Welcome to Bite Size Dental Marketing. Today,
we are here with the second episode of our Story
EO miniseries that we're doing. And we have the
one and only Shimmerin here, who is actually
one of the, I would say, original thinkers. Shimmerin,
is that an accurate statement? You're trying
to make me blush. I think that's the accurate
way to say it. She was in the team along with
Andre, who in the previous episode, all of you
met. If you've not seen that one, please pause
this one. Jump back to episode one where we introduce
the StoryEO concept and why it's important. And
in this episode, we're going to hear from Shemran,
who is the head of our SEO department, why as
an agency we chose this direction. I, for some
of you who don't know, worked in the SEO department.
I had founded it in pain free many, many years
ago. And what SEO was for me and what I was focusing
on five years ago has definitely changed. And
this is through advancements with AI and how
search works and the algorithm getting smarter,
how patients are actually getting smarter in
looking at content you put on websites. So I
know a lot has changed. And I want to understand
today from your side, what has changed? Why did
it change? How did we get to story EO being so
important? And then hopefully we can build on
that to give our listeners and especially the
dentists a great understanding of why this is
the next evolution of search engine optimization.
Well, I think one of the important things to...
remember or think about as we go through this
change is that we're currently in the change.
I like to think of ourselves as story of pioneers
in the sense that this is something that we're
starting and testing the waters of. But we are,
in a sense, figuring it out as we go. And we
are putting trust in the data that we're seeing
and how users are interacting with the changes
that we're making. So if we want to recap on
what Andrea said for anybody who hasn't had a
chance to listen to our previous episode, I think
that the approach of Storio is essentially looking
at SEO from a user's perspective more than just
Google's perspective. For those of you who don't
know, traditional SEO takes a very data -forward
approach. We look at the numbers, we're pushing
content out in a way that helps push rankings,
and that has always been the primary focus when
doing SEO. What we've noticed, however... in
the last couple of years, and I myself have been
in SEO for a few years now, is that rankings
don't always equal, in our case, working with
dentists, new patients. It doesn't mean that
it is a foot through the door for your practice.
And that is essentially not helpful for the practices
that we are helping. So we wanted to take a new
approach to SEO that could mean that one does
equal the other. So what you're saying is if...
even if you're number one on Google or you're
in that map pack, it's good, but it's not time
for dentists to celebrate just yet because it's
not all about the rankings. Do I understand that
correctly? Yes, that is what I'm saying. You
could be ranking for number one and you may have
people clicking through to your website, but
that doesn't necessarily mean that they're making
the call. Now, there are some cases where one
does equal the other. And I think the primary
reason for that is, because of how they have
exhibited themselves on their websites. Because
you need to remember that once you have ranked
for that number one position and somebody has
clicked through to your website, there's still
an entire journey that they go through and an
entire experience that they have with your website
before they make the decision to contact your
practice or give your office a call. So our focus
has instead shifted from rather making content
that... purely gives you that number one ranking
to rather making content that A, supports rankings
because it is important to get in front of people,
but also have content that will engage with potential
users and your potential patients more effectively
so that we can get that call. What we spoke about
in the previous episode was content for the sake
of content is not valuable anymore. The dental
industry continues to grow in the U .S. With
tools like ChatGPT and Gemini and these things,
I can write you literally a Harry Potter book
of content within two minutes. Probably less.
It depends how fast your internet is. But, I
mean, it can take two minutes to write a Harry
Potter -style book of content on your website.
That does not mean that it's good content. And
we covered that. What you say and the type of
patient you are talking to, who is your niche,
who is this practice even trying to be, that
is more important. What have you seen in terms
of taking on a generic keyword in Citi and we
treat you like family and the best technology?
serving the areas of city and city and city.
You know what I mean? Away from that shift, which
I think most dentists probably still see, depending
on the company that they're working with, to
where you are. It's definitely something that
we still see. But I think what we were seeing
when our content still looked like that, and
I'm sure there is still content out there that
we're managing and sifting our way through that
does still have Those factors, if I could put
it that way, a location -based keyword is how
we refer to it, is that even focusing content
around those keywords weren't getting the rankings
that we'd expect it to get. And I think that
also comes from a bit of a shift that we've seen
in Google and saying the primary phrase that
everyone uses is content is king and you need
to... create quality content and it needs to
be authoritative and effective and trustworthy
and all these things. But that content in itself,
that quality that we're looking for doesn't equal
having lots of content. And I think that as we
explored the content avenue, we were realizing
that we're realizing that quantity wasn't equal
to quantity and it sort of posed the question
of how do we create quality content, which is
what you had mentioned, Nana, and what Andre
has spoken about previously in creating content
that really speaks to a user's journey when they're
entering the website. So for us, I can tell you
a little bit more about what that looks like.
For us as an agency and as the SEO team, it required
a little bit of a shift in our mind because as
you said yourself, Ian, you're coming from a
traditional SEO background. We had to change.
our perspective as well that it's to put a dentist
in location -esque keyword in content to something
that we had spent years doing so it was something
that we were very used to and those were the
golden rules that we were sort of taught to follow
but we are looking to break out of the mold.
We're not just looking to do what everyone else
is doing and has done. We're looking to break
out of the mold so that we can stand out amongst
competitors on behalf of our clients. So the
process that we're trying to follow now is a
little bit more unique. in writing content that
speaks more to the fears and the desires that
a potential patient may have. And for us, that
really starts with what we dub core pages for
websites. The first page that somebody is likely
to interact with when they land on a website
is the homepage. It's the primary hub for how
a user can navigate to every other page on the
website, or it should be if it's done correctly.
because it's the primary page that people are
landing on, it's really your first opportunity
to engage with potential patients and start that
conversation to speak to what are their fears
as a patient or as a user that is looking for
dental services. And I think you mentioned earlier
how that shifts from one kind of... dentistry
to another. If somebody is just looking for a
general checkup versus looking for cosmetic services
to change the way their smile is, that shifts
from user to user. And we need to know how to
use content to speak to those desires and really
grab their attention so that they will follow
the way sort of through the funnel and get in
touch with the practice. i want to get more into
your process and i also want to get a bit into
certain types of dentistry which i think our
listeners would appreciate but when we take over
a client and it's still rooted in that traditional
way i know we touched now on the the dentist
in city type of keywords but beyond that What
are some signs that you very quickly pick up
on knowing what you know about StoryBrand, knowing
what you know about StoryO and these things that
you can share with dentists to go like, hey,
if you read through your homepage again, if you're
seeing these things, it's time to think about
it. I think there are a couple of things that
come to mind. Obviously, the first one being
the dentist in location type of keywords. an
agency working with traditional seo you can see
that sort of littered across a home page and
not only is it an indicator for us that that
approach or that traditional approach is being
taken but it's also an eyesore i you don't need
to be an seo expert to look at the words on that
page and realize that something feels unnatural
and our minds pick it up our minds do pick it
up for sure. It definitely does. A user or potential
patient may not know that that is an SEO practice
that is being used to try and rank higher on
Google, but they are going to look at it and
feel that something is off about it. And I think
in a world where AI is so prevalent and we're
so aware of things that don't seem natural, we're
constantly picking up on whether an image is
created by AI and now even AI in content generation,
I think our eyes are even more trained to pick
up abnormalities in text. So that is sort of
the first thing, and it speaks more to how content
feels unnatural. When content feels unnatural
and it feels generic, that is sort of the first
red flag that I see in my mind. Another thing,
another big thing that we look at is when a homepage
specifically, but this is obviously something
that carries out throughout a website, is all
about the practice. And that seems odd because
if your website is for your practice, surely
it should be about your practice. But it kind
of goes against the grain of what you want your
website to do, which is attract new patients.
And if you have a website that's all about you
and all about your achievements and all about
the services that you offer, isn't conveying
the message in the best way. People are very
selfish for... Frankly, we're focused on ourselves.
As we should be when we're spending money. As
we should be. Exactly. As we should be. And we
want to know how things will benefit us. And
a lot of practices aren't using their websites
and their content to do that. And that is something
that we are changing in the way that we write
content on behalf of our clients. And it's something
that usually needs to be changed when we're taking
on new clients. I think another thing is, and
this is something that sort of happens in the
background, even with clients that we do work
with and make big changes for, I think it's something
that can go unnoticed. But because we are Storio,
it's not just that we're trying to create content
that is more authentic and content that speaks
more to the user, but we are actually creating
a story. We're building the brand. creating something
that feels engaging and stories have flows. They
start in one place, they have a good chunk in
the middle and they tie everything in a neat
bow at the end. And we want the pages that we
work on to do that same thing. So when we're
working on a homepage or any other page, we have
an idea of what that page should look like and
what the best outline is to take. a potential
patient through. When they're landing on a page,
you want to engage them with that hook line and
think, hopefully we grab their attention fast
enough. But if they don't, we need to think about
what is the next best thing to show them? What
pulls them through the page? What gets them reading
more? And what will they think about next that
we can preemptively provide them information
for or answer a question for? That's also something
that we have a look at. Which we know at this
point, we have a pretty good idea about what
these patients are thinking about. We've done
a lot of research through calls we listen to,
through data surveys, through what we hear from
our dentists about what people are asking. So
that's so spot on. Think about what you're putting
on these pages and the story, as you said, that
you're telling. If it's introducing the team
and feeling safe with the doctor or the reputation
of the doctor or how am I going to pay for this
or what are other people saying? If these things
are not being represented in the story that you're
telling, you're going to struggle. And I want
to, for the dentist or listeners in general,
I know I keep saying dentist, but if you're listening
to this and you heard what shimmer and said now
about don't make it about yourself it needs to
be about the patient or about the user and you're
thinking but okay but how do i tell them what
i do and what it is if i don't talk about my
practice or talk about my experience and as you
said that shimmer and i thought about an example
of if you let's say it's a traveling company
and you want to book a trip to italy okay we're
going to tuscany join me to tuscany and all that
this travel brochure says is you will fly with
this metal plane that has these jet engines and
you're going to meet this captain who has been
doing this for so many years and then you will
take this taxi and that taxi will take a year
and it's a great taxi the taxi is very fuel efficient
so you don't have to worry and first of all i'm
not paying for the fuel i'm paying for the meter
so it does like this is very and this goes on
versus What would you feel like if I told you
that I can get you the fastest trip to Tuscany
where you will experience the countryside and
you won't have to worry about getting from the
airport to your Airbnb because there'll be someone
waiting for you where it's going to be affordable.
And immediately you hear the difference in I'm
painting the picture. I'm telling you why that
taxi matters. I'm telling you why that plane
matters. We're still telling the patient on the
homepage, back to dental now, we're still telling
the patient about the practice, about the experience,
but you need to think about what does it actually
mean for them? And then as you said now, Shem,
how does it fit into the story that we're trying
to tell to actually address the needs of these
patients? And it's shocking how many dental practices
we see that just miss this mark. It is shocking,
but at the same time shocking, but not surprising
almost, because it seems obvious that the experience
is something that you need to focus on. But when
we're looking at dentistry and the things that
we or the things that dentists would typically
want to showcase, it's difficult to do that.
You do need an expert by your side to make dental
technology sound exciting for a patient. It's
just one of those things. differences across
types of dentistry if i'm a periodontist or a
cosmetic dentist or a pediatric dentist or orthodontist
like does does the core of it remain the same
to you and the story just needs to be adjusted
or how have you approached it when you deal with
these different types of dentistry i would say
or argue that outside of just different types
of dentistry, it honestly differs from practice
to practice. We may have a framework that we're
following for each and every practice, but practices
are unique. You will find different dentists
from one practice to the next. At the end of
the day, you could go anywhere to get the dental
service that you need. You're really choosing
the practice and you're choosing to stay there.
And while we don't want to focus on the team
in a way that puts them at the forefront and
not the patient, they are really who we're selling.
And their expertise, their experience, and frankly,
their personality is what we're trying to let
shine through. And that's the kind of thing that
I think speaks more. authentically to patients
because it's intrinsically human so it's don't
think of types of dentistry think of who are
you as a practice or who is this practice and
how are we going to tell their story and the
services that they want to push not cookie cutter
It isn't exactly kikata because if it was, anybody
could do that and that's something that anybody
could offer, any dental practice. We're trying
to find what makes a practice unique and make
that be what helps them shine. However, if we're
looking purely at services they offer, I think
there is sort of a recipe for success that we
can look at when we're trying to market certain
services, especially on a website. So while we're
trying to highlight what is uniquely that practice
on the core pages, like I mentioned, that typically
encapsulates the homepage, the about page, which
is truly all about the team and the dentists
and what their first visit experience is like.
We do have a list of service pages that we rely
on to build our online visibility. And on those
pages, There are certain things that we can always
accept as true. If you are looking for a dentist
to help alleviate a dental emergency, the kind
of content that you would put on that page would
look vastly different from if you're looking
for a dentist to help. take out your wisdom teeth.
While emergency dentistry would require a sense
of urgency, wisdom teeth removal doesn't necessarily.
Maybe some element of urgency, but not quite
the same. And the way that we structure our content
and the sort of the elements that we include
in the actual information is vastly different
from the one to the next based on that. So I
guess my next question for you is, I'm a dentist
and I say, okay, I'm buying into the idea of
story. I get it. We can't just have a bunch of
keywords on a page. It's about the story. It's
about making it about the patient. We want them
to feel that we truly understand them. We're
showing social proof. I'm with you. But if you're
going to be taking away all of these keywords
or at least lessening it, is that not going to
hurt my rankings? Have we seen that there's any
significant drop in these changes we've been
making? What can you tell us in terms of risk
management and results that we've seen when we've
changed our ways? Because a lot of the industry
would probably tell you, no, it's going to hurt
your rankings. So that would be interesting for
me to know. Yeah, I get that. We can't just say.
trust us and then expect everyone to give us
a big thumbs up and a smile. So I understand
that uncertainty and we've received some of that
pushback even within our own agency from clients.
It is a concern that we see and with good reason.
We come from years of doing SEO in a traditional
way where we are also told to follow the steps
that give us good rankings. But if I haven't
mentioned it already, Rankings do not necessarily
equal new patients. And if we are working with
a practice, our primary goal is to get them new
patients. Our goal is to not necessarily give
them rankings. Now, if one equals the other,
then we're just, I suppose, winning. But one
does not always equal the other. So what we've
seen so far, if I can share a little bit about
that, because we've been on this journey now
for close to a year of changing the way that
we look at SEO and changing the way that we work
on content and anybody who is familiar with SEO
will know that change takes time. It always takes
a couple of months for things to really hit Google
and for us to see the effects of that. But we've
actually not seen any crazy dives for our clients.
There have perhaps been some fluctuations in
rankings, but nothing that has been a major cause
for concern. If we look at the pure data on Google
Search Console, for example, visibility is stable.
In many cases, it's up. So we're actually reaching
more eyes than we expected. And we are still
very much in the process of making the changes
that we are making on behalf of our clients.
So far, it's looking good. Another thing that
I thought about was insurance officers, HMO,
PPO, fee -for -service officers, your officers
that want even higher -end treatment. I'm talking
about a $40 ,000, $50 ,000 full -arch case. I
can imagine that as you move up on the cost,
of treatment and the type of practice you are
what you're telling us here becomes more and
more and more important because if i think of
like a watch the entry level watch is it tells
you the time and it will go this far into the
water and that's great and it will cost you maybe
two hundred dollars a rolex that's associated
with the masters is said that Like this is the
type of watch that Tiger Woods would wear because
he's a champion. And this brand is associated
with it. So people are willing to spend that
money because they're associated. Do you see
that in dentistry too where this, what you're
saying with StoryO becomes more and more important
as you go up on that pay scale? Yes, for sure.
That's definitely something that we see. And
I think that is where the essence of creating
a story on behalf of our clients is so important.
We've spent a lot of time as a team considering
how we can create content and truly make content
unique in a way that speaks to what these practices
are hoping to achieve. For practices that do
offer services that are more on the high -end
cost scale, we need to create an atmosphere,
almost an environment through their brand and
through their content that speaks to that. If
you're comparing a cheap watch that you have
bought off the road compared to Rolex, you really
want content that is sleek and professional and
gives you confidence in the services that they're
offering versus something that is dental specialist
in location and the content looks generic and
they're not telling you anything about the practice
or why that practice and that specific specialist
is the best for your needs. So it is something
that we've needed to take into account and decide
how we can structure content and actually write
content and create the feeling that we're hoping
to. So to end off, I want to ask you if I'm a
dentist or a practice manager, hygienist, someone,
I'm listening to this now. And I just want to
take the initial first steps of trying to judge
if we need this, if we're doing it right. What
are some initial steps that I can take on my
current website to identify these things and
to start making changes? I think the quick...
sort of surefire way to identify if your website
has fallen victim to a lack of story is how I
could phrase it. It's similar to the things that
us as a team would look out for. If you've opened
up the homepage of your website and it's littered
with content that feels odd because of location
-based keywords or sentences that just don't
quite have the right structure, That is one way
to tell if you need a bit of a story or approach.
Another is that if your homepage is sparse, if
it isn't telling a potential patient why you
are different from your competitors and why they
should reach out to you versus a competitor,
that's something that you really need to look
out for. And if it is telling your patients that
Where is it telling that? Is it sharing that
information the moment you land on the page or
do you have to scroll for two minutes before
you can actually find out that bit of information?
Two things that come to mind as you say that
is, number one, there's limited real estate.
So as you were saying, how far are you scrolling
if you're trying to communicate something? So
if you're looking at your website and your patient
testimonials or your in -house membership plan
or the reviews saying how amazing you are, is
sitting two minutes into me trying to get to
the bottom of your page, and I'm exaggerating
now, but understand what I'm saying, then that
is not something that's going to help your practice
get new patients. And the second thing I want
to mention is, what Shimran mentioned there now
is making yourself stand out, being unique, how
you stand out from someone else. Treating you
like family, and we have a new cone beam, latest
this and online scheduling is nice, but a lot
of people are starting to do it. You will root
it in tradition. These are all terms that as
consumers, our minds have become so trained to
just kind of gloss over these things because
it's such an old way of looking at things. We
treat you like family, modern dentistry. No.
look at your homepage, read it, and then understand
why am I modern dentist? What is it? Is it that
the turnaround times are a lot quicker? Is it
that I'm open on weekends too? Is it that with
my new scanner, you can sit at home and send
me a picture instead of having to come in and
I can just ship you your next set of trays? Like
that is what matters to people. So go and look
for those things and then truly try and differentiate
yourself. in valuable ways not just by saying
you will feel at home that is not that is not
differentiated no that's you've you've summed
it up perfectly and i think that is what we could
classify as a bit of a dental cliche for content
so on that note shimmerin thank you so much i
appreciate you coming to share with us um stay
tuned we have the third episode of the series
coming on where we will talk to our paid media
specialist and he will be sharing how what shimran
has shared with us today also plays a role in
your paid advertising and the ads you put out
there because that is still you representing
your brand to the world um you can't have it
right on your website and then your ads and your
social media and these things still have that
bad generic type of wording it all works together
as an ecosystem so we look forward for that one
Shimran, thank you so much. It was great having
you. Thank you, Ian.