of it was in France, in modern day France, I should say, and half of it was in modern day Spain. 222 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:10,000 And it was absolutely, you know, it was sizable. It was not on a global scale, but it was sizable in that it was about as big as England. 223 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:18,000 It wasn't a small like little sliver of Spain and a small little sliver of France. It was a massive kingdom. 224 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:40,000 Although, in order to get to England, anyone going from the kingdom of Aragon would need to travel through some of France, they don't even need to travel through a little bit of it to kind of get to the right shore or they could sail all the way around Spain, but it's, I don't know, because I've never heard of it. 225 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:49,000 I didn't think it was a big deal, but then I saw it on a map and it was just like, okay, that's actually, yeah, that's a. 226 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:56,000 It's one of those things is ignorance, but it's like, it's not. 227 00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:09,000 Intentionally ignorance, you hear the name Catherine of Aragon and you're like, oh, that's just her name, you know, and then eventually you see on a map, you're like, wait a minute, that makes more sense than just being her name. 228 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:17,000 It also makes sense why King Henry wanted them, wanted them as a Protestant nation covering his back. 229 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:18,000 Yeah. 230 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:23,000 I mean she, Catherine of Aragon was heavily Catholic. 231 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:31,000 She was devout Catholic, she actually retreated to an nunnery after being divorced. 232 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:34,000 Not that. 233 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:39,000 I do like that at least Catholicism does have sanctuaries. 234 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:44,000 But that's a whole other conversation for another time. 235 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:54,000 Okay, so yeah, King Henry VIII I guess was our first Renaissance King. 236 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,000 What I like. 237 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:01,000 What do you think of the Medici family as a whole? 238 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:07,000 Did you come across them much like I realized that they're used a lot in pop culture and stuff as well. 239 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,000 Yeah, I've heard the name quite a lot. 240 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:12,000 What relevance they have, I couldn't tell you. 241 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,000 Okay. 242 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:35,000 They're a very, okay so in ancient Rome, a number of families which ended up buying for the seat of emperor were originally olive oil like franchises. 243 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:48,000 With the Medici's they vied for several thrones and the Pope, the seat of the Pope. 244 00:31:48,000 --> 00:32:00,000 And they succeeded several times in several different countries and getting the seat on the top of the church. 245 00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:06,000 And they did that because they were originally a banking family. 246 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:20,000 And again, this is I guess one of my problems with not with organized religion but when it becomes too organized, too institutionalized and you can buy your way to the top. 247 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:30,000 You know, like that's just one of those things but the Medici family were hugely influential. 248 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:48,000 And it was kind of almost a sign of the Renaissance was this mercy and tile or this ability to use trade and just wealth to achieve greatness. 249 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:50,000 Yeah. 250 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:58,000 I mean some of the best produce of the Mediterranean now is sold under the name Medici. 251 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:10,000 Yeah, because it's got those old ties with kind of greatness or with kind of like skilled trading. 252 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:19,000 Yeah, I knew I could I knew I'd heard the name in the modern day and both modern and historical. 253 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:31,000 I know the names come up in historical texts I've been reading but I also know that I've read it in like modern day. 254 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:37,000 Or maybe it was on a cooking program or something like that where they bloated about it being Medici or whatever. 255 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:41,000 I can't remember. 256 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:49,000 Okay, so yeah, as you said Martin Luther was in your mind the most influential. 257 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,000 I believe he did put stuff. 258 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:59,000 He put stuff out there though, which was already in people's minds. 259 00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:11,000 And yeah, like I think he did have a huge effect in that he kind of stood up and pointed out some of the obvious kind of flaws with the Catholic Church at the time. 260 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:12,000 Yeah, I've got a quote. 261 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,000 He wasn't perfect himself, but he did do well. 262 00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:20,000 I've got a quote from his 95 Thesis. 263 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:38,000 Exactly on that line it says why does not the Pope whose wealth today is greater than the wealth of the richest Crassus build the Basilica of St. Peter with his own money rather than with the money of poor believers. 264 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:39,000 Yep. 265 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:44,000 And it's a fair question and that's why he caused yet another schism. 266 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,000 Yeah, absolutely. 267 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:53,000 It's not like I don't think he asked the question aggressively in a way that was like you should be doing X, Y, Z. 268 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:58,000 I think he kind of just said like come on man you've got enough money. 269 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:00,000 Why are you not doing this yourself? 270 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:08,000 Like you are a leader therefore be the leader like do unto others as you would have done unto yourself kind of stuff. 271 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:16,000 Yeah, be the change you want to see in the universe using modern day terminology. 272 00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,000 Yeah. 273 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,000 For me there was a... 274 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:27,000 Okay, so I see. 275 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:35,000 One of the most influential people was Nicholas Copernicus. 276 00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,000 Who was a Polish astronomer. 277 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:39,000 Yep. 278 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:46,000 And what he did was he started... 279 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:50,000 He got rid of something well... 280 00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:53,000 He didn't disprove it Galileo disproved it. 281 00:35:53,000 --> 00:36:06,000 But all of the original all of the concepts that were set about by or that were proved by Galileo were first brought about by Nicholas Copernicus. 282 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:07,000 Copernicus, yeah. 283 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:10,000 Yeah Copernicus, sorry. 284 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:14,000 And it's interesting because you know how you said about how people did loads of different things. 285 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,000 Yeah. 286 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:26,000 Copernicus was both a lawyer and a doctor and an astronomer and also a philosopher of course. 287 00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,000 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 288 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:28,000 I mean to be fair. 289 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,000 And it's just like... 290 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:30,000 If you... 291 00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:31,000 Okay, all right. 292 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:34,000 You can just stick with one impressive career. 293 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,000 You had to, you know, get all of them. 294 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:54,000 But what he came up with was really important to me at least in that he started the journey from believing in geocentrism which was a fallacy brought about by... 295 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:57,000 I think it was either Aristotle or Plato. 296 00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,000 Which was the Earth is the center of the... 297 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,000 Center of the universe. 298 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:02,000 Yeah. 299 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:03,000 Because why wouldn't it be? 300 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:04,000 Yeah, absolutely. 301 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:20,000 And then it was also kind of the idea that beyond the moon, everything else in the sky was metaphysical and insubstantial rather than just very far away. 302 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:21,000 Yeah. 303 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:42,000 And so he brought about heliocentrism which was believing that the sun is the center of the universe but that's wrong but at least believing that it's the center of the solar system and that the Earth travels around the sun. 304 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:44,000 It also interests me. 305 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:48,000 I'm still waiting for a lot of humans to catch up with heliocentrism. 306 00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:49,000 Yeah. 307 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,000 They are not the center of the universe. 308 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,000 The sun is the center of the solar system. 309 00:37:54,000 --> 00:38:03,000 That is definitely the sun and you should get on with your own lives because you are in the grand scheme of things inconsequential but you are only consequential to yourself. 310 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:05,000 Yeah, that's it. 311 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:08,000 But he was... I see him as one of the major things. 312 00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:23,000 What really does kind of... I guess what kind of frustrates me is the... about the Renaissance or at least one of the things that frustrates me about the Renaissance is some of the unfairness. 313 00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:51,000 Not just the fact that it's when colonialism really kind of started and took off which I also found ridiculous because there were a number of books which were instructing people on how to do good business and a number of the books simply pointed out that if you follow the things in the Bible 314 00:38:51,000 --> 00:39:02,000 like love your neighbor or if you try and do good to people who are poorer than you, you won't gain financially from that so you shouldn't do it. 315 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:10,000 And it's interesting to me that you had writers writing that and advising kings and they weren't touched because of their high positions. 316 00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,000 Yep. 317 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:26,000 Yet the moment somebody didn't have that clout or that high position or that influential family, that's when they were persecuted. 318 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:39,000 And that's that to me kind of really... yeah, that annoys me just the fact that money bought you safety. 319 00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:42,000 That still kind of just frustrates me. 320 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:52,000 I suppose a good point to segue into the teachings of the Renaissance and how that kind of changed. 321 00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,000 Yeah, sure. 322 00:39:54,000 --> 00:40:09,000 The difference between the Renaissance and I suppose Middle Ages was that in the Middle Ages you kind of learned your trade and you stuck at that. You became part of a guild, etc. 323 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:21,000 And in the Renaissance they had two kind of core teaching umbrellas, should we say? They called them the Trivium and the Quadrivium? 324 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:23,000 Yes. 325 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:39,000 The Trivium was like their most important and the Quadrivium was not necessarily less important, not necessarily less important, but it was secondary, should we say, to the Trivium. 326 00:40:39,000 --> 00:41:05,000 The Trivium is the teachings of grammar, the teachings of logic and the teachings of rhetoric. And to put that in layman terms, it's the art of using word, then the logic of thinking and or the art of thinking, and then rhetoric is the art of communicating your thinking in words that makes sense to other people. 327 00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:20,000 Quadrivium is the arts of number and quantity, so that's the teaching of arithmetic, geometry, music, astronomy, things like that. 328 00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:36,000 No, that's a good point. I know that that was, it interests me as well that rhetoric was seen as so important. 329 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:55,000 Another thing, you know what, I should have researched more the people that I don't like and kind of said why I don't see their contribution to the Renaissance as a good thing. 330 00:41:55,000 --> 00:42:13,000 The types of people that I didn't like in the Renaissance were the people who said or the people who were so versed in rhetoric that they could make anything true by talking. 331 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:17,000 Yeah, so basically the media, the propaganda of today. 332 00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:37,000 The very first spin doctors, and they would write these books to prove how good they were at rhetoric and send them off to kings, quite often multiple kings, as a way of saying, look, let me in your court, I can make any decision you make just and legitimate. 333 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,000 Yeah, seem like the best thing in the world. 334 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:53,000 Exactly. And it's just like, I realize you want everyone wants a place at courts and stuff but you're just you're enabling somebody who's already been way too enabled. 335 00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:54,000 Yeah. 336 00:42:54,000 --> 00:43:11,000 And I like when I heard about you know, when I heard about several of these people who wrote these books sent them off to both the King of Spain and the King of England, and weirdly enough to Henry the eighth to say look we can make. 337 00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:16,000 You can do whatever you want and I'll take care of the details. 338 00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:18,000 That just wasn't fantastic. 339 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:28,000 I think also the idea that I don't like that came about in the Renaissance was the idea. It seems to be the birthplace of. 340 00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:31,000 We have rediscovered. 341 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:36,000 Aristotle, we have found out what is profitable. 342 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:44,000 Therefore, we are better than everyone else it's when like Europe as a power started to come into its own thing. 343 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:49,000 And immediately, almost immediately. 344 00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:59,000 The people in power started trying to figure out how to carve up the rest of the world. Yeah, and lay claim to things that weren't weren't theirs. 345 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:06,000 Yeah, you know, we pre pre Renaissance people would not have called themselves re European. 346 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:16,000 And that's it. However, post Renaissance, it was pretty normal, be European, you know, as a as a sect. 347 00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:23,000 And anything that wasn't European was seen as lower base. 348 00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,000 Until the New World. 349 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:32,000 Or see it was Columbus is was it Columbus that went to the New World. 350 00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:36,000 So Columbus went to Columbus went to America. 351 00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:43,000 There was another bloke who went and did it called John. 352 00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:48,000 K bot who, weird enough, did it under the patronage of King Henry the seventh. 353 00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:53,000 Interesting thing about him. His name was actually Giovanni K bots. 354 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:59,000 And he literally. 355 00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:14,000 Really weirdly the whole reason why he went on this voyage to try and go find another way to get to India and get the get spices get all of dyes get all of the good stuff. 356 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:19,000 Was because he was running away from debtors. 357 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:36,000 And it almost like says it all he literally ran out of Florence in the city states and went to England and sought patronage there because he'd rung up loads of debts in his home country. 358 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:39,000 And it's just. 359 00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:43,000 Yeah, but sorry. Yeah, Columbus. 360 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:49,000 Columbus is renowned for finding America. 361 00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:54,000 My I kind of actually went knowing it was there. 362 00:45:54,000 --> 00:46:02,000 There are there are maps from yeah, like the Perry Reese map where it is quite clearly. 363 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:15,000 On this map. I also love that another thing that they don't teach you in history class is although you know we had some maps and there were some classical maps from ancient Greek and stuff. 364 00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:23,000 It was the astrologers and it was both Jewish and Arabic navigators. 365 00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:24,000 Yeah. 366 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:36,000 Who helped who helped in this in this European expansion. And I'm sorry I'm not saying like are who helped as in like they were they were. 367 00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:48,000 They were instruments that came with it. Yeah, it was their know how it was their instruments and their knowledge which enabled that at school like why is why are the where do you live. 368 00:46:48,000 --> 00:47:05,000 All right, fair. Yeah, yeah, I'm just to clarify that point. Or I live in England listeners. Exactly, because we live. I mean, if you live in America, you're taught, you're taught the American perspective you live in England, you're taught the English perspective or the United Kingdom's perspective. 369 00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:26,000 And it's really important to remember that when you're learning things at school, and I do go out and do your own research because you will find that there is a little bit of taint on your education because you're taught a certain perspective, you're taught a certain rhetoric. 370 00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:49,000 You must tip your toe into other waters in order to get a broader, broader picture of your education, which I think is a lot of what the Renaissance was kind of saying, we can't just go by what our leaders are saying or what our church is saying we have to kind of broaden our horizons and, and look at, look at the look at the bigger picture. 371 00:47:49,000 --> 00:48:07,000 And it was, I think, the annoying thing is that there are there are hypothetical conversation conversations going on that the Renaissance is is a non existent entity in history. 372 00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:36,000 And I understand the reasoning behind it in that it only really existed for those with money and power. Yeah. You know, the Renaissance only because let's face it, the only people who had the time to think about things beyond the end of the day, and the money they were getting bread and meat that they were eating was people that didn't have to worry about those things. 373 00:48:36,000 --> 00:49:04,000 And they're the minority, they're the elite. They knew where their meal was coming from because they had people that were going to get it for them that enabled them to then broaden their horizons proverbially speaking, therefore, in the Renaissance exists and history is written by those people that had the money and power to write the books and talk about this Renaissance. 374 00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:19,000 I shouldn't I should point out as well that the Renaissance wasn't this thing that being the light comes on and all of a sudden you realize there's a Renaissance, like it happened over 200 years, and nobody knew it was really happening. 375 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:35,000 Which is kind of happened. As a matter of fact, a layman, the worker had no bloody idea that it was happening at all. It was only really the powers that be knew this kind of movement was happening in that this transition was happening and eventually it filled a day. 376 00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:56,000 Absolutely. Like, you know, like the fact that anti church pamphlets were being written, the fact that books were available to more, more rich people 377 00:49:56,000 --> 00:50:05,000 doesn't change the fact doesn't really affect you if you're illiterate, if you're an illiterate fisherman. Yeah, or a farmer. 378 00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:16,000 Or, to be fair, it doesn't really affect you all that much. If you're one of the many workers in 379 00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:34,000 Yeah, in any of the kind of in the first factories in the city states where crafts people would be gathered from throughout the country, and at least given a station where they could work, whereas before maybe they were destitute or had a successful, successful business. 380 00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:46,000 Although they were drawn together. It was other people, it was the rich, it was the elite who still benefited from their from their labors. Yeah. 381 00:50:46,000 --> 00:51:10,000 As we're, we're coming towards the end of time, just very quickly. I've only just found out about my favorite person from the Renaissance, but just so that I've always given other people the choice first, who, although we've talked about most influential 382 00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:20,000 as a person who is your favorite figure from the Renaissance, and what it is about them that you respect or like. 383 00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:23,000 I think Da Vinci. 384 00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:30,000 Da Vinci because his art world is still today so 385 00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:38,000 influential and the bloke was designing things like helicopters. 386 00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:44,000 Yeah, and stuff way before he even knew anything about 387 00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:46,000 like. 388 00:51:46,000 --> 00:52:06,000 So the guy was, if an alien existed in humanity in the 1415 hundreds, it was Da Vinci. He was way before his time. He was so clever so intelligent and an incredible artist and philosopher and mathematician and archer. 389 00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:13,000 God, just the thought of being good at all of those things hurts my brain but yeah he was all of the above. 390 00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:15,000 Absolutely. 391 00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:20,000 For me, although it's somebody in the later Renaissance. 392 00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:23,000 It was somebody called Baphomet Lemieux 393 00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:25,000 De La Carces 394 00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:44,000 who isn't massively famous because his contribution was a reaction against some of the things that started had started to happen as a result of the Renaissance, he was literally the first. 395 00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:47,000 So you know about like William Wilberforce. 396 00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:49,000 Yeah. 397 00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:55,000 Yeah, the bloke, the former slaver who then became an advocate for abolition. 398 00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:56,000 Yeah. 399 00:52:56,000 --> 00:53:00,000 Weird enough, it turns out that this had actually happened several hundred years before. 400 00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,000 And it was this bloke. 401 00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:14,000 Who was the like the first person who in his young life went out to Cuba and went out to the islands 402 00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:22,000 in the Americas and annoyingly carved out a fortune for himself 403 00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:26,000 through, if I'm honest with you, bloodshed and exploitation. 404 00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:30,000 But then, he was only doing what he was taught. 405 00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:33,000 Well, this is the thing, he did it. 406 00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:40,000 Then he became the first Catholic priest in the new in the new Americas. 407 00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:49,000 And he continued to he continued to gain from these evil things and then he read. 408 00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:57,000 And then he went a bunch of other priests came over from Spain and started pointing out what you guys doing. 409 00:53:57,000 --> 00:54:02,000 This is literally this is literally genocide. 410 00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:05,000 What what are you doing? 411 00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:08,000 He rebuffed them, sent them back. 412 00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:13,000 But then five years later, he was reading the Bible. 413 00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:27,000 He came across a line in Ecclesiastes 34 verse 18, which basically pointed out that God doesn't look favorably on an offer to him, 414 00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:34,000 which was taken by by evil gains or by if you're a dick and you profit by it and you try and give it to God, 415 00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:39,000 God doesn't like that is the very layman translation of it. 416 00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:47,000 And it's really weird that this bloke who had been oppressing the people in the people in these islands, 417 00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:53,000 he he he loaned own some land in Haiti and he had a complete turnaround. 418 00:54:53,000 --> 00:55:08,000 And he immediately gave back his land to the natives and then started to convince trying to convince all of his other landowning friends that they should do the same. 419 00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:11,000 It went down like a lead balloon. 420 00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:14,000 He stopped being quite as rich. 421 00:55:14,000 --> 00:55:21,000 He slowly but surely lost all of his political power. 422 00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:29,000 And he wasn't able to he did his very, very best to convince people he wasn't able to. 423 00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:32,000 And he ended up. 424 00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:36,000 Yeah, he ended up becoming a monk. 425 00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:47,000 But it's just it's interesting to me that at the very least he celebrated nowadays because he realized what he was doing was wrong and changed his mind. 426 00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:51,000 I reckon he's got a conversation with a burning bush. 427 00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:52,000 Maybe maybe he did. 428 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:53,000 Maybe he did. 429 00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:58,000 It says he was just reading the book, but I don't know what he saw or if he had any dreams or anything. 430 00:55:58,000 --> 00:55:59,000 I should have maybe researched it more. 431 00:55:59,000 --> 00:56:07,000 If he was in South South America, then you might have taken a bit of ayahuasca and then you definitely would have had a conversation with a burning bush. 432 00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:12,000 To be fair, hallucinogenics have been used for most societies in a whole different topic. 433 00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:18,000 Listen, you know what? Right. That is another one that will do at another point. 434 00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,000 But yeah, he's he's my favorite. 435 00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:29,000 And it's annoying, though, because he's my favorite simply because a lot of the other ones were well, they were all products of their time. 436 00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,000 Yeah. Yeah. 437 00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:39,000 I think it's important to remember that they were taught a specific way of thinking and they like to think they were quite revolutionary in the way they were thinking. 438 00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:42,000 But at the end of the day, they were subject to the times. 439 00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:51,000 And yeah, like Martin Luther was fantastic in that he was able to denounce the Pope's use of finances. 440 00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:56,000 But he himself was not prosemitic and was not pro-islam. 441 00:56:56,000 --> 00:56:58,000 I mean, he was he was a subject. 442 00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:08,000 He didn't get a scholarship for his religious studies because his father was so bloody rich. 443 00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:12,000 His father was a copper miner and owned copper mines. 444 00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:26,000 And as such, when it came to him changing from law to religion studies, he couldn't get a scholarship because he's because he had too much money. 445 00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:33,000 So my God, it wasn't like I said, the Renaissance existed only for the elite. 446 00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:38,000 You know, it was certainly wasn't a lowly fisherman. 447 00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:42,000 Right. And then this is why Martin Luther wasn't just stoned to death by a rabble. 448 00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:43,000 Absolutely. 449 00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:45,000 Because he was that because he was that rich. 450 00:57:45,000 --> 00:57:52,000 He had money. He had spending in society. 451 00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:57,000 He wasn't just picking up peanut shells. 452 00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:01,000 That's fantastic. 453 00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:05,000 Yeah, I think. 454 00:58:05,000 --> 00:58:11,000 My very least favorite character of the Renaissance is Hernan Cortez. 455 00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:16,000 But that's a whole other conversation for another time. 456 00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:24,000 I mean, I don't have I don't I really don't know enough to have a least favorite. 457 00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:29,000 I think from an English perspective, you've got to you've got to have a bit of a distaste when you talk about Henry VIII. 458 00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:32,000 But it doesn't come without it. 459 00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:36,000 Like once again, he was a subject of his own. 460 00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:39,000 Yeah, I mean, to be standing. 461 00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:43,000 Like if a girl smiles at me too much, I'll start getting big headed. 462 00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:46,000 Imagine, you know, being pampered to your entire life. 463 00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:51,000 Yeah, I mean, I didn't know that Green Sleeves was actually written. 464 00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:58,000 I say written. I use that term in very loose quotation marks by Henry VIII. 465 00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:07,000 He wrote Green Sleeves as a wooing for Anne Boleyn. 466 00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:21,000 I say he did. Obviously, he had a court minstrel that wrote it for him and made him go and perform it to Anne Boleyn to woo her. 467 00:59:21,000 --> 00:59:29,000 And you do wonder how much of anything the people who wrote these things actually came up with. 468 00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:39,000 But yeah, you know, like the fact that the Renaissance was you could only have books on the quadrivium if you could afford books. 469 00:59:39,000 --> 00:59:41,000 And that was definitely not everyone. 470 00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:44,000 Yeah. I mean, I was watching a complete tangent here. 471 00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:54,000 But once again, that whole topic of you wonder how much somebody that wrote the book actually has to do with the research. 472 00:59:54,000 --> 01:00:04,000 I watched Oppenheimer and he really learned that actually Oppenheimer was just the guy at the head of the operation. 473 01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:11,000 There were scientists that kind of had the thinking that made it go the way that it did. 474 01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:18,000 And Oppenheimer was just the guy leading the road, leading the car as it were, as it traveled down that road. 475 01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:22,000 No, he was just the guy at the wheel with very limited control over where it was going. 476 01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:34,000 Don't get me wrong. The guy was very much he had a number of the pinnacle ideas that led to the hydrogen bomb. 477 01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:40,000 But there were scientists below that made his vision a reality. 478 01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:50,000 I don't know that his education would have been enough on its own to make the hydrogen bomb a reality. 479 01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:53,000 That's fair. And that's a good point. 480 01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:59,000 Kids, if you're listening to this, first off, you probably would be better served by other people. 481 01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:04,000 But secondly, don't be careful of what you're part of. 482 01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:10,000 I know I've been part of things that in hindsight I'm not necessarily too happy with. 483 01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:14,000 But anyway, yeah, so that was the Renaissance, guys. 484 01:01:14,000 --> 01:01:30,000 It was a massive cultural movement over the 15th and 16th century from feudal individual countries in Europe to Europe as a mass identity. 485 01:01:30,000 --> 01:01:45,000 The beginnings of colonialization, corporations beginning to have their power, the rise of the mercantile classes, innovations in art and visual representation, 486 01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:58,000 and the death of a theocracy, a theocratic state in the form of the end of the Byzantine Empire. 487 01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:02,000 Yeah, thank you very much for listening. Goodbye from myself. 488 01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:04,000 And goodbye from me. 489 01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:32,000 Have a good night, everyone. Bye.