Hello and welcome to another episode of Upfront and Undivided with Luke and Dean'na.
Hi babe.
How's it going?
It's good.
How are you?
I'm good.
I talked over you, sorry.
It's okay.
You good?
Yeah.
You get to go play some baseball?
Possibly, yeah.
Softball?
Yeah.
Baseball?
Something?
Yeah, I'm excited.
I'm excited for you.
You're looking awfully cute.
Thanks.
I like your jersey and everything.
And our sweet friends that actually listen to this are going to be able to see it and
say, ah.
Maybe.
Yeah.
Well, I'm thinking of one in particular.
Yeah.
The one that called you and roped you into this.
Yeah.
So, thanks Chico.
What are we talking about today, babe?
So today, it's going to be kind of a fun subject for some.
Okay.
I will let you know I made a mistake.
And that's the title.
I will let you know that I made a mistake.
Yep.
Okay.
Yeah.
So what are your thoughts?
Because I know you have some.
I have some thoughts about this.
And I think.
What got you on this thought?
I mean this specifically, I think when you boil it down, it's, I know there's a lot of
people that they have trouble admitting that they're wrong.
You know.
Okay.
There are some people that, you know, not even so much that they're wrong, but sometimes
that they just made a mistake.
Right.
You know.
And I see it a lot in.
That they're not perfect.
Yeah.
You know, because there are some people that, you know.
But even the ones that say, you know, oh no, I'm not perfect.
You know, there's still that whole, there's some pride involved.
Yeah.
You know.
And whether it be in, you know, businesses, whether it be leadership, whether it be friendships
and you know, and especially in relationships.
Yeah.
You know, husband's wives, you know, boyfriend, girlfriend.
Parent, children.
Yeah.
You know.
And so I, and I think that's something that a lot of people get held up on.
You know, because there's this idea that, like I know, especially as a guy, it's, you
know, you want to, you want to look strong.
You want to look stable.
You want to look consistent.
Yeah.
And you want to be that for your, for your spouse, for your kids.
Yeah.
For those around you.
And to admit that you're wrong.
Yeah.
It takes a certain level of humility.
I think it also creates a certain amount of strength because the scripture that immediately
comes to my mind when you're saying this to me is where we are weak.
He becomes strong.
Talking about Christ.
Yeah.
Right.
He gets, he now gets to step into your situation and gives you wisdom, gives you courage, gives
you, you know, strength, whatever it is that you're needing in that moment.
He, he gets to be basically the armor that you now get to put on you and that you get
to walk successfully and, you know, or like you were telling me earlier today, the sweetest
story about Sebastian and you guys talking, and it was just the two of you in the car
and he's asking you, dad, do you cry when you're sad?
Because I cry sometimes when I'm sad.
And you gave him the opportunity to be, to be in that, you know, you said, yes, I do.
And then you also said sometimes why you don't.
And what you just said was I have to appear like I have it together.
And then what did he say to you, baby?
He basically said, dad, if you cried, I wouldn't think any different of you or something along
those lines.
But yeah, how precious is that?
I would still think you're strong if even if you cried.
Yeah.
And I think that that's a takeaway.
Maybe that's where Christ says, unless you come to me like a little kid, you know, it's
like we have to have that childlike faith of just because you're crying, just because
you're breaking down doesn't mean that I think you're weak.
I just think that something has overwhelmed you.
And now I get to come alongside you and be in that space with you.
Or it gives me a chance to say, oh, wow, you're human.
OK, I'm not the only one that has to deal with this stuff.
And so it gives me permission to also step into that place of either weakness or vulnerability,
being transparent, and then ultimately allowing the Holy Spirit and allowing God into that
space to where he can be the strength that we need.
Yeah.
And I think also part of it, you know, along with the admitting that you made a mistake
or admitting that you're weak, I think another aspect of this is there's a really bad stigma
around I don't know.
Yes.
You know, I heard it.
I heard a joke once years ago.
They're like, what's the difference between ignorance and indifference?
I don't know.
And I don't care.
Wow.
You know, because, you know, and one of my big
biggest takeaways and and there's a lot of times I'll use the word ignorant.
Yeah.
As a normal word, because there's a lot of people that think ignorant or ignorance and
they think that's a bad thing.
Yeah.
When in fact, it's really just I don't know.
Yeah, you're not educated in this area.
Yeah.
You know, it's like, you know, if I were asked to wire the electricity for a house, I don't
know how to do that.
Right.
I am ignorant in that aspect.
You know, it's not a bad thing.
Yeah.
You know, if if somebody refuses to learn to improve themselves, I mean, then it can
be a sticking point.
It can be a bad thing.
But you know, but to admit that you don't know something, that's not a bad thing.
And and I think there's a lot of people that think if they say that they don't know, they
think, oh, people are going to think less of me.
Right.
They're going to think I'm stupid.
Especially if you are a husband, a parent, a leader.
Yeah.
You know, somebody that is over people that, you know, people look to you and and for you
to say, I don't know.
Yeah.
But I would also bring up when you do say, I don't know, follow it up with, you know,
but I'll find out.
Yeah.
You know, especially if it's something, you know, let's say, Gabriel comes up to us and
has a really big question.
Yeah.
You know, we don't know the answer to that, but we'll find out.
I mean, we are the Google family.
We are.
We love Google.
You are Google.
I have my cup.
It says I don't need Google.
My husband knows everything.
And it's true.
We always laugh about how much knowledge you have.
Yeah.
But the reason why you have so much knowledge is because you said, I don't know.
And so now I'm going to go find out.
Yeah.
And I think a lot of the takeaway with you is always, and that you kind of impart into
our kids and into me too, you give us that space to where it is okay for us to not know.
And then you also give us that space to say, how about we learn this together?
Let's learn a new, you know, like one of our bedtime things right now is Sebastian likes
random facts.
Tell me a random fact, mom.
And I'm like, Gabri, break out your phone.
What random fact do we have?
Yeah.
And it just expands our brains and keeps our curiosity and our wonder alive.
And I think, you know, kind of along that line is it's a lot easier nowadays to find
at least some sort of an answer to almost any question.
You know, because when you and I were kids, it was like, you know, what's the answer to
this?
I don't know.
Let's go find an encyclopedia or a dictionary or, you know, you know, I know I grew up,
you know, we were, we were Catholic growing up.
So we had the big Bible that was like 18 inches tall, you know, like, yeah, like four inches
thick.
And yeah, it was like, you know, but the pages were like so paper thin.
It's like, you don't want to touch it because it's like, I don't want to break this thing
and I don't know what's in it.
You know, but again, so it's like, you would have to read and really, really hunt for something,
you know, or you had to rely on somebody that knew something.
The Strong's Concordance is what it's called.
Yeah.
It's basically the dictionary for the Bible.
Yeah.
We have two of them in our bookcase.
Yeah.
Just like we didn't have one of those.
Yeah.
I'm just telling you, I'm just educating you from my A Symbols of God background.
Yes.
Strong's Concordance.
Yes.
Is that what I not said?
Yeah.
It's fine.
Go ahead.
That's fine.
Yeah.
But you know, so again, it's like, you know, and I know we've joked about it, you know,
with Gabri, you know, she'll like ask us a random question and we're in the car and especially
me, I can't pull my phone out of my pocket while going down the highway.
It's like, hey, you have this super computer in your pocket.
Sincerely.
Nine times out of 10, it's in her hands when she's asking a question.
You have an iPhone.
I think it's sweet though.
It is sweet.
Yes, it is.
Can I tell you?
I genuinely do.
And you like it too.
But I think it's just genuinely sweet because there is something about, but I want to hear
it from dad.
Yeah.
I want to hear it from you.
Or you might know the knowledge, but then you're going to also give her some sort of
background or you're going to give her some sort of, you're going to give her your spin
and your take.
Yeah.
And it becomes personal at that point.
Yeah.
So I think that's, it's like you with your history love because it came from your dad.
Your dad showed you history through his eyes and made it come alive.
There's something different that comes.
There really is.
Yeah.
No, I agree.
I agree.
It is.
Sorry.
That was a side note.
I do.
I think that I think that's the reason why she does that.
Yes.
You have this super computer.
Yes.
You could be doing this.
Yeah.
I've noticed now with medical terminology and things, when I say, what is that?
She will get on her phone like immediately.
So again, those moments where I'm like, yep, you're going to be a nurse.
That's all there is to it.
Oh yeah.
Something.
Yes.
So go ahead.
I'm sorry.
So yeah.
Totally interrupted you.
No, you're fine.
So, you know, again, so it's, it's that whole, it's okay for people to not know the answer.
Yes.
You know, but again, it's, it's back to what do you do with that?
Yeah.
You know, okay, you made a mistake.
Now what?
Yeah.
You know, you've wronged your spouse, your friend, your coworker.
Now what?
Yeah.
You know, you don't know the answer to this question that, you know, somebody asked you
now what?
Right.
You know, and, and I think that's the biggest thing that I, I think we all need.
Yeah.
You know, because yes, it is, it is kind of humbling to say, I made a mistake or I don't
know.
Yeah.
You know, but again, like you said, where we are weak, he is strong.
Right.
And that's where we get to lean on, on him and his, his wisdom and his patience.
Right.
You know, so, so that we can look and say, yes, here we go.
Yeah.
You know, and, and I think, you know, I think there's a lot of, I think there's a lot of
leaders nowadays, you know, in, in pretty much every realm.
Yeah.
You know, politics, religion, business, that it's, it's almost like they almost treat it
as a kiss of death.
Yeah.
If they don't know the answer.
And it's, they, it's like they're so, it's like they've gotten so high in the hierarchy
that they've forgotten that people will be more, more readily to that people will more
readily relate to them.
Yeah.
If they appear more human.
I absolutely, no, absolutely.
Because I believe that that was one of the things.
So God could have come completely come down.
Right.
And he could have just been like, I'm going to make it all right.
It's all going to be good.
We're going to fix it.
We're going to celebrate it Easter.
Right.
So here's his son.
He literally gave us son for our lives and he three days, right?
Three days in the tomb, third day, he rises from the dead, completely conquers death,
hell in the grave.
And but the thing was, is he came as God and he also came as humanity.
Yeah.
And I believe that that's one of those things that helps in knowing that, okay, wait a minute,
my humanity, you know, wait a minute, you're, you know, people go, your humanity showing
and I'm like, but that should be a beautiful thing.
Not so much a bad thing.
It should.
You know, when we have all the scriptures and we have like a whole page of them that
we wanted to share with everybody, just talking about just unforgiveness and just the poison
of things and, and, and not letting, you know, people go from junk that they've done or even
just mishaps that they've had.
And it's, it's one of those where it's like, here's Christ saying, um, I, I came to give
you life.
I came to give you abundant life.
I came to, to, to be encapsulated with God.
Yes, but to show you what it is to walk human, but walk with the presence and the spirit
of God living inside of you.
And I think so many times we think, oh my gosh, I have to walk this out perfect, you
know, cause we hear the scripture, you know, be perfect as I'm perfect.
No, it's be holy as unholy, you know, cause he knows that we're not going to do it perfect.
That's the thing that we, we, we've had sermons that have been preached beautifully in front
of us that said, you know, here's Jesus, the great intercessor between us and God and him
literally looking at them and going, dad, you don't get it.
Yeah.
You don't understand how hard this world can be.
Yeah.
You don't understand what, what, what the beautiful creation that you created, what,
when sin came into the world, you, you don't, you don't get how hard this really can be.
And that's why he came so that way we could, you know, overcome these things.
But he also said, I want to commune with you.
You can't do this by yourself.
Adam and Eve, the reason why God gave Adam Eve was he needed a help mate.
He needed someone to come alongside of them.
And when you were talking and you were saying so many times, we don't want to be weak.
We've talked about it over the years.
You have strengths that I do not have.
I have strengths that you don't have.
And the two of us together coming together become this like force to be reckoned with.
And then you encapsulate us with the Holy Spirit and you bring God into the equation
and then becomes an unstoppable force.
Right?
That's how we should be as people.
That's how we should be with humanity, with other people around us.
That's where the forgiveness comes into play.
That's where speaking goodness, finding the best in each other, you know, being able to
look at each other and saying, I really messed up here.
I really screwed up and being able to say, it's okay.
Let's dust it off.
Let's get back up and let's go again.
You know, it's like a child trying to walk.
We're not going to chastise them because they fall down.
We shouldn't be doing that to each other when we're trying to walk through this life together.
Yeah.
I mean, kind of along those lines, I heard it once, you know, when a child is learning
to walk, you know, even if they take one step and they fall, you know, everybody around
cheers and they celebrate that.
But then all of a sudden somewhere when we get older, there's a switch over that if we
try something and we fail, nobody celebrates the fact that we tried.
Yeah.
They focus on the failure and stuff.
Yeah.
It's time for our minds to change.
It's time for that child likeness to come back.
Yeah.
That's genuinely my takeaway from your talk right now is we have got to change our thinking.
We've got to let each other fail forward.
Yeah.
And I think also, you know, when it does come to a lot of the unforgiveness and a lot of
what we're talking about, I think there are too many people and I'm guilty of this as
well, there are too many people, they focus on their position or their title versus their
relationship and not just their relationship of who they're with, you know, us, husband
and wife relationship, parent, child, friends, you know, but also the relationship of you
and God.
I love that.
I love that because again, without that relationship, you know, especially us to God, you know,
the other relationships aren't going to matter as much, you know, and especially our position
or our perceived positions are not going to matter much.
You know, we're just, you know, it reminds me of that scripture of, you know, without
love, you know, we could sing the prettiest song, but without love, we're just like clanging
symbols.
We're noise.
You know, and it is without that connection to God, without that connection to the Father,
you know, our positions, our perceived positions are meaningless and they're hollow and I think
there's too many people that are, they're focused too much on what is my title versus
who can I be.
That's so good.
You know?
And I, and I, and kind of along those lines, I think there's a, you know, I know I'm skewing
a little bit, but I think along those lines of focusing too much on who, what, what they're
called or what position they're in.
Yeah.
You know, I think there's also a, a hang up of how am I saved?
Not so much, you know, cause I know that it's, you know, it's, it's by faith, not by works,
not not talking that, but how did I come to God or who was I before I came to God?
You know, because I, I've, I've heard the stories, you know, I've heard the stories
from, from people like me that, you know, have not always walked the straightest and
narrowest path, have not always known or appreciated God in my life.
You know, I, I look at some people and, you know, like you and like some of our other
friends that have known and loved God their whole life.
And some of our other friends that have, you know, I know there's the worshiper Catherine
Mullins, she loves to tell how she loved Jesus from as far back as she can remember, you
know.
One of our, our pastors, you know, loved God ever since she was a little girl and that's
all she ever knew.
And it's like, I'm jealous of that.
You know, I, you know, I don't know how that feels to say, you know, from as far back as
I can remember, I loved God, I loved Jesus, I was always wanted to be filled with the
Holy Spirit and here I am 45 and I'm still walking that path.
You know, but then I know other people that have been walking that path, they look at
people like me that went out and lived all these crazy boneheaded moments and they're
like, man, I'm kind of jealous of your testimony.
It's like, really?
Yeah.
It would have been so much cooler to not have all this pain in package.
Yeah.
You know, because, and I think, I think in some way there's some people that get caught
up and that's a status symbol.
Wow.
For them.
Wow.
So it's so much not, it's not so much like, like you said, not so much how we came to
Christ.
It's the fact that we're in him now.
Yeah.
And we have that relationship with him.
And I think that that's one of the things that's so beautiful about the kingdom of God
and the tapestry that he builds with all of our lives because every one of us have got
a testimony of some sort.
Every one of us can look at anybody at any given time and say, listen, the whole point
here is not that I haven't been in the world or not be, not that I had the most cleanest
testimony.
Yeah.
It's the fact that I have a Jesus.
Yeah.
I have a God.
I have a, I have a creator of the universe that came down, that loved me so much that
he gave his son to die for me.
Yeah.
And for you so that we could live and have abundant life because even in our most perfect
perfectness, it's, it's still filthy rags.
It's still not, you know, we still need Jesus.
Yeah.
We need Jesus is what it boils down to.
We all need Jesus.
Yeah.
And I love that.
I love that you said we need to stop, you know, focusing on that status, focusing on
the position because I also, it's like too many times, sometimes we, we see someone coming
from that sin or we keep somebody that's been delivered from that life.
And then we hold that past against that person as opposed to letting them walk into the fullness
of what God has called them to be.
And so no matter what it is, the enemy is always going to try to divide and conquer
and do all of his junk.
But the fact is that we all need Jesus.
Yeah.
And I've, I've also seen it where let's say there is a leader and they have a past of
their own.
They almost whitewash it or almost try to forget it because now they think, Oh, I'm
in a position.
No, I have a title.
So I, I can't make it look like I've made mistakes.
And it's like, it's like that, that, and that compassion, that empathy, that hope is now
almost shut off because they're like, well, I have to, I have to act like I'm up here.
I have to act like I deserved this.
No, see none of us deserve it.
That's the point.
Yeah.
But the whole thing is, is when we, I was telling this to a friend just the other day,
cause I had, I text a friend and I said, um, you ever come in contact with those people
that never let go of your past and don't let you walk into the abundant future that God's
got for you?
Yeah.
And I said, I want to tell you thank you for never being that person to me.
And the thing is, is in the word of God, listen to me guys in the word of God, it says we
overcome this world.
We overcome the enemy by the blood of the lamb, by the blood that Jesus shed on the
cross and the word of our testimony.
If we are not sharing the good news about what God has done in our lives, we are creating
a great misjustice.
We could literally be causing somebody to not have hope.
You could have somebody walk away from you because you've decided, well, I can't tell
that part of my story.
Listen to me.
The Holy Spirit's going to guide you.
You'll know what to say, when to say it.
And if you don't, by all means, in my mind, I'd rather err on the fact of I've told you
too much and gave the enemy a black eye.
Listen, you don't understand.
You know, people, our testimony last week with the kiddos, you know, somebody coming
and saying, you know, but, but the baby.
And I'm like, no, listen to me.
You don't understand.
See, if you don't know my testimony, if you don't know what God has already done, then
you don't know what it is that God can do in you.
You don't know what it is.
It may not even be in you.
Maybe it's your cousin.
Maybe it's your brother's sister's mom's aunt.
You know, it's, it's, we've got to be more bold and more in the enemy's face when it
comes to shouting the goodness of what God has done in our lives.
Are we going to fail, guys?
We're going to fail.
Oh yeah.
We're going to fail.
Are we failing constantly on a daily?
Yeah.
We're falling short all the time, but that's why we need Jesus.
But even in the midst of the falling short, our lives are better than what they were before.
It's true.
I told Gabri the other day, I was like, I'd rather be on the other side with Jesus, lucky,
just having like nothing.
Then to live high on the hog in a palace somewhere drenched in sin, knowing that my life is going
to hell.
It's just that simple.
I would rather just have the peace, the peace that goes beyond any understanding.
You can't put a price tag on that.
We have millionaires, billionaires, people in the highest of positions that are so miserable
because they don't have the peace.
They don't have, they don't have a sound mind.
They don't, they don't, because they're either walking in unforgiveness or walking in bitterness,
jealousy, anger, strife, whatever it is, whatever it is.
And so it's like, my prayer today would be that people would release themselves, release
each other and us start being those cheerleaders when we see our friend fall down, cheer and
say it's okay.
Let's get back up.
We're going to try it again.
And then we're going to try it again.
Yes, we will.
We will.
Yeah.
Because again, everything, everything with there, it is never too late to reset.
Never.
Everything with God.
Yeah.
Because God does, he will always forgive.
You know, as long as, you know, as long as you come to God and say, I messed up, I'm
sorry.
Yeah.
And you genuinely mean it.
God will forgive you.
Yeah.
You know, it's, it's not complicated.
No.
It's not like, it's, it's not like, well, if you, if you do this and you go through
these steps and you do this and then you say that these exact words and then God will put
you on a list that he'll get to you and possibly forgive you.
No, it's not.
It's, it's super easy.
God forgive me.
Yeah.
Forgive me.
Help me.
I want to, I want to repent and restart.
Yeah.
Okay.
Let's go.
Yeah.
And then surround me with people that will help me too.
Because here's the deal.
If we cause people to walk in condemnation, they're not going to want anything to do with
us anyway.
How is anybody going to know the right way to go unless we come alongside each other
and say, even if we say, I look at you and I go, babe, where are we going?
You go, I don't know.
Yeah.
Okay.
But we're going to get there together, right?
We're going to get there together and I'm not leaving you.
Jesus said, I'm not going to leave you or forsake you.
Yeah.
We've got to be that for each other too.
We've got to love each other enough to say, I know who God has called you to be.
I see the potential of heaven.
We're going to grab onto that mercy that is new every day, every day.
And it starts now and again, now and again.
Now that's it.
That's it.
So hold onto that today.
Yeah.
Don't, don't let the enemy steal that from you.
That's right.
We have a good God.
We have a good God and he wants nothing but good for you.
Yes.
I love this talk, babe.
This was good.
Thank you.
This was fun.
Do you have anything else you want to say?
Nope.
That's it.
That's good.
Yeah.
Maybe another time my other notes will come out.
I like it.
I know this was beautiful.
This was.
All right.
Have the best week, y'all.
Enjoy the journey.