Welcome to the Innovation Conversation, a podcast
about innovators, both in business and real life.
Hosted by myself, Ricardo Rescual and Harry McCona.
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Hi, and welcome to another episode of the Innovation
Conversation. Today we are joined by Tessa de
Breyne. Tessa, welcome to the podcast. Thank
you so much for having me, Ricardo. I'm so excited
to be here. Same, it's a pleasure having you
here. Tessa, would you like to introduce yourself
to the audience, please? Yeah, of course. So
my name is Tessa and I have just recently started
my own company, my social first agency called
MidMarketing. Okay. So how do you get started
in your journey? How do you end up, you know,
from first getting on the knowledge, then launching
a company and we actually met at the TikTok event.
Yeah. Tell us a bit more about that. So, yeah,
I just started actually working for TikTok about
three years ago and I was just, you know, quite
fresh in my career. So I was learning a lot very
quickly and I very soon realized that there's
actually a little bit of a disconnect sometimes
between the account managers and the clients
that you're working with. So as an account manager,
I took it upon myself back then already to really
work with the clients as well in regards to content
and not just give advice on, you know, like product
implementations, but really think about what
can work and what can go. viral, as they say,
which is a toughie, but always very fun. Then
afterwards when I was, you know, working in sales
for a bit longer, I realized I really missed.
helping out people with something I'm good at,
because I guess I'm quite good at it. And I decided
to just try it out for myself. And yeah, now
I'm working with TikTok again, actually. But
it's like working with an ex, but it's very nice
to work back with your ex because they see me
as kind of like this external expert now, which
I'm very happy about, of course. Was it scary?
Taking that leap from, I guess, a normal paid
job to launching your own business? Yeah, I mean,
very scary because my entire life, you know,
for the past two years was in Ireland, but I'm
originally from Belgium. So I was like, OK, I'm
moving back in with my parents, I guess. And
I'm figuring stuff out from scratch. So, you
know, all the friends I still have, my partner
still lives there in Dublin. And it's. A bit
stressful at this point still because I'm just
starting out, but very quickly I didn't realize
when people were reaching out to me that I could
bring some value to them. So I'm just going to
go with the flow and you know, whatever they
need, I'm kind of adjusting to see what else
I can offer. You know, what made you take the
leap from, I guess, a corporate job to a more,
you know, to having your own business? To be
completely honest, I was quite burned out from
sales and I think that was the biggest factor.
I was working for LinkedIn at the time and I
realized that even though, you know, nothing
wrong with the product, it was very, it was a
very cool product LinkedIn and I still use it
every day. I realized that I was not as good
at selling it as I was when it came to marketing
and advertising because I just, I just did not
have the same. connection to it, I guess. So
that's when I started realizing like I started
questioning myself a lot more and my self -esteem
was getting lower. So when I would even get the
results, like I would hit the targets, but I
was just not enjoying it as much. And that's
when I realized like I actually have to do something
else. And if I stay in sales, I'm not going to
be able to come back to marketing as seriously.
So I have to start now. So it's kind of one of
those make it or break it moments, right? You
needed to... A little, yeah. A little. Just taking
care of yourself first. Which makes perfect sense.
I mean, most entrepreneurs kind of get started
that way. They have such a gigantic, I guess,
itch to scratch that they cannot say no to it.
They literally need to scratch it and launch
very successful business afters. And now, as
you're advising startups in marketing and all
that, what are the common mistakes you're finding?
I think a lot of times startups or scale ups
they just don't really bother with marketing
initially or they're like yeah we have Instagram
and that's that's enough you know we're like
we're we're active on LinkedIn and people know
about us but that's not enough of course it depends
on what your business is but I think if you're
starting a business let's say in clothing you
really have so much competition out there and
then you're just starting out thinking like hey
I have a shirt as well that's not you have to
be a bit more strategic about it so I think the
whole idea of creating awareness sometimes comes
last well actually it should be one of the first
things you do when starting out a business it's
funny because there's a lot of like um people
doing like tiktok lives and stuff like that where
they put on clothes take off clothes and that's
actually that creates a lot of views and yeah
all right yeah it's a good way to get started
i guess that's a very fun one yeah i think tiktok
live can can help a lot just in general being
being active having some organic content already
out boosting those like using using spark ads
on tiktok or you know going on instagram and
making a bit more videos and making content just
like be very active for two weeks like post multiple
times for two weeks and you're already gonna
see so much more than if you just like post once
a week What do you do when you're camera shy?
When you're camera shy, well, a lot of times,
you know, you can actually hop on some trends
without using your own face. Like I myself, I
don't like being in front of the camera that
much, but I realized like, okay, I'm there's
this one person in this company and it's me.
So who else is going to do it? So if that's the
case, I would say get over yourself. But if you're
saying like you're selling products or something,
you can always go for content creators like you
user generated content because then it's gonna
feel a bit more authentic you're gonna have some
good reviews already and that kind of word -of
-mouth or that social proofing as they call it
is actually so valuable because the best videos
on both TikTok and Instagram and YouTube the
best performing videos are people that are just
talking to the camera like this like I'm talking
to you right now so that's something that you
have to take into account and if you're okay
with going a bit slower then yeah you can just
use like whatever you have laying around to make
to kind of make it for yourself make another
kind of video but it's not going to perform as
well and what is there a platform that you advise
over another or actually you should make content
for all of them and just see where it works better
That's a really difficult one. So I had it before
a client comes to me and they're just like, yeah,
just make content for everything. And I'm just
like, gosh, it's going to be a lot of work because,
um, yeah, you have to really figure out where
your audience is. And your audience, a lot of
times startups come with the idea of like, Oh,
my audience or my target audience is everyone.
Like great. 18 plus. Thank you. That's really
helpful. Yeah, you just have to really look into
where your audience is So I think if you're looking
at a younger audience, maybe you can look at
snapchat and tiktok while with the Millennials
you're Probably also looking at tiktok and instagram
older generation. Of course is more facebook.
You can kind of just Adjust and play play all
all the different social media platforms, but
definitely do your research first because otherwise
you're gonna get overwhelmed. I myself am overwhelmed
because I don't have like a clue right now where
my biggest clients will be as I'm just starting
out myself as well. But the first mistake I made
is creating a Pinterest account. No, the reason
that people want to come to me is probably because
they want to be more like creative and they're
not gonna find like my little infographics on
Pinterest for that. So yeah. Love your two stuff.
Love me too, I'm a big fan. It's really great.
But then you probably say that create more video
content also makes it easier to, I guess, absorb
information than just having infographics and
stuff like that. Yeah, I actually really like
infographics so much, but I've noticed that their
performance pretty much on all platforms, maybe
LinkedIn is still okay. The performance is just
really not that good. So if you want to make
infographics for your clients to post on your
website yourself or to use it in blogs for more
like SEO content, absolutely. But if you're talking
about like real posts, then yeah, you should
think more about videos or pictures. But I think
pictures are also kind of leaving the scene at
this point. And is it more like when we talk
about the products or any products? Should we
go and show our vulnerabilities to the camera
and as founders or as sent? Yeah. Yeah. Like
once you're crying, just immediately be like,
guys. No, I'm joking. But yeah, like show your
vulnerabilities because that's one of the best
things that you can do is to show people that
they're actually buying from a human. Interesting.
Because you don't want to buy from a brand. You
want to buy from other people. And how do you
manage that? Because let's say you have a company
and you're just launching out. Obviously, the
founder's journey is very important, but at the
same time, you might not want to be, I guess,
associated with what you're selling and kind
of you want to keep it on download. So how do
you manage that fine balance between is this
too cringe or is this just right to actually
talk about what I'm doing right now? I mean,
it's very difficult to get over the cringe, but...
To be honest, you have to embrace the cringe,
because if you don't want to be associated with
your brand, with your product, with your service,
why would anyone else want to be associated with
your brand or product or service? So yeah, embrace
the cringe. That's the hashtag embrace. Hashtag
embrace. Is that still a thing, the hashtags,
or not anymore? I don't know. I'm always thinking
like, should I use hashtags or not? And then
at one point I realized like, oh, LinkedIn has
hashtags now, I should use them more. So with
hashtags, I'm always falling behind, I feel.
I know with TikTok, it was obviously where my
expertise lies still. With TikTok, it's more
about the words that you use on the video itself.
So if you use like a little bit of words and
then you put them out of the screen, they're
still gonna be read by the algorithm and used.
but then otherwise like the hashtags I don't
I think it's good enough to use words and hashtags
are just good for filler words okay so the trick
for having a successful viral view and by viral
I mean just having a little bit more views is
actually use all the keywords you want on the
TikTok reels oh yeah reels for sure TikTok and
reels yeah that's that's a really really good
one actually but you have to think about it and
I don't think about it myself all the time to
be like oh yes now I have to do hashtag digital
marketing hashtag AI hashtag this you're not
thinking of it really there's so many different
ways that you can go viral as well one of the
biggest things is just pure luck just be lucky
and everyone just thinks that they're gonna post
one video when they're gonna like that's not
so like every single client conversation I've
had already since I started now is them asking
me to make them go viral. They're like, you worked
at TikTok. Do it. Do your thing. I'm just like,
I wasn't able. If I'm not viral myself right
now, what makes you think that I can do it? Otherwise
I would already be an influencer somewhere in
the Bahamas, but I'm not. Well, but then you'd
be posting different type of content, right?
For sure, I would like to drink smoothies all
day and just be like, I'm hashtag blessed. Yeah,
and I manifested all this. I just thought about
it and it kind of magically happened. I manifested
it with my tarot cards. Booker reading. and we
call everyone like goddess queens and stuff yeah
it would be i would be so good at that and then
he also usually i think what normally works well
and it's like the the first the first thumbnail
like that first static image which is always
99 like someone looking very very sexy and then
the whole video has nothing to do with it whatsoever
uh and you see this a lot on youtube it's like
oh girls on bikinis and then and then it's like
this horrible guy talking for an hour and there's
a millisecond of a girl in the bikini kind of
shows up in the frame I think you are telling
on yourself right now Ricardo yeah I'm much telling
on myself Now I'm thinking for example, I follow
this guy called ball and and what's it called
ball and bankrupt and he's just going he's a
he's a travel vlogger I guess and he goes on
multiple things What's funny is most of his videos
unless they have like some historical or very
important monument is just a girl in the bikini
thing Oh interesting, and then you click on it.
And of course, it's just a guy doing his stuff.
So yeah, yeah What's the way they say they used
to say it as well sex sells sex sell. Yes sex
sells And girls in bikinis do well, usually.
And good -looking guys as well. Exactly. Which
brings me to the biggest question right now,
which is hooks. What works as a hook? What doesn't
work as a hook from your experience? I actually
have a funny story about that because the same
thing happened where they asked me at the workshop
and I was so sleep deprived that I decided to
show them. So I'll show you now. A good hook
is just... Really? I literally just like, did
this. You just slide your hands in and say, okay.
No, but a good hook is just like something that
really grabs your attention, you know? Just be
like, like right now the blog that I posted as
well is kind of similar with a hook, right? Like
if your startup isn't on social media, you're
already losing. And then people are like, oh
shit, why? And then they keep watching. But otherwise,
if... If it's gonna be more, you know, physical
where you're like doing this or I'm grabbing
something to eat. Like there's a lot of ways
that you can kind of use around yourself to create
a hook. Like if right now one of my stuffed animals
would fall or something and I would grab it,
that's already a hook. And what about, you know
how the videos sometimes always have like this
infinite loop? They just ask a question and then
they kind of, they answer the question but keep
on asking the question over and over again. Do
you think that should be the right format for
people to post videos in? I think it's a really
cool format. I think it's definitely a fun one
to try if you're able to do it. I think for me
myself, I don't always have the patience to go
into like editing that nicely of like and this
is why your startup should do this and then it
starts again like why your startup should do
this. I don't really Yeah, I mean it's good,
but I don't know if you should try it constantly
because I think it's a lot of work for your editing
and sometimes it can be more fun to kind of try
something else. There's always a big conversation
around very long content versus short content.
When TikTok began it was very short content,
you know 30 seconds max or something like that.
Whereas now we can actually watch videos for
a couple of minutes as well. What do you think
people should actually do? Should they go? And
also how does the algorithm work regarding the
length of the content? So good question I Would
have to check what it is now But I remember previously
it would only be seen as a as a view if you watched
I want to say 30 % of the content already so
then obviously if you're talking about like oh
if it's shorter than it's easier for you to get
that 30 % Yeah, I would I would have to check
what it is now in terms of like the best content
or like the long or the short formats, just play
with it. I think it really depends on what you
want to do. I think the sweet spot would be around
like two to three minutes. I think that would
be ideal because otherwise it's going to be a
bit too long for people with a short attention
span and Lord knows that TikTok has not helped
with that. No, that's why not. You're like watching
TikToks and your series at the same time and
then you're like doing something on your laptop
at the same time, right? So you want to be very
quick with it but at the same time it needs to
stay interesting and I think if you have a really
good video and you're able to entertain people
throughout those three minutes or 10 minutes
or whatever length you want to pick I think you
can just you know if you're saying something
valuable you can use it for 15 minutes Interesting,
okay. So something to consider. Now, when it
comes to video format, I think that's also not
just the length, but also do you record it horizontally,
vertically? Obviously, there's specific formats
for different platforms. Yeah. What do you think
actually works best in the sense that should
you create content that only works for YouTube
and then crop everything else and put it on TikTok?
Or quite on the contrary, should I actually just
record horizontally and that's horizontal? No,
vertically. And that's it. And then post it on
all the other platforms. I've kind of started
very quickly to realize when I started a TikTok
that you really need to implement the TikTok
first strategy if you want to be able to work
it out on all platforms. So if you're thinking
TikTok first, then that same video is probably
gonna work for Instagram. If it works for Instagram,
it's probably gonna work for Facebook. If it
works for Facebook, it's probably gonna work
for LinkedIn and also like YouTube, the YouTube
shorts. I think that's... Most relevant right
now then of course if you're talking about more
horizontal videos for YouTube I think those are
still amazing, but I've seen even on normal YouTube
videos that I get advertisements and they're
vertical and it's very interesting to me like
how the Advertisements all of a sudden are vertical
even though the video that I want to watch is
horizontal or should be horizontal So I think
it kind of works everywhere at this point the
vertical the vertical lining, aligning of the
video. When you're a startup and you're starting
out, obviously you want to create as much content
as possible, but is there any tips or tricks
you can give them in terms of their strategy?
What are the core basics of creating content?
Purely organic. I would say just try to think
about the three rules. The first step is always
to grab the attention. bunny falling or something.
Just grab the attention. Be entertaining. I used
to say be entertaining or educational but to
be honest the educational part if it's not entertaining
people are gonna scroll by because they don't
want to like hear a whole monologue of you. And
then the third part is a call to action. So no
matter what if you're actually a business you
should make sure that there's some sort of way
for people to understand that you're a business.
that you're not just a random person on the internet
but you're actually also representing something
because sometimes what I saw is like clients
that are doing really well and their content
is going so viral they're doing so well and it's
just the intern who's like doing great but at
the same time they're not really clear that it's
a company and when you're just scrolling on the
for you page you see this funny person doing
something funny okay but that's not really gonna
help you attract more clients Where should you
direct people? Should you just get them on the
TikTok messaging functionality? Should you direct
them to a different website? What do you think
actually works better? I think if you're able
to just go into the website, like if you were
able to put your website on your TikTok page
or your Instagram page or wherever, a social
media platform. I think that works best. I see
a lot of companies also start using Linktree.
I think that was something that creators were
using at first to kind of showcase their other
social media platforms, but now companies are
doing that as well. So it's also an option if
you want to have more like links to maybe an
external blog or maybe to your LinkedIn page
and yeah, just goes a bit further. What do you
think about AI generated content? Like there's
always like these crazy videos you can do with
just AI pictures and animations that affect that.
Do you think that works or not so much? Or not
yet? I think at this point it still works because
people are still kind of intrigued by it. I think
there's gonna be a time where I mean listen right
now we're seeing the worst that AI can do. So
It's still interesting to look at because like
just recently I saw a bunny who was like rolling
dough pretending to be in a bakery and I'm just
like, what am I looking at? Obviously I'm gonna
keep watching because I need to know if he's
actually able to put the bread in the oven. But
that's something that I think not always works
for a company. Like you take kind of this absurd
chaos element. And if you're able to twist it
into something that actually works for you and
for your industry and for what you represent,
yes, absolutely. But if it just stays absurd
and chaotic, I don't think you should use it.
I know that TikTok right now also came out with
Symphony, where you're able to kind of record
yourself and reuse the same video to talk in
different languages to be able to, yeah, like
my old boss was like speaking in Chinese on LinkedIn.
I was like, huh? I didn't know she could do that.
Um, but at the same time, it's just a little
creepy for me. So I think it's still best to
just use actual people to get certain messages
across, but it definitely gives an extra element
of, yeah, just being interesting. Yeah. Symphony.
Yeah. TikTok symphony. Okay. Interesting. It's
for free as well. So I think you can, if you
go into CapCut. um you're able to to try it out
and you're going to be able to um to use symphony
as well it's quite interesting interesting i
can now speak multiple languages well i can already
speak multiple languages but even more languages
uh okay yeah that's quite interesting uh i wonder
how i'm going to sound in chinese uh or mandarin
yeah that should be very cool uh which actually
brings me to the next question which is How do
you get a good sense, if you're just starting
out, of who your audience actually is? Because
we now have, like you said, the ability to create
videos with AI, the ability to create content
in multiple languages. How do we narrow it down
on our audience and actually make content just
for them? It's a good question. And I think it's
a question that not enough people ask themselves.
So it's really good that you're putting that
out there. It's a tough one because you have
to really... Try to think who you're making your
product or service for. Really, I think there's
such a big benefit into a marketing kind of technique
that I haven't used in so long, but I remember
using it like when I was working at other companies
to have your personas ready. Like who are your
different personas, right? Like it's something
that we had in marketing classes and like when
I was 18 or something. That's like is it the
I was working for a pet food company So then
you have like okay the single twenty something
girl that has like a cat or a dog How is she
gonna treat like is she gonna buy the product?
Yes, because it's a bit more expensive and it
has fun colors That's and it's like the healthiest
option on the market like yes She's gonna buy
it is like the person who's putting their dog
outside for the day And they don't really care
about it. Just like a guard dog they're probably
not going to be in your demographic, you know,
even though they do have pets. But you can't
just be like everyone that has a pet. So that's
something that I think personally, a lot more
people have to kind of think through. And that
probably takes you like, together with your partners,
like a week to really agree on who your personas
are. And you probably still have to talk to an
agency to kind of walk you through everything
and ask you some very hard -hitting questions,
because you're obviously gonna believe that your
product is the best for everyone, but that's
just not the case sometimes. Sorry. And it's
always a bit of a wake -up call, isn't it? A
little, yeah. Who is this, you know, targeting?
Everyone, everyone's gonna buy this. No. Not
even Coca -Cola can sell to everyone, there's
still people who don't drink it. So, yeah. it's
pretty funny because i used to be able to be
a little mean to my clients when i was working
at tiktok um in the sense that i could really
ask them like hey you just posted a picture on
tiktok a picture with no sound and just one plus
one tree of like very blurry shoes be honest
would you buy this yourself and then there would
be like Okay, I guess not. And now with clients
that I have now, obviously, I can't just be mean.
So I have to be like, hey, that's great, buddy.
Let's try to do this a bit differently next time.
But then, I mean, if you're posting pictures
on TikTok and a single picture, that is a complete
marketing failure, isn't it? I mean, at least
a carousel with some funky music, right? I think
carousels were invented because of those people
that decided pictures were a good idea on TikTok.
And TikTok was just like, you know what? We got
you. It's okay. You don't have to try harder
anymore. Carousels are okay. Like they can still
be fun, but they can also be super boring. Like
if you just post very bad product pictures, like
I'm sorry, no one's going to go through your
catalog. they have to still be telling a story,
they have to be interesting. But it's fun that
now people can kind of be lazier in their content
creation. An interesting question is, or at least
for me, let's say you have built a TikTok account,
you've posted multiple things, but they've all
been an absolute disaster. You have more than
100 posts, 200 posts, and none of them actually
got more than 50 views each or something like
that. Should you delete that account, create
a new one, or can you actually start posting
better content and then ideally it will go not
viral, but you get more views just because of
the quality? Well, the first... thing that you
have to ask yourself is what kind of content
were you posting? And are you gonna do things
differently? Are you gonna use the best performing
ones of your old account? I would first always
try to work with your existing account simply
because you're gonna already have some people
that are following you there, or I hope. And
then hopefully you're gonna be able to re -engage
them and get more views and new people coming
in as well through that. But it is the case that
TikTok... would post, would boost or promote
newer accounts. That's something that I've noticed
many times already that like if you start a new
account, for me myself as well now, like I have
my own existing account, my personal one that
I'm not really active on at all. But when I would
try to be active for a while, it would just not
really be that popular because I was already
on TikTok for the past year. but now with my
agency I notice that I'm having like 2k views
for the first two videos and they're not really
that good to be honest with you like I know I
can do much better but I'm just like you know
kind of preoccupied as well with other things
and other clients but yeah it's It's weird. I
don't know why they do it. I think they just
want to kind of motivate you to keep creating
content. And then obviously it's really sad when
you're already having an existing profile. You're
getting less of the motivation that you might
need. Interesting. And how do you balance between
doing lives and actually creating content? Because
I think lives also serve as a way to, I guess,
boost your rankings, right? So the more lives
you do, the higher the likelihood of actually
people following it. Even though sometimes they're
absolutely horrible. Like, I avoid going on the
live section because it's either, you know, someone
DJing or someone talking complete horrible things
about something that they're nothing about. Yeah,
I always get the same lives, but recently I found
a live with Kermit the Frog who's going through
a heartbreak and that's definitely one of the
most interesting ones I've seen. You can keep
all of the weird things in by the way. Yeah,
I think live, you can only go live if you have
a thousand followers on TikTok, I believe. Interesting.
I don't know how it works. on instagram and and
like facebook and and youtube i would have to
check that again how many followers you need
for that but on tiktok i'm quite certain that
it's from a thousand followers onwards i would
say it's good if you have something interesting
to do like if you're just talking as a creator
you can do everything right i see people that
are trying to pop popcorn with their like hair
utensils but if you're really like talking about
business then obviously you want to make sure
that you're talking about your business or you
starting your business or like i'm doing admin
come do admin with me and you're playing like
just fun music or something or you're answering
the questions you're just hanging out it can
be a lot of things and it can kind of boost the
feeling of community i think and that's the most
important thing that you can have especially
as a startup that you're able to kind of create
a community for you and your potential clients.
Interesting, because I think that's always something
that people kind of struggle with, which is finding
the early adopters, the people who love your
product, the people who talk braving about it,
and actually they're going to get you even more
clients. And that's kind of what you want to
be, right? Where you want to be in the sense
that it's organic content, it's people loving
your product, talking about your product, and
yeah, that's the sweet spot. Yeah, it's the best
when like you start getting reviews, like all
of a sudden you're tagged in a video and you're
just like, oh, what's happening? And then you
realize that it's actually someone who's just
raving about your products. You're like, great,
you know, that's what you want. That's the best
thing. it reminds me many years ago there was
this whole video ads I'm a Mac I'm a PC and they
would compare the two type of users and what
was interesting was that I know if you recall
those what was interesting was that the Mac users
were such strong brand ambassadors like they
really really loved the product when it came
to PCs no one ever said check out my new Lenovo
or check out my new Asus or my HP how do you
know I'm on a Lenovo? but yeah exactly but the
point is no one ever like brag to their friends
who check this out i think the first time that
people start bringing was when uh the the gaming
one showed up alienware or something like that
and people like oh check this out lady specs
very good for gaming but before that i was like
yeah i got a laptop it does what you need to
do and that's kind of it I think Apple has a
really strong sense of community. It's like Apple
and then you also have, you know, like the Pepsi
versus Coca -Cola kind of things. It's really
interesting how there's like this cult following
around certain brands because you expect that
with people. So even with like Tesla, it's like
people that are also a big fan of Musk probably.
Now not so much. Yeah, now maybe, you know, for
a while, you know, Musk was kind of the person
that was creating Tesla so it was more quickly
that you would say like okay he has a cult following
because of the person that's behind it and I
feel like with companies like Apple it's really
because of the company and because of what they
represent or like with Nike, Adidas I feel like
they also have this kind of like I mean it's
not a fight that they're having but at the same
time it kind of is because they're very competitive
and you can tell in the communities as well a
lot of times And I think that they kind of resonate
with with the way you see yourself in the world,
right? Mm -hmm. There's the reason why you buy
a night well Ultimately all shoes are the same
But if you buy Nike instead of Adidas, there's
a reason why you buy Nike not Adidas at least
for me I just like the logo. Just do it. I like
that. It's like yeah, it's kind of why I'm just
two things I don't worry too much and even though
Adidas make really good shoes. I cannot recall
the last Years I've ever bought like I haven't
bought Adidas for probably the last 20 years
But just because I associate more with Nike.
So yeah, yeah, and that's the thing like the
power of association is very strong especially
if you're talking about Characteristics that
you hope that your ideal audience has so I think
Nike does very well with that I think Apple does
very well with that as well because they're like
we are we are innovation, you know And that really
brings in a lot of people that are like, yeah,
I'm innovation as well and same goes for Izzy
Cook Coca -Cola sells happiness, right? They
don't sell soft drinks. And then I guess McDonald's,
for example, I think they also they don't sell
happiness. They sell familiarity and the sense
of belonging because regardless of where you
go in the world, McDonald's always looks the
same. The menu might change. Right. But apart
from that, it's always the same feeling. You
know, consistency. It's actually something quite
important when you're traveling. So yeah. Especially
as I like Starbucks does kind of the same thing
because they're so big they're everywhere It's
always kind of the same so that sense of familiarity
and the sense of home is always there Okay, you
kind of feel okay. This is a safe space and it's
always you know coffee save our flavors you can
get the grande with extra something something
I don't drink coffee so But yeah, it's always
the same thing. Now, very important, Tessa, if
people want to reach out to you as we're nearing
the end of the podcast, what's the best way of
doing so? You can always find me on LinkedIn.
I'm quite active there. Otherwise, you can shoot
me an email on tessa at mitmarketing .eu. Mitmarketing
.eu is also my website, so you can check out
my portfolio there. You can see what I did. You
can see if you like my jokes. If you don't like
my personality, then maybe we're not a good fit.
But if you... are okay with what I've said so
far, then we probably are. Awesome. Sounds good.
Tessa, thank you so much for your time. It's
been an absolute pleasure having you here on
the podcast. Thank you so much for having me.
I enjoyed it so much. Thank you. The podcast
is also sponsored by Notion .so. Notion is offering
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