Welcome to the Love and Context podcast of Unscripted Conversation with Ben and Spence.
We're so glad that you could join us today, whether that's from your car, office, home,
church, or wherever you're at. We did have a few sound quality issues with our first few episodes.
Those have been resolved. So if you do notice that the sound is funny in the first couple
episodes, we do apologize for that. If you want to contact us, you can email us at
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All right, man. So it is time for us to jump into the next one. The last episode, I don't know,
with your editing, we had like an hour and 15 minutes worth of stuff. So, and I don't know
what the episode ended up being because obviously you haven't edited yet. 46 minutes and 22 seconds.
Yeah, I don't think that's going to be true, but good luck with that. So if you're listening to
that episode and you're like, Ben talked a lot, it's because Ben talked a lot. I did talk a lot,
so I apologize for that. All right. So this episode, we're going to talk about Isaac, Jacob,
and Joseph, because we really want to try to just step through the rest of Genesis and start talking
about the Exodus. So Isaac is an interesting character, right? One of the passages in the
New Testament where I see Jesus actually referencing Isaac is in the story about the grain that falls
and dies, right? And it yields in 50 and a hundred times. So there's references to all those intervals
of growth, except there's only one place that it talks about a hundred. That's actually in the story
of Isaac. So once again, if you haven't checked it out and I don't know why you'd still be listening
to us and not checked out the Baymaw podcast and the Bible project, right? They've got great videos
on YouTube. You can check them out. Baymaw has some great content here. They're going to have some
really cool stuff on Rebecca and Isaac. I'm going to jump right into something later that I think is
really cool that we see in the life of Isaac. In a time of famine, right? Isaac goes and sows seed.
He sows food and he reaps a hundred fold. So he trusts in God and he goes and sows and famine
and reaps a hundred times what he sowed. That's cool. Like let's talk about the church, right?
Let's talk about our Christian lives. How often do we think, oh, everything is going wrong. It's
time to actually dig in. But that's exactly what we're supposed to do, right? So like, okay, I'm
already talking way too much, but let's talk about the stock market. Okay. This is something I was
thinking about the other day. Now people who know the adage, they say, buy low, sell high, right?
Except what do people actually do? They buy high, sell low and lose a lot of money. All the time,
right? Because they're covered by their emotions. But when everything is crashing, they're like,
I gotta sell. When everything's crashing is actually the time you go and buy because things
that are valuable are cheap, right? It's kind of like, if I want to buy a house, I'd love to buy
it in a housing crisis when everything's crashing. Yeah. Right. Cause then I can buy a much nicer
house for less money. All right. So if that's true about economics, what about your spiritual life?
Right. Now people are, I'm going to get us emails because people would be like, are you saying that
you need to sell out on Jesus when you're on the mountain top? No, I'm not saying that. And you need
to listen to what the analogy, all analogies fall apart, right? What is this temptation when things
aren't going our way to give up? Like how often are we just shy of breakthrough because we don't go
and put seed in the ground during the middle of a famine? Yeah. Yeah. And take it, take your stock
market example. When, when you're at your low point, you're supposed to dig in more and when
you're doing well and everything is going great, you're supposed to celebrate. Yeah. Yeah. Like
at least when I look at my portfolio, when it's up, I'm like, this is awesome. Right? And when it's
down, I have a few moments where I'm like, oh crap, this is, I'm losing so much money. I have those
moments, but then I remind myself, I'm like, no, this is why I'm supposed to dig in. Right. And then
when I dig in, I'm so thankful because I just end up in such a better spot when I'm back on the
mountain top. Right. So there's two things. And we're going to carry this analogy into our faith
filled lives, right? One thing is the church doesn't know how to celebrate. And we're going to talk
about this in Leviticus. When we get to Leviticus, we don't know how to party. And yes, there's
celebration on Leviticus. And yes, the church should be the place where people know how to party.
Yeah. This is going to be wildly unpopular with some people. Yeah. The most carefree celebratory
people should be the church. Yeah. Knowing how to rejoice and revel in a good God. Yes. But when
everything around you is crashing, we go, oh man, it is our time to invest. Uh-huh. So it's always
interesting to me. Let's talk about like just global economic news. Yeah. People talk about,
they're like, we've been praying for revival for America for a long time. And then things start to
get really bad in some capacity. Right. And we go, oh no, why is this here? And I'm like, guys,
what do you think happens in famine? Abundance from God happens. Yeah. Like this is the time
where the church gets to be the church. Yeah. We are made for this. Uh-huh.
Isaac. Yeah, right. And I just, I love that Isaac goes and sows in a time of famine.
Mm-hmm. We should learn from that. Yeah. Now I think that it's really easy for people to build
a theology off of one statement, so please don't run with that too far. Right. But something about
Isaac, he sees that God will provide and he does what nobody else is anticipating and he goes and
sows in famine. Yeah. By the way, this is just after he went and dug a bunch of holes for wells
and the people are like, yeah, you can't have that. That's ours. Okay. So he moves on, digs another
hole for a well and they're like, yeah, you can't have that. Move on. Then finally finds another
place and they're like, nobody says anything. So he's like, okay, well, I'm going to be here.
Right. Now Isaac is far from perfect. He has the same issue with Abimelech. Yeah, he does.
Where he says that now Rebecca is his sister. Uh-huh. And once again, we've talked about
mistakes, sin, those types of things tend to be generational. Like father like son, man.
He is, he's learning and Isaac actually starts to push the envelope forward. Yeah.
But Isaac has two kids, two wildly different kids. Yes. Ben's understating this. Like go read the
text. You will see just how different his kids, Jacob and Esau are. They're so different. They're
so different. Right. You got Esau who's like, I'm going to be outside. I'm going to go hunt,
kill my own food. I'm going to be a meaty, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat, fat,
man's man. And he's also like a wooly mammoth. Yeah. He's a hairy dude. And so much so that they
literally put like goat skins on his arm. And Isaac is like, oh yeah, that feels right. Yeah. Right.
That's how hairy this guy is. And then you have Jacob who for lack of a better term, he's a mama's
boy. Like he's, he's the stay at home, going to please mom, hang out with mom all the time.
He's definitely going to be the guy who wins wars with his words. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So you got the
macho manly man who has such hairy arms that you can put goat skin on there and it'd be similar.
Then you got the smooth talker mama's boy. Two very different kids, two very different kids.
And one of the things that I want to point out that comes up a lot in Genesis, and it's going to
be throughout the Bible, but it happens a lot in Genesis and cause it's going to happen in the life
of Jacob and there's prominence also with Abraham and Abram names are important. Yes. Right. So
Esau is born, they call him red because he comes out red, right? Esau meaning red. Jacob comes out
and they call him Jacob because he's grasping the heel. It means heel grasper. By the way,
stop saying Jacob means liar. That's not what it means. Okay. It means heel grasper. You're
surfer. I maybe foolishly named my child James, right? My first born, I named him James. And so
if you don't know, James is the English equivalent of Jacob. In fact, if you look at the book of
James in the Bible, it could just as easily be the book of Jacob. Right. James has a definite
personality that I'm okay. He's a Wheeler and dealer. Okay. Oh, the wheel ends. He is so well
Wheeler. Yeah, he is. And so one of the things that I've been telling him as he's been growing
up, I've talked to him about what his name actually means. And I asked him, I said, the thing is,
are you going to usurp or assume authority or step into these roles? Are you going to do it for
yourself or are you going to do it on behalf of others? Are you going to serve yourself? Are you
going to serve God in your identity? Yeah. Now, can we pause? Because I'm not sure if I'm going
to serve myself because I said that to my son. But then right after I said it, I was like,
what about me? Yeah. You had that moment where you're like, oh, I said this to my son and then
God's like, hey, Ben, I got something for you. Yeah. I, as the father said it to my son and then
my father, I'm Dan. It was like, hey, did you just hear yourself? Yeah. Do you hear yourself? I'd like
to give you a playback on what you just said. Yeah. Right. But that's the thing is like,
we all have these things that God's called into our identity and you have talents and you have
gifts and all these different things. Like Jacob has talents. East all has talents. Yeah. The
question is, are you going to use them for yourself? Are you going to use them for the glory of God?
Yeah. Like if there's one thing you can take away from Genesis is identity and what are you going
to do with it? Yeah, absolutely. You know, you're going to be given pieces of favor, blessing,
all these different things. What are you going to do with it? Are you going to serve yourself
or serve others? By the way, there's a right answer. Well, I actually should say there is a
kingdom answer and then there is a way that leads to destruction. Yeah. It's been prominent all
throughout Genesis. Is God holding out on you or are you going to be a part of his kingdom solution?
Yeah. And by the way, that doesn't change all the way into Jesus. Right? So true. These characters,
it's so funny. It just cracks me up because in the New Testament, they're like, okay, the God of our
ancestors, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. And if you read through the stories of these guys, it's like,
dude, they did some weird things. Like they're not perfect individuals. I love that the Bible does not
edit them as like perfect individuals. No. Because it's not trying to give us a lofty standard that
we can't identify with. And we should learn from that. Yeah. Right. I mean, like how many times have
you heard some of it? Like how many times have you seen someone try to just maintain a perfect
reputation? Yeah. Like how well does that work? We have been putting pastors on pedestals. Uh-huh.
And we've been making those pedestals higher and higher. And then we're shocked when they fall.
Mm-hmm. Right? Like there'll be pastors who have like a slight hiccup. Right. Like not even something
that's going to be detrimental to their ministry, but just like a slight hiccup on something in
their lives. Like a little sin thing that reared its head, but forgiveness and restoration had
taken place and they're good again. Right? And people have been like, whoa, they are unfit to
serve because they're imperfect. Well, so are you. And churches still ask you to serve. Yeah. We're
all imperfect. And so if we're looking for perfection for service, let's spoil alert,
nobody would be serving God. Yeah. No kidding. Well, and it's interesting because I want to
address two different things in that. Right? One is that none of us are perfect. And I guarantee you,
at some point I'm going to disappoint you. Mm-hmm. Right? I mean, that is a guarantee. One thing I
can guarantee you about myself at some point, I'm going to do something that disappoints you.
I disappoint Ben all the time. Like we record these episodes and like an hour later he's like,
are they edited? I have unrealistic expectations. Yeah. Unreal. Actually, while we're recording,
I'm like, have you finished editing? But then I want to address the other side of it is the
church is also really bad at dealing with people who have garbage in their life. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Right? And let me explain this. So one of two things happens is we try to pretend like what
a pastor did is okay. Or they sweep it under the rug or they're like, hey, it wasn't that big of a
deal. No, it is a big deal. But we need to deal with it so that restoration, forgiveness, and
restoration can happen. I said restoration twice. I meant redemption. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean?
Yeah. You're making it a big deal by hiding it. Yeah. Hey guys, what happened in the garden?
Adam and Eve hid from God. Mm-hmm. And he's like, where are you? You're not where I left you.
Right. And he wasn't mad. He wasn't mad. Yeah. But they needed to deal with what was going on there.
Yeah. So if you're listening to this and you're like, man, I am an imperfect human. Great. Join
the club. Yeah. We're all trying to get better. We're all here. We're waiting for you. Jump on
in, man. Let's go. On the good side, if you've been waiting to get involved in the kingdom of God
until you get your act together, good news is jumping today. Yeah. Yeah. You're not going to
get your act together. None of us have our act together. Holy Spirit is moving through us and
making us into better versions of ourselves every day. I saw, I actually saw on Instagram,
Riele the other day, he was like playacting his conversation with himself. And he was like,
I'd like a refund on adulthood. Right. And the guy's like, oh, you can't do that. He's like,
well, okay, can I speak to your manager? And he's like, well, you're the manager. And he's like,
well, who put me in charge? I'm not qualified. Right. Like we're all figuring this out. Yeah.
Like, and when I watched that reel, I just laughed because I was like, I feel that way a lot of time
too. So let's, let's jump back in and into the ugly of character. Right. Yeah. So Jacob and Esau
is an interesting story, right? Because one Esau sells his birthright for a bowl of lentil stew.
And I can't say that I've ever wanted lentil stew when I ever, ever. Right. I mean, I made lentil
stew all the time growing up and I hated it. I mean, you might, you might be able to like convince
me or like, at least like have a, have a chance if you're like, Oh, we have this really delicious
pepperoni and black olive pizza and also a bacon cheeseburger for you. Right. Like these are things
that might act, but even then I'm like, okay, well, why is that? Why would I want that over
my birthright? But it's clear that Esau doesn't care about the birthright and Jacob does,
except then later Esau does care about the birthright when it actually comes time to pay the
counting. Yeah. Have you made, have you ever made a bad deal and then when you got done with it,
you're like, I really wish I didn't do make that deal. Right. So, but then Jacob's mother, Rebecca,
like jumps in on this too. And she helps him deceive his father and steal a blessing,
which is a big deal in Hebrew culture. By the way, we should make that a big deal in our culture.
Yes, we should blessing each other. Yes. Specifically your children. One of the things
I've been starting to try to do is I ask God, because I said, when I release my kids from my
household, like when they go in their adults, I've asked God to start putting a blessing in my heart.
Yeah. That I speak over them when they go. Right. Something that's from him that is imparted through
the mouth of the father, their father to them. Yeah. They actually go and I want to speak into
their identity. Yeah. It's powerful. Oh, it's so powerful. Right. And, and understand I'm not
getting all like, I'm not getting, it's like super mystic here, but at the same time I'm getting kind
of mystic because God does crazy things through spoken word. Right. He does. When you hear the
voice of the father and you repeat what he's saying in heaven on earth, you'd be shocked at
the things that happen because it's not your authority. It says authority flowing through you.
Yeah. And, and let's, can we simplify this down a little bit? So like you hear us talk about
blessing and like there is legitimate, when you're talking, when you're blessing people,
blessing people in the name of Jesus, like things happen in their lives and you should be a person
of blessing anyways, because apparently when Jesus told his disciples, he's like, you say a blessing
with those people. If they don't receive it, it's coming back on you. Yeah. Like, man, that sounds
like a great deal to me. Go bless everybody you can. Yeah. If they don't want it. Sure. It's going
to come back to you. Great. Right. And so just taking this like a step further, one of the things
I try to do in my life, and I, and I don't do this perfectly, but I try to is I'm like, I want the
things to come out of my mouth. I want the positive things to far outweigh the negative things.
Now there's issues you gotta deal with in life, right? But if you just complain about everything,
how are you being a blessing to those around you? Yeah. Right. Like instead there might be
situations that you're like, oh, this isn't going the way I want. This isn't what it should look
like, but I'm going to find the good and I'm going to find, I'm going to find the people in
a situation that I can bless. Yeah. I like that a lot. So Jacob comes in and he steals Esau's
blessing and Esau is not shockingly upset and he's like, well, I'm going to kill this guy. And so
Jacob takes off and he, and he gets a taste of his own medicine with this guy. That's his uncle named
Laban. Not a very nice guy, by the way. No, he's very similar to Jacob though. Yeah. Right. I have
issues with Jacob is like, I know he's a founding father of the faith, but like he's not a terribly
awesome dude because okay, so he's at Bethel and he has this dream about Jacob's ladder with angels
ascending and descending, which by the way, you should catch the reference when Jesus is talking
in the new Testament about angels ascending and descending on the son of man. Yeah. Right. He goes,
he's like, okay, God, well, if you bless me and you do this and you do that and I increase in wealth,
I'm going to give you a 10th of everything I get. What? So he cheated his brother out of blessing
and then he's trying to wheel a jiggly God out of what God already owns. Yeah. So I read those
story of Jacob and sometimes I'm like, okay, I got to get ahead of this with James. Right. So now I
want to just tell you my boy is a sweetheart. He is a sweetest kid, but he is a wheeler and dealer
and that's why calling it in is going to be important because he's going to have a tendency,
especially as he gets older, to buy into that side. And it's our job as parents to steward them well.
Yeah. Right. So Jacob is just this really questionable character. He runs into Laban.
Laban is also a very questionable character and he's got two daughters, Leah and Rachel.
Mm hmm. Right. And he's like, okay, well, if you work for me for seven years, you can have
my daughter, you know, Rachel. And there's some slight of hand he gives her Leah because, you know,
the first daughter has to get married first. And then there's that conversation and he works
for another seven years for Laban. But here's the disappointing thing. I don't know if he actually
picked this up in the text. He actually marries Rachel a week later or however long the honeymoon
period would be. Right. Yeah. Leah actually only gets her husband to herself for very little time.
Yeah. He doesn't work for another seven years and then another seven years marry Rachel.
He immediately marries Rachel. Yeah. This is actually one of the times in scripture where
Jacob actually honors his work. He immediately marries Rachel, but then he honors his word and
then still works for Laban for another seven years. Right. But I want to talk about Leah
because I think God comes in and really, is this Leah or Leah? I'm going to say use both. Okay.
Let's say Leah. Okay. I've always heard Leah. Yeah. I mean, I think you could say Leah. Okay.
But I mean, Leah might confuse people who watch Star Wars, right? And they'll be like, they'll
be like, well, where's Luke? So when Anakin Skywalker, just kidding, just kidding. So,
but I think God, in the very similar way that we saw Hagar and Sarai, God sees Leah. Yeah. And he
meets her where she's at and she has tons of kids. So there's 12 tribes of Israel. Yes. Which is what
Jacob's name eventually gets changed into. 10 of those tribes are from Leah. Are from Leah. Yeah.
Yeah. And the other two are from Rachel. That's a lot of tribes that come from Leah.
Leah. Mm-hmm. La-li-dee-ah. If you ever want a chapter in the Bible where you're like,
what is happening here? Just go read the story of Leah and Rachel trying to have kids for Jacob.
Yeah. It's real interesting. It's very interesting. We'll just, we're not going to dive into that.
We'll just leave it at that. Go do Genesis 30, I believe. Go do your reading and then you'll be
like, why'd you recommend that to me? No, this section of scripture is very interesting, right?
It's super interesting. There's a lot that's going on moving on into the life of Jacob as he has kids.
There's a teaching by Rabbi David Foreman called Coats and Goats, which is fascinating. I'm not
going to get into it. Go check it out, alfbeta.com org. It's great. He's got some really interesting
things that are happening with coats and goats. One of the things that I, well, I'm going to stop,
I'm going to stop saying one of these things, one of the things, okay? Ben says one of the things,
and you got to know that that's that thought for that moment. For that moment. And then he
gets on to the next moment. He's like, one of the things, that's the next thought for that moment,
but they're all one of the things. Yeah. Two of the things. Two of the things. They're saying that.
Because if you start a county now, we'd have a lot of the things. Yeah. So trending throughout
Genesis is this though, Abraham and Sarah, they are where the promised line comes through. Yes. Isaac
and Rebecca are where the promise comes through. Now, Isaac is the second born of Abraham. Jacob,
who the line continues through, is the second born of Isaac. Joseph, who ends up actually going into
Egypt, is going to be the first born of the second wife. Right? So I don't know if you guys are
starting to notice a trend here, right? God is not working through the first born, but for the
second born. Right? Just keep your finger on that, because we'll come back to that at some point.
Some people are going to be like, when? Eventually. It's like 10 years from now, people will be like,
you never addressed this. And I'll be like, you know what? You're right. You're right. We're going
to get to it next week. Next week, we'll be 20 years from now. Yeah. So Jacob has all these kids.
He's got 10 kids on the side of Leah. He's got two kids on the side of Rachel, though one is born
initially and the other one's born much later. So he has this kid named Joseph, and I always love it
when they have the Joseph and the technicolor dream coat, you know what I'm talking about?
One of the things that's going on in Hebrew, and it does say multicolor, that's one of the ways
that they translate it. But the bigger deal about Jacob giving Joseph the coat is it's a second coat.
Now, if you know anything about legacies and families in that time period, you know that the
first born is the one who is supposed to get the double portion. Yeah. Because it's the first born's
responsibility to take care of the family after dad dies. And what Jacob says is he says, I know
that my first born is Reuben and also a delicious sandwich. Apparently he was famous for making
these sandwiches. That's not in the Bible. Sorry. I'm just totally aware of that sandwich.
I guess that's totally where that sandwich comes from. But Jacob says, hey, I know that you're my
first born, but I really wish it was Joseph. So I mean, I understand why his brothers don't like him.
And then Joseph doesn't exactly do himself any favors. Right? No, he doesn't. He's like,
let me tell you about this dream about when you all bowed down to me because I was the coolest
person ever. I mean, sounds like a youngest child to me. Like, you're not wrong. No, I mean,
but yeah, Joseph doesn't do himself any favors in this moment. And Jacob, he's doing a couple
things by giving the coat to Joseph. Is like, one, he is saying, okay, Rachel's my favorite wife
because I'm honoring her first born. Right? And then two, he's saying Reuben, your youngest sibling
is more important to me than you are. It's a hard thing here. Right? Imagine, I mean, just imagine
your parent or guardian coming up to you and being like, hey, this right here, this one right here
is my favorite sibling. Right. That's hard. That's hard. So like, I can understand the hurt from his
brothers. I mean, I maybe don't understand it to the point where they're like, hey, let's toss him
in a pit and pretend like he got murdered and sell them off into slavery. But there's a lot going on
there and I'm not going to get into it. But I mean, like, they have a pretty severe reaction to that.
Yeah. Right. So Joseph does get sold into slavery. He ends up in Egypt. And so remember what we said
about Isaac. He sells them time of famine. Right? What does Joseph do? He's in Potiphar's house as a
slave. Right? Yep. And yet he becomes so prominent in his slavery because he's so good at what he
does. He becomes the head of Potiphar's household. He basically runs everything. Yep. He is a slave
in his master's household. And yet he just serves so well in the worst circumstance that he gets
put in charge of everything. Okay. Well, then of course, there's a situation where Potiphar's wife
wants to sleep with Joseph. He's like, yeah, I'm not going to do that. And so she lies and says that
he tried to rape her and he gets thrown into jail. And once again, he's even a worse situation.
And he just serves and rises to prominent and basically runs the jail for the guy at that point.
Right? Yep. Again, he sows in famine and God meets him there. Right? He doesn't take him out of jail.
Yeah. He's still in jail. And then he gives these prophetic words about a baker and a cup bear,
one that ends very, very well and one that ends not so well. If you go and check out the one that
says like his eyes are going to get plucked out by birds or something like that, it's really gruesome.
Yeah. And then he gets forgotten until Pharaoh has a dream that he can't interpret.
And all of his people are like, yeah, we don't got anything. And then this guy remembers, he says,
oh wait, there was a guy in the jail who told me all these things and he was a pretty cool dude.
Maybe he can help you. And Joseph is brought forward and he has like this moment where he
is able to step into his identity that he's had the whole time. Yep. Now he's put onto a platform
where he's actually able to step into it. Yeah. And he goes and he interprets the dream. And I
and I love the conversation about like, how does he interpret the dream? Actually, Baymaw has a great
conversation about that. If you haven't caught the theme, we're referencing them a lot because
they've got great stuff and we're not going to trot over that ground again. Yeah. Okay.
But Joseph basically is able to see the famine that's coming. I think that's interesting.
Famine, right? Given who his grandfather is. Yep. And Pharaoh says, oh, okay, well, I'm going to put
you in charge basically of Egypt and you're basically going to be underneath me and you'll
have all the authority to get ready for this. Right? So he wants again, so some famine.
And then what Joseph does is very shrewd. He starts to accumulate a lot of reserves,
knowing the famine is coming. Okay. He accumulates in advance knowing the famine is coming. Yeah.
And so then what ends up happening in a lot of the rise of prominence of Egypt can be attributed
to this is the fact that when famine comes and nobody has any food, including Egypt,
because they aren't growing new food, they only are living off their stores. They are now able
to sell their food to these people in exchange for sometimes land, sometimes animals, sometimes,
you know, whatever the prophet would be. Now, I think the temptation is to say, well, yeah,
but this is going to lead to slavery. This is taking advantage. I was like, you do realize that
a whole region would have died if Egypt hadn't accumulated this food. Yeah.
Like, so God used the greed of men or maybe the self-preservation of men to actually save a whole
region. Like sit with that for a while. Yeah. God doesn't let anything go unwasted.
Like, and so hear me out on this. Okay. You might be like, well, there was this horrible moment in
my life. Okay. God's not going to let that go unwasted. Now I'm not someone who's going to
come and say, God caused all that stuff to happen in your life. I don't necessarily believe that. I
believe there's consequences for our own actions. And I believe we have to accept some of that stuff.
There's also a reality of living in a fallen world. There's a reality of living in a fallen
world. There's disease, there's brokenness, there's all these things, right? But God will use those
things to draw you closer to him. He will use that to draw you closer to him. I mean, with Joseph,
one of the things that kind of strikes me about the story is that every time Joseph was put in
a really bad situation, he leaned into who God is and God blesses that. Like every time, like he's
thrown in a pit, sold into slavery. He leans into who God is, is faithful, God blesses it.
Right? He was thrown into jail. He leans into who God is, is faithful, God blesses it. Okay. He gets
brought before Pharaoh to interpret dream. He leans into who God is, God's faithful, he blesses it.
Again, you see that again with the stores of food. Joseph is a very different character than his
father. Very different. Very different. And we need to see that because Jacob was a wheeler and
dealer, kind of sly, good with his words type things. And Joseph is just a straight up faithful
guy, faithful to the Lord. Yeah. I mean, is there some squishiness in him? Of course. Of course.
Absolutely. Because he's a person. Absolutely. Yeah. And there's also echoes of his father in
him as well. Right? But his father also is called Israel. Right? Yeah. Like the nation, Israel,
like that Jesus eventually comes from, that was from his father, Jacob. So the hunger gets,
the family gets so big that his brothers actually have to come and get food from Egypt. And there's
a whole like dance that ends up happening where he reveals himself and doesn't reveal himself and
throws one of them in jail and gets his father to come back to Egypt and all these different things
that happen. Right? Like, I'm not going to get into that, but you know what is the most beautiful
part of all of that? Joseph forgives his brothers. Yeah. He puts the hurt, he takes the hurt on
himself. And he said, he makes a statement. He says that what you meant for evil, God, you are
meant for evil. God purposed for good. And he's like, it's okay, guys. The best possible thing
came out of this. Doesn't make what you did. Okay. But I recognize the hand of God, even in your evil
and I choose to forgive. Boy, if we could talk about a more relevant thing in the church today,
right? And we're talking about people who were close to him, who hurt him. Right? Like we're not
talking about like, okay, somebody said a sly comment at the grocery store. The equivalent would
be like, I mean, literally, if you had family members who just sold you out for some reason.
Yeah. Like family that was close, like immediate family who sold you out,
you'd want nothing to do with them. But Joseph comes around and he's like, no, I forgive you.
Because you are my family and I love you. And I see the divine hand that moved behind you.
Yeah. Even in the midst of when you tried to do evil, God turned her for good.
I mean, because it is an evil guy. It's like they sold him into slavery. That's not cool.
It's not good at all. But what God ended up actually doing is putting Joseph in a position
where he could save not only one nation, but all the nations in that area. Yeah. Egypt actually
becomes very powerful after this. Right? Now, of course, we're going to get into the Exodus
and this power, once it goes generation to generation to generation becomes a problem.
But I think the tendency is to maybe blame Joseph for creating Egypt into this powerhouse.
And I don't think that the person who creates blessing, who creates functional things,
carries the blame for people who misuse it. Right? No, they do not. Right? And I think you need to
hear this because I think sometimes we have this tendency to blame Jesus for the people who follow
him. I made a statement to a person about an event that they were going to. They felt very
convicted that they should go and participate in this event. Right? And I made a statement to
them. And I made a statement. I said, if people don't like you because of Jesus, that's expected.
Yeah. If people don't like Jesus because of you, that's sin. Make sure that the reason people don't
like you is because of Jesus, not the other way around. Right? And I think that often in our
churches, we get a lot of people who claim to represent Jesus and do everything except that.
Right? I am very cognizant of my shortcomings. Same here. And I'm trying to live them out well,
but I also try to remind people, hey, I'm not Jesus. I'm becoming more like him. Yeah.
But I also am going to live into my changed nature because my nature is no longer prone to sin,
it's prone to righteousness. The Holy Spirit is working inside of me to do good things in this
world. And if I listen to him, he's going to direct me to better things rather than worse things.
Mm-hmm. Sometimes though, it's time to store up because famine's coming. Yeah.
And having enough in the time of famine is not just about you. It's about all those that are
around you. There's a ton of things we can learn from these guys. I mean, we didn't even talk about
Jacob wrestling with God. We didn't even talk about the Jacob's letter. I briefly referenced it.
We didn't talk about Esau forgiving his brother. Right? What I think is worth mentioning though,
is the two forgiveness moments we've mentioned, Esau forgiving his brother and Joseph forgiving
his brothers. These are forgiveness moments pre-Jesus. Growing up, actually, the church that
I grew up in, they kind of skimmed over that. They didn't really talk about that. And then when they
got to Jesus, they're like, okay, this is when forgiveness happens. Yeah. But then you dive into
this and you're like, wait, wait, wait. There's actually forgiveness that happens pre-Jesus.
Like you have Esau forgiving Jacob. You have Joseph forgiving his brothers. You have Moses
forgiving the Israelites. And the story keeps going. Right? Right. And then some of you are like,
well, what about Jesus? What's the work of Jesus have to do with anything? I'm so glad you asked.
We're going to get to that soon. We are going to get to that soon. We promise. So stay tuned for
that. If you want a spoiler alert, just go read the four gospels. Yeah. There's some good stuff
in there about why that's important. This is what we can tell you about the work of Jesus.
The work of Jesus is not about satisfying God's wrath. There's, I just said that and I guarantee
you we get an angry. Oh yeah. We will. Okay. Cause I want to break this down for you. Okay.
Who is Jesus? He's God. It's not a trick question. Right? So if Jesus drinks the cup of God's holy
wrath, so God drinks God's holy wrath. Jesus drinks the cup of God's holy wrath. Yep. Okay.
This sounds like a God who walked both sides of the covenant. Yep. This sounds like the God who
meets people in the middle of nowhere at a place called Bethel. This sounds like a God who gives a
vision of abundance and scarcity so that a nation can protect an entire region. Yeah. This sounds
like a God who remembers even in the midst of a cataclysmic flood. This sounds like a God who knows
when to say enough and realize that creation is ready to start blossoming. Yeah. It's almost like
the God in the new Testament is the God of the old Testament. Then it's always been a story about
how God is getting his kids back home and that when he gets into the new Testament, he's still not
angry. He's working through Jesus to bring about the redemption of the entire world. And yet we
still want to talk about an angry God. He created a new covenant just like he created with Abraham,
where he created a new covenant where he's like, I am going to walk both sides. There's nothing you
have to do except come home. Yep. Guys, it is time to come home. It is time to stop living in this
reality of an angry God. That is what pagans do. Their gods are angry. Ours is not. Now there are
times that God gets angry and we will talk about that because it shows up in the rest of Torah,
but it is not for the reasons you think. And we already saw in Sodom and Gomorrah, why was God
angry with Sodom and Gomorrah? Why did he reach out and have to wipe them out? Because they were
fat and overfed and they didn't care about anybody but themselves. Just a warning church. Maybe it's
time to actually believe that God's not angry with you and go love other people. Go and actually
bring the kingdom wherever you go. Stop living in fear of God and go and be the church. So when you
look at this story, one of the things with Joseph that is just very interesting to see is he relied
on God 100%. He also took responsibility and stored up food. Yeah. Right. He took responsibility
to store the food and because he did that, he took care of the whole region around him.
Okay. We as a church should take note of that. I often hear people who are like, well, this church
just isn't feeding me. The church is supposed to help build you up so you can be sent out, right?
But you should be taking responsibility for getting your own spiritual food. Right. Right.
Especially if you're here in America, man, you're two clicks away on Amazon from getting a Bible.
There's tons of podcasts out there. There's Bible apps. There's so many resources to be able to get
the spiritual food you need. There's two randos that are talking on a Love and Context podcast.
Right. Exactly. And so we should take note of this, of like Joseph took care of that for himself.
He made sure he was going to be fed. Yeah. Right. And then he used that to bless his whole region.
Yeah. And believe me, if you're like, well, they paid for the food. I was like, it's still a blessing.
Still a blessing. Because there's no other food around. Yeah. I want to share a quick story and
we'll probably end the podcast on this and people are going to be like, that's a really weird way to
end it. Are you ready for that? We like weird. I had a pastor when I was in college and he made
a comment about, he's like, people come to the church and they're like, well, I'm just not being
fed. I'm not getting, you know, I'm not getting what I need. I'm not being fed. And he's like,
you know, if you eat and eat and eat and eat and you never go, it's called constipation and you can
die from it. The church today is spiritually constipated because we're so busy eating that
we never go and be. The church has been eating so much and eating and eating and eating and they
never go and be the church. They're like, ah, I love God with all my heart, soul, mind and strength.
And my neighbor is also there. No, it's time to actually put what you've been eating into use
and go and be the body of Christ. And the foods you've been eating is good. It's good. Like it is
so good. Like if you're talking spiritual food, we're not talking the top ramen and spiritual food
here. We're talking like high end steaks, the ice cream with the gold flakes on it. Like the
restaurants that us poor people wish we could eat at, right? That's the spiritual food we're getting
and we're being called to, hey, take that and share it. That's huge. Like take that spiritual
food and share that. Like, so just to take this analogy a little bit further, if you, if you go
to someone who has nothing, someone who needs food and you give them a Twinkie, they're probably
going to be thankful and they're probably going to eat it. Right. You take that same person and
we're in Alaska and go get them some really good fish and chips. It's a totally different ball
game for them. Yeah. I'm going to change this analogy just slightly and say, Hey guys, maybe
it's time for us to have a bigger table. Yeah. And to invite those people to that table. Mm hmm.
I was, I was talking with a few people a while back and I was like, so often the church, what
they do is they invite, they invite people out and they're like, Hey, why don't you come to coffee
with me? And then what they do is they throw their crap all over every seat at the table they're
sitting at. And they're like, by the way, you need a stand. It's no wonder they leave.
It's like, you gotta have room for them to sit down and feel welcomed. Yeah.
I don't know if you're familiar with God's table, but it's pretty big. There's a lot of spots in
there. It's time for us to live like it's a bigger table and get some people here to eat. Yes. And
there's tons of food on it. Stop complaining about the fact that you got to eat, eat, eat, eat,
eat. It's time for you to go and invite and bring, bring that food out. We're mixing metaphors all
over the place, but you guys understand what we're saying. It's time to be the church. Yeah. Yeah.
So that's Genesis. Like that's the invitation. Jacob is going to die and he's going to, but he's
going to tell his kids that he wants to be buried back in his homeland, right? With his, with his
ancestors. And Joseph is going to honor that, but then the Israelites are going to be in Egypt
and that's going to be their home. Right. Now we know the story that's coming up next, right? We
understand what's coming up in Exodus, but at this point, this is a good thing. The question is,
when you live in Egypt, do you now become Egypt or do you stay God's people? Yeah. And I think
that's the question as we move into the Exodus that we actually have to start asking because Egypt
gets so inside of the people that even when they're let out, they're still in Egypt.
Boy, if there was only a relevant story for the church today. Yeah. So next time we're going to
talk about that. If you have thoughts, comments, please email us at love and context at gmail.com.
You can also follow us on Instagram at love and context. We want to hear from you. We also would
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other social media platforms out there. We know. Don't worry. Instagram is where we're at right now.
Yeah. Yeah. We're just shy of Boomer. Yep. Just shy of Boomer. That's not true. We're a lot
else. Yeah. Thanks for listening guys. And until next time.
Thank you so much for listening today. We hope you enjoyed this podcast and we hope that you got
something out of it. If you have any questions, please contact us at love and context at gmail.com.
You can also follow us on Instagram and message us through there. Instagram is love and context.
Again, love and context at gmail.com or Instagram are the two ways to get ahold of us. And we'll see
you next time. Thank you. Once again, we really appreciate you being here. God bless.