Welcome to Living in the Matrix. I'm Jonathan and I'm left of center.
And I'm Rich and I tend to lean a little bit more to the right, but the bottom line is,
is together we try to look for the balance of what it means to be human in today's world.
And so when you ask me what's on my heart, I think it's trying to explain, well,
number one for me personally is like, I got to really pump the brakes and realize
where I start people is probably way too advanced in their world of what healthy life balance is
and mindful is. And I don't mean that like I'm better in there, not or I'm smarter and they're
not just. No, but Sean, you've been studying it for decades. 25 years. And if you can,
my own weight loss journey started, you know, 15 years old. And so I mean, I've been here heavy,
oh man, I was, remember that story, the nurse looks at me and goes, Sean, you realize you're
five foot three and weigh nearly 200 pounds. Oh, shit. I didn't realize you got that thing.
I didn't know that. No, no, I didn't know that. I didn't know that when every girl
laughs when I ask them out. And you know, I didn't know that I can't, I fit in Huskies. I really
didn't know. Thanks for informing me of that. But yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. Sorry. I was just
going to say so, I mean, not that that was motivating, you know, what's really was motivating was,
you know, girls was motivating. And if I'm to be real honest, and so I just, you know, I decided
to drop weight and start working out and I lost 60 pounds in six months between my sophomore and
junior year in high school. And so, and I was like a different person next year. I mean, literally,
people didn't know I was the same person, which is so ridiculous. Because now all the people,
you know, that is the perfect place for us to get started. Welcome everybody to living in the
Matrix. I'm Jonathan, my co-host Rich is not here today. But we have back one of my very best
friends, Sean, who is a chiropractor, lives up in El Dorado Hills in Northern California.
And we have known each other for probably 20 years now. Welcome, Sean. It's so good to have you back.
Welcome. Great to be back. Great to chat as we are already kind of fired up here.
I know. So I want to just kick right off because you were bringing it. You lost 60 pounds in how long?
Six months. Six months. Okay. Six months. I want to talk about this because that's a unique situation
because it's not just like people think losing weight is about losing the weight. Like I lose
the weight and I'm exactly the same person. I'm just 30 pounds lighter. It's not that. Right. It's
it's how I want to ask you and to walk through this, how did that affect you spiritually,
physically, mentally and socially? Let's talk about those four. I don't want to get your
perspective on how did that affect you? Well, I guess I would start by saying first, let me tell
you that I never knew I was chubby, heavy, or there was any problem until I was nine years old.
And I remember my dad, who I met when I was nine years old. And I don't mean this to sound horrible,
but it is kind of messed up like, Hey, son, nice to meet you. By the way, you might want to go easy
on the cookies. And that was, I mean, it wasn't, I mean, there was a little thing. Well, not the
first thing, but you know, at nine, you're like, but here's the interesting thing that I want to
interject. Nine is when around the age when we start getting our prefrontal cortex. And so I'm
curious how much of that was there. You just didn't notice it. And once you notice, you go, Oh,
this doesn't feel good. Yeah, it was really weird. I, my first response was like to kind of reject
it like, what are you talking about? You know, I'm nine. And, but it was a funny age. And I just
kind of, you know, you package it up, I put it in the back of my head like, okay. And then, you know,
three, four years later, now I'm five foot three, 200 pounds. So apparently he didn't know what he
was talking about. It was that obvious. I was kind of last to know what gave you the weight.
Did you eat a lot? Were you doing sugar? Total emotional eater? Well, you know,
okay, so emotional eating. Unfortunately, it isn't just a one thing. It's hard because I also grew
up, you know, government assistance, welfare. I mean, it's all carbohydrates. It's wick. It's,
it's just this is the food pyramid eat tons of this stuff. So I was a cereal carbs are the cheapest
thing you can give people. Yeah, you know, at least in America, I mean, they've become the cheapest thing.
They really shouldn't be, you know, wild grazing animals are pretty cheap. But when you make a
massive like, you know, corn industry and wheat industry. So yeah, I was just, but I was an emotional
eater. It was interesting because at nine years old, that's also it is funny that I never thought
about it connected. Nine years old when I realized maybe I was starting to get chubby. And also,
Oh, really? Yeah, well, that comment from, you know, my father, I mean, it didn't go unnoticed.
And I didn't, I don't remember so much any emotion attached to it. I just know that's my first memory
of somebody saying, Hey, you know, yeah, and obviously, maybe I was overeating and I was unaware
of myself, but either way, but that's also the same summer where emotionally might have been one of
the hardest of my life because I got sent to go see a stranger called my father. And also, that's
when I also was introduced to pornography that summer. So if you want to talk about melding
sugar hormones, visual images that can't be undone and that mess. So fast forward, which is funny,
because you know, as joking around saying, you know, I lost weight for girls, well, it kind of
really was that was my motivation. Something in me was like, Look, this isn't going to happen unless I
get the weight off. I didn't really care about it. I was always strong and whatever. I mean, I
don't need to be stopped. I don't care about anything. Just I want girls to like, and so, you know,
your motivation was to meet girls. Yeah, or girl, it wasn't even a meet girls. It was just the
attention, the affection of others. And what better, I mean, you know, you're a man, what
feels better than the attention of a female, especially a cute, popular, fun, young female,
right? So as a teenage boy, I'm like, I'm not dummy. I'm like, all right, but what's funny is,
I don't want to take too much credit that I was so disciplined either. I mean, my pride got me in
trouble, but it also helped me start losing weight. My mom moved us to this area and I was pretty
pissed off. I went from Santa Rosa to a place called Katadi, and I had to change schools. And we lived
way far out from the high school, like a little over three miles. And, you know, we had a car that
worked half the time and my mom's working two or three jobs, she's like, yeah, take the bus. I'm
like, okay, I'm the chubby kid. I'm already in the project poor neighborhood here. I am not getting
on that bus. So everybody knows those things. So I'm like, I'm walking my ass to school. And
that's what I did. And what's funny is a little over three miles each way. Oh, wow. Yeah, so I mean,
I'm walking six miles a day. And I'll tell you what, when you walk six miles a day, you start
losing weight, right? And once I noticed I was starting to lose weight, I mean, I noticed it
because my clothes were getting looser. Then it caught fire, like I'm on to something here. And
then I kind of took it and ran with it. But I don't know, barring that prideful moment of my life,
if anything really would have changed, that was, it was almost like it indirectly started happening.
And then I observed it. And but once I got started, man, I mean, here I am all these years later,
I'm probably still at the same thing, trying to be fit and strong. And it, I don't think it's bad.
It's your good shape. I'm getting there. I'm trying to be like Benjamin Button, man. I'm trying to be,
you know, leaner and leaner. I'm actually questioning that of how much does my thought of my age that
I think I am actually affect my aging process? Well, that's where we're going with all this,
is the mind. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because that's really, I mean, did people notice more? Yeah. Well,
did people notice me more because I felt better about myself? Or did they notice me more because
I just lost weight? What is it? Well, you can't ever appreciate life more when you're grateful.
The answer is absolutely. And I think it's the perfect test is anybody can be happy.
You just have to be grateful for what you have in this moment that right here right now. And
when you do it completely changes your entire trajectory. Okay. So we covered the first one.
What's the second one? I forgot. What was socially, socially, spiritually, physically, and mentally?
Yeah. Yeah. Socially, did it improve yourself? What's that? Socially, did it improve your
situation? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like that worked. You know, my, my, I guess, dating life started
my junior year. You know, I hadn't, my friends didn't change. I had great friends and they were the
kind of friends who, you know, love me right or die, right? Like even if I, and here's the irony
of it all is, you know, during that weight loss, I lost all that weight. I'm about to play football.
And I mean, my whole life can be almost comical to some degree. You know, the whole Domino's Pizza
30 minutes or less thing. Well, I'm part of why that doesn't exist anymore. Because I got slammed
in a crosswalk going to school on my bike. And I wasn't walking anymore. I was going to football
practice and I'm in a crosswalk and 30 minutes or less trying to make a right on red without stopping
and just never looked and blasted me. And so my face hits the ground. I find the intersection.
My teeth are all broken. My lips all ripped apart. I'm bleeding everywhere. And so then, you know,
I finally attain this like I'm this handsome fit young man and I get my teeth knocked out.
And so that, you know, so emotionally and spiritually, it's almost like I kept doubling down.
Okay, well, now I got to prove, you know, so now I'm all goofed up here. So now I got to get really
witty and really, you know, whatever, get get make people, you know, I got to keep that attention,
right? I got to keep that affection. And so that built that. So there was nothing spiritually
going on for quite a while. It was getting kind of worse, if anything. You know, I just went from
being not a lot of options to now too many options. And but I pushed further into the kind of fitness
thing and and my friends and really was always kind of living on the edge of I think that's where
the dopamine in the brain, the reward addiction started coming from. And it was strong. It was
like I would do, you know, whether it's working out or eating or not eating or dating or not dating,
whatever I was going to be like, like super pure, strict, you know, like the intense, everything
was intense. And I look back now, I'm like, Oh, I have that addictive personality and all those
things were just triggering dopamine. So but mentally, I was sharp, you know, when you're,
you know, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, you know, the mental abilities are sharp and the neurotransmitters,
I hadn't burned my body out yet. So I was really, yeah, a lot of it still had a lot of energy. And
I think that's, but it's an interesting thing about the idea of because you see people not just for
back, you see people for weight and health as a chiropractor. What a lot, how often do you talk about
seeing weight loss is something bigger than just losing weight? Is it usually more? Well,
I already know just about everybody that comes in wants to lose weight too. So it doesn't even
need to be a, it's a byproduct of everything. Yeah, yeah, because nobody's really happy with
their body much anymore. Men, women, I mean, and it's, and even finally, when I get men,
aren't healthy weights, now they want to gain weight, you know, I have men almost 70 years
older, like how do I build muscle? And they're like, you know, they're basically dirty bulking.
I'm like, what are you doing? Like, which you mean just eating a ridiculous amount of calories?
I'm like, you're reading that those steroid editorials, aren't you for people? I mean,
editorials by people on steroids, not normal people like us. I'm like, could do in that.
You can't force your body and manipulate it to make these great changes, small changes over time,
for sure. And if you're in a deficit, you can get back to kind of a homeostasis really quickly.
But if you're already in your homeostasis, you're not put on 20 pounds of muscle in a year. You're
not, you know what I mean? There's always a cost to doing something like that. And so,
but yeah, most patients, if I'm to be honest, I think it's people come in and I'm not even joking.
They don't know why they're there a lot of times. They're just like so and so said, I needed to see
you. Or I've been to this person, that person, that person and what they're hearing doesn't sit
right with them. And I think they're looking for hope, but they're also looking for somebody that's
not going to sell them and take advantage of them, give them hope, but also give them results too.
And but, but yeah, weight loss seems to be always linked into that identity and that
just displeasure with their body. And I know that displeasure, people just, I think people just hate
the way they look. And they hate the way they feel. And most people, no matter how good their life is,
we can tell them, hey, be grateful. It's a great life. And they go, yeah, yeah, I know. But if
they're to be honest, they just, they don't like their lives. And so I get a lot of people who seem
to really be struggling with like loving themselves or liking their lives. Yeah. Do you feel kind of
like as a doctor, sort of at the front lines of that, is that increasing? Are people becoming
more conscious or is, is just same as it has always been people just always been unhappy?
What do you think? Well, I mean, my circle, like, so my mom was total hippie. So like this
looking for something deeper and more meaningful and being well and being fit is, I mean, in my world,
I haven't seen that change much, you know, my people. But in terms of patience, absolutely.
When I started in practice about 20, I don't know, 2001, say two, 2001, 2002, the big thing was
carpal tunnel syndrome and fibromyalgia. I mean, it's like, Oh my gosh, who doesn't have that?
And that was such a physical thing. And then people started kind of getting more, I think things
like Dr. John Sarno's work about mind body pain started hitting and Eckert totally is the power
of now. And he started talking about pain body. And I think people started realizing maybe this
pain, well, there's all these fields now it's placebo work and understanding how much placebo.
But there was a lot of mechanical stuff back then. And like people go to a chiropractor because
I'm out. And you have to put me back in. And this model was so like, we were so like, bought
into that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, rack and crack, you know, line them up and just boom, they would call
it the flying seven, it's like the neck on the left, the neck on the right, three times in the
mid back, the low back one way, the low back, the other way, three, four, five, yeah, the flying
seven. And I realized there's nothing wrong with mobilization. That's great. But like, okay, I
like, okay, I just did it. What, how many times are we gonna do that? And then we start going, no,
you just have to believe more and the power that made the body heal the body. And if I just adjust
there, then all your symptoms go away, magic. And I'm like, okay, now we're getting into what,
when that does happen, when you adjust somebody and something miraculous happened, I personally
believe that's more to do with your faith in me, my faith in what we're doing, a physical touch,
appropriate touch, and somebody just caring for you. Do I really think it's the few millimeters
that joint segment moved and made some pressure and you heard a pop that did that? No, I mean,
it has something to do with it. Do you think the sound of the crack gives people a sense of reassurance
that something good is happening? Well, because it was out. And now it's back in. And here's what's
comedy about, which is all nonsense. Like, look, oh, it's not in. Look, oh my gosh, I have a 90 degree
problem in this joint. If it was just, oh, it restored. And if I just got a pop, then I'd be,
like it's so silly, like I used to take x-rays of people. And if I had somebody not standing,
right, it looked like they have a curvature and I can create this whole paradigm and philosophy
and treatment plan based on this. And it's really like, well, did you have, did you even check to
see if they were in the same socks? Because some people have a thick sock on and a thin sock,
and it makes it too, like we could get into all the silliness. And then we would double down. No,
no, no, no. Now you got to clamp the head and take extra. It's like, here's the reality. Like,
the reality is people are very influenced by buy-in, right? They're paradigm. You connect with
somebody's paradigm and you think you're out. And I reinforce, yes, your neck's out. And then I put
it back in, you're fixed. But to me, that is a huge part of how placebo works. I'm not saying it's
fake. I'm not saying it's not good. I'm just saying, you know, we explain this stuff in ways
that are good for business. Power of influence. Yeah, really. Yeah, absolutely. Like, even down to
like the, like I was just watching the rubber hand experiment. You ever see the rubber hand
experiment? No. They tell somebody, look, they put a rubber hand and they say, hey, we're going to
trip the brain and they block it so you don't see your real hand. So there's a rubber hand there.
It looks like yours. And your hand over here, but it's covered up. And they start, they put one
side and you start to feel pain in the rubber hand, basically. And then they catch you off guard.
They put a hammer in and they hit your rubber hand and you scream. It's like, well, nothing happened.
That's not you. But like, you know, or the middle room experience, right? When you got the first
of the middle room experience, you got the person on the other side, crank them up and you feel like
you're shocking death and you keep doing it because an authority tells you to. Like these things are
real. These things are triggers in our brain. And I think, unfortunately, in the healing arts,
especially, I mean, in business too, we're just, we're kind of manipulating people sometimes
intentionally. Sometimes it's not, you go to school, you learn something, it's not even right,
but you think it's right. So you speak that to people and it works, which is what kind of placebo
is, right? And so I don't know how we got talking about that. You had asked about are people coming
in more open to mindfulness and health body balance. Yeah, they are. It's a journey of yours,
you're in chiropractic, which you do the back. But as you said, people come in with intentions of
almost always wanting to lose weight. And it's at the end of the day, they're walking in wanting
a mindset. They want a way of thinking that's going to produce life. Like you said, people are
unhappy. Do you think that number is growing? Like people are becoming more aware of it and
there's more or it's just always been really bad? No, I think it's getting worse because I think
there's way more information dump on us daily. And it's pretty much all negative. I mean, once in a
while, like I tried to if I'm going to get on Instagram, I am trying to follow as many funny
cat videos as I can. I want to see cats smacking each other. I want to see, you know, Dallas Cowboys
and 49ers with different cat faces on, you know, going at it. I want to see silliness. But the
reality is inevitably, what am I going to see in my feet? No matter what, what am I going to see
today? I'm going to see red versus blue. I'm going to see what a racist Trump is and what an
invalid Biden is. I'm going to see it's nonstop. I'm going to see the border. And I'm going to,
and it's, you know, and as you know about the algorithm, it's to get me, it's to pick the scabs
that I already have. And Facebook is being sued. Facebook is being sued right now in 41 states for
its influence on children. Did you know that? It's like a week old. It's crazy. I think it's
awesome. I think it's wild. I think it's, I mean, it's by the time that gets all sorted out, AI is
going to be so far out of like, we're in trouble, right? Like, because the information, I mean,
my son showed me something hilarious the other day, like Joe Rogan and David Goggins and Goggins
is talking about something and then Rogan's all, wait a minute, you're AI, you're not even you.
And then he reveals he's not him. And then there's Rogan watching this going, that is me, but I never
said that. And it's just, oh, you just got to laugh, but it's scary. But right. Like, so the
psychological influence on people, people come in and tell me things. They saw on Facebook and I
know what they're talking about. And I know it's just completely nonsense. And it's a really delicate
thing to say, Hey, just so you know, you might want to fact check things before you tell people.
And I got a good friend of mine, Paul, who fact checks me all the time. I got to be careful because
reposting things is like, you know, Sean, I fact check that and that's not legit. And I'm like,
Oh my gosh, you're right. I just assumed because of the source and but yeah, our influence. So you
ask, all right, why are people like this? So that extreme negativity from information dump every day,
every moment, right? And then there's, we've converted all our incandescent lighting, right,
which is closer to fire, I would imagine the wavelength of red lights like 635 nanometers.
So when we look at a rainbow, right, we got violet on the bottom. And we got red on the top.
Any stronger than violet down here is ultraviolet. That could hurt us. Any slower than red up here
is infrared can't see it. And that could hurt us too, can be healthy. Both of these things,
you know, they're just light. But what's happening is we're picking this one piece out now, which is
the 400 and something spectrum, which is what fluorescent and LED. And we're we're beaming
that that's why I'm wearing a hat right now. I got this LED light up here. It stresses me out.
I'm not trying to be a crazy person. The minute I get inside with these LED lights,
something in me just gets a little more agitated. And it's interesting if I block it from coming
right into my my eyes, my retinal pathways by the rays hitting now they're refracting, but they're
not pumping into my eyes. I just think it's a healthier thing. But like, you know, this is a
real thing. This isn't who I mean, I, I do some work with one of the city engineers in Long Beach,
and one of his huge projects was converting everything over to LED light. And the amount of
reports he had to write because it is not it is light pollution. You're changing things and it is
more polluting. And, and, you know, I follow one doctor who you had on Dr. Cruz, right? He talks about
this is his world, this light thing. What about the basically, when you after the sun sets, when
you take that, that spectrum of light that's in our daytime, and you pump it into our eyes after
the sun sets or bring it to a confused, it's like, Hey, it's noon, it's noon. And then, you know,
we try to go to sleep. And what does everybody have sleep apnea, insomnia, I mean, the sleep.
But it's good for productivity when you want to extract every ounce of power out of people.
24 seven. It's cheap. It's cheap energy too. It's, yeah, that's the thing. I think we are
reaching a point culturally in the world where we're kind of saying how much can be extracted
out of people before they just give up or fight back because the the medal is going to jump and
it has two main ones, fight or flight. It does have fun and freeze, but it's fighter,
flight are the core ones. And that's what's building is I was talking to rich about today is
what we were talking about, what is the black swan of change. So anytime like 9 11 was a black
swan came out of nowhere, but had massive shifts. And if we are moving towards a something,
what is going to be that black swan? And I think it's one interesting possibility,
one of possible possibilities is the idea that Gen Z basically says, think about Gen Z
entirely wired into the influencing market. If you got 300 million person influencers and said,
Gen Z tomorrow, we don't go to work for a month, you change policy pretty quick when you do that.
Everything grinds to a halt, you know, and that's the kind of black swan that could erupt
that could shift things because I think I think what me too taught us is that we can change quickly.
What the good side of Instagram is reels educate you very quickly. It creates a thread,
it creates a neural pathway. If you're watching it 30 days in a row, you've created that habit in
you by watching Instagram. That's the power of it. Yeah, to your point, there's a dangerous side
to all that too, which is, and I have this feeling that I honestly think this gets into what our
original talk was like, or like, let's just use weight loss because this is something that I feel
like everybody, what I love about like being overweight, just being fat, being obese, whatever
you want to call it. Listen, I have more body fat than I need. Okay, nobody would call me fat,
but it's not the body I want at this point in my life. Right? I have residual adipose tissue,
adiposity. It's fat. I'm not fat as a human, but I have, you get what I'm saying, but here's the
thing, what I tried to do, and I did this 60 pounds in six months, I've also lost 30 pounds in 21
days before, and I've lost 30 pounds in three and a half years. Those are my three major,
and in between those, I had gotten heavy through lifestyle. But what's really funny is I just
documented, okay, one was 15 or 13 years to be 60 pounds overweight. Another one was, you know,
my college years to the time I gained 30 pounds again, that was probably 10 years.
And then my other one was another 10 years. And I wanted them done even quicker than 21 days,
right? Like, that's, that's a funny thing. So take, we have so much power and momentum here,
and it takes so long to get there. And then our expectation or our expectation, I guess, of what
it takes and how long it should take to change things. But we're doing that too. Like, so the,
the Me Too movement was a great example, right? And I'm not well versed in this. So I'm just using
this as a general example, please, you know, disclaimer on this one. But we had a lot of years
that led to what was happening in the workplace that was inappropriate, right? Oh, God, a lot of
years. And actually, millennials. And then how quick did we really, like you said, look at how
quick we changed that, how quick was that change just being generally speaking, you couldn't have
made Barbie pre Me Too, you couldn't have, it would not have made the thing that it is today,
because part of what Barbie did is it said, Hey, women do have the power now, and we're going to
use it in a good way. That was the power of it. So I, and it's sorry, I derailed there for a second,
because I think that was a teaching moment that men could change. Yeah. But how long do you think
it took to for where it was to like where we are now? Like how long was that process from the time
it like this is a like a public perception when you heard that, and you're like, we're not going
to tolerate this anymore till where we are now where it's like clearly not tolerated anymore in most
workplaces that I do business with. Like how long was that? I don't think it's completely
eliminated by any stretch, but it's considered culturally. It's the shape of the culture. And
I think that's the power of media and social to shape a culture very quickly. Me Too is considered
about a year and a half to two years of hardcore activities from Harvey Weinstein to all the
Bob I all the guys that were in that group, right? Shape culture enough to say, okay, enough guys,
enough. That was the impression. It wasn't like we're going to turn a blind eye. It was everybody
is saying enough. I feel like maybe the BLM kind of thing too, right? What's that? The Black Lives
Matter. Yes. That had a very similar in my public perception of watching it. It's like that. Here
lies some of the problem. That's just our nature. And I feel like our nature is like, and it's great
because you have convicted people with a lot of consciousness and there's activism. And it's great.
We need people to do that. But sometimes the problem is we try to change things so fast that we
create more problems. And I'm not saying those problems are worse by any means, but they can be.
But now we do that with our health too. And just knowing that it's kind of human nature and cultural
nature, like people get canceled fast, but we want to cancel health issues fast too. And it doesn't,
nothing works this way. There's just like a, there's kind of like a, I love like if we're to use
ancient tests, let's just use like the Old Testament, right? The Torah. Is that the first five books?
Yes. The Jewish Bible. Yeah. So that is just nothing but like, and then they forgot about the Lord.
And then what would happen? Come in, get taken over, get, you know, you're now our slaves hundreds of years.
And so obviously to get to that point wasn't a moment, but it was like, it seemed to follow like
historically, it kind of seemed to follow a more like, you know, natural curve. It didn't go like this
for millennia and then just go boom over. Then somebody remembered and then they started taking
good, healthy actions and then favor came in. Like I feel like our body's like that. You can't just
mistreat your body. And you know, I have this little thing that cracks me up when I'm talking.
We can't do this, right? You know, here, what is this? I don't, I can't hear it. I want to hear it.
I can't see it. I don't want to see it. I mean, obviously metaphorically could be either. And
I'm not going to say anything. And then all of a sudden one day you wake up and go, it's time to do
something and you just go like, you know, gangbusters. I'm like, I love that. But in my experience,
that creates so many like mental illnesses and disorders because you're like, your brain's like,
wait, we constructed a whole life around this and this and this and you're changing the paradigm on
me. And it's hard for people to adjust to that's why they get really good short term success on
health programs. Okay, I tell people we're going to do this. And then the first two weeks, I mean,
nothing goes wrong. They're feeling great. And then, but they don't sustain it. Why? Because it was too
fast. And I'm starting to realize, as much as I can give you all the information, Jonathan, to
like, let's say you want to get more muscle, you want to lose fat, you want to get your testosterone
higher, you want blah, blah, blah, you have all these things, right? I could give you all the right
answers, you know about the right answers. But it's like, am I going to do damage to you if I give
you too many right answers, too quick, independent of relationship, independent of time to heal?
And I think that's what we do with about everything. We just hit it too hard, too aggressive, and
there's no staying power. And so how do I help you, right? How do I help affect change? So I'm
not just keeping that burden on people and then watching them fail. Okay, you walked into my
question. What are people looking for from you or for you to do when they walk in? Are they saying,
fix me? Or are they saying, help me fix myself? Now it's give me hope. Yeah. But base that hope
in the right information and the right empowerment so I could heal myself over time. Now, so it's
hope. I need your help now, but I don't want your help in three, six, nine, 12 months, 24 months.
I don't want to be, not that they don't want it. I don't want to be dependent. See that dependent
piece is where I think like in my profession, now a lot of that's just what we are public perception,
right? We're spine people, but that's really not what chiropractic was founded on. And in fact,
if you look at what chiropractic was founded on, it's completely bananas. It was a magnetic healer
who was way whack and he adjusted a guy for hearing loss and it was never really about back pain.
That came way later. But you know, I think a lot of chiropractors said, look, we can make a good
living and insurance will pay for it if we take on this back pain model. Well, I wanted to be an
osteopath from like the turn of the century, like 19, it was basically like a medical doctor and a
chiropractor, even though that wasn't really, the medical world calls a chiropractor. Yeah. Yeah.
An osteopath was basically, it was basically a doctor that did manipulation, but there weren't
a lot of drugs back then. So you still had, you know, plant medicines and herbs and you had
relational and I came to your house and I don't know when that all changed. But by the time I
looked into being an osteopath, I realized, oh, they're just the kind of MDs now. And so it was
only that. That's probably when the insurance companies took over and dovetailed everybody
into, okay, we need this fixed plan so we can make profit. We need to fix costs. And to do that,
you can have a lot of variables. Right. Right. Get a control. And here we are now. Okay.
When I never knew that about chiropractic world, did start with an understanding of the body as a
frequency? Yeah, because he was a magnetic energy healer, BJ Palmer. And then there was DD and I
mean, I pretty think the sun, I get the story goofed up, but one of them tried to kill the other.
He like ran into it, drove his car into him and Joe Rogan cracks me up. I love Joe, but he
hates us, but he clearly doesn't understand what I'm talking about. Because what he's talking about
is kind of like, it's not untrue. But then there's a whole nother side to explaining things and
endocrinology and neurology and encyclopedia. You should write him and tell him I would like
to correct your, I would love to come on your show and tell you why there's another way of looking.
I think you would, he would be so perfect. You would be perfect. It would be a funny conversation
because I'm okay with him just laying in because I mean, it's, I'm listening to him a couple years
ago going, Oh my gosh, he hates me. He doesn't even know me. He'd love me if he met me, but I get
where that comes from. And then, you know, it's an echo chamber all that. But so, but what's funny
is it's really one of the only kind of accredited authority figure doctors, what I do that allows
me to be independent of the medical paradigm, the AMA and yet still be kind of considered
legitimate. And that's, so that's why I kind of went this route. It's like, I don't get the prestige
of the AMA and the medical doctor and the surgeon. I want to be a surgeon. Are you with our hippocard
oath? We have our own oath and our own board and our own, I mean, it's very legitimate. I mean,
the reality is I don't think my medical schooling, I took the same classes where they
as hard and grinding as medical school would have been, maybe not, but I would have done fine in that
too because I'm a hustler and I could take in information, but it was more just the idea of,
look, I do, I do understand. So when people come in, like who's going to one, okay, so you could go
to a counselor and get hope, right? And you could go to a counselor and get some great techniques.
But are they going to talk to you about your endocrine system about plant based natural
bio-identical hormones, about detoxification, about four hundred. Because they need to send you a pill.
Right. So they're going to do talk therapy or they're going to do certain techniques,
but at some point here's the problem. The patient's expectation is way faster than that's going to
work most of the time. So you go, okay, well, what if you took good talk therapy, which you know,
well, you don't have to be licensed to be a good coach and mentor to somebody or just help somebody
out, right? It helps to attract and run your business, but you've done that a million times over
in your life just with friends and counseling people. And, you know, without being a marriage and
family licensed counselor, I'm not saying to do that. And that's a great idea. But you know what
I'm saying, right? That used to just be called being a friend or a mentor or something, right?
Or perhaps, yeah, now it's like, you know, but so what I'm trying to do for people is here that
they want hope here that they need tools to make their symptoms go away. That's all they care about
in the beginning, make my pain go away, whether it's physical pain, emotional pain, or pain when
they look in the mirror. It's pain though. That's why people come. Or else, why would you ever seek
out a doctor? Why would you change anything if you don't have those? But how we do it is so
important because you have to do it from so many just different angles now that it's crazy. It's
it's just, it's almost overwhelming, Jonathan. But what I am learning, and we were going to talk
about the carnivore diet, right? I learned something from that. And it's more about what I
learned than the actual diet itself. It's almost like, you know, why could you just so our audience
knows you are a carnivore, essentially, I've been since April of 23. I've been a full carnivore with
the exception. What is that mean for you? So I just went, well, just to sum it up real quickly,
I went from being like more of a zone diet person back in the early 2000s. That was like the 40,
30, 30, it's called the zone. To more of an addkins to more of a ketogenic diet,
meaning now I just keep my carbs under 40 grams a day. And I did that for three and a half years.
I was my metabolism was slow, meaning I barely could eat, man, I did like 1700 calories a day
and exercise and not like burn fat. And so my body would just tone down its life force. So I was cold
all the time, you know, and I just wasn't feeling right. I was looking smaller. I lost 30 pounds
over three and a half years, but I just wasn't feeling great. And Jordan Peterson hearing his
story about his mental issues and his daughters autoimmune issues and they want carnivore and then
it just becoming to pick up some steam. So I just said, Hey, I was already only eating like four
plants. It was lettuces, you know, ketogenic diet, it was nuts, lettuces, not really many beans,
some more, you know, lettuce nuts, avocado. And what was the other thing that was plant based?
I don't even remember it was maybe like artichokes or something like that or oh,
probably cauliflower. That's what it was. And that was all the plants I was eating.
When I gave those four things up, it was like wild. I lost four pounds of body fat in two weeks.
And I know it's body fat because I checked my numbers through through a fan to the computer I
have. I felt so much better. My the reason I really did I had like a bicep tear that wouldn't heal
over a year. It just wouldn't heal. I grabbed things and like I let go and it was really bad
and my stomach was hurting. I was getting headaches. My stomach is hurting and I had this bicep tear
and I'm like, I got to try something else. And that's why, you know, Jordan Peterson talking about
I healed this with that and my joint pain. So I just said the heck with it. I'm just going to go
carnivore. I'm almost there anyway. And in the first few weeks, way more energy. Like there's a
Dr. Anthony Chaffee and he talks about when he played rugby, he felt like he was like a superhero.
I got a glimpse of that. Like I felt I felt like I didn't need to sleep. It wouldn't matter. Five,
six hours, nine hours. I felt the same. I felt so good for this period of time. Lost body fat,
increase my my energy intake of food from technically what we would call I don't call calories
the same way I used to. But if we are measuring I went from 1700 to 2300 like 500 calories like
overnight. And now I mean I don't even have to track anymore. I just eat when I'm hungry. And I
eat until I'm full. And then I don't eat again until I'm hungry again. And then I eat until I'm
full. But it's what I eat, right? So okay, I just had that. I had an interesting thought. Okay.
You've basically cut out every single product that's in chips and guacamole and margaritas.
I miss it so much. Come on. It's hard, buddy. Here's the thing people like, don't you get bored
with what you eat? Not really. But I do understand that I don't yeah food. I'm a good food. I mean,
I'm not going to act like I don't love those things. But here's what's funny. And I think you'll
track on this. It digress just for a second. But what I tell people is remember how I said like,
look, I wanted to be like the medicine man of the old days in osteopath. Basically, I wanted to be
able to manipulate because I always knew there was something special when you free up something that
surrounds the central nervous system. Me your brainstem sits here, right? C1, C2, C3, that's your
brainstem. You could live without a brain. You can't live without a brainstem, you know, which is wild.
Like there's a chicken where they they it was a bad cut cut in its head off and his brainstem survived
and it ran around the yard for years and they just feed it had no blame. And it's creepy. Well,
when people are like brain dead, but they're still alive, it's because their brainstems attack. So
brainstem here and then you have your central nervous system, this cord that goes all the way
down and like everything feeds off that. So when you do work and adjust joints and move things and
there's a fair information going in and efferent coming down, it is pretty darn cool what happens.
Now our bodies are so polluted now, but 100 years ago, it was they responded better to everything,
right? So I wanted to do that, but I also knew the power of plant medicine. And you know about
plant medicine, everything from before pharma, what was medicine? It was food. It was plant
compounds. Now 99% of the plants in this world will kill you dead. 1% we have for medicine and we
eat. Now just because we eat it though doesn't mean it's food. That's a whole nother conversation.
We eat a lot of things that are not food, but we eat it like C. de Wales. That's not food.
That's industrial byproduct, but we eat it and we get confused. Let's not call that food. Okay, so
but plant medicine and then drugs came out and said, look, if we could change a few carbons and
nitrogen and hydrogens or chemistry, organic chemistry and general chemistry, if we could tweak
a couple, it will still have the same effect on the body. But if we tweaked it from nature, what,
like 30% we can patent it, which is business, right? And so that's where we started moving away
from and good came out of that maybe because now you could really like not overdose people and you
could right. But here's the problem that came, came, came, came, came to where we are now,
which is like drugs for everything, drugs for everything, drug after drug after drug after
big business. But here's what's interesting. I tell people, all right, what were the original drugs
made from? It's recap, right? Food, right? Plants. Yes, we're drug synthesized from pretty much we
know how drugs work because we study in the body from plants and we've make them. But so what's
the difference between morphine, heroin, ayahuasca, THC and garlic powder, black pepper powder,
cayenne pepper powder? What's, I mean, what's the difference? They're both plant extracts, right?
It's their effect on the body. Like, have you ever gotten almost like a high from eating spicy
food? You're like, this is, so my point being is we are eating medicine all the time. It doesn't
mean it's food. So for me, I found out when I gave up peppers, garlic, onion, and even worse in their
powdered state when they're concentrated, that's what I think did it for me. Giving up those compounds.
Oh my gosh, like my body said, thank you, you've been poisoning me your whole life.
Now they taste great. I love garlic and onions and peppers. I love hot sauce. I was like addicted to it.
But it's funny. I was addicted to the very things and tomatoes that were causing me harm. Kind of
sounds like a drug addict, right? But we're like, oh, but it wasn't heroin or it wasn't THC or it
wasn't whatever people demonize these days, right? But it was still killing me. It was causing slow
metabolism, thyroid problems, joint pain, and probably mental illness because when you've hurt
constantly. So all that to say, people don't know this stuff. So we're eating food thinking, oh,
I'm eating healthy food. No, no, you're taking drugs or just food drugs and you're messing
yourself up. So you want to change that? And that's why the carnivore diet is just really the most
simple modified elimination diet there is, because you could literally live off beef salt and water.
You can live off your teeth. Yeah. And some people don't even use the salt. They literally live off
beef. And I know one guy who doesn't even drink water, he drinks a tiny bit of water,
Dr. Boroch, the whole do do do do denominics, deuterium study? He he talks about how we make
metabolic water from fat and he only drinks water. If he's had a little fat in his mouth,
and he's still thirsty five or 10 minutes later, he pretty much doesn't drink water,
which is how animals survive that don't drink water. I mean, animals don't walk around with
their 40 ounce, what do you call those containers, everybody walks around, you know, all the gym
Jimbrows got there, right?
Like we're addicted to water now, which is not healthy.
We do drink too much water.
So when I talk to a group of people, Jonathan,
do you know how overwhelmed people are?
And I'm not like BSing you.
I could tell you right now why drinking water is bad for you.
And I'm not trying to be like snarky about it.
It really is bad.
Yeah, your municipal water, your filtered water,
even your, the best one you could buy right now
at the grocery store that's low enough in deuterium
and not really hurt yourself is, what's the name
of that water, right?
There's all the, you know, Fiji water.
Evian or?
Yeah, Evian.
That one's still 146, I believe, parts per million
of deuterium in that.
The human body wants like 130 and no higher.
So we are loading our body with heavy hydrogen.
That's periodic table stuff.
That's a whole nother talk.
But what does deuterium do to the mitochondria?
Mitochondria is what makes our energy,
our literal life force energy, ATP.
It jumps in there and slows down the nanomotors that spin.
And this is Dr. Borsch's life work.
It's fascinating.
What are the metabolic diseases now of low energy?
These are all the brain diseases, right?
I believe park, I know dementia, Parkinson's,
Alzheimer's, all those, those are energy deficiencies
in the brain and there's also other things going on,
but we need energy to heal.
Is it, I want to say it's Dr. Hyman.
I saw him yesterday and he was talking about that
that really dementia in Alzheimer's is type three
diabetes.
It's a deficiency.
It's not a typical disease in the way we think it.
It's a loss of something.
We're not getting enough.
And that's, so that totally stays in here.
Not what we're doing to ourselves.
It's what we're not doing.
It's, I mean,
We're creating blocks.
Yeah, the solution isn't add drugs, add neuro, add,
the solution is stop doing things
that are lowering our metabolic energy
because healing is a slow process.
And this is what like,
I wish people understood about just anything we want in life
starts with, we need the right energy and healing, right?
Because if we're not meeting most of us, myself included,
I'm probably barely meeting my daily metabolic
energy requirements.
Okay.
So if I'm not meeting my energy
and how do I know that?
Well, do I hurt?
Am I sleeping without waking up in the night?
Like, do I have symptoms?
If I have symptoms, there's a good chance
I'm not meeting my daily metabolic energy needs.
Okay.
And so if I'm not meeting my energy needs,
I'm not rebuilding muscle.
I'm not rebuilding joints properly.
I'm not rebuilding my blood cells properly.
I'm not.
So I'm basically pulling tomorrow's energy for today.
I'm trying to live off tomorrow's grace for today.
Can't do that, right?
But that is what we do.
So what happens when you live off tomorrow's
minerals for today?
What disease do that lead to over time?
When you pull minerals out of bones,
that's osteoporosis, right?
When I'm not burning fat and I'm living off tomorrow's energy
and I don't have it,
so then I need more carbohydrates and sugar, right?
What's the cost of doing that?
Too much sugar circulating the blood
is messing up the nerves, then the nerves don't work.
So it's like when we get to tomorrow,
then we keep up in the game and taking more pills
and pushing harder.
But the problem is it takes a long time to heal.
And if we don't have any surplus energy,
how are we ever gonna heal?
Mentally, emotionally, physically, maybe spiritually,
because we are connected into these physical bodies.
And that is really the talk for people to hear is
you are in a deficit.
You go to bed and wake up every day
and you are in a deficit.
And you're trying to bridge that deficit with drugs
and sugar and dopamine hits from whatever it is,
gambling and pornography and overexercise.
And this is what we're doing.
We're going through life in a deficit and it hurts.
And we got to heal.
That's what Dr. Hawkins would say.
You're living below 200 in that negativity space
where you're always burning more than you have.
Now you're taking away from everything.
You're not putting anything in.
No deposits.
Do you think from the people that you see,
what percentage do you think are living in survival mode
and those that are actually trying to make something?
Is it, how do you see people getting stuck
in that stressed out space?
Because here's the thing, it's a loop.
If you wake up exhausted,
because you didn't get enough tonight sleep
and that carries you through and you're never getting enough,
even if you gorge food,
it doesn't give you what you really want.
So by the time you get to bed,
you've had a 10 o'clock bowl of cereal
because you're still freaking hungry.
And then you go to bed and you don't sleep.
It's just endless cycle.
How do people get into that?
And how do they get out of that?
Well, I guess it's kind of, it's tricky
because we're not all the same, right?
So I'll use me.
So I did that carnivore thing for two weeks
and between two and six weeks,
I mean, I can't tell you how good I felt,
but then I started not feeling as good again
and I didn't change anything.
Okay, but here's what I came to call it.
It's a carnivore.
Oh, full on.
And I'm pretty disciplined.
If I say I'm gonna do something, I'm gonna do it.
I'm not trying to brag.
I just, I have to be that way.
No, you are.
You're exactly like that.
I think quite of something, I'll think,
like I went to Italy and the only time I broke,
I went to Europe for 10 days and I ate pasta twice,
I ate pizza twice and I had gelato once, so five times.
And I mean, I still came back in great shape
because I walked and I burned, it wasn't about that,
but I thought about carbohydrates
for probably six weeks after that trip, maybe two months.
I was just like romanticized about how that pizza,
it's like a drug.
But here's what happened with me.
I had an issue with my landlord
at my commercial building, my office,
and I felt like I was being mistreated
and bullied by just a really rude person
and not treated right, who wasn't repairing the things
and wanted to raise my rent.
And so then that started this ongoing dialogue.
I also found out through all this health stuff,
like I have a cholesterol level, you know, hold on, right?
700 pegs the meter.
I peg the meter for LDL and cholesterol.
I think I'm 670 triglycerides or LDL
and I'm 700 plus cholesterol.
They start giving people statins in the twos.
Okay, so the doctor's like,
you gotta have statins, you're gonna die,
you're gonna have a heart attack.
And I go, I get what you're saying,
but that's in standard American diet, you know, car beaters.
I'm not a car beater.
And he looks at me like I'm crazy.
And I go, well, let's do this then.
Before I take the statin, let's do an MRI of my heart
and look at my heart vessels to see,
because the idea is plucking, right?
That's the idea.
So I get my MRI done.
I have zero score out of 400.
I have zero plucking.
Everything looks great,
but they find an aneurysm on my aorta
that I've probably had most of my life.
And it's not big enough to need to do surgery,
but it's big enough to stress me out, right?
Cause like, they're like, we're just gonna watch it.
And if it gets bigger, we'll have to go in there.
And I'm like, that's like my garden hose coming off my heart.
I'm like, life, are you serious right now with this?
So I got that and that.
And then a couple other things.
And what I started noticing was,
I started feeling like I did before.
I started getting cold again.
I started gaining a tiny bit of weight,
but I hadn't changed anything nutritionally.
So all that to say, it's the 80-20 rule, man.
80% of this health, this life, this existence is mental.
It's stress-based and my ability to deal with stress.
And you know that ebb and flow?
If I have more stress coming in
than I'm processing and getting rid of,
I'm not flowing and building.
I'm stagnating.
And that's what I started doing.
So, but what I'm good at doing
and what a lot of people are at the 20% that's light
and food and drugs and exercise and all these other things,
we're trying to do the 20% to fix 80%,
but it's really the other way around, right?
And so I micromanage this 20% so much
and put so much energy into it.
But what I just proved to myself is like,
I could probably eat McDonald's every day.
And if I control my mental stress,
I'm probably healthier than I am right now today.
And that's why people can get away with that.
Yeah, my grandmother, she smoked for 70 years of her life,
like two packs a day.
It's like, there's always an anomaly.
What's that?
And she probably enjoyed it.
She did.
And you know, it's, yeah, it's,
so what is the value of,
so here's the thing,
I contemplated doing carnivore for this January
and I ended up doing my fasting process,
which is my body's pretty dialed in.
But as I began looking at it,
here is sort of the pushback.
And I'm not saying for people to pushback,
I'm saying everybody has their reasons to think through.
And I thought through them pretty carefully is,
I like alcohol and I don't drink a lot.
I really don't.
I probably will drink on Friday and Saturday nights,
maybe cocktail and a glass of wine.
So I don't drink a ton, but I do enjoy it.
But those are both grains and fruits for you.
Do you cut out alcohol too?
Cause virtually all alcohol is-
I'll myself now a little bit of red wine
or a sip of a gin drink.
Cause my wife likes her little drinks and she's good at it.
And you know, our mutual friend Tim
can make a mean gin and tonic and I have,
but like it's literally, it's funny.
Like we're watching Niners and he goes,
you want to drink?
I go, no, no, here's what we're going to do.
You're going to make a drink a little taller than normal.
And you're going to literally pour an ounce into a glass
and I'm going to sip on that while you sip on that.
Okay.
Cause it doesn't metabolize right in me,
but a little bit of clear spirits or red wine.
And same thing, like I don't drink.
If I have a second drink, I'm going to feel ill tomorrow.
I'm going to poison myself, but one drink I'm okay.
And I usually just sip on it.
So for you-
But for you, the sort of loss of fruits
and vegetables was a moving completely to carnivore
is based on, you did have adverse effects.
It wasn't just like, I don't have any adverse.
I don't have any allergies that I know of.
Yeah.
Let's go and tell you what,
if you're going to have symptoms,
why would you change anything?
Now, if you want to reach a higher level of something,
well, then that could be a discussion.
But if we're just talking like,
and when I tell people symptoms, look,
if you could sleep seven or eight hours uninterrupted,
or if you wake up and you roll back over
and you don't have to get up and pee,
because that's not normal.
That's common, but not normal.
So if you can make it through the night with sleep,
if your gut isn't constantly burning
or have a ton of gas and your bowel movements are normal,
no problem there.
If you don't hurt chronically, headaches, migraines,
neck pain, back pain, toe pain, whatever.
If, for a male, if your erections work the way you want,
if you're a female, if you have a sex drive,
you know, all these things,
then you probably are,
now, given, does that still mean you're healthy?
No, because I still think we're all aging too fast.
Even that person I just said, maybe that's you,
I still think there's a cost, we're aging too fast.
And that's a whole nother conversation though,
because remember, what level are we talking here?
Are we talking just basic level of health?
What, you're probably at the basic level of health,
I would say, hey, why change?
But then if we say, well, let's just say I could prove to you
that you're aging 25% faster
and that you're not on track to be 100,
and strong at 100, then we could get into it.
But that's more like, that's more of an in-house debate,
don't you think?
That's like a kind of a,
we already agree that you should treat your body
a certain way and that symptoms are not normal,
but now we're getting into fine-tuning things,
or that's where the professional athlete conversation
will come in and things like that.
But what I do know is you are having to deal
with more stress than is healthy and normal,
and there is a cost to it.
I don't know if we can get away from it.
I just don't, like the light problems,
the chemicals in our environment,
but the food is a big one.
And here's the thing, heart disease and cancer,
especially heart disease, is we're seeing signs of that
really early, and when you do eat carbohydrate,
you're going to have way more inflammatory response
in your blood vessels, and if you're eating an American diet
and you are eating carbohydrates and fat,
you just, I mean, it's physiologists
called the Randall cycle, the fatty acid cycle,
the cells protect themselves from glucose.
That's just how the body's adapted.
We just weren't meant to put all this exogenous carbohydrates
in that from the outside in.
We're meant to make glucose out of fat,
and we do that very effectively with no spikes of insulin.
And if you look at the biggest problems in health right now,
heart disease and insulin resistant problems,
like the dementia, like diabetes,
those are the biggest problems,
and this is a consequence of industrial seed oil
and carbohydrates, in my opinion.
And I think it's very clearly in the research.
So is it good enough just to not hurt?
That's a good starting point,
but it just depends what your goals are in this world.
I'm going to leave you alone.
You wouldn't find your way into my office
because no symptom brought you in.
Unless I said, hey, do you want to be 75
and still doing pull ups and running sprints?
Because we could get you there,
but probably not with what you're currently doing.
I don't want to put that on you negatively.
Maybe you will, but you're working against the odds,
I would say.
Let me ask you a question.
Because this is the question that I was talking to Rich about,
and I was thinking about you when I asked it.
So as I digest a diet,
and I say I eat a steak, steak example,
or like a popsicle, let's say something
that's actually on the lesser side,
like a popsicle, ice cream with a, like a creamsicle.
How much is its effect on my body
in the understanding I have in relation to it?
So if I think, like when I was five years old,
I could eat a thousand of these and I'd be fine.
I'd gain weight, nothing happened.
But when I'm 56 and having one of these,
it gains me a pound every night.
Yeah, yeah.
Because I'm beginning with the thought process
of this is adversely affecting my body.
So my question is, there's the physiological components
of the mass of the food in the ice cream bar,
and then there's my understanding of its value.
How much is the message
affect our health as much as the physiological mass component?
Which is more important?
That's amazing.
Well, for me, I would say,
I would say as much as I know
and as much as how I eat and all that,
I would say if I was more, more than less,
the majority, over 50% for me personally.
And I have a feeling it's a lot of people that way.
And in fact, I think it'd be shocking if we realized
because why can't our body,
I mean, our body knows what to do.
We could handle massive trauma, massive poisoning.
We can, bodies are amazing.
So why is this little popsicle whooping my butt, right?
Like what?
But it's because of that other stuff we talked about.
Like our mind is so distracted and tired.
It's just a combination of, I believe,
it's overloaded, man.
It's too stressed out.
It's over-concerned.
It's over-debated.
It's over-taxed.
It's not a simple life where we could just go,
yeah, I'll have that because I want it and it tastes good.
But once again, when you were a kid, it was a treat.
It wasn't as readily of,
and maybe it was some houses.
It was a treat.
That's a good way of putting it.
But it wasn't, and I think how did we eat in the 70s?
We probably had a lot less carbs,
a lot of canned foods, a lot of family's canned foods.
There were some pivotal things in health and nutrition, right?
Like seed oils, trans fats, partially hydrogenated.
Yeah, that really did.
Those are actual poisons to your body.
But like an orange is not.
Yeah, is it the food or is it the way we live?
Because I feel like, I think at the end of the day,
nature gives us a blueprint of how we're to live.
And we have violated that so much.
I'll give you an example that I like where you're going is,
imagine if I eat a popsicle.
It's a creamsicle with orange wrapping on it.
So everybody knows it's probably got like 100 cars in it.
Eat it.
And my thought process is, this is not good for me.
Every single time I'm eating this, I tell myself,
well, this is not good for me, but I'm still going to eat it.
What am I eating?
And you're doing this so far now.
Yeah, yeah, now you're like, how many people
consciously think about it?
You're knowingly poisoning yourself
is what your brain is probably thinking.
Because you're like, now, that's why ignorance is bliss, right?
Like for somebody, it's almost like,
in a way, if you don't wake them up to nutrition,
maybe they're healthier eating their crap.
But that's the problem.
The minute you're convicted or your conscience tells you
you're doing something that's, maybe this isn't good for me,
now it's a whole other conversation, isn't it?
Well, that's a disease problem.
If you can convince someone they have a disease by,
I have a lot of friends who have wives who go on WebMD
religiously because they're like, oh, they're self-diagnosing.
And how much is created by self-diagnosing in that way?
Yeah, and how about just over and over?
You know how many people go to the ER because they're dying
and it's just, sorry, it's anxiety or you have heartburn?
But you have to kind of do it now because so many people
do have heart attacks.
So it's like, you don't want to be the fool sitting at home
thinking, I just ate too much pizza
and you're having a heart attack.
And I know a guy, it wasn't a heart attack, it was a stroke.
He was having a stroke.
He had a headache for two days.
He finally does go to the hospital, the ER.
They put him in a hallway overnight
and they're like, you're just having a migraine.
He was having a stroke.
He is not recovered.
His life has changed forever in that 24.
It's really sad.
So you don't want to be like, you
don't want to be a hypochondriac, but you
don't want to be too stoic either where you're
sitting at home dying when, man, they could have just
put you on some aspirin and checked you in for a few hours.
You'd be good to go.
But here's the reality still is, well,
how did you get to that point in the first place?
And so that's where I'm trying to do it.
By the time we get to that point, we're in a lot of trouble.
So I'm trying to use wisdom and nature to say, OK,
like the last 49 years, I have really banged this machine up
here.
And I know my spirit is connected to this physical machine
and there's a consciousness.
But the reality is I've got to do some work on this machine
if I wanted to go another 50 years.
And I don't want to live long just to live long.
I want to live long to be effective.
And I want to be resilient and antifragile, right?
I want to be even better than being strong as antifragile.
I want to gain from disorder, like Talib says in that book.
I want to be like, that's all you got for me?
And get stronger, because that is how the body is.
We get stronger from stress.
But there's a breaking point, like a rubber band.
We're like rubber bands.
We snap out of breath.
There is a breaking point.
And I feel like we are all grossly pushing
the verge of that breaking point.
We don't know it.
It's worse than we think is that.
And so it's hard, John, to think, as you said,
what if I don't know it?
And maybe ignorance is bliss and I'm just eating and enjoying
life.
And that's great.
And I think there's no problem with that.
But the minute you're awake to things,
now it's almost like you have a responsibility to yourself
to do something about it.
You can't go back into the matrix, right?
I mean, remember in the movie, the guy
tries to go back into the matrix?
And he's eating at stake.
And he goes, I know this isn't real.
My brain's telling me it's juicy.
And he's like, but he's having that moment of pleasure.
But the reality is, everybody else on that ship
knows once we're unplugged and we know what life really is,
we have a responsibility.
And that's where I think we get into our God side
and Christ and our purpose.
And what are we here to overcome?
But it's not brought to your attention.
The problem, though, is with all the social media.
It's bringing it to everybody's attention,
whether you want it or not.
And I do think that needs to stop.
I don't need grandma seeing COVID 2.0 is coming in.
It's going to kill her.
I don't need her because I don't need her seeing that, right?
She was fine before all that.
She would have been fine if it never got to her CNN ticker
tape, right?
So anyway.
Sean, last question before you wrap up.
I just thought of this and I wanted to ask you.
Someone walks into your office and says,
I want to get healthy.
Where would you say start?
I would say for the listeners.
Yeah, I would ask them all about their symptoms.
OK, and I would start there.
And I would probably say, look, I
would do some techniques to just change
those little bitty symptoms, usually pain or something,
to give them some hope.
And I would say now, look, we have
to control the things that are controllable that
are low bearing fruit.
What are the easiest things?
And I love, I think Jordan Peterson says that.
When he's working with somebody really in a bad way,
really bad way, he goes, all right, you have a goal.
OK, there's certain steps you've got to get to your goal.
But he says, what is something that you could do,
that you would do to get you closer to your goal?
And that's where you start.
Some people are suicidal.
Can you get through the day?
Nope.
Can you get through the hour?
Nope.
Can you get through 10 minutes?
Yes.
It's kind of like, and I don't mean to be dramatic,
but these people probably don't have a track record of keeping
things going very long.
So I would try to help them identify the low bearing fruit
and get them some success and hope and be real honest.
Be real honest, like, because here's where they are, right?
They're stuck in this pain.
Why is that important?
Why is being honest?
And you're not talking about with them to you.
You're talking about them to yourself.
Yes, because it's so easy to be sold on lies and BS.
And what's out there is going to tell them,
if you buy this program, if you do this,
it might not be easy, but it will be quick.
Or it's not going to be quick, but it's going to be easy.
It's all lies.
It's going to be terribly hard.
It might take decades to get to where you want to go.
So you either have to learn to accept yourself right
where you are with all your symptoms and just be at peace.
And then maybe because you will feel better being at peace,
right?
You will feel better.
All right, quick.
Just get the information out.
Just be at peace with your eye.
Or you want to get here.
Do you really want to get here?
OK, let's get you there.
But you can't stay stuck in the middle.
That's the wilderness.
That's 40 years in the wilderness.
That's where all the pain is.
That's where I've been stuck most of my life.
That's what causes health problems and symptoms.
And don't be stuck in the wilderness,
either except where you are, your present time,
consciousness, your circumstances,
or do what's required to get you there.
But you better trust somebody who
could help you get there because, man, people
are just selling stuff.
And it's going to be easy.
It's going to be quick.
No, it's not.
It'll just be hard in a different way.
But slow incremental changes that last,
I think that's the way to go.
So that's what I would do with somebody.
Hopefully they can do it.
And little by little, we get to where we're going.
Sean, thank you.
You're always welcome on our show.
This has been an absolute.
I love hanging out with your brother.
It's always good to see you.
Thank you for your wisdom.
And I think our listeners are going
to be a lot better for it because you're someone I truly
know that cares about people.
And so if you're hearing this and it resonates,
Sean is very much the real deal so you can trust what he says.
To all of our listeners, thank you.
This has been a wonderful episode of Living in the Matrix.
Please subscribe, comment, let us know what you'd like to hear.
And much love, everybody.
Thanks for what you're doing, my friend.