How did you get started?
Yeah, that's a great question.
I think over my life I learned that the best way to get started is to follow the steps of others.
So read the books, watch the videos, talk to other people, get some certifications.
And through that I was able to get some of my first clients.
Okay. And then when you got started, how long did it take you to actually get up and running?
Especially with the tech part, I'm sure you had to do a lot of the work on your own.
I think the technology part was the easiest because of my background.
The business part was a little bit longer to kind of work on because it required building a bigger network
and also changing my branding and market awareness of what kind of things I do now.
Because in my network originally I was perceived more of a technology expert,
and coming out and saying that I now coach others from a business perspective was a change.
So introducing new dialogues, introducing new titles, introducing new messaging and narrative
was the important thing that I had to support.
So is it just you or do you have a team of individuals?
Well, I think we all have teams of individuals available at the clicks notice from a consulting perspective,
but for full-time it's just me.
Yeah, yeah. And when you need that consulting, it is just a click away.
Is it someone that you work with very often, or is it someone you might have to have help assist you
in another area with a different niche that you're not very well versed in?
Right. So I think for, let me just fix the slide a little bit, it's developing relationships.
So in a sense that for some tasks that hasn't been done before, I will always look for somebody who is recommended
or will explore a relationship with multiple consultants.
But I think for the tasks which I had before, it's much easier to go to a proven contact
with you've done business with and you already know what kind of results to expect.
Yes, yes. It makes all the sense in the world.
And as I'm doing some of the numbers and adding in my head, you've had the business for two years,
which meant you were in the corporate world as an employee or the...
So I had startup careers for the past 10 years.
So before I joined this, well, before startups were...
I look at my current business as more of a practice, like a coaching practice, not necessarily startup,
because startup requires a product, a team, like you have a growth trajectory of investors.
And since I'm running this individually, and a lot of time, I just do one-on-one consultations
or coaching sessions, I consider more of a practice.
My prior businesses where I was a co-founder, those were more of a startup nature,
where it was two, three people at the beginning who had a product, and we took it to the market,
and then all the other details came along.
Makes all the sense in the world. Now I get it.
And it's interesting because you have this love for things and you did have a startup business,
and now you've gone into coaching. What held you back for so long?
I see. That's a good question. I think it's the realization of where the most impact lies
with the overlap of my skills. I thought before that it was important to be part of the company
to feel the outcome of my efforts better, and I did that through my startup experience.
But then the bigger question, why, popped, like, why am I part of this startup?
So I started working on that, what made me kind of switch to the aerospace,
and then I started thinking about the scope and breadth and the depth that I can offer,
and I just had to shift to a different level.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And coaching is such a different type of business, I guess you could say,
because it's definitely just leading and guiding and making sure that whatever their end goal is,
is that you're helping with that. How long is your coaching for?
So typically it's between three to six months sessions.
We meet either bi-weekly or weekly, depending on the level of chaos in your mind or in your organization.
OK, OK. So on your side, I see book a call. So if I booked a call right now,
take me through what a call would be like.
Cool. And I hope you'll click after this session. I'm looking forward to chatting with you.
It will be initially a discovery session. I would like to understand where you're coming from,
what the nature of the issue is. But the most important thing is the context.
This is where coaching is a little bit different from consulting.
Consultants usually ask for the individuals to describe the problem in detail,
and then they go to work on solving that problem.
In coaching, we're co-thinking the problems together, and we're trying to figure out
whether that's a real problem or not a real problem, where it's coming from,
how does the context influence our problem definition,
and do we need actually any external help to figure it out, how to solve it,
once we identify those problems.
But during the first session, it's going to be a lot of context sharing,
nature of the issue sharing, background sharing.
So this way we can identify what are the actual issues that we're working on.
OK, OK. And then once that's found and we decide,
hey, you know what, this sounds like a good fit for one another,
we go further in depth of what our needs are and how we'll move forward.
Yeah. So typically that gets converted into a relationship over three to six months.
And I like to introduce those timely differentials because our relationship is unknown.
Even though we had one discovery session, we may not be good fit after two, three sessions.
So in a sense, like I'm introducing conversations which allow our relationship to either blossom
or transfer into something else.
So I might refer to another coach would be more appropriate for the situation.
Once we know what we're working on, then we start setting up goals
of what we're trying to accomplish at the end of the three or six months relationship.
And we're trying with each session to get closer to those outcomes.
Yeah. I mean, that's and that makes all the sense in the world.
The outcome is definitely I guess that's what determines how long you'll spend time
with that individual and developing more of a relationship just to see
if it would be the three months or the six months. Right.
That's right. That's right. And as we're progressing, some individuals come for just one or two sessions and that's fine.
I feel like I've done my work well. I don't get paid for the rest of it, but that's what it is.
I'm here to be the most effective partner that you can have with those conversations.
But sometimes it's hard to rule in the chaos of just after just a few sessions
and we continue working as new issues come up. Yes. Yes.
What are some of the biggest challenges you see leaders face that you hope?
I think the biggest challenge and this might sound like is cliche, but it's communication.
And I know communication is such a multidimensional work, but I feel like there's so many different layers
and any of those layers could be could be in the need of adjustment.
It's like, how do I think when I think what kind of work comes out, how does that work travel?
Does it land with the same clarity with the other person, which thought does it get connected?
So there's like multiple different layers.
And if you're doing it one on one, what other gestures with buddy posture are you assuming?
What tone are you using in the end? You're trying to answer the question.
Did what I say land in the same way as I thought about it?
And what makes it more difficult is that each single interface between two different people is radically different.
We have to adjust so many different parameters in our heads to adjust to each person's unique factors.
And then it makes it even more challenging when you're trying to talk to multiple people at the same time
and you're trying to take their inputs and adjust them.
And we all have experience talking to people. We have experience talking to multiple people.
But I find that many leaders, especially when they just joining the leadership opportunity,
have not given a lot of thought of how to approach that communication in such with such a minutiae in mind.
Yes, yes. And communication is key to everything, every business leader, employee.
And I mean, you that's a great point. If there isn't we have effective communication and in my own words, block communication.
I guess I'm going to go anywhere. We're just, you know, we're just talking to be talking and effective communication.
It is listening to be heard and not to respond only. You know, so I get that.
And I can understand the communication and in the introduction, could that be a mix up or somewhere down the line of how you help them
if they're not communicating effectively enough in order to get to that outcome sooner than later?
Yeah. So in coaching, it's a good question. And I have to highlight that in coaching, a lot of progress is driven by the client.
The client has to arrive to the point where they have to say, like, I would like to work on communication.
And it is that while coaches responsibility may be there to lead them to make that the conclusion,
but the coach is not in a position to say, hey, listen, your communication kind of sucks. Let's work on it.
That's not coaching. That's something else. Maybe it is a type of coaching that some people think coaching.
The best type of coaching works when it comes from your context, from your own initiative,
when you identify something that you want to work with, because it gives you autonomy to start working on that yourself.
Start working on also defining autonomy of how finding other things that you would like to work on and also gain that ownership of your transformation.
If I say that you need to work in communication, I own that responsibility.
And the client feels like, well, you know, a lot of me are taught me that you need to do communication.
He tried it and doesn't work. You know what? It's not important. Yeah.
And it becomes more of a product that you kind of consume. And it's not effective from that perspective. Yeah. Yeah.
So are there clients that you've just realized based off of the communication and where, because as a coach, I believe that I've done coaching before.
We have a thought process, right. And I think there's at some point in time when the communication is lacking,
there's a point where we're like, OK, I can't help this individual. This one is us again.
You know, it's not going to be a good match for us. So that's something you experience.
And if you do, is that like a referral to another coach or how do you handle that? Yeah.
Sometimes that absolutely happens. And I think in the end, it has to be a through the means of asking the question.
Hey, how does this work in for you? Are you reaching the outcomes that you want to?
Do you think this is appropriate? And sometimes the client says, yes, absolutely. Yes.
Even though you're not a good fit, I really like this aspect, this aspect, this aspect, this aspect, which allows you to restructure the relationship,
the focus on just those capabilities and competencies.
And sometimes, like they can say, like, hey, I'm not finding that you have a lot of experience with this and this and this.
And you might say, well, we might disagree on this, but I appreciate your candid feedback.
And it wouldn't be OK if I refer to somebody else who I think actually maybe has a slightly different approach there.
Thank you for being here today. I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward.
This is going to get more and more fun. More and more engagement as well.
I invite people to participate in the show. And thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent time building out your vision and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.