Hi everyone, and welcome back to Airway First, the podcast from the Children's Airway First
Foundation. I'm your host, Rebecca St. James. My guest today is Dr. Catherine Murphy. Dr. Murphy
partners with orthodontic facilities to implement her distinctive patient-centered approach and
healthcare collaborative approach. As an independent contractor and consultant, Dr. Murphy helps
orthodontic practices establish and enhance their orthodontic departments through specialized
program-based guidance, including patient care. She shares her passion for holistic dentistry
through her speaking engagements and consulting across the globe. She's the author of two picture
books focusing on the connection between oral and overall health. Dear mama and dear friend,
do you know about tongue ties? Both books can be found on the CAF-recommended reading list.
She also reaches caregivers nationwide through her podcast, Dear Mama with Dr. Murphy. The show
provides insights into the holistic and collaborative care approaches that she teaches to orthodontics
throughout the globe. A graduate of the Indiana University School of Dentistry, Dr. Murphy has
been inducted into the American College of Dentists and selected to serve as an American Dental
Associate Wellness Ambassador. Dr. Murphy is on a mission to elevate patient care by introducing
a holistic approach to orthodontic treatments and to dental professionals across the nation.
I am super excited about today's episode, so let's get right to it and jump into my interview
with today's guests, Dr. Catherine Murphy. All right, great. Thank you so much for joining us
today, Catherine. Thank you, Rebecca. It's my pleasure to be here. Yeah, I'm super excited to talk to you today
really because this message is something I think parents need to hear.
So let's start our conversation and just talk a little bit about what is holistic
orthodontics in facial harmony. So we can kind of get an understanding of how this is different
from what we know as traditional orthodontics. Thank you because the word holistic, I chose it
for many reasons to kind of set myself apart. And I realized when I chose the word holistic,
it can come with lots of different ideas that parents might have as well as other providers.
So first, let's just address that some people might think holistic orthodontics means that they
don't need to have any actual orthodontics done. They don't have to have any appliances,
that there's some other alternative method for straightening teeth that they don't actually
have to involve me. And I can help support that idea, but if they come to me, I'm going to talk to
them how I can help grow their jaws. So I don't have a magic wand yet. Right. I just help move
everything. So that's one of the things because some parents have come in like, oh, well, I thought
you were holistic, so I wouldn't actually have to do any actual appliances or anything. But if you
want me to help grow your jaws for me, that's my modality. And I can help support others that can
then help further growth, such as cranial secret therapy, things like that. And by the way, I love
that you're saying grow the jaw. It's not just about straightening the teeth. Right. So that's
we'll get to that too. So thank you. The other thing is some some people think then it's just I
incorporate essential oils or that it's some kind of weird voodoo that I do. I will say I support
those oilers out there. I don't incorporate that into my practice because I don't have a strong
enough knowledge base, but I support anyone that they feel that is helping their child,
such as different people use diffusers, things like that. Right. I'm aware enough to know that
that can be very beneficial. It's just not part of my practice. Okay. And there's no voodoo.
Everything that I do is scientifically based. Right. I just choose the word holistic because
it really resonated with the patients I wanted to help those that understood I am not going to be
looking at the teeth primarily on my list of checks of what I looked for on my patients.
The teeth come in maybe like the lower third part of my checklist. Okay. And that shift alone.
I want to help the patients and parents that are going to be like, oh, that's okay that you're
talking about the teeth last because that's not for everyone yet. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah.
And I understand there's others that use airway centric or airway. For me and where I was starting
out in a town outside of Chicago, but it's a suburb in Indiana, airway, what did that mean to them?
Right. Airway and orthodontics didn't seem to go together. You know, there's some things that go
together like peanut butter and jelly, but airway and orthodontics, that was so much of a barrier
because it what what did that even mean? Right. Now, all these years later, it's much more of a
topic. Right. But when I started out, that wasn't something that would resonate with those I was
trying to help. So holistic is actually patient centered care. So I'm looking at the entire patient
and what the patient needs and not just focusing on, okay, you came in here with this chief
complaints. I'm only going to adjust this chief complaint and not look at the rest of either your
child or yourself, which was the modality before you came with a chief complaint. I addressed
your chief complaint. You were happy if I did well, you weren't happy if I didn't. Okay. And
the word holistic then actually gives me room to better like support a community that also
wants to track those same type of patients. So it opened me and my patients up to a whole new
community that I didn't even realize was in my own area. So what I also like to share is that
there are some practitioners that are holistic that don't advertise as being holistic, because
it's not a new thing. It's not a trendy thing. It's really just letting the caregivers, the parents,
the patient know, hey, you can come in here, share with me what is bringing your concern,
but crooked teeth are really just a symptom of an underlying cause. And most often that underlying
cause is mouth breathing. And mouth breathing is really just a symptom of many other underlying
causes. And everything can be brought back to the oral health, everything can be brought back to the
story of the teeth. And I'm going to look at all of this and how I can help address your
chief complaint, but also let you know if crooked teeth is your only chief complaint and you don't
want to discuss this other stuff, there are many other people that can help you.
Right. Right. And you know, it's interesting and you mentioned that it's not this isn't a new concept.
But it's just not the normal concept. Let's look at the root cause. Let's look at everything
and go to the root cause. And I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but we just,
as somebody who has spent so many years in this medical realm, as a patient, so often it's,
you know, here's a pill, here's a pill, here's, and we just move along. Where did this come,
at what point did we go off force? And where we don't look at the root cause, what's causing
all this? Because otherwise you're just going to have a patient back and back and back.
Well, this is actually where I might be rubbing some people the wrong way with this.
It's two sided. Okay. It's part of what us, the patient, because I'm also a patient, I've had
similar stories where then we didn't get to the root cause. I was just giving a med that then
caused more problems than it caused me to be on other meds. Exactly, right. But also, I understand
that where I was, I went in and I'm like, this needs to be fixed, fix me. Okay. So now I've gone
through and I've had to own that. That is what I asked. And that is what the physician gave me.
That's fair enough. Yeah. And especially in my specialty of orthodontics, the patient wants it
painless, right? We all want things to be as painless as possible. Sure. We all want things to
be as easy as possible and as fast as possible. And that's where the biggest thing comes in, where
there's a whole other discussion about the demand of the six month smiles, if you're aware of that,
treating just the, you know, aesthetic six teeth, all of that was driven though by what the patient
was asking for, right? So we need to remind ourselves as the patient, what did we ask of them?
Now, we also have to understand we didn't always know that we could ask for more. And that's why
CAF was created so that we could let patients and parents know you can ask for more. You are
deserving of feeling good every day. But how many companies profit off of us feeling good every day?
Right. So many companies profit off of us not only being codependent on others for feeling good,
but our coffee for feeling good, our clothing for making us to have a status symbol. There's a lot
of revenue generation off of us not being empowered. And now there is enough upset when, when it
affects ourselves, it's one thing. But when it affects our child, that's where the earth shakes,
because then we're like, no, I've allowed this to happen to me, but I'm not going to allow this to
happen to my child. So I'm so appreciative that this organization has been started and continues
to grow so much because it is the parents. And it's not fair. Okay, there's a lot of things that
might not be fair. But that's how it is. They're the ones that are requesting the change for care.
Yeah. And there's there's so many things in this question that I'm answering.
No, no, it's great. It's great. And this goes right along what we say all the time to these
airway mamas. That's driving this change. Yes. And it's I'm I'm here because I'm that airway mama.
I had already started looking into like, okay, why is this happening? And it wasn't until my own son.
And I just this morning, he was asking certain things. And I told him a brief story again of like,
you know, I owe it to my son that he was the tipping point for me to actually become the best
version of me, because I didn't take enough. I don't know, I guess I would say I didn't have
enough confidence in asking for what I really wanted and deserved from my health from many things.
Because I'm like, oh, I probably don't deserve that. Oh, I'm gonna be a bother. That's gonna take
up too much time. Right. Right. We've all done that. Or I'm complaining. I'm complaining. Oh,
I should just listen to the doctor. And then my son, I was at that point of, well,
I could just listen to everybody. Everybody's just telling me. And okay, some people will be out
there saying, buddy, okay, majority of people around me are like, why don't you just listen to
the doctor? Why don't the doctor says everything's fine. But I was at this fork in the road where I
could just say, okay, yeah, it's the doctor, the doctor, the doctor, I'm just gonna follow what
the doctor says. Or I could address that little eating away part of me that I'm not
like, you know better, you know better, you know better, listen, listen, listen.
So not to get on that tangent, but to that, it brings us back to
orthodontics. Okay, so that's, that's where I realized, oh, goodness, I,
I get to change how I care for my patients. And with my specialty, my specialty sometimes gets
really hit hard, right? How dare they have done this and the headgear and the teeth pulling.
And I'm going to just say that
the majority of healthcare providers out there, and I'm sure there's, there's all,
you can't always say always or never, right, they went into this, because they wanted to serve others.
They did the best they could. And what they were taught. With what they were taught and what they
were asked for. Any patient that comes in at 12 years old, that missed by so many other providers
that saw that child, that patient before the orthodontist at 12 years old saw them.
Yeah. And this also goes back to something we say all the time.
Usually we say it for the parents, but just to be fair, it goes to our, our clinicians
audience as well. You don't know what you don't know. They weren't taught this. We hear this
so often from medical providers on our show. They weren't taught this. So how would they know?
You know, so we're all parents and providers growing in the same direction, trying to catch up.
And when you don't know what you don't know, and you're being asked, you're being asked to look
at the teeth, you're being asked to fix these as fast as possible with as little pain as possible,
with as few visits as possible. And then you get into your zone of, okay, patients are happy.
Patients are happy. Patients are happy. And you keep going down that road. Now this is where I can
also say my profession, there are many that they want to not see this. Because once you see
the difference in treatment planning your patient based off of crooked teeth or a symptom
versus crooked teeth are the problem. And you can see the dramatic shifts in the care for that
patient. You can't unsee it. Nope, you can't. So what do they do? They throw doubt. No,
there's no way that that can be true. You need more research because what does research do?
It gives it time. Oh, you got to have X number of randomized control studies, which
we're not going to do this in children, right? Oh, I don't think so.
But then they said, well, that's the highest. Yes, but that's not ethical. That's not fair.
So it buys that like, oh, I have time. I have time. I don't have to look at this. I don't have to
acknowledge this aspect of care because it's not validated enough because it is validated.
It is validated. And arguably, I've read many journal articles, many textbooks, many years of
study. You simply go back to your anatomy book and physiology of how we are supposed to function.
And are you going to make me do a research project on the anatomy
of what proper anatomy is supposed to be? We're taught proper anatomy. How many times do you see
proper anatomy in your patients? I ask them how often? And then why? Why? Just tell me, just
start the question of why. But a lot of people, they don't want that why because it makes the job
harder. It makes it timing harder and makes it more work for the patient because it can't just be
dropped off here. Drop off my kid. I'm going to pick them up in 20 minutes. Okay. And then I'll come
back in six weeks and I don't want to do anything other than making sure that the child brushes
because that's not patient-centered care. That's drop off, pick up. I'm not going to worry because
I'm going to put it all on the practitioner. Yeah, let's just put in a fix on it too. Yeah.
Yeah. And it's also not addressing the other part of your question was facial harmony, which
to have that truly stunning smile, when you, everyone will think of, when you think of someone
that has a truly stunning smile, whoever that might be. Julia Roberts. Yes. Every time. Yeah.
But everything's connected. She's got wonderful symmetry. She's using her muscles evenly.
Everything works well together. Those that have straight teeth, but not a great smile,
which think about it for a second. Let that picture come to your mind. You're like, oh,
and then you might see that they have poor posture. They might always be leaning to one side.
But if you look at me, I'm still, I'm a recovering mouth breather. So I am a recovering facial
disharmony. Okay. When you can get everything working together and you have facial harmony,
all of the muscles are supporting to your tongue posture, your tongue is up at the roof of the
mouth. Your lips want to go together without struggle. You can breathe through your nose.
Now that is not only a stunning smile, but a stunning face.
And as we've discovered the mental implications that come with it as well,
you're going to see not everybody, but overall signs and symptoms of ADHD go away,
anxiety drops, depression comes more and more. You see mental changes as well in these patients.
Well, one thing we all have in common, anyone listening to this, anyone that's here,
we're all breathing, but we don't all breathe correctly. Right. And that's just not a topic
that is in most parental groups. That's not a topic that's brought up in medical groups of what's
going on with my patient. They might look at oxygen saturation, but they're not looking at how the
patient is breathing because they're obviously breathing. Otherwise, they wouldn't be in your
clinic, but that we can breathe incorrectly. And we take the simplest thing sometimes and think,
oh, well, I'm not going to think about that because obviously they are doing it.
But we also can understand that you can walk incorrectly. Right. We talk about toe walking
and walking is discussed. We can eat incorrectly. We talk about messy eating. So the discussion of
breathing incorrectly seems so simple. Yet it is complex. And that is something that we are not
trained well enough. So anytime that we're not trained very well, well, I'm supposed to be the
expert. And I'm not the expert at this. So we're going to send this to somebody else or we're just
not going to talk about it. We're going to punt it down. And then you realize that there are so
many people that disagree on breathing like, yeah, excelling through the mouth if you're trying to
relax. I was being tested, gosh, two years ago for my N95 mask. I was a part-time faculty member.
And so he put the whole hood thing on me and he's like, now take a deep breath in.
So I did like this. And for those that can watch, you can see my shoulders didn't rise.
And he's like, no, you need to take a deep breath. I'm like, I did. Like look at my belly.
Right. No, you need to take a deep breath. And like, was getting really upset at me.
And I said, well, I will do that with the understanding that's not a deep breath. If you
require me to do that, but that's not a deep diaphragmatic breath. He's like, just breathe.
I'm like, okay. So this guy whose whole job is to test how well I breathe with my N95 mask.
That's another right way to do it.
Argued with me in front of my students that I didn't know how to take a deep breath.
And that's his job. Even in that arena, they have arguments about what a deep breath should be.
And we run into that on this podcast, all that, which is your stories.
It's crazy.
When it comes down to how, which one makes you feel better? Okay. Which one makes you feel better?
Let's start with that. Because your body's not going to lie to you.
Right. And if you haven't tried it, try it. Sit somewhere quietly, get still, take breaths like
normal and then go watch a Patrick McEwen video and see how to breathe from the diaphragm and try
that. And I will tell you, I'll be shocked. You don't, but you'll just feel not sure and everything
just kind of your whole body relaxes. And if you feel changing, if you feel anxiety,
that means your nose needs to be cleared. And so let's watch Patrick McEwen's video of how
there's two different ways to declod the nose. And if you can't do that, then let's get you help.
If trying to breathe that way is causing you anxiety, there could be a nasal obstruction.
You could also though have some actually like PTSD that needs to be observed. There could be
trauma that you don't even realize that's causing you anxiety to breathe. And so let's,
let's get you help. So going back to what holistic orthodontics is, is that it will also say,
there are many people that say, oh, you can start this age, you can start this age.
But reminder that just because you can start at that age, sometimes those patients aren't ready.
And first you get to deal with what is, what is really agitating the system the most. And sometimes
these kids don't know how to be calm. They haven't observed it in their house. They haven't observed
people in their house, nasal breathing, or sitting there and being quiet. Or if they sit there in
school and be quiet, sometimes that's not rewarded. Right. Sometimes they have to always be so active.
And now I'm expecting a child to sit in my chair. And I'm going to oftentimes invade the only way
that they've known how to breathe. I'm going to go into their mouth. There are problems. And in the
past, there used to be different techniques. Either the parent would try to overpower their child
through fear, shame, or the provider using fear, shame tactics to force that child to go through
different procedures. Right. But you got to meet them where they are. This is back to what's the
root cause that goes, then again, why you call it holistic. And let's see what the patient can handle.
And oftentimes, let's get them started with something like the myelmunchie, with the myelbrace,
because they're not ready yet even to work with a trained myelfunctional that ever sets
trained with a little one. They might not be ready for that intensity yet. Right. Give them
some stepping stones. And I have run into the parents, them getting very upset because, well,
but they need the expansion right now. I've heard it. I've done my research.
Okay. I see you and you're worried. And prior to starting the podcast, I was telling Rebecca,
I'm like, okay, thank you for allowing me to share on my ultimate mission, which is to empower
caregivers and patients. So I don't use very many statistics. There are so many awesome
practitioners that are out there sharing that. And I love that that raises awareness.
And oftentimes we'll get parents to take that next step. But I also understand sometimes it can
invoke shame and fear. And what my true calling is, is to help patients and caregivers get through
that hurdle of shame and fear, because it keeps us locked up. And understanding that with the
holistic approach, I am going to have some conversations of ultimately trauma comes with a
word with different thoughts with it. But we need to understand that trauma is just anything that
our body can't handle at that time. If you've ever hit your knee against a coffee table,
one day, darn it, I need to move that coffee table. But another day, if you've had a bad morning,
because you didn't sleep well, and you got up, and kids are screaming at you, and you're late for
work, and then you hit that table, it can hurt all day, mom. And then you're mad at yourself,
because you didn't move the coffee table. Like, oh, it's the same thing. It's the same knee.
But it's what your body couldn't handle that day, because you'd already reached that threshold.
Right. It's just one more thing. And each kid has a different threshold. Each patient,
all of us have a different threshold. And sometimes what happened to, with the child's
history, you need to first address some trauma. And I don't mean trauma, like the horrible things
that you can see on TV. I mean, sometimes all those nights of poor sleep, it was just, it was a lot
on the child being told you should be able to sleep and the child can't sleep. Let's first just
let it go. Yeah. Let's let all, all of what happened in the past go. Let's acknowledge the things like,
okay, this provider wasn't helpful in our journey. Let's let them go. We can address it, get back
to them and form them when the time is right. But right now, just let it go and look to the future.
Right. Start from here and go forward. Yeah. And so that's the other part of the holistic approach,
because getting mad isn't going to get you anywhere. It's going to keep you stuck and it's going to
keep you in that shame because you're getting mad because you ultimately feel shame that you trusted
somebody who really trusted them and it ended up not working. Right. Right. And if we look really
deep, sometimes we're like, oh, I kind of didn't feel so great about that provider, but I kept going
there and we need to be OK with that inner voice and it's OK. Listen to the voice and we've all,
we've all ignored it. Yep. I was that mom. It took it took my son having night tears at six months.
I kept going to what was supposed to best in our area, pediatric. I love the fact that
the pediatric pediatric office, you could call them at any time because there was like four providers.
Now, the first month he was there almost every week, he had to be on IV antibiotics after birth.
And so he had to be seen. He was seen throughout that whole month.
And at the month check, when he didn't gain any weight, I had a bottle thrusted in my hand
and told you and your child cannot leave until he drinks this entire bottle of formula.
Yeah.
And I kept going for another five months. I kept going, even though during that first month,
prior to the formula bottle shoved into my hand, I was told that my worries of my son's heavy
breathing was that you're a geriatric mom who worries too much. Go home and enjoy your child.
I kept going. But until six months when he was having his first night tear,
I immediately call me, I need to get in. So I called our office and I called another office
that thankfully a colleague had talked about her in passing. She said, you know what,
this pediatrician actually asks her patients if they brush their teeth.
And I go, oh, well, that's a breath of fresh air. Yeah. Wow. I like that. That's great. So I called
at the time I was practically a startup. So I, we got in first to our regular pediatrician.
Becca, can you guess what he told us? Yeah, he'll grow out of it. Go home. You're worrying too much.
Don't worry about it. Yeah. Any of those. Yeah. He'll grow out of it by four or five years old.
He won't remember it. And when I said, well, but my husband and I do, he's like, just grab a beer.
Oh, God.
You're listening to airway first, the podcast from the Children's Airway First Foundation.
You can find out more about CAF and our mission to fix before six on our website at
children's airwayfirst.org. The CAF website offers tons of great resources for both parents
and medical professionals. In our parents portal and clinicians corner, you can find educational
and informational content, including videos, blogs, our recommended reading list, comprehensive
medical research, podcasts, events, parent support, and educational opportunities.
Parents are also encouraged to join the airway huddle, our Facebook support group,
which was created for parents of children with airway and sleep-related issues.
You can access the airway huddle support group at facebook.com backslash groups backslash airway huddle.
Are you interested in being a guest on the show? Then shoot us a note via the contacts page on our website
or send us an email directly at infoatchildrensairwayfirst.org.
As a reminder, this podcast and the opinions expressed here are not a medical diagnosis.
If you suspect your child might have an airway issue, contact your pediatric airway dentist
or pediatrician. And now let's jump back into today's podcast.
For those that don't know what a night care is, my experience is with an infant.
It's different if as your child gets older, but either way, it's when the child is actually
inconsolable. So the child, it's different than a nightmare or dream because the child can sometimes,
depending on age, might get out of bed. They can move and if you try to comfort them, it makes it
worse. And then they come out of it and not really understanding what's going on because
now you're trying, now it is okay to hold them. But then they're disoriented because they don't
know what just happened. But their body, like for my infant, was just crying and screaming and heaving.
And that's a lot of stress on a body and then feeling, oh, because your body remembers that.
Yes, it does. By the way, it's a great book. The body remembers. We'll put that link in there
because it's a great book. And you as the parent, you're going to remember trying to console your
child and not being able to console them. So we went to the other, to the new practice. Okay.
And within 10 seconds, she's like, what are you doing about his head shape? Because he
started to have a little bit of head flattening because of his torticolus that he was getting
physical therapy for. She's like, oh, I think he's got, he's either got a lip tie or a tongue
tie, maybe both, maybe. We started talking about low vitamin D levels, his probiotics,
because he had been on the IV antibiotics. We'd had trouble nursing. Now we went to
Northwestern, which is the best hospital in my area. No conversation about how to help my babies
gut microbiome after being on IV antibiotics an hour after more.
Just surprising. I was a new mom. I could be shamed. Yeah, like, oh, I should have thought about this.
But I didn't think about it. And his life started to drastically change from small things that were
done same day, starting to month vitamin D three that day, I started him on the probiotics that
day started bathing him in Epsom salt baths that day. Now he still had some night tears. We had
some things that needed to be worked out. So I just I share that story to let any caregiver, any
patient themselves, if you don't have children, that reminder that that little voice isn't always
easiest because you have to give up other stuff. I had to give up the comfort of this practice. I
had four doctors that could call it anytime. I had to give up the comfort that everybody else took
their kids to and they could understand and give me pros and cons like, oh, you should go see this
one for this question. And usually it's that comfort that's the hardest to give up.
But on the other side of comfort is growth. Yep. And that goes for practitioners and parents.
And I was about to say it also transcended from your personal life into your practice,
which is why and I'd like to talk about that just a little bit. Your practice is very different.
It's very unique, I should say. It's not just because of the airway focus and the holistic
approach you take. What else makes it different? Well, I as of last December, 2023, I was finally
able to close the doors on my private practice and solely focus on getting this approach to as
many people as possible. So I had started a startup. We've gotten through COVID. I'd had our second
child right before COVID. I should just say the pain, I'm not great. I'm sorry. I apologize.
I'm trying to be better about that. And then I realized, wow, I'm putting so much into this,
but I can only see so many people one to one. And I need more of me to my kids who ultimately
need the best of me every day. And I realized having my own kind of limited me.
Because again, I could only see so many. Whereas how can I get this to more caregivers? Because
ultimately they're going to be the ones that change because they're going to be asking.
And how can I get to more providers that once they see it, but then sometimes they're like,
I don't know what to do with it. And orthodontists, especially at that time, were like, I don't really
want to do this at all. And we had a lot of general practitioners that were like, I've got to do this.
Because a lot of times they had had it for themselves, or most likely their own children.
So I'm like, I'm gonna figure out a way that I can help other practices, especially holistic
dental practices, that they get to see the kids, they have that no like trust factor.
But so many general dentists, they're really good at what they do, right?
And typically the training in orthodontics in school is so little. And then they're looking
at spending so many weekends and investing so much into something that they're not very comfortable
with. Because it's very different from the restorative needs of their patients.
And they're left with this in between, like, I really need to do this, but I don't really feel
comfortable. What do I do? And I would love to help them. And so I started being able to do that and
start going in there so then I can serve as someone that can actually initiate the orthodontic
department if they need me to initiate that, they don't have that. Some have a small orthodontic
department where it's in visible line, it could be that six months smiles, but growing it and taking
that approach differently so that they can focus on like, Oh, well, I already know some of this.
And if I just shift the way I'm thinking about it, I can offer these benefits with it too.
And then being there to talk with the patients when they need me to, I can be there, you know,
to ask questions I've had the doctors send pictures like I haven't seen this before,
what's going on. Like, Oh, here, this, this is common. If one of the most common things,
so parents listen, one of the most common problems when you have a patient going through expansion
is what they're eating and not getting out of their gums or their teeth.
That can lead the patient either like them playing with the things in their mouth,
because they want to get it out. But they don't want to tell you because you might find out that
they ate popcorn, eating the popcorn that shell up underneath the gums, but no mom because they
don't want to get in trouble. Right. Right. Or, Oh, I did eat all those sour patch kids and now
things are poking me. Oh, but I can't tell the doctor this, I can't tell my parents this. So
I'm just gonna say I don't know what happened. And then it leads to all these things. Well,
this shouldn't have happened. Well, no, yeah, it shouldn't have happened. But they're doing things
that they're not feeling comfortable telling you. So it's how you question them. Right.
And so that's what I get to do now. I get to work out of different offices and
kind of help them as needed. I'm also working in an office where I do run, I'm the only orthodontist
that I'm not helping another general practitioner there. I am transforming the department where
they are permitting me to talk about my functional therapy with patients. It's brand new to this
DSO. And I have so much pride in them that they, I am very thankful for this opportunity.
And very grateful for seeing DSO is kind of shifting gears. So that's where I'm really,
I'm really grateful for it because I do know now I'm able to make a bigger impact.
Yeah. Yeah. And I love that. And you touched on this a little bit, but something we don't hear a
lot of, how does myofunctional therapy work with orthodontics? I mean, we've talked about it from
the dental side, but not from the orthodontic side. Well, it helps get to that root cause.
Now, I love my myofunctional therapist and I will say,
sometimes I think the burden that's put on them is way too heavy because the four goals of myofunctional
therapy, lips together, tongue up, proper swallowing and nasal breathing. That's a lot to put on one
provider. So those are the goals. And I remind the patients that your myofunctional therapist is
kind of the quarterback for the team to meet all four goals. I'm like, that therapist is going to
help you and it's going to give you exercises to support those. But if there's barriers to that,
that exercises are not going to help with, that is on you. So there's going to be a need for
collaboration outside of just ortho and myofunctional therapy because if they can't breathe through their
nose, that therapist can't get them nasal breathing. Right. Right. So sometimes I feel like those
those four goals should be the four goals of all like health care. And we understand that
myo is the one that can help with the integration. Everybody and we're back to that again, right?
You're taking this holistic approach where it's not just the sort that on us on an island
and the pediatrician on this island, we're all on the same island together. Yes. With the myofunctional
therapist and the dentist and whoever else we need. Because I've had patients. I went through myo.
I'm like, well, but what did you do to really make sure that you can nasal breathe? If you
still have all those glade plugins and you're never opening up the doors in your house, what are you
doing to support that nasal breathing? I mean, there are so many things that go into it. And if
you have that obstruction, but you don't want to see the ENT again, just because you went through
myofunctional therapy doesn't mean that that therapist can get you to all four goals. If you
don't again, gets the root cause of why? Right. Again, because myofunctional therapist isn't going,
well, some might do revisions on oral restrictions if needed. Right. So there's,
it's not this one and done. It's not just myofunctional therapy and orthodontics. I do tell my patients
that if they can only choose one to first start with myofunctional therapy. Okay. And the reason is
because it gets them more empowered because they can actually feel what is a struggle for them.
They can see what they should be doing, right? The therapist can show them how to do the
lingual palatal section where they put the tongue up through for the mouth. It's also called the cave.
And if they're struggling, they can, they can see it. The reason also for this, because when I start
to move the jaws, when I start to widen them, they see what I can do and they're not understanding
that maintaining that is on them. They're relying on an appliance and a force system that I can put
in that I'm trained to do. And it's great. I love the fact that we are able to do this. I mean,
my job is incredible. I can move teeth and jaw. And you don't have to be under. And change blood.
Yes. You don't have to be hospitalized unless you're obviously needing orthodontastic surgery.
But we can do these things. But again, we are relying on externals. If you can first see what
you can do, you're going to be more empowered to then maintain what I can help facilitate your body
to do with expanders, braces, etc. Yeah. Well, and this seems like a good time to bring this up
because you have this video, which I will put in the show notes for people about shooting yourself.
And just I know people might think I just said something else, but it's what you should have
done or what others think you should do. So that's what I'm saying. I'm saying shooting.
How do we as parents and I would and I would think it would apply to providers as well. But
I'm just going to look at it from a parent's perspective. How do we shift away from this whole
shooting thing and start to follow our intuitions? Trust yourselves.
There are a few reminders sometimes that we know more than what we give ourselves credit.
But we know so much about our child. And I say that and I understand there are so many different
ways to be a parent, so many ways. And you know your child. And so I honor that. And listeners,
I understand that your situation might be different than mine. I share with you that I
gave birth to my son, but that doesn't make me any more in touch with my son than a parent that
adopted a child from halfway across the world. You know your child. You also know yourself.
And the input that you have is needed and should be asked for. You have gone through the scientific
method on your child without knowing it. There's six things for the scientific method. You ask a
question about what you're observing. You do your background research. You construct a hypothesis.
You experiment that hypothesis. You analyze the data. And then you communicate it. You've done that
because no person comes with the set. You might have read these great books that are out there
that say your child should go and take a nap from 11 to this time. And then you get them up and you
do all this and you get them back in bed. But we're not robots. And then you've decided, okay, well,
we got this going on and this going on. And then you start to see, well, if I put my child to bed
earlier than 11, the child might lay there for a while. If you're co-sleeping, might play with
you for a little while and then go to sleep. But if you wait till 12, they became overly tired.
You've done this since you tried to get them to sleep. Right. From this department. And every child
is different, too, because I have two what I did for one. The second one just kind of it's almost
as if she looks at you like, okay, mom, because she knows, like, I'm not doing it that way.
Every child is different. So you have to adjust. Exactly. I love that. You're game on mom. Oh,
yeah. Oh, she was. Yeah. We're going to test you out because you thought this was going to be easier.
Exactly. Yeah. And so you've done little experiments. You've done that with food.
Okay. You may not have known it. You may not have said, okay, I'm just going to think,
should I take away all gluten? But you've probably done like, oh, I gave them ice cream right before
bed last night. That didn't seem to work out so well. So maybe if I move the ice cream actually
to this time and we just don't have a night, we don't have nighttime snacks. Let's see how that
is. You've done this so often. You've tested so many things without knowing it.
That if your provider's not asking for your input, then you may want to find a provider or
ask them, can I tell you? Because again, that provider might be used to patients not wanting
to share information. Yesterday, I had a patient that it was so nice. She easily shared her whole
sleep history with me, her medication list, everything. I'm like, thank you. Thank you for
trusting me without you hadn't even met me yet. And you wrote all of that down. And I want to honor
you because it's not easy to share all that with someone that you don't know. That's true.
And there are many providers out there that don't get all the list of medications. I love
talking to optometrists because the work I do can really help positively impact vision.
But optometrists are often treated the same way as dentists, often treated the same way as chiropractors.
Like, oh, why does that doctor need to know that information? But it's all connected. Yes.
And your physician is not going to call us and tell us. If you don't tell us, we won't know what
you're on. So the shooting yourself. It is one of my most proud things to share because
it empowers you when you start doing what you know is right. And at first, you might not be
fully confident. You might be like, I think it's right. But then take a minute. You don't have to
you don't have to do it right now. Most things we feel like once we get scared, we hear we got to
take action right now. Most things you don't have to. Right. If your kid's choking, you take action
right then. But there's not any doubt of like, oh, you should help your child and they're choking.
Right. Right. But if your child, if you're looking at your child's teeth and you're like,
man, they are really crooked. I just, I don't know yet. Do some more research. Feel some things out.
So go back, listen to some more calf podcasts. Look at their resources. They've got lots of great
books on there. Do your research and then you'll find what resonates with you and follow that.
I think that's brilliant. And it's usually I ask my guests at the end of an episode,
I turn the floor back over for the final word and was actually a really good final word. But
is there more that you could add to that for the final word? Well, this might seem a little off
topic, but it really goes back to everything. Okay. Listeners, viewers, I know for the most part,
I don't know you, but I truly believe in every single one of you. And you are enough.
You are enough of a parent. You are enough of a daughter, son, mother, father, co-worker,
educator, whatever is how you serve people because they don't want to say your job,
because it's all how we serve. You are enough and you are so deserving to feel good every day.
So if I can be of help, I limit my one on one time with colleagues and one on one time with
caregivers because I, like I said, I've chosen to spend as much time as I can with my kids, but
also making a big impact. But let me know, reach out and I would love to support you
and what you're doing because if you're listening to this podcast, then you're on such a great journey
and you are deserving. You are enough and so is your child. Thank you for that. Thank you so much.
And thank you for everything you shared with us today. Absolutely my pleasure. Thank you so much
for having me. Thanks again to today's guest, Dr. Catherine Murphy for sharing her medical insight
and airway journey and to each of you for listening to today's episode. If you're new to our podcast,
please don't forget to subscribe. And if you enjoyed today's episode, leave us a review
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Take care, stay safe, and happy believing everyone.