WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.859 Welcome to the Innovation Conversation, a podcast 00:00:02.859 --> 00:00:05.400 about innovators, both in business and real life. 00:00:05.860 --> 00:00:08.419 Hosted by myself, Ricardo Rescual and Harry McCona. 00:00:08.660 --> 00:00:11.660 This podcast is sponsored by OpenExperts .com. 00:00:11.939 --> 00:00:14.140 OpenExperts is a place to go if you're looking 00:00:14.140 --> 00:00:16.140 to talk with top experts from around the world. 00:00:16.539 --> 00:00:20.879 That is Open -Experts .com. This podcast is also 00:00:20.879 --> 00:00:24.539 sponsored by StartupNetworks .co .uk. Startup 00:00:24.539 --> 00:00:26.820 Networks, it's an online forum where you can 00:00:26.820 --> 00:00:28.739 find all the resources you need to learn your 00:00:28.739 --> 00:00:31.460 startup. from brands to investors to tips and 00:00:31.460 --> 00:00:33.700 tricks on how to be successful to start. Hi, 00:00:33.759 --> 00:00:35.920 and welcome to another episode of the Innovation 00:00:35.920 --> 00:00:38.799 Conversation. Today we are joined by Laura Idiarte. 00:00:39.179 --> 00:00:42.399 Laura, welcome. Hi Ricardo, thank you very much 00:00:42.399 --> 00:00:45.780 for this invitation and I'm very happy to be 00:00:45.780 --> 00:00:47.939 here. It's a pleasure having you here. Laura, 00:00:47.979 --> 00:00:49.619 would you like to introduce yourself to the audience, 00:00:49.719 --> 00:00:53.520 please? Sure. I am head of PR and communications 00:00:53.520 --> 00:00:58.299 at Zero 100 conferences. We organize networking 00:00:58.299 --> 00:01:01.780 opportunities in the investor's world. So we 00:01:01.780 --> 00:01:04.420 work in the private equity and venture capital 00:01:04.420 --> 00:01:08.359 industry. And I also have a podcast, the ESG 00:01:08.359 --> 00:01:11.519 and Impact Talks, where I talk to investors about 00:01:11.519 --> 00:01:15.640 these topics. We release an episode every two 00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:18.599 weeks, so I'm very, very passionate about these 00:01:18.599 --> 00:01:21.689 topics. Interesting. And, you know, how did you 00:01:21.689 --> 00:01:24.450 get started in this industry? Well, actually, 00:01:25.189 --> 00:01:29.290 I've always been very, I've been always part 00:01:29.290 --> 00:01:35.290 of the financial services, right? I started 10 00:01:35.290 --> 00:01:37.430 years ago, actually, like working for the Banks 00:01:37.430 --> 00:01:41.750 Association in Chile. And while doing this, I 00:01:41.750 --> 00:01:47.739 also started course on community relations in 00:01:47.739 --> 00:01:51.319 the extractive industry, which is very specific, 00:01:51.319 --> 00:01:55.760 right? But I was living in Chile. I even did 00:01:55.760 --> 00:01:58.680 like a project on financial inclusion in the 00:01:58.680 --> 00:02:00.840 mining industry. You know, I was very passionate, 00:02:01.099 --> 00:02:03.480 always been very passionate about this. I had 00:02:03.480 --> 00:02:07.299 worked in sustainability for many years, from 00:02:07.299 --> 00:02:12.000 airline then in Chile as well. for a bank in 00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:14.340 the Banco de Chile, which is the largest bank 00:02:14.340 --> 00:02:18.460 in Chile. And my job was, I was in charge of 00:02:18.460 --> 00:02:21.659 the financial inclusion strategy for the bank. 00:02:22.439 --> 00:02:26.500 I've always done it from the more of the commercial 00:02:26.500 --> 00:02:30.300 side of the financial services. And last year, 00:02:30.379 --> 00:02:37.159 I joined the Zero 100 conferences and went directly 00:02:37.159 --> 00:02:41.560 into the investors world. Even though it's all 00:02:41.560 --> 00:02:43.680 about the financial services industry, this is 00:02:43.680 --> 00:02:48.580 a very specific, very niche world, and I really 00:02:48.580 --> 00:02:52.500 love it because it's the one that actually makes 00:02:52.500 --> 00:02:55.900 the decisions on where this world is heading 00:02:55.900 --> 00:03:04.280 to. Where VCs and private equities invest is 00:03:04.280 --> 00:03:07.759 where the innovation is going to happen. How 00:03:07.759 --> 00:03:10.300 did you find the transition? Was it easy? Was 00:03:10.300 --> 00:03:16.060 it hard? Well, I had three years of doing a different 00:03:16.060 --> 00:03:21.539 thing, away from the financial services world. 00:03:22.080 --> 00:03:25.680 And it made me realize that I really like this 00:03:25.680 --> 00:03:30.560 industry. So I think the transition was that. 00:03:31.539 --> 00:03:35.520 I didn't transition from doing financial inclusion 00:03:35.520 --> 00:03:40.080 and financial wellness into the investors world, 00:03:40.159 --> 00:03:43.280 but I did this like other transition which was 00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:46.439 from the financial services world to this other 00:03:46.439 --> 00:03:50.560 like designing innovation world and then coming 00:03:50.560 --> 00:03:53.300 back to the investor, to the financial world, 00:03:53.400 --> 00:03:56.139 you know? And I think that I've been learning 00:03:56.139 --> 00:03:59.000 a lot because I know in general I have an MBA 00:03:59.000 --> 00:04:05.539 from I Business School. It's a very entrepreneurship 00:04:05.539 --> 00:04:09.240 oriented school here in Spain. So I did have 00:04:09.240 --> 00:04:14.580 a lot of venture capital and classes, classmates, 00:04:15.099 --> 00:04:16.800 and like, you know, like a lot of people from 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:20.199 my generation either, either founded a company 00:04:20.199 --> 00:04:23.620 or went to work for a VC, you know? So I didn't 00:04:23.620 --> 00:04:28.259 know a lot about this world, but I didn't actually 00:04:28.259 --> 00:04:34.860 like dive deeper, you know? And now I'm all in 00:04:34.860 --> 00:04:39.120 and not only in, but I'm all in from what I like. 00:04:39.540 --> 00:04:45.019 That is the ESG part. So I'm more than happy. 00:04:45.540 --> 00:04:50.279 When you talk with investors, how concerned are 00:04:50.279 --> 00:04:53.779 they with the ESG thing? Is it something that 00:04:53.779 --> 00:04:56.620 they actually look out for or is it still something 00:04:56.620 --> 00:05:00.379 on the back of their mind overall? Well, it depends. 00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:04.079 No. And one thing is ESG and another thing is 00:05:04.079 --> 00:05:08.279 impact. And I talk about both topics. And it 00:05:08.279 --> 00:05:11.860 depends on the type of investor, right? If you 00:05:11.860 --> 00:05:16.240 talk to a VC fund, that's an impact one. I mean, 00:05:17.720 --> 00:05:20.139 the level of conversation, it's completely different 00:05:20.139 --> 00:05:22.319 to another that's more generalist and that's 00:05:22.319 --> 00:05:27.620 actually more ESG focused. You know, I think 00:05:27.620 --> 00:05:33.480 the industry as a whole, it's very, very concerned 00:05:33.480 --> 00:05:36.879 about this because they have to. The regulation 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:39.899 is asking them to start doing something about 00:05:39.899 --> 00:05:43.279 it, right? You know, you have like this whole 00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:49.560 CSRD and then you have this whole SDR here in 00:05:49.560 --> 00:05:54.300 Europe and they have to actually make sure they 00:05:54.300 --> 00:05:59.170 are being compliant with the regulation. I haven't 00:05:59.170 --> 00:06:04.810 had conversations yet with funds or investors 00:06:04.810 --> 00:06:09.670 from the US, for example. I did have the chance 00:06:09.670 --> 00:06:13.189 to talk to European funds that invest in the 00:06:13.189 --> 00:06:17.110 US and I can tell you that they do struggle with 00:06:17.209 --> 00:06:21.870 with portfolio companies in the U .S. and without 00:06:21.870 --> 00:06:24.149 this, I mean, without this in the U .S., it's 00:06:24.149 --> 00:06:26.069 not a struggle, but the conversation is different, 00:06:26.110 --> 00:06:31.470 right? Whereas here in Europe, where the rules 00:06:31.470 --> 00:06:35.689 are there, they are for everyone. They are not 00:06:35.689 --> 00:06:38.029 easy because they are new, they are changing, 00:06:38.189 --> 00:06:40.949 but at least you have them. So we are all going 00:06:40.949 --> 00:06:44.790 towards the same direction kind of, you know? 00:06:46.569 --> 00:06:50.089 But when you think about like on a more international 00:06:50.089 --> 00:06:52.990 level, okay, yeah, you have the US, but then 00:06:52.990 --> 00:06:57.050 you also have another emerging countries where 00:06:57.050 --> 00:07:00.910 the challenge is different. And investors are 00:07:00.910 --> 00:07:04.430 either raising from these countries or investing 00:07:04.430 --> 00:07:06.810 in these countries. So it's very complicated. 00:07:07.350 --> 00:07:13.129 For example, if you're an investor that raises 00:07:13.129 --> 00:07:16.709 money in Europe, It's very hard for you to deploy 00:07:16.709 --> 00:07:20.110 it in Latin America. If you have all this regulation, 00:07:20.430 --> 00:07:23.050 if you are, for example, an SDR Article 9 bond, 00:07:23.149 --> 00:07:26.949 you know, you cannot, you need all this data 00:07:26.949 --> 00:07:31.170 to be available for you to report. And it's very 00:07:31.170 --> 00:07:35.350 hard to do it like in a market like the Latin 00:07:35.350 --> 00:07:37.790 American market where this is not a priority 00:07:37.790 --> 00:07:41.370 and the rules are not the same. So I think this 00:07:41.370 --> 00:07:44.910 is a very interesting topic and it's gaining 00:07:44.910 --> 00:07:48.449 more relevance. And it's also very confusing 00:07:48.449 --> 00:07:51.470 at the same time because of the new regulation. 00:07:51.850 --> 00:07:57.389 I think that everyone has like different approach 00:07:57.389 --> 00:08:02.089 to it. And that's what the whole new regulation 00:08:02.089 --> 00:08:05.509 is trying to like clear up a little bit, no? 00:08:05.589 --> 00:08:08.689 Like to make sure that we all speak the same 00:08:08.689 --> 00:08:11.910 language and we're all on the same page when 00:08:11.910 --> 00:08:18.980 it comes to to talking about impact on ESG. I 00:08:18.980 --> 00:08:21.600 was just wondering, because I normally talk with 00:08:21.600 --> 00:08:23.360 a lot of startups and they're always curious 00:08:23.360 --> 00:08:26.240 on how hard it is to actually get investment 00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:29.939 from other countries and other regions. How do 00:08:29.939 --> 00:08:32.659 you normally find that? Is it hard for investors 00:08:32.659 --> 00:08:36.820 to actually put down money? Is there any advice 00:08:36.820 --> 00:08:38.360 you can give to startups if they want to get 00:08:38.360 --> 00:08:40.740 some money from European investors that are building 00:08:40.740 --> 00:08:43.279 something that is really impactful, it's really 00:08:43.279 --> 00:08:45.080 going to change the world, but they just don't 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:46.240 happen to be in Europe, they happen to be in 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:48.899 Latin America. Is there like a magic pill or 00:08:48.899 --> 00:08:53.419 formula they can do? Well, European investors, 00:08:54.419 --> 00:09:00.480 they have to be compliant with their with the 00:09:00.480 --> 00:09:04.440 European regulation and with what their LPs are 00:09:04.440 --> 00:09:09.100 asking for. So if you're a Latin American company, 00:09:09.720 --> 00:09:13.340 maybe you should also make sure that you understand 00:09:13.340 --> 00:09:18.620 what they need and what they have been requested 00:09:18.620 --> 00:09:24.179 from their LPs. That way you can actually maybe 00:09:24.179 --> 00:09:31.279 give them the idea that you will be able to deliver 00:09:31.279 --> 00:09:35.259 that information. I think that could be an option 00:09:35.259 --> 00:09:40.299 because in the end, it's about the capacity of 00:09:40.299 --> 00:09:47.820 the VCs to actually deliver and report the ESG 00:09:47.820 --> 00:09:51.480 data that they need to report. They have to be 00:09:51.480 --> 00:09:55.620 compliant. Otherwise, they cannot get the money. 00:09:56.269 --> 00:10:00.970 Nowadays, it's very hard to get the money. It's 00:10:00.970 --> 00:10:04.070 like this cycle, right? You want to be compliant, 00:10:04.370 --> 00:10:09.330 you have to do this and you have to look for 00:10:09.330 --> 00:10:11.549 companies that are able to actually help you 00:10:11.549 --> 00:10:18.509 in this transparency data. So yes, it's complicated. 00:10:19.149 --> 00:10:21.570 I was just about to ask you, are you finding 00:10:21.570 --> 00:10:24.110 it that most companies complain that it's actually 00:10:24.110 --> 00:10:27.169 very hard to get money right now or on the contrary 00:10:27.169 --> 00:10:29.230 is actually it's a good moment because everyone's 00:10:29.230 --> 00:10:33.429 talking about this topic. Well, it's very hard 00:10:33.429 --> 00:10:36.789 to find money for everyone right now. Nowadays, 00:10:37.110 --> 00:10:41.029 since like last year was a disaster in terms 00:10:41.029 --> 00:10:43.129 of fundraising. And I think this year is also 00:10:43.129 --> 00:10:46.360 being very hard. I mean, I see every. at every 00:10:46.360 --> 00:10:49.500 conference that we organize, and there's a big 00:10:49.500 --> 00:10:52.240 need for fundraising, and LPs are being very, 00:10:52.240 --> 00:10:58.559 very careful about it, and it's tough. I can 00:10:58.559 --> 00:11:02.399 say that the people that I've talked to that 00:11:02.399 --> 00:11:07.879 do more impact investing, they say, yes, it is 00:11:07.879 --> 00:11:14.160 hard, but we feel it's less hard for us. like 00:11:14.160 --> 00:11:20.080 they might have it a bit easier, but under the 00:11:20.080 --> 00:11:21.980 idea that it's very hard right now, you know? 00:11:22.840 --> 00:11:26.220 So because there's this need, I mean, like there 00:11:26.220 --> 00:11:31.940 is this climate change, there's this energy transition, 00:11:32.120 --> 00:11:34.360 these topics, I mean, they're just like starting. 00:11:35.759 --> 00:11:39.179 So many international, many like institutional 00:11:39.179 --> 00:11:44.529 LPs and entities are really looking for ways 00:11:44.529 --> 00:11:47.629 to take part in this and invest in solutions 00:11:47.629 --> 00:11:50.250 that will actually tackle climate change and 00:11:50.250 --> 00:11:55.970 help us to build a more sustainable world. So 00:11:55.970 --> 00:12:03.570 probably that's the reason why they have it a 00:12:03.570 --> 00:12:06.889 bit more easy, but still very hard. And how, 00:12:06.889 --> 00:12:08.870 you know, from companies from within Europe, 00:12:09.149 --> 00:12:11.320 are there any limitations? Because obviously, 00:12:11.620 --> 00:12:13.139 I'm based in the UK, I know you're based in Spain. 00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:16.580 Do you find that, for example, for British companies, 00:12:16.679 --> 00:12:18.779 is it hard to get funding in Europe or the other 00:12:18.779 --> 00:12:22.879 way around? How is that happening? Or not at 00:12:22.879 --> 00:12:26.779 all? Actually, it's not an issue. Well, I think 00:12:26.779 --> 00:12:32.600 that in general, European VCs are very pan -European. 00:12:34.419 --> 00:12:40.549 They invest all across Europe. About the UK, 00:12:41.269 --> 00:12:44.570 I cannot give you. I mean, I'm not sure. I have 00:12:44.570 --> 00:12:47.710 spoken to people that invest only in the UK, 00:12:47.789 --> 00:12:52.549 you know? But when it comes to the rest of Europe, 00:12:53.750 --> 00:13:00.419 most VCs invest all across Europe. Like they 00:13:00.419 --> 00:13:02.480 start maybe focusing on their own countries, 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:04.820 but then they end up if they want to grow, if 00:13:04.820 --> 00:13:07.840 they want to find best startups and actually 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:14.980 can also raise funds from other places, they 00:13:14.980 --> 00:13:18.600 start investing and fundraising. Interesting. 00:13:19.019 --> 00:13:20.480 And is there, you know, when you talk with all 00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:22.879 these VCs and stuff, did they ever tell you, 00:13:22.879 --> 00:13:25.580 you know, if a company does this, I'm never going 00:13:25.580 --> 00:13:28.669 to invest in them? Or if they do this, I'm 100 00:13:28.669 --> 00:13:30.490 % going to invest in them. Is there any like 00:13:30.490 --> 00:13:32.750 red flags that I'm always on the lookout for 00:13:32.750 --> 00:13:36.070 or stuff like that? Well, more than red flags, 00:13:36.169 --> 00:13:40.690 it's about like the company and founders have 00:13:40.690 --> 00:13:45.970 to know that all these have their own strategy, 00:13:46.529 --> 00:13:50.809 right? So you have to do your homework, not like 00:13:50.809 --> 00:13:53.950 go to their website, see what they have been 00:13:53.950 --> 00:13:58.100 investing in. and try to adjust your pitch to 00:13:58.100 --> 00:14:02.539 what they actually are looking for. Sometimes 00:14:02.539 --> 00:14:07.620 founders just throw themselves to anyone and 00:14:07.620 --> 00:14:10.179 in the end, that's annoying for the business 00:14:10.179 --> 00:14:20.470 because they are always being maybe like... Chased 00:14:20.470 --> 00:14:23.909 by too many founders, no? I just attended South 00:14:23.909 --> 00:14:27.110 Summit last week, you know, here in Madrid. And 00:14:27.110 --> 00:14:30.129 well, I mean, the ones that had the investor 00:14:30.129 --> 00:14:35.070 stack, they were kind of like a bit overwhelmed, 00:14:35.070 --> 00:14:40.470 you know, because there was like all these founders 00:14:40.470 --> 00:14:43.210 with these great ideas trying to get in touch 00:14:43.210 --> 00:14:46.070 with them. But in the end, if you are pitching 00:14:46.070 --> 00:14:56.490 your, I don't know, AI solution to climate tech 00:14:56.490 --> 00:15:00.450 found that only invests in whatever, you know, 00:15:00.450 --> 00:15:03.409 like that's not AI related. I mean, you're just 00:15:03.409 --> 00:15:07.049 wasting your time and their time as well. Yeah. 00:15:07.090 --> 00:15:10.049 So you have to do your homework. And of course, 00:15:10.309 --> 00:15:14.789 I did hear, I mean, actually from a conversation 00:15:14.789 --> 00:15:18.120 I had, I don't remember when. And someone told 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:21.460 me that they have to actually show and prove 00:15:21.460 --> 00:15:23.539 that they know what they're talking about, you 00:15:23.539 --> 00:15:30.059 know? So if they don't know what they're talking 00:15:30.059 --> 00:15:33.080 about, or they show any ignorance on the topic 00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:35.980 they are pitching, that's like, okay, red flag, 00:15:36.200 --> 00:15:41.409 goodbye, because it's very complicated. specialized 00:15:41.409 --> 00:15:44.450 the VC, the harder it is for a founder to actually 00:15:44.450 --> 00:15:47.750 talk to the VC, right? Yeah, of course. But it 00:15:47.750 --> 00:15:49.690 does make sense. I mean, you wouldn't want to 00:15:49.690 --> 00:15:53.690 have a founder in an area they don't fully understand. 00:15:54.190 --> 00:15:56.070 And then to have them run the company in an area 00:15:56.070 --> 00:15:57.789 they don't fully understand with someone else's 00:15:57.789 --> 00:16:00.909 money, that's a recipe for disaster, right? That's 00:16:00.909 --> 00:16:03.490 not going to work out well. And this is coming 00:16:03.490 --> 00:16:08.509 from like, like, top down, actually, because 00:16:08.509 --> 00:16:13.159 they're more and more LPs that are very specialized. 00:16:13.620 --> 00:16:19.000 I have interviewed an LP that only invests in... 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:26.259 He only invests in biotech. And he knows about 00:16:26.259 --> 00:16:29.259 it and he's an expert on it. So imagine if he 00:16:29.259 --> 00:16:33.720 only invests in VCs that do this. So for him 00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:37.000 to talk to the VC, I mean, the level of conversation 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:39.559 that they are going to have, You know, it's going 00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:43.100 to be very high. So the VCs level of conversation 00:16:43.100 --> 00:16:46.700 with the portfolio companies has to be that high 00:16:46.700 --> 00:16:50.120 as well. You know, and I've spoken, for example, 00:16:50.360 --> 00:16:53.100 I've heard some family offices saying, you know, 00:16:53.480 --> 00:16:57.860 like, we don't like generalists because we need 00:16:57.860 --> 00:17:01.940 people to actually like commit to a sector and 00:17:01.940 --> 00:17:05.359 specialize because that's the way you can actually 00:17:05.359 --> 00:17:07.839 think that or say that they really know what 00:17:07.839 --> 00:17:11.619 they're talking about. This morning, I had a 00:17:11.619 --> 00:17:18.640 conversation with Energy Transition BC. I asked 00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:24.099 her this question, what do you think about generalist 00:17:24.099 --> 00:17:28.200 funds and you, that you are very specialized 00:17:28.200 --> 00:17:32.480 on? What's your take on this? She did give me 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:35.000 a really great answer. She said that I mean, 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:37.519 they are very specialized, you know, and these 00:17:37.519 --> 00:17:39.940 very specialized funds are kind of new, you know, 00:17:39.980 --> 00:17:42.000 because then you have other VC funds that have 00:17:42.000 --> 00:17:46.200 been around for 20, 30 years, you know, and have 00:17:46.200 --> 00:17:50.240 invested in many, many companies, have heard 00:17:50.240 --> 00:17:53.859 thousands of pitches, you know, so they know 00:17:53.859 --> 00:17:58.619 a lot about like startups. So she said like, 00:17:58.819 --> 00:18:01.279 the cool thing about this is that I think that 00:18:01.279 --> 00:18:04.640 there's space for both, you know. Because, I 00:18:04.640 --> 00:18:08.980 mean, you never invest, well, a business invests 00:18:08.980 --> 00:18:14.160 on a portion of stakes. So in the end, they don't 00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:16.299 normally go by themselves, but there are also 00:18:16.299 --> 00:18:18.240 other businesses investing on the same company. 00:18:18.460 --> 00:18:20.500 So the fact that you have, okay, the very specialized 00:18:20.500 --> 00:18:24.599 one that knows all the technical part, but then 00:18:24.599 --> 00:18:26.980 you have the other one that knows all about how 00:18:26.980 --> 00:18:33.039 the startup ecosystem and how founders work, 00:18:33.160 --> 00:18:36.390 et cetera. is also like a good, they complement 00:18:36.390 --> 00:18:40.690 each other, which is a point of view that I didn't 00:18:40.690 --> 00:18:44.269 have before this competition this morning. So 00:18:44.269 --> 00:18:46.410 I think it's very interesting like to speak to 00:18:46.410 --> 00:18:50.789 people and ask these questions and understand 00:18:50.789 --> 00:18:53.170 like there's a space for everyone, you know, 00:18:53.589 --> 00:18:59.109 but yeah, we need founders to be very prepared 00:18:59.109 --> 00:19:02.250 and passionate about their topics, you know, 00:19:02.250 --> 00:19:05.160 and And when you're passionate about something, 00:19:05.460 --> 00:19:07.319 you do a lot of research, you read about it, 00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:12.599 you talk about it, you really care for it. Do 00:19:12.599 --> 00:19:14.579 you think it's hard to get into the VC world? 00:19:15.619 --> 00:19:17.819 To start working as a VC or to actually get your 00:19:17.819 --> 00:19:21.559 foot in the door overall? I think now it's very 00:19:21.559 --> 00:19:25.420 hard. At least harder than it was like a few 00:19:25.420 --> 00:19:27.680 years ago, right? When there was a lot of money 00:19:27.680 --> 00:19:31.920 and a lot of opportunities to actually raise 00:19:31.920 --> 00:19:34.569 money. I think now it's getting, it's very hard 00:19:34.569 --> 00:19:38.509 and only those that had like a really good strategy 00:19:38.509 --> 00:19:41.210 are the ones that are being able to still to 00:19:41.210 --> 00:19:45.390 keep fundraising and in the long term are the 00:19:45.390 --> 00:19:47.990 ones that are going to like stay around, right? 00:19:48.369 --> 00:19:50.829 I think it's very, I mean, being a VC, it's very 00:19:50.829 --> 00:19:55.089 hard. Like being, I'm not like entering the world. 00:19:55.690 --> 00:19:57.490 I don't know. I haven't thought about it, but 00:19:57.490 --> 00:20:00.769 being one, it's very hard. I mean, I see them 00:20:00.769 --> 00:20:06.769 at our conferences. And it's because of the fundraising, 00:20:07.109 --> 00:20:13.130 right? That's a very tough part. And it's always 00:20:13.130 --> 00:20:15.609 going to be there, right? You always need to 00:20:15.609 --> 00:20:18.529 fundraise. Maybe, okay, you have to stop fundraising 00:20:18.529 --> 00:20:21.349 that much when you are already ready with the 00:20:21.349 --> 00:20:25.309 fund, but then you'll be fundraising again. So 00:20:25.309 --> 00:20:29.730 you have to know how to do it. And I think that's 00:20:29.730 --> 00:20:33.940 something that Some VCs didn't know before because 00:20:33.940 --> 00:20:36.519 it depends. I think, I mean, what's happening 00:20:36.519 --> 00:20:38.900 here in Spain, for example, from the conversations 00:20:38.900 --> 00:20:45.119 I have had is that many VC, many VC bounce, they 00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:50.859 were small. They had their, um, like their LPs, 00:20:51.099 --> 00:20:55.519 you know, very, uh, like their loyal LPs. So 00:20:55.519 --> 00:20:59.660 they will always get the funding. But when things, 00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:03.180 things got harder. And in order to also be able 00:21:03.180 --> 00:21:07.359 to grow, you had to start like going out and 00:21:07.359 --> 00:21:11.059 fundraise, you know, and this is like something 00:21:11.059 --> 00:21:13.759 kind of new. You know, you have to, you have 00:21:13.759 --> 00:21:16.859 to learn like know how to do it. It's not easy. 00:21:17.380 --> 00:21:20.740 I mean, I always say it reminded me to the times 00:21:20.740 --> 00:21:24.640 when I was a business journalist working for 00:21:24.640 --> 00:21:29.859 a newspaper in Chile and I had to basically like 00:21:29.859 --> 00:21:32.960 chase all the CEOs from the companies that I 00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:37.259 wanted to talk to, you know? So when you're fundraising, 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:39.700 this is kind of like similar, you know? They 00:21:39.700 --> 00:21:42.900 have to chase the out piece. And that's very 00:21:42.900 --> 00:21:46.200 hard. I mean, it's not easy. And you have to 00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:49.920 like, be have a really like a personality that 00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:52.819 that can, you cannot be shy, you know, because 00:21:52.819 --> 00:21:54.319 if you're shy, how we're going to approach this 00:21:54.319 --> 00:21:58.019 person, you have to be very, like, genuine, but 00:21:58.019 --> 00:22:02.490 also like People have to trust you because in 00:22:02.490 --> 00:22:04.490 the end, they're giving you money, right? So 00:22:04.490 --> 00:22:05.750 they need to trust you. You are going to ask 00:22:05.750 --> 00:22:08.190 them for money. So you have to be very patient 00:22:08.190 --> 00:22:10.329 because it's not like you're going to ask for 00:22:10.329 --> 00:22:12.569 money today and you're going to get the money 00:22:12.569 --> 00:22:15.349 tomorrow. I mean, it's about building relationships 00:22:15.349 --> 00:22:18.269 and these relationships can take years, you know, 00:22:18.369 --> 00:22:24.230 like two to three years of talking to these LPs 00:22:24.230 --> 00:22:27.789 in order to get the money. So it's very hard 00:22:27.789 --> 00:22:32.799 to be a VC. What about family offices? Because 00:22:32.799 --> 00:22:35.920 family offices is always a bit of a mystery, 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:38.039 I think, for most people. They don't fully get 00:22:38.039 --> 00:22:39.960 how they work and they don't fully get how to 00:22:39.960 --> 00:22:41.799 approach them or if they should approach them 00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:44.140 in the first place. How do you find that connection? 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:48.480 Well, it depends. There are family offices that 00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:53.859 make direct investments and they're mostly, for 00:22:53.859 --> 00:22:59.200 example, family offices that have made their 00:22:59.200 --> 00:23:04.200 wealth with their specific business in a specific 00:23:04.200 --> 00:23:09.299 industry or many also other, for example, tech 00:23:09.299 --> 00:23:14.200 entrepreneurs that made their own wealth as well. 00:23:14.539 --> 00:23:16.920 So I think that you have to do research. It's 00:23:16.920 --> 00:23:19.519 not easy because there's not that much information 00:23:19.519 --> 00:23:22.819 available out there. But you can always find 00:23:22.819 --> 00:23:25.690 some. speak to people, talk to people. Of course, 00:23:25.690 --> 00:23:30.529 there are other family offices that invest in 00:23:30.529 --> 00:23:38.029 funds. I think it's also related to knowledge. 00:23:39.829 --> 00:23:42.529 If you don't know that much about something, 00:23:43.049 --> 00:23:45.809 you can do it through a VC or through private 00:23:45.809 --> 00:23:51.160 equity. Because in the end, they do know. lowering 00:23:51.160 --> 00:23:54.779 the risk. Whereas when you invest directly, you 00:23:54.779 --> 00:23:57.500 are putting your money into something that, I 00:23:57.500 --> 00:23:59.400 mean, if it works, it's awesome, but if it doesn't 00:23:59.400 --> 00:24:01.480 work, you're just like, and you might not know 00:24:01.480 --> 00:24:04.380 that much about it, no? But I've been, we have 00:24:04.380 --> 00:24:08.140 been working a lot with family offices and they, 00:24:08.599 --> 00:24:14.599 there are more family offices interested in investing 00:24:14.599 --> 00:24:18.180 into the alternative assets world, you know, 00:24:19.119 --> 00:24:23.480 and private equity, like bio -private equity 00:24:23.480 --> 00:24:33.079 and venture capital. It's one of these new spaces 00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:38.339 for them to invest in. But yes, it depends. It 00:24:38.339 --> 00:24:41.299 depends, but you have to do the research. Because 00:24:41.299 --> 00:24:42.880 there are bigger ones, there are smaller ones. 00:24:44.289 --> 00:24:47.630 There are multiple family offices. It's a very, 00:24:47.730 --> 00:24:54.089 as you said, it's kind of like a very, I don't 00:24:54.089 --> 00:24:59.349 know, unknown world, right? But it's growing. 00:25:00.029 --> 00:25:03.430 I mean, there are many family offices that do 00:25:03.430 --> 00:25:06.230 a lot of impact. They care. I mean, actually, 00:25:06.329 --> 00:25:09.190 there are many, for example, I have the opportunity 00:25:09.190 --> 00:25:17.990 to talk to fund of funds that only invests in 00:25:17.990 --> 00:25:23.349 ocean solutions. This is that investing company 00:25:23.349 --> 00:25:31.029 that generates great solutions for the whole 00:25:31.029 --> 00:25:42.910 ocean issues. So he told me that his LPs are, 00:25:42.910 --> 00:25:45.869 a lot of them, of course, they are family offices 00:25:45.869 --> 00:25:53.309 with families that actually care about the ocean 00:25:53.309 --> 00:25:56.609 and the whole like taking care of the ecosystem, 00:25:56.869 --> 00:26:00.569 you know? So that happens a lot. Which countries 00:26:00.569 --> 00:26:03.849 do you find that not have the highest amount 00:26:03.849 --> 00:26:08.279 but are More receptive to all this, to raising 00:26:08.279 --> 00:26:10.900 funds, to raising funds, to working with companies, 00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:14.099 to getting things off the ground overall in Europe. 00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:21.460 Do you think the Spanish market is good for companies 00:26:21.460 --> 00:26:23.299 launching startups or they should actually go 00:26:23.299 --> 00:26:25.700 and look out for investment in other countries? 00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:30.000 Well, I think that the Spanish startup ecosystem 00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:35.180 is growing a lot. Like we are, for example, we 00:26:35.180 --> 00:26:38.400 have these hubs like Malaga is becoming into 00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:41.859 this very techie hub, you know. We have events 00:26:41.859 --> 00:26:48.779 like South Summit that gather all the most relevant 00:26:48.779 --> 00:26:52.940 startups in the southern region of Europe and 00:26:52.940 --> 00:26:58.700 also Latin America. I think Spain has this strength 00:26:58.700 --> 00:27:03.140 compared to other European countries, which is 00:27:02.890 --> 00:27:06.809 Latin America. Like Latin American companies 00:27:06.809 --> 00:27:13.970 really want to come to Spain and either maybe 00:27:13.970 --> 00:27:19.150 learn from the ecosystem. And also there's the 00:27:19.150 --> 00:27:23.549 Latin American LPs who invest in Spain, which 00:27:23.549 --> 00:27:28.359 there are a lot of them. It's not necessarily 00:27:28.359 --> 00:27:31.380 great. I mean, from my point of view as a Latin 00:27:31.380 --> 00:27:34.039 American person, I'm from Bolivia. So you would 00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:37.119 think that, I mean, the investments should be 00:27:37.119 --> 00:27:43.519 done where they are needed the most, right? So 00:27:43.519 --> 00:27:46.779 from an impact point of view, which is the world 00:27:46.779 --> 00:27:50.839 that I love, there's a lot to be done in Latin 00:27:50.839 --> 00:27:54.880 America. But on the other side, I mean, it's 00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:58.220 about like, certainty, you know, about you knowing 00:27:58.220 --> 00:28:03.319 that there's this very strong regulation behind 00:28:03.319 --> 00:28:05.920 all the investments, et cetera, no? But we, well, 00:28:06.059 --> 00:28:07.660 in Latin America, we do have a lot of, I don't 00:28:07.660 --> 00:28:10.680 know how familiar, familiarize you with Latin 00:28:10.680 --> 00:28:13.920 America, but we do have really interesting countries 00:28:13.920 --> 00:28:17.940 with. very interesting and attractive ecosystems 00:28:17.940 --> 00:28:19.960 for startups. Like, for example, there's Chile, 00:28:20.119 --> 00:28:22.319 there's Mexico, there's Brazil. I don't know 00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:24.539 that much about Brazil, like to me, Brazil has 00:28:24.539 --> 00:28:26.579 always been like a completely different world. 00:28:26.900 --> 00:28:29.319 But when you think about Latin America, like 00:28:29.319 --> 00:28:33.599 Chile, Mexico, Colombia, you know, there's a 00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:38.960 very interesting startup world going, like happening 00:28:38.960 --> 00:28:41.160 there, right? What about the regulations? Is 00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:44.019 it as flexible as it is in some countries in 00:28:44.019 --> 00:28:47.259 Europe? Or is it is it very cumbersome to actually 00:28:47.259 --> 00:28:50.200 launch a company overall there? Well, I know 00:28:50.200 --> 00:28:54.240 in Chile, Chile is very, you can launch a company 00:28:54.240 --> 00:28:58.740 in one day. Yeah, that's at least that it was 00:28:58.740 --> 00:29:01.460 that way a few years ago when I was living there, 00:29:01.460 --> 00:29:06.619 we had this startup Chile, we had all this regulation, 00:29:06.740 --> 00:29:10.259 I think in terms of innovation, Chile did a great 00:29:10.259 --> 00:29:15.079 job. you know, on like making things easy for 00:29:15.079 --> 00:29:19.740 startups to start. I remember the conversation 00:29:19.740 --> 00:29:23.279 was that it was a bit hard to, like if you failed, 00:29:23.599 --> 00:29:25.619 then it was a bit hard. Like the conversation 00:29:25.619 --> 00:29:28.000 was different, no? But to start, you could do 00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:31.460 it. And there's like a lot of innovation going 00:29:31.460 --> 00:29:36.000 on in Chile and on that way. But it's a very 00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:40.900 small market, right? So the normal path for a 00:29:40.900 --> 00:29:43.779 company to keep growing is to move to Mexico. 00:29:44.460 --> 00:29:49.440 You know, Mexico is a big market with many opportunities, 00:29:49.539 --> 00:29:52.900 you know, and I think Mexico is also a great 00:29:52.900 --> 00:29:57.500 example. I'm not that familiarized. I mean, I 00:29:57.500 --> 00:30:01.940 don't know that much about the Mexican regulation, 00:30:02.140 --> 00:30:06.019 you know, but I can tell you that Chilean companies 00:30:06.019 --> 00:30:10.519 that want to grow, they go to Mexico. They go 00:30:10.519 --> 00:30:17.240 to Mexico and they do well. Laura, tell us a 00:30:17.240 --> 00:30:19.220 bit more about your podcast because you also 00:30:19.220 --> 00:30:22.759 have a podcast. So what do you talk about on 00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:30.339 your podcast? Well, my podcast is my baby. What 00:30:30.339 --> 00:30:35.730 I do is I interview people from the investors 00:30:35.730 --> 00:30:40.049 world, like it can be LPs or OGPs, you know, 00:30:40.190 --> 00:30:46.269 to talk about ESG and impact. And this is a very 00:30:46.269 --> 00:30:48.910 complicated topic because you can see that everyone 00:30:48.910 --> 00:30:53.609 has a different idea on it, you know, because 00:30:53.609 --> 00:30:56.930 it's kind of new, you know, and it's very interesting 00:30:56.930 --> 00:31:03.859 to discuss about it with different people with 00:31:03.859 --> 00:31:07.259 different perspectives and different, you know, 00:31:07.400 --> 00:31:09.619 for example, yes, I was saying before, if you 00:31:09.619 --> 00:31:12.000 talk to an impact fund, I mean, they are going 00:31:12.000 --> 00:31:16.200 to talk to you more on, you know, what impact 00:31:16.200 --> 00:31:19.960 is for them, you know, how they, how it is important 00:31:19.960 --> 00:31:25.799 to, like, look for solutions that are going to 00:31:25.799 --> 00:31:32.059 make this a better world and not necessarily 00:31:32.059 --> 00:31:38.099 focus on data availability, which is what ESG 00:31:38.099 --> 00:31:43.660 is more about. ESG is more about reporting. It's 00:31:43.660 --> 00:31:49.119 about your ability to gather the information 00:31:49.119 --> 00:31:53.390 and show that you are doing something. about 00:31:53.390 --> 00:31:57.069 these environmental, social, and governance issues. 00:31:57.910 --> 00:32:04.289 It doesn't necessarily mean that you care that 00:32:04.289 --> 00:32:09.470 much about impact. There's this example that 00:32:09.470 --> 00:32:13.450 one of my interviewers gave me once and said, 00:32:13.789 --> 00:32:22.390 for example, Shell has a very great ESG performance. 00:32:22.589 --> 00:32:25.869 You know, they are actually like top something, 00:32:26.150 --> 00:32:31.609 like top five in ESG reporting, but they are 00:32:31.609 --> 00:32:35.309 an oil company. So, but they do this, they do 00:32:35.309 --> 00:32:38.789 really good job in delivering the data, you know, 00:32:38.930 --> 00:32:41.190 like they do. And that's the thing, like they 00:32:41.190 --> 00:32:45.549 are very good in gathering, delivering, and maybe 00:32:45.549 --> 00:32:49.910 measuring, you know, but in the end, they do 00:32:49.910 --> 00:32:54.069 what they do. So that's a little bit like the 00:32:54.069 --> 00:32:59.130 difference and I think that with this whole like 00:32:59.130 --> 00:33:01.990 greenwashing, you know, there has been a lot 00:33:01.990 --> 00:33:14.490 of misuse of ESG, misuse of impact and these 00:33:14.490 --> 00:33:21.019 topics and terms that are very important. are 00:33:21.019 --> 00:33:26.039 now being mainstreamed. Not mainstreamed, but 00:33:26.039 --> 00:33:30.960 they are being under scrutiny. You see what's 00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:35.160 happening in the US. You don't want to say. Some 00:33:35.160 --> 00:33:39.160 people rather not say that they care for ESG 00:33:39.160 --> 00:33:44.880 because it might be bad for you to do it. It's 00:33:44.880 --> 00:33:50.049 because we are because of all this greenwashing, 00:33:50.230 --> 00:33:55.990 because of this lack of understanding and of 00:33:55.990 --> 00:33:59.430 agreement on the terms. But for example, there's 00:33:59.430 --> 00:34:07.029 this ESGVC here in Europe that is like a group 00:34:07.029 --> 00:34:12.190 of partners of all the most relevant VC firms. 00:34:12.909 --> 00:34:15.590 in Europe, but worldwide now. I mean, it started 00:34:15.590 --> 00:34:18.090 in Europe and what they do is they are trying 00:34:18.090 --> 00:34:30.070 to set some ground rules, some maybe basic information 00:34:30.070 --> 00:34:37.989 and frameworks for founders to be able to report 00:34:37.989 --> 00:34:43.320 ESG data. Because the problem in the in the VC 00:34:43.320 --> 00:34:46.340 world and startup world, actually, is that you 00:34:46.340 --> 00:34:50.659 cannot ask a founder to be compliant with the 00:34:50.659 --> 00:34:53.820 regulation if they don't even know, like, for 00:34:53.820 --> 00:34:56.039 example, if you ask them, yeah, I mean, like, 00:34:56.099 --> 00:34:58.619 yeah, what's your diversity and inclusion policy? 00:34:58.940 --> 00:35:01.719 It's like, okay, I'm helping people, you know, 00:35:01.719 --> 00:35:04.219 like, it doesn't make, and they have to start 00:35:04.219 --> 00:35:07.519 kind of like, not making up, but just trying 00:35:07.519 --> 00:35:10.000 to fill in the blanks with whatever information 00:35:10.000 --> 00:35:13.449 they can actually have or come to their minds 00:35:13.449 --> 00:35:17.670 instead of actually thinking of what is our approach 00:35:17.670 --> 00:35:22.349 and what can we do about this environmental, 00:35:22.469 --> 00:35:27.190 social and governance issues from our company, 00:35:27.710 --> 00:35:34.829 from within our business, from within the business 00:35:34.829 --> 00:35:38.809 that we are in and what we are trying to do. 00:35:39.019 --> 00:35:41.079 you know, instead of trying to like make up and 00:35:41.079 --> 00:35:45.920 say, yeah, we have more and hire 10 women, you 00:35:45.920 --> 00:35:50.559 know, just to make sure we are very gender balanced 00:35:50.559 --> 00:35:55.039 company. It's a really hard one, to be honest, 00:35:55.159 --> 00:35:57.539 because I find that, for example, the events 00:35:57.539 --> 00:35:59.840 that I run, it's me and my business partner, 00:36:00.099 --> 00:36:04.369 we both men but we had all the interns were all 00:36:04.369 --> 00:36:07.750 females. So technically, we would overfill the 00:36:07.750 --> 00:36:09.550 criteria for everything, because we actually 00:36:09.550 --> 00:36:12.150 had a lot of female staff. So it was it was well 00:36:12.150 --> 00:36:13.909 balanced in that sense. But at the same time, 00:36:14.329 --> 00:36:17.110 now that we just had interns, now that they've 00:36:17.110 --> 00:36:19.269 all left, it was like, oh, now we're stuck with 00:36:19.269 --> 00:36:21.969 the same problem again. And it's it's a hard 00:36:21.969 --> 00:36:24.949 one to do, because you don't want to you don't 00:36:24.949 --> 00:36:27.050 want to be in a position where you're not complying 00:36:27.050 --> 00:36:28.690 with things. But at the same time, it's like, 00:36:28.690 --> 00:36:31.719 well, What can we do to make us compliant? Should 00:36:31.719 --> 00:36:33.559 we just hire someone, even though we might not 00:36:33.559 --> 00:36:35.500 need someone, just to make sure that we're compliant? 00:36:35.880 --> 00:36:37.920 So it's a tricky one, isn't it? For most companies, 00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:41.039 just starting out. Yeah. And then if you analyze 00:36:41.039 --> 00:36:44.239 your own information, like with that, like EEG 00:36:44.239 --> 00:36:47.159 lens, right? And then, okay, yes, you have, you're 00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:49.539 mostly, you have like a, like you're very gender 00:36:49.539 --> 00:36:53.340 balanced or maybe you have even more female employees 00:36:53.340 --> 00:36:56.940 than male. But then if you go with through the 00:36:56.940 --> 00:37:01.230 numbers of seniority, then you're not doing well. 00:37:02.949 --> 00:37:06.690 It's very complicated, but in general, I think 00:37:06.690 --> 00:37:12.010 that what ESGVC is trying to do is to give frameworks 00:37:12.010 --> 00:37:16.349 for portfolio companies in general, to actually 00:37:16.349 --> 00:37:21.210 report on what's relevant for them and at the 00:37:21.210 --> 00:37:25.710 point that they are. You were mentioning AI. 00:37:25.900 --> 00:37:28.940 at the beginning of the conversation or recording 00:37:28.940 --> 00:37:32.179 yet. I mean, AI is another thing. It's also because 00:37:32.179 --> 00:37:35.719 AI is about investing in AI, but also about you 00:37:35.719 --> 00:37:38.639 being able to use AI to do your job, your work 00:37:38.639 --> 00:37:46.539 and also about, okay, how you are being, how 00:37:46.539 --> 00:37:50.500 careful you're being with AI in your own company, 00:37:50.679 --> 00:37:55.480 you know, like, like setting up ground. rules 00:37:55.480 --> 00:37:58.639 now, so in the future you don't have problems. 00:37:59.320 --> 00:38:04.940 So I think that's another topic that I know that 00:38:04.940 --> 00:38:13.380 ESGVC is trying to give founders some base knowledge. 00:38:14.760 --> 00:38:18.559 And what's interesting about ESGVC is that they 00:38:18.559 --> 00:38:23.480 started because many of their portfolio companies 00:38:23.480 --> 00:38:30.000 were asking them for help on this. And that's 00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:32.119 the thing. They do want to do something about 00:38:32.119 --> 00:38:35.800 it, but they don't know where to begin. And I 00:38:35.800 --> 00:38:38.420 think that's a problem with regulation, right? 00:38:39.900 --> 00:38:44.440 I find it very hard because even here when I'm 00:38:44.440 --> 00:38:48.179 running my business, me and my business partner, 00:38:48.260 --> 00:38:51.039 we always struggle with the fact that As much 00:38:51.039 --> 00:38:54.820 as we have no issues whatsoever in being as diverse 00:38:54.820 --> 00:38:58.280 as we can possibly be, sometimes it is hard to 00:38:58.280 --> 00:39:00.920 be as diverse as we can possibly be because it's 00:39:00.920 --> 00:39:02.619 just the two of us. We don't have, you know, 00:39:02.739 --> 00:39:04.159 anyone from a different background. And that's 00:39:04.159 --> 00:39:07.199 also okay if that happens, but that's, you know, 00:39:07.280 --> 00:39:09.219 it's a complicated position to be in a lot of 00:39:09.219 --> 00:39:11.199 times, to be honest. And because you don't want 00:39:11.199 --> 00:39:13.179 to be seen as someone who's not. But at the same 00:39:13.179 --> 00:39:16.599 time, you also want to be open to new ideas and 00:39:16.599 --> 00:39:18.440 making sure everyone gets their fair chance and 00:39:18.440 --> 00:39:21.159 opportunity. So, yeah, it's a tricky world sometimes 00:39:21.159 --> 00:39:24.260 to navigate. But also you have to ask yourself, 00:39:24.780 --> 00:39:32.380 why would that be important for your company? 00:39:33.880 --> 00:39:36.719 And it's not just about being able to say, yes, 00:39:36.739 --> 00:39:41.190 we are very diverse. But also being able to say 00:39:41.190 --> 00:39:44.730 maybe that's not what I can do right now, report 00:39:44.730 --> 00:39:46.630 on right now because it's not relevant. We are 00:39:46.630 --> 00:39:55.730 just two people. But maybe what are the data, 00:39:55.809 --> 00:39:58.010 what's the data that you actually could report 00:39:58.010 --> 00:40:03.269 on and it could make sense with your specific 00:40:03.269 --> 00:40:07.809 business. So I think that's the idea that we 00:40:07.809 --> 00:40:12.110 should have in general. We cannot measure everyone 00:40:12.110 --> 00:40:17.710 with the same rule. We cannot assume that everyone 00:40:17.710 --> 00:40:23.960 has to deliver data under the same rule. with 00:40:23.960 --> 00:40:28.139 same reporting requirements and I think that's 00:40:28.139 --> 00:40:30.239 the problem because in the end you say okay you 00:40:30.239 --> 00:40:32.159 have to feel this and if you don't have this 00:40:32.159 --> 00:40:34.219 information you have to say I don't have it but 00:40:34.219 --> 00:40:37.039 you have to explain why not you know and then 00:40:37.039 --> 00:40:38.659 in the end it's like you don't want to leave 00:40:38.659 --> 00:40:41.820 anything blank you know so you just start like 00:40:41.820 --> 00:40:44.179 getting nervous and think okay what can we do 00:40:44.179 --> 00:40:46.659 about this you know and it's a waste of time 00:40:46.659 --> 00:40:51.750 and energy and it's useless So, but I think that 00:40:51.750 --> 00:40:55.469 in general, this is something that it's, I mean, 00:40:56.010 --> 00:40:59.750 we know there's something to be improved and 00:40:59.750 --> 00:41:03.090 there are a lot of conversations on these matters 00:41:03.090 --> 00:41:06.949 and I think they will just, they'll fix them, 00:41:07.050 --> 00:41:13.530 right? This is like just the beginning, no? Yeah, 00:41:13.789 --> 00:41:17.610 we're getting the game started and it gets better 00:41:17.610 --> 00:41:19.659 as we go along, which is... normal with all these 00:41:19.659 --> 00:41:22.380 things. I always say that the good thing is that 00:41:22.380 --> 00:41:25.059 we're talking about, you know? The more we talk 00:41:25.059 --> 00:41:27.340 about it, I mean, even if it goes mainstream, 00:41:27.559 --> 00:41:30.780 I mean, even if it ends up being like a very, 00:41:30.780 --> 00:41:35.639 you know, way to, you know, we speak too much 00:41:35.639 --> 00:41:38.840 about this and people get like bored of it. Just 00:41:38.840 --> 00:41:41.619 the fact that we, for example, that we know that, 00:41:41.619 --> 00:41:46.119 okay, It is important to have a diverse team, 00:41:46.219 --> 00:41:49.440 not only talking about having women, men, having 00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:54.780 people from everywhere. We now think it is important. 00:41:55.239 --> 00:41:57.400 So maybe tomorrow, when you have to make a decision, 00:41:58.139 --> 00:42:01.900 you will pay attention to it. Not today because 00:42:01.900 --> 00:42:03.440 you don't need it today. You are just two people, 00:42:03.539 --> 00:42:06.619 but tomorrow, yes. And I think that's what this 00:42:06.619 --> 00:42:14.219 is about. It's about being able to Put the like 00:42:14.219 --> 00:42:16.940 the need on the table, you know, so in the future 00:42:16.940 --> 00:42:20.860 when you have to Make decisions, you know that 00:42:20.860 --> 00:42:24.360 you have to take that into account We always 00:42:24.360 --> 00:42:26.820 travel we always travel at the conferences when 00:42:26.820 --> 00:42:32.239 we are looking for female partners from you know 00:42:32.239 --> 00:42:36.920 venture capital funds or private equity or you 00:42:36.920 --> 00:42:41.719 know, it's not easy and we are trying to at least 00:42:41.719 --> 00:42:46.699 have one woman on stage for each panel and we 00:42:46.699 --> 00:42:50.420 struggle with it. I've been lucky to have you 00:42:50.420 --> 00:42:53.260 as a guest on the panel we've had in Madrid on 00:42:53.260 --> 00:42:56.179 our first event. I think you were the only lady 00:42:56.179 --> 00:42:58.139 on stage, unfortunately. We couldn't get anyone 00:42:58.139 --> 00:43:01.619 else. But in the UK, surprisingly, it's actually 00:43:01.619 --> 00:43:04.380 super easy. We never struggle with that. We always 00:43:04.380 --> 00:43:07.500 manage to get a really good ratio. And it's something 00:43:07.500 --> 00:43:11.139 that for us, we don't even see it as a necessity, 00:43:11.500 --> 00:43:16.320 it's more that it's not even let's fill it up 00:43:16.320 --> 00:43:18.760 half half, it's more okay, who can we find to 00:43:18.760 --> 00:43:20.739 talk about these topics? And it naturally occurs 00:43:20.739 --> 00:43:22.900 that way, which is great, because we don't even 00:43:22.900 --> 00:43:25.179 need to think about it, right? But I get what 00:43:25.179 --> 00:43:26.500 you're saying, in other countries, it is a big 00:43:26.500 --> 00:43:28.239 issue, you need to actually look out for people, 00:43:28.360 --> 00:43:30.639 okay, can we find another female speaker, please, 00:43:30.840 --> 00:43:33.179 or someone from a diverse background here, because 00:43:33.179 --> 00:43:34.699 there are people there, we want to listen to 00:43:34.699 --> 00:43:36.340 them, but sometimes they're hard to find, which 00:43:36.340 --> 00:43:40.340 is which is annoying. Well, that organic balance 00:43:40.340 --> 00:43:45.480 is, I mean, the ideal, right? Because then you 00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:48.500 don't choose just, I mean, you don't, you choose 00:43:48.500 --> 00:43:52.099 the best one. You don't maybe, in general, this 00:43:52.099 --> 00:43:54.820 is happening in general, like for me, even like 00:43:54.820 --> 00:43:57.679 senior positions in general, no, like instead 00:43:57.679 --> 00:43:59.760 of choosing the best one, they're choosing the 00:43:59.760 --> 00:44:01.760 second best one because it's a female, you know, 00:44:01.760 --> 00:44:03.940 like, and stuff like that, which is an issue. 00:44:04.059 --> 00:44:07.460 It's an issue. And, and, and it's a bit of a 00:44:08.980 --> 00:44:13.199 It's a pity, but it's also good, because that's 00:44:13.199 --> 00:44:15.980 the only way you can actually start having more 00:44:15.980 --> 00:44:20.400 real balance. But I think that your situation 00:44:20.400 --> 00:44:24.639 is awesome. It's great. And that's the ideal 00:44:24.639 --> 00:44:28.960 world in general. In the future, the idea is 00:44:28.960 --> 00:44:33.579 for these topics to be very organic, that people 00:44:33.579 --> 00:44:36.730 don't have to talk about them anymore. because 00:44:36.730 --> 00:44:39.789 they are not an issue anymore. You're not going 00:44:39.789 --> 00:44:44.789 to wonder if everyone is from the same country 00:44:44.789 --> 00:44:47.949 and everyone is from the same university. No, 00:44:48.489 --> 00:44:52.429 but everyone is from all over the world and etc. 00:44:53.489 --> 00:44:55.909 I think that the fact that we're talking about 00:44:55.909 --> 00:45:00.670 it now is just the beginning to end up on a more... 00:45:01.659 --> 00:45:05.599 We should talk about it more because it shouldn't 00:45:05.599 --> 00:45:08.659 be an issue. We shouldn't be having conversations. 00:45:09.159 --> 00:45:11.019 For example, here, obviously, there's different 00:45:11.019 --> 00:45:13.699 family protection laws, but we shouldn't be having 00:45:13.699 --> 00:45:17.239 a conversation about why women are still forced 00:45:17.239 --> 00:45:20.699 out of jobs to take care of kids in the UK. That 00:45:20.699 --> 00:45:22.480 shouldn't even be happening in the first place. 00:45:23.579 --> 00:45:27.139 For me, as a man, it really upsets me that this 00:45:27.139 --> 00:45:33.110 is even happening. you shouldn't and it seems 00:45:33.110 --> 00:45:36.969 like this you know as a company um you know when 00:45:36.969 --> 00:45:39.949 i look at thankfully not thankfully but i haven't 00:45:39.949 --> 00:45:42.389 had the opportunity to hire anyone at that stage 00:45:42.389 --> 00:45:44.630 of their lives yet but it's not an issue for 00:45:44.630 --> 00:45:46.610 me in the slightest we have family yeah of course 00:45:46.610 --> 00:45:48.369 go pick them up from school go do whatever work 00:45:48.369 --> 00:45:50.190 whenever you can that's completely fine by me 00:45:50.190 --> 00:45:53.210 i don't care uh that's that's how it should be 00:45:53.210 --> 00:45:55.710 um but yes for i guess for other companies it's 00:45:55.710 --> 00:45:59.889 a big issue No, but in the UK and everywhere, 00:46:01.690 --> 00:46:05.449 this conciliation, it's like a myth. It doesn't 00:46:05.449 --> 00:46:10.369 exist. In the end, when you become a mother, 00:46:10.670 --> 00:46:15.690 you have to make decisions and it's not easy 00:46:15.690 --> 00:46:19.869 to find places where they actually give you that 00:46:19.869 --> 00:46:26.159 flexibility and understand that it's... it's 00:46:26.159 --> 00:46:31.380 part of it. It should be like everyone should 00:46:31.380 --> 00:46:35.820 be able to have that flexibility. I don't know. 00:46:36.139 --> 00:46:40.300 Do you have kids? No. I do. I have a son. But 00:46:40.300 --> 00:46:43.739 I know how hard it is. And also I see with, for 00:46:43.739 --> 00:46:47.480 example, my sister, she has a very high position 00:46:47.480 --> 00:46:50.360 in a pharmaceutical company and I can see how 00:46:50.360 --> 00:46:52.760 she needs the flexibility. And I can also see 00:46:52.760 --> 00:46:54.500 they always give her the flexibility to take 00:46:54.500 --> 00:46:57.210 care of her own child. And that makes a big difference. 00:46:57.449 --> 00:47:00.929 And I don't, I always think what would happen 00:47:00.929 --> 00:47:03.050 if she was, for example, to live in the UK and 00:47:03.050 --> 00:47:04.849 it wouldn't work. They wouldn't give them that 00:47:04.849 --> 00:47:06.889 type of flexibility. And it's really a shame. 00:47:07.649 --> 00:47:09.909 Because ultimately having families, having kids, 00:47:10.010 --> 00:47:12.510 it benefits us all, right? I'm not saying let's 00:47:12.510 --> 00:47:14.929 have as many kids as possible. I'm saying that's 00:47:14.929 --> 00:47:18.110 the way that we as a species work. We reproduce, 00:47:18.170 --> 00:47:19.929 we have kids, and we should take care of the 00:47:19.929 --> 00:47:22.170 younger generation. So, you know, as business 00:47:22.170 --> 00:47:23.969 owners, we should take care of people with families. 00:47:24.210 --> 00:47:26.369 That's just the way it works. But yeah, it's 00:47:26.369 --> 00:47:28.710 always complicated. What do you think that the 00:47:28.710 --> 00:47:31.949 UK has this, like... Why do you think, I mean, 00:47:31.949 --> 00:47:35.369 is this an issue like everywhere? I know there 00:47:35.369 --> 00:47:37.429 are some countries with, for example, better 00:47:37.429 --> 00:47:39.989 policies in terms of maternity or paternity leave, 00:47:40.030 --> 00:47:42.750 you know? Here in Spain, we have a good policy 00:47:42.750 --> 00:47:45.389 in terms of like, we, like both parents get the 00:47:45.389 --> 00:47:49.309 same, you know? But in the end, when it comes 00:47:49.309 --> 00:47:54.110 to like, okay, the job themselves, like there's 00:47:54.110 --> 00:47:57.309 no, there's no like flexibility or always in 00:47:57.309 --> 00:47:59.889 a hurry or always have to be like, you know, 00:47:59.929 --> 00:48:04.409 like Owing time, you know? I think it's a matter 00:48:04.409 --> 00:48:07.630 of people being aware that there is a difference. 00:48:07.929 --> 00:48:11.210 There are different ways that we as a society 00:48:11.210 --> 00:48:13.789 will have a man and woman will have different 00:48:13.789 --> 00:48:18.489 career paths and different moments in their career. 00:48:18.510 --> 00:48:21.329 And that's perfectly fine. And we should accommodate 00:48:21.329 --> 00:48:25.110 for them. For example, I read a very crazy statistics 00:48:25.110 --> 00:48:29.090 that said that a female worker in reality ends 00:48:29.090 --> 00:48:32.159 up making less money. uh overall during the duration 00:48:32.159 --> 00:48:34.460 of her career first because she never negotiates 00:48:34.460 --> 00:48:37.039 as high as a man then because she only applies 00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:39.280 for jobs where she knows for 100 she can actually 00:48:39.280 --> 00:48:42.179 perform and then because whenever she has kids 00:48:42.179 --> 00:48:45.679 she then takes back a step so if she never negotiates 00:48:45.679 --> 00:48:47.719 and she never changes job she actually ends up 00:48:47.719 --> 00:48:49.400 with less money by the end of the career than 00:48:49.400 --> 00:48:52.420 a guy would and that's just crazy and it's crazy 00:48:52.420 --> 00:48:54.780 that we don't teach young women about that and 00:48:54.780 --> 00:48:56.880 say actually when you walk in the room you might 00:48:56.880 --> 00:48:58.920 not be able to fill 100 % of the requirements 00:48:58.920 --> 00:49:02.599 of a job. But if you feel 70 % or 60%, tell you 00:49:02.599 --> 00:49:04.619 what, just go for it. Just say you want a job. 00:49:04.940 --> 00:49:06.719 And when you negotiate, just go for the highest 00:49:06.719 --> 00:49:08.500 record you can think of, because that's the way 00:49:08.500 --> 00:49:11.280 you should do. And yeah, things like this that 00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:13.219 we should be talking about should be happening 00:49:13.219 --> 00:49:16.360 right now. Yeah, I mean, and hopefully in the 00:49:16.360 --> 00:49:19.380 future, that will be, again, won't be a topic 00:49:19.380 --> 00:49:22.139 anymore. But now, today, that's an issue. I mean, 00:49:22.380 --> 00:49:24.219 as you were saying, I mean, I'm also very lucky 00:49:24.219 --> 00:49:28.699 to have like that flexibility. But I did have 00:49:28.699 --> 00:49:32.699 to make some decisions in order to be able to 00:49:32.699 --> 00:49:38.699 have that flexibility. And making decisions, 00:49:39.300 --> 00:49:42.820 it means that you have some transition times 00:49:42.820 --> 00:49:48.719 that are not easy. They are not easy and that's 00:49:48.719 --> 00:49:51.760 the problem. And some people don't even have 00:49:51.760 --> 00:49:54.559 the opportunity to take those transition times. 00:49:55.759 --> 00:49:59.480 I think that's the most complicated thing. It's 00:49:59.480 --> 00:50:02.179 a luxury, I think. To be able to have a support 00:50:02.179 --> 00:50:04.420 network to make the decisions you need to make, 00:50:04.900 --> 00:50:06.539 to be able to have a support network that allows 00:50:06.539 --> 00:50:09.539 you to grow and have the down moments that you 00:50:09.539 --> 00:50:11.460 have when you're growing, that's very important 00:50:11.460 --> 00:50:14.500 and that's hard. That's a blessing to have and 00:50:14.500 --> 00:50:18.780 I need to be lucky to have that. All that, it's 00:50:18.780 --> 00:50:23.929 about ESG and impact. It's about ESG. The more 00:50:23.929 --> 00:50:26.369 companies are reporting on this topic, the more 00:50:26.369 --> 00:50:28.369 uncomfortable they will feel if they see that 00:50:28.369 --> 00:50:31.070 they are not improving. So from that part, that's 00:50:31.070 --> 00:50:36.489 the ESG part. That's really great. And from the 00:50:36.489 --> 00:50:41.530 impact part, it's about creating solutions that 00:50:41.530 --> 00:50:50.090 will actually help to pursue or achieve a more 00:50:51.110 --> 00:50:54.309 balance the world. There's a really cool movie 00:50:54.309 --> 00:50:56.829 by Michael Moore, the guy who did bowling for 00:50:56.829 --> 00:51:01.030 Columbine, and he does this fascinating comparison 00:51:01.030 --> 00:51:03.969 between the way that people work in the US and 00:51:03.969 --> 00:51:07.460 the way that people work in Italy. And he says 00:51:07.460 --> 00:51:09.719 well in italy you get two hours for lunch you 00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:12.559 get paid vacations you get paid medical insurance 00:51:12.559 --> 00:51:16.380 or paid health care and when you have kids you 00:51:16.380 --> 00:51:18.139 can take it take time off to take care of the 00:51:18.139 --> 00:51:19.980 kids you can take time off to you know spend 00:51:19.980 --> 00:51:22.079 some time with them when they're born and then 00:51:22.079 --> 00:51:23.980 the us workers think oh my god is this for real 00:51:23.980 --> 00:51:26.099 yes it's perfectly normal to have that and then 00:51:26.099 --> 00:51:27.960 they tell the italian workers this is what we 00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:30.380 have in us and they said this must be a joke 00:51:30.380 --> 00:51:33.239 you mean you cannot take you know vacation days 00:51:33.239 --> 00:51:36.190 no you cannot take time for lunch. No, you need 00:51:36.190 --> 00:51:39.570 to pay for your own health, health care. That's 00:51:39.570 --> 00:51:42.210 really weird. And it's things like this, we should 00:51:42.210 --> 00:51:45.110 actually be talking about societies like, what 00:51:45.110 --> 00:51:46.889 do we actually want for our society? But you 00:51:46.889 --> 00:51:48.829 know, it's a much bigger conversation, I guess. 00:51:49.489 --> 00:51:52.409 Yeah, but it's happening more often. So it's 00:51:52.409 --> 00:51:54.630 good. I mean, the fact that we ended up talking 00:51:54.630 --> 00:52:01.550 about this. Yes. It's an issue. So so it's gonna 00:52:01.550 --> 00:52:04.289 be solved. in the future, hopefully. Hopefully, 00:52:04.769 --> 00:52:06.289 yes. Laurie, if people want to reach out to you, 00:52:06.329 --> 00:52:08.590 how can you do so? I think that my LinkedIn, 00:52:08.670 --> 00:52:11.690 I'm very, very responsive on LinkedIn in general. 00:52:11.809 --> 00:52:15.329 So you just can add me on LinkedIn and message 00:52:15.329 --> 00:52:20.269 me out. I'm there. That's my name, Laura Idiarte. 00:52:20.489 --> 00:52:23.909 Sabalaga, I mean my full name. So you can just 00:52:23.909 --> 00:52:26.909 look for me. Sounds good. Laurie, thank you so 00:52:26.909 --> 00:52:29.000 much for your time. I really appreciate it. No, 00:52:29.099 --> 00:52:31.739 thank you, Ricardo. It was nice and great having 00:52:31.739 --> 00:52:33.480 this conversation with you. It's been a pleasure. 00:52:33.659 --> 00:52:36.619 Thank you. This podcast is also sponsored by 00:52:36.619 --> 00:52:40.019 startupnetworks .co .uk. Startup networks, it's 00:52:40.019 --> 00:52:42.639 an online forum where you can find all the resources 00:52:42.639 --> 00:52:45.099 you need to run your startup, from grants to 00:52:45.099 --> 00:52:47.480 investors to tips and tricks on how to be successful 00:52:47.480 --> 00:52:49.980 in your startup. This podcast is sponsored by 00:52:49.980 --> 00:52:53.199 openexperts .com. OpenExperts is a place to go 00:52:53.199 --> 00:52:55.360 if you're looking to talk with top experts from 00:52:55.360 --> 00:52:59.079 around the world. That is open -expert .com