WEBVTT 00:00:10.320 --> 00:00:12.539 Welcome to Bitesize Dental Marketing. Today, 00:00:12.640 --> 00:00:16.019 I have Taylor Hill. Taylor is a CPA and CFP at 00:00:16.019 --> 00:00:20.100 Serity Partners. And what a wonderful time to 00:00:20.100 --> 00:00:23.179 have you on the show. We can talk about planning 00:00:23.179 --> 00:00:27.460 in the midst of the 2025 tariffs and hear about 00:00:27.460 --> 00:00:31.379 it. Taylor, when you jumped on, I was sitting 00:00:31.379 --> 00:00:34.820 here debating, are we going to talk about tariffs? 00:00:35.850 --> 00:00:38.450 I can't imagine tariffs are too impactful to 00:00:38.450 --> 00:00:40.070 dentists. And then on the pre -show, we were 00:00:40.070 --> 00:00:43.250 talking about how the investments and what you're 00:00:43.250 --> 00:00:46.990 doing. But before we jump into anything in -depth 00:00:46.990 --> 00:00:50.509 and political or crazy, Taylor, I'd love to hear 00:00:50.509 --> 00:00:55.310 more about you, Serity Partners, how you came 00:00:55.310 --> 00:00:58.109 to be. I know at some point you were at E &Y 00:00:58.109 --> 00:01:03.109 and you've had a great career there. Talk to 00:01:03.109 --> 00:01:05.549 me more about it. Yeah, well, I appreciate you 00:01:05.549 --> 00:01:09.430 for having me, Eric, first of all. And it's definitely 00:01:09.430 --> 00:01:11.409 an honor and a pleasure to be on the podcast 00:01:11.409 --> 00:01:14.310 with you. Yeah, so I'm Taylor Hill. I'm with 00:01:14.310 --> 00:01:18.689 Serity Partners. We are a national financial 00:01:18.689 --> 00:01:21.269 planning firm, investment management firm all 00:01:21.269 --> 00:01:23.859 across the country. As you mentioned, I... came 00:01:23.859 --> 00:01:26.099 out of college went to oklahoma state i'm from 00:01:26.099 --> 00:01:29.200 a small town in wichita falls texas two hours 00:01:29.200 --> 00:01:32.200 northwest of here and uh graduated from oklahoma 00:01:32.200 --> 00:01:34.239 state and i had no idea what i was going to do 00:01:34.239 --> 00:01:37.040 when i went to school and about even two years 00:01:37.040 --> 00:01:41.060 into school to be honest um but when i was 19 00:01:41.060 --> 00:01:43.819 i read a book by dave ramsey called the complete 00:01:43.819 --> 00:01:46.280 guide to money and it really impacted me and 00:01:46.280 --> 00:01:50.969 how i thought about money in general and how 00:01:50.969 --> 00:01:53.370 it impacts all of us we can't really get away 00:01:53.370 --> 00:01:55.709 from it to be honest and what shocked me about 00:01:55.709 --> 00:02:01.909 it is how little i knew and how much how little 00:02:01.909 --> 00:02:03.829 i knew from not only from my parents but from 00:02:03.829 --> 00:02:06.250 the school system and uh you know public high 00:02:06.250 --> 00:02:10.090 school and so it really fascinated me and so 00:02:10.090 --> 00:02:12.270 because of that you know i eventually majored 00:02:12.270 --> 00:02:14.949 in finance at oklahoma state and then eventually 00:02:14.949 --> 00:02:18.280 switched over to accounting I went to Ernst & 00:02:18.280 --> 00:02:20.020 Young, just like you mentioned, worked at EY 00:02:20.020 --> 00:02:24.699 Dallas as an auditor and got my CPA. I quickly 00:02:24.699 --> 00:02:27.580 realized that not everyone loves auditors. And 00:02:27.580 --> 00:02:31.379 when you walk into the room, they're not exactly 00:02:31.379 --> 00:02:35.319 fired up to see you walking in. And so within 00:02:35.319 --> 00:02:37.159 a couple of years, I realized I really didn't 00:02:37.159 --> 00:02:40.520 want to stay in that industry, in that space. 00:02:40.620 --> 00:02:42.879 But I did want to switch over to financial planning. 00:02:43.819 --> 00:02:47.360 And so I found myself in the, in financial planning 00:02:47.360 --> 00:02:49.560 for Dennis. And so that's the space that I am. 00:02:50.139 --> 00:02:52.740 How'd you hook up with just Dennis? Yeah. That's 00:02:52.740 --> 00:02:54.860 a, that's an odd group of, that's an odd group 00:02:54.860 --> 00:02:59.500 of people. To be, yeah, to be honest, I, that's, 00:02:59.500 --> 00:03:02.800 it kind of came out of the blue to, to an extent. 00:03:02.840 --> 00:03:04.819 I mean, I knew I wanted to be a financial planner 00:03:04.819 --> 00:03:08.159 and help people manage money and, you know, do 00:03:08.159 --> 00:03:10.860 tax planning and all the things. But to be quite 00:03:10.860 --> 00:03:13.259 honest, not every account can easily transition 00:03:13.259 --> 00:03:17.400 to the financial planning space. And so the first 00:03:17.400 --> 00:03:19.699 group I got connected with just happened to be 00:03:19.699 --> 00:03:22.520 in that industry, in that space. And I said, 00:03:22.560 --> 00:03:24.919 sure, you know, why not? And so now I know way 00:03:24.919 --> 00:03:26.620 more about dentistry than I ever thought I would. 00:03:26.780 --> 00:03:29.439 And I've really enjoyed it. But, you know, at 00:03:29.439 --> 00:03:34.020 the end of the day, it is a niche space. But 00:03:34.020 --> 00:03:37.460 you're also what you're really helping is small 00:03:37.460 --> 00:03:41.449 business owners. And, you know, that's that's 00:03:41.449 --> 00:03:45.150 really what I enjoy doing. I love working with 00:03:45.150 --> 00:03:48.909 small business owners and helping them grow their 00:03:48.909 --> 00:03:52.530 practice and plan their finances and tax planning 00:03:52.530 --> 00:03:55.909 and investment management. And so, yeah, that's 00:03:55.909 --> 00:03:57.530 how I mean, that's how I got connected. It was 00:03:57.530 --> 00:03:59.449 I wish I could say that I had like an uncle or 00:03:59.449 --> 00:04:01.990 whatever. That was a dentist. But it just happened 00:04:01.990 --> 00:04:05.349 to be our place at the right time. And that recruiter 00:04:05.349 --> 00:04:08.030 hit me up. There's dentistry. You know, vets 00:04:08.030 --> 00:04:10.229 have been brought up. bought up in record number 00:04:10.229 --> 00:04:12.349 by private equity in the last few years right 00:04:12.349 --> 00:04:15.870 i've heard dentistry chiropractics are kind of 00:04:15.870 --> 00:04:19.230 the last bastion of small businesses out there 00:04:19.230 --> 00:04:21.529 in the medical yeah plumbers are being bought 00:04:21.529 --> 00:04:24.350 up like crazy they are so they're they're not 00:04:24.350 --> 00:04:27.589 even uh most most you know fred's plumber down 00:04:27.589 --> 00:04:31.410 the street he's probably working for some they're 00:04:31.410 --> 00:04:33.350 still around they're still around because i do 00:04:33.350 --> 00:04:35.430 have family in that industry but yes you're right 00:04:35.430 --> 00:04:37.810 they are getting They already bought everything 00:04:37.810 --> 00:04:40.230 with private equity. I agree. Air conditioning, 00:04:40.529 --> 00:04:44.209 HVAC is crazy and, you know, bought up there. 00:04:44.290 --> 00:04:46.970 What other like small businesses are out there 00:04:46.970 --> 00:04:50.610 that you know of? Like, is dentistry the last 00:04:50.610 --> 00:04:54.310 of, are we a dying breed in these non -private 00:04:54.310 --> 00:04:58.810 equity backed industries? I think that, I don't 00:04:58.810 --> 00:05:00.069 know that I would say that. I mean, there are 00:05:00.069 --> 00:05:03.209 plenty of small niche. companies that are run 00:05:03.209 --> 00:05:06.870 by just a few people. One stat that has fascinated 00:05:06.870 --> 00:05:09.509 me when I joined with Serity, and we'll get into 00:05:09.509 --> 00:05:11.269 that here in a minute, but in joining Serity 00:05:11.269 --> 00:05:14.829 Partners is the stat that 87 % of businesses 00:05:14.829 --> 00:05:19.189 that have over $100 million of top line revenue 00:05:19.189 --> 00:05:23.649 are privately owned businesses. And so when you 00:05:23.649 --> 00:05:25.750 think about that, now you're right, a lot of 00:05:25.750 --> 00:05:28.230 that has been swallowed up by big PE groups like 00:05:28.230 --> 00:05:30.610 KKR and all those. Which would be considered 00:05:30.610 --> 00:05:33.009 private, right? which would be considered private. 00:05:33.089 --> 00:05:37.029 You're right. There are still plenty of not just 00:05:37.029 --> 00:05:39.430 family -owned businesses, but partnerships that 00:05:39.430 --> 00:05:42.170 have not been swallowed up by the likes of KKR 00:05:42.170 --> 00:05:46.750 and Apollo and all those giant guys, BlackRock 00:05:46.750 --> 00:05:49.949 and those guys. I still think there's plenty 00:05:49.949 --> 00:05:55.170 of opportunity for small business owners. Dentistry 00:05:55.170 --> 00:05:58.490 is one of the major fields that is still hanging 00:05:58.490 --> 00:06:00.009 in there. I think it's just because it's such 00:06:00.009 --> 00:06:02.930 an intimate People have really intimate relationships 00:06:02.930 --> 00:06:05.290 with their dentist. I mean, they want to go to 00:06:05.290 --> 00:06:07.089 the same person over and over and they get really 00:06:07.089 --> 00:06:11.730 close with them. And I think that's why there's 00:06:11.730 --> 00:06:14.250 always going to be opportunity for small private 00:06:14.250 --> 00:06:18.850 dentists to run their own practice. Yeah. And 00:06:18.850 --> 00:06:20.689 we've seen it in the past couple of years. Now, 00:06:20.689 --> 00:06:22.069 some of it's because capital is so expensive. 00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:25.939 I don't know that there's any of the big DSOs 00:06:25.939 --> 00:06:28.600 that have recapped recently. Yeah, it's definitely 00:06:28.600 --> 00:06:31.300 slowed down. No question. And I'm not seeing, 00:06:31.360 --> 00:06:34.019 I'm seeing prices still behind practices, but 00:06:34.019 --> 00:06:37.000 there for a while we were, you know, we were 00:06:37.000 --> 00:06:39.819 losing an account to DSO. Yeah. Because of course, 00:06:39.899 --> 00:06:41.740 you know, I mean, just bang, bang, bang, bang, 00:06:41.800 --> 00:06:44.019 bang. And now we've, I don't know, we've lost 00:06:44.019 --> 00:06:48.600 an account to DSO in the last 16 months, maybe. 00:06:48.680 --> 00:06:50.779 It's been a minute. Yeah, interest rates have 00:06:50.779 --> 00:06:54.459 had a part in that. And also, I mean, let's be 00:06:54.459 --> 00:06:57.120 honest, they were moving quick, like rapidly 00:06:57.120 --> 00:07:00.439 acquiring dentists and small practices. And so 00:07:00.439 --> 00:07:02.180 inevitably, that's going to slow down. There's 00:07:02.180 --> 00:07:04.540 going to be ebbs and flows with private equity. 00:07:05.399 --> 00:07:08.079 But yeah, you're right. It's definitely slowed 00:07:08.079 --> 00:07:10.139 down in the last couple of years. No question 00:07:10.139 --> 00:07:15.480 about that. So today, we're just entered Q2 of 00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:18.839 2025. What are you talking to your clients about? 00:07:19.449 --> 00:07:22.350 Yeah. Well, and we were talking about this pre 00:07:22.350 --> 00:07:24.689 -show, but the buzzword right now is tariff. 00:07:24.829 --> 00:07:27.709 I mean, that's the word of the year. Somebody's 00:07:27.709 --> 00:07:32.430 favorite word. Yeah, tariff. I can guarantee 00:07:32.430 --> 00:07:33.970 you 80 % of the population didn't even know what 00:07:33.970 --> 00:07:36.370 a tariff was until the last couple of weeks or 00:07:36.370 --> 00:07:39.529 maybe the last quarter. But, you know, right 00:07:39.529 --> 00:07:42.129 now, I mean, to be honest, our meetings really 00:07:42.129 --> 00:07:44.129 haven't changed. I mean, what we do with our 00:07:44.129 --> 00:07:46.930 clients at Serity Partners is, you know, they'll 00:07:46.930 --> 00:07:49.389 come in i usually don't meet me here in arlington 00:07:49.389 --> 00:07:51.829 texas or i'll fly to them wherever they are in 00:07:51.829 --> 00:07:55.089 the country and we will start with an update 00:07:55.089 --> 00:07:57.110 what are the goals for the day and we'll spend 00:07:57.110 --> 00:08:00.110 most of our time on the practice hey what's working 00:08:00.110 --> 00:08:02.990 what's not i noticed that this piece of overhead 00:08:02.990 --> 00:08:04.550 is a little bit higher than last year why is 00:08:04.550 --> 00:08:08.509 that um and that really hasn't changed you know 00:08:08.509 --> 00:08:10.430 just because tariffs have become a bigger player 00:08:10.430 --> 00:08:12.639 in the investment world investment landscape, 00:08:12.959 --> 00:08:16.220 it hasn't changed how we go about our business. 00:08:17.579 --> 00:08:20.220 And I don't expect that to change. Now, whenever 00:08:20.220 --> 00:08:23.220 we talk specifically about investment allocation 00:08:23.220 --> 00:08:26.459 and you've noticed that the S &P 500 has come 00:08:26.459 --> 00:08:29.279 down 10%, 15 % in the last couple of weeks, of 00:08:29.279 --> 00:08:30.819 course, we're going to talk about rebalancing 00:08:30.819 --> 00:08:33.200 their investment portfolios, their accounts, 00:08:33.360 --> 00:08:35.539 and we'll talk about what's going on and what 00:08:35.539 --> 00:08:38.259 we can reasonably anticipate in the coming months. 00:08:38.379 --> 00:08:40.519 But it doesn't change how we go about our... 00:08:40.700 --> 00:08:44.000 our business with our clients and with our dentists. 00:08:44.039 --> 00:08:47.559 So it's definitely, and again, we're only in 00:08:47.559 --> 00:08:50.379 the first couple of innings of this. That's right. 00:08:51.039 --> 00:08:52.740 It's going to be a long game. Yeah, it's going 00:08:52.740 --> 00:08:54.200 to be a long game. We think it's going to be 00:08:54.200 --> 00:08:57.840 a long game, but who knows? But it really hasn't 00:08:57.840 --> 00:08:59.500 changed how we go about our relationships with 00:08:59.500 --> 00:09:01.899 clients and our meetings so far. Just making 00:09:01.899 --> 00:09:04.559 them more aware of, hey, what is a tariff? What 00:09:04.559 --> 00:09:09.200 is going on? Why is this a thing? helping them 00:09:09.200 --> 00:09:11.320 plan for working around that and working through 00:09:11.320 --> 00:09:16.399 it. Now, is it correct to say that outside of 00:09:16.399 --> 00:09:18.259 the investments, the personal investments, right? 00:09:18.539 --> 00:09:23.120 Your supplies, maybe some equipment at some point, 00:09:23.179 --> 00:09:25.960 but any equipment here is probably already on 00:09:25.960 --> 00:09:29.919 the US, right? What would be the next 60 days 00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:32.419 impact to a dentist office outside of the investment 00:09:32.419 --> 00:09:35.730 side? Well, number one, I would say that tariffs 00:09:35.730 --> 00:09:38.330 implemented for the long term at this rate that 00:09:38.330 --> 00:09:42.950 Trump just enacted, if they are left in place 00:09:42.950 --> 00:09:45.629 for a long period of time, everything as a consumer, 00:09:45.730 --> 00:09:47.509 everything that you purchase will eventually 00:09:47.509 --> 00:09:50.250 get touched. And that includes Dennis. Dennis 00:09:50.250 --> 00:09:53.610 will not be immune to that at all. All supplies. 00:09:54.490 --> 00:09:56.809 And I shouldn't say all, but the vast majority 00:09:56.809 --> 00:09:58.710 of society. The vast majority come out of China 00:09:58.710 --> 00:09:59.990 or somewhere like that. When you go to the grocery 00:09:59.990 --> 00:10:01.529 store, that's correct. When you go to the grocery 00:10:01.529 --> 00:10:03.250 store, when you go buy clothes, food and clothing, 00:10:03.409 --> 00:10:06.029 everything will be impacted if they are left 00:10:06.029 --> 00:10:08.970 in place for a long period of time. However, 00:10:09.129 --> 00:10:12.629 if this becomes a one -month, two -month negotiation 00:10:12.629 --> 00:10:15.350 tactic by the current administration, I don't 00:10:15.350 --> 00:10:20.690 suspect it's going to have a material impact 00:10:20.690 --> 00:10:25.549 for the long term. For now, nothing that's going 00:10:25.549 --> 00:10:28.570 on right now should impact how our clients are 00:10:28.570 --> 00:10:31.110 behaving or how they're buying supplies, how 00:10:31.110 --> 00:10:33.490 they're purchasing products. This is not just 00:10:33.490 --> 00:10:35.690 because tariffs are in place and we expect prices 00:10:35.690 --> 00:10:38.129 to rise over time. If they're left in place, 00:10:38.230 --> 00:10:40.029 it doesn't mean you should just go out and buy 00:10:40.029 --> 00:10:42.870 all kinds of equipment and do all of that. But 00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:45.889 long term, I mean, if they are left in place, 00:10:46.090 --> 00:10:49.470 then you can expect all supplies to creep up. 00:10:49.529 --> 00:10:52.809 No question. Yeah. What else are you seeing in 00:10:52.809 --> 00:10:56.649 the industry today that dentists might be struggling 00:10:56.649 --> 00:11:00.850 with? We have rising labor costs. We have increased 00:11:00.850 --> 00:11:06.429 competition. What is it that is mid -2025 we're 00:11:06.429 --> 00:11:08.169 seeing as the big challenges they're facing? 00:11:08.809 --> 00:11:11.870 Well, I think over the last few years, I mean, 00:11:11.889 --> 00:11:15.950 inflation has been a problem and it's impacted 00:11:15.950 --> 00:11:19.070 staff staffing. And that's whether you're a general 00:11:19.070 --> 00:11:22.240 dentist. orthodontist pediatric dentist i mean 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:24.340 it's impacted all the different sectors of the 00:11:24.340 --> 00:11:27.759 dental space all the different specialties and 00:11:27.759 --> 00:11:31.120 i would say that that's at least with what's 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:33.600 going on right now that's still a primary focus 00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:37.379 of our clients is inflation hey are we keeping 00:11:37.379 --> 00:11:40.059 up with inflation with our current fees and it's 00:11:40.059 --> 00:11:43.500 a really tough balance because if patients are 00:11:43.500 --> 00:11:46.539 experiencing this at home and you're experiencing 00:11:46.539 --> 00:11:49.480 this in the practice You know, it's a delicate 00:11:49.480 --> 00:11:52.620 thing to keep up with your current costs and 00:11:52.620 --> 00:11:55.159 keeping your current profitability. And so I 00:11:55.159 --> 00:11:57.259 would say that's a primary concern right now. 00:11:57.659 --> 00:11:59.899 Not just and not just right now, but over the 00:11:59.899 --> 00:12:04.259 last few years, you know, gauging what is actual 00:12:04.259 --> 00:12:07.740 inflation and are we keeping up with with costs? 00:12:08.120 --> 00:12:10.960 And that's been that's been a very tough thing 00:12:10.960 --> 00:12:13.740 to work around, to be honest, you know, because 00:12:13.740 --> 00:12:16.330 no one wants to feel like they're. squeezing 00:12:16.330 --> 00:12:18.070 their patients. No one wants to feel that way 00:12:18.070 --> 00:12:21.549 at all. And I see a lot of my clients that are 00:12:21.549 --> 00:12:24.690 very hesitant to raise their fees because of 00:12:24.690 --> 00:12:27.129 it. And so that's been a primary focus. And the 00:12:27.129 --> 00:12:29.169 other thing too is, yes, there is increased competition 00:12:29.169 --> 00:12:33.509 with the DSOs. And another big thing has been, 00:12:33.649 --> 00:12:37.470 hey, do I want to sell to a DSO? That's still 00:12:37.470 --> 00:12:39.370 a thing, even though that has slowed down, that's 00:12:39.370 --> 00:12:42.870 still a primary factor in all of our clients' 00:12:43.029 --> 00:12:48.049 momentary plans. To negotiate fee schedules, 00:12:48.250 --> 00:12:54.190 are you advising them they should? We look at 00:12:54.190 --> 00:12:56.190 that every single year they come into our meetings. 00:12:56.570 --> 00:13:01.190 And so we have a fee comparison report to the 00:13:01.190 --> 00:13:04.169 NDAS, and we will run that based on their zip 00:13:04.169 --> 00:13:06.330 code. Now, this is not the end -all, be -all. 00:13:06.490 --> 00:13:09.149 It's not the Bible. Just because that report 00:13:09.149 --> 00:13:11.690 tells them they're only in the 50th percentile, 00:13:11.730 --> 00:13:14.269 well, there's some new ones there. Like just 00:13:14.269 --> 00:13:16.149 because you're in the Houston, Texas zip code 00:13:16.149 --> 00:13:18.629 or Dallas, Texas zip code. I mean, you could 00:13:18.629 --> 00:13:20.649 be on a different side of town. Like there's 00:13:20.649 --> 00:13:22.429 a lot of factors that come into play. What type 00:13:22.429 --> 00:13:26.350 of dentistry are you doing? But yeah, every year 00:13:26.350 --> 00:13:29.149 they come in. I mean, at a minimum, we recommend 00:13:29.149 --> 00:13:31.690 clients raise their fees at least 3 % to keep 00:13:31.690 --> 00:13:35.710 up with inflation at least. And then outside 00:13:35.710 --> 00:13:38.699 of that, there's nuance and determining. What 00:13:38.699 --> 00:13:41.539 percentile are they in their community? Is it 00:13:41.539 --> 00:13:43.179 time to raise fees a little bit more dramatically? 00:13:43.340 --> 00:13:45.769 Do they need to stay put? it's a very nuanced 00:13:45.769 --> 00:13:49.110 conversation for sure yeah now is there a strategy 00:13:49.110 --> 00:13:52.750 that you like as far as keeping your hygiene 00:13:52.750 --> 00:13:56.169 fees lower but your cosmetic fees a little on 00:13:56.169 --> 00:13:58.490 the higher side or do you do you like to raise 00:13:58.490 --> 00:14:01.210 everything is there a strategy to it or just 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:03.309 you know let's just raise fees well i would say 00:14:03.309 --> 00:14:05.850 there's absolutely a strategy and it really depends 00:14:05.850 --> 00:14:09.289 on the client eric um it depends on what they're 00:14:09.289 --> 00:14:13.350 trying to do, what niche are they in their community. 00:14:14.330 --> 00:14:18.809 But I would say that for your crown fee, if someone 00:14:18.809 --> 00:14:22.009 comes in and they need a crown, whether it's 00:14:22.009 --> 00:14:24.649 $2 ,000, $4 ,000, it's going to be a lot of money 00:14:24.649 --> 00:14:28.309 to them. And so for those, what I would usually 00:14:28.309 --> 00:14:31.470 tell clients is they can be more willing to raise 00:14:31.470 --> 00:14:35.299 those a lot faster than their pro fee fees. Right. 00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:37.519 Because those are the routine fees that everyone 00:14:37.519 --> 00:14:40.600 sees every time they come in for their six month 00:14:40.600 --> 00:14:42.720 cleaning. Right. Well, more importantly, it's 00:14:42.720 --> 00:14:43.840 the fee that everyone thinks they're going to 00:14:43.840 --> 00:14:46.600 pay. Exactly. Whether I need a deep cleaning 00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:48.940 or not. Yeah. How much is cleaning? Yeah. And 00:14:48.940 --> 00:14:50.779 so when we look at that, that's usually a huge 00:14:50.779 --> 00:14:52.799 part of our strategy. Now, again, every client's 00:14:52.799 --> 00:14:55.620 different. Every community is different. And 00:14:55.620 --> 00:14:57.840 it's a very nuanced conversation. But that's 00:14:57.840 --> 00:15:00.700 definitely one thing that we typically approach 00:15:00.700 --> 00:15:02.899 fees. I mean, if you're in the 20th percentile 00:15:02.899 --> 00:15:05.669 in your area. we're going to be more willing 00:15:05.669 --> 00:15:08.769 to raise those bigger fees, those bigger codes 00:15:08.769 --> 00:15:14.649 than the pro fee or oral exam. And so you're 00:15:14.649 --> 00:15:16.509 looking at the fee structures, you're looking 00:15:16.509 --> 00:15:19.389 at the overall P &L of the practice. How are 00:15:19.389 --> 00:15:22.090 you balancing that then? Because I assume you're 00:15:22.090 --> 00:15:24.250 getting into some version of tax strategies and 00:15:24.250 --> 00:15:27.629 things. How are you bridging that office P &L 00:15:27.629 --> 00:15:30.830 and office expenses? And I've got a car and I'm 00:15:30.830 --> 00:15:33.539 paying my kids or whatever into it. their personal 00:15:33.539 --> 00:15:36.759 tax strategies. How are you sort of drawing the 00:15:36.759 --> 00:15:40.039 line in those meetings? Every planner is different, 00:15:40.139 --> 00:15:43.519 but how I approach our meetings is if you were 00:15:43.519 --> 00:15:45.820 to look at a P &L and go from top to bottom, 00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:48.840 at the very top is going to be revenues, right? 00:15:49.159 --> 00:15:51.740 Are revenues growing? Are they declining? Are 00:15:51.740 --> 00:15:53.980 they staying stagnant? That's the first thing 00:15:53.980 --> 00:15:56.179 we're going to look at. Why are they, if they 00:15:56.179 --> 00:15:58.159 are stagnant or they're declining, why is that? 00:15:58.820 --> 00:16:04.129 Did you scale back on your days? Is the population 00:16:04.129 --> 00:16:06.190 in somewhat of a decline? If you're in a smaller 00:16:06.190 --> 00:16:07.950 community, people are moving out. I mean, there 00:16:07.950 --> 00:16:11.230 could be all kinds of reasons for why top line's 00:16:11.230 --> 00:16:14.669 decreasing. But that's where I start. And so 00:16:14.669 --> 00:16:16.649 we start with collections, which is a function 00:16:16.649 --> 00:16:21.809 of production and fees and insurance or the in 00:16:21.809 --> 00:16:24.669 -network or the out -of -network. And then I 00:16:24.669 --> 00:16:27.049 go down the line. And so we start with the top 00:16:27.049 --> 00:16:29.590 line revenues, like I said. And then next we 00:16:29.590 --> 00:16:32.190 go to our direct costs. What are direct costs? 00:16:32.309 --> 00:16:37.269 A great example is staff. Right. If you are going 00:16:37.269 --> 00:16:39.450 to produce, you know, two million in production 00:16:39.450 --> 00:16:42.110 where you're going to need more staff staff than 00:16:42.110 --> 00:16:43.590 if you're producing one million of production. 00:16:44.610 --> 00:16:46.809 Another great example of direct costs would be 00:16:46.809 --> 00:16:49.250 dental supplies and lab bill. The more you produce, 00:16:49.269 --> 00:16:53.360 the higher in terms of dollars. that that line 00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:55.559 item is going to be on your profit and loss statement. 00:16:57.039 --> 00:16:59.360 Credit card processing fees is another example 00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:02.100 of direct costs. It's directly correlated to 00:17:02.100 --> 00:17:04.640 the top line. It's directly correlated to how 00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:07.819 much you produce and collect. And then once we 00:17:07.819 --> 00:17:10.920 get past the direct costs, we'll talk about fixed 00:17:10.920 --> 00:17:12.960 costs. What's a great example of fixed charges? 00:17:13.359 --> 00:17:16.779 One of the best examples is rent. Whether you 00:17:16.779 --> 00:17:20.529 produce $100 ,000 or $200 ,000, The rent is the 00:17:20.529 --> 00:17:22.269 rent is the rent unless you own your building. 00:17:22.369 --> 00:17:24.009 Then you can kind of manipulate that a little 00:17:24.009 --> 00:17:28.670 bit. What's another example of fixed cost advertising, 00:17:28.970 --> 00:17:31.809 right? When they come and meet with you guys 00:17:31.809 --> 00:17:35.509 and they sign a contract or a deal, no matter 00:17:35.509 --> 00:17:38.089 what they produced or collect that month, typically, 00:17:38.150 --> 00:17:41.130 you know, their advertising budget is what it 00:17:41.130 --> 00:17:45.849 is. And so that's how I go down. That's how I 00:17:45.849 --> 00:17:47.750 organize our meetings is we start with the top 00:17:47.750 --> 00:17:49.470 line and go all the way down until we get to 00:17:49.470 --> 00:17:52.109 their net profitability or otherwise known as 00:17:52.109 --> 00:17:54.869 their quote unquote EBITDA profit margins. And 00:17:54.869 --> 00:17:57.710 how are you deciding what to push through the 00:17:57.710 --> 00:18:01.130 office and what to leave personally? And I know 00:18:01.130 --> 00:18:02.730 that's different for every person, but just sort 00:18:02.730 --> 00:18:05.730 of broad strokes, right? Well, that depends on 00:18:05.730 --> 00:18:07.769 the client and how aggressive they want to be. 00:18:08.029 --> 00:18:11.750 You know what? Exactly. Everybody wants to be 00:18:11.750 --> 00:18:13.549 very aggressive until they see how much work 00:18:13.549 --> 00:18:17.359 it actually takes. Or they meet an IRS agent, 00:18:17.500 --> 00:18:19.759 and then all of a sudden they're nearly as aggressive. 00:18:20.220 --> 00:18:22.640 Yeah, the Augusta rule sounds great on paper 00:18:22.640 --> 00:18:25.779 until you really realize what is required to 00:18:25.779 --> 00:18:29.039 implement it at a practical level, and then you're 00:18:29.039 --> 00:18:31.019 like, oh, that doesn't sound fun anymore. Yeah, 00:18:31.019 --> 00:18:32.440 but you know what? I have clients who are willing 00:18:32.440 --> 00:18:33.940 to do it, and they're willing to document it, 00:18:33.960 --> 00:18:36.799 and they get away with it. And so it is totally 00:18:36.799 --> 00:18:38.700 dependent on the client. You're 100 % correct. 00:18:39.039 --> 00:18:41.779 But how do we determine? One thing that we do 00:18:41.779 --> 00:18:43.880 in our meetings is whenever I meet with my clients 00:18:43.880 --> 00:18:46.579 every year, they will give us a lifestyle spreadsheet. 00:18:47.559 --> 00:18:49.880 Because we want to know what are they spending 00:18:49.880 --> 00:18:53.000 just to project out cash flow. I don't really 00:18:53.000 --> 00:18:55.859 care so much about what the dollar amount they're 00:18:55.859 --> 00:18:58.759 spending as long as it works in their plan. As 00:18:58.759 --> 00:19:00.920 long as they can meet their goals, they could 00:19:00.920 --> 00:19:03.359 spend 5K a month, they can spend 25K a month. 00:19:03.700 --> 00:19:06.039 I genuinely don't care what they spend as long 00:19:06.039 --> 00:19:09.539 as they can reach their retirement goals. or 00:19:09.539 --> 00:19:12.839 their you know annual cash flow goals as long 00:19:12.839 --> 00:19:14.319 as they're covering that that doesn't really 00:19:14.319 --> 00:19:16.859 matter to me but one thing we'll do is we'll 00:19:16.859 --> 00:19:18.819 use that lifestyle spreadsheet that they fill 00:19:18.819 --> 00:19:21.599 out and we'll say okay just as an example cell 00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:24.299 phone bill can this be justified as a practice 00:19:24.299 --> 00:19:27.440 expense and we'll talk through it dining out 00:19:27.440 --> 00:19:30.200 if their spouse is on payroll hey can this be 00:19:30.200 --> 00:19:33.019 justified as a business expense whenever you 00:19:33.019 --> 00:19:36.819 go out with your spouse and you eat are you talking 00:19:36.819 --> 00:19:39.400 about the business Right. Can we justify this? 00:19:40.420 --> 00:19:43.519 Those are just two examples. But we'll go through 00:19:43.519 --> 00:19:45.859 the list and we'll say, OK, what what could be 00:19:45.859 --> 00:19:48.799 classified as a quote unquote business perk and 00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:52.160 what should be left in personal expenses? And 00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:55.000 typically I'll recommend clients be pretty aggressive 00:19:55.000 --> 00:19:57.519 with that because the worst thing that happens 00:19:57.519 --> 00:20:00.160 is their CPA looks at their books at year end 00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:02.819 and they say, hey, that's not actually a business 00:20:02.819 --> 00:20:05.359 deduction and they code it. they reclassify it 00:20:05.359 --> 00:20:07.460 to a distribution. And so I'll typically recommend 00:20:07.460 --> 00:20:10.299 them be pretty aggressive. If they think it's 00:20:10.299 --> 00:20:11.880 a business expense, then I would recommend them 00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:14.299 ride it off a hundred percent. And the beauty, 00:20:14.380 --> 00:20:15.980 I mean, we have the same, you know, Andre and 00:20:15.980 --> 00:20:18.720 I have the same thing. We deal, we like someone 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:21.619 who does other businesses like ours because they 00:20:21.619 --> 00:20:24.400 have an eye for like, Oh, look, your Porsche 00:20:24.400 --> 00:20:27.859 911 is in fact, not, I can't defend this. No, 00:20:28.099 --> 00:20:32.119 you know, your truck. Sure. You know? Yeah. And 00:20:32.119 --> 00:20:35.119 I've, I think that's to me, where we were talking 00:20:35.119 --> 00:20:37.500 on the pre -show about how dentists and businesses 00:20:37.500 --> 00:20:40.460 and private equity, I know that you can get your 00:20:40.460 --> 00:20:42.539 taxes done cheaper somewhere else. I know that 00:20:42.539 --> 00:20:44.900 there's, you know, I'm sure cheaper places, but 00:20:44.900 --> 00:20:49.140 the fact that you get to see other dentists and 00:20:49.140 --> 00:20:50.759 what they're coded, like that just has to have 00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:53.900 so much confidence. And this is an outlier, you 00:20:53.900 --> 00:20:57.099 know, to me that. That's always brought me confidence 00:20:57.099 --> 00:21:00.519 when I do talk about my taxes as an agency owner. 00:21:00.680 --> 00:21:02.859 And, you know, I'm obviously not this, but what 00:21:02.859 --> 00:21:04.779 do I see other agencies doing in travel? You 00:21:04.779 --> 00:21:06.660 know, how are they paying their kids? How are 00:21:06.660 --> 00:21:08.480 they doing their vehicles and how are they doing 00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:11.380 client visits? You know, all of those. Why is 00:21:11.380 --> 00:21:13.680 it I always visit my clients in Hawaii? I don't 00:21:13.680 --> 00:21:18.180 know. Yeah. It works out. They're needy. Yeah. 00:21:19.299 --> 00:21:21.539 Yeah. It's one of the biggest things when we 00:21:21.539 --> 00:21:23.720 first meet a client and they come in for their 00:21:23.720 --> 00:21:27.920 first meeting. That's always a huge topic is 00:21:27.920 --> 00:21:29.440 we look at what they're running through their 00:21:29.440 --> 00:21:32.859 practice and it's just not nearly enough. And 00:21:32.859 --> 00:21:35.140 that's not because we're trying to cheat the 00:21:35.140 --> 00:21:36.980 tax code. That's not that's not our goal ever. 00:21:37.119 --> 00:21:39.359 Our goal is to just make sure that anything that 00:21:39.359 --> 00:21:41.759 can be justified as a business expense should 00:21:41.759 --> 00:21:43.559 be written off through the corporation, through 00:21:43.559 --> 00:21:47.740 the business. And so that's one thing that we 00:21:47.740 --> 00:21:50.039 help clients with. And we usually spend a good 00:21:50.039 --> 00:21:51.819 amount of time on it, especially for our first 00:21:51.819 --> 00:21:53.579 meeting. Now, by the third or fourth meeting, 00:21:53.680 --> 00:21:55.380 they usually have that down for the most part. 00:21:56.000 --> 00:21:58.099 And we don't have to spend the same amount of, 00:21:58.200 --> 00:21:59.700 you know, we don't have to go through their lifestyle 00:21:59.700 --> 00:22:02.740 in detail. Yeah. Taylor, you should talk to Andre. 00:22:03.150 --> 00:22:05.789 Andre has a printout of all the things that he 00:22:05.789 --> 00:22:07.750 should be expensing regularly. And he's got to 00:22:07.750 --> 00:22:10.009 buy his monitor. So every time we buy something, 00:22:10.170 --> 00:22:13.710 he's like, can I do that? No. Exactly. I love 00:22:13.710 --> 00:22:17.309 that. Yeah. Now, let me ask you, you know, sort 00:22:17.309 --> 00:22:21.170 of a summary question here. So what are the three 00:22:21.170 --> 00:22:25.670 things or X number of things that that you find 00:22:25.670 --> 00:22:29.849 dentists or just you just wish they knew? You 00:22:29.849 --> 00:22:33.609 know, when they come and talk to me, I. I wish 00:22:33.609 --> 00:22:35.670 they had a better understanding of how X works. 00:22:35.730 --> 00:22:37.049 I wish they had a different set of questions. 00:22:37.230 --> 00:22:39.470 Someone come and talk to you. What's the dream 00:22:39.470 --> 00:22:42.690 first meeting you're having, Taylor? Well, I 00:22:42.690 --> 00:22:46.910 think three things that I wish more dentists 00:22:46.910 --> 00:22:49.670 knew, and you just hit on one of them. They're 00:22:49.670 --> 00:22:53.309 not writing off enough deductions. That is one 00:22:53.309 --> 00:22:56.849 of the things I would tell you. Another thing 00:22:56.849 --> 00:23:01.269 is managing staff and connecting with their staff 00:23:01.269 --> 00:23:05.539 members. I feel like a lot of dentists, I think 00:23:05.539 --> 00:23:08.180 when they first start their practice and they 00:23:08.180 --> 00:23:13.019 hire those first couple of employees, they meet 00:23:13.019 --> 00:23:15.140 their front desk person, they meet their first 00:23:15.140 --> 00:23:17.900 hygienist, they meet their first assistant. They're 00:23:17.900 --> 00:23:19.839 very close with that group because they're the 00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:21.940 first employees, just like any business owner 00:23:21.940 --> 00:23:24.660 would be. But then over time, I think they lose 00:23:24.660 --> 00:23:27.980 that connection. They lose that camaraderie with 00:23:27.980 --> 00:23:31.559 their staff. And so bringing that up during our 00:23:31.559 --> 00:23:35.339 meetings and how they manage people and how they 00:23:35.339 --> 00:23:38.019 connect with people, I think a lot of it, and 00:23:38.019 --> 00:23:39.619 this isn't just specific to dentists, I think 00:23:39.619 --> 00:23:41.700 a lot of business owners, they kind of miss that. 00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:44.759 And so when you meet with a third party that's 00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:46.480 advising you on your business, your practice, 00:23:46.680 --> 00:23:51.259 I think bringing that up is very important. And 00:23:51.259 --> 00:23:53.680 you'd be shocked at whenever you have a staff 00:23:53.680 --> 00:23:58.500 member or staff that feels feels like they matter, 00:23:58.619 --> 00:24:01.079 feels like what they do is important, and that 00:24:01.079 --> 00:24:04.279 they're actually being watched and appreciated, 00:24:04.519 --> 00:24:07.579 that's when you notice that production and efficiency 00:24:07.579 --> 00:24:12.180 comes up. So that's one thing that's big that 00:24:12.180 --> 00:24:13.920 a lot of people don't talk about. The second 00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:17.420 thing you hit on, writing off expenses and not 00:24:17.420 --> 00:24:19.539 paying more to the IRS. I mean, no one likes 00:24:19.539 --> 00:24:21.700 the IRS. I haven't met one person yet. I keep 00:24:21.700 --> 00:24:23.740 looking for them, but I haven't met one single. 00:24:24.559 --> 00:24:28.279 And that's not just business owners either. Let 00:24:28.279 --> 00:24:31.119 me know if you find that person. But then number 00:24:31.119 --> 00:24:35.519 three is I feel like they aren't as aware of 00:24:35.519 --> 00:24:39.420 how to save for retirement. A lot of business 00:24:39.420 --> 00:24:41.980 owners in general and a lot of dentists are not 00:24:41.980 --> 00:24:45.220 aware of how powerful a 401k plan can be. They're 00:24:45.220 --> 00:24:47.259 not aware of, if they're a little bit older and 00:24:47.259 --> 00:24:49.660 they've been practicing for a while, what a cash 00:24:49.660 --> 00:24:52.920 balance plan is. and how that can that can keep 00:24:52.920 --> 00:24:54.859 a lot of money away from the federal government 00:24:54.859 --> 00:24:58.920 and save them a lot of a lot of cash um that's 00:24:58.920 --> 00:25:02.059 so that's another thing um and so number one 00:25:02.059 --> 00:25:04.500 managing people number two keeping the government 00:25:04.500 --> 00:25:07.079 away from their money you know write -offs and 00:25:07.079 --> 00:25:09.799 then number three saving for retirement one thing 00:25:09.799 --> 00:25:11.720 we spend a lot of time on in our first meetings 00:25:11.720 --> 00:25:14.980 is the three buckets the taxable bucket the tax 00:25:14.980 --> 00:25:17.940 deferred bucket and the tax -free bucket so an 00:25:17.940 --> 00:25:20.019 example of a taxable bucket would be a brokerage 00:25:20.019 --> 00:25:24.059 account or a bank account right if you earn interest 00:25:24.059 --> 00:25:27.240 or capital gains in that bucket you pay taxes 00:25:27.240 --> 00:25:30.380 on it a tax deferred an example of a tax deferred 00:25:30.380 --> 00:25:32.700 account in the second bucket would be a 401k 00:25:32.700 --> 00:25:36.099 plan or a cash balance plan when you defer money 00:25:36.099 --> 00:25:38.599 into that type of plan you are keeping it away 00:25:38.599 --> 00:25:41.460 from the government and so you are deferring 00:25:41.460 --> 00:25:43.180 taxes that's why it's called the tax deferred 00:25:43.180 --> 00:25:45.799 bucket and then the third type is a tax -free 00:25:45.799 --> 00:25:47.759 bucket so the best example of that is a roth 00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:51.880 ira Or even a Roth 401k. Whenever you contribute 00:25:51.880 --> 00:25:54.140 to that, you aren't deferring it in the year. 00:25:54.220 --> 00:25:57.059 You contribute from taxes. However, just like 00:25:57.059 --> 00:26:00.579 a 401k plan, it grows tax -free. So all the interest, 00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:04.119 dividends, capital gains within that bucket are 00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:07.599 kept away from the government. And so we talk 00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:11.299 about how important all three of those are at 00:26:11.299 --> 00:26:13.470 retirement. and how they all are interconnected 00:26:13.470 --> 00:26:16.910 and how we can use all of them as tools to efficiently 00:26:16.910 --> 00:26:21.289 pull your assets out and use during your retirement 00:26:21.289 --> 00:26:26.289 phase. So, yeah. Now, I'm going to test my financial 00:26:26.289 --> 00:26:30.250 acumen. Okay, I'm ready. Is it a true statement 00:26:30.250 --> 00:26:35.069 that an HSA maxed out, not used, is one of the 00:26:35.069 --> 00:26:38.529 best investments you can make in 2025? It absolutely 00:26:38.529 --> 00:26:41.589 is. You're correct. Look at me go. Proud, yes. 00:26:42.600 --> 00:26:44.400 And I saw you light up right there. You were 00:26:44.400 --> 00:26:47.039 proud. I was proud. I knew I knew it was going 00:26:47.039 --> 00:26:50.160 to be. Yes, it's the only it's the only type 00:26:50.160 --> 00:26:53.140 of account where when you contribute to it. And 00:26:53.140 --> 00:26:55.400 by the way, to be eligible, it has to be a high 00:26:55.400 --> 00:26:57.779 deductible health care plan. Your health care 00:26:57.779 --> 00:27:00.220 plan is not a high deductible plan. You are not 00:27:00.220 --> 00:27:03.819 allowed to contribute to an HSA. But it's the 00:27:03.819 --> 00:27:06.079 only type of account where whenever you contribute 00:27:06.079 --> 00:27:09.079 to it, it is deferred from taxes, just like a 00:27:09.079 --> 00:27:14.059 401k. It grows tax free, just like a 401k and 00:27:14.059 --> 00:27:16.759 a Roth IRA. And then when it's pulled out, as 00:27:16.759 --> 00:27:20.839 long as it is for health care costs, it is pulled 00:27:20.839 --> 00:27:23.579 out tax free. It is the only triple tax advantage 00:27:23.579 --> 00:27:27.619 type of account that we have like that. And so 00:27:27.619 --> 00:27:29.980 you're right. It's a great account and it's a 00:27:29.980 --> 00:27:32.279 great tool to use in saving for retirement. Now, 00:27:32.420 --> 00:27:34.680 one thing that's important about that is you 00:27:34.680 --> 00:27:36.880 have to document your expenses and you can do 00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:40.470 that for a long period of time. scan your receipts 00:27:40.470 --> 00:27:43.289 in, save them into a folder, and then down the 00:27:43.289 --> 00:27:45.849 road, you can pull those expenses out tax -free. 00:27:46.529 --> 00:27:49.670 And so that's one important thing to note is 00:27:49.670 --> 00:27:52.450 you have to keep track of your healthcare expenses. 00:27:52.910 --> 00:27:55.230 Well, man, Taylor, thank you so much for jumping 00:27:55.230 --> 00:27:57.910 on the show. I'll link Serity Partners and your 00:27:57.910 --> 00:28:00.309 bio out there in the show notes and certainly 00:28:00.309 --> 00:28:04.009 give Taylor a call. I mean, it's been from tariffs 00:28:04.009 --> 00:28:09.410 to taxes. Taylor does it all. Yeah. I don't tariff. 00:28:09.470 --> 00:28:12.990 I promise I don't. Do not confuse me with that. 00:28:13.630 --> 00:28:16.589 But I will help you work around tariffs. Work 00:28:16.589 --> 00:28:19.009 around tariffs. Yeah. I mean, we can work out 00:28:19.009 --> 00:28:22.089 a jingle like Taylor does tariffs and taxes. 00:28:22.230 --> 00:28:24.230 I mean, we can work something. We can workshop 00:28:24.230 --> 00:28:27.670 some ideas, Taylor. You know what? I would love 00:28:27.670 --> 00:28:30.289 to have a happy hour when we come up with that. 00:28:30.309 --> 00:28:32.150 That would be fascinating. Yeah, a little jingle 00:28:32.150 --> 00:28:35.589 goes along. Taylor, tariffs and taxes. Yeah. 00:28:35.990 --> 00:28:38.289 Well, Eric, I appreciate you for inviting me. 00:28:38.849 --> 00:28:41.170 Yeah, of course. And it was a pleasure. And I 00:28:41.170 --> 00:28:42.869 always love connecting with you and your team. 00:28:43.230 --> 00:28:46.009 You guys do a great job and have helped many 00:28:46.009 --> 00:28:47.789 of my clients. And so I really appreciate that. 00:28:47.849 --> 00:28:50.289 Thank you again. Absolutely. You bet. Anytime. 00:28:50.450 --> 00:28:51.049 Appreciate it, Eric.