1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:06,600 Welcome to the love and context podcast engaging in unscripted conversations with your hosts Ben and Spencer 2 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:13,600 Whether you're tuning in from your car your office your home or anywhere in between we are so happy to have you join us today 3 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:20,120 Our mission is simple to explore the Bible through a powerful lens of love 4 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:28,600 Together will uncover fresh insights and gain deeper understandings of how we can love God and love the people in our everyday lives 5 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:34,080 So buckle up and join us on the spiritual journey as we discover timeless wisdom 6 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:41,460 That is just as relevant today as it was thousands of years ago without further ado. Let's dive right in 7 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:45,200 Welcome to the love and context podcast. I'm Ben 8 00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:52,560 I'm not Ben. Yeah, you are not Ben and then we're also joined by our friend pastor Nick again today. I'm back 9 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:55,860 Yeah, he said that this time he'll actually talk and not just shake his head 10 00:00:55,860 --> 00:00:58,680 Just a few words at this point in the series 11 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:03,120 I think we have said the desert is hot like a thousand times because your wife brought it up 12 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:09,120 I was really hoping to say that today. Yeah find the opportunity just for that. Well, they still are in the desert 13 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:13,320 So yeah, we are still in the desert. So like last week we literally said I think six times 14 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:15,680 Yeah, so it's just a thing now 15 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:19,720 So the last episode and ended up on this really good note because we talked about how 16 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:21,080 We're in the book of numbers 17 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:25,440 Whenever the cloud would stop they would camp and they would wait and then when the cloud moved they'd follow the cloud 18 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:27,040 And it was over and over again 19 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:32,720 It says in the scripture says when the cloud moved they was moved when the cloud stopped they stopped and it's like over and over again 20 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:36,560 It said this and you're like, yeah, I get the point. It's like but do you get the point? 21 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:44,160 Because we postulated that are the best thing we can do is recognize where Jesus is working and go there 22 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:47,600 And if he stays we stay and if he goes we go. Yeah 23 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:55,160 So that is the last fairly good story that happens for a little bit in the book of numbers because there's just there's a lot of 24 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:59,480 Stuff that is going on here because humanity we're kind of a mess sometimes just put it this way 25 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:03,880 Have you ever followed Jesus be like this is awesome. And then a week later you're like, why'd you bring me here? 26 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:10,720 Yeah, that's so good. What ends up happening right after this they set out and they're they're going from place to place 27 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:15,980 The first thing that happens is they start complaining. Of course they do naturally 28 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:18,360 naturally and 29 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:24,880 So says the Israelites complain and there's this word that they they have hardship and it might show up in your translations 30 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:29,740 But it isn't actually in the text says that they have they complain about hardship that word hardship isn't actually there 31 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:32,800 It's a supplied word and it's trying to help you make sense 32 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:38,640 But it says that they're just complaining because of their journey and the Hebrews it more implies that they're they're open murmuring 33 00:02:38,640 --> 00:02:43,180 So it's like have you ever you ever gotten somewhere with your kids Nick? Yep, and you just hear like 34 00:02:43,180 --> 00:02:49,540 How's it so better never never never ever ever, you know, there's mumbling and this is like current in the back seat 35 00:02:49,540 --> 00:02:51,380 We take my kids 36 00:02:51,380 --> 00:02:58,580 Okay, so when we vacation we vacation to other islands like Hawaii Hawaii and we're islanders 37 00:02:58,940 --> 00:03:00,940 Here and so we don't drive that much 38 00:03:01,300 --> 00:03:03,300 So we go to the big island of Hawaii 39 00:03:03,380 --> 00:03:09,100 We hit 30 minutes in the car and my kids are complaining right want to be back at school, right? 40 00:03:09,100 --> 00:03:13,620 They don't want it. They don't you know, it's bad if they want to be back at school 41 00:03:13,620 --> 00:03:17,860 It's only 30 minute drive and they will they will cry there will be tears 42 00:03:17,900 --> 00:03:18,420 Yeah 43 00:03:18,420 --> 00:03:24,580 And there's like this undercurrent that's there since we're all about context if you knew Nick's son 44 00:03:24,860 --> 00:03:27,380 Him saying he wants to be back at school. It's real bad 45 00:03:29,620 --> 00:03:36,540 So there's like this undercurrent like this the Hebrew implies like there's an undercurrent of murmuring and specifically they're not just murmuring about the journey 46 00:03:36,540 --> 00:03:41,480 They're murmuring about that. They're upset with God, right? And it says the translations that says that it displeased 47 00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:42,700 But let's displease God 48 00:03:42,700 --> 00:03:48,700 But if you actually go into the Hebrew, it actually means more literally it was evil in the ears of the Lord 49 00:03:49,220 --> 00:03:53,180 Which is significant. Yeah, like that the English translation does not do it 50 00:03:53,180 --> 00:04:00,340 Justice evil in the ears of the Lord is much worse than it was against the Lord, right? It's not some small complaint not shockingly 51 00:04:01,260 --> 00:04:04,100 There's this fire that comes out from God, right? 52 00:04:04,100 --> 00:04:09,100 So on that journey when they're murmuring and that your kids are like, I want to be back at school 53 00:04:09,100 --> 00:04:16,280 I don't want to be in Hawaii. Is there the fire of Nick that comes out? I I do lose it. Yeah, that's legit 54 00:04:17,140 --> 00:04:21,620 Yeah, let's go ahead and acknowledge that God probably doesn't lose it in the way that we lose it, right? 55 00:04:21,620 --> 00:04:24,340 But there's like there is there is like this this fire that comes out 56 00:04:24,340 --> 00:04:29,820 And so the last time they saw fire by the way was Nate Abedabai who which we talked about in the Q&A episode 57 00:04:29,820 --> 00:04:35,500 Huh, and so naturally they're nervous when they see the fire because last time they saw the fire Lord came out 58 00:04:35,500 --> 00:04:40,100 It consumed two people. Yeah, so they talked to Moses and he prays and the fire is removed, right? 59 00:04:40,100 --> 00:04:45,260 And they named the place in memory of what happened there ideally not to be repeated. That's why you would name the place by that name 60 00:04:46,660 --> 00:04:51,420 But the claims don't stop there. This is my this one gets really fun for me actually 61 00:04:51,420 --> 00:05:00,260 Yeah, cuz then they start complaining about food now everyone who's sitting in this room recording this podcast has kids and it's our 62 00:05:00,620 --> 00:05:05,260 absolute favorite thing when we when we make a nice dinner and 63 00:05:05,700 --> 00:05:09,300 They're like no, I don't want anything to do with it 64 00:05:09,620 --> 00:05:13,660 You know the best part about that is is when you make something and they're like I want chicken nuggets 65 00:05:13,660 --> 00:05:19,460 You make chicken nuggets are like, yeah, where's the pizza and then you asked for chicken nuggets not pizza 66 00:05:19,460 --> 00:05:21,460 Exactly 67 00:05:21,580 --> 00:05:28,060 Yeah, exactly. And so here you have the Lord actually providing quite well for his people 68 00:05:28,060 --> 00:05:31,860 It's not like he's giving them just enough to eat like they're actually eating well 69 00:05:31,860 --> 00:05:36,180 Like a right man up from heaven and then they get to a point like I'm tired of manna 70 00:05:37,020 --> 00:05:41,780 Yeah, if only we were back in Egypt where we were just slain. Uh-huh, right and 71 00:05:42,460 --> 00:05:46,740 Foreman rabbit David Foreman who we recommended a couple times has a really interesting note on this 72 00:05:46,740 --> 00:05:50,940 Is that they are asking about food because they're like we want cucumbers and we want 73 00:05:51,260 --> 00:05:55,500 Watermelons or we want fish and it's all these things that are in the ground or on the ground or below 74 00:05:56,460 --> 00:06:02,860 Whereas they're actually being fed from heaven and they're like we don't want the food from heaven. We want the food from 75 00:06:03,540 --> 00:06:07,320 The earth. Yeah, God's actually literally feeding them from heaven 76 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,620 They don't want it and then he also makes a note that I think is really interesting 77 00:06:10,620 --> 00:06:13,820 There is that the bread that come down from heaven is actually already bread 78 00:06:13,820 --> 00:06:20,020 It's already bread but it says that they're taking it and they're actually processing it and changing it and shaping it and making it something 79 00:06:20,020 --> 00:06:25,460 Different as well. So they're not even content with what God has given them from heaven. They're like now we're going to manufacture it even more 80 00:06:25,500 --> 00:06:30,100 Yeah, now you could always take that too far 100% but I just think it's an interesting thing to note 81 00:06:30,220 --> 00:06:35,900 Yeah, they're real discontent at this point. Yeah, they're like nothing but manna nothing 82 00:06:35,900 --> 00:06:40,580 But this amazing thing that shows up literally six days a week. This is a really cool thing 83 00:06:40,580 --> 00:06:45,300 Free food exactly but to be fair, I do want to talk about the other side of it 84 00:06:45,300 --> 00:06:50,100 It is really hard to trust in the desert. Like it is an act of faith 85 00:06:50,100 --> 00:06:57,140 Yeah, and it seems like their faith is being tested and the test isn't going so well now, right? No 86 00:06:57,660 --> 00:07:03,220 Moses hears the complaints of the families and then Moses it says that he was also displeased 87 00:07:03,220 --> 00:07:06,820 Which is just like the displeased above where it says it was evil in the eyes of Moses 88 00:07:06,820 --> 00:07:11,340 Oh, really? So it was evil in the eyes of Moses. So Moses brings his complaints to God 89 00:07:11,340 --> 00:07:14,260 He's like why me why all this burden? Why is it all mine? 90 00:07:14,260 --> 00:07:18,780 Did I get birth to these people and it and it seems like we've heard this before. Yeah, so 91 00:07:19,540 --> 00:07:21,940 Moses back in excess he was complaining 92 00:07:21,940 --> 00:07:26,820 God interesting thing here is that God in that time met Moses and his complaints right and 93 00:07:27,300 --> 00:07:30,260 Came up with a solution which was actually to send Aaron with him 94 00:07:30,260 --> 00:07:35,180 Yeah to actually go and be his spokesperson because it was just it really got down to the front of it 95 00:07:35,180 --> 00:07:39,060 Which is that Moses didn't want to go. Yeah. Yeah, and God was ticked off about that 96 00:07:39,060 --> 00:07:43,180 But he's like listen, you're gonna go because Exodus is relying on you. Oh, yeah 97 00:07:43,180 --> 00:07:44,580 Yeah, and yeah 98 00:07:44,580 --> 00:07:49,020 And I love in that in that passage in Exodus which we're talking about the burning bush by the way 99 00:07:49,020 --> 00:07:55,780 If you guys haven't figured that out in that passage where it says in God's anger. He sent Aaron. Yeah God was like, okay 100 00:07:55,780 --> 00:07:59,900 I am not happy with you. But here's a solution. Yeah, exactly 101 00:07:59,900 --> 00:08:04,620 Moses is just he's filled with these complaints and he's like he's like a it's it's too much 102 00:08:04,940 --> 00:08:08,620 It's a burden. The people are a burden. Your your mission is a burden 103 00:08:09,340 --> 00:08:13,660 I'm not capable. I can't do this alone. It's it's it's the burning bush all over again 104 00:08:13,660 --> 00:08:18,220 It's it's it's almost like the Bible has these cycles that keep repeating over and over again, right? 105 00:08:18,860 --> 00:08:23,260 Mm-hmm, not that real life is ever like that. No, not at all real life's never like that 106 00:08:23,980 --> 00:08:26,460 Life's perfect 100% of the time. No problems whatsoever 107 00:08:26,460 --> 00:08:31,100 I think that God's answer to this is really funny though because it's just a very strange thing 108 00:08:31,100 --> 00:08:35,180 He says tell the people that they're gonna have so much meat 109 00:08:36,220 --> 00:08:41,980 They're gonna be sick of it. There's gonna be so much meat that they could possibly handle now 110 00:08:41,980 --> 00:08:47,260 I've never had so much meat in my freezer that I was just like I'm sick of it 111 00:08:47,260 --> 00:08:53,100 This so this takes me back to a time of my childhood where like my mom made this like amazing homemade lasagna 112 00:08:53,100 --> 00:08:57,020 Yeah, and she puts them on my plate and I was like, I don't really like this 113 00:08:57,260 --> 00:09:00,620 And so as she do she takes like half the pan and puts it on my plate 114 00:09:00,620 --> 00:09:02,620 She's like now you're gonna eat all of it like 115 00:09:04,620 --> 00:09:07,820 I never complained about food after that, but it was like yeah 116 00:09:08,300 --> 00:09:13,740 This is actually interesting the note coming back to Foreman's idea about this food from above food from below because it's actually all birds 117 00:09:13,740 --> 00:09:17,180 Yeah, so which also be food from the sky as opposed to like fish 118 00:09:17,180 --> 00:09:22,700 Which I don't think there's a lot of fish in the desert. Why is that neck? Because the desert's real hot 119 00:09:23,340 --> 00:09:26,140 This is high-level stuff man. It's high level stuff. Yeah 120 00:09:26,140 --> 00:09:32,140 Oh, man, your wife is gonna listen to this and be like these guys. Do they ever talk about anything worthwhile? Yeah 121 00:09:32,780 --> 00:09:34,220 sometimes 122 00:09:34,220 --> 00:09:39,980 So God says like his answer to like, oh man this burden these people are complaining like I can't do this 123 00:09:39,980 --> 00:09:43,740 I can't bring out this leadership guys. Oh, wait, tell everybody that they're gonna have more meat that they can handle 124 00:09:43,740 --> 00:09:47,260 They're gonna be so sick of it. Like they're gonna have to eat meat for like a solid month 125 00:09:47,900 --> 00:09:50,540 Maybe like stop giving us meat 126 00:09:52,060 --> 00:09:57,740 Yeah, but Moses I think is okay, so this is the guy Moses is the guy who's literally walked through the Red Sea 127 00:09:57,740 --> 00:10:01,580 He's seen the ten plagues on Egypt. He has been to Sinai 128 00:10:01,580 --> 00:10:07,580 He's literally held the carved commandments in his hands and he goes where are you gonna get all this meat from? 129 00:10:07,580 --> 00:10:14,140 So Moses has his moments of doubt you're right after seeing all the miraculous ways that God has provided 130 00:10:15,180 --> 00:10:20,940 And there's nothing to test your doubt as much as having to feed 600,000 people who are really picky 131 00:10:21,180 --> 00:10:25,900 Yeah, so let's just take a moment here and say hey if Moses 132 00:10:26,620 --> 00:10:27,980 doubted 133 00:10:27,980 --> 00:10:29,980 After seeing the Red Sea parted 134 00:10:30,220 --> 00:10:32,700 Like they're following a cloud during the day 135 00:10:32,700 --> 00:10:38,060 Fire at night seeing the ten plagues take place all these things if he doubted like 136 00:10:38,620 --> 00:10:42,380 Audibly hearing the voice of God and you're coming in. Oh, I never doubt God 137 00:10:43,420 --> 00:10:50,060 Yeah, hmm. I bet you do. I bet you do question every once in a while and let's be honest like the problem isn't 138 00:10:50,940 --> 00:10:54,140 Doubting is being ruled by your doubt 139 00:10:54,140 --> 00:10:58,060 Yeah, if it's like it's one of those things where I'm reminded of the story in the New York Times 140 00:10:58,060 --> 00:11:02,300 Where this guy comes to Jesus. He says if you can heal my child 141 00:11:02,860 --> 00:11:07,740 And Jesus like what do you mean if that's Ben's living translation? He's not insulted bro. Come on 142 00:11:08,300 --> 00:11:13,340 Yeah, what do you mean if he says with God all things are possible and he says I believe 143 00:11:14,060 --> 00:11:16,060 But just help my unbelief 144 00:11:16,620 --> 00:11:19,020 Like intellectually, I believe you can do this 145 00:11:20,140 --> 00:11:22,140 Experientially, I've never seen it happen 146 00:11:22,780 --> 00:11:24,780 Yeah, I've never seen it happen 147 00:11:24,780 --> 00:11:27,820 Experientially, I've never seen it happen. Yeah 148 00:11:28,540 --> 00:11:31,740 Which is just this true for following God in general though, right? Yeah 149 00:11:32,780 --> 00:11:33,820 Very true 150 00:11:33,820 --> 00:11:39,420 I don't want to stress that because I think we've made this culture in church in church culture where we're like 151 00:11:39,500 --> 00:11:41,500 Oh, you need to be certain about everything 152 00:11:42,380 --> 00:11:45,900 And first of all, I just gotta say you're not God so you're not going to be certain about everything 153 00:11:45,980 --> 00:11:52,060 I'm laughing over here right now because it's what level of audacity and pride and vainness do we have to be like 154 00:11:52,060 --> 00:11:56,220 Oh, i'm certain about everything and how quickly is God going to be like, let me take you down a peg 155 00:11:56,780 --> 00:12:00,300 That's one of the reasons we make doctrines. Yeah, because we try to explain everything away 156 00:12:00,460 --> 00:12:03,820 There is definitely let's say the big one that we always talk about the trinity now 157 00:12:03,820 --> 00:12:08,540 There is definitely the infrastructure of the trinity all throughout scripture like you can see it, right? 158 00:12:08,860 --> 00:12:11,420 It never actually tells you how that works. No 159 00:12:12,460 --> 00:12:17,100 yet, I know a lot of people and i mean like maybe you do too like that just are like 160 00:12:17,100 --> 00:12:22,540 This is exactly how it works. I'm like 100. Yeah, this is how this is happening. Yeah how it happened 161 00:12:22,540 --> 00:12:28,700 I mean there may or may not have been multiple books written on this. Yeah. Yeah, one or two one or two at least 162 00:12:29,420 --> 00:12:31,500 Uh, so in the show notes, we're gonna no i'm just kidding 163 00:12:32,540 --> 00:12:38,860 My sarcasm is real strong. It's real strong. He he's had that second cup of tea and it's uh, it's really starting to hit. Oh, yeah 164 00:12:39,660 --> 00:12:42,940 Um, but I think when we set people up where you're like, oh you can't ever doubt 165 00:12:42,940 --> 00:12:46,220 I was like nope, but faith is operating in the midst of doubt 166 00:12:46,220 --> 00:12:51,340 When I go to sit on a chair, I don't always know that chair is going to hold me up, especially okay 167 00:12:51,340 --> 00:12:53,980 There's actually a really good story. So a few days ago. We were sitting around a fire 168 00:12:54,540 --> 00:12:57,100 right, and I have a camping chair, which has 169 00:12:58,140 --> 00:13:00,460 Been well loved is what we're gonna call it. Okay 170 00:13:01,420 --> 00:13:04,540 And i've told spencer a few times when i'm sitting we're sitting out hanging out 171 00:13:04,860 --> 00:13:08,700 I said one of these days i'm gonna sit on this chair and it's just gonna go kaput. Uh-huh. Right 172 00:13:09,340 --> 00:13:11,340 Now I have faith that that chair is going to hold me up 173 00:13:11,340 --> 00:13:16,540 I also have this doubt in the back of my mind that at some point it's just gonna fall apart. Mm-hmm 174 00:13:17,260 --> 00:13:18,220 right 175 00:13:18,220 --> 00:13:21,100 It'll happen at some point. It will happen at some point. Yeah 176 00:13:21,660 --> 00:13:23,660 And faith will be rocked if my faith will be rocked 177 00:13:23,660 --> 00:13:29,660 I was like, but can you imagine though that if I never had faith in chairs again because one broke 178 00:13:30,860 --> 00:13:33,740 Like I would I gave up on the concept of chairs 179 00:13:34,300 --> 00:13:38,460 Uh-huh because one chair broke. Yeah, and yeah, this is a lot of times what we do with our faith 180 00:13:38,460 --> 00:13:41,980 We're like, oh this one thing that i'm confident about that god is doing it 181 00:13:41,980 --> 00:13:46,940 It didn't work out the way that I thought it should right? So now I just don't believe god exists 182 00:13:47,580 --> 00:13:52,700 Wait, what? Uh-huh. Tim Ross has that podcast the basement and some people like and some people don't that's fine 183 00:13:52,700 --> 00:13:57,980 He reaches a very niche crowd one of my favorite statements. He talks about his he's talking about people going to church and they're like 184 00:13:57,980 --> 00:14:00,220 Well, I went to church once and I you know, it just wasn't for me 185 00:14:00,220 --> 00:14:05,180 He's like I went to a restaurant once and I got food poisoning. I said like I don't no longer go to any restaurant 186 00:14:05,180 --> 00:14:10,620 I just don't go back to maybe that restaurant and people are like I had a bad experience at a church. Yeah, there's like 187 00:14:11,020 --> 00:14:15,340 You know, I mean, I've had a bad experience at a church too. There's hundreds of thousands 188 00:14:15,340 --> 00:14:20,060 There's hundreds of thousands of churches just in the u.s alone. I was like maybe just go to a different one 189 00:14:20,060 --> 00:14:25,420 Maybe you had a bad experience. Maybe you got some food poisoning because on that day the food is a little rotten. Yeah. Yeah 190 00:14:26,140 --> 00:14:28,540 Yeah, doesn't mean that all food is rotten. No 191 00:14:28,540 --> 00:14:33,580 Moses is doubting God and he's like, I don't know if you can really do this God or where are you gonna find that much meat for? 192 00:14:33,580 --> 00:14:38,780 600,000 men he apparently is not planning on feeding the women and children just the men God 193 00:14:39,340 --> 00:14:41,420 Responds he says you need to just watch and see 194 00:14:41,980 --> 00:14:47,100 Right now I are doing this whole section by the way the way that it's structured and verbalized 195 00:14:47,100 --> 00:14:51,980 I believe there's probably a chiasm here some in some capacity. Mm-hmm. I can't find it, but I can feel it 196 00:14:51,980 --> 00:14:52,860 Yeah, you know what I mean? 197 00:14:52,860 --> 00:14:54,660 You can feel the repetition and the stories and the 198 00:14:54,660 --> 00:14:59,540 Stories like yeah, like when once you've seen a few of them you start to recognize that something's going on here 199 00:14:59,540 --> 00:15:01,100 Yeah in the section in numbers 200 00:15:01,100 --> 00:15:05,940 It feels very disjointed because like you go from like this conversation about their displeased and then God's like well 201 00:15:05,940 --> 00:15:07,580 I'm gonna send them more meat that they could handle 202 00:15:07,580 --> 00:15:11,660 Can you really send them more meat than they can handle and God's like stand back and watch by the way? 203 00:15:11,980 --> 00:15:13,980 go and get 70 elders and 204 00:15:14,700 --> 00:15:18,620 Bring them back in front of the tent of meeting and I'm gonna take a portion of the spirit 205 00:15:18,620 --> 00:15:21,180 That's on you and I'm gonna put it on the table 206 00:15:21,180 --> 00:15:26,960 And I'm gonna take a portion of the spirit that's on you and I'm gonna put it on them. Uh-huh, right now 207 00:15:27,620 --> 00:15:30,780 It just feels like the story is like moving in weird ways 208 00:15:30,780 --> 00:15:35,000 It's only talking about this but then we're gonna talk about what's like a then C then B then D 209 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:40,460 It's like Spencer is telling the story. I'm not that bad worse. Okay. Yeah 210 00:15:40,860 --> 00:15:43,480 But it's it feels like it's almost out of order a little bit 211 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:46,840 Huh, but what happens is Moses goes back and he tells everybody what's about to happen 212 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:50,900 He's like you're about to have more meat than you can handle and then he takes 70 elders with him 213 00:15:50,900 --> 00:15:58,180 And then it says they go to the tent of meeting and the spirit rested on them and they prophesy but they did not do so again 214 00:15:59,260 --> 00:16:04,000 Then it also says that there was two guys remaining in the camp, but the spirit rested on them as well 215 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:09,200 So apparently even if you don't come to the temple and God's gonna move it doesn't matter where you go 216 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:10,860 He's gonna get you anyways, huh? 217 00:16:10,860 --> 00:16:17,420 so someone runs to tell Moses and they run into Joshua who then goes and tells Moses and they says we should stop them because 218 00:16:17,740 --> 00:16:19,740 they're not over at the tent of meeting and 219 00:16:19,740 --> 00:16:24,940 Moses me then makes a statement. He's which we would do well to hear. Are you jealous of me? 220 00:16:24,940 --> 00:16:31,620 I wish that all the Lord's people were prophets that the Lord would put his spirit on them 221 00:16:32,220 --> 00:16:35,920 Mm-hmm. Now this story right here guys is where we're gonna camp for a while 222 00:16:36,540 --> 00:16:39,820 Because this is this is the crux of what's going on in this in this section of scripture 223 00:16:39,900 --> 00:16:44,580 It's about the spirit being moved. Did you intentionally say upon there? No, I did not. Okay 224 00:16:44,580 --> 00:16:50,260 We're gonna camp here that I gotcha. I was like, what are you talking about? What was the pun? 225 00:16:51,900 --> 00:16:55,380 Yeah, we're gonna we're gonna camp here because I think this is this is a really big 226 00:16:56,060 --> 00:17:00,900 Concept that we need to get around and there's a lot of facets to this. So we're just we're gonna take some time 227 00:17:00,900 --> 00:17:04,660 We're gonna pull this apart and just talk about some connections to the New Testament some different things 228 00:17:04,780 --> 00:17:08,100 Yeah, so one of the things that I've noticed in here 229 00:17:08,660 --> 00:17:10,660 To get us kicked off is 230 00:17:10,660 --> 00:17:15,400 Is that there's 70 but there's also 72. Yeah, right 231 00:17:15,820 --> 00:17:17,980 Some of you were listening and you're like, oh, I've heard that before 232 00:17:18,300 --> 00:17:23,980 Where have I heard that it turns out that in the New Testament like Jesus has 12 disciples who he sends out 233 00:17:24,020 --> 00:17:27,060 But that's not the only time he sends people out on a mission 234 00:17:27,700 --> 00:17:31,980 Another time he sends out 70 or 72 depending on who recorded it 235 00:17:33,060 --> 00:17:36,500 There seems to be an implication connecting back to this idea of numbers 236 00:17:36,500 --> 00:17:42,100 About the spirit being multiplied and being sent out and so now you have this whole idea of 12 originally 237 00:17:42,100 --> 00:17:47,220 But 70 or 72 depending on which translation and it could be 70 or 72 238 00:17:47,380 --> 00:17:51,740 Because the Greek is ambiguous and people think it's a textual mistake and I don't think it is 239 00:17:51,740 --> 00:17:55,400 I think they did it on purpose to reference the story back in numbers 240 00:17:55,420 --> 00:18:00,500 Yeah, that the spirit is actually being divided and going and the the prophets of the Lord are actually moving out 241 00:18:00,500 --> 00:18:06,800 Mm-hmm. Yeah, and so you have so like the parallel there and if you're looking for the story of 72 242 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:08,800 One of the accounts is Luke 10 243 00:18:08,900 --> 00:18:15,880 Okay, and so there's the parallel there where you have the anointing of the spirit of the Lord coming upon the 72 and numbers 244 00:18:15,900 --> 00:18:22,180 Mm-hmm, just so we're really clear on this and then in Luke 10 you have the Lord appointed 72 245 00:18:22,180 --> 00:18:25,860 Yeah, just so we're really clear. It's not just yeah. Yeah. Yeah 246 00:18:25,860 --> 00:18:30,940 Ben's like you just said what I said. I was like, yes, that's okay. That's what's reiterating. That's okay 247 00:18:30,940 --> 00:18:34,900 I actually don't mind it when you repeat things that I say because somebody just seemed slightly differently 248 00:18:34,900 --> 00:18:37,780 So somebody else is gonna hear what we said. Perfect. You know what I mean? I 249 00:18:40,140 --> 00:18:45,940 Think there is there's some things that we need to really like latch on to in this story, right? 250 00:18:46,220 --> 00:18:49,620 The first thing is this I hear people frequently talk in 251 00:18:49,620 --> 00:18:57,180 In theological like circles and they talk about how the spirit didn't really come in like really powerful ways until Pentecost 252 00:18:57,180 --> 00:18:59,180 And I was like, did you read the Old Testament? 253 00:19:00,100 --> 00:19:03,380 Yeah, there's a lot of things happening by the Spirit of God now 254 00:19:03,380 --> 00:19:09,380 I think that the difference between the Old Testament the New Testament is something we've talked about is that we become the temple and the 255 00:19:09,380 --> 00:19:14,740 Dwelling place of the Holy Spirit and rather than the spirit resting on us. He resides in us. Yeah, that's the big difference 256 00:19:14,740 --> 00:19:20,060 but the spirit is incredibly active in the Old Testament and incredibly active in the New Testament and 257 00:19:20,620 --> 00:19:22,620 Depending on your theology 258 00:19:22,660 --> 00:19:28,020 You're gonna recognize these incredibly active today. Mm-hmm. Yep. And so if that's true 259 00:19:28,020 --> 00:19:31,620 We need to acknowledge that in the way that we pursue God. Yes. I 260 00:19:32,140 --> 00:19:33,980 Want to I want to bring it back a little bit 261 00:19:33,980 --> 00:19:41,140 There's a there's an interesting thing that happens here with these 70 elders showing up what just happened the people were complaining 262 00:19:41,620 --> 00:19:43,620 Yeah, Moses is 263 00:19:43,620 --> 00:19:46,940 I guess we could say losing faith not so much losing faith, but 264 00:19:47,620 --> 00:19:53,580 He's struggling here and he's having this conversation with God which like you had said earlier at the burning bush is the same 265 00:19:54,060 --> 00:20:00,620 Situation that was happening and then Aaron shows up God provides. Yeah somebody there 266 00:20:00,620 --> 00:20:04,460 Mm-hmm to give him I don't know the strength or 267 00:20:05,460 --> 00:20:10,340 The push he needed a teammate. Yeah to to keep that forward in in this situation 268 00:20:10,340 --> 00:20:17,940 We're dealing with an even bigger situation where there's 600,000 people complaining. Yeah, which I am no politician 269 00:20:18,460 --> 00:20:19,580 and 270 00:20:19,580 --> 00:20:23,500 That's a lot of people complaining and so there's a different pressure there 271 00:20:23,500 --> 00:20:28,820 You know in the past God's like you're gonna take the people out of Egypt. That's a future thing 272 00:20:28,820 --> 00:20:33,220 This is going to happen. Okay, whatever God and then somebody comes to help 273 00:20:33,220 --> 00:20:37,860 but now all of a sudden that has happened you've taken all these people out of Egypt and 274 00:20:37,860 --> 00:20:43,820 They're staring at you. The mob is staring at you. Where's the food? I'm hungry 275 00:20:43,820 --> 00:20:50,020 We don't want to eat this anymore. And now you're going back to God being like, hey, you know that this is difficult 276 00:20:50,020 --> 00:20:55,820 And this is not fun. And what are we doing? Yeah, and I understand that idea 277 00:20:55,820 --> 00:21:00,260 You know the mob coming at you like that. This is a this is a scary situation 278 00:21:00,260 --> 00:21:04,660 So, you know you start to put that in context and as a leader I can see where it's okay 279 00:21:04,660 --> 00:21:10,980 This is dangerous now real dangerous for me, but God provides and what giving him leadership and 280 00:21:11,300 --> 00:21:13,780 Bringing his spirit on that leadership, right? 281 00:21:14,740 --> 00:21:18,660 And and to take your point if you go back to when 282 00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:23,940 Jethro comes and he's like wait Moses adjudicating every single dispute that's going on 283 00:21:24,660 --> 00:21:27,060 That's a terrible idea. That's a tear 284 00:21:27,060 --> 00:21:31,860 We need to take some people and they need to like take care of these things like we talked about a couple episodes ago 285 00:21:31,860 --> 00:21:36,980 Can you imagine and you haven't heard this because we haven't posted it yet because then podcasts the way they work everybody 286 00:21:36,980 --> 00:21:41,540 Just you know, we record them ahead of time because it takes me forever to edit out every dumb thing we say 287 00:21:43,140 --> 00:21:47,780 You're like there's still a lot of things in the podcast. Yeah, just imagine what I took out so 288 00:21:49,620 --> 00:21:56,420 I said, can you imagine at Apple if the CEO of Apple was taking like complaints like how much would he get done? 289 00:21:56,420 --> 00:22:01,220 Next to nothing nothing and I always choose Apple because Spencer doesn't like having an iPhone. So 290 00:22:01,940 --> 00:22:05,780 That's the way I'm under the bus app. There's a lot of Apple in this room 291 00:22:06,500 --> 00:22:10,660 They're making fun of me because I have an Android, but I definitely have two Macs at the same time 292 00:22:10,660 --> 00:22:17,380 It does feel like abusive in our relationship when you are part of a group text and the text is a different color 293 00:22:17,380 --> 00:22:19,380 I lived in convenience you 294 00:22:20,980 --> 00:22:23,460 So this coming back to that idea, you know 295 00:22:23,460 --> 00:22:29,300 Once again, Moses is taking on the burden of everything. So we've just gone through Leviticus. We've had Levitical law 296 00:22:29,300 --> 00:22:34,020 We've talked about Exodus. They put the tabernacle together. They're walking. They're serving they're running after God and 297 00:22:34,580 --> 00:22:38,900 Once again, he's got this massive amount of like burden that he's putting on himself 298 00:22:39,620 --> 00:22:42,740 Right. Do you think that everybody was actually complaining? 299 00:22:43,620 --> 00:22:47,140 Probably not. Yeah, probably not. Have you ever had somebody come to you in the church and be like 300 00:22:47,780 --> 00:22:50,580 Everybody is frustrated with the way that you teach 301 00:22:50,580 --> 00:22:54,980 And it's always one maybe two. Yeah, like they're and they're real loud 302 00:22:54,980 --> 00:22:57,140 So they're like real squeaky wheels, right? 303 00:22:57,140 --> 00:23:00,500 Now if you have multiple different people come and talk to you about an issue 304 00:23:00,500 --> 00:23:03,460 You can not be like, oh, maybe this is actually more widespread than we thought, right? 305 00:23:04,020 --> 00:23:10,100 Okay, this is actually perfect because um, so you and I have both served in the worship pastor role, right? 306 00:23:10,100 --> 00:23:14,420 So my favorite thing is when you get done with church somebody's like they're like, well, how are you gonna make adjustments? 307 00:23:14,420 --> 00:23:17,540 I was like, let me tell you the comments I got today. The music was too loud 308 00:23:17,540 --> 00:23:21,060 The music was too quiet. Yep, the drums were too loud. Yep. The drums were too quiet 309 00:23:21,060 --> 00:23:25,780 Yep, the singers were I couldn't hear ben. I could hear ben way too much. I couldn't hear the guitar 310 00:23:25,780 --> 00:23:30,900 The guitars are actually too loud. Yep. We are doing way too contemporary music. We don't do enough traditional music 311 00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:35,620 We do way too much traditional music and there's like this huge list of things and I was like, so which 312 00:23:36,020 --> 00:23:38,020 Voices am I going to listen to? 313 00:23:38,020 --> 00:23:42,500 See me being the drummer over here whenever I hear people say hey the drums the drums were too loud 314 00:23:42,500 --> 00:23:44,500 I was like, oh I can be louder 315 00:23:44,500 --> 00:23:49,140 And they're like, oh, okay. Never mind. Yeah, and then we mic the drums. Yeah 316 00:23:51,300 --> 00:23:58,020 But it's like, you know, which which voices are you listening to which I think is actually probably a solid perspective in general 317 00:23:58,020 --> 00:24:03,060 Yeah, who's around you? Who do you trust that is around you to call out those things? 318 00:24:03,060 --> 00:24:06,980 And to speak into those situations at our church. We have 319 00:24:07,460 --> 00:24:11,220 The leadership team of three pastors, but then we also have a preaching team 320 00:24:11,220 --> 00:24:14,740 And we have deacons and all of those people have 321 00:24:15,300 --> 00:24:17,060 perspective and 322 00:24:17,060 --> 00:24:23,780 Opportunities to bring things up in those different areas and that's important to us like just having 323 00:24:24,340 --> 00:24:27,860 A variety of people from different backgrounds coming in 324 00:24:28,580 --> 00:24:34,580 To have discussion and everything's fine. Everything's not fine. There's just a group of us and what's awesome is 325 00:24:35,620 --> 00:24:38,180 Everybody cares and just wants everything to work 326 00:24:38,180 --> 00:24:41,700 Out and everybody has that relationship with christ 327 00:24:42,340 --> 00:24:47,860 And we see that so one of our deacons at our church. I do brazilian jiu-jitsu and he shows up 328 00:24:47,860 --> 00:24:54,420 He's a wrestler and he started coming in and jiu-jitsu is I can only imagine what people think our church is like 329 00:24:54,500 --> 00:24:56,980 I know like from the stories that we tell 330 00:24:57,540 --> 00:25:03,860 Anyway, he shows up and we're on the mats trying to break each other's arms or choke each other out and we're talking about 331 00:25:04,580 --> 00:25:06,100 revelation 332 00:25:06,100 --> 00:25:11,140 And the people around us have no background in what we're doing and they're like, are you preaching to each other? We're like 333 00:25:11,620 --> 00:25:18,020 No, not really. We're just encouraging each other. Like that's something that culturally we want to be in our culture, right as 334 00:25:19,060 --> 00:25:22,100 What we do we encourage each other and I think kill each other. Yeah 335 00:25:22,100 --> 00:25:26,100 Yeah, I think let me redirect this because I think we're actually hitting on something really important here 336 00:25:26,100 --> 00:25:29,140 It's so moses makes a statement. He says are you jealous for me? 337 00:25:29,460 --> 00:25:33,220 That i'm hearing from god or that the spirit of god is not moving only on me 338 00:25:33,220 --> 00:25:38,260 It would be better that it's moving on everybody which is this idea. So like prophetic word 339 00:25:38,260 --> 00:25:41,060 I think it gets misunderstood in the pentecostal church 340 00:25:41,540 --> 00:25:44,980 Because a lot of times there's some people who do some really weird stuff with it 341 00:25:44,980 --> 00:25:49,860 I was like, but on a very broad level prophetic word is god is speaking something to me 342 00:25:50,500 --> 00:25:54,820 That is meant to speak into your life and encourage you in your walk with him 343 00:25:54,820 --> 00:25:57,380 Yeah, it's not actually meant to bring condemnation. First of all 344 00:25:58,340 --> 00:26:00,340 Don't speak condemnation 345 00:26:00,340 --> 00:26:05,460 into people period and you're like, oh but god told me I need to tell them this and I was like listen 346 00:26:06,180 --> 00:26:11,380 God is fully capable of telling somebody that they screwed up. Right. You ever heard of the conviction of the holy spirit? 347 00:26:11,380 --> 00:26:15,300 It's a real thing. Yeah, you don't need to tell them that they done screwed up now 348 00:26:15,300 --> 00:26:17,300 God might tell you to come to them and be like hey 349 00:26:17,700 --> 00:26:19,700 I I just feel like god is telling me like 350 00:26:20,180 --> 00:26:22,740 This is something that you're dealing with and that there's a way out 351 00:26:23,300 --> 00:26:26,580 But that's meant for encouragement and to love and build people up 352 00:26:26,580 --> 00:26:30,420 And so this whole idea of prophetic word is like who are you actually letting speak into you? 353 00:26:30,420 --> 00:26:32,420 Yeah, because I was thinking about for myself 354 00:26:34,260 --> 00:26:36,260 You got all these voices coming back to this worship analogy 355 00:26:37,460 --> 00:26:39,460 That they have a bunch of different things that they could say 356 00:26:40,180 --> 00:26:45,140 But let's go away from worship. Let's talk about like my life ben edwards when I look at my life 357 00:26:45,140 --> 00:26:47,620 And i'm trying to figure out like how to walk with god 358 00:26:48,180 --> 00:26:53,060 I don't listen to every voice that tries to speak in because as a person 359 00:26:53,060 --> 00:26:58,340 I don't listen to every voice that tries to speak in because otherwise i'm not necessarily 360 00:26:58,740 --> 00:27:00,660 Lining up with what god has called me to first of all 361 00:27:00,660 --> 00:27:06,420 I'm in relationship with god studying the word in prayer all these different things and then there are a few people 362 00:27:07,060 --> 00:27:10,260 In my life that I will allow to speak in no matter what 363 00:27:11,620 --> 00:27:14,500 And then there's a lot of people that I will hear and I will just file it away 364 00:27:15,540 --> 00:27:19,220 And then there's some that I will just literally put that on a shelf and never listen to it 365 00:27:19,300 --> 00:27:22,500 Right because they don't come with the uh, they don't actually come in an attitude of love 366 00:27:22,500 --> 00:27:27,380 They come in an attitude judgment, right? Right. And so until we actually are looking to love each other 367 00:27:27,380 --> 00:27:28,660 I can't actually accept it 368 00:27:28,660 --> 00:27:33,700 Now in our church you and pastor clint are people that if you are on you and I have been friends forever 369 00:27:33,780 --> 00:27:37,140 Yeah, you know me you've seen what god has done in my life over the years 370 00:27:37,300 --> 00:27:40,820 If you gave me a statement about something that god was speaking to you about me 371 00:27:41,380 --> 00:27:45,700 I would give it a lot of consideration because I know that you wouldn't just do that willy-nilly 372 00:27:45,940 --> 00:27:48,260 You're actually going to be considered what is god doing in my life? 373 00:27:48,580 --> 00:27:49,540 Spencer is very similar 374 00:27:49,540 --> 00:27:53,780 Spencer is very connected to my life if he thought that there was something going on that god wanted to move in my life 375 00:27:53,780 --> 00:27:56,020 And do something different. I would give his word 376 00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:01,380 considerably more weight because our relationship our love for each other our our 377 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:07,060 Community is a lot stronger above both of you if my wife speaks into my life 378 00:28:08,020 --> 00:28:11,620 I'm gonna give her word a considerable amount of consideration. Yeah. Yeah 379 00:28:13,060 --> 00:28:15,060 We have this tendency as christians 380 00:28:15,060 --> 00:28:21,060 To try to receive every word that somebody would speak into your life and I think that's dangerous 381 00:28:22,660 --> 00:28:26,820 Yeah, I know in my life i've had people try to speak into my life who 382 00:28:27,620 --> 00:28:29,620 Really had no place to and so 383 00:28:30,180 --> 00:28:34,100 And I know there's probably people who can I know there's people who can relate to that as well 384 00:28:34,180 --> 00:28:40,420 But just because someone says they can doesn't mean that they're actually doing it for your good 385 00:28:40,420 --> 00:28:46,340 Right. I've had one of the misconceptions i've seen in the church a lot of times is i've had people try to 386 00:28:46,820 --> 00:28:52,340 Say hey the lord's telling me to say this to you and then they just come at you all condemning like 387 00:28:52,980 --> 00:28:56,980 And then and then when you push back on it a little bit it really comes down to well 388 00:28:56,980 --> 00:28:58,980 This is how it affects me and i'm like 389 00:29:00,020 --> 00:29:05,060 Okay, so you want me to change so your reputation is not hurt, right? That's very different than hey 390 00:29:05,060 --> 00:29:09,860 Here's a way that the lord's actually working in your life. And how are we coming alongside? 391 00:29:10,500 --> 00:29:12,500 aside that person in love 392 00:29:12,900 --> 00:29:18,260 There's also a consideration like how you're gonna say that so if you're if you are a person who like god is using to speak 393 00:29:18,260 --> 00:29:23,380 Into other people's lives. I have a lot of friends who are not necessarily as open to the movement of the spirit 394 00:29:23,380 --> 00:29:28,020 Like they're not for pentacosal theology and that's perfectly fine because I know god's gonna meet them where they're at and do their things 395 00:29:28,100 --> 00:29:30,740 Like he does crazy cool things in their life anyways. Yeah 396 00:29:30,740 --> 00:29:35,780 Yeah, but if I have something that I is like god is speaking to me about a lot of those i'll come up to them 397 00:29:35,780 --> 00:29:42,660 I say hey, so I was reading the word the other day and I thought about this in your life. Have you considered this? 398 00:29:43,700 --> 00:29:47,060 Yeah, I think this might be something that god is putting in your path. Yeah 399 00:29:48,260 --> 00:29:53,140 Now I was like, what did I really just say i'm saying god spoke to me and I believe there's something for you 400 00:29:53,460 --> 00:29:57,140 Yeah, but I phrase it in a way that they're capable of grasping it 401 00:29:57,140 --> 00:30:02,500 Yeah, because the words are not as important is that the message is heard and the connection is made to god 402 00:30:02,660 --> 00:30:03,780 Yeah 403 00:30:03,780 --> 00:30:08,900 And if you're really obsessed with people being like, oh no, they have to understand it was a word of the lord 404 00:30:08,980 --> 00:30:12,980 I got news for you. You're probably not bringing the word of the lord. You're bringing the word of something just not god 405 00:30:13,380 --> 00:30:13,940 Yeah 406 00:30:13,940 --> 00:30:21,780 So growing up in a pentacostal background or pentacostal one thing that i've been through years of different types of leadership and different types of 407 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:23,060 ministries 408 00:30:23,060 --> 00:30:27,620 whether that's evangelists coming into the church or missionaries coming to church or 409 00:30:28,180 --> 00:30:30,260 school or pastors whatever it is 410 00:30:30,820 --> 00:30:32,820 Really that it comes down to 411 00:30:33,060 --> 00:30:38,900 I take if somebody says something in my life one do I have a relationship with them and what's that relationship look like two? 412 00:30:39,460 --> 00:30:44,980 Is that an encouraging word? Is there something in there that is going to build me up and allow that relationship? 413 00:30:45,700 --> 00:30:47,540 Or reveal something 414 00:30:47,540 --> 00:30:52,260 That furthers that relationship and three is it biblical in any way shape or form? Right? 415 00:30:52,260 --> 00:30:55,380 Um, i've had a lot of prophecies come to me that were definitely not biblical 416 00:30:55,380 --> 00:30:58,980 Yeah, and I don't know where that came from and I think people get hurt in that situation 417 00:30:59,060 --> 00:31:04,740 Yeah, and to your point in that is that actually I believe it's in deuteronomy, but it says to test every word exactly, right? 418 00:31:05,060 --> 00:31:10,820 So yeah, which means you also have to know the word to test it against. Yeah, exactly. And that's really important. Um, 419 00:31:11,540 --> 00:31:16,900 I could tell you some weird stuff. I've heard prophesied over people. Yeah, we might have that in another episode 420 00:31:16,900 --> 00:31:23,220 I might need to I don't want to say it right now. There's some weird stuff and it really comes down to does it build them up? 421 00:31:23,220 --> 00:31:24,660 Is it in the word? 422 00:31:24,660 --> 00:31:29,140 That biblical foundation if you receive a word for somebody else from the lord 423 00:31:29,540 --> 00:31:33,860 You need to remember that word is for somebody else, right? It's not for you 424 00:31:34,580 --> 00:31:41,140 Right. The lord's chosen you to speak that into their lives and that is a huge honor a huge privilege a huge blessing 425 00:31:41,380 --> 00:31:44,420 But that word's not for you. It's for them, right? 426 00:31:44,420 --> 00:31:49,540 So sometimes it might pertain to your life some too is the Lord's putting on your heart as the Lord puts on my heart 427 00:31:49,540 --> 00:31:53,540 To say hey, I want you to go talk to Ben and I want you to say this 428 00:31:53,700 --> 00:31:59,460 Yeah, right that words for Ben, right and he's just using me to give that word to Ben 429 00:31:59,460 --> 00:32:02,740 right, and so a lot of times what I've heard in prophecies is people have 430 00:32:03,180 --> 00:32:09,140 Twisted that around and tried to say this is what's really happening and how it affects me and it's like that's not prophecy, right? 431 00:32:09,140 --> 00:32:13,180 That's you having an issue with that person that you need to deal with understand the difference there 432 00:32:13,180 --> 00:32:17,660 Right. Yeah, and so for those of us so those of you listening that are not in Pentecostal churches 433 00:32:17,660 --> 00:32:21,740 I want to just help you understand the broader definition of like prophetic word or speaking into people's lives 434 00:32:21,820 --> 00:32:26,940 Like this is also just speaking the truth of God into people. Yeah, you might call it preaching the gospel reaching the word 435 00:32:26,940 --> 00:32:28,300 Yes, all those different things 436 00:32:28,300 --> 00:32:33,220 So when we speak into each other things from scripture if you're just speaking scripture into people 437 00:32:33,260 --> 00:32:36,860 Make sure you're doing it to encourage them and not to condemn them like John 3 438 00:32:37,060 --> 00:32:41,660 17 forgot to not send his son into the world to condemn the world but to save the world through him 439 00:32:41,660 --> 00:32:46,300 The world was already standing condemned because they hadn't believed because they're already in darkness 440 00:32:46,300 --> 00:32:50,980 So they like darkness so like people don't need to be condemned. They're already sitting there in condemnation 441 00:32:50,980 --> 00:32:54,460 We're actually showing them the way of the Lord. We're showing them the light 442 00:32:54,460 --> 00:32:57,740 We are being salt and light to borrow from the Sermon on the Mount 443 00:32:57,820 --> 00:33:02,020 Yeah, when you speak into somebody when you're speaking scripture when you're speaking words 444 00:33:02,180 --> 00:33:08,300 However, that that shows up in your practice in your following of Christ. Make sure that it's like Paul says 445 00:33:08,300 --> 00:33:14,300 Edifying building up that it benefits those who listen. Yeah and doesn't benefit just you now 446 00:33:14,300 --> 00:33:19,060 It might benefit you also, but it should benefit them and then you as secondary. Yeah 447 00:33:19,060 --> 00:33:24,820 Yeah, there's a fancy word that shows up in a lot of like legal documentation and it's a word called fiduciary 448 00:33:25,820 --> 00:33:29,740 Fiduciary means that when I do something I do it for your benefit and not for mine 449 00:33:29,740 --> 00:33:32,300 Yeah, so when I when you have a fiduciary 450 00:33:32,820 --> 00:33:36,460 Relationship with somebody means every decision that you're making for them 451 00:33:36,460 --> 00:33:40,660 Mm-hmm is for their benefit and not yours. That doesn't mean you won't benefit 452 00:33:40,660 --> 00:33:44,340 But the decision of why you do it is for their benefit and not yours 453 00:33:44,820 --> 00:33:48,540 Yeah, that's a really good way to operate with people. You know, so good 454 00:33:49,060 --> 00:33:54,620 So the so the other place that this clearly connects with scripture is in 455 00:33:55,140 --> 00:34:00,980 Corinthians when Paul actually says that I wish everybody would prophesy. Yeah, right now once again 456 00:34:00,980 --> 00:34:04,860 I want to put prophecy and however you follow Jesus 457 00:34:04,860 --> 00:34:08,660 Right. We are not telling you guys that you need to be Pentecostals. No, right 458 00:34:09,780 --> 00:34:13,980 In fact, like we'll just agree or disagree on how we go about following Jesus on that. Okay 459 00:34:13,980 --> 00:34:18,260 Yeah, we're gonna follow after Jesus because he's awesome and our opinions are less awesome 460 00:34:18,780 --> 00:34:24,140 Right. Yeah, right. And so it's actually this when Paul's quoting this in Corinthians 461 00:34:24,140 --> 00:34:27,380 It's a really interesting because he it references back 462 00:34:27,820 --> 00:34:32,620 Shocker to parts of the Old Testament and not just to this story not just to Pentecost and Exodus 463 00:34:32,620 --> 00:34:37,420 But also references back to I believe it's Joel. Yeah minor prophets where it says every man 464 00:34:37,420 --> 00:34:42,300 Everyone will probably something your spirit will be poured out on all. Yeah, which references back over to excess too 465 00:34:42,300 --> 00:34:46,860 Yeah, and so and and honestly that connects with when Peter is talking at Shavuot 466 00:34:47,660 --> 00:34:51,260 Also called Pentecost and he says this is what was foretold 467 00:34:51,260 --> 00:34:56,700 Yeah, when your spirit would be poured out on all flesh. This has been coming. This has been talked about in the Old Testament 468 00:34:56,700 --> 00:35:00,540 This is not a new concept that comes to the New Testament. Yeah, right 469 00:35:00,540 --> 00:35:03,900 I think we have a tendency to maybe think it's a new concept because we're like, oh, it's a new testament 470 00:35:03,900 --> 00:35:07,660 I'm a concept except the New Testament is the fulfillment of the Old Covenant 471 00:35:07,660 --> 00:35:10,780 Jesus as a Jewish Messiah steps into the role of Israel 472 00:35:10,780 --> 00:35:14,540 Redeems all of mankind and is a priesthood and it welcomes in everybody 473 00:35:14,540 --> 00:35:20,540 Yeah, right and all spirit is poured out and people's fundamental natures are changed in their power by the Holy Spirit to live differently 474 00:35:20,540 --> 00:35:26,460 So that we can subdue the earth fill it and bring glory to God. Yeah, so we can live up to the idea of the image 475 00:35:26,460 --> 00:35:29,500 Without the spirit that's impossible. Yep 476 00:35:30,540 --> 00:35:33,980 So you have Paul echoing Moses here where he's saying or he's saying no 477 00:35:34,460 --> 00:35:36,460 Where he's saying that we are the body 478 00:35:37,020 --> 00:35:41,260 We are the church and we are to go out and be the light in the community 479 00:35:41,740 --> 00:35:44,780 Right. You have Moses saying the same thing when 480 00:35:45,340 --> 00:35:50,780 Joshua which is really interesting Joshua the one who actually leads them into the promised land. Mm-hmm says 481 00:35:51,500 --> 00:35:54,460 Moses let's make let's stay in the same place 482 00:35:54,460 --> 00:36:00,220 Moses let's make let's stop this. Yeah, put an end to this and Moses is like, what are you talking about, bro? 483 00:36:00,300 --> 00:36:07,660 Like he's no this is great. Don't you want this? Don't you want the outpouring of the spirit on all of God's people? 484 00:36:08,940 --> 00:36:10,140 so 485 00:36:10,140 --> 00:36:16,860 When you're saying that the star remember the story about Jesus and his disciples and they're like Jesus these guys over here are preaching your 486 00:36:17,180 --> 00:36:19,340 Your word, but they're not with us 487 00:36:19,340 --> 00:36:24,300 He's like, yeah, whoever's not against us is for us. He's like your point is 488 00:36:24,620 --> 00:36:29,900 He's like you you can't proclaim these things by accident the kingdom like you're proclaiming the kingdom 489 00:36:29,900 --> 00:36:32,700 Uh-huh. Go ahead and let them do it. Even if they're doing it with selfish motives 490 00:36:32,700 --> 00:36:36,220 Let them do it because at least the kingdom is going to be proclaimed. That's something that Paul says. Yeah 491 00:36:36,700 --> 00:36:39,820 And by the way, love and context we talk about that a lot 492 00:36:39,820 --> 00:36:47,100 There's a reason we don't talk about people badly from our platform. Yeah, because even if they're preaching for selfish motives 493 00:36:47,100 --> 00:36:49,100 The gospel is still preached. Yep 494 00:36:49,420 --> 00:36:54,460 And people are still changed even with like awful pastors people still come to find christ in spite of them 495 00:36:54,460 --> 00:37:00,860 Uh-huh, right because often god works in spite of us not because of us. Yes. It's so true. It is so true 496 00:37:01,580 --> 00:37:07,580 So true one of my favorite stories revolving around that like god working in spite of people is the in the story of Jonah 497 00:37:08,140 --> 00:37:08,940 Uh-huh 498 00:37:08,940 --> 00:37:12,700 Like Jonah does not want to go to Ninevah. He does not want to preach 499 00:37:12,700 --> 00:37:18,060 By all accounts Jonah is a horrible prophet. Yeah, and it's a piece of it's definitely a book of satire 500 00:37:18,060 --> 00:37:19,740 Like it's like purposely set up like that 501 00:37:19,740 --> 00:37:26,060 But I want to focus in on the fact that it says Ninevah it takes three days to walk through which is a massive city 502 00:37:26,060 --> 00:37:28,860 Yeah, it says that Jonah walks in one day 503 00:37:29,420 --> 00:37:34,940 So he doesn't even get halfway through the city and then he preaches a sermon that is five words 504 00:37:36,060 --> 00:37:38,060 once and then he leaves 505 00:37:38,060 --> 00:37:42,220 And then he goes and sits on a hill. He's like burn them. Yeah burn everything 506 00:37:42,220 --> 00:37:45,820 He's like he's okay god. I preached like you told me I had to 507 00:37:46,380 --> 00:37:52,300 And the entire city and the animals which is why like once again satire 508 00:37:52,700 --> 00:37:59,820 All this city and the animals repent in ashes and sackcloth. Uh, like pleading to god for forgiveness 509 00:38:00,620 --> 00:38:01,820 Uh-huh. Okay 510 00:38:01,820 --> 00:38:05,100 If there's not a story of god working in spite of us 511 00:38:05,100 --> 00:38:11,180 Uh-huh. It's that yeah in this story joshua comes and he's like hey these guys aren't with us 512 00:38:11,740 --> 00:38:15,260 They didn't come to the tent of meeting like they were supposed to and the spirits on him 513 00:38:15,260 --> 00:38:17,660 We should stop them and most of us like come on, dude 514 00:38:18,220 --> 00:38:21,900 Don't you see what's happening? God is moving and they're a part of what God is doing 515 00:38:21,900 --> 00:38:26,060 We're going to rejoice in it not freak out about it. I wish everybody. Yeah 516 00:38:27,100 --> 00:38:31,340 And we should be extremely grateful. That's how the lord works 517 00:38:31,340 --> 00:38:36,940 Because you look through the old testament and new testament that story happens again and again 518 00:38:37,340 --> 00:38:41,500 Where people are like no i'm not going to do that and then god works through them. Yeah, right 519 00:38:42,220 --> 00:38:45,740 I think this happens sometimes in denominationalism in today's culture 520 00:38:46,220 --> 00:38:50,220 Where somebody comes to christ and let's just say they're not a good fit for your church. That's okay 521 00:38:51,340 --> 00:38:54,620 Like I would rather somebody connect somewhere that they're going to grow in christ off 522 00:38:55,260 --> 00:38:56,940 Then just come to our church, right? 523 00:38:56,940 --> 00:39:03,980 Because we're not trying to build our church. We're trying to build the kingdom, right? Yeah, and the kingdom is the part that's going to move forward and has no bounds 524 00:39:03,980 --> 00:39:07,420 Right god is going to move through the kingdom. Okay, so you're not a good fit here 525 00:39:07,420 --> 00:39:09,420 Let's find a place that you're going to connect and grow 526 00:39:10,460 --> 00:39:14,540 I've gone to churches where it was really hard for me to connect and when god released me 527 00:39:14,540 --> 00:39:17,900 I was so thankful that I can move on to somewhere else. Yeah, and they weren't bad people 528 00:39:18,460 --> 00:39:22,300 It was not a good spot for me. Yeah with all of that said 529 00:39:22,300 --> 00:39:26,540 I just want to put a challenge out if there's any pastors or ministry leaders listening 530 00:39:27,420 --> 00:39:32,380 Get to know the other ministry leaders in your community and learn how to work with them. Oh, yeah 531 00:39:32,860 --> 00:39:37,580 Like I was a part of I was a past I was associate pastor at church for a few years 532 00:39:37,980 --> 00:39:42,940 And the town that we were in it was one of those things where six months into the job. I was sitting there and I was like 533 00:39:43,580 --> 00:39:47,820 Hey, do we know pastors at other churches and they're like, oh no, I don't even know they're not 534 00:39:47,820 --> 00:39:52,860 I was like, oh, we should probably get to know them and so I started going from like church to church 535 00:39:52,860 --> 00:39:57,900 And I couldn't make it past the secretary half the time like it was like what is going on here? 536 00:39:57,900 --> 00:39:59,420 And they're like, oh no, they don't have time for you 537 00:39:59,420 --> 00:40:05,740 I'm like, I'm a fellow kingdom worker here and I just want to get to know their name see their face say hello 538 00:40:06,700 --> 00:40:08,140 Let them know 539 00:40:08,140 --> 00:40:11,900 What church I'm at what we're doing love to hear the story about what you're doing 540 00:40:11,900 --> 00:40:18,940 So that I can know where to send people if we're not a good fit and let me tell you the church that was some of the toughest ministry 541 00:40:19,580 --> 00:40:23,180 Because when you have people leave the church, they didn't know where to go or we have people be like man 542 00:40:23,180 --> 00:40:27,100 This is a really hard place for me to be I didn't know where to send them. It's difficult and it's very difficult 543 00:40:27,100 --> 00:40:31,420 So if you're in a community get to know your minister fellow ministry leaders 544 00:40:31,420 --> 00:40:36,860 Yeah, build good healthy relationships with them and not to mention you're gonna be able to put them in a place where they're not 545 00:40:36,860 --> 00:40:43,180 They're just fellow ministry leaders. Yeah, build good healthy relationships with them and not to mention you're gonna be able to partner to do awesome things 546 00:40:43,340 --> 00:40:47,580 Yeah, yeah partnering together. We are the king like the kingdom, right? 547 00:40:47,580 --> 00:40:52,380 Yeah, right and and a hundred percent there's some things we got to agree on we got to agree that jesus is lord 548 00:40:52,620 --> 00:40:56,300 Yeah, we got to believe that he came back from the dead that he's given us a changed nature 549 00:40:56,300 --> 00:40:59,340 We're empowered by the holy spirit to live differently that scripture is real, right? 550 00:40:59,580 --> 00:41:02,860 And then beyond that let's not get bent out over semantics 551 00:41:02,860 --> 00:41:07,500 I mean some of the things we talk about contextually on the podcast if somebody disagrees with us, we still love you 552 00:41:07,660 --> 00:41:10,460 Yeah, yeah, you're still a brother sister in Christ 553 00:41:10,620 --> 00:41:15,900 let's take one step back here and then let's put the story back in perspective because we've talked a lot about how this spirit movement is 554 00:41:15,900 --> 00:41:20,620 Really big deal and understanding like the movement of the spirit and what voices are you listening to? 555 00:41:20,860 --> 00:41:25,340 Uh-huh. So in this story it starts with them complaining about and gone evil in his ears 556 00:41:25,500 --> 00:41:29,660 And then they get afraid because of the fire. They're like, well remember having lots of time with fire 557 00:41:29,660 --> 00:41:32,460 And then they complain again about food and moses 558 00:41:32,460 --> 00:41:36,140 He complains about the burden of leadership and god says not only am I going to deal with the food 559 00:41:36,140 --> 00:41:38,780 I'm also going to alleviate some of these issues with 560 00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,060 Leadership. I'm actually going to appoint people in 561 00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:44,540 leadership 562 00:41:44,540 --> 00:41:46,780 To work through here with you, right? 563 00:41:47,580 --> 00:41:51,820 Now, you know what comes out right after this story, which we're actually going to be talking about next week 564 00:41:53,500 --> 00:41:54,860 Is that? 565 00:41:54,860 --> 00:42:00,060 Miriam and erin start to grumble about moses's leadership 566 00:42:02,380 --> 00:42:07,020 So now this burden is taken off of them because moses like I can't handle this on myself 567 00:42:07,180 --> 00:42:09,820 God actually brings more people to help carry the load 568 00:42:10,380 --> 00:42:13,820 And then immediately the people who were in leadership originally 569 00:42:14,540 --> 00:42:17,020 start to feel intimidated like 570 00:42:18,940 --> 00:42:20,860 That's so 571 00:42:20,860 --> 00:42:24,620 On par with everything that I have seen in the church, right? 572 00:42:25,180 --> 00:42:28,540 Especially like pastors when they're trying to train people to be pastors 573 00:42:28,860 --> 00:42:31,580 They're always worried about them taking their position, right? 574 00:42:31,660 --> 00:42:37,900 Yeah, one of the things that I respected a ton that both nick and clint do at our church 575 00:42:38,780 --> 00:42:43,020 Is that they are intentional about raising other people up to speak to lead? 576 00:42:43,740 --> 00:42:47,260 To facilitate it's almost like they're trying to give away their job 577 00:42:48,380 --> 00:42:50,060 Yeah 578 00:42:50,060 --> 00:42:52,700 It's almost like they're equipping the body to move 579 00:42:53,020 --> 00:42:53,580 Yeah 580 00:42:53,580 --> 00:42:57,340 But it becomes really paramount in all of those leadership talks that we don't become 581 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:02,620 Conceited in what we're doing but rather recognize that it's the spirit of the lord brewing through us back to what spencer said 582 00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:06,540 You're actually speaking a word for somebody not your word to them 583 00:43:06,700 --> 00:43:11,420 Yeah, and there's a there's a great thing that we see. I think it's in the next chapter with moses 584 00:43:12,140 --> 00:43:17,980 Where we find that moses is the most humble man in the entire earth is the writing and as leadership 585 00:43:17,980 --> 00:43:24,540 It's not our ministry. That's the most deadly phrase i've heard in any ministry is oh, this is my ministry 586 00:43:24,700 --> 00:43:26,700 Yeah, it's not my ministry 587 00:43:27,020 --> 00:43:31,100 It's god's ministry. It's god's people right we get an opportunity to lead 588 00:43:31,340 --> 00:43:36,860 Yeah, and equip like that. That is the purpose of leadership, right and we just see that in in america 589 00:43:36,860 --> 00:43:42,860 It's all corporation. I own a business and the way I think about my business is different than how I think about ministry 590 00:43:43,100 --> 00:43:45,820 Yeah, there's some crossover and ideas and teaching 591 00:43:45,820 --> 00:43:49,500 You know growing people but my my goal in business is 592 00:43:50,140 --> 00:43:56,140 To make money and my goal in church is to equip and build the church. It's not my church 593 00:43:56,220 --> 00:44:01,740 I gain nothing. Yeah, even like the idea of like my church is like it's is like our city 594 00:44:02,140 --> 00:44:06,860 Like we're part of the city church, which is part of the state church, which is part of the national church 595 00:44:06,940 --> 00:44:09,740 Which is part of the global church. All right newsflash 596 00:44:10,380 --> 00:44:12,380 Jesus is part of all that. Yeah 597 00:44:12,380 --> 00:44:17,340 The huge part of it so i'm going to give you a little push back on the humbleness of moses because I remember at 598 00:44:17,340 --> 00:44:21,580 The beginning of exodus that he wrote this line about being a fine young baby 599 00:44:22,700 --> 00:44:24,380 right 600 00:44:24,380 --> 00:44:30,940 I think we're getting some ben semantics here. Yeah, no, I just remembered that so if you remember back in the beginning of exodus 601 00:44:30,940 --> 00:44:33,820 We moses writes this thing about he was a fine child 602 00:44:34,300 --> 00:44:39,260 Yeah, and so moses being the guy who wrote the book of exodus or is at least a scribe to have written it was writing about 603 00:44:39,260 --> 00:44:41,660 How fine he was as a baby? Uh-huh. Yeah 604 00:44:41,660 --> 00:44:43,340 Yeah 605 00:44:43,340 --> 00:44:44,940 humble 606 00:44:44,940 --> 00:44:52,620 Yeah for the most part in verse three. Yeah, there it is. Yeah, I also isn't it like the epitaph is can you imagine? Okay, so 607 00:44:53,580 --> 00:44:58,380 This is a little bit like the epitaph that comes into drama. It's way in advance. Imagine if moses wrote that before he died 608 00:44:59,420 --> 00:45:04,700 He just never has there been a man who was so close to god that we've talked with god face to face 609 00:45:05,420 --> 00:45:07,420 Yeah, so great 610 00:45:07,420 --> 00:45:12,300 Yeah, no, it's more likely that subscribe to my uh, joshua or one of the guys who came after him. Yeah 611 00:45:13,340 --> 00:45:14,700 So to tie it all together 612 00:45:14,700 --> 00:45:20,540 It becomes really important that we respond to the spirit and in humbleness right that we follow god in humbleness 613 00:45:20,940 --> 00:45:23,500 Because being in the desert is an act of faith 614 00:45:24,300 --> 00:45:27,760 Like egypt is oppressive, but it's understandable 615 00:45:28,460 --> 00:45:30,460 Yeah, right understand like your role as a slave 616 00:45:30,460 --> 00:45:34,540 But when you're in freedom and you have to follow the cloud and you don't know when the cloud's moving 617 00:45:34,540 --> 00:45:39,260 Right. Yeah, that's an act of faith and it just requires a different set of muscles. Yeah. Yep. Yeah 618 00:45:40,300 --> 00:45:42,300 Thank you all for joining us today 619 00:45:42,780 --> 00:45:46,700 You can find us in all the usual places spotify apple 620 00:45:47,020 --> 00:45:50,380 I'm saying spotify first because i'm an android user at heart 621 00:45:50,380 --> 00:45:56,060 So we have to go we have to go the more android route than the apple route to start with 622 00:45:56,540 --> 00:45:58,540 Ben's shaking his head at me right now. It's so great 623 00:45:58,540 --> 00:46:02,140 So you can find us at spotify you can find us apple podcast amazon music 624 00:46:02,140 --> 00:46:07,740 And then lots of other places as well youtube over there. We instagram facebook the tiktok 625 00:46:08,220 --> 00:46:14,940 We are on the tiktok. Yeah, so we're actually gonna try at some point to start posting live clips of us actually talking 626 00:46:15,580 --> 00:46:19,020 Cool, we might break some cameras. We might break some cameras heads up. Yeah 627 00:46:19,260 --> 00:46:23,580 Also, one of the things we're gonna start putting out there too is we're gonna start giving some book rep recommendations 628 00:46:23,580 --> 00:46:25,580 And we're gonna talk about the books and why we recommend them 629 00:46:25,900 --> 00:46:29,340 cool because we've got a ton of stuff that we reference and 630 00:46:29,340 --> 00:46:31,980 Some of you have been asking like where are you getting this material? 631 00:46:31,980 --> 00:46:36,700 Like where do you even start and we're gonna try to give you some things that are approachable and you can get a handle on 632 00:46:37,260 --> 00:46:39,260 Cool. Yeah 633 00:46:39,260 --> 00:46:41,260 Till next time folks. Bye. Bye 634 00:46:42,060 --> 00:46:44,060 That's a wrap for today's episode 635 00:46:44,380 --> 00:46:50,220 We want to extend a heartfelt. Thank you for tuning in and spending your valuable time with us 636 00:46:50,460 --> 00:46:52,620 We hope that you found today's conversation 637 00:46:53,180 --> 00:46:57,020 Insightful and that you take something meaningful from it 638 00:46:57,020 --> 00:47:00,540 If you have questions or comments, we would love to hear from you 639 00:47:00,860 --> 00:47:06,620 Reach out to us at love and context at gmail.com and we will be sure to get back to you 640 00:47:07,260 --> 00:47:12,300 Remember you can always engage with our content on all your favorite listening platforms 641 00:47:12,780 --> 00:47:19,420 Including apple spotify amazon youtube and one don't forget to follow us on social media at love and context 642 00:47:19,980 --> 00:47:22,780 On instagram and facebook for updates 643 00:47:22,780 --> 00:47:25,900 This guy right here. Yeah, just shake your head 644 00:47:27,340 --> 00:47:29,340 nod 645 00:47:30,140 --> 00:47:32,140 Yeah, all right, so it's gonna roll 646 00:47:33,340 --> 00:47:38,300 And this is where ben gets to edit the podcast this is where ben gets to edit 647 00:47:38,940 --> 00:47:40,940 Actually left the lights on your truck 648 00:47:41,740 --> 00:47:47,740 Now that was that I know guys can restart the battery that that's gonna that's that's gonna be a blooper right there. I I 649 00:47:49,020 --> 00:47:51,020 This is where 650 00:47:51,020 --> 00:47:57,440 This is where I have to cut out like a minute and a half of random stuff 651 00:47:57,440 --> 00:48:11,700 Stuff random stuff we're like eight minutes in all you've done is laugh at us