Season two of Love in Context podcast welcomes you. Get ready for engaging unscripted conversations
with your hosts, Ben and Spencer. Our mission remains unchanged to explore the Bible through
the powerful lens of love. In this new season, we'll embark on a journey together, unearthing
fresh insights and gaining deeper understanding of how we can love God and live out our faith
in practical ways. So let's dive into this season of Love in Context, where love in the
context of the Bible intersect to transform our lives. Welcome to the Love in Context
podcast with Ben and Spencer. I'm Spencer. I'm Ben. And I'm back. He's back. So back
in town. Wait, what's that song that goes? Well, I never, to be fair, I never left town.
Yeah, that's true. My schedule just got insane. Yeah. What do we say? Summers are stupid.
Yeah. Summers in Alaska are stupid. Like they're fantastic. Don't get me wrong. But they're
also kind of stupid. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So you guys have been listening
to you were listening to me and Brian talk for the last couple of weeks and it was a
lot of fun. Yeah, I'm really kind of annoyed that that guy's leaving us. Yeah, he's too
great. But that is a huge pickup for Idaho. Yes, it is. So we're in our third week of
the book of James. And I just wanted to kind of remind everybody where we are up to this
point. You'll notice that I have, if you're watching the video version, you notice I have
printed notes where I normally go off my phone because Ben's old. Yeah, it's well, yeah.
Pastor Nick is listening. I also have difficulty reading pages. That's an inside joke. And
basically Pastor Nick is the oldest 37 year old you'll ever meet. Yes, it's true. I know
I have I have physical pages because we're now using my phone for the picture, which
by the way, we look a lot nicer, but it's really hard to reference the notes on your
phone when you're using the phone and also the computer is recording. So like, I'm like,
do you think I could justify for Tara that now I need to buy myself an iPad for the podcast?
Well, bro, you make enough money just to buy yourself an iPad. That's the nice thing about
being an adult. Right? Uh huh. Yeah. Also backing up to Pastor Nick, like I have preached
with him before and have had him be like, I need to print these notes off with bigger
font. Yes. And I was like, I was like, you are the oldest 37 year old I've ever met.
Like I was, uh, I would say that to his face. Don't worry. His father in law was I was talking
about. I said that Nick acts like a 75 year old and his father in law, 75 and he's like,
75 isn't that old. I was like, it is when you're 37 and he's like, yep, that's true.
That's 100% true. Yep. Um, so the last, last couple of weeks we introduced, uh, the book
of James and we talked about how James is speaking to a Jewish audience as James half
brother Jesus speaking to a Jewish audience in the Dyspora. So they're out, uh, not in
Jerusalem. They're actually dispersed out all throughout the regions. And, uh, so he's
coming to them in the, in a very similar vein of fashion, like the wisdom of Ben Sirach
or Proverbs. And he's saying, Hey, as followers of Jesus, as a Jewish followers of Jesus,
like what are we actually going to do in this area to, um, be different? And so he starts
off and he talks about trials. I wish you talked a lot about in the first week with
Brian and about how trials are meant to actually refine in us to be the kind of people who
are, um, uh, to get into the next part, not just hearers of the word, but doers of the
word, right? Uh, that we allow God to use trials, both self-inflicted and world-inflicted
to refine us into what he wants us to be. And we talked about like, it started touching
and we'll touch a little bit more on this today with a favoritism and like not showing
preferential treatment because somebody has a lot of money or doesn't have a lot of money
or they smell good or they don't smell good. I didn't mean to look at you when I said,
smell good. I mean, I've been working outside until this point, so I probably don't smell
the best right now, but also I'm just going to be real honest with both the podcast listeners
and you. I don't spend a whole lot of time smelling you. Yeah, that's fair. That's not
something that's regular part of my day. Yeah. Um, but then he, he, and, uh, this was really
what we talked about in the last week's episode was this idea of your faith. The things that
you believe in should shape what you do. Yes. Like how you behave. Right. Um, and with that
being said, that, that then pivots into chapter three, where he starts talking about the taming
of the tongue. Yeah. And we're actually going to read that. I'm going to open up here. I
got it. The book of Jacob, also known as James. So I'll just start here in chapter three.
I did, uh, make mention by the way, you haven't listened to that episode yet at the, at least
at the time of this recording, um, that we're not reading out of the NLT despite it being
your favorite. Well, no, I'm just say we should read out of it because it's the best. Yeah.
All right. So charting it starting in the beginning of chapter three, it says, not many
of you should become teachers. Very encouraging. My fellow believers, because you know that
we who teach will be judged more strictly. We all stumble in many ways. Anyone who is
never at fault at what they say is perfect, able to keep their whole body in check. When
we put bits in the mouths of horses and make them obey us, we can turn the whole animal
or take ships as an example. Although they're so large and are driven by strong winds, they
are steered by a very small rudder wherever the pilot wants to go. Likewise, the tongue
is a small part of the body, but it makes great boost. Consider what a great force is
set on fire by a small spark. The tongue is also a fire, a world setting a world of evil
among the parts of the body. It corrupts the whole body, sets the whole course of one's
life on fire and is itself set on fire by hell. All kinds of animals, birds, reptiles
and sea creatures are being tamed and have been tamed by mankind, but no one, no human
being can tame the tongue. It is a restless evil full of deadly poison. With the tongue,
we praise our Lord and father. And with it, we curse human beings who have been made in
God's likeness out of the same mouth, come praise and cursing my brothers and sisters.
They should not be. Can both freshwater and saltwater flow from the same spring? My brothers
and sisters, can a fig tree bear olives or grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring
produce fresh water. Okay. We're going to pause there because we're going to continue
on in our discussion today. But this is, this is when I saw this section coming up, I was
like, we're probably going to park here for a little bit. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So that is
quite the statement about the tongue. Yes. Specifically, this comes on the heels of not
many of you should choose to be teachers. Right? So in the context of being a believer, believer,
in the context of being a believer and being a follower of Jesus, we have this thing about
how the tongue is incredibly destructive. And I just think that every leader who is
listening should just take a pause and hear that. Yeah. Right? Yeah. So starting at three,
one, where it talks about teachers, I think one of the hard things here is like we interpreted
as like, okay, well only a select few people can teach, preach the gospel. Correct. Which
that's not what's actually going on here. Yeah. What are you saying? Is he saying when you
do, you're going to be judged more strictly. Yeah. And, and as far as like, and it's more
so like you shouldn't, like it shouldn't be a desired position to be a well-known teacher.
Well or I mean, maybe a better way to think about this is case. If somebody, if I don't
know how to drive and I open a school for driving awesomely. Right? And I teach people
how to drive incorrectly. Please call it driving. Awesome. That's, that's going to be the name
then school of driving awesomely. And then people graduate from that school with a certificate
that says I went to Ben's school of driving awesomely. And then they go out in their cars
and they wreck everything. I'm partially responsible for that. Right? Because they went to a school
with the assumption that I'm actually teaching them to be good drivers. Yeah. Right now,
of course there's personal responsibility. Like of course there's personal responsibility,
but there is a responsibility as me as a teacher. If I'm going to teach things to teach them
correctly. Yeah. Now every teacher that I know has made a misstep at some point. They've
made a statement that is factually incorrect or they connected a piece of a verbiage to
the wrong part. Actually you were talking about a pastor on Sunday who had a slip of
the tongue. Right? And they said they wanted to quote from Hebrews 412 and they instead
quoted Hebrews for quoted it as 411. Yeah. They, they quoted 412 but references 411.
Yeah. I mean that, that stuff happens. Like the teacher, he's not a, he's not purposely
maliciously misleading people and everybody knew what he was talking about. But when you're
teaching, when you're talking, when you're doing those things, it's very easy to say
the wrong thing. And I think the other part with this, this couple of verses here is we
need to have grace with our teachers because we are going to misstep, right? Like you and
I have the opportunity and privilege of preaching in church pretty regularly. We are going to
misstep. Correct. Right. And it even says so right, right here where in, in chapter
three, verse two, it says we all stumble in many ways. Anyone who is never at fault in
what they say is perfect, able to keep their whole body in check. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So,
I mean, James is saying right there, he's like, you're going to stumble. Yeah. Like
that's not the thing. He's saying like, this is going to happen. Like you're going to stumble.
You're going to fall short. Um, so let's have grace with our teachers. Well, and I think,
I think if you compare this with especially what's been going on in James so far, right?
Um, if you stumble, what's that going to do for you moving forward? Um, one of, one of
the things we've talked about with teachers that we really appreciate are people who,
when they realize they said something incorrectly or reference something incorrectly, they'll
come back and say, Hey, I said this last time and that was incorrect. Um, having the humility
to say, Hey, I'm not infallible is a really big deal. Um, but how many times have you
been a part of a ministry where somebody says something incorrectly and they just keep doubling
down on it? Right. Yeah. Cause they don't want it to be up here. I don't know. One of
the healthiest churches I've ever been a part of the pastor, there's he constantly from
the pulpit would say, you need to know your scripture and you need to know it so well
that you can actually check what I'm saying. Right. And like, and that, that being the
challenge to the congregation of like, you know your scripture so well that when I'm
teaching that you hopefully are getting something from this, but you can also recognize when
I am not speaking truth and then you can come have a conversation with me about it. Yeah.
Well, and it's, it's so crucial as believers that we learn like the power that our voices,
that our words have. Yes. Um, one of the things that I have, I have struggled with through
most of my life and I referenced it in the first episode of James is that like, so my
son is diagnosed with autism, but I've noticed that a lot of the, um, things with autism
I also struggle with. And so low emotional intelligence has been one of them and it has
taken me a, it took me a long time and many years of marriage to really start grasping.
Like when I say things, how people react to them and that even though it may be factually
accurate, there may be a better way to say it that is more considered out of their feelings.
Right. Well, my, my wife has mentioned that about you and she's, and she's been like,
oh, but I know Ben doesn't mean no by it. So she's like, it's whatever. I'll just let
it roll off and it'll be fine. Yeah. It's a, it is a perpetual process for me. Yeah.
Um, I am, I am better today than I was a year ago and I hopefully will be a better year
from now than I am today. Yes. Children do a lot for that by the way they do. Cause you're
like, you're like, okay, how do I say this nicely while you are infuriating me? Well,
children are also a good gauge on like helping you watch your tongue because there's been
a number of times in my house where I've said something and then my daughter's like, oh
dad, what does that mean? And I was like, oh crap, that just came out of my mouth. That's
not something I want you to say. We're like, no, we're not like any, you know, and then
you get to have a conversation and be like, I'm sorry kid. That was a slip of the tongue.
I shouldn't have let that happen. Right. Well, and it's, uh, and perhaps the place that I
see one, I shouldn't say the most destructive, but in the church where there's a lot of destruction
with the tongue is in this form of gossip. Like a lot of times people won't necessarily
say hurtful things to people's face though. It is absolutely an issue, but a lot, there's
a lot of character assassination that happens behind people's backs. Yeah. You know, I'm
thinking of like, when we can think back to Torah where, um, Miriam and, and Aaron are
having this conversation. They're like, well, Moses has a Kushite wife and I'm not sure
how I feel about that. And blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, this conversation that's
kind of like not really helpful. Yeah. Right. And, uh, ultimately doesn't end well for them
in that situation, but, um, in, in our churches, in our, as teachers and as congregants, uh,
like I just don't know that there's a lot of intention behind our words. Yeah. Well,
can we pick on gossip for a little bit? Yeah. Cause I mean, I think it's just a good example.
Uh, unfortunately the reality with gossip is a lot of times when we do gossip about
somebody it's our perceived perspective of that person. Right. It's not necessarily the
truth about them. And like there might be elements of truth in it, but it's often our
perspective of that quote unquote truth. Yeah. Cause we thought we, we mentioned that briefly
in the, in the, um, hypocrisy episode is that we tend to judge people by their actions and
ourselves by our intentions. Yeah. So, so what happens when we gossip is we'll say something
about somebody, right? And then somebody else will meet that person and then they'll realize,
wait a second, what, what Ben said about that person actually isn't fully true. And then
what it actually does is it tears down your own character. Right. And so like it takes
it like, and if you're like, well, man, I'm trying to live with a good reputation with
Christ. So people can see that I am following God, but then you go gossip about these people.
And then, then other people are meeting the people you're gossiping about. And they're
like, wait, that's not fully true. Then you have this assassination of your own character
that's going on in your own, uh, your own reliability and your own trustworthiness.
Yeah. Right. Right. I'm growing up. One of the things my mom always said is she's always
like, yeah, I always look at how other people are talking about other people and that determines
how much I share with that person. Absolutely. And she's, and she was like, and, and, and
that wasn't like, okay, I'm casting judgment, necessarily casting full judgment on them,
even though there was some element of judgment there, but that was more so of like, Hey,
I can see how they're slandering people. So I'm going to be careful what I say, say around
that person, uh, for the sake of my name, not being slandered because I'm here for Christ.
And so, you know, gossip can be something that is so destructive, even though it can
seem so minor and minuscule. Yeah. Um, somebody made, uh, there's a, there's that old phrase.
I don't know if you remember it is sticks and stones may break my bones, but your words
will never hurt me. I don't know if that's actually ever been true. Like people's, your
words can absolutely hurt people and they can hurt them drastically. I mean, I like
the idea of not allowing people's words to get past you, but I think in practicality
in real life, that's not true. Especially when, if you care about somebody, I don't
think it's a black and white issue. Right. Right. I think, I think there's a little bit
more of a grayness there because no, it's only black and white. It's right there. That's
we're only dealing in black and white today, Spencer. I'm going to buy you a black and
white TV and replace your TV in your house when you're not looking. And then you're going
to be like, what's going on? I'm actually going to be more impressive. You can find a
black and white TV. Oh, I'm going to do it. Yeah. I believe it. I believe it. I'm going
to be more impressed with that. But I think it's more of a gray issue because like there,
there are people who have said some slanderous things about me that I'm like, okay, that's
whatever. Right. Right. Um, and there are other people when they say something slanderous
about me, it's like, no, I want to go talk to them because it's like, I have a great
deal of respect for them. I have a deeper relationship with them. Right. Um, and then
it's also like, I also know people who in the past who have said slanderous things about
me, who they say slanderous things about everybody. Yeah. And then for people like that, I'm like,
okay, I'm just going to let that roll off the shoulder. Yeah. Cause that's just what
they do. Um, so I think, I think there's more, I think, I think there's more of a relational
aspect to it that can be applied to the gossip. Yeah. I want, and more of my, more of the
reason to even bring it up is, is I think, um, you, you can do people a disservice where
they're like, oh, well they're just words. I was like, well, yeah, they are sometimes
I was like, but it depends like how it's received matters. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Like how, how
what you say is received matters. Uh, does that mean that every person should take offense
at everything? A single thing you say? No. Does it mean that you should think about what
you say and how you communicate with people? Yes. Yeah. And there's, and there's a difference
between gossiping and venting. Yeah. Right. Like, so I, in conversations with my wife,
we often different people come up and we vent and we have conversations, right? It's usually
about me. Yeah. It's usually, it's usually me. It's usually Ben. Um, mostly because yeah,
there's a long list. We're not going to go to that right now. There's a, there's a long
list. We actually have it on a scroll. We unroll every night and we're like, uh, item
number one, item number 47 to the notch. Um, but, uh, where was I going? Oh, so like, so
about my wife and I, we've created a place where it's safe for us to be okay. This really
frustrated me. This is why it frustrated me, but it doesn't leave that space. Right. Right.
She doesn't go around and call Tara and be like, all right, Tara Spencer said this about
Ben. Right. Right. And vice versa. Like when you and your, when you and Tara are talking
and like Tara doesn't turn around and call Lindsay and be like, Oh, Ben said this about
Spencer. No, his beard is getting too long. Tara is actually a really good, like when
we're, when we're having those conversations and venting on about whatever like situations.
And she's like, she'll say things like, well, it sounds like you're being irrationally upset
at that person and that maybe you should just take a break, take a couple of breaths and
just get over it. And you know, not necessarily like that. Like that's how, what I hear it.
And I hear her and I'm like, Oh yeah, you're probably right. You know, like, I want to
be mad at you, but you're correct. I was like, listen, I understand that you're, you're right
right now, but I am not happy about it. Right. Um, but there is, uh, and, and I think, I
think James does a really good job of really stressing this. There is a, there is an added
responsibility. The more people that listen to your voice, the bigger platform you have,
the more influence you have. Yes. Uh, it does become more crucial for you to be cognizant
of your speech. Yeah. Now I think that's especially important when we think about like this whole
kingdom of trolls idea, right? This idea of that, like outrage is what sells. Like there
are people who are building their platform by tearing other people down and, uh, in the
name of the kingdom, you know, quote unquote kingdom, the quote unquote kingdom of God.
Right. Uh, and the, the reality is when you actually just look at what James has to say,
they're starting fires everywhere. Yeah. Right. They've got, they've got their tongue, uh,
building fires in all these different forests. And it becomes really important that, um,
the more people are listening to you, the more they're relying on you, the more that
they are learning from you, that you have a humility and a responsibility in your speech,
that you're being careful about the things that you say. Uh, you talked about being a
parent, uh, as a parent teaching my son, what's right and wrong. I have to have to be a lot
more cognizant of what I say. So, uh, things that Tara and I may have said, you know, flippantly
jokingly, like some of those things, because we're adults and we understand how to use,
uh, just different, like, like I can use, I can use like, uh, some words to represent
like multiple ideas. And so like, she's able to track it. A five year old can't. And so
I use it and he's very confused. And so he repeats what I said, but when he repeats it,
because he doesn't understand what's going on, it tends to be less appropriate. You're
like, Oh, yeah. And, uh, and so like being aware of that, um, is, is a really big, is
a big responsibility and, um, which is why I think we've stressed on the podcast. We're
very careful not to mention people we disagree with as much as possible, right?
Well, I want to trust that the Lord's doing a work through them, right? Cause like, like
even in James, James is writing to the Jewish believers across the scattered nations at
the time. So like he's addressing people who follow Jesus and he's saying, Hey, be careful,
right? Be careful how you talk about each other. Cause, cause we want to trust that
the Lord is still doing a work in their lives. Well, and, and it's not just the destructive
side that he talks about because he also says like, uh, the tongue can also be like a bit
that you put in a horse's mouth or it's a rudder that steers a ship, right? So these
are very helpful things because like the, the bit helps to keep the horse on track,
right? The rudder gets the, like takes all the energy that's going into a boat and gets
it going in the right direction, right? But it has both positives and it has both negatives
that impact the way that you're having these conversations. And he really gets down to
it when he says with the same mouth, you bless God and then you curse people who are actually
made in the image of God. Like that's just, uh, it's not, that's not good. That's not
a good combination. He even goes on and says like, this cannot be, like this should not
be right. Because it's like, if you're going to bless God and then curse his creation,
he's like, you're actually doing an insult towards God, right? Because coming back to
Torah, which by the way, James referencing here again, mankind is made in the image of
God. Yeah. And so if you actually curse the image of God, man, yeah. Also let's, let's
go ahead and just like take one step beyond that. Do you remember, uh, in our Torah series,
like how often mankind is trying to step into like the cursing role and how well that ever
ends up? It doesn't end well. It does not end well. Spoiler alert for those who did
not listen to the Torah series, it doesn't end up Noah, Noah cursing his great grandson
or his grandson doesn't end up well. Doesn't end well. Then there'll be an a thorn in their
side, you know, all the curses that are loving it out. Oh, how about when a bailik wants
Balaam to curse the Israelites does not end well for him. Right? Like cursing, like if,
if somebody is going to curse it is going to be God. Yeah. Like some things we need
to make sure to like leaving God's hands and well, actually, you know what? Let's most
things we should probably leave in God's hands and we should stick to what he asked us to
do, which is to, um, do the work, trust him and walk faithfully. Well, the things we should
take into our own hands are the things that God has asked us to do. Correct. Uh, you and
I and like you and I individually and us corporately, right? It's not, it's not what we think other
people should do because there are convictions that other people have that might be very
good for them, but might not be very applicable to somebody else. So, um, yeah, because jumping
to another idea from Paul, not from James, he's talking about this meat sacrifice to
idols, which is the example that's used on frequent. Like if you doesn't bother you,
like eat the cheap meat, right? But if it is like going to cause conflict in your spirit,
you shouldn't do it. But the not meat people shouldn't judge the meat people and the meat
people shouldn't judge and not meet people. Everybody has to live out their convictions.
Yep. Yeah. And so when we're, when we're talking about the tongue, we're talking about a small
thing that can cause in measurable damage. And so that's why it's so important that we
rein it in. Well, and, and, uh, with that idea, because remember these are not written in
seclusion, seclusion, they're connecting ideas. So he's has this whole idea, but you can't
have a salt spring that produces fresh water. Right? So who is wise continuing verse 13
and understanding among you, let them show it by their good life, by deeds done in humility
that comes from wisdom. But if you harbor bitter envy and selfish ambition in your heart,
do not boast about it or deny the truth. Such quote unquote wisdom does not come down from
heaven, but is earthly, unspiritual and demonic for where you have envy and selfish ambition.
There you have disorder in every evil practice, but the wisdom that comes from heaven is first
of all, pure, then peace loving, considerate submission, full of mercy and good fruit,
impartial and sincere peacemakers who sow in peace, reap a harvest of righteousness.
Okay. So if your wisdom in approaching somebody and having a conversation about correctness,
perfection, isn't peace, loving, considerate, submissive, full of mercy and good fruit,
impartial and sincere, it's probably not from heaven. Right? Now that doesn't mean it's
not direct. It doesn't mean it's not dealing with issues. Uh, this is hearkening back to
earlier in chapter two, James has talked about where are you going to look for wisdom? Are
you looking from the world, from your wealth, from your creation, like things you can earn
or you trusting in God for all of these things? Are you showing partiality to people who have
a lot of money because you're like, Oh, they got wisdom. They got to figure out. Right.
Yeah. Right. And, Oh man, the earthly wisdom versus heavenly wisdom. That's something we
could do like a whole episode on, but, um, but as soon as envy and deceit sneak in, uh,
at least I have found in my life, that's when the destructive nature of the tongue becomes
more vocal. Yeah. Um, that's what I found in my life. Somebody else has something else
that you want. Yeah. That's what I found in my life. When it's happened to me, when I've
seen it happen to other people, when they're like, man, I want to be like that person or
they become deceitful about something or try to sneak it around about something. And then
they try to justify that is when the destruction of the tongue becomes so evident. Yeah. That's
that whole idea of envy. And, uh, I don't remember when we talked about, um, the 10
commandments and we were doing the connection that Foreman does. And he actually connects
like envy with, uh, like this whole envious thing with actually like murder. Yeah. Right.
And like how they're like, I want to be you. So I need to eliminate you so I can be you.
Yeah. Right. Like that's absolutely a thing. Yeah. Um, I was actually thinking about in
my industry, I had this conversation with a, uh, with a coworker recently and, uh, we
were talking about success and I said, you know, the thing is that my success doesn't
diminish yours as like, nor will your success diminish mine. And when it does, my success
stops mattering. Yeah. Right. Like I think it kind of comes back to like, I have to keep
thinking back to like Kane with his whole thing of Abel gets the, gets the, uh, approval
from God and his is not approved. And like, is his mind reeling towards, there's only
so much approval that can come from God. Right. Now that's speculative. That's Jewish conversation.
I was like, but that's like the whole idea of envy is, uh, you grew up in a, in a family
with a bunch of kids, mom and dad only have so much attention. Maybe I should get rid
of the right Spencer get out. No, my dad listens to this. He did not do that. Just
to be very clear. No, no, we, we both have parents who have been incredibly loving. Yes.
But, um, but there is, there is, especially with when your family is large, like people
are like, oh, well, you know, but that's not how love works. Love is able to, uh, move
exponentially. But to say that there's never a feeling of so and so gets more attention.
Right. My brothers and I have had that conversation about how they're like, well, you never get
in trouble for X, Y, Z. And you get away with blah, blah, blah. I'm the youngest. First
of all, I get away with everything. Second of all, I have had that exact conversation
with my dad about my younger brothers. Yeah. Um, it'll get a little too close for Spencer
that time. Well, there's actually, there is one conversation that I can recall. And, and,
uh, my dad will probably laugh when he listens to this, but, but growing up, like my older
brother and I were like, mom, dad, can we get tattoos? And they're like, no, absolutely
not. You cannot get tattoos. Right. Under no circumstances. Like you will be in so much
trouble if you do. We're like, okay. My younger brothers, they turned 16, they drove them
from Washington to Idaho to get tattoos. And we were like, what the crap? And like, and
my dad just looks at us. He's like, get over it. And, uh, and so, um, you know, but they're
this, I, this idea of envy, you know, the wanting what other people have, right? Like
wanting, uh, I mean, an example, example in Lindsay in my life is like, we have, we do
not work in fields that make us rich, right? Like we're, we do not work in areas where
we are going to be monetarily wealthy within a few years. Yeah. I was going to say you
don't work in fields that compensate you financially. Yes. You're compensated other ways and, uh,
spiritually, emotionally, like a lot of those things. Yeah. Right. Right. So like we drive
20 year old cars. We always have, we, you know, we make our own tortillas at home. We
do a lot of homemade homemade food. Uh, I know how to fix cars. I do most of the work
around the house, like all this stuff, all stuff that I've learned because we have chosen
a lifestyle to where we want to be a blessing to other people. Um, but that doesn't mean
that we're going to, but it also means that we don't have a lot of monthly income, right?
Um, not, and, uh, but it's really easy for me to look at other people and be like, man,
it'd be really nice to have a brand new car. Right. Yeah. Right. But the reality is, is
what's the car, what's the car supposed to do? Get you from point A to point B, point
A to point B. And what's a brand new car going to do? Get you from point A to point B. And
what's my 20 year old car going to do? Get you from point A to halfway to point B. It
gets me there most of the time. Most of the time, most of the time. Yeah. I do have occasions.
Yeah, there are occasions. There are occasions, but, but, um, but the point being is that
a lot of times the things that we are envious about don't matter. Yeah. And well, it's,
it's about learning to be content. And I can't remember which episode it was that we talked
about this. And I said, you know, I've had people say, well, you know, if I had X, Y
or Z suddenly my life would be better. But that's never actually been the case. Yeah.
Right. If you're not content where you are now, you're not going to be when you have
whatever it is. Yeah. So, right. And, uh, and that's, that's for everybody, like across
the spectrum, whether you're of low economic means, high economic means, low spiritual
needs, high spiritual needs, uh, whatever your situation is, um, like generosity and
like, and, um, like being, being a generous person is not regardless, it's not tied to
your amount of money. No, no, I do a lot of fundraising in my job and I can tell you the
people who give the most do not have high paying jobs. Yeah. They're generous people.
Yeah. They're just generous people who care. Yeah, absolutely. And, uh, and I was like,
if you are, if you are a higher earning person, then you have the ability to show a lot of
your generosity. Like it's, it's a, it's a very nice thing. Um, but this comes back to
once again, we've talked about identity as I said, the, the thing is if you are gifted
to make money, go make money for the kingdom of God, the benefits, the forwarding of his
kingdom, right? And if you are, um, gifted in ministry and speaking, then you go and
you speak and for the purpose of moving forward, the ministry of God, right? Whatever it is
that you're called to do, you go and do it for the kingdom of God. Yeah. And you shouldn't
stop being who God made you to be. You should go and do that, but it's no longer for you.
It's for those around you. Yeah. And so you have two contrasting ideas in this section
of James, which you have the idea of envy and deceit and the idea of sincerity. Right.
Right. Like, like the wisdom of the world says, be deceitful, be envious until you get
what you want, until you do better, until you have nicer things. And the wisdom of God
says, be sincere about who you are. Yeah. Right. And that sincerity of who we are in
Christ will Trump anything the world has to offer.
So you're just talking about that. And I always want to continue on into four, what causes
fights and quarrels among you, right? Don't they come from your desires that battle within
you, you desire, but do not have. So you kill, you covet, but you cannot get what you want.
So you quarrel and fight. You do not have because you do not ask God. And when you ask,
you do not receive because you ask with the wrong motives that you may spend what you
get on your pleasures. You adulterous people. Don't you know the friendship with the world
means enmity against God. Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes
an enemy of God. Or do you think the scripture says without reason that he jealously longs
for the spirit he has caused to dwell in us, but he gives us more grace. This is why the
scripture says God opposes the proud, but gives favor to the humble, by the way, gives
us more grace. That's why he says he opposes the proud opposition from God when you're
in your pride is actually good for you.
I think that's a hard thing to hear because your pride is going to kill you. Submit yourselves
then to God, resist the devil and he will flee. Come near to God and he will come near
to you. Wash your hands, you sinners and purify your hearts. You double minded, grieve, mourn
and wail. Change your laughter to mourning and your joy to glim. Humble yourselves before
the Lord and he will lift you up. Okay. How many times have you heard this statement about
flee the devil and resist the devil and he will flee? Right. But it's actually in this
context of not envying, not fighting, not quarreling. Like if there is ever a time that
Satan is impacting you, it's when you're talking to your brothers and sisters in Christ. Right.
That second of envy.
Yeah. And oftentimes what Satan does is when you are having a conversation with your brother
or sister in Christ and then you find a point where you're like, I don't know if I fully
agree with that. Satan's like, Oh, let me see if I can sneak my foot in that door. Right.
Right. Let me see if we can make this disagreement way bigger than it needs to be. Um, I can
tell you right now, Ben and I have had disagreements and there's been times where one or two I've
been like, what has been talking about? And then we sit down and we talk about it. We're
like, Oh, okay. That's not a big deal. Yeah. Like, and we move on. Yeah. There is just,
there's just these things when two people have different brains, they think about things
differently and like learning to ask questions and be curious. Yeah. Big thing with friendship.
Yeah. So I've, I've learned how to ask questions about why Ben's brain is wrong all the time.
Um, but you know, sorry. No, I mean, that's fine. I'm going to send that clip to Lindsay
and she'll be like, well, what about Spencer's brain? That's a hundred percent what she will
do. Uh, no, but it's, I mean, but I remember cause we were having this conversation and
we were talking about a church topic and I remember we were both talking about it and
we actually both actually thought exact same thing. We're just coming at it from different
sides. We're coming at it from different spots. And I was like, I don't quite understand what
you're saying. So I, we clarify and then suddenly I'm like, Oh, I understand exactly what you
mean now. That's just not how I was thinking about it. Yeah. And, uh, and I, I actually
think at that point when we were sitting around the fire, I was just, I actually mentioned,
uh, can you imagine if we just went away thinking we knew what the other person meant and never
bothered to stop and have a further conversation about it? Yeah. Well, I, I recall another
time this is years ago, Lindsay and I were having a conversation and we were saying the
same thing. We were coming at it from a very different, like from different lenses and
we were just going at it being like, we'll be like, what are you talking about? And like
doing all this stuff. We worked together at the time and there was an intern that was
working with us and our intern who was like 10 years younger than us was like, you're
saying the same thing. And we're like, Oh, we are. That's right. Okay. That's just like,
are they like, but the intern was like quiet for a long time because she was like super
stressed of like, Oh, what's going on? They're fighting and then why are they fighting? And
then then they're like, Oh, we are. And then we're good. And then, uh, then the intern
was like, wait, you guys are okay. And I was like, yeah, we're fine. We were just having
a conversation. Yeah. Like, you know, like we're good because we realized we're saying
the same thing. We're just going to let the past be the past. I mean, I think this comes
back down. This comes back to first Corinthians 13 when Paul is talking about, when he's talking
about love, right? But he says one of the trademarks of love is not holding records
wrong. Right. Do you think maybe some of the issue that sometimes we run into when we're
talking about loving people is that we think that love is the absence of conflict. I think
so. And that's just not going to be true. Like there's going to be conflict. We're going
to disagree. We're different people. We think about things differently. There's going to
be conflict. But the question is, is my love for you greater than our conflict? Yes. Um,
I have a story actually that I think is great about not understanding each other. So when
Tara and I lived in Vancouver, Washington, we were, um, it was a very busy day. I can't
remember what happened, but I had one of those nights where, um, I was not over 30 at that
point, but I had one of those over 30 nights where you sleep on your neck wrong and you
wake up and everything hurts. Right. So I had a really bad headache. So we went and
I can't remember. We went to like a, like a, um, garage sale and some different things
and Tara had to work in about an hour and a half. So we were heading back and we stopped
at the drive through to get McDonald's, not a sponsor. And Nick, yes, I understand there
are other restaurants besides McDonald's. That's just where we went. And this is how
the story goes. Um, so we stopped at McDonald's and I asked her what she wanted. She told
me what she wanted. We go home. I wasn't thinking anything of anything. Um, we go home and we're
sitting down and I'm going and, uh, and I dropped some, some fries on the floor and
I was like, ah, and I, and I was like really upset. And she's like, what? Like, she like
screams and I'm like, nothing. I dropped fries on the floor and I was just annoyed. And then
I bring the food out to her and, uh, and I put it on there and then, um, and then I went
to go grab the bag that had like the burgers in it. As I went to go grab it, the whole
bag ripped, like my fingers went right through it and I threw them across the room. Right.
And uh, so some of you are like just visualizing this and it's, it's just, it was not great.
Uh, and then it's Tara. She stands up, she takes her fries and she throws them on the
couch. Right. And then she picks up her drink, thinks better of it and sets it down and walks
out of the room and goes upstairs to our bedroom. And I'm about to go out to her to figure out
what the heck just happened. Cause I'm confused. And as I'm going, I kicked the drink over
and knocked it all the way under our area car, our carpet. Right. So this big supersize
drink. Yeah. I was, we were having a day. So then I'm cleaning it up and I finally get
upstairs and Tara, you have to go to work in 45 minutes, come downstairs and eat. She
comes down and she says, she says, why are you, why are you so mad at me? And I'm like,
I'm not mad at you at all. Now Tara tells her perspective and I'd been quiet. I've been
distant. I hadn't been saying anything because I was hurting. She didn't know I was hurting.
Right. Um, I came home, she heard me like I ordered food. I'm like, what do you want?
You know, like tonality, how you say things matters. I come home and I, I, uh, yell because
I dropped stuff on the floor. I bring her her food and then I throw burgers across the
room. Right. And she's just like, I'm done with this because this is the, this is the
tipping point. And she goes upstairs and we have this conversation. I was like, so what
are we fighting about? Oh, we're fighting about nothing. Literally nothing right now.
And uh, like learning to understand each other is a big deal. Yeah. Like that's that, that
is how our story, like that's how it happened because like we weren't taking the time to
be like, Hey, why is this happening? Yeah. And sometimes when you take the time to understand
things, you're like, Oh, this, there's an easy solution for this. Right. So, so I mean,
for me and my ADHD, like if things are behind closed doors, they're gone. They don't exist.
I don't remember they're there type thing. So are you, are you like a puppy or a bird?
If we put like a blanket over your face, do you think it's night? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No,
not that bad. Not that bad. Not that bad. So, so, but like Lindsay would always like
for the longest time in our marriage, she was like, why do you not put dishes back where
they go? And I was like, I was like, cause I don't really know like legitimately, I
was like, I don't really know where they go. She's like, how do you not know where they
go? I was like, because literally like once it goes behind a closed door, I don't like,
I just, it's gone. Like it's out of my mind. If you would like to send a sympathy cards
to Lindsay, you can send them to love and context care of gmail.com. Yeah. Yeah. Right.
And, and so she's like, so it frustrated her for years. And then finally she was like,
she was like, you know what? She's like, I think I have a solution. And she did, we just
took all the cabinet doors off. Perfect. Right. And then I saw where everything went and I
just put it away when I did dishes. And then she was like, that's all it took. So apparently
what we need to do is get you cabinet doors, but glass ones. Uh, so you can see through.
I mean, you could try that. Yeah. I probably still wouldn't work. Uh, yeah. I mean, if
I, I mean, as long as I can see it, it's fine. But like, but you know, that's, that's, she
always complains about my office being a mess too, because it's the same thing. Like I don't
spend a ton of time in there. And so then when I go in there, I'm like, oh yeah, I haven't
been in here in a while. And then I have to clean it up. Right. Right. And so, um, but
a lot of times these quarrels that we have, um, these quarrels that we have, they're very
simple solutions, but a lot of times we hang onto them for whatever reason, because of
maybe we want to prove ourselves. Right. Maybe when we want to prove the other person wrong,
just because we have something against that person. Right. Right. I don't know. I'm not,
I can't fill in the blank for you. Yeah. But, but a lot of times if we just sat down, had
a conversation, we can figure out a easy solution. Maybe if you had an unscripted conversation
with your friends, right? Exactly. Referencing like why we do our podcasts in general is
there's not enough times that Christians just sit down and talk and work their things out.
So in today's episode, we were talking about like, it's, it was the, the tongue, you got
to be careful. I was like, especially if you're going to be in any sort of like elevated position.
Yeah. Like you need to be considered what you're saying. You got to seek the right wisdom.
I wanted to finish off the last two verses, um, in 11 and 12, uh, not the last two verses
of chapter four, but the last two verses we're going to cover today, because I think this
is James is a really good job. That is summing up what we're talking about. Brothers and
sisters do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against a brother or sister or
judges them speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping
it, but sitting in judgment on it. There is only one law giver and judge the one who is
able to save and destroy, but you, who are you to judge your neighbor? That's a really
good place to leave that. Right? When you, when you're standing in judgment, don't slander,
don't judge when you're actually standing in judgment, you're actually standing against
the actual law. Now in James's case, he's referencing Torah and who was the Torah made
flesh? So when we're actually slandering, it's equivalent essentially to a slandering
Christ, right? Slandering his body, his bride, right? Probably not a good position for us
to be in. So we gotta be so careful. So careful. And we are going to make mistakes, a hundred
percent guarantee you will make mistakes, but consider it pure joy because every mistake
that you made and every mistake that you walk with and every, um, discomfort, every, uh,
piece of suffering that you go through, God will use to refine you into a better, more
clear version of Jesus. Yeah. And nothing is going to be wasted. So true. So with that,
I think we're going to be done with James for today and we're going to be back next
week finishing or not finishing. I said finishing. We'll be back next week continuing on in the
book of James. If you have any questions or anything, please feel free to comment or send
us information for the Q and a that will be coming up in just a little bit. Yep. Till
next time. And that's a wrap for today's episode of love and context. We hope you enjoyed this
engaging conversation and gained valuable insights into the powerful message of love
within the Bible. We'd love to hear from you and continue the conversation. Connect with
us by sending us your questions, thoughts, and suggestions to love and context at gmail.com.
We greatly appreciate your feedback and ideas for future episodes. Stay connected with us
on social media for updates, behind the scenes content and additional resources. You can
find us on Instagram, tick tock, YouTube and Facebook at love and context. Don't forget
to hit that follow button to stay up to date with the latest episodes and join our growing
community. Thank you for being part of the love and context family. Remember love is
at the heart of it all. Until next time, keep seeking wisdom, embracing love and living
out your faith in the context of today's world.