you know i would say something and then he would
develop it so uh yeah it was um it was a good
exploration i would say very good and uh since
then so let's look back over the last six months
or so what have been some of your favorite accomplishments
or building blocks that you've put into place
for bringing your vision to fruition over the
last six months Well, there's quite a lot going
on at the moment. I've finished writing my book.
And so it's now it's now how do I get it out
into the world? So we're talking about I gave
it to sort of my project manager and he he told
me that it doesn't need content editing, which
was kind of exciting. Just just proofreading.
And I'm. I'm excited by that. There's a lot of
trust in there. Yes. And I launched a series
of webinars which started with the title of Leading
from Within and now have developed from one of
the themes of the book, which is rewilding. So
rewilding leadership is where we've got to. And
I've got a couple of webinars. in two days time
on thursday um that uh i'm going to be exploring
some of the aspects of of rewilding that can
be applied to leadership which is uh feels feels
very important to me and and is a it's a great
mindset it's a great paradigm i think for um
challenging uh some of our the principles of
leadership that have been taught since the early
1900s, which really are so hopelessly out of
date now, and yet are still being taught, particularly
in business schools and some schools as well.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, in the book launch, a lot of
you visionaries out there familiar with the process
or the idea of launching a book. And I love that
you said you finished writing it and you're very
aware of the uphill battle and challenges that
exist with where you go with it from there. And
the content editing aspects. At first, I was
concerned because you said that, you know, it
needed none of that. But then he said proofreading.
I was like, OK, OK, they still got a process.
But I see so many people. um prematurely publish
their books without a great plan um and it's
one of those it's like you can pre -publish a
website and it doesn't hurt you too bad because
you can just edit it as you go but with a book
You got to land the reviews, right? The ratings
on Amazon and stuff. You got to have a whole
club of people ready to support it. It's a process.
And so I'm glad to hear you're doing that well.
It's not surprising to me, given the dedication
you've put into your brand, Serenity and Leadership.
I love the way that you submitted to that, what
we're going to talk about today. And Tom, it's
not common for me to allow my guests to fully.
drive the theme of the direction but in this
case you've earned that um you put decades into
figuring this out so yeah you answered the question
where did your vision come from what circumstances
help bring it to life and you know what is the
vision that you have and you said to influence
the influencers encouraging them to take full
responsibility for the impact they have on their
people their organization and the environment
you furthered that concept you said growth is
a common driver But as the world evolves, it's
becoming increasingly clear that growth for its
own sake is unsustainable. We must instead reframe
the concept of growth within the context of our
broader purpose. I would go as far to say it's
not only an unhealthy practice to grow for the
sake of growth. It's toxic. It's destructive
for us as individuals. So I'm really happy to
hear you leaning into that. Normally, I'd ask
for three resources, but I'd love to just dive
into those concepts first. We live in a world
that's just struggling with inauthenticity. Where
do we go from here, Tom? Well, there's different
dimensions to that, I think. Yeah. The first
word that came into my mind as you asked me that
question was education. love that we we are teaching
our young people uh to replicate uh the mistakes
and the environment um that that we have created
uh and at the same time i'm encouraged i think
that a lot of young people um are coming in now
uh coming into the world coming into late teenhood
early 20s and they really have a different set
of values so it's like they're ripe to be educated
to challenge things and to think differently
to the way that we've experienced so that's one
thing but nevertheless we have governments that
dictate And, you know, I mean, what's going on
in the US, I don't know, you know, how political
one wants to be in a conversation like this.
But, you know, burning books was never a good
idea. And in just the same way as the Israeli
government today are talking about eliminating
Hamas, the concept is... is completely unworkable
because they're creating, as they try and destroy
so much, they are creating people who will grow
up with a level of hatred that few of their antecedents
had. I remember when I was in the military and
I was involved in the troubles in Northern Ireland,
I saw what trying to eliminate a concept or an
idea does, you can't do it. You cannot do it.
So we need a new political system. We need people
to go into politics not as a way to make money,
not as a way to have a career, but as a way to
be a servant of the people. and to make decisions
that are in the interest, the greater interest
of the society and of the people. There are almost
no politicians like that now. Almost none. There's
one or two in the British government, but they
tend to be ostracized, they tend to be criticized,
and all sorts of things are done to mobilize.
uh ways of demeaning them or uh disempowering
them which i find very sickening actually um
but that's uh i mean i could go on but i i think
the authenticity and what you're saying you know
you're not you're not shying away from a subject
that most people don't want to touch you're you're
willing to dive into it with a with a with a
healthy dose of assuredness but also a respect
that if i challenged it i i don't think you would
leave the air. I don't think you would feel the
need to back down on it. I watched a movie a
few weeks ago called Michael Collins. I had no
concept of the story. And so ironically, I watched
it right before you came on and talked about
some of what I saw in that history, where this
man... had a concept of freedom that he wanted
to achieve and and the government and people
fought so hard against uh the bureaucracy fought
so hard against what he was standing for what
he was doing that no they couldn't win he created
a movement that was successful even if it did
hurt his own life the movement was not going
to be stopped all right and so i would be happy
to tie that back to okay so in a world of influencers
um right that Uh, and I think my generation,
I think the millennials and perhaps even the
generation before us, maybe it's not generational.
Maybe this is forever a reality, but there's
a lot of pressure put on us to be perfect. Um,
there was a lot of pressure on us to perform
for the sake of love. Um, and to, you know, we
didn't, we didn't have the type of career our
parents wanted. We were a disappointment. Um,
right. If we didn't do the church things the
way our parents wanted, then there's a disappointment.
Right. And so a lot of us, I think a lot of people
learn to be something in public that they're
not in private in order to feel connected to
the world and feel acceptable. And that is a
big part of why Instagram and TikTok and people
show up and say, you know what, I better be something
that people accept on the external. in order
to feel valued in this world. Am I wrong or am
I right about that? Yeah, you said I'd better.
I'm not sure it's that. I think it's, I was writing
about this today, funnily enough, this sense
of loneliness that is so prevalent in such an
ironical situation where we're supposed to be
so connected. So Instagram, I know less about
TikTok, but Facebook, all this lot, they're selling
snake oil in a way. And I think people go on
there. And, yes, they feel the need to be perfect.
I mean, I experience it, for goodness sake. You
know, I'm trying to build up followers. I want
more people to see the stuff that I'm investing
in and putting out there, which are ideas, which
will then bring them to me to come to attend
one of my leadership programs or a webinar or,
you know, if they're incredibly enlightened,
come and be coached by me. But how do I build
my followership? what sort of things have I got
to do to please these people so that they're
sufficiently interested that they're going to
watch a little video clip or read a small caption
as opposed to just swiping by. It's like Tinder
and all that lot. It's another version of Tinder.
It's swipe, swipe, swipe. Yes, it is. It's sad.
It's so, so sad because actually what we need
to do is to be going out there and talking to
people and engaging and finding someone and saying,
I really don't agree with this guy, but he's
saying something that's different to me. I'm
curious about that. Why does he believe that?
Why is he saying that? And what is the reaction?
What is the visceral reaction that's happening
in me as a result of this? Do I just hate him
because he says something that I don't like?
I mean, what logic is that? It's crazy. It's
crazy. But that's the world that we're living
in. It's so short term and it's so shallow. I
wrote a piece for HR Zone, which was published
today, funnily enough, about men's mental health.
And one of the things that I am so sad about
is that Certainly in this country, I mean, the
US is a different subject, really, but they've
austerity, you know, after the banks went bust
and we put all our money into saving them. One
of the things that they cut back on was spaces
where young men could go and be interested and
have an activity that took them away from hanging
out on a street corner. spitting on people and
taking some kind of drug. Young men need something
to engage with. They need something that challenges
them, that corrals their ego. And then they can
grow up to be healthy contributors and members
of society and challenge. And I'm not saying
it's all sort of... lovey -dovey you know men
need to express their masculinity in a way that
is is creative and robust but all those environments
have gone and we've just got shitty holes that
they can go in instead uh and what's the result
gangs um violence it's isolation yeah Loneliness,
desperation, suicide. The rates of suicide of
young men is the highest reason for death of
young men up to the age of 50. Crazy, crazy,
crazy. It is. Let's dive into the opposite side
of that, though. Let's dive into what we're doing
to resolve. And I'll start with the first three
resources. What are three resources you would
recommend? for other visionaries who are building
out there you're right it's challenging it's
hard to figure the social media game out it's
hard to figure out how to build you've built
you've built a lot of clarity around your website
and a lot around your messaging and you focused
on serenity which so much of the world has decided
to kind of abandon in place of fun or enthusiasm
or dopamine or lots of other other things that
are related to that what are the three resources
tom Gosh. Well, the first that comes to mind
is this sense of serenity. I think we've become
incredibly disconnected from nature. So, you
know, I took the dogs out this morning, you know,
and I stopped a number of times in front of a
flower and I just smelt it. I want to. find ways
where I can get a sense of my role and place
in nature. I'm not the master of this. I am a
part of it. And I think to have that sense of
groundedness, I think it can be enormously resourcing.
So that's one thing. take the time i mean they
say take the time to smell the roses it's huge
it's huge and yet yesterday when i was on a walk
um talking to somebody very important to me making
the time for that um right and that's it's hard
when you're single father of four too there's
a lot of a lot of directions i get pulled in
right but um as i walk past this this bush of
flowers that i had never seen like paid attention
to before You know, here I was like just appreciating
the aroma of that. And I'm glad you're doubling
down on me on it because I looked up the definition
of serenity right now while you were talking.
I was like, OK, I know this has to do with peace,
but I haven't looked at the full definition a
long time and what's there. And so I obviously
haven't mastered it, but it's a calm peace. And
then it said a word that I didn't associate with
it yet. It said untroubled. And I was like, that's
what I need right now. I need that in my life
right now. And I have all the access to it if
I'm willing to be aware of that, right? And really
dive into it. I can meticulously, methodically,
meditatively lean into that. So first off, thank
you for the first switch of serenity. Yes, I
have the power to be untroubled, right? And I
need to lean into that. What's number two? number
that's really nice um well number two is there
might be a big challenge you know i particularly
in the states i lived in the states for for six
years and you you go into a person's house and
typically the the tv would be on uh and if not
certainly the radio was on if not both and um
i i say this with a degree of humility because
i find this really hard to do myself but switch
off the noise switch off the noise when i'm coaching
um ceos and sort of senior execs i often say
to them how can you hear the faint signals um
because when there's so much noise in your life
you can't And yet, as the leader of an organisation,
you need to be able to sense the future which
is coming towards you. And I remember driving
up a motorway a while back, and I was about 10
miles away from where I was living. And I remembered
then... what I needed to have with me to go to
the meeting that I was on my way to. And I didn't
have it. And then I thought back, and as I was
leaving the house, there was a sense that I had
that I needed to take something with me. But
I was too noisy in myself to hear that. And I
remember shouting in the car, Speak louder. But
it's like, no, you shut up and listen. So it's
give yourself some space where there isn't any
noise. Golly, man. Our lives, the stars of alignment
of this, Tom, I just can't. And my, one of my
prayers this morning, I had a very open talk
with God about that. And I know how important
it is to listen and that the, we call it the
still calm voice. You know, that's that, that,
that talk that, that you said, you said, as a
leader, you need to be able to see the sense,
the future that is coming towards you. And with
all that distraction on, we can't. And I literally.
kind of told God the same thing. I was like,
I need to hear, I need to understand, right?
I need to understand. And it's not too different
than what you were saying, you know, speak louder.
And I got that calm voice back of like, you will,
you know, hang in there. You know, like it's
not coming the way that you want it to, Jackson.
You know, that's not how this process works.
But I do want to lean in deep to that. At first,
I got on my high horse as soon as you talked
about the TV and radio. And I was like, mine's
never on. And I was like, yes, I'm winning. And
then I remember my computer whirring. We were
talking and I'm like, no, I turned that off too.
I was like, don't go there. I turned that off
too. So I'm like champion. Then I remember my
phone. And I was like, crap. I do a decent job
of unplugging. but it's still there, right? It's
still coming at me a lot of times, interrupting
those signals that you talked about. And then
I remembered my personal relationships. And now
it has nothing to do with technology, but sometimes
we either overindulge in a relationship or we
take on other people's baggage that we're not
supposed to take on. There's so much noise, right?
There's so many things that can keep replacing
the noise that we might remove. So I'm going
to ask a bold question. Maybe you do or don't
have the answer. If those are symptoms, if the
TV is a symptom, if the radio is a symptom, then
what the heck? Where do we go? What is it that
really needs to be shut off? How do we really
tune in to that serenity? Well, you know, we
are the masters of our own destiny. Try it. Quite
a few people now are trying meditation. Some
people find it unbelievably difficult, and I'm
one of them. So give yourself a break. Meditate
for a minute. Just switch everything off for
a minute. and just sit there and, you know, your
head will be spinning and, oh, I've got to do
this and I want some breakfast and my stomach's
aching and, oh, God, I forgot about the papers
that the kids have got to take. All of that is
going on. But that is practice and it's not about
trying to close it off. It's about thank you.
You know, sometimes I kind of get panicky about,
oh, God, I've got to do this. And then the thought
comes to me and says, well, right now, there's
nothing you can do about that. So let it go.
You know, we spend so much, such a high percentage
of our time worrying about things that are not
going to happen. And it just takes energy, and
it distances ourselves from that place of serenity,
which is there. Wow. I'm taking a lot of notes
in this one, guys. This is powerfully aligned
with what I need in my life right now as a visionary,
and I honor that. um and i hope the rest of you
too are able to use these moments of silence
to sense you know what is it that you need to
do as leaders all visionaries in this role are
leaders um we may not be of the winston churchill
levels um you know we may not be the president
of countries and some of us yet um right and
at the same time if we're called into a sense
of purpose where we're supposed to be helping
others. And it's so important to learn to access
powers beyond our cerebral recognition, right?
Beyond our emotional reactions and instincts
as well. And I'd love to dive into resource number
three. Tom, what do you got? What's the third
one? What's helped you get to where you are?
I think there is no greater gift that one person
can give to another. then they're 100 % presence.
And so the resource there is how can I be with
this person? So, you know, I switch off the phone.
Do whatever. But in that moment, you know, even
if you're just passing someone in the street
and you have a very brief interchange, in that
moment, you are there with them. You know, my
daughter picked me up on this years ago and we
were on the phone and I was fiddle -tapping on
the computer at the same time. And she stopped
talking and she said, you're not really with
me, are you? And we were just on the phone. But
she could sense that. I'm, you know, pretty basic,
so it was fairly obvious, I suppose. You know,
I mean, that pulled me up pretty short. You know,
I'm still not great at that. But I do know that...
And even... Not so much being on the giving end
of that, but on the receiving end of that. You
know if somebody is really there talking to you
and there is nothing else. There are no other
distractions. Clear your desk. I am with this
person. Bang. Full stop. 100%. And if they're
doing it both ways, I mean, that's when you can
feel. That's when love will transmit, pass between
people. I mean, because it is a moment of great
respect and it is a moment of great love. Yes.
I absolutely love that. There's levels on this
too. It's like a dial for volume, right? There's
lots of levels where this can exist and maximizing.
the dial of tuning in presently allows us to
maximize that power of love and how it's felt.
So I, I did something while you were talking
about that. And one, one, one, I want to go back
to what you said. You said, I guess the resources
is after you said the resource, but I want to
go back to, you nailed the resource. The resource
is 100 % presence. I don't think anybody should
mince words. I got cerebral people I meet with,
Tom, who would in a heartbeat, and I can think
of their faces and their names and I won't shame
them. But all of you listening, you have people
in your life like this who would say, well, like,
how is that practical? You know, or how do you
like, what is the real resource behind it? And
they don't mean to disrespect the sacred value
of what was just given. They just can't see it.
They just can't feel it the way those of you
who are leaning into this. And it's important
because you're surrounded by so many people who
can't. who won't pick that up, who won't learn
like, oh, I'm supposed to do something with this
from here and meditated on it myself and find
what this means for me. So thank you for diving
into some examples on that. And I think the greater
opportunity for all of you visionaries listening
in is how do I lean into figuring out what does
100 % presence mean for me, right? So I'm taking
notes here and I'm like, okay, wait, am I really
presence with Tom if I'm taking notes? Because
my brain is doing this and I'm on this panner.
And then I took my phone and it was sitting in
front of me like this. Right, right, right here
underneath there. And it was on vibrate. And
I should never leave my phone on vibrate during
the podcast. Right. And I'm like, it'll be fine.
And then I said, no, I'm not being present. He's
talking about being present right now. So I was
being unpresent, literally going through this.
And I was like, OK, I'm going to turn on silent.
And I threw my phone over there. it's one more
way to just turn that dial up. And I think it's
easy as human beings to trap ourselves in the
concept of beating ourselves up and focusing
on what we fall short on and then diving into
guilt and shame. But we all have an opportunity
to say, you know what? Tom's pouring his heart
and soul out to us by showing up on the show
and giving the way he's giving. And I don't need
to wallow in self -pity. Can I dive right back
in with him? And say, you know what? I'm going
to turn my dial up too. I'm going to meet him
where he's meeting me. So we're going to come
right back, my friends. We're going to dive in
and talk about influence and Tom's vision for
that. We've already talked about the authenticity
of the world. We've already talked about how
we're all in this world that contains a lot of
mud and a lot of distraction, a lot of fighting
and things like that. But I'd love to dive in
and see where he's going with the vision, how
he's helping people, how he can help us too.
We're going to do our best to pull together as
much truth and value for as possible. based on
the love that Tom is talking about. We'll be
right back. All right. Welcome in to Vision Pros
Live with Jackson Callum. I'm your show host.
We'll be doing interviews for visionary entrepreneurs
and guest leaders who are building fantastic
visions out there. Hey, what's up, everybody?
Welcome in to another episode of Vision Pros
Live. I'm your show host, Jackson Callum, founder
and CEO of First Class Business. And I'm super
excited to have Tom Dennis on the stage with
me from Serenity in Leadership. Those words are
really, really sacred to me, by the way. When
I saw that Tom was coming on the show, I went
and Googled his brand and I was like, okay, he's
got a well -structured website too. I went and
checked that out and I felt the serenity of it.
I could see it was like, okay, this guy is really
working to be intentional in helping others.
He's got decades of wisdom as well. There's so
much opportunity to lean in and see, okay, what
truths can he unpack for the rest of us? What
things can we gain from somebody who's decided
to dedicate? his life and vision to the space
of serenity in a world that moves towards entertainment
and noise and hype and hustle things that are
ultimately at odds with the idea of leaning into
serenity so to me this this interview is an absolute
pleasure Before I bring Tom back on stage, I
do want to make sure to talk about some of the
resources you have available to you. We're going
to start with Junaid Ahmed's Home Studio Mastery.
I've got a podcast. I'm really happy with the
setup that I have. And yet I'm also grateful
to have a business partner in Junaid now who
builds out world -class podcast studios. This
is for those who want to be an industry expert.
This is for those who want to be able to lead
their industries, who really understand the value
of, you know what? Let's just say that you're
in a market or an industry where you need to
have the appearance of leading as a great leader.
You can't show up in a Pinto. You need to have
your Lamborghini present or you need to have
a nicer car. Well, I get that. That's not how
I do things. I lead the third world, just so
y 'all are clear. I want to be relatable and
present in a way that's different than the way
Junaid is able to set these studios up. So when
it comes to upgrading studios and when it comes
to my clients moving towards that. Junaid is
absolutely the place that we turn people to because
he knows how to put all those details in order
and what it takes to have a world -class podcast
studio. So if that's you, go ahead and check
him out and see what he's up to in terms of building
media schools out as well to help young kids
make the most of their life and create a better
sense of freedom of the press. As you all know,
we suffer tremendously from that in this world
too. Moving on, we got Dr. Danny Brassell. Dr.
Danny Brassell isn't only a world -class, world
-renowned speaker who helps corporate organizations,
professionals move their lives forward. What
I really love about Danny is he's got a program
called The Reading Habit. He's an educator, he's
a teacher. He helps parents inspire their children
to become great leaders and to learn to love
to read. And he's got that energy where he's
one of those people you have to be careful with
because if you sit down with Danny, in a 10 -minute
session or 20 -minute session he's going to change
your life and you know if you're like scared
like i don't know if i want to meet this guy
because he's going to make a big impact and he's
going to inspire me and then i'm going to be
yes he is that level of leader i absolutely love
talking to danny he has superpowers when it comes
to helping people and i can't think of too many
better causes than actually helping kids learn
how to read and helping them through the parents.
So the parents get to be part of that experience
as well as they're going to be the ones who are
there long -term. Danny comes in, he's able to
make his mark and help people. He's got a program
on this online as well. And I highly recommend
checking out what Danny's doing to do that. If
that touches your heart, if you understand the
value of reading, reach out to him, partner with
him, be a collaborator with what he's doing.
That's what we're doing as well. Then there's
the water project. As I said, I can't think of
too many things that are more important than
reading. And better than that, maybe this is,
maybe this isn't. This is simply what I'm called
to talk about. I understand the value of the
water project because I meditated on it, not
because I've been through it, but I imagined
what would it be like for my kids to not have
water and to not know where the next source of
water is? What about me as a provider? What if
I had to leave work or risk bringing water home
that wasn't safe for my kids? I've never, ever.
had to live with that type of experience yet
there are millions of people throughout the world
who do and because of organizations like the
water project we're able to get involved and
do something about it look at this picture these
kids are celebrating water perhaps with even
more enthusiasm than my own kids celebrate christmas
day itself and that's just for the most basic
essential resource for us beyond the oxygen we
have the opportunity to choose which community
want to provide for i love that they show you
how the project works what is being built whether
it's a sand dam or borehole well or a upgrade
to an existing infrastructure that they may have
it shows you how many people you're helping and
all you got to do is donate a little bit of money
to that Now, if you're struggling financially
and you can't do that, my hope is that you'll
just talk to others about it. You never know
what happens when you spread the word about something
that you believe in. You don't know how far that
ripple effect is going to go. You might be the
chain link that connects a friend to a friend
that ends up investing $100 ,000 in helping said
projects. So my hope is that you use your voice,
you use your opportunity to influence. And with
that being said, we're going to go back to this
conversation about influence and purpose. And
who better to speak to that? than Tom Dennis.
Tom, welcome back to Vision Pros Life. Thank
you, Jackson. I love the fluency with which you
have just given people some important messages.
It's very professional. Thank you. You know,
it's passion. I'll dive in with that. It's passion.
It's because I care. I'll write about these institutes
and these organizations. And all of you out there,
you can flow that type of fluency as you really
lean into your passions with purpose. So back
to that with Tom. Tom, tell me about your vision.
Let's hear about what you see on the horizon.
Well, the project manager for my book sent me
a whole bunch of questions. because they want
to do the book cover design and so they really
wanted to get inside tom dennis and this this
this this concept of rewilding the corporate
mind um and so i i have a um this this this this
vision i don't know of a new type of leader really
being in the majority, of people who care and
are in service. We have political systems which
are just so riven with money and self -aggrandisement.
And what we need is, we desperately need people
who... are doing things because uh they can see
the the the the the positive um impact on community
i mean the word sort of came into my mind community
you know we're too big we're and and you know
we're global and yet we've lost our village You
talk about being a single parent. My goodness,
the number of people who are single parents.
And in the past, a child was part of the community
and it was the community that brought the child
up. So the burden was not just on the parents
or parent. but on the support, the guidance,
and the inspiration of all the elements that
made up that community, which is so beautiful.
And we've killed all that. We don't have community
anymore, pretty much. And where we do have it,
the system is trying to break it down. I'm looking
for leaders who, you know, I mean, one of my
great sort of models is Yvon Chouinard, the founder
of Patagonia, which is just such a truly amazing
company. Yes. And if you look now, because they've
had crashes from way back. They've now got people
who are working in the organization who grew
up through the crash system within the company.
And that is a community. And it's an unbelievably
successful community. I had the privilege to
interview a guy who was the head of people, HR.
I mean, he had a big title. for about eight years
at Patagonia. And I interviewed him on a couple
of podcasts. And just the passion. He's left
the organization, but still the passion. He still
talked about we. Yeah. And it's like, you know,
Srinath and his family put the organization in
trust to the earth because it cost him a fortune
in tax. But nobody can lay their hands on it
now. And, you know, 10 % of everything they turn
over goes to protecting the environment. I mean,
they're just beautiful people with beautiful
ideas, principles, purpose, all these good things.
It is possible. It is possible. And so, yeah,
I haven't put it like this before. I want leaders
to create. healthy, happy community. I love that.
I love that. I'm grateful that you talked about
how it's possible. And, you know, we live in
a world of false guarantees, you know, where
that's the competition. You know, this illusion
of certainty, you know, this vanity of look at
what I did, you're guaranteed to do this too.
when the variables are so different and it's
so easy to fall victim of diving into that. But
I can say wholeheartedly, I would rather strive
for what's possible and aligned with purpose
and fail than go towards some guaranteed outcome
that makes me a shadow of the man that I'm meant
to be. That's not something I'm willing to concede
and dive into. There's two questions we're going
to skip for the sake of time. things that I would
love to talk about, worst leadership experience,
best leadership experience. Maybe we can get
you back. Maybe we can talk about those in the
future or do a separate segment that maybe is
a solo and you send back. But I'm going to dive
into the power question. My favorite question,
Tom, if this is the last chance that you had
to speak on earth, this was it. What powerful
lesson can other visionaries learn from your
experience? I thought you were going to go into
power and the dynamics of power as opposed to
just saying it's a power question. Powerful lesson.
So in that, again, this is the last chance you
had to leave wisdom with us. What would that
wisdom be? Be kind. You know, you see someone
and we make up stories about people very quickly.
You see someone, you don't actually look at their
face, so you make up a story. You see someone
who's got some disability and you make up a story
about it. You know, as opposed to saying, what
is it about me that is making me uncomfortable?
And who am I to make any judgments about this
person? You know, life is tough. Even multimillionaires,
you know, money doesn't buy happiness. But it
does tend to amplify the journey that these people
took. to make a whole bunch of money. And a lot
of that journey was probably quite uncomfortable
for other people and by implication for that
individual as well. Don't judge. Don't judge.
Just come with an open and kind mind. You know,
you could say come with love. We could do with
a bit more of that. I'm tempted to let it resonate.
So I, cause I love it. And yes, we can, we can
do a bit with a, with a bit more. And so it's
a polite way of putting it a very graceful way
of leaving that be kind. I love it. I'm grateful
for it. As we, as we get ready to wrap up, are
there, are there any questions that. No podcaster,
no interviewer has asked you that you've been
like, I want to answer this. I want to bring
this to light. I want to talk about this subject.
I'd be happy to use the next few minutes to dive
into those territories. Well, thank you. I mean,
the thing that comes to mind is rewilding. Are
you saying rewilding, like wild? There you go.
So the classic example is a 3 ,000 -acre estate
in the south of England. And the husband and
wife who were running the estate, they've been
trying and trying and trying to make it work,
but it's just chalk earth. uh it wasn't supporting
anything commercial in terms of farming it was
it was just desperate so they took the decision
in 2001 to just let it go they took down all
the fences they introduced the hierarchy of of
of animals that as much as they could replicate
existed In ancient times. So instead of wild
boar. There was a certain type of pig. And just
looking at the pig. The pig does it. It uses
its snout. And digs for worms and stuff. And
what it does is break up. The hard earth. They
brought deer. They brought wild horses. And.
Very quickly. they were starting to see animals
that were extinct, thought were extinct, turning
up in this place. There's one, a bird that was
almost unheard of in this country, and now they've
found that 90 % of these are in this 3 ,000 acre.
There's the apocryphal stories of what they did
in Yosemite, where they reintroduced the wolves.
And that all started a whole series of changes.
And it's been written up in all sorts of ways.
And some of the stories are a bit apocryphal,
but never mind. NEP, this estate in the UK now,
since 2001, I mean, they make a very good living
from that land because people come and they do
safaris there. They have an excess of, because
they don't have any of the higher predators,
like lions or stuff like that, they have to cull
some of the larger animals, like some of the
deer. So, you know, they'll take out the weakest
ones, you know, seasonally and that. And they're
selling that meat. And so they're making a very
good living, but in a totally different way to
the way that they've been introduced to it. What
you get out of that are the principles of honoring.
as opposed to us coming in with a level of arrogance
that we know best and that we're going to have
straight lines and we're going to make the earth
work and work and work and work. We're going
to put chemicals on it so that we get more and
more. Some people say that there's only about
60 harvests left in most of the earth. on the
planet before it becomes dead so um we we have
to stop trying to rule nature but work with nature
i mean why on earth are we still putting all
these chemicals on the land which are killing
bees which are probably the single most important
resource on the earth for feeding us. And, you
know, the short -termism, the short sort of level
of thinking that goes into, I've got to put all
these chemicals on because I'm going to get the
maximum out of my harvest or whatever, and forgetting,
you know, how it ruins. the biological infrastructure,
but not only that, all the chemicals that go
into the offshoot when it rains into the rivers,
which kill the fish, and then we drink the water,
and then we're surprised, like in Flint in the
US, where people end up with cancers and all
the rest of it. We are completely out of control,
and we need to listen. Listen to nature and honor
our place in nature as opposed to putting ourselves
in somehow above it. Rewilding. You guys heard
it first here. I love it. I really strive to
see the world from the perspective of physics,
the perspective of what? what life has tried
to teach us for thousands of years, not what
some influencers has uncovered in the last 10
years. Go ahead. Because what I'm then doing
is taking the ideas of how nature works so beautifully
and then applying that to the corporate mind
and leadership. So as a leader, Do I come in
and say, right, you're going to do this, you're
going to do that, as opposed to saying, okay,
this is the objective, let's agree on that objective,
and then let's say, what role, where is the best
of all this team, and how can we work in such
an integrated, systemic way that we can get towards...
what we are trying to achieve. And by the way,
as we go along, the objective may change. It's
funny to me. Patrick Lincione wrote a phenomenal
book, Five Dysfunctions of a Team. This poster
behind me is a reflection of these principles
that he teaches. And it is ironic. It's not ironic.
It's something that I know, though. We could
do a test on this and see. I bet most companies,
once a leader, learns this process and then wants
to shift their company to follow this style,
then tries to teach the style itself to people
right away. Ryan says, all right, we're shifting.
We're doing this. As you talk about, they apply
this control, this force aspect. When in reality,
in his book, the new CEO who's come into the
company, he shares one tip that almost everybody
forgets. She comes into the company and she sits
back and watches for two weeks. She doesn't do
a dang thing. And everybody's starting to see
that. And he makes a big deal out of it. But
I think most people forget that part of the book.
And they think they just want to move forward
with the answer and they just want to fix it.
Let's just solve it. And in reality, the grace
which he leads with and the grace which he teaches
is not about diving into the puzzle and fixing
the puzzle as fast as possible. It has a lot
to do with situational awareness and as you call
it, rewilding. I love the term. It's a really
catchy term. So I hope you champion this, Tom.
I hope you really, really bring this to the world
in a big way because our world, the world I want
my kids to live in needs it. People will benefit
from having that. So thank you so much for being
here. Vision pros, those of you listening in,
we're going to have Tom's links, of course, on
the page. You can reconnect with him. You can,
of course, Google Serenity and Leadership and
find him there too. We'll also put the resources
and the links below as well. And we've got that
big button in the top right corner that says
Be Our Guest. If you're a visionary leader, you
want to come on the show and talk about your
vision, we would love to have you. You don't
have to have... the the ultimate grand cure for
the world in terms of rewilding um you don't
have to be that far along you might be at the
discovery phase of what it is you want to do
we're just looking to find those who want to
make real impact in this world and want to help
and are going to put some work in to make that
happen so tom thanks for all that you've done
any final thoughts you want to share before we
wrap up you asked me with these big questions
thank you thank you for spence um sharing some
time with me and giving me the opportunities
to share my ideas. I'd love to come back. There's
lots more to talk about. And thank you to all
those who are still here and listening and watching.
And I hope that there's something that, just
something amongst all the things that we've said,
Jackson and I, that will make a difference to
you. I love it. Vision Pros. We'll see you next
time. Thank you for being here today. I'm really
happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions
as these episodes continue to move forward. This
is going to get more and more fun. We'll have
more and more engagement as well. We'll invite
people to participate in the show. And thank
you for giving us your time and attention. Have
an excellent time building out your vision and
becoming a vision pro yourself. Thank you for
being here today. I'm really happy that you tuned
in to Vision Pros Live. I'm looking forward to
seeing your reactions as these episodes continue
to move forward. This is going to get more and
more fun. We'll have more and more engagement
as well. We'll invite people to participate in
the show. And thank you for giving us your time
and attention. Have an excellent time building
out your vision and becoming a vision pro yourself.