Anything that has to do with sales.
Tell me more about it.
So when I say anything has to do with sales,
first off, people have a misconception
of what selling is.
All selling is, is understanding
and modifying other people's behavior.
That's all it is.
So when you just start, okay, I wanna sell something.
Well, first off, don't think that way.
What you should be thinking is I wanna help this person.
I really wanna help this person.
So therefore I wanna help them buy.
So now I'm buyer-orientated, not seller-orientated.
It's now all about them, not about me.
So the moment that you make that mindset shift
and make it about the buyer, not the seller,
you start realizing that everything they do
is simply, it's behavioral.
So you just shift behavior and start changing behavior.
So when I say anything sales,
really it's anything behavioral.
Because that's what the selling is,
is behavior modification.
And that's where the psychology
and the sales part comes in.
I hear it.
I love that you said understanding
and modifying people's behavior
and leaning towards knowing what they want
and giving them what they want pretty much
rather than what we really want.
I guess the thing about it is,
is not many people get into business as just for people.
They really truly want money and profit.
And so how do you go about ever having a client
that's like, I'm not really caring about what people want.
Like I want money and I think this is the best product
that will give me my money.
Well, first thing I'd say
is that they're not gonna last very long
because all that's gonna happen
is they're gonna burn relationships
and their reputation's gonna get burned
and they're just gonna have to keep cycling
through clients, which gets very difficult
and very tedious very quickly.
We all know that the first step of gaining clients
is normally the most time consuming
and often the hardest, hardest thing to do.
So what we do is that we adopt
long-term relationship-based approaches,
which makes that investment process
not only more time efficient,
but also more financially effective as well.
Another thing I'd say is that those people
are doing it all in reverse.
They're short-term, they're selfish, they're being selfish.
The best way that I've found to sell
is being short-term selfless,
totally short-term selfless and long-term selfish
and being very open about that relationship
and say, look, I want to help you.
The way I help you is by trading this thing
called currency for services
and I will always do what's in your best interest
to ensure that you get to your goal.
Even if sometimes I have to A, tell you
that what you're doing is wrong or ineffective,
B, say, I don't think I can help you,
I'm gonna refer you to someone else,
or C, doing what I believe is in your best interest
even if you don't think it is.
So it's about being truly courageous, really.
So that's what I'd say.
And opening up and just truly, like you said,
being courageous and honest
and letting them know where you're at.
I think that also builds a relationship as well,
honesty and communication and truly being open.
So when you have someone
and you're knowing that they have a goal,
I see that you state that you are helping businesses
get to a 100K a month?
Correct.
So typically we start at 10K because a lot of,
so I particularly help AI automation
and AI companies that are just starting up
because tech people really struggle
with having those initial first conversations,
what's my offer, what's my ICP, blah, blah, blah.
They really struggle with that because they're tech people.
They're not sales people.
They're not people people.
They go into their little hobbit holes of technology
and they code away.
They're not used to having those conversations.
So I help them first get to 10K per month.
My offer there, I do what's called a Godfather offer.
A Godfather offer is a deal they can't refuse,
which is if you don't get up to 10K in six months,
reoccurring revenue, I will pay you 10K.
Do you know everything I ask?
If you don't get there, I'll pay you 10K.
Okay.
That's the service I am about it.
I like that.
How long have you been in business?
I've been in business now for five years,
going on six years.
I started out coaching, did a psychology degree.
Then I went into politics,
that left politics, went into coaching.
Then after coaching, I went in to start my own AI company.
I scaled that up to 100K, reoccurring revenue.
I exited that company.
And then now I'm just spending my time,
A, enjoying myself,
B, coming on beautiful podcasts with beautiful people,
like you, Jamonka,
and C, doing sales consulting
and yeah, helping businesses grow, scale,
do better, perform better.
And now that things are a little bit different,
you're going into your sixth year.
Tell me about your vision for your company.
So, number one,
I would say that a business is a way
in which we can self-improve.
That's all it is.
It is the vehicle for self-improvement.
Now, you can make a load of money
without self-improvement.
I've met loads of people who are big,
you know, very, very large stomachs,
and they're making loads of money
because they filled a gap in the market.
But truly, it's a vehicle for self-improvement.
So my vision for my company
is that not only can it continually help others,
but also it can be that vehicle
for me to self-improve it, isn't it?
I'm very much agnostic.
I'm not one of those people
who is totally in love with a niche
or totally in love with the way I do business.
All that matters to me is,
is this gonna be a challenge?
Is this gonna help people?
Is this the way the wind is blowing?
That's all that matters to me.
So I don't have a business vision,
I have a personal vision,
and that is a vision, that's a purpose.
I'm gonna ask this, where did that vision come from?
My personal vision,
so my big, big, big, big, big vision
that's gonna happen, you know, 40, 50 years from now,
is that I want to create a philosophy
which enables human beings to become multi-planetary.
Because the likes of Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, et cetera,
they're doing the physical physics to get us into orbit.
But what about the culture?
What about Martian culture?
What about, what's gonna be this philosophy
and the psychology that's gonna motivate human beings
to do and be all that they can be?
We have an opportunity to detach from the Earth,
physically, mentally, emotionally.
There's so many things that we can actually get rid of
or retain in that moment.
And in order to do that, well, guess what?
I need to become a great psychologist,
need to become a great salesperson,
need to become a great philosopher,
need to have loads of money.
I'm 26, so that's the vision.
That's what I need to do to get there.
That's what I'm doing.
Wow, you're 26, kudos to you.
And I cannot get off this show without telling you
how cool your sweater is.
I super love it.
I love it, I love it.
It's nearly Christmas, it's nearly Christmas.
You buy Christmas, you know.
I'm telling you, even if it wasn't, I still love it.
And every time I look at it, I'm just happy.
I'm just super happy, so that's a good one.
And that makes all the sense in the world.
40, 50 years, we still have to have that thought process
of how are things changing?
What is the business gonna look like then?
And how do we, I wouldn't say, I don't know.
Will you, do you think, you know what?
I'm gonna just ask the question.
What do you think is gonna happen with AI?
What is it gonna be?
What's gonna happen with it?
Well, firstly, I'd say that we need to change the question
because we know what's gonna happen with AI.
It's an inevitability.
The only thing that's constraining AI at the moment
is its lack of energy, physical energy.
You know, that's what's constraining the energy grids,
can't sustain it.
Well, we're fixing that by getting modular nuclear reactors
at the likes of, you know, Microsoft and Google
are getting modular nuclear reactors
so that they can feed into their AI system, give it energy.
So that means that AI is going to progress into AGI,
which is general intelligence,
and it will be able to perform the tasks of a human being
much better than a human can.
We've already seen that robotics are on the increase.
You've got Elon Musk releasing his X robots,
which means that AI is going to be able to,
instead of learning by language model,
which is what it has been,
it's gonna be able to learn
by a tactile experience in the world,
which means that you are going to have AI,
which is totally 100% in the world
and can not only perform everything a human can,
but can think 10 times, 100 times, 1,000 times faster
and more effectively than a human can.
The question isn't what's gonna happen with AI,
we know that.
The question is what's gonna happen with humanity?
And when you think about it and you go, okay,
we're moving into a world of pure abundance,
genuine pure abundance,
and that does not fit the business model of the present
or the last 2,000, 10,000 years.
It doesn't fit because Tony has a job
because Tony is making a thing
that Josephine wants.
Tony is paid for the money that Josephine earns
from what she does, which then feeds Tony, blah, blah, blah.
It's just a cycle of more money going round.
But all of a sudden you've got robots
that can perform all of the functions of Tony
and all the functions of Josephine.
So not only do they no longer need to have work
to have a job, they're redundant,
there will be what we're gonna pay the robots, nothing.
So what's the point of having our business
in the first place to provide service
without the financial incentive?
So these are big questions that we are going
to have to answer because we're gonna still want service.
We're gonna still want McDonald's.
We're gonna still want to have beautiful books
and have beautiful experiences,
but our current economic model doesn't sustain that.
That is the question that we're gonna have to wrangle
with over the next decade and a half, I think.
Yeah, and you know what's so interesting
is that since you told your age, I'm gonna tell my age.
I am 45 and I tell you,
I guess I just didn't see this coming.
We've talked about so much in the last 20 something years,
so much and it never came to fruition.
I'm not sure if you were aware of the 1999
and then 2000, everything was just gonna crash
and we were supposed to party like it's 1999,
but we were all in fear.
So since it did not occur in that way,
in my mind, as you speak Ash, I'm just blown away
because 20 years ago it was big cell phones and patrons.
And so now we're talking about AI and it taking over
and not necessarily, well actually somewhat replacing them.
So when it comes to AI, how can AI tools enhance
rather than replace the human connection?
Do you want the honest answer
or do you want the answer that's gonna sound nice?
Hey, I want the honest answer.
It can't.
Yeah. It can't.
That's the answer.
So as you know, I'm in the world of AI automations
and AI tools and I speak to AI business owners
all the time and they're doing automation and everything else.
And at least four to five times a day, I'll sit
and they'll convince me, try and convince me
that they're not replacing jobs.
They'll say, no, we're not replacing jobs.
We're just replacing tasks.
What's a job?
It's a person doing a number of tasks.
So just accept, accept that you are reducing jobs
in the workforce, just accept it.
And not only should you accept it,
you should also be happy about it.
And here's why we should be happy about it.
You are releasing people in back,
you're releasing people back into the job market
who now fully understand that everything they do
is redundant, which means that they now need to rescale
because think about the number of jobs
which are just pencil pushing, bureaucratic.
We don't need them now.
We generally don't need them.
It sounds horrific to the majority of people who hear this,
but I'm sorry, you need to reskill.
You do not add anything that can't be done
by a robot or an AI.
Now at the minute, you can reskill.
I think we've got 20 odd years
before we really start seeing robots seriously affecting
everything that we do.
We've got that kind of runway,
which means that inevitably what is going to happen?
Loads and loads of people will be out of work
because their current economic system
will no longer function the way it does.
It will change.
And if it doesn't change,
we're gonna live in some sort of weird dystopia
because the powers that be don't want to let go
of their power, which will lead, I think,
to some sort of civil war or war of some kind
where all the power changes hands and everything else.
And that will mean that we will come together
because in crisis, we come together.
So right now, very disconnected,
but in the long scale of things,
I think we're going to be closer than we ever have been
20 years from today.
Wow.
And so when you were talking about it,
just like totally came into my thought process
of being relieved of duties and tasks
will allow a person to,
I think the thought that I had was what you said earlier,
continue to help others and self-improve.
So if you're replaceable by a robot per se,
then I think the other option for us to do
is actually to go and figure out what more we can do
to be better connected to people.
And that's exactly what you were saying.
So as you were talking, I was like,
okay, I could see that happening.
But I think in my mind,
I think it's a little scary if you ask me.
No, it's terrifying.
It's terrifying.
It really, really is terrifying.
And if you look into the psychology
of universal basic income,
so the people who really like universal basic income say,
oh, people can now do whatever they wanna do
and it's all wonderful, it's all great.
The majority of people on universal basic income,
they don't do anything.
They just consume.
They just stop working
because the majority of human beings are consumers
and they have no interest in creation.
They have no interest in high pursuits.
All they want to do is consume their bread and circus
and just exist.
That is the majority of people genuinely.
I think that if this mass movement
and this mass change came tomorrow,
I think that 80% of people, maybe more,
would lose their minds and would break down completely.
Seriously, I'm not, because how work,
their jobs give people so much purpose.
If performing a task for another human being
gives people so much purpose.
If you suddenly say to them, oh, by the way,
you no longer need to perform that task
and not only do you no longer need to perform it,
a robot can do it 10 times more effective than you
and not only 10 times more effective than you,
now that we've completely reconfigured our entire system,
the job itself is no longer needed at all
and a person has always felt that their job is part of them,
they would lose their minds completely
and you'd have that with 80% of the population,
which means that 80% of the population
are gonna be depressed,
80% of the population are gonna be without purpose,
80% of the population are gonna be
without a reason to carry on.
What are they gonna do?
They're gonna consume.
So my big fear, my big, big, big fear
is that we're gonna move into a complete dystopia,
not a 1984, is it, I thought you wrote this book,
1984, I think it is, is it?
Yes, I think it's called 1984.
We're not gonna go into a 1984 dystopia,
we're gonna move into a brave new world,
which is a dystopia where it's pleasure,
pleasure rules today, that we have pleasure
which fundamentally controls people.
I think we're gonna move into that in a worst case scenario.
Thank you for being here today.
I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions
as these episodes continue to move forward.
This is gonna get more and more fun,
we'll have more and more engagement as well.
We'll invite people to participate in the show
and thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent time building out your vision
and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.