Hello, everybody.
My name is Ed Ryan.
I am the editorial director of the podcast Business Journal.
When I was at PodFest just a month ago down in Orlando, I had an opportunity to meet
Bruce Wozniak.
Now, Bruce has three podcasts that he takes care of plus his regular job and he was at
PodFest doing a presentation and meeting people and hanging out with people and networking
with people.
And so we thought it would be a great idea to talk to Bruce about his experience in the
podcasting space and we put him in the PBJ Spotlight where we talk about how to promote
your show, how to prepare great show notes, how to prepare for a show, how many shows
you should have in the can before you launch.
And so right now, let's get in the PBJ Spotlight with Bruce Wozniak.
Bruce, thanks so much for coming on.
And the first question I always like to ask podcasters is, how and why did you become
a podcaster?
How and why?
Well, how was by attending a e-marketing group that was put on by someone that we affectionately
know as the Podfather.
And the reason that I did it was I had known about podcasting and thought that it would
be a good marketing tool for my business.
So I don't want to say the plan that's aligned.
I just think that the time had come that I was ready and launched it in February of 2014.
What were you doing before that?
Well, I still have the same business that I had then, which is now here this incorporated,
which has always been a company that does promotional work.
I call it communications, public relations, media relations, marketing, the web, social
media for clients that range anywhere from performers to authors, small businesses.
I even had an Olympic athlete client.
But I thought that starting a podcast would be a good way to start reaching people who
I otherwise probably wouldn't get in front of, meaning that some artists who performs
maybe say in the St. Louis area might hear the podcast and say, I wonder if this bruise
guy could manage and promote me from across the miles.
And now here we are in 2019.
And of course, podcasting being what it is, it became so much more to me than just that.
So the first podcast, I believe it was the first one right now here is now here this
turned into your first one.
And has that helped your business?
Yeah, it's interesting.
I'm only going to correct you because there's a neat lesson here for podcasters that has
always surprised me.
When I went to start the podcast, I thought, well, my company is called Now Hear This.
So I guess I'll just call the podcast Now Hear This and did something as simple as go
on iTunes and punched in Now Hear This.
And I said, oh, someone's already using that title.
I'm going to call mine Now Hear This Entertainment.
And I bring that up, Ed, because it surprises me that it's so fundamental.
Yet I think people who are starting into podcasting just think I need to come up with a good name
for my podcast.
And because they come up with something that they like, they don't think to take that extra
simple step, which is I got to make sure no one else is already using that.
I called my Now Hear This Entertainment.
And yes, it has very, very much helped me in terms of everything from getting a client
to getting a speaking engagement to getting hired by someone else to do a podcast.
That has done so much for me.
And really, the depth of contacts that I have built up because of all those guests that
I've interviewed doing it every week for more than five years, I don't know that you could
put any kind of value on that.
Everybody always wants to talk about monetization.
Well, how are you monetizing the podcast?
And I feel there's a huge value on those relationships that I've been able to build and those contacts
that I've gotten through interviewing guests week after week for five years on Now Hear
This Entertainment.
So talk to the new podcasters, somebody that's thinking of launching one or is just launching
one.
You take your idea from your business and you'll launch a podcast.
My guess is not too many people know about it.
You have to push it out.
You have to get listeners.
How did you do all that?
And give advice on people that are just starting out so they can pick up on the different steps
they need to take in order for the podcast to be successful.
Well, it is going to take time.
And don't get caught up in looking at stats.
You'll get discouraged right away.
If you can really, really niche it down to something really specific, you're going to
have a lot better luck getting more listeners faster.
But at the same time, don't get discouraged if you have five episodes out and you feel
like, okay, feel like nobody is listening because it's way too soon and there's a lot
of work that has to be done.
I do a presentation called 20 Plus Ways to Promote Your Podcast and I always start that
off by saying, don't do the build it and they will come approach, which is, well, I launched
my podcast.
I guess people will find it now that it's on iTunes.
There's more than 600,000 podcasts on iTunes.
So just because it's there doesn't mean someone's going to find it.
So you do have to put in the time.
I also say in that presentation, if not you, then who?
So you do have to become your own biggest advocate for your show and take any one or
more of those 20 plus steps that I talk about so that you can get the word out there.
You really have to get out on the streets figuratively and literally to let people know
about it.
In your opinion, is podcasting a career or a job or is it a marketing tool?
Yes.
Is it a career?
Is it a job?
Is it a marketing tool?
It can be a career.
It can be a job.
But I think that some people are so stargazed at the idea of starting a podcast that one
of the first questions they ask other than how do I monetize this is, boy, I really like
this.
Can I make a career out of doing this?
Not so fast, young man, is what I say because it does take some time.
And who said the expression about it takes 10 years to become an overnight success?
You're not going to start into podcasting and a month later all of a sudden that is
your new full-time job.
Yes, it could very much be and it should be a marketing tool.
I'm surprised at with as popular as podcasting has become that more and more major corporations
have not taken to podcasting yet because you have so much control over what your message
is.
So I joked but yes, it could be all of those things, Ed.
It could be a career.
It could be a job.
It could be a marketing tool.
It's also just being realistic.
Now you start with now the Hear This Entertainment.
How does that lead to your second podcast and tell us all about that?
So I was doing Now Hear This Entertainment and through the Florida Podcasters Association,
I was able to get connected with Tascam and hopefully the listeners know that Tascam is
a global company more than 40 years in business that does all kinds of audio recording solutions.
I beta tested their mini studio creator, the US 42.
It's an audio interface.
They wanted to really market it towards podcasters.
So I quote unquote test drove it, gave them some feedback.
They liked what I had to say.
They wrote an article and published it on the homepage of their website and found that
it was getting a lot of traffic and contacted me back and they said, Bruce, how would you
like to come to California to the NAMM show, which is more than 100,000 people over four
days at the Anaheim Convention Center.
It's the National Association of Music Merchants.
We're going to have a huge, huge, you can't even call it booth there, but they wanted
me to do my Now Hear This Entertainment podcast live on location from the NAMM show at the
Tascam booth.
So I did that over four days.
This was in January of 2017 and I did 23 interviews in four days.
They had such a good experience with that that a month later they came down to Orlando
for Podfest Multimedia Expo.
We sat and met again after they were done as an exhibitor, as a sponsor at Podfest and
we talked about them wanting to get more immersed in the podcasting community and I asked them
if they had a podcast and they did not.
I said, well, I think you should have one and they agreed and I said, I think you should
hire me to do it.
They said, I couldn't agree with you more.
Just like that, the deal was struck in a handshake fashion and we worked over the next few months
to formalize it in writing and that birthed the show Tascam Talkback, which is a podcast
for podcasters and streamers.
The idea being, let's put this out every other week to help out the podcast community
and not directly sell and sit and talk about Tascam products in every episode, but the
inference being, hey, Tascam is helping me out with a lot of good information.
I should probably take a look at their products.
In addition to iTunes and all the other places you can get podcasts, is it on their website?
The website is undergoing some construction right now.
I really recommend that listeners look for Tascam Talkback on the traditional podcast
platforms instead, such as iTunes or I should say Apple Podcasts, such as Stitcher, TuneIn,
those types of platforms.
How long have you been doing that now?
You said it's every other week, correct?
Yeah, Tascam Talkback has been going for a year and a half.
Great.
Give us an example of two or three topics that you've talked about over the last few
issues.
It's a lot of fun doing that show because it's things that podcasters, I think, want
to know and dare I say are sometimes afraid to ask because everybody thinks, well, I should
know what my show notes page should include for my website.
We did an entire episode about show notes, what that should look like on your website.
We did one on how do podcasters come up with ideas to put out shows on a regular basis.
These are things that podcasters are doing on a regular basis.
It's just more a case of let's actually spend 20 full minutes talking about this one particular
subject instead of it's maybe a two-minute part of a 45-minute discussion because there
are people that say, well, wait, I have more questions about this specific topic.
The most recent one was about stats.
What stats should you pay attention to?
Which stats are most important?
Where do you look for the stats?
Which do you believe, that type of thing?
Do you get a lot of feedback?
Do you get a lot of interaction about this podcast that you're doing with Tascam?
What are the downloads like?
I do get feedback.
It's something that I think the podcasting community has responded to well.
I've enjoyed watching the downloads increase over time.
Obviously, when we initially put it out the door, just like with any other podcast, as
I said before, you have to give it time.
Tascam was good enough to say, look, we need to let this thing grow some legs for a while
before even we ourselves really flex some muscle and get behind it.
The downloads, I don't have the numbers in front of me.
They wouldn't blow you away, but at the same time, when you do watch a show start out and
you see it crawling out of the gate and then all of a sudden you see the numbers continue
to increase, it really does make you feel better.
Here's a tip I want to give Ed because I hear people say, nobody listens to my show.
I say, how do you know that?
They say, because I haven't gotten a single email from a single listener over and then
they tell you how long period of time they've been doing their show for.
Now, mind you, yes, I see emails coming in on behalf of Tascam TalkBack and that makes
you go, great, someone's listening.
But we always joke that podcasters are all about their stats.
Well, if you log in and you see stats, that means people are listening.
So please don't base the success or lack thereof on emails.
I often ask myself, of the podcast that I listen to, have I ever emailed the host of
the show for any reason?
Don't get discouraged.
Now the big question I wanted to ask you before we move on to your third podcast is, what
are your thoughts on the podcasting industry as a whole today?
What do you see going on, especially from day one when you first started to maybe PodFest
that was just a month ago?
From when I started more than five years ago, I feel like it has changed tremendously.
I feel like when I say it's become very corporate, I think there's this huge division in podcasting,
meaning there's this big sector over here which is very corporate, which is a lot of
money, which is a lot of dollars, which is exactly what you would picture when I say
corporate and then way over here, there's all of the indie podcasters, a lot of whom
are having success, but I think there's a great divide there.
I think that's okay.
I also see that the popularity has just exploded from more than five years ago when I started.
I do think that just like anything else, the cream is going to rise to the top.
So, just because podcasting has become popular and it is so accessible and for all intents
and purposes, anyone can start a podcast, it doesn't necessarily mean that just because
you start one, you're going to stick with it and you're going to be successful.
We did an episode of Task Cam Talkback about pod fading and people who do a podcast and
they're regular with their delivery and then all of a sudden they miss a show and now it's
easier to miss a second one.
Eventually, they disappear for a month or two and so on.
So, in the big podcasting picture, I think people get all excited about it, they do it
and then it's a matter of, okay, now the real work starts.
You got it launched but now what?
I tell people, think of your first dozen episodes so that you already know what they're going
to be because otherwise, you're going to be among the 600,000 plus that are on iTunes
but you're going to be in the big percentage that are no longer still generating new episodes.
What are your thoughts on what Spotify is doing?
The gimlet anchor thing seems like old news even though it's just a month or two old and
then podcast this week.
What are your thoughts on these companies being bought up like that by Spotify and where
Spotify is heading?
Well, it's part of, as I said, the corporate side of podcasting.
I'm waving my arm around over here to create this chasm, as I said, between the Indies
and the corporate stuff.
In the big picture, I have to look at it and say, it's good for podcasting that there's
this much attention being given to the medium, that there's this much distribution for it
that we can sit there and say, I'm to the point where I'm starting to edit myself and
when I'm doing now here this entertainment, I'm doing this intro that's becoming unnecessarily
long because one of the things that I was taught early in podcasting is you have to
let people know where they can find it.
I sit there and I tell people to go to nhte.net to listen to it and I think it's because of
Spotify that I wanted to let people know, hey, this is on Spotify now.
They have moved up so quickly to the number two position in terms of the second most used
platform for listening to podcasts that I wanted people to know.
Now here this entertainment is also on iTunes or Apple podcasts and then I'll say, and it's
on Spotify, SoundCloud, Google Podcasts, Stitcher, TuneIn, Google Play Music, the Overcast app
for iOS and so I find myself to the point where I say, I need to just start saying wherever
you get your podcast from but as I said, I think that's a credit to Spotify.
They have really emerged so quickly and really shown we're going to be a major player in
podcasting that a lot of us are reacting to what they're doing and to their credit, they
have a huge, huge audience that we can all get in front of.
Now let's move on to your third podcast, Catholic Sports Radio that you just recently launched.
Tell us why three, why this one and why this one means so much to you.
This is something that I had the idea for two years ago I think is when I first registered
the domain name and I was all excited.
I went to GoDaddy and I purchased catholicsportsradio.net and I thought, okay, here I go and then a year
went by and I didn't do anything and I renewed the domain name and then you get the email
again from GoDaddy, catholicsportsradio.net is ready to be renewed.
Please click the button to keep it for another year and so I thought, okay, I need to finally
do this and Ed, I'm really careful when I say this because in the podcasting community
as I mentioned earlier, the more niched down you are, the better.
You're not competing for so, so, so many ears that so many others are and I say this knowing
that religion and spirituality is the biggest category out there.
However, to get it down to something as specific as not just Christian but Catholic and then
to say, now wait a minute, now I'm talking about sports.
So these are guests that I'm interviewing who are Catholic and they're doing something
in the sports world whether they're a current or a former coach, athlete, official, meaning
a referee or an umpire, an administrator.
I want to get to team chaplains, I want to get to team doctors who are Catholic and I
just think this is so unique and I was born Catholic.
I've been a practicing devout Catholic my whole life and I have this long background
in sports where I've worked in the National Hockey League for 10 years.
I worked in the Olympic movement for 10 years and then marrying that with my broadcasting
and podcasting background, I thought this is a perfect fit and it's something that I'm
really passionate about and I'm also finding that the guests are refreshed by the topic
because so many of them want to get, or I'm sorry, so many of them are always getting
asked about the typical wins and losses, statistics, typical sports interviews that for this to
be, no I want you to talk about your faith life and I want you to talk about how you
intersect your faith life and your sports life, they go, wow, thanks, that's different.
So I'm really enjoying it, I think the guests are enjoying it and it's fun starting to
watch some momentum build for Catholic Sports Radio now.
How hard is it to find guests and were you worried at the beginning that it would be
a problem?
Boy was I worried.
How difficult is it to find guests?
Well I practiced what I preach, no pun intended.
I sat down and said okay, let me make a list of guests that I know would be a fit.
Now there's a big difference, you can sit and make a list of guests that you know would
be a fit for your podcast but it doesn't mean you're going to be able to reach them and
then do it, it doesn't mean they're going to say yes.
But I got as far as 50, 51, 52 people and I said okay, this will hold me over for a
while, it's going to take some prayer because I'm going to need guests well beyond that
so this doesn't end up being a one year show and then it's gone.
But it's really been a blessing that what has happened already is as I'm interviewing
guests, as I'm meeting these folks, they're saying by the way you should interview so
and so and it's someone that I don't have on the list or they'll say by the way do you
know that this person here is Catholic?
No I didn't know that.
Yeah let me get you connected with them.
So that's been really terrific.
So it's given me a lot more confidence, enthusiasm that I can sustain this over a long period
of time.
So Bruce you have three podcasts and you have a full time business.
How much time are you spending editing and working on the shows that you know you can't
really quantify in terms of money but time, it does take a lot of time especially if you're
perfectionist like I think you are where you want it to all sound perfect.
Yeah I would say the answer to how much time am I spending, the answer is too much time
and that is not by the way an invitation for people to contact me and say well let me edit
your podcast for you.
I am a perfectionist.
I used to do Now Hear This Entertainment at a recording studio and then when I came together
with Tascam they said well we want you to be able to talk from a first hand standpoint
about our products so we're going to make sure that you have everything that you need
to record and edit on your own.
So I even have a client that comes to me that she records her podcast with me.
I do all the editing.
So I do spend a lot of time with it.
I am a perfectionist.
I have kind of told myself maybe that's to a fault and maybe I need to, I don't want
to say stop over editing my podcast but you also have to keep in mind Ed, Now Hear This
Entertainment, those episodes come out 45, 50, 55 minutes long sometimes even as much
as an hour.
So a show that long is going to take a lot of time to edit including dropping in bumpers
and things like that.
Something like Catholic Sports Radio that's half the running time is obviously going to
be half as much work but at the same time it's a labor of love.
I'd be lying if I didn't say that I wasn't trying to monetize this.
Obviously right now with Catholic Sports Radio I'm trying to be a good and faithful servant
and just use my time and talent as we say in church but at the same time I do have a
responsibility to look at it and say is this something that at some point I can monetize?
I do feel confident that it is.
Right now I just want to build it up before I can start down that road because again practice
what you preach.
We always tell new podcasters don't get into it and have your first question be how do
I monetize this?
So tell us about your setup, what kind of equipment do you have?
Is it all at home?
What are you using to edit on what program you're using to edit?
Tell us all about it.
Take us through all of that.
All right.
So yes it is at home although I do have a lot of gear that I can take out with me on
the road.
I do a lot of on location interviews and of course I use Task Cam for everything.
So the Task Cam audio interface that I referred to before, the US-42 which is the mini studio
creator.
Initially I was taking that out on the road with a couple of microphones in my laptop
but to simplify it even further I now just use the Task Cam DR-44WL which is a handheld
recorder.
Although it has built-in microphones I choose to XLR to external microphones into it.
I just feel I have better control that way.
I bring my headphones and it's really that simple.
When I'm at home I have the audio interface again the mini studio the US-42 from Task
Cam.
I use that.
I use one of their microphones and then believe it or not someone laughed recently because
they said wow I didn't know anybody that was using that for podcasting.
That's for music but I use Sonar to edit and record all the podcasts, Cakewalk.
And it is designed for music but Task Cam trained me on this.
It was a product that they had that they no longer market but it was called the Track
Factory which was kind of an all-in-one where you get a small little computer.
It's about the size of my hand and then all I had to get was a monitor but it had the
US-2x2 audio interface, headphones, microphone.
So it's not a lot to get set up and running.
I've gone through a few different iterations of Task Cam headphones.
They have their latest ones that they just came out with which I'm wearing right now
and these are very comfortable which we all know is extremely important.
They're the TH-07s and that's really it.
It's a nice looking setup but it doesn't have to be really extensive and elaborate.
I'm proud of the sound that I get and I'm real happy with all the Task Cam gear and
my whole setup here at home.
Earlier on you mentioned 20 plus ways to start your podcast.
Share two or three with our folks.
So 20 plus ways to promote your podcast.
I always make sure that I'm really far into that list before I talk about social media
because everybody just thinks, oh I know he's going to say Facebook, Twitter, Instagram
which are all important but there are so many other things that you can do.
So for instance, Media Relations is one of the services that my company offers so that's
something that I do.
Right now for Catholic Sports Radio I'm getting a lot of attention for it because I wrote
and sent out a press release about the podcast and I think people go, press releases?
Does anybody do press releases anymore?
Absolutely.
So you send this press release out about your podcast and all of a sudden you have in my
case the Catholic News Service writing a feature story they called and interviewed me and now
all of their member papers are picking this up.
So that's a great way to promote your podcast and again then you go to your social media
and you say, look at this article that was published about my podcast and so it gives
you something to talk about on your social media instead of just when a new episode comes
out.
Another one that I like to talk about is to have a promotional item that is specific to
your podcast.
Here's what I mean by that.
Whenever I go to networking events everybody always wants to hand you a koozie and I think
what does that koozie tell me about your business?
When I see that koozie how does that make me think of what your product or service is?
So for now here at this entertainment I have a small little plastic case on the top of
it is the Now Here This Entertainment Podcast logo and right below it it says www.nhte.net
and people go, what is this?
They pop it open and there's earbuds inside.
You need earbuds to listen to a podcast and it's a podcast about music so it's very appropriate.
If you are somebody whose business was you're in the trades and so your promotional item
was a small little screwdriver that's a magnet that people could put on the side of the refrigerator
so all of a sudden they have to adjust the garbage disposal or something goes wrong they
need to grab a screwdriver.
They see that and now it's a repair that they say I can't handle this myself.
We need to call somebody.
Oh yeah, the guy who gave me this screwdriver his website is right on the screwdriver or
his phone number is on the screwdriver.
So think of something that will help promote your podcast that people will think of when
they look at it and not just a koozie because it's always good to have something to pass
out.
One of the other ones that I say Ed is to have a business card just for your show.
If you work at Bank of America Monday through Friday 9 to 5 and you give me that business
card when I sit down on Saturday afternoon and I say I'm going to go through some of
these business cards have been accumulating recently at some of these events I've been
going to I'm going to look at that card and say why do I have the business card of someone
from Bank of America at best I might remember oh I think this person said they have a podcast.
I'm not going to remember what it was and so to have a card just for your podcast will
show people you're serious.
It'll tell them where they can go and listen to it print it on print on both sides of it
so you can give a little description of what they can expect when they go to that show.
And again it's something that's not social media.
You have to be deliberate about promoting your podcast.
Talk about the best way to prepare show notes.
Well this is just one man's opinion of course but because I edit my own podcast I do it
all at the same time.
So as I'm editing I'm also typing up my show notes.
So I am I make it real easy on myself in terms of the description of the episode because
when I write the intro for how I'm going to bring in the guest on the Now Hear This Entertainment
episode that I'm recording I already have written on there joining me today on the Now
Hear This Entertainment guest line from Atlanta Georgia my guest is a singer songwriter guitar
player who finished second on The Voice two years ago.
He has a new EP coming out and has been on tour opening up and so I have this whole thing
written out.
So that can also become the episode description and so when I go to do my show notes I don't
have to say well what am I going to write as the description for this episode.
I already wrote it the day I interviewed the guest.
Now when it comes to the quotes from the guest again as I'm editing I'm also kind of keeping
an ear out for oh that was really good that was helpful.
Now here's another good trick.
So there's two here.
One of the things that I do is every Monday on the Instagram account for Now Hear This
Entertainment I publish a quote and it's a quote that's pulled from a show notes page
so I'm not having to do the work all over again but it's something that was impactful
that was said during that episode and so I can say on Instagram this is a quote from
episode 123 when the guest was Wendy Wagner who sings on tour with Joe Walsh.
If you never heard it before go to nhte.net and listen to episode 123.
So on those days when you say I don't have anything to post on social media there's something
that you can pull out so that you don't have to go quiet.
You don't have to go dark that day on social media and you send people back to old episodes.
Now the other trick is as I'm typing up my show notes I'm listening for myself to do
this little game that I have with myself which is this helps you become a better interviewer.
If you're really dialed into what your guest is saying number one you're not only going
to think of good follow-up questions but number two they're going to say something that's
going to trigger a prior conversation that you had on another episode.
So someone will say something and I'll say gee you know Ed I'm really glad you brought
that up because that was a lot like episode 175 with Katie Bell who is a singer in Atlanta,
Georgia and also a model who told me that her modeling helps her get more singing gigs.
Listeners if you never heard that one go back and listen to episode 175.
So then when I'm typing up my show notes I have a section of my show notes page that
says related and or mentioned episodes and so I put a link to those that I talked about.
So it's also a way to kind of someone might have come to that episode just to hear me
interview that one guest and now all of a sudden I'm sending them around to other episodes
well now they forgot that they ever came in the first place just for that one and they're
saying I like this show these are good interviews these are good guests and so you're bringing
them in now as a listener of your show instead of a listener of just that one episode and
like I say it helps you provide a more comprehensive show notes page and obviously you want to
put a link on the show notes page to the guests website.
Bruce great information I'm sure we could go on and on all day long how can people reach
out to you talk to you listen to your shows throw everything out there so people know
where to find you.
Well we already talked about Taskam TalkBack so for now here this entertainment just go
to nhtt.net which obviously stands for now here this entertainment and when you go to
nhtt.net you'll see all the episodes there you'll see links to the other platforms that
you can go hear it and obviously you can just click on the contact button to send me an
email and then for my newest one you can go to catholicsportsradio.net and the website
same thing the episodes are there there's links to social media there's links to other
platforms and I always love hearing from people whether it's email or social media so I'd
love to see some people who have found me through this conversation with you contacting
me through social media or through traditional email.
Bruce thanks so much for your time.
My pleasure thank you.
Thank you so much for your time the video will end here.