1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:21,000 Hi everybody and welcome back to Airway First, the podcast from the Children's Airway First 2 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:22,000 Foundation. 3 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,160 I'm your host Rebecca Downing. 4 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:30,520 My guest today is the owner of CT Oral Facial Myology, Brittany Murphy. 5 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:34,880 She is a certified oral facial myologist and butaiko breathing educator. 6 00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:41,480 Brittany received her degree from the Forsyth School of Dental Hygiene at MCPHS and postgraduate 7 00:00:41,480 --> 00:00:47,040 training in myofunctional therapy through the AOMT and IAOM. 8 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:52,320 Brittany is an educator and mentor for the Dental Sleep Toolbox and Airway Health Solutions, 9 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:57,880 joining other registered dental hygienists who share the same passion in becoming myofunctional 10 00:00:57,880 --> 00:00:58,880 therapist. 11 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:03,760 Brittany is also the face behind the podcast, I Spy with My Myo Eye. 12 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:09,760 You can find out more about Brittany at CTOralFacialMyology.com. 13 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:12,880 And now let's jump into my interview with Brittany Murphy. 14 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:16,960 Thanks so much for joining us on the podcast today, Brittany. 15 00:01:16,960 --> 00:01:17,960 Absolutely. 16 00:01:17,960 --> 00:01:18,960 Thank you for having me, Rebecca. 17 00:01:18,960 --> 00:01:20,680 I appreciate it. 18 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:22,520 Of course, of course. 19 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:27,520 All right, so in a lot of our previous podcasts, not a lot, in several of our previous podcasts, 20 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:31,240 we've talked a lot about myofunctional therapy. 21 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:37,120 But one thing that we've never really talked about are what are the goals. 22 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:42,200 How does myofunctional therapy tie into this concept that we're hearing a lot about about 23 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:43,400 whole body health? 24 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,080 Yeah, absolutely. 25 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:52,840 So our goal, regardless of who we're working with, is we want to establish correct oral 26 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:54,040 rest posture. 27 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:59,960 So that is the lips being closed all day and all night, the tongue resting up in the roof 28 00:01:59,960 --> 00:02:04,040 of the mouth, the tip of the middle and the back of the tongue lightly suctioned in the 29 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,400 roof of the mouth all day and all night. 30 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:11,440 And we want to establish dominant nasal breathing patterns all day and all night. 31 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:15,480 Now when you're in that typical oral resting posture, we also want to talk about where the 32 00:02:15,480 --> 00:02:16,480 teeth are. 33 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:21,680 The back teeth should be ever so slightly apart, like pretty much hovering over each other. 34 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:26,160 The only time those back teeth should really ever come into contact is when we swallow 35 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,000 and that's to help stabilize the jaw. 36 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:33,240 Okay, so if, and I'm sure everybody else does this whenever somebody mentions this, you 37 00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:34,240 check your own mouth. 38 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:39,720 So if your back teeth are together naturally, what does that mean? 39 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:42,040 Probably a clencher would be my guess. 40 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:47,080 Some clenching and grinding going on, some tension in those masticatory muscles. 41 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,600 So we would definitely want to change that, get you into a dental freeway space. 42 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:55,640 So a dental freeway space is exactly that little tiny space between your back teeth, 43 00:02:55,640 --> 00:02:58,240 which should be about two to three millimeters. 44 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:02,880 And, you know, your other question was how does that tie into whole body health? 45 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:08,760 And, you know, our oral cavity is the gateway to our overall health and having that tongue 46 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:13,280 resting up in the roof, the mouth does a lot for the rest of the body. 47 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,640 You know, it turns on the vagus nerve. 48 00:03:15,640 --> 00:03:20,880 It helps, you know, that parasympathetic nervous system to take over that rest and digest 49 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:22,240 nervous system. 50 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:25,360 When you have your tongue up, you're more likely to be a nasal breather. 51 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:29,500 And I'm sure you've had people on here talking about, you know, the benefits of nasal breathing. 52 00:03:29,500 --> 00:03:31,400 So we don't have to get into that. 53 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:35,840 But once that tongue posture drops, that mouth is going to open, right? 54 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:38,480 And when that mouth opens, that jaw is going to swing back. 55 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:41,880 So you have to think about what that's going to do to your jaw joints. 56 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:45,400 Even if you were just sitting here right now, if you had your tongue resting up in the roof 57 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:49,920 of your mouth and your lips closed, and then you just simply parted your lips and dropped 58 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:52,960 your tongue, you could see what that does to your body. 59 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:57,040 It almost literally starts to, you know, close your body. 60 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,600 You'll feel your shoulder start forward. 61 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:04,000 So it really has an impact on the rest of our body. 62 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:08,600 You probably also had somebody on here talking about that piece of fascia that runs from 63 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:11,640 the tip of our tongue all the way down to our toes. 64 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:16,800 So you can think if there's issues going on in that upper part of that fascial system, 65 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:19,600 that you're going to see these other things happen. 66 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:24,780 And I think the biggest thing is really just talking about that wanting to be in that dominant 67 00:04:24,780 --> 00:04:30,360 parasympathetic state, in that state of rest and digest and not in sympathetic overdrive, 68 00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:31,880 which is fight or flight. 69 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:35,640 And you're going to have that if you are doing some mouth breathing, you will be in that 70 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:36,640 sympathetic overdrive. 71 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:37,640 Right. 72 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:44,300 And then so mouth breathing, I think we kind of all understand, you know, how that falls 73 00:04:44,300 --> 00:04:45,300 into all of this. 74 00:04:45,300 --> 00:04:50,520 But one of the things that I saw on your website, and actually let's go to a podcast where 75 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:59,440 you discuss this about how myofunctional therapy and sleep issues and TMJ all kind of go together. 76 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:00,440 Yes. 77 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:03,160 Which my hair may not be completely instinctive to some people. 78 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,400 So I was wondering if we could just unpack that a little bit and talk about that. 79 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:07,400 Yeah, absolutely. 80 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:12,280 So I think that your tongue is a big stabilizer when it comes to your jaw joint. 81 00:05:12,280 --> 00:05:16,840 And in a course that I took before, so it was Sarah Hornsby's course, who's another 82 00:05:16,840 --> 00:05:21,280 myofunctional therapist, and she put this analogy up and she heard it from somebody 83 00:05:21,280 --> 00:05:22,280 else. 84 00:05:22,280 --> 00:05:25,840 And I don't think she could remember who she heard it from or maybe I can't remember 85 00:05:25,840 --> 00:05:26,840 who she heard it. 86 00:05:26,840 --> 00:05:29,560 So whoever made that analogy, we're giving credit to you. 87 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:30,560 This is not my analogy. 88 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:33,000 It wasn't your analogy. 89 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:37,400 But she put a picture up of a stool, a three-legged stool. 90 00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:42,240 And if you think about the three-legged stool and two of those legs being your joints, your 91 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:48,000 TMJ joints, right, your left and your right one, and that third one being overall good 92 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:49,420 oral rest posture. 93 00:05:49,420 --> 00:05:51,720 So that tongue being up in your lips together. 94 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:53,640 Now that stool would be nice and steady. 95 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:55,520 You can totally sit on that stool. 96 00:05:55,520 --> 00:06:00,720 But if you knock off that tongue posture, that lip competence, how shaky, how steady 97 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,100 is that stool going to really be now? 98 00:06:03,100 --> 00:06:08,920 And so when we have that lower tongue rest posture, we tend to see a lot more TMD issues. 99 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:13,920 And the other thing that, now I can just hypothesize this from clinical experience. 100 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:18,400 I don't, there's not, I mean, there's some research, but there's not tons of research 101 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:20,640 supporting this. 102 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:26,560 A lot of times I find that my TMD patients have tongue restriction or decrease in their 103 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:28,520 tongue mobility. 104 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:32,120 Whether it's a tongue tie or just something we have to work through functionally with 105 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:37,080 myofunctional therapy, I find that quite often that there is a restriction there. 106 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:41,480 And that's why they're not really able to get that really solid tongue rest posture. 107 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:46,760 Because I think when people hear about myofunctional therapy, they hear a lot about like tongue 108 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:47,840 to spot. 109 00:06:47,840 --> 00:06:50,620 Like everybody learns what your tongue to the spot. 110 00:06:50,620 --> 00:06:53,560 And the spot is right behind your upper front teeth. 111 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:57,640 So like if you were to say the letter N, if you produce that sound correctly, your tongue 112 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:01,480 would hit behind your upper front teeth, not touching your upper front teeth. 113 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:05,160 Now that is where you want the tip of your tongue to go, but that's not enough. 114 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,560 You can't just have, I'm going to use my hands here, the tip of the tongue up there and the 115 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:12,000 rest of the tongue kind of hanging down. 116 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:16,960 You need that whole tongue up there in contact, lightly suction, the tip, the middle and the 117 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:22,440 back of the tongue to really have what we consider functional tongue rest posture. 118 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:27,640 And when you don't have that, I think it really creates a lot of issues in that jaw stability. 119 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:32,600 Even talking about that swallowing pattern that we talked about, when you don't have 120 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:38,600 that teeth together swallowing pattern, that good tongue to palate elevation of the back 121 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:43,000 part of the tongue to complete that peristaltic motion of the swallow. 122 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:45,280 Typically what happens is your body will learn to compensate. 123 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:46,640 Your body is a beautiful thing. 124 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:47,640 You have to swallow. 125 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:48,640 You have to swallow all day long. 126 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,480 You're saliva, your liquids, your solids. 127 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:57,040 Body learns to compensate and you tend to have more of a tongue thrust swallowing pattern. 128 00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:02,560 And with that tongue thrusting forward, that's going to cause some disruption on those joints 129 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:04,040 rubbing against each other. 130 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:09,440 So we're going to see function in the jaw joints due to an incorrect swallowing pattern. 131 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,240 So then you want to think, well, where did that incorrect swallowing pattern come from? 132 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:14,520 Like what's the root cause of it? 133 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:15,920 Could it be a tongue tie maybe? 134 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:19,280 Not all the time, but if there is a tongue tie, typically there's a dysfunctional swallowing 135 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:21,280 pattern associated with that. 136 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:23,120 So we always want to dig deep. 137 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:26,640 Myofunctional therapists are like detectives. 138 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:30,880 Patients come in and it's like some of the stuff we ask them, they're like, why do you 139 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:31,880 want to know this? 140 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:36,280 Why do you want to know if I was born vaginally or if I had an assisted birth? 141 00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:37,720 Why is this stuff important to you? 142 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:40,360 I thought you were just here to fix my mouth. 143 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:41,360 Right. 144 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:42,360 Right. 145 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:43,360 But it is all connected. 146 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,200 So I'm not going to go down to breastfeeding, whether or not you were breastfed and for 147 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:47,200 how long, right? 148 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:48,200 Absolutely. 149 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:51,160 Because it's building the muscles. 150 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,600 So one thing on your website that I would really love to chat about, because it was the 151 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:59,280 first time I'd ever heard this phrase, primitive reflex integration. 152 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:00,280 Yes. 153 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:02,640 What is this? 154 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:05,040 So I learned about this. 155 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:12,440 I recently networked with a wonderful pediatric therapist, occupational therapist, I'm sorry, 156 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:14,560 in my area, and she's wonderful. 157 00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:17,640 And she specializes in retained primitive reflexes. 158 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:19,880 And I learned so, so much from her. 159 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:26,720 So primitive reflexes are, it's a specific set of reflexes that all babies are born with. 160 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:31,160 And they basically just help like natural survival for babies. 161 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:33,160 They're like natural instincts. 162 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:34,400 It helps with brain development. 163 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:35,640 It gets babies moving. 164 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:41,960 It helps with the way they move their hands, the way they move their feet, muscle tone, 165 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:42,960 head control vision. 166 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,200 Like it helps with a lot of developmental things. 167 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:54,440 And these primitive reflexes should integrate within the first six to 12 months of life. 168 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:59,280 And when they don't, which is what is a retained primitive reflex is a primitive reflex that 169 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:01,760 hasn't integrated, it's retained still. 170 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:03,560 That's what we consider formal. 171 00:10:03,560 --> 00:10:07,440 And you can see some developmental delays from having that. 172 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:13,760 Now what's interesting is when I have this lunch meeting with this occupational therapist, 173 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:18,920 we're talking about symptoms of myofunctional disorders and symptoms of retained primitive 174 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:22,320 reflexes and a lot of them overlap. 175 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:26,240 So what I'm finding with a lot of the kiddos that I'm working with, and even adults can 176 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:31,800 have retained reflexes, is that we really need to work together because sometimes if 177 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:38,560 there is a retained reflex, it can inhibit the amount of progress I can make. 178 00:10:38,560 --> 00:10:46,800 So examples of symptoms of retained primitive reflexes, difficulty reading or writing, like 179 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:51,640 when kids hold the pencil more in like a grasp versus how you should hold the pencil when 180 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:52,640 you write. 181 00:10:52,640 --> 00:11:01,080 If they have issues regulating their emotions, any sensory processing difficulties, finer 182 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:07,920 gross motor delays, bedwetting can be a symptom of a retained primitive reflex, low tone, 183 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:08,920 speech delay. 184 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:13,440 So again, these are overlapping a lot of the things that I see in my patients. 185 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,120 So I found this really interesting. 186 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:22,640 And so just to give you guys an example of a reflex is the rooting reflex. 187 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:27,160 So the rooting reflex for an infant, if you were to touch their cheek or if the infant 188 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:32,840 was near mom and the mom's breast was to rub up on their cheek, their instinct is to turn 189 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:34,000 their head. 190 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:35,800 And that is to find their food source. 191 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:40,160 So again, what they're for, it's for babies' natural survival. 192 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:42,400 So again, that should be integrated. 193 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:50,520 But if it's not, what we would see in an older child or a toddler is maybe some feeding difficulties 194 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:57,320 or some speech difficulties or an oral habit, like a thumb sucking habit. 195 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:00,760 So there's a whole bunch of different reflexes. 196 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:05,440 When I met with the OT, she gave me some ones just to be on the lookout for in my patients. 197 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:08,120 But it's a really interesting topic. 198 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:12,800 And that's why, especially when you're working with that younger population, to have that 199 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:18,360 collaboration with an occupational therapist that can really help these kids. 200 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:23,000 And a lot of the stuff they do to integrate this, it's a lot of play-based. 201 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:27,440 I mean, she's somebody actually even awesome to have on your podcast and I can share her 202 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:29,240 contact information with you after. 203 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:33,600 But for anybody that wants to follow her on social media, her name is Ann Marie DeMarco. 204 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:39,000 And she puts a bunch of videos out on her Instagram page showing all the work and the 205 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,760 fun that she does with these kids that is helping them integrate these reflexes. 206 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:46,320 So we've been referring patients back and forth to each other. 207 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:51,000 So it's been really cool to start working with her because there's just some kids where 208 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:55,440 sometimes you reach this roadblock and you're like, ah, there's something missing here. 209 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:56,880 Like, what is it? 210 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:59,040 And that's why that collaboration is so important. 211 00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:01,200 Like, Mayo is important. 212 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:05,200 It is 100% totally a piece to the airway puzzle. 213 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:06,600 But it is not the only answer. 214 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:07,600 Yeah. 215 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:08,840 And I absolutely agree with that. 216 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:11,520 And I want to talk a little bit more about that in a minute. 217 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:16,040 As parents, what are things, I guess it's twofold, right? 218 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:17,720 So what are some things that we can do? 219 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:22,280 Obviously, it's going to be a little easier when they're younger to help prevent some 220 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:24,200 of this oral dysfunction. 221 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,200 But what can we do with older kids? 222 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:28,160 We don't really talk about them very often. 223 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:32,800 What can we do to help open bites or mouth breathing things that we're seeing? 224 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:33,800 Yeah. 225 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:41,120 So I think when you talk about older kids, the dysfunction you're seeing is a result 226 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:45,800 of the dysfunction that probably started very, very early on, right? 227 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:48,040 So we talk about open bites. 228 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:49,040 So let's talk about that first. 229 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:50,040 So things that you can do. 230 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,640 So oral habits are definitely a big one. 231 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:59,320 So like, thumb sucking, finger sucking, nail biting, prolonged sippy cup use. 232 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:05,160 I mean, really getting these kids less, you know, not using those sippy cups or at least 233 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:10,560 getting one that is a little bit better to promote good as best of function as you can. 234 00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:14,200 Sippy cups do not have good oral facial function in mind. 235 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:18,560 But you can do, you know, you can start sipping out of a straw at six months. 236 00:14:18,560 --> 00:14:22,920 You can start sipping out of a cup, single sips, you know, at six months. 237 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:27,720 Now of course sipping out of a cup, yes, they can spill it much easier than if it wasn't 238 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:29,120 a sippy cup. 239 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,320 But we have to think about what the benefits of this are, right? 240 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:36,600 So those are things that you can definitely do. 241 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:40,600 The oral habits, like I said, just being mindful, you know, there's so much more awareness. 242 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:45,680 I feel like we get a lot of moms reaching out to us through Instagram, like sending me 243 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:50,440 pictures of their babies, you know, with their mouth open, like baby babies, like new babies. 244 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:51,880 And like, what can I do? 245 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:57,600 And one of the things that you can do is literally just close their jaw. 246 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:11,160 Keep reiterating that lip close, lips close, lips close. 247 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:14,960 You're listening to Airway First with today's guest, Brittany Murphy. 248 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:18,840 You can find out more about the Children's Airway First Foundation and our mission to 249 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:24,080 fix before six on our website at childrensairwayfirst.org. 250 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:29,240 The CAF website offers tons of great resources for parents and medical professionals, including 251 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:35,680 videos, blogs, recommended reading, comprehensive medical research, podcasts, and so much more. 252 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:40,200 We also encourage parents to join the Airway Huddle, our Facebook support group, which 253 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:45,080 was created for parents of children with airway and sleep-related issues. 254 00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:52,400 You can access the Airway Huddle support group at facebook.com backslashgroups backslashairwayhuddle. 255 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:56,800 Are you a medical professional or parent that's interested in being a guest on our show? 256 00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:59,880 Or do you have an idea for an upcoming episode, perhaps? 257 00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:04,800 Then shoot us a note via our contacts page on our website, or send us an email directly 258 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:08,600 at infoatchildrensairwayfirst.org. 259 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:14,000 As a reminder, this podcast and the opinions expressed here are not a medical diagnosis. 260 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:18,880 If you suspect your child might have an airway issue, contact your pediatric airway dentist 261 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:20,640 or pediatrician. 262 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:24,600 And now, let's jump back into my interview with today's guest, Brittany Marchie. 263 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:39,280 Now of course, if you're hearing the child very congested or they're snorting or they're 264 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,200 wheezing or something like that, then that's a sign that there's some kind of nasal obstruction 265 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:44,200 going on. 266 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:45,680 And we want to take care of that. 267 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:49,120 So oftentimes, you know, referring to an ENT. 268 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:54,000 And you know, I think the biggest thing is I'm not a mom yet. 269 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:55,200 I hope soon to be. 270 00:16:55,200 --> 00:17:00,800 We just got married in June, but moms have that gut feeling like that instinct, right? 271 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:02,800 Like this isn't. 272 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,600 And you go to the pediatrician and the pediatrician says it'll grow out of it or you go somewhere 273 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:08,600 normal. 274 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:13,120 Like something just because it's common doesn't mean it's normal, right? 275 00:17:13,120 --> 00:17:14,120 Exactly. 276 00:17:14,120 --> 00:17:19,480 So just following that instinct and keep going until you meet somebody that is going to listen 277 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:20,480 to you. 278 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:25,640 And there's so much more access to people in the airway field now than there ever were 279 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,480 with all of the groups and the directories and things like that. 280 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:33,480 But just for moms to follow their instinct, like, you know, it's not normal that your 281 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:34,480 kid is snoring. 282 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,880 It's not normal that they're clenching and grinding their teeth. 283 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:43,360 And these are all things that if we can get to them earlier, the better, because by age 284 00:17:43,360 --> 00:17:47,560 four, you know, 60% of craniofacial development is already complete. 285 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:52,320 I mean, that's crazy when you think about it by age four, and is already complete. 286 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:57,360 So why wouldn't we want to start working with these kids earlier? 287 00:17:57,360 --> 00:18:02,640 Myo munchies, myo munchies are really great for younger populations, you know, to start 288 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:04,560 using moms can order those online. 289 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:10,320 You can't order the baby one, but you can order, you know, what would it be? 290 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:11,840 I don't even know what years it would be. 291 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:13,560 I know you can't order the baby one. 292 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:15,160 Like two to four. 293 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:19,920 Yeah, maybe even smaller, it might start maybe at 12 months. 294 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:23,760 I can't remember what the smallest one starts out as. 295 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:28,800 You can order that off of the Myo Munchie website and start introducing that to them. 296 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:34,800 You can work with a myofunctional therapist, you know, at a young age, 18 months to two 297 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:35,800 years. 298 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,480 It's going to look a lot different than working with like a five or six year old, but there's 299 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:47,880 still things we can do to help promote better foundations and help to, you know, put them 300 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:51,120 on a better trajectory to having better habits. 301 00:18:51,120 --> 00:18:55,960 And one of the things that I saw and I can't remember where I saw this, but just to clarify, 302 00:18:55,960 --> 00:19:01,680 you know, when you're looking at your child, is it okay if you notice they only chew on 303 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:02,840 one side of their mouth? 304 00:19:02,840 --> 00:19:07,000 Is that just, I don't know, like, is that just a habit thing? 305 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,800 When that throw things off with their oral development? 306 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:16,560 Yeah, so yes, you know, chewing on one side, think about, you know, if you went to the 307 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:22,360 gym and you only did bicep curls on your right arm, like your left arm, what's going to happen 308 00:19:22,360 --> 00:19:23,360 to you? 309 00:19:23,360 --> 00:19:24,360 Nothing, you're not going to get bigger muscles. 310 00:19:24,360 --> 00:19:26,840 The muscles might even even atrophy, right? 311 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:27,840 Or get smaller. 312 00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:28,840 Sure. 313 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:30,240 It's kind of the same idea. 314 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:35,280 I mean, muscles, you have to use them in order to really develop that good, strong, you 315 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:36,680 know, foundation. 316 00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:41,560 So sometimes with one unilateral chewing or one side chewing, we can see some facial 317 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:45,320 asymmetry due to the difference in those muscles. 318 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:50,160 The other thing I'd want to know if a kiddo was only chewing on one side was do they have 319 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,600 difficulties bringing the food to the other side? 320 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:58,640 Because sometimes with a tongue tie or restricted range of motion, sometimes even just, you 321 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:05,760 know, lack of muscle coordination or low tone or things like that, they can't get that 322 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:07,240 tongue to move side to side. 323 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:09,400 They can't lack of muscle coordination. 324 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:13,560 So that's what I'd want to make sure that there wasn't a tongue tie involved. 325 00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:17,440 And definitely something, you know, a feeding therapist can assist with if there's like 326 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:22,440 actual feeding difficulties associated with that, like any choking, gagging, spitting 327 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:24,440 up, things like that. 328 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:25,440 Awesome. 329 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:26,440 That's good. 330 00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:27,840 So and it makes total sense. 331 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:28,840 It's just funny. 332 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:30,440 I'd never heard that and I saw that. 333 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:31,440 Yeah. 334 00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:33,960 I had one. 335 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:39,720 So my very first myofunctional therapy patient ever and like looking back, now we got tremendous 336 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:40,720 results. 337 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:46,840 Like I'll never forget taking her final photos and being like, wow, like this, this really 338 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:47,840 does work. 339 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:50,360 Like I knew it worked, but like now I'm really seeing it. 340 00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:51,840 Yeah, to see it. 341 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:52,840 It's funny, right? 342 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:57,520 So looking back though, I would have done her case so much differently. 343 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:00,360 I mean, at that point, I didn't have the connections I have now. 344 00:21:00,360 --> 00:21:04,720 There weren't as many airway dentists in Connecticut that there are now. 345 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:09,240 She was a four premolar extraction case. 346 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:11,120 She definitely needed expansion. 347 00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:15,320 She probably could have used, you know, actually at that point, I don't know if she really 348 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:16,320 had a true tongue tie. 349 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,000 I think it was more just lack of space. 350 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:19,720 She was so narrow. 351 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:25,960 But anyways, her initial chief complaint when she came to see me was asymmetry in her face. 352 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:30,560 It almost looked like she had some, something went on if she had like Bell's palsy or something 353 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:31,560 like that. 354 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:35,840 One side of her face was significantly bigger than the other. 355 00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:43,720 And through myofunctional therapy and normalizing that bilateral chewing process that she had, 356 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:46,760 we were really able to gain some good symmetry. 357 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:51,360 Now that's not technically one of our goals as myofunctional therapists. 358 00:21:51,360 --> 00:21:57,360 Remember, our goal is to restore correct oral arrest posture, but through that, we see these 359 00:21:57,360 --> 00:21:59,240 other changes. 360 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:00,800 So that was really cool with her. 361 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:08,080 And one of the things was she had dental work done on her lower right area and at her. 362 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:14,200 So she started chewing on the other side and she only chewed on that left side for years. 363 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:15,200 Years. 364 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:16,200 Wow. 365 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:17,200 Yeah. 366 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:20,600 It was really cool. 367 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:25,560 It's always amazing when you've got some on yours and you can see them on some other 368 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:27,440 websites where you see these before and after. 369 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:32,520 I mean, even just in posture, it's just, it's just so amazing to me to see them. 370 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:33,520 Yeah. 371 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,800 I mean, like I said, the second that you get that tongue resting up in the roof of the 372 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,720 mouth, it's just going to help open this area. 373 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:46,920 And that, you know, myofunctional therapy is so much more than just giving mouth exercises, 374 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,480 tongue exercises, jaw exercises, you know? 375 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:54,160 I have a close colleague of mine and she was actually on the podcast, Karise Laguerre, 376 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:58,760 who she likens myofunctional therapy to personal training. 377 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,520 And I love this analogy twofold. 378 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:07,080 As the trainer or the therapist, you know, you're not just talking about, okay, do this 379 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:12,760 bicep curl, do this tricep dip and have good form, but you also have to help your client 380 00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:16,640 make good lifestyle changes or have good lifestyle habits. 381 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,640 And it's the same as us for myofunctional therapists with our patients. 382 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:22,120 I mean, we're talking about nasal hygiene. 383 00:23:22,120 --> 00:23:24,200 We're talking about sleep hygiene. 384 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,960 We're talking about diet. 385 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,520 You know, we're talking about all these different things. 386 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:34,640 If you're posture, you know, we'll do some posture exercises with patients, give them 387 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:35,640 tips. 388 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,840 You know, if you're somebody that works at a computer, okay, well, make sure your monitor 389 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:40,280 is raised up. 390 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:47,760 Make sure you have, you know, all these a cheer where your, you know, your legs are 391 00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:48,760 at a 90 degree angle. 392 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:53,480 Different things that we're helping them to just incorporate better habits, even for kids, 393 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:54,480 kids that play video games. 394 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:58,920 I mean, yes, we should lessen the amount we play video games, but play that lessened 395 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:01,720 amount of video games on a medicine ball. 396 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:06,280 Don't sit on the couch where you're like all hunched over on that medicine ball. 397 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:07,720 You can help engage that core. 398 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:13,000 We can support better posture, you know, making sure the screen is directly in front of you 399 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,600 instead of like up or I guess it wouldn't be down for any reason, but we're doing all 400 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,040 of this outside of just the exercises. 401 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:22,040 The exercises are a small part of it. 402 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:26,880 That overall awareness is key to creating changes. 403 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:32,080 You could do your myofunctional therapy exercises twice a day, just like they're prescribed. 404 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:36,280 But if you add up the time you're doing it, let's say it takes 30 minutes a day, which 405 00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:40,880 usually it doesn't, but let's just say for the sake of math, what are you doing the other 406 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,160 23 and a half hours of the day? 407 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:47,320 If that mouth is slumped open, if you're mouth breathing, if you're not paying attention 408 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:51,400 to the way you're chewing, you're not paying attention to where your tongue is, how are 409 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,760 we really going to be able to reach the goals we want to? 410 00:24:54,760 --> 00:25:00,120 So as therapists, it's really our job to help our patients or clients regardless of their 411 00:25:00,120 --> 00:25:04,320 age to integrate these like check-ins with themselves. 412 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:10,960 So like for instance, if I was working with like a eight-year-old girl, I would say, okay, 413 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,360 I want you and mom to go to the store. 414 00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:15,840 I want you to get a new scrunchie, a really cool scrunchie. 415 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:17,600 And I want you to wear it on your wrist. 416 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,560 And when you go to school and you look down and you see this new scrunchie, I want you 417 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:23,600 to think, where is your tongue? 418 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:24,600 Where are your lips? 419 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:25,800 And how are you breathing? 420 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:30,320 So now, around our school day, she has something to serve as a reminder. 421 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:34,680 So it's not just when she's doing her exercises that it's on her mind, we're having it on 422 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:36,280 her mind more consistently. 423 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:37,280 Continuously. 424 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:38,280 I like that. 425 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:39,560 I love that. 426 00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:41,640 And you touched on this a little bit earlier. 427 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:45,200 And so I'd like to dive into this a bit more. 428 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:53,520 What are your thoughts on why this whole cross-functional, I say cross-functional team, but approach is 429 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:55,280 so important. 430 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,840 And it sure feels like it's just all of a sudden, right? 431 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:04,200 Everybody's in the forefront, we're talking about this and we're talking about the benefits 432 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,400 of this cross-functional approach. 433 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,720 What's driving this movement? 434 00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:17,040 I think it's a mixture of there's a lot more professionals getting trained and educated 435 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:21,480 on understanding the importance of airway and collaboration. 436 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:27,200 I think that James Nestor's book had a lot to do with it because that was somebody completely 437 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:32,600 out of the field that wrote this amazing book that brought so much attention to what it 438 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:38,120 is we do from every aspect, from breathing, from myofunctional therapy to structure. 439 00:26:38,120 --> 00:26:40,720 He literally talked about everything in his book. 440 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,360 So I think that was huge. 441 00:26:43,360 --> 00:26:51,200 I think that, and we all, we thank him so much, it really helped the general public just become 442 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,160 more aware of these things. 443 00:26:54,160 --> 00:27:00,000 And then that importance of the collaboration, I think people are just realizing it's not 444 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:01,680 a one-stop shop. 445 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,280 You can't just go to the orthodontist, right? 446 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,080 It's not just about having straight teeth. 447 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:08,560 It's about the airway. 448 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:12,720 And we have to think, when I go and do a lunch and learn an orthodontic office and they're 449 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:18,000 like, look, we know about myofunctional therapy, we want to refer you patients, who do we send 450 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:19,000 to you? 451 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:24,800 And I kind of feel like a jerk because I'm like everybody because they're literally in 452 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:28,280 your chair because there's some kind of dysfunction that's going on. 453 00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:31,080 So we can't have one without the other. 454 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:35,360 I mean, you can put somebody in braces, you can expand them. 455 00:27:35,360 --> 00:27:40,080 Yes, things are going to move and shift while they're literally in these appliances. 456 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,680 But what's going to happen when those appliances are out? 457 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:48,360 When they're having that, those muscles working in their dysfunctional way, where they're, 458 00:27:48,360 --> 00:27:53,040 the cheeks are pressing against the teeth and collapsing those arches again after this 459 00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:56,360 beautiful expansion you gave to a patient. 460 00:27:56,360 --> 00:27:58,520 And I always explain it to parents. 461 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:03,520 I have this slide that I put up that has like three triangles and one is function, which 462 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:05,280 is me. 463 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:09,320 One is structure, which is an airway dentist or an orthodontist. 464 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:14,960 And the other one says limitations because even you could even see me and even see that 465 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:20,720 airway dentist or that orthodontist and sometimes that's not enough because if we have a limitation, 466 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:26,480 if we have a tongue tie, if we have nasal incompetency, how successful are we going 467 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:27,480 to be? 468 00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,280 Most of what I do, my patients have to be able to breathe through their nose. 469 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:36,120 I can't, if somebody's main route is orally because they literally can't breathe through 470 00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:40,240 their nose, I'm never going to get them to keep their lips closed and their tongue up. 471 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,640 It's just, I could be the best my own functional therapist in America. 472 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:44,240 It's just not going to happen. 473 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:48,520 So we have to be sure that all these moving parts are all working together. 474 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:50,640 It's just, it is literally so important. 475 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:55,080 And I'll say to my patients, and I'm very upfront with them because again, I love my 476 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,280 functional therapy, but we're not magic workers. 477 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:03,600 So you know, if this is the start and this is the finish line, if you don't do the other 478 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,880 things we suggest, maybe we'll get here. 479 00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,800 But if you want to get to that finish line, you have to see the ENT. 480 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:12,520 You have to see the release provider. 481 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,920 You have to see the orthodontist and you have to see me and maybe even a body worker or 482 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:18,480 big proponents of body workers. 483 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:19,960 I love that. 484 00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:21,440 I absolutely love that. 485 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:26,200 So one of the things I like to do, Dan, of every podcast is just completely turn the 486 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,240 floor back over to our guests. 487 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:33,200 It's whatever you feel that we haven't covered, whatever you'd like to reiterate to parents 488 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:35,520 in the floor is totally yours. 489 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:36,520 Yeah. 490 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:41,880 I would say, I mean, I don't know, we covered a lot and I know you've interviewed such great 491 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:43,320 people on this podcast. 492 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,760 So throughout all the episodes, I'm sure you've covered like everything, you know, to its 493 00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:51,320 entirety, but I think one of the things I would say, especially this happens more with 494 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:57,440 the pediatric population than I feel like with our adults, they come to us or they come 495 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:06,480 to an airway dentist and then they go back and ask the advice from their ENT, their pediatrician, 496 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:14,280 their general dentist that isn't trained in airway and they become very, very confused. 497 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:19,160 And sometimes of course you've been with this pediatrician for however old your child is, 498 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:20,600 you trust this pediatrician. 499 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:21,600 Yes, you should. 500 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:27,800 They're your child life for the last however many years, but especially pediatricians, you 501 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,960 know, they have to know so much about everything. 502 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:33,280 They aren't specialists of this area. 503 00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:37,800 And that's literally not their job and I think that my biggest advice would be, and I always 504 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:40,880 say to parents when I have clients come back and they're like, oh, you know, we talked 505 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:45,000 to our ENT and the ENT doesn't really think that there's a restriction. 506 00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:50,320 So I'll say, okay, well, I would love if me, you and the ENT could have a conference call. 507 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:55,120 I love for the three of us to all get on the same page so that the ENT understands what 508 00:30:55,120 --> 00:31:00,600 I'm seeing from my perspective and I can see what the ENT is seeing from their perspective. 509 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:08,840 Don't take it's not that bad or it's not that good as an answer because the opposite of that 510 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:09,840 is what? 511 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:12,600 Do you want your child just walking around with it? 512 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:13,600 It's not that bad. 513 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:14,600 It's not that bad, right? 514 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,760 Or they'll grow out of it. 515 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:17,760 Or they'll grow out of it. 516 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:19,320 Like you don't want that. 517 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:20,760 You want your child to thrive. 518 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:24,840 So I would just keep asking more questions. 519 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:30,760 You know, when the ENT disagrees with a tongue-tie diagnosis, why? 520 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,000 Tell me why you disagree with this. 521 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:38,320 Don't just take what they say as gospel because we don't, I don't know everything. 522 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:39,600 I learned something new every day. 523 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:40,920 I mean, that is the biggest thing. 524 00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,160 Like we're lifelong learners. 525 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:47,400 And if you have it in your head that you know it all and you're somebody with that big ego, 526 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,120 you're putting your patients at risk, right? 527 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:54,440 We always should be, there should be no reason that somebody's pediatrician or ENT doesn't 528 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,720 want to have a conversation with me. 529 00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:57,720 And it does happen. 530 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:02,480 And it's one of my pet peeves because at the end of the day, like we're all in this for 531 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:03,480 the same reason. 532 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,200 We're just trying to help our patients and help them thrive. 533 00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,800 So let's communicate, let's collaborate, let's learn from each other. 534 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:11,920 I absolutely love that. 535 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:13,720 Thank you so much for being on today. 536 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:20,120 And you mentioned we've had so many great people, but that's why we continue to have 537 00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:25,000 so many of you on here is because you all bring different perspectives and you all are 538 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,560 adding to the conversation and we really appreciate your time. 539 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:29,560 So thank you. 540 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:30,560 Thank you. 541 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:31,560 Thanks for having me. 542 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:32,560 It was fun. 543 00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:36,760 Thanks again to today's guest, Brittany Murphy for sharing her medical insight and to each 544 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,400 of you for listening to today's episode. 545 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:42,160 If you're new to our podcast, please don't forget to subscribe. 546 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,520 And if you enjoyed today's episode, leave us a review or comment telling us about what 547 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:48,520 you enjoyed most. 548 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,400 You can stay connected with the children's Airway First Foundation by following us on 549 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:56,160 Instagram, Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn. 550 00:32:56,160 --> 00:33:01,600 Parents can also join us via our Facebook parent support group, Airway Huddled, at facebook.com 551 00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,560 backslashgroups.com. 552 00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:10,300 On the Calf YouTube channel, you can find a variety of informative original video content 553 00:33:10,300 --> 00:33:16,280 as well as video recordings and excerpts from selected Airway First podcast episodes. 554 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,600 If you'd like to be a guest or have an idea for an upcoming episode, shoot us a note via 555 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:28,200 the contacts page on our website or send us an email directly at info at childrensairwayfirst.org. 556 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:32,160 And finally, thanks to all the parents and medical professionals out there that are working 557 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,120 to help make the lives of kids around the globe just a little bit better. 558 00:33:36,120 --> 00:34:03,640 Take care, stay safe, and happy breathing everyone!