So, no, it's already ultra wrong with my hair.
It's how we do it here in Ecuador. So, Angela,
where are you based right now? I am in England.
So, northwest England is where I'm based. So,
in between two big cities, one's called Manchester
and the other one's called Liverpool, which people
might know for football. They're like two big
football cities. You know it. It's right in my
post for LinkedIn at the same time. almost literally
on the opposite side of the world from each other
this is yeah that's so fun and so yes as as we
have promised we are going to be talking about
branding growth and priorities we're both going
to bring our experiences together on this vision
pros those of you out there who are building
this is a unique and amazing opportunity we also
want to be real and raw so we while we're setting
this up you know angela and i have done one interview
in the past we've gotten to know each other pretty
well i have a lot of respect for how she builds
a business and the different opportunities that
she's built with in the past. And I was like,
you know what, do you want to go live and do
this as we go? And she's like, sure. So let's
go live while we post on LinkedIn and while we
just handle like the nuts and bolts of how we
want to move things forward. And entrepreneurs,
I think that's one of the greatest lessons that
we can all learn. Progress is far better than
perfect. You're not going to reach perfection.
And so it's so important to just get out there
and do things sometimes. um yet you still want
to be aware of the dangers that can exist and
what we're doing right now this this isn't that
dangerous so i'm okay with flying by the seat
of our pants a little bit um but we are going
to spar today um you know we're gonna i hope
that you will look for opportunities to kind
of poke holes in some of my my theories angela
or things that i bring up and i'll of course
be doing the same we'll play devil's advocate
and really i call angels advocate for each other
on this so um anything you want to add before
we continue to like i don't know more official
segments i guess i think just to add that you
know you said that you know we can it's easy
to kind of just go on and do these things as
business owners but the reality actually it can
be a little bit scary you know the thought that
people could potentially be watching you right
now as somebody might walk in the door or you
might sneeze or you might whatever you know all
of that authentic kind of piece is actually really
real the way that we are as business owners is
we are that as people and that's what i think
is nice to show that sneak behind the curtain
of what it actually is to run a business because
it's not all the bells and whistles and the glamorous
bits that you post online all the time yeah absolutely
it's uh something i take for granted because
i've been in the digital space you know since
i've been working for a startup since 2010 um
but i've been working heavily with video and
video interaction since 2016 or so with video
power marketing and oh my gosh just jumping on
a zoom call was scary back then Um, you know,
like showing my face on that call and it's easy
to forget to have empathy for people who haven't
done that before. And then going live on podcasts,
it's so much harder for me to record a VSL, by
the way, like a static video that you have to
get right. And that you can edit. It's harder
for me to do that than it is to go live. I don't
know if that's weird or not, but what's harder
for you to recording pre -recording a video or
going live. pre -recording is harder and the
reason for that is because I overthink it and
then I really start thinking about the words
and what my face looked like and did my hands
look okay at that point and was I breathing in
enough it's a big one but you know when you're
live you're just authentic and it's just you
you just I think you're more involved in the
conversation as well when you're live because
you can't edit what it is that you're saying
and that manar and the thought process is actually
nice for people to see that you're not always
polished you don't always have the answers you
know to come out I love it. I love it. I got
the huge advantage here because I get to lead
like the direction we go. And there was no question
provided. You know, there's like there was no
direction that we're going to be talking about
vision. And so and then we came up with the conversation,
the two founders sparring. literally like right
before we hit live. So Angela's coming in fresh.
So I'm going to, I'm going to take the lead on
this and I'm going to plant the seed for you
to have a little bit of time to think about this
Angela. But if there's a concept that business
owners are kind of unaware of or not participating
in that can make a big difference for their brand,
what would that concept be? What's something
that you can give to the world that will make
people go like, dang, I I'm excited to dive into
that. Or I really need to verify that with chat
GPT or like, I should probably see if my business
is doing that. I'll lead the way. on that thought
process. So one of the big concepts that I've
been teaching clients over the last year that
is just blowing everybody's mind because nobody
in the world is teaching it and it's so fundamental.
It will literally change everything about how
you think about the business. It's called the
seven avatars of business. The seven avatars
that we need to prepare for as a business. Nobody's
teaching it. It will change the game for you.
It's one of those things that we're going to
talk about. On your side, Angela, is there a
concept like that, something that you want to
bring up today that will help people get centered
around what's most important for them, for their
branding, for their growth, or for their priorities
of their business? For me, it's about personal
branding because people buy from people, right?
So if you have your business brand, it's always
the polished version of that. It's the thing
that you publicly put out there on social media
and in your marketing channels. But personal
branding, there's been a massive rise in that
in the last couple of years, and particularly
I'm seeing it this year. And I think it's because
people want to show their own stories. They want
to show their own passions, their own purpose,
their own sneak behind the brand of what is the
kind of glamorous, glossy version that goes out
there. And I'm really engaged with that. And
I'm really into it now. I started that journey
of personal branding in January this year. And
I was really quite scared. Like, oh my gosh,
I'm going to crash record. Oh my gosh, I've got
to do 14 version or something. Oh, I need to,
I want to post something on social media, but
I don't know what to post. And now I just post
anything and everything that comes into my mind
because I think then you get in the actual real
version of me. So when they do come working with
me and they do become my client, they kind of
know what to expect by that point because they've
already known, like, and trusted you by that
stage. Oh, I really like that. And I love that
you add some context in that personal branding
that takes it in an even healthier direction.
And I see most people taking that. So that is
something that we're definitely going to spar
on for the sake of the audience. We're going
to we're going to dive into and there are goods
and bads and ugly signs of that. So I definitely
want to. And like I said. If you think of things
when we talk about the seven avatars of business
too, where you're like, Jackson, let's poke some
holes in this theory. Let's do it. This, this
is like two mathematicians, my friends going
on chalkboards and we're like looking at each
other's notes and seeing what's there. While
we're also allowing any of you other nerdy mathematicians
to come along and play with us. So, you know,
this is this is all about business nerdship and
trying to create even greater visions for all
of us. So we'll see you guys on the other side.
We'll be right back with a short break and then
we'll dive right into our visions of how do we.
do a better job with our branding, how do we
create more growth for ourselves, and how do
we prioritize as business owners. All right,
welcome in to Vision Pros Live. With Jackson
Callum, I'm your show host. We'll be doing interviews
for visionary entrepreneurs and guest leaders
who are building fantastic visions out there.
Hey, what's up, everybody? Welcome into another
episode of Vision Pros Live. I'm your show host,
Jackson Callum, founder and CEO of First Class
Business, and I'm super excited to have another
phenomenal business owner on stage today, Angela
Hodgson. Between her and I, we've got 44 years
of business experience. The glory, the gory,
the good, the bad, and the ugly, all of the above.
I'm going to start out humbly with a very, very
important request. Please, if you see this. subscribe
on youtube we recently changed our youtube channels
up we had first class business youtube channel
growing quite well and we decided you know what
let's go ahead and make this harder for ourselves
divide our content so that it's easier for you
guys to access and know what you're getting But
let's start the Vision Pros Live channel. So
we've got like, I don't know, 60 subscribers,
maybe six on there. I don't know. It's not very
big, but if you can go and subscribe on that,
we're going to continue to provide content that
will help you clarify your vision, connect with
some of the world's best leaders, and see behind
the scenes of how they're creating their visions
to inspire you on your way. This has been such
a unique and awesome opportunity. I don't know
if you'll know, we're at a... We're a top 5 %
global show at this point. And apparently on
Podmatch, we're one of the top ranked interview
shows out of over 11 ,000 shows. You know, we're
on the list of 300 top shows, but we've also
cracked the top. 10 lists on that several times
so it's been a real big honor to talk to the
the wonderful leaders that we have and again
your subscription helps us reach more people
who are like you and who might might need some
better leadership might need some mentorship
might need some ideas for how to move their brands
forward so before i bring angela on stage i do
want to give you a few more tools and opportunities
and ideas Junaid Ahmed of Home Studio Mastery.
He builds world -class podcast studios. He's
also a top 2 % global podcaster with Hacks and
Hobbies. He's a friend of mine. And we love to
talk about what he does because he's able to
help people set up their podcasts from a successful
standpoint, well, from an infrastructure standpoint
for success. The right microphone, the right
backgrounds and stuff. As you guys noticed, Junaid
did a great, just kidding. He didn't do my studio.
I'm down in Ecuador on a humanitarian mission.
I love to help out. I'm not too big into like
the fancy studio aspects. but I am into quality
audio. I am into making sure that my audience
get what they want out of the show. And it's
really nice to be able to mastermind with what
you need and make sure that, again, our podcast
studio is taken care of. And I hope that you
have the chance to do the same with us or with
him. Then there's Dr. Danny Brassell. Any of
you who have kids or have friends that have kids,
I hope that you're striving to find the best
coaches and trainers and teachers for them. Danny,
he teaches parents how to inspire their children
to love to read. And specifically, he works with
struggling readers and is able to help them turn
into passionate readers. And he's one of the
world's best educators. He's got over 300 testimonial
videos from educators out there. And I've seen
him on stage. He's become one of my best friends
over the last year. And I can't say enough about
Dr. Danny. what he's able to do. He does also
help corporations and help business leaders with
their growth. As one of the few speakers out
there who gets paid, again, I'll say that again,
and it looks like everybody gets paid to speak.
I promise you they don't. There are very few
people who are actually that highly qualified
who get paid on a regular basis to speak. That
speaks very highly of Danny's credentials as
well. The market truly does appreciate and know
what he's valued at. At the end of the day, my
friends, i just want you to know the resources
that i find best neither one of these people
pay me to be up here as sponsors i put them up
there because i love what they do and i believe
in it then there's the water project same thing
i do not have a personal connection with the
water project but what i do have is a connected
heart to it now that i learned that there's millions
of people out there who don't even have access
to clean drinking water My friends, I've never
truly been thirsty in my life. I've never had
to face that. And as I looked at these projects
and saw that there's people who need access to
what's called a sand dam or a borehole well just
so their kids can stay in school and not have
to go find water for themselves, just so they
didn't have to leave work. I really allowed that
to hit me and thought through what would my life
be like, what would my children's life be like.
And these kids, when they get the water, they
celebrate that water like my kids celebrate Christmas
Day. And it's very humbling that we have the
opportunity to contribute to that. So we contribute
monthly to the Water Project. And my hope, too,
is that you will at least talk about this message.
Talk about the Water Project with your friends
and family. Show them what they do and how the
project's come to fruition. It is really neat
to see the stories of these people transition.
from extreme poverty that I've never related
to, to an opportunity to focus more on moving
their lives forward. And this can have a generational
impact for people that can last for decades.
And so I hope you get involved with us on that.
Now, last thing before I bring Angela back on,
if you know of another project or cause or opportunity
for us to get involved and help, my hope is that
you will share it in the comments. I'm a big
believer that even if it's not connected, the
more we give, the more we get. I've just seen
it over and over in life. And so I hope that
if you don't have a cause that we can get back
to, if you put it in the comments, I will personally
take a look at that. I will probably share it
with my team as well and have them take a look
at it. And we will try to evaluate how we can
get involved. And that's just another way we
can help out the 8 billion people in this world
who really need it. So let's get back to helping
each one of you. I'm going to get into sparring
with Angela. Maybe she's supposed to hate me
right away when we bring her on. But Angela,
welcome back to Vision Pros Live. Well, thank
you very much. That was a very nice haymaker.
I don't know what a haymaker is. I've never heard
the phrase. What does a haymaker mean? Haymaker
is a giant punch. Like you come in swinging.
Oh, I had no idea what it meant. There we go.
Cool. We learned something new today. We can
wrap up. Everybody have a good day. Nope, just
kidding. All right. So we're going to dive right
back in. And we're talking about this idea of
personal branding and the personal branding,
just like everything in life. There's a good
and a bad to all resources, right? And it's not
the resource that's bad. So water, it can drown
us and kill us. But it's also something that,
like we're talking about with the water project,
it can provide a sense of security and safety
for an entire village. And so personal branding,
I have heard rumors of stats, I will call it
that, from doctors. I didn't do the actual research
myself. I've also seen this firsthand. So many
people are getting caught up in the Instagram
life, right? And the fake reality, fake it till
you make it. I actually fired a client a while
back who had over 500 ,000 followers and she
was lying to her followers about her lifestyle.
She was literally attending events where they
would. In four days, take a year's worth of photography
with clothing, with fake money, with with, you
know, all sorts of glamour stuff to showcase
that she's living, you know, like a god, basically
a goddess. And she was making less than a janitor's
salary. She was about to lose her home. And there
was there was nothing authentic or true about
this situation. And she was a poster child for
Kajabi. So it's really sad, too, that sometimes
even the giant. programs they don't do their
own research on credibility and worse there's
a lot of these these these people that then turn
suicidal and they then go depressed and they
feel like they have to be the brand and i don't
know too many brands that have um done very well
over hundreds of years of period that are built
on the backbone of one individual look no further
than david sandler of sandler sales institute
the institute is a shadow of the man at this
point they did not do a great job of building
the infrastructure for long -term success versus
the universities that stand the test of time.
So I'm not anti -personal branding. We're obviously
here. I've got a brand to run and maintain and
build as well. But I do want to pose, take that
conversation in both directions. What do we do
to maximize our personal brands? How do we do
so in a healthy fashion? And what are some of
the downsides that maybe people don't realize
when they're getting into it? that may create
a disaster for them. So it may create a monster
instead of a legacy. I think it's interesting
that you reference all of those kind of stories,
particularly about the client that you fire,
because that's the opposite to what I perceive
personal branding to be. So it's a really interesting
take because for me, personal branding is all
about you as an actual authentic individual.
So you're giving people insight into your actual
world, because if it is just the, you know, really
structured really polished really glossy post
then that's not a sneak behind the curtain that
isn't a glimpse into your world that's a curated
experience that you're giving to people whereas
on my social media or my personal branding I
talk about my burnout I talk about how you know
I've struggled parenting my children I talk about
the failures and the massive mistakes that I've
made in my career because I want people to feel
inspired and to learn from that and to feel like
I really do connect with Angela and I really
do want to work with Angela because I kind of
feel like I know her rather than me trying to
pretend to be somebody who I'm not. And then
they start working with me and they're like,
I don't really connect, you know, I don't really
understand who this person is. But the main reason
I do that is because when I was in the corporate
world, I wore a mask for a very long time and
pretended to be something that I wasn't. And
I felt really uncomfortable and it led to a burnout
and it led to breakdown. And since that point,
I've always said I will never do that again.
So every client I work with, I talk about mistakes.
Well, guess what happens? They talk about their
mistakes. Guess what happens? We have a good
conversation. They learn from that. If I pretend
to be this amazing person who's never made a
mistake in my life, well, it's lies because I've
made a lot. Yeah, huge. I really appreciate you
honing in on that. So I would say, especially
for the younger people in this audience, you
have such a great opportunity, an important opportunity
to. develop and establish your authenticity first.
If we don't do that, we do box ourselves in.
And then later our authenticity has to be built
around showing that we weren't authentic. Or
picking what you said online. You get stuck in
that world of being fake. I'll pick on somebody
publicly. I think Johnny Manziel is stuck in
that. And that's a real tragedy. here's where
this came up last year. So Johnny Menzel, who
was supposed to be, you know, I think he was
the number one pick in the NFL and he'll go down
and history is probably the biggest bust of a
draft pick ever. And he doesn't like that story.
I'm pretty sure. I'm sure that's not the legacy
that he wants to be remembered for as being the
cocky and football player who is Mr. Money to
then not making it all in the NFL. And so I saw
him bounce back last year, but. The bounce back
made me even more sad because as he told his
story about how, you know, he made some mistakes
and how he's learning from those mistakes. What
did he transition to? Sports gambling. And his
story is not about, oh, look at what I did and
look how I'm improving. It's, hey, come join
me on this sports gambling venture. You could
see and feel it. It was like, dang, there's almost
no authenticity baked into this whatsoever. Again,
if we don't, if we're not careful with our lives
about how do we position ourselves as a personal
brand, we can get stuck in an endless loop of
never really figuring out who we are, but just
trying to be what the world wants us to be rather
than being authentic. And so there's a lot, I'll
actually dive into some of my personal stuff
too in just a minute. But Angela, what are your
thoughts on that process even further? Let's
double down further on this because it is such
a, I think it's such a misunderstood concept
of like, how do you, uh utilize the personal
brand and how do you do so authentically well
it's interesting actually because i wrote an
article on this and i'm a columnist for a business
magazine called the female boss and i wrote a
column exactly about this about how you are successful
without having just the curated real behind the
screens behind the scenes sorry and i wrote this
whole thing around how even in business you know
in your family life you look at instagram or
you look at facebook and you see these amazing
children who look amazing and you know the lovely
stage photos like pumpkin picking was a big thing
recently everyone's pumpkin picking and they
look just beautiful in these pictures then I
look at the pictures of me and my children pumpkin
picking and they don't look anything like that
because the kids are screaming it's really cold
you're trying to do the s'mores and there's blooming
marshmallow everywhere and there's chocolate
everywhere and people's hands are dirty and they're
crying because they didn't get that particular
pumpkin and then the knife won't work and But
that's the reality that, yeah. So what, you know,
the reality, if you think I really want this
really lovely hay bale pumpkin type picture is
not the reality of how you get to that picture.
It's the one snap that you managed to get. So
I think when you show up online from a business
sense and actually show, do you know, things
aren't great every single day. Like I've delivered
a training course last week and I was talking
about, in fact, yesterday, I think it was, and
I was talking about how. to be authentic in your
business and to grow your business you have to
change as an individual to do that and there'll
be things that you look at and you think it's
not kind of you know how I wanted to be and I
was talking about how to be really structured
and have this really good rhythm in your business
and how you can be successful from that and I'm
teaching that and then I'm saying to them well
this week has been chaotic for me because this
this and this you can still know the things and
not apply it but then that makes them feel a
bit better as business owners because then otherwise
I don't want them looking at me thinking I'm
doing it in this perfect way because I'm not
every single time. But with intention, I'm trying.
And I think the more you show that publicly,
the more you're giving other people permission
to try. Otherwise, you're going to be so far
elevated compared to where they are. They're
never going to feel like they can reach it. So
it's not aspirational. It's actually off putting.
Yeah, absolutely. And I want all you business
owners who are not big on the personal branding
side to realize that while it's an opportunity,
it's not for everybody. It's not something that
you have to do for growth. We are, when we get
into the seven avatars of business, we're going
to talk about dynamics of business and actually
like the, the tactical and the infrastructure
side of things that are going to help every single
person who's listening to this. But I still think
it's so important to not bury the hatchet on,
on the personal branding. Don't, don't turn yourself
against it. Don't turn yourself for it, but just
continue to see and look and see like, okay,
how does this work? Because people like Walt
Disney. and steve jobs um you know and uh michael
hyatt t harvacker robert kiyosaki they can keep
going dr eric berg they have built such a dynasty
for themselves by making sure that they are getting
their own personal brand out there i'll also
throw stephen bartlett with the diary of a ceo
in there as well like there's so many people
that have been able to build with that aspect
of personal branding. And there's so many tools
available to us now that 10 years ago weren't
available to leaders of the past. That's why
Phil Knight's book came out recently, you know,
on shoe dogs. Like they didn't have those opportunities
decades ago to be able to dive into personal
branding like we do today. So there are amazing
opportunities there. I want to hit on this Halloween
idea. Just because you have great family photos
during the holidays doesn't make you a bad person
either. It doesn't make you inauthentic. I know
you're not saying that, Angela, but I also know
some of us have that inferiority complex, that
worry and fear, and it's so easy to get in our
heads. I had that Instagram family, you know,
my first, my first attempt at being a family
man. and uh having a marriage we made it eight
years we we are divorced uh we had three blonde
hair blue -eyed kids um you know they're very
photogenic so we had a great life and it was
there was a lot of awesome things that were going
on with that and i still had a lot to learn about
authenticity i don't think i'll ever stop learning
about how to truly be my full self and accept
my identity fully i think that's a part of this
life but i can say that when we were in that
position where we were kind of like everything
looked wonderful on the surface um no not everything
was wonderful on the surface and we never tried
to portray that but the grass looked greener
and everybody else's photos right and it looked
like everybody else had it better than us and
we got into this this like shameful act of comparison
too um you know and i guess i should only speak
for myself on that but um you know it's something
where we have to be careful about, can we still
maintain our sense of gratitude? Can we be grateful
for what we do have? And when we're trying to
have those pictures and one child's sick, you
know, or one child's upset, you know, there's
all sorts of challenges that exist in life. And
I think sometimes we, we almost want to look
past or move past or fast forward past those
moments, like in the, like in the movie, um,
and it's like, well, wait a second. No, those,
those are all part of the elements that contribute.
to the holistic good and beauty of life itself.
And so, again, I want to just triple down on
exactly what we've been talking about, which
came from Angela, not me. Authenticity comes
first, right? That's the core of this personal
branding process. And so if you're younger, I'll
share what Ali Abdaal shared about the experience.
He said, you know, just speak from, he said,
I'm a doctor, but I don't ever leverage that.
And I never would. I just speak from what works
for me. and what things have what things have
transpired from my life and if we stay rooted
in that as we strive to build our personal brands
then we don't run the risk of being inauthentic
we don't run the risk of being a faking until
we make it we don't run the risk of imposter
syndrome being able to do overpower us as much
because we know in our hearts of heart that like
no this is this is just who i am so another vulnerable
side i've never shared this before um in the
last year though i actually went homeless um
and it's like what um you know yeah first class
business is a beast of a of a business and there's
a lot of cool things about it and vision pros
live has done awesome we get a lot of things
but you learn things and now i've learned that
these articles where these uh billionaires talk
on forbes subtly about like it doesn't get easier
you just have more to lose you have you have
more expenses there are bigger challenges that
exist and so Um, I've never been able to get
to a point where the full sense of security,
um, you know, is like permanent and where the
sustain, our, our business slogan, a first -class
business is sustainable revenue growth. You know
how embarrassing it is to go homeless with that
as your, as your, uh, tagline. It's like, Whoa,
I had to really evaluate like, okay, how, how
do I relate to this line now? When. i myself
my business model ended up becoming unsustainable
um and those types of challenges like do you
talk about it do you not do you wait till after
i just said you know what no i'm i'm actually
willing to be open and real and it was a it was
a weird day to call some of my clients and be
like uh hey uh can you sell me can you sell me
something because i got nothing um right now
and uh that That process, that walk of shame,
if you will, or that walk of I'll call it ownership
of saying, here's where we're at. Here's what
we need to learn from this. Here's where I can
go from here. Do I have to give up? Do I have
to throw in the towel? Do I have to let go of
everything? No, but I do owe it to myself to
be authentic with it. So again, thank you for
bringing it up, Angela. I think it's so valuable
to be able to do that. my friends be very careful
with what you share and who you share with when
you share it how i don't want to be i want to
inspire you all to go and expose all your dirty
laundry to the world that's not what my statement
is about as much as it is like no it's very important
to establish who you are as an individual and
how to be authentic in the process so angela
let's end with your words on personal branding
and how to go about it what what else on the
on the positive side or i guess just on the open
nature side what else would you like to talk
about for personal branding before we switch
gears Well, before we do that, I want to just
come on to what you just said about the homelessness,
because I don't want to go into personal branding
when you've just revealed such a big, significant
thing about yourself. So first of all, I want
to say well done you for being so brave and honest
and open about those issues and experiences that
you've had in your personal life. But secondly,
well done you for actually making the choice,
if it was a choice, to go homeless, because you
talk about sustainable revenue. If you'd have
continued on the pathway of having whatever those
assets were around you. you'd have been even
more unsustainable because you'd have ended up
racking up a load of debt. And then you'd have
possibly ended up impacting other people's businesses
because you'll have suppliers, you'd have had
customers or clients that you couldn't cater
for. So actually, I think you have stuck to your
core value and your mission of sustainable revenue,
but you've put a plug in, this was not working
and now I need to change and pivot and do it
in a different way. And you've done it at the
ultimate sacrifice because you've become homeless.
So I just wanted to frame your mind around what
you just said. Now you do. Yes, perfect. But
I just meant kind of reframing your thoughts
around how you've described the homelessness
and that mission, you know, that feeling unauthentic.
I don't think you were unauthentic. I think it
was the ultimate authenticity. Oh, thank you.
And yeah, it was definitely a very humbling experience
to go through that. And I think most of us, in
some relation, in some parallel, we have that
opportunity to face. how are we going to go through
this experience? I'll learn from it. And I don't
think I, you know, it would have been an eternal
punishment to shift gears and find a new path.
But only, only you know that for yourself with
your vision and with your plants. And do you
pivot? Is your pivot permanent? And it was a
temporary, are you homeless in the sense too
of, of I'm Lewis Howes and I'm sleeping on my
sister's couch, which to me is not quite homeless.
You know, that that's a different level of nature
or. are you rock bottom? And like, no, you got
nowhere to go. And you got to find somebody who
can, who can help you in the process. Those challenges
exist. And you know, if you, if you watch enough
stories like Martin Luther King's documentary
or Nelson Mandela, I mean, he wasn't just homeless,
Nelson Mandela spent years in prison. That is,
that is some rough stuff, but you know, I, I,
I can't speak for him, but I can tell you in
my most difficult and darkest of experiences
of life. i have often learned some of the greatest
pieces of wisdom and the greatest moments of
like dang this is going to help me forever now
whether it's through empathy through compassion
through the sacrifice realizing the resilience
that's available to us there's so much that's
there so again be careful my friends as you consider
how are you going to dive into your personal
brand experience authentically and just know
that it can pay off huge dividends for doing
just that. And Angela is a shining example of
how to go about that. Before we move into seven
avatars of business, anything else that you would
like to propose we bring up related to branding
growth or prioritizing as business owners? Let's
go fast. The other thing that I actually, yeah,
the other thing I would actually like to bring
up is as a small business owner is Don't be put
off by the big brands. Don't be put off by having
to have an actual brand to start off because
I never had a brand literally up until about
five months ago when I've been in business for
five years. I didn't have a brand. I had a logo
that my friend created for me. and I had that
I had a color palette and on reflection I had
this color palette it was blue and blue and yellow
and I always thought I wonder where I got that
from and then I looked at my son's school uniform
and it's blue and yellow and because I see it
every day and they were literally this exact
same tone as my son's school uniform so up until
literally a few months ago I never had a brand
so don't be put off about starting a business
because you think oh gosh I've got to get a brand
I need to you know I need to have all of this
stuff and any brand guidelines and I need you
know you don't you need a presence you need authenticity
you need something that is something people want
to buy you know you don't need a brand behind
it so i've created i've renamed the business
as i say i think it was august this year that
i did it and it used to be called elite business
improvement which was just a name that i just
kind of plucked out of a hat really And this
Ignite improvement was more about me. And by
that stage, I really learned about who I wanted
to be and what I wanted to deliver to my clients.
And my husband and I own the business together
and want to deliver all this momentum and all
of this energy. So then this blue and yellow
school uniform we branded didn't really sit for
that. Then I've got an amazing graphic designer
who I work with. So shout out to Louisa. And
she's created this brand that I. really, really,
truly now believe in. So that's two things really.
One is don't be put off and scared to start a
business because you don't have a brand. And
two, when you do invest in it, invest properly,
get a proper graphic designer to do it. I'll
spark back on it. Big time, big time. We do branding
guides for free at First Class Business. For
free. 100%. It is not about the monetary investment.
And please don't wait on that process. But I
will spark back in a way that if you did, and
if you do, it's not the end of the world. But
let's not turn our blind eye to either side of
that. So if you feel the need to move forward
without a brand, move forward out of brand by
all means, just know that 96 % of businesses
lose within 10 years and 4 % survive. And you're
putting yourself in a position to where you may,
you may sacrifice opportunity. I would say the
better opportunity on that. And we're both, I
think we both back this is work with mentors
that you trust people who've been there and done
it and made it happen. But I can tell you right
now. My first couple of brands had horrific branding.
We suffered the hell out of those situations.
I'm not going to lie to you. Don't follow that
five -year path that I was on. Don't do that.
If you've got somebody in front of you who can
help you on that process, then have an open mind.
Have an open idea like, okay, maybe they can
help me learn from their mistakes in the process.
And as Angela was getting at, don't overdo it.
Don't just go and invest in something and don't
force the issue. But I would say that have an
open mind to find the providers who can help
you build things the right way. That would be
the caveat. And that is you survived it without
the brand. Other people may not. I'll add one
more final thing on that and I'll pass the mic
back to you. And that would be. The Twice the
Ice company, you know, I helped a franchise owner
of Twice the Ice, a machine that produces ice
with their brand, and they wanted a website.
I said, you don't need a website. I said, what,
how many gas station websites have you ever been
to? And they're like, none. Again, nobody goes
to a website for a gas station. You have an ice
machine. Nobody cares about your, but you do
need a Facebook page. And we can run Facebook
ads through that and drive a ton of traffic.
And we crushed it. I mean, no pun intended. They
had an amazing campaign, an amazing opportunity.
We did some local things with local restaurants
and local entities that could also come in and
buy in bulk. But there was no need for a website.
So are there places and entities that don't need
it? Of course there are. But again, this is where
it's like, okay, consult with somebody like Angela
who has 25 years of experience or Jackson who
has 19 years of experience. Don't make that decision
by yourself. That would be my next piece of advice
for all you entrepreneurs is stop deciding by
yourself what to do. Get a team of brains and
hearts that you trust around you to help you
build. Angela, your turn. Yeah, so it's a really
good point that you've just kind of sparred back
with. And I'm glad that you did because I want
to provide a bit more clarity. My points were
around inertia of thinking, oh, I've got this
idea for this business and I want to do something.
And then the inertia that comes with, I don't
understand branding, don't understand marketing.
I can't do it. So then it becomes that they just
don't do it because it becomes a blocker. Mine
was more about just get yourself out there and
do something. The other side of that, on my side,
as I said, I didn't have the branding for five
years, is because I'm very well connected at
this stage in my career. I've got really good
networks of people who I've worked with in the
past who didn't need to have a shiny brand and
a logo to work with me. They wanted me. So it
worked because I already was known, liked and
trusted by a lot of different people. Whereas
now the new side of my business is a new industry
that I'm entering into and it's a new set of
clients and it's a new, it's all about kind of
online and it's all about semi -passive income
and passive income. They don't know I can trust
me because I've never been in that industry before.
So now I do need the branding. So everything
you said, I 100 % agree with. And it's interesting
because my business is kind of established on
one side and then on the other side, it's brand
new. So I've got two bits going on at the same
time. And I'm kind of struggling with both camps.
Both require different sets of principles and
leadership and thought process. One's very mature,
one's very new. So in terms of that branding
piece, I think sometimes you can get a bit overwhelmed
with what you're trying to do. And sometimes
that stops you doing something. So my thing is
just do something, even if it doesn't look pretty
at this particular stage. The main thing is about
trying to get the revenue, trying to build your
clients. If you need the branding to get the
foot in the door, then it might be. it might
be a what you call it connected piece or it might
not you don't know yeah and i'll play i'll continue
to play angels advocate on that and in relation
to these blockers a lot of times my friends the
blockers are necessary they're they're healthy
boundaries they're things that it's that it's
that feeling like i'm in a dark and a mountain
and i don't know which way to go and you got
a blocker that's telling you not to move forward
and then all of a sudden you know you're able
to get your flashlight on or whatever you find
out you're on a cliff's edge um right that is
entrepreneurship 99 % of the time. You are basically
napping cliff's edge. And if you don't realize
that and you turn a blind eye to that, you're
going to fall off and it's going to hurt badly.
And the bigger you grow, the harder you can fall,
the further you can fall in the experience. So
I don't mean to scare all of you as much as just
validate the reality that you got an internal
instinct to trust. And the opportunity is to
figure out, okay, well, what do I do when I feel
that sense of like blocking there? What is it
that I need to learn from this experience or
move on? Odds are, if you've got one coach by
your side, if you find yourself saying, I have
a coach, then just realize you have a poor mentality.
Because the greatest people in the world, the
ones who are really crushing it, they have lots
of coaches. They have entire teams around them
to help them and support them. And so one of
the greatest things you can have by your side
is people who are willing and able to guide you
without stealing your vision, without manipulating
you, without coercion, without pressuring you
to follow what it is that they do. You know,
think people like Grant Cardone, who have a bunch
of sheeple that follow them. If they're telling
you what you should do, what you have to do,
what you need to do, odds are that's not the
type of leader that you want by your side. It's
more of the people who are willing to hear you
out with where you are, ask better questions
and figure out what could be possible. What are
your opportunities? What feels right? That will
expose the cliff's edge without pressuring you
forward or pressuring you away so that you can
then make a more collectively sound decision.
So we're going to dive in. to this other side
of the seven avatars of business. This is something
that I've talked to about a hundred people now.
And I teach it from a humble standpoint of like,
please, if you guys have heard this in the market
somewhere, let me know the resource. Cause that
guy's a genius or that gal's a genius. And it
is so logical that it makes you go like. Why
the heck are we not talking about this more often?
And I'm going to put you in the guinea pig seat
on this, Angela. And if Angela surprised me,
she's like, oh, these are the seven avatars.
Great. If not, what we're exposing is not somebody
who doesn't know what they're doing. What we're
exposing is a reality that somehow we continue
to tolerate a 96 % failure rate in the market
and a 4 % survival rate. And we aren't putting
together these super simple pieces. that are
a little bit complex to build out, but they're
necessary for us to understand as businesses.
So today, Angela, you and I opened a brand new
restaurant in three and our restaurant, let's
call it Angela's Pizzeria. And there's seven
different avatars. There's seven different types
of people who are going to walk into our doors
and we got to figure out how to serve them. And
so. I'm not going to lead the witness on this.
This makes me a bad teacher right now so that
you guys know. Normally you give people context.
No, we need to see. Because if I were to say
there's six different levels for marketing and
marketing influence. Oh, unaware, aware, considerate.
That stuff's already known in the market. So
it's possible. I don't think that these seven
avatars are out there right now. I mean, I've
never heard of them. We're going to see. Maybe
there's some other definition or name for it.
But somebody opens our door to Angela's Pizzeria.
What's the avatar, Angela? Make mistakes on this.
You could say it's like a Lego man or something.
We'll play with it. But who might walk into that
door? What type of avatar? A family man with
his family who comes every week to have a pizza
with his family. It's like a little treat and
a ritual. Very good. So that would be a demographic
and a psychographic combined for the family man.
But you said something key. You said this guy
comes in. Every week, like a ritual. What do
you call that avatar? The person who's purchasing
and coming over and over again. What are they
called? I don't know. Loyal customer. Very good
customer. You nailed it. So that is one of the
avatars that walks in the door is you've got
a customer, somebody who purchases and somebody
who purchases on a repeat. And so sometimes in
other markets, that's called a patient or it's
called a client. It's called a consumer. there's
a number of different a patron a resident those
are all fall fall into that exact same category
number one of avatar so customer business owners
are really good at paying attention to the reality
that they want customers um they need to prepare
for their customers the door opens again in walks
another person what avatar is person number two
somebody who's an office lady and she just wants
to grab a quick a quick snack because she's working
late on that night So that would be a customer
as well. Very good, though. Different type of
customer, but she's coming in as a customer.
So door opens again. Third person walks in. What
might they be? What might their intention be
or what might they sell me something? So they're
going to sell me some equipment or they're going
to sell me some boxes or some ingredients. I
love how many people dive into this. This person's
going to take my money. This person's, you know,
probably going to be some type of of dog eat
dog world. We also call these people vendors.
We call them providers. We call them distributors.
We call them, I call them strategic partners.
I'm not looking at these individuals as people
who are trying to sell me. I'm looking at these
people. Again, I'm going to use the word vendors
more commonly here. Small businesses have a bad
tendency to, when that door opens and John comes
in, John says, hey, my name's John, and I have
a POS company. Do you guys already have a merchant
service provider? And what happens in the small
business? A small business goes, oh, you guys
are always coming in here trying to sell me a
bunch of bull crap. I already have a POS provider.
Why don't you go away? And they don't realize
that John's a family man who lives three blocks
away. John doesn't have a family of six that
would have been coming in regularly. He also
goes to the local church and his kids go to local
school. And every time somebody asks him about
Angela's Pizzeria, his response is, you know,
maybe it's good, but they were so, they just,
it felt like I was just coming in as some snake
oil salesman and I didn't really get a good vibe
from this culture. And so what are we getting
at with that? Vendors, they have a different
need than customers have. And we need to have
team members trained up with the right procedures.
with the right resources, the right templates
and the right assets in order to honor the vendors.
Because if we don't, we're just like everybody
else in the world, fighting over stuff that we
don't even understand what we're fighting about.
And all these LinkedIn messages we get from people
saying they want to sell us stuff. If we see
that as a threat, we're never going to get to
Tony Robbins level. We're never going to get
to Taylor Swift level because how many times
do vendors go to Tony Robbins and Taylor Swift
and try to sell them? I tell them because they're
pre -qualified for everything. And so if we as
an operator, as we recognize the opportunity,
to service these individuals, they truly become
strategic allies in the market. So we've got
customers and vendors, the door opens again,
and in walks avatar number three. What could
that avatar possibly be? Somebody wants to learn
about the business. He wants to learn they're
interested in setting up a pizzeria themselves
in another town or further down the road. Interesting.
I might box them into the strategic partnership
opportunity as well because they might be able
to franchise with us. Let's say that person who
wants to learn about the business, though, starts
to ask about, hey, do you guys have multiple
locations? Are you a performer? Are you guys
planning on expanding nationwide? What's that
avatar called? An investor. Very good. There's
an investor avatar. And again, small businesses
often never even think through the reality. of
what it's like to talk to investors what it might
be like to potentially expand or sell or have
somebody come in and so that's the one that people
are terrified of so much that we're just going
to skip that for now but ultimately they need
some resources too the door opens again we tell
that investor hey feel free to send us more information
on or let us know what information you need you
know bam we move on so who's the next person
that might walk in the next avatar somebody wants
to work for me very good and we call those candidates
right so in walks timmy and timmy goes hey Are
you guys hiring? And the host team member at
the front goes, yeah, go apply online just like
the rest of us did. How's Timmy going to feel?
He'll probably never come in again and he probably
won't have the confidence to go and apply elsewhere.
And that's so sad because Timmy, we only apply
as candidates at places that we actually like.
We were already probably an ambassador of this
establishment. But now you've just kind of crushed
little Timmy's hearts and dreams. And while he
may not be great at representing the company
front facing, he might be the best dishwasher
there is. He's willing to stay for 10 years and
maybe he's the best delivery driver you'd possibly
have. We don't know. But if we don't train our
team members how to support those candidates
that come in. And again, what's the asset they
need? Imagine your team members like, hey. yeah,
if you eat some pizza first, then maybe we'll,
we'll give you a chance. Like what are we training
our team members to do in these scenarios? We're
often not training them at all. And so the great
ones don't end up coming in. Who do you end up
with in that case? You end up with the most desperate
candidates, the ones who are going to be the
worst to work with because they're the ones that
are willing to put up with that bull crap. And
most of us aren't willing to do it. So candidates
is another, the door opens again and walks, John.
Hey, sorry, I'm late guys. You know, what avatar
is that? He already works there. Yeah. Yep, so
I already work there. What do we call that avatar?
Employee, staff, colleague. Most of the time,
you know, and so if I really want to create a
bad culture, I'll call them staff. I'll call
them employee. I'll treat them like they're not
important. But I prefer to use the word team
member. So when we have these team members and
we treat these individuals more like equals and
we start to realize, wait a second, for them
to do well, we need procedures. We need resources.
We need templates. We need handbooks. We need
to help them understand the value of the different
pizzas that we have and the ingredients and all
that. We've got a whole culture to build internally
that completely gets overlooked while we're desperately
planning for one of the avatars that you haven't
mentioned yet, Angela, which you've gotten close
to. Let's pretend we just opened. The only other
one that's in my head is the innovator. So the
one who come up with the original pizza recipe
or the original pizza topping kind of unique
thing for that pizzeria. That's the only other
one that's in my head. I would add them to team
because we want to create a team hierarchy where
everybody's equal. And so even if I'm the genius
behind the pizza, I'm still the idiot who doesn't
know how to run the place. I'm still part of
the process. And if I make myself too important,
then we're going to end up in a situation where
absolute power corrupts absolutely. And I'm not
going to create a great team environment culture.
But I do love that you mentioned this, the founders
aspect of it as well. But before somebody becomes
a customer, what are they called? A prospect.
Very good. So another avatar, because we can't,
we can't, I can treat my prospects just like
my customers. But that would mean that every
time you come into my restaurant, instead of
addressing me as a customer. I'm just going to
treat you like you're some other random guest.
And I'm not going to ever create a personalized
relationship with you. So we call it a prospect
or we call it a lead. And most businesses get
trapped in this mindset of we need leads, we
need leads, we're desperate for leads. And they
never even develop what's going on for the customer,
but they certainly never learn about all these
other avatars. And so because they're so desperately
high strong on impressing the leads that they
want to take money from. Rather than serving
those individuals and helping them have a great
experience, sushi restaurants are notorious for
this. As are most Indian -style restaurants.
Most of them don't know how to relate with the
market that doesn't understand how to behave
in their restaurants. And the greatest of those
restaurants, they train you. They help you understand
the culture and the food and the dynamics. But
if I don't know how to eat sushi, And I'm worried
about, do I have to use the chopsticks? And I
don't really want fish that's not cooked. If
I'm worried about that experience, I'm not going
to have a great experience with that brand. So
preparing for prospects and leads is extremely
important for getting people to feel safe and
like they belong. And there's one final person.
So I walk into the restaurant and I say, hey,
my name is Bill. I'm with the San Antonio Express
News. You guys have a new restaurant. Who can
I talk to about this place and interview them?
I want to feature you guys. What is that prospect
or that avatar? Media and PR. Very good. So we
got PR, media, press. And if that hosting member
or team doesn't know what to do, they start calling
the owner. Hey, hold on. Just wait. I got the
owner on the phone or the owner doesn't have,
you know, nobody knows where the media kit is
that you need to have a media kit and how that
asset works. They don't know how to do the interviews.
You're going to end up lucky to be a footnote.
In the San Antonio Express News, they're definitely
not going to feature your brand or your business
because you didn't know how to pull together
the assets necessary and you didn't train your
team members on. And so we have these seven different
avatars that the world is ultimately ignoring,
not preparing for when in reality, Michael Gerber
of the E -Myth or Gina Wickman with Traction.
Or Patrick Lincione in Five Dysfunctions of a
Team. And all these phenomenal business leaders
that have helped us. Dr. Peter Drucker with the
Effective Executive tried to open our eyes to
help us see there's so much more to this business
stuff than the Get Rich Quick world wants you
to believe. And the Get Rich Quick world is constantly
telling you how easy it is, how simple, and how
they're one little solution. They are selling
all of you vision pros. They are trying to help
you make quick gambles so that you will invest
in them. So they can get an MRR monthly recurring
revenue from a thousand different people. And
they never have to think to truly serve your
needs. But if we're going to be responsible business
owners, we're going to scale. And it's so important
to realize that every single one of these seven
avatars. Needs different procedures, needs different
resources, needs different templates, needs different
training, needs different workflows, needs different
pipelines, needs different email sequences. My
sequences, by the way, you can't just write one
email for a prospect. You have to have a series
of it. Same thing for an onboarding of a client.
Same thing for an onboarding of a team member.
You've also got automations baked into that as
well. Then you've got pipelines to build out.
Pipelines from awareness all the way through
loyalty. There are six different levels in relation
to that. And then there's the actual marketing
influence of going from awareness to wanting
to purchase. If you were to multiply all those,
I've got a breakdown of these, all those elements
times each other, you're talking over 11 ,000
variables. And if you in your own mind as a solopreneur,
as the successful world calls a wantrepreneur,
believes you're going to figure out how to pull
that off all by yourself. One, I congratulate
you. That's a level of self -assuredness I cannot
possibly attain. If you do it, like hats off
to you. Amazing. You're the one unicorn in the
market who's able to pull it off. But three,
if you have the realization that I had, oh crap,
I should probably have a team of people help
me stuff out. Maybe I don't know as much as I
think I know. And maybe I need other people to
help me. My hope is that you will use this as
a gift. I hope you've mapped it out and thought
through what do we do as a team. You can use
this on your own. You do not have to work with
me in order to unpack that. You can ask Chad
GPT as well to take what I just said and try
to build out something for it. But my hope is
to inspire more entrepreneurs, more visionaries
to realize that you have seven relationships,
types of relationships that if you plan for and
you start preparing for and you start automating
around, it will save yourself time. You will
create income for yourself. You will create a
stability for yourself. Nobody else has. Angela,
have you ever heard these seven avatars talked
about? Do you have any additions to it or any
thought process on? Is this just crazy and overwhelming
and confusing and wrong? Or does that make a
lot of sense? And I'm obviously in my world,
they're called stakeholders as opposed to avatar.
And they are the kind of fundamental types of
people that you interact with within a business
environment. So, yes, I'm aware of them from
a stakeholder perspective, but not in the context
of marketing as you've applied it. For me, when
I use the words client avatar, the version that
kind of I. more familiar with is a singular one
where you really go into the detail of the preferences
the needs the wants the desires the pain points
the you know this the 28 years eight years years
old and they're called jimmy and they live in
san francisco and they that type of avatar so
you're really building out the understanding
of the type of person that you're trying to attract
so that then you niche down and then you focus
all of your marketing efforts and then you end
up with a thousand gimmies But then you end up
with a thousand of that one tiny avatar come
your way, but you've only got the ability to
provide for four, even though you thought you
could provide for 400 of them. Now you don't
have to attract more jimmies. You have to figure
out, well, what am I supposed to do? And nobody's
talking about these other avatars. So stakeholder
wise, you said you, you let, did you have all
seven of these labeled out as stakeholders or
are there any of these levels that didn't fall
in your stakeholder process? No, I think they're
all in there. There's other stakeholders as well
from a business perspective. We've talked about
investors in your business, but other stakeholders
would be like the government or legislators or
things like that. So they are also people who
have an influence on your business. But stakeholders
are different to avatars in this sense because
maybe the government will buy from your business.
On the government side, I'll add that as an eighth
avatar. That makes sense. What else did you have
as stakeholders? What was the other one? Oh,
legislators. I think I said like regulators,
because in your industry, if you know, you could
be, you talked about monthly recurring revenue,
talks about revenue in your business, sustainable
revenue. You could have all of these great, great
bright ideas or something that you want to build
out. But if there's a new regulation coming in
or a new legislation coming in, it might prevent
you from doing it. So understanding the needs
of those individuals is actually quite important.
One of my favorite things about what you just
did is you didn't just validate the seven. you
added another layer so this is even harder than
jackson's trying to simplify it down too good
you were able to add one layer and i'm going
to use that so there are eight avatar layers
is there another layout of stakeholders that
that is being overlooked i don't see one i assume
no the only i mean just like franchise isn't
franchisees and stuff like that. We talked about
investors, but franchisees will be people who
you're trying to replicate all of those standards
and protocols and licensing and templates and
tools that you referenced, the playbooks. Well,
depending on their level, right, of where they're
at with things, that would either fall under
vendors and distributors or team or potentially
investors, right? It depends on the asset level.
But I can see that as somebody that you might
consult with or build with. And so that's awesome.
Well, good. Then those of you listening in, the
nice thing is we have a 25 -year veteran in business
who was able to add a layer to our avatars. And
for the other seven layers, what percentage of
businesses that you've worked with have done
a phenomenal job of building procedures, resources,
templates, workflows, pipelines, emails for all
seven of those? And it's not even it's not even
avatar based in terms of the volume that how
many kind of do that. A lot of entrepreneurs
and business owners that I work with, they don't
like processes and standards and structure. They
like flying by the seat of the pants and, you
know, navigating the course of change. No, they
like it and they embrace that. And that's the
world that they love operating in. And then I
come in and I always talk about simplifying the
complex. Because I try to simplify all those
ideas that you have instead of having 15 things
that you do at the same time. Let's simplify
that. So you're actually making tangible impact.
You're getting the right resources and team behind
you to deliver on the things. It really intrigues
me. The ones who are flying by the seat of their
pants because they like that. Yeah. How many
of those ones have made it to the 10 year mark
and are thriving, not just surviving? What percentage
would you say? A high percentage, and I think
it's because a lot of them have got ADHD. I've
got to ask you, for our audience's sake, you
get to provide the resource of proof. I'm serious,
because if there's not public proof for that
reality, then I can't trust it. I can't take
that. What I will provide is on my side. I said
I don't know any, but that's not true. Laserway,
SpyTech Inc., Dr. Eric Byrd, Lewis Howes, Michael
Hyatt, T. Harv Eichert. These are all entities
that somehow, geniusly, were able to uncover
the reality of the needs for these opportunities
because there's no way they would have been able
to scale. If they had to constantly reinvent
the wheel or the team had to constantly reinvent
the wheel for all the messaging they get from
all these types of people, they may have weaknesses
in relation to some categories. Like I know Dr.
Berg, as far as I know up until now, he's not
scaling a big team. So I have a feeling his resources
for team development are probably less than his
resources for his existing customers who absolutely
love him. But I can't think of too many of those
individuals that are thriving past the 10 -year
mark that are like, oh my gosh, I can't wait
to fly by the seat of my pants today and not
know what I'm doing. Well, to spar back the context
around that is because of two things. One is
that they get the dopamine hit from operating
like that, but they've normally found an amazing
partner who they work with, who does all of the
behind the scenes processes and standards in
there. It's actual clients, so I don't really
want to say people's names. But they are people
who... They like to operate in that crazy world.
They like to operate as the flying by the seat
of the pants because they are so visionary. But
the reason why they can operate like that and
bring all of this knowledge and bring all this
energy actually into the business is because
they work with someone hand in hand who then
does all of the processes, procedures, compliance
systems and all of that type of stuff. So then
you find your effective partner who enables you
to still continue to be like that. That's the
type of conditions when they've got that backup
behind them. But the other side that I see is
the business is thriving, but they're burnt out.
So the business is still here 10 years down the
line, to answer your question before, but they
are burnt out. And it's at that point when they
normally kind of come to me and then I can help
them to not be burnt out but still have a great
business. So there are caveats to what I just
said. You either need the partner or you need
to have something that's going to support you
from not burning out, from operating at that
high dopamine, high CT. I love that. That's been
the challenge that I've seen too with, you know,
Wickman's theory on US and the integrator is
that out of all the relationships I've seen that
do that, yes, that person can thrive on that
dopamine and that energy, but there's almost
always somebody they're abusing in the process
to take care of all the integrated details. Very
rarely do those people actually have a sense
of like gratitude. And a sense of full appreciation
of the team members that they're moving forward
with. And I just, I don't want to be that type
of visionary. And I don't want to, there's another
great movie on that, now that you mentioned it
too, called The Aviator with Leonardo DiCaprio.
And that movie exposes this exact reality we're
talking about. He was literally sacrificing people's
lives trying to get the aviation industry to
move forward. And there are people dying and
he did not care about other people's opinions.
And he just kind of moved. He's like the poster
child of the extreme side. And so I don't mean
to say that everybody who operates that way is
a direct reflection of the gentleman who ran
that. But I think it's very wise for us as visionaries
to think through what type of leader do I want
to be known for in the process? What's all my
legacy to be? Do I want to go down? as the next
aviator um you know who kind of punishes and
is cruel to individuals in the process or do
i want to have a stronger balance um you know
and one where my team members 10 15 years when
we're talking about growth are able to honor
the type of environment i was able to create
for those that i worked with and um so visionaries
that's where i lean towards that's my bias my
bias is i want a team that loves me And I want
to know that I've done everything I can for my
team as well as for the market in the process.
And what transpires typically with that is the
reason why the movie The Aviator is so cool and
so dramatic and so like attractive is because
he's like the one exception who made it successfully
to that area where it's going to be hard to make
a movie about it. Whereas most people who attempt
life that way never make the history books and
they're never worth talking about. burning their
own legacy to the ground in the process. And
so branding, growth, priorities. At the end of
the day, my friends, your priorities will come
through your own prayer, your own meditation,
and what it is that you want to look at and how
you may want to move things forward. Angela,
I love that you started me on this. I'm super
grateful for your thoughts on personal branding
and what we're able to uncover for people. in
terms of the eight avatars as well and the new
gift of the eighth level that you added to that.
Would you like to share any final thoughts of
wisdom for those who are listening today? My
final thoughts of wisdom are around just coming
back on what you were just saying, actually,
around the flying by the seat of the pants and
the kind of visionary lead. That's me as well.
I am quite visionary. I like the imagination,
creativity. I like all of that, coming up with
new opportunities, building new relationships.
But it's like me and my husband. If you think
of the book that we were just talking about with
traction and the visionary and the integrator
and we talk about Disney in the book, it's also
in your personal life as well that you need that
partner who is the stability. So if you are the
visionary person like I am, my husband would
be the integrator using that book as the method
because I can go off and do all of these things
to build our life and build all these new opportunities
in our life. But I wouldn't be able to do that
if he wasn't the one sorting out. everything
else you know he does everything to keep our
family stable so I might be the one booking the
holidays or looking at the next thing that we're
going to be doing but he's the one who's making
sure we've got bread and milk and you know the
kids are fed and they've got the school lunch
box packed for school and all that type of stuff
I don't do any of that stuff because I do this
and he does this it's the same in business you
have to have that partner who you implicitly
trust and also who value the contribution that
you're making because if he didn't value me doing
that and I didn't value him doing that A, the
marriage would break down, but businesses break
down because of the same reasons because they
just don't see the valuable contribution. So
that was my closing thoughts. Okay. That's just
huge wisdom all around on it. I want to be able
to honor all of it because these are the things
that took me too many years, my friends, to figure
out and to fully pull together and realize how
it all comes together. So while I love that you
condition the reality that The people who fly
by the seat of their pants benefit from having
a team that they appreciate. And vice versa,
the team has to appreciate the reality of the
strengths that you bring to the table. And to
be fair for all of us, all of us in some form
or fashion fly by the seats of our pants in life.
We're all spontaneous creatures. Nobody just
comes out routinely brushing their teeth. There's
processes that exist. And so I do want to caution
on both sides. I know you well enough already,
Angela, to know that while you fly by the seat
of your pants in some areas, you're extremely
pragmatic. Oh, yeah. About a lot of balance.
Yeah, you have. Exactly. You have built that
incredible balance. And so whether it's waiting
to get your logo and branding in place for five
years, deciding having the discipline nature
of knowing I'm going to do this and I don't need
that. That is not fine by a seat of your pants.
That's preparing methodically. to prioritize
on. And so again, I don't mean to challenge your
identity as much as recognizing that the actions
that you take while you, you probably do a lot
of great things by the seat of your pants. You're
also really, really responsible in how you build
too. And then I've got the vice versa going on.
But there's a reason for that for me. And that's
because I massively burnt out by continuing to
be the fly at the seat of the pants. So now I
have to have discipline on myself. Otherwise,
I know I will end up burnt out again. So it's
from going through trauma, basically, that's
made me completely change my style. So now I
really value structure and I really value discipline
and process. But I still also really enjoy this
world, the visionary and the thing. But I think
I've become actually quite a balanced person
over these last five years post that burnout
because I've recognized I can't operate only
in that world. So I've become my own kind of
balancing act. But my husband makes it even more
balanced because he is the ultimate stability
and all of that stuff. And that's never really
going to be me. Huge. And that's hopefully what
we've just gifted to the future visionaries who
are listening to this is the ability to realize,
dang, okay, maybe I can learn from their experiences
on this and start to achieve that from the get
-go or from the point that you're at. So Vision
Pros, if you've got anything else to add, if
you've got any comments, any questions that you
have, feel free to drop those in the chat. Of
course, I highly recommend catching up with Angela
Hodgson and seeing what she's up to with Ignite
Improvement and seeing how she might be able
to help your brand. I know. i will be doing the
same um as long as she's able to tolerate my
my contrarian nature of oh wait i want to look
at this too being a phenomenal ally by our side
as we continue to build back to that avatar of
strategic partners, vendors. I'm always looking
for and open to who else can I find? How can
we include? How can we create a win -win? How
can we produce more results together than apart?
And Vision Pros, that includes you. We'd be happy
to get to know you. And at the top right corner
of the screen, you'll see a button that says
Be Our Guest. If you'd like to come share your
vision with us, please do. We'd love to see how
you're impacting the world. We'll see you guys
all in the next episode of Vision Pros Live.
Thanks, everyone. Thank you for being here today.
I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision
Pros Live. I'm looking forward to seeing your
reactions as these episodes continue to move
forward. This is going to get more and more fun.
We'll have more and more engagement as well.
We'll invite people to participate in the show.
And thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent time building out your vision
and becoming a vision pro yourself.