1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,000 What's your why? 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:06,380 You know, I just have I mean I'm an aquarium 3 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:12,320 so we're always like people minded and humanitarian minded and I just 4 00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:19,440 This is just how I'm built. Like I don't even know what the why is as much as I'm driven to do this 5 00:00:20,080 --> 00:00:20,700 You know 6 00:00:20,700 --> 00:00:26,600 My family is certainly part of my why as to why I wake up every day and work every day and want to create good 7 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:28,040 things for them 8 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:29,880 but also 9 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:34,280 in the Jewish tradition tikkun olam means that you 10 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:39,880 Live to make the world better than you found it and I really feel that that's part of my 11 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:42,520 mission in life I 12 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:48,980 Get that and and interesting enough as I go to your website, I love the 13 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:54,760 About part where it says change should have been my middle name, please 14 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:57,800 Elaborate on that for me because I love it 15 00:00:57,800 --> 00:00:59,800 Yeah, I mean by five years old 16 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:04,320 My parents had moved to Venezuela Caracas, Venezuela 17 00:01:04,960 --> 00:01:10,960 To my dad was pursuing his dream of seeing the world and so we were supposed to be stationed there for one year 18 00:01:10,960 --> 00:01:12,960 We ended up staying six 19 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:19,600 And it was a formative thing for me to live in another country to learn another language at five years old 20 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:23,000 to be a part of another culture and 21 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:27,600 So I've been forced to deal with change ever since I was a little kid 22 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:31,120 You know then we came back to the United States and I was not an American kid 23 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:34,480 I mean, I didn't know who the Beatles were. I didn't know what a cheerleader was. I 24 00:01:35,320 --> 00:01:39,520 I was a very naive, you know soon-to-be teenager and 25 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:48,040 You know, I've just had to deal with change as everybody does but because I was five years old and 26 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:55,800 assimilating to a different culture, I think it's made me very sensitive to not just fitting in but trying to understand and 27 00:01:56,120 --> 00:02:01,440 and cause connection and bridges with other people in 2006 I became an interfaith minister 28 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:04,160 because after 9-eleven 29 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:12,680 People were you know, very anti-islam and I was like, well, you know, Islam is a peaceful loving religion as well 30 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:15,000 There's extremists everywhere 31 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:21,600 So I took it upon myself to learn about 14 major religious traditions and become an ordained interfaith minister 32 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:23,040 And it has been again 33 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:29,920 Proven to be a way that I bridge differences in the world and try to understand where other people are coming from so 34 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:34,480 Yeah changes change and connection. I guess is my middle name. I 35 00:02:35,920 --> 00:02:41,120 Love it. How do you find how do you define your coaching style? I 36 00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:47,920 Call myself a velvet hammer. So I'm not mean but I will be direct. I will say unpopular things 37 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:50,480 But it's all wrapped up in love 38 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:53,640 I 39 00:02:53,640 --> 00:02:54,360 Love that 40 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:57,840 And you know, sometimes we just need to hear that truth, right? 41 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:03,840 that truth about how things are going and I love the fact that you say the velvet because 42 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:08,760 Although it's soft. It's it's uh, it's tough. It's definitely tough 43 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:11,960 Yes, how did you get started? I 44 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:14,760 had 45 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:17,120 Really I got started because of my intuition 46 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:23,000 My intuition was telling me to call an old acting mentor of mine because I told you I had been an actor and 47 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:28,280 The intuition was so strong that he had my next career or my next job for me 48 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:30,280 I wish my tuition were always this clear 49 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:32,480 and I 50 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,480 You know was pre the internet and I looked at the internet 51 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:39,880 And I you know was pre the internet and I looked him up in the phone book 52 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:42,880 And I was like, do you remember me? 53 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:46,320 You know what? I didn't want to tell him that I had this intuition that I should call him 54 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,040 I just was you know acting like I was catching up with him and 55 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,400 He had become a coach and I had never heard of such a thing 56 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:57,080 And so I became a client first and I was a client for two years changed some things in my own life 57 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:04,180 He helped me make the decision whether to get married or not, which I did and we just celebrated 31 years together 58 00:04:04,180 --> 00:04:05,660 so 59 00:04:05,660 --> 00:04:07,100 my coach 60 00:04:07,100 --> 00:04:12,940 led me to then become one of the first people trained in the United States as a coach and one of the first people 61 00:04:13,180 --> 00:04:17,980 Credentialed as a master credential coach and I helped found the International Coaching Federation 62 00:04:18,060 --> 00:04:24,060 Which is the largest body that exists worldwide to put standards and credentialing and ethics to this profession 63 00:04:24,660 --> 00:04:26,660 so an intuition 64 00:04:27,060 --> 00:04:33,260 Led you to be where you are today 30 years later and 31 years married. Yes 65 00:04:33,260 --> 00:04:35,260 I love it 66 00:04:37,260 --> 00:04:41,900 Everybody did you guys hear that intuition if you have it follow it? Yeah 67 00:04:43,100 --> 00:04:46,620 What's the common challenge that you see your clients face? 68 00:04:48,220 --> 00:04:54,780 Trusting themselves, you know, it's it's when you have an intuition or when you have an inkling to do something that 69 00:04:55,540 --> 00:04:59,620 Doesn't make sense to the rest of your the people in your world 70 00:04:59,620 --> 00:05:06,740 You know, it's it's really hard to take action. Like I often say that if everyone is telling you you're crazy 71 00:05:06,740 --> 00:05:08,740 You're probably on the right track 72 00:05:09,780 --> 00:05:11,700 Right, so 73 00:05:11,700 --> 00:05:14,580 So that's the hardest thing is to you know 74 00:05:14,580 --> 00:05:19,980 Obey your own path when it doesn't seem to match what everyone else expects of you 75 00:05:19,980 --> 00:05:24,340 And how do you go about helping them when they're in that space? 76 00:05:24,340 --> 00:05:28,620 Building consensus in their world helping them be more 77 00:05:29,140 --> 00:05:34,020 Firm in their own vision and firm in taking action towards the new thing 78 00:05:35,060 --> 00:05:37,060 a lot of times 79 00:05:37,060 --> 00:05:39,300 You know life will tell you if you're wrong 80 00:05:39,300 --> 00:05:42,300 You know if you keep trying something and it doesn't work and it doesn't work and it doesn't work 81 00:05:42,540 --> 00:05:47,300 You have to kind of take the message and take your bumps and scrapes and move on but 82 00:05:47,620 --> 00:05:51,300 Most of the time when people are following a deep-seated 83 00:05:51,300 --> 00:05:57,140 Want or desire the doors and the windows start opening and then you have to keep going through them 84 00:05:57,740 --> 00:06:04,700 Yeah, and you know interesting enough when you get a client and they began to tell you 85 00:06:05,820 --> 00:06:10,460 What their desires are and where they want to go if they are 86 00:06:11,140 --> 00:06:15,500 Are in a business is there is the coaching more towards? 87 00:06:16,660 --> 00:06:19,460 Them or how to be a better coach for them 88 00:06:19,460 --> 00:06:26,900 Or how to be a better coach for their employees or who they're working with well if I'm working with leaders 89 00:06:27,700 --> 00:06:30,180 I help them develop into better coaches 90 00:06:30,740 --> 00:06:36,140 But sometimes they have to make strategic decisions, which you know I help them hear themselves better 91 00:06:36,140 --> 00:06:39,100 You know I'm not an expert in every field. I'm an expert in 92 00:06:39,780 --> 00:06:42,260 processing people to hear themselves and to 93 00:06:43,020 --> 00:06:45,180 understand their own criteria for success 94 00:06:46,100 --> 00:06:47,340 so 95 00:06:47,340 --> 00:06:53,500 You know when I work with other coaches, you know when I work with people who want to have a business like mine 96 00:06:54,540 --> 00:06:59,020 A lot of it is more consultative. You know it's more telling them what to do 97 00:06:59,020 --> 00:07:03,740 But for most most of the time it's asking the right questions to help people 98 00:07:04,660 --> 00:07:07,900 Recognize their own brilliance and take action accordingly 99 00:07:08,380 --> 00:07:14,260 Yes, yes, and you know I ask that question because you mentioned something about trusting themselves, right? 100 00:07:14,260 --> 00:07:21,020 And so I know that when I sought out a coach or a mentor it was more so 101 00:07:22,220 --> 00:07:28,020 To get me together right and the goal wasn't for me to become a coach just the goal was to be coached 102 00:07:28,860 --> 00:07:33,020 Yeah, so it's it's a it seems like it would be just so different 103 00:07:33,020 --> 00:07:37,460 Especially coaching the leader who may not be in tune or in touch with themselves 104 00:07:37,660 --> 00:07:41,840 You know and it may be having to reverse the things to say hey 105 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:46,660 What about you before we actually start focusing on who you lead? 106 00:07:47,780 --> 00:07:53,420 Yeah, I mean it coaching is so much about the individual like we when I'm training other coaches 107 00:07:53,420 --> 00:07:57,260 I'll tell them you know you're not coaching the situation. You're coaching the person 108 00:07:58,140 --> 00:08:02,720 Right, so I'm not coach. I'm not fixing their situation. I'm coaching them to deal with it better 109 00:08:04,780 --> 00:08:09,900 So a lot of the insights come from the coachee 110 00:08:09,900 --> 00:08:11,900 But it's my job to pull it out of them 111 00:08:12,420 --> 00:08:17,780 So it is a different kind of discipline. You know like consulting is flat-out. I know better than you 112 00:08:17,780 --> 00:08:19,780 I'm going to tell you what to do 113 00:08:20,820 --> 00:08:25,340 You know but coaching is asking the right questions so that people open up to their own 114 00:08:26,220 --> 00:08:28,220 brilliance and their own answers 115 00:08:28,380 --> 00:08:33,620 Laura I have a random question has there ever been someone you said you're not coachable? 116 00:08:34,100 --> 00:08:38,220 Oh, yes, definitely yeah after 30 years. I've definitely come across 117 00:08:38,220 --> 00:08:40,220 uncoachable people 118 00:08:40,220 --> 00:08:44,900 People who just think they're right all the time people who don't want to change 119 00:08:44,900 --> 00:08:50,660 I mean I was working with a very senior leader who he was willing to take the journey with me 120 00:08:50,660 --> 00:08:56,820 But he would say you know I have to decide if I really want to be the leader that develops other people 121 00:08:56,820 --> 00:09:02,860 Because I've really liked being the leader that just has all the answers and people listen to what I say oh wow 122 00:09:02,860 --> 00:09:05,420 Okay, yeah, you know he had the insight to know 123 00:09:05,420 --> 00:09:09,220 There's a difference between the two and he's not so sure that he wants to be 124 00:09:10,340 --> 00:09:16,580 That you know yeah, yeah, you know and I think that that's um that's that's some self 125 00:09:17,860 --> 00:09:18,940 self 126 00:09:18,940 --> 00:09:24,060 Finding you have to say something like that which makes all the sense in the world for that individual 127 00:09:24,060 --> 00:09:29,020 They have to really know where they are and what they want so I've actually never heard that but um 128 00:09:29,540 --> 00:09:31,540 Hey, there's a first time for everything right 129 00:09:31,540 --> 00:09:36,660 What's the most important quality of a great coach um I 130 00:09:37,300 --> 00:09:39,300 Think they're really good listener 131 00:09:40,900 --> 00:09:42,900 And also that they 132 00:09:43,700 --> 00:09:45,700 practice reducing their ego 133 00:09:46,180 --> 00:09:51,780 You know and I when I train other coaches I tell them that becoming a coach is ego reduction therapy 134 00:09:51,780 --> 00:09:57,140 Because you're not it's not about you. It's not about your great ideas. It's not about your great wisdom 135 00:09:57,140 --> 00:10:00,700 It's about bringing out the greatness and other people 136 00:10:01,100 --> 00:10:06,940 So you have to reduce your own ego and be a great listener and listen for that brilliance and somebody else 137 00:10:07,580 --> 00:10:12,180 Yes, yes interesting enough that that's a part of one of my own business quotes 138 00:10:13,180 --> 00:10:20,260 You speak you you speak I listen you desire I deliver and I just really believe that that's something so important 139 00:10:20,260 --> 00:10:22,260 It's just to be able to listen 140 00:10:22,260 --> 00:10:29,300 Before you decide to respond so you're you're right and I think that's a great quality of life in general 141 00:10:29,620 --> 00:10:31,260 You know if you're a good listener 142 00:10:31,260 --> 00:10:38,660 I think you can pretty much get through and and speak to most people I won't say anyone right not everyone 143 00:10:38,980 --> 00:10:40,660 But I'll paraphrase a roomie 144 00:10:40,660 --> 00:10:46,220 I think it's a roomie quote, but and I'm paraphrasing because I don't have it exactly right, but like before you open your mouth 145 00:10:46,220 --> 00:10:51,820 Is it true is it kind and does it improve on the silence? 146 00:10:52,540 --> 00:10:53,980 And I love that last part 147 00:10:53,980 --> 00:11:00,820 You know does it improve on the silence because so many people feel like they have to fill the silence and say something and sometimes you don't 148 00:11:01,140 --> 00:11:04,180 Yes, yes that statement. I'm just be quiet 149 00:11:05,340 --> 00:11:07,340 Just be quiet and listen 150 00:11:07,340 --> 00:11:10,860 Can you share the story where your coaching led to a proposal? 151 00:11:10,860 --> 00:11:17,180 Change in someone's life? Um there's so many of them do 152 00:11:17,980 --> 00:11:25,300 But I'm reminded of an early story of a woman who was in her 50s, and she was a recruiter and 153 00:11:26,140 --> 00:11:29,180 she made about $50,000 a year and 154 00:11:29,940 --> 00:11:35,300 Working with me for 18 months she moved her income from 50k a year to 500k a year 155 00:11:35,300 --> 00:11:43,300 and she created herself a lovely retirement in her in her dream home with a garden and her dream Mercedes Benz and 156 00:11:43,860 --> 00:11:52,500 She went from thinking very small to thinking much bigger in her field and she was very well respected by the time she retired and 157 00:11:53,220 --> 00:11:55,220 Really made a life for herself 158 00:11:56,020 --> 00:11:58,420 Even in you know a later life 159 00:11:58,420 --> 00:12:06,340 When a lot of people think there's no possibility for them. Yes, yes, and you know, I'm definitely going back to the story 160 00:12:06,340 --> 00:12:12,180 I heard on your TEDx talk and the end of the story was saying that 161 00:12:12,660 --> 00:12:17,460 If I if I may tell just a piece of it because of what I heard the 17 year old 162 00:12:18,100 --> 00:12:20,980 Having being a young mother and then 163 00:12:20,980 --> 00:12:27,620 pushing forward to do the work, right and then thereafter as she got older 164 00:12:27,620 --> 00:12:33,140 That was what she did and she was very good at what she did and getting to where she needed to be 165 00:12:33,140 --> 00:12:39,140 But as she got older some things needed to change and she found herself in a moment 166 00:12:39,140 --> 00:12:42,020 And there was a statement you made of course, I'm paraphrasing 167 00:12:42,020 --> 00:12:44,660 You probably know it for me, but I'm not sure if you've heard of it 168 00:12:44,660 --> 00:12:51,220 But once she realized she was in a different position and her why was different 169 00:12:51,220 --> 00:12:54,260 You helped her to change that. Am I on the right track? Do you remember? 170 00:12:54,260 --> 00:12:57,460 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what story you're talking about. See she was um 171 00:12:58,260 --> 00:13:03,220 We the point of the story is that sometimes we make a vow very young in our life 172 00:13:03,780 --> 00:13:10,260 And we base all our actions on that vow and her vow that was as you know, having given birth to her 173 00:13:10,260 --> 00:13:14,980 Child at 17 years old and she had to give up going to college at the time and a basketball scholarship and she 174 00:13:15,780 --> 00:13:19,860 Made us that she made a vow that she would not be a teenage statistic like that 175 00:13:19,860 --> 00:13:24,500 She was going to beat the odds and here she was now in her 30s working with me 176 00:13:25,140 --> 00:13:28,580 And she was successful at what she did, but she didn't like it anymore 177 00:13:28,580 --> 00:13:32,180 And she didn't have any motivation and she didn't know why she was losing her mojo 178 00:13:32,900 --> 00:13:35,300 And it was because she had outgrown the why 179 00:13:35,300 --> 00:13:39,860 She'd outgrown the motivation like she was not a teenage statistic. She blew that one out of the water 180 00:13:40,420 --> 00:13:45,780 And she needed a new motivation and she didn't even realize it. So once I had her awareness on 181 00:13:46,500 --> 00:13:49,940 You did it you proved it that can't be driving you anymore 182 00:13:49,940 --> 00:13:53,620 That's why you don't have your mojo is because you need a new driver a new reason 183 00:13:54,420 --> 00:13:58,580 And so she changed that reason and went on to continue successfully in her career 184 00:13:59,380 --> 00:14:03,220 And I wanted to give her a reason why she was losing her mojo 185 00:14:03,220 --> 00:14:08,580 I want to give her a reason why she was wanting to live her life. I don't know how 186 00:14:08,660 --> 00:14:10,940 She knew that situation 187 00:14:11,380 --> 00:14:19,080 When she was 188 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:25,720 where we stopped knowing that we've grown and stayed in our past and tried to make it 189 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:27,760 work moving forward. 190 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:33,080 So I really thought that story was super impactful for others. 191 00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:37,440 And if you're listening, it is a TEDx talk. 192 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,760 Utilize her name and find it. 193 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:40,760 And it's a good one. 194 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:45,880 And you'll understand where the story comes from as we sort of minimize it or shorten 195 00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:46,880 it a little bit. 196 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:51,920 And I invite you to go to Laura's TEDx talk and watch that. 197 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:52,920 Thank you. 198 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:53,920 Of course. 199 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:57,680 And as I mentioned before, it hit home. 200 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:00,560 I too was young with children. 201 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:06,760 And so I was like, oh, wow, this is, is she talking about me? 202 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:09,680 But I love that for you. 203 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:19,480 When it comes to leaders and you coaching them, what tips do you have for leaders? 204 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:23,120 The tip on reducing your ego, I think, is big for leaders. 205 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:26,120 That's hard. 206 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:27,880 You could always be the answer person. 207 00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:40,120 But if you become the developer of people instead of the answer person, your legacy, your ripple 208 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:42,160 effect will be much bigger. 209 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:43,160 Yeah. 210 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:46,720 So what do you want to be measured by? 211 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:53,040 So I think it was Jack Welsh, the CEO of GE, who said leaders are not measured by how many 212 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:58,680 followers they have, but by how many leaders they've developed. 213 00:15:58,680 --> 00:15:59,680 I like that. 214 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:04,040 You know, interesting enough is, do you keep track of this? 215 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:07,120 You know, and I mean, and I guess it comes off of that question again. 216 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:09,960 This is another question off the top of my head. 217 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:17,120 Do you keep or should leaders keep track of how many people they've assisted to determine 218 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,680 where they are and measure what they've done? 219 00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:24,520 You know, it's not something I actively do with clients, you know, counting or even me 220 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:25,520 counting. 221 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:29,480 I've lost track of how many clients I've coached and how many hours I've coached. 222 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:33,920 But because of other colleagues of mine who have kept track of their hours, they guesstimate 223 00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:40,840 that I'm in like the 35,000 hours now of coaching and you get 10, you master at 10,000 hours. 224 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:49,520 So I think that, you know, you'll know your impact based on how many people keep, they'll 225 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:50,520 tell you. 226 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:56,320 So if it weren't for you, I wouldn't have done this or, you know, you'll get that occasional 227 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:58,760 letter of gratitude from somebody. 228 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:02,920 But you know, people say so many nice things about you at your funeral. 229 00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:07,160 It'd be nice if people could say those things along the way while you're still alive and 230 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:08,680 can hear them. 231 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:09,680 Absolutely. 232 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:13,520 So what you're saying, Laura, is you're a master coach. 233 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:14,520 I am a master coach. 234 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:15,520 Did you all hear that? 235 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:16,520 She's a master coach. 236 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:17,520 She's well over the 10,000 hours. 237 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:26,600 So if I may ask, what new projects or ideas are you most excited about right now? 238 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:27,600 If any. 239 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:32,280 Yeah, I mean, I'm still coaching leaders and I'm still coaching people who are figuring 240 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:33,720 out what they want to do with their life. 241 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:39,160 But I have turned my focus towards helping other coaches be successful because, you know, 242 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:45,240 I'm now a senior member of this community of coaches and I just see too many talented 243 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:49,560 people not treating it as a business and not succeeding. 244 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:54,160 And these are well-meaning, heart-centered, really talented people and I want to see them 245 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,160 do well. 246 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:59,720 So I've been supporting coaches on what they need to do to be a business owner and to be 247 00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:04,560 an entrepreneur because they need to be an entrepreneur to be the coach that they want 248 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:05,560 to be. 249 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:10,280 So that's where my attention and focus is and people can find out more about all my 250 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,280 areas of expertise on laurabermanforking.com. 251 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:14,520 Thank you for being here today. 252 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,000 I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live. 253 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:21,800 I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward. 254 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:23,360 This is going to get more and more fun. 255 00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:25,480 We'll have more and more engagement as well. 256 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:29,200 We'll invite people to participate in the show and thank you for giving us your time 257 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:30,200 and attention. 258 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:45,160 I hope you're having an excellent time building out your vision and becoming a Vision Pro 259 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:46,160 yourself.